When you lose, you have no one to blame other than the game or yourself. If you play team games you can always scapegoat your teammates as the reason you lost and absolve yourself of any blame.
this
play csgo or apex or rainbow six siege or lol and you can use the "bad teammates" or "bad matchmaking" or "unlucky rng" excuses
true RTS gives you no excuse, it's just you and your gameplay and you lose if you're worse
no way to cope
well of course you can cope with "other player's units are imba" but that's just a delusion players have collectively decided to allow to keep their ego, even though deep down they all know it's cope
>DUDE MY PING WAS TOO HIGH >DUDE HE WAS USING A CHEESE STRAT >DUDE THAT MAP WAS IN HIS FAVOR >DUDE THAT MATCHUP WAS IN HIS FAVOR >OMG HOW DID I KNOW I WAS THERE HE'S CHEATING
Want me to go on? It has been proven over and over again that Moba games are harder than RTS games as some of the best RTS players in the world struggle to even be AVERAGE at MOBA games.
Same thing happens in fighters, then in smash where they can't blame imputs (minus terry, ryu/ken and kazuya)
They just blame their controller then break it
>you characters is OP >you have the better matchup >this stage sucks for my character >omg you have 20ms it's impossible to play against you! >you're just cheesing! >you use a hitbox it's cheating >I don't have a faulty gamecube controller that's why I lose
want me to go on?
it changes nothing, they just blame race/unit balance or the artosis classic "this cheese strat wouldn't work against good players so i shouldn't have to prepare for it"
He casts too many tournaments. He goes into ladder where you play a against a random opponent you can't prepare for in a best of 1.
His mindset sort of makes sense for tournaments, not for ladder.
well i lied it's not really the same shit but very similar
but it was match point against another zerg and serral was up in supply but FFd incredibly early after losing a few units
go to 48:35
?t=2915
the next day he admitted it was nerves and shouldn't have done it
This. Like I tried playing Iron Harvest. Sounded like a cool premise, but the balance was awful. Since you're so limited on population cap, there is no point whatsoever to making infantry. You end up just making mechs. And even if the terrible unit balance was bad, a good campaign could have made it fun. But no, you play as this oppressed girl who has to show all the boys in the town that she is better than them and force them to let her play, so you beat them in a snow ball fight. It's such a overdone and trite narrative now that it's boring.
It's actually because RTS has always been a niche genre that accidentally filled other genres like tower defence, god games, or ASShomosexualS which didn't exist yet. Once it was realized a larger market for these genres existed people started making games for them and draining away the "RTS" playerbase. Unless you were a godgame gay, then you're SOL forever.
Similar things happened with DayZ and all of the crafting survival games and battle royale games now.
name 5 good rts that came up in last 5 years
i don't mind playing RTSs but most of them are shit nowadays
as a kid , i played hours upon hours of rising kingdoms ,Nemesis of the Roman Empire and then quitely shifted to RPGs
i did play they are billions a lot
>You didn't scout his proxy Dark Shrine three minutes ago so now you auto lose >You didn't play 16 hours a day for 3 months to learn the timings by heart, therefore you didn't know it was coming even though he hid his proxy well >Cheese is so strong that even when it doesn't outright win, the cheeser might establish an expansion and get ahead, slowly chocking you out
LOL, nice "game". And the thing that killed ladder was that everyone was playing the same carbon copy builds, you might as well go against bots at that point anyway. I made it to master league as zerg and felt zero accomplishment.
The adversial and toxic faceoffs during the MLG days were KINO though.
>everyone was playing the same carbon copy builds
That's just the nature of competitive games past the early days of no optimization. Once people learn the best strategies and mechanics of course they'll use them to compete.
I'm pretty sure none of this happen below masters MMR which is where 95% of the playerbase is at
Heck, I picked up SC2 a few years ago and spammed A click marines up to diamond in a few weeks just because I practiced my APM a lot
People were hitting perfect 4gate timings in silver and 2 proxy raxing all the way up until diamond, not to mention the moronicly brainless 10pool ZvZ.
Black person I was there and I'm telling you, if you were employed when Starcraft 2 launched, there was nothing on the ladder for you. Now you can argue this is as it should be, but don't scratch your head when the game atrophies and rots into pure meta-slavery. For a strategy game, the "strategy" part was mined out and swapped for twitch-micro.
You severely overestimate your ability to recognize "perfectly" executed strategies and severely underestimate the amount of counter opportunities you had. Especially in Silver out of all places. Literal Dunning Kruger effect
>I didn't scout well enough and now I lost >I wasn't as good as the other player and now I lost >I didn't have the presence of mind to anticipate non standard play that became so ubiquitous it became standard and now I lost
LOL, nice "game" dotards.
The intersection that was smoked had a tank that was going back and forth, the smokescren made it safe to move the infatry squad that took out the armored vehicle with a short range AT rocket.
Its called broken arrow and its looking more like Wargame meets world in conflict. People are saying its better than Warno but if you were looking for another Wargame you will be disappointed.
I haven't played it myself but from what I've seen it doesn't look like a Wargame replacement.
Actually I've never played Wargame or any WTT if it matters. I was just looking to try the genre out and saw a clip of that game's demo a few days ago and thought it was a new Wargame. Just figured I'd start there. But you say it doesn't look like good as existing titles of the genre?
Its called broken arrow and its looking more like Wargame meets world in conflict. People are saying its better than Warno but if you were looking for another Wargame you will be disappointed.
I haven't played it myself but from what I've seen it doesn't look like a Wargame replacement.
I prefer its scale, wargame always felt kind soulless to me because you must be super zoomed out all the time, this one has a better balance between large scale and small scale.
There was a demo this past Next Fest. It was alright
Actually I've never played Wargame or any WTT if it matters. I was just looking to try the genre out and saw a clip of that game's demo a few days ago and thought it was a new Wargame. Just figured I'd start there. But you say it doesn't look like good as existing titles of the genre?
I mean it looks fun I just see people comparing it to Wargame alot and it doesn't really look like a replacement. It just looks like it barrowed some elements from Wargame and did its own thing. Considering the state of Warno I am sure if it plays as good as it looks I am sure it will have no problems building a fanbase.
They probably don't want to spend 20 mins microing resources to get to a point where units produced aren't total trash just to get scout rushed by some Korean.
>They probably don't want to spend 20 mins microing resources to get to a point where units produced aren't total trash
sc2 is 12 years old and you can reach highest tier of units within 8 minutes of the match's start
That's cool but just like Zoomers don't want to spend time getting good at Arena shooters they don't like when a game doesn't provide those instant dopamine hits and most RTS's whether its AOE, COH, SC, Dawn of War, Warcraft or whatever are turned off by this shit. I am sure on top that the fact that most recent entries into the genre have been multiplayer focused doesn't help considering the vast majority of casual RTS players just fight AI or their friends the success of things like Total War and Grand Strategy should have made that pretty clear.
Arena shooters probably provide the highest amounts of dopamine hits per minute.
Saber dropped the ball with QC by developing it on a complete trainwreck engine, as well as never implementing continous lobbies. It actually STILL doesn't have continous lobbies.
>Arena shooters probably provide the highest amounts of dopamine hits per minute.
yeah but the people who still play them are good at them and getting good at the is a skill most people are unwilling to learn. Frick I've seen games with sub 3 digit populations and watch players unironically tell new players to uninstall only to b***h 10 mins later about the player count.
>you can
You mean you need to and if you don't, you get roflstomped by the guy who endlessly practiced the most efficient build orders to minmax the time he needs to shit on you
Remember when that fat frick from Riot would shill their shitty Moba in every forum and website that talked about RTS games and dota? Yeah. Unironically Riot and Chinks with their aggressive shilling
Strategy games are bad for multiplayer, you can see who's gonna win in advance just because of the sheer resource advantage, it makes people not want to play any further. This is especially true for 4X where the games are played on hour-long scales and not minute-scales like RTS. >play Civ 5 with friends >we stomp the AI >I end up as the strongest civilization >we don't play anymore because we don't want to PVP >play Endless Space 2 with friends >send a doomstack umbral choir fleet at the capital of a friend >friend doesn't want to play anymore because the removal of his capital essentially kneecapped him for the rest of the game
RTS isn't a very good genre in the first place, it's demanding enough that you feel more stress than fun the better you are at the game. It should remain at the realm of singleplayer and co-op, never competitive multiplayer.
Firaxis can't program, all of their games are riddled with technical issues. >Civ 5 and Beyond Earth have to reload the map tiles on start-up and it looks like a grey plane until then >long loading times for Civ 5, Beyond Earth, Civ 6 and XCOM 2 despite simplistic nature >finish vanilla XCOM 2, game lags the frick out at the ending "cutscene" despite running well enough until that point
I don't think you can play multiplayer Civ 6 with mods to this day but I'm not sure. I know that in Civ 5 it involves some file voodoo magic from the bowels of CivFanatics.
Play Sins of a Solar Empire instead of turn based stuff. >All the depth of 4x but real time >Not so blisteringly fast that you need 600 apm to compete
The fact that sins of a solar empire never achieved the recognition it deserved is a crime against VIDYA
RTS is hard and I'd guess most of them didn't even grow up with it. Most RTS games which still have an active playerbase are going to have dedicated players which would make the learning curve very steep even for somebody who is familiar and comfortable with RTS mechanics. If you don't even have that familiarity you are probably going to get your shit pushed in for an eternity before you become decent at the game. People just aren't going to put themselves through that.
Despite originating in WC3, DotA isn't particularly similar to RTS. Just because they're both top-down and you click your hero around with a mouse doesn't mean there's any deep similarity beyond the surface.
>Despite originating in WC3, DotA isn't particularly similar to RTS. Just because they're both top-down and you click your hero around with a mouse doesn't mean there's any deep similarity beyond the surface.
There's more similarities that aren't immediately obvious. Extracting the most resources you can from the map, keeping knowledge of and hindering your opponents movements. Winning fights with as little commitment as possible. They play very differently because there's no basebuilding but the underlying goal is similar just compartmentalized between 5 players. RTS scrubs will focus on fights, pros will harm economy. Same in dota, scrubs chase kills, pros inflict objective damage. Tech could be seen as an analogy to itemization
i really dont see the fun in playing RTSes competitively.
If you tryhard it too much it kills the fun of it and becomes a queue game simulator instead.
Zerg player building 6 Swarmhosts would turn any match into a 1h30minute stand off, which audiences weren't that excited to watch for the twentieth time a tournament. Eventually the viewership dropped from SC2 and the sponsors demanded viewers -> BW was back.
holy based, thank you for this. i was just gonna ask if someone had the david kim one. also its funy how the other guy is trying to be as politically correct as possible lmao
I wish I could find that screenshot of tasteless or artosis casting Nony vs Idra in Brood War and forgot to turn <DND> on, and a PM appeared on the cast with something like >frick yeah Nony frick that homosexual idra in his big gay ass shout out to gerber baby food'
and i've never forgotten it
same reason fighting games aren't popular. they require more multitasking and execution than more popular competitive games. plus the added layer of losing being squarely on your shoulders as opposed to having a team to fall back on.
chess isnt skill anymore its literally just memorizing what the computer tells you to do in every situation. its why bobby fischer stopped playing and the last tournament before he died he made completely random moves to open so his opponent wouldnt have a memorized response and would have to actually play him
because they have degenerated into drilling build orders for the first few minutes of the game, so that you have hopes of reaching the interesting part of a match, because without asiaticclicking you lose the to the guy who snowballed his APM into rushing you if your macro up to par to the same efficiency as him.
>tfw 24 >ywn watch Idra, HuK, inControl, gaulzi, Dragon play during the 2010-2011 days ever again >ywn see the days of crazy shit people got away with during the early days of SC2's map editing scene >ywn be able to shitpost on the old SC2 forums and community map forums again
Frick this shit I want to go back.
I sorta dont belive the reason why he gave for deleting his channel. Bet his GF made him do it or some moronic social media manager. Still dude looks like the biggest tool alive so maybe he really is telling the truth and he cant comprehend why that might had been a rude move. Eh whatever im sure hes wealthy beyond measure and happier then me.
nothing could ever beat orginal korea time, but korea time 2.0 was good fun.
There was just something about having to watch through GOMplayer at 3 in the morning that made it feel like you were watching something illegal, or that you were never meant to see
Felt like less of its own thing and more of the embers of an old fire.
It was fun but the most fun I had were running into some of Ganker's old bw players. That's one of the big differences I think between koreatime 1 and 2. Millenials that watched bw were also bw players, by the early 10's we'd already seen the transition start to watchers being more consumers only.
>By far the best WC3 player in the world >Starcraft 1 and 2 professional >Arguable one of the top 3 best RTS players in the world >tries to play Dota 2 >coached by like 10 of the best players in the world >been playing for 8h each day for half a year now >still at an average skill level
Care to explain this, RTS boomers? And no, age is not an excuse as most of the best Dota players is at his age.
Yeah? He's the best WC3 player in the world which is the second most competitive RTS in the world and he was a Starcraft pro as well. Which other RTS player has this much experience and cred?
>By far the best WC3 player in the world >Starcraft 1 and 2 professional >Arguable one of the top 3 best RTS players in the world >tries to play Dota 2 >coached by like 10 of the best players in the world >been playing for 8h each day for half a year now >still at an average skill level
Care to explain this, RTS boomers? And no, age is not an excuse as most of the best Dota players is at his age.
>By far the best WC3 player in the world >Starcraft 1 and 2 professional >Arguable one of the top 3 best RTS players in the world >tries to play Dota 2 >coached by like 10 of the best players in the world >been playing for 8h each day for half a year now >still at an average skill level
Care to explain this, RTS boomers? And no, age is not an excuse as most of the best Dota players is at his age.
>By far the best WC3 player in the world
Not even close to the level of Moon. What kind of moronic fangay are you?
>By far the best WC3 player in the world >Starcraft 1 and 2 professional >Arguable one of the top 3 best RTS players in the world >tries to play Dota 2 >coached by like 10 of the best players in the world >been playing for 8h each day for half a year now >still at an average skill level
Care to explain this, RTS boomers? And no, age is not an excuse as most of the best Dota players is at his age.
>has never experienced a meta shift, since he started playing >you watched him play, when he was still a noob, so you don't accept him as a pro player, who seems to just be effortlessly good at everything he does >is old
Weren't millennials the generation who transitioned away from RTSs and MOBAs became incredibly popular instead?
It's more like millenials creating offshoots of the RTS genre. It evolved and lives on through her children. Games like Dota are basically an RTS with only a single unit. Games like Total War are RTS, which externalized base-building to a turn-based grand strategy map. Grand Strategy from paradox are types of games, which made that real-time again.
When I was a kid and I played Warcraft 3, I imagined I was playing Total War Warcraft. So naturally when the technology comes around to make that possible, millenials like me want this, instead of being slaves to nostalgia and only wanting to playing games with the same exact technical fidelity as when we were young,
Dota is not a skill based game, StarCraft and warcraft are. It's quite simple. A master of chess would also lose at dota because dota is again, not skill based >me pick op point and click hero >me win
It's embarrassing that dotards have tournaments and throw money at a bunch of clowns who just abuse what's broken during x patch and then have the gall to pretend their moron game is in any way comparable to real rts
Here comes the cope. Grubby despite being one of the best RTS players IN THE WORLD can't even climb to a good rank in Dota DESPITE spamming the single most OP stuff in the patch.
Explain this
>Most of the best Dota players are around his age
The point was that when he was good, he was younger. Most RTS players in Starcraft are great when they're young with very few exceptions.
Also you ignored the rest of my points. It's not a 1vs1 game.
Grubby also doesn't have the practice time like he did in Warcraft III. Streaming on Twitch is not equal to spending 10 hours a day practicing Orc vs Night Elf to beat Moon in a WCG.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Also you ignored the rest of my points. It's not 1vs1 game.
What does that have to do with anything? skillful players have shown being able to consistently climb on any role and most heroes, not just OP meta of the patch.
He is just GOD awful at the game, he can see enemies units 5m in front of him and not even react. He sucks at microing.
Let's see you dominate with meepo first game you ever play with him, also, let's see you take an account up from 600 mmr to 3500+ in a few months?
Just a scrubby Black person talking shit about a white man behind his back.
I have less games played than him and I'm 5k mmr.
1 year ago
Anonymous
I'll just post it again since you ignored it?
Grubby also doesn't have the practice time like he did in Warcraft III. Streaming on Twitch is not equal to spending 10 hours a day practicing Orc vs Night Elf to beat Moon in a WCG.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Grubby also doesn't have the practice time like he did in Warcraft III. Streaming on Twitch is not equal to spending 10 hours a day practicing Orc vs Night Elf to beat Moon in a WCG.
So? What does that have to do with anything? We're not talking about him becoming a pro at Dota 2. We're talking about one of the best RTS players in the world not even able to climb away from the average bracket in a game that plays kind of the same as a RTS game.
And he has been coached by the best players in the game, playing for 8h day, looking at countless replays and "analyzing" his gameplay.
He is the perfect example that RTS players are actually bad at games, because RTS is a "solved" genre where you play the same way each and every single match. Grubby can't take it out of his mind why he doesn't win despite him following the biggest meta builds and OP stuff, because RTS players can't do any actual thinking by themselves.
1 year ago
Anonymous
You're the one that started with naming his success in Warcraft III and asking why isn't he great in Dota.
What isn't clear to you about the guy streaming for his viewers 15 years past his prime isn't the same guy that practices 8~12 hours a day for weeks in one match up (Orc vs Night Elf) only vs other Night Elf pros to beat Moon in a WCG finals.
1 year ago
Anonymous
HE PRACTICES DOTA 8H PER DAY you moron. He plays the game, gets coached by the BEST players in the game, analyzes replies of the heroes he plays and looks up guides and what's meta.
hes been streaming it near daily for 6 months now. He's generally too passive in lane and too keen to farm when he's strong. The moment he wants to fight is the precise moment his allies are nowhere near. He doesnt recognize power spikes well yet and has some crucial decision making issues.
>afk farms 24/7 every single game no matter what the hero >still have no idea about power spikes >is so far up his own ass he never think he does anything wrong and always blame team mates >even downloads replays only to blame his team mates >only plays the single most OP and meta hero of the patch and still sucks at it >haven't even touched any of the micro heavy heroes despite them being excellent to climb MMR with >obsessed with gaining MMR it's actually sad to see
The only fun I have in Dota nowadays is too watch Grubby and see him seethe and fail
Does anyone have a link to the vid of someone raging and doing a BM SCV rush in a tourney? I was looking for it yesterday and couldn't fricking find it, assume it was Gred "Idra" Fields
>fgc has been ruined and sanitized >the games themselves are awful now >rts is completely dead with only moronic cartoonshit coming out >no bants allowed
Fricking hell I hate this timeline
>got good at fighting games >try to discuss high level issues >Ganker is so casual they dismiss it as "lol u hate losing xD" >even though I have gotten good
Ganker literally cannot comprehend moving past entry level
"Most of that army was halluc"
Is this a holocaust reference? Because well, duh! Of course zoomers are not going to be into your edgy manosphere bullshit.
I always just played custom games. I was addicted to playing shit like cat n mouse, lava run, battle of helms deep. SC2 didnt really have the community as much all anyone played at least when I played sc2 was that "war" game where both sides build buildings to spawn units that walk across the map. Modern RTS games dont really have custom game modes so they dont really interest me much beyond the single player campaign.
For the same reasons they don't like fighting games. They suck.
Nerve-wracking, yet boring. There are a shitload of options for attack and defense, but you're ultimately forced to learn how to initiate and counter with the same bullshit as everyone else. Takes a billion hours to learn all of the strategies and meta, yet high level players can be beat with cheesy noob bullshit (button mashing oddly timed jump moves, grab spam, etc.)
i prefer it when RTS games have cool campaigns and i don't care for the PvP
i got gold in SC2 as zerg quite quickly but i gave up because it's just stressful and boring
campaigns are better
>i got gold in SC2 as zerg quite quickly but i gave up because it's just stressful and boring >campaigns are better
I think thats the thing a lot of hardcore classic RTS players forget. Most people don't want to fricking 1v1 you in MP most players can't even handle the AI on high difficulties. Most RTS players lack the clicks per minute and the map awareness for MP and it gets reflected hard by the population of most newly release RTS's.
What someone need to do to seriously revive this genre is make a game that caters to the singleplayer side of things first before worrying about being the perfectly balanced MP game that all the Esports homosexuals cry for then dump when the next big thing comes out or the game starts to die.
this is the truth
rts needs to cater to casuals again and make fun campaigns (with brutal difficulty additions for experienced players), and then AND ONLY THEN start thinking about esportsBlack folk that form a minority of the playerbase
here's the thing, SC2 has those elements you are talking about right now. I think you can even Co-op to do the campaign together with a friend. This is in addition to the mutation co-op vs AI with random affix mode.
The simple fact is that people just want to control one unit and blame up to 4 other people for failures. RTS will never be big again.
For the same reasons they don't like fighting games. They suck.
Nerve-wracking, yet boring. There are a shitload of options for attack and defense, but you're ultimately forced to learn how to initiate and counter with the same bullshit as everyone else. Takes a billion hours to learn all of the strategies and meta, yet high level players can be beat with cheesy noob bullshit (button mashing oddly timed jump moves, grab spam, etc.)
2 lazy 2 look up the clip on youtube because I don't keep track of fighting game autist's online handles. Fighting games are broken af, look up the fight where the dude who plays with his mouth kicks some Black folk ass in SF. All the skill in the world wont save you from a guy who uses his tongue to play. Perhaps you should learn to >> properly before you call someone else moronic lmao
Doeant help they confuse trpg with rts
When you lose, you have no one to blame other than the game or yourself. If you play team games you can always scapegoat your teammates as the reason you lost and absolve yourself of any blame.
this
play csgo or apex or rainbow six siege or lol and you can use the "bad teammates" or "bad matchmaking" or "unlucky rng" excuses
true RTS gives you no excuse, it's just you and your gameplay and you lose if you're worse
no way to cope
You've obviously never watched an Artosis stream.
well of course you can cope with "other player's units are imba" but that's just a delusion players have collectively decided to allow to keep their ego, even though deep down they all know it's cope
well brood war has the added bonus excuse of "my units pathed like fricking morons"
>DUDE MY PING WAS TOO HIGH
>DUDE HE WAS USING A CHEESE STRAT
>DUDE THAT MAP WAS IN HIS FAVOR
>DUDE THAT MATCHUP WAS IN HIS FAVOR
>OMG HOW DID I KNOW I WAS THERE HE'S CHEATING
Want me to go on? It has been proven over and over again that Moba games are harder than RTS games as some of the best RTS players in the world struggle to even be AVERAGE at MOBA games.
Based
>playing rocket league
>at least 70% of losses result in one of the teammates either giving up or destroying morale by shitting on the other teammates
It never fricking fails.
Same thing happens in fighters, then in smash where they can't blame imputs (minus terry, ryu/ken and kazuya)
They just blame their controller then break it
>you characters is OP
>you have the better matchup
>this stage sucks for my character
>omg you have 20ms it's impossible to play against you!
>you're just cheesing!
>you use a hitbox it's cheating
>I don't have a faulty gamecube controller that's why I lose
want me to go on?
jej, this shit makes me wonder if people cry about specific keyboard types and mice
people cry about wooting keyboards in some games because having analog inputs on a keyboard can be kinda busted
This really is the reason. People can't mentally handle it. It's just a lot easier to get angry at teammates.
it changes nothing, they just blame race/unit balance or the artosis classic "this cheese strat wouldn't work against good players so i shouldn't have to prepare for it"
He casts too many tournaments. He goes into ladder where you play a against a random opponent you can't prepare for in a best of 1.
His mindset sort of makes sense for tournaments, not for ladder.
No attention span thanks to social media and moronic apps like tik tok.
serral did the same shit two days ago at IEM katowice
link? I wanna see the reactions
well i lied it's not really the same shit but very similar
but it was match point against another zerg and serral was up in supply but FFd incredibly early after losing a few units
go to 48:35
?t=2915
the next day he admitted it was nerves and shouldn't have done it
Tragic
Serral was still in a losing position, I Agree he shouldn't have GGed but this is way less egregious than the great hallucination ruse of our time
Zoomers don't know how to use a keyboard. Ask them to capitalize a word without toggling caps lock and they'll break.
>you will never watch idra stream wings again at the EG house
There hasn't been a good RTS game made in the last decade
This. Like I tried playing Iron Harvest. Sounded like a cool premise, but the balance was awful. Since you're so limited on population cap, there is no point whatsoever to making infantry. You end up just making mechs. And even if the terrible unit balance was bad, a good campaign could have made it fun. But no, you play as this oppressed girl who has to show all the boys in the town that she is better than them and force them to let her play, so you beat them in a snow ball fight. It's such a overdone and trite narrative now that it's boring.
rts games rely 90% on mechanical skill
learning to multitask and click with perfect accuracy and incredible speed is kinda stupid
man I loved seeing that tossgay get stomped
hated him so much
zergcucks mad when they could not beat top 3 control
Shut up Huk. We all know it was you. Cough up those porkchops.
skill issue
Why didn't any of his brothers follow in his footsteps and play competitively?
It's actually because RTS has always been a niche genre that accidentally filled other genres like tower defence, god games, or ASShomosexualS which didn't exist yet. Once it was realized a larger market for these genres existed people started making games for them and draining away the "RTS" playerbase. Unless you were a godgame gay, then you're SOL forever.
Similar things happened with DayZ and all of the crafting survival games and battle royale games now.
This is the real and only actual answer. It has nothing to do with difficulty, which has always been a massive cope.
I remember watching that game live, it's been like 12 years.
post vid of this match
Is competitive RTS the most stressful genre?
Probably. Imagine doing 5 matches of TvT and having each be a 45 minute game.
I tried going into AoE2 competitive 1v1 for a bit and I've never sweat so much from playing a game, I can't do it
Wrists: gone
leave the woman (man) to me
one of the greatest moments
>sends 6 probes cross map
>causes international butthurt
naniwer was a class of his own
name 5 good rts that came up in last 5 years
i don't mind playing RTSs but most of them are shit nowadays
as a kid , i played hours upon hours of rising kingdoms ,Nemesis of the Roman Empire and then quitely shifted to RPGs
i did play they are billions a lot
>You didn't scout his proxy Dark Shrine three minutes ago so now you auto lose
>You didn't play 16 hours a day for 3 months to learn the timings by heart, therefore you didn't know it was coming even though he hid his proxy well
>Cheese is so strong that even when it doesn't outright win, the cheeser might establish an expansion and get ahead, slowly chocking you out
LOL, nice "game". And the thing that killed ladder was that everyone was playing the same carbon copy builds, you might as well go against bots at that point anyway. I made it to master league as zerg and felt zero accomplishment.
The adversial and toxic faceoffs during the MLG days were KINO though.
>using "toxic" unironically
Hello fellow Ganker users!
I don't give a frick Black person, you know what I meant.
What are you supposed to describe this interaction as?
>everyone was playing the same carbon copy builds
That's just the nature of competitive games past the early days of no optimization. Once people learn the best strategies and mechanics of course they'll use them to compete.
I'm pretty sure none of this happen below masters MMR which is where 95% of the playerbase is at
Heck, I picked up SC2 a few years ago and spammed A click marines up to diamond in a few weeks just because I practiced my APM a lot
People were hitting perfect 4gate timings in silver and 2 proxy raxing all the way up until diamond, not to mention the moronicly brainless 10pool ZvZ.
Black person I was there and I'm telling you, if you were employed when Starcraft 2 launched, there was nothing on the ladder for you. Now you can argue this is as it should be, but don't scratch your head when the game atrophies and rots into pure meta-slavery. For a strategy game, the "strategy" part was mined out and swapped for twitch-micro.
You severely overestimate your ability to recognize "perfectly" executed strategies and severely underestimate the amount of counter opportunities you had. Especially in Silver out of all places. Literal Dunning Kruger effect
>I made it to master league as zerg and felt zero accomplishment.
That's because you played with Macro crutches enabled
>I didn't scout well enough and now I lost
>I wasn't as good as the other player and now I lost
>I didn't have the presence of mind to anticipate non standard play that became so ubiquitous it became standard and now I lost
LOL, nice "game" dotards.
>Real Time Strategy
Meh or pure cancer
>Real Time Tactics
Based
This.
>smokes road and does nothing
>vehicle that was going down road and was going to get blown up anyways gets blown up
>OMG TACTICAL SUPERIORITY
The intersection that was smoked had a tank that was going back and forth, the smokescren made it safe to move the infatry squad that took out the armored vehicle with a short range AT rocket.
orrrrrrrrrrr you could put javelins in the closest treeline and destroy everything anyways
Is this the new Wargame demo?
Its called broken arrow and its looking more like Wargame meets world in conflict. People are saying its better than Warno but if you were looking for another Wargame you will be disappointed.
I haven't played it myself but from what I've seen it doesn't look like a Wargame replacement.
There was a demo this past Next Fest. It was alright
Actually I've never played Wargame or any WTT if it matters. I was just looking to try the genre out and saw a clip of that game's demo a few days ago and thought it was a new Wargame. Just figured I'd start there. But you say it doesn't look like good as existing titles of the genre?
It seems that it will have a better single player campaign than wargame, which effectively doesn't any.
I prefer its scale, wargame always felt kind soulless to me because you must be super zoomed out all the time, this one has a better balance between large scale and small scale.
I mean it looks fun I just see people comparing it to Wargame alot and it doesn't really look like a replacement. It just looks like it barrowed some elements from Wargame and did its own thing. Considering the state of Warno I am sure if it plays as good as it looks I am sure it will have no problems building a fanbase.
They probably don't want to spend 20 mins microing resources to get to a point where units produced aren't total trash just to get scout rushed by some Korean.
>They probably don't want to spend 20 mins microing resources to get to a point where units produced aren't total trash
sc2 is 12 years old and you can reach highest tier of units within 8 minutes of the match's start
That's cool but just like Zoomers don't want to spend time getting good at Arena shooters they don't like when a game doesn't provide those instant dopamine hits and most RTS's whether its AOE, COH, SC, Dawn of War, Warcraft or whatever are turned off by this shit. I am sure on top that the fact that most recent entries into the genre have been multiplayer focused doesn't help considering the vast majority of casual RTS players just fight AI or their friends the success of things like Total War and Grand Strategy should have made that pretty clear.
Arena shooters probably provide the highest amounts of dopamine hits per minute.
Saber dropped the ball with QC by developing it on a complete trainwreck engine, as well as never implementing continous lobbies. It actually STILL doesn't have continous lobbies.
It was all there for them to gain monopoly on.
>Arena shooters probably provide the highest amounts of dopamine hits per minute.
yeah but the people who still play them are good at them and getting good at the is a skill most people are unwilling to learn. Frick I've seen games with sub 3 digit populations and watch players unironically tell new players to uninstall only to b***h 10 mins later about the player count.
>you can
You mean you need to and if you don't, you get roflstomped by the guy who endlessly practiced the most efficient build orders to minmax the time he needs to shit on you
>sc2
Remember when that fat frick from Riot would shill their shitty Moba in every forum and website that talked about RTS games and dota? Yeah. Unironically Riot and Chinks with their aggressive shilling
it really was a different time
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA I WANT TO GO BACK
>AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Strategy games are bad for multiplayer, you can see who's gonna win in advance just because of the sheer resource advantage, it makes people not want to play any further. This is especially true for 4X where the games are played on hour-long scales and not minute-scales like RTS.
>play Civ 5 with friends
>we stomp the AI
>I end up as the strongest civilization
>we don't play anymore because we don't want to PVP
>play Endless Space 2 with friends
>send a doomstack umbral choir fleet at the capital of a friend
>friend doesn't want to play anymore because the removal of his capital essentially kneecapped him for the rest of the game
RTS isn't a very good genre in the first place, it's demanding enough that you feel more stress than fun the better you are at the game. It should remain at the realm of singleplayer and co-op, never competitive multiplayer.
I wish they'd ever fix the fricking netcode on civ 5 or 6, constant fricking desyncs every 10 turns means you need everyone to restart the lobby
Firaxis can't program, all of their games are riddled with technical issues.
>Civ 5 and Beyond Earth have to reload the map tiles on start-up and it looks like a grey plane until then
>long loading times for Civ 5, Beyond Earth, Civ 6 and XCOM 2 despite simplistic nature
>finish vanilla XCOM 2, game lags the frick out at the ending "cutscene" despite running well enough until that point
I don't think you can play multiplayer Civ 6 with mods to this day but I'm not sure. I know that in Civ 5 it involves some file voodoo magic from the bowels of CivFanatics.
>I fricked him over with the dickass hackerman invis faction and now he doesn't want to play anymore
Who do you have to blame?
It would've probably been the same if I played UE or something.
Play Sins of a Solar Empire instead of turn based stuff.
>All the depth of 4x but real time
>Not so blisteringly fast that you need 600 apm to compete
The fact that sins of a solar empire never achieved the recognition it deserved is a crime against VIDYA
zoomers are pretty good at dota. It's just a matter of telling them that everyone works like meepo
RTS is hard and I'd guess most of them didn't even grow up with it. Most RTS games which still have an active playerbase are going to have dedicated players which would make the learning curve very steep even for somebody who is familiar and comfortable with RTS mechanics. If you don't even have that familiarity you are probably going to get your shit pushed in for an eternity before you become decent at the game. People just aren't going to put themselves through that.
Despite originating in WC3, DotA isn't particularly similar to RTS. Just because they're both top-down and you click your hero around with a mouse doesn't mean there's any deep similarity beyond the surface.
>Despite originating in WC3, DotA isn't particularly similar to RTS. Just because they're both top-down and you click your hero around with a mouse doesn't mean there's any deep similarity beyond the surface.
There's more similarities that aren't immediately obvious. Extracting the most resources you can from the map, keeping knowledge of and hindering your opponents movements. Winning fights with as little commitment as possible. They play very differently because there's no basebuilding but the underlying goal is similar just compartmentalized between 5 players. RTS scrubs will focus on fights, pros will harm economy. Same in dota, scrubs chase kills, pros inflict objective damage. Tech could be seen as an analogy to itemization
i really dont see the fun in playing RTSes competitively.
If you tryhard it too much it kills the fun of it and becomes a queue game simulator instead.
why did all the koreans and artosis go back to bw? what happened after hots
Zerg player building 6 Swarmhosts would turn any match into a 1h30minute stand off, which audiences weren't that excited to watch for the twentieth time a tournament. Eventually the viewership dropped from SC2 and the sponsors demanded viewers -> BW was back.
SC2 is an inferior game in the eyes of most BW players
back when you could banter without getting banned
btw pls post more kino sc2 screenshots, i've lost all mine i believe
holy based, thank you for this. i was just gonna ask if someone had the david kim one. also its funy how the other guy is trying to be as politically correct as possible lmao
Legend.
you're really good at making carriers. a very useful talent toi have
I wish I could find that screenshot of tasteless or artosis casting Nony vs Idra in Brood War and forgot to turn <DND> on, and a PM appeared on the cast with something like
>frick yeah Nony frick that homosexual idra in his big gay ass shout out to gerber baby food'
and i've never forgotten it
same reason fighting games aren't popular. they require more multitasking and execution than more popular competitive games. plus the added layer of losing being squarely on your shoulders as opposed to having a team to fall back on.
Because it isnt skill, its just memorizing build orders for 12 hours a day.
>chess isn't skill, it's just memorizing openers for 12 hours a day
chess isnt skill anymore its literally just memorizing what the computer tells you to do in every situation. its why bobby fischer stopped playing and the last tournament before he died he made completely random moves to open so his opponent wouldnt have a memorized response and would have to actually play him
>chess isn't about skill
>this is why Bobby Fischer used his skill in order to open up his opponent
????
That's what high-end chess ended up becoming though.
>sc2 thread on Ganker
>destihomosexual streaming sc2
feels good to be at home
Anyone else remember chill vs combatex? those matches were pure fricking kino
ye
because they have degenerated into drilling build orders for the first few minutes of the game, so that you have hopes of reaching the interesting part of a match, because without asiaticclicking you lose the to the guy who snowballed his APM into rushing you if your macro up to par to the same efficiency as him.
>tfw 24
>ywn watch Idra, HuK, inControl, gaulzi, Dragon play during the 2010-2011 days ever again
>ywn see the days of crazy shit people got away with during the early days of SC2's map editing scene
>ywn be able to shitpost on the old SC2 forums and community map forums again
Frick this shit I want to go back.
i want to go back to. early SC2 days were legendary. we didn't know how good we had it but god damn those were the days.
genuinely the only time I was ever excited about a multiplayer game was late bw to early hots
would go home from uni early to watch gsl
I remember waking up early in the morning to watch gomtv through that shitty ass gomtv player, but it was still a good time.
WELCOME THIS IS H TO H HUSKY
or whatever the frick he said
what happened to that gay?
I sorta dont belive the reason why he gave for deleting his channel. Bet his GF made him do it or some moronic social media manager. Still dude looks like the biggest tool alive so maybe he really is telling the truth and he cant comprehend why that might had been a rude move. Eh whatever im sure hes wealthy beyond measure and happier then me.
His wife got successful being a cooking celeb, stupidly so.
Funday Mondays ended.
hello grack
Korea time 2.0 was fun for a short while but it was never the same.
Millennials killed the rts, not zoomers.
nothing could ever beat orginal korea time, but korea time 2.0 was good fun.
There was just something about having to watch through GOMplayer at 3 in the morning that made it feel like you were watching something illegal, or that you were never meant to see
Felt like less of its own thing and more of the embers of an old fire.
It was fun but the most fun I had were running into some of Ganker's old bw players. That's one of the big differences I think between koreatime 1 and 2. Millenials that watched bw were also bw players, by the early 10's we'd already seen the transition start to watchers being more consumers only.
>Millennials killed it
They were also the only ones who ever gave a shit
>By far the best WC3 player in the world
>Starcraft 1 and 2 professional
>Arguable one of the top 3 best RTS players in the world
>tries to play Dota 2
>coached by like 10 of the best players in the world
>been playing for 8h each day for half a year now
>still at an average skill level
Care to explain this, RTS boomers? And no, age is not an excuse as most of the best Dota players is at his age.
>Arguable one of the top 3 best RTS players in the world
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
Yeah? He's the best WC3 player in the world which is the second most competitive RTS in the world and he was a Starcraft pro as well. Which other RTS player has this much experience and cred?
>By far the best WC3 player in the world
Not even close to the level of Moon. What kind of moronic fangay are you?
>grubby
>greatest at wc3
Grubby was 2nd best Warcraft III player, after Moon.
It really isn't the same skill set.
It's not but RTSgays routinely claim that it is much much much easier because "you only control 1 unit"
Mechanically it is easy.
>has never experienced a meta shift, since he started playing
>you watched him play, when he was still a noob, so you don't accept him as a pro player, who seems to just be effortlessly good at everything he does
>is old
It's more like millenials creating offshoots of the RTS genre. It evolved and lives on through her children. Games like Dota are basically an RTS with only a single unit. Games like Total War are RTS, which externalized base-building to a turn-based grand strategy map. Grand Strategy from paradox are types of games, which made that real-time again.
When I was a kid and I played Warcraft 3, I imagined I was playing Total War Warcraft. So naturally when the technology comes around to make that possible, millenials like me want this, instead of being slaves to nostalgia and only wanting to playing games with the same exact technical fidelity as when we were young,
>And no, age is not an excuse as most of the best Dota players is at his age.*
* and have been playing dota for 20,000+ more hours
Dota is not a skill based game, StarCraft and warcraft are. It's quite simple. A master of chess would also lose at dota because dota is again, not skill based
>me pick op point and click hero
>me win
It's embarrassing that dotards have tournaments and throw money at a bunch of clowns who just abuse what's broken during x patch and then have the gall to pretend their moron game is in any way comparable to real rts
Here comes the cope. Grubby despite being one of the best RTS players IN THE WORLD can't even climb to a good rank in Dota DESPITE spamming the single most OP stuff in the patch.
Explain this
>Explain this
He's older and has way less time to practice. Also it's a team game and not a 1vs1.
Most of the best Dota players are around his age
He SUCKS at the game and can't micro for shit. He tried to play some "hard micro" heroes and can't even see enemies 5m away from him.
>Most of the best Dota players are around his age
The point was that when he was good, he was younger. Most RTS players in Starcraft are great when they're young with very few exceptions.
Also you ignored the rest of my points. It's not a 1vs1 game.
Grubby also doesn't have the practice time like he did in Warcraft III. Streaming on Twitch is not equal to spending 10 hours a day practicing Orc vs Night Elf to beat Moon in a WCG.
>Also you ignored the rest of my points. It's not 1vs1 game.
What does that have to do with anything? skillful players have shown being able to consistently climb on any role and most heroes, not just OP meta of the patch.
He is just GOD awful at the game, he can see enemies units 5m in front of him and not even react. He sucks at microing.
I have less games played than him and I'm 5k mmr.
I'll just post it again since you ignored it?
Grubby also doesn't have the practice time like he did in Warcraft III. Streaming on Twitch is not equal to spending 10 hours a day practicing Orc vs Night Elf to beat Moon in a WCG.
>Grubby also doesn't have the practice time like he did in Warcraft III. Streaming on Twitch is not equal to spending 10 hours a day practicing Orc vs Night Elf to beat Moon in a WCG.
So? What does that have to do with anything? We're not talking about him becoming a pro at Dota 2. We're talking about one of the best RTS players in the world not even able to climb away from the average bracket in a game that plays kind of the same as a RTS game.
And he has been coached by the best players in the game, playing for 8h day, looking at countless replays and "analyzing" his gameplay.
He is the perfect example that RTS players are actually bad at games, because RTS is a "solved" genre where you play the same way each and every single match. Grubby can't take it out of his mind why he doesn't win despite him following the biggest meta builds and OP stuff, because RTS players can't do any actual thinking by themselves.
You're the one that started with naming his success in Warcraft III and asking why isn't he great in Dota.
What isn't clear to you about the guy streaming for his viewers 15 years past his prime isn't the same guy that practices 8~12 hours a day for weeks in one match up (Orc vs Night Elf) only vs other Night Elf pros to beat Moon in a WCG finals.
HE PRACTICES DOTA 8H PER DAY you moron. He plays the game, gets coached by the BEST players in the game, analyzes replies of the heroes he plays and looks up guides and what's meta.
Let's see you dominate with meepo first game you ever play with him, also, let's see you take an account up from 600 mmr to 3500+ in a few months?
Just a scrubby Black person talking shit about a white man behind his back.
>way less time to practice
hes been streaming it near daily for 6 months now. He's generally too passive in lane and too keen to farm when he's strong. The moment he wants to fight is the precise moment his allies are nowhere near. He doesnt recognize power spikes well yet and has some crucial decision making issues.
>afk farms 24/7 every single game no matter what the hero
>still have no idea about power spikes
>is so far up his own ass he never think he does anything wrong and always blame team mates
>even downloads replays only to blame his team mates
>only plays the single most OP and meta hero of the patch and still sucks at it
>haven't even touched any of the micro heavy heroes despite them being excellent to climb MMR with
>obsessed with gaining MMR it's actually sad to see
The only fun I have in Dota nowadays is too watch Grubby and see him seethe and fail
Micro-managing a single unit =/ Micro-managing an entire army
Different skill set, different game type.
But you don't really care, do you? You're not here to discuss anything, you're just here to troll and get free (you)s. Well here ya go I suppose.
he's climbing consistently though, so there's a reason to watch. It's too bad the micro multi unit heroes are heavily countered.
Weren't millennials the generation who transitioned away from RTSs and MOBAs became incredibly popular instead?
https://twitter.com/PlayStormgate/status/1625595072271249408
Does anyone have a link to the vid of someone raging and doing a BM SCV rush in a tourney? I was looking for it yesterday and couldn't fricking find it, assume it was Gred "Idra" Fields
I'm a boomer and I hate RTS.
KYLE IT'S A moron MAGNET
JIMMY NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
>CLICKY CLICKY CLICKY!
>MUH APM
>CLICKY CLICKY CLICKY!
>"Engaging"
Gee, I wonder why.
>tfw you will never drop storms so hard it makes pussies wet in the audience
but i do?
>try to get into bw
>bro you have to learn all these glitches and bugs to exploit :^)
>fgc has been ruined and sanitized
>the games themselves are awful now
>rts is completely dead with only moronic cartoonshit coming out
>no bants allowed
Fricking hell I hate this timeline
games are for brown people now
it's always how it was going to be
Don't think that's the case, because brown people like latamreys bant and are based
More like overly sensitive white twitter americans have taken over
When is ASL starting again?
TODAY
God knows when Tastosis will get around to translating though.
https://liquipedia.net/starcraft/AfreecaTV_StarCraft_League_Remastered/15
Oh that's great. Hopefully doesn't take Tastosis too long to get on it.
>got good at fighting games
>try to discuss high level issues
>Ganker is so casual they dismiss it as "lol u hate losing xD"
>even though I have gotten good
Ganker literally cannot comprehend moving past entry level
Only Black folk play fighting games
>be in rts thread
>make a lobby
>no one joins
Ganker does not play
try >>>/vm/ or even
It's 1am.
I miss KOTH. Meavis I'll fricking rek' you again, those helions were super fricking obvious.
t. stingray.
FOUR
INFESTOR
HIT SQUAD
Why dont zoomers like hitler? What the heck gamerbros? Why dont zoomers like to bully harass and rape millions of minprities gamerbroooooos.??
>zoom zooms wont co tinue the tradition of white supremacist mass murder brainwashing
i think we lost gamerbros....
What?
"Most of that army was halluc"
Is this a holocaust reference? Because well, duh! Of course zoomers are not going to be into your edgy manosphere bullshit.
I always just played custom games. I was addicted to playing shit like cat n mouse, lava run, battle of helms deep. SC2 didnt really have the community as much all anyone played at least when I played sc2 was that "war" game where both sides build buildings to spawn units that walk across the map. Modern RTS games dont really have custom game modes so they dont really interest me much beyond the single player campaign.
hi grack
Take me back
Anyone have "Apologize for playing that race"
>love the sc2 campaign
>no fren ever wanted to play coop with me
The games just aren't fun. If a match takes more than 5-10 minutes, then it's a shit game.
sc was peak esports
For the same reasons they don't like fighting games. They suck.
Nerve-wracking, yet boring. There are a shitload of options for attack and defense, but you're ultimately forced to learn how to initiate and counter with the same bullshit as everyone else. Takes a billion hours to learn all of the strategies and meta, yet high level players can be beat with cheesy noob bullshit (button mashing oddly timed jump moves, grab spam, etc.)
lol this, there are absolutely no design problems with fighting games they are perfect core-a said balance is for scrubs
Single player games with long playtimes (Stellaris, Rimworld, Kenshi) are better than micro intensive competitive clickfests.
i prefer it when RTS games have cool campaigns and i don't care for the PvP
i got gold in SC2 as zerg quite quickly but i gave up because it's just stressful and boring
campaigns are better
>i got gold in SC2 as zerg quite quickly but i gave up because it's just stressful and boring
>campaigns are better
I think thats the thing a lot of hardcore classic RTS players forget. Most people don't want to fricking 1v1 you in MP most players can't even handle the AI on high difficulties. Most RTS players lack the clicks per minute and the map awareness for MP and it gets reflected hard by the population of most newly release RTS's.
What someone need to do to seriously revive this genre is make a game that caters to the singleplayer side of things first before worrying about being the perfectly balanced MP game that all the Esports homosexuals cry for then dump when the next big thing comes out or the game starts to die.
this is the truth
rts needs to cater to casuals again and make fun campaigns (with brutal difficulty additions for experienced players), and then AND ONLY THEN start thinking about esportsBlack folk that form a minority of the playerbase
here's the thing, SC2 has those elements you are talking about right now. I think you can even Co-op to do the campaign together with a friend. This is in addition to the mutation co-op vs AI with random affix mode.
The simple fact is that people just want to control one unit and blame up to 4 other people for failures. RTS will never be big again.
>>>>>>>>>>>>high level players can be beaten by mashing
Surely you'd provide proof of such a moronic claim?
Meant for
>implying ill give that homosexual a you
Post proof of claim
2 lazy 2 look up the clip on youtube because I don't keep track of fighting game autist's online handles. Fighting games are broken af, look up the fight where the dude who plays with his mouth kicks some Black folk ass in SF. All the skill in the world wont save you from a guy who uses his tongue to play. Perhaps you should learn to >> properly before you call someone else moronic lmao
>uh you can totally beat pros by mashing
>i just have no proof because i just uh cant be bothered
Holy shit this is pathetic
>calls a man a moron
>forgets to >> his post
BOOTY SMACKARAX
Cabalbros... we couldn't even get one of ours into the finals, it was a TvT... what do we do now?
>thread entirely about esports e-celeb shit
>or scrubs complaining they got roflstomped
I wish there was a Ganker but for actual players
Remember the mothership core?
member pylon cannon
what, did they delete it at some point?
>JUSTICE HAS ARRIVED
>newbie doesn't understand deliberately not quoting
Summer never ends...
will he ever be meta again?
did anyone get bad gateway
yeah
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