They could've at least added portraits back then like FF.
With all the mangaka that made an artwork for the game, it's such a wasted opportunity to not have them make specifics portraits for each characters, that would've made the game stand out even more.
Here 37€
https://www.amazon.fr/dp/B09WZ1DMF1/ref=s9_acsd_ri_bw_c2_x_7_i?pf_rd_m=A1X6FK5RDHNB96&pf_rd_s=merchandised-search-5&pf_rd_r=VCCXJ3AB2MEQ3CE21PX2&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=8acd2702-cda0-4f48-baf2-587ca6f2fd4a&pf_rd_i=342808031
>Top should theoretically be pretty easy to outdo considering 90% of the screen is just slightly different colored tiles forming a basic pattern >Only things of note are the big enemy and the glimpse of the wall >Bottom has the pattern on the tiles replaced for a uniform color and the walls were replaced with a generic texture and covered with wall hanging and gongs to cover it up >Sprite for the enemy is still pretty good, the face is better than the originals, but the folds in the clothing are more simplistic and less interesting which makes him look a bit more generic overall, and all the glowy shit is kinda tacky and at very best just unimpressive compared to the spritework
It's a hard aesthetic to pull off because cheaping out on a single asset is glaringly obvious.
It is ok. But is ultimately basically just SNES tier sprites with some effects. It is the 2020s, where are my RPGs with sprite art and animation like a Capcom or SNK arcade title? That's what I would imagine when I hear "HD 2d". Not an SNES sprite with colored lighting.
High res sprites are extremely labor intensive for the payoff. Basically an anachronism. Might as well just use hand drawn animation like rayman legends.
I know why they aren't made, I'm just saying that I'm not super impressed. Yes, it is still better than an entirely polygonal game.
The future sucks. The best graphics are from games that are 20 years old which will never be topped because its too much work. What sort of fricked up world is that.
And pixel art games look way better than hand drawn.
Who cares? All higher res sprites were hand drawn then hex edited into the game. The more high res you go they're just spending more time layering pixels on hand drawn frames or posed 3d models. Unless it's an ultra autist passion project that is fully 2d why bother
I fricking love it, reminds me of that PS1 era, 2D assets in a 3D world sort of vibe that I've always enjoyed. The post processing can be a bit much at times, but on the whole I tend to really enjoy how they look. Especially looking forward to DQ III
The idea is fine but the way they handle it is stupid, specifically "realistic" lighting and nocolor.
Not a fan of over the top DoF as well.
I fricking love SWR/Melty aesthetic but I don't think it compares to "HD 2D" OP is talking about, considering they got fat colorful sprites with fluid animation and not tiny rpgmaker shits running around.
They aren't good but it blinks so fast the brain can't notice what's happening. It's the equivalent to Hollywood shakey camera fights so they don't have to train proper choreography.
I can sort of see what you’re saying there, but the main difference I see is there’s barely anything on the screen in those
On the Live a Live game there’s clear and visible spritework but I guess the after effects is what bothers you
Combining traditional pixel art techniques with modern smooth lighting, ambient occlusion and bloom looks like hot garbage. I wish they would stop doing that.
I remember seeing a video of some game, I think it was on Game Center CX. Celestia or something. It had this style where everything was simple pixel art, but there were all of these HD perfectly round explosion effects going off on-screen.
I think Pixel Art only really works when everything on-screen in using the same pixel size. The moment you start including anything else, it just calls attention to blocky the pixels are.
Spell effects and lighting drawn with pixel art simply look way better than particles or bloom. Octopath would look so much better if all the effects and lighting were drawn. There's no way they are going to do that though, when they can just use out of the box effects from Unreal engine, which don't look as good or consistent, but are easier to do AND most of the audience have no eye for it anyway.
I don't like it. In theory it could be great, kind of like how a lot of PS1 and Saturn games married high quality spritework with early 3D elements and higher quality transparencies. Good examples of SotN, Grandia, Strider 2, Breath of Fire 4 and so on. That stuff looks great.
But games like Octopath, Triangle Strategy, and Live a Live remake just seem content to cram fricking insane levels of bloom, ambient occlusion, god rays, and horrible bokeh shit into every frame. It's nauseating and not to be a snob but it's one of those things where it just makes me question someone's taste if they think that dogshit looks good. Like John Linneman from Digital gaytry endlessly shilling for HD 2D along with fricking Bluepoint remakes. I just can't relate to thinking it looks pleasing.
Really depends on how its done. Footage I've seen of Triangle Strategy looks too harsh with the bloom at times. But I'm okay with how the DQ3 remake looks.
It's kind of a necessary evil, high quality 2D is very labor intensive and probably isn't profitable anymore.
>It's kind of a necessary evil, high quality 2D is very labor intensive and probably isn't profitable anymore.
I don't believe you and I think this sentiment is total bullshit. Back in the day, you had high quality 2D sprite based games come out almost every 1 or 2 year, sometime even multiple a year. Dev teams were also much smaller compared to whats considered normal today. Even today, if you look at the indie game scene, you can find a huge amount of high quality 2D games coming out within very resonable time frames.
>ack in the day, you had high quality 2D sprite based games come out almost every 1 or 2 year, sometime even multiple a year. Dev teams were also much smaller compared to whats considered normal today.
yeah but you could also hire people who had been solely doing pixel art since the NES days. those skills aren't as common now
They are mostly also SNES tier graphics. No one that I know of it making Capcom or Nazca tier sprite animations in actual games.
Yeah, that's on me for not defining "high quality 2D". I was thinking stuff that's beyond SNES-levels, like CPS3 games or KOF12/KOF13. This isn't it to imply that I think HD-2D looks near as good as those games kek
>Dragon Quest III remake
I still say they should go the extra mile and put all three of the Erdrick-era games into one release. I and II are probably so small that they would still leave III with room to spare.
I think it's really good, has an almost diorama look to it. And I know people hate it but I think the aggressive DoF shifts look pretty good in motion
I wish I could turn down the bloom just a smidge though. Either way I'd take something like this over the shit remakes Square typically pumps out, jesus christ
How can a game be simultaneously so dark and so bright? So colorful yet so unsaturated and bland? I get what they were going for but wow the execution is terrible
By washing everything out. Also OT was their first HD-2D so maybe they just had less of an idea what they were doing, the LAL remake looks a lot more polished in that regard.
I didn't like it in Octopath and Triangle Strategy, but LAL actually understands the fricking concept of color and not making everything so drab and washed out. It helps that this remake is a genuine labor of love from the creator and has been trying to get it made since like 2010.
I genuinely don't know what bloom really is in games other than "when you're looking at a light source you're half-blind because the glow obscures things"
I personally really don't like HD-2D.
It barely looks better than how games used to look 30 years ago, and that's when it looks better at all.
You don't need all of these crazy post-processing effects to beat the visuals of the 90's. All you need is an artist with a new, great vision for how a game could look and modern technology will carry them the rest of the way.
That's the main reason I don't like it, I think. It feels uninspired. There are a million different ways you could tell the story of Live A Live visually. Hell, if you wanted, you could have a different artstyle for each era. And out of the nearly infinite options they had, they chose the one that looks as close to the original as they could get away with and charge full price?
I want to be challenged as an audience. Take a risk. Give me something I'll really like or I'll really hate. I'll remember you for either.
Looks awful.
If you're gonna remake something, do it properly - make it modern and full 3d. not some faux-hybrid old/new abomination with a cheap post processing bloom and depth of field effects.
One redrawn sprite that is worse cancels out ten that are redrawn better.
I don't think I can get behind THAT strict a criteria, especially if the one bad sprite is one no one cares about.
if the original game looks as fricking shitty as it does, then a single well drawn sprite cancels out all kinds of shit
The original game looks fine...in battle. Outside of battle it has FF4 overworld-tier graphics which was pretty outdated even at the time.
They could've at least added portraits back then like FF.
With all the mangaka that made an artwork for the game, it's such a wasted opportunity to not have them make specifics portraits for each characters, that would've made the game stand out even more.
man why is that live a live remake fifty bucks
Here 37€
https://www.amazon.fr/dp/B09WZ1DMF1/ref=s9_acsd_ri_bw_c2_x_7_i?pf_rd_m=A1X6FK5RDHNB96&pf_rd_s=merchandised-search-5&pf_rd_r=VCCXJ3AB2MEQ3CE21PX2&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=8acd2702-cda0-4f48-baf2-587ca6f2fd4a&pf_rd_i=342808031
The lighting doesn't make the sprite as soulful as the old one.
Quite the contrary actually.
>Top should theoretically be pretty easy to outdo considering 90% of the screen is just slightly different colored tiles forming a basic pattern
>Only things of note are the big enemy and the glimpse of the wall
>Bottom has the pattern on the tiles replaced for a uniform color and the walls were replaced with a generic texture and covered with wall hanging and gongs to cover it up
>Sprite for the enemy is still pretty good, the face is better than the originals, but the folds in the clothing are more simplistic and less interesting which makes him look a bit more generic overall, and all the glowy shit is kinda tacky and at very best just unimpressive compared to the spritework
It's a hard aesthetic to pull off because cheaping out on a single asset is glaringly obvious.
It's great, looking forward to LaL and DQ III remake.
It is ok. But is ultimately basically just SNES tier sprites with some effects. It is the 2020s, where are my RPGs with sprite art and animation like a Capcom or SNK arcade title? That's what I would imagine when I hear "HD 2d". Not an SNES sprite with colored lighting.
High res sprites are extremely labor intensive for the payoff. Basically an anachronism. Might as well just use hand drawn animation like rayman legends.
I know why they aren't made, I'm just saying that I'm not super impressed. Yes, it is still better than an entirely polygonal game.
The future sucks. The best graphics are from games that are 20 years old which will never be topped because its too much work. What sort of fricked up world is that.
And pixel art games look way better than hand drawn.
Who cares? All higher res sprites were hand drawn then hex edited into the game. The more high res you go they're just spending more time layering pixels on hand drawn frames or posed 3d models. Unless it's an ultra autist passion project that is fully 2d why bother
as long as 2D makes a return I am happy
excellent, it looks like they've finally figured out how to marry new and old
looking forward to the dragon Quest 3 one too
I fricking love it, reminds me of that PS1 era, 2D assets in a 3D world sort of vibe that I've always enjoyed. The post processing can be a bit much at times, but on the whole I tend to really enjoy how they look. Especially looking forward to DQ III
Fake gamer shit
what the frick does that mean
Additive blending out the ass is what doujin-games did in the 2000s to cheapily fake better graphics.
more please, I fricking love it
It's cheap, cheesy and it works just like TV anime production
The idea is fine but the way they handle it is stupid, specifically "realistic" lighting and nocolor.
Not a fan of over the top DoF as well.
I fricking love SWR/Melty aesthetic but I don't think it compares to "HD 2D" OP is talking about, considering they got fat colorful sprites with fluid animation and not tiny rpgmaker shits running around.
How can you "fake" good graphics? Either the graphics are good or they aren't.
They aren't good but it blinks so fast the brain can't notice what's happening. It's the equivalent to Hollywood shakey camera fights so they don't have to train proper choreography.
Fair enough.
Show an example
To me this reminds me of NIS games on the PS2
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I can sort of see what you’re saying there, but the main difference I see is there’s barely anything on the screen in those
On the Live a Live game there’s clear and visible spritework but I guess the after effects is what bothers you
don't care for it
similarly low fidelity 3D + 2D = ambrosia for the eyes
I want to tongue Sue.
Damn, that's a pretty looking town area. And those portraits are cute as frick.
It's a neat gimmick, but it feels off.
Got old fricking fast. Chinks probably love it, cuz they are moronic like that.
Combining traditional pixel art techniques with modern smooth lighting, ambient occlusion and bloom looks like hot garbage. I wish they would stop doing that.
putting bloom in pretty much anything makes it look like shit. game goes for motion blur with very few exceptions.
Per object blur can be ok. Full screen motion blur is 100% garbage in all cases.
Agreed. I prefer motion smear frames over blurring myself, but that's more a person preference and a style thing.
But God don't blur the whole screen.
Agreed, the bloom and shallow dof effect are garbage
The chances of any developer bothering to actually animate out lighting using pixel art is zero. No one cares enough about the art to do that.
I remember seeing a video of some game, I think it was on Game Center CX. Celestia or something. It had this style where everything was simple pixel art, but there were all of these HD perfectly round explosion effects going off on-screen.
I think Pixel Art only really works when everything on-screen in using the same pixel size. The moment you start including anything else, it just calls attention to blocky the pixels are.
Spell effects and lighting drawn with pixel art simply look way better than particles or bloom. Octopath would look so much better if all the effects and lighting were drawn. There's no way they are going to do that though, when they can just use out of the box effects from Unreal engine, which don't look as good or consistent, but are easier to do AND most of the audience have no eye for it anyway.
I'm sure they Squeenix has professionals paid to handle this.
HD-2D is shit. It makes pixel art look bad.
these always just look like Minecraft mods (I don't say that as a compliment)
I don't like it. In theory it could be great, kind of like how a lot of PS1 and Saturn games married high quality spritework with early 3D elements and higher quality transparencies. Good examples of SotN, Grandia, Strider 2, Breath of Fire 4 and so on. That stuff looks great.
But games like Octopath, Triangle Strategy, and Live a Live remake just seem content to cram fricking insane levels of bloom, ambient occlusion, god rays, and horrible bokeh shit into every frame. It's nauseating and not to be a snob but it's one of those things where it just makes me question someone's taste if they think that dogshit looks good. Like John Linneman from Digital gaytry endlessly shilling for HD 2D along with fricking Bluepoint remakes. I just can't relate to thinking it looks pleasing.
Really depends on how its done. Footage I've seen of Triangle Strategy looks too harsh with the bloom at times. But I'm okay with how the DQ3 remake looks.
It's kind of a necessary evil, high quality 2D is very labor intensive and probably isn't profitable anymore.
>It's kind of a necessary evil, high quality 2D is very labor intensive and probably isn't profitable anymore.
I don't believe you and I think this sentiment is total bullshit. Back in the day, you had high quality 2D sprite based games come out almost every 1 or 2 year, sometime even multiple a year. Dev teams were also much smaller compared to whats considered normal today. Even today, if you look at the indie game scene, you can find a huge amount of high quality 2D games coming out within very resonable time frames.
>high quality 2D games
They are mostly also SNES tier graphics. No one that I know of it making Capcom or Nazca tier sprite animations in actual games.
>ack in the day, you had high quality 2D sprite based games come out almost every 1 or 2 year, sometime even multiple a year. Dev teams were also much smaller compared to whats considered normal today.
yeah but you could also hire people who had been solely doing pixel art since the NES days. those skills aren't as common now
Yeah, that's on me for not defining "high quality 2D". I was thinking stuff that's beyond SNES-levels, like CPS3 games or KOF12/KOF13. This isn't it to imply that I think HD-2D looks near as good as those games kek
Vandal Hearts looks fine
>Dragon Quest III remake
I still say they should go the extra mile and put all three of the Erdrick-era games into one release. I and II are probably so small that they would still leave III with room to spare.
I will take HD 2D any day against the low cost 3D we saw like the remake of Secret Of Mana.
I think it's really good, has an almost diorama look to it. And I know people hate it but I think the aggressive DoF shifts look pretty good in motion
I wish I could turn down the bloom just a smidge though. Either way I'd take something like this over the shit remakes Square typically pumps out, jesus christ
How can a game be simultaneously so dark and so bright? So colorful yet so unsaturated and bland? I get what they were going for but wow the execution is terrible
By washing everything out. Also OT was their first HD-2D so maybe they just had less of an idea what they were doing, the LAL remake looks a lot more polished in that regard.
I didn't like it in Octopath and Triangle Strategy, but LAL actually understands the fricking concept of color and not making everything so drab and washed out. It helps that this remake is a genuine labor of love from the creator and has been trying to get it made since like 2010.
I genuinely don't know what bloom really is in games other than "when you're looking at a light source you're half-blind because the glow obscures things"
I personally really don't like HD-2D.
It barely looks better than how games used to look 30 years ago, and that's when it looks better at all.
You don't need all of these crazy post-processing effects to beat the visuals of the 90's. All you need is an artist with a new, great vision for how a game could look and modern technology will carry them the rest of the way.
That's the main reason I don't like it, I think. It feels uninspired. There are a million different ways you could tell the story of Live A Live visually. Hell, if you wanted, you could have a different artstyle for each era. And out of the nearly infinite options they had, they chose the one that looks as close to the original as they could get away with and charge full price?
I want to be challenged as an audience. Take a risk. Give me something I'll really like or I'll really hate. I'll remember you for either.
You're long past the age of caring.
I don't like the egregious lighting effects and DOF.
Cool but not retro
Wrong board
Found the homosexual thread police.
I think this is kind of ugly frankly. You can call it 2.5D, you can put it in HD, but pixeltrash is still pixeltrash.
Looks awful.
If you're gonna remake something, do it properly - make it modern and full 3d. not some faux-hybrid old/new abomination with a cheap post processing bloom and depth of field effects.
Full 3d is trash.