We will never get a game this good again...
>inb4 "it isn't a fighting game"
I know.
We will never get a game this good again... >inb4 "it isn't a fighting game". I know.
We will never get a game this good again...
>inb4 "it isn't a fighting game"
I know.
Just play PM, it plays almost as well as Melee with a roster better than Ultimate.
Does it have rollback + matchmaking like Slippi yet?
No, but it has a lot of devs working on it so maybe after they finish adding and polishing characters we can get it
It does not have a lot of devs working on it. It mainly has one guy working on it who previously only managed the project but had to take over after the only competent dev left. This dev is constantly tweets like a 14 year old girl and only releases progress reports when pressed by backers. The project is a scam for patreon money.
>PM
Based, P+ is amateur trash outside of its codebase and updated costumes.
p+ is better than pm's final version
except I think the bar for costumes has probably been lowered. I was never the guy who cared about that too much though
the techroll changes incosiderately changed every characters techchase game, knuckles is cancer, balance is cancer and most of the new graphics are of poorer quality than 3.6
>the techroll changes incosiderately changed every characters techchase game
for the better. fox (and others) having a dthrow techchase on every character in the game is fucking stupid
>balance
the balance is better, which gay gay character did you play? gnw?
>most of the new graphics are of poorer quality than 3.6
so don't use them
>knuckles is cancer
yeah kinda I don't care for him much just because he's low effort and kind of braindead but 3.6 had characters that were more cancer than knux
Eurotard is mega ultra gay
not until there's proper online for it. Still the best Smash game, though.
>Roster better than Ultimate
Jesus Christ the dogshit taste
some people hate Steve I guess
literally who fucking wanted him or even plays him
idk who doesn't PMEX have?
>PMEX
the actual best smash game
tfw it nukes my laptop and they are going to add even more characterscwith apparenly 256 being the slot limit
I thought Nintendo DMCA'd PM
>Just play PM
Brawl is one of the ugliest games ever made, it looks like every texture was scanned in from a public bathroom. I'm not playing it for that reason alone.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO YOU ONLY PRAY NINTENDO SANCTIONED GAMES
>Plateprop on Ganker again.
fpbp
Brawlback can't come soon enough. It will sap Melee's players like mad.
Stinky game
Rent Free
Melee is really fun but I prefer 64 and ultimate.
This.
SUPAHHHHHHHHHHHHH
SMASSSSHHHHHHHHHH
BROTHERSSSSSSSSSS......
MAAAAAAAYYYYYLAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY
Melee can't work in the modern era. The golden reason I think that Melee is still enjoyable for me is that there's no threat of nerfs, bans, or changes to the rule set.
The game I play today is the same as the one I played years ago.
Try shield dropping on a stock controller and let me know how that works out for you.
I learned how to do it
fuckin kids these days
Shield dropping isn't that hard once you realize you never have to go from neutral standing ---> shield drop (extremely hard to do fast)
You only need to do things like dash --->shield drop, waveland ---> shield drop, aerial ---> l-cancel ---> shield drop, take hit in shield ---> shield drop...
And all of those things allow you to be in shield with your stick fully left or right, and you just have to drop the stick down
TLDR git gud, also melee is sick
>And all of those things allow you to be in shield with your stick fully left or right, and you just have to drop the stick down
Fucking GPT bot I swear
I play Rivals of Aether instead, i like melee but i suck. I dont want to relearn how to l-cancel every 3 months just to enjoy playing the game
i played plenty of rivals but not having a shield feels REALLY bad. i don't mind some experimenting but all they really did was remove shit from smash and didn't adequately replace the depth of interactions that things like shields, ledges, and grabs can provide. which is why i couldn't be happier that rivals 2 is not only bringing those mechanics in, but is also expanding on them
RoA might be my favorite now. Good core gameplay, good balance, all the characters are fun to play.
I really hope 2 is good.
I have a ton of hours in RoA but I always eventually get frustrated and stop playing because of how random and gimmicky it feels. Particularly how insanely difficult it is to edgeguard most of the cast which causes hitting people off stage to feel like you haven't actually put yourself in an advantageous position. I guess if I were to sum up my main complaint with the game, I would say that I wish edgeguarding was a little bit more flow-chartey instead of feeling like you're trying to swat a really fast bug out of the air with just your hands. Also, holy shit, there are some seriously brainless rage-inducing ape characters who you can basically auto-pilot your way to solidly upper-mid level success with despite never having a single conscious thought inside your brain
>some seriously brainless rage-inducing ape characters
Which ones?
>clairens who just waffle around the stage with nair/fair pointed towards you, fsmash you if it hits. Lazilly recover the same way for free every time if you can't find some way to hit them from two miles away
>kraggs who land on platform with spikes, then just kind of flail their massive hitboxes around in between throwing rocks
>etalus just being a large eraser that goes back and forth across the stage, hope you're good at parrying
I guess i'm mostly just annoyed at how difficult it is to deal with large hitbox moves with virtually no lag and tons of inherent movement
I’m not disagreeing with you, but parries are the answer you’re looking for.
Yeah parries are the reason why characters like that are able to exist and be balanced at high level, it's just frustrating to me that the more fundamental characters are faced with the challenge of learning to cope with degenerate playstyles whereas toxic people can just hop onto the game and flail their hitboxes around while of course taunting after every kill
Clairen annoys the shit out of me, too. I’m not great at parry timings, but I know how well it can shut her down.
this is why i'm hyped at rivals 2 having a shield
No character is more fun than Peach
Melee isn't the best smash game but I like the Peach design.
Her dress was sexy as fuck in Melee.
>sexual awakening in every boy 20+ years ago
Shes killed trillions
yah , god forbid nintendo/sakurai release games with balanced rosters, we want fox vs marth again
you really believe this shit you say after two games in a row they ruin the balance with p2w dlc?
all of the fun characters in melee are balanced against each other* and that's what matters.
*except sheik vs climbers that shit is mad gay
>all of the fun characters in melee are balanced against each other
you dont actually believe this, do you?
Melee's a weird game, in that it got lucky that the fun, fast characters are the good ones.
If we lived in a timeline where the two best characters were Ness and Luigi, Melee would've been dropped as soon as Brawl came out.
let me really think about it.
>Fox
>Falco
>Falcon
>Marth
>Sheik
>Peach
>Puff
yeah I guess there's also Peach into Puff, that's pretty AIDS and also boring. so you got me there
>7 characters that are leaps and bounds above the rest of the roster means its not broken
what I wrote was,
(emphasis added)
all of the FUN characters in melee are balanced against each other
and that's what matters.
>all my [ headcanon] characters are top tier, so its balanced
gotcha
lol which character do you play in melee you tasteless gay
Link? Mario? Roy?
The better a character is the more people play it, therefore people don't know the matchups vs lesser good characters, it evens out.
Of course you can just bruteforce vs a lot of the E/F-tiers without knowing the MU, but mid-tiers definitely can win majors
Yeah icies vs sheik is so unbalanced, meanwhile sheik having chain grabs on half the roster is completely fine right?
Its a travesty they banned wobbling btw and I dont even play IC.
>caring about balancing in a party game
>trying to play as anyone but the meta? lmao retard
youre literally proving my point
but it's my point that you haven't even tried to dispute
none of the fun characters are nonviable, none of the nonviable characters are fun. so there's just 7 or so (9 at most tournaments) characters and you pick whichever one appeals to you and the only balance problems you're likely to encounter are minor annoyances like Fox into Marth or Marth into Sheik. the balance is fine
>none of the nonviable characters are fun
according to who? you?
>according to who? you?
yes.
>verification not required
Most melee players, I reckon.
There's a couple of fun characters that aren't viable. Roy could've been interesting, and if Pikachu is anything to go by, Pichu as well. But Ness, Zelda, Bowser, Kirby, etc are all lame as fuck to play against.
Roy is like one good aerial kill move away from being fun. but he doesn't have one so instead he's just lame and unsatisfying
>But Ness, Zelda, Bowser, Kirby, etc are all lame as fuck to play against.
importantly they're also lame as fuck to play AS. slow, boring, cement shoes feeling with shitty recoveries especially Ness's ugh.
my personal vote for a character that should have been cool but in practice isn't is Mewtwo. cool animations, cool SFX, and a teleport. but he just feels like shit to play
fox is fun to play, fun to play against, and fun to have on your team
fox+link is a solid 2v2 team
9 different characters have won a supermajor and two of those characters were midtiers
b-but fox
no those don't count because *insert 50 different goalpost shifting spergouts here*
My favourite posts are the "just because somebody won a major tournament with them doesn't mean they're viable".
You should have seen the cope and seethe when Axe won that Summit, it was nothing but
>he just got lucky
>he didn't fight (other person) so it doesn't count
>his bracket was easy
and all sorts of other shitposting excuses
I did. Remember people claiming that Pikachu was actually a broken character.
balance is bad, it makes every character play the same
Lmfao, what a cope. You can tell Melee ""players"" never played an actual fighting game in their lives.
I want to play a game and make everyone play differently
When i see the god damn "balanced shit" its like all the characters play the same and even the players
where melee I can litterally play as peach
run to people shield and slap people and stay alive forever because i know how to react to people presurring me so much that i will have 4 stocks while everyone else will have 0
nintendo needs to make better games
IM SICK OF IT
funny how a melee player can win at another fighting game at EVO yet not a single FGCuck can crack it at the top 20 in Melee
Unless youre a top tier super elite player you can win with anyone
>god forbid nintendo/sakurai release games with balanced rosters
Still waiting btw
What Smash game is balanced?
Make everyone as broken as fox, problem solved. It worked for 64.
You mean where Pikachu is so busted he started to get banned?
The balanced nonsense is what made smash outside of melee unfun. It became how overwatch is now with excessive character balances to "improve" gameplay
You say this yet Melee Fox never got banned while Brawl Meta Knight, Smash 4 Bayo, and Ultimate Steve have all been banned at some point or had people calling for them to be banned.
Yeah having Meta Knight or Bayonetta dominate is so much better than fox guys!
Play PMEX Remix
The very definition of quantity > quality.
You mean like Trash 4 and Ultimate?
Ultimate has SHIT Quantity
PMEX Remix BETTER QUALITY Quantity
1 example: Remix actually has more echoes and actually makes them fun to mess around with, while Ultimate does jack squat with theirs.
1/3 of the cast literally feels unfinished, it's like they just throw whatever mods into it and barely care about polishing what's already there
>Me who doesn’t care about all the competitive shit in this thread
Guess I’ll post my Remix Main
Puff bros why did they fucking kill us in brawl and 4?
they were scared of the puff power
Kinda off topic and non-competitive shit
I kind of miss the abstract nature of older Smash games
Melee had such a vibe, and all the stages felt cohesive and like imagining a new, high definition world on GameCube for all these older games, complete with new character designs too. Stages don’t feel like they take many liberties anymore for obvious reasons, as they’re usually based directly on HD games, but Magicant from Smash 3DS comes to mind as a great reimagining that we don’t see every day.
Melee was such an info dump of a game (in the greatest of ways) that opened my eyes to many games and franchises i didn't know even existed.
It was released at a perfect time where the Internet wasn't as mainstream, so the Trophies were perfect to provide you information of Nintendo games you've never played.
>I am nostalgic the post
he's not wrong though.
There's a reason melee has immense staying power and still overshadows current Smash.
That game used to move gamecubes by itself and be the only one you even needed with friends.
Agreed. Check this out for more of what you're saying:
https://www.ssbwiki.com/Notice
Look at the flavorful descriptions of the games prior to ultimate, and then the barren wasteland of personality of SSBU's descriptions.
I understand what you're saying, I remember looking at the trophies in this game about characters whose games I never played and imagining a lot of scenarios of what those games would be like. The time between Melee and Brawl was quite nice.
Anyone remembers Detstar.com?
Man I had some crazy fucking misconceptions about a lot of the games that only had trophies in Melee. I remember thinking Wrecking Crew was a horror game because I thought Eggplant Man sounded creepy, and thinking Marth and Roy were from the same game of course.
You are correct, the first two Smash games (before Sakurai's wife designed the UI) had a cool futuristic theme the other games abandoned. They also had far better single player content, something this thread is ignoring because of muh roster and muh competitive.
Predict what the next Smash Game Menu will look like?
The Ultimate one but every button says "Fuck Melee" -Sakurai
Apparently his wife has designed all the menus since brawl
The worst part of nu smash games is how they keep recycling Brawl's aesthetic over and over again. It was great when Brawl did it, but now its stale as fuck.
for some reason every game since brawl had poor readability on party play
>inb4 "it isn't a fighting game"
Why not?
it's not a SF2 clone, even though other games have ring outs, dmg conditions and platforming before and since. It's just gatekeeping because the various smash communities (melee, PM, Ult) are fully of spergs and literal kids and the FGC want to distance themselves from them as much as possible.
the goal isn't to fight your opponents it's to party with them
no is not retard, you mainly fight in the missions you have to beat the game
Its techskill is just bullshit where you mash 5 buttons consecutively. Other games you just rotate the stick and press a button. Melee is the most pseudo-intellectual fighting game ever.
Explain without being homosexual, I'll wait
You're double homosexual, you adhom doublegay.
Explain how the techskill in melee is mashing 5 buttons consecutively, retard. Do you know how to wavedash?
Wavedashing is literally a single 4 frame consecutive input. Baby shit compared to a real game.
not that this is a particularly high bar to pass, but I don't remember needing to constantly do 4 frame consecutive inputs just to move around the stage when I was playing street fighter
>what are combos?
More complex and timing based than pressing x and flicking the c stick in real games.
Retard(s) detected.
>Cope and seething.
And it's a glitchy fuck of a game too.
Melee combos do not have sensitive timing, especially not compared to SF.
nuSF has a 5 frame buffer on everything lol melee has much tighter combos than that
If you want to reference nuSF then you have to reference nuSmash too which has a 10 frame buffer. Melee competes against 3rd Strike.
>Melee competes against 3rd Strike
it would if anyone played 3s LMAO
There are still 3S tourneys. If you're appealing to social mechanics over quality you already lost to Minecraft.
3s is a dead game bro please don't cope like this
sf players sold their soul for capcvck monies and play the new shit. melee players kept their game alive. i'd have respect for capcvcks if 3s (or alpha) got as many entrants as sf6 but no. cope
I actually play both of these games and it's so obvious that melee is more mechanically demanding, like what the fuck buttons are you even pressing in third strike? Name one thing that's mechanically demanding about that game other than like, necro corner juggles or something
Spamming buttons with incredibly lenient timing in sequence is not tech skill.
How are the timings lenient when there is no buffer and many techs have 1-3 frame inputs you FUCKING REEETTTAAAARRRDDD
Oh right, you don't know anything about melee
you don't play melee and you don't know how to play it either
if you spam or misinput you not only lose neutral you literally SD and die immediately. you can't mash and get a ledgedash
That's one situation, fucker. Melee combos are infinitely easier than SF combos in any SF game.
players ledgedash like 20 times per game
and that's not the only situation that's like that, that's the entire game, if you're one degree off of a perfect wavedash you airdodge horizontally and your waveshine turns into you getting chaingrabbbed to death
marth uthrow punishes have tons of 1f links in them
some of the combos are lenient but also some combos in 3s are easy. if I do Ryu's jump in hk to close HP to hadouken that's easy as fuck
again you neither play melee nor understand it
there will never be another 3S tourney with real players for him to participate in lol
Lel arent sf combos the exact same inputs every time? Most combos in melee require a ton of mid combo adjustments to react to your opponents inputs. You cant really compare it, its like comparing playing piano to fencing.
>Lel arent sf combos the exact same inputs every time?
no. spacing, frame advantage, counter/punish counter status, what resources you have, how close you are to the corner, and what route gives you the outcome you need most (corner carry, damage, saving meter, etc)
If you can do 10 short hop fast fall Falco lasers in a row, I’ll concede to you. Practice as long as you like, try as long as you like.
And after you get frustrated and quit, understand that that’s as basic as it gets. That’s his neutral game that you have to be able to do without thinking about it, while weaving in and out of range before going for an opening.
After that, you can try ledge-dashing for a bit. If you fuck that up, you actually just die.
For the record, I like SF and Smash, but you obviously don’t know what you’re talking about.
>Spamming buttons with incredibly lenient timing in sequence is not tech skill.
Even if this completely ignorant description of melee's playstyle were accurate, what would you even compare it to in third strike? How hard is it to meander back and forth with chun li while throwing out pokes? The hardest thing I can think of that's relevant would maybe be Genei Jin combos, but even those are just rote memorization whereas melee combos require you to react to how the opponent is moving around/colliding with platforms. They are both great games but the reason third strike is hard isn't because of mechanical skill requirements
3S is """hard""" for you smush gays because it's not purely read based. Losers who try to parry a lot get hit a lot. A real fighting game isn't intended to be a board game but faster.
You should understand well enough that the people you are arguing against aren't doing so honestly. Everyone who knows anything about these games knows that 3S is the bogeyman OG game that people who don't play it love and think is super technical because it does an amazing job of looking flashy and well animated, while Melee is a bonafied end game of how technically polished a game can actually get that does all kinds of whit with its physics that fighting games have no equivalent to.
I'm one of the 3S fans and yes I prefer flashy characters hence using Marth in Melee but being pretty does not make a game less skill based. Wtf is wrong with you?
We're just talking about moving around though. Obviously melee has combos with sensitive timing as well. Melee is more mechanically demanding than street fighter, it's simply not debatable. You're seeing it, not understanding it, then calling it button mashing because you're a fanboy
>smash
>good
kek
fighting games and "fighting" games are categorically bad
P+ is the most fun and balanced smash but also has no rollback which sucks
Ultimate is second most fun barring the powercreep DLC but also has shitty online
Melee is only fun if you are interested in dedicating an autistic amount of time to it and your favorite character isn't below mid tier
repeatedly doing ganons forward air in melee is more fun than top level ultimate
>caught some chillindude streams after the stroke
>
You just made me check, I didn't know he had a stroke. Damn dude. Hope one day he fully recovers.
It's funny seeing Ganker continue to seethe at Melee.
Using the same old garbage "arguments" that have been disproven countless times already
>o-o-only 3 viable characters!
>t-t-t-tech skill is cheating/glitching!
>y-y-y-y-y-you have to break your controller in a specific way just to play it!
it's funny watching them continue squirm and seethe over it, 22 years after release
>seethe
I like melee but I wouldn't call it that, they are just making fun of the people that play the game and think it's the best thing ever, which isn't bad at all.
You should expect it considering where you are.
I'm pretty sure even people that love melee are laughing at this gay
Seems like seethe to me.
I don't think so, but you are free to pretend.
I'm pretty sure there is a guy that actually hates melee but I don't think he is here, yet. I would love to see someone like that because it would be funny, but for now most of these anons are just baiting and telling jokes. Good shit.
Yeah you're seething.
but we did
It's a shame this didn't get as renowned as roa. Feels so much better to play. They cared about what matters most and it's having some goddamn fun with it's stages and characters too. godlike soundtrack
we tried on 2018 Ganker. we tried.
>godlike soundtrack
you're god damn right it did
you are sub 0-2, stop posting until you can prove you aren't a shitter
I have never had as much fun in a smash game than playing Fish.
forgot my pic
waveshine i sleep
waveflex real shit
for me it's Hurt Land
the last game that let you pause mid fight and stare at peach's panties. good times, fun times.
Melee remix when?
it already exists, it's called project M and all of its spinoffs
Based retard.
I like project M but I would love the concept of "what if Melee had extra dev time" and add content with no one passed the GC/GBA era
this roster maker didn't have everyone I would like in a "Melee Remix" like Viewtiful Joe, Custom Robo, Goroh, Balloon Fighter and Excitebiker
also assume those that should be decloned are decloned
also the rest of the cut characters from Melee like Ayumu and idk who else
wasn't there 27 guys in Melee?
26.
unless you're counting nana and popo separately lol
It might be a while. Melee modding tools have a long way to go. But people are slowly but surely making shit happen
https://twitter.com/MidnightMelee/status/1685704169355649025
Brawl came out already.
The HDR mod for ultimate is somewhat getting a scene where I live. I liked what I played of it.
is a toss up between S and HewDraw but I love what HewDraw did with Min-Min
the parry dashes are sick, actually like it more than perfect shielding reflects
So why is it only ever a problem when melee has the same characters win?
It just is, ok?? By the way do NOT ask how many grand finals in EVO2023 were mirror matches.
Off the top of my head only SF6 and Strive weren't. Maybe Tekken too but don't remember anything about it outside Arslan winning.
>ctrl+f Rushdown Revolt
>0 results
typical Ganker, complains vidya sucks while ignoring everything good
This is it. Shame smash is really only popular for it's roster.
Smash Bros have better gameplay than most platform fighters even the shoddier ones do
>nusmash
Fixed that for ya.
Is this game actually better than melee? If so, how?
you can roll your face on your controller and get huge combos and also there's a burst.
basically like PM turbo mode except they try to make a real game out of it
Are there good defensive mechanics? What I like about melee is that even when you're getting combo'd you're still playing, through DI and SDI. I don't like games where an autist can practice a 20 hit combo in training mode, and if they execute the combo correctly the other player isn't really playing
I think SDI and DI are cloned from Melee in RR but I haven't played it enough to know how meaningful the defensive mechanics are vs the crazy combos you can do.
There's DI, tap DI, burst, and air tech. Outside of being combo'd, you have directional shields, shieldwalking, advancing guard, parry, and an invincible reversal (up-special on the ground).
RushRev is combo centric but gives shit tons of defensive counterplay. Most people just dismiss it because muh generic character designs. Oh well
Oh I forgot there's also throw teching. I always forget that's not in Melee.
These aerial dashes weaken the value of positioning and using stage platforms for combo extensions.
It also adds lots of depth to off-stage play, adds a great deal of verticality to neutral, and gives a lot of freedom to combo routes.
I think stages need to be completely overhauled from a conceptual standpoint to accommodate this insane verticality. The burst/aerial dash mechanic looks way too powerful.
Bluelock is incredible as the focus is on strategy and adaptation and cultivating a winner's mindset. If I were back in grade school watching this show, I would have stopped being so wishywashy and would have joined a sport.
I have never seen movement look worse than in this game. Why are the characters just sperging around and moving all over the place like they have 500 ping for no reason?
It just makes me appreciate how well animated Melee is.
You're not used to seeing a game this fast. That's normal. Imagine how a Smash 4 player would feel the very first time he saw a match of Melee.
Well, I'm more interested than before at least
While the game has very unique universal mechanics such as having HP instead of %, I think the actual best part of the game is the character movesets. But the only way to get a feel for those is to play the offline demo.
I just don't get who this is really for. It doesn't look like melee anymore, it might have most of the mechanics but you look at that combo and none of it was achieved through movement, it just looks like burst spam and the FGC crowd will immediately dismiss it because there's no walls
I was so hyped for Icons but honestly, I, and seemingly almost everyone else has no faith to give them a second chance. Who is keeping this thing alive, poor people who are scared of installing an emulator?
>Who is keeping this thing alive, poor people who are scared of installing an emulator?
1. The game is not free and I'm pretty sure its sys reqs are on par with Slippi.
2. It's barely alive and I'm pretty sure the devs are going through the last of their funding lol their next character is probably their last chance of populairty.
I think the people who still play it are people who want anime fightan air dashan fun in their Melee. You should try the game.
I live in Japan, there is no way I could possibly find a match even if I did want to play it.
I'm not happy that it failed, but Icons-Revolt is a perfect lesson in what not to do
The netcode is great enough to make cross region play good. One of the top players lives in Alaska. Not that it matters since no one wants to play it.
Me?
Rivals 2
I wish they kept it spritebased but I do love celshaded visuals so I'm torn
Clearly doesn't have the same focus on physics as melee and instead is just 'spam burst as much as you can for le ebin long combo'.
Honestly, the game just reeks of 'Oh fuck Icons failed but this Strive game is pretty popular, let's thoughtlessly graft it's mechanics into our failed PM clone'.
it is really good but i can't get over the atrocious art style and character design. Sorry it's a limit of mine. I'm a sucker for good aesthetic
Don't ever say the word that sounds like ever but if you put an n at the start anon.
It's fine, we got 3 better sequels.
whats the best modded in character in PMEX and can I just delete the half-assed ones?
>still the best physics
>best event matches
>best all-star mode
>best trophies
>best item balance
>best stages
god damn Melee was so fucking good
It really is incredible what they were able to achieve with that development cycle. It's only blunder is the roster
it pisses me off how they refuse to make the platforming physics fun again, is always a testament when you notice how less fun Hyrule Temple is in later games
2001 had it all!
How do I play teams with randoms in Slippi? Is it even possible?
i used to like melee when it was the only game i played but going back to it is so painful now because of how finnicky the movement is and how much better rectangles are and all the controller autism plaguing the scene right now in general
still it will always have a special spot in my heart for the community it fostered and the friends i've made thru it
Rectangles shmectangles. No top player uses a rectangle. But either you like playing the game or you don't...
All my Melee friends seethe at me when I make them play Street Fighter. The cucks can't compete in a game that isn't purely just reads and button mashing.
You think melee has button mashing? You and your friends must be terrible at both melee and SF...
If you button mash in SF you lose, you insufferable gay.
I won a lot of close matches by just button mashing at the end when the opponent was trying to read me
Good. Reads are the worst part of Smash. I want to play a fighting game not platformer chess.
In Melee you just need a lucky flick of the c stick.
see me or literally anybody else in this board and see how fast your ass gets raped if you try mashing buttons in melee
>I HAVE PERFECTED MY TECHSKILL IN CHILDREN'S PARTY GAME!!!
Very serious threat.
you can't mash in melee any more than you can in other fgs
which one do you want to get raped in btw
>no more argument, resorting to name calling
Based, the homo retard has been annihilated fellow melee bros, verification not required.
>hypocrisy from jealousy hypocrisy from jealousy
You don't even know what that's from because you're not white.
Wtf are you even saying, are you a bot? Say something that makes sense RIGHT NOW
Do you zoomers and nonwhites not know what hypocrisy is?
>Good. Reads are the worst part of Smash. I want to play a fighting game not platformer chess.
Dude, that's literally EVERY competitive game and EVERY competitive sport.
kino (I don't even like Soccer or sports in general)
not any more so than in melee
Melee is shit. The best character is a literal furgay.
marth btfo
riddle me this FGCucks, how come a melee player can win at a so called real fighting game at EVO yet a FGCucks can't even be top 20 in Melee, why is that?
the current cope is that strive doesn't count
>plays both Melee and a real game
>he represents Melee and not the real game
Meds time.
>plays melee for decades
>plays Strive for a year
>
UHM ACKSHUALLY HE REPRESENTS STRIVE
You suck pp's
What's next in Leff's quest to win at absolutely everything forever purely out of spite?
Leffen will never win a 3S tourney against real players.
If you keep saying stuff like this, you'll make him mad enough to do it.
Leffen cannot overcome truth.
>literal dead game
Fgcucks really embarrassing themselves out here.
Appeal to Minecraft fallacy.
>minecraft schizo
I think you've been btfo enough in this thread.
You never btfo me. You've done literally nothing but smug posturing and character assassination like a gay desperate for social clout.
>I CLAIM YOU ARE SCHIZO AND THEREFORE SOCIALLY UNDESIRABLE
>I CLAIM YOU ARE BTFO AND THEREFORE SOCIALLY UNDESIRABLE
Monkey, I'm on Ganker. You cannot touch my social points here. Why do you 4garden gnomes worship social mechanics when it means nothing here? WHY? Why do you pick such a worthless idol to worship?
Alright whatever. Adhom and appeal to shame fallacies. Low level orc slain. Next non-argument.
Imagine thinking SF is a complex game.
Why are FGCucks so insecure?
they don't actually play their games they just post on r kappa
I play 3S with friends. I bait them over by saying I'll play Melee with them. I pick Marth, spam wave dash forward smash, and then when they get sick of losing to spammy Marth I kick their asses in 3S.
you would lose to the 0-2s at my local
I have Melee tourneys in my area and its winners are the friends I cream with spammy Marth.
that's nice that you have melee tourneys for downs syndrome kids in your area, doesn't change the fact that the people i 4stock would beat you
>I was born perfect running Dark Souls
/v/tardation.
you have literally said that you don't do anything other than wavedash fsmash with marth while you play melee, you are gigabronze if that's true and not just a story you made up
I literally just have to be unpredictable with my wavedashes and throw in dash dancing and ledge cheese. Smush players rely entirely on reads. The notion of true footsies evades them.
You should go win majors with your pro strats lmao
I probably would.
I literally just remove the read aspect. Party gamers can't win when they can't read their opponent.
>FGCuck discovers mix ups
Lmao. Mix ups work every time in Melee but your commentators sperg out every time one is used because your party game isn't serious. 3S is barely neutral because once you get your opponent in disadvantage there are ways to keep them there if your timing isn't shit. Melee has edgeguarding I guess but that gains you 1 stock out of 4. In 3S it wins the round.
>work everytime
>except for the times they don't
You can maintain an advantaged state in melee just as good as you can in third strike, even without edgeguarding. This would still be the case regardless of how many stocks each player has. You literally don't know what you're talking about.
you would not win your entry fee back at my local, you would not take a stock off of the people who are actually good at this game
plenty of fighting games justify scrubs saying "pssh yeah I could beat that guy" because it's not obvious what the top level players are doing but please just watch one high level match to see how fast your retarded ass would get ztd'd
>Leffen: "he's... wavedashing "unpredictably" and f-smashing!!!! This strat is... unbeatable. Decades of training, for nothing..."
>I win doing nothing but
>I also do other things
i'm sorry that you play against total fucking retards who don't know how to press R
>smash players rely entirely on reads
you can read all you want, if you don't have mechanical skill in melee then you're going to just get rolled over, also I seriously don't understand how you think "reads" are the only thing that matter in melee while comparing it to third strike which is parry guessing and 50/50 galore
Accidental parries happen all the time so it's not like winning neutral by guessing a read is guaranteed. 3S is about maintaining advantage and mentally oppressing your opponent. Melee is about looking pretty and pressing C stick when the furry looks like it's about to do something stupid.
>it's not like winning neutral by guessing a read is guaranteed.
When the fuck is winning neutral by guessing a read ever guaranteed in any game? Why are you so retarded?
>3S is about maintaining advantage and mentally oppressing your opponent.
Yeah no shit, every fucking game is like this, you're just describing any competitive endeavor
>Melee is about looking pretty and pressing C stick when the furry looks like it's about to do something stupid.
Just because you managed to forward smash some downies with marth at the retard convention doesn't mean it works against actual opponents
>Melee is EXACTLY the same as 3S I swear!
Oh fucking God.
When did I say that? You are getting backed into a corner it's fucking hilarious
Give us even a molecule of proof. Oh wait you can't cause you made that up
melee is not a good game because all of the top tiers are busted, fox, marth, and falco especially
you can say the same about any other smash game
yes all smash games are horrible, but i do admit melee is still the best smash game. doesnt mean its good.
Why does it matter if they're busted if they're super fun to play because of it?
The great thing about melee is that even with their bustedness they actually have enough weaknesses to also make them fun to fight. You can combo fox like a ragdoll
I feel like it's an often under considered thing with games is "how fun is it to verse the top tier".
Because if I am a more skilled player than you then I should win every single time. If this cannot happen the game is shit. Are the top tiers fun? Yes. But what about people who want to play other characters? I expect a FAIR game. Why do melee players WANT their game to be unfair?
it is fair. everyone has the same character select screen
>the game is fair if everyone picks fox
How are you not bored yet?
there are like 8+ undisputed top tier characters, the "fox only" thing has been a 22 year ongoing cope from disingenuous gays such as yourself and I'm looking forward to another decade of correcting you over it; please remind me how many viable characters there are in third strike? The gap between chun/yun and the rest of the cast is fucking massive compared to the gap between top tiers in melee, you are embarrassing yourself by using melee top tiers as a criticism when your example of a good game is street fighter
Chun is not nearly as overrepresented as Fox is.
Yes she is. Chun casts a shadow over the rest of the game in a way that honestly kind of ruins it, whereas fox is out here getting historically dunked on in grand finals by marth and yoshi and jigglypuff
No, but Sheik does because she shuts down the entire lower cast. Chun is just hard to parry and if she ruins the one read based aspect then good. Smushies stay out.
>now shiek is his problem with melee
lmao I thought it was fox only huh? Kind of crazy how your original arguments just morph into different arguments
I'm a different Anon, coping gay.
Well you're wrong too.
In melee the better player wins moreso than every other fighting game.
guess you weren't the better player if you were so stupid that you picked the wrong character retard
>every mu must be fox vs fox
he loses to marth retard
>he loses one mu out of 26 bro this game is fair btw
i don't fucking know. when i find an actual balanced game ill let you know.
I literally MAIN yoshi? Also it is IMPOSSIBLE for amsa to win a tournament if he has to face plup in bracket because the yoshi sheik mu is not possible if the sheik plays properly
he loses to falco too
otoh he beats sheik puff and peach
more importantly all of these matchups are within 45:55, so, yes the game is fair
>I literally MAIN yoshi?
ah, so you are gay and autistic (I deduced this from the way you type not from your main btw). this explains everything
wtf? you enter the thread spewing "duhh fox v fox" but then your actual complaint is that your main loses to sheik
so clearly the game is not fox v fox
>Why do melee players WANT their game to be unfair?
Because of some Gankertard life is unfair therefore bullshit is based delusional thinking.
Name a balanced game.
Why do you fags always skip over Yoshi winning multiple tournaments?
Never happened. I bet you believe people landed on the moon
Ah we're going this route? You never happened.
Again because it's unbalanced doesn't mean it's shit, also
>"I want muh fair game"
>in a time where games didn't get any patches
Lmao at that point just play the PAL version nobody plays
So? a game being unbalanced doesn't mean it's bad, otherwise every fighting game would be bad.
Zoomers don't know what it was like to play Melee in 2001. They never saw this bad boy on a 50 inch Sams Club demo TV and begged their parents to get it for christmas. They never experienced what an astronomical jump in graphics, animation, sound, music, gameplay, and features Melee had. This game felt like what a game released after the turn of the century should represent. Kids now can only experience it vicariously through youtube video essays, long after its glory days. It is one of the best sequels of all time period.
im a zoomer and i still experienced the massive jump in gameplay when i got into melee after playing smash 4
why don't you guys just pretend melee released with 8 characters so that you can finally get over this huge mental block of
>the game has a tier list and some characters are better in tournaments than others, this means the game is BAD even though I would never apply this criticism to other fighting games
>meanwhile Melee players are bitching about the one character that shuts down parry reads
Hypocrisy. You're just mad reads aren't usually do or die in real games.
I wasn't, though. I was using Chun as an example of how your criticism of melee having high tier characters could be better applied to third strike. It's ultimately a shitty criticism in the first place. I already addressed how randomly forward smashing with marth is not how the game is played with high level, so please shut the fuck up with this shizo headcanon about "reads"
you're putting a lot of effort into refuting a guy who's only barely pretending to know what he's talking about, anon
wtf is burst spam
Rushdown Revolt has a 'burst' (roman cancel) mechanic where you can spend some meter to cancel a move into a dash.
>le social mechanics shaming therefore Melee better
It's confirmed. Minecraft is the best fighting game to ever exist. Minecraft is more popular.
do you actually read the posts you're replying to? what the fuck does "social mechanics" have to do with that post
Okay. It's grab -> upthrow -> something else -> fsmash. We're back to my original criticism that Melee is just mashing five consecutive buttons with light timing requirements.
how does doing an upthrow combo with marth compare to just grabbing someone in street fighter though, even if it were really this simple and you never had to account for DI/platforms/shffling your extenders, street fighter is the same thing with less mechanical requirements
Please stop talking. Or better yet, actually try that against a bot that DIs.
>mashing 5 consecutive buttons with light timing requirements
How is it "mashing" if there are timing requirements and you have to press certain buttons at specific times
Plus you need nontrivial movement tech to be in the position for the buttons to link in the first place.
I laugh at FGC players complaining about having to do microwalks mid combo since they can't just mash and let the buffer system to the work.
>tfw trying to do a standing turnaround mid combo under pressure without dashing
im kinda glad wobbling got banned even though i play this character
22 years of casuals who don't actually play bitching about Fox
meanwhile actual players know that this dude is the real cancerous gay
>*short hops in your direction and presses neutral B*
>powershielding a projectile makes it do less damage
Melee is a joke idk why people still play it unmodded
bro, here's the true gay character
I swear everyone screaming insults on 4cuck sees himself as literally Captain Falcon.
>dashdance grabs you
>upthrows you
>does an upair
>does a forward air
>you die
>he taunts
>the crowd goes wild
how do you respond without sounding mad?
Spike him every time he tries to sweetspot the ledge >:)
>crowd goes silent
>*ladies and gentlemen your winner is... *sigh*... gaymarthpicker69
>here's your $22 anon
>donkey kong dtilt him as he tries to recover for 20 minutes
Stop holding in.
gay in the sense that a leather clad muscle man is incredibly homosexual? Sure.
Gameplay wise he is very fun and balanced though.
(me)
(me)
Sorry I put the wrong image
Yeah but he dies really really quick and is significantly slower in his movement and aerials. Also his shine is way worse.
Once you learn to counter laser he isnt that hard to beat anymore.
Why is balance and top tiers only a problem in melee? Why is it never a problem that tier lists exist in every other fighting game?
Because Chun Li losing a tournament isn't a historical event on the tier of 9/11 unlike Melee and Brawl top tiers losing.
Yes it is.
half of our entire history was foxes getting dunked on by Ken's marth, then Mew2king doing the same thing for years. you're living in an alternate shizo dimension
>the number 2 character sometimes wins looks like Fox doesn't win 100.0000% of tournaments get dabbed on retards
Very serious.
So why hasn't a Necro won in 3s?
Is it cause it's a bad game?
Because he's halfway down the tierlist. When will Luigi win a supermajor instead of Marth player 4 million?
So tier lists and bad characters are okay in 3s because?
Because on that metric 3S is better than Melee. How do you not know what hypocrisy is? Take the beam out of your own eye before criticizing the splinter in your brother's eye. I can't believe I have to quote the fucking Bible to party gamers.
What metric?
i'm pretty sure necro and luigi's position on their respective tier lists are comparable to each other, not that it fucking matters because your argument is retarded anyway
Appstone
Adhom
Something something Gankerners aren't human.
53
>sits in a thread arguing about something he knows nothing about
>gets stuck for an hour arguing in circles because he can't gracefully be wrong about something
>blames "Gankerners"
why don't you go back, then
>you called out my fallacy but you lose admit it
Lmao.
the difference is nobody good finds luigi fun so nobody plays him
if he had an amsa autist he'd have won one by now
melee's tier list is also a list that orders the characters by how fun they are to play so there are almost no low tier heroes in melee
Eddy Mexico is a thing but he's strongly nerfed by his region of play. RIP Abate
neither of those guys were ever tippy top players, even if they had swapped to spacies or w/e they wouldn't have won majors
hmm the fox boogeyman is mysteriously absent for about 11 years, I wonder if these criticisms of our tier list could perhaps be disingenuous somehow. If anything they should be complaining about jigglypuff apparently
See
See
why are you linking me to this post? you've failed to explain why third strike having low tier characters is OK while the same thing is bad for melee
>both games have a flaw
>this is le win for Melee
Narcissism.
if the two games you're comparing both have the same flaw then your criticism is disingenuous, nice projection on the narcissism
Is this solo main only?
https://www.reddit.com/r/SSBM/comments/10kgk9p/oc_melee_solo_major_wins_timeline_2003_to_2023/
Apparently, there's a far better graph I remember from some youtube video that also breaks down dual mains but I couldn't find it.
is there one that lists people rather than character mains?
I wonder if there are more winners than the number of characters in the game
Don't think there's more winners than characters.
Seeing as 5 people won a lot.
ken, mango, armada, hungrybox, and who?
About 20 people have won a melee major
huh, 10 characters between 20 players isn't that bad
That's only solo character wins. If you add in secondaries/tertiaries who've been used to win the list also includes characters like Link, Young Link, Mario, Zelda and I think even Ness
i'm guessing only yl belongs on that list
like... link is on the list from when mango lost in link dittos to silentwolf at pound 3 lol. but that was a joke
learn english monkey
OO OO AA AA
iirc he beat kage with link but that was also a joke
I'm surprised ganon isn't on that list, people sometimes bring him out against ICs
Blanking on his name but NY Fox has a great Link. Even brought him out against Zain.
Aklo has used Link to beat Kodorin in grand finals at an event that also had Zain in attendance (and maybe IBDW). Probably not a major but still.
Mango has used Mario as a counter pick for Axe's Pikachu on FD, I believe he has won events where that has happened but I could be wrong.
Armada has used Young Link as a counterpick for Hungrybox's Puff. Similarly Hbox has used Ness as a counter pick for the young link.
Plup sealed out a game against Armada using Zelda.
The only people who really try that are Falcon players and the only Falcon player to have won a major is Wizzy who doesn't touch anyone else.
was thinking more along the lines of ken, azen, pc chris, m2k
There's a lot of weird match ups people seem to forget about.
Top tiers often have some niche counter pick.
Fucking Ringler beating the chops off of Leffen's fox and forcing him to switch to Shiek is one recent example that comes to mind
The DK resurgence is weird.
>Top tiers often have some niche counter pick.
kinda but not really
Even YL loses vs jigglypuff. The advantage comes from matchup inexperience.
>falco x4 (2)
i feel like that's probably underselling a lot of mango runs that involved falco
>top tier character Sheik only won 2 majors and they're nearly a decade apart
gawd dayum
Hungrybox has a 75% winrate against sheik.
damn, rip Ice Climbers
Slug could have done it if he didn't basically retire. At least he proved that ICs are still extremely capable post wobbling ban
>Peach: 3
uhhhhhhhhhh
solo only, Armada was Fox+Peach for most of his career
pretty sure most of those are getting deleted by his ylink peach era actually lol.
Low hanging fruit because the gameplay has (almost) nothing genuinely criticisable about it so to cope with the fact their game is clunky, slow, and dull as fuck they hyper fixate on the one "strength" their game has, that it's got a wide as an ocean shallow as a puddle roster. This is of course totally ignoring the fact that proportionally melee has a higher representation of its roster in tournaments and the top 100.
Even outside of smash Melee's actually more diverse than modern day fighting games like SF6 and Strive.
I really appreciate Melee’s soundtrack. Whereas 64’s sound track sounds kinda dated, Melee took the same songs and made them sound like the original creators probably intended them to. Look at stuff like Mute City, the Main Pokémon theme, or the Starfox main theme; they’re all timeless versions of the songs. Also love how Brawl would always do off the wall versions of these same tracks, really fits that grimy 2000s feel the game had with its aesthetic, because they knew they couldn’t do better at straight adaptations like Melee did. Then Smash 4 came and gave us forgettable shit with no overarching identity like the first three games had. Forgettable shit like the new version of Mute City, two uninspired and unnecessary versions of Jungle Level, or Yoshi’s Island. Not all the tracks are bad but there’s no cohesion in its ideas and so many smash 4 songs are forgettable. Melee was timeless and simple.
When it came to music, Smash 4 also started the trend of giving favoritism to certain series while completely ignoring others.
yup, never liked the "someone's playlist of his favorite songs" feel of Smash 4 and Ultimate soundtracks. They taught me how important a soundtrack having a cohesive identity is
>this gay bird dairs your shield
What do you do in this situation?
Dair-ing ICs shield is suicide and I make sure every Falco I ever play learns it
people are wild on netplay
>52 posts from this gay retarded gay
How can you see how many times someone's posted without IDs? Are you a janny chud?
Whoa my eyes have been opened! This 22 year old party game with a viable roster of 3 characters out of 26 is better than most fighting games! Melee fags are retarded but somehow they persist like roaches
it is better than most fighting games
>viable roster of 3
which 3
So which fighting game do you play where every character has won a major tournament?
NTA but in SF6 about half the cast has already won a regional/minor so far.
You mean the game which is just Ken?
do you see how that's different from what anon asked for on both counts
probably the whole cast of melee has won a regional / minor at this point and its bottom tier lis literal shitbads
Anon... SF6 is three months old. There has only been two majors. Seems appropriate to widen the scope a bit. Point is the game is pretty balanced.
the game is also a homogenous pile of characters who just poke into green move confirm so balancing was probably mostly done with damage sliders
and by the time it's a year old it'll have been patched into being unrecognizable, balance wise
probably twice
If we’re including regionals bro well over half of Melee’s cast has won. Hell, Roy has won a regional scale tournament.
See:
>the game has a tier list that means it's bad, unlike real fighting games
>this argument AGAIN
it's like i'm arguing with some kind of NPC with pre-programmed phrases, but it can only pronounce the sounds and doesn't understand the words
something something 9 characters something 2 midtiers
Admit it smushgays. You just like reads. The thing you fear the most is getting poked to death by unpunishable safe moves in neutral which is why you hate Chun.
What even qualifies as a "read" in your mind? Are you referring to making high-risk, high-reward guesses in neutral? As if that doesn't happen in street fighter?
The entire smash neutral in all games is reads and most of them are low risk. Playing rock, paper, scissors all day is just not my cup of tea.
In SF I'm usually thinking "okay how do I keep advantage or escape disadvantage?" In Melee I'm thinking "lol guess where the furry goes and wack a mole!"
please hop on slippi so that your baboon noises can be silenced
OOK OOK WYTBOI
not sure if moment of self awareness or the exact opposite
that's just not really how it works, melee neutral is very "tug of war" esque, aren't you the same guy from earlier in the thread who said he just spams forward smash with marth?
yes he is that same completely clueless mouthbreather who would get rinsed by anyone ITT with 5 hours in the game, and who has posted in this thread 60 times
Janny chud plays party games.
Melee neutral is Marth wins.
anyone can count your posts in the thread retard it's not like there's any confusion about who's made the absolute dumbest fucking posts over and over again you aren't hiding it and nobody is agreeing with you on any point so it just becomes obvious
>social mechanics AGAIN
Appeal to Minecraft fallacy.
There's a reason Armada was undefeated for so long.
There's a lot more diversity in top 16 in SF than Melee.
This game destroyed my hands in 2008 and I still have pain when I use them too much now.
It wasn't a good game. Brawl had more content and god-tier story mode.
>inb4 compeditivefag butthurt
>god-tier story mode
For tendee standards, it's the best one so far. Better than OoT.
This. Smash is a party game and Brawl was a better party game.
melee was the better party game
Yes, Smash is a party game, and it's also a better competitive game than 99% of fighters.
Because you can hard read your opponent to death instead of mastering combo timing?
Smashfags are so funny, they always pretend they want to talk about smash but the tourneyshitter can't stay 'mask-on'
evergreen image
I wish people who jerk off about SSE played it.
Brawl had more content but a lot of the content was filler. Melee's content was almost all good and everything felt perfectly tuned. Smash has never been able to replicate the Event mode.
As a mega casual who knew zilch about competitive melee or wavedashing this was just completely untrue in my circle of family and friends. When Brawl came out:
>Why the fuck is everything so slow
>oh god these stages
>fucking tripping, are you serious?
>what did they do to Target Smash?
etc
Going through Subspace Emissary was fun but it was only 2 player co-op, which isn't much of a party
SF has sexier ladies. Simple as.
10 years ago, Melee:
>a young, new, no-name nobody from Japan wins sets against the top 10 gods while playing an usual character
>becomes crowd favourite and climbs to top 5 players globally, goes on to win largest majors
Now, Ultimate:
>a young, new, no-name nobody from Japan wins sets against the top 10 gods while playing an usual character
>his character is banned from all tournaments globally after one good performance
Why are They (Americans) afraid of another aMSa happening?
>an usual
Meant an unusual, obviously.
I cannot think of a single person that enjoys playing against Steve no matter the format. Not sure if a ban is justified though.
Another no-name nobody 3-0ed the best player in the world with said unusual character. Then other no-name nobodies made names for themselves sneaking into Top 8 throughout the year as well.
A bit of a disingenuous comparison no?
I actually like playing against him. He feels more doable to play against than fighting against Kazuya with Yoshi. It also helps that I can watch other people play Steve and gain experience (also helps that Yoshi has all the tools to contest Steve) while with Kazuya, you need hands on experience to learn how to deal with him. A lot of your approaches flat out don't work against him.
>reading through thread
>see this massive fucking gay's 200+ post chimpout over Melee and SF
holy moly why are FGCucks so fucking insecure?
this made me realize that the reason Smash doesn't have a presence on Ganker like it used to is the lack of shitstorms yet the FGCfag reminds me of it
i think rivals 2 is a good approximation. More interesting kits without the excessive autism (i respect that in melee but grinding that shit is too much for me). Don't give a shit about nintend𐐬 characters
Meleefags and competitivefags ruined the game for me
Don't you have children to molest, Meleefag?
the series at it's core is not good, just a stripped down abomination of a fighting game, but still too hard and complex to be a party game for turbo normies like mario kart. A weird in between that makes no one satisfied. Melee is the only one in the series that accidentally pushed it forward and made something interesting of the dysfunctional formula. They chickened out after that and went back to make lame milquetoast shit that luckily for them still sells cause dumb rosterfags exist. Boring and sad
>Melee is the only one in the series that accidentally pushed it forward and made something interesting of the dysfunctional formula
It was always great, Smash was competitively solid and casually exciting from the very first entry on the 64, unlike Street Fighter, which had to go through several iterations to get to that level. Brawl was the start of it being lameified.
Is Ultimate also lame? I know the DLC characters are all apparently ridiculously OP.