Yeah no, the new forms are as lazy as the older ones and now they take a slot in dex. I don't think we will ever get 100+ completely new Pokemon again.
>Confirmed open world that lets you tackle the story in whatever order you want >ACTUALLY updated models and textures for pokemon >Potentially carries over some features from PLA >Potentially 100+ new pokemon for the first time since gen 5 >So far there seem to be no moronic gimmicks
It could legitimately be the Kino that saved the series, we'll just have to wait and see
People that want the scaling never answer why when you tell them it just means you can beat the entire game skipping all trainers and having low leveled pokemon
Im for scaling but i also think its fine if the game doesn't have it. They could scale the game based on badge number and include a threshold for catchable pokemon as well as tweak spawns as you progress so that evolutions spawn more when you get more badges. I want it for the immersion aspect and i think it would be fun if everyones adventure is different in that way
If the levels don't scale there's still an effective optimal path to follow, which defeats the purpose of an open world. Why would I go out and explore if I'll effectively be gated by a monster 20 levels above me that I can't beat so I have to go back to an easier area regardless? I'll just keep taking the clear and obvious path of progression that puts me on the same scale as opponents in the area. At that point you've just made a hallway that you can TRY to skip through some points. But this is also Pokemon, so you'll need to hit all the points on the map eventually anyways to beat the game, so this really only adds meme value for going back to beat up the low level gym with your level 50+ pokemon that just beat the final gym.
The majority of open world games are also garbage and just think having a huge empty field is enough to make the game good and call it a day. Decent open world games usually implement some type of scaling, or do away with concepts like levels entirely. So that's really not a great argument.
>If the levels don't scale there's still an effective optimal path to follow, which defeats the purpose of an open world
Yeah, it's a failsafe for the type of kids who got filtered playing DP 16 years ago, anyone else can play the game as intended, the terminally in need of spoonfeeding can still play the game to get hooked on the product to CONSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM.
Please tell me you're not today years old learning Game Freak ensure no kid gets left behind these days.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I feel like you got lost somewhere moron-kun because you aren't making any sense whatsoever.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I think you did zoomie. Pokémon has never given a shit for making the game challenging for adults (it took them12 years to add a hard mode and even then, you needed to go through bullshit to unlock it so no kid could accidentally activate it) and since gen 5 have designed the games and routes specifically to ensure little people will be able to get their avatar from starting point to Champion battle. That extends to leaving a clear path of progression for the youngest kids to make sure they get to the final battle, instead of risking they outplay themselves by scaling too high pissing baout doing kiddy shit instead of "optimally progressing through thr gae to result in the greatest challenge".
Rule of thumb, you want Pokémon to care you exist again, an hero, see if you respawn in the developed world within the last 26 years.
There is literally always an optimal path. No development style can ever eliminate the ability of players to play efficiently, and if they can then there wouldn't be a game left. Speedrunning is literally the practice of finding the optimal path.
2 years ago
Anonymous
No shit sherlock. That won't stop moronic kids from being lost in areas way above their level, and it won't stop people with two braincells from figuring out to do things in a certain order either.
I think you did zoomie. Pokémon has never given a shit for making the game challenging for adults (it took them12 years to add a hard mode and even then, you needed to go through bullshit to unlock it so no kid could accidentally activate it) and since gen 5 have designed the games and routes specifically to ensure little people will be able to get their avatar from starting point to Champion battle. That extends to leaving a clear path of progression for the youngest kids to make sure they get to the final battle, instead of risking they outplay themselves by scaling too high pissing baout doing kiddy shit instead of "optimally progressing through thr gae to result in the greatest challenge".
Rule of thumb, you want Pokémon to care you exist again, an hero, see if you respawn in the developed world within the last 26 years.
I literally never brought up challenging adults, I was talking about design decisions that go against the statement of "open world". Also I guarantee I've been in this shithole of a franchise longer than you have unless you're Japanese.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>That won't stop moronic kids
Not a problem. >and it won't stop people with two braincells from figuring out
Not a problem.
2 years ago
Anonymous
So why bring it up in the first place.
2 years ago
Anonymous
You did.
2 years ago
Anonymous
No, I was responding to someone bringing up that this was a decision to stop it from happening. Have you just not followed the conversation?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Follow the reply chain. It's only like three posts, it's not hard. My first post was
There is literally always an optimal path. No development style can ever eliminate the ability of players to play efficiently, and if they can then there wouldn't be a game left. Speedrunning is literally the practice of finding the optimal path.
2 years ago
Anonymous
You know what, I fricked up there and was thinking of >50962991. That's on me. I still stand by the opinion that it feels it defeats the purpose of being open world to not bother with scaling at all.
I bought Red in my mid-teens before they started running the telly show in my country. I doubt you saw the games before Pikachu shocked Ash for sight gags so I shade that one on the whole.
I live in the States, we got it a year before bonglanders, and I was 5 when I got it on release. But leave it to a brit to think they're better for stupid reasons when they aren't.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>I still stand by the opinion that it feels it defeats the purpose of being open world to not bother with scaling at all
I'm saying even if you do account for it, it doesn't solve the problem you present. For example, Skyrim scales levels, but it's still best to go to Whiterun early so dragons start spawning. Contrary, Elden Ring does not scale to levels, but it's still best to start with Margit for rune bosses. Additionally, botw scales the world up, but people still prefer to hit the divine beast because they make exploration easier. There will always be an optimal path, avoiding that is impossible, and working against it is a waste of time.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I'm aware there's always optimal paths to follow in games, even arguably in linear games as long as there's any level of player choice. But there feels like a conflation here between "there is a best way and it makes things easier because it lets you explore more or get the most content fastest" and "picking the unoptimal path may as well be bashing your head against a wall". The former is fine and indeed unavoidable. The latter can be curbed with proper game design by either making the game linear or making major hurdles scale to the player's level.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Seeing as this is pokemon, it's luckily the former and not the latter. You can take on any gym if you have a fast mon with a SE coverage move, so there won't be any head bashing.
2 years ago
Anonymous
If you follow the intended path sure. If you don't, and gym leaders don't adjust their teams based on your number of badges, it is indeed bashing your head against a wall if you go against the intended path. Being fast and having SE coverage is fine if you're around their level, but drops off the bigger the difference is.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Nah, you just have to be faster than them. I could solo Wattson in Hoenn with a level 10 Diglett, thats just how pokemon works.
2 years ago
Anonymous
No you couldn't, because you can't catch Diglett in any version of Hoenn before Wattson. But pretending you traded you'd still run into problems. Diglett is fricked by Sonicboom, Quick Attack, and Magnet Bomb in ORAS and can't guarantee an OHKO even with Magnitude due to the level difference, and wouldn't outspeed everything either at level 10. Although man I had to check Wattson's team and it's embarrassing how they nerfed him in ORAS.
Thanks for confirming you didn't get into the games till after the funny cartoon on telly told you to buy things.
Does explain why you're malding about the games not offering a challenge for your ageing arse. They cared back then because they care about kids' opinion but you think they're obligated to continue to give a shit you're a thing, sad.
The fact that you got BTFO and immediately pivot to another point only shows that you know you lost. I've been into Pokemon longer than you, and you can't refute that. And I still never brought up challenging adults, so your pivot is moronic too. This is honestly sad.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>No you couldn't
Yeah, sure I could. You can trade one in, and Dig deals with all those counters while you one shot all of his team, especially the Magnemites. But all this pedantry is besides the point, the point is that you can safely wander off the path in an open world game and still beat unscaled gyms because of how the battle system works. Pokemon is and always has been an easy game.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Sorry kid, back in the late 90's, there was these things called "imports" where the operators of the shops would have gone to E3/similar and played/viewed games in the US, then bought a job lot to sell in home market (there was a whole ecosystem around them at one stage). I got Red on import, as it was the first new Game Boy game I'd seen in two years, before the rest of the country had been pozzed by the telly.
Nice assumption though.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Thanks for confirming you didn't get into the games till after the funny cartoon on telly told you to buy things.
Does explain why you're malding about the games not offering a challenge for your ageing arse. They cared back then because they care about kids' opinion but you think they're obligated to continue to give a shit you're a thing, sad.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I bought Red in my mid-teens before they started running the telly show in my country. I doubt you saw the games before Pikachu shocked Ash for sight gags so I shade that one on the whole.
>If the levels don't scale there's still an effective optimal path to follow, which defeats the purpose of an open world.
You haven't played a single other Open World game in your life you fricking moron. Even the best designed open worlds are designed with some sort of progression throughline in mind, even if they leave the greater order largely flexible and up to the player. Pokemon's a game that's very heavy on cheese-strats and counter-teaming anyways, so if someone really wanted it they could power through higher-leveled enemies with no effort. No one b***hed about Kanto letting you skip Gym Leaders to take on some underleveled or come back to one with a massive level advantage yourself (in fact, that's something that people have been wanting to come back) so I don't see what the problem it now.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Sure, make assumptions about my gaming habits because I know garbage when I see it. That makes you look real smart.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Sure, make assumptions about my gaming habits because I know garbage when I see it.
I'm making assumptions about your gaming habits because not only are you jumping to insane conclusions based off of nothing more than a vague descriptor that's far from the whole story (even SwSh had a form of scaling for the Wild Area based off of badge-count and not levels, for example), but you also had a take that fundamentally misunderstands what makes a good open world, acting as if an "optimal path" is the sole factor in determining the merit of the style in the first place. Once again, even the most "you can do whatever the frick you want" Open World games of the modern era like BoTW, RDR2, or Elden Ring have a logical, "intended" path tied to their respective progression systems, and the last criticism (of the many that exist, don't get me wrong) for any of those games is that their open worlds felt pointless or too restrictive.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Open World games of the modern era like BoTW, RDR2, or Elden Ring have a logical, "intended" path tied to their respective progression systems
NTA, but maybe you should use other games that have turn-based battles where the most important stat in determining who wins is the level each side has for your examples. Pokemon plays very differently than the games you brought up, so the complaints people may have will not be the same.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Smartest person ITT.
There's a huge difference between a game where skill can influence the outcome of the battle, and turn based.
Turn based is pure math and RNG. There's no actual action skill involved.
The only purpose open worlds have is to make every game they're in worse, so I don't care. A normal level progression with the option to venture beyond my means to find a particular item or pokemon is a compromise I'll take if the game has to be open world.
>m-m-m-m-muh grafix
funny how the gaming community seems to flip flop between graphics dont matter and IT HAS TO HAVE THE MOST REALISTIC GRAPHICS every couple of years
120-140 and also we know that there are only 9 or so Past/Future mons and Khu said there are relatively few Rfakes, so we're still probably getting around 100 totally new designs
keep in mind a portion of the new ones are "new forms" like regionals or megas just with a pokedex number, also the person who said this is a verified leaker
keep in mind a portion of the new ones are "new forms" like regionals or megas just with a pokedex number, also the person who said this is a verified leaker
How much of a verified leaker is this really? The pictures could still be an elaborate troll and Khu piggybacked on it. This could still be an unorganized farce, until we actually see something supporting this in a trailer.
>906-914 = starters >915-999 = new pokemon >1000-1006 = convergent pokémon >1007-1024 = past and future pokémon >1025-1028 = legendary quartet >1029-1030 = Koraidon and Miraidon
>140 new pokemon....
that means the designs are going to be hot trash.
it's the rule in pokemon, if many new pokemon = shitty design, if low amount = great design. This is true for every generation.
This really sounds too good to be true. I'm never one of those morons who always posts "looks like shit, so it must be real" in response to leaks, but I do manage my expectations. I haven't expected over 100 new pokemon for a long time. If this is true, this gen will be incredible.
only 2 regional forms
Past/Future forms and Convergent evolutions both count as new and we'll probably have 20-30 of them in total, which still leaves around 90-110 new mons that are not variations on old designs
>only Alola, Galar and Hisui have regional forms >Unova, Kalos don't. Paldea only gets two
So it seems that only island regions are isolated enough to get regional forms, huh?
Hisui is not an island region, it's Sinnoh. It has nothing to do with geography, and everything to do with the fact rhar every gen after they came up with the idea has had them. Remember, Alolan Exeggcutor is the actual one, the one we're used to is the regional form.
It's not. I mean, I guess if you consider the Americas to be an island in the real world, because they're surrounded by water. But no one calls them that.
You might as well say that there are no pokemon in Hisui because there's none in Hokaido. Based on an area in the real world is not the same as being identical to it. Unless you think that because Galar looks like a vertically inverted British Isles, that up on the map is south in the pokemon world? The pokemon world isn't a 1:1 with the real world.
2 years ago
Anonymous
OK, but Sinnoh is an island
2 years ago
Anonymous
Source? In game proof?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Even on the pokemon center tiny map it's connected to land
2 years ago
Anonymous
Pic related
There is nothing in any game that says its an island
2 years ago
Anonymous
It's really not, it also shows Sinnoh connected to a landmass as a peninsula, same as Hisui.
We know from kaka that there are very few past and future forms and convergent evolution forms so I think the amount of new mons is gonna be somewhere between 95 and a 110
>we can put 140 new ones in but we can’t put the old favourites back! Too much work! Small indie company prrease understandu!
Imagine defending this shit.
We are eventually going to hit a point where you can have the complete dex in pokemon go, but not in the actual games, and people will still defend this
People are setting themselves up for disappointment. These past/future forms will not be separate dex entries, but function like megas/gmaxes. We'll get maybe 2 dozen and then they'll disappear in gen 10. Put together that another 20-30 are going to be the regional fakes, we're looking at far less than 140.
Khu said to expect XY dex + megas, so we're going to be closer to 80-90 new + past/future forms. I'll happily be wrong but to expect 130-140 new mons when they've purposefully been doing smaller gens since 6 is setting yourself up for disappointment.
English isn't even your first language and you're talking to me about reading comprehension. You're gonna be flat out disappointed when you get 80 new mons while expecting 140.
Anon, there ARE going to be more than 80, as the new critters taking up dex spaces will be new pokémon (Digletteel could have markings like dig on its snout and have its eyes on the sides of its head, but it's an eel cosplaying diglett, not a regional diglett, thus not actually a redo of an existing design).
But that's the thing, people are too simple to entertain anything but "hurr, it's a new pokémon that looks like an existing one, so that means it HAS to look exactly like one of the older existing ones, reeeeee".
I mean not only that, even if you don't like the concept(and I do) there are going to be at least over 90 fully new mons since we know there aren't that many past/future or Convergent mons and we know 120 new mons total is the minimum
You're not even reading what I'm saying properly you dumb frick. You're expecting 140. What's going to happen is 80 Pokemon (new + fake regionals) and the rest will be forms through the new battle gimmick.
I don't know how the frick you're extrapolating that I'm saying that fake regionals =/= new pokemon. Khu said they occupy a rather large part of the new dex, which is what I'm taking into account.
.... I'm trying to process the autism here, what do you mean by fake? How is something in the game a fake?
2 years ago
Anonymous
>autism >commenting on leaks >doesn't even know what the leaks are
Who's the autistic one here?
2 years ago
Anonymous
>t. ESL moron
2 years ago
Anonymous
>t. UOL newbie
2 years ago
Anonymous
Are you only just now looking at leaks?
2 years ago
Anonymous
>autism >commenting on leaks >doesn't even know what the leaks are
Who's the autistic one here?
No, I'm not talking about fake leaks. He's saying part of the dex will be comprised of fakes. How can the actual dex on release have fakes in it?
2 years ago
Anonymous
They're pokemon that look like or appear to be other pokemon. Basically, the Galarian bird lore.
2 years ago
Anonymous
So regional forms? Just, phrased in a hyper autistic way?
2 years ago
Anonymous
>calls others autistic >can't comprehend the literal phrasing presented multiple times
Don't call others autistic when you're the autistic one.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Your secret code is so confusing that everyone who replied to me asking about it thought I was asking about fake leaks, and I had to clarify. Don't push your autism on me.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>No, I'm not talking about fake leaks.
You convince yourself people are incorrectly reading what you're saying, but you yourself are clueless. You didn't read what Kaka or Khu have said over the past month, then blame others because you need to be spoonfed. Go play with your fidget spinner.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I'm sorry that you can't follow a conversation.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Considering you cant remember a sentence you typed 3 minutes prior, I don't think that's something you should be saying.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Oh, I remember it fine. You're talking about something completely unrelated to anything I said, so I assumed you got lost in the conversation somehow. So I say again, I'm sorry you can't follow a conversation.
2 years ago
Anonymous
No, they're they're own pokemon, with their own entries.
The past and future forms are OP mons, the convergent ones are mons filling in different niches but appearing like existing mons. One example is a not diglett which is a pink eel.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Regional fakes is a term of Khu for the new Pokémon which look exactly the same as existing Pokémon, but an entirely new one.
Think of a hummingbird and a hummingbird moth.
Hummingbird is the existing Pokémon.
Hummingbird moth is the new one.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Oh, so very different from current regional forms then? Regional forms look very different from the originals. How would we tell the difference between a regional fake and the original? Are we sure these aren't just buffs/nerfs to the original and are actually a new mon that just looks the same?
I'm expecting 120 new designs anon. I don't make distinctions between "regionals, rip-offs and proto-evo forms". But leaks say 3 regionals and 9/8 ancient/future forms. That leaves 100 *new* (as in entirely undocumented until this Gen) pokémon, which is more than enough to send us over 1000 total species, which is what morons are sperging out about. They thought it was supposed to be significant.
They're pokemon that look like or appear to be other pokemon. Basically, the Galarian bird lore.
>They're pokemon that look like or appear to be other pokemon. Basically, the Galarian bird lore.
Huge if real. Sounds sort of cool, even if it is, as another Anon stated, "Regional Forms but phrased in a hyper autistic way". Would be nice to see the Galarian Bird Trio/Legendary Wings labeled or retconned as such, given that they are not actually related to Kanto's Legendary Birds. Only reminiscent of them.
FYI we don't know ow how many of these convergent mons there're, but they evolve.
The past/future ones do not. So it seems outside of thr two regional forms we have, convergent is the main 'form gimmick' this gen
Oh, looks like further discussions took place while I was typing my response. So they might be more differentiated than a standard Regional Form. Whatever the case, it's something new to look forward to.
FYI we don't know ow how many of these convergent mons there're, but they evolve.
The past/future ones do not. So it seems outside of thr two regional forms we have, convergent is the main 'form gimmick' this gen
Thank you for the further details! >Regional Forms and Evolutions (an alternate take on an existing species, inspired by the new region's ecosystem or real world culture) >Past/Future Forms (alternate forms of Pokemon from the distant past or far future, likely brought to the present as a result of Koraidon and Miraidon's influence in SV's region) >Convergent Forms and Evolutions (new Pokemon with similarities to existing species)
Forms and Evolutions (an alternate take on an existing species, inspired by the new region's ecosystem or real world culture)
Forms (alternate forms of Pokemon from the distant past or far future, likely brought to the present as a result of Koraidon and Miraidon's influence in SV's region)
Forms and Evolutions (new Pokemon with similarities to existing species)
I think this is a good summary
Oh NOW is when you fricking morons beg for more than 100+ mons? After talking SOOOO much shit about gen 5 and unironically praising gens 6-8 for having a pitiful 80+ amount? And btw your moronic cope mechanism doesnt automatically make it more than 100+ just because you have arbitrary definitions for what """"counts""""" as a dex slot. You morons deserve N O T H I N G
Gen 5 had a lot of mons and had more 'good designs' than gen 6. More quantity higher chances of better mons. Game freak has never gone for quality over quantity. They always deliver almost more or less the same quality with varing degrees of quantity.
also we have 8-9 past/future species and relatively few RFakes(according to Khu) so we probably have at least 100 fully new unrelated designs
>centro literally stealing Ganker guess posts
nope this was from Kaka
nope Kaka confirmed only 8-9 past/future forms
yes hes never posted a real leak all he does is repost shit hes a gay, all these twitter Black folk are exactly the same
>90 actualy real pokemon
>close to 1000
>30-50 ancient/future forms.
That's being hopeful
90 would actually be really fricking good given it's bigger than the last 3 gens
I for one, am looking forward to aurochs tauros
I call bullshit
If there is more than 100 actually new original species (forms don't count) I will be entirely pleased.
Yeah no, the new forms are as lazy as the older ones and now they take a slot in dex. I don't think we will ever get 100+ completely new Pokemon again.
Holy, dare I say, based? Could SV save Pokemon?
>Confirmed open world that lets you tackle the story in whatever order you want
>ACTUALLY updated models and textures for pokemon
>Potentially carries over some features from PLA
>Potentially 100+ new pokemon for the first time since gen 5
>So far there seem to be no moronic gimmicks
It could legitimately be the Kino that saved the series, we'll just have to wait and see
It's too bad the MCs look so bland and boring though.
the base look of the MC doesn't matter in a game with character customization
small price to pay
We know about the whole crystal gimmick which sounds really dumb
Also according to him the customization is literally just variants of the school clothes
Also
>Gym leaders and Pokemon look like hot garbage
But however
>Game took 60 hours to beat
>Also according to him the customization is literally just variants of the school clothes
No fricking wayy. How can GameFreak be so moronic
he meant face customization
You forgot the best part
>Gyms don't scale up depending on badge
In a fricking open world game
a majority of open world games don't scale, you gays need to play things besides pokemon romhacks
And a majority of open world games are dogshit. Interesting, huh?
You people think every game is dogshit let's be real here
That's right. What are you going to do, cry?
>Invalidates one's own words
>Acts smug about it
Lol based moron
Modern games are the definition of shit. Same for the tastes of modern day consumers.
People that want the scaling never answer why when you tell them it just means you can beat the entire game skipping all trainers and having low leveled pokemon
Im for scaling but i also think its fine if the game doesn't have it. They could scale the game based on badge number and include a threshold for catchable pokemon as well as tweak spawns as you progress so that evolutions spawn more when you get more badges. I want it for the immersion aspect and i think it would be fun if everyones adventure is different in that way
Kaka said there's only 3 routes to beat the game
when leaker says 'routes' do they mean route 101, 202, 303 etc. or do they mean there is a different 'story' path/route?
>a majority of open world games don't scale
Confirmed moron.
If the levels don't scale there's still an effective optimal path to follow, which defeats the purpose of an open world. Why would I go out and explore if I'll effectively be gated by a monster 20 levels above me that I can't beat so I have to go back to an easier area regardless? I'll just keep taking the clear and obvious path of progression that puts me on the same scale as opponents in the area. At that point you've just made a hallway that you can TRY to skip through some points. But this is also Pokemon, so you'll need to hit all the points on the map eventually anyways to beat the game, so this really only adds meme value for going back to beat up the low level gym with your level 50+ pokemon that just beat the final gym.
The majority of open world games are also garbage and just think having a huge empty field is enough to make the game good and call it a day. Decent open world games usually implement some type of scaling, or do away with concepts like levels entirely. So that's really not a great argument.
>If the levels don't scale there's still an effective optimal path to follow, which defeats the purpose of an open world
Yeah, it's a failsafe for the type of kids who got filtered playing DP 16 years ago, anyone else can play the game as intended, the terminally in need of spoonfeeding can still play the game to get hooked on the product to CONSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM.
Please tell me you're not today years old learning Game Freak ensure no kid gets left behind these days.
I feel like you got lost somewhere moron-kun because you aren't making any sense whatsoever.
I think you did zoomie. Pokémon has never given a shit for making the game challenging for adults (it took them12 years to add a hard mode and even then, you needed to go through bullshit to unlock it so no kid could accidentally activate it) and since gen 5 have designed the games and routes specifically to ensure little people will be able to get their avatar from starting point to Champion battle. That extends to leaving a clear path of progression for the youngest kids to make sure they get to the final battle, instead of risking they outplay themselves by scaling too high pissing baout doing kiddy shit instead of "optimally progressing through thr gae to result in the greatest challenge".
Rule of thumb, you want Pokémon to care you exist again, an hero, see if you respawn in the developed world within the last 26 years.
Boomergay, how are you?
There is literally always an optimal path. No development style can ever eliminate the ability of players to play efficiently, and if they can then there wouldn't be a game left. Speedrunning is literally the practice of finding the optimal path.
No shit sherlock. That won't stop moronic kids from being lost in areas way above their level, and it won't stop people with two braincells from figuring out to do things in a certain order either.
I literally never brought up challenging adults, I was talking about design decisions that go against the statement of "open world". Also I guarantee I've been in this shithole of a franchise longer than you have unless you're Japanese.
>That won't stop moronic kids
Not a problem.
>and it won't stop people with two braincells from figuring out
Not a problem.
So why bring it up in the first place.
You did.
No, I was responding to someone bringing up that this was a decision to stop it from happening. Have you just not followed the conversation?
Follow the reply chain. It's only like three posts, it's not hard. My first post was
You know what, I fricked up there and was thinking of >50962991. That's on me. I still stand by the opinion that it feels it defeats the purpose of being open world to not bother with scaling at all.
I live in the States, we got it a year before bonglanders, and I was 5 when I got it on release. But leave it to a brit to think they're better for stupid reasons when they aren't.
>I still stand by the opinion that it feels it defeats the purpose of being open world to not bother with scaling at all
I'm saying even if you do account for it, it doesn't solve the problem you present. For example, Skyrim scales levels, but it's still best to go to Whiterun early so dragons start spawning. Contrary, Elden Ring does not scale to levels, but it's still best to start with Margit for rune bosses. Additionally, botw scales the world up, but people still prefer to hit the divine beast because they make exploration easier. There will always be an optimal path, avoiding that is impossible, and working against it is a waste of time.
I'm aware there's always optimal paths to follow in games, even arguably in linear games as long as there's any level of player choice. But there feels like a conflation here between "there is a best way and it makes things easier because it lets you explore more or get the most content fastest" and "picking the unoptimal path may as well be bashing your head against a wall". The former is fine and indeed unavoidable. The latter can be curbed with proper game design by either making the game linear or making major hurdles scale to the player's level.
Seeing as this is pokemon, it's luckily the former and not the latter. You can take on any gym if you have a fast mon with a SE coverage move, so there won't be any head bashing.
If you follow the intended path sure. If you don't, and gym leaders don't adjust their teams based on your number of badges, it is indeed bashing your head against a wall if you go against the intended path. Being fast and having SE coverage is fine if you're around their level, but drops off the bigger the difference is.
Nah, you just have to be faster than them. I could solo Wattson in Hoenn with a level 10 Diglett, thats just how pokemon works.
No you couldn't, because you can't catch Diglett in any version of Hoenn before Wattson. But pretending you traded you'd still run into problems. Diglett is fricked by Sonicboom, Quick Attack, and Magnet Bomb in ORAS and can't guarantee an OHKO even with Magnitude due to the level difference, and wouldn't outspeed everything either at level 10. Although man I had to check Wattson's team and it's embarrassing how they nerfed him in ORAS.
The fact that you got BTFO and immediately pivot to another point only shows that you know you lost. I've been into Pokemon longer than you, and you can't refute that. And I still never brought up challenging adults, so your pivot is moronic too. This is honestly sad.
>No you couldn't
Yeah, sure I could. You can trade one in, and Dig deals with all those counters while you one shot all of his team, especially the Magnemites. But all this pedantry is besides the point, the point is that you can safely wander off the path in an open world game and still beat unscaled gyms because of how the battle system works. Pokemon is and always has been an easy game.
Sorry kid, back in the late 90's, there was these things called "imports" where the operators of the shops would have gone to E3/similar and played/viewed games in the US, then bought a job lot to sell in home market (there was a whole ecosystem around them at one stage). I got Red on import, as it was the first new Game Boy game I'd seen in two years, before the rest of the country had been pozzed by the telly.
Nice assumption though.
Thanks for confirming you didn't get into the games till after the funny cartoon on telly told you to buy things.
Does explain why you're malding about the games not offering a challenge for your ageing arse. They cared back then because they care about kids' opinion but you think they're obligated to continue to give a shit you're a thing, sad.
I bought Red in my mid-teens before they started running the telly show in my country. I doubt you saw the games before Pikachu shocked Ash for sight gags so I shade that one on the whole.
>If the levels don't scale there's still an effective optimal path to follow, which defeats the purpose of an open world.
You haven't played a single other Open World game in your life you fricking moron. Even the best designed open worlds are designed with some sort of progression throughline in mind, even if they leave the greater order largely flexible and up to the player. Pokemon's a game that's very heavy on cheese-strats and counter-teaming anyways, so if someone really wanted it they could power through higher-leveled enemies with no effort. No one b***hed about Kanto letting you skip Gym Leaders to take on some underleveled or come back to one with a massive level advantage yourself (in fact, that's something that people have been wanting to come back) so I don't see what the problem it now.
Sure, make assumptions about my gaming habits because I know garbage when I see it. That makes you look real smart.
>Sure, make assumptions about my gaming habits because I know garbage when I see it.
I'm making assumptions about your gaming habits because not only are you jumping to insane conclusions based off of nothing more than a vague descriptor that's far from the whole story (even SwSh had a form of scaling for the Wild Area based off of badge-count and not levels, for example), but you also had a take that fundamentally misunderstands what makes a good open world, acting as if an "optimal path" is the sole factor in determining the merit of the style in the first place. Once again, even the most "you can do whatever the frick you want" Open World games of the modern era like BoTW, RDR2, or Elden Ring have a logical, "intended" path tied to their respective progression systems, and the last criticism (of the many that exist, don't get me wrong) for any of those games is that their open worlds felt pointless or too restrictive.
>Open World games of the modern era like BoTW, RDR2, or Elden Ring have a logical, "intended" path tied to their respective progression systems
NTA, but maybe you should use other games that have turn-based battles where the most important stat in determining who wins is the level each side has for your examples. Pokemon plays very differently than the games you brought up, so the complaints people may have will not be the same.
Smartest person ITT.
There's a huge difference between a game where skill can influence the outcome of the battle, and turn based.
Turn based is pure math and RNG. There's no actual action skill involved.
The only purpose open worlds have is to make every game they're in worse, so I don't care. A normal level progression with the option to venture beyond my means to find a particular item or pokemon is a compromise I'll take if the game has to be open world.
>It could legitimately be the Kino that saved the series
PLA also had shit graphics and nobody with taste cared.
>and nobody with taste cared.
yeah because they didn't play that dumpster fire
>m-m-m-m-muh grafix
funny how the gaming community seems to flip flop between graphics dont matter and IT HAS TO HAVE THE MOST REALISTIC GRAPHICS every couple of years
Because more than two people play games, and shockingly, they don't always agree.
new spider confirmed by khu
new spider and 3 new dog mons, one of which is the ghost dog.
Also the old black lady gym leader is a rapper
I don't think he means literal dogs
>got around 70~90 max new mon in every games for a decade
>suddenly we get 140 new mon
Yeah sure
140 including the rfakes and forms
120-140 and also we know that there are only 9 or so Past/Future mons and Khu said there are relatively few Rfakes, so we're still probably getting around 100 totally new designs
It's still more than what we had since the gen 5
keep in mind a portion of the new ones are "new forms" like regionals or megas just with a pokedex number, also the person who said this is a verified leaker
but its not that large of a portion
How much of a verified leaker is this really? The pictures could still be an elaborate troll and Khu piggybacked on it. This could still be an unorganized farce, until we actually see something supporting this in a trailer.
At this rate, we won’t be getting a trailer
You are probably right. How is it that TPC managed to make the reveal schedule worse? Why not front load more trailers but with far less information?
9 past "forms'
9 future "forms"
9 RFs
93 brand new critters (including cross-gen evolutions)
For a total of 120. DLC could raise this number to 140 or close.
>906-914 = starters
>915-999 = new pokemon
>1000-1006 = convergent pokémon
>1007-1024 = past and future pokémon
>1025-1028 = legendary quartet
>1029-1030 = Koraidon and Miraidon
this could work, and its worst case scenario if we get the minimum number of the range, I think 100 new guys is possible
not including past/future mons or convergent mons
Bullshit
without dex fillers, starters, legendaries and gimmick forms there's gonna be like 20 new pokemon
Yeah, anon if we ignore all the new pokemon there's only gonna be 20. you're so smart.
shut the frick up joe
>thinking they will just casually pass 1000 pokemon
>thinking that the 1000th pokemon won't be an event mythical
theyve never carried about special dex numbers why would they now
Forms aren't new pokémon
>140 new pokemon....
that means the designs are going to be hot trash.
it's the rule in pokemon, if many new pokemon = shitty design, if low amount = great design. This is true for every generation.
galar
what about it
galar shit
had few new pokemon, all trash
It's the complete opposite but ok
That's a lot of potential porn.
Feels like we've been piggybacking off gen 7 porn for years this could be a whole new wave
How is it 120-140? They don't know the actual number?
Maybe it’s a number closer to 120, but they’re expecting more new Pokémon in DLC but aren’t definite on that total yet
Khu said it's like the same amount as Gen 6 new Pokémon but with Mega Evolutions also considered as new ones.
These people are all full of shit stop believing everything you read on twitter
Should've called it Pokemon Waifu version, seeing as how most new pokemon look like.
>regional recolors
try 50 new pokemon
>Fire James
>Suddenly decide to make more than 80 Pokemon
What did GF mean by this?
James was a moron who enjoyed ruining the games for people who actually cared
This really sounds too good to be true. I'm never one of those morons who always posts "looks like shit, so it must be real" in response to leaks, but I do manage my expectations. I haven't expected over 100 new pokemon for a long time. If this is true, this gen will be incredible.
paid post
Cringe.
Form changes and regional forms don't count as new numbers. Only cross-gen evolutions do.
This time it does though. There are two regional forms only
>This time it does though
Why are you offended by a fact?
What
only 2 regional forms
Past/Future forms and Convergent evolutions both count as new and we'll probably have 20-30 of them in total, which still leaves around 90-110 new mons that are not variations on old designs
Maybe that's why he said 120-140. Like, 120 if you don't count new forms, 140 if you do.
leak battle music
>only Alola, Galar and Hisui have regional forms
>Unova, Kalos don't. Paldea only gets two
So it seems that only island regions are isolated enough to get regional forms, huh?
Hisui is not an island region, it's Sinnoh. It has nothing to do with geography, and everything to do with the fact rhar every gen after they came up with the idea has had them. Remember, Alolan Exeggcutor is the actual one, the one we're used to is the regional form.
>Hisui is not an island region
OK I needed a laugh
It's not. I mean, I guess if you consider the Americas to be an island in the real world, because they're surrounded by water. But no one calls them that.
Hisui is based on Hokkaido, literally an island, and one smaller than Britain (Galar). Japan is an island nation. What drugs are you on, anon?
Don't you know that Australia is largest island in the world?
Sinnoh is as much an island as Kanto is.
On one hand technically correct, on the other hand; literally thousands of years in the past. That shit more than justifies it.
It's only about 100 years back, you drooling c**t. Play the fricking games.
>Hisui is not an island region
That is a peninsula, notice the land at the bottom. Again I say it's only an island if you consider all continents to be islands.
>connected to landmass
Not a single piece of ingame, promotional or tcg art shows it as an island
Compare it to a map of Hokkaido and say that again. Sinnoh/Hisui is intended to be an island.
You might as well say that there are no pokemon in Hisui because there's none in Hokaido. Based on an area in the real world is not the same as being identical to it. Unless you think that because Galar looks like a vertically inverted British Isles, that up on the map is south in the pokemon world? The pokemon world isn't a 1:1 with the real world.
OK, but Sinnoh is an island
Source? In game proof?
Even on the pokemon center tiny map it's connected to land
Pic related
There is nothing in any game that says its an island
It's really not, it also shows Sinnoh connected to a landmass as a peninsula, same as Hisui.
It isn't though, Hokkaido middle range cuts off whereas sinnoh never does
minus -95 new species, 45 regional forms, not bad.
We know from kaka that there are very few past and future forms and convergent evolution forms so I think the amount of new mons is gonna be somewhere between 95 and a 110
>we can put 140 new ones in but we can’t put the old favourites back! Too much work! Small indie company prrease understandu!
Imagine defending this shit.
We are eventually going to hit a point where you can have the complete dex in pokemon go, but not in the actual games, and people will still defend this
Joe Meriku still has a lot to say to defend this absurdity
>140 new mons
>no charizard
BROS....?1!!1
>implying CHARIZARD won't get a future and ancient form
Both khuck, centrol banking and the chinasiatic said he is not in.
People are setting themselves up for disappointment. These past/future forms will not be separate dex entries, but function like megas/gmaxes. We'll get maybe 2 dozen and then they'll disappear in gen 10. Put together that another 20-30 are going to be the regional fakes, we're looking at far less than 140.
Khu said to expect XY dex + megas, so we're going to be closer to 80-90 new + past/future forms. I'll happily be wrong but to expect 130-140 new mons when they've purposefully been doing smaller gens since 6 is setting yourself up for disappointment.
can you reading comprehend anything ?
English isn't even your first language and you're talking to me about reading comprehension. You're gonna be flat out disappointed when you get 80 new mons while expecting 140.
Anon, there ARE going to be more than 80, as the new critters taking up dex spaces will be new pokémon (Digletteel could have markings like dig on its snout and have its eyes on the sides of its head, but it's an eel cosplaying diglett, not a regional diglett, thus not actually a redo of an existing design).
But that's the thing, people are too simple to entertain anything but "hurr, it's a new pokémon that looks like an existing one, so that means it HAS to look exactly like one of the older existing ones, reeeeee".
I mean not only that, even if you don't like the concept(and I do) there are going to be at least over 90 fully new mons since we know there aren't that many past/future or Convergent mons and we know 120 new mons total is the minimum
You're not even reading what I'm saying properly you dumb frick. You're expecting 140. What's going to happen is 80 Pokemon (new + fake regionals) and the rest will be forms through the new battle gimmick.
I don't know how the frick you're extrapolating that I'm saying that fake regionals =/= new pokemon. Khu said they occupy a rather large part of the new dex, which is what I'm taking into account.
.... I'm trying to process the autism here, what do you mean by fake? How is something in the game a fake?
>autism
>commenting on leaks
>doesn't even know what the leaks are
Who's the autistic one here?
>t. ESL moron
>t. UOL newbie
Are you only just now looking at leaks?
No, I'm not talking about fake leaks. He's saying part of the dex will be comprised of fakes. How can the actual dex on release have fakes in it?
They're pokemon that look like or appear to be other pokemon. Basically, the Galarian bird lore.
So regional forms? Just, phrased in a hyper autistic way?
>calls others autistic
>can't comprehend the literal phrasing presented multiple times
Don't call others autistic when you're the autistic one.
Your secret code is so confusing that everyone who replied to me asking about it thought I was asking about fake leaks, and I had to clarify. Don't push your autism on me.
>No, I'm not talking about fake leaks.
You convince yourself people are incorrectly reading what you're saying, but you yourself are clueless. You didn't read what Kaka or Khu have said over the past month, then blame others because you need to be spoonfed. Go play with your fidget spinner.
I'm sorry that you can't follow a conversation.
Considering you cant remember a sentence you typed 3 minutes prior, I don't think that's something you should be saying.
Oh, I remember it fine. You're talking about something completely unrelated to anything I said, so I assumed you got lost in the conversation somehow. So I say again, I'm sorry you can't follow a conversation.
No, they're they're own pokemon, with their own entries.
The past and future forms are OP mons, the convergent ones are mons filling in different niches but appearing like existing mons. One example is a not diglett which is a pink eel.
Regional fakes is a term of Khu for the new Pokémon which look exactly the same as existing Pokémon, but an entirely new one.
Think of a hummingbird and a hummingbird moth.
Hummingbird is the existing Pokémon.
Hummingbird moth is the new one.
Oh, so very different from current regional forms then? Regional forms look very different from the originals. How would we tell the difference between a regional fake and the original? Are we sure these aren't just buffs/nerfs to the original and are actually a new mon that just looks the same?
I'm expecting 120 new designs anon. I don't make distinctions between "regionals, rip-offs and proto-evo forms". But leaks say 3 regionals and 9/8 ancient/future forms. That leaves 100 *new* (as in entirely undocumented until this Gen) pokémon, which is more than enough to send us over 1000 total species, which is what morons are sperging out about. They thought it was supposed to be significant.
What Khu means by new concept
I missed out. What are "RFakes"? "Regional Fakes"?
Call them convergent evolution, Khu said he fricked up.
Okay, "Convergent Evolutions" then. Sounds interesting. Thank you.
>They're pokemon that look like or appear to be other pokemon. Basically, the Galarian bird lore.
Huge if real. Sounds sort of cool, even if it is, as another Anon stated, "Regional Forms but phrased in a hyper autistic way". Would be nice to see the Galarian Bird Trio/Legendary Wings labeled or retconned as such, given that they are not actually related to Kanto's Legendary Birds. Only reminiscent of them.
FYI we don't know ow how many of these convergent mons there're, but they evolve.
The past/future ones do not. So it seems outside of thr two regional forms we have, convergent is the main 'form gimmick' this gen
Oh, looks like further discussions took place while I was typing my response. So they might be more differentiated than a standard Regional Form. Whatever the case, it's something new to look forward to.
Thank you for the further details!
>Regional Forms and Evolutions (an alternate take on an existing species, inspired by the new region's ecosystem or real world culture)
>Past/Future Forms (alternate forms of Pokemon from the distant past or far future, likely brought to the present as a result of Koraidon and Miraidon's influence in SV's region)
>Convergent Forms and Evolutions (new Pokemon with similarities to existing species)
Forms and Evolutions (an alternate take on an existing species, inspired by the new region's ecosystem or real world culture)
Forms (alternate forms of Pokemon from the distant past or far future, likely brought to the present as a result of Koraidon and Miraidon's influence in SV's region)
Forms and Evolutions (new Pokemon with similarities to existing species)
I think this is a good summary
it was khu fricking up and covering his ass, call them convergent evos like
said
This is the full in-game map, matching irl Hokkaido.
That's afan edit, moron
Oh NOW is when you fricking morons beg for more than 100+ mons? After talking SOOOO much shit about gen 5 and unironically praising gens 6-8 for having a pitiful 80+ amount? And btw your moronic cope mechanism doesnt automatically make it more than 100+ just because you have arbitrary definitions for what """"counts""""" as a dex slot. You morons deserve N O T H I N G
Gen 5 having an underwhelming dex has little to do with the number and Gen 8 had an underwhelming dex with less than 100 mons introduced. shut up.
Gen 5 had a lot of mons and had more 'good designs' than gen 6. More quantity higher chances of better mons. Game freak has never gone for quality over quantity. They always deliver almost more or less the same quality with varing degrees of quantity.
There are more than 2 people on /vp/.
>here's your 120 Pokémon bro
not enough compared the NFT mon called alcremie.
Finally bros, it took fricking three generations but we're coming back to the real form of Pokemon.
SV could be the first climb in quality after a consistent downgrades of quality started by 6th gen
Cringe.
Finally bros, it took fricking four generations but we're coming back to the real form of Pokemon.
SV could be the first climb in quality after a consistent downgrades of quality started by 5th gen
>still buying modern
considering gen 5 exists, the convergent mons are not an entirely new concept