how do you explain it in-game when characters suddenly gain subclasses after beating up a bunch of goblins?
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how do you explain it in-game when characters suddenly gain subclasses after beating up a bunch of goblins?
I don't, that shit's moronic. No multiclassing allowed.
I don't play 5e and you shouldn't either.
Traditional multi-classing is fine, in my opinion, because it's a massive investment for minimal returns. Dual-classing is likewise.
AD&D-style dual classing has far better returns than multiclassing in 3.x or 5e. AD&D multiclassing is similar to them in that you'll always be a few levels behind, which just sucks if you're a spellcaster.
Yes but it takes an investment, and for a long time you're behind on HP.
Can you even fricking read? He clearly said subclass in the OP, not multiclass.
I've never had a player try to take a class without justifying it with roleplay, so I wouldn't know. Maybe try to find some better players.
Pretty much this. Even when I play, I always find a reason in-game to take another class. Hell, a couple times it was handed to me, so I figured "frick it, I guess I'm taking cleric levels now"
If we're playing 3rd edition or higher players are conditioned by video games and just want their ding. There's no need to explain it.
I don't, they need downtime to make whatever breakthrough they are ready for. If they don't take time to train, meditate, pray, study, etc, they don't get their level.
I don't. Levelling generally happen between adventures, and doubly so if you want to take a new class/switch careers/retrain/specialize.
Everything should be justified from an in-character perspective, always. Sometimes this is beyond simple and becomes largely unnecessary, but at other times a rationale needs to be presented and training time taken, etc.
If you're smart, you spend the ongoing "level" or equivalent going for something, which means that you're already rationalizing your next advancement. If you do it really well, you might even get extra XP or free abilities, a minor feat or talent as appropriate, etc.
In a game I'm running that's basically a introduction to a system for my players I just let them level up on the spot. The game isn't too serious anyway. I just want to teach them a new system
Then teach them in earnest, instead of giving them the wrong idea of the entire medium. The narrative and thematic circumstances form the basis of mechanical/systemic actions taken and played out, feeding back into the events.
Divorcing the game from narrative/thematic-mechanical/systemic fidelity and verisimilitude is idiotic. It should always go hand in hand.
This is not their first RPG. Most of them played for basically as long as I, they know how this shit works but it's a short, pulp campaign that was designed with teaching them how the system works. Wasting time on having them go back to town and level up wouldn't make sense, especially when most of them are divine casters so I can just explain them getting stronger by "your god granted you more strength". Don't get your panties in a twist Anon.
Have you tried not playing DnD?
No. Nobody has tried not playing D&D.
"Other RPGs" are mere figments of your fevered imagination.
I'd like to know exactly how switching to Don't Rest Your Head fixes any of the problems in D&D
Smaller chance of falling asleep during a dull af game?
I see what you did thar
Actual D&D doesn't have this issue.
Only WotC's cargo cult game does.
My PC devoured enemy essence and subsumed it into herself via internal alchemy techniques. Since she pulled a Mr. Anderson on Matrix suits, she now gnomes kung-fu.
Alternatively, she catalyzed her inner ki to a new level during the stress of battle. So naturally, defeating an orangutan with a porn magazine logically leads to her spamming ghost punches using the Way Of The Astral Self. The frick? 5e is slightly terrible for having these subclasses, but I can't actually put it into words. Why the frick is this setting off my 'shit taste' alarm?
You level up in time skips. Your levelling up is the result of you training in specific things. What kind of question IS that?
Do you perhaps simply not play games?
I am inclined to believe that one or both of these women are having sex with the creature in the middle, yet my knowledge of the monsterhunter games tells me that the floppy ears are a female-exclusive sexual characteristic of the monster species in question.
can someone tell me what is going on here?
The answer is >women
it's year of our lord 2012+10 anon, why would the lizard creature being female prevent one or both of them from having sex with it?
what's going on is exactly what you think is going on
>can someone tell me what is going on here?
>one of the girls is clearly pregnant
You should know better
magic
practicing makes you better at things
systems with subclasses where you get some random shit? you were always trying to get that thing, and now you've succeeded. by practicing. on goblins.
My games don't have classes, so I don't have to explain it. But if I did, I would explain it in a way that makes sense within the context of the setting.
Just in case you didn't know, different settings, especially fantasy settings, have different structures of logic, so one thing that makes sense in one setting can be complete nonsense in others.
In my games, you need to choose your subclass in character creation
I don't play D&D, but when I'm running a game, I have a quick rule of thumb: If it's a skill or ability you've been using on the most recent adventure, when you level up, XP buy, or whatever mechanic the system uses, you get the ability right away. If you haven't, you have to go somewhere and train with it (certain abilities will require actual trainers) before you see improvement. You won't suddenly gain brand new abilities after fighting unless those brand new abilities were somehow involved in fighting.
My game has "instant power granting", but it's done by gods and you need to find a church for that.
You stand before an Allfather god's golden statue, get "tested" and level up instantly in a very Warcraft-like ball of light, playing the sound and all.
You get rewads and praises if you level up many levels at once.
You can pay a fee and get "pre-tested" by a high ranking church cleric (For NPC's only, players know what they are getting) to know what powers are you getting
This leads to things like
>PC's not wanting to lvl up untill they get to the next big city, because they'll get more praise and fame
>PC's faking evil pre-tests
>Beloved by the party, but useless NPC's, getting pre-tested and discovering they can adventure a little more with the party
>Recurring villains getting stronger
>NPC's shenanigans, like the highest "Pope-like" holyman is a 12yo boy that got pre-tested as having 21 levels of cleric inside, but he can't be tested untill adulthood or his body will explode
you know what, that's pretty fricking cool
By the holy clairvoyance bestowed upon me, you have been pre-tested, and be certain to hold one status of Awesome in you!
"A god did it" is a more honest and forward reason than half this thread, gives you something you already wanted to play and you focus on the story/game.
Imagine playing a campaign based on the levels of your chracter, to justify them, like this
This is why you should get higher skill ranks for using skills and better proficiency with your weapon by using it in combat
You should also learn new skills from other party members, trainers, books, or whatever the frick
There's no reason the wizard shouldn't be able to teach someone how to cast magic and no reason a fighter can show you how to swing a sword
Never seen that happen.
Neither in D&D 5e or 3.5e.
From what I've seen, usually it's something that doesn't need much explaining, like a barbarian getting a couple of levels in fighter or rogue (guy who fights is fighting better), it's something that's already tied to the character (cleric of the god of knowledge and magic taking a level of wizard), or it's caused by the world/plot (we got a power blessing from a dragon, time to get a draconic themed class), that kind of thing.
I agree with this anon. OP you're going to have to actually provide a specific example, because every class that receives something that would be jarring to suddenly appear. Well they generally by the rules already have it at level 1.
>Barbarian kills bunch of goblins
"Huh.....I think I found Kord."
"Really? Just now?"
"Yeah. His strength flows through me."
"Praise him"
>Starting at level 1.
Eh, sorry I will find a new game.
>character is a half elf wizard
>has been studying his entire life, training to understand the ancient art of the bladesong
>hits level 2, finally feels his decades of training coalesce into a breakthrough, creating an interwoven dance of magic and fencing
>denied because the DM is some homosexual on Ganker
>devotes life to something called 'bladesong'
>"interwoven dance of magic and fencing"
>thinks he gets to call anyone else homosexual
>a 5e DM who doesn’t just start the PCs at level 3
What a strange creature you are
I truly despise D&D's notion of multi-classing but that also goes hand in hand with the way leveling work as you only have access to certain abilities and the rest are locked behind dead levels and levels you may never actually utilize.
To me, it makes more sense to have a system where all your abilities are up front and your leveling system either allows you to tack on a new abilitiy (an ability from another class if you will) or to enhance your existing ones that are scaled for the sort of session you are looking for
I like the idea of talking with the DM and negotiating level up enhancements or homebrewing minor abilities based on what the character has accomplished and the direction his player wants to take in his development.
But people are like “uhhhhh too much thinking and also MUH GAME BALANCE”
Clearly that is something that would work well with the DM and their players because the DM ultimately has the say which a lot of people forget or ignore entirely.
I just find it weird that it's necessary to disrupt the progression of one class to tack on another full class just to access a couple of features it has and still never being able to fully achieve all of both side's abilities.
Honestly I think this is where Feats would be most appropriate instead of gating what should be basic abilities behind Feats; You take the essence of a given class, make it not as strong as the original version's ability and in exchange for not progressing an inherent ability you get a new one that then progresses normally along with everything else. Vastly more elegant and allows you to still realize the identity of your core class.
For example, if you wanted a barbarian that has a Warlock pact weapon the Pact weapon would be the feat the barbarian could take along with maybe some minor spell casting on top.
These things don’t happen because most people won’t let themselves think outside of the collection of rulebooks they’ve amassed for hundreds of dollars. If they did, they would have to question why they spent all that money in the first place. For players who haven’t bought the books, it’s more about needing a gamer identity. “I play 5e” means “I go by what’s in WotC’s shiny-covered tomes only.”
But they also say in the books that the DM has final say so clearly they don't read the books either.
I bet gamers are too soft-brained these days to even begin to think about the idea that one person has ultimate and arbitrary control over a group experience.
To be just a tad bit generous I assume there are cases where if you go to LGS or you have shit like the Pathfinder league, or whatever the frick it's called, then your ability to free-form is stunted as opposed to just a personal group of you and your friends hence the hightened severity of the rule autism not that it can't manifest anywhere if someone calls bullshit on the GM's reasoning and uses the very some book as a bludgeon. At the end of the day it's still a group game where the GM is generally given that power by their players to make those dictates.
>one person has ultimate and arbitrary control over a group experience
They don't have to run it in an arbitrary manner, but then again, D&D has no internal consistency or logic, so that would be too much alteration for the DM.
>Sorcerer, Rogue, Fighter, Barbarian, Monk
During the battle something inside of you changed, something that you had within you that you now realized for the first time. It yearns to be unleashed.
>Cleric, Warlock, Druid, Paladin
During your fight, it felt as if *something* were speaking to you, guiding you toward power to help you further. Swear yourself to it, and it can be yours.
>Wizard, Bard, Ranger
A training that you taken had when you were younger now finally has meaning. A forgotten skill returns to you like muscle memory, and careful preparation will let you utilize it.
Goddamn, it's not hard AT ALL just be creative for one second.
"Obviously god has blessed me for beating up all these ugly goblins."
They pick up a few tricks from a local specialized in that sort of thing in their mandatory 2 weeks of downtime every time they gain a level.
Dear fricking god I recognise that doujin you fricking degenerate