>sell $20 game
>valve takes $6.00
>uncle sam takes up to $7.40
>unity takes between $0.02 and $0.20 (and only after you reach 200,000 installs, which would mean you already made $4 million at this price point)
OH THE HUMANITY
>b..b.b.b.but what if someone installs multiple times
Cope retard, for everyone who installs the same game multiple times there's 5 people buying it and never installing it once
>but what about f2p games getting fucked over
good
You could just give away your game for free so steam owes you 6c for every download.
>steam just increases the price of something else to make it up
It always comes back to the consumer
>sell $20 game
>valve takes $6.00 when you sell it
>aunt(male) sammy takes $7.40
>unity takes $00.02 every time that one sale is installed
You belong shackled to a canoe in a volcano.
Can you remind me how many good games have been made with Godot?
The same number as good Unity games
>cuphead is a bad game
Grim state on this board
compared to other shmups, it really is. it feels more like a demo than a full good game
>arguing cuphead is a genuinely bad game rather than saying “oh no, unity has a couple good games”
Why are you retards so afraid of admitting when you’re wrong?
Im a diff anon
The point of the conversation is pinpoint whether unity has any worthwhile games. Whether you personally view your reluctance to admit cuphead is quality as some kind of appraisal of your high standards, I don’t care. The consensus is that it’s a good game. No need to try to impress random people by saying it isn’t. This reminds me of a conversation I had years ago with a mutual friend who told me 2001 a space odyssey is a bad movie because STALKER is better. Total retard nonsense meant to impress people are are usually just annoyed instead.
cuphead is a mediocre game. not bad, just mediocre. all glitter no soul
>soulposting
I hate zoomers so much, it’s unreal.
Games like donpachpachi and capcom's shmups are ten times better than that boring ass cuphead
They're not even the same genre you disingenuous retard
I can think of five action roguelikes that come out the same year as Hades that are better than it. That doesn’t mean Hades is bad. Pretending to think a popular thing is genuinely terrible is retarded. Actually, lemme put it in terms you can understand, kid. Bruv ong that’s sus fr fr, no riz.
cuphead sucks
more like cuckhead XD
Ori and the Blind Forest
Contra for babies
>B...b...but it's hand animated!
Yeah, it's well animated. That's all it has going for it. It plays like a high schoolers first game.
>likes ori, one of the easiest platformers ever made
>usually only praised for the art
>hates cuphead for being too easy and being praised too much for having good art
>Fluid movement
>Unique environment and artstyle
>Optional challenges if you want difficulty
vs
>Janky, unrefined movement
>A bunch of trash thrown at the screen in the hopes that something sticks.
Like literally hundreds. This question is asked on this board every fucking day, even today I've seen it posted 4 times.
Shit meant to reply to
Godot only has some 2d games for it, and gdscript sucks.
Did this come from Godot's site or is this a shitposting image from here? Because if Godot isn't taking full advantage to shitpost about this, they're missing out.
https://twitter.com/InnerslothDevs/status/1701731398498013575
Look at the first reply.
Pretty much every single program you install has telemetry, it's not illegal nor rare despite it deserving to be.
>https://twitter.com/InnerslothDevs/status/1701731398498013575
It's funny and all but name one successful studio that moved to Godot. People who move to it are mostly no devs that think they will have a better time with it (they won't).
Before Unity was a main stay in the current development realm, there were people that said similar things about it. In a way it all has come full circle. Hope Godot will be spared from this cycle of rise and poop
Godot is completely open source so it's possible it will become the Blender of video game engines.
cruelty squad
It didn't move there, and it wasn't a studio of people either.
oh you were being specific, i thought you were just saying godot is bad
i'd say give it a year. i'm not super up to date but i heard something happened with unity that's making a lot of actual studios put in the time to consider moving engines
remind me how many good 3d games are made in godot
now make it an actual decent engine, I don't give a shit if it's free when it can barely hold up to standards
>ThErE aReNt AnY gOoD gAmEs
Unity has almost a DECADE of maturity on Godot. There were very few good games out for Unity at this point either, relatively speaking. Godot has a chance of being great, I personally think they need to fuck off with all these fancy visuals and specialize in 2D and stylized simple 3D.
Or atleast refine the 2D tools for now. Its what 90% of users are coming to it for.
Unity does have a few good games, but the majority of them games are asset flops and babby's first game.
First good game that comes to mind is City Skylines.
so how is godot making money exactly? "it's free don't worry about it" is what leads to the exact issue unity is having when it's time to monetize
>so how is godot making money exactly?
Mainly donations and grants.
https://fund.godotengine.org/
I'm a donor myself.
Remember if it’s not a publicly traded company and the CEO isn’t a leach you can operate on much less money. Linux, Firefox, Gimp, etc. all stay alive from donations and community support. It’s open source software and that lives and dies on community trust.
Nobody tell him about pozzedfox
Or just come home to Godot and stop worrying about paying for installs.
godot script doesn't even have a fucking garbage collector. The whole thing is just a memory leak. It's shit.
Yeah it really sucks that you totally can't use C++ or C#, it's just not possible
>can't into memory management
Literally pajeet-tier.
>dynamic programming language
>with no memory management
bruh
It automatically frees references. Also there is C# with .Net Core support, meaning you can do all the garbage collection in the world. But i have the feeling you are just here to shit on the engine with limited knowledge
>It automatically frees references
No, no it does not.
If you have a root node that has a child reference that references that other node, and let the root node drop out of scope, you just created a memory leak.
Hm, i stand corrected then from what the manual is describing for 3.5. Either way, garbage collection with the C# version is possible and unproblematic
Unity has specific c# optimizations that I'm pretty sure godot doesn't have, see pic related. Godot will be creating garbage in all of these common c# use cases. It isn't identical.
who's gonna create the illegal unity c# godot fork
Sorry, bad cap
I don't think unity's modified version of mono they are using is open source, it would have to be decompiled.
No idea if Godot has a similar system implemented in 4.1. Probably something they will add later on as usual
>SortedDictionary, Hashtable
Unreal bros, why can't we have these nice things?
unreal is better though
Who cares? If you need a hyperoptimized set of tools because you’re making something insane that isn’t feasible with existing engines, just make your own engine. It’s not even that hard. You do 75% of the work in your typical computer graphics class.
An engine is more than a graphics pipeline retard. It needs to support an entire developer workflow. If it's so easy where are the other not-shit engines out there other than unity, unreal, and godot?
Everyone thinks they can make an engine if all they do is get a graphics pipeline, input, and sound figured out, but that's 1% of the work.
Looks like they've fixed it.
New thing is called "RefCounter" and this does not seem to leak
Anon, reference counted objects do not get freed on circular references.
If you made an inventory that got filled up with items, and those items had references to that inventory, then if that player gets removed, or deleted, or whatever, dropping that inventory data, the inventory and all the quests would leak in memory, because they would both have a refcount over zero because they reference each other.
gdscript was designed to be newb friendly but it's worse than lua.
You mean something like this?
Even the previous homer and lenny example you gave was a leak. That's what reference counting is.
oh no!
What do?
Pick another language:
https://github.com/Vivraan/godot-lang-support
>If you made an inventory that got filled up with items, and those items had references to that inventory, then if that player gets removed, or deleted, or whatever, dropping that inventory data, the inventory and all the quests would leak in memory, because they would both have a refcount over zero because they reference each other.
Then free them all. You're working for free for a reason slave.
Imagine having to introduce cpp level managed memory in your DSL. FUCKING KEK.
EA stocks went to 5x the price after that idiot left lol
Oh shit really?
memory leaks don't matter
bruh
are you retarded, anon?
Exactly, if your game is $20, $0.2 is nothing, but the cheaper your game the more impactful it is. At $1 you are now making fuck all.
it only counts if you install it on different PCs
we have built in fraud detection
I’m pretty sure, in their first updated clarification, it was the same device within 1 month was counted as a single install, so if you reinstall every 6 months they would have been unique.
>we have built in fraud detection
The same one that detects multiple installs and charges per install? So how does this "fraud detection" effect sales numbers exactly?
>at the point where i have to pay the per-download fee im already forced to use their 2k/year license
The point of no return of course.
>We
Wow unity devs shill here
>we
Hey at least they are being honest for once.
>we have built in fraud detection
Ah, yes.
The tool has make Unity more money if it's shit.
They will definitively put a lot of effort into it.
alot of people reinstall every time they play, especially if your game is short
idk why they do it, i just know my own sales to install ratio is close to 10-1.
>for everyone who installs the same game multiple times there's 5 people buying it and never installing it once
Buying?
They now report you to your ISP and block you if you use a VPN.
>block you if you use a VPN.
>people believe this
Most popular f2p games come from china and they have their own Unity China there where big game developers own major stocks in the company. Garbage western Unity Technologies Inc can't touch them.
Wasn't that per 200000$? So free games never hit that trashhold SO never get pay for installetion?
If the game is entirely free, then yes, but microtransactions, ads, donations, etc. all contribute to revenue beyond sales.
Donation? What if dude make free game and ask donation for his forever not complete project?
It's not donation for free game, it's for other project *wink*
Revenue per company is known, wether you fell like committing fraud and misrepresenting what your funds are related to is up to you.
Someone mentioned that they factor in patreon bucks too. I would love to see a source on that.
There is an install threshold in addition to a revenue threshold. This means that you can distribute the game for free, and you would still have to pay per install once that threshhold is exceeded.
You are either a fucking idiot or a fucking liar. There is a runtime tracker. It is not illegal. Go fuck yourself.
>You are either a fucking idiot or a fucking liar. There is a runtime tracker. It is not illegal. Go fuck yourself.
he doesn't know
Doesn't know what? Nobody cares about euroshits, you don't matter
Apple literally bent the knee and put USB C on the iPhone because of Europa, get fucked garden gnome
I fucking love the Brussels Effect sometimes
apple is garden gnome shit, dumbo
Anon they said they used proprietary methods of figuring it out because they don't use telemetry for it. That's just what they said.
Can you even read dipshit? Their own announcements say that you are wrong.
if it wasnt for valve your game would reach a grand total of two people and a toaster, not to mention how the amount of utility steam provides makes that tax acceptable.
but what does unity do that warrants a flat fee on every fresh install? at the point where i have to pay the per-download fee im already forced to use their 2k/year license
What makes millions of people fellate a random fat fuck who got lucky?
Lack of a parental figure
Valve was good once upon a time but I don't see how people still jack them off after the past decade of stagnation. They've done the exact same shit Rockstar has.
>what does unity do that warrants a flat fee on every fresh install?
the engine that your game runs on. they own the underlying technology that facilitated the creation of your game. how many games wouldn't exist if the devs had to created their own engines from scratch
which im already paying them for the license to use the software.
Only 10% of games on Steam have revenues in excess of $200k. This whole kerfuffle is over edge cases that Unity has already acknowledged that they're willing negotiate. Unity has zero incentive to bankrupt devs.
It's a slippery slope. It's the horse armor dlc of game engines.
Johnny Riggatoni was the guy who wants to charge for each bullet you fire. Don't enable these maniacs.
The problem isn't even if a lot of devs will be affected or not.
The problem is with their "we are altering the deal retroactively, because we allowed ourselves to" mindset.
You can't make long-term business plans with a partner like that, and making vidya is years of investments before seeing any payoff.
It's suicidal to stay with Unity just because of that, not because of losing 0.20$ here and there.
And yet it's the devs who have made those 10% of games that are all jumping ship
If they have zero faith in the future of Unity I don't see why any dev starting out should
this lol, you think the indie dev who can barely code at all is going to jump ship? he doesnt have a realistic hope to reach 200k anyway and it's a moonshot.
It's the successful people that leave, in my opinion
>This whole kerfuffle is over edge cases that Unity has already acknowledged that they're willing negotiate.
Then why bother making this change if they're not going to do anything with it?
(Jou)
don't respond to these shills in any other way you retards.
>how many games wouldn't exist if the devs had to created their own engines from scratch
wow who cares, maybe those devs should stop sucking
maybe your mother should've kept sucking
Im sure anon your next mega hit on steam will sell like hot cakes. Those 4000 hours spend to make a custom engine truly showed those nerds!
How many piece of software wouldn’t exist if not for the compiler? What a retarded question. Should the Grace Hopper estate get 20 cents every time I compile some jars?
Does the Hopper estate have the legal capacity to demand 20 cents every time you compile some jars? Is the Hopper estate actively engaged in the development and maintenance of the compiler?
Are you arguing that what unity is ethical or just that it’s legal? If you’re saying it’s ethical, then what you’ve just said is retarded because whether Grace Hopper is currently maintaining the compiler is irrelevant, seeing as Unity is already charging per license. If they need to charge more per license, fine. Charging an amount that scales with installs is dystopian.
But if you’re just saying that what they’re doing is legal, and the Grace Hopper estate doing the same isn’t, then I don’t know what you expect me to say other than “okay”. The initial premise of my reply is that you seem to think that unity enables otherwise incompetent game devs to make games. That’s like saying the compiler enables incomplete product devs to make software. It’s just a tool that people have come to rely upon in order to focus their limited resources on other parts of the software construction process.
Wowee. Good thing Unity was already charging people for that, otherwise they would have literally no money!
By that logic your OS company has every right to demand a cut. And your chip manufacturer. And, and, and...
what application do people use to make that type of video/gif? i see that format everywhere
without unity they would be no game.
Steam does fuck all about promoting your game.
It's all automated.
Unity deserves $6.
Valve deserves a kick in the butt.
>unity installs spyware on your computer because they just have to know when you install their game
Its more about the message this sends to developers. Unity is letting everyone know that if you make a game in unity, its theirs, not yours. They can add charges on installs, they can automatically roll you over to a new price plan - they have you by the balls and they want you to know. Even if this all gets thrown out after a legal fiasco, do you really want to spend dozens of hours developing a product in an engine run by the kind of suits that would even try to nickel and dime people like that? Its just big own nothing, be happy vibes
Yeah no shit it's unity's game. If you want your game to be 100% yours write your own game engine.
that's Valve, yes.
You pay them 40%, or else they ban your game.
Paying to use somebody elses game engine? Those greedy capitalists!
post nose
>Americans pay over 50% Tax when they sell a product
The fuck? Do you either not know math, or how taxes work?
If you didn't get that $20, you don't actually pay tax on the entire $20. Valve takes their 30% then gives you the remaining $14. So you are taxed on that $14 you actually earned.
Unless you're getting robbed, usually a game developer will get to keep somewhere between 50-60% of each games sale.
You also get tax deductions on the other percentages taken of your revenue.
37% in the top trax bracket, + 13% self employment tax
I made a thread last month about this.
You don't make a game and send all your profits to your personal bank account. That's how you end up being taxed for all it's worth.
You're supposed to create a company with a bank account and have all the money sent over to said bank account. Then you pay yourself a salary within a comfortable tax bracket (+use your company card to go to restaurants and buy cars and label them as business expenses) now you won't be taxed 50%
>You're supposed to create a company
That's nice, but no I'm not filing a fucking ESG report and hiring a mulatto moron to do that for me. It would cost to much in the mandatory bennies/workers comp i'd have to pay that my shit state forces.
>now you won't be taxed 50%
>He believes companies pay less tax that work-a-day schmoes
You really have to abuse that card, to the point where you risk an audit for it to be worth it. Honestly it's not worth it considering the mental gymnastics/time wasting you'll do in paper work. And the point is to do less work, not more. There's actually a much simpler way. Just:
>Make less than the cost of housing a prison inmate
And no one will bother you.
You are Unbelievably stupid if you don't know how to make a company
There are literal wetback Mexicans who barely speak English smarter than you, and apparently understand tax code better than you
And there's no esg for just an s corp you dingus
>stupid
I know how to make a company. It's actually really fucking easy and all it takes is some paper work and no money. Then more paper work after to actually form the company. Then even more paper irrelevant paper work. I know how to form an LLC so you can just run away when shit hits the fan. Or file bankruptcy after you incur thousands of dollars in debt that you can actually pay but don't want to because you're set for 7 years.
It's not that I don't know how to do it, it's that I'm not going to do it is all. Too much like work when you could just make more on welfare/odd jobs. Plus you don't have to fund evil in the process.
>stopped reading there.
Your opinion is dogshit because it probably supports what any letter in that acronym stands for. Nobody with a brain stem supports this shit.
>and apparently understand tax code better than you
Anyways enjoy welfare I guess if it works it works
You undoubtedly understand the tax code better because you participate in it. There's nothing more important in life than carrying 0's and managing receipts more efficiently than someone with OCD does with pantry items.
>muh ESG
stopped reading there.
>>muh
stopped reading there
>(You)
stopped reading there
>ESG
ai-generated post, good night sir.
>personal expenses on company credit card
Yeah anon, that's tax evasion.
Every single person who does this knows this. It's been known for a long time. This poster also thought it was pretty clever to mention
how illegals abuse this specifically because they then run away back to their country where the wealth they accumulate is worth even more. Because that's so great of them, these "business owner's" are so much better than the average moron on welfare. Not only paying less tax simply for existing, but basically eating for free on top of it and being allowed to actually save their funds and use them for investments unlike NEETbucks.
Yeah there's also no "esg for an s corp", now have him explain how the fuck you get a loan from a bank as an actual legitimate business (you don't because again you're just being a schmuck who produces nothing).
Illegals are working under the table, they're not going to be reporting the majority of their income anyways. This is unlike using a company credit card for personal expenses which actually requires you to perjure yourself on tax forms. It's not even a case of omission, it's outright fraud. You go to prison for this if you're caught and you will be caught if you're in the top 1% tax bracket. There's way safer and legal ways to move your money around to reduce your tax burden.
1. You're confusing a tax write off and using company funds legitimately
2. Purchasing a vehicle IS a tax write off for business expenses
2. Spending money for trips via the company credit card is completely acceptable and fucking everybody does it. I knew a tradesman who took his family to Costa Rica using his company bank card.
3. You vastly overestimate how much oversight the IRS looks through your financials. When you're doing taxes and you file expenses you can claim practically anything as business expense
Go ahead and commit tax fraud, retard. What you said is a crime but go ahead with the "everyone is doing it" fallacy.
Holy fuck kid you literally can write-off 50% of dining out expenses as legitimate business expenses. have a nice day and stop spreading misinfo.
Yeah you're going to write off a non-business dinner as a business expense?
https://www.freshbooks.com/hub/expenses/tax-deductions-small-business
I'm Tired of repeating myself. Just fucking read what you can and can't do.
You cannot write off a non-business dinner as a business expense. So no, anon, you can't take mom and dad out for steak on your company credit card.
>So no, anon, you can't take mom and dad out for steak on your company credit card.
>not taking them out and justifying you went with business people instead
You guys suck at this. But yes, dont writeoff 100% of everything
So you propose committing TAX FRAUD by LYING about WHO was there and WHAT the dinner was about?
You do know thats how rich people do it all the time. Hang out with wealthy people and you'll see a lot more than this. No one likes paying the tax man.
You don't know what you're talking about. I've seen company cards used on strip clubs, I've seen company cards used for theme parks. I've seen businesses write off the dumbest shit.
Idk what retarded Amish upbringing you had to be so sheltered and defensive about taxes, but you're completely out of the fucking loop about everything. Shut the fuck up.
Go ahead, commit tax fraud.
tax fraud was made scary to keep slaves like you uninformed
Yeah that anon is still an innocent tax lover who hasnt woken up yet for his slavery to governments.
>Illegals are working under the table
Not in sanctuary cities (the entire country at this point)
>This is unlike using a company credit card for personal expenses which actually requires you to perjure yourself on tax forms
It's not a personal expense it's a "business expense" I took a client out to taco bell for lunch, then another to Ruth's Chris for dinner.
>It's not even a case of omission, it's outright fraud.
No it's "Accurate descriptions". What could be more scientific? I have a "service business" you see. We don't move any tangible goods in the first place! Besides you will have to schedule a court date to prove all this which could take months and I have a bus to catch in the morning.
>You go to prison for this if you're caught and you will be caught if you're in the top 1% tax bracket.
Every single "1%er" does this. They look forward to audits, in fact they welcome them because it means the IRS does free work double checking them. They trade with other 1 percenters for tax write offs. You are unironically the stupidest person on earth if you believe anyone in that bracket actually pays that in tax. No rich person effectively pays a single dollar in tax because they are so rich that it becomes comped to them. They either write it off, or they pass the cost off to the consumer. Them simply moving money, creates money and it works for them.
You know why the IRS doesn't give a single shit? Because these same rich people then make companies like Unity where they charge consumers .20 for literally nothing (which is taxed). It invents tax revenue to add to the already phony numbers. Even Jose and his fake company adds to this, which is great because Jose wasn't intending on paying tax himself.
They openly talk about it. It is literally a conspiracy they're proud of and advertise as a benefit to corporations across the globe.
>Yeah anon, that's tax evasion.
It's only tax evasion if somebody can prove that it is.
>(+use your company card to go to restaurants and buy cars and label them as business expenses)
"lol just commit fraud"
amazin post
this only works if you are as big or bigger than hollywood.
You do realize that it means Unity will need to implement way to create unique ID for your OS installation, store it for unknow time and compare it each time you install game and it phone home? Or that without internet connection you won't be able to install, something against principles of services like GOG? And that, as always, pirates will get workaround and honest consumers will either get fucked or forced to use pirate solutions themselves?
People are so dumb.
>as always, pirates will get workaround and honest consumers will either get fucked or forced to use pirate solutions themselves?
This. It's so sad that this post is so far down the thread.
It's every time it's installed.
And they even take money every time they install a demo, and they even take a lot on free downloads, sales and stuff
why do people keep acting like charging per install is unreasonable? The installer calls home to unity's servers and that's not free, so it makes complete sense
>The installer calls home to unity's servers and that's not free,
lolwhat? No it doesn't.
how do you think they check to see if it's a new machine installing? retard
They literally don't, and legally can't you giant gay. They said themselves it's an estimate. They bill you based on a computer model of what they *think* the installs are. It's fucking retarded. Look it up.
>lolwhat? No it doesn't.
They have already stated Unity tracks users and gathered data. The company that bought Unity was known for malware. Unity is malware now.
Well officially they state that they aren't doing telemetry for that and that they just have a proprietary way of approximating it.
>approximating
top fucking kek, so their billing methodology is now "$0.20 per install we guess you probably have"?
Hey guys come eat at my restaurant, when you get the bill I'll just estimate what you ordered. Don't worry I'm usually pretty accurate.
Yeah, it's pretty crazy.
Well for the record you're less likely to scam someone to their face. I've done business with people like this IRL and they're typically on the safe side. A faceless corporation with no physical accountability? Nah, not trusting them.
>approximating it
Which is the same kind of nebulous bullshit statment they made about demos.
>You mostly won't have to pay for demos
>mostly
You're right, players should be using real life money to buy each bullet in a FPS game. It's reasonable!
that's ridiculous because the bullets dont cost server time to create
My FPS game has a bullet authorization server that has to process charges. This costs money to maintain. It's only a small charge, less than a fraction of a cent per bullet. It's perfectly reasonable.
>make 400k on free to play game with 3 million installs
>owe 600k dollars
funny how no one is mad at valve taking 30% doing nothing but the engine makers taking 0.20 per unit
No one is mad at unreal taking 5% either. The issue with per install is that it makes no sense. Most unity revenue comes from mobile, and a game that has millions of installs that's free might only make a few hundred thousand dollars. Those million installs times the cost per user is insane and can be an order of magnitude times greater than the revenue.
>0.20 per unit
>The act installing is a unit
Nice change in description, schlomo.
techically, we can keep uninstalling and reinstalling a game and they will take money from the devs for each install.
We can bankupt companys this way...
new logo
>valve takes $106.00
fixed
Just do it with webgl games and clear your cache between runs. They consider the engine initialization to be an install for their metrics.
the fact that you dumb fucking zoomers keep reposting this uninstall/reinstall idea on the assumption that it will actually work is so eye-opening as to how many underage kids are on this board
what a fucking disaster
Back in the day we used to call these types sript kiddies for a reason. Still, it's a fun idea.
the fact that you dumb fucking autists cant see the humor in that webm is more baffling
old morons have no humor
Yeah where’s the heckin longcat xddd
2000s memes were so good
>run Windows 7 in an emulation box
>randomize hardware IDs
>install, run, uninstall game
I think you overestimate how smart Unity's system is and you can guarantee they err on counting installs over not counting installs.
genuinely hilarious to me that people think that unity didn't think this through and that a couple of idiots on Ganker found some loophole that they didn't expect.
as if a company that would know when a game installed on your computer so they could charge the developers couldn't also see the rate at which something is being installed and wouldn't have safeguards in place to stop flooding like this.
this board is legitimately filled with underaged retards.
actually, this makes Unity now have to decide whether their software is a botnet or not due to its tracking capabilities. if it's phoning home, this goes into a lot of shady shit
>if it's phoning home, this goes into a lot of shady shit
It already fucking does this. It would take you 20 seconds to find out that its done this for years.
I wish you had to take an IQ test to get an internet connection, or better yet, to buy a fucking keyboard.
judging by the fact they keep changing the messaging (
) i don't think they had it as figured out as they thought they did
sometimes companies are just stupid, anon
or they know that indie devs are a bunch of high strung histrionic retards who will flip their shit regardless so this is has been orchestrated to convince the precious little darlings that they're being listened to and they're concerns taken super-duper seriously
>actually, they're not dumbasses, they're GENIOUSES who're perfectly manipulating the foolish indie devs
ok ricci
yes these super competent people are actually 180+ IQ with some master plan
the CEO who wanted to make reloading a microtransaction definitely understands the industry and is there because of his competence
these people definitely did not fuck up horribly, which is why they keep contradicting themselves and make things actively worse
John's face is very punchable. It's like my first instinct when seeing him. How does he do it?
natural/resting sanpaku eyes betraying his sociopathy
normally people cannot do this unless they lean their head forward
actors are often asked to try it when they are portraying a deranged character
I haven't been able to find any definitive proof but John sets off my early-life detector
Listen to a tech venture capitalist talk about unity for 30 seconds, they sound like a 75year old grandpa trying to invest in crypto. The money men have no idea what the fuck unity even is beyond it having market share that they think should sustain this kind of retarded anti user policy.
I dunno anon, I've been in some high end meetings of transnational corporations and they can get very retarded
I've seen this board break enough games, with silly malicious exploitation of the rules, to know you're full of shit... heck, I've been accidentally responsible for this myself.
RIP oh dango jam.
It's a joke
Did you get upset when people were "stealing" nfts by screenshotting them too, you dumbass
This could be funny if there was a SINGLE Unity game on that list.
NONE OF THEM ARE UNITY GAMES
Wallpaper Engine is developed in Unity, you retard.
>OH N-
>create online game that spins up server instances on demand per game
>have to pay $.20 per match players play because each server gets its own docker instance
Wut
Godot or Unreal for starting off on 2D and working my way up to 3D?
Godot for 2D, I feel it would be kind of a retardation to use unreal for 2D when it's grafixx engine and fee is made for 3D standard,
althought if it does not hurt (You) of putting na extra work in bettering your skills in coding and such Godot is no sluch itself
I'm definitely sticking to regular old coding either way. I guess that UE5 would be too much bloat and work in terms of learning the UI and all the other elements for making a 2D/2.5D game with no real payoff for it. Unless I at some point decide to go full 3D and utilize all of it's features, which I don't really see happening.
>Unless I at some point decide to go full 3D and utilize all of it's features, which I don't really see happening.
if you do not need triple slop grafix Godot does 3D as well and works wonders with artsyle instead of "realism", but you do you,
I know now it sound like I'm a shill, but honestly I just want Godot to be what Blender became,
it'll really be the best in the long run as unity situation cannot happen
Yeah, I generally prefer stylization to realism graffix, however it is nice to have the options for either one. But from what I remember writing/editing shaders in UE4, and probably the same in 5, is a real pain in the ass. So you're way more limited in stylization.
I get what you mean by that, I see quite a few fair criticisms and shortcomings of Blender compared to something like 3DS Max, but I still think that in most use case scenarios Blender is more than enough for most people.
I'll give Godot a fair shot and see how it goes, not like I have any huge or ambitious projects in mind at the moment anyways, so I might as well try it out first hand. Cheers!
Thanks and good luck on your journey,
but one thing to mention for Godot,
the language devs push is retarded because it's retarded version of Python, but there is a mono version of C# and if you're willing to to slog through a tutorial to make headers for C++ it is also the 'bestly' intergrated
still you can fuck around with unreal, timmy is at least generous enough to let you go scott free with monetization on garden gnometube videos making tutorials for using unreal
Or you could, you know, raise the price of the yearly subscriptions and charge a flat rate for hitting certain milestones? That seems way easier to track than say number of installations. And this took me like all of less than 5 minutes to think up.
it's even worse than that because you used to have to buy pro at 200k anyway. theres basically no reason to not buy pro by the time you have 200k installs so the real threshold is 1 million installs.
are any of the actual features provided by pro any useful though?
you get to see the source code. which is cool if you arent a codelet. Of course the source code is out there anyways.
also you can remove the splash screen. that's the main benefit
Even the CEO jumped ship.
It's over Unity devs. Why you didn't listen?
now that i have been thinking, are they really going to charge companys like Nintendo,Xbox,Sony,Ubisoft,etc this?
I'm using libgdx. I wanna kill myself because of all this camera bullshit.
>Ganker is nothing but shitpost
>Ganker has no Unreal thread currently
Is there any board that has a dedicated Unreal thread?
>20
>-6
>-7.40
>*200000
>4mil
american public education was a mistake
remember when unity updated the hub to include literal malware?
Qrd?
>someone who hates you figures out how to send an install notice to unity without actually installing the game
>they can now "install" your game 1000 times per second
>you end up in debt to unity
PIRATE PIRATE
PIRATE PIRATE
PIRATE PIRATE
PIRATE PIRATE
GET BANKRUPT GET BANKRUPT
GET BANKRUPT GET BANKRUPT
GET BANKRUPT GET BANKRUPT
>compile game
>agree to terms of use when compiling the game
>years later, have followed those terms and have been paying appropriately
>engine provider now days that new contract changes now retroactively include older games that were not compiled using these new terms
>they seriously think this will hold water in court
>>they seriously think this will hold water in court
It won't, but how many gamedev have the budget to start a lawyer battle with Unity?
I may not have the money but I think I know someone who'd be willing to fund it
That will still take years before a judgement happen, and in the meantime minor studio will still get billed and have the debt collectors on their asses.
Also 99% the big publishers will settle for out-of-court agreements that only affect their catalogue.
By the time a class action judgements goes through (which is already in the works) unity will most likely be forced to refund everyone
for their runtime fees. I'm not giving them a cent
I will take that bet
Wanna bet that big companies that are not gatcha games will be exempt? Cause they will just class themselves as gambling and be done with it
United they stand. Developers might form group case and pool resources for good lawyers they wouldn't be able to afford alone.
Only takes 1.
They said they will charge Microsoft for games installed via Gamepass.
That is a direct threat to that business model.
>for everyone who installs the same game multiple times there's 5 people buying it and never installing it once
source?
only v is contrarian enough to celebrate a new tax
>Make free game
>No revenue gained
>Not even ad revenue
>Still have to pay Unity when someone installs
Fuck Unity.
Fuck the people defending it.
Fuck the execs who sold MASSIVE volumes of stock before this shitty policy change.
You will be running a script that redownloads games infinitely, right?
I'll run a script that fools unity into thinking I installed a game and loop it
That goes without saying
The real question is who do you target first?
>all the stripped-down, low-level, SDL-driven indie games in the near future
I for one am excited.
>Valve takes 30% of gross revenue -> Predictable
>Uncle sam takes 40% of taxable income -> Predictable
>Unity takes $0.2 per installation -> Unpredictable.
Simply stupid decision. They would have fare better if they went with 10% of gross revenue or something similar.
There’s no logical explanation for why unity needs to make an amount of money that scales with the sales of the products made with their tools. Imagine if hammer manufacturers started charging $0.20 for every birdhouse a carpenter makes with one of their hammers. What god damn sense does that make? I’m already paying for a unity license. They shouldn’t charge me a dime for anything else. If they need more money to keep the lights up, they should just increase the cost of license. How much I pay shouldn’t scale with the number of people who download my game. That’s retarded.
Unity is already profitable and makes a shit ton of money, this is just a money grab.
>Unity is already profitable and makes a shit ton of money
Prove it
They pull over a billion every year in revenue, it's in their public statements. They only reason they're 'not profitable' is because they blow so much money on dogshit acquisitions instead of development.
>Unity lost 921m last year. And because Unity is a public company, it MUST put shareholders first.
Source: https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/U
>In 2022, Android Google play had 109B downloads. And unity owns a 22.66% market share.
Source: https://www.statista.com/statistics/734332/google-play-app-installs-per-year/
Source: https://6sense.com/tech/game-development/unity-market-share
>We can estimate based on a .01 cent per install that the revenue made by Unity with their new pricing model would be $246m (.01 cents per install * 109B downloads * 22.66 market share).
>Now, this estimate is conservative, in reality, it would be even lower because the installs are "apps" not games, and not all downloaded installed games will be profitable to fit the new license agreement.
>BUT, $246m is still very short of the $932m they need to make just to break even. After that there is a NEED to make profit for the shareholders.
>And to do that, that will need to charge even more from, YOU, the developer, because Unity Engine is Unity's main, and only, valued product.
>Unity only has $1b worth of current assets ($2.3b current assets left - $1B current liability). And with the rate of $932m burn rate per year, unity will have a little over 1 year left.
Source: https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/U/balance-sheet?p=U
>After that, someone will acquire Unity in bankruptcy, and then who knows what license they will force on to you to make back the millions they lost from acquiring Unity Engine.
>It is time to jump off this sinking ship. And put the time to learning a new engine now instead of later.
hammers aren't game engines
How about miles using some car manufacturer's proprietary engine?
how about selling a product that you've used copyrighted tech to build and then not paying the copyright owner
>muh copyright tech
John Deere were blasted for their hardware propriety, but they are not as greedy as your garden gnome garden gnome boss that they would went as far as charging farmer for each and every crop they sold.
What’s the difference as far as whether I should be charged every time an end user uses a project build with it?
>thing is ethical because it’s legal
Whew what a bombshell of intellect. Nobody is debating whether this is how things work, retard. We’re saying it’s stupid.
Unreal's 5% share after $1mil seems fair. This unity thing is like if photoshop charged you $0.20 for every design printed with the images you made in the editor. It makes no sense.
Don't give Adobe ideas
They're already bad enough
>It makes no sense.
it makes no sense because your analogy isn't analogous
nta but yes it is
>be EA CEO
>be greedy asswipe who once proposed the idea of automatically charging the credit cards of your player when they reload in battlefied
>become Unity CEO
i think i dont need to continue. Its a fucking mystery how these people get high paying jobs while offering nothing in return. The dude is driving the company towards bankruptcy in record speed
Does he have an Early Life?
Dunno, i only know hes a retard and loves to snort cocain
O
Can I get quick rundown, i have 30 IQ
garden gnomes garden gnomeing.
If your game has more than 200k installs (according to Unity) and you've made more than $200k in revenue then Unity is going to start taxing you $0.20 for each additional install above 200k.
thanks, understood
Basically it all started with the creation of federal reserve and now we need to kill larry fink
https://twitter.com/unity/status/1702077049425596900
these fucking retards keep digging deeper.
how is this digging deeper? they've responded to just about every concern i've seen raised
they are doubling down on their retarded INSTALL FEE
the fucking notion of such a thing is retarded.
>just trust us bro when you reconcile your fraudulent bill, we promise we'll remove the fraud, tee hee
holy retard
>make $200k on game with 2 million installs
>owe unity $400k dollars
Why are you only making $0.10 off each install?
Imagine, if you will, a game who's player base is mostly free to play, with a few people spending a few bucks and the occasional whale here and there.
(In other words: imagine a smaller scale TF2)
Anon that's pretty normal, considering that after adspend your average customer value could even be negative.
number of purchases =/= number of installs
The average gacha game make between 0.05$ and 0.15$ per install. The immense majority of people don't spend a cent on those things, it's entirely propped up by whales who spend hundreds, often thousands, of dollars.
>If you happen to notice any fraudulent installs then please let us know and we might do something
>Trust us bros just full out the paperwork and we'll definitely adjust our bullshit stats and refund your money just trust us
Moron
> yesterday - The installation and initialization of a game on an end user's device as well as distribution via streaming or web browser is considered an “install.”
> 18 hours ago - The installation and initialization of a game or app on an end user’s device as well as distribution via streaming is considered an “install.”
> just now - Web and streaming games - we are not going to count web and streaming games toward your install count either.
> presumably a few days in the future - We never said we would make you pay for installs. Who told you that? You're insane.
>make script to spoof hardware IDs
>install/uninstall game
>do this for a month
>game company is now bankrupt
>only after you reach 200,000 installs, which would mean you already made $4 million at this price point
>for everyone who installs the same game multiple times there's 5 people buying it and never installing it once
I can't believe you are simping a greedy game engine by posting fake stats. How did you even come up with this?
That applies to games being commercially sold. There's no way for the Unity devs to know about or charge for downloads from places like Mega or Mediafire, ect.
post the best dev salt
I don't care about the Unity news. I'm glad game developers are getting fucked. Make better games next time.
twitter user
>pirate game
>install it over and over again
>studio loses money
AND NOT A SINGLE CENT SPENT!!
>pick developer you hate
>get 100 PCs to mass install/uninstall their games
>billions in fees
>they go bankrupt
there are pros to this change, anons.
>get emulator, used phones and pcs, whatever
>make an install/uninstall script
>genshin impact
>chinks vs unity (EA) lawsuit to end all lawsuits
>bootlicking Ganker contrarians unironically defending israel
KWAB
Lick my boots you dumb goy, might as well since you're sucking corpo cock so badly.
UE won.
Tim won.
how the fuck does unity know if you are OFFLINE and install a game.
They don't which is why they have their own patented super secret methods you just have to trust, which is most likely just charging you 20% extra for estimated stealth installs.
they would have to use literal malware, to upload information to unity servers, about your install.
Fucking retard. Everyone is doing it. They just have to comply with GDPR and not send information that can be used to identify (You).
if I firewall 127.0.0.1 and install a unity game, how do you get the install fee.
They don't. If devs deploy a .bat that automates the process, they risk getting sued by Unity.
devs should just make installers that are offline only and disable your connection during install. voila, no install fee to the dev.
*also, wipe any info about the files/install from the registry and give it a fake ID
ie: you install Rust, and the game ID is "club penguin". you didn't install Rust, so no install fee.
Did you miss the part where the Israeli malware company merged with Unity?
>logging information about an executable made with your proprietary game engine is the equivalent of malware
The extent to which non-devs are tech illiterate is genuinely baffling. Anon, logs of nearly any significant behavior in the software running on your computer are executed alongside the code that makes the software work in the first place. I can think of a dozen places where unity could emit an increment event whenever you install a game made in their engine. This is like a design problem you’d give someone who’s interviewing for an intern position.
secretly logging information about an executable is malware
Anon, why do you think they bought a malware firm up
They're not secretly logging shit. You accept those terms when you purchase your games. Do you not read your License agreements?
Telemetry isn’t malware unless you aren’t informed that it’s happening. The fact that you, like pretty much everybody, don’t read user agreements doesn’t mean you weren’t warned. Besides, telemetry is required to keep software companies running properly. They’re not gonna find your stash, schizo.
On Ganker there was a thread where a guy just was launching random indie unity games with a packet sniffer and on launch they all immediately sent out telemetry data and there wasn't a warning or anything.
>citation: idk, a thread from some guy on Ganker
Ok
When you make an absolute negative claim, a single positive instance of something happening disproves the whole claim.
Too bad you don’t have proof that anything happened outside of
>bruh a thread a while back said this was a problem
Besides, the context of this conversation is whether unity itself keeping track of whether you installed something is malware. Whether the dev of an individual game is doing that is beyond the scope of the topic.
https://discussions.unity.com/t/why-is-my-game-connecting-to-config-uca-cloud-unity3d-com-on-startup-after-recent-unity-update/184385
Thank you anon
And it also presents a possible system of fraud for unity:
They can run scripts to generate installs to their own service to bill people who use Unity an extra amount of install fees. An arbitrary amount. They could choose to literally bankrupt companies through this - and how would you prove otherwise? It's all part of Unity's contract that you pay them for installs, and the entire system of detecting and verifying these installs is controlled by Unity.
What they're doing is designed from the ground up to enable fraud. You'd have to be a fucking idiot to go along with this.
That "system of fraud" is how infrastructure has operated for decades. You pay your ISP based on how much data they claimed you've used; you also pay them for how many phone calls they claim you have made. You pay your water supplier based on how much water they claim you've used. You pay for electricity based on how much they claim you've used. I'm not saying Unity is in the correct for this, I'm simply saying your argument is stupid.
You absolute fucking retards. I am convinced this place is riddled with sub-100 IQ subhumans. This sets a precedent that they can retroactively change their pricing schemes to whatever they want on a whim. You think this will only affect shovelware mobile trash? They will destroy EVERY game made with Unity for the sake of hitting higher revenue targets next year, the year after that, and the year after that. Every. Single. One. It will change if and when they are strapped for cash, at your favorite dev's expense.
What compels bootlicking? I know OP is baiting, but I've seen a few people on other websites who are unironically pro-Unity. Why? I feel like a billionaire could literally step on puppies and these people would still find a way to lick his boots. Do they think by sucking billionaire cock, they'll get a chance to become rich themselves?
Stockholm syndrome bc some of these people cant seperate managment of Unity from the love they have for the engine itself
OP is obviously paid shills.
Nobody, not a single human being would logically think this as a positive thing for them UNLESS they themselves gain something from it.
I didn't spot any of them yesterday, so I guess they are part of the newly contracted shills that work in tandem with these PR shit they've being doing today.
No one is arguing that being charged more is a positive thing. All the arguments "defending" Unity's decision have been in response to the tantrums being thrown that come with no argumentation, only emotive rhetoric. Where arguments are made they're edge cases or have already been addressed by Unity.
>What compels bootlicking?
leftism
they are programmed from the ground up to lick boots
The response from Unity haters has been so hysterical that most of these threads is just correcting the contra-reality bullshit being spouted.
The same thing that compels doomposting. Attention.
C'mon anon, you didn't really believe that Unity wouldn't go full corporate. All major companies do this once they get big enough. The alternatives either aren't viable or more expensive, and once the initial crybabies tire out, it will just be another revenue stream. FOSS rules itself out on the fact that it is premised on demanding money up front for support and indie devs are cheap.
retard, you have to make more than $200,000 a year in order to start the install shenanigans
The 200k sounds like a lot but its misleading, after steam and the government takes their cut its more like 100k, this doesn't account for the expenses when making the actual game.
>that last line
God damn
welp, should have stuck to libGDX
>We have never made a public statement before. That is how badly you fucked up.
This will get le heck heckin updoots my fellow wholesome chunguses! BACON NARWHAL LOL
Fuck off, unity shill. Everyone hates you, you pathetic cocksucking retard. Get a real job.
A real job like "game development" rofl
Yeah, seems like the big boys are starting to weigh in now.
GG no re.
The dorito pope knows how slim those margins are due to how much goes into advertisements and how a user count fee is totally retarded.
This is pretty cringe man, but the removal of the tos from github is an important point.
The fact they can just remove it at all, is wild.
Yeah for like fortnite or something who cares, but Unity is well aware people are 3-4 years in to some projects and can't just drop the engine right away.
Omega scummy shit.
>We have never made a public statement before. This will be our first.
Based, dignified, understated, patrician, intellectual.
>We have never made a public statement before. That is how badly you fucked up.
Cringe, low, debased, crude, unworthy, pandering.
They should've said "gas all shitalians and garden gnomes 1488"
>takes basically nothing per download
>punishes f2p gotchas
cant say its a good business decision but it could have been good for the industry
I wanted to do a Fear and Hunger clone.
I was THIS CLOSE of starting the project on Unity.
Maybe I should do it in Godot?
Who knows.
Just make it in RPG Maker unless you want to have some functions that divert from the rpg maker norm. Shouldnt even be that hard to make with tiles map bc every fucking Godot tutorial under the sun dives into 2d rpgs
RPGMaker seems like a complete mess of spaghetti code that only sort of works because some incredibly autistic spergs sort of hijacked the engine and build a javascript real engine inside the engine.
I'm a programmer and just wanted some flexible enough 2d engine with some subsystems and shaders handling already resolved.
The "events" systems of rpgmaker completely and absolutely suck ass.
To do anything interesting you need to write HUNDREDS of lines of shitty scripts or build your own script engine inside the engine.
That's one of the reasons I was sort of against the idea of using RPGMaker in any of its versions.
To make something good you need to make an effort? huh, who would guess hmm
isn't it literal malware if unity forces user data to be transmitted without user/developer knowledge?
also, why the fuck are they charging an INSTALL FEE on an inferior, garbage engine compared to UE4 or UE5?
>why the fuck are they charging an INSTALL FEE on an inferior, garbage engine compared to UE4 or UE5?
Because they can't compete, simple as.
I am 100% convinced the person implementing this works for Epic and is trying to kill Unity.
It's worse.
>make indie game
>nobody will pay more than $4.99
>steam takes 30%
>publisher takes 30%
>taxes take 30%
>you now have $0.49 cent for yourself
>unity takes $0.20 of it
>make indie game
>publisher
>taxes take 30%
That's not how taxes work. In your example you'd pay 30% tax on your revenue, which would be 40% of $4.99, and not on the total amount.
bootlicker
>ohh nooo what will we do without all the unity shovelware
learn to use an actual engine
what if i like playing bad video games because they're funny
I'm the same, but I don't really fault the engine for western indies being shit at game design in the first place. It's like they learned nothing since American trashbags crashed the market with Atari 2600 garbage and Japs had to come to the rescue. Here's a Mega Man clone that's a free, Unity browser game made by Japs where you don't have to log-in to play it. I'd play this over a lot of the things the Steam shitters want money for, kek.
https://unityroom.com/games/unakiriaction
How are games actually taxed? If you worked on a game for 3 years full time then suddenly earned 1mil it seems a bit unfair that you would get raped by the tax man for earning too much money in 1 year when you lived like a homeless person for the last 3 years. Big success as an indie and earning 1 mill after everyone takes their cut is like 300-400k which divided by the years you were developing it its barely better than an average tech job but a million times riskier.
Anon I'm so glad you mentioned this because it's something I think about regularly. The tax code is not properly setup to deal with this sort of thing.
The solution I can think of is, if your game makes a ton of money, you can essentially turn it into a trust fund by having it buy up a bunch of assets so that it has net zero income, so pays no taxes.
Then you have it sell off those assets yearly and do payouts to you over the years as an employee or beneficiary, so that you pay yearly income on those gains at a lower tax rate.
That's the best idea I have but I'm not a tax professional.
From filling out tax shit as a freelancer I think there are some allowances for having no income in prior years and so partially spreading out your income over a longer time frame but I have no idea if that's still a thing or how it actually works. Your idea is pretty interesting, this type of pain in the ass money movement is the last thing you expect to have to think about as a dev but I don't think anyone realises how much of your money is taken till its too late.
incorporate and pay a flat 21%
would you have to incorporate while in development or can you just make a company before you release?
*set up a script to continuously install and uninstall the game with a dozen devices 24/7*
tick tock, devie
You do realize it costs money to make a product, right? Games just don't appear out of thin air.
>uncle sam takes up to $7.40
Literal theft
This is the real reason why they try to fight piracy btw
>buy canvas to paint on
>paint my masterpeice
>sell my masterpiece then two weeks later the canvas maker asks for more money because I sold it and wants money for every future painting sold using there canvas
It's worse than that, because it's designed to make your business insolvent if you don't take their deal to use their third party services over amazon web services or microsoft, so it has this antitrust element as well.
And you'll pay him, or you won't sell paintings. Cry about it.
>sell painting
>get call from canvas supplier
>tells me I need to pay them every time someone hangs it
>create multiple reproductions of said paint
>distribute it for free among peers
>original artist must pay the canvas maker for each distribution
You forgot the $100 American price fee that Valve always charges for each game. You will never get net positive.
watching delusional corporations speed run suicide is pretty entertaining. Corporate suits are so reliably retarded its a natural form of karma.
>all these retards thinking that they're defending impoverished indie devs
>all the examples they use are of indies who struck gold and are set for life
oh no, a guy whose game made tens of millions in revenue is going to have to start paying 20 cents per install :'(
>all the examples they use are of indies who struck gold and are set for life
bruh
>make $200k from 2 million downloads
>30% goes to apple
>50% went to adspend to get the users in the first place
>have $40k left
>now owe unity $400k
>$200k from 2 million downloads
Literally who? Even fucking Vampire Survivors selling for $3 a pop would be fine.
Many mobile games are free to download and try, but lock you off at a certain level of progression until you pay for the full game, no microtransactions, and no ads. Pic related the game you can download to play and then pay $2.50 for the whole game.
>Even fucking Vampire Survivors selling for $3 a pop would be fine
What is fine? Paying a reoccurring 6.7% fee on all revenue any time someone installs your game on a new system? And for what? using the shittiest engine on the market? mmm sounds super fine, not at all like unity is suddenly the most expensive engine on the market while being unmaintained cobbled together dogshit.
>various devs get big with Unity
>a lot of them are now publicly calling out Unity for this
I don't know, that sounds like very bad reputation and a warning for new devs not to use it
you're too stupid to comprehend this topic on anything above the micro scale, just leave the thinking to the people who have to deal with more than their weekly lunch money.
Make a fucking argument. All you people have is weird edge cases and twitter tantrums.
How many people are working on the game, how many years did it take to make, how much are they paying in taxes, what are the ramifications of this being taken from revenue and not profit, why is the calculation for the amount of installs a black box from a company that has just thrown its credibility in the bin, what is to stop them from increasing the tax in the future, why has the pro license increased in price by over 4x, why would anyone use unity when the percentage they scrape at 200k could be far more than unreal takes after 1mil, why would you get into business with a company that has created perverse incentives and a moral hazard where their goals and yours no longer align and their ability to lie cannot be checked, and on and on
these are more important questions than
>huehuehueh 20 cent, i cant even buy my daily mcdonnalds booger with it
Who here has the unity garden gnome flag?
This one?
Feel free to
>Find your own videogame distribution service
>Your own country with power, water, infrastructure and gnomish bankers
>your own game engine
Simple as...
>build a decentralized social media
>people leave twitter
>twitter is now dead
Unity will learn the same lesson as twitter
>only just two days ago came across someone making a crash fangame in the vein of the PS1 trilogy on itch
>was going to have mario maker elements too
>will probably be abandoned now
Shit
Psilosybil exists
Shit (again)
Yeah, it's at least out (in early access) so you can play it.
Dev hasn't made a statement on if theyre gonna port it or what.
Except the dev already pays royalties and licensing fees to Unity. The install fee is stupid because the dev is already paying Valve for the service of hosting their game and handling the downloads and servers. Something Unity has literally no hand in, so why would Unity be paid for that part of it when they're already receiving compensation for their engine?
Why are you defending some reptilian CEO's plan to make games even scummier?
How do you fuck up this hard with your product? It's like you want to lose money.
microsoft is going to have to pay hundreds of thousands for every shitty indie game they put on gamepass which is more than they pay to the fucking dev. Their budget for UE devs would essentially be double.
And this when NASB2 is going through a new controversy.
Don't care. Still terminating my consumer relationship with Unity and their partners.
what realistically will happen
>the average indie dev will keep using the basic service because he will probably never sell enough to have to pay fees
>the few who luck out and sell a lot will end up just paying for the higher tier to decrease fees
>big companies will keep running as usual
the average indie follows what the average successful indie does, once all the games they are playing are being made in UE no new indies are going to be using unity.
>the few who luck out and sell a lot will end up just paying for the higher tier to decrease fees
many succesful devs are jumping ship
for example, cult of the lamb, hollow knight silksong and others i can't remember right now
>storefront takes a flat percentage
Vs
>no cap on potential fees
Golly gee gosh anon I can't imagine why devs would be okay with one but not the other. Also this applies to games that have already released so Unity games made x years ago will also be subject to this fee. I wouldn't touch this engine ever again personally.
>Unity should get royalties for something that has nothing to do with them
>but don't worry, they already have spyware on your PC to prevent too many problems
I'll simply make my unity game free.
>pirate Unity
>make blockbuster game
>pay no royalties
piratebros win again
despite what big corpo wants you to believe, Piracy doesnt affect creators, at all. those who pirated a game, song or anything, by definition were NEVER planning to buy anything at all.
this new fee would actually put pirates as criminals, justiifying all those stupid govt campaigns. since of course pirated installs will also count and possibly be inflated as to create fearmongering.
Why can't they just differentiate mobile plans from desktop plans and let us PCbros be in peace?
>everyone must have a shit time equally because unity wants to gouge more out of appstore games
wow now i want unity to take as much money as they want thanks OP
>uncle sam takes up to $7.40
Europoor or super-NEET who doesn’t know how taxes work
>uncle sam takes up to $7.40
???? There is no federal sales tax in the US you stupid shitskin third world gay.
It’s a Yuropoor who thinks taxes are taken out of the $20 game, not added on top
>be indie dev
>put game made with unity on steam
>its good and starts selling a lot of copies
>get to 199999th sale
>pull game from steam
CHECKMATE epic.
Relaunch as game: remaster after a while too.
Doesn't work.
Epic would add up to the install count
Pirates also add to it
They count and send a bill retroactively so for the 200.000 sales, you also need to pay 20 cents
yep, even if the game is free, costs 0, .....
(you)
The more I think about it the crazier and scary it get tho.
IF things like this are allowed to happen, in the future powertools company like Bosch or Dewalt could literally put shits in their tools and charge people for the work they do using them.
Or Car companies charging you for driving around like Taxis...
Every companies would just inch toward goals like this to eat up the marrow of our bones.
first time?
what the fuck are you talking about lmao
royalties aren't some new thing unity invented, they're an established practice across many industries, including vidya engines
This isn't a a "royalty", this is treating a physical item that you bought and continue to use as a service. It is covered under a completely different set of laws. You do not own the thing you bought, you have a service license that is required for its correct function and should that license be reworked, so will the function of it.
a game engine isn't a physical item, it's a service.
no it's not it's a program which means it's just a thing that you own.
programs were not meant to be server reliant.
they were made as tools for individual computers.
well said, you crushed that retard
>unity charging dev per user install
>photoshop charging artist per download of image
>cubase charging music producer per play on spotify
these are not royalties. royalties are % of revenue. this is charge per arbitrary event. btw you owe me a quarter for reading this post, and my proprietary model has determined you've read at least 10 of my posts ever the last 12 months so you meet the threshold.
Well, the car industry is already selling "on disc dlc", so yeah.
Reminder that Intel tried to sell you CPUs you could upgrade through software too.
This is already happening. People like Louis Rossmann tried pushing back against the emergence of these trends within the hardware spheres, because the preclusion to success of such closed services is literally outlawing your right to repair the product that you own, but it had largely been unsuccessful.
>unity
an garbage engine. one version support.
>valve
provides download spot, host, market place, product page
>the government
provides universal rights like free health car-
wait, what do you mean US people have n-
ah. nevermind.
the difference is everyone else takes a percentage of the revenue earned, unity's model can technically take more than you even made
>f2p game with in-game purchases
>2 million downloads
>cash shop earns $200,000
>you now owe unity $400,000 dollars
>buy unity pro at $2000 per dev
>owe $0
wow
> 200,000 installs
>$4 million
???
I know of an indie game that sold 200k copies and generated its devs 4.6 million in revenue.
Nice, do you know how long was development and costs for wages? Cause a team of at least like 5 might get like 60~90k if it took a few years
People are pissed about the 'number of installs' bullshit first - if anyone could fuck that part up it's Unity - the fact that it will apply to already-released games secomd and the money a distant third.
>NO YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND THIS MEANS LESS SLOP AND FREEMIUM BECAUSE DEVS WILL HAVE TO OPT-ACK
>Unity has 7700 employees
>Epic Games has 2300 employees, this includes their engine, game, and EGS teams
>Nintendo has 6800 employees across JP, US, and EU
Jesus, no wonder they need to nickle and dime their customers.
What do those 7000 employees even do? Clearly not work on the engine seeing how many bugs and unfinished features are in the engine.
It's the good 'ol
>Tech company balloons out of control during/after IPO to give a false sense of growth to investors and pump shares value up
There's NO fucking reason a company like Unity needs more than 1000 employees, if even that much
>What do those 7000 employees even do?
Jerking off making fake asian women.
https://youtube.com/shorts/f392ovOJKqM?si=r3J9jzJzLP0U2ou0
It's insane. They should fire over 6k employees first. Keep the guys working on the engine and some admin staff and customer support.
They don't do basic copy-editing just look at the Unity documentation for five minutes. They have a form to notify them of errors on each page and I just stopped after the first few.
most them (70+%) are in the ad sales department. Mobile ads have been unity's bread and butter for many years now.
You forgot credit card company cut
>Gamedev says something I don't like online
>Pirate his game
>Run UnityFakeInstallScript.exe 20 million times
>Bankrupt his family for 3 generations
they can change pricing any time and you, yes YOU, gonna pay for it, piggie
starfield deflection thread
you're not getting off the hook todd
People wanted Bethesda to use another engine. Maybe unity or something. Look who's laughing now.
Would you indie devs stop complaining and just pay up? I'm getting real sick and tired of the complaining around here.
>what are you, poor? just give away 80% of your income
If you use an an engine to develop a game you're a noob anyway. It's been years now. You should have already made your own engine.
>Just reinvent the wheel lol
Where's your games, anon?
why can't valve release source 2 like they said they would