Hypothetically speaking, if I were to make a setting based more on medieval literature and misbeliefs rather than Tolkien and modern fantasy tropes, w...

Hypothetically speaking, if I were to make a setting based more on medieval literature and misbeliefs rather than Tolkien and modern fantasy tropes, what would be an appropriate list of playable races?
So far I've got
>Humans (duh)
>Blemmyes
>Cynocephali
>Woodwoses
>Gnomes(?)
Any other enticing options? I'd be interested in any ideas for such a setting in general.

  1. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    >if I were to make a setting
    Are you, though?

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Maybe I will, maybe I won't, what's wrong with an honest to goodness thought experiment?

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >setting
        To set what in? Several dozen more dogshit spam threads?

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >spam
          That said, I am open to system suggestions, something like WFRP but not as deeply tied to the warhammer setting perhaps.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Pendragon is specifically Arthurian and is very heavily built around those notions of chivalry, though I don't know its mechanics in any detail.

            Could pull parts from OSR domain play and d20 Rokugan to try and assemble its core around D&Disms for popularity reasons, but I'm pretty sure Pendragon is the closest specialized system.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              I considered Pendragon but I assumed it would be more strictly focused on playing as knights when I'd like something more general.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                It's still a place to look, and adjusting the incentive structure to have those same Knights as the desired end goal rather than the starting assumption shouldn't be an ENORMOUS workload.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                You should look into Harnmaster

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Instead of "gnomes", consider fairies as being the "neutral angels" which didn't rebel neither fought the rebels, so they fell only as far as the world. Fey can be a huge variety, from Sidhe and Changelings all the way to Djinn and Cantabrian Trentis.

            There are also giants, ogres, nephilim, cambions, mouros...

            Ars Magica anon. Both the rule system and the setting are similar to what you propose. Fantasy Europe that's actually based on medieval folklore. There's also Vampire: The Dark Ages as a system option, because Ars has the players as part of a larger group, that might include a number of NPCs.

            https://www.redcap.org/page/Character_Creation

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              >consider fairies as being the "neutral angels" which didn't rebel neither fought the rebels, so they fell only as far as the world
              elves also have this lore attached to them, but then again you can easily just make elves and fairies interchangeable, same sort of thing

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              https://i.imgur.com/DpgZqX7.jpg

              Hypothetically speaking, if I were to make a setting based more on medieval literature and misbeliefs rather than Tolkien and modern fantasy tropes, what would be an appropriate list of playable races?
              So far I've got
              >Humans (duh)
              >Blemmyes
              >Cynocephali
              >Woodwoses
              >Gnomes(?)
              Any other enticing options? I'd be interested in any ideas for such a setting in general.

              Fomorians and youkai as well. The former are stereotyped as 'giants', but they came in all shapes and sizes, as did youkai. Several youkai are very likely feudal misunderstandings of rotten corpses or getting lost on the road, too.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Ars magica, or even better aquelarre, the latter which has baked in christian mysticism, which is traditionally medieval.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          > Another 'worldbuilding' thread
          disgusting

          Worldbuilding has been part of /tg/ since the beginnings of this board. Just ignore those chuds

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            This thread doesn't even PRETEND to be about world-building.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              This poster doesn't even PRETEND to have read the thread.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            a fa/tg/uy would never use the word chud.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              You wish, chud.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                The hell is a chud
                Looks like a Twitter term to avoid using real insults

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                A Chud is a kind of magical being, like an Elf, than lives underground and has a big plasma sun than gives them energy and the ability ot raise food in the underworld.
                That or a tribe of balts or Finno-ugric people.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                That's the creature from the Finnish mythology. Chud as used by the libs is derived from the eponymous horror movie and it means roughly the same as "/pol/tard"

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Maybe he is? Maybe he isnt? Why do you Give a fuck you little Shit. Fuck off.

  2. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    > Another 'worldbuilding' thread
    disgusting

  3. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I need you to understand that races are superficial and what you DO with them and their place in the world matters much more than something as rote as shape.
    But like other anons I also believe that you're a worthless idea guy who's never gonna make anything, ever.

  4. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    >Sciapods
    >Panotti
    >Collogruis
    >Headfusslers, Piperbirds and other Boschian abominations
    >Creatures from medieval Bestiaries
    >Creatures/races from medieval heraldry
    >Obvious stuff like dragons and unicorns but looking more like in the medieval depictions

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >Creatures from medieval Bestiaries
      Pic related for example

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous
        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >Creatures from medieval Bestiaries
          Pic related for example

          Gotta watch those little buggers.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Do these guys have an 'official' name or are they just 'rabbit men'?
            Are they meant to be rabbits or hares?
            Does anyone know what their symbolic role was, if any?

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              Probably just doodles from bored scribes.
              I've seen people hypothesize that the animal-men are symbolic of men falling to their baser desires (lust for rabbits, sloth for snails, etc) but I don't think there's much evidence.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              Probably just doodles from bored scribes.
              I've seen people hypothesize that the animal-men are symbolic of men falling to their baser desires (lust for rabbits, sloth for snails, etc) but I don't think there's much evidence.

              The reason for it is extremely simple: monks grew their own vegetables, and rabbits were the biggest pests they had to deal with. It's literally just a joke where the monks are portraying the 'invading' rabbits as marauding warriors out to get the poor innocent monks. Snails often appear alongside them as well because they would have been the other major pest, but they're easier to deal with and less destructive so they're not as prominent.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                That's like, your interpretation, man. I much prefer the one that links snails to the Lombards.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        [...]

        Gotta watch those little buggers.

        Rabbits are the goblins of the setting, the reproduce at an incredible rate and ravage the farmlands

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          That gives a whole new meaning to Bunnies & Burrows

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >Sciapods
      I don't really think they're player character material on account of their one leggedness
      >Panotti
      A good option but they don't have as much going for them as the ones I listed
      >Collogruis
      Now this one I like, good find
      >Headfusslers, Piperbirds
      A quick google search doesn't turn up much on either but I assume they'd make good monster material, do you have a source?
      >and other Boschian abominations
      Again, good monster material

      >Creatures from medieval Bestiaries
      Pic related for example

      Love these little bros

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >A quick google search doesn't turn up much on either
        That's because those aren't offical names for them. They are just a recurring theme in Boschs body of work. Look up the garden of earthly delights or any other bosch painting in a good resolution. You'll find them.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          Oh shit, you mean this little bro?

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Hell yes. He's one of them.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Someone should make Bosch miniatures if no one has already.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              For a ttrpg context? Seconded. Figures of them already exist though. I own a few of them

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                Yeah, like stuff you can kitbash, base, and paint yourself, that'd be pretty cash. Where'd you get yours and what scale do you reckon they are?

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                got mine from here: https://arthouse-online.nl/en/product-category/figurines-sculptures-en/hieronymus-bosch-en/
                They are a bit pricey but really good quality. There are cheaper ones but I really like them.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              Great fucking idea

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              There are some, but they are few and far between. Eureka Miniatures has an army inspired by them. Harwood Hobbies has a couple inspired by them, the imp is directly from a Bosch painting. The now ancient Valley of the 4 Winds line at Minifigs has some Bosch stuff in there. Including the head on legs gryllus creature

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >The Garden of Earthly Delights
          Bird up.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      I used to have a comic when I was a kid, it had "Boschniks", which were an army of Bosch monsters.

      https://ausreprints.net/series/8907/0

      There! I knew I wasn't having an antacid flashback.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >I used to have a comic when I was a kid, it had "Boschniks", which were an army of Bosch monsters.
        >https://ausreprints.net/series/8907/0
        Damn is it possible to view this without buying it? I really want to view it now.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >Damn is it possible to view this without buying it?

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            I already tried but where in the fuck would you get esoteric stuff like that? This shit is pretty obscure.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      this, two legged snake-ass dragons with dog heads and bat wings

  5. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    >Ctrl+F
    >No Wildman
    Well, this thread Is shit

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Wildmen have turned up in a lot of other medieval based bestiary threads already iirc. You can get the ball rolling on wildmen if you want.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >No Wildman
      >Literally says Woodwose in the op

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        If it ain't dacing, it ain´t no friend of mine

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          WE CAN DANCE IF WE WANNA

  6. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Cynocephali
    Blemye
    Aegipanes
    Gegenees
    Gorgades
    Hippopodes
    Machyles
    Panotii
    Nuli
    Sciapods
    Pelargolai
    Pards
    Salamanders
    Sylphs
    Gnomes
    Undines
    Green men

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Luv me pards, simple as.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Stat them /tg/

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        I've always been partial to race as class so I like this approach

        . The details could be shifted to make them more functional but I appreciate the idea behind it, particularly with the idea of rolling for your tribe. Were I to tweak it I'd give them better weapon and armour proficiencies to be on par with other demihuman classes, and let them summon tribal warriors to make up for not being able to build a stronghold, like the AD&D barbarian.

  7. 2 months ago
    Anonymous
  8. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Not playable race, but imo essential part of such a setting would be demons from various demonologies.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      What about cambions though?

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Cambions could function like tieflings and nephilim like aasimars. Personally what I call the two anyways.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Fuck tieflings. Cambions should be the only wizard race for "human" pcs.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      While technically a century late, the Goetic/Grimoire demons could be a fun concept to play with.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      While technically a century late, the Goetic/Grimoire demons could be a fun concept to play with.

      Expanding on this, there should be a class called a sigilist which uses sigils to summon monsters, casts spells, etc.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        This seems like a very narrow concept for a class, assuming this would even be in a class based system. Why can't sigils just be part of the wiseman class' repetoire?

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Fair enough. Maybe it's just a wizard then? And I feel like the system would be class based.
          Speaking of, what classes would there be? I would think it would be pretty bog-standard tbh:

          >Alchemist
          >Barbarian
          >Bard
          >Druid
          >Fighter
          >Paladin
          >Priest (Good Cleric)
          >Ranger (Hunter)
          >Rogue (Assassin, Thief, Etc.)
          >Sorcerer (Innate Magic Users)
          >Witch/Warlock (Neutral/Evil Clerics)
          >Wizard (Studied Magic)

          I feel like there is a better word for rogue and sorcerer for a medieval setting.
          I could also see there being a difference in how holy entities are contacted/how they work versus unholy ones in a medieval setting so I specified them as separate (priests and warlocks).

          Cavalier, spiritualist/medium, and summoner fit the medieval motif pretty well, but they might be too niche to have as a core class. When I say spiritualist, I mean someone who deals with the dead but have an innate connection to them. Or almost like a "neutral" cleric dealing with entities which are not undead but not angelic nor demonic like agathodaemons or genii.

          I'm not sure if monk would be a thing here as there isn't really (fighting) monks in medieval fantasy. Maybe it would be a brawler or fisticuffs sort of thing instead?

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            I've always felt less is more when it comes to classes, I'd probably stick with the basics and have witches (male and female) in place of wizards. Have magic as a whole be more about rituals and components.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              You don't have barbarians in medieval Europe, at least not that fits the D&D archetype.
              Magic users in the medieval mind are making pacts with outsider entities, usually demonic but some also pretended to be able to work with angelic entities.
              So sorcerers (innate magic user) are out, too, I would suggest.
              On the other hand, D&D monks started as a Friar Tuck archetype, so could still fit.
              Druids stricto sensu are from the Roman period, but you have plenty of "wise man close to nature" archetypes, in all sorts of variations, in medieval imagination, so you could still adapt it somehow.
              But for character classes, I would start afresh rather than take the D&D classes and remove the ones that don't belong.

              I disagree. Wizards are kind of required for medieval fantasy. Magic books and grimoires are a staple, you know? I do agree on slimming it down though.

              You don't have barbarians in medieval Europe, at least not that fits the D&D archetype.
              Magic users in the medieval mind are making pacts with outsider entities, usually demonic but some also pretended to be able to work with angelic entities.
              So sorcerers (innate magic user) are out, too, I would suggest.
              On the other hand, D&D monks started as a Friar Tuck archetype, so could still fit.
              Druids stricto sensu are from the Roman period, but you have plenty of "wise man close to nature" archetypes, in all sorts of variations, in medieval imagination, so you could still adapt it somehow.
              But for character classes, I would start afresh rather than take the D&D classes and remove the ones that don't belong.

              >You don't have barbarians in medieval Europe
              Vikings are legit from the Middle Ages. Though I could see wrapping barbarians into the fighter class.
              >But for character classes, I would start afresh rather than take the D&D classes and remove the ones that don't belong.
              Fair point. What are some medieval archetypes?
              I am not sure if barbarian should just be put into a fighter class as a subclass with knight or as it's own, but the concept of barbarians is not unheard of in medieval times, vikings being a plague on monasteries.
              Druids or at least naturemen are a trope as old as civilization itself so I would say have a class for that.
              Definitely a class for holy men, the European medieval ages characterized by their faith in God. And one for demon worshipers if not just lumped into a general religion class like "cleric".
              Bowmen or general archers are so distinct from the time period, you can tell the skeletons of longbowmen apart from other skeletons at the time so I would definitely add an archer class.
              I also think a thief and assassin sort of class would be in order.
              And in Arthurian legend, you have magic wizards like Merlin so wizards would be a must.
              And I do think innately magic people would work, but I can see how it is a point of contention.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                >What are some medieval archetypes?
                Dude, I went through the pain of writing all of this:

                [...]
                [...]
                So for the classes, assuming a cookie cutter model where every class needs a use during combat, I would go with something like this:
                >Knight (well rounded fighter, especially on horseback. With some special skills related to either nobility or faith)
                >Mercenary/adventurers (more pragmatic fighter)
                >Woodsman
                >Bard
                >Saint (cleric-like. performs miracles)
                >Courtesan
                >Merchant
                >Jester
                >Executioner
                As for magic
                >Witch from the Sabbath (witch that made a pact with the devil)
                >Good witch, soothsayer
                >Goethic mage (performs magic by summoning and controlling demons)
                >Kabbalist (performs magic by hacking into the sacred language of reality)
                >Alchemist (try to master the forces of nature through metallurgic and chemical processes)
                >Astrologer/Philosopher (for the Newton, Tycho Brahe characters. Does science, but don't distinguish between the forces of nature and what we would consider supernatural forces)(I wanted to throw that one in just to mess with the stereotypes of the medieval times as an obscurantist period)
                It's difficult to have a class for "monks" because different orders had *very* different ideas of what being a monk meant. Some where into getting themselves through insane physical and psychological suffering. Others were jovial workers. Some were traveling preachers.
                Stuff like workers from a guild (character class: journeyman?) would be great to add in a system which has non-combat centric classes. A game system like Interlock, where your profession gives you additional abilities but don't restrict your skills.

                Ok. I am with [...] in that less is best for classes. This is too much.
                >Wizard/Scholar: Merge Goethic mage, Kabbalist, and Astrologer/Philosopher together into what is essentially a wizard. Even modern Kabbalist often do Goethic shit and it's super similar. Maybe make them into subclasses.
                >Alchemist: Personally would keep alchemist as a separate class as I think it is asking too much to lump it into the scholar/wizard class above.
                >Fighter: Knight and mercenary should be merged into fighter. Have it so you can, again, just make subclasses or things you can invest into. "Barbarians" of the time like vikings can also be put in here.
                >Entertainer: Bard, courtesan, and jester can be merged into an entertainer.
                >Priest: Saint should be a "magic" class like a cleric, performing divine miracles under the lord. I would call them priests personally as saints are a specific thing in Catholicism.
                >Witch: Witch from the Sabbath or who is in cahoots with Satan/not God is also a good one for this sort of setting.
                >Woodsman?: Woodsman works. Archers could also be lumped into here or with fighter. Your choice. I am also not sure if they should be called something other than woodsman. Any thoughts?
                >Sorcerer?: Good witch could essentially be a catch-all for your innate magic users or those who tap into magic via intuition versus scholarly discipline. Nature magic could also fall into this. Idk what you would call this intuitive magic class other than sorcerer though. Any thoughts?
                >Rogue?: We need an assassin or rogue class imo. Thieves and dex-based stuff runs pretty well into this. Any better names other than rogue?
                >Merchant and executioner are more professions or how you play a character versus fantasy classes.

                I suggested executioner as a class because of how unique this profession was in the medieval mindset. They often sold body parts from the people they executed, they often also worked as barbers/surgeons...
                Jesters I put as a separate class thinking it could be a great magical trickster archetype.
                Good witch I don't see as having innate abilities, more like a very good knowledge of plants, poisons etc... Maybe who may have friendly contacts with the fair folk. But fair enough.
                Woodsman would be closer to a ranger/druid/wild man than a Robin Hood. It feels like a "Robin Hood/Wilhelm Tell" class would be fantastic but I'm not sure how to define it. They are not just "fighters who are good with ranged weapons", they both are folk heroes, as opposed to knights.
                That's also why I wanted to make knights and mercenaries distinct: because of how different they were in medieval societies.
                Maybe you could have something like:
                >Noble fighters
                >Professional fighters
                >Folk fighters
                The later goes from highwaymen to folk hero like that one guy from the Netherlands, with a freakishly big sword.
                Each class goes with distinct side abilities and maybe a few special combat abilities.
                Initially I was thinking about lumping rogues with brigands, but I agree that there is enough imagery about urban medieval cut throats and thiefs to make them deserving of their own archetype.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Oh fuck I'm pumped up now.
                Ok, let's get this baby

                Anyone down for homebrewing a setting/system for this? I feel like there’s a lot to work with

                going.
                I'm proposing using the Interlock system (the same system as Cyberpunk), because it's a great hybrid between class and classless, with a lot of freedom in character creation while retaining very distinct use for character professions and leaving open the possibility of having non combat professions with a big use in game.
                Plus it has solid rules for melee and an elegant but brutal combat system.
                I may borrow a few good bits from Mythras for the combat system, too.

                I propose four settings, each with a few unique classes.
                >Dark ages
                (around the year 1000, including vikings, huns, that kind of things)
                >Age of Crusades
                (around 1300)
                >Travels
                (Marco Polo trip into the mysterious Asia, encountering weird Plinian races)
                >Pandemonium
                (around 1400, the period of plagues, but the Dance Macabre are real, hell's mouth opens and starts spewing Bosch's grotesque)
                Maybe we with an added
                >Age of fables
                For Reynard kind of talking animal stories.

                Starting point is the choice of the list of abilities and skills.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Your two early periods are 200 years late.
                Age with vikings and "huns" (magyars) would be around the 800s.
                Age of crusades would be around 1100.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Ah yeah that's right. I should have written "up until".
                So that leaves us with
                >Dark ages (800-1000)
                >Age of Crusades (1100-1300)
                >Age of plagues (1400)
                >Fantastic travels

                You could have an "Age of legends" that explores the Arthurian period, but I guess plenty of games already cover that.
                Although a more historical approach to the fall of the Roman empire/very early middle age period could be very interesting. It's a very rich period, too, with the Vandals invasion of North Africa, Burgundy...

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Age of Plagues would be very special technologically because firearms start becoming very common and relatively modern, which kind of forces the whole system to be reevaluated in term of armor, magic, etc to balance things out.
                There's also a strong focus on plate armor.
                In term of game rules and functions dark age and crusader age would be very similar with most differences between weapons and armor being aesthetic.
                The big difference would be the rise of higher tier armor, with great helm + cervelière + camail + brigandine/ hauberk etc making the wearer almost impervious to bladed weapons.
                A big difference could be the rise of medieval fighting schools; with more varied stances in the later periods.
                Forcing the players to chose what weapon they use against which enemy would be interesting.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Age of plagues sound pretty good

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                t. Nurgle

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                The plague epidemics all occurred in the 1300's but ok.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Ah yeah that's right. I should have written "up until".
                So that leaves us with
                >Dark ages (800-1000)
                >Age of Crusades (1100-1300)
                >Age of plagues (1400)
                >Fantastic travels

                You could have an "Age of legends" that explores the Arthurian period, but I guess plenty of games already cover that.
                Although a more historical approach to the fall of the Roman empire/very early middle age period could be very interesting. It's a very rich period, too, with the Vandals invasion of North Africa, Burgundy...

                [...]
                I disagree. Wizards are kind of required for medieval fantasy. Magic books and grimoires are a staple, you know? I do agree on slimming it down though.

                [...]
                >You don't have barbarians in medieval Europe
                Vikings are legit from the Middle Ages. Though I could see wrapping barbarians into the fighter class.
                >But for character classes, I would start afresh rather than take the D&D classes and remove the ones that don't belong.
                Fair point. What are some medieval archetypes?
                I am not sure if barbarian should just be put into a fighter class as a subclass with knight or as it's own, but the concept of barbarians is not unheard of in medieval times, vikings being a plague on monasteries.
                Druids or at least naturemen are a trope as old as civilization itself so I would say have a class for that.
                Definitely a class for holy men, the European medieval ages characterized by their faith in God. And one for demon worshipers if not just lumped into a general religion class like "cleric".
                Bowmen or general archers are so distinct from the time period, you can tell the skeletons of longbowmen apart from other skeletons at the time so I would definitely add an archer class.
                I also think a thief and assassin sort of class would be in order.
                And in Arthurian legend, you have magic wizards like Merlin so wizards would be a must.
                And I do think innately magic people would work, but I can see how it is a point of contention.

                If we run professions the way Interlock manages them, basically it just gives you a special skill that either gives you a unique ability, or a bonus to a range of actions, added to your normal skill.
                The trick is to figure out special skills that incapsulate the spirit of the profession without being too directive or too OP.
                For example, in Cyberpunk, the fighter class (the Solos) get a bonus for initiative and for spotting, but not for... say... shooting or dodging. So they won't necessarily be the best at hitting a target, but they will be sure to shoot first. And it leaves them free to choose if they want to specialise in using a trusted shotgun or be the crazy guy with a katana.

                So, for example:
                >Merchant. Gets the "haggle" special skill, which gives them a bonus to negotiate, appraise and to identity which products in a region could be sold with a benefit elsewhere.
                >Folk Hero. Gets the "feat" special skill. Gives them a bonus to perform improbable feats (like cutting the rope of a hangman before he suffocate)
                But nothing stops a merchant to have a very high sword fighting skill or negociation for a folk hero.

                It also gives you favoured skills which have a character points pool of their own.
                This can be perfect for flavouring subclasses or character's origins (calligraphy could be a class skill for Saracens, for example)

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                So, as per this framework, here are the archetypes I would pick:
                (I'm putting a * for the ones I'm really not sure of what skill to give them)
                Fighters:
                >*Knight (need a skill that gives them an edge for duels, maybe being able to identify the fighting school of an opponent?)
                >*Mercenary (more used to fighting in formation, also have a flair for running the war business)
                >Folk hero (feats, maybe a bonus that can be spent to decrease difficulty modifiers)
                >*Raider (for the vikings, mongols, magyars... maybe a bonus to intimidate?)
                >Thief (bonus to do stuff stealthily. So pickpocketing or disappearing in the shadows after cutting someone's throat)
                Professions:
                >Journeyman (can give a special, almost magical quality to the objects they build)
                >Merchant (can build a stock using a special ability to figure out what product can be bought for cheap somewhere)
                >Bard (can use perform to improve the moral of others)
                >Jester (special skill can be used to fool people)
                >Courtesan (special skill can be used to open doors for you in high places)
                >*Monk (ideally, there should be special skills for different orders. Cistercians are better at enduring mental or physical pain, while the Dominicans are preachers)
                >Priest (special skill can bring consolation?)
                >Woodsman (bonus to travel and movements when in forests)
                Magic:
                >Alchemy/Philosopher/Astrologer (can figure out "discoveries" that gives them special single-use-per-day powers. May or may not be supernatural. Definitely not supernatural in their mind)
                >Sabbath witch/warlock (special skill is a pact with a supernatural force that gives a bonus to magical abilities)
                >Natural witch/soothsayer (bonus to healing, poison...)
                >Wizard (special skill allows them to memorise and perform magical rituals in a short time, the nature of the ritual itself depends on their skills: goetic, kabbalistic...)
                C&C welcome

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Some supernatural professions:
                >Loberos (command to wolves, turn into one)
                >Saint (should be distinct from a Priest, I think. Supernatural forces can give them bonuses to actions in some circumstances and exceptionally to perform impossible actions)

                Ok this is starting to get a bit off topic.
                How about let's give this project a code name and keep discussing it in another thread?
                I have to go back to work for now... you know... my actual job.
                >Saint (should be distinct from a Priest, I think. Supernatural forces can give them bonuses to actions in some circumstances and exceptionally to perform impossible actions)

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                >Saint (should be distinct from a Priest, I think. Supernatural forces can give them bonuses to actions in some circumstances and exceptionally to perform impossible actions)
                A saint should be a type of holy undead as recognized saints have to be dead in order to be canonized in Catholicism. We need a different term other than "saint".

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                >That's also why I wanted to make knights and mercenaries distinct: because of how different they were in medieval societies.
                Fair. Maybe knights function almost like paladins and mercenaries like typical fighters?
                >Good witch I don't see as having innate abilities, more like a very good knowledge of plants, poisons etc... Maybe who may have friendly contacts with the fair folk. But fair enough.
                So a druid?
                >Woodsman would be closer to a ranger/druid/wild man than a Robin Hood. It feels like a "Robin Hood/Wilhelm Tell" class would be fantastic but I'm not sure how to define it. They are not just "fighters who are good with ranged weapons", they both are folk heroes, as opposed to knights.
                Fair point. And an archer class would be good to add.
                And folk heroes are a way of play, not a class in and of itself.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                >Good witch
                >So a druid?
                See

                So, as per this framework, here are the archetypes I would pick:
                (I'm putting a * for the ones I'm really not sure of what skill to give them)
                Fighters:
                >*Knight (need a skill that gives them an edge for duels, maybe being able to identify the fighting school of an opponent?)
                >*Mercenary (more used to fighting in formation, also have a flair for running the war business)
                >Folk hero (feats, maybe a bonus that can be spent to decrease difficulty modifiers)
                >*Raider (for the vikings, mongols, magyars... maybe a bonus to intimidate?)
                >Thief (bonus to do stuff stealthily. So pickpocketing or disappearing in the shadows after cutting someone's throat)
                Professions:
                >Journeyman (can give a special, almost magical quality to the objects they build)
                >Merchant (can build a stock using a special ability to figure out what product can be bought for cheap somewhere)
                >Bard (can use perform to improve the moral of others)
                >Jester (special skill can be used to fool people)
                >Courtesan (special skill can be used to open doors for you in high places)
                >*Monk (ideally, there should be special skills for different orders. Cistercians are better at enduring mental or physical pain, while the Dominicans are preachers)
                >Priest (special skill can bring consolation?)
                >Woodsman (bonus to travel and movements when in forests)
                Magic:
                >Alchemy/Philosopher/Astrologer (can figure out "discoveries" that gives them special single-use-per-day powers. May or may not be supernatural. Definitely not supernatural in their mind)
                >Sabbath witch/warlock (special skill is a pact with a supernatural force that gives a bonus to magical abilities)
                >Natural witch/soothsayer (bonus to healing, poison...)
                >Wizard (special skill allows them to memorise and perform magical rituals in a short time, the nature of the ritual itself depends on their skills: goetic, kabbalistic...)
                C&C welcome

                I think good witch should be healers and potion makers.
                Druids, as per the D&D archetype, would be a "Lobero", a wolf leader: both able to command to wolves and turn into one.

                >Saint (should be distinct from a Priest, I think. Supernatural forces can give them bonuses to actions in some circumstances and exceptionally to perform impossible actions)
                A saint should be a type of holy undead as recognized saints have to be dead in order to be canonized in Catholicism. We need a different term other than "saint".

                >A saint should be a type of holy undead
                Oh fuck yeah fantastic idea

                While you are right about the demons all looking somewhat different there are in fact recurrent themes.
                Here are some examples:
                >headfusselers (head walking on his own),
                >piper demons (demons with a nose that is some kind of blowing instrument),
                >imps (just little impish demons that look pretty standard and mostly appear in the background, some of them have wings),
                >humanoid structures (anthromorphised buildings that are part human and tend to look very grotesque)
                >temptresses (at first glance they look like human females but somethings off about them a demon foot or leg in most cases)
                >bird monsters (for some reason just lake later surrealists bosch really loved depicting birds as monstrous beings)
                >animals in human clothing (satirical mockeries of priests or noblemen often pigs, toads or other animals associated with bad attributes)
                >creatures wearing an iron funnel as a hat (antisemitic depiction of medieval gnomish headwear)
                >hellmouths (giant faces stuck in the ground that swallow people and act as portals to hell)
                >chimeras (grotesque mixtures of parts from different animals)
                >human animal hybrids (pretty self explanatory)
                >devils (like the imps but bigger and often depicted with faces and mouths instead of genitals and on other body parts)
                >ice-skater (creatures depicted with wooden skates tied to their feet)
                >fishes outside the water (fish creatures that seemingly live on land and move by walking or flying)
                >dragons (doglike walking snakes and reptiles sometimes depicted with wings or multiple heads)

                Thread theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bG-34_6_rrk

                That's... An extremely good post. Well there you go, here we have our bestiary for the legions of hell.
                For the legions of death it's going to be much easier: iirc the skeletons in the dance macabre just mirror society of the living. So we just need to stick a "skeletal" template over a normal human character.
                On top of that you add a few specialised skeletons (lantern bearers, riders, and the ones welding a net, the ones welding a scythe) and the grim reaper.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                >Well there you go, here we have our bestiary for the legions of hell.
                Sweet!
                >dance macabre
                Good take this could give risen dead a fresh new feel since they'd be more like devious dancing jesters than your typical mindless undead.

                With races, undead and demons mostly done (We'd still need to stat them of course, potentially even make a pdf with images since there are some pretty cool art sources) now we can think about the non-humanoid beasts a medieval bestiary should include. As far as I'm concearned a few pretty good ideas have already been posted regarding that aswell.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                >Druids, as per the D&D archetype, would be a "Lobero", a wolf leader: both able to command to wolves and turn into one.
                I wasn't thinking the D&D archetype. I was thinking historical druids.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                >Vikings are legit from the Middle Ages.
                Well I was thinking that vikings didn't have a significantly different fighting style or level of civilization than the people they were raiding.
                But yeah maybe here it's better to tap into the legend rather than stick too closely to history.
                Having vikings raises the question of *which* part of the middle age we want to emulate, though.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            You don't have barbarians in medieval Europe, at least not that fits the D&D archetype.
            Magic users in the medieval mind are making pacts with outsider entities, usually demonic but some also pretended to be able to work with angelic entities.
            So sorcerers (innate magic user) are out, too, I would suggest.
            On the other hand, D&D monks started as a Friar Tuck archetype, so could still fit.
            Druids stricto sensu are from the Roman period, but you have plenty of "wise man close to nature" archetypes, in all sorts of variations, in medieval imagination, so you could still adapt it somehow.
            But for character classes, I would start afresh rather than take the D&D classes and remove the ones that don't belong.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              A sorcerer in a lower-magic setting would be something like a changeling or cambion, they don't have innate magical powers but they have a heightened awareness and sensitivity to magical things, which would give them an advantage at actually doing magic.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              So, let's start at the source.
              Question 1 is:
              Do you accept romantic (19th century) images of the middle ages (say... the White Company or Sir D'Ivanoe), or do you want to really stick to the material from the period?
              Sticking strictly with the original sources, you have tales of Roland, Arthur, Reynard, Robin Hood, Wilhelm Tell, plus the stuff you can take from history: Templars, Joan of Arc...
              I would stretch a bit to include the 1500s, this way you can add in Gargantua, Shakespeare, Bosch...

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                You don't need to stretch anything to include Bosch's grotesques, he merely borrowed them from much older illuminated manuscripts.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Bosch was born in 1450, no potential era stretch needed for him

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                So, as for playable races I would go with:
                >Giants (the Arthurian kind)
                >Wild men (basically stereotypical neanderthals) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wild_man
                >Green men (magical plant men) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Man
                I would also include "ethnicity as race" because it seems to me that the middle age mindset wouldn't distinguish between "oh these people there have black skin" and "oh these people here only have one eye and therefore are not humans". So additional races could be:
                >Latins (the equivalent of baseline human)
                and then all the minorities you can think of depending on the context you want : Gypsies, Cagot https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cagot , garden gnomes, Lepers, Saxons, Sarassen, Ethiopians, Magyars...
                Each ones with some unique equipment/class that only they can take.
                Blemmys and Cynocephali I wouldn't include in the main game, because they are supposed to be exotic people you wouldn't encounter in Europe. Maybe added in a Marco Polo expansion.
                Talking animals should definitely be there, because of the rabbit illustrations and because of Reynard, but I would make them NPCs only to weed out the furfags (or make them part of the Reynard expansion).

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              >what are Hungarians

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Horse archers.
                Historical barbarians but certainly not D&D barbarians.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                D&D barbarians are as ahistorical as they come.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              I probably would as well but aren't conventional d&d barbarians based on Nordic Raiders, who sometimes went into battle high as fuck?

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Ah dude, don't mention berserkers or you are going to bring in Lindybeige with his video on the topic.
                But yeah, no matter how historical they are, berserkers make for a kino character specialty.
                Seems to me that D&D barbarians, as this anon

                D&D barbarians are as ahistorical as they come.

                said, basically originates as the answer to the question "ok what power can we give to the dumb brute archetype" crossed with pulp cover beefcake imagery.

                >Druids, as per the D&D archetype, would be a "Lobero", a wolf leader: both able to command to wolves and turn into one.
                I wasn't thinking the D&D archetype. I was thinking historical druids.

                Ok, so don't quote me on this because I'm even more out of my depth as a history enthousiast, but seems to me that druids were closer to priests than to magic users strictly speaking.
                There is very very little source material on what they really were though.
                Although (thinking out loud there):
                Often you'll hear that historical witches may have been a remnant of European pagan beliefs and practices. Soo... possibly from druidic or druidic-adjacent stuff. So possibly you could be very right.

                [...]
                What's the difference between african and homeric pygmies?

                >What's the difference between african and homeric pygmies?
                Pic related
                - Not specified as being black
                - Small child sized
                - Fierce warriors
                - Rides rams to combat
                - Somehow have a mutual hate for cranes (the birds)

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                I want to point out that tiny men at war with birds aren't an invention of Plini, this is one of those universal myths that exist in every region of the world in one variety or another. For instance, this myth was also known in ancient China.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                >Often you'll hear that historical witches may have been a remnant of European pagan beliefs and practices. Soo... possibly from druidic or druidic-adjacent stuff. So possibly you could be very right.
                That's what I was thinking. Specifically, I was thinking a shaman or animist who contacts the spirits and energies of the natural world so maybe they could be called a Shaman or Animist. Or even a Heathen given that's what pagan stuff was called back in the day. And priests in fantasy settings tend to be magic users who use divine magic/power.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            You don't have barbarians in medieval Europe, at least not that fits the D&D archetype.
            Magic users in the medieval mind are making pacts with outsider entities, usually demonic but some also pretended to be able to work with angelic entities.
            So sorcerers (innate magic user) are out, too, I would suggest.
            On the other hand, D&D monks started as a Friar Tuck archetype, so could still fit.
            Druids stricto sensu are from the Roman period, but you have plenty of "wise man close to nature" archetypes, in all sorts of variations, in medieval imagination, so you could still adapt it somehow.
            But for character classes, I would start afresh rather than take the D&D classes and remove the ones that don't belong.

            So, as for playable races I would go with:
            >Giants (the Arthurian kind)
            >Wild men (basically stereotypical neanderthals) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wild_man
            >Green men (magical plant men) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Man
            I would also include "ethnicity as race" because it seems to me that the middle age mindset wouldn't distinguish between "oh these people there have black skin" and "oh these people here only have one eye and therefore are not humans". So additional races could be:
            >Latins (the equivalent of baseline human)
            and then all the minorities you can think of depending on the context you want : Gypsies, Cagot https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cagot , garden gnomes, Lepers, Saxons, Sarassen, Ethiopians, Magyars...
            Each ones with some unique equipment/class that only they can take.
            Blemmys and Cynocephali I wouldn't include in the main game, because they are supposed to be exotic people you wouldn't encounter in Europe. Maybe added in a Marco Polo expansion.
            Talking animals should definitely be there, because of the rabbit illustrations and because of Reynard, but I would make them NPCs only to weed out the furfags (or make them part of the Reynard expansion).

            So for the classes, assuming a cookie cutter model where every class needs a use during combat, I would go with something like this:
            >Knight (well rounded fighter, especially on horseback. With some special skills related to either nobility or faith)
            >Mercenary/adventurers (more pragmatic fighter)
            >Woodsman
            >Bard
            >Saint (cleric-like. performs miracles)
            >Courtesan
            >Merchant
            >Jester
            >Executioner
            As for magic
            >Witch from the Sabbath (witch that made a pact with the devil)
            >Good witch, soothsayer
            >Goethic mage (performs magic by summoning and controlling demons)
            >Kabbalist (performs magic by hacking into the sacred language of reality)
            >Alchemist (try to master the forces of nature through metallurgic and chemical processes)
            >Astrologer/Philosopher (for the Newton, Tycho Brahe characters. Does science, but don't distinguish between the forces of nature and what we would consider supernatural forces)(I wanted to throw that one in just to mess with the stereotypes of the medieval times as an obscurantist period)
            It's difficult to have a class for "monks" because different orders had *very* different ideas of what being a monk meant. Some where into getting themselves through insane physical and psychological suffering. Others were jovial workers. Some were traveling preachers.
            Stuff like workers from a guild (character class: journeyman?) would be great to add in a system which has non-combat centric classes. A game system like Interlock, where your profession gives you additional abilities but don't restrict your skills.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              Ah yeah I wanted to mention:
              >Werewolves. It's not a curse, it's not a species, it's a magical ability.
              >Wolves leader. These are people with the supernatural ability to lead and control wolves. Sometimes transform into one, too
              >Half a dozen weird regional variations of the witch. Some of them specialised in predicting someone's death, for example
              I'm not sure which kind of character class could a character like the Hunchback of Notre Dame belong to, but I feel like there should be something. Some sort of hermit.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Oh you had Loberos and the equivalent of the werewolves (Lobisome in my country)?
                I think the Hunchback is a non-character class, in 3.5 they were called experts, but I think in old games you simply gave them the Hit Dice and some pluses for his awesome ability to play the bells.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              Ok. I am with

              I've always felt less is more when it comes to classes, I'd probably stick with the basics and have witches (male and female) in place of wizards. Have magic as a whole be more about rituals and components.

              in that less is best for classes. This is too much.
              >Wizard/Scholar: Merge Goethic mage, Kabbalist, and Astrologer/Philosopher together into what is essentially a wizard. Even modern Kabbalist often do Goethic shit and it's super similar. Maybe make them into subclasses.
              >Alchemist: Personally would keep alchemist as a separate class as I think it is asking too much to lump it into the scholar/wizard class above.
              >Fighter: Knight and mercenary should be merged into fighter. Have it so you can, again, just make subclasses or things you can invest into. "Barbarians" of the time like vikings can also be put in here.
              >Entertainer: Bard, courtesan, and jester can be merged into an entertainer.
              >Priest: Saint should be a "magic" class like a cleric, performing divine miracles under the lord. I would call them priests personally as saints are a specific thing in Catholicism.
              >Witch: Witch from the Sabbath or who is in cahoots with Satan/not God is also a good one for this sort of setting.
              >Woodsman?: Woodsman works. Archers could also be lumped into here or with fighter. Your choice. I am also not sure if they should be called something other than woodsman. Any thoughts?
              >Sorcerer?: Good witch could essentially be a catch-all for your innate magic users or those who tap into magic via intuition versus scholarly discipline. Nature magic could also fall into this. Idk what you would call this intuitive magic class other than sorcerer though. Any thoughts?
              >Rogue?: We need an assassin or rogue class imo. Thieves and dex-based stuff runs pretty well into this. Any better names other than rogue?
              >Merchant and executioner are more professions or how you play a character versus fantasy classes.

  9. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    >Gnomes(?)
    Use Pygmies instead

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      You mean like african pygmies? Seems a little detached from the subject matter. Is there something else I'm missing?

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        No I meant the Homeric ones

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          well now I feel stupid

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        No I meant the Homeric ones

        What's the difference between african and homeric pygmies?

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >That river goeth through the land of Pigmies, where that the folk be of little stature, that be but three span long, and they be right fair and gentle, after their quantities, both the men and the women. And they marry them when they be half year of age and get children. And they live not but six year or seven at the most; and he that liveth eight year, men hold him there right passing old. These men be the best workers of gold, silver, cotton, silk and of all such things, of any other that be in the world. And they have oftentimes war with the birds of the country that they take and eat. This little folk neither labour in lands ne in vines; but they have great men amongst them of our stature that till the land and labour amongst the vines for them. And of those men of our stature have they as great scorn and wonder as we would have among us of giants, if they were amongst us. There is a good city, amongst others, where there is dwelling great plenty of those little folk, and it is a great city and a fair. And the men be great that dwell amongst them, but when they get any children they be as little as the pigmies. And therefore they be, all for the most part, all pigmies; for the nature of the land is such. The great Chan let keep this city full well, for it is his. And albeit, that the pigmies be little, yet they be full reasonable after their age, and can both wit and good and malice enough.

      Sounds pretty standard as far as smallfolk go. I like their rivalry with cranes though, maybe it could elaborated into something to do with the Collogruis/Pelargolai? Pygmies are said to be good with gold, silver, and silk which were all very coveted in the middle ages, and if the crane men are as greedy and covetous as what few sources I can find say, they may be interested in making slaves of them.

  10. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Other than gnomes all the races here are also present in pdf related.
    Although this one is more Greek focused(hence the language but you could always machine translate it) you can take some interesting stuff from it.
    Though they aren't present in this copy since it's the free player version.

    The Woodwoses/Wildmen have a +1 bonus to Strengh and Endurance and -1 Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma. They also get a +1 when rolling against poison and sickness. They can only be this games equivalent of a fighter class.

    Due to their advanced senses, the Cynocephali are 1/6 harder to ambush than a regular human, their chance of detecting noise is increased by 1 and get a +1 advantage in unarmed combat.

    The Blemmyes, or Acephali as they are called here, are a man-eating monster race.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      There's also some other Byzantine stuff in it like equipment you could take unless you want to make a purely west medieval setting

  11. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    >Any other enticing options? I'd be interested in any ideas for such a setting in general.

    >elves
    >dwarves
    >hobbits

  12. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Take a peak over here
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ulster_Cycle

  13. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Wouldn't the only acceptable playable race be humans?
    Non-humans aren't exactly protagonist material in medieval literature.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Elves and Dwarfs weren't protagonists in nordic sagas but that didn't stop Tolkien
      Same principle here

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        elves = rapists, and fathers of great heroes
        dwarves = small guys who get used and bullied for gold or whatever by everyone including the hero

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      There are many medieval romances with giants as protagonists (see T. M. Boyer's The Giant Hero in Medieval Literature), or companions to protagonists, at least one narrative which has a cynocephalic hero (the story of St. Christopher), and a few which have heroes who more-of-less fit the wildman archetype (sometimes a normal person transformed into a hairy wildman, sometimes ambiguous whether they are of a monstrous race, transformed, or mutants). So there is precedent.
      Also, note that mainstream learned thinking in the middle ages held that all of these beings were human (that is, descended from Adam, possessed of both reason and souls). This distinguished them from elves, fairies, and so on, which were essentially demons.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Also loads of folktales with animal protagonists. Might not have made theological sense but they told the stories anyway.

  14. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I love this concept, would definitely play in a setting like that

  15. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    You could still have dwarves and elves. But they would not resemble the standard fantasy dwarves and elves we are used to seeing. Instead take inspiration from the Norse sagas. Trolls and giants would also make good antagonists in your system.
    Could use pic rel as source material. Although it is Christian, based on broken telephone oral stories, and likely highly sanitised for a Christian audience, it nonetheless remains one of our best sources on the Norse along with Heimskringla and the Prose Edda.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      I think op is talking about european middle ages

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      I think op is talking about european middle ages

      Yeah, norse mythology feels like an entirely different genre compared to weird things medieval europeans believed in. Of course scandinavians, who lived in europe during the middle ages, did believe in those things, but it's different. The difference, I feel, is that Cynocephali/Blemmyes/etc aren't a feature of mythology or folklore, they misconceptions that scholars of the time believed in, unrelated to religious or cultural beliefs, just "science" that happened to be wrong.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        As far as i recall nobody actually believed in cinocephali. Instead they were a theological thought experiment that‘s pretty accurately mirrored in Tolkiens „orc problem“ which just shows it‘s actuality. Medieval scholars weren’t idiots.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          I don't know much about that, but cynocephali were attested by multiple travellers of the time and appeared in bestiaries for a reason.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Belief seems to have varied quite a bit. The mainstream position was 'they are probably mostly bullshit, but maybe a bit of truth in some of the stories' (this is basically St Augustine's position) with some people being entirely credulous and others totally disbelieving in the whole lot.
          Most of the writing about them does concern the theological implications, but that isn't unusual for medieval scholarship. Medieval scholarship mostly used animals, plants, minerals, and natural phenomena to illustrate religious allegories rather than to inform people about the actual characteristics of those things. There was a lot more written about how dogs symbolized garden gnomes than about what actual dogs were really like.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Let me put this a different way, medieval bestiaries are as much mythology as 19th century depictions of dinosaurs are, they're both just outdated views of the natural world.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        I mean stuff like the volsung saga is another telling of the nibelunglied, which is connected to Arthurian myth in the mabinogion, which is connected to Charlemagne and the chansons of* geste, which is connected to fairy tales, and arthurian myth is also connected to the aeneid and the odyssey/Iliad which Snorri connected norse myth to. Medieval people thought Arthur actually existed.

        Shits all connected

        * but of not de because of ocd

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      know any other examples of classically translated works for other regions of Europe?
      seems like Tolkien and others have a monopoly on Norse mythos, but everything else is lacking.

  16. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    see: Elden Ring
    They got the Giant Snails, the Disproportionate Abominations, Overly-Ornate Knight Armor
    Put the monster designs of Elden Ring up next to some old tapestry and margin-artwork from the medievals and you'll see some quick connections. The whole of their design seems to be "How would Olde Europe describe things we kind of know about and then make them Hyper Realistic"

  17. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Don’t forget the quest to find prestor john

  18. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Dragon magazine once had an article purporting to contain 'true' wrong facts about animals taken from medieval bestiaries, like "if sold to a stranger a camel will become ill from disgust". I don't have it at the moment (had a fairly spectacular system crash recently) but a search for "dragon magazine medieval bestiary" finds it easily enough (issue 199 if necessary).

  19. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    https://www.theoi.com/greek-mythology/fabulous-tribes.html

    Here you go OP

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >https://www.theoi.com/greek-mythology/fabulous-tribes.html
      Thanks, man

  20. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Going to put down some worldbuilding ideas, will post more as they come to me.
    >Cynocephali
    They call themselves Augani, apparently after some legendary spiritual leader. Cynocephali have historically acted much like dogs, being attracted to human settlements by the prospect of food and shelter which they earned by hunting and fighting on the humans behalf. On their own, they are primitive hunter scavengers, but they are quick and eager to adapt to human civilisation and culture. As their own spiritual beliefs are relatively shallow, they’re particularly attracted to human religions and many end up joining priesthoods and religious orders. In the present, large swathes of land are afforded as cynocephali reserves and they are becoming increasingly rare in human society due to a shift from nomadism to a sedentary lifestyle based on farmed food, which is unpalatable to the cynocephali. Today, most who live outside the reserves are found in small rural communities or as monks and hermits living apart from society.

  21. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    elves would still be present, but they would be spirits from another world who are unpredictable etc.

    Also, they look like beautiful human beings, not taller creatures with pointy ears and elongated faces, just someone who could be human if not for something odd about them (though with dark elves and black elves, this isn't the case)

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >consider fairies as being the "neutral angels" which didn't rebel neither fought the rebels, so they fell only as far as the world
      elves also have this lore attached to them, but then again you can easily just make elves and fairies interchangeable, same sort of thing

      elves = rapists, and fathers of great heroes
      dwarves = small guys who get used and bullied for gold or whatever by everyone including the hero

      I explained it in a few previous posts (

      [...]
      Yeah, norse mythology feels like an entirely different genre compared to weird things medieval europeans believed in. Of course scandinavians, who lived in europe during the middle ages, did believe in those things, but it's different. The difference, I feel, is that Cynocephali/Blemmyes/etc aren't a feature of mythology or folklore, they misconceptions that scholars of the time believed in, unrelated to religious or cultural beliefs, just "science" that happened to be wrong.

      ,

      Let me put this a different way, medieval bestiaries are as much mythology as 19th century depictions of dinosaurs are, they're both just outdated views of the natural world.

      ) but the subject of this thread is rooted more in outdated natural philosophy rather than folklore

  22. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Panotii are a personal favorite just from this illustration alone.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      This is how I Panotti.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        So more human twi'leks? Not bad anon, not bad.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          I mean, if you want to get super anal about it, twi'leks are humans with some of their DNA tweaked by the rakatan supercomputer, and so is every other "near-human" race that produces fertile offspring with humans.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          If they're living in the North Sea like the legends describe, they would have to roll their ears into these tubes and also sheathe them in ear-socks during the winter. Ears lose heat like a bitch, they lose heat faster than any other body part.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      This is how I Panotti.

      I must admit, I've warmed up to these goofy bros

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        They're the least goofy of all the Pliny's races. They're as human as elves.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          Elves just have pointy ears. Panotti have huge floppy bedsheets for ears, that's the opposite of pointy.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Ears are the sole difference in both cases.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              Mythical elves:
              Usually look human except for
              >always notably attractive or ugly
              and may have one of
              >weird colouration (notably, black skin)
              >grotesque feet or legs (bestial or reversed)
              >very small size
              Are absolutely not human or (rarely, ambiguously) are (un)dead humans
              >either have no souls, or no soul-body distinction
              >can breed with humans, producing humans with some magical powers or exceptional traits
              Are generally immortal
              Always have magic powers, usually invisibility, shape-changing, and curses

              Fantasy elves:
              Look distinct from humans in many details
              >usually attractive, or have 'alien' facial features like sharp cheekbones, slanted eyes, vertical pupils, etc.
              >have pointed ears
              >may be taller or shorter than humans
              >usually thinner than humans
              Are similar to humans but distinct
              >physical bodies
              >may have souls
              >can breed with humans, producing half-elves
              Either immortal or long-lived
              Usually a bit more magical than humans, may have minor inherent powers or just more likely to learn magic.

              Panotti
              Look exactly like humans except
              >huge ears
              >maybe a bit smaller
              Are actually just an exotic variant of humans
              >definitely have souls
              Are not immortal, same lifespan as other humans (presumably; sources don't say)
              Are no more magical than humans

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          [...]
          I must admit, I've warmed up to these goofy bros

          This is how I Panotti.

          Theoretically, they could be done like rabbitfolk, but I think that ruins the fun.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Ears are the sole difference in both cases.

          Folkloric elves didn't have pointy ears originally, they were spirits or magical people who could inhabit lakes and hills and dish out curses or blessings on humanity, shapeshifting and invisibility were inherent to them and they often looked albino

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            There's no way to know what the folkloric elves looked like. Except that they were apparently extremely gorgeous and also dark elves had pitch black skin.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              >There's no way to know what the folkloric elves looked like.
              Read the sources you lazy fuck

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                First you read the sources, you lying fuck.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Do we have any idea of what the panotti's culture is like? I don't imagine so, given how cursory most of the descriptions are. From what I know the only details we have are:
      >Have real big ears
      >Don't wear a lot of clothes, wrap themselves in their ears for warmth
      >Live on some islands up north, either in Orkney, the baltic sea, or "off the coast of scythia" probably in the caspian or black sea
      >Can fly? Maybe?
      I think it would be a bit cliche to make them good sailors just because their an island people. Instead, I'd expand on their possible ability to fly. Panotti are a migratory people who use their big floppy ears to glide on the wind from island to island, this way they avoid totally exhausting any one island's resources by hopping around and giving them a chance to replenish naturally. They aren't capable of true flight though, they're carried by seasonal wind storms, which my be embodied as deities in their religion.
      Just throwing out some ideas, think it has potential?

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Ear flight is far too silly to ever work. Also, if they live on some islands up north, they would need more clothes than just their ears.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Not flight but gliding, and panotti are already silly to begin with. Also, they use their big ears to keep themselves warm which is why they don't wear a lot. That's also silly given how vulnerable ears are to the cold.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >panotti are already silly to begin with
            Did my picture look silly? You choose deliberately to run with the retarded parts of the lore, make an interpretation that's even more retarded, and blame the source material.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              Just because your picture downplays the silliness doesn't mean giant floppy ears aren't at least a little silly. On the other hand, I played up that aspect and made something weird and whimsical, it's fine if you don't like it.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                It's literally just a matter of getting used to it.
                An elephant would look absolutely ridiculous if you had never seen one.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                It's not any more silly than elf ears. And before you say that elf ears can also be short, that's just boring and you should be playing a human at that point.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >Ear flight is far too silly to ever work
          Realism obsession is a disease

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            It's not obsession with realism, it's demand for a serious tone.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              >It's not obsession with realism
              Yes it is. Try having some fun and stop pretending to be all adult about your infantile hobby.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Panotti are fun as they are. Turning them into Dumbo the fucking Elephant actually sucks the fun out of them for all but the pre-schoolers.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Panotti were already dumbo the fucking elephant in some accounts, I was toning it down by making them only be able to glide on specific winds.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                What are these accounts?

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Fuck man I don't know, Theoi mentions it but doesn't give a source so I just assumed. I'm still going to role with it just to spite you though.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                They could use the ears for gliding though

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                Do you seriously thing that's less ridiculous than using them for flight?

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              >It's not obsession with realism
              Yes it is. Try having some fun and stop pretending to be all adult about your infantile hobby.

              Let's find a middle ground: realism matters but it can be altered to fit the form, fun and aesthetic if the explanation is good.

  23. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I'm not a fan of the name that most medieval monster-people have.

    They sound rather uuuh "scientific"? Must be the latim.

  24. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Some sensible ones.
    >Machyles: A race with a feminine top half and masculine bottom half or vice versa.
    >Satyr: Pretty self-explanatory.
    >Hippopodes: Akin to a satyr, but with horse legs instead of goat ones.
    >Panotii: A race of people with large ears. Often depicted as being a type of "smallfolk" so they could be a good halfling-type race.
    >Nuli: A race with backwards feet.
    >Sciritae: A race of snakefolk with serpentine nostrils and either bow-legged legs or snake-tails for legs depending on how you want to spin it.
    >Satyros/Aigipan: Different from the satyr, these fellows are apemen from the land of Libu (Africa).
    >Pygmies: You know, pygmies.
    >Cyclops/Arimaspian: No cyclops? Would have thought they would have been mentioned at this point. If it's due to their size, the Arimaspians would be a good medium sized option.
    >Heliadian: A long-lived race of tall, beautiful humanoids with highly flexible bones and a split tongue which allowed them to hold two conversations at once.
    >Pamphagoi: A race which can eat anything.

    Some unique ones
    >Cephalophore: A saint which holds his own severed head.
    >Melusine: A lamial race of two-tailed snake women. Often depicted with wings and associated with water.
    >Hyperborean: People of the land of Hyperborea.
    >Sciapod: One footed people.
    >Centaur: Self-explanatory.
    >Caligni: A race of short-lived Indians. Need a bit of Hispanice imo if you gonna implement them. Pathfinder adds a light allergy to explain their short lifespans (light leading to a rapid decrease in longevity) so maybe something like that could work.
    >Astomoi: A race which eats via smell. (Bonus points if you remembered this race from Pathfinder 1e).
    >Bishop Fish: It's a fish-bishop fellow.
    >Revenant: For if you want an undead option.
    >Pilosus: Essentially a satyr. Just found the name entertaining. (From Hortus Sanitatis)

    You brought up gnomes so what about their medieval counterparts: the sylph, undine, and salamander?

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      High quality post. Thanks fren!

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >Akin to a satyr, but with horse legs instead of goat ones.
      More commonly referred to as sileni.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      This post is great
      I've never heard of the Heliadian though, they sound fucking cool, where are they from?

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Why do you infest every subject I find interesting on this board

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Heliadian is just a term for Heliades since they are only ever referenced as "dwellers", "islanders", and other terms rather than the land itself by Diodorus Siculus. Technically a group of nymphs also share the name Heliades as it means "children of the sun" hence why I used Heliadian as to differentiate them from the daughters of Helios.
        They come from a land known as "Nesi Heliades" which means "Islands of the Sun" hence why they are referred to as Heliades.
        Only mention of them I could find is in Diodorus Siculus's The Library of History: Book II, paragraphs 55 through 60.
        So they are extremely obscure, and likely not used in, well, anything tbh.
        For convience: bit<dot>ly<slash>Diodorus2B

  25. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Man, I love cephalophores so much. Not great for a race, per say. But it would make an interesting NPC or encounter, and an opportunity to showcase the ever rare good-aligned undead.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Whats their story?

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        martyred saints.

  26. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Personally I’d go human only with Cynophaly as a possible exception since they can live among humans with one of them being a saint even. The rest are usually either antagonistic or keep to themselves.

  27. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Alchemical salamanders would be cool as a beast race

  28. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    If you wanted to base it on medieval literature, you should start by building your cannon of medieval literature you're pulling from.

    I'd start with the classics: the mabinogi, the nibelungenlied, le morte, the decameron and chaucer.

    I'm confused why so many people are posting ancient greek myths in a medieval literature thread. But if we go with actual medieval literature, we've got faeries, giants, dragons.

    The subject matter of adventures are often either competitions or literal quest-givers, where a hero wants something and a faerie or a giant or a king says "ok go get me this thing or kill that guy." And they're obsessed with class and place in society, and subverting those rules and transgressing against them, but usually getting your come-uppance if you do. Monsters are typically just giant animals, or animals of unusual colors with weird powers.

    Actual medeival literature looks a lot like Tolkein and D&D, and the only PC races are human.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Oh and magic items. Belts, cloaks, rings, shields, swords, helmets, shoes... lots and lots of magical items that give you strength or make you fly, or invisible, or are sometimes weird spears that shoot venomous spines.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >I'm confused why so many people are posting ancient greek myths in a medieval literature thread.
      Well the thread's more about natural philosophy in the middle ages, and Greece was the source of that in the west. While most of the creatures posted here originate from greek observations they were still believed in and featured in bestiaries in the middle ages.
      >and the only PC races are human.
      Well the only "PC races" in most of the mythology Tolkien was inspired by were humans, but that didn't stop him

      Oh and magic items. Belts, cloaks, rings, shields, swords, helmets, shoes... lots and lots of magical items that give you strength or make you fly, or invisible, or are sometimes weird spears that shoot venomous spines.

      >weird spears that shoot venomous spines.
      That sounds fucking sick

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >Well the thread's more about natural philosophy in the middle ages, and Greece was the source of that in the west.
        But by the medieval period, anyone mentioning any of them was using them as a metaphor, mostly for "and if you touch yourself you're basically a cannibal."

        >That sounds fucking sick
        The Gáe Bulg is pretty metal. It hits someone, blossoms inside them and travels along their veins spreading barbs. You pretty much have to dissect the person's corpse to get it back out, afterwards.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >Gáe Bulg
          Fuck I should have known it had something to do with Cú Chulainn. bro literally can't go five seconds without being metal as fuck.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >But by the medieval period, anyone mentioning any of them was using them as a metaphor
          I kind of doubt that seeing as Marco Polo, among other medieval adventurers, claimed to have encountered Cynocephali and Blemmyes

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            You wouldn't need to doubt it if you'd read the things you're talking about.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              So they all just happened to use the same metaphore drawing on greek mythology? Was that their equivalent of cringe or based?

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                No I'm saying that you lack context for what you're talking about. First off we have no idea what Marco Polo claimed to have encountered, because he didn't write that book. It's a recollection of conversations that was considered silly in its own time.

  29. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Humans
    Italians
    Russians
    Finns

    thread

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      OP didn't want trolls or gnomes I'm assuming

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >including freakshit

  30. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    A setting like this should be human only with the beast races being npc only

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      You could say the same thing about a setting inspired by norse/germanic mythology and look what Tolkien did

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Not everyone is Tolkien though. For some reason people tend to forget that when making this argument. How exactly would you go about it for example? I'm willing to change my mind.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          My point is you can't say it absolutely "should" be that way. Cynocephali have been portrayed as converting to christianity so it's not like they can't adjust to a more player character appropriate role despite being rare and exotic.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Elves and dwarves aren't exactly "player races" either. Arguably only hobbits and maybe men fit that criteria since the story is usually told from their pov.

  31. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    If I was going to try to do actual medieval lit to RPG, humans would be the player race, the only magic system would be "miracles" the players can't perform, any extraordinary abilities would be connected directly to magic items the players had, and the game would be about wandering around asking lords for quests and hopping into battles to change the outcome. Honestly it'd be pretty much D&D, with only humans, way fewer monsters (most of the "dire" variety), lots more magical items, and no spellcasters. Come to think of it, it'd just be D&D except with less shit in it.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      I think you're largely on the right track but to nitpick

      >the only magic system would be "miracles" the players can't perform
      I think there would also be space for demonic magic and foul secrets you learn from pacts with the Devil, but again as something beyond the means of the players unless one or all of them were actually being evil characters. Maybe magic performed by fairies and elves too, but as a nuisance and a threat rather than something the players can utilise.

      >any extraordinary abilities would be connected directly to magic items the players had
      I think good blood would also give the potential for extraordinary abilities, even if not explicit magic. Long lasting royal and noble dynasties being regarded as favoured by God and so having power due to their lineage (e.g. touching for the king's evil).

      >wandering around asking lords for quests and hopping into battles to change the outcome
      I haven't read nearly as much chivalric romance as I should have, but afaik in such literature knights just deciding to go out and do things on the basis of their own virtue is a staple. I think there would be room for players to decide their own holy quest and seek to fulfil it, rather than having to get all their directions from a lord. Alternatively, quests being given by holy or supernatural figures (e.g. Lady of the Lake) rather than only temporal lords.

  32. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Make playable bestiary, Werewolf, vampyr, fae or fairy, giant, sea monster, serpent, unicorn, griffen, rhino, elephant, etc

  33. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    The more I keep reading this thread, the more I want to play in such a setting.

  34. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Don't forget the Mannshahn

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Chicken men?

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Man's chicken.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          BEHOLD, A

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          https://www.heraldik-wiki.de/wiki/Mannshahn

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >Diogenes is rapidly approaching your location

  35. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    the surreal and dream like beat-em'-up video game series 'Zeno Clash' has a number of creatures and characters pulled straight from a 1500s French book that could definitely fit the creatures and character ideas and stuff you're looking for,

    'Les songes drolatiques de Pantagruel' -- or -- 'The funny dreams of Pantagruel', which was weird as hell to see years after playing the games.

    YouTube Video talking about the books history and who made it:

    The Book - Internet Archive:
    https://archive.org/details/lessongesdrolati00tros/mode/2up

    'Zeno Clash':
    https://store.steampowered.com/app/22200/Zeno_Clash/

    'Zeno Clash 2':
    https://store.steampowered.com/app/215690/Zeno_Clash_2/

  36. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Read chapter 29 of Baudolino. Pirate it obvs. It's all about a city full of medieval folkloric creatures.

  37. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Cool Thread

  38. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    I use Blemmyes in place of black people on my not!africa

  39. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Good thread

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      All good threads come to an end, anon

  40. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >misbeliefs
    Oh boy here comes the thought police to tell me gnomes are disinformation.

  41. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Need more Bosch posting

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Where is this miniature from?

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Eureka Miniatures, It's under Chaos as a cavalry unit

  42. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Was Shakespeare's a midnight summer during the medieval time?

    I know that despite christianity being the dominant religion medieval society iconified ancient greek legends.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      No, it was an early modern play set in ancient Greece.

  43. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Went searching for some Panotii illustrations when I stumbled across The Nuremberg Chronicle: a 763 paged manuscript which is where the image of the Panotii originates.
    It actually comes in color in the book, and they have a couple more races in there which I don't think are a part of the Pliny the Elder set.
    One is what is likely the Astomoi, but is depicted in a different way, and has a tad bit of a different anatomy, having tiny mouths rather than no mouths.
    >Toward Paradise, by the River Ganges, are people who do not eat. Their mouths are so small that they are obliged to drink through a straw. They live upon the odor of fruits and flowers. They quickly die if they encounter evil odors.
    Might post the page which they come from wholesale along with a translation as the book is in Latin.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >The Nuremberg Chronicle
      One of my favorite medieval sources

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      The races are not listed by name, but I put the race Schendel is likely describing in front of the description.
      >THE SECOND AGE OF THE WORLD
      >FOLIO XII recto
      >Pliny, Augustine and Isidore have written of variously shaped people, of whom mention will be made hereafter.
      >[Cynocephali] In India are people with the heads of dogs, who bark when they speak. They sustain themselves by catching birds and clothe themselves in the skins of animals.
      >[Arimaspi] Item: Some have but one eye, which is in the forehead above the nose. Their diet is restricted to animal flesh.
      >[Blemmyae] Item: In Lybia some are born headless and have mouth and eyes.
      >[Nuli] [They lack a description, but are the next race in panel set.]
      >[Machlyes] Some are double-sexed, the right breast male, the left one female. They are indiscriminate in their associations with one another and bear children.
      >[Sciapods] [They lack a description, but are the next race in panel set.]
      >[Astomoi*] Item: Toward Paradise, by the River Ganges, are people who do not eat. Their mouths are so small that they are obliged to drink through a straw. They live upon the odor of fruits and flowers. They quickly die if they encounter evil odors.
      *As mentioned here , the description is inaccurate to what Pliny the Elder originally described.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Forgot to post the rest. All apologies.
        The descriptions are kind of all over the place so I'm gonna organize them by appearance in the panel set versus how they appear in the manuscript. I’m gonna post the three panel sets separately with their (most likely) corresponding description, then the full list as they were originally listed by Schendel.
        >[Cynocephali] In India are people with the heads of dogs, who bark when they speak. They sustain themselves by catching birds and clothe themselves in the skins of animals.
        >[Arimaspi] Item: Some have but one eye, which is in the forehead above the nose. Their diet is restricted to animal flesh.
        >[Blemmyae] Item: In Lybia some are born headless and have mouth and eyes.
        >[Nuli] But it is unbelievable, as Augustine writes, that there are certain people in the region of the earth opposed to us and where the sun rises, who reverse the position of their feet when the sun sets.
        >[Machlyes] Some are double-sexed, the right breast male, the left one female. They are indiscriminate in their associations with one another and bear children.
        >[Sciapods] Item: In Ethiopia, toward the west, are people with but one foot, which is very broad. They are so fleet that they pursue the wild animals.
        >[Astomoi*] Item: Toward Paradise, by the River Ganges, are people who do not eat. Their mouths are so small that they are obliged to drink through a straw. They live upon the odor of fruits and flowers. They quickly die if they encounter evil odors.
        *As mentioned here

        Went searching for some Panotii illustrations when I stumbled across The Nuremberg Chronicle: a 763 paged manuscript which is where the image of the Panotii originates.
        It actually comes in color in the book, and they have a couple more races in there which I don't think are a part of the Pliny the Elder set.
        One is what is likely the Astomoi, but is depicted in a different way, and has a tad bit of a different anatomy, having tiny mouths rather than no mouths.
        >Toward Paradise, by the River Ganges, are people who do not eat. Their mouths are so small that they are obliged to drink through a straw. They live upon the odor of fruits and flowers. They quickly die if they encounter evil odors.
        Might post the page which they come from wholesale along with a translation as the book is in Latin.

        , the description is inaccurate to what Pliny the Elder originally described.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Panel Set 2
          >[Unknown] In this country there are also people without noses, their faces flat.
          >[Likely Sara or Mun peoples] Some have lower lips so large that they cover the entire face.
          >[Panotii] Item: In Sicily some people have ears so large that they cover the whole body.
          >[Aegipanes] Item: Some have horns, long noses and goat’s feet; and these are spoken of throughout the legends of St. Anthony.
          >[Macrobi?*] Item: And there are some people five cubits [7.5 feet] in length and who never sicken until death.
          >[Hippopodes] Item: In Basedthia are people with hoofs like a horse.
          >[Pygmies] [Lack a description.]
          *I do not know who this is supposed to be depicting so I picked this one out of the descriptors.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Panel Set 3
            >[Gegenees] Item: In the histories of Alexander the Great one reads of people in India who have six hands.
            >[Gorgades] [Lack a description.]
            >[Unknown] some have six digits on hands and feet.
            >[Centauri] Others who live in the water are half man and half horse.
            >[Could be Machlyes] Item: Women with beards extending down to their breasts, but their heads hairless and bald.
            >[Unknown] Item: In Ethiopia, toward the west, some have four eyes.
            >[Unknown] So in Eripia are people with necks like those of cranes, and bills for mouths.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              I also have the translation itself in the order which the races were actually given.
              If any of you can identify the unknowns, that would be much appreciated.
              >THE SECOND AGE OF THE WORLD
              >FOLIO XII recto
              >Pliny, Augustine and Isidore have written of variously shaped people, of whom mention will be made hereafter.
              >[Cynocephali] In India are people with the heads of dogs, who bark when they speak. They sustain themselves by catching birds and clothe themselves in the skins of animals.
              >[Arimaspi] Item: Some have but one eye, which is in the forehead above the nose. Their diet is restricted to animal flesh.
              >[Blemmyae] Item: In Lybia some are born headless and have mouth and eyes.
              >[Machlyes] Some are double-sexed, the right breast male, the left one female. They are indiscriminate in their associations with one another and bear children.
              >[Astomoi*] Item: Toward Paradise, by the River Ganges, are people who do not eat. Their mouths are so small that they are obliged to drink through a straw. They live upon the odor of fruits and flowers. They quickly die if they encounter evil odors.
              >[Unknown] In this country there are also people without noses, their faces flat.
              >[Likely Sara or Mun peoples] Some have lower lips so large that they cover the entire face.
              >[Unknown] Item: Some have no tongues, and speak to one another in winks, in the manner of the cloister people.
              >[Panotii] Item: In Sicily some people have ears so large that they cover the whole body.
              >[Artabatitae] Item: In Ethiopia some wander about with their bodies bent downward in the manner of animals; and some of these live four hundred years.
              >[Aegipanes] Item: Some have horns, long noses and goat’s feet; and these are spoken of throughout the legends of St. Anthony.
              >[Sciapod] Item: In Ethiopia, toward the west, are people with but one foot, which is very broad. They are so fleet that they pursue the wild animals.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                >[Hippopodes] Item: In Basedthia are people with hoofs like a horse.
                >[Macrobi] Item: And there are some people five cubits in length and who never sicken until death.
                >[Gegenees] Item: In the histories of Alexander the Great one reads of people in India who have six hands.
                >[Unknown] Item: Some are naked and rough and live in the water
                >[Unknow] some have six digits on hands and feet.
                >[Centauri] Others who live in the water are half man and half horse.
                >[Could be Machlyes] Item: Women with beards extending down to their breasts, but their heads hairless and bald.
                >[Unknown] Item: In Ethiopia, toward the west, some have four eyes.
                >[Unknown] So in Eripia are people with necks like those of cranes, and bills for mouths.
                >[Nuli] But it is unbelievable, as Augustine writes, that there are certain people in the region of the earth opposed to us and where the sun rises, who reverse the position of their feet when the sun sets.
                >However, there is much dispute among writers as to just where people in general reside; for round about us people live everywhere upon the earth, directing their footsteps against one another, and standing upon the earth. And yet, they all turn the crowns of their heads toward heaven; and we wonder why we, or they who turn their heels toward us, do not fall. But that is the nature of things. For just as the seat of fire is nowhere than in the fire, that of water nowhere but in the water, and that of the spirit nowhere but in the spirit itself, so the seat of the earth is nowhere but within itself.
                Sorry for spamming. Just a lot of info I thought was worth sharing.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            there is a trope of pygmies fogthning birds for survival

  44. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    garden gnomes as goblins, since the idea of goblins was that they were originally the ghosts of garden gnomes haunting mines.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      So what you are saying is gnomish women are hot, green-skinned shortstacks?

  45. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    It'd be best to stick to humanoid-ish races with differences that justify them being a new race that would have mechanical impact in-game.
    Hippopodes and Cynocephali are good.
    Arimaspi and Sciapods are cool, but they don't make good player races since their physical differences would be more of a hindrance than a boon.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Arimaspi are literally just people with one eye. It isn't THAT huge a hinderance.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      A decent system should be able to handle 'unbalanced' races.
      For example, in GURPS, a racial template can be either an advantage which you have to pay for out of your character points, or a disadvantage which gives you more character points to spend on your personal traits.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Yeah but in the sciapods case I feel like the one legged thing would just be annoying to deal with in spite of whatever benefit they get to make up for it

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Why? The source material is pretty clear that they are perfectly mobile despite having only one leg. Hopping can be a fairly efficient way of getting about. The only issue I can see is that they are probably pretty bad at stealth, since they can't walk slowly.
          On the other hand, in games with hit locations, one leg may be easier to armour than two, or be more resistant to getting crippled (albeit at the cost of being completely immobilized if it does get broken).

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Nobody wants to fucking play gurps.

  46. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    What about the Pillar Men?

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Forgot pic.

  47. 1 month ago
    Sean

    Leprechaun and other faye of that sort?

  48. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    if you don't include at least one Drolatic Dream of Pantagruel you will have done the world a disfavor

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Noted

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >*if you don't include at least every single Drolatic Dream of Pantagruel
      Fixed that for you.

      https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b8624589t/f1.image

  49. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Just play Mythras. The Mythic Constantinople book has everything you're looking for.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >mee-no-TAFF-ree
      IT'S PRONOUNCED "mee-NO-tav-ree" YOU FUCKING BARBARE

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        My no tor oy

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          is it not mee noh tor?

  50. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    I like the idea of this thread in theory, but in practice pretty much every one of these races are goofy as hell. I couldn't take any of them seriously.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Dwarfs and goblins are pretty goofy aswell You are just used to them.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      That's part of the appeal. Though out of all of them I think Cynocephali, Blemmyes, Woodwoses, Panotii, Collogruis, and Pygmies are the most usable

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      All non-human races are goofy, you just haven't been as exposed to them.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      if panotti were called elves you wouldn't be saying that

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Those ears are too small

  51. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Cephalopods

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous
  52. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    What would be some good monsters and villainous races for such a scenario?

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >What would be some good monsters for such a scenario?
      Unironically Hegehogs

      Medieval folk had some pretty wild ideas about nature that make some common animals seem like fantasy creatures. Another of many example is the vegetable lamb.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >Ant

        Latin name: Formica
        Other names: Foranis, Formi, Furmi
        Ants harvest grain to store for the winter

        General Attributes
        Ants are said to have these characteristics: they walk in order like soldiers; they carry grains in their mouths, and an ant with no grain will not try to take the grain from one which has it; they break each grain in half to keep it from germinating when it rains, because if it does the ants will starve in the winter; when it is time to harvest the grain, they go into the fields and climb up to the grain, where they distinguish wheat from barley by its smell and reject the barley because it is food for cattle.
        Some Physiologus versions tell of the gold-digging ants of Ethiopia, which are the size of dogs. These ants dig up gold from sand with their feet and guard it, chasing down and killing any who try to steal it. It is said that people safely steal the ant's gold by separating mares from their foals, with a river between them. The mares, carrying packs, are driven to the side of the river inhabited by the ants; the ants, seeing the packs as a good place to hide their gold, fill them with the golden sand. When the mares swim back to their foals on the other side of the river, the ants cannot follow. This story is well illustrated in the Image du Monde by Gossuin de Metz (manuscript Bibliothèque de la Faculté de Médecine, H. 437, folio 104v).

        Allegory/Moral
        The ants working together for the common good is to be taken as a lesson to men, who should work in unity.
        The splitting of the grain represents the separation that must be made in the interpretation of the Bible, distinguishing the literal from the spiritual meaning, "lest the law interpreted literally should kill you". Some sources compare the ants to the garden gnomes, who have taken the law literally and have "died of hunger".
        The barley the ants reject signifies the heresy that Christians are to cast away.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >Antelope
          Latin name: Antalops
          Other names: Acolopus, Antelups, Antula, Antule, Aptalon, Aptalops, Autalops, Autula, Entulla
          An animal so wild no hunter can approach it

          General Attributes
          The antelope is so wild that hunters cannot catch it, except in one instance: When the antelope is thirsty it goes to the Euphrates River to drink, but as it plays in the thickets of herecine trees there, its horns get caught in the branches and it cannot free itself. The hunter, hearing its cries, comes and kills it. Its horns are like saws, and with them it can cut down trees.

          Allegory/Moral
          The antelope's two horns represent the biblical Old and New Testaments, with which people can cut themselves free of vice. People are also warned not to play in the "thickets of worldliness" where pleasure can kill body and soul.

          Illustration
          Antelope illustrations vary considerably, depicting the animal as anything from dog-like to horse-like. They are almost always given horns; in some cases the saw-like nature of the horns is minimal, while in others it is greatly exaggerated. The antelope is almost always shown with its horns tangled in a bush or tree, usually with a man killing it with a spear or an axe. Sometimes the river the antelope is said to drink from is also shown.

          Heraldry
          The antelope was not much used in heraldry, though the antelope head alone was more common. On his badge King Henry IV used a white antelope with gold horns, tusks and hooves. Kings Henry V and VI also used the antelope. It is thought that this beast was the badge of the Bohun family in England.

          Reality
          The antelope of the Physiologus and the bestiaries is not the animal now called antelope. Medieval writers were unsure of its identity, hence its many names.

  53. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Check original medieval and renaissance sources for inspiration.
    Here's a pretty good one. If anyone else knows more illuminated manuscripts besides pantagruels dreams, nuremberg chronicles and link that are adequate for a seeting like this please share!

    https://archive.org/details/vlyssisaldrouan00aldra/mode/2up

  54. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Why do most of these mythical races look like they fit into 40k as mutants?

  55. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >I'd be interested in any ideas for such a setting in general.
    Animals having enough moral agency to be reasonably considered capable of standing trial:
    https://www.historytoday.com/archive/natural-histories/pigs-might-try

  56. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Good thread

  57. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Read Baudolino by Umberto Eco , thats basically what he did and he had massive encyclopedic knowledge about the middle-ages.

  58. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    A none human showing up of any type is bad in historical fiction. Human only.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      That's just like your opinion man..

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      This isn't about historical fiction you dunce. It's fantasy of medieval lit, art, folklore, and bestiaries were accurate. baka

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Nobody has ever thought the grotesques to be accurate any more than you believe Wojak to be a real person. They were the memes of their times, things that people laughed and joked about. The Plinian races, on the other hand, were very much considered real by many.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          What the duck are you talking about anon? All I said was "art," if you are referring to the pic, I never claimed it was accurate to people's beliefs. HOWEVER, medieval folks did believe demons were very real so what's wrong Bosch's; other period relevant depictions are also bizarre and fanciful. So yeah, I'd say they are accurate to at least someone's views in retrospect.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Actually that's not true- It was boschs goal to scare the literal hell out of people with his images and he succeded even if some of those depictions may look funny to you now. Medieval people weren't as backwards as most people think but the fear of purgatory and hell was very fucking real.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Not a good look if your HFY fails at reading comprehension.

  59. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Maybe troglodytes as humanoid cave dwellers?

  60. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Period accurate demons are awesome.

  61. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    bump

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Fuck you

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Calm down man it's a good thread.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Not worth bumping from Page fucking 11

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            yes it is

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            American hours currently as soon as euros wake up this thread will continue. Mark my words.

  62. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    According to Medieval lore of Alexander the great there is a cyclopean Blemmyes variant

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Some cool draconic beasts too

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Those look fucking sick

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >the biblically accurate dogs

  63. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >Plant people
    >Sentient bees
    >Spectres
    >Giants
    >hive mind ants
    >centaurs
    >Gnome = about the size of your thumb

  64. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Anyone down for homebrewing a setting/system for this? I feel like there’s a lot to work with

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      By all means, if you have ideas feel free to post them. I've been sharing my rough ideas throughout the thread.

      >That river goeth through the land of Pigmies, where that the folk be of little stature, that be but three span long, and they be right fair and gentle, after their quantities, both the men and the women. And they marry them when they be half year of age and get children. And they live not but six year or seven at the most; and he that liveth eight year, men hold him there right passing old. These men be the best workers of gold, silver, cotton, silk and of all such things, of any other that be in the world. And they have oftentimes war with the birds of the country that they take and eat. This little folk neither labour in lands ne in vines; but they have great men amongst them of our stature that till the land and labour amongst the vines for them. And of those men of our stature have they as great scorn and wonder as we would have among us of giants, if they were amongst us. There is a good city, amongst others, where there is dwelling great plenty of those little folk, and it is a great city and a fair. And the men be great that dwell amongst them, but when they get any children they be as little as the pigmies. And therefore they be, all for the most part, all pigmies; for the nature of the land is such. The great Chan let keep this city full well, for it is his. And albeit, that the pigmies be little, yet they be full reasonable after their age, and can both wit and good and malice enough.

      Sounds pretty standard as far as smallfolk go. I like their rivalry with cranes though, maybe it could elaborated into something to do with the Collogruis/Pelargolai? Pygmies are said to be good with gold, silver, and silk which were all very coveted in the middle ages, and if the crane men are as greedy and covetous as what few sources I can find say, they may be interested in making slaves of them.

      here

      Going to put down some worldbuilding ideas, will post more as they come to me.
      >Cynocephali
      They call themselves Augani, apparently after some legendary spiritual leader. Cynocephali have historically acted much like dogs, being attracted to human settlements by the prospect of food and shelter which they earned by hunting and fighting on the humans behalf. On their own, they are primitive hunter scavengers, but they are quick and eager to adapt to human civilisation and culture. As their own spiritual beliefs are relatively shallow, they’re particularly attracted to human religions and many end up joining priesthoods and religious orders. In the present, large swathes of land are afforded as cynocephali reserves and they are becoming increasingly rare in human society due to a shift from nomadism to a sedentary lifestyle based on farmed food, which is unpalatable to the cynocephali. Today, most who live outside the reserves are found in small rural communities or as monks and hermits living apart from society.

      here

      Do we have any idea of what the panotti's culture is like? I don't imagine so, given how cursory most of the descriptions are. From what I know the only details we have are:
      >Have real big ears
      >Don't wear a lot of clothes, wrap themselves in their ears for warmth
      >Live on some islands up north, either in Orkney, the baltic sea, or "off the coast of scythia" probably in the caspian or black sea
      >Can fly? Maybe?
      I think it would be a bit cliche to make them good sailors just because their an island people. Instead, I'd expand on their possible ability to fly. Panotti are a migratory people who use their big floppy ears to glide on the wind from island to island, this way they avoid totally exhausting any one island's resources by hopping around and giving them a chance to replenish naturally. They aren't capable of true flight though, they're carried by seasonal wind storms, which my be embodied as deities in their religion.
      Just throwing out some ideas, think it has potential?

      and here
      As for a setting/system, I image the focus would be on exploring strange foreign lands. The known world serves as background for your marco polo-style adventurers and the boundaries of the world are undefined. Your players should always be wondering what strange and wonderful things they'll find on the next island over.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Take Ars Magica, toss in some races. wah la

  65. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >playable races
    just humans with variants based on nationality
    the mythical shit people believed in was too wacky for player characters

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      booring

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Way to miss the point of the thread

  66. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Humans only, but treat different ethnicities as completely different species of creature.

  67. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >everybody says blemmeys
    >nobody says monopods

  68. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Anyone interested in making a bestiary for these guys? How would you stat picrel for example?

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      For Bosch or Bruegel creatures, I wouldn't make a beastiary. They basically never paint twice the same monster, these are beings of pure chaos.
      I would give them a threat level, basically the equivalent of a hit dice
      >small monster
      >medium monster
      >giant monster
      and pick or roll for a special ability.
      So the one in your pic related would be:
      >Threat: small
      >Special mutation: Demonic instrument: have a [threat level] stunning attack every turn.
      Other special abilities could be:
      >Vomiting new monsters of an inferior threat level
      >Swallowing enemies whole
      >Grapple
      >Can fight with weapons
      >Has a shield
      >Has armour
      >Reach
      >Fly
      >Highly mobile
      >Just so damn obscene that it gives you minus to hit

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        While you are right about the demons all looking somewhat different there are in fact recurrent themes.
        Here are some examples:
        >headfusselers (head walking on his own),
        >piper demons (demons with a nose that is some kind of blowing instrument),
        >imps (just little impish demons that look pretty standard and mostly appear in the background, some of them have wings),
        >humanoid structures (anthromorphised buildings that are part human and tend to look very grotesque)
        >temptresses (at first glance they look like human females but somethings off about them a demon foot or leg in most cases)
        >bird monsters (for some reason just lake later surrealists bosch really loved depicting birds as monstrous beings)
        >animals in human clothing (satirical mockeries of priests or noblemen often pigs, toads or other animals associated with bad attributes)
        >creatures wearing an iron funnel as a hat (antisemitic depiction of medieval gnomish headwear)
        >hellmouths (giant faces stuck in the ground that swallow people and act as portals to hell)
        >chimeras (grotesque mixtures of parts from different animals)
        >human animal hybrids (pretty self explanatory)
        >devils (like the imps but bigger and often depicted with faces and mouths instead of genitals and on other body parts)
        >ice-skater (creatures depicted with wooden skates tied to their feet)
        >fishes outside the water (fish creatures that seemingly live on land and move by walking or flying)
        >dragons (doglike walking snakes and reptiles sometimes depicted with wings or multiple heads)

        Thread theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bG-34_6_rrk

  69. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    If we're actually talking mechanics I think we should keep the focus on the weird creatures like cynocephali, blemmyes, panotti, etc. In addition to set playable species we could make tables to randomly generate more "lost tribes" which you roll for mutations and basic cultures.

  70. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    My hometown has a legend that could make for an interesting monster.
    It's am amphibian monster that can both swim and fight on land.
    It has the tail, size and head of a big crocodile, scales, but also long green hair with lethal poisonous spikes.
    It has suction cups on it's feet to climb on buildings and trees, to ambush people.
    And it can produce some fire from it's mouth as well.
    It's supposed to be originally an ocean creature from a lost age, that climbs rivers up to attack inland river towns and hamlets.
    It attacks, people and cattle indiscriminately but prefers eating young women and children.
    It also liked burning crops with it's fire breath.
    And finally, it has a kind of splash attack, jumping in the water causing gigantic waves.
    It's called "la velue", which means "the hairy".

  71. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Nail
    Coffin

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      What?

  72. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Elves/Faeries
    Fauns/Satyrs

  73. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >AAAAAUUGHH! My foot! My foot is enormous! Blemmy you rat! You did not call your sorcerer friend to give another eye to my cyclops wife, you called your friend to curse me with the six-foot stomper!
    >How could you give the six-foot stomper to your own brother, Blemmy!

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      goddamnit i laughed, why isn't there an edit of the original comic yet

  74. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Dragons in general, though they'd vary wildly in size. I'm thinking about the weird doggy-type ones they'd draw in "Here Be Dragons" warnings all the time. St. George's dragon is also depicted as dinosaur-size, from what I've seen.

    Fae for sure, though I don't know if they had a uniform appearance.

    I believe Manticore were still around, and those are corruptions of Antlions?

    Centaur and Nuckelavee, being based on horse-riding invaders.

    Mermaids being manatees seems to be more for the age of sail, but that can still work.

  75. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    For playable races, I think there is an issue:
    You can actually make a low fantasy; down to earth "realistic" (in feel) setting with tolkien races, because they've been so integrated in our culture.
    Therefore, a dwarf or an elf doesn't sound all that weird, even in a modern setting (see shadowrun).
    On the other hand, medieval races, even through they are grounded in real historical beliefs, are so outlandish to our modern perception, that they feel very high fantasy and non-realistic.
    Therefore, I think having medieval races as playable would make the game feel much more un-grounded, unless there is a strict limitation on number of said races in party (for instance with the random d100 race selection system of Warhammer fantasy RPG) and if they are stated to be very rare and legendary among normal people (humans). With the consequences on the party members of said race (hard time being trusted, discrimination, outright hostility etc).
    I think an interesting way to have another playable race would be treating women (female humans) as truly different in regard to starting stats, and with the way npcs see them/ interact with them.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Yes but the point of the thread isn't to make a setting that's realistic or grounded in historical beliefs, just a setting that features the kinds of things found in bestiaries of the time

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >make a setting based more on medieval literature and misbeliefs rather than Tolkien and modern fantasy tropes

      >down to earth "realistic"
      Obviously not what OP is going for. Medieval bestiaries and art are chaotic and often nonsensical thus that should be the vibe of the region.
      Also, what is so far-fetched about a race of small people (pygmies), hermaphrodites (machyles), or cyclops (arimaspi)? Even the panotii are well in bounds if you execute them right.

      This is how I Panotti.

      Pathfinder's depiction of the astomoi I would say is a good example of reimagining a race done right. They look visually interesting while keeping to the theme of what an astomoi is. That is, if you even wanted to go for a "realistic" and "grounded" setting in the first place.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Source on pic rel?

  76. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Somebody make a new thread. Let's actually do something out of this idea once and build a playable setting for this!

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Seconded.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      We reached bump limit.

      New Thread:

      [...]

  77. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    We reached bump limit.

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