>We have to confront a hard truth that few people seem to want to face about the Souls games, but here it is: the combat is nothing remarkable.
>In terms of actual complexity there's not much going on. There's not much depth, and that wouldn't be a problem, except the series has increasingly leaned on its action elements more and more as time has gone by.
>If you're a staunch defender of the series this is where you might be tempted to rattle off all the attack animations your favorite weapons has... It's true that there are differences in range and damage, but the effect on the enemy is usually identical. They lose some health, possibly suffer some hitstun which either lasts long enough to get another attack in or it doesn't, in which case you go back on the defensive until your next opening. Positioning is important, but that's about the extent of it.
>In terms of defensive options the series is a lot better, with the ability to block, parry, or dodge most regular attacks...Unfortunately, against bosses, parrying is often completely impossible and blocking is often ill-advised, which leaves you with rolling as your one and only defensive action. So prepare to roll again and again, and again and again and again. When you're not rolling you'll generally be getting 1-2 hits in with whatever weapon you choose, hits that usually provoke no response from the boss whatsoever making every weapon basically the same thing apart from whatever damage types and numbers it has.
>You go in, you learn the moveset. maybe you die a few times along the way, until you know the boss's moves like the back of your hand. Then you dodge past them, punish at the right times, and win the battle. It's perfectly serviceable gameplay but doing it 20x in one game is just excessive.
>I'm not saying you should be able to juggle Hollows or anything, but if the game is going to be so relentlessly focused on action then I have fewer reasons not to just play a better action game instead
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 Ape Out Shirt $21.68 |
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If I cared about some random gay's opinion I have just clicked on his
Wait a minute.
>Monster Hunter would be better if it was a linear boss rush game with no loot or upgradeable equipment
>Glorified cookie clicker garbage
People actually listen to this guy?
He's not wrong. You fight like 9 or 10 monsters ad-infinitum for over a hundred hours just to grind your stats up a few points
Yes, because the game design of Monster Hunter focuses on killing monsters just so that you can get items for incrementally better gear so that you can kill monsters. The item and gear farming through monster parts is monotonously boring and is a giant waste of time.
yeah but if they did that the japanese bugmen that play it after their 15 hour shift wouldn't be able to do it for 400 hours while pretending they're having fun
Hunter would be better if it was a linear boss rush game with no loot or upgradeable equipment
He's right, you know.
He said that HE would prefer that kind of game but that it would be shit for everyone else.
I don't understand why you're obsessed enough to watch hours of his streams and then constantly make out of context shitposts about them. I guess you're just a tremendous homosexual.
>tremendous homosexuals? on my Ganker? more likely than you think
I don't get this shit, like some of you say "he's right you know", but when I think of Monster Hunter's fantasy, and what I enjoy about the games, I know for a fact I would like them less if they didn't have some of the grinding aspect.
I'm VERY particular about grind too: generally grind isn't something I find fun unless I'm being actively challenged. Part of the fun of monhun for me isn't grinding endlessly for gear, but it IS fighting the monsters a few times over and learning them. The RPG elements are the reason you re-fight monsters, and I know for a fact less people would go on their own and refight monsters if there was no benefit to doing so.
Monster Hunter has the theming, mechanics, and flair to create that immersion of a hunter who kills beasts, gathers their flesh, and forges it into his strength. A gauntlet Sinner of Sacrifice style would be pretty boring. Rogue Likes already do this too, but they get old in their own way. They, too, use other mechanics like artifacts and weapons you get per-run to facilitate your engagement.
I prefer monhun's way of doing it bc it's more player centric, and you NEVER REALLY need to grind that much to move forward in the game.
I have ONLY ever grinded bosses for rare drops if it's for a sick weapon that looks amazing that I want. I don't really go out and try to make a ton of armor sets and builds, I just collect and make what I think is fun, and most of the time I have what I need already. Monhun isn't that grindy if you play like this and don't mind kitbashing your set a little if neeed be. Really it's all in the players hands, and when I have to refight a mon, it's fun bc I get to enjoy the fight for what it is and further my mastery.
It's an engaging loop with few leaks in cohesion.
So if he subjectively thinks a boss gauntlet would be better? sure, go play that, but I don't think those games really need something in between to shine. SotC as my case in point for that being done right.
Also RIP unintentional reddit spacing I rape redditors with a fork in hell
Play alien soldier, then you'll get it
Looks fun tbh, thanks for the rec
still, I think Matosis and many of his "flock" in this thread seem to put off their subjective ideas as gospel
and missing the point of shit like monster hunter int he processes, outing them as pretty dull and moronic.
He doesn't do that at all, its a shitposter posting random off hand comments from his stream, even in this monster hunter comment he admits nobody else would like it
>he RPG elements are the reason you re-fight monsters, and I know for a fact less people would go on their own and refight monsters if there was no benefit to doing so.
and what's the problem with that? what's the problem if someone somewhere decides to not refight monsters because there's no grinding?
>immersion
really immersive when I kill a 100t dragon and the only thing I get from it is 3 ass hairs and 1/4 of an eyeball
Am I supposed to hate him for being right?
He used to constantly spam threads /here/ while parroting contrarian takes that were popular with local anons at the time. However, he also was decent at editing moderately long videos and made videos regularly.
that's literally just his opinion, it's what he would like the series to be
he's right albeitwhever
>games should be completely linear and have no ways of costumizing your experience and difficulty
If any dev listened to that homosexual they would go bankrupt as soon as their next game released.
Anyone agreeing with this take doesn't understand that monster hunter is meant to be played with friends, the equipment grind is to give you excuses to hunt different monsters with your friends when in a pure boss rush you'd likely only fight it once or twice.
He's objectively and factually right. RPG elements have ZERO play in Action.
You tried to make this thread a few days ago you dumb homosexual. have a nice day now that the dlc is out and confirmed goated.
Well what would YOU prefer? An unforgiving adventure game that rewards diligence and intuition, or an action focused game with adventure aesthetics?
From aren't good at making action so I want them to go full immersive adventure again.
>posted another one since the other one got buried
gay
I like this guy. He's smart enough to still be understandable and clear.
>E-celeb thread
have a nice day.
He's right and no one ever disproved him here. Souls games don't have good combat.
Funny how he said this years before Elden Ring was even announced. From truly became predictable, stale and boring
The video came out in 2017, by that time Dark Souls 3 was out so there were 5 souls games. It's no secret that they were already stale by that point because they basically made the exact same game 5 times in a row.
>It's no secret that they were already stale by that point because they basically made the exact same game 5 times in a row.
Almost no one was talking about these games in the way Matthew talked about them when he made the video.
People have trashed DS2 for having a world that makes no sense internally, dogshit level design with shortcuts that do nothing while having too much bonfires and being exclusively combat oriented with no "experience" bosses among other things. What are you talking about?
Only world not being as cohesive as other games is true, the rest of the critiques you mentioned are nonsense.
I have no problem with souls games but with open world.
>Dragon's Dogma? More like Dragon's Dogshit.
>no new video
>no stream
>no patreon update
Yes everything sounds lame when you pointlessly reduce it. Guy sounds like he wants to seem smart for saying how a action game works.
He's even a dumbass about parrying and just wrong about blocking.
As much as I hate this homosexual, he's right on this occasion and how it exasperates ER's biggest issues. The combat is servicable in other souls games because they're relatively short in terms of actual content and consist entirerly of hubs and dungeons in which you don't mind constantly fighting and exploring, but Elden Ring is a massive open world with really only one way of intereracting with it.
You step out into Limgrave and you fight, you travel to Liurnia and you fight, you teleport to Caelid and you fight. What's the point of having this frick huge map when you can't interact with it in any meaningful way? I'm not asking for shitty minigames or Ubisoft towers either before anyone tries to strawman me, I simply wanted more ways to interact with the Lands Between other than listening to homeless schizos and swinging a sword.
>I'm not asking for shitty minigames or Ubisoft towers either before anyone tries to strawman me, I simply wanted more ways to interact with the Lands Between other than listening to homeless schizos and swinging a sword.
Breath of the Wild has puzzles and Skyrim has quests and settlements to break up the pace. I don't think those will fit with Elden Ring tone though.
Then add something else, "muh tone" isn't an excuse.
Brainlet take. He's being overly simplistic, which is moronic since it makes literally any videogame sound bad. Any FPS is just clicking your mouse on pictures of enemies, any MMO is just pressing buttons in the right order to make enemy health bar shorter, etc.
Some games are good at obscuring that you're just pressing buttons to make things happen, and being able to do that is part of good game design.
If you were playing an FPS and all that was on your screen was a crosshair and enemy, you would feel like you were only clicking on enemies to make their health go down. By adding things like a gun model, gun animations, sounds, bullet ballistics, and enemy reactions to the hit, you have obscured the button click so that now it feels like you're shooting a gun instead.
>Brainlet take. He's being overly simplistic, which is moronic since it makes literally any videogame sound bad.
He's not being overly simplistic though, he's literally describing how simple the game actually is.
>Any FPS is just clicking your mouse on pictures of enemies
Imagine someone made an FPS game with only 1 weapon, no alternate fire modes, hit scan bulltets (for you and the enemies), no hit reactions when shooting enemies, no differences in damage depending on where you shoot the enemies, no ammo management, no encounter design, no enemy variety, no target prioritisation, no recoil, no interesting movement etc. Is it overly simplistic to say "all you do is move from room to room and shoot enemies"?
This is coming from the guy that wants MMO damage circles on floors because he doesn't want to learn enemy attack patterns in action games.
>because he doesn't want to learn enemy attack patterns in action games.
does anyone? gimmick enemies/bosses built around delayed or awkwardly timed attacks suck. feels less like a satisfying challenge and more like homework, "i can move on from this boss once i've memorised his moveset"
the simplicity of the combat system is its strength.
it's not trying to be an action game in the vein of devil may cry.
differences in range and damage, differences in attack animations and abilities make meaningful distinctions between weapon types. to say otherwise is moronic. furthermore, boss fights are as dynamic as can possibly be, thanks to the addition of gap closers, estus punishing moves, delayed attacks that punish rollspam, parrying, guard countering, jumping, and blocking. adding more won't necessarily make things more dynamic, just more complex.
the game is about fighting bosses until you've memorized their moves enough to defeat them, and then moving on to the next major boss encounter. that's the core, the meat of the experience, the thing that is facilitated by the moment to moment gameplay, and everything else - the "lore", the story, the characters, the themes, the worldbuilding, the scenic vistas, etc - it's all background dressing to facilitate the core experience. if you want more, you're not going to get it; this series has always been this way, since fricking demon's souls. if you disagree, you're delusional or perhaps being willingly ignorant.
you literally repeated what he said
is this your brain on dark souls combat
reading comprehension isn't your strong suit, is it?
holy fricking shit dude
what? you seem to be under the impression that what I wrote is somehow in agreement with what ol' mundane matt wrote. that is not the case. hence, you are either acting in bad faith (unsurprising) or you are perhaps unable to recognize the discrepancies between what I wrote and what OP quoted because you lack the necessary reading comprehension to make that determination and get a full grasp of what anyone is saying when a sentence is longer than three words.
bosses in later games are simply more complex than those in previous games. whether or not that complexity is warranted, whether or not its appropriate for this particular game series, whether or not you like the direction the series has taken, those are all valid discussions to be had, but it's quite clear that the bosses as they exist in later games are perfectly serviceable to the core combat as it has evolved over time. I know because I've played all of these fricking games ad nauseam. even the dreaded malenia blade of miquella isn't some infallible harder-than-nails nigh invulnerable opponent that only 0.000000001% of the population can defeat.
>but it's quite clear that the bosses as they exist in later games are perfectly serviceable
this is highly debatable
serviceable, as in, beatable?
sure, they are beatable
serviceable, as in, of high quality and bounces well off of the game's combat mechanics
i would say definitely no
sure, the combat did evolve, but it's still clearly not enough
camera is still ass, big enemies and walls clip into it, annoying input queues and delays have been in these games since forever and there's nothing being done about them, etc
I don't disagree with anything you wrote.
at what point did you realize that you're wasting both my time and yours with your inane bullshitery, and your time would be better spent explaining your point rather than acting like a smug dicksniffing butthole? what is your point? if you think we're in agreement, we're not as far as I can tell. he is disparaging the game for its elements being too discordant. in other words, he acknowledges and analyzes the simplicity of the system, but then complains about how it isn't becoming more complex in the same breath. to me that is an implicit plea to miyazaki and fromsoftware for a more complex combat system, with combos, a style meter, a super form, and other type of bombastic features that you'd find in something like devil may cry.
if not that, then what exactly do you think he wants?
>I don't disagree
i see what you mean, these games are just an interesting topic of discussion for me, even if i hate genuinely all of them
honestly all this combat needs to work properly is animation cancelling and a dodge that doesn't make you look like a kid playing in a sandbox on a playground i think
I honestly don't know what I would suggest to make this combat system better. I guess the biggest thing would be to design bosses so that their moves and abilities are identical, or at least similar to, the limitations that the player character is bound by. in other words, both the player and the bosses should be operating under the same effective rules. I think, with some exception, most of the special treatment that bosses like malenia enjoy (animation canceling, being able to launch an attack that effectively prevents staggering, etc) are solutions that they've enacted to continuously make the game more "difficult" in the fear that people will eventually adapt to their combat system and start to say
>yeah these games aren't hard
but the fact is that we've already reached that point ages ago, and people still enjoy these games for what they are. anyway, my dream fromsoft ARPG would be to take elements from every previous game (bloodborne's directional dashing and trick weapons, sekiro's posture meter, deathblows, and deflecting, etc.) and implement them into one huge game, so the combat changes according to your given weapon choice, build, and style of play.
I don't speak to zoomers who can't read. learn to read if you're going to be here, this is an adult website.
>I honestly don't know what I would suggest to make this combat system better. I guess the biggest thing would be to design bosses so that their moves and abilities are identical, or at least similar to, the limitations that the player character is bound by. in other words, both the player and the bosses should be operating under the same effective rules. I think, with some exception, most of the special treatment that bosses like malenia enjoy (animation canceling, being able to launch an attack that effectively prevents staggering, etc) are solutions that they've enacted to continuously make the game more "difficult" in the fear that people will eventually adapt to their combat system and start to say
>>yeah these games aren't hard
>but the fact is that we've already reached that point ages ago, and people still enjoy these games for what they are. anyway, my dream fromsoft ARPG would be to take elements from every previous game (bloodborne's directional dashing and trick weapons, sekiro's posture meter, deathblows, and deflecting, etc.) and implement them into one huge game, so the combat changes according to your given weapon choice, build, and style of play.
bro be thinking he's being verbose
lmao moron be thinking he's amusing. I'd legitimately strangle your neck if I could you little shit. please go eat some fricking tide pods, we don't need you here.
>we
blud be shitting words like he has diarrhea
alright kid. this is the last response (you)'re gonna get out of me. have a nice day, alright? eat your vegetables, do your homework. make sure you get good grades, it really does matter.
blud wrote another essay lmao
rizzless behaviour
not as much in agreement as you have literally regurgigarerated or however you spell it his points
at which point of writing that babble did you realize how worthless your input really is
>it's not trying to be an action game in the vein of devil may cry.
yea, this applies to des, ds1, ds2, but the rest of this shit has bosses straight up from dmc, especially fricking elden wienerring
No wallsplats no buy, frick you from
🙂
Watched the video for the first time and for the most part I agree
BASED
seriously, unironically, the man was right then and he's right now. The souls games have never been about good combat.