Was Zelda just dumb?
>hurr Link the only way to stop Ganondorf is to open the special seal of time that only you can open but btw anyone can get in once you're in there and steal the Triforce too
b***h should've kept everything on lockdown while Ganondorf was a still a mortal
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>Was Zelda just dumb
I mean, she basically admits it in the ending.
shes hot but not as hot as saria
This is right. The whole point was that Link and Zelda were dumb kids in way over their heads.
people become idiots when they're in love.
With their brother?
If that theory is correct, they still don't know they're brother and sister. Not an uncommon trope, see the first Star Wars.
Landwhale shipper is back
>shipper
>just for pointing out an obvious thing
rent absolutely free
all women are stupid especially princesses.
Zelda was like 5 years old at the beginning of the game. She thought ganondorf was evil because he's ugly and gave her nightmares. Link was like 9 and lived in a forest of eternal children, so he wasn't about to figure out how dumb everything is.
He was evil though
>in love
She stopped him because she foresaw what he would do, and letting him into the sacred temple early meant everything could be undone
So what's the correct way to interpret OOT's ending?
I know the official timeline states that there's 2 different timelines, one where the Hero of Time managed to beat Ganon, and one where he failed. But how does that play in the ending scene of OOT? When I was a kid, I imagined that Ganondorf being enclosed in the Sacred Realm means that he just plain can't exist, in any timeline, he's blocked in a space-time realm. So the ending of OOT, for me, was a good ending where Link goes back to his original timeline but this time Ganondorf doesn't exist. He goes to see Zelda just because he wants to hang out with her. I know another way to interpret it is that Link has to save Hyrule from Ganondorf again, but that'd be a terrible fate, imagine being trapped in a time loop like that.
>When I was a kid, I imagined that Ganondorf being enclosed in the Sacred Realm means that he just plain can't exist, in any timeline, he's blocked in a space-time realm.
Originally that ending led to ALttP where the Sacred Realm became the Dark World.
Ganondorf is sealed in the Sacred Realm in the Adult timeline of OOT, in the Past OOT Ganondorf is arrested and executed for his crimes. Thats why in the timeline Wind Waker is set in the Adult timeline. (Link is sent to the past so in the future timeline Link is gone and at the start of Wind Waker tells about this and how Ganondorf escaped Sacred Realm and Link wasnt around to stop him so Hyrule was flooded) and in the past timeline thats why Twilight Princess is after MM's (The execution scene in TP is Ganondorf being executed for his crimes in OOT)
This is all going off if you buy into the official Zelda timeline, which I always found bizarre when it was announced. I had never heard of the fanbase theorizing a timeline like everyone was claiming and the whole point of Zelda is that its a LEGEND. A tale thats told over time that changes as time goes on. Simple as
>. A tale thats told over time that changes as time goes on
I always took it like that. Different times will tell different tales based on the same concept. Then Nintendo came up with that stupid timeline.
Well, WW and TP do both directly reference OoT. The part where it gets wonky is trying to keep them compatible with ALttP, for which OoT was supposed to be a prequel in the first place.
>I had never heard of the fanbase theorizing a timeline like everyone was claiming and the whole point of Zelda is that its a LEGEND. A tale thats told over time that changes as time goes on. Simple as
I'm not insulting you, I'm genuinely asking if you're a zoomer. as far back as 2003, once Wind Waker came out, people began waging in outright flame wars regarding how the Zelda timeline fits as WW's "Hyrule is now gone" put OoT's Adult ending at odds with ALttP where Hyrule is still a thing and Hylians are a race are thinnening to round-eared humans. These conflicts happened in places like BBSs and forums such as Zelda Universe, Zelda Dungeon, IIRC Zelda 64 Central had a forum in those days as well, The Hyrule Odyssey. And that's just the English forums. Spanish Zelda forums such as El Palacio de Sheik/Sheikav had the exact same arguement going on and on. At some point, probably in ZU, someone pointed out at the child Link scene at the end of OoT being the moment Link and Zelda first met up, as Zelda's model does her animation from when you met her the first time in the actual game before it fades into black and white. Since Back to the Future discussed timeline splitting (1985A and 1985B) people began considering that being the case.
It was the third timeline that came out of nowhere and most likely a patchjob because Wind Waker's very premise threw a wrench on the whole thing.
Incidentally, I do remember also a the Zelda timeline being discussed on HTLOZ but that was pre-TWW, it was more of a quick rundown that the order then was OoT>MM>ALttP>LA>Z1>Z2
Not a zoomer but I never frequented those forums and the few I did was never centered around Zelda discussion so what few I got in those days never talked much about it. WW days everyone around me was too busy screaming about the cell shading.
Ah, that might be it. The timeline stuff was always taking place on the big Zelda-centric forums and BBSs of it's time. Minish Cap made things even worse. Many things in that game point at it being pre-OoT but others didn't like the idea of having a game further back than OoT. And that's not even bringing in the Oracle games.
The Capcom Game Boy games just kept reusing the OoT/MM side characters as some sort of general npcs who reoccur throughout history and in other countries too.
Yeah, but this led to eggregious in-fighting about OoX Link being the same as LA Link, which means LA Link wasn't ALttP Link or his backstory was retconned or what the frick happened. Or if OoX Link was his own self and his design is just a product of LA asset recycling.
The current official take is that Oracle Link is the same as LA and ALttP and Zelda didn't recognize him because of his wish to the Triforce in ALttP being essentially a hard reset button of all evils caused by Agahnim/Ganon (hence the king and Link's uncle being back to life), so from Zelda's PoV, she never met Link proper.
Going by Zelda II, all princesses are named Zelda, so I can kinda overlook Oracle Link not knowing her since she wouldn't be the same from ALttP. However, Oracles bring up their own continuity headaches, like Link implied to have no experience as a hero and not knowing what the Triforce is, or both classic and OoT Zoras co-existing (hastily explained as the monsters being an inland species).
My personal preference is that Oracle Link is a separate one from ALttP/LA Link altogether.
I'm just curious, where do they say Oracle Link had no prior experience? He does go in the intro cutscene by horse to a shrine where the Triforce is being kept because the Triforce itself summoned him.
Although Encyclopedia is pure fanfiction and theories by the staff of Nintendo Dream and no actual official word from Aonuma or Miyamoto like Historia was, I do like their fan theory that the enemy Zoras were from the Zoras themselves becoming hostile and more feral, basically changing alliance to the clan of evil.
In real life though, I wonder then they decided Zoras should be good NPCs and Octoroks should be their replacements on water. Considering how early Zelda 64 materials had actual ground-based Octoroks.
The Triforce summons whoever it wants, but everybody pretty much treats Link as a new kid to being a hero. He doesn't know about the Triforce mark on his hand until Impa and the Oracles points it out and then has to be explained what it means, something an experienced Link like the one from ALttP would not need nearly as much exposition to understand.
And where the hell did Epona come from? ALttP Link never owned any horse because she never existed yet. Another point in my belief that Oracle Link is his own self and not from any other game.
I see what you mean, it can always be chalked up to the game being like that for a new player but I really wonder what the Capcom devs were thinking, since they even reuse the Fighter's Shield from ALttP.
As for Epona, this a fair point but I can imagine Link and his uncle getting a horse. It's clear Capcom Oracle team were just concerned with patching up their original plan of these being retellings of Zelda 1, Zelda 2 and an original game once that floundered, but Link having a horse just makes sense. Even the cartoon had one lmao.
>whole point of Zelda is that its a LEGEND
I hear this a lot but it only makes any sense in a handful of games, many other titles directly reference previous entries.
What makes more sense to me is that every adventure becomes a legend, which is the case in games like Wind Waker and Twilight Princess.
There is a connection between the games, most obviously between all the 3D titles, I can't pretend it's all the same legend being retold when it's so obvious to me when these connections show up.
Not to mention that it's much more entertaining to think about how they fit together anyways.
>When I was a kid, I imagined that Ganondorf being enclosed in the Sacred Realm means that he just plain can't exist, in any timeline, he's blocked in a space-time realm. So the ending of OOT, for me, was a good ending where Link goes back to his original timeline but this time Ganondorf doesn't exist.
Then you were a moronic kid. He goes back to his original time to WARN the king about Ganon
>I know the official timeline states that there's 2 different timelines, one where the Hero of Time managed to beat Ganon, and one where he failed.
No the official timeline says there's 3.
>one where Link just straight up fails Ganon kills him (LttP timeline, the Sages have to exhaust themselves at much higher cost to seal Ganon)
>the one where Link gets to live out his childhood and grow up after beating Ganon (MM and TP timeline)
>the one where Link beat Ganon as an adult, but then he taken out of that world by Zelda so when Ganon's seal is broken, Link isn't there to beat him so the sages flood the world to contain him again (WW timeline)
In the timeline with the party scene in the ending the world goes on with Ganon sealed and Link utterly vanished, this is what is shown in the intro to Wind Waker. In the timeline where Link goes to speak with Zelda for the first time for a second time Ganon is arrested and Link is still around, this is what's implied to be the cause of the execution flashback in Twilight Princess.
she was only a kid at that point, what could she have done to stop him.
>she was only a kid at that point, what could she have done to stop him.
not told Link to open the Temple of Time.
The defeat timeline is posthoc bullshit made up by the interns contracted to write hyrule historia. The idea was to try and explain away LttP and WW having almost the same backstory.
>Ganondorf is sealed in OoT's ending as a human with only a piece of the Triforce
>In ALttP, he's permanently Ganon and holds the entire Triforce, leaving a big plothole
To me, it was mainly to reconcile OoT with ALttP's backstory since OoT fricked it up in the ending. Would've been easier for Nintendo to just say all the pre-N64 weren't canon anymore, like they did with Star Fox and F-Zero.
*pre-N64 games
I'll be a bit of a devil's advocate but even before TWW, OoT already contradicted ALttP. The sealing wars were supposed to be this massive bloody conflict according to ALttP were the knights of Hyrule fought the demon clan/Clan of Evil while protecting the seven sages of it's conflict, seven humans who sealed the demon king Ganon as the war waged around them. OoT it was a solo job and the seven sages were new people as the previous ones suddenly were gone and new ones needed to awaken.
Ganondorf was chasing her and dismissed Link as a random boy. The plan would've worked if the story didn't need it to not work.
Ganondorf had already learned of Link's quest by that time. The note from Ruto was a forgery made by him.
big if true
>The note from Ruto was a forgery made by him.
this makes too much sense
wind waker was a mistake. it should be its own AU canon and ALttP should be the canon sequel in the adult timeline
Im not saying your wrong, but personally Wind Waker is the one part of the Timeline I really like. Although thats mainly because I love WW's story of a lost hero timeline where a regular boy has to rise to the occasion to become his timelines hero of courage. I suppose you can still do that if you made WW be in an AU like you suggest, if you change some minor details around.
Well, she was a child. I think the whole point is they don't really know what they're doing. But ultimately it takes the master sword to beat Ganondorf, so it all works out.
BOTW having clear references to all 3 timelines yet never having an official announcements on where it sits only seems to show me even Nintendo doesnt want to have to deal with it either. Either BOTW is set in a time when all the timelines have converged or Nintendo themselves dont give a shit about the timeline
I consider BotW to be a straight reboot. Any shared names and elements with past games are just Easter Eggs.
She was a child, so we should cut her some slack for not thinking her plan through. She might not have even really believed Ganondorf was dangerous; she might have just been playing a game with Link. More concerning is that three grownups just handed Link one of the three spiritual stones; I hold them more responsible than I do Zelda.
Zelda wants BGC. Big Ganon Cawk.
Yeah... that's why she has no problem helping Link killing him.
Even his own harem of gerudo women had no problem betraying him after they met the BHC
Speaking of post-OoT stuff, I feel like the people who don't like that the Hero's Shade is OoT Link, didn't actually play TP. Hero's Shade was dissatisfied because while by most people's standards he led a fulfilling life since he got married and had kids (he had to have, TP Link is his direct descendant), he still has to pass on his legacy. It's an extremely Japanese concept and you're free to not like it but to them, your accomplishments mean nothing if your skills and knowledge aren't passed down to the next generation, they're otherwise lost and it's like they never happened. Especially considering in the time since OoT, Link had grown to become a master swordsman surpassing anything he was capable of in the game itself, if the Hero Shade's abilities are anything to go by. Like he said himself
>Although I accepted life as the hero, I could not convey the lessons of that life to those who came after. At last, I have eased those regrets. You who have marched through countless foes, each mightier then the last... You who now gaze to the future with vision unclouded... Surely you can restore Hyrule to its stature of yore as the chosen land of the gods...Farewell!
Hence why when he meets you, he plans to whip your ass into shape because as you are now at that point in the game, you couldn't possibly defeat Ganon. You wield the Master Sword but you lack the Courage to unleash its true power against evil. Hence why in the above quote, when your training finishes he's proud of you. I don't know how people took a story of honoring the legacy of your ancestors and completely misinterpreted what it was trying to say.
Yeah same I have always been confused by how it seems like the community almost universally agrees its OOT Link despite it never being directly acknowledged.
especially since none of his equipment seems like anything oot link would wear
god I hate nintendrones
they live rent free in you
Everyone in OoT is a fricking moronic moron who stinks. Name one NPC that isn't a babbling moron
Saria is pretty based
back off shes mine
this guy was probably the most logical dude in the game
Gets lost in the woods and dies
Doesn't notice Link ditched the Ocarina she gave him
>Gets lost in the woods and dies
... so the same thing that happened to Link?
hi mat pat
The OoT manga explained it as Ganondorf taking Saria's ocarina from Link thinking it was the Ocarina of Time.
wait is that what really happened?
All of this would be so simple if Japanese game developers would just write a story that made sense and then stick to it.