Is Japan just l permanently stuck in 2010's fedora mode?
>In Xenoblade the game makes God out to be some egotistical manic and the game is all about Shulk wanting to kill him.
>In Persona 5 you summon Satan to shoot God in the head.
There are many more Jap games where they try to be le edgy with "God bad Satan good" but I don't want to list them all.
My question is what is Japan's deal?
"they are the seed of satan" "they are of their father, the devil"
The largest Christian cathedral in Asia was in Japan. Guess what happened to it?
It got nuked?
lel, church so bit it got nuked twice
It got turned into an arcade?
>In Xenoblade the game makes God out to be some egotistical manic
It's not THE God you dunce. 99% of the time it's never THE God. It's literally a Satan/Demiurge stand-in. Some tyrant who proclaims themselves God when they are the devil.
>makes God out to be some egotistical manic
Literally not Abrahamic God though, you dumbass
has it right.
You must be confused because that is the exact description of the abrahamic god
The party in games like SMT usually team up with Lucifer himself aka Satan and what the hell is a Demiurge?
Your religious knowledge is lacking.
Look up Gnosticism, Japan loves that shit
Even in SMT, the God you fight is only an aspect of a true omnipotent will painted by human cognition, and driven mad by that disparity. The main characters all exist under that will to act as the savior to decide the fate of the world. As does Lucifer incidentally who is himself another cog in the same machine (also a seperate character from Satan).
If I got it right, the Demiruge is basically a corrupter. While God made the perfect world, the Demiurge then twisted it into his own image, introducing all the bad shit into the world, and took credit for all of creation, demanding that only he be worshiped as the big guy in charge.
In SMT, I think even YHVH is the Demiurge, as V mentioned that he only usurped the throne that Baal and Ra had held as the chief gods in the past.
>If I got it right, the Demiruge is basically a corrupter. While God made the perfect world, the Demiurge then twisted it into his own image
Is that how it is in SMT? Because that's not the gnostic story.
Haven't played the games and just clicked on the thread out of curiosity.
So the Demiurge is a benevolent being who only desires for humans to transcend and reach God? Sounds like he's actually a pretty good guy compared to SMT's interpretation.
obligatory
This is also 1:1 the creation myth in the Elder Scrolls.
SMT is a everything and the kitchen sink sort of approach to religion and myth (with a helping of Jungian Collective Unconscious which has its own thoughts on it). In it you have YHVH, Yaldabaoth and The Demiurge as seperate characters who are simultaneously the same. And all of them act apart from a true higher existence, but are also supposed to be an avatar to it. Their mom also runs the church that makes your demons fusions for you.
Sophia runs the Cathedral of Shadows in one of these games?
SMT5 yeah
That’s sick. I like her. Do you get to pal around with Jesus in any SMT games? I know he shows up in Xenosaga.
Technically you play as the next coming of Jesus in Persona 3. You even sacrifice yourself to save everyone, and your ultimate Persona is "Messiah".
Obviously they can't directly depict Jesus so it's all kept vague but it's kinda obvious.
>Persona 3
>THIRD coming of Jesus
Would Ikutsuki be Judas in that case? He betrays you and literally tries to crucify you.
Reminder that there are thirteen Persona Users in P3. Putting aside the protagonist who's the Jesus allegory, there remains twelve other Persona Users. Twelve Disciples. Three of them ended up not siding with the protagonist though, and one even attempted to become a false prophet.
I would probably convert to Christianity if this wasn’t considered heretical.
bruh spoilers! sheesh!
You can also end up becoming the new Messiah in Devil Survivor, if you go the appropriate route. That game went surprisingly wild.
SMT games might not be knowingly Gnostic interpretations but they basically are. While YHVH is presented as the Christian God, the character in the series acts like a Gnostic god, someone who separates humans from their in-borne divinity. You can tell because the SMT series also has this idea of the Axiom or Universal Will, which gives humans unique power over demons and gods. That's a dead ringer for the Gnostic idea of the Monad, the in-borne divinity of humans trapped in a fundamentally fallen and evil realm where "lower powers" use illusion to trick them into staying trapped. A more classical Christian interpretation would imply that humanity are fallen, and have fallen due to their distance from God and perfection. This distance is another way of describing sin. But the fundamental difference in theological thought is fallen world VS fallen people. The Gnostic God created the world to imprison sparks of the divine, whereas the Christian God created the a good world for humanity to inhabit, though the reasons behind this is a central mystery of the faith.
The Gnostic demiurge traps humans in the material world where their divine spark is unable to reunite with God unless they achieve enlightenment, he didn't do it out of malevolence but he is an imperfect being playing at God. Other interpretations of the Demiurge have him as something akin to an architect who constructed the material world so that humans could see the true form of things from the crude imitation and basically achieve the same thing.
>Lucifer himself aka Satan
Lucifer isn't Satan.
Lorelet Black person.
This. If OP had played Xenoblade he'd know the "God" was just some human scientist who became a higher being.
This. In Xenoblade """god""" was literally some egomaniacal scientist from Earth. In Persona 5 it's Yaldabaoth, essentially the Demiurge. Even in games like SMT4 Apocalypse where you're fighting literal YHVH, the character is way closer to a gnostic God than a Christian interpretation.
>first game has “a” god that fights with another god
>the god is clearly fricking nuts and wants to devour everything
>in 2 “god” is a scientist trying to make amends for his sins
In 2 he's not a god, but the Architect.
Architects have a plan, have a map, an schematic.
But they, often, don't act upon what they've preordained. Meaning that he's not even a god, just a Creator. Or at the very least, a Renewer. (capital leters in the words are to point out that those are archetypes)
>Architect
Shit localization
What is the original?
I like it quite a lot
God
they call him kamisama in japanese. architect is localslop
I see...
Dunno, I think Architect sounds better, or makes more sense, for what Klaus actually is in Xenoblade 2.
And in a sense, Kami-sama being "The One Above All", taking out the christian influence of the word, could very well mean just his position above all of Alrest. Which is also fitting.
But that can be an strech.
That's one ending. The other YHWH just ceases to be, and the world is freed from his influence. Then the Axion is able to act upon that world again.
Isn’t that a localization quirk? He’s called god in nip.
>Isn’t that a localization quirk?
It's called: "let's not upset US soccer-moms"
No one cares what soccer moms think anymore unless those soccer moms are the ones trying to transition their children.
The real kino is that it's the same guy whose just gone through two completely opposite results simultaneously. In 1 his perspective is that his experiment is a success, in 2 he sees things from the other side and sees just how much of a failure it was.
It doesn't take a genius to realize that the abrahamic religions are the embodiment of evil. The world would be a much better place if the religions were wiped from existence.
Easy end game boss material since some kind of powerful entity is often the villain and what's more powerful than a god
Though it isn't capital G God, just a god
You are an idiot.
But it's always funny to see how gays like you view their religion in every negative depiction of religion in media.
I bet you also belief stories like shield hero are "anti religion" because they have evil popes.
>But it's always funny to see how gays like you view their religion in every negative depiction of religion in media.
Underrated post right here.
Hits the fricking nail on the head.
>Yaldabaoth
>God
>Satanael
>Satan
Lol, LMAO even.
>Getting upset about a god getting killed.
>Can't even distinguish between a real god and a fake.
In Persona 5 you kill the DEMI-URGE, literally YALDABAOTH the FALSE GOD who is claiming to be the real one. He was created by humans a year ago. You fricking moron.
Christgays posting just can’t tell the difference between the two.
Isn't the boss in base Persona 5 the literal Demiurge?
Also, Zanza is an analog to the Demiurge also. Quite in fact, Xenoblade 1 is basically a modern retelling of the gnostic lore. Complete with the fake world (the pocket dimension where Xenoblade 1 takes place), and the MONADo being something from OUTSIDE the fake world that has power over it.
>MONADo
Can't believe I didn't make that distinction.
Yeah, had to have someone pointing that out to me too.
It helps if you say the word "Monad" in a Japanese accent, where they'd render it as mo-nah-doh
But a monad is just a monoid in the category of endofunctors, right?
The only two games that I know where you can fight actual God, or at least, YHWH is Shin Megami Tensei II and Shin Megami Tensei 4A. The latter you actually beat him, not to send him to a dormant state, but bringing down from a level of God to a level of god, the tribal god of war from the early israelites.
But the Axiom is shown to be God, capital G and all. The Logos, the Ordainer.
SMT 4 apocalypse is weird... You kill YHWH because big yellow head bad then you help you help Dagda that wants to become "wind" to kill all your friends and after you become an edgy serial killer entity then you become the new God... Was YHWH really that bad compared to the MC? Making a new world with a serial killer teenager doesn't sound like a good thing.
>He fell for the green man's lies
His fate should be a brainwashed husk because he was a fedoratipping edgelord and he wanted me to kill my dog.
Frick him.
It's not God, you rube, its the Demiurge. 100% of the time. Often times proper God is a character in these games helping you take the self-proclaimed God out. Hell in Pic related you have Alvis who is the computer interface to actual God giving you the same power to put Zanza down. Zanza himself is revealed to be just a man playing with forces way beyond his reckoning and proclaiming himself to be divine when he was rewarded with such an awesome power.
*Ahem*
FRICK DINOSAURS
FRICK ROMN
FRICK KRAKENS
FRICK THE WARDENS
AND FRICK THE CONCEPT OF EVOLUTION ITSELF
WORLD DESTROYED, PEACE OUT
>This wakes up the truest goddess of the world.
>She decides to remake the world and have Adol's dino girl become the goddess of evolution.
>Peaces out and goes back to sleep.
>Goddess now sleeps even deeper so reality doesn't crumble.
>Would've ended all life as we know it if he didn't luck into the fact the world is just the fabrication of some woman
What are the odds.
My problem with Zanza isn't that he is a God or anything like that is that the game makes him act like a dick then when you kill him then Alvis say hey bro he was just lonely... Frick you. The truth is Zanza was literally half of Klaus's brain so he was in permanent schizo mode.
Because anyone can become a god in asian religions, including you.
In many cases like the ones you listed the Japanese are pulling from an ancient belief called Gnosticism. They are actually pretty based in certain regards. If you want to know go to ask around on /x/.
Black person try playing the games you're talking about.
In both games, the God you kill is a pretender to the throne who does nothing good or godly. Persona 5 literally has you killing the fricking Demiurge— if you equate that with the Christian God you're edgier than the game.
You will never be a real god.
>Why doesn't the far-eastern Asian country view religion, gods/God/deities, and spirituality the same way I do?! It's so cringe!
You wrote this post when you could have been helping us fell Gods, OP. For shame.
Zanza isn't a God in the traditional sense, no more so than Jenova in FFVII, or Yu Yevon in FFX. Shinto's founding myth is about the casting away of comfortable illusion, because sometimes, what you think is God is something outright monstrous, and what you think is ultimate evil is something you've misunderstood. I'm pretty sure persona 3(?) even makes a reference to Izanami, and Auron's monologue against Yunalesca is a direct parallel with the story. Izanagi goes to the city of the dead, and discovers what has become of his sister/wife.
Can you actually play the game instead of shit posting on Ganker? That "God" is a fricking human scientist and also the other human scientist "Goddess" is seen as benevolent. Stop trying to force this le kill God jrpgs may may bs
*yawn* meh we need some different messages in games huh? God good corporations good society great, that's what the people want!!!! Work hard for the system!!!!!!
God good would actually be an extremely unusual message for a video game, though. I'm struggling to think of one with such a message, aside from The Neverhood which was basically just a video game version of the Bible.
I would say most Dragon Quest games have that message considering the Church and its people are all good guys who help you on your journey
>I'm struggling to think of one with such a message
FAITH: The Unholy Trilogy
They're both 2010s games, Black person.
christianity to japan is an occult interest rather than a genuine faith.
>ignore Xenoblade 2
>Is Japan just permanently stuck in 2010's fedora mode???
I feel like it's worth mentioning that OP said Japan was stuck in "2010s fedora mode" while posting a game that literally came out in August 2010.
>christcuck cant tell the difference between a real god and a fake one
>throws a tantrum on an imageposting board because of it
you deserve games where the real god is killed.
I for one like being a slave I hope our society never changes. I hope we just keep on like this.
Is mainline SMT the only game where you actually do fight God? And in SMT4A I think it was retconned that YHVH is the demi-urge after all.
Even in 2 YHVH and the Great Will are not the same. Actually I would say Brahman is more like fighting against God, but in that case it's also fighting against yourself.
>>In Persona 5 you summon Satan to shoot God in the head.
Yaldabaoth is the Demiurge you illiterate fricking chimp
The reason Japan is "still like this" is because they can usually trust their target audience to have a literacy level above the 2nd grade, but you manage to fail even that
I think the entire globe's competency and awareness has been dropping hard the last decade or two.
Do you really think the average Jap is familiar with Gnosticism? They just won't care if they think it's based off Christianity because they aren't Christian.
I think the average Jap is educated enough to know that the name "Yaldabaoth" is not generally associated with Christianity. For that matter most other people are too, but OP is a special flavor of Black person.
Do you think the average Jap is playing these games? Do you also think Japanese gamers wouldn't do some cursory research into a topic to get the gist of Gnosticism like we do in the west?
See
They're familiar with the names and think they sound cool. Names like Azazel, Asmodeus, Goetia, Valac, Lucifer, and so on are popular. They love the "devil aesthetic" and use it a lot in their games and media.
Xenoblade X even has an enemy named Goetia.
Monotheistic gods are seen as evil in polytheistic societies.
They're evil anyway.
Democracy vs Dictatorship
Dawkins would shit in your local preachers mouth if it was backed by scientific research.
I miss when we could be Atheist and it was considered normal. Fricking hate Reddit for making it cancerous.
Japan loves Gnosticism. One of the most popular manga right now is a story about a neglected teenage boy being bought by a devil and brought into hell to live alongside the demons of the Ars Goetia.
god she is just the cutest
Fellow Clara enjoyer. I want to bully her for her tiny angel wings.
>Fedora
You type like you're stuck in the 2010's yourself
It is very amusing to me that so many Japanese video games, anime and manga depicts the western mystery tradition so faithfully and unashamedly.
>western
I mean, relatively yeah but it mostly started here.
God is dead.
I want to kill God
God transcends life and death.
It was ME, I killed him
Xenoblade Chronicles; June 10, 2010
You Christcucks think all Japanese devs are out to genocide you when the real reason they always have the player kill God is that nips are garbage at writing small scale stories that don’t involve upping the powerscale to ridiculous levels to make the audience soiface ala Dragon Ball.
Why are Christcucks always looking to be upset? Why do they come off like temporarily embarassed mortals?
Because they’re Christcucks first and Christians second. Shit makes me so fricking mad, anon.
Play Xb2
no shit he's thankful his god made catgirls real and gave him a harem
XB2 is the worst Xenoblade. Play XBX instead.
>Play X instead
NTA but tatsu food jokes and a no ending game is a lot better than gacha shit right...
As a man who has played both X and 2, yes X is superior. 2 is absolute shit. There's nothing redeemable about the game.
Personally i think it's the best one, good cast, the best villains by far, the conflicts and shit involving war trades and blades were interesting, the world is fun to explore and the chapter 10 reveals/explanations were amazing
>Is Japan just l permanently stuck in 2010's fedora mode?
that's a game from 2010....
>I judge a whole nation based on the video games I play
moron line starts on the left, OP.
The one single solitary good thing about jap games is that they make christcucks seethe
Yes, god is an evil butthole, deal with it
>"god loves everyone! you're going to heaven, and you're going to heaven! everyone's going to heaven!"
>meanwhile romans 9:22 exists
Because it’s kino and they do it fricking well.
>Is Japan just l permanently stuck in 2010's fedora mode?
Better than that what we get from "progressive" west
>In Xenoblade the game makes God out to be some egotistical manic and the game is all about Shulk wanting to kill him.
It was self made usurper that used artifact to have godlike powers
The train of thought goes from "things sure do suck, I should do something about it" to "so why do things suck, I should fix that" to "so in order to change the way things are I have to fight the personification of reality"
Skipping over a couple of layers of abstraction and "it is what it is" to get to this point. In SMTIV you have to kill whatever ur-Deity is on your alignment path in order to stop whatever's going on that's bad (eating people, mind control)
I always thought it was because the Japanese hated the fact that the Christian or Catholic? Missionaries came over to their land. And it's been deeply ingrained somehow.
Think about Odin and Zeus for a moment. That's how normal people feel about your god. Neat story but that's all it is.
A couple things to note:
1. You will never see a game anywhere in the entire world shitting on moohammed or the muslim god. Ask yourself why?
2. You will notice that the posters and individuals in these threads never attack judaism or the israeli god, despite the fact that Why Hecht Vee Hecht is a israeli concept of god primarily. Ask yourself why this is.
>1. MUH MUSLIMS!
because goat frickers dont go into image boards or meme apps and preach where people just want to be left to their own
>2. MUH JOOS!!!!
everybody knows the israelites dont worship a god, they worship money.
and everybody knows the israelites are the bad guys, they just dont want to think about it because surprise surprise, people come to these places to not think about the real world.
(you) on the other hand come to places primarily focused on forgetting the woes of the real world, and try to spread the woes of the real world.
that is why people express hate for christianity more than other religions.
tl;dr: frick off and go preach in front of a church.
I love making fun of muslims, wtf are you talking about
yeah what the frick that one guy making fun of Muhammad for being an autistic desert bandit gets posted all the time
Shut up, israelite. Whatever moron god israelites worship belongs in the trash with the rest of them.
because goatfrickers aren't relevant you christisraelite moron.
In Xenoblade 2 you meet god and thank him
God is a stand-in for nature and the natural order. These games typically portray a world in which the world is bleak and depressing, being oppressed by some natural force, which is personified as a God or godlike entity. The protags defeat this natural order by defeating the god that represents it. It has nothing to do with Christianity. It is entirely based on the 4 types of story conflicts, Man vs Man, Man vs self, Man vs society, and Man vs nature.
>god god god god
god is just a buzzword used by people who dont play jrpgs so they can make their epic reddit OMG LE JRPG LE KILL LE GOOD LE RELIGION BAD memes. just call him zanzar or clause or whatever the frick he was called in xc1. killing "a god" is a lot different than "killing God (pbuh)"
You're not fighting god because "religion bad", you're fighting a "god" as representative of the fricked up systems of the world.
Xenoblade 1 and P5 are just simple underdog stories about people fighting against the world's natural order that fricks them in the ass, and a god/god-like figure is the one trying to maintain the fricked up system.
Even when SMT makes it clear as day with Angels being law aligned, homosexuals like still can't see the metaphor.
>Japan is stuck in 2010s
>see, here's a game from 2010 as an example
If you haven’t played already, you would probably like Dragon Quest, very positive outlook on religion and God. You even talk to a priest to save. Only problem is that their God is a goddess, very gay.
Nothing gayer than women, huh?
yes women are very gay, 90% of them are either full on gay or bi, and they spearhead lib movements. God is masculine.
>>In Xenoblade the game makes God out to be some egotistical manic and the game is all about Shulk wanting to kill him.
Zanza IS an egotistical maniac, and he's not even the Abrahamic God, he's just some guy that made his own universe, so calm down
XC1 wasn't a god, it was literally just some dude that gained a lot of power.
P5 was entirely themed around rebellion. Lucifer/Satan is VERY thematically related in this sense.
This is happening over and over again as Japan see's the atrocities the U.S will cause in the name of god or some other silly shit.
and I don't just mean the country and it's government. I'm also talking about all the Christian Trumptards making the rest of us look like knuckle dragging morons.
>a god
>not the god, or just god
Drop the victim complex, it's not about your god
Japan thinks Gnosticism is cool.
Persona 5 is based loosely on gnostic ideas which are pretty bad but the gist is that Yaldawhoever is not the ‘true God’, hes the demiurge. Some gnostics claimed Yahweh was the demiurge and Christs revelation was meant to reveal the true God above him. Its blasphemy but its not as simple as just saying Satan good God bad. The worst part is the attempt to make Satan out to have been acting in our interest during the ‘fall’. Hence Satanael, he retains his angelic suffix. Anyways yeah Japan is still kind of fricked up about Christianity, but at least its mostly because theyve never been Christian - the wests post-Christianity is much worse