Holy shit, I've caught a Ganker thread before it got archived! So, my opinion is here.
archive vn/b8N9v
The artstyle is vomit-inducing SJW trash > Looks like something from Battlerite. Ugly women and cartoony demons. Even an anime ayaya RTS with waifus (like Eternal Return) would be better - at least, it wouldn't make me wanna vomit. > (Sorry for strong wording, it's Steam forums, I hope, it is constructive feedback.)
Since then, I can vouch for mobile gaming (I have sold my soul to Mobile Legends) - and mobile games are infinitely closer to old Blizzard than this unfunny cuck millennial shit. I'm not joking, in Mobile Legends, every chick is hot and wears thighhighs, and every dudebro is an epic burly man from thirsty gay teenage fantasies.
Chink artstyle is more trad and based than this. Play DORF.
P.S. There is a good point from the casual perspective here.
rockpapershotgun com/the-new-rts-from-former-starcraft-2-devs-looks-a-lot-like-starcraft-2
>game made by 2(dos) with a nonexistent budget pays shills on Ganker
I am truly sorry that Shartgate is looking that bad, but there is no need to lash out irrationally
>>game developer can't shill his own product
Apologies, I don't have control over what makes me hard. DORF just has that OOMPH I wish Shartgate had.
Even though I will agree with Grubby that DORF's pixel art is much less clear than Brood War's (or C&C's). Personally, it reminds me of that old Ukrainian game Cossacks - too many sprites or something?
Yes, he does shill here. We know this and he's admitted to it as well.
>Yes, he does shill here.
I'm not him because I'm a namegay. I do shill against BasedGate. They have shown basically nothing, they have released two hype pieces - both of which have objectively failed at their job (worse).
People say cinematics are expensive, but I have a hunch that a 30 sec trailer à la CHIMERA would have been money well spent (01:26:00).
A brain damaged tasteless coomer like you should not ever comment on other art styles or matters of aesthetics, even if you are coincidentally right. What are the odds you think that the D2 prostitute sorc looks better than the D2R one? Near guaranteed I say
>What are the odds you think that the D2 prostitute sorc looks better than the D2R one? Near guaranteed I say
I'm really confused as to your argument and your image of me. The Resurrected sorc looks better? Has the same skin colour, thick thighs, high HD definition?
In the AMA they said that the story would be something like Marvel MCU stuff. I like Marvel a lot, but everything after phase 3 is not interesting anymore, and anything after the Guardians of the Galaxy became a comedy movie. I believe that they are going into this comedic style that was adopted later. I'm totally going back to SC2.
>In the AMA they said that the story would be something like Marvel MCU stuff.
Wait, that's bad. They seem to pan out dangerously close to the unfunny millennials.
Yeah, if they start to do Marvel quips all over the campaign it won't be fun to play. Say what you want, but WoL and HotS don't really have quips all the time. Everything feels "epic".
In the AMA they said that the story would be something like Marvel MCU stuff. I like Marvel a lot, but everything after phase 3 is not interesting anymore, and anything after the Guardians of the Galaxy became a comedy movie. I believe that they are going into this comedic style that was adopted later. I'm totally going back to SC2.
>I like Marvel a lot, but everything after phase 3 is not interesting anymore, and anything after the Guardians of the Galaxy became a comedy movie. >likes marvel >likes guardians of the galaxy >knows what the 'phases' are and whatever 'phase 3' is
NORMIES GET OFF MY BOARD REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Even setting atrocious art style aside, the gameplay looks like a fricking mobile game.
This shit is going to bomb HARD if they don't put all the focus on PvE co-op.
>bomb HARD
afaik its f2p, not a fan of art style myself i also doubt there will be campaign lol, game looks very basic right now and they seem to put a lot of emphasis on multiplayer gameplay.
Sounds like PvE/SP is going to be an afterthought and they are chasing that e-sports rabbit just like every fricking failed competitive RTS released in the last decade, shame.
I thought all those failures and the popularity of SC2 co-op mode would teach the devs something, but guess not.
They are letting themselves get cucked on the
co-op front by Immortal
No offense to the Immortal devs, but I can't see that game taking off considering how virtually no hype exists behind it. Not even most RTS players know this game exists, let alone anyone in the mainstream.
>the lead Frozen Throme campaign dev on the team >the mascot is an ugly brownskinned woman
https://stormgatenexus.com/article/monk-interview-back2warcraft
Meanwhile, TFT was an epic slash between Arthas emasculating Illidan. What went wrong?
>Meanwhile, TFT was an epic slash between Arthas emasculating Illidan.
Did you forget that befire Arthas Illidan was already emasculated by Maiev and player literally had to save Illidan from a cage? Or that Arthas an Illidan barely even met until the final level of the TFT undead campaign?
>Illidan was already emasculated by Maiev
It was Kael'thas' emasculating Maiev, plus Vashj character development (imagine underwater snake bawds conquering a desert, very epic). FGS' gaping StormGAYt will have nothing of this caliber, let's face it.
TFT was peak RTS, peak Blizzard, and peak Warcraft. Frick, I wish I were conscious around the time when Blizzard trashed Westwood with BW, then took their sweet time releasing RoC, AND THEN delivered the most brilliant expansion to it. They literally copied LotV missions from the TFT campaign such as the Tomb of Sargeras, 12 years later.
>Or that Arthas an Illidan barely even met until the final level of the TFT undead campaign?
L and Light never met for like a dozen episodes in tbh Noto, so what? The yaoi tension was palpable throughout. And in the Symphony of Frost & Flame, Ner'zhul poured all of his essence into his boy, it was such a gripping moment.
>I wish I were conscious around the time when Blizzard trashed Westwood with BW >L and Light never met for like a dozen episodes in tbh Noto, so what? The yaoi tension was palpable throughout.
You don't seem to be conscious right now. If you are living in Canada then you should consider euthanasia. And if you don't, then you should take a bath with powered up toaster, i heard it cures moronation.
As a SC2 gay, I'm happy. I was afraid it's gonna be casualized as frick - tiny maps, a handful of units to control, etc. Turned out to be nothing like that, I'm actually kinda concerned about how many active abilities units have.
Concerned about visual bloat though, but overall looks good.
>visual bloat
Honestly I expected much worse considering all games these days are filled with particles everywhere. I managed to get what was going on in all scenarios they showed pretty well.
Maybe there are even some VFX options to reduce shit further like the dust and smoke.
looks horrible and plays horrible.
I understand that it's alpha, but even with all the effects and stuff we can already tell what the game is about. I'm not sure if I'll play it.
The gameplay looks limited, the micro is annoying, with that drops...
Micro looks slow as frick, the building seems lacking and the art direction is generic. Is this how brood war boomers feel; I'm going to be playing the same game for another decade.
pffft. The guys over at Back2Warcraft were hyping it up a bit. I expected it to be more similar to war3, with a focus on campaign but it looks like a shitty mp only starcraft clone
Sounds like PvE/SP is going to be an afterthought and they are chasing that e-sports rabbit just like every fricking failed competitive RTS released in the last decade, shame.
I thought all those failures and the popularity of SC2 co-op mode would teach the devs something, but guess not.
Name three successful RTS games that didn't have multiplayer.
1 year ago
Anonymous
nta, but that was a very badly worded question.
A lot of RTS were successful AND had multiplayer. I can't stand W3 multiplayer but I really like single player.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>didn't have multiplayer.
ignoring the goalpost moving Age of Mythology, Warcraft 3, and Red Alert are all well remembered for their singleplayer campaigns
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Wc3
The multiplayer side of it spawned a whole new genre (moba) and supported the growth of another (td) as well as being played like 10x times more often than the rts and campaign side of it.
It's true about red alert though. Still, all of the biggest games are multiplayer.
1 year ago
Anonymous
You're obviously too young to know it, but Warcraft 3 was a huge e-sport back in the day, it was one of the WCG disciplines for many years.
Age of Mythology was also a WCG discipline for a year in 2003, which contributed to its success. Quoting Bruce Shelley:
http://www.gamespy.com/pc/age-of-mythology-the-titans/6556p1.html >GameSpy: Who do you feel are the primary audience for the Age games? Single-player or multiplayer gamers? And, which audience do you primarily design for? >Bruce Shelley: Both, actually. We believe that one of the keys to the commercial success of our Age games has been their ability to appeal to both hardcore and casual gamers, including single-player and multiplayer fans. We put a lot of effort into the single-player campaign in Age of Mythology, for example, because our focus groups indicated that that was important to a high percentage of our players. At the same time, we put a lot of effort in the multiplayer game because that is important in creating buzz about a game. Plus, many of our people really enjoy that aspect of play. The random map games work for both audiences. We then provided a variety of maps, game types, and level of difficulty settings. All these choices mean a very broad audience of gamers can find a type of game (in The Titans) that suits their skill and taste, and they can all feel like they got a lot of value for their investment of money and time.
As for Red Alert, let me quote Joseph Bostic:
https://funambulism.com/2014/08/15/a-metric-ton-of-my-old-command-conquer-interviews/comment-page-1/ >JB: I think C&C was the first RTS multiplayer game. The multiplayer aspect is what really launched the RTS genre as there is endless replayability when human opponents are involved.
Once again, low iq SPbabbies have been utterly btfo and should keep quiet.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Stronghold/Stronghold Crusader, Majesty, Total War series. >but those have multiplayer
So does every RTS
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Stronghold/Stronghold Crusader, Majesty
Niche and dead >Total War series.
Not an RTS
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Niche and dead
Moving the goalposts. You asked for three successful RTS games, not three RTS games still actively played today. People still play those games regardless. >Game well known for its real time large scale battles is not an RTS
There are creeps there and a purple dot thing that the creeps were guarding. I don't know what to think, I think I'll just go back to SC2 and continue to suffer.
>no heroes >no items, no shops
So you want even more micro? >the blandest, most generic sci-fi setting
As opposed to the blandest, most generic fantasy setting of wc3? >no story
Are you one of those homosexuals who consider themselves "RTS fans" after playing through the campaign aka the babby's tutorial mode a few times?
>So you want even more micro?
I wanted a warcraft like experience, not starshit. And especially not mobile startshit.
>As opposed to the blandest, most generic fantasy setting of wc3?
From my understanding many of the original devs of warcraft3 are working on this game. So I expected some improvement after 2 decades - obviously was asking for too much.
>Are you one of those homosexuals who consider themselves "RTS fans" after playing through the campaign aka the babby's tutorial mode a few times?
I think you belong to /vm/, this is /vst/ lad. Take your eshit somewhere else.
>Take your eshit somewhere else.
They promised to appeal to subhuman casuals like you multiple times, since the very first announcement. So don't worry, you'll get your pve mode where no one is gonna hurt your fragile ego.
holy shit I knew it was bad but I didnt know it was THIS bad. It's like you took SC2, slapped on the WC3R color shader and level scale, and sucked all the soul right out of them. There's barely any feedback from the attacks, they look and sound like you're a fricking fairy sprinkling comicbook VFX on enemies instead of chucking mortar shells or whatever the frick that was.
I thought a few minutes about a suitable insult for the not-marines and came up blank. It's so fricking bad I can't even insult it
Insanely underwhelming. After all this time... if you gave me this much money, I'd have much more of a game and it would be 100x better. They're on UE5, they didn't have to develop new game engine.
They really did spent all this investor bux on diversity hires and s.oy lattes
This. The artstyle is so bad. It's going even further into cartoony territory than even SC2. Frick man, I just wanted it to be good. I was holding on to this hope that "They know what they are doing" like a moron.
I'm not even old yet, I'm technically a zoomer, but why does everything look so soulless? I don't even know what "soul" means but this shit has 0 of it. A single sprite of a dead dragoon from SC1 has more soul than this entire game
They probably spent all that money on marketing, it has a shitload more hype than the game deserves to have. Seriously, it looks like a cheap chink clone of starcraft 2 AND it's F2P, WHO THE FRICK GETS EXCITED FOR SHIT LIKE THIS
Anyone else really thrilled and satisfied with the result? Gameplay looks really fun, units look great. They are taking all of the best ideas from all of the different rts, while also adding things that are new. Interesting things on the map, creeps to kill from wc3, forest to block bigger armies, dog functions as a scout from aoe2. Kill time is high filtering sc2 shitters with boring no micro fights.
I'm not the biggest fan of the artstyle, but I don't really hate it like others here do. I do like that it is very clear what is going on.
I agree, the gameplay looks really fun and they seem like they are trying to appeal to casuals with a coop vs ai mode and a single player campaign so will definitely be trying the game on release.
My worry is that I wont like any of the launch factions. I think there are 2 launch factions, the human resistance and the demons, both which don't look very appealing to me. I think there is also a third faction that is either a third launch faction or will be released shortly after the game releases.
The humans seem to be generic humans and I just hope the demons aren't a "small number of units but each unit is stronger" faction like the protoss are in sc2. If those are the only two factions I'll try out the game and then probably just wait for the next faction to come out since those two seem boring to me.
They seem to have fused WC3 humans with SC2 terrans. Artstyle seems a bit odd. Gameplay seems to be SC2 but slower, which I enjoy. I hope they achieve a good middle ground between shit taking forever to die in WC3 and everything dying in an instant in SC2.
I really dislike the siege tank equivalent. It needs more oomph and it looks like shit. The shot was too slow and seems really easy to avoid, which would make the unit basically useless.
The infantry units look and sound great.
Honestly, the only real complaint I have is that I think the game needs more personality. Gameplay seems like something I will enjoy greatly.
Half the reason Black folk are screaming muh chink phone game is because of that and the flat colors.
Style aside, I think they have a similar problem (though maybe not as much?) as Reforged - nothing is distinct enough from the background and from each others.
Dogs reminded me of AoE4
Well... let's all go back to SC2 and hope that MS will continue the development of the game.
Maybe they could hire the director and the writer to write a new expansion.
i'm not sure what i was looking at when i saw it
i dont mind the phone like graphics or whatever, but just have this question
why would i play this over aoe2 or starcraft?
Looks like more WC3 than SC2 in terms of gameplay, everything seems slow and hard to kill, not that that's bad.
But holy shit, the artstyle/design is absolute garbage
why does everyone and their mum repeat the same shit that multiplayer doesn't sell from that e-celeb. This guy exlusively plays sp, of course he is going to shill for sp only rts:
I'm not saying that having singeplayer with an ai is bad but saying that's the only reason that people play rts is quite a false statement. clearly multiplayer keeps rts alive long term.
>why does everyone and their mum repeat the same shit that multiplayer doesn't sell from that e-celeb
/vst/ is full of literal redditors who consider themselves RTS fans because they used to play singleplayer campaigns as kids. When they tried to get into multiplayer later in their lives, it turned out that MP matches are nothing like stomping the AI by turtling and then amoving a blob of high end units. It's like a completely different game all of a sudden, and they suck at it. So they keep screeching about "meta", "apm requirements", "boring build orders", etc., which sounds absolutely deranged to any actual RTS fan.
>which sounds absolutely deranged to any actual RTS fan.
I know you don't know this, but saying things like this is a dead giveaway of someone on the spectrum. It's alright to be passionate about a hobby, but you're projecting your intense passion onto 8 billion strangers on the planet.
I implore you to stop being a moronic feral Black person sperg and stop posting. I know you can maintain high APM, but can you maintain a healthy relationship with another human being? I highly doubt it
>you're projecting your intense passion onto 8 billion strangers
8 billion people on the planet are RTS fans?
I'm afraid that you're the one projecting.
I played a guy in SC2 who fits this. After checking his match history it turned out he only played co-op/single player and I was his first MP game. He opened by building 50 cannons with no units. When i steamed rolled him around 8 minutes he accused me of hacking and reported me. I called him a scrub and he threatened to call police on me KEK
Kek. I feel like this guy, only it was WC3TFT at around 04-05 and it was literally my first time playing the game at the local LAN club with some friends. Except i just assumed that yep, looks like i suck at this, and proceeded to play CS with some other guys while friends finished the match.
>/vst/ is full of literal redditors
no place on the internet is as bad at competitive games as Ganker, /vst/, those boards are full of sim4, paradox trannies and console morons who cant play rts for shit.
answer is as always "it depends"
I wouldn't pick a game up if it doesn't have a singleplayer campaign. I wanna play through a cool story as a "commander" or whatever. Play some asymmetrical missions with varied objectives. If I like the game after that, I'll stay for mp, but not for long. Coop PVE in SC2 was pretty cool.
>why does everyone and their mum repeat the same shit that multiplayer doesn't sell from that e-celeb
/vst/ is full of literal redditors who consider themselves RTS fans because they used to play singleplayer campaigns as kids. When they tried to get into multiplayer later in their lives, it turned out that MP matches are nothing like stomping the AI by turtling and then amoving a blob of high end units. It's like a completely different game all of a sudden, and they suck at it. So they keep screeching about "meta", "apm requirements", "boring build orders", etc., which sounds absolutely deranged to any actual RTS fan.
this guy on the other hand will absolutely play the mp-only game, probably for years
The real answer is "you absolutely need both", as Bruce Shelley pointed out twenty years ago
You're obviously too young to know it, but Warcraft 3 was a huge e-sport back in the day, it was one of the WCG disciplines for many years.
Age of Mythology was also a WCG discipline for a year in 2003, which contributed to its success. Quoting Bruce Shelley:
http://www.gamespy.com/pc/age-of-mythology-the-titans/6556p1.html >GameSpy: Who do you feel are the primary audience for the Age games? Single-player or multiplayer gamers? And, which audience do you primarily design for? >Bruce Shelley: Both, actually. We believe that one of the keys to the commercial success of our Age games has been their ability to appeal to both hardcore and casual gamers, including single-player and multiplayer fans. We put a lot of effort into the single-player campaign in Age of Mythology, for example, because our focus groups indicated that that was important to a high percentage of our players. At the same time, we put a lot of effort in the multiplayer game because that is important in creating buzz about a game. Plus, many of our people really enjoy that aspect of play. The random map games work for both audiences. We then provided a variety of maps, game types, and level of difficulty settings. All these choices mean a very broad audience of gamers can find a type of game (in The Titans) that suits their skill and taste, and they can all feel like they got a lot of value for their investment of money and time.
As for Red Alert, let me quote Joseph Bostic:
https://funambulism.com/2014/08/15/a-metric-ton-of-my-old-command-conquer-interviews/comment-page-1/ >JB: I think C&C was the first RTS multiplayer game. The multiplayer aspect is what really launched the RTS genre as there is endless replayability when human opponents are involved.
Once again, low iq SPbabbies have been utterly btfo and should keep quiet.
You need good singleplayer to attract a large crowd of casuals when the game initially releases. A large player population in turn attracts hardcore players who will maintain the clout and keep your game relevant for years to come. This is why Stormgate will be f2p and will have singleplayer and coop while targeting SC2 fans.
After having watched that video, your post sounds incredibly disingenuous towards the arguments he gave. Also, whether he mostly plays SP or not is mostly irrelevant.
Looks like mix of sc2 with wc3(zoom level) but has terrible art style and textures, it has the same shitty blurry graphics as mobile games. Who the frick thought it was a good idea.
It's a streaming friendly art style. Panning the camera over a screen with a lot of distinct details results in the video encoder shitting itself and producing tons of artifacts.
I can tell units apart easily in WC3 and SC2. Granted I'm used to them, I can also see details on them despite my shitty eyesight. In this gameplay units look like blobs.
>esports focus
Dead on arrival. >normal people want a fun game, good campaign or compstomp, not caring too much for meta, build orders, etc >esport pros will play whatever is popular enough to make money >esport wannabes just want to watch esport pros play like the cucks they are, possibly thinking they will totally be a pro some day too or just that they somehow share in the "glory" by watching >normal people are turned off by the esport asiaticclick meta focus and either don't buy the game or leave after a week >esport pros see the lack of popularity and realize there's no money to be made here so they too leave after the contract with the dev/publisher expires >most wannabes follow the pros to another game, a few of the die-hard sweaties keep metaslaving in PvP until little by little they all give up too and the game hits 0 concurrent players
Every time.
They mentioned a campaign, a co-op vs AI mode, and custom maps. The game is even f2p. I dunno where people are getting this narrative that this is gonna be a hardcore RTS for hardcore RTS gamers only, they obviously want casual appeal.
nta, but while they mentioned that it will be a game good to both pros and casuals, the gameplay they showed was a bit too much catered to the former.
But, if they manage to get good map editor, like the WC3, I might be interested more. Frick, I miss WC3 and its custom games.
That's fair, this trailer was definitely focused on just showing a 1v1 ladder match with micro. Presumably because that's what's ready to be shown off at this point. I'm not saying this game will 100% be good, it might very well still bomb, but they're definitely aware that focusing entirely on esport is a bad idea, and their plans for custom maps, co-op etc. at the very least SOUND good
>Dead on arrival.
it's too often hard for the hardcore audience to gauge what their product looks like to the casuals, the barrier between the worlds is so impregnable, many don't even realise it's there.
Frost Giant Studios strikes me as a developer utterly lacking in "vision" or "aesthetics" for their game. They say all the right words to the multiplayer crowd, they're actually quite in touch, yet they seem to have lost sight of the bigger picture.
Like, even making a StarCraft 2-clone in 2023 is rather clueless, considering there has not been a hero RTS since the days of Warcraft 3 (maybe besides Dawn of War 3 and Spellforce 3?). Another funny thing is that Immortal: Gates of Pyre has been in development for years, and it's an even more simplified StarCraft.
Regarding the campaign... Oh boy, I wouldn't hold my breath for it at all. Coming back to the "aesthetics" question, they seem to be making it as bland and unassuming as possible. Just as the gameplay is basically SC2 (with minor differences such as neutral NPCs), so does the visual style scream a LoL-clone, with washed-up colours, cringy mechs with machine guns, and a female protagonist (who's not even hot like the bazillion female heroes in Mobile Legends).
In the end, it is impressive how one could be so out of touch. I would love to be wrong, of course. But in the best case scenario, it will only become StarCraft 3 (by cannibalising the population of SC2 and some of WC3). And the tragedy is that StarCraft 2 is the easiest RTS to get into these days - precisely because it's popular! I swear, I played it a few months ago, and the bronzies are actually 100% bronze. (It's Brood War, with its barely 1.5k concurrent players in the West, is an impenetrable brick wall, deserving the infamy.)
Yeah lol sure they did anon, sure they did. Might need to take off those nostalgia glasses.
Also SC2 was clearly an indie game from a newly established and crowd funded studio and not had huge company money behind it. And it also did not have a genre defining prequel game to it which made development way easier. Right Anon? Right?
1 year ago
Anonymous
what the frick is this moronic gibbering? kys, idiot
remove the heroes from wc3 and the terrible, terrible damage from sc2 and the result will inevitably be bland - those are the focus points of the entire designs
that they haven't presented something to fill this void is concerning to say the least
I can list a dozen of things I didn't like but in general it looks good. The standard stuff is there. Hope to see some innovative but not gimmicky stuff from the not-zerg and not-protoss races.
I HATE the dotted acronyms as unit names
I HATE that giant JRPG sword dude design, and from the video it doesn't even seem like the unit has any actual purpose to exist
The not-siege tank seems too slow and impactless right now
Also the model by itself makes it very unclear to me whether it's sieged or not
The minigun robot being outdpsed this hard by a couple of not-marines just makes me think about sc2 in a bad way
The infantry only forests are neat, but I thought it was placed a bit too close to the base
The rest is... ok? Serviceable?
>I HATE that giant JRPG sword dude design, and from the video it doesn't even seem like the unit has any actual purpose to exist
he's supposed to do whatever slow zealots are doing now, maybe he'll even get the legs upgracde instead of charge from sc2 >The minigun robot being outdpsed this hard by a couple of not-marines just makes me think about sc2 in a bad way
He has a piercing attack so I'm guessing he's the equivalent of firebat, his purpose is to counter low hp melee units, not to compete with marines.
>he's supposed to do whatever slow zealots are doing now
You might as well make not-marines, no? They look like they're in the similar price range seeing as how spammable they were >maybe he'll even get the legs upgracde
Yeah, that's probably a given >the equivalent of firebat, his purpose is to counter low hp melee units
Ok, fair, but this made me think that the match being a mirror really hurt the showcase
The DotA formula of AoS has been generic and uninspired since WC3 times already. There were a bajillion of AoS. There has been nothing inspiring or interesting about DotA since the mid-2000s.
Is remastered brood war has better unit controls? I remember pathfinding was borked when I tried to play it like 10 years ago as a kid. Also 12 units maximum to select is stupid
>functional ladder.
I tried getting into BW this February, while Korea reaches 30k concurrent players, the total Western population is barely 1.5k, and playing that is hitting your head against the brick wall, unfortunately. (Yes, I lost every PvT while playing Protoss. I could only win a Zealot rush in Protoss mirror.) At least, both WC3 and SC2 have the players.
Same. I hate the visual style of new blizzard, world of warcraft and its success has been a disaster for aesthetic design, even the new diablo games have that rubbery cartoonish tinge to them. Warcraft 3 was always the worse RTS compared to starcraft/brood war. On the bright side, brood war's competitive scene is still strong and the remaster didn't butcher it like warcraft's did (inb4 hair splitting over individual unit portraits, the overall remaster is great if you're not a contrarian).
Yeah it's definitely more like the prism. It's usually done with slow hitting units, since they can shoot and get picked up while reloading their shots.
Nobody likes to look at ugly games.
I trust them with the gameplay, I played hundreds of hours of SC2 coop. I just don't think the artstyle is up to par.
>I thought RTS players weren't graphic Black folk
Readable graphics are hugely important for an RTS game. Tempest Rising looks sweet but it's gonna be dogshit to play precisely because of its fancy graphics.
AoE4 fell apart because the visuals were unclear. AoE3 did a much better job by distinguishing units with their uniforms and other equipment, rather than just by making the weapons prominent.
I'm a design Black person and the unit design is generic af
>I thought RTS players weren't graphic Black folk
Readable graphics are hugely important for an RTS game. Tempest Rising looks sweet but it's gonna be dogshit to play precisely because of its fancy graphics.
AoE4 fell apart because the visuals were unclear. AoE3 did a much better job by distinguishing units with their uniforms and other equipment, rather than just by making the weapons prominent.
not sure what these guys are talking about, everything seems super readable
>not sure what these guys are talking about, everything seems super readable
It's about what your eyes are trained to see. I see mecha-men with weapons, not clear "swordsmen" or "gunners". I can identify the worker and the heavy, but there's already room for confusion.
Talking about the unit model. I don't normally clue in to size and weaponry.
Maybe it'll work out for you and others. It's just rough for me, at least for now.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Do you have problem with SC or WC units too?
Honestly I can't say I have the same problem, but I got used to differentiate units based on how they hold rectangles in C&C.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Do you have problem with SC or WC units too?
SC, yes. WC, no.
>I'm a design Black person and the unit design is generic af
So how would you make a non-generic design for >space soldier with gun and armor >space solider with big sword and armor
and have both look different to distinguish them for gameplay reasons but yet similar to look like they are from the same faction while also looking somewhat like a small type humanoid looking unit instead of a floating-spider with floating non connected joints and keeping to the cartoonish art style of the game.
>So how would you make a non-generic design for
NTA. Instead of using bulky, armored designs, make thinly-armored suits to resemble real-life uniforms.
countless RTS have tried thin/realistic proportions. it plays like ass.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>countless RTS have tried thin/realistic proportions. it plays like ass.
AoE2 is still one of the top 2 RTS games.
1 year ago
Anonymous
AOE has the same units for every "faction" save for their unique units.
1 year ago
Anonymous
it's also an unreadable mess, but since everyone just masses one type of unit at a time it doesn't really matter
1 year ago
Anonymous
In AoE2, units are distinguished first by their garb and silhouette. There is no trouble distinguishing them.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>AOE has the same units for every "faction" save for their unique units.
Visually, yes. In practice, no. A Burmese halberdier is not a Viking pikeman is not a Spanish halberdier is not a Japanese halberdier is not a Malian pikeman.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Don't start moving goalposts, Anon's problem was with unit visuals.
1 year ago
Anonymous
I misunderstood. The visuals are fine, because the units are distinguished from each other by their uniforms. This doesn't cause confusion. It makes visual recognition very easy.
I remember reading the lance guy will has a shield upgrade.
I think they need to add details to show they are fighting demons. Maybe something religious, I don't know.
I can give you an example from starcraft itself. The armor of the marines in the game have turbines on their backs, because otherwise they couldn't deal with zergs on top of them. Shit like that goes a long way to add personality to your game.
>and keeping to the cartoonish art style of the game.
ok, for a point number 1 I don't like the cartoony artstyle in the first place. SC2 had it, but this game goes even deeper into it and it's aproaching fricking clash royale territory.
point number 2, "If you can't make it better BY YOURSELF then you can't criticize it" is a silly statement. Now for the actual questions >So how would you make a non-generic design for space soldier with gun and armor
Start by not remaking terran marine 1 to 1. Fricking hell, they even have the same vents on their backs by the look of it.
Do NOT lean into gigantic pauldrons again, it's overdone. The bulky space marine armor is unnecesary in general, humans are fighting demons on earth in this one. If you wanna do power armor (which you don't HAVE to do), "literally space marine" is not the only design you can go for.
Problem is, unit's role usually dictates their looks to a degree, and if you are repeating every role from starcraft/warcraft 1 to 1 then you gonna have to stretch your imagination in attempt to make the same unit look different. But exact mechanical simularity of units is another problem and I fricking typed way too much already
you just ruined the game's readability. they're chunky for a very good reason.
oh yeah bro, the lanky ass zerglings or ghosts are completely unreadable, uh huh. moron
I remember reading the lance guy will has a shield upgrade.
I think they need to add details to show they are fighting demons. Maybe something religious, I don't know.
I can give you an example from starcraft itself. The armor of the marines in the game have turbines on their backs, because otherwise they couldn't deal with zergs on top of them. Shit like that goes a long way to add personality to your game.
If there's one genre that should have giant pauldrons, it's RTS games (and I guess any game from a top-down perspective), you gotta have a top-heavy design for it to be remotely readable. >zerglings
have two huge claws on their back >ghosts
always holding their giant fricking sniper rifle upright
>always holding their giant fricking sniper rifle upright
Yes? How is this a point against me? It's a perfect example of how you don't need the giant pauldrons to make a small unit pop. Even the glaive guys from stormgate read easily by the way they sholder their weapon. See, that's good design. The problem is the rest of a glaive guy is just a cartoony SC2 marine again. You can design any unit to be readable, my problem is with their artstyle. You can have a unit with 40k tier pauldrons if you want to. The problem goes deeper than that.
>So how would you make a non-generic design for >space soldier with gun and armor >space solider with big sword and armor
HOW ABOUT DESIGNING SOMETHING FRICKING NEW AND ORIGINAL FOR A CHANGE HUH? FRICKING GOYSLOPMAXXERS RUINING MY ALREADY DEAD GENRE
I remember that they joked that the game was about space aliens with vacuums kidnaping animals and stuff. I'd actually liked it more if it were really that theme. lol
I would do it like this then again I'm not a game designer
With upgrades swordsman gets an energy holographic green shield (holo-shield) and rifleman shoots green (plasma cartridges), normally it's standard colour.
why would we have space soldiers with guns and armor? It has been done to death, the same races over and over again. How about dwarves? Robots? Dragons? ANYTHING else but 'definitely not terrans', 'definitely not protoss' and 'definitely not zerg'
anon the entire point of all of this is to sell us on the game. If these trailers, teasers, pictures and interviews aren't working then it's a pretty good sign that the game will also be shit. The whole "don't judge a book by it's cover" is pretty much cope for losers who make shit products.
Denying damage by picking up units into speedy medivacs and warp prisms (to a lesser extent because those can't carry bio) is shit gameplay. Recently damaged (like 1 or 2 seconds) units should not be liftable.
I would rather they just significantly reduce the pickup radius. The only reason these silly strategies work is because the transport can hang back in safety and grab/drop off units at a distance.
I would rather they just significantly reduce the pickup radius. The only reason these silly strategies work is because the transport can hang back in safety and grab/drop off units at a distance.
the transport should have to land or deploy to load or unload units (but this should also be supcom-ferry tier convenient to order)
the question is if they designed hard counter units like immortal in this game too, they are cancer of rts games and always frick up the balance and viable strategies.
>Jaina in Warcraft doing practically everything but always being forgiven by the plot despite all the bad shit crazy things she had done.
>Sylvanas in Warcraft, Leader of the tragic Forsaken, then made Warchief (Later on saying it was just according to Keikaku), then later becoming a Demi-God all while similarly to Jaina SHE COULD DO ABSOLUTELY NO WRONG!
>Kerrigan in Starctaft leader of the Zerg becoming the Queen b***h of the universe then going back to human then going back to Zerg and soon after becoming a LITERAL GOD and defeat the "the universe's most ancient evil." Xel'naga.
You are talking like this is new or something, where have you been in the past 20 years?
The cartoony art style isn't even the problem, but the overal design of everything is. Age of Empires Online had an even more cartoony art style but was still able to have way more unque factions and units for their civs and still made it look decent and have some original game play.
and I think that's the thing with modern RTS games, not only do they not do anything new but they don't even do anything old. Can you name another RTS game that has mechanics like zerg creep? How about units that need to morph in to another unit or even a building? What about having to build ammo like with Protoss carriers and reavers? Or how about the Night Elves in WC3 where your buildings where also giant fricking trees that could walk around and become their own monster unit?
At MOST you get with modern RTS games is a unit that can transform in to long ranged artillery. That's it. Even AoE got rid of their one interesting mechanic, converstion in AoE3 and I'm not even sure if it's in AoE4. Even CoH3 has regressed on everything Relic did with DoW and CoH.
I really don't think you have to generally do anything new or inovative, but when you say you're game is based off something and you throw out everything that made that game stand out then there is a huge problem. Stormgate is made by a bunch of ex-Blizzard devs who left entirely because activision told them that they weren't allowed to make another RTS game and that SC and WC RTS where dead. For them to come from YEARS of RTS development and have ZERO of the things that make those games, well those games... what is there to be excited about?
And nothing they showed of that faction was not only original, but actually less than what SC was.
hey, they had 1 kind of cool thing, the big units couldn't go through vision blockers. More map design tools is good at least
That was about it but again, for a bunch of ex-blizzard devs who revolutionised RTS games you'd think they would have had a lot more to show other than a off brand versions of Terrans.
>new project from former Y employees who worked on great classics like X >third rate shitters with inflated sense of importance
Every time.
What ends up happening is that they clearly underappreciated the amount of resources they had or the role of management keeping them focused so the product is meh at best. Sometimes they have good workmanship but are not particularly inspired so it ends up a subpar clone.
Nah, at least the COOP guys are the minds behind what made the mode good.
Can't say anything about the supposed WC devs since I never knew anyone besides metzen and samwise.
>What ends up happening is that they clearly underappreciated the amount of resources they had or the role of management
Seems like commie approach. And commies also always failed.
Petroglyph also never made any good game and still use "we wuz westwood"
1 year ago
Anonymous
Empire at war, C&C Remake.
But you are gonna call them shit because you have abysmal taste, right?
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Empire at war
as someone whose played 400+ hours and loves it, EaW is a pretty bad game. Half of it (ground combat) is absolute trash.
But you're right about the C&C Remake, I consider it to be the only good remake and actually superior to the originals.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>played 400+ hours and loves it >EaW is a pretty bad game
Clearly isn't, it is at best a mediocre game, and that is if you ignore the best space combat RTS in any video game.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Empire at War is not really a good game. Ground combat is absolute garbage and campaign mechanics are poor. The only remarkable thing is space combat which was fun but can't carry a whole game by itself. And honestly it was just a flat 2D plane and the mechanics weren't actually all that complex. Most of the appeal was just spectacle because of the sound and visual design. If it wasn't star wars even that probably wouldn't be all that remarkable.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>space combat which was fun but can't carry a whole game by itself
It litterally does.
>For them to come from YEARS of RTS development and have ZERO of the things that make those games, well those games...
You have to keep in mind they'd spent 10 years only making e-sports focused units and changes.
Just compare the new additions to Terran roster from Wings of Liberty (Viking, Thor, Marauders,...) to the ones in Heart of the Swarm (Widow mine, a voiceless, loreless instagib unit) Legacy of the Void (Cyclone, a voiceless, loreless high damage unit). And this is terran, which still at least get a hellbat tranformation or the Liberator.
Protoss got what? A high damage orb, a flying orb, a base orb, a detonating insta-gib orb,...
I'm pretty sure there were more than enough people on the team who forgot that units with some interesting personality or ones you'd like to build just to use them... are kind of one of the good parts of Blizzard games.
Unlike the legions of beeping and buzzing robots with one or two cool standouts like in, say, SupCom.
>Widow mine, a voiceless, loreless instagib unit
I unironically couldn't get into heart of the swarm because of this. A mine that shoots a rocket from underground and then slowly reloads, infinitely. The attack is near instantaneous and can't be prevented once launched. That's so fricking stupid. Why is SC2 further simplifying a simple concept of a mine? BW got it right the first time.
I remember one game where I made like 3 WMs, plopped them in my natural, and they killed 90% of harassing muta squad instantly. Just like that, for free, and once he comes back the mines will just fire again. What the frick has this game turned into?
I won't even mention swarm hosts which initially broke all zerg matchups so hard it killed all popularity momentum the game ever had. There had to be a serious case of brain drain at blizzard at the time
I love how zerg and protoss are given and unit and then Terran just get a better version of it.
>Zerg get banglings. >Zerg players complain about having to constantly replace banglings and to either fix it or bring back lurkers. >Instead just give Terran the fix to zerg's problem. >Only add lurkers in once they give Terran the better lurker, the liberator.
tbh even they accepted swarm hosts were a mistake and nerfed them so much they became useless outside of baiting tank friendly fire.
Swarm hosts would have been good if they actually produced free units. What I mean is that for the Brood Lords cost 4 control, but can end up making 12 broodlings before the broodlings start dying off automatically. Swarm Hosts cost 3 pop, but can only ever make up to 2 locusts per swarm host. Even though they both technically make "free" units, I would argue that the units still counts when factoring in cost and attack, so really when you look at it the only unit actually making free units is the broodlord since it can produce more units than it's given cost for both minerals and population cap while swam hosts can not.
Brood Lords still need to be on the battlefield and in range of snipes, not appearing on any part of the map with nydus shitting their free units, then disappearing before they can be killed.
It's one of the worst mechanics they introduced in the game, on par with tank medivac.
>and I think that's the thing with modern RTS games, not only do they not do anything new but they don't even do anything old
there are no modern RTS games, there are base defense stuff and C&C copies
I think that it looks ok for an alpha or beta or whatever it is. But if that's the final design then it would be a dissapointment.
I like the units design so far and I see soul in it. I just hope that they really improve and polish the graphics and design. I want this to be good, vst bros.
that's because there is no thing to sell. This is a war3 + sc2 fusion that brings nothing new to the table. If I want to play w3 i'd play w3, if I wanted starcraft i'd play sc2. What would make me want to play this game?
They said the campaigns will be purchased, no?
I don't care if they ask money for new races or skins on multiplayer, as long as they aren't stupidly expansive.
If it's just a child of wc3 and sc2 how are they going to make team play fun, like they supposedly want to to attract casuals? Team games in those two were like moronic cousins of 1vs1s
>game made to be watched instead of be played >game made to be played at high level
if the map editor isn't at least made for a braindead moron then I literally can't do anything with this
I don't get how all the Youtube comments are saying how it looks so good but anyone who has eyes can see it's more dogshit than probably any early 2000's RTS. Looks almost like a onions-gay mobile game. How much do they pay people to type good things on Youtube?
SC2 alpha footage looks miles better than this heap of crap. I don't care if it is alpha or not the current product at display is shit. If and when they change it I too will change my opinion on it. I won't praise garbage willy nilly like how most homosexuals operate when a new product shows up. And I really doubt this cheap mobile garbage starcraft knock off of a game will change for the better in the first place.
I am not sold, to be honest. Out of "genre revival" RTS in development, it is the least memorable. DORF has cool and memorable graphics, WAOS has the attention drawing name, Tempest Rising promises the focus on the single player campaign for a change, and this is... F2P made by a couple of ex-Blizzard has-beens that looks like it belongs on mobile devices? I mean, even the artstyle in the OP is confusing. What the hell am i looking at? Sci fi stronk womyn and DnD monsters, both generic as frick, looking more like heroes in MOBA than units in RTS?
>Zeppelin micro >Minimal basebuilding >Cartoony artstyle
Dead on arrival
of all the fricking things you could bring over from WC3, they bring over fricking zeppelins? it's the dumbest thing i've ever seen
Zeppelin micro is a stupid busybody mechanic.
Zeppelins should be used for crossing impassable boundaries, not as a missile redirection system
They should make zeppelins very easy to kill, killing all units within, or add a mechanic that stuns units for a few seconds when they are dropped, like in Dungeon Keeper 2.
Busybody mechanics are annoying minigames that sane people don't want to play while playing the game.
Like having a Beat Mania minigame running in the corner of your screen at all times that you need to get a 100% score on throughout the whole game to get a 20% production bonus, or having a jumpscare across your whole screen in irregular intervalls to keep you on foot. StarCraft players love those kind of mechanics. Sane people don't.
I'd rather just not play your shitty game, thanks.
1 year ago
Anonymous
You are not gonna play any game if you can't handle something this basic.
1 year ago
Anonymous
There's countless games, including countless RTS, that don't submit to SC2-like busybody mechanics, because devs have already realized that you don't need to include this antiquated bullshit. I won't ever run out of games to play.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Why are you in the thread about a game from ex SC2 devs instead of talking about those other games?
1 year ago
Anonymous
Just because many of them are ex-SC2 devs, doesn't mean this will become SC2 again. And thank God for that.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Tell me what games don't have busybody mechanics.
1 year ago
Anonymous
nta but BAR I guess
1 year ago
Anonymous
It's probably not possible to completely remove them, but you can minimize them. A recent game with great quality of life features that try to minimize mindless busybody mechanics would be Old World.
A lot of arcade games might also qualify, like aforementioned Beat Mania, or Tetris. You probably want me to name more strategic games, though.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>devs have already realized that you don't need to include this antiquated bullshit
they do, but not that much!
I see. >Old Wolrd >turn based
A lot of things make sense now.
1 year ago
Anonymous
What I'm saying is, when devs are nowadays facing the inject larva decision they had to make in early SC2, where they wanted to automize it but hardcore SC1 players wanted it to stay manual because that's what they're used to and what they perceive to be skill, they're less likely to repeat the mistake of giving in to the SC1 players.
You can also take Mohawk Games' other game, the RTS game Offworld Trading Company, as an example if you insist on stressfull RTS. They tried cutting down on these dumb mechanics there as well. I'm just using them as an example because I admire their games.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Injecting larva isn't a busybody mechanic, you are choosing to it over creep spread or banking heals for defense. It might be a way more pronounce mechanic in the early game since you can just have 10 queens in the late game, but that's still a choice you are making in having a weaker army in exchange for quicker rebuilding.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Could you come up with a way to improve the mechanic?
1 year ago
Anonymous
With the way zerg works? Not really. Queens are the kind of unit that if you touch even a little you can easily make them too weak or too strong.
There's a reason why they ditched the mothership core but didn't frick with the queen.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Injecting larva isn't a busybody mechanic, you are choosing to it over creep spread or banking heals for defense. It might be a way more pronounce mechanic in the early game since you can just have 10 queens in the late game, but that's still a choice you are making in having a weaker army in exchange for quicker rebuilding.
nta, but they could've automated all that with a toggle button. "keeping in injecting larvas button", "auto chrono boost button", "auto MULE", "auto creep in a certain area".
There's no need to go back to the base every 30 seconds, not only that you need to select the queens correctly or they'll go all over place and start to walking toward the other based. SO you need to cycle through the bases, select the queen, inject, rinse and repeat.
There was no need for that.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Injecting larva isn't a busybody mechanic, you are choosing to it over creep spread or banking heals for defense. It might be a way more pronounce mechanic in the early game since you can just have 10 queens in the late game, but that's still a choice you are making in having a weaker army in exchange for quicker rebuilding.
>nta, but they could've automated all that with a toggle button. "keeping in injecting larvas button", "auto chrono boost button", "auto MULE", "auto creep in a certain area".
A toggle button would preserve you making the same choice but with far less clicks and attention being diverted to enact that choice.
If two game mechanics offer the same choice but one is less annoying to use than the other, you should use the less annoying one. Therefore a toggle would be preferable to manually injecting, chronoboosting, MULEing - with the option to do it manually, for the rare cases where there's an interesting choice to be made.
Choices that are not interesting to make should also generally be cut out.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Every single one of those economic buffs also have defensive and supportive actions you can use in certain situations. CC has extra supply cap and scans, queens have creep and health regen, nexus has battery overcharge and recall.
How are these not interesting choices, the option you select will be related to the strategy you focus at the time or the game you are playing.
1 year ago
Anonymous
You can make these choices even if you automate the execution.
Imagine you know that you need a lot of resources right now, so you decide that you will use MULEs for the next four cooldowns next to the mineral lane of your main base. Why shouldn't you be able to tell the game that this should happen for the next four times exactly when it's possible?
What additional meaningful choices are gained by forcing the player to wait four times to actually be able to tell the game what he wants to happen - to land MULEs next to his mineral line when the cooldown is ready?
(Obviously, also add the option to cancel what hasn't happened yet.)
1 year ago
Anonymous
You're making excellent points but the asiaticclick-worshipper's mind is made up and he won't respond with an actual argument because his position is indefensible. I want to play an RTS to build and manage an army, not play piano.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Why shouldn't you be able to tell the game that this should happen for the next four times exactly when it's possible?
Because you might want to preserve energy for scans.
Did you know that you can drop mules aggressively on the enemy mineral line to deny him minerals in a prolonged game?
Did you know that creep pathing actually matters, as well as the amount of tumors to drop, and it varies depending on the matchup?
How the frick are you going to automate chronoboosts when it's a part of your build order, which you might want to change on the fly to adapt to what's happening?
Apmlets sre insufferable.
I absolutely agree. If you need to add another spinning plate on top of other spinning plates you are doing something wrong with the design of your game. Mules, chrono boosts and injections are infamous for that. Even spreading creeps are really bad, the queen should do it automatically.
You don't want to be a nanny in these games, you want to create an army for war.
These mechanics are so bad that they had to introduce another resource called energy. It's all so annoying.
>Even spreading creeps are really bad
Idk man, creep gets a pass from me, because it feels cool to spread it. Then again, I'm campaign and coop only player
>These mechanics are so bad that they had to introduce another resource called energy
Energy has existed since the first game.
Creep spread is literally the most interesting and fun mechanic in the entire game, both fighting with and against. It rewards you greatly with vision and army speed while also forcing the enemy to act, incentivizing engagements. Both thematically and mechanically it's one of the best parts of the game. Making it completely automatic would erase one of the most important skills from the race.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Creep spreading could've been automated, select "an area", "random" or "manual".
About the energy, I just finished the first campaign of the Terran because I couldn't stand the bad pathfinding and limited units selection.
[...] >nta, but they could've automated all that with a toggle button. "keeping in injecting larvas button", "auto chrono boost button", "auto MULE", "auto creep in a certain area".
A toggle button would preserve you making the same choice but with far less clicks and attention being diverted to enact that choice.
If two game mechanics offer the same choice but one is less annoying to use than the other, you should use the less annoying one. Therefore a toggle would be preferable to manually injecting, chronoboosting, MULEing - with the option to do it manually, for the rare cases where there's an interesting choice to be made.
Choices that are not interesting to make should also generally be cut out.
Yes, it would free your mind to make more meaningful choices, maybe even manage two armies for a pincer attack, instead of choosing a death ball.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Creep spreading could've been automated
It would be extremely oppressive for the enemy at lower ranks. Not having as much creep to deal with is one of the expectations of playing with bad players.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Forcing a mechanic like that to any player is actually highlighting a bad design or a bad balancing of the game. You can't balance a game over APM or forcing input execution. That's not strategy, it's just babysitting/busy work. It's not a fighting game that requires precise inputs, theoretically, your troops should do all this work.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>That's not strategy, it's just babysitting/busy work
Choosing what to pay attention to is literally strategy.
The thing that makes RTS interesting is the real time part, otherwise it's just a mobile auto battler.
1 year ago
Anonymous
not every 30 seconds.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Yes, every 30s.
Macro is important and fun.
1 year ago
Anonymous
It wrecks your train of thought when you are truly thinking about a strategy, specially at lower levels. In the end, one of the main reasons people choose to death ball is because they have to manage 300 of stuff at the same time. Most of them makes no sense in a ware scenario, since your lower ranked soldiers would all be making these minute choices under your command. It's a RTS, not a micro clicky-clacky game, it's no wonder that MOBAs has swallowed a huge part of the RTS players.
1 year ago
Anonymous
I never had a problem with people not enjoying that aspect of RTS. I do, and I want games with it.
This is a game made by people that made games I and other people enjoy. It's no wonder why I don't want it to be more like a MOBA or an automatic gacha "game".
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Creep spreading could've been automated,
Do you even play the game? Do you realize the incredible advantage creep provides for the zerg?
Creep allows zerg units to move way faster thus allowing them to either relocate faster, close distance to their target faster, chase retreating targets better or disengage from encounters faster thus reducing losses even allowing them to commit more to uncertain battles with way less risk?
Creep allows several mechanics like Queens to use Transfuse, relocating their defensive buildings around and also blocking enemy buildings from being built offensively?
Do you realize CREEP IS LITERALLY MAPHACK for Zerg? Granting them the best map vision and map awareness out of all the 3 factions? To thr point where other factions even go as far as sacrificing units just to clear creep from the map?
And you would want these massive advantages to just be automated? What the actual frick are you thinking?
1 year ago
Anonymous
Balance the games around mechanics, not around "clicky-clacky 500APM I can spin the plates faster than you".
>I wanted a RTS chess, not an input execution/route memorization game. >I wanted to feel like I'm in charge of an army, not a babysitter.
Play wargames. What the frick is your problem? You're like a stupid kid complaining arcade physics in a new mario kart game and lamenting about the lack of realistic racing games.
The genre is dying/dead, besides a few games, because the devs try to design the game for people like you. I don't want to play 4x or gran strategy. I want to play something like SC, but without all clicky-clicky 500 APM.
Stormgate was the game that was supposed to solve that, but didn't and won't.
As another anon has said, I want to play a game not a piano.
I'm noticing that you are too used to SC, since you want to balance the gsme around the input mastery, not on the merits of the game mechanics. Any of these games should be playable at 60 apm at a pro level.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>The genre is dying/dead
Make up your mind, do you want a strategy game or do you want a fotm with tens of thousands of players? I've spent a good few hundred of hours playing MP wargames last year, namely Command Ops 2, Command Modern Operations, Combat Mission Black Sea, Flashpoint Campaigns: Southern Storm. Finding an opponent was as trivial as going to a forum or discord and asking who'd like to play.
If you're too shy to talk to people like that without the whole auto match making facade, I can see it being a problem. >I want to play something like SC, but without all clicky-clicky 500 APM.
Just play in silver or gold, everyone plays at like 50 apm there, and these leagues have a frickton of players. https://www.rankedftw.com/stats/leagues/1v1/#v=2&r=-2&sx=a
1 year ago
Anonymous
Make up your mind, It's called Real time strategy, not "500 Action per Seconds E-sport Starcraft variation number 3427" game.
1 year ago
Anonymous
It's called "starcraft and age of empires are the only relevant ones" genre, actually.
No amount of seething will change that name, unfortunately.
1 year ago
Adûnâi
>I don't want to play 4x or gran strategy. I want to play something like SC, but without all clicky-clicky 500 APM.
I have four words for you: > Immortal: Gates of Pyre.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Immortal: Gates of Pyre
Wow, this one looks great, I think it's not released though.
1 year ago
Anonymous
: Gates of Pyre.
well, the art looks like even worse version of league of legends artstyle, but sure, I'll keep an eye it.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Stormgate was the game that was supposed to solve that
Who the frick lied to you? They never once said they would make something completely different.
1 year ago
Anonymous
They said that they were going to simplify a lot of stuff. It's basically the same game as SC2, bit made worse with creeps. So far I don't see a reason to play it over WC3 or SC2. I still jope it'll be good though.
I understand that you want that kind of game, but your claim that RTS is dying because of micro is unfounded. There are RTS games with lower micro requirements than SC2, and people don't play those either.
It's one of the factors. Micros forces high APM, becoming pianist is not something people want to do to play a game.
then he should go play fricking turn based games not whine about RTS
You have a misconception that RTS should be AoE/SC styled games. It could be so much more, but it's limited by this paradigma of micro/high APM.
And yes, if Stormgate is micro focused, and I think it'll be thanks to the creeps.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>You have a misconception that RTS should be AoE/SC styled games. It could be so much more, but it's limited by this paradigma of micro/high APM.
I think people playing AoE/SC may literally be incapable of comprehending that RTS don't have to be clones of just those two games.
They may actually just not have played a lot of RTS either, because there's plenty that aren't those two games or clones thereof but that seems inconceivable to them.
1 year ago
Anonymous
I'm aware there's other types of RTS games, but Stormgate was always gonna be "something like Starcraft and Warcraft", and I find that exciting because there haven't been many games like that recently, especially with the same level of customizability.
1 year ago
Anonymous
I don't now, DORF seems to be a better game.
Stormgateis something really long term, because SC2 will surely be more balanced and will have more game modes for at least 3 or 4 years.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Yeah, I'm looking forward to DORF too, but I hope Stormgate will have a good amount of custom content and a fun co-op mode, which I'm not expecting from that game.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Yes. For example, Pikmin is considered a RTS, a game like this would be inconcievable for them.
Anything that's not a sppining plate game with 500 apm is not rts for them. Chess is a geriatric boomer game just because ir's turn based with low APM, according to them.
1 year ago
Anonymous
I don't like asiaticclicks, but Chess is literally, by definition NOT a RTS game
1 year ago
Anonymous
That's not what I said, I said that, according to them, Chess is a boomer game because it's not high APM.
1 year ago
Anonymous
They were never gonna make a game for geriatric boomers. I'm sorry you are this delusional.
1 year ago
Anonymous
If they said they were going to make macro easier, what could possibly be the game focused on if not micro. If pic related is what you want to play then you're setting yourself for disappointment right from the start.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>micro
does RTS even have that?
1 year ago
Anonymous
more than mobas
1 year ago
Anonymous
maybe in the realm of asiaticsports that term applies and makes sense but microing the frick out of a marine unit or just pressing attack move does not change reality
it's good macro play vs poor macro play
it's a god game and you puppeteer stuff around because you lack a solid body that can enter the physical realm
1 year ago
Anonymous
go back to your auto battlers homosexual i doubt you have brain capacity to even play turn based games.
1 year ago
Anonymous
uuuooohhhhhh
1 year ago
Anonymous
I understand that you want that kind of game, but your claim that RTS is dying because of micro is unfounded. There are RTS games with lower micro requirements than SC2, and people don't play those either.
1 year ago
Anonymous
they're called mobas and they're incredibly popular
1 year ago
Anonymous
MOBAs are literally the opposite of what that anon wants. They're all micro, minimal strategy. Anon doesn't want to control individual characters, he doesn't want to do pullback micro, he doesn't want to target abilities, he doesn't want to orbwalk, he only wants to ~make decisions~
1 year ago
Anonymous
then he should go play fricking turn based games not whine about RTS
1 year ago
Anonymous
I don't think he can handle 4 abilities + items during a fight.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Creep spread is literally the most interesting and fun mechanic in the entire game, both fighting with and against. It rewards you greatly with vision and army speed while also forcing the enemy to act, incentivizing engagements. Both thematically and mechanically it's one of the best parts of the game. Making it completely automatic would erase one of the most important skills from the race.
What's the actually fun part about creep spreading? Is it making the strategic choice on when and where to spread to, or is it the mechanical act of doing so? I believe the strategic placement is the fun part, while the mechanical act more often than not is a nuisance that could be improved.
To use an analogy, think of building queues in Command&Conquer: Red Alert 1 versus those in Red Alert 2. Or the original RA1 versus the remake. What was fun about building units? Was it making a choice on which one to build or was it actually going to the menu and pressing the button to actually do it?
Because in the original, you had to go to the menu every time you built even 1 of your most basic units, then wait two seconds for it to build so you can press the build button again. In the newer titles, you can just queue 20 basic rifle infanterists within a second. You know you want to build 20, so you queue 20. In the old one you know you want to build 20, but you go to the menu, build 1, wait, build 1, wait, build 1... for a whole minute.
There certainly was skill involved in switching to the infantry menu whenever build options were available again. The skill to get into the menu quickly. There also certainly were choices made. The choice on when to interrupt commanding your units to get into the build menu. Were those fun choices? Was this a fun mechanic?
There's a good reason why the RA1 remake has build queues. But if SC1 didn't have build queues, hardcore players would demand them to be removed from SC2 as well.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Yes, the precious time and energy used to make these mechanical decisions could've been channeled into making true decisions about the game. Keeping selecting the units that has less HP to send them behind the lines, for example, is a dumb mechanic, because that's a tactical decision, not a strategic one. Each blob should have a "global HP", for example, kiting should be a strategy, not something you keep clicking like crazy all over the map. There should be punishments for retreating from battle and entering in it again and again and again. Retreat should be a strategy, not a form of kiting your enemy with high APM. This input execution obsession that RTS players have has only made the genre less accessible and less fun, specially for new players. It's an input execution game, not a strategic one.
I never had a problem with people not enjoying that aspect of RTS. I do, and I want games with it.
This is a game made by people that made games I and other people enjoy. It's no wonder why I don't want it to be more like a MOBA or an automatic gacha "game".
This genre needs to evolve past AoE2 and SC styled games. These "Dune-likes" games are very limited. I wanted a RTS chess, not an input execution/route memorization game.
I wanted to feel like I'm in charge of an army, not a babysitter.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>This genre needs to evolve past AoE2 and SC styled games.
Why? I want games that cater to me. Go search other games that cater to you.
1 year ago
Anonymous
And you already got it, and pretty good ones at that, by the way. Stormgate should've be evolving the genre, not be making the same mistakes. I can already tell that micro will be important with the creep hunting all over the map, they did that, but without the heroes. I think it'll be extremely annoying to hunt them without a charismatic character that you can control.
There's no reason to play Stormgate over SC2 or WC2, specially with this plastic toy look
1 year ago
Anonymous
>There's no reason to play Stormgate over SC2 or WC2
I can play online without giving blizzard money, while also getting updates. That's reason enough for it to exist.
There were multiple games even posted in this thread that seem to cater to what you want, why not play those instead?
1 year ago
Anonymous
>I can play online without giving blizzard money, while also getting updates.
that's bullshit, they are not working for free, they are going to sell coop stuff and campaigns. Unless you are only going to play pvp with naked characters forever.
>There were multiple games even posted in this thread that seem to cater to what you want, why not play those instead?
Maybe Supreme Commander, but I think it looks ugly.
1 year ago
Anonymous
I don't mind paying for games, I don't want to give money to blizzard in particular.
1 year ago
Anonymous
I see.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Why?
Because classic RTS are fricking dead, and this is probably one of the reasons why.
And you may enjoy those new games as well, even if they are different from the old ones. Who knows, you may even find that you like them more, because they may offer even more meaningful choices to make. Maybe they'll end up being as chock full of micro as old games, just a more accessible kind of micro that would allow for RTS not to be fricking dead.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Shooters haven't changed significantly in the last 10 years, and they still sell.
I don't care that it would appeal to a larger audience, I want it to appeal to me.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Shooters aren't fundamentally broken, that's why they haven't needed to change significantly.
I'm also claiming that there are probably potential RTS games that would appeal to both a larger audience and you. I'm just speculating, though.
Starcraft 2 still has thousands of players, AoE2 still has thousands of players.
There's clearly a market for these games, while other RTS that do try something new fail miserably.
Which is a pitifully small market with almost no new titles, considering the enormous growth that games in general have had for the past 20 years.
And if this guy's
why does everyone and their mum repeat the same shit that multiplayer doesn't sell from that e-celeb. This guy exlusively plays sp, of course he is going to shill for sp only rts:
I'm not saying that having singeplayer with an ai is bad but saying that's the only reason that people play rts is quite a false statement. clearly multiplayer keeps rts alive long term.
stats are to believed, then the people actually still playing Starcraft 2 and AoE2 are actually by a vast majority not at all the hardcore crowd that appreciates these mechanisms.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>the people actually still playing Starcraft 2 and AoE2 are actually by a vast majority not at all the hardcore crowd that appreciates these mechanisms.
Yes, the majority of people are shitters.
You know what stormgate is doing? Separating COOP, multiplayer and single player. Something I completely approve and is the right choice. I didn't exclusively play 1v1 in SC2, I also had multiple lvl 15 commanders before they introduced prestige.
1v1 should still cater to what I want, those other modes can do completely different stuff.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Starcraft 2 still has thousands of players, AoE2 still has thousands of players.
There's clearly a market for these games, while other RTS that do try something new fail miserably.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Starcraft 2 still has thousands of players, AoE2 still has thousands of players.
There's clearly a market for these games, while other RTS that do try something new fail miserably.
All Actvision needs to do to kill Stormgate is to make a remaster of the models, so they'll be more polished/high poly, a revamp of the UI, some bug fixes, like the anti-aliasing not working correctly and some QoLs when it comes to hotkeys setup.
If they hire the director and the writer of SC2 to rewrite the original SC, they could even launch a new campaign, which could rise the interest in the game. And why is that? Because I don't see Stormgate advancing the genre, it actually feels like a worse SC2. Luckily for them, apparently, the MS/Actvision deal won't go through, and we already know that they are not releasing any new RTS games anymore.
Although they are surveying for a WC3 Reforged soft relaunch, if that's successful, anything could be possible.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Why the frick would they care?
They didn't give a frick about microsoft and EA trying to revive their games. They only remastered BW so they could cash in on the asiatics.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>All Actvision needs to do to kill Stormgate is to make a remaster of the models, so they'll be more polished/high poly, a revamp of the UI, some bug fixes,
Look at how that worked out for Warcraft 3 Reforged.
1 year ago
Anonymous
WC3 problem wasn't the remaster, but how bad it was. Diablo 2 Ressurrected was extremely well received. It has it's problems that are more associated with not updating the UI, lobbies and other stuff. But when it comes to the visual aspects of it, it was very well received everywhere.
SC2 is really good in what it does, they don't really to invest a lot to modernize it, specially if you consider what was done to D2R. They really need to make a better custom game browser, though.
Why the frick would they care?
They didn't give a frick about microsoft and EA trying to revive their games. They only remastered BW so they could cash in on the asiatics.
Yeah, they don't care.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>But when it comes to the visual aspects of it, it was very well received everywhere.
I've been playing and mapping WC3 continuously since 2004 and hate it for reasons well-expressed by other people who hate it just as much through, for example, that copypasta image about that Reforged forest road.
1 year ago
Anonymous
I was talking about D2R, I'm sorry if I didn't make myself clear.
The problems with WC3 are obvious, but the problem wasn't the remaster itself, as shown by D2R, that was well received. It was the incompetence of the team to faithfully remaster it and keep the original features of the game.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Black person they can't even finish overwatch multiplayer, you think they are going to make a team to a game that they can't realistically monetize?
They tried with skin packs, new campaigns, new commanders, and they still would rather let it die. It's gonna be at least another 5 years before they even start thinking about it.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Yeah, they even killed HotS because it wasn't making enough. I highly doubt that both SC2 and HotS wasn't making money. I think that they were, a lot, but it wasn't enough for them.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Yeah, especially after immortal.
At best we will get an SC mobile game like that C&C shit EA tried a few years back.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>"Killed" >Player base is quite active even by the drop, of wich the motive is was more likely the playerbase getting a little sick to playing MOBA games (ask any LOL player).
1 year ago
Anonymous
They really shouldn't put the game in maintenance mode. It's the best MOBA on the market. Super fun.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Better that adding constant content forever, a game development needs some rest you know?
1 year ago
Anonymous
I'm not sure if you are being sarcastic.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Smarter that you, shitty gacha addict.
1 year ago
Anonymous
bot?
1 year ago
Anonymous
Get out of the house, you getting fat son.
1 year ago
Anonymous
And stop with the nonsensical cringe anime images, this isn´t the channel...
Baka.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Hermano, tu eres gilipollas...
stop being a bot
1 year ago
Anonymous
Hermano, tu eres gilipollas...
1 year ago
Anonymous
>They really need to make a better custom game browser, though.
Wasn't that super high on the priority list ever since the game had come out? I'm not really hopeful, if they haven't managed to make a good one in 13 years.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Yeah, especially after immortal.
At best we will get an SC mobile game like that C&C shit EA tried a few years back.
Yeah, MS could've changed that, but they are finding a lot of problems to go through the buyout. Stormgate may end up getting most of the WC3 and SC2 players, since they'll be offering what Blizzard can't offer anymore.
Maybe, in the future, they could reskin Stormgate and release something for the WC3 public.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Good joke anon.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>I wanted a RTS chess, not an input execution/route memorization game. >I wanted to feel like I'm in charge of an army, not a babysitter.
Play wargames. What the frick is your problem? You're like a stupid kid complaining arcade physics in a new mario kart game and lamenting about the lack of realistic racing games.
I'm not impressed. Looks like a slowed down SC2. I'm still going to reserve final judgment until I actually play it, but nothing that they revealed so far has excited me.
Dawn of War innovated the "overwatch" build feature. You right click a marine from a barracks and the barracks will attempt to build marines as long as you have resources and pop cap. It lets you focus on the actual fun part of RTS: clashing armies and funneling in fresh reinforcements. Excessive micro (>120apm) being necessary for good macro moves the genre closer to fighting games (a genre so braindead even Black folk play it).
Yeah, I'm starting to agree with the rebranding of the genre. It only makes sense, especially when some people replying here just won't grasp what the central problem of the current RTS is.
anybody else not like this unit
the placeholder stuff looks great but when you look at this fast food running around you wish it was a placeholder
https://stormgategame.fandom.com/wiki/S.C.O.U.T.
it screams asiaticsports and it doesn't really seem to fit anywhere
is this STR or DEX or INT unit
when you do vision stuff it seems to be INT but
then in the trailer it seems to be STR unit but
since it's also small and long like a hot dog it reminds me of DEX
surely your not gonna breed only one type of dog...
the picture isn't really about the individual units but the 3 races
>What the frick are you talking about?
anybody else not like this unit
the placeholder stuff looks great but when you look at this fast food running around you wish it was a placeholder
https://stormgategame.fandom.com/wiki/S.C.O.U.T.
it screams asiaticsports and it doesn't really seem to fit anywhere
is this STR or DEX or INT unit
when you do vision stuff it seems to be INT but
then in the trailer it seems to be STR unit but
since it's also small and long like a hot dog it reminds me of DEX
surely your not gonna breed only one type of dog...
>log into your favorite RTS game and start up a match >guy in your team presses the push to talk button >a small window opens in the upper right corner with a dude saying >I have played RTS my entire life
how would you respond?
>players must now create a short video introduction for themselves >it's automatically sent each game in order to help the community feel more personal
What could possibly go wrong?
Yeah, his critics are valid. I'm worrying if it's worth switch to Stormgate. It'll all depends if Microsoft go through with the buyout or not. I'm sure that they'll invest on SC2 if they do.
Of course it is. It has to be a sanitized for all ages experience!
Can't have blood in germany. Can't have undead in china. So it's all this same robot or vaguely mystical creatures and energies instead of flesh grinding to a halt to a war machine.
>Can't have blood in germany.
There is blood in StormGate. Actually, robot dogs are better because dogs would look ridiculously stupid in a sci-fi game.
Come to think of it, robot dogs are equally stupid. See my previous comment. Every single unit they have shown is moronic. The Vulcan is the most interesting mechanics-wise, I'll give them that (wind-up time like Tychus in HotS + AoE cleave in a line à la gryphons), but its visual is a... robot suit with a machine gun. A detachable machine gun. Even though a robot should have it as part of its suit - see Goliaths or Thors... Like wtf, it just boggles my mind how moronic it is.
There is blood in the game, we've seen it. So why you're even bringing that is is moronic. and undead being banned in China is, honestly, a gigantic meme.
This puke-vomit artstyle is cancer that should be removed from the root.
This is not the natural evolution of the WC3 artstyle. Against the Storm genuinely looks more like the original warcraft than this WoW/StormGate feces.
I also hope that din't do like Blizzard and pack stuff, like decals ans skins with certain events, or at least, make them available at a later date. I don't think its fair and it's a bad practice.
Honestly, my main gripe with the game so far is not necessarily the graphics (which can work), and not the lore (of which we have only seen snippets), but the general unit design, unit fantasy (or lack thereof). I.e., having literal marines, medics and siege tanks kills it for me.
There could be rocket launcher men, like in C&C Generals. There could be marines that deal more damage with bayonets (my suggestion: combine the lancer and the exo units into one). Anything but the StarCraft units. Because this is not StarCraft. And if it's too close to it, the very StarCraft fans will shit all over it because of the small differences, ironically.
Yeah, I hope the other factions will deviate more. Having the human faction play very similar to Starcraft makes sense as an easy one to get into, but I would like to see some more creativity. The mech charge is the only thing I've seen so far that looks remotely creative.
It looks extremely Blizzard / Starcraft to me but I am really not a fan of the setting and art style tbh
Also very much not a fan of the first talking head I see being a "LE PRO PLAYER"
IDK it just kinda looks extremely middling
I listened to some 2 hour interview with artosis and I really didn't like some of the things they said.
Artosis immediately brings up how dts are "OP" and "not fun" and the developer agreed and said that if there's an invisible unit they would decloak when they attack.
With the gameplay reveal it looks exactly like you'd expect. It just looks uninspired.
Strong units is what makes RTS games fun but there's needs to be strong units in every race to balance things out, that's all
>Strong units is what makes RTS games fun
How are DTs strong if they are binary as frick? You either die to them because you have no detection, or they are useless. They only kind of work in BW because there is so much macro and you might not cover every base with proper defences.
I really don't get why everything seems to move so slow, particularly the slow siege tank like thing.
If you want to make a turn based game, just make a turn based game.
>I really don't get why everything seems to move so slow, particularly the slow siege tank like thing.
I only watch StormGate at x2 EZ
DTs are the perfect example in my opinion of a strong unit. Against Terran you can use them with carriers/arbiters and make the Terran run out of scans and slowly kill him that way.
Against Zergs they can destroy economy. It's the perfect unit, super strong, costly but can also be countered.
Bad example is the firebat in my opinion. It hard counters zerglings, it has no real downsides and they work under dark swarm which is a T3 ability.
I'd in fact "buff" DTs by making SCVs weaker in HP so they can get one-shot by DTs, it'd also make early rushes from Terran way weaker/risky. One of the biggest problems with Terran is their workers are way too buff, they never fricking die even against storms if they get away quick enough. It's absurd
>Artosis immediately brings up how dts are "OP" and "not fun"
I wouldn't like to play against that either but guy always builds the same shit
terran can do literally the same when massing ghosts
HAS HE NOT PLAYED CAMPAIGN? or does asiaticsports not allow ghost
Artosis has the most braindead and bruteforced playstyle
he should stop building marines and make firebats
>Morten previously was StarCraft II: Legacy of the Void's production lead, and Campbell had been Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne's campaign lead designer.
Hard to think of 2 people i would want to support less than these two lmao
big bulky cartoon robots is the least cool looking thing in the fricking world why the frick did they make it like that, it looks like fricking generic cheap plastic shit, frick this fricking game and frick them for trying to put on the 'saving rts' hat when they're just going to shit out a massive fricking pile of generic plastisheen rounded-edges bullshit and then ALSO suck the gay wiener of every fricking homosexual 'le pro' 'le streamer' and get their feedback for 'le balance' as if any - and i mean ANY - of these degenerate basement trolls could EVER - and i mean EVER - make a good fricking video game if their lives depended on it. You ask for a fricking 'pro's' or 'content creators' opinion all you are going to get is a laundry list of santizing 'no rough edges' bullshit changes to make everything 'le symmetrical' and balanced and nothing can ever feel too powerful because then it's 'OP' and the streamer might lose on stream and their fragile virgin homosexual egos can't handle it. What a crock of fricking shit, we are literally all going to die, we are nothing but warm worm food, and we are wasting our precious minutes on this earth begging for dopmaine-firing entertainment to help dull the anxieties of living and give us some, just a precious crumb, of engaging fun and instead they hold us down and they rape us and they kill our families and grind them up into mincemeat and overcook the shit out of it and feed us this blackened pile of fricking bland charred SHIT. FRICK.
I haven't seen anything this much "totally NOT-StarCraft" since the days of Priority:Survive, why didn't the devs just beg ActiBliz to let them make SC3?
Because right now is the time to get more people by expanding cybers globally with Stracraft and not only by youtube/twitch and similar shit? Maybe that anon, maybe that?
Literaly all they had to do was a competent fantasy/medieval RTS game a la WC3. Instead they are doing a butthurt cop of SC2 with marines, tanks, etc. This game is going to be a catastrophe and everyone can see the writing on the wall. Sci-fi shit is already in over-saturation mode with 10 sci-fi themed games realeasing every week. People are tired of space shit.
looks like absolute shit
can't believe i waited for this lmao
Holy shit, I've caught a Ganker thread before it got archived! So, my opinion is here.
archive vn/b8N9v
The artstyle is vomit-inducing SJW trash
> Looks like something from Battlerite. Ugly women and cartoony demons. Even an anime ayaya RTS with waifus (like Eternal Return) would be better - at least, it wouldn't make me wanna vomit.
> (Sorry for strong wording, it's Steam forums, I hope, it is constructive feedback.)
Since then, I can vouch for mobile gaming (I have sold my soul to Mobile Legends) - and mobile games are infinitely closer to old Blizzard than this unfunny cuck millennial shit. I'm not joking, in Mobile Legends, every chick is hot and wears thighhighs, and every dudebro is an epic burly man from thirsty gay teenage fantasies.
Chink artstyle is more trad and based than this. Play DORF.
P.S. There is a good point from the casual perspective here.
rockpapershotgun com/the-new-rts-from-former-starcraft-2-devs-looks-a-lot-like-starcraft-2
>Play DORF.
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaand shill spotted, frick off.
Also
>game named FOR
>There isn't a single dwarf.
>game made by 2(dos) with a nonexistent budget pays shills on Ganker
I am truly sorry that Shartgate is looking that bad, but there is no need to lash out irrationally
>game developer can't shill his own product
moron
Also
>shartgate
???
>>game developer can't shill his own product
Apologies, I don't have control over what makes me hard. DORF just has that OOMPH I wish Shartgate had.
Even though I will agree with Grubby that DORF's pixel art is much less clear than Brood War's (or C&C's). Personally, it reminds me of that old Ukrainian game Cossacks - too many sprites or something?
>Yes, he does shill here.
I'm not him because I'm a namegay. I do shill against BasedGate. They have shown basically nothing, they have released two hype pieces - both of which have objectively failed at their job (worse).
People say cinematics are expensive, but I have a hunch that a 30 sec trailer à la CHIMERA would have been money well spent (01:26:00).
Yes, he does shill here. We know this and he's admitted to it as well.
what is the Gankers if not the shilling board
needed
A brain damaged tasteless coomer like you should not ever comment on other art styles or matters of aesthetics, even if you are coincidentally right. What are the odds you think that the D2 prostitute sorc looks better than the D2R one? Near guaranteed I say
>What are the odds you think that the D2 prostitute sorc looks better than the D2R one? Near guaranteed I say
I'm really confused as to your argument and your image of me. The Resurrected sorc looks better? Has the same skin colour, thick thighs, high HD definition?
>In the AMA they said that the story would be something like Marvel MCU stuff.
Wait, that's bad. They seem to pan out dangerously close to the unfunny millennials.
Yeah, if they start to do Marvel quips all over the campaign it won't be fun to play. Say what you want, but WoL and HotS don't really have quips all the time. Everything feels "epic".
In the AMA they said that the story would be something like Marvel MCU stuff. I like Marvel a lot, but everything after phase 3 is not interesting anymore, and anything after the Guardians of the Galaxy became a comedy movie. I believe that they are going into this comedic style that was adopted later. I'm totally going back to SC2.
>I like Marvel a lot, but everything after phase 3 is not interesting anymore, and anything after the Guardians of the Galaxy became a comedy movie.
>likes marvel
>likes guardians of the galaxy
>knows what the 'phases' are and whatever 'phase 3' is
NORMIES GET OFF MY BOARD REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
let me be happy okay
Even setting atrocious art style aside, the gameplay looks like a fricking mobile game.
This shit is going to bomb HARD if they don't put all the focus on PvE co-op.
>bomb HARD
afaik its f2p, not a fan of art style myself i also doubt there will be campaign lol, game looks very basic right now and they seem to put a lot of emphasis on multiplayer gameplay.
nvm i asked on discord and apparently theres going to be sp campaign
>f2p
lmao, dead on arrival
>dead
all most played games are f2p you fricking braindead moron
>its f2p
wew lad, definitely not playing it now.
They are letting themselves get cucked on the
co-op front by Immortal
No offense to the Immortal devs, but I can't see that game taking off considering how virtually no hype exists behind it. Not even most RTS players know this game exists, let alone anyone in the mainstream.
It looks bad.
>the lead Frozen Throme campaign dev on the team
>the mascot is an ugly brownskinned woman
https://stormgatenexus.com/article/monk-interview-back2warcraft
Meanwhile, TFT was an epic slash between Arthas emasculating Illidan. What went wrong?
>Meanwhile, TFT was an epic slash between Arthas emasculating Illidan.
Did you forget that befire Arthas Illidan was already emasculated by Maiev and player literally had to save Illidan from a cage? Or that Arthas an Illidan barely even met until the final level of the TFT undead campaign?
>Illidan was already emasculated by Maiev
It was Kael'thas' emasculating Maiev, plus Vashj character development (imagine underwater snake bawds conquering a desert, very epic). FGS' gaping StormGAYt will have nothing of this caliber, let's face it.
TFT was peak RTS, peak Blizzard, and peak Warcraft. Frick, I wish I were conscious around the time when Blizzard trashed Westwood with BW, then took their sweet time releasing RoC, AND THEN delivered the most brilliant expansion to it. They literally copied LotV missions from the TFT campaign such as the Tomb of Sargeras, 12 years later.
>Or that Arthas an Illidan barely even met until the final level of the TFT undead campaign?
L and Light never met for like a dozen episodes in tbh Noto, so what? The yaoi tension was palpable throughout. And in the Symphony of Frost & Flame, Ner'zhul poured all of his essence into his boy, it was such a gripping moment.
>Ignores the facts and moves the goalposts instead.
COPE
>I wish I were conscious around the time when Blizzard trashed Westwood with BW
>L and Light never met for like a dozen episodes in tbh Noto, so what? The yaoi tension was palpable throughout.
You don't seem to be conscious right now. If you are living in Canada then you should consider euthanasia. And if you don't, then you should take a bath with powered up toaster, i heard it cures moronation.
It’s just starcraft 2 but slower, I don’t really see the problem
As a SC2 gay, I'm happy. I was afraid it's gonna be casualized as frick - tiny maps, a handful of units to control, etc. Turned out to be nothing like that, I'm actually kinda concerned about how many active abilities units have.
Concerned about visual bloat though, but overall looks good.
>visual bloat
Honestly I expected much worse considering all games these days are filled with particles everywhere. I managed to get what was going on in all scenarios they showed pretty well.
Maybe there are even some VFX options to reduce shit further like the dust and smoke.
Compgays think people actually want to play like this.
that's just zoomed out BAR
a lot of people turn off all visual bloat and postpossessing in single player you autistic homosexual
No, what the frick lol. I mean I guess thirdies with potato PC's do
If you play RTS you are either in your 50s or from the third world.
better art style than most games
It looks like it takes hardcore micro. That much was expected.
looks horrible and plays horrible.
I understand that it's alpha, but even with all the effects and stuff we can already tell what the game is about. I'm not sure if I'll play it.
The gameplay looks limited, the micro is annoying, with that drops...
Micro looks slow as frick, the building seems lacking and the art direction is generic. Is this how brood war boomers feel; I'm going to be playing the same game for another decade.
SC2 alpha
that's footage five years before release, you think stormgate is coming out in five years?
No.
>you think stormgate is coming out in five years?
at least 3
Why should we move from SC2 to this game? Maybe if M$ continues with the support we could go back to SC2?
The microsoft and activision merger was blocked
Temporarily, at the very least.
pffft. The guys over at Back2Warcraft were hyping it up a bit. I expected it to be more similar to war3, with a focus on campaign but it looks like a shitty mp only starcraft clone
they said it was launching with a co op vs ai mode and also a fairly small but still present campaign that will be expanded over time.
Sounds like PvE/SP is going to be an afterthought and they are chasing that e-sports rabbit just like every fricking failed competitive RTS released in the last decade, shame.
I thought all those failures and the popularity of SC2 co-op mode would teach the devs something, but guess not.
all successful rts are mainly multiplayer games you moron
>all successful rts are mainly multiplayer games you moron
No they fricking aren't.
Name three successful RTS games that didn't have multiplayer.
nta, but that was a very badly worded question.
A lot of RTS were successful AND had multiplayer. I can't stand W3 multiplayer but I really like single player.
>didn't have multiplayer.
ignoring the goalpost moving Age of Mythology, Warcraft 3, and Red Alert are all well remembered for their singleplayer campaigns
>Wc3
The multiplayer side of it spawned a whole new genre (moba) and supported the growth of another (td) as well as being played like 10x times more often than the rts and campaign side of it.
It's true about red alert though. Still, all of the biggest games are multiplayer.
You're obviously too young to know it, but Warcraft 3 was a huge e-sport back in the day, it was one of the WCG disciplines for many years.
Age of Mythology was also a WCG discipline for a year in 2003, which contributed to its success. Quoting Bruce Shelley:
http://www.gamespy.com/pc/age-of-mythology-the-titans/6556p1.html
>GameSpy: Who do you feel are the primary audience for the Age games? Single-player or multiplayer gamers? And, which audience do you primarily design for?
>Bruce Shelley: Both, actually. We believe that one of the keys to the commercial success of our Age games has been their ability to appeal to both hardcore and casual gamers, including single-player and multiplayer fans. We put a lot of effort into the single-player campaign in Age of Mythology, for example, because our focus groups indicated that that was important to a high percentage of our players. At the same time, we put a lot of effort in the multiplayer game because that is important in creating buzz about a game. Plus, many of our people really enjoy that aspect of play. The random map games work for both audiences. We then provided a variety of maps, game types, and level of difficulty settings. All these choices mean a very broad audience of gamers can find a type of game (in The Titans) that suits their skill and taste, and they can all feel like they got a lot of value for their investment of money and time.
As for Red Alert, let me quote Joseph Bostic:
https://funambulism.com/2014/08/15/a-metric-ton-of-my-old-command-conquer-interviews/comment-page-1/
>JB: I think C&C was the first RTS multiplayer game. The multiplayer aspect is what really launched the RTS genre as there is endless replayability when human opponents are involved.
Once again, low iq SPbabbies have been utterly btfo and should keep quiet.
Stronghold/Stronghold Crusader, Majesty, Total War series.
>but those have multiplayer
So does every RTS
>Stronghold/Stronghold Crusader, Majesty
Niche and dead
>Total War series.
Not an RTS
>Niche and dead
Moving the goalposts. You asked for three successful RTS games, not three RTS games still actively played today. People still play those games regardless.
>Game well known for its real time large scale battles is not an RTS
It looks wc3 as frick with how micro heavy it is.
There are creeps there and a purple dot thing that the creeps were guarding. I don't know what to think, I think I'll just go back to SC2 and continue to suffer.
>to suffer
Why suffer though? It's getting stale but it's still peak classical RTS.
I really hate chrono boosting/Mules/Injects. Besides that I still think it's the best RTS, even without support.
>no heroes
>no items, no shops
>the blandest, most generic sci-fi setting
>no story
"No"
>no heroes
>no items, no shops
So you want even more micro?
>the blandest, most generic sci-fi setting
As opposed to the blandest, most generic fantasy setting of wc3?
>no story
Are you one of those homosexuals who consider themselves "RTS fans" after playing through the campaign aka the babby's tutorial mode a few times?
>So you want even more micro?
I wanted a warcraft like experience, not starshit. And especially not mobile startshit.
>As opposed to the blandest, most generic fantasy setting of wc3?
From my understanding many of the original devs of warcraft3 are working on this game. So I expected some improvement after 2 decades - obviously was asking for too much.
>Are you one of those homosexuals who consider themselves "RTS fans" after playing through the campaign aka the babby's tutorial mode a few times?
I think you belong to /vm/, this is /vst/ lad. Take your eshit somewhere else.
>Take your eshit somewhere else.
They promised to appeal to subhuman casuals like you multiple times, since the very first announcement. So don't worry, you'll get your pve mode where no one is gonna hurt your fragile ego.
>wot if SC2 looked like a mobile game????
Yeah, I'm just going to keep playing Brood War until I die of old age.
I wanted WC3, got slowed down SC2 with mobile graphics.
Lukewarm reaction.
>trees block vehicles but not infantry
That's one thing I found cool. Different type of terrain for different units could be used more in games.
Doesn't look too bad for a free to play, alpha I will play it but is it good idea to copy starcraft? I don't know about that.
This looks awful, it's literally just slower sc2.
This looks amazing, it's literally just slower sc2.
holy shit I knew it was bad but I didnt know it was THIS bad. It's like you took SC2, slapped on the WC3R color shader and level scale, and sucked all the soul right out of them. There's barely any feedback from the attacks, they look and sound like you're a fricking fairy sprinkling comicbook VFX on enemies instead of chucking mortar shells or whatever the frick that was.
I thought a few minutes about a suitable insult for the not-marines and came up blank. It's so fricking bad I can't even insult it
Insanely underwhelming. After all this time... if you gave me this much money, I'd have much more of a game and it would be 100x better. They're on UE5, they didn't have to develop new game engine.
They really did spent all this investor bux on diversity hires and s.oy lattes
It hurts. I agree and it's not about the polishing.
This. The artstyle is so bad. It's going even further into cartoony territory than even SC2. Frick man, I just wanted it to be good. I was holding on to this hope that "They know what they are doing" like a moron.
I'm not even old yet, I'm technically a zoomer, but why does everything look so soulless? I don't even know what "soul" means but this shit has 0 of it. A single sprite of a dead dragoon from SC1 has more soul than this entire game
>A single sprite of a dead dragoon from SC1 has more soul than this entire game
this
>They know what they are doing
terrible misconception
they never did
Starcraft was a fluke and they never knew why it was good
They probably spent all that money on marketing, it has a shitload more hype than the game deserves to have. Seriously, it looks like a cheap chink clone of starcraft 2 AND it's F2P, WHO THE FRICK GETS EXCITED FOR SHIT LIKE THIS
Spending more money for unnecesary social control/marketing that the actual gameplay.
Sure that Internet was a mistake all along.
Anyone else really thrilled and satisfied with the result? Gameplay looks really fun, units look great. They are taking all of the best ideas from all of the different rts, while also adding things that are new. Interesting things on the map, creeps to kill from wc3, forest to block bigger armies, dog functions as a scout from aoe2. Kill time is high filtering sc2 shitters with boring no micro fights.
im mostly optimistic
but seeing a Lancer hit a dog with a bigass mecha sword and do 1 damage made me cringe
I'm not the biggest fan of the artstyle, but I don't really hate it like others here do. I do like that it is very clear what is going on.
I agree, the gameplay looks really fun and they seem like they are trying to appeal to casuals with a coop vs ai mode and a single player campaign so will definitely be trying the game on release.
My worry is that I wont like any of the launch factions. I think there are 2 launch factions, the human resistance and the demons, both which don't look very appealing to me. I think there is also a third faction that is either a third launch faction or will be released shortly after the game releases.
The humans seem to be generic humans and I just hope the demons aren't a "small number of units but each unit is stronger" faction like the protoss are in sc2. If those are the only two factions I'll try out the game and then probably just wait for the next faction to come out since those two seem boring to me.
I thought the demons were supposed to be the zerg of this game
They can be the generic bad guys while having the gameplay mechanics of protoss. We have no clue what their play style is right now.
the dna assimilation of Zerg from starcraft
combined with the demon motif and uselessness of Inferno from Homm
They seem to have fused WC3 humans with SC2 terrans. Artstyle seems a bit odd. Gameplay seems to be SC2 but slower, which I enjoy. I hope they achieve a good middle ground between shit taking forever to die in WC3 and everything dying in an instant in SC2.
I really dislike the siege tank equivalent. It needs more oomph and it looks like shit. The shot was too slow and seems really easy to avoid, which would make the unit basically useless.
The infantry units look and sound great.
Honestly, the only real complaint I have is that I think the game needs more personality. Gameplay seems like something I will enjoy greatly.
Half the reason Black folk are screaming muh chink phone game is because of that and the flat colors.
Looks, sounds and plays like chinky mobile slop. Also
>e-sports oriented
This piece of shit is literally DOAAAAAAAAA
I hate how (lazy) cartoony art style has become the corporate memphis for games, now I regret complaining about brown&bloom
Let's not get ahead of ourselves here. Broom and bloom did and still does look like shit.
Old wc3 looks crystal clear while reforged has that shitty soft misty/foggy look that all new games have for some reason and I FRICKING HATE IT
>for some reason
Just making 3d models to look "ok" in the redactor of choice, instead of making them look good from the camera angle specifically
ok i rewatched the gameplay again and textures arent as bad as i thought but it does have weird mobile game aesthetic.
Style aside, I think they have a similar problem (though maybe not as much?) as Reforged - nothing is distinct enough from the background and from each others.
Dogs reminded me of AoE4
Well... let's all go back to SC2 and hope that MS will continue the development of the game.
Maybe they could hire the director and the writer to write a new expansion.
Not touching your shit again, mister blizzard shill.
i'm not sure what i was looking at when i saw it
i dont mind the phone like graphics or whatever, but just have this question
why would i play this over aoe2 or starcraft?
Looks like more WC3 than SC2 in terms of gameplay, everything seems slow and hard to kill, not that that's bad.
But holy shit, the artstyle/design is absolute garbage
Starcraft 2 is a mobile game. It has oversized soldiers, buildings, vehicles and overly bright colours.
I fricking HATE slow moving dodgeable high damage explosive projectiles!
I don't want to have to micro every fight involving enemy artillery!
why does everyone and their mum repeat the same shit that multiplayer doesn't sell from that e-celeb. This guy exlusively plays sp, of course he is going to shill for sp only rts:
I'm not saying that having singeplayer with an ai is bad but saying that's the only reason that people play rts is quite a false statement. clearly multiplayer keeps rts alive long term.
>why does everyone and their mum repeat the same shit that multiplayer doesn't sell from that e-celeb
/vst/ is full of literal redditors who consider themselves RTS fans because they used to play singleplayer campaigns as kids. When they tried to get into multiplayer later in their lives, it turned out that MP matches are nothing like stomping the AI by turtling and then amoving a blob of high end units. It's like a completely different game all of a sudden, and they suck at it. So they keep screeching about "meta", "apm requirements", "boring build orders", etc., which sounds absolutely deranged to any actual RTS fan.
>which sounds absolutely deranged to any actual RTS fan.
I know you don't know this, but saying things like this is a dead giveaway of someone on the spectrum. It's alright to be passionate about a hobby, but you're projecting your intense passion onto 8 billion strangers on the planet.
I implore you to stop being a moronic feral Black person sperg and stop posting. I know you can maintain high APM, but can you maintain a healthy relationship with another human being? I highly doubt it
>you're projecting your intense passion onto 8 billion strangers
8 billion people on the planet are RTS fans?
I'm afraid that you're the one projecting.
>doesn't even care to deflect any hard truths about himself
>I'm afraid that you're the one projecting.
>complete with a redditjak
I accept your concession.
no problem my man. Be sure to have this victory engraved on your tombstone next to your peak APM.
your first post came with a redditjak you moronic monkey
I played a guy in SC2 who fits this. After checking his match history it turned out he only played co-op/single player and I was his first MP game. He opened by building 50 cannons with no units. When i steamed rolled him around 8 minutes he accused me of hacking and reported me. I called him a scrub and he threatened to call police on me KEK
Kek. I feel like this guy, only it was WC3TFT at around 04-05 and it was literally my first time playing the game at the local LAN club with some friends. Except i just assumed that yep, looks like i suck at this, and proceeded to play CS with some other guys while friends finished the match.
>/vst/ is full of literal redditors
no place on the internet is as bad at competitive games as Ganker, /vst/, those boards are full of sim4, paradox trannies and console morons who cant play rts for shit.
Not fault them, fault to the South Koreans that they didn´t expand globally their e-sports cybers.
answer is as always "it depends"
I wouldn't pick a game up if it doesn't have a singleplayer campaign. I wanna play through a cool story as a "commander" or whatever. Play some asymmetrical missions with varied objectives. If I like the game after that, I'll stay for mp, but not for long. Coop PVE in SC2 was pretty cool.
this guy on the other hand will absolutely play the mp-only game, probably for years
The real answer is "you absolutely need both", as Bruce Shelley pointed out twenty years ago
You need good singleplayer to attract a large crowd of casuals when the game initially releases. A large player population in turn attracts hardcore players who will maintain the clout and keep your game relevant for years to come. This is why Stormgate will be f2p and will have singleplayer and coop while targeting SC2 fans.
After having watched that video, your post sounds incredibly disingenuous towards the arguments he gave. Also, whether he mostly plays SP or not is mostly irrelevant.
looks lame. where's the terrible, terrible damage?
the sound effects are placeholders, right?
... right?
it's over
early-game looks like the gayest parts of AoE2 and BW mashed together
>2:26
>An entire marine squad struggling to kill some chicken thing
as much as I shit on the game, pretty sure that one is some sort of a joke
they're australians, please understand
the chicken thing is a placeholder for a neutral creep intended to look like some sort of bigass mad max barbarian
I'm very happy it seems to play a lot more like WC3, rather than SC2. The artstyle seems more SC2-inspired, though, which I'm sad about.
I'm a lot more interested after the gameplay trailer than I had been before.
Looks like mix of sc2 with wc3(zoom level) but has terrible art style and textures, it has the same shitty blurry graphics as mobile games. Who the frick thought it was a good idea.
>Who the frick thought it was a good idea.
making a plain matte texture is much, much easier (faster, cheaper, safer) than something detailed
just call it what it is lazy low effort garbage
not gonna critisize someone for working inside their budget
can't wait to have your worthless ass replaced by AI soon enough
seethe all you want, on time and on budget is the hallmark of a professional in any business
It's a streaming friendly art style. Panning the camera over a screen with a lot of distinct details results in the video encoder shitting itself and producing tons of artifacts.
both wc3 and sc2 are stream friendly and dont have shitty pastel colored textures like in
Hehe, he's named "Dong".
not good not terrible.
homosexuals as usually are getting worked up and then will cry how there are no RTS games being made anymore
I can tell units apart easily in WC3 and SC2. Granted I'm used to them, I can also see details on them despite my shitty eyesight. In this gameplay units look like blobs.
so the units are dog, marine, really big marine, very fat potion thrower and siege tank?
no, you forgot the zealot
dog, zealot, marine, medic in a marauder's suit, D.va, siege tank, medivac, oracle
the artstyle looked unimpressive, as expected, but overall i liked it
I have no strong opinions on this game. Could be good, I suppose. Time will tell.
>esports focus
Dead on arrival.
>normal people want a fun game, good campaign or compstomp, not caring too much for meta, build orders, etc
>esport pros will play whatever is popular enough to make money
>esport wannabes just want to watch esport pros play like the cucks they are, possibly thinking they will totally be a pro some day too or just that they somehow share in the "glory" by watching
>normal people are turned off by the esport asiaticclick meta focus and either don't buy the game or leave after a week
>esport pros see the lack of popularity and realize there's no money to be made here so they too leave after the contract with the dev/publisher expires
>most wannabes follow the pros to another game, a few of the die-hard sweaties keep metaslaving in PvP until little by little they all give up too and the game hits 0 concurrent players
Every time.
They mentioned a campaign, a co-op vs AI mode, and custom maps. The game is even f2p. I dunno where people are getting this narrative that this is gonna be a hardcore RTS for hardcore RTS gamers only, they obviously want casual appeal.
nta, but while they mentioned that it will be a game good to both pros and casuals, the gameplay they showed was a bit too much catered to the former.
But, if they manage to get good map editor, like the WC3, I might be interested more. Frick, I miss WC3 and its custom games.
That's fair, this trailer was definitely focused on just showing a 1v1 ladder match with micro. Presumably because that's what's ready to be shown off at this point. I'm not saying this game will 100% be good, it might very well still bomb, but they're definitely aware that focusing entirely on esport is a bad idea, and their plans for custom maps, co-op etc. at the very least SOUND good
Pretty much https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XehNK7UpZsc
Apparently there's going to be a campaign but so far there's been no sign of it.
>Dead on arrival.
it's too often hard for the hardcore audience to gauge what their product looks like to the casuals, the barrier between the worlds is so impregnable, many don't even realise it's there.
Frost Giant Studios strikes me as a developer utterly lacking in "vision" or "aesthetics" for their game. They say all the right words to the multiplayer crowd, they're actually quite in touch, yet they seem to have lost sight of the bigger picture.
Like, even making a StarCraft 2-clone in 2023 is rather clueless, considering there has not been a hero RTS since the days of Warcraft 3 (maybe besides Dawn of War 3 and Spellforce 3?). Another funny thing is that Immortal: Gates of Pyre has been in development for years, and it's an even more simplified StarCraft.
Regarding the campaign... Oh boy, I wouldn't hold my breath for it at all. Coming back to the "aesthetics" question, they seem to be making it as bland and unassuming as possible. Just as the gameplay is basically SC2 (with minor differences such as neutral NPCs), so does the visual style scream a LoL-clone, with washed-up colours, cringy mechs with machine guns, and a female protagonist (who's not even hot like the bazillion female heroes in Mobile Legends).
In the end, it is impressive how one could be so out of touch. I would love to be wrong, of course. But in the best case scenario, it will only become StarCraft 3 (by cannibalising the population of SC2 and some of WC3). And the tragedy is that StarCraft 2 is the easiest RTS to get into these days - precisely because it's popular! I swear, I played it a few months ago, and the bronzies are actually 100% bronze. (It's Brood War, with its barely 1.5k concurrent players in the West, is an impenetrable brick wall, deserving the infamy.)
Yeah, it's missing that "epic" feeling that SC2 and WC3 had.
>Yeah, it's missing that "epic" feeling
a literal Pre-Alpha build
I hope you are right.
I forgot to say, because what we got is very close to the artworks/concepts released and the designs look like toys.
beta starts this month, i played sc2 beta graphics looked pretty much exactly like current sc2.
Yeah lol sure they did anon, sure they did. Might need to take off those nostalgia glasses.
Also SC2 was clearly an indie game from a newly established and crowd funded studio and not had huge company money behind it. And it also did not have a genre defining prequel game to it which made development way easier. Right Anon? Right?
what the frick is this moronic gibbering? kys, idiot
>lowko reacts to alpha
What did he mean by this?
remove the heroes from wc3 and the terrible, terrible damage from sc2 and the result will inevitably be bland - those are the focus points of the entire designs
that they haven't presented something to fill this void is concerning to say the least
I can list a dozen of things I didn't like but in general it looks good. The standard stuff is there. Hope to see some innovative but not gimmicky stuff from the not-zerg and not-protoss races.
>innovative
seems unlikely
I HATE the dotted acronyms as unit names
I HATE that giant JRPG sword dude design, and from the video it doesn't even seem like the unit has any actual purpose to exist
The not-siege tank seems too slow and impactless right now
Also the model by itself makes it very unclear to me whether it's sieged or not
The minigun robot being outdpsed this hard by a couple of not-marines just makes me think about sc2 in a bad way
The infantry only forests are neat, but I thought it was placed a bit too close to the base
The rest is... ok? Serviceable?
>I HATE that giant JRPG sword dude design, and from the video it doesn't even seem like the unit has any actual purpose to exist
he's supposed to do whatever slow zealots are doing now, maybe he'll even get the legs upgracde instead of charge from sc2
>The minigun robot being outdpsed this hard by a couple of not-marines just makes me think about sc2 in a bad way
He has a piercing attack so I'm guessing he's the equivalent of firebat, his purpose is to counter low hp melee units, not to compete with marines.
>he's supposed to do whatever slow zealots are doing now
You might as well make not-marines, no? They look like they're in the similar price range seeing as how spammable they were
>maybe he'll even get the legs upgracde
Yeah, that's probably a given
>the equivalent of firebat, his purpose is to counter low hp melee units
Ok, fair, but this made me think that the match being a mirror really hurt the showcase
>he's supposed to do whatever slow zealots are doing now
die pointlessly?
>Warcraft III with a D.Va vs Diablo skin
>Stormgate = Starcraft
>Tempest Rising = C&C
>DORF = RA + KKND
We're in the golden age of RTS copycats.
Golden age implies success this here reeks of disaster
dorf is the only one doing anything interesting
and I hope it has as much success as possible
Who cares whether anyone is doing anything interesting, I want 10 copies of old RTS rather than a new DotA.
Watch as dota btfo of your generic and uninspired rts#346
The DotA formula of AoS has been generic and uninspired since WC3 times already. There were a bajillion of AoS. There has been nothing inspiring or interesting about DotA since the mid-2000s.
>BAR = TA
it's the RTS Renaissance
>SC2gays and WC3gays fighting over which one they want Stormgate to copy
I just want a new brood war, bros
You will never get anything remotely close to brood war, and you know it.
Is remastered brood war has better unit controls? I remember pathfinding was borked when I tried to play it like 10 years ago as a kid. Also 12 units maximum to select is stupid
Remastered changed nothing gameplay wise, only added better looking sprites and a functional ladder.
>functional ladder.
I tried getting into BW this February, while Korea reaches 30k concurrent players, the total Western population is barely 1.5k, and playing that is hitting your head against the brick wall, unfortunately. (Yes, I lost every PvT while playing Protoss. I could only win a Zealot rush in Protoss mirror.) At least, both WC3 and SC2 have the players.
well shit, don't really feel like going back to 1998 controls and responsiveness wise
Same. I hate the visual style of new blizzard, world of warcraft and its success has been a disaster for aesthetic design, even the new diablo games have that rubbery cartoonish tinge to them. Warcraft 3 was always the worse RTS compared to starcraft/brood war. On the bright side, brood war's competitive scene is still strong and the remaster didn't butcher it like warcraft's did (inb4 hair splitting over individual unit portraits, the overall remaster is great if you're not a contrarian).
its over RBT bros
>Zeppelin micro
>Minimal basebuilding
>Cartoony artstyle
Dead on arrival
of all the fricking things you could bring over from WC3, they bring over fricking zeppelins? it's the dumbest thing i've ever seen
I think they're more based on the SC2 warp prisms. That kind of micro is very popular in that game.
Yeah it's definitely more like the prism. It's usually done with slow hitting units, since they can shoot and get picked up while reloading their shots.
Man you guys are really sure the game is going shit when you haven't even played it yet. I thought RTS players weren't graphic Black folk
Nobody likes to look at ugly games.
I trust them with the gameplay, I played hundreds of hours of SC2 coop. I just don't think the artstyle is up to par.
>I thought RTS players weren't graphic Black folk
Readable graphics are hugely important for an RTS game. Tempest Rising looks sweet but it's gonna be dogshit to play precisely because of its fancy graphics.
AoE4 fell apart because the visuals were unclear. AoE3 did a much better job by distinguishing units with their uniforms and other equipment, rather than just by making the weapons prominent.
I'm a design Black person and the unit design is generic af
not sure what these guys are talking about, everything seems super readable
>not sure what these guys are talking about, everything seems super readable
It's about what your eyes are trained to see. I see mecha-men with weapons, not clear "swordsmen" or "gunners". I can identify the worker and the heavy, but there's already room for confusion.
They have clear different silhouettes and sizes. Knowing what units were different was pretty easy.
>They have clear different silhouettes and sizes
The gunmen and the lancers fighting the workers? Not clear enough for micro.
It's very clear what is what.
Talking about the unit model. I don't normally clue in to size and weaponry.
Maybe it'll work out for you and others. It's just rough for me, at least for now.
Do you have problem with SC or WC units too?
Honestly I can't say I have the same problem, but I got used to differentiate units based on how they hold rectangles in C&C.
>Do you have problem with SC or WC units too?
SC, yes. WC, no.
>I'm a design Black person and the unit design is generic af
So how would you make a non-generic design for
>space soldier with gun and armor
>space solider with big sword and armor
and have both look different to distinguish them for gameplay reasons but yet similar to look like they are from the same faction while also looking somewhat like a small type humanoid looking unit instead of a floating-spider with floating non connected joints and keeping to the cartoonish art style of the game.
>So how would you make a non-generic design for
NTA. Instead of using bulky, armored designs, make thinly-armored suits to resemble real-life uniforms.
you just ruined the game's readability. they're chunky for a very good reason.
Adjust unit and prop size to compensate.
>just zoom in bro
yeah nah
countless RTS have tried thin/realistic proportions. it plays like ass.
>countless RTS have tried thin/realistic proportions. it plays like ass.
AoE2 is still one of the top 2 RTS games.
AOE has the same units for every "faction" save for their unique units.
it's also an unreadable mess, but since everyone just masses one type of unit at a time it doesn't really matter
In AoE2, units are distinguished first by their garb and silhouette. There is no trouble distinguishing them.
>AOE has the same units for every "faction" save for their unique units.
Visually, yes. In practice, no. A Burmese halberdier is not a Viking pikeman is not a Spanish halberdier is not a Japanese halberdier is not a Malian pikeman.
Don't start moving goalposts, Anon's problem was with unit visuals.
I misunderstood. The visuals are fine, because the units are distinguished from each other by their uniforms. This doesn't cause confusion. It makes visual recognition very easy.
>thinly-armored suits to resemble real-life uniforms.
that is exactly the reason why AoE4 failed miserably.
It failed because it made the units too small to clearly see.
I remember reading the lance guy will has a shield upgrade.
I think they need to add details to show they are fighting demons. Maybe something religious, I don't know.
I can give you an example from starcraft itself. The armor of the marines in the game have turbines on their backs, because otherwise they couldn't deal with zergs on top of them. Shit like that goes a long way to add personality to your game.
>and keeping to the cartoonish art style of the game.
ok, for a point number 1 I don't like the cartoony artstyle in the first place. SC2 had it, but this game goes even deeper into it and it's aproaching fricking clash royale territory.
point number 2, "If you can't make it better BY YOURSELF then you can't criticize it" is a silly statement. Now for the actual questions
>So how would you make a non-generic design for space soldier with gun and armor
Start by not remaking terran marine 1 to 1. Fricking hell, they even have the same vents on their backs by the look of it.
Do NOT lean into gigantic pauldrons again, it's overdone. The bulky space marine armor is unnecesary in general, humans are fighting demons on earth in this one. If you wanna do power armor (which you don't HAVE to do), "literally space marine" is not the only design you can go for.
Problem is, unit's role usually dictates their looks to a degree, and if you are repeating every role from starcraft/warcraft 1 to 1 then you gonna have to stretch your imagination in attempt to make the same unit look different. But exact mechanical simularity of units is another problem and I fricking typed way too much already
oh yeah bro, the lanky ass zerglings or ghosts are completely unreadable, uh huh. moron
>Maybe something religious
ENTER picrelated
If there's one genre that should have giant pauldrons, it's RTS games (and I guess any game from a top-down perspective), you gotta have a top-heavy design for it to be remotely readable.
>zerglings
have two huge claws on their back
>ghosts
always holding their giant fricking sniper rifle upright
>have two huge claws on their back
>always holding their giant fricking sniper rifle upright
Yes? How is this a point against me? It's a perfect example of how you don't need the giant pauldrons to make a small unit pop. Even the glaive guys from stormgate read easily by the way they sholder their weapon. See, that's good design. The problem is the rest of a glaive guy is just a cartoony SC2 marine again. You can design any unit to be readable, my problem is with their artstyle. You can have a unit with 40k tier pauldrons if you want to. The problem goes deeper than that.
>So how would you make a non-generic design for
>space soldier with gun and armor
>space solider with big sword and armor
HOW ABOUT DESIGNING SOMETHING FRICKING NEW AND ORIGINAL FOR A CHANGE HUH? FRICKING GOYSLOPMAXXERS RUINING MY ALREADY DEAD GENRE
I said from day one that this RTS should have knights vs cowboys vs sentient food
I remember that they joked that the game was about space aliens with vacuums kidnaping animals and stuff. I'd actually liked it more if it were really that theme. lol
sounds like a great game in the spirit of Destroy All Humans tbh
yeah, there was an army of hamsters or something.
I would do it like this then again I'm not a game designer
With upgrades swordsman gets an energy holographic green shield (holo-shield) and rifleman shoots green (plasma cartridges), normally it's standard colour.
why would we have space soldiers with guns and armor? It has been done to death, the same races over and over again. How about dwarves? Robots? Dragons? ANYTHING else but 'definitely not terrans', 'definitely not protoss' and 'definitely not zerg'
because the studio was created by programmergays
turns out that you actually DO need at least one ideas guy with a creative vision
anon the entire point of all of this is to sell us on the game. If these trailers, teasers, pictures and interviews aren't working then it's a pretty good sign that the game will also be shit. The whole "don't judge a book by it's cover" is pretty much cope for losers who make shit products.
Everyone is a graphics Black person. Even dwarf fortress players.
Denying damage by picking up units into speedy medivacs and warp prisms (to a lesser extent because those can't carry bio) is shit gameplay. Recently damaged (like 1 or 2 seconds) units should not be liftable.
I would rather they just significantly reduce the pickup radius. The only reason these silly strategies work is because the transport can hang back in safety and grab/drop off units at a distance.
the transport should have to land or deploy to load or unload units (but this should also be supcom-ferry tier convenient to order)
the question is if they designed hard counter units like immortal in this game too, they are cancer of rts games and always frick up the balance and viable strategies.
>good faction is named "resistance" and has a female leader
we're slopmaxxing, boys
>Jaina in Warcraft doing practically everything but always being forgiven by the plot despite all the bad shit crazy things she had done.
>Sylvanas in Warcraft, Leader of the tragic Forsaken, then made Warchief (Later on saying it was just according to Keikaku), then later becoming a Demi-God all while similarly to Jaina SHE COULD DO ABSOLUTELY NO WRONG!
>Kerrigan in Starctaft leader of the Zerg becoming the Queen b***h of the universe then going back to human then going back to Zerg and soon after becoming a LITERAL GOD and defeat the "the universe's most ancient evil." Xel'naga.
You are talking like this is new or something, where have you been in the past 20 years?
weren't sylvanas wank in WoW and kerrigan wank in sc2 written by the same guy? he just has a type lmao
metzen's sylvanas stuff wasn't very wanky, it's the homosexual who took over later that had the banshee queen as his waifu
it'd be cool if the game had A SINGLE original idea. just one. all i ask.
There's not a single good RTS on the horizon
The mourning pigeon is blind.
DISREGARD THAT; I SUCK wienerS
The cartoony art style isn't even the problem, but the overal design of everything is. Age of Empires Online had an even more cartoony art style but was still able to have way more unque factions and units for their civs and still made it look decent and have some original game play.
and I think that's the thing with modern RTS games, not only do they not do anything new but they don't even do anything old. Can you name another RTS game that has mechanics like zerg creep? How about units that need to morph in to another unit or even a building? What about having to build ammo like with Protoss carriers and reavers? Or how about the Night Elves in WC3 where your buildings where also giant fricking trees that could walk around and become their own monster unit?
At MOST you get with modern RTS games is a unit that can transform in to long ranged artillery. That's it. Even AoE got rid of their one interesting mechanic, converstion in AoE3 and I'm not even sure if it's in AoE4. Even CoH3 has regressed on everything Relic did with DoW and CoH.
I really don't think you have to generally do anything new or inovative, but when you say you're game is based off something and you throw out everything that made that game stand out then there is a huge problem. Stormgate is made by a bunch of ex-Blizzard devs who left entirely because activision told them that they weren't allowed to make another RTS game and that SC and WC RTS where dead. For them to come from YEARS of RTS development and have ZERO of the things that make those games, well those games... what is there to be excited about?
well, you still do not know if they have these things. You saw 2 minutes skirmish with one faction and ~5 unit types.
And nothing they showed of that faction was not only original, but actually less than what SC was.
That was about it but again, for a bunch of ex-blizzard devs who revolutionised RTS games you'd think they would have had a lot more to show other than a off brand versions of Terrans.
>for a bunch of ex-blizzard devs who revolutionised RTS games
these are the guys who kept the seats warm after the big decisions were already made
their grand vision is to stay employed as rts devs
>new project from former Y employees who worked on great classics like X
>third rate shitters with inflated sense of importance
Every time.
What ends up happening is that they clearly underappreciated the amount of resources they had or the role of management keeping them focused so the product is meh at best. Sometimes they have good workmanship but are not particularly inspired so it ends up a subpar clone.
Nah, at least the COOP guys are the minds behind what made the mode good.
Can't say anything about the supposed WC devs since I never knew anyone besides metzen and samwise.
>What ends up happening is that they clearly underappreciated the amount of resources they had or the role of management
Seems like commie approach. And commies also always failed.
Petroglyph also never made any good game and still use "we wuz westwood"
Empire at war, C&C Remake.
But you are gonna call them shit because you have abysmal taste, right?
>Empire at war
as someone whose played 400+ hours and loves it, EaW is a pretty bad game. Half of it (ground combat) is absolute trash.
But you're right about the C&C Remake, I consider it to be the only good remake and actually superior to the originals.
>played 400+ hours and loves it
>EaW is a pretty bad game
Clearly isn't, it is at best a mediocre game, and that is if you ignore the best space combat RTS in any video game.
Empire at War is not really a good game. Ground combat is absolute garbage and campaign mechanics are poor. The only remarkable thing is space combat which was fun but can't carry a whole game by itself. And honestly it was just a flat 2D plane and the mechanics weren't actually all that complex. Most of the appeal was just spectacle because of the sound and visual design. If it wasn't star wars even that probably wouldn't be all that remarkable.
>space combat which was fun but can't carry a whole game by itself
It litterally does.
hey, they had 1 kind of cool thing, the big units couldn't go through vision blockers. More map design tools is good at least
>For them to come from YEARS of RTS development and have ZERO of the things that make those games, well those games...
You have to keep in mind they'd spent 10 years only making e-sports focused units and changes.
Just compare the new additions to Terran roster from Wings of Liberty (Viking, Thor, Marauders,...) to the ones in Heart of the Swarm (Widow mine, a voiceless, loreless instagib unit) Legacy of the Void (Cyclone, a voiceless, loreless high damage unit). And this is terran, which still at least get a hellbat tranformation or the Liberator.
Protoss got what? A high damage orb, a flying orb, a base orb, a detonating insta-gib orb,...
I'm pretty sure there were more than enough people on the team who forgot that units with some interesting personality or ones you'd like to build just to use them... are kind of one of the good parts of Blizzard games.
Unlike the legions of beeping and buzzing robots with one or two cool standouts like in, say, SupCom.
Cyclones have voices though.
Actually, the Cyclone is kind of reminiscent of the GLA Buggie from Generals.
https://cnc.fandom.com/wiki/Rocket_buggy_(Generals_1)
Isn't Cyclone is supposed to resemble Nod's Stealth Tank, while pilot looks like Havoc from Renegade
>Widow mine, a voiceless, loreless instagib unit
I unironically couldn't get into heart of the swarm because of this. A mine that shoots a rocket from underground and then slowly reloads, infinitely. The attack is near instantaneous and can't be prevented once launched. That's so fricking stupid. Why is SC2 further simplifying a simple concept of a mine? BW got it right the first time.
I remember one game where I made like 3 WMs, plopped them in my natural, and they killed 90% of harassing muta squad instantly. Just like that, for free, and once he comes back the mines will just fire again. What the frick has this game turned into?
I won't even mention swarm hosts which initially broke all zerg matchups so hard it killed all popularity momentum the game ever had. There had to be a serious case of brain drain at blizzard at the time
sounds like you got lucky and did a perfect high-stake blind-counter that your opponent fell for twice. yeah you'll win from that. happens in bw too.
tbh even they accepted swarm hosts were a mistake and nerfed them so much they became useless outside of baiting tank friendly fire.
they do show up in the occasional lategame deadlock even on the pro level
And are a waste of resources 90% of the time.
At least were 2 years ago when I still watched.
hey that still leaves 10% reusable bug rape
I love how zerg and protoss are given and unit and then Terran just get a better version of it.
>Zerg get banglings.
>Zerg players complain about having to constantly replace banglings and to either fix it or bring back lurkers.
>Instead just give Terran the fix to zerg's problem.
>Only add lurkers in once they give Terran the better lurker, the liberator.
Swarm hosts would have been good if they actually produced free units. What I mean is that for the Brood Lords cost 4 control, but can end up making 12 broodlings before the broodlings start dying off automatically. Swarm Hosts cost 3 pop, but can only ever make up to 2 locusts per swarm host. Even though they both technically make "free" units, I would argue that the units still counts when factoring in cost and attack, so really when you look at it the only unit actually making free units is the broodlord since it can produce more units than it's given cost for both minerals and population cap while swam hosts can not.
Brood Lords still need to be on the battlefield and in range of snipes, not appearing on any part of the map with nydus shitting their free units, then disappearing before they can be killed.
It's one of the worst mechanics they introduced in the game, on par with tank medivac.
>Cyclone, a voiceless, loreless high damage unit
shit the frick up, cyclone sounds like an ace combat character and I love him
>and I think that's the thing with modern RTS games, not only do they not do anything new but they don't even do anything old
there are no modern RTS games, there are base defense stuff and C&C copies
I think that it looks ok for an alpha or beta or whatever it is. But if that's the final design then it would be a dissapointment.
I like the units design so far and I see soul in it. I just hope that they really improve and polish the graphics and design. I want this to be good, vst bros.
another concern: this is apparently a f2p game. So you know there must be some bullshit monetization practices.
tbh i think they're approaching it from the other end, they're f2p because they have no clue how to sell the game
that's because there is no thing to sell. This is a war3 + sc2 fusion that brings nothing new to the table. If I want to play w3 i'd play w3, if I wanted starcraft i'd play sc2. What would make me want to play this game?
Not giving blizzard money, mister shill.
They said the campaigns will be purchased, no?
I don't care if they ask money for new races or skins on multiplayer, as long as they aren't stupidly expansive.
If it's just a child of wc3 and sc2 how are they going to make team play fun, like they supposedly want to to attract casuals? Team games in those two were like moronic cousins of 1vs1s
Team games are always 1-2 guys from each team getting fricked while the rest rush late game.
>game made to be watched instead of be played
>game made to be played at high level
if the map editor isn't at least made for a braindead moron then I literally can't do anything with this
I don't get how all the Youtube comments are saying how it looks so good but anyone who has eyes can see it's more dogshit than probably any early 2000's RTS. Looks almost like a onions-gay mobile game. How much do they pay people to type good things on Youtube?
not very much, shills are cheap
pretty sure the forced positivity is free.
it's just a thing now
Because it is "Pre-Alpha" footage. Starcraft 2 also looked like dogshit in pre-Alpha.
SC2 alpha footage looks miles better than this heap of crap. I don't care if it is alpha or not the current product at display is shit. If and when they change it I too will change my opinion on it. I won't praise garbage willy nilly like how most homosexuals operate when a new product shows up. And I really doubt this cheap mobile garbage starcraft knock off of a game will change for the better in the first place.
I think it's you who needs eyes.
No one would give a flying frick about this shitty game if it didn't have 1 or 2 names attached to it.
I'm sorry for your lack of proper vision bro.
>I don't get how all the Youtube comments are saying how it looks so good
Mobile game graphics are the standard now, also they look readable
>I don't get how all the Youtube comments are saying how it looks so good
it looks pretty normal though
definitely better than Starcraft 2
I am not sold, to be honest. Out of "genre revival" RTS in development, it is the least memorable. DORF has cool and memorable graphics, WAOS has the attention drawing name, Tempest Rising promises the focus on the single player campaign for a change, and this is... F2P made by a couple of ex-Blizzard has-beens that looks like it belongs on mobile devices? I mean, even the artstyle in the OP is confusing. What the hell am i looking at? Sci fi stronk womyn and DnD monsters, both generic as frick, looking more like heroes in MOBA than units in RTS?
>muh graphics
It's a strategy game, bud, you're not the target audience.
>2:40
these units shouldn't be able to be loaded in and out of combat willy nilly unless they are smaller units and it's a special type of dropship
https://leagueoflegends.fandom.com/wiki/Combat_status
but muh micro
Zeppelin micro is a stupid busybody mechanic.
Zeppelins should be used for crossing impassable boundaries, not as a missile redirection system
They should make zeppelins very easy to kill, killing all units within, or add a mechanic that stuns units for a few seconds when they are dropped, like in Dungeon Keeper 2.
>get outplayed
>>busy body mechanic
Just build anti air.
Busybody mechanics are annoying minigames that sane people don't want to play while playing the game.
Like having a Beat Mania minigame running in the corner of your screen at all times that you need to get a 100% score on throughout the whole game to get a 20% production bonus, or having a jumpscare across your whole screen in irregular intervalls to keep you on foot. StarCraft players love those kind of mechanics. Sane people don't.
Just build towers.
The transport costs food, you are at army advantage. Just build anti-air.
I'd rather just not play your shitty game, thanks.
You are not gonna play any game if you can't handle something this basic.
There's countless games, including countless RTS, that don't submit to SC2-like busybody mechanics, because devs have already realized that you don't need to include this antiquated bullshit. I won't ever run out of games to play.
Why are you in the thread about a game from ex SC2 devs instead of talking about those other games?
Just because many of them are ex-SC2 devs, doesn't mean this will become SC2 again. And thank God for that.
Tell me what games don't have busybody mechanics.
nta but BAR I guess
It's probably not possible to completely remove them, but you can minimize them. A recent game with great quality of life features that try to minimize mindless busybody mechanics would be Old World.
A lot of arcade games might also qualify, like aforementioned Beat Mania, or Tetris. You probably want me to name more strategic games, though.
>devs have already realized that you don't need to include this antiquated bullshit
they do, but not that much!
I see.
>Old Wolrd
>turn based
A lot of things make sense now.
What I'm saying is, when devs are nowadays facing the inject larva decision they had to make in early SC2, where they wanted to automize it but hardcore SC1 players wanted it to stay manual because that's what they're used to and what they perceive to be skill, they're less likely to repeat the mistake of giving in to the SC1 players.
You can also take Mohawk Games' other game, the RTS game Offworld Trading Company, as an example if you insist on stressfull RTS. They tried cutting down on these dumb mechanics there as well. I'm just using them as an example because I admire their games.
Injecting larva isn't a busybody mechanic, you are choosing to it over creep spread or banking heals for defense. It might be a way more pronounce mechanic in the early game since you can just have 10 queens in the late game, but that's still a choice you are making in having a weaker army in exchange for quicker rebuilding.
Could you come up with a way to improve the mechanic?
With the way zerg works? Not really. Queens are the kind of unit that if you touch even a little you can easily make them too weak or too strong.
There's a reason why they ditched the mothership core but didn't frick with the queen.
nta, but they could've automated all that with a toggle button. "keeping in injecting larvas button", "auto chrono boost button", "auto MULE", "auto creep in a certain area".
There's no need to go back to the base every 30 seconds, not only that you need to select the queens correctly or they'll go all over place and start to walking toward the other based. SO you need to cycle through the bases, select the queen, inject, rinse and repeat.
There was no need for that.
>nta, but they could've automated all that with a toggle button. "keeping in injecting larvas button", "auto chrono boost button", "auto MULE", "auto creep in a certain area".
A toggle button would preserve you making the same choice but with far less clicks and attention being diverted to enact that choice.
If two game mechanics offer the same choice but one is less annoying to use than the other, you should use the less annoying one. Therefore a toggle would be preferable to manually injecting, chronoboosting, MULEing - with the option to do it manually, for the rare cases where there's an interesting choice to be made.
Choices that are not interesting to make should also generally be cut out.
Every single one of those economic buffs also have defensive and supportive actions you can use in certain situations. CC has extra supply cap and scans, queens have creep and health regen, nexus has battery overcharge and recall.
How are these not interesting choices, the option you select will be related to the strategy you focus at the time or the game you are playing.
You can make these choices even if you automate the execution.
Imagine you know that you need a lot of resources right now, so you decide that you will use MULEs for the next four cooldowns next to the mineral lane of your main base. Why shouldn't you be able to tell the game that this should happen for the next four times exactly when it's possible?
What additional meaningful choices are gained by forcing the player to wait four times to actually be able to tell the game what he wants to happen - to land MULEs next to his mineral line when the cooldown is ready?
(Obviously, also add the option to cancel what hasn't happened yet.)
You're making excellent points but the asiaticclick-worshipper's mind is made up and he won't respond with an actual argument because his position is indefensible. I want to play an RTS to build and manage an army, not play piano.
>Why shouldn't you be able to tell the game that this should happen for the next four times exactly when it's possible?
Because you might want to preserve energy for scans.
Did you know that you can drop mules aggressively on the enemy mineral line to deny him minerals in a prolonged game?
Did you know that creep pathing actually matters, as well as the amount of tumors to drop, and it varies depending on the matchup?
How the frick are you going to automate chronoboosts when it's a part of your build order, which you might want to change on the fly to adapt to what's happening?
Apmlets sre insufferable.
Yeah, automate all that.
I absolutely agree. If you need to add another spinning plate on top of other spinning plates you are doing something wrong with the design of your game. Mules, chrono boosts and injections are infamous for that. Even spreading creeps are really bad, the queen should do it automatically.
You don't want to be a nanny in these games, you want to create an army for war.
These mechanics are so bad that they had to introduce another resource called energy. It's all so annoying.
>Even spreading creeps are really bad
Idk man, creep gets a pass from me, because it feels cool to spread it. Then again, I'm campaign and coop only player
spreading creep is cool, and should be autocast
>These mechanics are so bad that they had to introduce another resource called energy
Energy has existed since the first game.
Creep spread is literally the most interesting and fun mechanic in the entire game, both fighting with and against. It rewards you greatly with vision and army speed while also forcing the enemy to act, incentivizing engagements. Both thematically and mechanically it's one of the best parts of the game. Making it completely automatic would erase one of the most important skills from the race.
Creep spreading could've been automated, select "an area", "random" or "manual".
About the energy, I just finished the first campaign of the Terran because I couldn't stand the bad pathfinding and limited units selection.
Yes, it would free your mind to make more meaningful choices, maybe even manage two armies for a pincer attack, instead of choosing a death ball.
>Creep spreading could've been automated
It would be extremely oppressive for the enemy at lower ranks. Not having as much creep to deal with is one of the expectations of playing with bad players.
Forcing a mechanic like that to any player is actually highlighting a bad design or a bad balancing of the game. You can't balance a game over APM or forcing input execution. That's not strategy, it's just babysitting/busy work. It's not a fighting game that requires precise inputs, theoretically, your troops should do all this work.
>That's not strategy, it's just babysitting/busy work
Choosing what to pay attention to is literally strategy.
The thing that makes RTS interesting is the real time part, otherwise it's just a mobile auto battler.
not every 30 seconds.
Yes, every 30s.
Macro is important and fun.
It wrecks your train of thought when you are truly thinking about a strategy, specially at lower levels. In the end, one of the main reasons people choose to death ball is because they have to manage 300 of stuff at the same time. Most of them makes no sense in a ware scenario, since your lower ranked soldiers would all be making these minute choices under your command. It's a RTS, not a micro clicky-clacky game, it's no wonder that MOBAs has swallowed a huge part of the RTS players.
I never had a problem with people not enjoying that aspect of RTS. I do, and I want games with it.
This is a game made by people that made games I and other people enjoy. It's no wonder why I don't want it to be more like a MOBA or an automatic gacha "game".
>Creep spreading could've been automated,
Do you even play the game? Do you realize the incredible advantage creep provides for the zerg?
Creep allows zerg units to move way faster thus allowing them to either relocate faster, close distance to their target faster, chase retreating targets better or disengage from encounters faster thus reducing losses even allowing them to commit more to uncertain battles with way less risk?
Creep allows several mechanics like Queens to use Transfuse, relocating their defensive buildings around and also blocking enemy buildings from being built offensively?
Do you realize CREEP IS LITERALLY MAPHACK for Zerg? Granting them the best map vision and map awareness out of all the 3 factions? To thr point where other factions even go as far as sacrificing units just to clear creep from the map?
And you would want these massive advantages to just be automated? What the actual frick are you thinking?
Balance the games around mechanics, not around "clicky-clacky 500APM I can spin the plates faster than you".
The genre is dying/dead, besides a few games, because the devs try to design the game for people like you. I don't want to play 4x or gran strategy. I want to play something like SC, but without all clicky-clicky 500 APM.
Stormgate was the game that was supposed to solve that, but didn't and won't.
As another anon has said, I want to play a game not a piano.
I'm noticing that you are too used to SC, since you want to balance the gsme around the input mastery, not on the merits of the game mechanics. Any of these games should be playable at 60 apm at a pro level.
>The genre is dying/dead
Make up your mind, do you want a strategy game or do you want a fotm with tens of thousands of players? I've spent a good few hundred of hours playing MP wargames last year, namely Command Ops 2, Command Modern Operations, Combat Mission Black Sea, Flashpoint Campaigns: Southern Storm. Finding an opponent was as trivial as going to a forum or discord and asking who'd like to play.
If you're too shy to talk to people like that without the whole auto match making facade, I can see it being a problem.
>I want to play something like SC, but without all clicky-clicky 500 APM.
Just play in silver or gold, everyone plays at like 50 apm there, and these leagues have a frickton of players. https://www.rankedftw.com/stats/leagues/1v1/#v=2&r=-2&sx=a
Make up your mind, It's called Real time strategy, not "500 Action per Seconds E-sport Starcraft variation number 3427" game.
It's called "starcraft and age of empires are the only relevant ones" genre, actually.
No amount of seething will change that name, unfortunately.
>I don't want to play 4x or gran strategy. I want to play something like SC, but without all clicky-clicky 500 APM.
I have four words for you:
> Immortal: Gates of Pyre.
>Immortal: Gates of Pyre
Wow, this one looks great, I think it's not released though.
: Gates of Pyre.
well, the art looks like even worse version of league of legends artstyle, but sure, I'll keep an eye it.
>Stormgate was the game that was supposed to solve that
Who the frick lied to you? They never once said they would make something completely different.
They said that they were going to simplify a lot of stuff. It's basically the same game as SC2, bit made worse with creeps. So far I don't see a reason to play it over WC3 or SC2. I still jope it'll be good though.
It's one of the factors. Micros forces high APM, becoming pianist is not something people want to do to play a game.
You have a misconception that RTS should be AoE/SC styled games. It could be so much more, but it's limited by this paradigma of micro/high APM.
And yes, if Stormgate is micro focused, and I think it'll be thanks to the creeps.
>You have a misconception that RTS should be AoE/SC styled games. It could be so much more, but it's limited by this paradigma of micro/high APM.
I think people playing AoE/SC may literally be incapable of comprehending that RTS don't have to be clones of just those two games.
They may actually just not have played a lot of RTS either, because there's plenty that aren't those two games or clones thereof but that seems inconceivable to them.
I'm aware there's other types of RTS games, but Stormgate was always gonna be "something like Starcraft and Warcraft", and I find that exciting because there haven't been many games like that recently, especially with the same level of customizability.
I don't now, DORF seems to be a better game.
Stormgateis something really long term, because SC2 will surely be more balanced and will have more game modes for at least 3 or 4 years.
Yeah, I'm looking forward to DORF too, but I hope Stormgate will have a good amount of custom content and a fun co-op mode, which I'm not expecting from that game.
Yes. For example, Pikmin is considered a RTS, a game like this would be inconcievable for them.
Anything that's not a sppining plate game with 500 apm is not rts for them. Chess is a geriatric boomer game just because ir's turn based with low APM, according to them.
I don't like asiaticclicks, but Chess is literally, by definition NOT a RTS game
That's not what I said, I said that, according to them, Chess is a boomer game because it's not high APM.
They were never gonna make a game for geriatric boomers. I'm sorry you are this delusional.
If they said they were going to make macro easier, what could possibly be the game focused on if not micro. If pic related is what you want to play then you're setting yourself for disappointment right from the start.
>micro
does RTS even have that?
more than mobas
maybe in the realm of asiaticsports that term applies and makes sense but microing the frick out of a marine unit or just pressing attack move does not change reality
it's good macro play vs poor macro play
it's a god game and you puppeteer stuff around because you lack a solid body that can enter the physical realm
go back to your auto battlers homosexual i doubt you have brain capacity to even play turn based games.
uuuooohhhhhh
I understand that you want that kind of game, but your claim that RTS is dying because of micro is unfounded. There are RTS games with lower micro requirements than SC2, and people don't play those either.
they're called mobas and they're incredibly popular
MOBAs are literally the opposite of what that anon wants. They're all micro, minimal strategy. Anon doesn't want to control individual characters, he doesn't want to do pullback micro, he doesn't want to target abilities, he doesn't want to orbwalk, he only wants to ~make decisions~
then he should go play fricking turn based games not whine about RTS
I don't think he can handle 4 abilities + items during a fight.
>Creep spread is literally the most interesting and fun mechanic in the entire game, both fighting with and against. It rewards you greatly with vision and army speed while also forcing the enemy to act, incentivizing engagements. Both thematically and mechanically it's one of the best parts of the game. Making it completely automatic would erase one of the most important skills from the race.
What's the actually fun part about creep spreading? Is it making the strategic choice on when and where to spread to, or is it the mechanical act of doing so? I believe the strategic placement is the fun part, while the mechanical act more often than not is a nuisance that could be improved.
To use an analogy, think of building queues in Command&Conquer: Red Alert 1 versus those in Red Alert 2. Or the original RA1 versus the remake. What was fun about building units? Was it making a choice on which one to build or was it actually going to the menu and pressing the button to actually do it?
Because in the original, you had to go to the menu every time you built even 1 of your most basic units, then wait two seconds for it to build so you can press the build button again. In the newer titles, you can just queue 20 basic rifle infanterists within a second. You know you want to build 20, so you queue 20. In the old one you know you want to build 20, but you go to the menu, build 1, wait, build 1, wait, build 1... for a whole minute.
There certainly was skill involved in switching to the infantry menu whenever build options were available again. The skill to get into the menu quickly. There also certainly were choices made. The choice on when to interrupt commanding your units to get into the build menu. Were those fun choices? Was this a fun mechanic?
There's a good reason why the RA1 remake has build queues. But if SC1 didn't have build queues, hardcore players would demand them to be removed from SC2 as well.
Yes, the precious time and energy used to make these mechanical decisions could've been channeled into making true decisions about the game. Keeping selecting the units that has less HP to send them behind the lines, for example, is a dumb mechanic, because that's a tactical decision, not a strategic one. Each blob should have a "global HP", for example, kiting should be a strategy, not something you keep clicking like crazy all over the map. There should be punishments for retreating from battle and entering in it again and again and again. Retreat should be a strategy, not a form of kiting your enemy with high APM. This input execution obsession that RTS players have has only made the genre less accessible and less fun, specially for new players. It's an input execution game, not a strategic one.
This genre needs to evolve past AoE2 and SC styled games. These "Dune-likes" games are very limited. I wanted a RTS chess, not an input execution/route memorization game.
I wanted to feel like I'm in charge of an army, not a babysitter.
>This genre needs to evolve past AoE2 and SC styled games.
Why? I want games that cater to me. Go search other games that cater to you.
And you already got it, and pretty good ones at that, by the way. Stormgate should've be evolving the genre, not be making the same mistakes. I can already tell that micro will be important with the creep hunting all over the map, they did that, but without the heroes. I think it'll be extremely annoying to hunt them without a charismatic character that you can control.
There's no reason to play Stormgate over SC2 or WC2, specially with this plastic toy look
>There's no reason to play Stormgate over SC2 or WC2
I can play online without giving blizzard money, while also getting updates. That's reason enough for it to exist.
There were multiple games even posted in this thread that seem to cater to what you want, why not play those instead?
>I can play online without giving blizzard money, while also getting updates.
that's bullshit, they are not working for free, they are going to sell coop stuff and campaigns. Unless you are only going to play pvp with naked characters forever.
>There were multiple games even posted in this thread that seem to cater to what you want, why not play those instead?
Maybe Supreme Commander, but I think it looks ugly.
I don't mind paying for games, I don't want to give money to blizzard in particular.
I see.
>Why?
Because classic RTS are fricking dead, and this is probably one of the reasons why.
And you may enjoy those new games as well, even if they are different from the old ones. Who knows, you may even find that you like them more, because they may offer even more meaningful choices to make. Maybe they'll end up being as chock full of micro as old games, just a more accessible kind of micro that would allow for RTS not to be fricking dead.
Shooters haven't changed significantly in the last 10 years, and they still sell.
I don't care that it would appeal to a larger audience, I want it to appeal to me.
Shooters aren't fundamentally broken, that's why they haven't needed to change significantly.
I'm also claiming that there are probably potential RTS games that would appeal to both a larger audience and you. I'm just speculating, though.
Which is a pitifully small market with almost no new titles, considering the enormous growth that games in general have had for the past 20 years.
And if this guy's
stats are to believed, then the people actually still playing Starcraft 2 and AoE2 are actually by a vast majority not at all the hardcore crowd that appreciates these mechanisms.
>the people actually still playing Starcraft 2 and AoE2 are actually by a vast majority not at all the hardcore crowd that appreciates these mechanisms.
Yes, the majority of people are shitters.
You know what stormgate is doing? Separating COOP, multiplayer and single player. Something I completely approve and is the right choice. I didn't exclusively play 1v1 in SC2, I also had multiple lvl 15 commanders before they introduced prestige.
1v1 should still cater to what I want, those other modes can do completely different stuff.
Starcraft 2 still has thousands of players, AoE2 still has thousands of players.
There's clearly a market for these games, while other RTS that do try something new fail miserably.
All Actvision needs to do to kill Stormgate is to make a remaster of the models, so they'll be more polished/high poly, a revamp of the UI, some bug fixes, like the anti-aliasing not working correctly and some QoLs when it comes to hotkeys setup.
If they hire the director and the writer of SC2 to rewrite the original SC, they could even launch a new campaign, which could rise the interest in the game. And why is that? Because I don't see Stormgate advancing the genre, it actually feels like a worse SC2. Luckily for them, apparently, the MS/Actvision deal won't go through, and we already know that they are not releasing any new RTS games anymore.
Although they are surveying for a WC3 Reforged soft relaunch, if that's successful, anything could be possible.
Why the frick would they care?
They didn't give a frick about microsoft and EA trying to revive their games. They only remastered BW so they could cash in on the asiatics.
>All Actvision needs to do to kill Stormgate is to make a remaster of the models, so they'll be more polished/high poly, a revamp of the UI, some bug fixes,
Look at how that worked out for Warcraft 3 Reforged.
WC3 problem wasn't the remaster, but how bad it was. Diablo 2 Ressurrected was extremely well received. It has it's problems that are more associated with not updating the UI, lobbies and other stuff. But when it comes to the visual aspects of it, it was very well received everywhere.
SC2 is really good in what it does, they don't really to invest a lot to modernize it, specially if you consider what was done to D2R. They really need to make a better custom game browser, though.
Yeah, they don't care.
>But when it comes to the visual aspects of it, it was very well received everywhere.
I've been playing and mapping WC3 continuously since 2004 and hate it for reasons well-expressed by other people who hate it just as much through, for example, that copypasta image about that Reforged forest road.
I was talking about D2R, I'm sorry if I didn't make myself clear.
The problems with WC3 are obvious, but the problem wasn't the remaster itself, as shown by D2R, that was well received. It was the incompetence of the team to faithfully remaster it and keep the original features of the game.
Black person they can't even finish overwatch multiplayer, you think they are going to make a team to a game that they can't realistically monetize?
They tried with skin packs, new campaigns, new commanders, and they still would rather let it die. It's gonna be at least another 5 years before they even start thinking about it.
Yeah, they even killed HotS because it wasn't making enough. I highly doubt that both SC2 and HotS wasn't making money. I think that they were, a lot, but it wasn't enough for them.
Yeah, especially after immortal.
At best we will get an SC mobile game like that C&C shit EA tried a few years back.
>"Killed"
>Player base is quite active even by the drop, of wich the motive is was more likely the playerbase getting a little sick to playing MOBA games (ask any LOL player).
They really shouldn't put the game in maintenance mode. It's the best MOBA on the market. Super fun.
Better that adding constant content forever, a game development needs some rest you know?
I'm not sure if you are being sarcastic.
Smarter that you, shitty gacha addict.
bot?
Get out of the house, you getting fat son.
And stop with the nonsensical cringe anime images, this isn´t the channel...
Baka.
stop being a bot
Hermano, tu eres gilipollas...
>They really need to make a better custom game browser, though.
Wasn't that super high on the priority list ever since the game had come out? I'm not really hopeful, if they haven't managed to make a good one in 13 years.
Yeah, MS could've changed that, but they are finding a lot of problems to go through the buyout. Stormgate may end up getting most of the WC3 and SC2 players, since they'll be offering what Blizzard can't offer anymore.
Maybe, in the future, they could reskin Stormgate and release something for the WC3 public.
Good joke anon.
>I wanted a RTS chess, not an input execution/route memorization game.
>I wanted to feel like I'm in charge of an army, not a babysitter.
Play wargames. What the frick is your problem? You're like a stupid kid complaining arcade physics in a new mario kart game and lamenting about the lack of realistic racing games.
I'm not impressed. Looks like a slowed down SC2. I'm still going to reserve final judgment until I actually play it, but nothing that they revealed so far has excited me.
*sigh* Somehow Havoc...stole yet another tank.
>The game is under development, with closed testing starting in July 2023 and expected to be released in 2024.
I WANT TO PLAY IT NOW
If there is an inject larvae mechanic in this game that I have to manually click every 60 seconds, I'm not playing this game.
me neither
Dawn of War innovated the "overwatch" build feature. You right click a marine from a barracks and the barracks will attempt to build marines as long as you have resources and pop cap. It lets you focus on the actual fun part of RTS: clashing armies and funneling in fresh reinforcements. Excessive micro (>120apm) being necessary for good macro moves the genre closer to fighting games (a genre so braindead even Black folk play it).
RBT genre is over. Time to grow up and play real strategy games
Yeah, I'm starting to agree with the rebranding of the genre. It only makes sense, especially when some people replying here just won't grasp what the central problem of the current RTS is.
Maybe "High APM RBS" would be a good ter..
^AI generated post
^ Piano player generated post
what is this supposed to mean?
SJW autism.
anybody else not like this unit
the placeholder stuff looks great but when you look at this fast food running around you wish it was a placeholder
https://stormgategame.fandom.com/wiki/S.C.O.U.T.
it screams asiaticsports and it doesn't really seem to fit anywhere
is this STR or DEX or INT unit
when you do vision stuff it seems to be INT but
then in the trailer it seems to be STR unit but
since it's also small and long like a hot dog it reminds me of DEX
surely your not gonna breed only one type of dog...
What the frick are you talking about? It's just the scout cavalry from AOE2 in a dog skin.
> It's just the scout cavalry from AOE2 in a dog skin.
good to hear i'm not the only one seeing that
>What the frick are you talking about?
Zealot should be str since it has the most health and shields
Marine should be int since it is the only ranged and is the only one of the three that has an activated ability
the picture isn't really about the individual units but the 3 races
jak?
>jak?
meds
Zerg should be cha, because they're the only of the three that turn other people to their side.
Terran should be dex, because it's a ranged attack.
Protoss should be wis, because they depend on mystical energies for most of their bullshit.
M'fers are basically stealing assets from other games
So fricking over
you are a fricking schizo
have a nice day
Is this a bit or legitimate intense autism / schizophrenia?
Why are you arbitrarily assigning the RTS units to D&D attributes?
What the frick?
This is the real reason of why the RTS genre is shit nowdays.
Get frick.
haha yeah sure buddy whatever you say
>doctor get in here quick he needs his meds hes doing the RTS archetypes as stat types thing again
Stupid cat lover don´t got the message, as per usuall...
>People want to make RTS to surpass Starcraft
>Doesn´t even understand the basics of the genre
The secondary effects of playing to much DOTA 2 I guess.
Fricking chaotic neutral posts not understanding the value of organization.
mind you the scout cav is awful
PLAY STARCRAFT NORMIES!!!
Here
>log into your favorite RTS game and start up a match
>guy in your team presses the push to talk button
>a small window opens in the upper right corner with a dude saying
>I have played RTS my entire life
how would you respond?
>You must have lived a short life.
>"Frick off Black person" and give him the birdie
Resign, kindly
>players must now create a short video introduction for themselves
>it's automatically sent each game in order to help the community feel more personal
What could possibly go wrong?
Nothing, I welcome penises getting jerked off and cartel execution videos, telling me that I should kill myself for our team's failings.
for me it will be meatspin
>~私は指挥官breastsですうううう~ <3
Best be using a voice changer my dude, the only acceptable exception is for dudes with deep whiskey'n sigars for 20 years voices.
that sounds all good expect for the word compete in front of 3vs3
some guy is roasting the game because you can compete
https://steamcommunity.com/app/2012510/discussions/0/5570437336429145047/
I don't see how Armies of Exigo fits that definition even the box art backside never said
>Competitive PvP focused RTS
Yeah, his critics are valid. I'm worrying if it's worth switch to Stormgate. It'll all depends if Microsoft go through with the buyout or not. I'm sure that they'll invest on SC2 if they do.
Spoiler: Not, is not gonna happen neither.
Investing is not the solution of everything kys anon.
you are a dense one, aren't you?
wiener wise, yes
>the dense wiener
BTW MICROPENISOFT ONLY CARES ABOUT CALL OF DUTY AND CANDY CRUSH!!!
TAILS, WATCH OUT!!!
It's literally SC2, aka dogshit
>Casually repairs dog.
Wut?
So the dogs are robots? Is everything robots? Why where they killing tanky chickens?
Apparently the chickens are placeholders for various neutral creeps that are yet to be implemented.
The dog apparently is a robot/cyborg, yes.
The cyborg dog of the Allies for Red Alert 3, of course!
Because frick EA right? Is not like we SJW´s were equally worst that Putin a this point...
sc2 people who work on stormgate already made a robo-dog unit
Of course it is. It has to be a sanitized for all ages experience!
Can't have blood in germany. Can't have undead in china. So it's all this same robot or vaguely mystical creatures and energies instead of flesh grinding to a halt to a war machine.
>Can't have blood in germany.
There is blood in StormGate. Actually, robot dogs are better because dogs would look ridiculously stupid in a sci-fi game.
Come to think of it, robot dogs are equally stupid. See my previous comment. Every single unit they have shown is moronic. The Vulcan is the most interesting mechanics-wise, I'll give them that (wind-up time like Tychus in HotS + AoE cleave in a line à la gryphons), but its visual is a... robot suit with a machine gun. A detachable machine gun. Even though a robot should have it as part of its suit - see Goliaths or Thors... Like wtf, it just boggles my mind how moronic it is.
There is blood in the game, we've seen it. So why you're even bringing that is is moronic. and undead being banned in China is, honestly, a gigantic meme.
There's no blood in stormgate, moron. Maybe lay off the shrooms.
This puke-vomit artstyle is cancer that should be removed from the root.
This is not the natural evolution of the WC3 artstyle. Against the Storm genuinely looks more like the original warcraft than this WoW/StormGate feces.
AgtS is SOVL as frick
that shit looks like old league of legends and it's disgusting
Will Stormgate save RTS?
doesn't look like it
How do you know? I will reserve judgement until the game releases. You have nothing to lose if you decide to play the game since it will be free.
>How do you know?
the footage they released
I don't want to be that guy but its pre-alpha...
when it changes for the better so will my opinion until then it's shit
I don't think so, I'll go back to SC2.
Shartgate won't save shit
Next grey goo
I also hope that din't do like Blizzard and pack stuff, like decals ans skins with certain events, or at least, make them available at a later date. I don't think its fair and it's a bad practice.
Honestly, my main gripe with the game so far is not necessarily the graphics (which can work), and not the lore (of which we have only seen snippets), but the general unit design, unit fantasy (or lack thereof). I.e., having literal marines, medics and siege tanks kills it for me.
There could be rocket launcher men, like in C&C Generals. There could be marines that deal more damage with bayonets (my suggestion: combine the lancer and the exo units into one). Anything but the StarCraft units. Because this is not StarCraft. And if it's too close to it, the very StarCraft fans will shit all over it because of the small differences, ironically.
Yeah, I hope the other factions will deviate more. Having the human faction play very similar to Starcraft makes sense as an easy one to get into, but I would like to see some more creativity. The mech charge is the only thing I've seen so far that looks remotely creative.
It looks extremely Blizzard / Starcraft to me but I am really not a fan of the setting and art style tbh
Also very much not a fan of the first talking head I see being a "LE PRO PLAYER"
IDK it just kinda looks extremely middling
As long as it can replace Starcraft 2 Coop for me, I'm sold. That was the promise.
I listened to some 2 hour interview with artosis and I really didn't like some of the things they said.
Artosis immediately brings up how dts are "OP" and "not fun" and the developer agreed and said that if there's an invisible unit they would decloak when they attack.
With the gameplay reveal it looks exactly like you'd expect. It just looks uninspired.
Strong units is what makes RTS games fun but there's needs to be strong units in every race to balance things out, that's all
>they would decloak when they attack.
Very much like invisible people in WC3, which is what Stormgate is leaning towards.
>Strong units is what makes RTS games fun
How are DTs strong if they are binary as frick? You either die to them because you have no detection, or they are useless. They only kind of work in BW because there is so much macro and you might not cover every base with proper defences.
>I really don't get why everything seems to move so slow, particularly the slow siege tank like thing.
I only watch StormGate at x2 EZ
DTs are the perfect example in my opinion of a strong unit. Against Terran you can use them with carriers/arbiters and make the Terran run out of scans and slowly kill him that way.
Against Zergs they can destroy economy. It's the perfect unit, super strong, costly but can also be countered.
Bad example is the firebat in my opinion. It hard counters zerglings, it has no real downsides and they work under dark swarm which is a T3 ability.
I'd in fact "buff" DTs by making SCVs weaker in HP so they can get one-shot by DTs, it'd also make early rushes from Terran way weaker/risky. One of the biggest problems with Terran is their workers are way too buff, they never fricking die even against storms if they get away quick enough. It's absurd
>It just looks uninspired.
it IS uninspired
>Artosis immediately brings up how dts are "OP" and "not fun"
I wouldn't like to play against that either but guy always builds the same shit
terran can do literally the same when massing ghosts
HAS HE NOT PLAYED CAMPAIGN? or does asiaticsports not allow ghost
Artosis has the most braindead and bruteforced playstyle
he should stop building marines and make firebats
He didn't even play the game.
I hope that Pikmin succeeds and these "hardcore" "pro gamer" RTS fail hard. I'm starting to hate this community focused 1v1 games.
Sucks to be a american, uh?
>I'm starting to hate this community focused 1v1 games
1v1 is still superior to team games all the way, man.
I really don't get why everything seems to move so slow, particularly the slow siege tank like thing.
If you want to make a turn based game, just make a turn based game.
>incoherent lowskill noises
i cannot imagine a bigger gay than someone who would make that macro or post it
>plus you´re protoss
And? Suck my dick dog eater.
Says the south korean fatty that doesn´t last even a 10 minute walk outside.
>Morten previously was StarCraft II: Legacy of the Void's production lead, and Campbell had been Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne's campaign lead designer.
Hard to think of 2 people i would want to support less than these two lmao
big bulky cartoon robots is the least cool looking thing in the fricking world why the frick did they make it like that, it looks like fricking generic cheap plastic shit, frick this fricking game and frick them for trying to put on the 'saving rts' hat when they're just going to shit out a massive fricking pile of generic plastisheen rounded-edges bullshit and then ALSO suck the gay wiener of every fricking homosexual 'le pro' 'le streamer' and get their feedback for 'le balance' as if any - and i mean ANY - of these degenerate basement trolls could EVER - and i mean EVER - make a good fricking video game if their lives depended on it. You ask for a fricking 'pro's' or 'content creators' opinion all you are going to get is a laundry list of santizing 'no rough edges' bullshit changes to make everything 'le symmetrical' and balanced and nothing can ever feel too powerful because then it's 'OP' and the streamer might lose on stream and their fragile virgin homosexual egos can't handle it. What a crock of fricking shit, we are literally all going to die, we are nothing but warm worm food, and we are wasting our precious minutes on this earth begging for dopmaine-firing entertainment to help dull the anxieties of living and give us some, just a precious crumb, of engaging fun and instead they hold us down and they rape us and they kill our families and grind them up into mincemeat and overcook the shit out of it and feed us this blackened pile of fricking bland charred SHIT. FRICK.
Are you OK?
Thank you for the spoilers of Ciconia When They Cry anon.
>How it feels to enjoy RTS games in 2023.mov
Why didn't anyone warn him?
what is this garbage
John Wick 4
He is us anon.
>He is us anon.
A commercial puppet for a scam.
pasta in the making
New gameplay video:
I haven't seen anything this much "totally NOT-StarCraft" since the days of Priority:Survive, why didn't the devs just beg ActiBliz to let them make SC3?
Because makes more sense upgrading Starcraft 2 (and maybe 1) like Overwatch and Counter Strike, that making shitty sequel after shitty sequel.
Because right now is the time to get more people by expanding cybers globally with Stracraft and not only by youtube/twitch and similar shit? Maybe that anon, maybe that?
?t=1192
Blizzturd is a sinking ship that only exists to launder money from morons and nothing more
Because they probably did, and they said no, it would be a waste of resources.
Now get your warcraft auto battler.
Literaly all they had to do was a competent fantasy/medieval RTS game a la WC3. Instead they are doing a butthurt cop of SC2 with marines, tanks, etc. This game is going to be a catastrophe and everyone can see the writing on the wall. Sci-fi shit is already in over-saturation mode with 10 sci-fi themed games realeasing every week. People are tired of space shit.
it's over
>human towers look big, ugly and weak
>atlas chad knocks on your base door
>RTS devs still hate the turtle
Why are we still here? Just to suffer?
RTS doesn't need saving.
RTS is already saved.
RTS is eternal.
RTS doesn't need saving because it's already dead.
>wow this looks like shit, unlike this game X
>X looks like shit