The idea of having to unlock stages, characters, weapons, etc in multiplayer games is outdated game design to pad gameplay to hide lack of content.
Everything should be unlocked right away.
Everything should be unlocked
The idea of having to unlock stages, characters, weapons, etc in multiplayer games is outdated game design to pad gameplay to hide lack of content.
Everything should be unlocked right away.
CORRECT
I agree, I hate progression, unlockables and anything similar
I need everything in my hands and I hate when people say no to me, especially those pesky girls!!!
I also love when there's paid DLC that unlocks everything and give me any advantage in single player games
Please just let me pay to unlock all the content at once
TOTAL ZOOMER DEATH
This is a compromise I'm willing to have. Leech money from the ADHD-riddled brains and incentivises companies to make the games more fun.
First of all, fuck you. Second of all, all this does is incentivise companies to put everything behind paywalls. When is the last time a game came out with actual stage and character unlocks? No indie shit.
>No indie shit.
If you play triple a games in 2023 there's no reason to continue this conversation
>incentivizes companies to make the games more fun
It does the exact OPPOSITE of that, you fucking dunce. If it's actually fun to unlock things, then it means players will be incentivized to play to unlock things, making them less likely to pay. These companies don't want players, they want payers, so they are going to design things to encourage giving them more money. Do you think before to speak?
imagine playing super mario world and you can just skip to the end
I know this is bait, but I hate that it's all like this now. Everything has to be spoiled ages before release, no surprises anymore, nothing to work towards or uncover, it's all told and handed to the babby player with zero patience and an addiction to instant gratification.
You can just not look at trailers and data leaks.
Or maybe people just woke up and realized they didn't want to play hundreds of shitty boring matches with characters and stages they didn't give a fuck about before finally getting to the good stuff, at which point they don't care anymore. If you're a kid in the pre-DLC era, you might have a case to make for unlockables. In today's ecosystem it usually makes no fucking sense.
How about a compromise: in single player you have to unlock things, but in multiplayer everything is there from the start.
Public execution for all dataminers and wiki contributors
Developers, put more fucking hidden cheat codes in your games
>Day before game releases
>Ending spoiler is already on the youtube front page
>"ALL ENDINGS EXPLAINED"
>"ALL UNLOCKS EXPLAINED"
>Ending spoiler is already on the youtube front page
Uploaded by the developer as a "teaser trailer"
>foreshadowing is put in the game
>community finds it
>developers remove it for some reason
some do this with easter eggs nowadays as well and it always seemed fucking retarded
That game came out in 2001.
No.
You absolute naggerhomosexual.
The GC-era unlocking exists for completely practical reasons:
>It prevents a new player from being overwhelmed with choices.
>Characters with a low skill floor available at the start allow a player to learn the basic mechanics
>It allows for non-random progression for completing objectives that demonstrate basic competency of the game's mechanics
And if you want it unlocked instantly because you've played it before, just download a save.
Unlocks exist to prevent you from instantly going to the hardest map and getting your ass kicked if you're a fresh new player.
What actually sucked was the era of unlockable content that can only be obtained through timegated DLC (Pokemon), or by getting a completely different game to complete the one you already have, like Mario Golf Toadstool Tour requiring Advance Tour and 3 separate complete saves of that game's story mode (for context you can only have one save file there) to get all the special clubs. Unlockables themselves aren't an issue as long as the means to obtain them are reasonable.
I always found it neat that Melee's first unlocks were typically Jigglypuff (beat any single player mode without special requirements) or Marth (try out every default in VS. mode), since the two of them are also very beginner-friendly choices but have their own unique gimmicks to ease you into the game. The clones all being unlockable also prevent that sort of overlap/being overwhelmed with more choices that barely change things on paper.
>What actually sucked was the era of unlockable content that can only be obtained through timegated DLC (Pokemon), or by getting a completely different game to complete the one you already have, like Mario Golf Toadstool Tour requiring Advance Tour and 3 separate complete saves of that game's story mode (for context you can only have one save file there) to get all the special clubs.
That's where F-Zero GX handles this very well.
You're encouraged to find an arcade machine to unlock the 10 AX characters and 6 courses, but you still can get them just by clearing some hyper-difficult challenges.
Pokemon really is a big offender even in spin-offs.
Pick up any Ranger game and you're locked out of the on-cart DLC missions.
Last, I like how Brawl/4 handled unlocks where each character had multiple possible unlock criteria: X vs. matchs, some unique condition,
and the bonus option of playing Subspace for Brawl.
Fuck off. Unlocking shit is fun. Not when it's done the way Ultimate did it, but the way Melee did was fun.
tbf, unlocking mewtwo in ths game is a fucking chore. I stil have traumas because my memory card with my melee save got corrupted once many years ago, the though of having to unlock mewtwo again made me want to kill myself....
I unlocked my character by using the ness lv9 cheese at the DKC stage where he instant kills himself, is a lot faster to get to G&W at 1000 vs matches actually
>pretending its faster to press start, select a stage, wait 8 seconds, press start again and repeat all this ONE THOUSAND FUCKING TIMES rather than just beating 25 fun target tests
I don't believe you
you're right, I looked at it now and is way slower than I remembered, 1 stock sudden death was was faster
>plug in 1-4 controllers
>start VS match
>leave game on for X hours, where X = 20/num_controllers
>do whatever you want
>end VS match
The problem is you're not doing anything. It's the simplest solution, sure, but keep in mind that to unlock a character, you aren't actively playing the game.
>The problem is you're not doing anything.
And? You were likely in school during this time so just let it run then or overnight if you really are this retarded that you couldn't figure this out.
is a good thing that GC was durable since no way PS2 would survive this
My ps2 was afk levelling in FFXII and X-2 overnight, sounds like skill issue
It's still the worst out of all the other character unlocks just requiring basic gameplay. It's why people would unlock everything else first before Mewtwo and then Game and Watch. Yeah it's a simple solution nowadays, but 20 hours for one character is a stupid idea no matter how you slice it. If you had put it at maybe 5 or something, you wouldn't need to go through having to wait overnight to get him and probably would just get him playing with your bros. Hell, even if it considered regular playtime with single player events, it would naturally flow to having him unlocks.
TL;DR the issue is the fundamental design of keeping Mewtwo locked behind the specific requirements, not how hard or easy it actually is.
Who the fuck cares? Melee is 22 years old at this point.
Everyone with a braincell is playing Ultimate.
That's irrelevant to the discussion.
>this unlock method is dumb
>no it's not, you have to go about it in a dumb way
>that's exactly why it's retarded
>who cares just play new game
This is the most mouth breather response.
The game is two decades old, get over it.
>Everyone with a braincell is playing Ultimate.
So if I have more than one I should stick with melee? Got it.
>be 9
>finally get a new video game for our gamecube
>it's Melee
>me and my younger brother play it every day
>its so fun
>have no idea how to unlock the extra characters, nor who they will be, thanks to the internet not being a thing yet
>one way-too-late-for-a-school-night evening me and my bro is playing VS against each other, as many other nights
>match ends
>suddenly a new character appears
>its fucking mewtwo
>we both flip out, hype as shit
>get told to calm down, shut up, and go to bed by our mother
>"please mom, just let us finish this match"
>"okay, just this one."
>you have to beat the character to unlock it
>had no idea how we triggered the unlock so we assumed this was it, no retries, one shot
>my brother fights Mewtwo for his life, sweating
>beats him just barely
>go to bed happy and hype to try Mewtwo after school the next morning
Anons, you are admitting to wanting to suck this fun out of the game.
Fuck you, it was great.
Wholesome.
Once again, the internet exists.
>thanks to the internet not being a thing yet
the internet was a thing then
This is why I like Vidya unlocks, for kino like this
>have no idea how to unlock the extra characters, nor who they will be, thanks to the internet not being a thing yet
You lying homosexual. GameFAQs and Cheatcc were both a thing even in 2001.
all you have to do is leave the game on for a day max... surely you can go 1 day without playing smelee right?
>tfw me, my brother, and friend played so much of this game that we unlocked mewtwo naturally without even knowing why
once upon a time, you and your friends had to be in the same room to play video games together.
Unlock everything in multiplayer (except potentially fancy reskins that are account-tied), force single player story mode to start with the basics and unlock characters and potentially OP characters for use only in single player challenge modes.
>Translation = I'm an entitled zoomer nagger that cannot earn anything via merit and determination and need to literally steal my content instead of earning it
Fuck off.
>content
Fuck you, I'm sick of you fuckers crying about this shit. Games were fun diversions meant to be played for a set amount of time, not something you sink a full half a day into doing banal fetch quests with twenty reskinned objectives. Fun was the law of the land, if a game was fun, you came back to it until you wanted something else. Games weren't focused on content, they were trying to be fun and they didn't have to do a dollar to hour ratio either.
You don't even want to play games, you want to analyze them.
There should just be a button that lets you skip to the "YOU WIN" screen that pushes the big "produce dopamine" button in your brain. Gotta get muh fix.
Side content and rewards should be unlockable. Just not anything that'd affect multiplayer.
>have some content in the game that is unpolished because you ran out of money
>don't want to outright remove it from the game because it's cool
>but also dont want ruin a player's experience by having them play it before the more polished stuff
>timegate it a little bit with an unlock
this is a good strategy and you have no argument against it
>muh mewtwo
theres such a thing as taking it too far albeit
>play it before the more polished stuff
but the only unlockables that are actually good in the game are Marth and Jigglypuff with a ton of clones that was unlockable
but the point still stand nevertheless
you misunderstood me. let me put it another way
>your best content should be available at the start
>your worst content should something dedicated players unlock later
having clones all be unlockable characters means they aren't clogging up the list when you first start playing, but later when you have played enough to care about the difference between falcon and ganondorf, THEN you can play as either one
i disagree, starting with simple characters and unlocking more complex ones is a good progression method
of course, if you're an autist who's experienced with the genre this minor inconvenience will mindbreak you so hard you make threads on 4chinz for years
>i disagree, starting with simple characters and unlocking more complex ones is a good progression method
It would be if multiplayer wasn't a consideration. When you go over to play with a friend and he doesn't have your character unlocked, it sucks. And having to unlock your main is a bore.
the point of a game is to play it
a game giving you rewards over time for playing it means you are playing the game for longer which is what the dev ostensibly wants
simply paying your way to the content means you have nothing left worth getting, which drastically shortens the time you will likely spend with the game even if it's fun
stop being ADHD and just unlock the shit
>Play game
>Use my main from the previous installment
>Play for hundreds of hours
vs
>Play game
>Marathon through the SP mode
>Eventually unlock my character
>Play for hundreds of hours
Why gate it?
>the point of a game is to play it
No, the point of a game is to get the dopamine fix as soon as possible.
im guessing your parents never said no to you and are now paying for their consequences by having a five hundred pound homosexual refusing to leave their basement
Just do it how Shovel Knight Showdown worked. Let players unlock things if they want to, but have a toggle deep in the options settings for unlocking everything. Players that want a single player experience can get it. TOs that need 30 setups and can't pass a save file around can just press the unlock option.
Sounds like a skill issue, OP
What filtered you?
Couldn't beat event matches?
Agreed! That's why I'm glad we've moved to the format of paid DLC instead of unlocks. I don't have the time to grind your game to unlock things, just let me spend money and get it immediately.
least obvious shill
>tfw you are the only kid at school that unlocked final destination and G&W
>other kids one-by-one each day ask to borrow your memory card to copy your save on to theirs
>easily dispatch of your friends in 3v1 matchups with your esoteric knowledge of forward tilts and roll spamming
>no youtube or publicized tournaments yet
>as far as you can tell, you are the greatest super smash bros player in the universe
zoomers will never know this feeling
>oh shit, here comes anon
>HUFF HUFF NO, YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND
>I NEEEEEEEEEED MY INSTANT GRATIFICATION
>NOOO YOU HAVE TO PLAY FOR TWENTY HOURS BEFORE YOU CAN BE MEWTWO BECAUSE... BECAUSE YOU JUST DO, OKAY?
>muh mewtwo
yeah that one unlock goal sucked still doesn't mean that having unlockables should be a thing of the past anyways
just leave your gamecube on overnight dude
Smash Ultimate does this shit with Spirit Training
24hrs just to get like 30lvl ups, but atleast is active while off
>redditfrog avatar
>retarded and disingenuous
you'd be surprise how low the floor is for the average smash player
for the longest time I did not know that Fans and Mr. Saturn deplete shields like crazy
in my circle barely anyone bothers to shield so I also never knew that shieldbreaking
Jigglypuff is an instant kill for that fighter as gag ever since Smash Bros 64, thats crazy
Yeah I think that was almost every circle. When you're a kid shielding and guarding is lame even in real fighting games. No one who played Melee as a kid ever air dodged ever either, because it puts you into freefall and so we all observed first-hand how often the CPU will kill itself doing it.
also in a circle that is unaware of touney people thought I was a god for being able to Yoshi to aim his egg throw consistently and short hop aerial spam but I didn't know what a wave dash was
also everyone thought jigglypuff was shit for not using her aerial game at all
For modern games, OP is unironically correct. Grinding to unlock all the characters in Smash Ultimate is fucking horrendous and serves no purpose. If I pay for the game I want to have all my shit unlocked on day one.
shut the fuck up tourneyfag
go drown in pools, online-warrior.
For overexpsoed modern games sure, its just a chore.
Back in the time of melee's release it was awesome when you did some random shit and then got told you just unlocked a secret character none of your friends even knew about.
the last thing that captured that feel was honestly the dojo when fighters were revealed out of fucking nowhere first thing in the morning checking the dojo
however shit like Toon Link, Wolf and Jigglypuff I I was surprised to see when I stopped using the internet when the japanese release of Brawl came so I knew better
I just want trophies back
Then stop rosterfagging. The more they have to focus on 200+ stages and 80+ fucking characters and balancing is less time for game mechanics and fun extras.
where do you draw the line?
I wouldn't mind 40 with about 25 vets and 15 newcomers in rotation
>Ever cutting an N64 character
Fuck off zoom-zoom.
theres no way in todays world that Jigglypuff should be a priority over as say an Inkling
Smash as a series is also something worth respecting. It's not about Jigglypuff, it's about respecting a series long tradition. There's a reason Captain Falcon is still important, even you on some level realize this.
F-Zero has a presence regardless of Smash Bros, with MK8 and Nintendoland and now F-Zero 99 and I just like him more
Yeah F-Zero and Star Fox are just super crucial Nintendo franchises, not like F-Zero's last game since 2005 is an online 99 game. What was Star Fox's last release? Zero? What was the last one anyone liked? You on some level recognize that series tradition is important placing them so high up. If you honestly believed what you did Marth would be in 12 since that series actually still gets releases.
EAD Priviledges is EAD Priviledges for Fox and Falcon, Marth is Mr. Fire Emblem like Pikachu is Mr. Pokemon
The series is co-owned by HAL and since Brawl are always developed externally. Even still you just don't get it.
I see what you're saying but I just don't care
I see where you are coming from like would it be worth it to replace Sheik
with Impa, i would say so, functionally, impa can do every do every Sheik can
do and more, alongside with the benefit of actually being a character of her own
rather than an extension of Zelda, plus you can have a win-win situation with
Impa being a newcomer that works like Sheik with a new bag of tricks while
you can still keep Sheik as an echo, no such thing can be done with Jigglypuff
when puff is gone, puff is gone, I guess kirby can be in spirit of gengar
You really just do not understand. Let's start over, why is a Sentinel important for Marvel vs Capcom games? It's not a particularly important Marvel character. Surely some other giant robot can do the same thing. The importance is Marvel vs Capcom itself, it has a history there worth respecting. Same reason Iron Man pulls out a giant fuck you gun as a super, does he ever have a fucking gun teleport in to shoot a big laser? If he does it's obscure at best.
Likewise, Sheik, Jigglypuff or any number of "disposable" characters are only disposable if you look at the smash cast as a roster of guests but that is simply not the case. Smash is its own series with its own identity and staples. That's why Ganondorf will always do the Warlock Punch, that's why Jigglypuff is in and that's why Impa is never replacing Sheik. Every Smash discussion is full of people who simply do not understand crossover series being series themselves.
people thought the same about Ice Climbers, who gives a shit if jiggs get cut over more significant characters
Jigglypuff and Mewtwo deserve a spot over trainer imo
Mewtwo I can see, but Jiggs, hell no
Anti-cutfags really are annoying as fuck thanks to getting spoiled with Ultimate. Jigglypuff was nearly cut every fucking game. The original 12 are so special and sacred until one day they aren't.
imagine if there was this shit for Mario Kart with people insisting on DK Jr
he would be cool nevertheless
Cuts are necessary but you're a fool if you think it's a good idea to cut the characters who have been present since the start.
Ice Climbers only got cut once due to the 3DS tying them down. They made the models, they intended to include them, this is well documented. Ice Climbers also aren't N64 characters.
Different series expectations, MK has almost no reverence for its cast. From the second game they tossed out 2 characters.
you don't seriously think Jigglypuff should have more priority than Peach
I'm a realist so I know Peach and Mario's entire ensemble is good as gold for these crossovers but in my heart I feel that N64 roster is forever. The image that sparked this topic is complete horseshit even from his perspective, roster is not shrinking below Brawl's size at the absolute least. Nintendo is not putting out a 12 character game like some broke indie.
My favorite experiences in Melee as a kid was unlocking the characters. I didn't have easy access to the internet, so I had no idea who was in or how to unlock them. I'd just randomly play and get surprised. You have no idea how shocked I was when I unlocked mewtwo, since it takes so long for him to show up. That being said, having to unlock characters in any competitive game is dogshit design. Having to buy them like we do now is even worse though.
bump
ok i read the op, i call op a naggerhomosexual before this thread archives
The only BS unlock in Melee is Mewtwo, the rest are fine and can be earned through natural play.
>Everything should be unlocked
no everything is going to be locked behind DLC and paywalls and you're going to like it homosexual
Nostalgianaggers itt seething
no fuck off but maybe there should be cheat codes.
>there should be cheat codes
my nigga
There was a time when secrets, unlocks, etc were commonplace, because its fun to work with a good amount of content and work your way up, and be able to explore each new aspect piece by piece.
No secrets/ unlocks is a modern "feature". Your zoomy perspective is null and void.
Its a gatcha mechanic meant to artificially extend the game
"Muh nostalgia niggah" is not a valid argument
now say it without buzzwords
This is why I like new Resident Evils. They have the BS "unlocks" like a character model viewer (why is that in everything these days) as well as fun unlocks that make new playthroughs fun.
Shut up
Sonic R is based when you unlock rainbow
You mean when you're literally super sonic racing? Yes, anon, it is truly based
I miss cheat codes so much. THAT'S when games were fun for players, and presumably the developers. Who didn't love goofy shit like "big head mode", "infinite _____", or "god mode"?
That way you can enjoy the game plain jane, or with a little extra something.
I miss new game+ like you wouldn't believe too, it's way too rare in gaming these days
Zoo Tycoon giving money for shift+4 but you have to hold it and if anything is built which can degrade, it degrades, freeing your animals to kill guests, so you have to remember to hold it down for a while at the start of the game
Kino
No, it should have a Konami code style cheat you can enter to unlock everything
Lmao this is really how gay little entitled zoomers think. How about apply yourself for once in your miserable life?
I liked unlocking stuff as a kid.
>Everything should be unlocked
No.
>Why?
Because God said so. It's best to do what God says or you'll end up burning in hell.
If they want to pull shit like this at least have a cheatcode that unlocks everything. Having to grind up fresh saves of Melee several times was pure suffering
Having to unlock all the characters again in ultimate was fun. Especially since the cpu difficult was higher on launch.
Ultimate was pretty buggy at launch
More of the game should be locked and then unlocked through gameplay. Just not through "play x number of matches" attrition, that was fucking stupid.
>unlockable characters
>they're all actually shitty and fucking useless
I hate when they make you unlock your main but also they're not even mid tier fuck that.
2 top tiers are unlockable but yeah most are either clones or trash or both
zoom zoom