Post your tabletop playstyle.
>The Grappler
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Post your tabletop playstyle. >The Grappler
Post your tabletop playstyle.
>The Grappler
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Too bad you have to take up a bunch of feats so that they not provoke AoO, and they still suck anyways because you can't grapple bigger foes.
Just play GURPS lmao
Pathfinder has some pretty good grappler feats.
It's not "my style," but man do I love the grappling rules we use at my table.
Somebody name me two relatively grounded things of reasonable parity. This shit's now a wrestling fecht thread until I get bored or fall asleep.
How about you. Name me some lowish level shit it'd be cool to have grapple in pathfinder and I'll restat that shit and run it in jank ass gurps alternate rules. Then we may compare notes.
I'd rather have scale increases over time that DON'T require manually building the core math progression needed to survive it so we aren't juggling basic game numbers every single fricking session
But Cleric adds no important scores to Monk. In 3.5, there's classes like the Beguiler and Sha'ir that have hard features asking for both Int and Cha to become Every Attribute Dependent, with the latter having quite strong desire for both.
>I'd rather have scale increases over time that DON'T require manually building the core math progression needed to survive it so we aren't juggling basic game numbers every single fricking session
I'm actually curious what your specific experience is. I remember having to fix a bunch of shit in gurps, but it's been fixed so long it's slipping my mind what you're talking about exactly.
Sounds like it's working as intended since GURPS is a toolbox system that you can use to make it do whatever you want
>hey there's some problems with the system I found and had to fix, what did you find?
>Oh that's the system working as intended,
Black person this is literally what we clown on D&Drones for, the fact that the GM has to fix a bunch of problems and people go "yeah that's normal, it's intended that the product is deficient."
But it's especially bad here where it just terminates the conversation.
>I remember having to fix a bunch of shit in gurps, but it's been fixed so long it's slipping my mind what you're talking about exactly.
That point-buy is awful for shifting "tiers of play" as represented by leveling up because you have to earmark every single scaling value manually instead of having any guidance as to how to maintain a "sliding scale"?
I've never played GURPS, but this is an issue of D&D and GURPS having fundamentally different goals for character progression resulting in their mechanics clashing horribly when you try to use one for the other.
The Trissociate would be a decent example of the sort of scheme I'd like to play:
https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?234951
Separates functions into niche coverage, you choose the niches early on, they scale by your character level. Still a bit poor because 3.5 is just that horrendously broken a system, but gets across "the point"
This is fair. The goals are extremely different, and if you try to play GURPS by just 'leveling up,' by buying higher numbers, it will, yes, break in short order.
In the span of play time most D&D groups seem to go from level 1 to like 14, my fantasy party has gone from 150 points to like 260, and the average attack skill among them has gone from like 14 to 17. which represents a massive improvement, the game just doesn't have as broad a range of numbers for certain things.
They're drastically more powerful but most of that is equipment and lateral progression. Consider if you will never advancing core stats much but gaining class features tuned down to those numbers at a similar rate. That's pretty much how you make GURPS do dungeon fantasy correctly.
I'm still not...100% sure I follow entirely, I'll admit. I haven't played a 3e-like in so long the context has all drained out of my head. I genuinely don't remember what it's like fretting over encounter balance and massaging numbers like that, excepting that I remember doing it. Though, it being on the tail end of my being awake likely doesn't help much.
It isn't so specifically the "Dungeon Fantasy" of OSR as it is the harsh absence of "blowing away the chaff". The amount of points needed to render the threats they faced at 150 points negligible would be several times their progression so far, while in (at least WotC) D&D 1st-14th has had this happen three times over.
GURPS lets characters get "wider" easily, but to my understanding is strongly against this sort of "outmoding" of starting conflicts. And yes, I'm very well aware that this is something that seeped into RPGs from entirely different mediums like comics, anime, and video games, but such escalation is THE big "gap" that pure point-buy just does not work for.
Gotcha. yeah, I see nothing wrong with that assessment at its core, and appreciate you spelling it out in clearer terms for my dumb ass. As for blowing away the chaff I'm not...100% sure.
I don't think the shit they fought early on is of zero threat, but my party has largely moved from 'fighting goblins at a 2.5 ratio or so and that seems kinda fair,' to "Frickit, fight these forty professional mercenaries." But it's still a different...kind of progression than what you're talking about, yeah. I don't know that they'd wipe the floor with their original selves like they didn't exist in quite the same way as a 'similar' gap in a D&D like but it would definitely be a disgusting curbstomp.
...I don't know if their original 150pt builds could do anything to stop the warlord at all unless they basically all dogpiled him.
Interesting thought experiment. I my run a few of these to see.
The one thing I do to achieve the scaling effect when i need it though is to use the 'mowing down hordes of zombies,' rules from, unsurprisingly, gurps zombies, if one side outclasses the other sufficiently. Doesn't interact well with precision fighters though, so you definitely don't want to use the horde as the only enemy. Learned that shit the hard way.
Not OP, but I don't play GURPS and I don't run into any of the issues you described with my grappler.
>the not even close to feasible and has more MAD than a nuclear cold war Monk/Cleric.
I like playing the monster or people with the control of one, especially the fey kinds.
Find a group that I enjoy enough and then be like water to patch up weaknesses that the party has. My current character is a fricking mess. Functional, but a fricking mess.
>The strategize under the assumption that everyone else will just throw themselves at the enemy
>gm'ing game
>player keeps trying to grapple enemies
>there's no rules for it
>scream at the player and throw his dice in his face
>jk actually make up quick rules for it on the fly when it comes up
>make shit up in the middle of the session; shit that will likely either be forgotten or run inconsistently in the future, or outright said no to
>still calls it a game
If it's solid enough I write it down for later use. I have said no on multiple occasions.
nta, but if the rules don't cover something, you make shit up and you keep the game moving.
You stop after the session, write shit down, and fix the problem.
If there's no rules it's not a game, but if I can't grab onto a dude because nobody wrote a chart for it, it's not roleplaying.
>prevent players from doing something mundane because the devs didn't think to include it
>still call it roleplaying
So much this.
DM's need to break out of the videogame mindset.
A lot of newbies just run prefabs unaltered out of the box, and don't let their party go remotely off the rails.
That candlekeep quest book full of oneshots?
I had to suffer through three quarters of that shit, played straight as an arrow, with no connectivity between the quests, and wasn't even allowed to go a bit off the beaten path sometimes to take advantage of the quests essentially having zero impact one another.
>No, you aren't allowed to use the dynamite you swiped from the last quest to blow up the obviously evil bath-house
>GM doesn't care that I believe I have discovered an Elven Grooming Gang
Blast his pinko hide, we could have saved those people.
Roleplaying isn't even a part of a game if there's no actual structure to support it. So many homosexuals grandstand about "b-but muh roleplay!" or "i-it's narrative focused!" while running their sessions without any consideration for cohesion of plot, story, and character, and how anything fits into their world.
It's not about roleplay or narrative to you homosexuals, it's about having some kind of moral high ground over the evil "powergamers" and other moronic buzzwords that get thrown around by morons who think there's only one way to have fun, and use that fun as a shield against criticism.
c**t.
I agree with you completely in principle, but let's look at the comment chain you're replying to.
If you take 'the game must have structure,' to the extremes of 'No, you can't grab that guy and restrain him, they didn't write down a grapple move,' or 'you can't dive under tables, there's no prone state in this,' then man I don't frickin' know.
The only exceptions I'd make here are very tightly controlled combats like, I dunno, Kamigakari or something, but even then if it was meaningful I'd arbitrate something at least.
People who change the rules constantly for no goddamn reason should be strung up. "Man, that seemed broken, let's talk about it as a group and see if we can come up with a better mechanic' is one thing. "Uhh, I don't like this outcome, so as the GM I'm changing the rule just this once, for the third time today," should get you tarred and feathered.
There's SOME truth to 'the rules are just guidelines,' but you should only really be intervening in them mid-game like that if they break and spit out an answer that's complete gibberish, or offensively wrong to common sense.
>will likely either be forgotten or run inconsistently in the future
I hate this like you wouldn't believe
Why are we even use dice if shit changes not only in between sessions but in between fricking turns. At that point just fricking freeform if you aren't going to even read the manual for the game you claim to run
>The person driving the plot forward
Unflappable sniper that's also well prepared for hand to hand combat just in case some moron thinks all he needs to do is get close.
Heh I used him as inspiration of my barbarian battlerager with unarmmed style feat. Surprisingly pretty good, even better than monks at combat
>unitentionally becomes the macguffin