Community-driven video game blog & discussion
Sniper, no explanation needed
Sniper is a low skill class. A sniper fucking up a headshot rarely results in his death while any missed meatshot from a scout could be the end of his run
Scout, no explanation needed
If you can't explain your opinions nobody should ever listen to what you have to say. Plus your gay and retarded.
If you need to explain your opinion nobody should ever listen to what you have to say
sniper and spy because aim and complexity
the classes in any game that take the most skill arr usually the ones that would attract the most intelligent players, which is these two in this case
pyro is for morons who got dominated 3 times then switched classes because they suck at the game
I play Pyro for the sole reason that he causes immense amounts of butthurt to rocket-spamming Soldiers, AKA 80% of Soldier mains.
I play Sniper for the sole reason that he causes immense amounts of butthurt to WM1 Pyros, AKA 100% of Pyro mains.
I've got a gun for that as well.
Don't worry you're not surviving your first peak at me.
Yeah but you arent surviving a backstab with that one.
Why would anyone need a weapon to counter backstabs? just look at the spy
I play sticky jumper demo for the sole reason that he causes immense amount of butthurt to edgy powertripping snipers, AKA 100% of Sniper mains
>hit you in midair with the piss rifle
>watch as you die from fall damage
>bodyshot with Machina
>they get mad in all-chat
>nice bodyshot gay
>nice headshot gay
>nice hacks loser
>fucking camping asshole
>no skill gay can't land a headshot
>kick your bot
the asshurt generated from machina bodyshots is unreal
why does the laugh taunt make people seethe so badly?
the only one that tilts me a bit is when snipers do it and sometimes scouts, everybody else is so inherently funny i can't help but laugh too, demoman's OOOOOH start to his laugh makes me laugh by pavlovian response
demomans drunkin roar gets me everytime too. scout and sniper are smug and evil bastards who make you feel lesser.
>purposely play Sydney Sleeper
>get body shots
>someone calls me a hacker
>find him and just throw Jarate at him
>laugh in his face as he's covered in piss
>he kills me
>kill him again, domination
>"STOP PLAYING WITH THE PISS RIFLE IT'S NOT FUNNY!"
>Find him again, he switched to scout
>throw jarate and laugh
>xxxxx has left the game (Client Disconnect)
>vaccinate a pyro who's amazing at airblasting
>soldiers can't do anything with their secondary pea shooters
>snipers can't kill him due to bullet res
>only really countered by sentries
>one time where spy can do something sniper can't
>somehow market gardening takes his place
I hate it because I like using banners.
no explanation needed
Direct Hit soldier
I always found Soldier boring until I learned the Direct Hit, now I can’t stop focusing Gunslingers and chuckling a bit when ragdolls don’t gib and instead fly backwards like 60 mph into a wall
>killing a Pyro in one hit with a 180 dmg mini-crit rocket
Buff Banner + Direct Shit is so fun.
>focusing a sniper with direct hit
>he complains about random crits
>call him a retard and explain nothing else as I continue to focus him
For me it's pretending to be a friendly Heavy to get past their front line then punching the snipers to death
>playing DH+conch soldier
>random teammate blows buff banner
>see sniper running to sniper perch
>shoot minicrit DH rocket into sniper perch as he gets into position
>see a kunai spy swing his knife at the dead sniper then immediately die to a scout that chased him
>sniper rages in chat, about how he wouldn't have died if not for random crits
Mobility skill go for soldier who can do longer rollouts than demo
Aim go for sniper because that the whole point of the class
Both go for scout, low floor skill but oh my god, those gays scout who seems flying around the map always behind your view and who keep hitting meatshots on you were scary af
And that was worse with the sandman/clever experts
>mobility skill go for soldier
If you ask me?
Poor Scouts get torn the fuck up and aren’t even worthy distractions, average Scouts can secure kills but are easy to deter, but great Scouts are menaces that keep everyone away from wandering alone and can sacrifice themselves to wipe out the backline at the slightest opening. It’s a long long road to this point and most don’t make it.
Needs a knack for calculating distance, projectile speeds and predicting enemy movement without the luxury of rockets that explode on impact, even the cheap-seeming sticky spammers can get shut down easily if they do it at the wrong bad time because of the easily abusable short range weakness. The same class that can nuke the frontline by himself is also an embarrassment to seen played at a beginner level, sometimes doing nothing at all as grenades just fly past everyone or fall short. Demoknights can fuck right off, however.
Generally speaking both of these guys tend to need a lot of experience and sense of strategy, not because they’re hard to learn and can kick some ass at their peak, but because they’re poorly balanced in scenarios out their comfort zone. A combo Pyro can be outdone by a friendly Demoman, a Spy can be outdone by a friendly Sniper, etc. An Engineer can live without a Pybro, an enemy Sentry doesn’t necessarily need a Spy to destroy it. Even at their peak there are still scenarios where you might think that you’re better off switching to someone else when the enemy is so dense you cant get close enough to burn them or sneak past them. They’re still fun as hell for their uniqueness tbh
Spy at least has the niche of being able to sit in the enemy backline and pick off stragglers for free like a discount scout. Pyro is a complete waste of a player slot unless you are the engineer's personal whore
Spy was wrongfully nerfed to the point of uselessness. Among veteran players, the only use the disguise kit has is to get up near the dumb enemy sentry gun. Revolvers are useless and the knives suck. If you want to take out the back line, Scout does the job better.
>Revolvers are useless
Pyro is a wonderful defense class even without engis to protect and can counter a lot of classes
He is a Jack of all trade
People shitting on Pyro really just w+M1 and complain when they die
Not necessarily, Pyro is just a walking irony of overspecialization
Rather than an attacker he’s better off as a defensive support kind of guy, able to push dangerous enemies away from the team or push them INTO the team so they dogpile them, cancelling out the afterburn enemy Pyros, sacrifice themselves to stop an Uber push, keep projectiles at bay and the classic spychecking
He’s an obnoxious disrupter and bodyguard with single-target nuking via combo attacks, generally second or third fiddle to the ACTUAL attackers like Soldier and Demoman, but he’s better off playing with the team to be out to full use, otherwise he’s just Sentry, Heavy and Sniper fodder
Still, if it’s more firepower you need Pyro is ironically the last guy you want, I just go Heavy when it looks like the frontline is suffering
Dragons fury actually turns pyro into an offensive class, depending on the sitution you can delete heavies/nests, its insane
Dragon's Fury is such a meme. Wake me up when it'll do extra damage on *every* fireball hit on an enflamed enemy, not whenever it feels like.
It's actually op, but its good you are all too stupid to realize it
Nah. I like being able in control the amount of damage and I'm not gonna die because I didn't get rewarded for consecutive hits in the same way every time. I will not bash my head against a wall mechanic I have too little control over ("center hits"). I will not die because the game didn't give me the damage I deserve arbitrarily. I will simply continue top scoring with stock until this "feature" gets patched out.
literally git gud
people just don't realize that pyro with the dragon's fury is just solder without splash damage or rocketjumps, and that's only if played optimally
>but as soldier if you miss
as dragon fury pyro if you miss it takes roughly two centuries before you are able to do actual damage again
i've played dragon'f fury pyro for a decade, it's called the direct hit
If you use the jetpack with it you're just Soldier without splash damage lol
gotta admit they nailed the sound design on it tho
i fucking wish it was more viable
or that spy didn't suck mad dick
or that medic had choices for primary and melee
Make it actually hitscan instead of pseudo projectile and i'll agree with you.
Low skilled players often underestimate scouts. They can close the gap between you and them in a blink and meatshot your ass back to spawn.
good scouts often underestimate better scouts. that is to say, they never expect someone to just stop moving mid strafe and they get fucked up
Scouts and pyros are the two greatest examples of either being a free kill or hell incarnate.
Spy no context, a top scoring spy is the hardest class to find, spy is the mos tkilled class in the game EASILY.
>install autostab script
wow so skilled
>install money printer
wow that was easy
The shotguns/scatterguns in this game are so satisfying to use mmmmm~
Even with the weapon choice thing completely getting fucked by the weapon switch speed buff and virtually all of his combos nerfed into the dirt because of people whining.
The floor before you're even able to do anything more than spam flares and hit people with two flame particles before IMMEDIATELY getting gunned down by anything and anyone that can outrange you and contribute nothing is pretty huge, and you don't even start with a flare gun.
I think people forget how much of a fucking nuisance a fresh install pistol scout can be.
Literally all of them except Soldier. Soldier boils down to shooting the floor or wall near anything that vaguely resembles an enemy color and if you believe otherwise, you're huffing some quality copium. Fuck Soldier mains, eat my shit.
nah heavy is generally easier
Heavy isn't bottom since he has range, but he gets positively fucked by everything but pyros that haven't managed to sneak up behind him
>using any launcher other than the direct hit
>Implying any fucking Soldier on Casual or inceltopia knows how to aim the Direct Hit
Come on now, we all know the average Soldier, hell even the above-average Soldier doesn't have enough braincells to even comprehend what aiming even is as a concept.
>casual uses dh
>mge chad uses dh
>comparing a 1v1 mode to a 12v12 mode
God, TF2 players really are just a special breed of retard.
terrible bait, try again
In terms of pure mechanics I would say scout. To play scout well you need to know how to airstrafe around to dodge projectiles while also having to flick to an enemy mid jump. In terms of gamesense definitely spy, but its pointless since the best spy in the world will still be mediocre compared to a competent sniper.
Scout is definitely the hardest class.
I casual, most people play payload and there is always at least 3 sentries per square foot.
Sniper benefits from payload maps which is why most players hate him.
Sniper has the highest theoretical skill cieling, but in terms of human-possible gameplay, it's probably scout, due to him being both reliant on very good aim and having by far the most difficult and precise movement.
>stop suddenly and crouch still instead of jumping around
>Miss all six shots
popular opinion spy
my opinion, demo, because i tried to get back into tf2 & tf2 classic after a long hiatus and all of my muscle memory for that class was gone despite it being my most-played class.
Put on shoes and use the sticky launcher as a primary
the opinion probably changes depending on meta classes.
for example stock demo is likely a lot more challenging to master than demoknight, and people who struggle to hit with rockets would probably do better at getting shotgun and market gardener kills with the rocket jumper equipped.
maybe someone who regularly plays classes wrong (maybe uhh, scout equipped with shortstop, mad milk, and spiked bat) thinks that class is more challenging than it actually is. so imagining if all classes were vanilla, i think spy is pretty difficult.
Spy isn't hard, he's just weak. A dominating spy would whoop even more ass as anyone else.
real reason i think spy is hard to get into is it's so easy to be spotted, and heavily unique cosmetic loadouts make that even riskier because who's not going to spot their own loadout? cosmetics effectively ruin spy as a class, but he can still be good.
scout. simply because the faster you are the more skill it takes to control that speed.
reminder that W+M1 pyro takes no skill and W+M1+M2 demoknight also takes no skill.
Playing Engineer competently takes the most skill
this is the moment when dell conagher became engineer gaming
>Pyro takes no skill
>*shoots the floor*
when will you people stop with this. at least you have to fucking aim and nobody dies from that blast damage unless they are under 10hp.
soldier haters can never be satisfied
>you just have to shoot the floor!
>direct hit comes out where you have to get a direct hit
>More like direct shit ammirite?
i hope all pyro mains burn in hell and all demoknights overdose on their HRT and die.
>not knowing about the built in aim assist for rocket launchers
Since direct shit rockets are faster it abuses the system
Anon if you don't understand how that makes the direct hit busted in every way you may just have autism
*deals 100 damage to passing scout*
>dies from blast damage
*kills cloaked spy with a rocket jump*
>unless they are under 10hp
>hits payload with crocket
It was called the Direct Shit because it revealed how the vast majority of Soldier players have incredibly bad aim and become useless without being able to use splash damage as a crutch.
As a mediocre Soldier I disagree.
DH creates the same exact effect the Loch-N-Load used to do where the faster projectile speed is so good that all you need to do is spam a chokepoint and you are guaranteed a kill. I'm not the best Soldier player yet when using the DH I get long killstreaks because spash damage doesn't mean shit when the projectile fucking zooms faster than people can react and just being at close to mid range can kill 1/4 of classes with one hit.
It's a crutch that Soldierfags refuse to admit is a crutch. And Ican say this with 100% confidence because I use it as crutch.
Soldiers that actually use the Direct Hit properly (bouncing and airshotting) are nightmarish, the weapon is CRAZY fucking good when used properly in one-on-one fights
The worst part of this is Pyro forces you to shoot for splash since reflects are easier if you aim directly at the Pyro as its gives them more time to reflect but its harder for them to reflect if you aim for splash. Pyro actively punishes you for aiming your rockets and grenades accurately, its fucking ass backwards design, and then retarded Pyro players act like its Soldier fault he has to abuse splash.
I don't think it's a bad thing or bad design at all that Soldier has a hard counter in the reflect and he has to vary his approach if he wants to keep a Pyro from reflect-killing him. It's why you've got secondaries and melees, also.
What you call "varying my approach" I call forcing me to play in a less skillful way that isn't satisfying for either side. When a Scout dodges every rocket and kills me I understand I was being outplayed, but I was never being discouraged from aiming directly at the Scout. However if a Pyro reflected every rocket and kills me I would think it was because I had the audacity to actually aim at him instead of playing gay and going for splash, retreating around a corner and spamming rockets at chokes instead of actually engaging in a fight. And I know Pyro's hate me playing this way too given how much they bitch about rocket splash.
Approaching it from an issue of "skill" is really weird when you're complaining about not being able to approach Pyro the same way you do other classes. Approach Pyro as a Pyro and not as a Scout; hell, you should be trying to nail the Scout with splash and not a direct hit because he's a slippery shit.
There is nothing skillful about aiming for splash or retreating and spamming at a choke. Its not "strategy" its just a dumb but effective way to kill Pyro when the more engaging and skillful option is the one that punishes you.
Mate have you tried varying your fire rate and moving around and not just firing like a robot?
I'm not saying its hard to kill Pyro, I'm saying you have play gay and abuse splash. Varying fire rates and moving around don't factor in when the issue is that aiming directly at a Pyro makes it easier to have rockets reflected.
When your "smart" or "skillful" way is to shoot directly at him and get your stupid ass reflected, yeah, it's pretty skillful to shoot at Pyro in a way that makes it difficult for him to properly reflect. I dunno where you're getting the idea that it's less skillful to change how you approach a Pyro, this is like people complaining about "dishonest play" in Smash Bros. or other fighting games. It's an intrinsic part of the rocket and it's built for exactly the scenario we're describing.
I think Soldier mains might be more retarded than the Pyros they complain about.
Isn't the airblast hitbox WAY bigger then rocket splash radius? Pyros have no reason to cry lol
>NOOOO I CAN'T FIGHT PYROS "HONESTLY"
>wtf I have to play around my counter in a different way from how I play against every other class?
my trick for reflecting pyros, in a one on one. now keep in mind, im very stupid and only play 2fort. what i do to them, is i walk straight towards them. or just stare until they do reflect at nothing.
>but I was never being discouraged from aiming directly at the Scout.
What do you think leading and using splash from surfaces is?
The game actually has a tip telling you to shoot the floor at peoples' feet...
>at least you have to fucking aim
You literally don't. That's the whole point of the "aim at floor" criticism
Anon you should be aiming for the floor anyway. Yes it means soldier is an easy class, but it's literally how he's designed to be played. You're basically not playing him right if you're always aiming for directs because anything out of close range is going to be easy to dodge.
>Anon you should be aiming for the floor anyway
Wrong, you should be aiming at the bottom of player hurtboxes to pop them up.
>soldier is an easy class
Easy to pick up and do decently but is top 3 in terms of skill ceiling.
>mobility skill go for soldier
Soldier and demo jumping have about the same difficulty, anon. Soldiers get to flex it more in actual matches because of how much HP it costs demo to sticky jump.
There are like 3 people per continent who can consistently airpogo without thirdperson or speedo breh. I mean I think soldier jump is more fun but airpogo is just a bitch to get even remotely decent at, you can cheat with thirdperson or whatever, but without it, you'll have to figure it out on your own because of how inexplicable the timing is.
>There are like 3 people per continent who can consistently airpogo without thirdperson or speedo
This is beyond false pal. I am dogshit at demo jumping and can consistently hit 3+ air dets, no speedo required. If you wanna go that deep then you can even make the same arguement for rampsyncs for soldier, or powerbounce syncs. They both have super hard tricks in both directions.
I was referring about many more than 3 airpogos, in either case, both techniques' technical limits go beyond human ability, but getting started in airpogo is quite more difficult, and most importantly, the timing aspect is near impossible to acquire, and whereas you can train to finish difficult soldier jumps consistently, once you're in the air as demo, unless the segment is short and guidelines you into shooting certain stickies in certain ways, you're on your own and many jumps won't do you any gifts in terms of adaptability.
Also, proportionately, there are much wider gaps in times of demo map speedruns.
But yeah, the idea of "the most skill technique" is pretty silly anyway, since both techniques can be taken beyond the human limit.
>you should be aiming at the bottom of player hurtboxes to pop them up
That's still incredibly easy to do. Even when you miss you still do damage since you're still aiming at the floor.
>but is top 3 in terms of skill ceiling
Skill ceiling is a daft term. You're either talking how much skill you can put in before getting diminishing returns on effect out. Which means the class is easier because he's more effective at same levels of skill. Or you're claiming there's a point where you get so good at something it becomes physically impossible to be better at it. Which is arrogance more than anything else.
I'll read all that anti-soldier cope after you've sent me a proof of you completing any T3 jump map or a comp profile. Prove to me you're good enough to know what you're talking about and i'll care.
Hey I didn't say he had to be actually that good, just good enough to be able to recognize what good play actually looks like.
Wouldn't good play entail actually playing the game and not jump maps?
Jump maps teach movement which translates very well into actual gameplay skill. Simply learning how to traverse the map well and making yourself hard to hit is a good indicator of above average skill.
How do you learn to make yourself hard to hit in a jump map, where nothing attacks you?
You learn how to control knockback, both yours and potentially enemies. Being able to consistently control where your blasts take you enable you to evade like crazy, along with airstrafing and it's many nuances. Damage surfing is made much simpler when you know proper air control as well.
Couldn't you show that skill in an actual game, where you're actually expected to put it into practice?
Sure, it's why I also suggested a comp profile instead.
Saying jump maps teach you how to evade is retarded. Apart from learning how to rocket jump, what they teach you is twitch aiming and gauging the timing of your rockets so you can hit things more easily.
When a soldier who hasn't played jump maps jumps at me I can airshot them 99/100 times. Soldier who know proper air control are much MUCH harder to airshot. The same applies for chain airshots.
Air strafing is such a basic bitch skill, you don't need to play a single jump map to learn that, let alone complete a T3.
Basic airstrafing is, sure. Not everyone knows about things like W or S tapping, helicopter-strafing or regaining air control from a pyro airblast. T3 was just a suggestion as that's a decent amount of time invested into learning to play the class.
I'm not convinced there's a difference in how hard it is to hit people who know what holding W while strafing does and people who don't.
Spy, mostly cause he's the most UP class and unless playing against literal children you're constantly have to be two step ahead and be lucky to get by.
Sniper because you actually have to aim.
>/threading your own post
do sniperfags really?
thats a really cool weapon idea actually. I could see myself using that.
it's like the not-retarded version of the wrangler
it looks fun but it's way too OP
just slap a bit more of damage fall-off on the sentry and it is fine
Honestly just remove the lifesteal and it would be fine.
The insane range and ability to priotiize are decent abiltiies with its own benifits and weaknessess.
true, I agree with you, and I'd even add that its ammo should take from the metal reserve so the engineer doesn't spray like a tard
Remove the paint when the engineer dies and it would be fine
Remove the lifesteal and it would 100% be something that could fit in the game
>paint counts as wet
>partner with a buddy using neon annihilator
>gas passer still doesn't count as being wet
In general, I would say, Scout. To play him at his best requires mastery of both movement and aim and the ability to do both at the same time. I would also give honorable mention to spy, due to the fact that you have to learn a completely different skill set compared to the rest of the classes. I'm also very hesitant to say soldier because while rocket jumping allows for a huge range of skill expression, very little aim is required at a base level.
>knock-off wrangler with lifesteal for no reason
We Splatoon now
Splat Fortress was a cool mod, but Nintendo were fucking gays that took it down before it got finished.
Pretty much everything but some kotaku article and pic related are the only traces of it left online
I was very annoyed and sad when i coldnt find anything on this
and was it really nintendo or just the devs being fags?
Nintendo forced them to take it down, yeah. Around that time they were super anal about fan mods. I tried to comb through wayback to see if anything could be salvaged but came up with nothing. I vaguely remember playing on the alpha server but it had potential. Given enough time It would've been a nice TF2 twist like TF2ware and TF2 Smash Bros were.
It's crazy how attentive Nintendo can be at times.
Really it just demonstrates that all those fan boys that defend Nintendo's bad decisions with "they just don't know what the fans want."
Dude, they detected and shutdown a fan made mod in TF2. An ancient western FPS computer game. They have eyes fucking everywhere. They know what's going on.
>before it got finished.
>mentioning anything on a nintendo-related mod/fangame BEFORE it's finished so they can get C&D'd
when will they learn? at this point it's on purpose
>They thought this was okay
They don't playtest a goddamned thing they put out and boy does it show.
>Civilian has microphone that forces people into melee
>doesn't work on revved heavies
>works on ubered medics
>civilian has guns period
>they're all counted as melee weapons because his code is jank and because melees are "close-range guns" as far as the code cares anyways
That's a really cool idea but good God whoever thought that they should lifesteal from tagged enemies needs beaten
Yeah without the lifesteal I think it could legitimately be added to the game.
It'd be fun to have your sentry out in the open, and run up to enemies, spray them then shoot them with the shotgun.
now show it with a minisentry
ATTENTION ANONS ITT
POST MORE CUSTOM WEAPON IDEAS YOU LIKE NOW!!!
Always been a big fan of the idea of either buffing the Liberty Launcher to give more vertical knockback or a custom launcher that has more vertical knockback to combo with the Reserve Shooter.
Custom weapons are shit.
The ones I made.
>The Sixth Sense
I mean you can kinda do that by fucking with the medic autocall options. Bind a key to set it to max health so you can see where everyone is, bind another key to set the autocall back to your original setting, and there you go, you can see(ish) through walls.
>"it's the wrangler but balanced"
what, this is op as fuck
Fags that argue about balance in a game like this are the reason online shooters are no longer fun
It's not a tournament just play the fucking game
Why is nobody talking about our favorite doctor?
because he's easy
I think we can mostly agree on the following -
Doc has little room for technical skill but needs a lot of wisdom and game sense - anyone can heal and Uber, but how many can do it right? How many Medics make the mistake of following the brightest unusual wearing Demoman into certain doom instead of recognizing that he should break off and living another few minutes? Or save their Uber for the exact second the enemy is up everyone’s ass and save the round?
The Crossbow is nice to use and gives a bit more depth like Flare Pyros but isn’t strictly necessary or that hard to learn compared to common sense
Scout > Sniper > Spy > Pyro > Engi > Demo > Soldier > Heavy > Medic
how the FUCK do you do that like in your webm?
it's the heavy dab taunt made to get more zoomers into the game. they even added the zoomer haircut for scout.
You press the dab button, next to the floss button
I exclusively play Scout so I have no opinion on the skill required for other classes.
chance we get some decent cosmetics AND maps for next week scream fortress?
>cool new gas mask for pyro never ever
can't wait for more furfag bullshit
The only Pyro hat you need is the Seared Sorcerer, painted Cream Spirit for the proper hat color.
Yeah because abusing bad and broken hitboxes is a skill that should be rewarded. I have gotten facestabed more times then backstabbed.
t. got matador'd
I'm pretty sure everybody has the wrong opinion on Pyro
There is no right opinion to have about Pyro.
>take enemy teleporter
>somehow telefragging the enemy engineer on the other side
Spy takes the most skill because you have to try and make an inherently deception-based class work in a game that so heavily favors head-on fights that Spy is legitimately not viable in some setups. Being a good Spy does also entail knowing when to switch off from Spy and play something else, usually when the enemy team is so paranoid that you *can't* get a backstab.
Play it like Metal Gear Solid with smarter WHOSE FOOTPRINTS ARE THESE? NPCs and Spy gets a lot easier.
>set sticky trap
>see uber heavy
>detonate them in panic
>he flies right into my team
This but for separating the medic from his uber target
Probably spy since he has to work twice as hard for half the results. Otherwise scout since he dies if you breathe on him.
Overall the most skillful classes are Scout, Sniper, and Demoman.
Did they already updated the game with the merasmissions?
Valve don't do updates on weekends afaik
Soldier > Medic > Demo > Heavy > Scout > Engineer > Spy > Pyro > Sniper
probably scout. you need good movement, good aim, and you need to have the game sense to run away from an unfavorable fight. also medic if you have a shit team
The other day on upward I met this spy who was jumping around and stabbing anyone in his bubble
Do you think a TF2 battle ryoale would work?
No. An Open Fortress BR probably would maybe I don't know
why work in open fortress and not tf2?
Open Fortress has generic goons with general stats and hitboxes
why would tf2 with its calsses not work?
How would finding weapons work if they're class restricted?
How do non-lethal items like bonk or mad milk work? And the Grordbort weapons like the Cow Mangler? There's a lot more concerns but those were what immediately came to mind. Open Fortress goons can use any weapon and have uniform stats/hitboxes.
dont class restrict weapons
not all items have to be included in this mode/game
If any class could get any weapon, everyone would play scout because speed is king.
>scout with a rocket launcher and the banana
Theyve already done this shit. What ends up happening is scout+phlog+ gunslinger+banner. You end up with a 150hp crit flame scout with speed boost. Cancer
Because sniper would dominate the game mode
The map would be like a TF2 map
Not a wide open feild like other battle royale games
Think like Hydro turned into a br map
That's just Arena mode without teams, no?
Soldier and Demo take the least. Sniper would follow.
Spy takes the most.
Haven't played in a long time (2015), where does everyone do their cosmetic trading nowadays, are trade.tf or scrap.tf still the go-tos?
Still are, yeah.
Scrap.tf is still good for instant trades or trading weapons for metal or buying a quick taunt or similar. Trade.tf I've never personally used but it looks like it's alright. Backpack.tf is the only one you should really avoid like the plague because that's a "curated list" of "confirmed good sellers" and you're not actually buying from anybody in The Community, you're buying from some Scrap.tf garden gnomes.
Snipers would be broken in a hypothetical TF2 br since they're normally ballistic weapons and not hitscan like TF2.
Extreme strafing and mindgaming required with good aim makes him one of the most difficult classes to play, but overpowered when handed to an able player. Learning how not to get shut down on sightline maps is a huge obstacle for him
Fucking joke. It is so ridiculously easy to topscore as Soldier it isn't even funny, coming from a Soldier main. You don't need to be able to beat a T6 to use rocket jumping effectively, either. Easiest class in the game
Has potential for a high level play with combos, but they've been crippled pretty badly. Otherwise you already know what W+M1 is, no explanation needed.
Pipes can be challenging to hit, otherwise same classification with Soldier. Most powerful DM class hands down
Walking sentry gun. If you can track and strafe, you can play HWG.
Memorize sentry spots and building rollouts, basic DM and sentry jumping. Meh
Most of the high skill challenges with Über only come into play with sixes. Otherwise, hit your crossbows and don't be a dumbass pushing and you should be fine. You are the other classes bitch.
Same classification as HWG, but now with headshots.
Trickstabs, map awareness and mindgaming put him right under Scout IMO. Such an easy class to kill but can be effective with good movement and disguise practice. Broken with Kunai
Also, a lot of the criticism towards Soldier & Demo boils away in higher levels of gameplay because of nuance. I'm grading it as if you were in a pub match
>This class is considered high skill by the community when the main gameplay mechanic is to stand still and hover your mouse in the general direction of the enemy team to get kills
Definitely Scout, your movement must be immaculate and your aim has to be on point to hit your meat shots.
I prefer Soldier because I am a quake boomer and I like rocket jumping for no reason
Everyone sleeps on how good the default revolver is.
If you see anyone under 22 hp he is dead, any range.
You also get to pick your battles as a spy.
So just shoot that 60 hp soldier who is retreating, you get the first hit and he won't react in time to do anything before you get in the second.
Sure its good but consider this. I could also use the diamondback and kill a heavy and wipeout his medic as well and kill any soldier under 50 health. Which stock revolver can in theory do in practice its a lot less likely.
moron you can kill anyone under 100 hp regardless of range with the diamond. I shoot my sapped buildings too much to use it properly. Shooting a sapped teleporter is peak anti engie play. They can't save it.
Yes. I was saying without the crit charge. With the crit charge its 102 damage without it it does like 45 per shot most of the time. The point I am making is the reason stock gets slept on is 12 damage difference from stock to diamondback/letranger is not seen as worth it half the time.
It is worth it.
I still use the abby too because most of my engagements take place at close range.
Being able to unleash rocket damage without needing a crit is nice, as I've said before I can't give up shooting buildings.
>can't find a normal trickster's turnout for sale anywhere
I'm surprised, this is an old item.
there's some on backpack.tf if you can deal with the absolute shoah of buying from an """approved seller""", around 5.5 ref
Well I had a fuckton of ref lying around plus a lot of dupe weapons that I got a ton of ref with, so I went ahead and let myself get garden gnomeed, thanks for suggesting it.
>Requires aim, high IQ positioning, mindgames and teamwork with no room for error
>Requires some basic dodging and aim and knowing when to run towards a health pack
>Requires good positioning and some mindgames
>Requires good positioning
>Requires being able to use a mouse
>Randomizer Arena will never come back
>No spiritual successors being hosted either
Why even bother playing this game anymore.
itt: less than 10k hourlets
demoman. have a nice day and go back to /vg/ + digg where you belong, black man is the hardest class in the game and you literally can't state otherwise.
all I need to say is
and you automatically lose, all of you are shitters, mouth breathing, smooth brained, knuckle dragging, long sentence typing, pink cosmetic wearing, meme spouting, buzz word throwing, mechanically gimped, low testosterone, transvestite loving, shit players who don't play games.
>MUH MUH AFK
cope and shit.
sticky jumping is not even that important
>not default or useable ingame
cope, you wouldn't get past level 1 you skill-let
i don't care
I could hear the
God, I want to go fast
is that an actual reference to proto-r3ddit in [current year] in which case holy shit that's a blast from the past or is it just some jargon nobody fucking knows?
>13k hours and not pro
>seething on Ganker instead
LOL you fucking suck. post your rgl profile
>not default or useable ingame
cope, you wouldn't get past level 1 you skill-let
time waster not applicable in game
>not applicable ingame
just like your skills
just like how you don't care about being a fucking dogshit player, holy fuck go back to /vg/, ms queen of sissies
applicable in my game ;^)
you can crawl back to you shithole now
>saying that when he clearly participates with /tf2vg/ cattle and probably party Gankeran trannies
I actually feel sorry for you and if you understood why you'd probably not be in this scum filled place, yet you are, I'm sorry you won't ever be able to.
so how do you feel when a sniper just domes you as you prance in the air with a market gardener
>13k hours in-game
>spends it on meme gamemodes
Scout. Sniper only needs to worry about aiming, scout needs to master both aiming and movement.
whichever class i'm currently playing
I'm not sure how well people really understand the game here when they think combo Pyro is optimal. Actual optimal play with the Pyro is just to run the shotgun and use the flamethrower as a reflect tool or niche sentry destroyer since the flamethrower is so unreliable because it's not lag compensated. You're able to shit out 90 damage to 70 damage shots at midrange and melt people if you can aim compared to flares where you have to light them on fire and then deal with a longer reload time for 90 damage at a way slower rate. At this point you're essentially just playing a slower Scout that can reflect. I understand that most people that play Pyro probably do so to avoid aiming so unless you play Scout a lot you'll probably never figure it out.
i am appalled. Ganker hates soldier and is holding pyro higher or seems to be kissing up to him. wtf has the world come to. it should be common knowledge that soldier is a based class for fraggers and pyro and demokight are made for trannies and other sexual degenerates.
t. soldier and spy main
They dont play tf2
>you're on your way to HARVEST
>you're on your way to UPWARD
>uncheck both of those
>queue doesn't pop
What is it with those two maps that people love so much?
Large variety of play space, cramped indoors and open outdoors. Cliffs. Every class has an opportunity to excel at different stages.
Tiny but still open enough to do silly soldier/demo movement. DM central. Sniper haven.
casual matchmaking players are all sniper players so they only want to play stupid sniper maps
TF2 is dead, it's time to move on to the superior multiplayer Valve shooter AKA Left 4 Dead 2
>Fully mod supported with a large amount to choose from
>Consistent playerbase that isn't filled with bots
>No garden gnome cosmetics, if you want to change the appearance of someone you download a mod, no transactions required
>A well programmed game director ensures that almost every game you play is different than the last, promoting replayability
>even if you get bored of playing the same campaign maps all the time, there are plenty of great custom maps to choose from
>has one of the most advanced gore systems in a vidya
>Versus still makes gays and shitters seethe to this day
when will you stop posting this meme literally all i play is l4d2 and tf2 with mordhau and garry's mod inbetween. in my opinion there are no better games.
>two limescouts on enemy team
>switch to natascha
>both of them leave
why is it always lime?
loud, obnoxious, attention-grabbing, outside of TF2's color palette
Come on Wheel, Merasmus needs this.
IT IS NOT
an exact science
For me it's Redmond and Blutarch shitposting at each other in Helltower
I always play whatever gives me access to fire. For Team Fortress 2 it is the Pyro and for Titanfall 2 it is Scorch, for example. Simple as.
spy is the hardest because you have to realize when you're no longer helping your team and are just deadweight. but also the class has a wide range of skills required to play effectively like map knowledge or how people tend to behave.
scout or soldier are also probably up there with high skill ceilings and not as much room for error as some classes. Snipers can be skilled, but their skills outside of aim don't get challenged as much in terms of movement and positioning.
>Why yes I do only play 24/7 Skial 2fort
>soldiers that turtle for 20+ minutes in VSH
>demos that turtle for 20+ minutes in VSH
>engineers that think they can turtle for 20+ minutes in VSH and can't because you can rage stun them more consistently than twitchy exploders
>soldiers and demos that are halfway across the map and detonating into a medkit the very instant you have your crosshair on them from 50 feet away
>VSH servers that disable the fucking point, something put there to discourage and shut down turtling in Arena
that turtle for 20+ minutes in VSH
this is actual cancer
>everyone else is dead
>it's ONE soldier and a hale at half health playing peek-a-boo for 20 minutes
>soldier barely attacks and hale can barely get close to them
literally the single most boring fucking thing you can ever watch
I take special glee in capping the point when a Soldier is going to do that, or when a Spy is doing the same with his infinite DR charges. They always cry in chat and I always type back something along the lines of "I'm not waiting an hour for you to decide you want to fight"
It's worse because Soldier is very capable of fighting back with all-crits at that low point in the match but he still won't because the thought of anything but a full-HP victory makes his scalp itch.
>I'm hale and the only two gays left are a gay DR spy who keeps running in circles and a gay Sniper who keeps climbing away with his kukri and running in circles
>go stand on the point so they can't run
>somehow I'm supposedly the coward for doing this
I hate these fucking morons who think it's okay to waste 10 minutes of 30 other people's time per round
>gay dr spy keeps running and doing chip damage for 10 minutes
>stand on point
>very easily cap since he won't actually come close
>chat is spammed with "BAD HALE BAD HALE BAD HALE COWARD UR A BITCH"
You have to be absurdly good to not be compelely useless to your team, and even then a good spy is easily outclassed by an amateur scout/sniper.
It's why Spy mains are so annoying.
They talk about their skill like it's some sort of refined martial art, while everyone else just knows they wasted 9000 hours learning a class of zero value.
tf2 is made to be fun y’know
Spy mains are retarded by default because they think they can "main" a situational support class
The real Spy players play him when he's needed
TF2 doesn't take skill.
Demo, two primaries means double the skill.
demoman. and literally all of his unlocks are self imposed challenge gimp weapons, except for the tard path of the demoknight.
I like the quicky in some situations, being able to clear traps and catch fleeing targets is nice.
Iron bomber is neat, I prefer the stock launcher.
Iron's a great sidegrade, I feel Quickiebomb Launcher is also a sidegrade but if you're mainly rolling an offensive demo then it's an upgrade. Pretty much all his melees cater to Demoknight but Eyelander without shield can make for some sneaky survivability upgrades if you get a couple heads, and Skullcutter crits hurt like an absolute motherfucker
The problem with the Scottish resistance is that it is very easy to clear areas of traps.
Being able to have multi traps sounds nice but requires too much setup and babying to use effectively.
he never mentioned the scottish resistance take your meds
Yeah being able to lay stickies across half the map sounds fun until you're actually trying it. In actual practice it's useful for guarding a split path or making one MASSIVE sticky trap in stupid places you can easily keep an eye on (like the floor below the rafter from spawn in 2fort). It shines most in MvM where you're doing both those things fairly regularly as a Demo.
Iron Bomber is a viable alternative to Grenade Launcher, even after its hitbox finally got fixed
Loose canon is hard to use, but god damn is it satisfying to land. Nothing like one hitting a light class or denying an uber with it.
>it's another "Ganker thinks raw aim is the only metric by which skill is defined in tf2" episode
kek, stop basing what you think takes skill or not based on your 24 man spamfest clusterfucks
t. engie main that goes 2-27
It’s definitely Scout.
>Good Spies are a terror but all it takes is one good player aware of them to slowly end their reign of terror
>Good Snipers that aren’t cheaters can be overwhelmed by strategic flanks pushing at the same time as an attack
>Good Scouts are nightmare material that can materialize INSIDE your push, consume the soul of your medic, and dematerialize before you even realize what happened.
A high level Scout is the true form of the devil basically
Demo if you're playing against a good team that won't just clump up in chokepoints, forcing you to actually aim.
In casual medic would be the hardest I guess? Sure the healing part is easy, but you'll have zero protection or reliable pockets.
Could a full melee class work in TF2? I mean an entirely new class, not something like demoknight.
Just make the demoknight his own class.
But it would just be demoknight
That's how they designed their melee only class
demeoknight already exists. I want to see how a character with dashes could work in a tf2 game
Literally Spy because it takes an insane level of patience to keep playing this character that objectively sucks. If you're against a team that has a shadow of a clue how to play, then they're probably checking Spies at a rate greater than zero, which means your whole plan is at great risk of falling apart at any moment. And if their team has a Pyro at all, you should just switch characters.
Playing Spy isn't hard per se, but it sure does take a lot of mental fortitude and patience to play him when you know you've got about a 90% chance of getting pwned before you stab that guy you're after.
How do I have fun in TF2 again without mods. It's been maybe 4 or 5 years since I played TF2 frequently and the last time I tried to play, like 8 months ago, it was so incredibly dull because of the new matchmaking system.
How would a new class with a rocket launcher, shotgun and melee weapon work in TF2?
And don't say soldier already exists
High risk, high reward.
If you don't know how to move optimally you'll get btfo.
High skill ceiling, undermined by being a W+M1 retard
Regular Demo requires a decent amount of game knowledge, Demoknights are Soldier tier retards
Deceptively skill intense
Most of the skill is optimizing building placements
Mostly at the mercy of your team. If your team is competent you're basically afk but if you're playing with randoms you will be in for a hard game.
Mechanically intense, not much else.
Everybody with more than 20 minutes in the game spychecks so unless you're unironically 200 iq at mindgames good luck
>High skill ceiling, undermined by being a W+M1 retard
> Soldier main
Probably use Black Box too
>Deceptively skill intense
He's displayed as the retard class that requires no skill but he has shit range, shit mobility and questionable sustain
Under the right circumstances and playing around the team he is a menace but somebody playing TF2 for the first time will get absolutely obliterated compared to classes like Soldier or Sniper that are much more straightfoward to play.
He's entirely dependent upon positioning which requires a certain level of game sense and map knowledge, sure
I don't know if that necessarily qualifies as skill intense because that also applies to every other class but they have to aim
I definitely don't think he requires more skill than soldier for example
>hmm this class that can outrun every other class in the game, yes this is the one that is high skill and high risk
who are you quoting
Just ctrl+F "scout"
back when the game first launched, the Heavy was considered a braindead OP class before people got used to them and how to deal with them.
as the game went on and people got better at it, they became the worst class for how many weaknesses they present, I would say the Heavy has the lowest skill floor, and has the hardest time retaining a competitive edge, in this case, you might be able to say it takes the most skill to be an effective heavy in this day and age.
The only time I remember heavy being considered OP was when he received that spin buff, along with GRU and Tomislav. Considering he got restricted to one per team in competitive as a result there was probably some credibility to that.
Ah yes, tommy, sandwich (floor hp pack), and GRU.
>he doesn't remember Launch Tomislav spinning up 80% faster and pairing that with KGB crits
Spy's requirements for an instant kill
>is at risk of getting caught making his way to the backlines, is at risk of getting caught every step behind you, is at the mercy of a player flicking their camera behind them for just a split second
Sniper's requirements for an instant kill
>click head lol
Sniper's requirements for an instant kill
>is at risk of getting caught singled out in the backlines, is at risk of getting sneaked up on when scoped, is at the mercy of a player flicking their WASD for just a split second
Spy's requirements for an instant kill
>click back lol
Nah now you're just reaching.
Reach deez nuts lmfaoo
>your team has 4 snipers
>their team only has 1
>their is way better and the 4 you have don't even bother trying to counter-snipe him
>your team is (You) with a couple thousand hours, two or three half decent players with <500hrs, and a bunch of fresh install baboons
>their team is a six stack of some gays from a high level comp team, all playing their main btw, probably using voice chat as well
Volvo is never bringing back team scrambling, are they
I just leave the match and force an autobalance if I'm no longer having fun. Plenty of other matches to be had.
There's another timeline out there where TF2 looked like this
Nothing about the TF2 in this universe would have existed. This game probably would've been forgotten after two-three years.
>TF2 is just CS:S with classes
>Battlefield Heroes, Paladins, Overwatch and all the other ripoffs never exist
Neither of the 2 prototypes even resemble anything similar to TFC in any way. Seems like Valve were trying to make a WW2 game or HL2:DM Source with aliens reskinned, then realized they should just actually make a fucking TFC with a new style.
Kind of a weird case where rehashing the game with a drastically new art style works out. Arguably neutral reception within the Zelda series, straight flop with Nidhogg 2.
Heavy. It takes a lot of skill and determination to stop from killing yourself out of boredom.
spy. because I like it
post halloween ones
Demo mains calculating y=mx+b so they can angle their pipes perfectly and miss by 2 yards
Soldier and Demo since they have the most mobility options. Beyond that, their playstyles are "shoot at the feet for splash damage/spam stickies and pills"
I've been being le epic griefing troll in casual lately, building teletraps in Frontier and Mossrock. Always good for a laugh
we are in an age where Ganker thinks pyro takes more skill then soldier. then they site some aim assist so miniscule that nobody even fucking noticed for 15 years and think thats comparable or worse than the W+M1 a trained chimp could do. i topped as pyro every time when doing his contracts way back. even if soldier is a little nooby in some ways theres still many ways to play him that take skill.
You can use that exact same sentence for every fucking class. Especially pyro.
>even if pyro is a little nooby in some ways theres still many ways to play him that take skill.
Vinesauce has been assigned to BLU team
Vinesauce (1) has been assigned to RED team
*holds tab and looks for the bot avatar*
>enemy team doesn't kick their's
ABANDON SERVER, LADS
>Anon E. Moose (Voice): No
>Anon E. Moose: you stupid cunts, enjoy your bots
>Anon E. Moose has left the game (Client disconnect)
many such cases
Why do they always take a couple minutes to actually select Sniper and join the game proper?
Feign being a human player arriving late, so they're not insta-kicked.
listen up eggheads
most skilled to least skilled:
speed, control and precision with very little HP
tactics, precision and general finesse with very little JP
need to pull off consistent headshots to be not a total waste of space. lots of accuracy needed
few are capable of fully wielding demos full DPS
multiple mechanics to master
only queers try to play medic as an offensive class. this class is mostly just healing
need some aim. not much else to be good at. can easily rack up 5 kills in one life
just strategy. not much else in terms of skill though there are some things you can do. he is a net positive to his team no one hates him
the chud class. if you want to feel good about yourself while having no skill then play demoknight. most encounters are just W+M1+M2. About as complex as a basic combo in mortal kombat
class so easy you would think it was made with the disabled in mind. there are things you can master though not many. Not that you need to master as mindless W+M1ing will either make you win most encounters or at the very least send your opponent running in the opposite direction for health.
>look at the bottom of the list
stop reading there
anon has been trying very hard to post retarded bait for some time now but nobody took it, so he had to double down, please be nice to him
>skill rating from someone who thinks W+M1 is an effective tactic
>skill rating from someone who thinks W+M1 is an effective tactic
post sexuality now
I'm actually pretty happy with the Axtinguisher in its current state, I feel it enables the old puff-and-sting playstyle without being completely and retardedly broken in Pyro's favor as "free crits on burning targets" used to be. It's now a nice sidegrade instead of a dead-lock for his melee slot. And if you're quick (Degreaser helps) you can even score a fire crit on another Pyro.
you literally just had to shoot at the pyro
current axt and its puny damage is underwhelming, you can't kill shit with it. i'd rather use my flare gun instead.
"Shoot at them" is every weapon's counter, genius.
Why do pyromorons think m1-q-m1 is the pinnacle of skill
Hey bitch. That's m1-m2-q-m1. Vewy intensive combo.
you also have to aim your flaregun and get a direct hit. compared to soldier where you can get the same dps by pressing m1 in the vague direction of the enemy
To be fair they unironically have one of the hardest techniques in the game to do with rocket reflect jumps.
About as useful as fucking short circuit jumping
Precisely, the fact you've got to hunt for situations where it's even useful to do adds to how much of a challenge it is.
ok let me summarize soldier
>flail mouse downwards
And soldiers pretend their class is the pinnacle of skill too yes.
Am I experiencing a Mandolin Effect or did this set used to actually have an effect like decapitating people on headshots?
You're thinking of the Hitman's Heatmaker which does decapitate enemies on a headshot-kill.
Why do soldierfags think m1 is the pinnacle of skill
Soldiers need to calculate aim and trigonometry to get airshots.
>LUL WALK UP TO ENEMY PRESS M1 Q M1
>not a thing pyro can do with flare gun
>not a thing pyro can do with LITERALLY THE SAME PROJECTILE soldier uses via reflect
>how to hit airshots:
>wait for enemy to fall down, then click at them
> Calculate aim and trigonometry
There's a reason the direct shit is the least used primary by a landslide
>low skill class gets angry at other low skill class
Engineer (sometimes Medic)
I guess spy and scout.
And I say this with "what would take most skill to be 1 effective team member" in mind rather than which item set/map or whatever.
engibros won't pretend they're skillful (aside from chud dane), we just play engi because we can lazy fags and still be useful
I just get a kick out of being a cunt with minis
in a high skill enviroment its demo, without a hit scan gun and his weapons being sort of shit at close range you get rushed down by good players and explode with no counter play except thinking 5 steps ahead positioning yourself perfectly before this can even happen.
>b-b-b-b-but demo is le op
yeah, a little. hes definitely a great class but the reason he dominates shitters because they simply walk into sticky spam and play on maps that are 2 choke hallways like 2fort that give you no room to dodge or maneuver his aoe damage.
if you think he his overpowered with no way to outplay him that says far more about you than demo
He's not overpowered, he's just really easy to play.
spy since it's the most rewarding even though sniper is like a better spy and can counter any class with its different tools spy dies so much and it doesn't help this game doesn't have friendly fire, so spy checking is like a second nature reflex
neat how you can always instantly tell exactly where a tf2 screenshot was taken
Unironically Heavy (with no Medic pocket).
>biggest target with the slowest mobility, becomes almost immobile when firing
>have to rev your gun in advance, very vulnerable unrevved and revving
>have to accurately track your opponents' movement when they all move faster than you
>must have a good sense of priority as you can only shoot at one person/direction at a time
>said aim limitations also means you are highly prone to getting ganked and you must rely on your team to watch your back
>need proper positioning at all times or else you will be easily cornerpeeked/sniped/backstabbed
Heavy with no Medic on your team is just straight up not worth playing.
but I usually don't get pocketed anyway because I refuse to use my minigun
finally someone gets it
scout because you actually have to hit shots
spy because you have to use a little bit of your brain
Who is your favorite TF2 freak and why is it Christian Brutal Sniper?
when are we gonna get strange variants for jungle inferno weapons come on valve
Reminder: Valve took the most braindead class and made it even easier.
>soldierfag complaining that they can't just aim rockets at airblast blind spots now
That's not how it works in the game
Yes, we know. The Gunboats were added so long ago.
>can only do contracts in casual
>retards that want to T pose, hold the intel to prevent people from capping/playing/finishing the round
>maps are unlimited time
what the fuck was valve thinking, holy shit
They were morongays that wanted to finish off whatever community servers remained after Quickplay didn't kill them
scout gameplay revolves entirely around walking around and shooting the enemy
performance also goes up proportionally to how good you are at walking and shooting enemies, technically able to engage anything
low skill floor high skill ceiling
Idk but spy and sniper are the most luck based classes
spy was actually so fun to play
"obstruct vision with fire" is such a reach to try and devise an anti-sniper strategy and i have no idea why it's bundled under scout as well
>here is pyros 10 easy ways to kill people
Scout takes the most skill
Heavy takes the least skill
put dispenser here
heavy/medic/engi are almost pure positioning, just need the knowhow to back it up
pyro, demo and soldier require great timing to play well
snipers and spies are all transgender, how do you counter getting tapped by a sniper cross map besides 'lmao avoid sight lines" or get better at randomly checking behind you for spies.
Scout is undeniably the highest skill ceiling class and i'm not even a scout main
>get better at randomly checking behind you for spies
by turning around while you're going places
it's not like you have anything better to do
plus if you know there's a spy then spychecking should be a high priority when you're not fighting
all this thread has taught me is that you can rationalize literally any class to be the most skilled if you are willing to do mental gymnastics a bunch. Its a great revelation really. our reality is totally built upon complex lies. these fags could convince you that engineer takes the most skill
Scout, and it's not even close; the entire class lives or dies by the cleanliness of their movement and aim with no real way to compensate for a lack of either. People say Spy but it's less that he's hard to master and more that he's just shitty and his tools straight up don't work against competent players; if someone dies to a Spy, 90% of the time it's the fault of the person facing them and not due to anything spectacular on part of the Spy. People also say Sniper because he has to autistically hone a single skill, but he does so from one-sided safety and has less shit to manage than any other class by a massive margin.
durr not as hard as pyro
Random Class takes the most skill because you need to be good with all the classes to be consistently good with it
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