>good levels
In terms of what, aesthetic? Sure. They kinda run their course with reusing them though. The first acts are generally the superior version, except for Bullet Canyon. That one just kinda sucks. Music is bitching though.
Other than that, the gameplay is only bad because you're forced to play through the same stages 4 times each. What the FUCK were they thinking.
>Other than that, the gameplay is only bad because you're forced to play through the same stages 4 times each
And then the one Team the changes it up has some of the most tedious or annoying levels. I love Heroes to a degree. Gave us Omegas as well WORTHLESS CONSUMER MODELS.
>Other than that, the gameplay is only bad because you're forced to play through the same stages 4 times each.
The gameplay is bad because the characters don't feel good to control.
They're not the best but more than half the time you'll be in control. That's why the level design sucks. Plus the "combat" aspect is annoying too, I just wanna go fast, not stop and fight.
Even the most glassy-eyed Heroesfag can't even pretend that the gameplay wasn't a massive downgrade from SA2, also the game is incredibly backloaded for some reason because some of the better parts of it ended up in the second half, that's the only time a Sonic game ever did that while the first half has the most annoying casino-themed level in the franchise
instead of playing a knuckles level that actually goes fast and controls well every now and then heroes makes you swap to a really slow and shitty knuckles who can't even glide or climb anymore in order to punch robots in order to open a door and then the automatic lock on breaks and you go flying clean off the platform to your death instead and have to start over multiple times in every single level
"heroes is good because it's sonic gameplay all the time" would be true if the game didn't massively change what sonic gameplay actually is for the worse and then also control like shit
what other sonic game before heroes made sonic come to a complete stop in order to kill robots to open a door?
4 weeks ago
Anonymous
Adventure 2 when I had to play as Tails instead
*mic drops*
4 weeks ago
Anonymous
I can replay the sonic levels in the adventure games and not have to deal with tails and knuckles unless I want to play them. in heroes every single level is forced to constantly do non sonic shit
That's a good thing though. It always gives you something to do.
by this logic then the adventure games making you play as non sonic characters all the time is also good, especially since knuckles can actually climb/glide in those instead of being a slow piece of shit that exists to punch enemies that are killed faster by a leveled up sonic or tails anyway.heroes stinks.
4 weeks ago
Anonymous
That's a good thing though. It always gives you something to do.
4 weeks ago
Anonymous
>open a door
Most of the time, Heroes has you defeat enemies to unlock a cage.
I had it on PS2 and it ran like shit and I hated it.
One stage started with running straight forward onto a rail, rounding a corner and falling out the world.
the ps2 version is the WORST version of this game and i think people that think this game is irredeemable trash must have grown up playing it on ps2. otherwise it's alright, nothing too great other than good soundtrack (obligatory) and giving us omega; nothing awful other than the casino levels with their janky horribly physics and some chaotix missions (especially extra ones) being tedious.
It's very repetitive but the way the game is designed makes it impossible to change it. I think the branching path nonsense in Shadow was a better use of the idea.
>Sonic Team at japan makes SA1 in 1997/1998. >after SA1 hits shelves in japan, Iizuka and some of the most important members behind the game pack their things and move to San Francisco in early 1999, where they establish a division which will only focus on making Sonic games for the Dreamcast. Meanwhile, the rest of the team in japan would develop non Sonic related games (which ended up being ChuChu Rocket!, Samba de Amigo, and Phantasy Star Online) >because of the Dreamcast's abrupt death, SA2 is the only game which San Francisco team got to make for the system. >after Sega went third party, they decided that San Francisco team would make the next 3D platformer of the series. Unlike SA2, it would be a multiplatform game for Gamecube, Xbox and PS2. It also would have to be aimed at family friendly audiences and be as innocuous/toothless as possible. >while the San Francisco team worked only on that multiplatform Sonic game, the team in japan developed Phantasy Star Online expansions, worked alongside Dimps on portable Sonic games for Gameboy Advance, and created an original IP : Billy Hatcher.
>It also would have to be aimed at family friendly audiences and be as innocuous/toothless as possible. >if a story isn't 1000% serious and dark all the time then it's a goo-goo ga-ga story for babbies
Really hate this light switch brained mindset Sonicfags have.
team sonic 5/10
team dark 7/10
team rose 1/10
team chaotix 3/10
super hard mode that you played by downloading a save file instead of actually 100%ing this shitty game 8/10
the game has a 10/10 concept held back by most versions of the game being extremely fucking glitchy, the 'good' version still being really fucking janky, and you needing a PHD in the mechanics in order to actually have fun instead of getting really frustrated constantly
its the only 3D sonic game that's ever had the feeling of the genesis sonic games where you just play the whole game in an hour or two and try to get the levels in a slightly better way and when its good its really good, but you're inveitably going to get killed because the game is a broken piece of shit and ragequit
>super hard mode that you played by downloading a save file instead of actually 100%ing this shitty game 8/10
It's funny because ShadowTH is exactly the same way. I always recommend people do that instead of actually playing the main story and just watching the cutscenes on Youtube. It just isn't worth it and you're missing absolutely nothing playing all those shitty repetitive missions and Westopolis over a dozen times.
sonic heroes is genuinely childish though, it's not just an 'all ages' or 'light hearted' story. you have shit like sonic describing himself as a sonic hero
The PAL version set to 60 hz mode runs 20% faster than NTSC versions, and it looks pretty crazy
Anyone have enough experience with both versions to say if PAL actually feels better or is it only worth it for those with speedrunning autism?
I think what it comes down to is that Heroes tripled the amount of action in stages but the action isn't fun. The platforming is shit and makes the whole thing frustrating in a bad way.
SA1 and 2 are similar in that they have this baseline where the action never overwhelms and in SA1 the stages give just enough room for exploration and making your own path using your own tricks and shortcuts. SA1 was great for this.
SA2 streamlined the exploration but kept the even pace, linear flow to stages while adding more stuff to do along the way; they play like streamlined SA1 stages.
I think they took the bad pacing from Shadow and made it worse in Heroes.
you waste robots while holding forward and avoid hits as Tails, yes Mission Street and the kart course is shit. For Knuckles you just follow the radar and go as fast as you want.
I played them to death in the past so I guess I'm biased. I remember most of Heroes feeling like a gauntlet and getting screwed by cheap shots and ganked when you don't have the special move.
It's a very flawed game but it's soulful as fuck. I miss when Sonic games were anime style instead of this lame-ass Winnie the Pooh crap it's doing now.
team sonic 5/10
team dark 7/10
team rose 1/10
team chaotix 3/10
super hard mode that you played by downloading a save file instead of actually 100%ing this shitty game 8/10
the game has a 10/10 concept held back by most versions of the game being extremely fucking glitchy, the 'good' version still being really fucking janky, and you needing a PHD in the mechanics in order to actually have fun instead of getting really frustrated constantly
its the only 3D sonic game that's ever had the feeling of the genesis sonic games where you just play the whole game in an hour or two and try to get the levels in a slightly better way and when its good its really good, but you're inveitably going to get killed because the game is a broken piece of shit and ragequit
Rose and Chaotix are much worse than the other two stories just because they don't have the light speed dash. They're also missing a lot of set pieces.
Nigga you don't need a grandiose plot to make a good game. Arcade games have proven that. Sonic was already an established brand, all they had to do was just make a good game and it would sell itself now that it's available on much more global and mainstream platforms.
>1 (Genesis/Master System) >2 (Master System/Genesis) >CD >Chaos >3 >& Knuckles >Chaotix >3D Blast >Jam (the 3D hub with missions) >Adventure >Adventure 2 >Heroes
All the home console platformers by that point. You judge if Heroes is one of the better or worse ones from this bunch.
the 3D hub from Jam introduced these item boxes shaped like balloons with a star symbol. SA2 brought them back. Afterwards, they reappear in Heroes, Shadow, Rush 1, some of the olympic games, and Lost World.
jam can be beaten in like 30 minutes its not really a mainline title, though its nice to think of it that way i guess since its the closest there is on the saturn
the 3D hub from Jam introduced these item boxes shaped like balloons with a star symbol. SA2 brought them back. Afterwards, they reappear in Heroes, Shadow, Rush 1, some of the olympic games, and Lost World.
Boss fights in Heroes suck compared to the better boss fights in Adventure saga (Chaos 6, Egg Viper, Egg Walker, Zero, Beta, Perfect Chaos, King Boom Boo, Sonic vs Egg Golem, Knuckles vs Rouge, Sonic vs Shadow at ARK, Biolizard, Finalhazard)
Even Chaos 0 has more inspiration in it than all the Heroes bosses. Sonic fighting at a city hall under the rain with a helicopter above him and the place surrounded by police cars is an inspired concept.
>Team Sonic starts in the desert >Team Dark starts in Eggman's base >Team Rose starts at the beach >Team Chaotix starts in the city >all of them begin the game at Seaside Hill anyway
>give each characters 10 unique stages to plow through for diversity >nah, let's just make em play 14 stages 56 times
why
they could've made it 7 at least for each emerald, why are they fucking retarded
>give each characters 10 unique stages to plow through for diversity >nah, let's just make em play 14 stages 56 times
why
they could've made it 7 at least for each emerald, why are they fucking retarded
>complains about autism kicking in to 100% the game
Wow now here's a novel idea. What if......................................you just don't? Shadow gets this same complaint. I don't want to collect chaos emeralds in ANY sonic game.
>these niggas were cut during development
Fuck man, and while it might have added to the tedium, at least they wouldn't be stuck behind Sega's arbitrary Classic Only Wall.
You needs mods to run it on PC
good levels
good music
bad gameplay
This. It's kino but it's heavily flawed.
>good levels
In terms of what, aesthetic? Sure. They kinda run their course with reusing them though. The first acts are generally the superior version, except for Bullet Canyon. That one just kinda sucks. Music is bitching though.
Other than that, the gameplay is only bad because you're forced to play through the same stages 4 times each. What the FUCK were they thinking.
>Other than that, the gameplay is only bad because you're forced to play through the same stages 4 times each
And then the one Team the changes it up has some of the most tedious or annoying levels. I love Heroes to a degree. Gave us Omegas as well
WORTHLESS CONSUMER MODELS.
>Other than that, the gameplay is only bad because you're forced to play through the same stages 4 times each.
The gameplay is bad because the characters don't feel good to control.
They're not the best but more than half the time you'll be in control. That's why the level design sucks. Plus the "combat" aspect is annoying too, I just wanna go fast, not stop and fight.
Even the most glassy-eyed Heroesfag can't even pretend that the gameplay wasn't a massive downgrade from SA2, also the game is incredibly backloaded for some reason because some of the better parts of it ended up in the second half, that's the only time a Sonic game ever did that while the first half has the most annoying casino-themed level in the franchise
The music in the casino stage is so good though that it makes up for it.
Sonic Heroes btfos Adventure 2 on the basis that it isn't shoving a knuckles scouting section every other level.
instead of playing a knuckles level that actually goes fast and controls well every now and then heroes makes you swap to a really slow and shitty knuckles who can't even glide or climb anymore in order to punch robots in order to open a door and then the automatic lock on breaks and you go flying clean off the platform to your death instead and have to start over multiple times in every single level
"heroes is good because it's sonic gameplay all the time" would be true if the game didn't massively change what sonic gameplay actually is for the worse and then also control like shit
>"heroes is good because it's sonic gameplay all the time"
is true. cope
what other sonic game before heroes made sonic come to a complete stop in order to kill robots to open a door?
Adventure 2 when I had to play as Tails instead
*mic drops*
I can replay the sonic levels in the adventure games and not have to deal with tails and knuckles unless I want to play them. in heroes every single level is forced to constantly do non sonic shit
by this logic then the adventure games making you play as non sonic characters all the time is also good, especially since knuckles can actually climb/glide in those instead of being a slow piece of shit that exists to punch enemies that are killed faster by a leveled up sonic or tails anyway.heroes stinks.
That's a good thing though. It always gives you something to do.
>open a door
Most of the time, Heroes has you defeat enemies to unlock a cage.
Pretty much.
it wasn't good in the first place
I had it on PS2 and it ran like shit and I hated it.
One stage started with running straight forward onto a rail, rounding a corner and falling out the world.
the ps2 version is the WORST version of this game and i think people that think this game is irredeemable trash must have grown up playing it on ps2. otherwise it's alright, nothing too great other than good soundtrack (obligatory) and giving us omega; nothing awful other than the casino levels with their janky horribly physics and some chaotix missions (especially extra ones) being tedious.
This. The Gamecube version is the definitive version.
Either Gamecube or Xbox are fine
SHIT
RAH
SHIT
RAH
SHIT
RAH
It's very repetitive but the way the game is designed makes it impossible to change it. I think the branching path nonsense in Shadow was a better use of the idea.
>Taking what the Adventure games built and shitting all over it.
No.
Adventure 2 pacing was beyond terrible. Non-Sonic playstyles should not be mixed in the main story. Cutscenes don't make the game good.
Stop playing nostalgiaslop
what's the best way to play this game right now? I remember renting it from blockbuster twice but I couldn't finish it
PC if you can follow some instructions from the pcgamingwiki.
Otherwise just avoid the PS2 version.
>Sonic Team at japan makes SA1 in 1997/1998.
>after SA1 hits shelves in japan, Iizuka and some of the most important members behind the game pack their things and move to San Francisco in early 1999, where they establish a division which will only focus on making Sonic games for the Dreamcast. Meanwhile, the rest of the team in japan would develop non Sonic related games (which ended up being ChuChu Rocket!, Samba de Amigo, and Phantasy Star Online)
>because of the Dreamcast's abrupt death, SA2 is the only game which San Francisco team got to make for the system.
>after Sega went third party, they decided that San Francisco team would make the next 3D platformer of the series. Unlike SA2, it would be a multiplatform game for Gamecube, Xbox and PS2. It also would have to be aimed at family friendly audiences and be as innocuous/toothless as possible.
>while the San Francisco team worked only on that multiplatform Sonic game, the team in japan developed Phantasy Star Online expansions, worked alongside Dimps on portable Sonic games for Gameboy Advance, and created an original IP : Billy Hatcher.
>It also would have to be aimed at family friendly audiences and be as innocuous/toothless as possible.
>if a story isn't 1000% serious and dark all the time then it's a goo-goo ga-ga story for babbies
Really hate this light switch brained mindset Sonicfags have.
>super hard mode that you played by downloading a save file instead of actually 100%ing this shitty game 8/10
It's funny because ShadowTH is exactly the same way. I always recommend people do that instead of actually playing the main story and just watching the cutscenes on Youtube. It just isn't worth it and you're missing absolutely nothing playing all those shitty repetitive missions and Westopolis over a dozen times.
sonic heroes is genuinely childish though, it's not just an 'all ages' or 'light hearted' story. you have shit like sonic describing himself as a sonic hero
think I enjoyed Shadow the edge hog more
The PAL version set to 60 hz mode runs 20% faster than NTSC versions, and it looks pretty crazy
Anyone have enough experience with both versions to say if PAL actually feels better or is it only worth it for those with speedrunning autism?
Would you live in Grand Metropolis?
I would if Eggman would stop building his energy blocking shit.
I think what it comes down to is that Heroes tripled the amount of action in stages but the action isn't fun. The platforming is shit and makes the whole thing frustrating in a bad way.
SA1 and 2 are similar in that they have this baseline where the action never overwhelms and in SA1 the stages give just enough room for exploration and making your own path using your own tricks and shortcuts. SA1 was great for this.
SA2 streamlined the exploration but kept the even pace, linear flow to stages while adding more stuff to do along the way; they play like streamlined SA1 stages.
I think they took the bad pacing from Shadow and made it worse in Heroes.
>SA2 streamlined the exploration but kept the even pace,
>Playing 1 sonic level followed by a tails then a knuckles level is an even pace
kys retard.
you waste robots while holding forward and avoid hits as Tails, yes Mission Street and the kart course is shit. For Knuckles you just follow the radar and go as fast as you want.
I played them to death in the past so I guess I'm biased. I remember most of Heroes feeling like a gauntlet and getting screwed by cheap shots and ganked when you don't have the special move.
it was great git gud homosexuals
t. played it as a child and live solely off nostalgia
It's a very flawed game but it's soulful as fuck. I miss when Sonic games were anime style instead of this lame-ass Winnie the Pooh crap it's doing now.
team sonic 5/10
team dark 7/10
team rose 1/10
team chaotix 3/10
super hard mode that you played by downloading a save file instead of actually 100%ing this shitty game 8/10
the game has a 10/10 concept held back by most versions of the game being extremely fucking glitchy, the 'good' version still being really fucking janky, and you needing a PHD in the mechanics in order to actually have fun instead of getting really frustrated constantly
its the only 3D sonic game that's ever had the feeling of the genesis sonic games where you just play the whole game in an hour or two and try to get the levels in a slightly better way and when its good its really good, but you're inveitably going to get killed because the game is a broken piece of shit and ragequit
Rose and Chaotix are much worse than the other two stories just because they don't have the light speed dash. They're also missing a lot of set pieces.
It's baffling how Iizuka, Naka and all of Sega thought that this was the direction to take after SA2.
It's just a little fun all-stars game.
You just want some grand convoluted plot written by hideo kojima.
Nigga you don't need a grandiose plot to make a good game. Arcade games have proven that. Sonic was already an established brand, all they had to do was just make a good game and it would sell itself now that it's available on much more global and mainstream platforms.
Worst 3D Sonic game.
Rouge's in-game model sucks in this game compared to her SA2 model.
>1 (Genesis/Master System)
>2 (Master System/Genesis)
>CD
>Chaos
>3
>& Knuckles
>Chaotix
>3D Blast
>Jam (the 3D hub with missions)
>Adventure
>Adventure 2
>Heroes
All the home console platformers by that point. You judge if Heroes is one of the better or worse ones from this bunch.
2 > Adventure > 1 > CD > & Knuckles > Heroes > 3 > Adventure 2
the 3D hub from Jam introduced these item boxes shaped like balloons with a star symbol. SA2 brought them back. Afterwards, they reappear in Heroes, Shadow, Rush 1, some of the olympic games, and Lost World.
jam can be beaten in like 30 minutes its not really a mainline title, though its nice to think of it that way i guess since its the closest there is on the saturn
you dont get items from those though
Still as kino as I remember, and if you don't think it's the illest shit you can go fuck yourself.
Sonic games have to have good music. It's a law.
It was never that good, it's about the same level as sonic superstars. Just indifference
it would be the best sonic game if it wasn't a buggy mess.
inb4 bait, have a nice day.
Boss fights in Heroes suck compared to the better boss fights in Adventure saga (Chaos 6, Egg Viper, Egg Walker, Zero, Beta, Perfect Chaos, King Boom Boo, Sonic vs Egg Golem, Knuckles vs Rouge, Sonic vs Shadow at ARK, Biolizard, Finalhazard)
>use homing attack
>boss dies and you win
awesome
i literally just spammed the attack button till the boss died, bosses in any adventure game isn't worth mentioning.
Even Chaos 0 has more inspiration in it than all the Heroes bosses. Sonic fighting at a city hall under the rain with a helicopter above him and the place surrounded by police cars is an inspired concept.
>only cares about spectacle
meh
>Mandatory to play through every difficulty, even the baby mode, disguised as different story modes.
>Team Sonic starts in the desert
>Team Dark starts in Eggman's base
>Team Rose starts at the beach
>Team Chaotix starts in the city
>all of them begin the game at Seaside Hill anyway
>give each characters 10 unique stages to plow through for diversity
>nah, let's just make em play 14 stages 56 times
why
they could've made it 7 at least for each emerald, why are they fucking retarded
>complains about autism kicking in to 100% the game
Wow now here's a novel idea. What if......................................you just don't? Shadow gets this same complaint. I don't want to collect chaos emeralds in ANY sonic game.
>he skips out on parts of the game because he's retarded
I just don't think you like video games
>play game
>move on to better game
crippling autism
(You)
Concession
Nice of you for hand me yours. Thanks for playing.
Accepted
>these niggas were cut during development
Fuck man, and while it might have added to the tedium, at least they wouldn't be stuck behind Sega's arbitrary Classic Only Wall.
Why not just make them a Team boss?