It's a difficult question. Dawn of War 1 had a beautiful skirmish mode, but I think the campaigns were relatively lacklustre in comparison to 2, which had wonderful campaigns, and a poor skirmish mode.
I've played hundreds and hundreds of hours of Dawn of War 1, I've played hundreds and hundreds of hours of Dawn of War 2, and I don't think it's achievable to get everyone onside. Upscaling DoW1 or DoW2 styles won't help (everyone forgets that Retribution actually has unit building and isn't fixed squad numbers like DoW2 and that didn't make any difference to opinions). DoW3 tried the best of both worlds and crashed and burned as we all know. Adding bases to DoW2 won't help. Just making DoW2 with Dark Crusade Risk style won't help because that's just 20 skirmish maps taped together.
I don't know how you'd achieve a good Dawn of War game in current year. I personally would welcome a solid DoW2 style campaign with update graphics, but I think I'm in a relative minority.
>It's a difficult question. Dawn of War 1 had a beautiful skirmish mode, but I think the campaigns were relatively lacklustre in comparison to 2, which had wonderful campaigns, and a poor skirmish mode
Do the campaign as DoW I and skirmish mode as DoW II :p
>remove the focus from skirmishes of small forces of infantry supported by vehicles by supporting DUDE TITANS AND NUKES LMAO
For what purpose? It's not even dawn of war at that point, play/make a game like supreme commander or wargame if that's the scale you want.
Agreed.
I think the real problem here is that there are two groups of people.
>Wants a meta game
Wants the scale to go to titans, pretty much supcom but 40k >Wants a micro game
Wants coh/dow2 style combat with more focus on small engagements.
Its almost impossible to get both sides as others pointed out given the vast differences in scale/scope required to pull it off. Most of the dow1 crowd seem to want more supcom levels of units on massive battlefields using a full 40k army you'd see in table top however I rly dont feel like it fits the "Dawn of war" game's initial scale and scope.
I think at the end of the day I don't think its possible under the given name, its clear from the start of dow1 theres always been an ask for a larger scale game, I just dont think the name fits and they'd be better off making a larger game on the level of supcom or TW (god help us if its TW) with a new IP.
More or less. It would almost be cool to have an alternating series where the evens focus on small unit tactics and the odd numbered entries focus on massive scale, but I don't think it's possible for a development team to be good at both.
Unironically this: >lite Total War style campaign with strategic and tactical layers >Tactical battles would make it something in the vein of Wargame or World in Conflict with huge army sizes and maps, with large-scale superunits >Main campaign is from PoV of Imperial Guard with Space Marines are some of the Superunits you can put in your deck
>build an army with points going in to a match like on table top >options for equipment, veterancy and what not >20+ player matches >fricking huge maps >random points spawn on the map >you need to control points to survive rounds >every new round your army is refreshed and reinforced >last player standing wins >this is just battle royale mapped onto RTS
I know it sounds like i'm memeing here but I think there is potential in a battle royale style RTS game mode,
I would absolutely play a game in the 40K universe inspired by some combination of SupCom and/or Wargame.
If they make another game in the CoH / DoWII style of >'le small le squad le engagement le hide behind le wall and le shoot at le bad guy and le bullet le never le hit and it take le 5 le minutes to le kill le one enemy le squad and you control le maximum 6 squads on le map'
I will fricking kill myself and never play it because I will be dead
Take Ultimate Apocalypse, put it in a non-shit modern engine, fix the horrid faction balance, fix the clashing artstyles and lorebreaking stuff, make the maps bigger to fit bigger armies, take the DOW2 style campaign and perhaps separate it more based on what factions you choose, instead of playing the same missions but with different factions, add some instances of DOW1 like missions where it's glorified skirmish.
There, my perfect DOWIV, I accept cash or card for my payment as an ideasguy.
>remove the focus from skirmishes of small forces of infantry supported by vehicles by supporting DUDE TITANS AND NUKES LMAO
For what purpose? It's not even dawn of war at that point, play/make a game like supreme commander or wargame if that's the scale you want.
>build an army with points going in to a match like on table top >options for equipment, veterancy and what not >20+ player matches >fricking huge maps >random points spawn on the map >you need to control points to survive rounds >every new round your army is refreshed and reinforced >last player standing wins >this is just battle royale mapped onto RTS
I know it sounds like i'm memeing here but I think there is potential in a battle royale style RTS game mode,
Pardon me but isn’t this just the Eugen template of game in terms of how armies are set up and reinforced?, personally for 40k on the apoc scale I wouldn’t disagree with it being a good fit but at that point I don’t necessarily think it would have much resemblance to DOW.
The previous anons make a good point about how when thinking about DOW IV, there really is a massive issue of conflicting vision, having 1,2 and 3 be vastly different games with primarily a narrative connection.
Personally I’ve by and large lost faith in Relic for a new DOW series continuation, perhaps the real DOW IV are the unrelated 40k Strategy games that live in our dreams.
Didn't read past the first sentence but makes me think a deck building system like wargame would be pretty cool.
Just include a few factions and give them a lot of flesh. We don't need every fricking faction represented in every 40k game.
Remaster Dawn of War 1, update the models an animation to Dawn of War 2/10th edition, expand the rosters and factions the way modders did, add more maps, the same voice actors.
This is also a good idea, although I think it would work better with Horus Heresy.
I want remastered DoW1&2 with additional factions and more content in general. And unfricked pathfinding. DoW1 needs upgraded graphics to make it consistent, because base game armies like Space Marines look like shit next to newer ones like Tau and Necrons.
DoW1 needs Tyranids, DoW2 really needs it's own Dark Crusade with Tau and Necrons at least
Make more maps in different biomes for both games. Last Stand especially needs more and add other heroes to it too. But I wish there was simply more nonImperial terrain in general. Let me fight on Craftworlds or in a Webway.
Make campaign map in DoW1 moddable or add some way to generate them. So it's possible to select factions and have them fight over different randomized planets and subsectors. I don't want to conquer Kronus again, but If I could set up my own scenario like in 4x game it would be fricking great.
DoW4 I want different. It would be most likely based on newest 40k edition. Some sort of more flexible faction could be interesting. Like Dark Eldar are not really a single army. It's 3 different factions (Kabalites, Wych Cults, Haemonculi Covens) working together. Plus mercenaries and auxiliaries like Medusae and Mandrakes. If you simply give player access to fricking everything at once during game, like in Unification and Ultimate Apocalypse you end up with a bloat and a mess with redundant units. It could be interesting if there was an option to customize your army in more indepth way before even starting it, so during one game I could go with Kabalites + Wych Cults, while in another as Haemonculi supported by Corsairs.
And of course then there are fricking Space Marines with Gravis, Tacticus, Phobos and Firstborn forces and chapter specific units and rules.
New edition apparently will have heroes and hq less important and an ability to attach them to units. This is nice. I don't want named characters either.
Keep cover system from DoW2/CoH but make battles bigger
I don't want cartoony graphics
Shareholders need a guaranteed return on investment. Can't have that with the vague threat of piracy looming on the horizon.
What do you mean by "it harms actual customers the most"? Who the frick cares about them as long as shareholders get the money?
More faction asymmetry, for example Space Marines/Eldar build almost no base structures, everything is moved as upgrade trees for orbiting battle barge/craftworld.
Imperial Guard and Orcs get massive fortresses and extra outposts.
Melee system that can properly handle multiple units fighting one stronger.
Do not listen to DoW1 fanatics since they will be upset even if you remake 1 with better graphics.
Why didn't they just make CoH with a melee system? I feel like DoW2 tried to do half that and half its own thing that made it different from both DoW1 and CoH in all the wrong ways.
Battlefield destruction, vehicle armor facings, 4 different factions with commanders that change units, call ins and abilities for different IG regiments/SM chapter/Eldar craftworld whatever...it looks simple to make when the framework is there. You even have the single player risk campaign in CoH3 now.
You can always go for the easy and lazy roster, IG and SM vs chaos and orks, Eldar obligatory DLC, Tau maybe later.
But truth be told, I kinda hate the fact that now every single 40k strategy game must have some convoluted plot to have a bunch of factions all in the same place, you can have good campaigns and stories with just 2 factions involved.
>you can have good campaigns and stories with just 2 factions involved.
True, but I think there's also two different preference groups here when it comes to campaigns as well: >Wants an old-school meta campaign Dune 2/Dark Crusade style - story/plot is absolutely inconsequential afterthought, it is about the conquest/campaign mechanics
There's always plenty of sectors that you can find an excuse for, to become a place of interest for *all* of 40k's factions, you just can't reasonably expect the plot excuses to be anything other than a contrivance >Wants a DoW1 vanilla/Winter Assault/DoW2 story-heavy campaign experience with character and overall plot progression
With the amount of factions in 40k and the overall setting state, the less factions involved, the better, if you truly want to have a story that isn't anything but an excuse for bolter porn and grimdark or god forbid grimDERP
IMHO, while I prefer the first option, I don't particularly care if it's the latter, as long as the skirmish gameplay is good and there's ALL (non-variant) factions included in it (and minimum of 6 included at launch, preferably no more than 3 imperial ones)
>you can have good campaigns and stories with just 2 factions involved.
True, but I think there's also two different preference groups here when it comes to campaigns as well: >Wants an old-school meta campaign Dune 2/Dark Crusade style - story/plot is absolutely inconsequential afterthought, it is about the conquest/campaign mechanics
There's always plenty of sectors that you can find an excuse for, to become a place of interest for *all* of 40k's factions, you just can't reasonably expect the plot excuses to be anything other than a contrivance >Wants a DoW1 vanilla/Winter Assault/DoW2 story-heavy campaign experience with character and overall plot progression
With the amount of factions in 40k and the overall setting state, the less factions involved, the better, if you truly want to have a story that isn't anything but an excuse for bolter porn and grimdark or god forbid grimDERP
IMHO, while I prefer the first option, I don't particularly care if it's the latter, as long as the skirmish gameplay is good and there's ALL (non-variant) factions included in it (and minimum of 6 included at launch, preferably no more than 3 imperial ones)
have several short story campaigns pitting one faction against another instead of having them all clustered in one place?
that way you can have all the factions for multiplayer and decent self contained stories
ig vs orks
sm vs chaos
eldar vs necrons
tau vs deldar
nids vs uhhh, some mechanicus biologis buffoons who did a fricky wucky
Battle Brothers meets Star Sector but you're Chaos Marines
early game you're scrapping for gear and trying to get your numbers up without getting noticed by a bigger threat, selling your services to bigger warbands and trying to survive the inevitable betrayals and poor intel
once you get a decent band together going raiding and carving out your own stronghold
Unironically this: >lite Total War style campaign with strategic and tactical layers >Tactical battles would make it something in the vein of Wargame or World in Conflict with huge army sizes and maps, with large-scale superunits >Main campaign is from PoV of Imperial Guard with Space Marines are some of the Superunits you can put in your deck
basically DoW 1 but with even more factions, a fleshed out campaign for each one, and a replayable sc2 style co-op mission system. also user generated maps
>have the ability to scale up battles which unlock new tech. Start with skirmish finishing at apocalyptic battles. >add in mechanicum, daemons, farsight and dark mechanicum >legions/units are more than just cosmetics >chaos gets unique powers for each god >buildable defences like in Company of Heroes >campaign map like Dark Crusade
Ever since I played this I get unimaginably angry when corpses don't stay in RTS games it just ruins it for me that there is no evidence a fight took place; I know some have battle scarring but corpses just makes it that more entertaining
Two separate games: Dawn of War IV, and Dawn of War: Tactician or something. DOW4 would be a direct riff on DOW1's macro-centric gameplay, Tactician would steer into the design decisions made with DOW2, favoring a more, "Diablo 2, but you control an entire platoon" style design.
>More like DoW1/CoH >rather than Space Marines, Imperial Guard, and Inquisition all having a moron fight; they are now the same faction and you specialize (begin the battle as PDF, call for reinforcements, select faction from there; some degree of mix and match possible) >Other factions have similar specialization mechanics, this ensures a degree of adaptability and an emphasis on discovering/refining your build and responding to the enemy's build
>How would you do it?
To little to describe it in a single post.
All I can say that it would combine the macro-heavy gameplay of the 1st game with the CoH stuff DoW2 had but on a larger scale, neutral buildings you can use, ruins you can use and destructible environment (also with a more polished and detailed version of DoW2's engine). Additionally give players tons of customization for characters from squad leaders to HQ heroes. You know you want that Tartaros Terminator Librarian with Cyclone Missile Launcher, dual Force Claws with installed combi bolters (one melta, one plasma). Plus adding in tons of cosmetics and traits to recreate various sub-factions like Space Wolves, Biel-Tan Eldar, Leviathan Tyranids and so on.
That and making the factions more lore-friendly.
Like limiting Space Marines to build giant fortress monasteries, listening posts, teleport/drop pod beacons and defensive emplacements. However the fortress monastery would be modular and have a lot of upgrades from facilities that receive units from orbit (and can be dropped anywhere that has a teleport/drop pod beacon), armories and reliquaries, defense systems and more.
That's all but a fraction of what I thought about how an actual DoW sequel would be. That and it would retcon DoWIII.
Woah I actually really like your ideas Anon ESPECIALLY the customization part as that's one of my favourite parts of literally fricking anything that lets it happen, no piece of Warhammer 40K has ever let me scratch my itch of grenadier's so I'm reduced to just playing the first DoW for the Kasrkin (seriously whose idea was it to limit their squad to just 1 while most other factions get several of their higher tech infantry?)
Gabe doing somersault flips in Terminator Armor is just the peak of the iceberg. And that's just the story. The game mechanics are also a disappointment.
You know? I could've accepted Gorgutz winning, but they did him so damn dirty and made him seem as a total dolt that I gladly ignore it.
I mean if he won, then he'd have 4 worlds worth of Boyz. 4 WORLDS. And with how fast Orkz multiply it's pretty much clear that he'd get enough greenskins to start a very serious WAAAGH!!! and carve his own small empire until he goes on to expand and do even more fighting.
But what does he do instead? HE FRICKING DUMPS THE KAURAVA ORKZ! Because he FRICKING DIDN'T LIKE THEM!
This is the single stupidest thing ever. In any normal situation an Ork Warlord of Gorgutz's caliber would've whipped them into proper Orkishness and made them into a force to be reckoned with.
Meanwhile he dumps them and goes away. That and all those bloody shenanigans with him taking over the WAAAGH!!! from another Warboss who is smaller, weaker and could be easily krumped by Gorgutz. Instead he plays errand boy until he backstabs his boss.
Video related, this is how I felt.
And thats precisely why Vance motherfrickin' Stubbs should've won
If he wins the system gets industrialised for the Imperium and skilled regiments are created to get spread thin and destroyed across the galaxy without real consequence.
If Gorgutz wins DoW III happens.
The fact that he didn't is proof we're living in the darkest timeline
Also about those 4 worlds.
A massive WAAAGH!!! led by Gorgutz would've made him even more notorious and infamous. Would've opened some interesting potentials for a story...but nope. Instead we got what we got. And GW also fricking canonized the Termie somersaults. >The fact that he didn't is proof we're living in the darkest timeline
I would say everything after 7th ED is a true age of darkness for 40K.
3 to 4 EDs were peak 40K. 5 to 7 were varied levels of good and bad. But 8 and onwards is a misunderstanding. Not to mention they ruined Squats with the new lore and bland StarCraft Terran aesthetics.
Closer to DoW1 mechanically, but with lessons taken from DoW2. Basically more or less like CoH1 since that was the golden mean for that type of game.
In terms of campaign something like Dark Crusade meets Retribution.
This
Dawn of War IV will still be a strategy game but the campaign will play like a survival/base management. Every faction is now exclusively female. You the player have an avatar in the world as the only male commander in the entire system and as such are a massive target of interest for every faction which are now barreling towards you and you have to hold out as long you can with your loyal Guard Regiment (also female).
>The base building of DoW1 >The cover system of DoW2 >The heroes system of DoW2 >Factions roster: Space Marines, Orks, Eldar, Chaos Marines, Imperial Guard, Tau, Necrons, Tyranids, Sisters of Battle, Dark Eldar. >Unit rosters will be DoW1's plus new additions from the recent tabletop editions. >A campaign like Dark Crusade's, with the option for multiplayer, co-op and pvp. >Artillery units can still be created like in DoW1, but they are used in the same fashion as in the Company of Heroes series (i.e. need abilities like "barrage" to attack). >Every faction has a "subfaction" that you can specialize in. Ex. Space Marines can choose between the 9 loyalist legions, Chaos can choose to follow one of the 4 or remain undivided, etc.
My ideas would mean an unbalanced mess, but I think it would be fun.
So it turns out, the reason I couldn't seem to get my province's Strength past 5 even with a full Garrison is because...it takes the amount of buildings you have and points captured into account, not just the Garrisoned troops.
I have over 75 hours on this game and I'm only just now learning that.
I haven't won once and that's probably why.
Make a modern mix of I and II, with the best features/ideas of both
Add more unit variety/subfactions (guard regiments, craftworlds, Space Marine Chapters, etc.) with special stuff for each to give huge variety in playstyle.
>Make a modern mix of I and II, with the best features/ideas of both
Would be too much to manage in RT against a computer player. So it would only really make sense as MP-only, at which point why not just make it an MMO and BY THE EMPEROR IT"S CHAOS SPA~BLAM!
A campaign like Dark Crusade or Soulstorm but allow for different mission scenarios like sieges which would take multiple different missions to complete, while also allowing other factions to attack on top of that to get several factions contesting for the same territory.
brutal legend style action RTS to continue the trend of being radically different from every other entry in the series. would do great for illustrating the difference in power between commanders/characters without completely erasing the well deserved glory of the troops.
would also please the space marine babies who just wanna power fantasy into a crowd of orks
Is there any reason why Tyranids were never added to the first Dawn of War? It feels odd that we got basically every other faction in WH40K lore except them. Was it just the publisher being greedy israelites that demanded the Tyranids be saved for the sequel?
Firestorm over Kronus for DC, and Unification or Ultimate Apocalypse or Titanium Wars for Soul Storm, those still let you play the campaigns. Honestly if it's your first playthrough you should do it vanilla.
>story
not really, I've never played Firestorm over Kronus, but every mod for SS turns it into a complete crashfest in campaign. Not that it matters, SS had a completely untouchably bad story anyway. You'll quickly get over the ancient models and maps when you see the still amazing level of detail in the animations and turn on persistent bodies.
If it were Dawn of War I'd make it like Company of Heroes 2 with heroes akin to Dawn of War 1 where you build them from a base instead of having one that can respawn, where if they go down you have to start from square one if you recruit another. The campaign would be like Chaos Rising or Retribution, linear with optional side missions for extra goodies and gear for your guys.
Now if it weren't Dawn of War, and if I were making a new 40k strategy game, I'd make it play like Wargame or Steel Division 2. A big meta map to move entire regiments or companies of space marines around, you get to put what's in each company and move them around on a continent or whatever the theater of war would be. The campaign mode in SD2 is fun as frick. The gameplay would be like SD2. You start with a limited number of points to deploy your initial force to the field. You generate more points every few minutes to spend on reinforcements. You aren't building or recruiting units, you're drawing from the pre-established regiment you're fighting with, so casualties carry over into the campaign meta map, as does experience gained. Only captured cities or manufactorums could generate new regiments or companies or whatever. It would be a pan-Imperium army, Guard making up most of it, supplemented by Mechanicus, Space Marines, and Sister of Battle. Those could potentially be fully deployed and fleshed out regiments or companies in their own right, but for the campaign you're managing all of them together.
Blood Ravens are helping lead a crusade across a planet, those characters have banter and establish objectives to secure. The Imperial Guard are under their purview like when Raptors or Mentors take command. The Sisters of Battle and the Mechanicus have to be wooed into joining the crusade, so you have to do missions to win trust to allow recruiting from their armies into your forces. Main enemies are Orks and Tyranids, from the Octarius war spilling out into Imperial space.
The Mechanicum has his own faction this time
Remake DoW1 and call DoW4
Dark Crusade but name it Dawn of War 4
I'd buy it.
DoW1 with better pathfinding and more factions and units.
Sandbox style SP campaign like in Dark Crusade for replayability outside of MP
It's a difficult question. Dawn of War 1 had a beautiful skirmish mode, but I think the campaigns were relatively lacklustre in comparison to 2, which had wonderful campaigns, and a poor skirmish mode.
I've played hundreds and hundreds of hours of Dawn of War 1, I've played hundreds and hundreds of hours of Dawn of War 2, and I don't think it's achievable to get everyone onside. Upscaling DoW1 or DoW2 styles won't help (everyone forgets that Retribution actually has unit building and isn't fixed squad numbers like DoW2 and that didn't make any difference to opinions). DoW3 tried the best of both worlds and crashed and burned as we all know. Adding bases to DoW2 won't help. Just making DoW2 with Dark Crusade Risk style won't help because that's just 20 skirmish maps taped together.
I don't know how you'd achieve a good Dawn of War game in current year. I personally would welcome a solid DoW2 style campaign with update graphics, but I think I'm in a relative minority.
>It's a difficult question. Dawn of War 1 had a beautiful skirmish mode, but I think the campaigns were relatively lacklustre in comparison to 2, which had wonderful campaigns, and a poor skirmish mode
Do the campaign as DoW I and skirmish mode as DoW II :p
You silly billy
Agreed.
I think the real problem here is that there are two groups of people.
>Wants a meta game
Wants the scale to go to titans, pretty much supcom but 40k
>Wants a micro game
Wants coh/dow2 style combat with more focus on small engagements.
Its almost impossible to get both sides as others pointed out given the vast differences in scale/scope required to pull it off. Most of the dow1 crowd seem to want more supcom levels of units on massive battlefields using a full 40k army you'd see in table top however I rly dont feel like it fits the "Dawn of war" game's initial scale and scope.
I think at the end of the day I don't think its possible under the given name, its clear from the start of dow1 theres always been an ask for a larger scale game, I just dont think the name fits and they'd be better off making a larger game on the level of supcom or TW (god help us if its TW) with a new IP.
More or less. It would almost be cool to have an alternating series where the evens focus on small unit tactics and the odd numbered entries focus on massive scale, but I don't think it's possible for a development team to be good at both.
>pretty much supcom but 40k
God yes, why did I never think of this
I'm shocked that there hasn't been a 40k mod. A group of 40k artists making something in the spring engine would be great.
I would absolutely play a game in the 40K universe inspired by some combination of SupCom and/or Wargame.
If they make another game in the CoH / DoWII style of
>'le small le squad le engagement le hide behind le wall and le shoot at le bad guy and le bullet le never le hit and it take le 5 le minutes to le kill le one enemy le squad and you control le maximum 6 squads on le map'
I will fricking kill myself and never play it because I will be dead
>I will fricking kill myself and never play it because I will be dead
Filtered. DoW1 and CoH1 are masterpieces.
I want Dawn of War 1(2), not any of that shit.
Frick Titans
Frick post-dow1 dow
Frick CoH
Frick the redesigns
>Frick Titans
With pleasure
>Frick post-dow1 dow
Frick you.
Unless you mean DOW plus Expansions.
The expansions are part of dow1, otherwise I would have written vanilla dow1.
The campaigns in dow1 were kino, never found it lackluster
LOL no, 2 had absolutely garbage everything including campaigns. 1 shits all over it.
Take Ultimate Apocalypse, put it in a non-shit modern engine, fix the horrid faction balance, fix the clashing artstyles and lorebreaking stuff, make the maps bigger to fit bigger armies, take the DOW2 style campaign and perhaps separate it more based on what factions you choose, instead of playing the same missions but with different factions, add some instances of DOW1 like missions where it's glorified skirmish.
There, my perfect DOWIV, I accept cash or card for my payment as an ideasguy.
>remove the focus from skirmishes of small forces of infantry supported by vehicles by supporting DUDE TITANS AND NUKES LMAO
For what purpose? It's not even dawn of war at that point, play/make a game like supreme commander or wargame if that's the scale you want.
>For what purpose
Because I want the game to correctly have the scale of Warhammer 40K. Simple as.
the scale of 40k varies. Sometimes you can have just small squads of guardsmen fighting like the entire Gaunt's Ghost series.
Yes anon, every single engagement in 40k has at least one titan on each side
I know, thanks for backing my point up.
DoW 1 but better
>build an army with points going in to a match like on table top
>options for equipment, veterancy and what not
>20+ player matches
>fricking huge maps
>random points spawn on the map
>you need to control points to survive rounds
>every new round your army is refreshed and reinforced
>last player standing wins
>this is just battle royale mapped onto RTS
I know it sounds like i'm memeing here but I think there is potential in a battle royale style RTS game mode,
>there is potential in a battle royale style RTS game mode,
There's a hugely popular WC3 custom map that is basically that.
Footman Frenzy?
They have that one battle royale F2P RTS called War Selection? It's pretty meh.
Pardon me but isn’t this just the Eugen template of game in terms of how armies are set up and reinforced?, personally for 40k on the apoc scale I wouldn’t disagree with it being a good fit but at that point I don’t necessarily think it would have much resemblance to DOW.
The previous anons make a good point about how when thinking about DOW IV, there really is a massive issue of conflicting vision, having 1,2 and 3 be vastly different games with primarily a narrative connection.
Personally I’ve by and large lost faith in Relic for a new DOW series continuation, perhaps the real DOW IV are the unrelated 40k Strategy games that live in our dreams.
>Just the Eugen template
Man I'd play Wargame 40k for 10,000 hours. Let them sell me every race as DLC, too.
Didn't read past the first sentence but makes me think a deck building system like wargame would be pretty cool.
Just include a few factions and give them a lot of flesh. We don't need every fricking faction represented in every 40k game.
Remaster Dawn of War 1, update the models an animation to Dawn of War 2/10th edition, expand the rosters and factions the way modders did, add more maps, the same voice actors.
This is also a good idea, although I think it would work better with Horus Heresy.
If it doesn't have persistent corpses, I don't want it.
Ship it with more than 3 factions for starters. Then just grander scale DoW 1, basically what DoW 3 was but with actual content and gameplay variety
Upgraded DoW 1
I want remastered DoW1&2 with additional factions and more content in general. And unfricked pathfinding. DoW1 needs upgraded graphics to make it consistent, because base game armies like Space Marines look like shit next to newer ones like Tau and Necrons.
DoW1 needs Tyranids, DoW2 really needs it's own Dark Crusade with Tau and Necrons at least
Make more maps in different biomes for both games. Last Stand especially needs more and add other heroes to it too. But I wish there was simply more nonImperial terrain in general. Let me fight on Craftworlds or in a Webway.
Make campaign map in DoW1 moddable or add some way to generate them. So it's possible to select factions and have them fight over different randomized planets and subsectors. I don't want to conquer Kronus again, but If I could set up my own scenario like in 4x game it would be fricking great.
DoW4 I want different. It would be most likely based on newest 40k edition. Some sort of more flexible faction could be interesting. Like Dark Eldar are not really a single army. It's 3 different factions (Kabalites, Wych Cults, Haemonculi Covens) working together. Plus mercenaries and auxiliaries like Medusae and Mandrakes. If you simply give player access to fricking everything at once during game, like in Unification and Ultimate Apocalypse you end up with a bloat and a mess with redundant units. It could be interesting if there was an option to customize your army in more indepth way before even starting it, so during one game I could go with Kabalites + Wych Cults, while in another as Haemonculi supported by Corsairs.
And of course then there are fricking Space Marines with Gravis, Tacticus, Phobos and Firstborn forces and chapter specific units and rules.
New edition apparently will have heroes and hq less important and an ability to attach them to units. This is nice. I don't want named characters either.
Keep cover system from DoW2/CoH but make battles bigger
I don't want cartoony graphics
Also give back fricking LAN. Why in the flying frick was it removed in Steam version?
Shareholders need a guaranteed return on investment. Can't have that with the vague threat of piracy looming on the horizon.
What do you mean by "it harms actual customers the most"? Who the frick cares about them as long as shareholders get the money?
I hate bots so goddamn much
More faction asymmetry, for example Space Marines/Eldar build almost no base structures, everything is moved as upgrade trees for orbiting battle barge/craftworld.
Imperial Guard and Orcs get massive fortresses and extra outposts.
Melee system that can properly handle multiple units fighting one stronger.
Do not listen to DoW1 fanatics since they will be upset even if you remake 1 with better graphics.
Why didn't they just make CoH with a melee system? I feel like DoW2 tried to do half that and half its own thing that made it different from both DoW1 and CoH in all the wrong ways.
Battlefield destruction, vehicle armor facings, 4 different factions with commanders that change units, call ins and abilities for different IG regiments/SM chapter/Eldar craftworld whatever...it looks simple to make when the framework is there. You even have the single player risk campaign in CoH3 now.
DoW2 felt like some of the design decisions were made trying to chase the competitive scene.
Anon, CoH is DoW with a reskin
CoH was nothing like DoW1 beyond squad based and capturing points on the map
Tbqh, Invasion of Italy but DoW and made properly would be kino as frick.
But you would have to IG and SM to be available at launch.
You can always go for the easy and lazy roster, IG and SM vs chaos and orks, Eldar obligatory DLC, Tau maybe later.
But truth be told, I kinda hate the fact that now every single 40k strategy game must have some convoluted plot to have a bunch of factions all in the same place, you can have good campaigns and stories with just 2 factions involved.
>you can have good campaigns and stories with just 2 factions involved.
True, but I think there's also two different preference groups here when it comes to campaigns as well:
>Wants an old-school meta campaign Dune 2/Dark Crusade style - story/plot is absolutely inconsequential afterthought, it is about the conquest/campaign mechanics
There's always plenty of sectors that you can find an excuse for, to become a place of interest for *all* of 40k's factions, you just can't reasonably expect the plot excuses to be anything other than a contrivance
>Wants a DoW1 vanilla/Winter Assault/DoW2 story-heavy campaign experience with character and overall plot progression
With the amount of factions in 40k and the overall setting state, the less factions involved, the better, if you truly want to have a story that isn't anything but an excuse for bolter porn and grimdark or god forbid grimDERP
IMHO, while I prefer the first option, I don't particularly care if it's the latter, as long as the skirmish gameplay is good and there's ALL (non-variant) factions included in it (and minimum of 6 included at launch, preferably no more than 3 imperial ones)
have several short story campaigns pitting one faction against another instead of having them all clustered in one place?
that way you can have all the factions for multiplayer and decent self contained stories
ig vs orks
sm vs chaos
eldar vs necrons
tau vs deldar
nids vs uhhh, some mechanicus biologis buffoons who did a fricky wucky
I like DoW2, especially the story for Chaos Rising, but to this day I'm still butthurt that it wasn't more of a CoH1 clone.
https://www.moddb.com/mods/dawn-of-war-2-eternal
There is a new mod for DoW2 that supposedly makes it play more like CoH. I hate unit miniatures in it
>being contractually obligated to make them all primaris
I think I would just pass.
Literally the same shit you moronic secondary
Battle Brothers meets Star Sector but you're Chaos Marines
early game you're scrapping for gear and trying to get your numbers up without getting noticed by a bigger threat, selling your services to bigger warbands and trying to survive the inevitable betrayals and poor intel
once you get a decent band together going raiding and carving out your own stronghold
>How would you do it?
Would not.
Dawn of War Definition Edition that gets post launch DLCs of additional factions.
DoW3 but patched and better.
Unironically this:
>lite Total War style campaign with strategic and tactical layers
>Tactical battles would make it something in the vein of Wargame or World in Conflict with huge army sizes and maps, with large-scale superunits
>Main campaign is from PoV of Imperial Guard with Space Marines are some of the Superunits you can put in your deck
basically DoW 1 but with even more factions, a fleshed out campaign for each one, and a replayable sc2 style co-op mission system. also user generated maps
>have the ability to scale up battles which unlock new tech. Start with skirmish finishing at apocalyptic battles.
>add in mechanicum, daemons, farsight and dark mechanicum
>legions/units are more than just cosmetics
>chaos gets unique powers for each god
>buildable defences like in Company of Heroes
>campaign map like Dark Crusade
The biggest thing I miss from Dark Crusade was the persistent fields of corpses after a battle, and the permanence of your built bases.
Stop trying to innovate and just give me a better version of DoW1 you homosexuals
any of yall remember chapter commander ?
Chapter Master is a great idea, if it had tactical battles. But I wouldn't make a game like this and call it DoW4.
Double down on the garbage moba line, Relic stopped making good games when they were done with DOW1.
turn it into a flash game like they did with bloodrayne 3
Ever since I played this I get unimaginably angry when corpses don't stay in RTS games it just ruins it for me that there is no evidence a fight took place; I know some have battle scarring but corpses just makes it that more entertaining
Dark Crusade's persistent corpses with Company of Heroes' terrain scarring and crater formation.
Two separate games: Dawn of War IV, and Dawn of War: Tactician or something. DOW4 would be a direct riff on DOW1's macro-centric gameplay, Tactician would steer into the design decisions made with DOW2, favoring a more, "Diablo 2, but you control an entire platoon" style design.
>More like DoW1/CoH
>rather than Space Marines, Imperial Guard, and Inquisition all having a moron fight; they are now the same faction and you specialize (begin the battle as PDF, call for reinforcements, select faction from there; some degree of mix and match possible)
>Other factions have similar specialization mechanics, this ensures a degree of adaptability and an emphasis on discovering/refining your build and responding to the enemy's build
>How would you do it?
To little to describe it in a single post.
All I can say that it would combine the macro-heavy gameplay of the 1st game with the CoH stuff DoW2 had but on a larger scale, neutral buildings you can use, ruins you can use and destructible environment (also with a more polished and detailed version of DoW2's engine). Additionally give players tons of customization for characters from squad leaders to HQ heroes. You know you want that Tartaros Terminator Librarian with Cyclone Missile Launcher, dual Force Claws with installed combi bolters (one melta, one plasma). Plus adding in tons of cosmetics and traits to recreate various sub-factions like Space Wolves, Biel-Tan Eldar, Leviathan Tyranids and so on.
That and making the factions more lore-friendly.
Like limiting Space Marines to build giant fortress monasteries, listening posts, teleport/drop pod beacons and defensive emplacements. However the fortress monastery would be modular and have a lot of upgrades from facilities that receive units from orbit (and can be dropped anywhere that has a teleport/drop pod beacon), armories and reliquaries, defense systems and more.
That's all but a fraction of what I thought about how an actual DoW sequel would be. That and it would retcon DoWIII.
Woah I actually really like your ideas Anon ESPECIALLY the customization part as that's one of my favourite parts of literally fricking anything that lets it happen, no piece of Warhammer 40K has ever let me scratch my itch of grenadier's so I'm reduced to just playing the first DoW for the Kasrkin (seriously whose idea was it to limit their squad to just 1 while most other factions get several of their higher tech infantry?)
>retcon DoWIII
What even happened in the third game to warrant a retcon?
Gabriel did a flip.
Gabe doing somersault flips in Terminator Armor is just the peak of the iceberg. And that's just the story. The game mechanics are also a disappointment.
Vance Stubbs is not the canon winner of Soulstorm
last stand only
more factions, more items
STUBBS WON THERE IS ONLY 2 DAWN OF WAR GAMES
You know? I could've accepted Gorgutz winning, but they did him so damn dirty and made him seem as a total dolt that I gladly ignore it.
I mean if he won, then he'd have 4 worlds worth of Boyz. 4 WORLDS. And with how fast Orkz multiply it's pretty much clear that he'd get enough greenskins to start a very serious WAAAGH!!! and carve his own small empire until he goes on to expand and do even more fighting.
But what does he do instead? HE FRICKING DUMPS THE KAURAVA ORKZ! Because he FRICKING DIDN'T LIKE THEM!
This is the single stupidest thing ever. In any normal situation an Ork Warlord of Gorgutz's caliber would've whipped them into proper Orkishness and made them into a force to be reckoned with.
Meanwhile he dumps them and goes away. That and all those bloody shenanigans with him taking over the WAAAGH!!! from another Warboss who is smaller, weaker and could be easily krumped by Gorgutz. Instead he plays errand boy until he backstabs his boss.
Video related, this is how I felt.
And thats precisely why Vance motherfrickin' Stubbs should've won
If he wins the system gets industrialised for the Imperium and skilled regiments are created to get spread thin and destroyed across the galaxy without real consequence.
If Gorgutz wins DoW III happens.
The fact that he didn't is proof we're living in the darkest timeline
Also about those 4 worlds.
A massive WAAAGH!!! led by Gorgutz would've made him even more notorious and infamous. Would've opened some interesting potentials for a story...but nope. Instead we got what we got. And GW also fricking canonized the Termie somersaults.
>The fact that he didn't is proof we're living in the darkest timeline
I would say everything after 7th ED is a true age of darkness for 40K.
3 to 4 EDs were peak 40K. 5 to 7 were varied levels of good and bad. But 8 and onwards is a misunderstanding. Not to mention they ruined Squats with the new lore and bland StarCraft Terran aesthetics.
Closer to DoW1 mechanically, but with lessons taken from DoW2. Basically more or less like CoH1 since that was the golden mean for that type of game.
In terms of campaign something like Dark Crusade meets Retribution.
as long as there's no retreat mechanic so units can actually die early game this would probably be alright
>release game with day 0 patch
>its a nude patch
ASStartes
Big titty Eldar.
This
Dawn of War IV will still be a strategy game but the campaign will play like a survival/base management. Every faction is now exclusively female. You the player have an avatar in the world as the only male commander in the entire system and as such are a massive target of interest for every faction which are now barreling towards you and you have to hold out as long you can with your loyal Guard Regiment (also female).
>The base building of DoW1
>The cover system of DoW2
>The heroes system of DoW2
>Factions roster: Space Marines, Orks, Eldar, Chaos Marines, Imperial Guard, Tau, Necrons, Tyranids, Sisters of Battle, Dark Eldar.
>Unit rosters will be DoW1's plus new additions from the recent tabletop editions.
>A campaign like Dark Crusade's, with the option for multiplayer, co-op and pvp.
>Artillery units can still be created like in DoW1, but they are used in the same fashion as in the Company of Heroes series (i.e. need abilities like "barrage" to attack).
>Every faction has a "subfaction" that you can specialize in. Ex. Space Marines can choose between the 9 loyalist legions, Chaos can choose to follow one of the 4 or remain undivided, etc.
My ideas would mean an unbalanced mess, but I think it would be fun.
>My ideas would mean an unbalanced mess
Good.
muh balans autism killed fun games.
So it turns out, the reason I couldn't seem to get my province's Strength past 5 even with a full Garrison is because...it takes the amount of buildings you have and points captured into account, not just the Garrisoned troops.
I have over 75 hours on this game and I'm only just now learning that.
I haven't won once and that's probably why.
easy to win this (though time consuming) by building up a system of turrents and fully upgraded listening posts near the enemy hq spawn
Turn it into an actual milsim like Combat Mission with a strategy layer as well.
I want more variety in maps, with some in the webway and in the warp for example.
A Throneroom map would be kino for a survival mode.
Make a modern mix of I and II, with the best features/ideas of both
Add more unit variety/subfactions (guard regiments, craftworlds, Space Marine Chapters, etc.) with special stuff for each to give huge variety in playstyle.
>Make a modern mix of I and II, with the best features/ideas of both
Would be too much to manage in RT against a computer player. So it would only really make sense as MP-only, at which point why not just make it an MMO and BY THE EMPEROR IT"S CHAOS SPA~BLAM!
Story exploring the Blood Raven's past and their likely connection to Thousand Sons chapter.
Don't care about the gameplay.
A campaign like Dark Crusade or Soulstorm but allow for different mission scenarios like sieges which would take multiple different missions to complete, while also allowing other factions to attack on top of that to get several factions contesting for the same territory.
brutal legend style action RTS to continue the trend of being radically different from every other entry in the series. would do great for illustrating the difference in power between commanders/characters without completely erasing the well deserved glory of the troops.
would also please the space marine babies who just wanna power fantasy into a crowd of orks
>umbrella ladies on the left
I don't want to frick a corpse.
I don't want to frick a corpse.
I don't want to frick a corpse.
maybe
Is there any reason why Tyranids were never added to the first Dawn of War? It feels odd that we got basically every other faction in WH40K lore except them. Was it just the publisher being greedy israelites that demanded the Tyranids be saved for the sequel?
Were there even Tyranids when the first came out?
They've been around since the first edition release.
Spent over 1,000 hours playing all three games, the voice lines in 2 are my favorite part. Those CSMs are so angsty, love it
MARK IT IN BLOOD, AND FIRE!
broke down and got me the Master Collection on GOG
any recommendations for good mods?
don't care about multiplayer,
just want to experience the story without it looking too crap
Firestorm over Kronus for DC, and Unification or Ultimate Apocalypse or Titanium Wars for Soul Storm, those still let you play the campaigns. Honestly if it's your first playthrough you should do it vanilla.
>story
not really, I've never played Firestorm over Kronus, but every mod for SS turns it into a complete crashfest in campaign. Not that it matters, SS had a completely untouchably bad story anyway. You'll quickly get over the ancient models and maps when you see the still amazing level of detail in the animations and turn on persistent bodies.
Ultramarines main faction
You control Marneus Calgar with direct orders from Girlyman himself
Blood Ravens show up near the end as an allied outpost/base to help you out along with IG, Inquisition and Mechanicus stragglers
You fight Orkz, Tyronenids, Dark Eldar, Eldar, Necrons and CSM
If it were Dawn of War I'd make it like Company of Heroes 2 with heroes akin to Dawn of War 1 where you build them from a base instead of having one that can respawn, where if they go down you have to start from square one if you recruit another. The campaign would be like Chaos Rising or Retribution, linear with optional side missions for extra goodies and gear for your guys.
Now if it weren't Dawn of War, and if I were making a new 40k strategy game, I'd make it play like Wargame or Steel Division 2. A big meta map to move entire regiments or companies of space marines around, you get to put what's in each company and move them around on a continent or whatever the theater of war would be. The campaign mode in SD2 is fun as frick. The gameplay would be like SD2. You start with a limited number of points to deploy your initial force to the field. You generate more points every few minutes to spend on reinforcements. You aren't building or recruiting units, you're drawing from the pre-established regiment you're fighting with, so casualties carry over into the campaign meta map, as does experience gained. Only captured cities or manufactorums could generate new regiments or companies or whatever. It would be a pan-Imperium army, Guard making up most of it, supplemented by Mechanicus, Space Marines, and Sister of Battle. Those could potentially be fully deployed and fleshed out regiments or companies in their own right, but for the campaign you're managing all of them together.
Blood Ravens are helping lead a crusade across a planet, those characters have banter and establish objectives to secure. The Imperial Guard are under their purview like when Raptors or Mentors take command. The Sisters of Battle and the Mechanicus have to be wooed into joining the crusade, so you have to do missions to win trust to allow recruiting from their armies into your forces. Main enemies are Orks and Tyranids, from the Octarius war spilling out into Imperial space.
they should make another dow3 just to spite all your warhammer gays
Based
Frick gayhammer, it's capeshit for neckbeards