What's the appeal of a setting where humanity is portrayed as weak and pathetic?
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What's the appeal of a setting where humanity is portrayed as weak and pathetic?
Some people like accuracy
Survival in the face of adversity.
How does being the bottom b***h slaves of the universe appeal to a sense of survival and grit?
are you actually talking about anything in particular or are you just letting your brain damage run the show?
fpbp
can someone explain this new autism of fpbping the not first post
It's like how people use "pov" in a meme without knowing what "pov" means. It's just a word they see and repeat.
That's pretty pov.
It was the first post to respond to another particular post, and the joke is that it's not actually the first post in the entire thread.
Can someone explain why this incredibly simple wordplay needs to be explained?
Survival in the face of adversity.
The more cosmic the adversity the more pluck in denying it
Look at Earth. We started as animals. We were eaten by lions, giant eagles, and wolves. We didn't know anything about anything. Disease and famine constantly killed people. Our near human cousins, the Neanderthals, were bigger, stronger, and likely smarter than we were.
At one point a volcanic eruption event called the Toba extinction reduced humanity to a total population of 2000 people. Had things gone a little worse, we'd have gone extinct ourselves.
Not only did we recover from our shit starting position, we're now the leading cause of extinctions on Earth. The species that used to eat us? The eagles are extinct. Neanderthals are extinct. Lions are protected. Wolves were domesticated. We harnessed the crops of the earth to give us food and overcome famine. We mastered knowledge to overcome disease and hardship.
These stories do nothing more than reflect real life. We were underdogs that almost died out until we got pissed and punched the Earth to the brink of death. That's the appeal - it's like looking in a mirror. Be it animals, natural disasters, gods, monsters, or disease humanity will ultimately overcome our challenges and murder all who oppose us.
I love those stories. We need new challenges to kill.
Spbp
You have an incredibly fragile ego.
Because many people who enjoys stories where the humans are greatly weaker then other races tend to have mental health issues as this trend is demonstrating. Especially since these settings usually have a author's pet race that is just "humans" without "the human condition"
That being said.
This
And this. Also being dominated, but then slowly turning situation around until you are the one dominating others can be a great narrative device and sexual fetish.
>And this. Also being dominated, but then slowly turning situation around until you are the one dominating others can be a great narrative device and sexual fetish.
>Flip fetish
Consider suicide.
Based as frick, humans as pets can be a great comfy setting
I agree, but you need to work on your reading comprehension.
Remember the "right" and "left"s opinion of vaccines before Biden became the president. I could have sworn every political figures positions mysteriously changed over night.
Let me guess, woman?
You're moronic
American liberals (i.e. the majority of this board) are obsessed with rooting for the underdog so their fiction represents this very exact masochistic victim cuck mentality. It's the slave moralist drive to deny our true role as warriors and conquerors that defines this mindset.
>masochistic victim cuck mentality
lol no, it's about having an actually interesting conflict (just effortlessly stomping everything is boring) and dancing around us being actual mary sues in practice despite the apparent "weakness".
Shut up homosexual. I know for a fact you post in "What if humans are the diplomats of your setting and the 8 foot tall werewolf men are the warrior race?" threads.
Never even seen those threads to begin with and am convinced they're yet another fabrication of yours.
>noooo different races having different strengths is badwrong nooooooooo
So basically your humans have to be the best at everything ever and never ever be allowed to even slightly lose, or they're "pathetic weaklings"?
>He thinks conquest happens without diplomacy
The British Empires biggest victories were not won on the battlefield, but in the backroom, turning prince against king and tribe against tribe untill there was no one left to oppose them. India, Scotland, Ireland, all were conquered willingly.
But I wouldn't expect a smooth brained "warrior" fetishist to understand that.
>t. someone who's never been challenged in life before
What exactly do you think "rooting for the underdog" means?
Probably something like being cucked to da israelites, it's always israelites with those people
I'm reminded of some parody of Revenge of the Nerds, where all the jocks are are aryan ubermensch going over their plans to get back at the nerds. All the nerds have stereotypical israeli names. At one point a Torah falls out of Ogre's pocket and the head jock picks it up and goes, "is this... a book?" Ogre ashamedly admits that he's half-nerd.
>It's the slave moralist drive to deny our true role as warriors and conquerors that defines this mindset.
I bet you're soft as shit dough boy
What a terrible, DYEL opinion
Name one setting.
Cthulhutech
Most people don't actually care about the position of humanity as a race.
For some less low IQ HFY fans, it is "What is better to be strong by nature? ...or to claim your place at the top through effort and will?"
For me, it is a combination of fetishes.
I like your style
>For me, it is a combination of fetishes.
based
Why exactly is the "position" of humanity in the setting important? Humans are not a playable race in the setting I'm using, but I'm having fun.
what is this gif
where is it from
Homestuck
Fortuna. Webcomic about aliens.
Power fantasy where you win as the underdogs
What's the appeal of a setting where humanity is the underdog that doesn't win?
Usually a group of humans win at least temporarily. Otherwise the appeal is just horror, some people like things that are scary and miserable.
By simply not playing as a human, or enjoying the setting without having "humanity win" as a must. Your characters, as individuals, can accomplish things and you can have a campaign. That is all that matters, even if they're vampires or werewolves or prey or human losers or human chads or whatever.
what setting are you talking about. be specific. i don't think you're actually talking about anything you've just got a bee up your dickhole over nothing.
Exalted.
Playing as the Exalts and being high-flying demigods or some shit. Come on, I don't even like Exalted and I get this.
>he doesn't know about the emu war
Go read Reign of Steel.
If you still won't get it - you might be brain-damaged, rather than simply trolling
Have you ever gone on a rollercoaster
a sizeable minority of humans are utter failures and can only cling to traits they were born with. they've never accomplished anything and they never will, so showing them any context where they're not automatically superior by virtue of their birth is like cutting their balls off. unfortunately there's a lot of overlap between those people and playing RPGs/poasting on Ganker, so we constantly get this HFY shit. on the bright side this is one of the more harmless things that type of person tends to get up to.
Most people are not fascist paper tigers who constantly need their ego inflated.
And characters require development. In order to do that, you need obstacles for them to overcome. For those obstacles to mean anything, they should be challenging. It's the same reason why Bill Goldberg wasn't interesting while his streak gimmick was protected in WCW. He had like a hundred squash matches when most of the other wrestlers were much more interesting than him. John Cena was uninteresting too because he always won. So it trivialized all his matches. Your writing would probably be improved by watching wrestling and also not being a fascist.
Was gonna say "white guilt" but you got there before me. Just with way more words.
Is this some sort of meme I'm not getting?
No just you and that Anon are autistic
no, john. you are the meme.
>whines about fascism out of nowhere
>proceeds to make a “professional wrestling” analogy
Are humans actually weak and pathetic, because if so, it's just victim porn and to make brain rotted dumbasses like it.
If it displays humans as an overall weaker group that is trying to survive in a hostile world, either from just how dangerous it is, or by a society made by other groups, it can be interesting.
But knowing this board your probably one of the anti-hfy gays that want humans to be stepped on so you can have your fetishes.
>If it displays humans as an overall weaker group that is trying to survive in a hostile world, either from just how dangerous it is, or by a society made by other groups, it can be interesting.
What if it display humans as a group that is reliant upon being subjugated by other, stronger groups to survive?
>Non-humans need to be malicious
Were you aware that every war known to man has been done by humans?
I never said malicious, I said subjugated, there's a difference. A king can be a good king, but he still has subjects.
I didn't mean to reply to you.
It was meant for
Humanity shot first and lost.
>Were you aware that every war known to man has been done by humans?
The Gombe Chimpanzee War for begginers. Chimps even fight gorrilas. If you want to go further away in the taxonomical order you have ants which do it all the fricking time, they even do slavery and pull moves like "Hello fellow white people" as a survival tactic.
English motherfricker
"She that keep watch", pag.03
Dialogues 01: "Do you see her too? But it's absurd ...", " I do not like"
Dialogues 02: "You have buildings full of food, which even if you feed more than necessary, rot, because you produce more than necessary. You breed lives, only to make them brutally broken. Yet, you are here to bring other death and destruction. Tell me why, why this horror?"
Dialogues 03: "Eeeehm... it's just a sport ... we're hunters, it's a tradition ... er ... and then it's fun...."
Dialogues 04: "Killing .... is it fun? For you mortals, violence is never enough, is it?"
Dialogues 05: "Ooooh, let's go! But what violence !!! They are just animals, and we pay, it is our right!!"
"She that keep watch", pag.04
Dialogues 01: "SHUT UP, mortal!"
Dialogues 02: "And what do you think you are? You are animals, and like them, you feel pain and terror before death...you can understand them, since you are made of the same essence! How did you unlearn this?"
Dialogues 03: "Allow me, therefore, to bring this back to your memory."
I expected something so basic but I'm still disappointed.
https://www.deviantart.com/blackbanshee80/art/COLEI-CHE-VEGLIA-pag-02-716202576
Yeah, it's exactly what you'd expect.
It's called The Night Land by William Hope Hodgeson.
Thanks anon I hope your next roll is a crit.
Christ it is moronic. Would she also kill dolphins and chimps for being absolute psychopaths of the animal kingdom? You know. Chimps which mutilate eachother during conflicts and dolphins that are the literal spawn of aquatic satan? Animals that bite other animal's heads off just so that they can use their corpse as a fleshlifght? Animals that rape eachother and kill other's young because they felt horny?
This shit sounds like something written by someone who has one massive Dunning–Kruger effect in regards to ecology and nature overall. Hunters are needed as they are a solution to a empty ecological niche. Fact the niche is empty because humans hunted those predators to basically extinction but leaving shit at that won't fix it. If you did that you would end up with greatly reduced natural selection which makes the overall quality of a species's gene pool go down, and also will probably end up with overpopulation which will frick over everything in the trophic web. There are literal cases of "Shoot on sight" when you see antler deformities in deer and other related animals.
I'm just pointing out that being a piece of shit isn't a feature exclusive to humans. Saying humans are better because our genocides are more efficient wasn't the point. Point is that you can have absolutely a pure evil race "from the human perspective" and have it be realistic.
>Point is that you can have absolutely a pure evil race "from the human perspective" and have it be realistic
That was not in dispute, not by me, at least. I was complaining about the idea that humanity could be more than innocent victims of circumstance.
>I was complaining about the idea that humanity could be more than innocent victims of circumstance.
Well depends on what sort of circumstances you are talking about.
humans are capable of choosing not to do awful things, and many do them anyway
That is actually full on moronic
>Humanity is bad because violent
>Me do genocide, making me better than the lessers
You know the gigachad is a parody right redditfren?
You self inserted yourself as a soijak. Rethink your life.
why are you HFY when you're not even human
No I called you moronic.
You have chosen in real life to be the person who uses soijak "strawmans". Strawmans is in quotes because, what you posted isn't a real position at all.
Two multicellular organisms fighting is a war
It could be interesting, but there has to be a dynamic, what roles do humans play in this world, how are they viewed, and what is the common opinion of humans in said society.
For example, say common fantasy dwarves are the dominant species in this setting, with most humans having towns on top of Dwarven settlements and elves having their old fancy forest empires.
How do dwarves see the humans, since all human towns are effectively vassals of thr Dwarven city they live on top of?
Probably some sort of symbiosis. Dwarves might be dominant but thwy still need to eat food. And because a large part of the industry has been moved below the surface humans can focus 100% on farming.
Indeed, that's how you make it interesting. Are humans equal to all other races by law, are they a second class? Are they a client/vessel race. What about in culture, even if humans are technically equal to dwarves or elves, Is it something that an average person believes/respects.
What about when an individual breaks the mold and trys to do their own thing, what if a large group of people break the mold and try to do their own thing.
I think humans wouldn't be second class citizens of every Dwarven keep, but they might not be permitted entry into them. Think of it like a semi autonomous zone.
Alternatively the humans could be horse people, responsible for farrying cargo between the dwarven holds after the old roads between them fell to goblins
What's the appeal of starting out at the top? Are you one of those folks who think the recent capeshit "strong empowered womyn media is any good?
>What if it display humans as a group that is reliant upon being subjugated by other, stronger groups to survive?
I've seen this a few times in some sci-fi setting where humanity is a client race in an interstellar empire. They ususally have the most thought and logic put into them. Without pause the HFY clowns lose their shit because humanity isn't top dog or in the process of becoming so and it hurts their fragile ego that another intelligent species isn't a doormat or worships the ground humans tread on.
I'm convinced that most of the HFY crowd are basically RP coomers.
>What's the appeal of starting out at the top?
Getting straight to the high-flying crazy shit instead of living in shit and getting lucky
Could be interesting. I've had a sci-fi spin on humans itching the back of my mind for a while, where no unified human empire was ever established and instead humans took to the stars irradically becoming a stateless immigrant population that's adapted to whatever alien civilizations took pitty on them
This. One reason I can't stand Warhammer or similar dumbass shit.
In my experience they appeal to a kind of fedora-tipper that is insecure about themselves but also simultaneously feels superior to the rest of the human race.
I say this as an atheist and as someone who used to, up until I literally got therapy for my crippling self-loathing and arrogance, prefer non-human characters and settings to human ones.
That seriously might be a coincidence though.
Could be. But there's also just something so fun and rewarding about taking down a foe that is in most aspects strictly superior. Take for example Mass Effect 1. There's no way humans (for convenience' sake I'll consider aliens as "quirky humans") could take down a reaper. Even just Sovereign is already capable of causing massed chaos throughout the milky way. But then you make the impossible possible.
Humanity as (relatively) weak and frail means that succeeding is a victory unlike anything a "fair fight" could offer, regardless of medium
Of course it's fun. But as usual, you have people who want that to be the standard to the point of losing what makes it special. Twisting it into superiority and making it their entire identity at the cost of narrative and everything else.
it’s fun
dicky
>tree-hugging hippie has no idea how animals die in nature
Every single time.
Also:
>defender of nature uses clearly unnatural forces to achieve his goals
>defender of nature is a naked e-girl
woke pasta comic, weird.
I don't speak taco what is going on here
Kingdom death monster
There is a book or series of books that humanity is trapped in a pyramid and the outside is full of monsters and abominations, also the "guards" use a weapon like the Whirligig saw from bloodborne.
If I remember well the monsters exist to mock the last remaining human city.
I dont remember the name but Its kinda cool setting.
It’s actually a really fun read although it’s somewhat badly written due to the conceit of the premise, but the vision of the future it presents is so fricking weird and compelling, it’s very worth checking out. total opium dream of a book
It's called the nightland, it also has a website filled with some pretty good fanfiction of it.
>Humanity is portrayed as weak and pathetic
Anti-spirals wrote this
Nihlistic self hatred going as far as hating your own species. Either that or trying to be contrarian to the HFY attitude that arose as a response to the misanthropic shit that gets shoved down our throats on a daily basis.
Name some of this misanthropic shit you're always b***hing about.
He can't because it doesn't exist in media, not really. Where it does exist is in his own life, the HFY "genera" has always had more to do with giving sad lonely people a power fantasy than any sort of media subversion
>Always b***h about
This is the first time I ever posted about it.
>Erm, actually it doesn't exist
It has been prevalent in media for fricking decades, and far more so than before in the public sphere. It especially exists outside of media as well. From episodes of Captain Planet, to movements like anti-natalism/modern environmentalism, to more subtle theme of it in Avatar. Christ "THE REAL MONSTER WAS MAN!" is even a commonly used trope. You deny this because you want to feel contrarian and/or view it as the truth.
>"THE REAL MONSTER WAS MAN!"
Bullshit, every time this trope is trotted out it's almost ALWAYS in service of showing man as greater than any monster in every way, even as the villain because only a man can truly challenge another man.
No it is most often used to show that humans are the actual villains of the story. You know this and won't accept it.
>i-ITS JUST CRITICISM
Bullshit. In earlier examples perhaps, but nowadays its most often used as a segway to hating humanity for the sin of existing.
Planet is misanthropic and anti-HFY
That wasn't the argument moron. The argument is that the theme has been widespread in big and small ways for decades. Although egg on my face for not being specific about episodes. Piratically one where the Planetiers are put on trial for the "crimes of man" which is just b***hing about humans invariantly driving species to extinction. Writer for that episode didn't go into details on how that can damage the environment (I am not saying it is a good thing), but instead treated it as an original sin that damned all humans.
The argument wasn't that it was good writing. Rather that it was everywhere, and the whole HFY (Both badly and well written) came as a response.
>r-RIGHTWINGER
>p-/pol/TARD
Not an argument. The attitudes/writing style exists on all political spectrums in some from.
>write post
>people reply to what you wrote
>get mad that people didn't reply to what you wanted to write instead
Are you a woman?
>Captain Planet is misanthropic and anti-HFY
I was about to insult your intelligence, but you already outed yourself as an Asukagay.
>THE REAL MONSTER WAS MAN
A trope that exists because writers are lazy and will copypaste the same two-three human-centric plots fricking EVERYWHERE.
It doesn't matter if it's a zombie apocalypse or a space opera, you're getting a completely unnecessary romantic subplot (if not the dreaded love triangle) and human baddies because then we can reuse the same focus group-approved scripts, slack off, and not risk our job if this pile of slop bombs.
Notice how memorable media doesn't do that shit?
So your example is anything that has ever said we should be responsible stewards of the planet? That's great, the epitome of HFY is the equivalent a redneck in a beaten down old trailer with busted windows and a rusty truck sitting on cinderblocks on the lawn.
>THE REAL MONSTER WAS MAN
A serious story, even one with non-human threats as the main enemy requires human antagonists to stay engaging. You need conflict with emotional if not philosophical stakes.
>Captain Planet, to movements like anti-natalism/modern environmentalism
Ah I see so this is a moronic /misc/itics thing instead of just your tiny dick.
Also homosexual you still only listed two properties that fall into your definition, and the real monster was man by design can't involve humans being pathetic or weak because otherwise there would be no conflict. The real monster was man is usually about how division or abuse of power or extra-thing-about-the-human-condition holds humanity back.
>contrarian
Avatar is the highest grossing movie, is it not? You are the contrarian.
>misanthropic shit that gets shoved down our throats on a daily basis
This isn't real.
Humans aren't weak and pathetic in avatar. By the end of the second movie they've managed to triumph over a fishing boat while the main human settlements continue to expand.
Avatar potrays humans as moronic violent monkey's that can't beat tribals with all of their technology and violent nature.
James Cameron shows humans as cartoon villains, buy in large.
I wasn't talking about this thread, I was talking about thar HFY isn't the mainstream.
>HFY isn't the mainstream
Things like Independence Day or Halo are very mainstream. Multiple things can exist in the mainstream.
Halo and Independence Day are not hfy, they're just typical science fiction war stories. I don't even understand where your persecution complex comes from if you consider stories like those hfy.
>Indipendence Day is not HFY
>but Pocahontas in space is clearly anti-HFY
>no u have a persecution complex!!!
Waste of trips
>I'm going to ignore all the sci-fi fiction where humans win to b***h for 14 years about one of the few examples where we don't.
>In fact, I'll make a new genre in response! One where humans win harder! One where there's no chance of us losing!
>Frick you aliens I made up, I'm better than you~
These are the thoughts of a secure person.
Exactly, gays like
are almost as insecure as the average waifugay.
>independence day is not hfy
>In less than an hour, aircraft from here will join others from around the world, and you will be launching the largest aerial battle in the history of mankind... Mankind. That word should have new meaning for all of us today. We can't be consumed by our petty differences anymore. We will be united in our common interests. Perhaps it's fate that today is the Fourth of July, and you will once again be fighting for our freedom. Not from tyranny, oppression, or persecution… but from annihilation. We're fighting for our right to live. To exist. And should we win the day, the Fourth of July will no longer be known as an American holiday, but as the day when the world declared in one voice: We will not go quietly into the night! We will not vanish without a fight! We're going to live on! We're going to survive! Today we celebrate our Independence Day
Yeah, that's how it usually goes in alien invasion flicks. It's nothing special in terms of sci-fi, it's typical. Humans win.
>It's nothing special in terms of sci-fi, it's typica
That's what I'm saying, HFY is typical. HFY gays are horribly insecure considering HFY is the default.
>Avatar potrays a greedy Megacorp as moronic violent monkey's that can't beat tribals with all of their technology and violent nature because exec's skimped on the budget to save a buck for a bonus.
FTFY.
Avatar potrays humanity as moronic enkugh to take orders from a megacorp.
If you are enslaved because you are to moronic to notice you aren't a master race, the slavers are.
>Avatar potrays humanity as moronic enkugh to take orders from a megacorp.
Earth in Avatar is a cyberpunk dystopia where mega-corps run governments. Money talks, and wins every time in a hyper-capitalistic society, choom. There hasn't been a real military shown on-screen in either movie. Just the Black-water/Wagner-esque mercenary scum fantasy Erik Prince probably jerk offs to.
>The megacorp's mercenaries beats the tribals after the blame has been pushed onto the previous decision-makers to save face and they decide to listen to their PMC advisors.
FTFY. That's how all big corpo fixes and decisions happen.
Forgot the image.
>Earth in Avatar is a cyberpunk dystopia where mega-corps run governments
...so you admit humanity fell to dystopia.
Do you believe it is a trait of master races to create dystopias?
It's a trait of master-races to trick dolts like you into thinking you're fighting for anything other than lining the pockets of your betters.
The masters of that master race have created a utopia where they're immortal and can freely modify their bodies
>I suffer so they can enjoy what's mine
Litteral cuck logic.
Sorry, I don't want to submit to a totalitarian state like you, cuck.
Imagine thinking you had a choice, gonk. Humanity always has and always will frick itself over for a quick buck.
>nothing can ever be good, humanity will always frick itself. i came to this conclusion through deep philosophical introspection, not as an excuse to suck
>fell to dystopia.
>alwayshasbeenshootingastronaughtmacrobutyouarebeingshotinsteadoftheastronaught.jpg
Does seem like you'll enjoy buying a next rage against the machine album.
>buying a next rage against the machine album.
Who?
This is a bad thing.
>This is a bad thing.
Obviously. But you and everyone else choose it via consumerism.
Humanity in Avatar is no different. It's gonna be fun when the Corp starts shipping Execs and VIP's over to Pandora and leaves all the poors and wage-slaves on Earth to die. There will probably some eugenics message in the foreground for that movie, because the mega-rich are obsessed with esoteric takes on eugenics (usually based on Objectivism to validate their greed) that are completely made up and aren't backed by science.
>everyone else
Including you, right? What device are you talking to me on.
>Your point
It is irrelevant to the discussion we are having. The question was, does Avatar portray humanity as bad? The answer is yes, as you just admitted.
Avatar is not HFY.
Avatar has HFY tropes, humanity just isn't the protagonist.
Anon, what are those tropes?
Humans being bad and incompetent is not a HFY trope. Categorically
Humans are posed as a technologically and numerically superior conqueror who will win in the long game. They're basically a more outwardly corpo rendition of humanity from starship troopers. They really only lose because they aren't the good guys.
>starship troopers
Starship Troopers fans don't believe that the Starship Troopers government is bad.
...also aren't they competent in Starship Troopers?
>Humans are posed as a technologically and numerically superior conqueror who will win in the long game
Humanity is on a clock due to their wasteful foolish nature, Avatar would be really silly if it thought humanity was going to win ultimately.
>Good guys
Yes, Avatar is poorly written, that is not the argument.
>...also aren't they competent in Starship Troopers?
Debatable. Kendathu was a major frick up in every way. In Roughnecks they managed to start a three-way war with the Skinnys and The Bugs at the worst possible time, and you see Command make a lot of moronic decisions. The disharmony between Fleet and Infantry is blatant and it gets even worse up the chain of command. They frick up and frick up hard.
Humanity sees Pandora as theirs for the taking, merely because it's there. The natives wouldn't matter even if they were also humans, because they were on Pandora first and that means they're in the way of the humans making actual progress. That's about as HFY as you can get.
Megacorps = israelites
Jews are aliens
Therefore, real humans got enslaved by aliens. Is this your idea of a master rwce?
The megacorp literally beats the tribals and the battle isn't even close
>moronic definition of contrarianism
>moronic definition of mainstream
It's as if you're looking for excuses to be upset.
>The most popular media of all time.
>Not mainstream
>A is mainstream
>so all mainstream must be like A
Forks have three teeth, my grandma has three teeth, therefore my grandma is a fork.
>pointing out problems with your species and its approach to certain issues is "hating your own species"
More of this moronic "love it or leave it" nonsense. When your toilet clogs, do you fix the problem, move houses, or continue to live with a clogged toilet? If someone told you to fix the problem instead of wasting money on a new house or just sitting there pretending nothing's wrong, would you say they're a "hater?"
Only morons and autists sperg out this hard when confronted with criticism. I'm sorry even surface-level media acknowledgment of problems hurts your precious snowflake feelings, but actual misanthropic self-hatred of the human species doesn't exist in mainstream media
Do you have a setting in mind here or are you just generally salty about Avatar again?
Stop making these moronic threads
What's the appeal of asking a question when you don't care about the answer?
You tell me.
White people rule the world so they have the luxury and leisure time to imagine scenarios in which they don't rule the world.
Yeah Whites are doing so well the last few decades. Totally not a collapsing race with no power or organization at all
>"White"
>A Race
You're moronic
Not as moronic as someone who says Whites are in charge
No the ultra wealthy is in charge racial politics are a distraction to keep you passive
I don't need the illuminati to trick me into avoiding Black neighborhoods or thinking pajeets are untrustworthy smelly people
No but there needed to think that's a bigger issue than the money and life they sap from you every day
one weakness of white people is the mentality that they have to elevate others
I mean, while I have a tendency to root for the home team, my identity isn't completely tied up in it. If the internal logic of the setting means that, I dunno, elves are naturally more advantaged, that's fine with me.
I don't get the obsession with the whole beta uprising thing.
It's because they watched Avatar (or heard about it and made up a fake movie in their heads) and felt personally attacked for some reason. They then spent the next 14 years writing fanfiction where they beat the blue cat people.
Ok but realistically speaking, we would beat the cat people in that situation.
And realistically the Covenant drives the human race to extinction and the aliens in Independence Day treat Earth as a minor speed bump on their way to suck the resources from the next planet, but you only hear complaints from the most hardcore tactical realism fans when the narrative conspires to give the humans a come from behind win.
The Covenant is consistently shown as being stronger than humanity, and winning the war, and the only reason we're winning anything is because of Chief.
As for Independence Day yeah we really should have been wiped out, but at the very least the difference in tech wasn't as big as between humans an whatever the avatar species is called, so I guess our chances of survival still would have been higher.
The humans did beat the blue cat people. They did it easily. The humans only lost when the planet wide super organism sent a zerg rush of infinite dinosaurs and dragons stampeding into a small band of private security.
HFY gays don't even remember the movie they cry about.
I'm not a HFY gay.
Realistically speaking, no competent organization would get into a war when the logistic situation is that stacked in favor of their opponent.
And that's before getting into the whole "enemy controls all the native flora and fauna" issue.
Overall, it's a dumb movie with dumb characters and a dumb story, and people obsessing over it are dumb.
>Realistically speaking, no competent organization would get into a war when the logistic situation is that stacked in favor of their opponent.
Why do autists think that characters acting irrationally is unrealistic?
>And that's before getting into the whole "enemy controls all the native flora and fauna" issue.
They didn't believe that at the time
>Why do autists think that characters acting irrationally is unrealistic?
People do not act irrational arbitrarily. They have motives.
The motive was corporate was breathing down his neck for results, the human race was depending on his success back home, he'd lost his patience with the restrictive RoE, he was furious at one of his own men betraying him, and he had deep antipathy for the blue freaks and confidence in his own superiority.
One people acting irrationally is realistic, hundreds and hundreds of people in an otherwise competent military organization suddenly forgetting about logistics is not realistic.
Also you're arguing about the most realistic outcome of a fictional war in a fictional setting, you don't get to cry about autism.
The need for stable mining operations (and associated logistic) is one more reason to not get into such a dangerous and expensive war.
Each Earth-Pandora trip is 12 years IIRC, slowing down mining for a while is preferrable to losing all of it for more than a decade at minimum.
>military disasters can't happen because the soldiers would simply vote and tell their commanding officer he's wrong
Autism
For being an HFYgay, you seem weirdly invested in the idea of human military organizations being horribly dysfunctional and stuck in a WW1-tier mentality.
>there have been no strategic blunders since WW1
Autism
They needed the magic mineral tho
It entirely depends on the setting, and it can be done in so many ways.
Look at dead space. Humans are utterly fricking doomed, our entire existence as conscious beings the product of an ancient alien intelligence who helped us evolve only so that it may consume us in the future. Humans are, relatively, utterly weak and pathetic, and not even the protagonist has any chance whatsoever to save us, and we're not even the first ones this happened to. Yet nobody complains about how pathetic the humans are in dead space, because that's the point.
Sometimes it just makes sense. It woudl be suprising if humanity wasn’t comparatively weak and pathetic to billion years old intergalactic supercivilization.
HFY can be done in a fun way, but after years of it having more bad examples than the alternative, it's okay to see how people spice it up. Sometimes humans are underdogs, or don't even exist in a setting anymore. Sometimes you can only play as a dwarf. Sometimes you just make your own alien race.
This feels like a bait thread but honestly, I tend to find humans more worth picking when it fits thematically or when they are on equal grounds. How they're handled in Star Trek as just another alien race, nothing inherently special but with their own unique cultural influences, that's interesting. At the end of the day though, play whatever you want.
>it's another "HFYgays complain humanity isn't winning hard enough" episode
The horror genre tends to not work as well when humans can just solve every problem with magic space lasers.
>HFY is supposed to subvert humans being weak
>but the whole point of humans being "weak" in fiction is for us to be underdogs who can humblebrag to ourselves that we're greater than the so called superior non-humans we invented
>this somehow needs fixing because we aren't leaps and bounds better mary sues in the fiction we made for ourself
>>but the whole point of humans being "weak" in fiction is for us to be underdogs who can humblebrag to ourselves that we're greater than the so called superior non-humans we invented
How do Goku and Clark Kent fit your theory?
They are just flanderized humans that are called aliens.
Anon. That is every saipent alien ever.
No, I mean specifically the part about humanity as a race overcoming aliens as a universal feature of fiction with aliens.
then I'd probably say look at
The narrative point there is that Goku and Superman are alien adopted children of humanity whose acceptance of and efforts to defend their adoptive species despite their own individual godlike power is de facto validation of human worth and existence. If someone so powerful decides that we're worth their time and effort to protect and not subjugate or destroy, why, we must be something really special!
I would say it's more insidious than that, in both cases the "alien" becomes an heroic figure because of incredible human parenting and not because of his willing intervention in human affairs.
Well, incredible parenting and brain trauma in Goku's case, but you get the point.
>autistic HFYgay applies real life rules to fiction
Depending on what the plot demands, Clark's DNA can be indistinguishable from human DNA in one story, then become easily distinguishable in the next.
Overall, Clark Kent's alien origins are irrelevant trivia that could be removed without impacting the character and most of his stories significantly.
Point of order, Goku doesn't care about humanity. He only cares about his friends and family.
He cares about fighting good and learning to fight gooder.
Different guy here. Narratives demand conflict to be interesting, and the whole point of Goku and Clark Kent is that they continually run up against credible challenges to their power that they must then rise to overcome by making themselves even stronger.
There's no conflict and therefore no interesting story with a strong individual who always and forever easily defeats all comers with no chance whatsoever of defeat. Shit's boring, unrealistic, and childish. There's always a bigger fish, always a higher mountain.
how about One Punch Man?
The whole point of OPM is how fricking boring life would be as the actual unkillable omnipotent god king.
Is the narrative boring?
As a viewer watching it? No. But then again a large chunk of OPM doesn't even follow OPM, it's about the lesser heroes struggling until Saitama shows up.
Imagine playing an RPG and the DM turns to you and goes 'you're invincible and kill every enemy in one hit.' It might be fun for a session or two, but eventually it'd get extremely boring. Go watch the Twilight Zone episode A Nice Place to Visit to get a better understanding.
Remember, in OPM you're watching a character, in an RPG you ARE the character. The fact you can't tell the difference means you really need to work on your media literacy.
And now the GM starts introducing elements into the story that don't involve physical combat.
>A Nice Place to Visit
But that's not about a person who is strong, it's about a person having their every wish fulfilled. Saitama most definitely does not have his every wish fulfilled.
Clark Kent is a human (with superpowers) in all but name.
He looks like humans, is raised since infancy by humans and thus ends up behaving like a human, his alien peers are almost completely wiped out before the story even begins, he almost exclusively partecipate in human social groups, and he himself pretends to be a normal human when he's not doing Superman stuff.
Basically, his alien origins are as meaningful as the backstory of a minmaxer's character.
>He looks like humans, is raised since infancy by humans and thus ends up behaving like a human, his alien peers are almost completely wiped out before the story even begins, he almost exclusively partecipate in human social groups, and he himself pretends to be a normal human when he's not doing Superman stuff.
Irrelevant. If he doesn't have human DNA, then he isn't human. Simple as.
Autism alert
Clark Kent is the fantasy of the all powerful man not corrupted by power. However it's also a completely different appeal than most humans as underdog stories
Tbh some parts of it are probably a cucking/emasculation thing.
The strongest man was born shorter and weaker than his mother, synthetic man.
We already had this thread this month that was successful.
>Here's my setting where humans are weak and pathetic and stupid look!
>now here's my OC race that's basically just humans but with slightly more limited roleplay options
Oh man cool what a great crafter of worlds
Is everyone in this thread underage or something
What do you mean hating your own species
Like what alternative do you have? There's only one species
Nobody beyond literal statistical outliers actually hates their own species, and certainly nobody represented positively in mainstream media. It's in anon's head.
No one hates their own species, that doesn't stop me from liking or rooting for another species in a work or fiction.
>But what about da hue-mans?
Yeah well maybe the humans were in the wrong in the narrative moron ever think about that?
>No one hates their own species
>humans were in the wrong
Sounds like you hate your own species
Least deranged American.
>Species A pets a puppy
>Species B kills them cause they wanted to rape that puppy
>Species B was in the wrong
>Oh sO yOu HaTe B NoW?
>if you criticize something that means you must hate it
4chin moment
Kys normalgay
how is this thread descending into actual politics
man frick this
Because people like
exist. It's right-wing culture-war nonsense.
it's both of you
Nah sorry bud, check the thread. The first political post was whiny righty-anon.
pretty sure the first political post was
The first political post was the fash OP being a whiny b***h about how not all fiction strokes them off with murder and power fantasies, and on how some fiction challenges them instead of insulting their intelligence.
Is Hitler in the room with us right now?
We can't say for sure that he isn't.
I cant decide if an SCP entry based off of that would be the worst SCP ever, or the best one.
If it's a nu-SCP, they'll say that the Hitlers are actually a manifestation of a god-like being, and they'll have a team of trannies explore an endless futuristic ruin, go mad when they "see" the true form, and after 10,000 words they'll end it with one of the trannies getting the powers of Hitler but without becoming evil.
If that's what passes for SCP entry's nowadays Im glad I lost interest in them years ago.
Yeah, they went away from the early days of "here is weird object, here's what it does, here's the brief fridge logic horror behind it" to "my SCP is a super special uncontainable eldritch god with some sort of troony coding and an essay on why you should be scared of it". Rainbowers ruin everything.
How the hell is the OP post fascist in any way?
Obsessed with strength and superiority of humans over non humans. This is dangerous because if we ever admitted israelites and Black folk weren't human we might genocide them. So instead being an enlightened liberal I will just say humans are bad and anyone who supports them is fascist
>le both sides
Nah get fricked, homosexual.
There is one moron trying to spin his fetish for lame HFY storytelling into a political position, but no one has been stupid enough to bite the bait and oppose him on the ground of politics.
Sure looks like you're that moron, trying the same trick again.
Turns out there are a lot of snowflakes who get deeply and personally offended when reminded that brown people and women exist on this website.
After years of jearing everything is political has become the genuine philosophy of the mainstream right, causing a flair up of the culture war humanity may never recover from in our lifetime
It's very humbling.
I like you, anon. And I agree, Godzilla is a great version of that too
Mothra should have a harem of feminized men.
>anti-natalism
Color blind nations are stronger.
Species blind nations would be too.
If a group is truly inferior, you don't need to actively discriminate.
>Mothra should have a harem of feminized men.
>feminized
She's better than this (I can understand effeminate boys). Also she only likes Japanese priest girls and Godzilla
>Also she only likes Japanese priest girls
We try to forget about that.
>and Godzilla
>American made Godzilla
Hmm
>Feminized
>She's better than this
What her harem can't look nice for her?
Actually having to struggle and come up with solutions to problems other than brute force is generally more rewarding than just steamrolling everything, even systems like Exalted/Godbound that are meant to be straight-up power fantasy usually want you to work a bit for your victories.
>settings where humanity is portrayed as weak and pathetic?
Unironically name 5. This site constantly acts like every series treats humans like shit but 90% of the time humans are either portrayed as numerous and normal, or it bends over backwards to essentially make humanity the most important thing ever. The worst you’ll ever see is “hey maybe we shouldn’t do X”
undertale
>weak and pathetic
>average human child can destroy the best monster warriors
?????
Well, there were the other human souls, right? That means that some humans lost and died at some point before the story. If even one human dies without first genociding an entire planet's worth of non-humans with just the power of being human, it means the story hates and belittles humans.
I mean, toby goes out of this way to shit on humans, but I gotta disagree with you here, bruv.
Sorry for the misunderstanding, I'll make sure to add /s to my next post.
>replying before reading the whole post
newbie
Has anyone ever noticed how the people that always ask "Why haven't the humans/more powerful races genocided the weaker ones" about a setting also always inevitably try to argue for euthanizing the weak and elderly?
No? I have yet to see the modern day Canada depicted in any setting.
First define what a Fascist is.
it's realistic and believable
HFY is for people that need affirmation that they're the best, not people who are aware of their own supremacy. They're for people who have to be told, "Oh, honey, of course you're the best! No one else could ever compare."
>the universe is vast and dangerous and you have to explore it in search of powerful ancient alien technology to even have a chance to survive; any encounter with the big bad aliens is potentially deadly
vs
>wait for the science dude to press a few buttons on his iPad or in a control panel somewhere so the thing will go ZOOOOOM and the bad guys are... defeated, I guess?
Most people like an underdog.
you sure? plenty of people like updog
ligma steve jobs, joe
You mean Ape-eal?
I'll see myself out.
I normally do humans as absolute masters who rule over the natural world, but completely useless vs the supernatural
Sex with monsters
(Against my will)
Its appealing to zoophiles and women.
The average person hates themselves ans by extension humanity.
It was the default state of mankind between 10,000 BC and 1812 AD. And even today civilization remains relatively fragile.
Depends on what we are talking about.
>A setting where all the threats of the world are so strong and scary?
Because overcoming adversity is gigachad
>A setting where all the PCs are amazing and so much better than those weak humans?
Because they're pussies that can't function unless they are ahead by default
Human beings love an underdog story of humanity overcoming nigh-impossible odds.
Realism