What is the hatred for Humanity Frick Yeah? I get it from a roleplaying perspective, you're playing an alien race who doesn't want humanity to "win the setting", but as a human being how could you not at least support the idea of it? Am I missing something?
it's typically lazy writing because humans don't have any notable advantage but they win anyway since the author is human
That, and stupid shit like 'humans are tough!' or 'humans are smart!' with citations of shit like moms getting adrenaline rushes to hurl cars off their kids or engineering in Ye Olden Days ignores the fact we can still become paraplegic because we rolled off the bed wrong, the fact that our very biology removed actually useful stuff like nictating membranes or fur to keep us warm while giving us a slew of health issues like /simply eating food depositing fat in your heart unless you're incredibly lucky/, and that the average human is too busy yelling at people on the internet, if they're not spending years and years to learn how to master one thing.
Just as HFYgays exaggerate and overhype our natural advantages you are understating our advantages to the point of moronation. Even if for some fricking reason we still had fur and nictating membranes you'd still be here complaining about how the human body is awfully designed because of how fur is awful for thermoregulation and how nictating membranes are just a completely useless feature. You're just a cynical moron that doesn't know how biology works.
>you are understating our advantages to the point of moronation
And now, you are completing the "No Akchully" cycle by trying to show off how much you think you know about biology, by trying to one up that guy.
For frick's sake.
Let me settle this for all of you. What advantages or disadvantages humans have or don't have doesn't matter. It's not a biology topic, but a narrative one. You can exaggerate any human trait in any direction, positive or negative, so what those traits happen to be don't really matter.
The issue comes from the idea that anyone reading the story will be a human, and thus on "Team Human." Like a sports team. And, just like [sports team my father liked] can do no wrong and is always the best and is definitely going to win today and deserves to win today, Humans in HFY are given allowances almost as bad as the shit in Angels in the Outfield, and then when any degree of narrative scrutiny is applied, even just your basic "that shit is dumb", the canned response is "what, are you not on Team Human or something?!"
Hfy is an excuse for bad writers to write poorly.
Excellent shift of goalposts.
For frick's sake.
Let me make this clear to you, kid, I don't care about the narrative topic, I care about morons on the internet saying stupid shit like humans being furless or that our bones aren't literally unbreakable is a sign of poor craftsmanship.
Next time, try and understand what a guy's saying before you jump in trying to be a hero, cause it's just gonna get you burnt.
>I don't care about the narrative topic
But that's literally the entire discussion.
I glazed through like 90% of the thread lmao I'm not part of this discussion at all.
What do you mean "hypocrisy"? My only post is me complaining about the guy saying that humans having no fur was a "removal of a good trait" which is a stupid statement. I haven't said shit about my opinion on HFY except that HFYgays overexaggerate our advantages.
>Hell, the frick are you even saying.
"Craftmanship"?
What are you so confused about? The fact that nature is beautifully designed is an objective fact. Did you really not understand that or are you purposefully trying to be an idiot?
>i overplayed my hand and am not hiding that i'm just a troll anymore
Thanks for warning us.
Black person do you really have any right to call me a troll when you posted
? I had a bit of fun with my posts but I actually tried to get my point across.
Too late man. You might have gotten away with it if you just stuck with "I can't see the hypocrisy of wanting people to not say dumb shit, while I myself say dumb shit," but you continued on with "beauty is objective" and that's where you tipped your hand.
I don't even need to go into your whole "craftsmanship" thing, because I already know you're just taking on the role of a braindead troll who is arguing for the sake of looking stupid for attention, so thr last courtesy I can provide you is calling you out, rather than engaging with you in your attempt to sidetrack the discussion.
How do you know it's beautifully designed?
Please, don't act like your hypocrisy burned anyone except yourself.
Hell, the frick are you even saying.
"Craftmanship"?
If you don't like people on the internet saying stupid shit, start with yourself.
>t. someone who has never gone to a zoo
>t. someone who'll downplay how shit like bipolar syndrome, deadly allergies, and all kinds of shit that isn't exactly lethal but also detrimental to humans as time goes on are
>t. someone who'll downplay how shit like bipolar syndrome, deadly allergies, and all kinds of shit that isn't exactly lethal but also detrimental to humans as time goes on are
No, I wouldn't. I'm not saying that the human body is perfect, just that saying that the human body is shit because we don't have every beneficial trait out there is a needlessly cynical way to look at things.
What dumb shit, Black person? What hypocrisy are you talking about? Also, the craftsmanship thing you're so upset about was literally just a single word. I didn't even expect anyone to get upset from that. Is it just because it has creationist implications? Also don't feel like going on with the "beauty is objective" thing either, I'm afraid. Just did that to upset you but it seems that craftsmanship was the sore spot lmao.
Oh shit, you're not just a troll, but genuinely stupid as well. My bad.
>Still hasn't said anything of substance.
>too dumb to understand what has been said to him
Your daily life must be such a burden. I extend my pity.
Yeah, man, It's been a real struggle. But please, forget the craftsmanship, forget objective beauty, please explain my hypocrisy.. I need it to grow as a human being
>simply eating food depositing fat in your heart unless you're incredibly lucky
How to tell me you're a fatass without just saying it.
>skinnyfat samegayging
This isn't a HAES issue, fatass. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatty_streak
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atherosclerosis
"Though it was first described in 1575,[13] there is evidence that the condition occurred in people more than 5,000 years ago.[13]"
Cardiologists are on record saying a completely fat-free heart is impossible to find, and you get people who aren't fricking fat dying of heart attacks all the time.
Stop projecting and work on your squats.
>Cardiologists are on record saying a completely fat-free heart is impossible to find
Fat's so fricking good though
Stop projecting, says man raging because he was simply called fat.
you need to stop being fat, most people aren't having fat depositions in our hearts
>humans don't have any notable advantage
we do, though
breeding very fast?
For one thing, humans can move while aliens all stand exactly still.
Seriously, humans are as special as you want, as long as you can define the other races to be whatever you want.
Humans can walk, other races cannot
Humans are capable of development, while other races are puppets (of gods?) following scripts
Human "space" is seen by others as something like WH40k warp that they only use for travel
etc
whatever you set as the weakness of all aliens, will be the strength of humans
We have the highest endurance of any animal on land. Our ancestors hunted animals by literally running them to death. The only things that are even comparable to us are dogs and horses.
Ah, yes. The many HFY stories, where humans beat the pitiful grays by challenging them into a marathon event.
It's incredible how reddit latched onto that shit right away and people today keep parroting it even though it's still very largely unproven.
>largely unproven
>tribes in Africa still running down animals for food
>marathons
>sweat
Are you dumb? Humanity is built to run and not get tired.
>tribes in Africa still running down animals for food
It's largely done as a rite of passage or to satisfy tourists. Not something they actually survive on.
But they're still doing it. That alone proves its possible.
A lot of things are technically possible, that means nothing when it comes to questioning if that thing is actually done day after day, after day. Persistence hunting for sustenance is extremely risky because you easily can blow way more energy than you can get back.
I'm sure that will be real helpful while you're in conflict with dudes that have ftl travel and antimatter weapons
Name one that isn't "adaptability" "versatility" or some other vague bullshit along those lines. Specialization > Generalization, every time, nature proves it over and over. Humans would get wiped the frick out against any species that has specialized.
Akshually generalists are more succesful in the long run. Specialists can excel when the environment is stable, but if it changes (and eventually it will), they have hard time adapting to the changes.
We are specialized. Each human specializes in something.
All advantages humans have are equally available to any sapient species.
If you compare humans to all other known life, humans have lots of advantages... we are an apex species...
Yeah great, but when you compare humans to other species with everything they can do PLUS more (i.e., all fantasy species that are sapient) then suddenly humans are a prey species and the bottom of the food chain.
>we are an apex species of contemporary Earth
FTFY
Yeah, but presumably any other species that can also build civilizations are also apex predators in their own right
slender elven fingers typed this post
underappreciated truthful post
Its mostly the insufferable fanbase
>but as a human being how could you not at least support the idea of it?
Because it's contrived. Humans aren't bad or anything but pretending we're some mythical species of ultimate lifeforms is stupid and boring, and ultimately leads to players not engaging with the setting which is shit for actually playing games.
Perfect example in your post:
>you're playing an alien race who doesn't want humanity to "win the setting"
HFY here has lead to a moronic mindset where you think that settings are things that one can "win" and that the goal of humans in the average setting should//is to "win the setting".
If you were in my game and got upset because I wouldn't let you try to "win the setting" I would fricking boot you immediately because you're poisoned with this stupid meme.
>he still doesn't know the true potential of humanity
I'm sorry anon but I don't get the reference
That one anime about football or some such, can't remember.
>i get it from a role playing perspective
>but
>[non role playing stuff]
Are you okay?
No
It's Because of Two things mostly.
Most hfy is moronic, this is from someone who likes hfy.
Hfy will typically have alienst/fantasy races be the most moronic ideas/goals/abilities ever. Like elves will be long lived and martial gods, but have no concept of medicine or field medics, so instead they just fricking kill anyone that gets injured. And then comes humanity, able to beat up elves because they have medicine.
Or they'll give humans an stupid and/or completely unreasonable advantage, such as from the veil of madness, where humans are all immune to its affects, or they'll make humans pyschic or something.
Or they'll jerk off persistence hunting, which is real and a possible advantage humans have, how we're able to keep hunting and fighting for a long period of time, but they'll write it a completely moronic way.
>persistence hunting
This is always massively misunderstood and presented in the most moronic fashion as well. It's not that humans are going to be able to chase after a mammoth by just running after it for days. It's more a combination of humans long wakeful period, endurance, and ability to track animals. I mean, the earliest human evidence points more towards scavenging than hunting anyway.
its because humans could co-operate ironically humans weakness made them stronger than other animals
It's always presented as something people widely did yet when calculated against it isn't sustainable and in modern day it's only even done as a rite of passage or to facilitate tourism.
>persistence hunting
AKA being able to run 5km. Next to no other animal can maintain that, only horses and some dog breeds, and even then 5km is around their upper limit for sustained running.
If you can run for 30-45 mins without a break then you're in the top 0.0000001% of all animals, and yet we can train ourselves to run marathons.
That's what persistence hunting is. By and large when it is memed in hfy you have people running for days continuously or some other nonsense that is usually impossible (unless you're Dean Karnazes), and yet every human is apparently capable of doing it in the setting.
Which only becomes pointless considering that space civilization requires specific technology levels, which would render any basic biological adaptation pointless, barring more philosophical and aesthetic concerns about retaining one's being, or humanity in this instance.
Persistence hunting isn't even likely to be relevant in 99% of science fiction in the first place, even assuming its most meme interpretation. oh damn you can walk for a long time? that's crazy bro. ok brb glassing your planet from orbit
There is nothing special or unique about man except his insufferable self centredness in a universe so vast it would fry his monkey brain. HFY is shit because because its a monument to mankind's hubris. Its a man overcome with self centered egotism, pounding his chest and shouting about how great he is, on a tiny speck of a planet in a infinite sea of the swirling cosmos.
Yes and? YWNBAW while my children will inherit the stars.
>my children
Sure buddy sure
>There is nothing special or unique about man except his insufferable self centredness in a universe so vast it would fry his monkey brain.
you know its entirely possible humans are the only intelligent life in the galaxy, maybe even the universe.
So yeah humanity frick yeah
Yeah, most HFY-gays achieve the opposite of what they try to showcase, they just demonstrate how petty we humans are by lashing out at fictional things that can't even reasonably defend themselves because they are fictional.
>Or they'll jerk off persistence hunting
The fun part of that is that any fantasy race with a similar anatomy would be able of that as well. The same goes for "humans are really great at throwing" argument.
not necessarily humans have advantages over other hominids.
>The fun part of that is that any fantasy race with a similar anatomy would be able of that as well.
well, depends if the writer is interested in making his world/setting "scientifically accurate", a simple dichotomy:
>these races are what they are and act how they do, because they're just narrative tools to peddle a concept, e.g. every race in Tolkien's Ea
or
>these races are what they are because the writer imagined how they evolved and is now exploring how they might interact with each other, without any presumptions, e.g. Simmons' humans and ousters
Tolkien's elves cannot *be* evil, lest they turn to literal orcs, his hobbits are all homely, comfy, etc. (Bilbo and Frodo are outliers, the exceptions that prove the rule)
ousters just try to survive, they and humans commit atrocities, no faction is set in the narrative to be the ultimate evil; even the technocore is nuanced, with some factions wanting to save humanity, while others exploit it
Actually any furred humonoid wouldn't be able to keep up with us.
You just came up with a better HFY hook than most HFY gays.
I agree with this. Overall, the problem is that if HFY was good it wouldn't be HFY it would just be a story about triumph in the face of adversity.
The problem comes down to that you have to invent aliens that are inherently flawed to reflect whatever random aspect of humans you want to praise, explicitly for the point of that. Any good HFY won't look like a HFY it'll look like a well written story with a HFY element to it as opposed to the focus.
Basically what everyone it this thread already said.
Hfy often at best written lazy and at worst bad, hfy writers have no imagination, so they using cliches, tropes and etc like death world, alien which came from herbivores so they can't fight properly and other made up shit, like a couple of fabrics where humans was only race with even make/female ratio and all universe had hots for them
HFY where humans are good at fighting other races = cringe because the opposition is usually written with some really moronic flaw and players arent encouraged to engage with the setting
HFY where humans are good at forging alliances with other races = based, because reading about and playing as characters that have to creatively engage with the world around them to prevail is actually interesting
What about a setting where aliens have conquered humanity and we're their vassal state?
>Parades in the streets to celebrate the qt Alien Queen's birthday
>Romantic Relationships between humans and Aliens are accepted
>Humanity can fight on the front lines as warriors then come home to a loving (alien) wife and child.
there's a plethora of xcom vipers x human men smut on AOOO
WANT SNEK WIFE
No.
However, are you willing to be impregnated by a chryssalid?
Is that an edit? What cutscene is that?
Definitely chimera squad.
you just have a victim complex
Many have already commented about how HFY is often done wrong, but it can be done well IMO.
A good example to me is Stargate SG1, at least until the end of the Goauld arc in S8. Here humanity's "advantadge" is just having been left alone for thousands of years to develop a subversive culture very used to war and technological change. Meanwhile the aliens have become very socially stale after a long status quo and their superior technology not really advancing anymore. So, when humans met aliens, the hostile Goauld are fricked over due to not being able to adapt quicky to the new situation, and the friendly Asgardians are saved due to being able to cooperate with us.
In both cases, Earth humans are shown as underdogs winning by small margins in desperate situations, with numerous setbacks. Which also helps to keep the aliens from looking like morons.
I like HFY, it's only problem is if it is unbalanced. If humanity is objectively the greatest at everything, it makes aliens look kind of lame and uninteresting; and it obviously just becomes masturbation. But if humanity is good at x and aliens are good at y, then what's the problem if the aliens are amazed by humanity's x capabilities?
Also, HFY is the best response to space hippies who want nothing other than to commune with nature all day. Frick them.
Its posters are huge shitposters, no-games or 40k-homosexuals.
intersection of socialists and furries. Socialists are misanthropes and also interpret everything as political allegory, non-human races are minorities, humans fascists.
Furries just think they are animals.
All of it stems from being bullied or abused.
It's masturbatory and self-congratulatory. It's predictable. It tries to carry spear-chucking pickaninnies along with the achievements of the civilized races. And it attacks a problem that isn't a problem. Humanity as the underdog is a good thing, because - at least in Anglo-Saxon sensibilities - we like to root for an underdog.
explain why people hate the Imperium, they are pretty much the underdog, flawed, suffer failure.
The other factions are written like mary sues.
Anti-hfy morons aren't mad at underdog/top dog status, they are just misanthropic bullied nerds.
>Has the two most overhyped and overwanked armies in the game
>More lore and attention than all the other factions combined
>90% of the setting's backstory is about them
>Always wins when it really matters
>Never suffers any consequences from defeats because it has infinite manpower and resources and everything is replaceable
>Has legions of fanboys doing olympics level mental gymnastics to explain why "the cruelest, most bloody regime imaginable", with a life expectancy of 40 and a literal thought police, is actually just as comfy as a 1st world nation
Wow, such underdog, much beleaguered
>The other factions are written like mary sues
Who? The green morons that never do anything important and exist only so space marines can slaughter them by the gorillion?
The space bugs that never do anything important and exist only so space marines can slaughter them by the gorillion?
The anime aliens that were gradually retconned from "optimistic newcomers" to "just as bad as everyone else" because the idea of a faction thriving without being a dystopia made imperiumgays shit themselves?
ahh its anti-40k gay again.
Nothing to see here folks, thread is another anti-40k kun bait thread so he can cry about the Imperium.
He's right though.
>explain why people hate the Imperium
>okay, here's why I hate the Imperium
>HURRRR Y U CRY ABOUT IMPERIUM
Obviously meant for
>explain why people hate the Imperium, they are pretty much the underdog, flawed, suffer failure.
Alright.
>won the Horus Heresy
>survived 13 black crusades
>galaxy got split, immediately launched great crusade 2.0 out of the blue
>defeated hive fleet kraken
>defeated hive fleet behemoth
>defeated hive fleet Leviathan so many times the bugs stared to hold a grudge against blood angels
>Imothek got fricked by Black Templars
>World Engine got fricked by a lousy no name chapter
>won the War of Beast
>won Armageddon 1
>won Armageddon 2
>won Armageddon 3
>fricked Ghazgkull like a b***h
>almost fricked Craftworld Alaitoc with 1 (one) no name chapter and some guard
>could frick the Tau any time, just too busy
>won at Vigilus
>won in the Plague Wars
>Magnus failed 2 time to frick Fenris
>fricked Magnus again on Luna
>fricked Magnus AGAIN on his own planet of sorcerers
Does this sound like the underdog faction for you?
All those "wins" are just to keep the status quo. The current Imperium is no closer to win anything than it was in 999.M41.
>won the Horus Heresy
The Imperium didn't win the HH. It's a repeated plot point than they only achieved a stalemate that has endured for 10k+ years.
hes an ideological fanatic he won't accept it.
If you win every major narrative event in the game and humiliate every single named character the other factions have, you are wining. Face it, the Imperium isnt the underdog, its the school yard bully that gives everyone a wedgie.
It's more the "poorly written faction from a shit setting hastily cobbled together to sell toys, with about as much coherent thought and direction as Starship Troopers, Mein Kampf, and the script to Road House thrown into a blender."
Discussing 40k lore is like asking if Count Chocula drinks blood or if he drinks chocolate. You can have fun with it, but it's dumb from the start and gets dumber the more seriously you approach it.
>the imperium is literally hitler
>the imperium is literally patrick swayze
Man, you hfy "chads" are so bad at basic argumentation.
Black person, the Warhammer setting IS the status quo. When was the last time a major character died? Okay fine, Cadia kinda exploded, but aside from that, when was the last time something as setting defining happened to non-humans?
>noooooo plz no hurterino my heckin spacemarino waaaaaaaaaah
Not that guy btw
>when was the last time something as setting defining happened to non-humans?
You don't now about the Eldar and the Ynnead? Tau being fricked up after their first real contact with warp stuff? Thraka on his way to become a Krork?
>You don't now about the Eldar and the Ynnead?
Did nothing at all for the Eldar, it went pretty much nowhere for them. Instead, the Imperium got Girlyman from this.
just remind him Eldar made Slaanesh and watch him go nuts
hfy morons are the bullied nerds.
Rebellion fantasies against alien empires are just as masturbatory.
so it just boils down to
>people bad
Ok moron
No, you said that underdogs are better. But rebellion fantasies are just a cultural myth born out of the fall of monarchies, modern political systems use those myths to give people an out to their desire for political rebellion and reform. So it is by definition just masturbation. At least HFY actually regards Humans as having qualities that are unique and special compared to other forms of life.
i didn't say anything im a different poster but you are presenting a catch 22
Hfy bad if humans triumph or excel
Hfy bad if humans are rebels.
Correct, it's always bad. You're finally catching up to the rest of us.
>at least in Anglo-Saxon sensibilities - we like to root for an underdog.
this is not uniquely 'anglo-saxon' but of course someone who considers himself one would say such a thing
the "unassuming protag stepping up against the seemingly unbeatable opponent" is a trope found in every culture across the planet, so it's related to something deeper in humans than just surface-level culture
as for HFY, it doesn't have to be self-congratulatory and predictable, consider Hyperion, its Hegemony and the Ousters and later the Pax in Endymion
Anglo-saxons are just inherently better people.
>Anglo-saxons are just inherently better people.
Yes, that's what I said, moron. Don't post if you're not going to contribute anything.
It had a narrow scope limited shelf life that had long passed by even back in 2010. It very quickly just starts recycling itself and you see how it really relies on aliens being moronic. It's amusing when you find it, but ready any handful of stories and you'll have seen all the genre has to offer.
Just stop for a moment and think about it on a conceptual level. Imagine making a story and inventing a fictional "foe" just to prove you are better than it while at the same time there was never any possibility of it being otherwise. because you dictate the story.
Its basically showboating and congratulating yourself saying you won through hard work and talent when in reality you rigged yourself to win from the start and there was no way for you to actually lose yet you insist on being praised for it anyway and get upset and confused about why people aren't playing along.
no, its because Leddit is full of anti-human schizo-commies who believe humanity should be extinct. I was clinically diagnozed as Misanthrope and am followed for this, and Even I don't believe, as much as I despise humanity, that our species should go extinct since we're literally a cosmic-level fluke of happenstance
>I was clinically diagnozed as Misanthrope and am followed for this
yeah i'm slightly misanthropic myself and anti-hfy is just mental illness.
I grew out of thinking human factions were icky when i stopped being a teenager.
In the Dresden Files, there's a frost giant who dueled and defeated Thor. Like, the god Thor.
He gets unceremoniously one-shotted by an M72 LAW from a normal human.
Why aren't more games like this? How do you capture this feel of HFY of regular mundane humans using military hardware to triumph against almighty gods and monsters?
>She was standing next to her Harley, and the box labeled CAMPING SUPPLIES was wide open.
>I watched her draw out a round tube with a couple of grip points and a control pad, painted olive drab. She extended the tube, flipped up some kind of little doohickey on it, lifted it to her freaking shoulder, and settled her fingers lightly on the control pad.
>“You fight like a woman, seidrmadr,” Svangar snarled.
>“Hey, drittsekk!” Murphy shouted.
>Svangar turned his head toward her, his expression furious.
>One corner of her mouth crooked up in a smile and her blue eyes were cold. “Me, too.”
>And she fired the weapon.
>I don’t know a lot about military hardware. But if you’re going to fight a Jotun, it seems to me a bazooka is about the right caliber.
>I didn’t really see the rocket fly. That’s not how those things work. They move at about the speed of a handgun bullet. There was simply an explosion followed almost instantaneously by another explosion in the hollow of Svangar’s throat. CrackBOOM.
>Resisting fire was a nifty trick, but in the end, again, Sir Isaac will always weigh in on matters. Fire is an absolute, a collection point of energy, and it can always get hotter. Eventually, as with any defense, there’s a limit to what it can do, a point of catastrophic failure—and Murphy’s rocket found that limit.
>Ever see a watermelon get smashed with a sledgehammer?
>It was sort of like that.
>Flesh and blood exploded from the Jotun in a cloud of aerial chum. I could see Svangar’s cracked and blackened collarbone and his freaking spine through the hole in his neck. The Jotun staggered, his shoulder smashing into a building, raised his axe one last time—and fell as it dropped from his suddenly nerveless fingers.
>The giant’s body crushed two cars and knocked over a streetlight as it came down. One outflung hand landed not three feet from my toes.
>And suddenly the street was silent and very still.
A cop kills her.
>dresden files is complete shit and poorly written from every possible metric
Why, oh why, is this supposed to be news to anyone.
because most of this site is 12 year old kyles that havent read trashy fiction like the jim butcher has to pay alimony series?
the only thing worse than dresden files is hte fans. those are true shit
>drezden files bad
no way, it have tv tropes page
it must be good
SG1 did it well. Human tech is inferior, but the thinking behind it is more ruthless and devious than more powerful weapons made by aliens that are too complacent in their superiority against "inferior" races.
>Why aren't more games like this?
It's an anticlimax. You not only trivialize anything impressive about the creature, you also cheat your own characters from the notoriety of besting them in combat because any random schmuck could do the same thing.
Only trained soldiers carry anti tank weapons around.
And it's good to be a soldier.
So, you're just gonna copypaste this in every hfy thread from now on?
>WOAHH ISNT IT CRAZY THAT THIS MUNDANE THING CAN TOTALLY BTFO THIS MYTHICAL BEING WOAHHH DUDE I LOVE SCIENCE
>WOAHH ISNT IT CRAZY THAT THIS MUNDANE THING CAN TOTALLY BTFO THIS MYTHICAL BEING WOAHHH DUDE I LOVE SCIENCE
This is literally the basis of all mythology and fiction.
... except not really, unless you come from a highly specific archipelago in Europe, which overrepresent this sort of "magic rules"
t. superelemental weaknesses are also supernatural in my culture
A sword is a mundane thing.
Mundane swords have always been able to BTFO gods and dragons in medieval European mythology.
what? no! the heroes that defeat mythical beings always have help from the divine!
>Saint george kills the dragon with a normal spear, but he has help from god
>perceus recieves magic weapons from the gods
>Sigfried is given the magic sword by odin to kill fafnir
man vs god in classical myth is always about one faith trumping over the other, the hero beats the monster because he gets help from someone or something stronger than the monster. By honoring the divine, the hero is elevated above the supernatural and the unknown, it was never about the weapons.
Humans are the only race that can conventionally poop. The other races suffer major constipation and only poop once a year because of it. But human poop is also the most powerful fuel source in the universe. Because of this, the humans have the most powerful ships in the setting, making them the most powerful military. The other races want to buy their poop, making humans also the riches. Also the poop is an aphrodisiac, and the poop particles that cling to humans after expelling their waste make humans well sought after mates. Therefore, half-humans are the most populous race in the setting.
This is how your typical HFY trash reads.
>all hfy is shit because the people who write it always have the most moronic ideas about humanity
>"noooo, it's just that most hfy is shit, except for the hfy that [embodies the most moronic ideas about humanity]"
Every fricking time.
Just leave that gay shit to reddit and stop trying to bring it up here.
Dude, did you know we humans breathe OYXGEN? Its basically a POISON. God, we are so fricking BADASS.
Haha, we treat our own fellow specimen like shit, we disregard our environment and put little value on life. I bet every alien shits their pants when they see us, haha.
Did you know we humans perfected warfare? Yeah, sure, there are warrior races out there. And yes, there are species that thrive on murder-torture. But duuuuude, none of them are so BADASS like we are. We, like, did attrition warfare in ww1. And we did did some pretty badass genocides in our history. All the other brutal, warlike species of [SETTING] are a bunch on PUSSIES compared to us.
i hear henry rollins saying that.
oh my heckin science there aren't really people that side with humans? don't you know thats fascism.
I for one always root for the diverse aliens of color.
>wah why can't i use human wank as a proxy for my racism waaaaah
It's so fricking sad.
lol you proved him right. This is entirely political shit to you.
Aliens = minorities.
>lol, you called him out on the exact thing he was trolling about
What's your gameplan? Act like an idiot, get called out as an idiot, and then revel in "tricking" people to get them to call you an idiot?
Oh boy, how you've inconvenienced us, but confirming our superiority over you, oh no.
that you farleft fascists think everything is political allegory.
You genuinely think space aliens or fantasy creatures are equivalent to human minorities.
>post moronic strawman
>someone replies to your moronic strawman
>SEE YOU'RE JUST LIKE MY moronic STRAWMAN
its not a strawman when you genuinely believe it.
you're the first person to bring it up in this fricking thread
this was your post. Own it.
Dude, he's a troll. Just don't reply to him.
i accept your concession
>This is entirely political shit to you.
Ah yes, because
>diverse aliens of color.
Is totally not a reference to any modern political discussions.
Why do you people even bother pretending you're being clever?
You are unironically a perfect example of why HFY doesn't work. I'm supposed to believe the species that shits itself at the idea of divergent members of its species is supposedly infinitely smarter, more capable, and better equipped for confrontation than a species that left orbit before we even invented vaccum tubes? You would break down crying if you saw aliens that had reversed gender dymorphic tendencies, much less anything actually difficult to understand.
>you are
you are just a mentally ill frickwit you moronic /misc/ c**t
Yes, aliens and minorities are inferior.
With the strength and cunning to demolish straw men like that you must be an amazing HFY author.
Because it almost invariably makes for shitty fiction. Humans have super powers and beat up ayylmaos made of straw. It's even worse if the humans are portrayed as underdogs and their super power is just plot armour.
It works find for a "save the world against the odds" game setup, but as a conventional narrative it's shit, and as a setting premise it's even worse.
Because you "people" unironically conflate "I don't like lazy, masturbatory writing" with "I wish humanity would go extinct".
You are the whiniest, weakest b***hes, unable to take any criticism and improve your writing, opting to instead paint your critics as some humanity-hating [buzzwords of the day], scream at them until they get tired of trying to go through your skulls, then continue to huddle together in your hugbox, jerking off each other and posing Chad pictures like a warped reflection of anime-posting trannies.
This post will get no replies, like any other sensible explanation in this thread, because while you have required brain power to scream autistically at outright bait, the one thing you can't handle is calling you what you really are.
They hated him, for he spoke the truth.
So apparently, HFY is also part of this schizo-culture-war enforced on us by some no-gaming crossboarders. Thanks homosexuals.
*sigh* humans...
ughh humans are so dumb they never learn *takes a drag of cigarette* *dilates*
>ughh aliens are so dumb they never learn *writes them exactly like that* *seethes*
doubt.jpg most fiction writes aliens as technological superior and intellectually superior.
We are talking about HFY though.
Define "most fiction"
No, they write them like playground bullies that collapse as soon as the super brave and strong humans confront them.
general gist of hard science with aliens is they are really advanced to even make contact with us.
Unless its the other way around humans are so advanced they make the contact but thats hfy to you.
I mean, humanity being the most technologically advanced and making first contact with yet-planetbound species could be a cool premise.
As long as we keep isekai conveyor-tier hfy authors out of it.
yeah cool and done to death and humanity is obviously going to triumph in that situation
As I said
>As long as we keep isekai conveyor-tier hfy authors out of it.
Instead of "aliens vs humans" or God forbid, whatever Avatar was, it could be a small group of researchers exploring the different culture and trying to blend in (Hard to be a God, for example), or first contact from the perspective of space faring humans establishing friendly relations with locals or accidentally fricking up their entire political relations and trying to salvage them...
There's lots of potential in the premise as long as it goes beyond the playground "pew pew I win u lose"
Hell, the second premise is literally in the same cycle.
The Inhabited Island follows your typical "Soviet superhuman crashes on the planet of dirty savages and teaches them freedom and communism"... except he accidentally fricked up the entire planet development plan, by his colleagues, no less. The unreleased book was supposed to be about the world War, his idiotic actions brought.
Elder Race is actually kinda close to what you're describing but it's way too short to properly explore the idea
I'll look into it, thanks, Anon.
(You)
Now be gone
literally just another seething leftists reeeing at 40k thread
>By yes, I didn't even bother reading the thread, how could you tell
Always knew /tg/ was filled with cucks. It's easy to see by the left leaning bias and rage against HFY, and non humans represent the ultimate form of cuckoldry, species cuckoldry.
>man, I'm such a CHAD, i love stories about how awesome the only thing I have left that I can be proud of: my species, the literal lowest common denominator among humans
lmao
they have accepted the highest form of cuckery, species suicide.
yeah, we HFY chads are such not cucks
The aliens have taken our babes
Lets rock
>wanting stories that aren't lazy shit about humanity dabbing on a galaxy full of technologically advanced morons is "species suicide"
WHAT is with the right wing people and cuck porn. I feel like the hypothesis about far right political beliefs being just a cover for closet homosexuality must be true, everytime these frickers pop into a discussion its always cuckoldry, wieners, troonys, gay porn, Black folk and interracial sex etc.
You go to /misc/ or any board that has something to do with politics its always the same thing over and over again, dicks, wieners, gay porn, transsexuals, Black folk having sex with white women.
Fricking quit porn for a month or two, maybe you'll stop thinking about dicks 24/7.
Also HFY a shit.
>literally proving
You are the whiniest, weakest b***hes, unable to take any criticism and improve your writing, opting to instead paint your critics as some humanity-hating [buzzwords of the day], scream at them until they get tired of trying to go through your skulls, then continue to huddle together in your hugbox, jerking off each other and posing Chad pictures like a warped reflection of anime-posting trannies.
This post will get no replies, like any other sensible explanation in this thread, because while you have required brain power to scream autistically at outright bait, the one thing you can't handle is calling you what you really are.'s point
You're addressing deliberate trolls.
You HFYgays are so obsessed with frick's and porn that it's almost like you're asking for people to make fun of your obvious obsessive rape fetish.
Man recent HFY is wack and stale. Old shit like the spice feast HFY and the missile cargo ship HFY were good. It's all been the same recently with the whole "MUH STAMINA" or "WE GOOD AT WAR DON'T FRICK WITH US".
Your taste in writing is objectively bad.
big aliens require big death
xenos lies itt. put your mouth around my satirical bolter and die.
I hate humans and despise the humanity, so I find HFY disgusting.
It's also invariably terribly written, which makes it even more disgusting.
Stories that have an already established outcome (in this case making humaninty look cool) are boring most of the time.
Top that of with the fact that these stories are often devoid of any actual characters with names or faces and you get stories that are just a drag to read through only containing an obvious message you already get from the HFY label.
Most HFY stories I've read are just badly written. A common thing they do is that instead of actually making humans be particularly good at something, they just make all the aliens weak. Like, it's easy for humanity to feel superior when all other species are half our height and so weak a 10 year old could bet them in a fistfight, but that just comes across as contrived. It just feel the author was unable to come up with actual traits that could give humanity an edge, so he just made everybody else weaker to make humans stand out.
Now I have read some stories that do something more clever, like have humans defeat aliens that on the first glance might seem superior through a good application of some technology or trait where humans are better, but it's rare.
I have exactly the opposite view.
>humans defeat aliens that on the first glance might seem superior through a good application of some technology or trait where humans are better
is generic trash (what is the quality in humans there that gives them the victory? It's just "moxxie" or "smarts" or luck or literal plot armor - bleh)
while
>they just make all the aliens weak.
is interesting and creative. By definition if humans are strong (= they win due to something other than luck or plot armor), then aliens are weak and vice versa.
I just can't enjoy HFY knowing it originated from a medical tragedy
>Group of oblivious and unprepared nerds goes to see James Cameron's Avatar
>They're suddenly confronted with the idea that humans with guns might lose a fight against nonhumans without guns
>The trauma causes them a severe case of anal devastation
>The butthurt reverberates up the spinal cord up to the skull
>The cranial pressure results in acute brain damage, mainly a form of localized amnesia that makes them forget humans already win in 99.9% of fiction
>More than a decade later medical professionals are still unable to find a cure
>The unfortunate victims and the people they infected are still stuck writing horrible fanfics were humanity comes back to Pandora and nukes everything from orbit
>humans bully me i side with the aliens
you really shouldnt be allowed on this site or the internet in general if you can't tell fact from fiction
i heckin love doggerinos unlike meany evil Hum*ns
I often encounter podgy nerds don't understand just how far humans can push their limits because they never had to.
This leads to podgy nerds being unable to write realistic people.
Part of the reason hfy sucks right now is because aliens are too human and not actually alien. Elves are humans with dexterity, dwarves are humans but tougher, aliens are humans with inherent superpowers. So we really start to think humans are dumb as a default. Think for a second though. What if any given animal on earth had human sapience and was at war with us?
Horses tigers peregrine falcons.
They don't have thumbs.
Thumbs are pretty fricking great. They allow for advanced tool use. Even if they managed to create good technology, we could commandeer theirs while they couldn't for us. Because they'd have at most 3 points of interaction(paws+head, 2 talons.
Tigers would be strong killing machines but they wouldn't be able to turn a doorknob.
Birds can fly, but they've got super brittle bones.
The only thing we'd maybe have to worry about in terms of dexterity are other apes and cephalopods since they have either thumbs extra prehensile limbs or both.
If we were at war with cephalopods we'd basically need to surrender the ocean I think. Apes with prehensile tails and feet could probably make our lives problems. Gorillas sink cause of their high muscle density so you need a naval campaign against them. It's the chimps you need to watch out for.
Vermin could probably eat our supply lines but that's why we resort to war crimes and commit to pesticides.
Please, never write another word again.
You are the living embodiment of "too stupid to understand how stupid he is."
Frick you. Think about tabletop games in general. Humans are the baseline default. Other races can do everything humans can do+something else. Maybe they have a penalty somewhere. But in the end they're still humanoids. We live in a giant fricking world, with tons of different species and we're the ones on top. Or at least we would be if we didn't spawn cretins like you.
So who is the mysterious species actually ruling Earth at this time?
Me
Please, always keep writing!
You are the living embodiment of "good, thoughtful poster".
>encouraging morons to be moronic
HFY in a nutshell.
>Part of the reason hfy sucks right now
>right now
It ALWAYS sucked, for it's one of the cheapest "feel good" writing in existence, appealing entirely on the lizard brain level of "feel good for yourself, for your own species defeated other, made up species".
most human vs alien stories boil down
to humans superior = human total victory
humans are inferior = struggle against extinction
near peer = coin flip
Or maybe the good stories are not about which side is "superior" but something of actual merit or import.
Maybe the good stories have nothing to do with HFY.
triggered by a word? gtfo idiot
It's like you didn't even read his post
i read your post but you miss the point because the word bothered you.
Most peaceful "smort" scifi for "smort" people has humans in a superior position.
I'm explaining to you how hinging a story on the question of how strong humans are compared to a fictional race is pointless.
At what level of understanding are you operating from? Do I got to start with kindergarten shit, or can you actually wrap your head around the idea that fictional races are only as strong or weak as the writer decides they are?
but the point isn't about strength you twit.
humanity ubër alles
choose a less gay song next time you want to wank humanity
Because I have no crippling psychological insecurity which demands I debase fiction to make myself feel better?
there is only one earth, humans are possibly the only intelligent life in the universe.
the question is do you want a future of ****** huffing their own shit.
or super men conquering the universe?
I want a future where the books are interesting.
humanity forever
Wasn't the original point of this stuff to make humanity not the baseline they usually are in most settings?
No, it was a failure to understand why humans, the non-fictional race we have an innate understanding of, would be used as the measure of other races.
Yeah, but this anon
is also right in that people really didn't understand the why of things either. /tg/ of the late oughts was a silly place.
Yeah pretty much, it's why the rare bits of goid hey are "humans special at x" not human want.
>rare
you mean non-existant.
humans get +1 to all stats in my games
humans are the master race
>anti-hfy
file that under mental illness
Anyone who is actually pro-human would be anti-hfy, because only the saddest examples of humanity would feel the need to revel in the literal lowest common denominator.
How pathetic must you be in order to only have your humanity to take pride in. Biggest shame for the race is the lowest members of it.
>How pathetic must you be in order to only have your humanity to take pride in
As opposed to what, exactly?
Your achievements, faith, and moral integrity.
That's better, but those are part of our humanity, as well, you realize?
The point about anti-hfy is only valid as far as judging these works as badly written, childish and droll, but that's about it.
>but those are part of our humanity, as well, you realize?
Part of our humanity sure, but not solely human qualities, which is what HFY is pretty much defined by. You can share the same faith, morals, and achievements as aliens. Such things are not defined by being human.
They are not from our humanity, but our divinity.
But they are our humanity, unless you posit that man is just an animal.
How are you getting "man is an animal" from "we get those traits from our divinity"? are you ESL, or just a chatbot?
Because neither integrity nor moral traits don't come from divinity. It's just internal intelligence.
Who is posting all these cringe youtube videos.
it's a mystery
Because the writing can often be unoriginal as anything, and can also suffer from bad humanwank by nature.
HFY is gimmick-y by nature, so you get some genuinely good reads, but they're because they've thought of some new or unique way of presenting humans being physically or mentally cool. If you aren't original, or don't know your material, it punishes you
I find it's better if it's approached by the angle that humans are aliens. Present a narrative told from the non-human perspective that showcases just how outside the pale Humans are in the setting.
Typically that turns out well.
>Source. Have written some fairly popular HFY fiction.
Any -wank writing is by definition almost always bad unless you are specifically the target audience. Just because the fictional people being wanked are of the same race as you doesn't make it good.
i identify as a meat popsicle.
anti-hfyers lost itt, hfy wins again
You lost the game
It's almost entirely because the people who push HFY are completely insufferable and make terrible ambassadors for their "genre."
It's less a "genre" or even a "thing," but just a gay writing prompt that a few idiots tried their hardest to make it seem bigger than it was. That includes ego-laden losers like this gay
, but also includes idiots who tried to act like anything where the human side wins should be called hfy.
To put hfy in perspective, its not even on the level of that gay wolf man sub genre "Omegaverse" shit. We're talking about something not even as popular as "erotic furry harry potter fanfiction." Hell, I could probably just string together any four random cringe-inducing words and end up with a "genre" more popular than hfy.
And the fiction is objectively bad.
Cool people don't need to constantly justify themselves and proclaim how cool they are to everyone else. HFY doesn't come across as badass because by making it a thing you just come across as insecure instead. If humanity is so great, why do we need to constantly fricking shout to everyone about how great we are all the time?
The hatred for HFY is a product of self-loathing and a degenerate misanthropic viewpoint.
This. Some of it is a reaction to poor writing, but it's generally more about virtue signalling how much self-hate you have.
A product of inadequate writing skill*
Because it runs antithesis to TNG era Star Trek's federation, which is the gold standard for how humanity should behave in a setting.
This. Star Trek asks the question "What if humanity acted according to our highest ideals?". HFY asks the question "What if we took all the most worst aspects of humanity and took pride in them?". A HFY moron would reject the concept of human rights entirely and scorn first world prosperity in favor of ISIS and Somalian warlords because they hate it when humans achieve anything worthwhile.
You're right until the last part, they want humanity to be a thinly veiled straight white male fascism allegory.
>Star Trek
>our highest ideals
>our
>highest
No.
Hello Somalian.
You seriously think a TV show about people whose unification among other things caused mass mongrelization and ostensible military incompetence is even remotely close to what real human moral highs are, in creation and destruction alike?
In first world countries, yes.
A low bar it is, then. Special spins on Christianity I can see, but this? No.
If you don't see something like a "Star Trek future" desirable, you're an enemy of humanity
If you see Star Trek as desirable, you're probably a hippie. Or a commie. Or both.
If you don't see Star Trek as desirable you're a sociopathic ancap, a pathological racist, or both.
you misread me
>Stable government, post-scarcity economy, strong military, and extremely competent diplomacy
Explain how this makes you an enemy of humanity without sounding like a moron.
A pastiche of humans in a society with a properly implemented globalism isn't even remotely close to at least a number of better futures, or true potential of humanity for good.
>Implying HFY isn't extremely globalist
The very idea of praising humanity as a whole is inherently a globalist idea, trying to do away with national differences in favor of a "human nationalism"
Have I said anything about praising humanity or any praise or it being a good thing?
The thing about Star Trek is that it's incredibly, incredibly naive. Naive to the point where even My Little Pony has a more logical foundation for its utopia.
Post-scarcity, just because they have replicators? Post-war? Did they figure out some cheat code for infinite land, infinite historical/ancestral sites, infinite and equal opportunity?
Hell, I don't bat an eye at the ideas of no racism or nationalism or all those other manufactured distractions, but an end to classism, caste systems, and all the other forms of elitism? Hell, Star Trek even maintains those various issues, and then wants to act like all the problems that stem from them could be solved first.
It's far from desirable, in the same way Atlas Shrugged is far from desirable, because anyone who tried to build a society based on those ideals would be crushed under the weight of the problems that they are desperate to pretend are not the real issues that need to be solved.
Hell, Piccard is a fricking landed noble with an inherited estate, and he wants to preach about things like equality and justice.
Wars don't only happen because of resource insufficiencies
That is true, but it is a prominent reason for them.
>t. only watched STD
Trek Post-scarcity is just as sci-fi as their warp drive. We know it works, but we don't know how.
Post-war is a matter of good enough productivity that makes the greed behind wars unprofitable compared to the alternative, plus a world tired of it after a devastatinf Word War. It's not a coincidence than the Federation is basically the US + the UN post WW2 in space.
Isn't the peace in Star Trek partly build on the last war humanity fought against itself so terrible?
But yeah. The economic system the peace is built upon is indeed handwaved.
My head cannon was that the winners of the eugenics war messed with the human genome enough to get rid of pesky things like selfishness and desire to question authority.
The humans of StarTrek are only human in appearance.
Have you seen the kinds of people who are into HFY? They're some of the cringiest frickers alive. You can tell when someone's biggest boast is the fact that they're human that they have nothing else to offer the world.
>What is the hatred for Humanity Frick Yeah
Just like most things /tg/ used to like, it sucks now
This includes: polearms, longbows, weird looking angels, coomerism, longswords, and Conan
HFY is inherently anti-Christian.
How so? If Jesus was both fully divine and fully human wouldn't that imply humans are pretty great?
Several reasons, the first and foremost being that pride is a sin, while HFY is the product of pride. The second being that if aliens exist, they were created by God and are a part of his divine plan as well, and in all likelihood are just as much made in his image as we are if they're sapient. The third is that Christianity calls for humans to resist the evil temptations that pull at them every day of their life, while HFY calls for them to embrace it.
I get what you're saying, but it still seems compatible with HFY. I mean unless the various aliens were also visted by Jesus, then Humanity has a singular place in the universe as God's missionaries. I don't think it would be much different than Christian opinions on the natives of the new world.
>The third is that Christianity calls for humans to resist the evil temptations that pull at them every day of their life, while HFY calls for them to embrace it.
What about human exceptionalism is inherently sinful?
Jesus not visiting the other aliens wouldn't necessary be a point of pride for humanity. Bear in mind that Jesus visited humanity because we were so sinful that only God sacrificing himself on the cross could save ourselves from our sins. If Jesus didn't sacrifice himself for aliens as well then that could mean that they don't have souls, or it could mean that they never needed to be saved in the first place.
>What about human exceptionalism is inherently sinful?
Any time you act based on pride you're going to go down a path of evil, in fact it pretty much always becomes a justification for doing evil, it happened with American exceptionalism, no reason it wouldn't for humans as well.
You know, considering aliens in Christianity context is based on presumption other aliens were actually constructed.
>Any time you act based on pride you're going to go down a path of evil
No, utterly not, it's extremely more complex than this.
No, it's not. Pride is known as the deadliest sin for a reason. Anytime we think we know better than God, we go down the road to Hell.
What does this even mean? If aliens weren't made by God, who else would have made them?
Fair enough, however it definitely wouldn't be HFY at that point.
I implied that either aliens aren't so alien (they pretend to be, and are alien to us, but not actually alien alien, like some conspiracy theories that are just fallen ones), or they wouldn't even exist.
Yes it is, all sins are deadly, but they have depths of varying levels of sophistication.
Gluttony is a simple one, being mechanically what it is, lust is extremely slippery and insidious, and can corrupt innocent, but pride?
Pride pertains to dignity of sapient beings, and specifically when said pride gets corrupted, it's dangerous like that. There's more to pride than instantly going to "know better than God" tier arrogance.
All pride is sinful, there is no "corrupted pride", there's just pride, and it is always evil.
Barring explicit definitions of it, it stands to reason that your current comprehension of good and evil is insufficient.
God is good, all that is opposed to God is evil. That is the Christian understanding of good and evil.
Considering the concept of the tree of knowledge, is it really the extent of their understanding? Knowledge of good and evil is beyond any deity.
If god is like a standard that lives up to goodness at all points of its being then yes, but abstraction itself is unbeholden to anyone, so posing things as opposition to god is in itself a risky comprehension failure to make.
Pride doesn't mean confidence or dignity, it means hubris.
Ah, a linguistical problem then.
In russian, гopдыня is superbia, whereas pride is гopдocть, which eng wiki article calls "haughtiness".
But the problem, is that even superbia, total self sufficiency and self capability without humility, which some define it as, isn't evil.
That's mere beginning of this complexity.
Every time, no exceptions. Don't talk back to your betters.
If talking to betters is the best thing you can come up with in life it's not surprising a religion with a notion of "slaves of god" became such a thing.
>that they never needed to be saved in the first place.
That would still be human exceptionalism, just in a more self flagellating way.
Americans are exceptional and everything we've ever done has been morally correct.
>The second being that if aliens exist, they were created by God and are a part of his divine plan as well
This is what Protestantism does to a mf.
Great yes, but it's the message here that poses humans as sole attention in this manner that contradicts.
Not concerning Christianity itself, I do hope you're not equating various types of pride here, though you are correct on this one. This particular type of daftness can be both innocent, healthy and proper, but it also can spiral out of control.
>If Jesus was both fully divine and fully human wouldn't that imply humans are pretty great?
No it doesn't, you're falling into the trap of pelagianic thinking (which is heretical).
Man was made in god's image, God is the greatest force there is and we are his servants second to none on this earth. Eat shit you Revisionist cuck
And whose to say only man was made in God's image?
>God is the greatest force there is
Wow, sounds like some anti-HFY shit, saying there's anything greater than humanity.
this is why HFY has been shit recently, it's always hurr durr humans are good at everything. It's never hey humans are resourceful and inventive or some other cool thing that makes us human.
Humans in a lot of HFY stories might as well not even be human.
>It's never hey humans are resourceful and inventive or some other cool thing that makes us human.
Boring and sterile as frick. Whatever happened to traits such as honor or lust or rage or strength of arms being distinctly human?
why would any of those traits be uniquely human?
Answer me.
>second to none on this earth
that seems irrelevant in stories not set on this earth
Fail
I've been known to write the occasional HMOFA. Intend to bank on the idea that humans are willing to go farther. The aliens might kill all of the fighting age men; humans will glass the planet from orbit and shoot down any fleeing civilian crafts.
What a dumb premise. Why are you projecting human qualities to aliens while making humans inhuman? That shit has been done to death.
You know, I'm not sure that glassing planets is inhuman in any way.
It's just military pragmatism.
Humans aren't willing to glass a single country and anyone that tries is painted as a villain. It's not even pragmatic. You destroy resources. You're not making just any HFY, you're making space-nazi fanfic (which is usually HFYs destination).
Some humans aren't, others would be. Some countries exist in such a state glassing them is a consideration.
As for resources, when a civilization is at a state it can afford destroying planets, resources aren't such a concern and it's not like planetary mass disappears anyway.
If the war is at that state, most military installations that matter would probably be on the orbit. Glassing planets "just because" is like a pizza cutter. All edge, no point. There already exists works where humanity takes things further that are far more interesting than just another planet destroyer.
Well, naturally, wars are done with reasons in mind, usually.
Also it depends on what war is it. Presuming installations being posed in orbit like that is too vague.
Spite is a fundamentally human thing. We used to follow the saber toothed cat that killed one of ours to where she sleeps. We'd kill her and her cubs mercilessly. It's easy to go scorched earth on something that isn't like you, and is a perceived threat.
But it isn't a human only thing.
Have any more imaginary caveman fantasy to support your imaginary spaceman fantasy?
Jesus you people are pathetic.
which works both ways. aliens are equally spiteful.
What was the turning point? HFY used to be Independence Day or Mass Effect, where freedom loving humans defended themselves or protected friendly aliens with our grit and resourcefulness. Was it the Colonel Quaritch speech? 40k getting more popular? HFY seems to mean killing everything but humans now.
Avatar and 40k almost certainly intersected to create HFY.
As with anything that gets a modicum of popularity, the good pieces gets polluted and diminished by endless regurgitation to the point where people forget why it was good in the first place, and then it's buried under tonnes of dumb and gay shit. The next batch of writers only see the gay shit and thinks that's how it supposed to be, so that's what they make. And then the cycle repeats until the medium is so watered down and so devoid of originality that it makes a fricking bored ape look creative.
HFY is typically badly written thinly veiled facism promoted by midwits.
A lot of your "Humanity frick yeah" people are very obviously American.
It's less "Humanity Yay!" and more "MERICA better than the rest of you" and it's very annoying to us non-burgers.
Good, stay annoyed. America is superior.
The issue isn’t humanity winning, it’s how humanity wins. They don’t win due being plucky individuals like Commander Shepherd or the guys from Independence day, nor do they win by pure chance like humanity in War of the Worlds, they win because they are human.
The issue with this is that the readers are human, so it doesn’t make the protagonists seem good because they’re just doing what any jackass can do, it just makes the aliens look like gigantic pussies.
>Humans are the strong race and a regular human can fight a platoon of enemy soldiers bare handed
Why are these aliens such colossal pussies? Watching a guy beat up an entire class of first graders by himself isn’t impressive or cool, it’s either uncomfortable, disturbing, or funny.
>Humans have great endurance they can run for miles without stopping
What fricking out of shape losers are these fat fricks? Are they slug people with no legs?
>Humans are tenacious once I saw a human strike an opponent with his skull
Who is so pussified that headbutting is unfathomable?
The issue is that to make human extremely good at something you have to take away basic competence from their enemies which makes their victories by their very nature seem unimpressive.
Hears an angle no one has used cause they're obsessed with "Muh warrior/soldier race" or "Muh death world" or "Muh Human spirit"
Humanity are storytellers. People scramble to find a way to make humanity special in not just HFY, or SCIFI or Fantasy in general, but they always seem to forget the one thing every society has shared across our history
We like to tell stories, we enjoy telling stories and hearing stories. Sure that won't let you rip an alien warmaster's skull out of his rectum, but weaving tales and building bullshit is practically in genetic code as a species. Frick, look how many similar myths and folklore are spread across the world. We like telling stories, and we're damn good at it.
ok, so what? should we assume other species don't tell stories? how do you propose to justify such an assumption?
Well, do you have any proof that other species do?
>What is the hatred for Humanity Frick Yeah?
It's essentially Mary Sue fanfiction bullshit for our entire species with the ultimate goal being to create some fantasized tribal enemy for us to unite against rather than simply moving past our need to form tribal enmities.
The only HFY I liked was the one where humanity was in an otherwise uninhabited sector of the galaxy because of an interstellar anomaly that psychically fried any of the other sapient races of the galaxy. Our lack of psychic ability allowed us, and all the creatures on our planet, to live in the maw. When we finally achieved interstellar travel and encountered alien life, they were horrified that 1) something existed in what they considered the dead zone, and 2) our comms were so shit it just sounded like slaughtered animals screaming.
Whoever wrote it was cringy as frick in their characterization, but I thought it was fun in our complete ignorance and lack of capability that we developed in complete safety because of it. It also gave a cute explanation on why we never encountered anything resembling intelligent life since we evolved in an area where no intelligent life could exist but they were actually everywhere outside our psychic desert.
I've read that one. I always thought it was funny that humanity just started fricking with the ayys after we realized they're afraid of us and give us ample room to grow due to the psychic bullshit zone.
the sound of a slaughtered animal screaming would be silence. dead animals can't scream.
Herein lies the problem with these threads. Anti-HFY people hate it because it's bad writing. Pro-HFY people love it because it's pro-human, and think that the people who hate it do so because they hate themselves. So you basically have people who have standards for writing quality butting heads with people who thinks this is supposed to be some sort of political misanthropy thing.
It'll be pretty freaky if it turns out that biotechnology is the norm and us (mostly) doing mechanical technology is odd. Like imagine humanity in robot power suits waiting for aliens to come on a moon and they see giant lumpy mounds of floating flesh at the horizon.
>HFY often suffers from setting up non-human elements to fail
>HFY often has an inflated sense of ego
>HFY often fails to understand the true potential of the 'other' and how their creations would function
>HFY often finds itself unable to present the complexities of internal group dynamics
I might enjoy a HFY story on occasion, but it often suffers from some brain rot of the average fan. I recall the start of the genre as HFY, and the subsequent decline.
Mind you, that last part is what often gets me the most. Oh when it's aliens invading suddenly we're humans but after this is over you go back to calling me a fricking Pier*gi.
I enjoy a bit of HFY. As a treat.
Does anyone have that comic with the alien talking about the /k/gay that defended him during a way, or something like that.
A story should, first, be interesting. "Look how great humans are" is quite dull.
>t. someone good for nothing.
lol mad
>t. stupid
Without having read the rest of the thread?
HFY sucks because no one wants to play out the appropriate pattern, where humans are the unique, weird precursor race that has died out.
>What is the hatred for Humanity Frick Yeah?
The main reason is that it is an inversion of the idea that Mankind is Weak and Overwhelmed.
Look at the majority of alien fiction from about, oh, 1950 on. Aliens have overwhelming technology (Earth vs the Flying Saucers) OR they are physically overwhelming to an almost supernatural degree (The Thing From Another World) OR they are manipulative, clever, and politically dominant (V).
All of that is easy to write because the 'scrappy underdog coming up with a scrappy plan to tenaciously overcome odds' is bog simple.
ALSO the majority of scifi nerds were underdogs - physically weak, emotionally unstable, outsiders, no social power, etc. It is *much* easier for your typical TTRPG GM to identify with a slower, weaker, poorer outsider than with a dominant position of any sort. They can write/GM from personal experience.
Making humans smarter/stronger/tougher is MUCH harder to write/GM because you have to explain why there is a conflict or problem with nuance and subtlety. And a majority, maybe a vast majority, of writers/GMs have NO IDEA what it is like to be stronger/smarter/more socially dominant/richer/etc. and cannot write from experience.
tl;dr weak humans are easier to GM/write
Easier to write? Really? Another extremely capable aliens get stopped by some humans and a string of nigh improbable coincidences starting with aliens themselves scenario?
It's a tacky cliche embraced by sociopaths