Are data hoarders right to refuse to release roms of games that are abandonware and aren't available publicly?
Are data hoarders right to refuse to release roms of games that are abandonware and aren't available publicly?
Are data hoarders right to refuse to release roms of games that are abandonware and aren't available publicly?
Well what's the point of preserving it if it isn't accessible to anyone? It might as well not even exist, just destroy it.
This is the main point. It isn't "preserved" if you're the only one who has a copy, because there's no way to ensure that it will remain existent. You could lose it, destroy it, it could be stolen, etc. Preservation of digital content entails spreading it. So if you want to be a collector and keep it to yourself, that's your right, you bought the thing. But don't tell anyone you're "preserving" it, because you're not.
I thought of an analogy with physical collectibles. Take some famous painting for example. There only exists one, likely in a museum somewhere. The museum is preserving the physical entity of the painting, but not the image itself. What if the museum burns down and the physical painting is lost forever? Its image can be preserved by photos, which have been distributed throughout the world through many years. The physical entity may be gone but anyone can still see what the painting was. So it is preserved not just physically but in a more protected way that can survive physical loss or destruction. It's not quite the same thing, of course, but I think this is close enough to illustrate the issue.
these homosexuals just use "preservation" as a shield for their hoarding
>mfw some random neighbors start protesting in front of my house for pickling eggs and not sharing
Eggs are non-ephemeral (comparatively), entirely interchangeable, and also strictly physical. The code and assets of a game have some very different properties and conditions, though there's ownership rights, they are also more.
You cannot reprint and redistribute an egg that once was, one consumed or perished it has passed, but the egg is easily replaced with a new one which has the same properties.
The preservation of a videogame is like the preservation of a book or a film. Can you imagine if the ownership of the James Bond rights changed hands, and the new owners make new films, but then refuse to continue distributing new copies of the old films? Hell, imagine if they didn't do anything with the IP at all, and just bought it so they could remove it from the market so they didn't have to compete with it with their own product (something you actually see happen with physical goods).
If the legal owners want compensation for their property, fine, but then they should put at least minimal effort into distribution as well. They may have the legal right to just lock stuff away and ignore it, but they can't realistically expect people to settle for that either.
It was just a joke anon.
Sorry.
twas a good post regardless
Abandonware is as real a thing as being allowed to download roms if you delete them after 24 hours. It's just an excuse people found to claim they can upload other people's stuff online.
No you homosexual.
Abandonware is supposed to apply when the companies are basically fricking dead and no one gives a shit about the rights or about re-releasing the game.
Nah, abandonware means the company is dead and the rights are in limbo so in theory no one is capable of suing you.
No.
Yes. Frick vidya gaymers
Something digital isn't really preserved until a lot of people have it, also its depriving people from enjoying it for no reason. So no there is nothing "right" about it and it's pretty uniquely pathetic. I always wonder what exactly the mindset of someone like this is and I can only imagine it's someone desperate to find meaning and value in their sad, depressing existence.
That said it is kind of funny to be that much of an butthole.
If they release digital copies of this kind of stuff, the resell value of the original plummets. It's that simple. There might be some ego involved too but money is usually the top reason.
Something like this doesn't strike me as something that would have a particularly stable value in the first place. The actual market for it has got to be incredibly small. Two "collectors" die of blood clots/cardiac episodes and whoops nobody is even around who cares about your shit and has the means to buy it anymore
>Something like this doesn't strike me as something that would have a particularly stable value in the first place
They can only sell it once and you only need 2 other collector autists/preservation guys to get in a bidding war on it for its value to grow quickly. The market isn't huge for this one in particular sure but it doesn't need to be to be worth money.
Some collectors who have this stuff might not be interested in selling it but there's no sense in harming its value when you might change your mind in 15 years or something.
>If they release digital copies of this kind of stuff, the resell value of the original plummets
it doesn't because collectors will always be collectors and pay top dollar to have the physical item
The mountains of cash people throw at games that have been easily emulatable for years proves this is a load of shit. It's 100% a bragging rights thing.
I agree with the image you quoted. First of all it often costs a lot of effort and money to buy this stuff and when you do, there is a screeching crowd demanding you dump it for free (again at your own time, cost and risk), at which point whatever you dumped will get printed on to carts and discs and sold by Chinese eBay sellers. Video game fans also feel entitled to every development version of released or cancelled games. Who says the people who made those games ever wanted unfinished versions of their own work out? People who read books don’t wail and cry that unpublished drafts aren’t leaked by those who have them.
Frank cifaldi is a scumbag and a scam artist for other reasons
>pretending it's not you in the OP picture
>Frank cifaldi is a scumbag and a scam artist for other reasons
What did he do exactly.
I heard he beat his girlfriend once. Not sure if true, but since he's friend with fellow spousal abuser Zoe Quinn on Twitter, it doesn't seem to be out of character.
Has withheld protos (that other people bought and entrusted him to dump) for long periods of time just to promote his gay new website that no one would visit or care about otherwise.
*just to use them to promote his gay new website
Are there any children around?
You sound like a massive cuck. Of course the people that made the games dont want unfinished versions to get leaked. This is irrelevant to preserving historic data.
>there is a screeching crowd demanding you dump it for free
not an issue if youre not showing it off so people suck your virtual wiener. they want the attention
>abandonware
no such thing. copyrights are still retained for decades.
>aren't available publicly
doesn't change anything. if the ownership rights can't be ascertained then any claim of "ownership" is dubious at best.
> he thinks someone is going to pirate a broken demo for profit
moronic fricking morons such as above ^- would love to believe that if they bought a demo from ebay that's "rare", or whatever fantasy shit they can make up, then they somehow also own the rights to copy it to people.
> Who says the people who made those games ever wanted unfinished versions of their own work out?
meanwhile people like yourself think it's perfectly fine to sell such discs to cash in on how rare it might be, despite incredibly questionable and shady chain of ownership.
"Abandonware" is more of a "de facto" law term.
It doesn't matter what is on paper contract "de jure" when there is no party to file suit.
But agree, it's either greed or nonsense to not release it.
>""preserved""
>if the person dies there's a risk it will never make it out of their vault
>backups can fail
nice fricking preservation butthole
Who cares. No one wants to play a demo. Let it die.
The only reason to do this is to increase its resell value. I don't doubt he has it safely stored and backed up but its still not preserved until its spread around.
I'm not saying they should be forced to release this kind of stuff, but don't sit there and fricking say you're doing everything for its preservation. It's blatantly obvious these collectors care about the dollar value just as much if not more than its value as video game history or whatever.
Funny how nobody ever gets angry at the guy at the publisher or dev for clinging on to the game, not leaking it but instead selling it to a collector. Do you know how these things end up in the hands of someone who refuses to dump them to protect value? Someone who retained access to something they shouldn’t have sold it to that guy. It sometimes takes years of networking online to get the trust of a former dev and the thousands to get them to part with the game
>Funny how nobody ever gets angry at the guy at the publisher or dev
If people knew who they were they probably would
The Acorn Archimedes community is notorious for this.
Some of this software is approaching 40 years old, and many still refuse to release the roms because "muh copyright".
I doubt any of the programmers for these games depend purely on these titles for their bread and butter.
Preserving old data isn't a fricking "scam" what the frick who wrote the OP? Holy shit what a dumbass.
Well yeah and no. Actual preservation isn't but most "preservation" groups like Cifaldis are. It's not even clear if they're backing up anything and all they've done is drum up hype for terrible remakes and brag about le game secrets.
The only ones I trust are the people who dump and arguably the frenchie who works with jp collectors to preserve dying doujin media. (and only because jps are super-hostile over pirates/copyright and jp collectors doubly so)
The Game Preservation Society is as cancerous as the Video Game History Foundation, even more so, because they haven't released literally nothing to the public.
The problem is that they're massive copyright cucks. What's the point of all this shit if it will only release in like 80 years when nobody alive will give a shit
This, they are just storefronts for more of the "usual suspects" destructive behaviour that has ruined our community
It's gay and not respectable, but understandable in that greed and autism are two very powerful forces.
>free shit
yeah what a killer gaming experience you'll get from a 20+ yo tech demo, these greedy gamers just don't want to pay for a good product, since they would otherwise be playing castlevania resurrection obsessively and all obviously. Log in on discord all the boys are already on Castlevania Resurrection, or as the kids call it "Res". It's the new drug in town, everybody wants a piece of it.
That’s another good point. People only give a shit about this stuff when they can’t have it. Then once it’s released it’s on to the next thing. Sure some autists will comb over every detail and catalog and speculate on it. But the vast majority of the foaming at the mouth is just demanding the right to have access to a 20 year old demo without any intention of playing it.
A lot of these people are only in it for their brand loyalty. No-Intro finally started adding homebrew in May, but that wasn't until after tons of free betas and v1.0's already dropped off the internet. Most of these types don't really care that much about putting effort into preservation of busted shit, whether it's good or not, unless some moron in a corporate suit made it.
Right. There are all these people that want to “preserve history” when it comes to major publishers like Nintendo or Konami but none of these “historians” care about saving shareware games from 1995.
If those games were any good, they would be preserved.
You missed the point completely. There could be a shareware masterpiece that would be lost to time in favor of the most unplayable fragment of the worst game ever as long as it contained mario, or Zelda, or Metroid etc
Nta but it also depends on the console. I mean all the games for the big boys will preserved but i see what you mean. Some lesser known title on windows 95 or something might not be and it might even be a actually decent game over some random ass castlevania level
>none of these “historians” care about saving shareware games from 1995.
https://archive.org/details/cdbbsarchive
Redump takes covermount and shareware CDs, for example. I know I contributed one I had.
>none of these “historians” care about saving shareware games
not true. also why are you calling ROM dumpers "historians", are you a homosexual?
>but none of these “historians” care about saving shareware games from 1995
/vr/'s resident compulsive liars, everyone.
But that Castlevania demo did leak?
I wrote that post. Interesting to see it popping up from time to time, it always seems to get a lot of replies. Last time i saw it was on Ganker and it got like 400 replies pretty fast. It's obviously a topic a lot of people are passionate about. And there are a lot of legal implications that you idiots aren't even considering.
Yeah it did after a couple of days
Yeah probably. But you don't have the right to someone elses IP.
>Well what's the point of preserving it if it isn't accessible to anyone?
No. It can be backed up securely. It can be shown to people if and when they wish to see it. But it doesn't mean you get a free copy of it.
You can just tell he has a load of CP hidden somewhere.
That was me. Gday c**t 🙂 Glad you're still upset.
>LeGaL iMpLiCaTiOnS
What are those implications? The fact that you are in possession of something that was never intended for >you is already illegal. Your whole morality argument doesn't hold up.
It's legal in Russia
As part of Russian counter-sactions, the ministry of culture stopped enforcing the intellectual property of unfriendly countries
>i saw some talking points i didn't understand and shared my hot take about it on a website i'm not old enough to be on
Many such cases
You sound mad. Bet you were ready to be like, "nu-huh they actually signed the international agree-" but sadly for you that doesn't matter anymore.
>i am mad. i were like "nu-huh blah blah blah"
No one gives a shit about your /misc/ hot take commie baby. Frick off back to whatever shithole you crawled into from.
It's legal in Russia
sauce?
https://lenta.ru/news/2022/03/05/rutracker/
So none. kwab
I accept your concession. Glad we agree it's legal in Russia.
only non-russian content, you dumbfrick communist. the russian government are still very active at taking down pirates of russian content.
Anyone fricking needs any russian content aside from Space Rangers and several old soviet movies?
There's definitely very little Russian content made by Russian hands that people know of outside of ROM hacks/bootlegs, homebrew for old computers & Tetris since their only NES was the Dendy which was a pirate console. Russia has made and translated like 0.1% of the video games in the world under any official and legal standing. Whatever they're cracking down on is very little of that made by Europe, Murica, South America, South Korea, China & Nipland; the primary 99% of the industry that actually matters. Whatever is made by Russia, Saudi Arabia, Israel & Africa is practically nothing, and is largely limited to obscure Windows & smartphone shit these days. Naturally, no legal body in Pakistan is going to care that you pirated some Russian shit, either.
https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2022/06/nintendo-is-suing-the-fashion-retailer-that-used-to-run-its-russian-store
lol
https://torrentfreak.com/russia-anti-piracy-agreement-renews-moves-towards-expansion-210128/
You're a dipshit, and you should have a nice day as soon as possible.
If congress passed a law saying it was illegal to watch videos that did not contain an naked orgasming child, would you just go along with it because of the "legal implications"?
I think some kind of detailed report on it should be released. That way we can get an idea of what the thing being preserved is like.
This elitist onions chugger's life has now been given validation. Attention whoring his refusal to publicly release the thing is the whole reason anyone knows it exists in the first place. Bet you this useless homosexual wouldn't hesitate to destroy the digital copy of the demo if he got C&D'd by Capcom.
>C&D'd by Capcom
Why would Capcom care about a game being shared that they had no involvement in making?
The link to the download is literally in the first Google result for Castlevania Resurrection.
"frick you it's mine"
There is no argument against this. If you want a copy too, buy one yourself, simple as that.
>preserved it so it won't be lost
>not released
It might as well not have been found and succumbed to disc rot. The outcome would have been the same.
>b-but it's backed up on a single hard drive that only one person ever can access!
>NO YOU CAN'T SEE IT THAT WOULD BE PIRACY!
>>NO YOU CAN'T SEE IT THAT WOULD BE PIRACY!
>it's piracy when shared
>but I'm not breaking the law by owning something that I don't own and isn't actually even mine since I can't buy it even if I pay for it to some 3rd party who didn't own it either
>>But I'm not breaking the law...
Yes I am. Who cares.
That was the point, yes.
This.
Piracy moralgays are mentally ill. Being a moralgay is already autismo, doubling down on it by being a moralgay over something that shouldn't even be considered wrong 99% of the time is just flat out mental moronation.
The sooner you realize that next to the "usual suspects", the biggest culprist of video game destruction and vandalism are the japanese themselves.
Still blows my mind Konami lost the source code to the Silent hill games which are relatively new.
Which frickup was that one?, the 2011 disasters?, konami being konami?, japanese autismo PIRASHY BADDO? just stupidity?
That's actually not that uncommon.
>go thru a box of old shit from a studio
>OMG I FOUND RARE SOURCE CODE / UNLREALEASED CODE
>"LOL NO I WON'T RELEASE IT LMAO"
Sure they might have paid for it and the seller though it's just another DVD copy of Terminator 3, doesn't make it theirs (or ours) and still a scumbag for not releasing it.
What risk? We have had this shit a dozen times, with people saying "make a copy and leave it on the park bench, I'll pick it up and share it, you're legally out of the question and don't have to worry" but the answer is always "no"
The industry person who shouldn’t have the build takes a risk holding it. Then selling it. The buyer takes a risk of getting scammed. Both parties take a risk of repercussions when dumped. Sometimes the list of people who could ever have had access to the thing originally is very small. Sometimes they still work in the industry.
Okay, say your park bench swap is enough to cover asses. What about the ten grand the industry person illicitly received from the buyer? For selling other peoples work? If the buyer wants to crowdfund the dump then fine. If they don’t then the real answer is they should shut up about even having the thing.
How is this related to cases where the person just found it in a pile of trash or bulk sale where nobody even know it was part of? Nobody even knows your name, how are you at risk?
It wouldn’t be, but you are imagining a very specific unlikely scenario when in most cases the story goes how I told it.
No, most cases is literally
or a ex developer who still had a copy nobody knew about anyways. In either way you can distribute anonymously without any risk.
>The industry person who shouldn’t have the build takes a risk holding it
So what you're saying is that you stole your "collectors items" and are taking on a considerable risk for what you call "childrens toys"?
By virtue of what unreleased games and protons are, these are always stolen in some way if they end up in the hands of an individual, yes. Dev kits usually were supposed to be sent back to the hardware manufacturer. Protos should have been disposed of per company policy or retained by the company, not smuggled out by employees. This is obvious, what are you questioning here?
I was just surprised that you are willing to put yourself into a risky situation over something you yourself basically called trash. But hey, you do you, I guess some people just like trash
If you're "preserving" something without allowing others to access it, you're not preserving, you're collecting/hoarding.
The point of data preservation is to allow people to experience things they would never have the chance to had it not been preserved.
If you use the internet, you have a duty to upload anything you have for free that isn't available already. I just recently put up my old copy of a Tifa porn game because I noticed that the most up-to-date version wasn't anywhere online and I had a copy, so I did my service to the internet.
post the link homie
or tell us how to find it
It's on f95zone. The Tifa 20 years old flash game. My post is on the last page, 2 zippyshare links.
Hoarding is a mental disorder.
Look up the clinical definition of hoarding then. It’s accumulating useless objects to the detriment of your well-being with the delusion you one day might find them useful. Demanding permanent access to every unreleased sega Dreamcast demo seems like hoarding to me. Buying a demo and not sharing it is just collecting.
Collecting treasures like some sort of dragon.
Yeah, maybe. It's not very considerate toward the people who would like to play or see the game. But "hoarding" isn't about "not sharing," it's about a fear of losing something disproportionate to its actual value or use, so getting enraged about not having every single beta or proto on tap seems like more of a "hoarding" mentality.
Not sharing it in hopes it increases in value is hoarding mentality. Preservation is about, well, preserving it. Your family is just going to see it as some old childish games Grandpa never let go of and toss it in the trash when you die.
Treasure implies it's valued by more than a few people.
Holy shit game collectors BTFO
As somebody that lost my drive and my backup drive in a freak accident, people who don’t share the data that is important to them could be really sorry. I lost those Ghost94 games (good luck for even finding a download for those any more), a bunch of old /x/ related games, my complete collection of Japanese pc98 games, and various art that I would reference regularly that the artist has since gone scorched earth and it has all been lost.
Now I share my stuff freely just in case I ever need it again. Sharing is self preservation.
You can still get these:
https://oldgamebox.tistory.com/13141
https://oldgamebox.tistory.com/13142
https://oldgamebox.tistory.com/13143
An I had a copy of Ghost93:
https://www117.zippyshare.com/v/oheWx8yE/file.html
Awesome, thank you! It’s sad cuz it was always a game I liked the look of and wanted to playthrough, but never got around to it because I wasn’t really into /vr/ yet. Now that I’m actually going through my backlog I’ve pretty much lost all my roms and rare games, though I probably wouldn’t have gotten into /vr/ at all if I still had those drives ironically.
Downloading now
Actually doesn't the official site have everything for free?
https://argonian94.mydns.jp/
I'm pretty sure you can get Ghost94 from https://argonian94.mydns.jp/ along with the developer's older and newer games. They are linked to on dropbox, I haven't tried them out yet because I don't have a virtual machine set up but the website is listed as the developer's site on multiple pages mentioning Ghost94.
I'd like to say it's not right or wrong. But causing entitled poorgays to seethe and cope is absolutely a good thing.
>all this desperate defending of this behavior ITT
Pathetic. OP asked if it was "right". It's not. If you buy it it's obviously yours to do what you want with but keeping it for yourself is hogging the enjoyment of what is an entertainment product, not a fricking fine art piece. Your choice but don't expect everyone to suck your microwiener
If it was a full game, he'd be fine in not sharing it with others; not a fan of it, but he'd be breaking the law if he did.
It's a Demo for a long-discontinued system, though, so he's a gay for not sharing it; he's not getting anything out of just keeping it to himself except for the satisfaction of huffing his own braps.
Another person already shared it, it's available online now.
Source me up because I find nothing
It's complex. I think he should share it, it's what I would do and it is the best way to preserve these things. But I also don't think anybody has the right to anyone else's private property. If he doesn't want to share it that's his right. We're privileged to have the demos and unreleased games that we do and privilege just makes people feel entitled rather than grateful.
Wrong, it's not his private property, he can't buy it, he can pay money for it to someone, sure, but it will still be the studios. Almost all demos and source codes are licenced like that.
Same with SDK hardware. You can buy it on eBay but technically the company who'se it is can always come and take it from you with a court warrant since it's theirs and not yours and you get no money back.
Heck it's even the same with released games, you're just paying to play the game, you didn't buy the rights to distribute it or own it, just to have access to it. So even if this was a one off retail game nobody else has anymore, this argument that "it's his property" is still bullshit, it's not his.
I hope Nintendo comes to your house to take all those retail games they merely licensed to you
They do it with their online stores constantly.
holy shit you're right
>tfw all those DS games I bought but can't download anymore
I wasn't talking about who'se responsibility it is to release, I was simply saying "they paid for it, it's their private property" is bullshit.
If it isn’t theirs to own then it isn’t theirs to distribute, what does pointing out the technicality that ‘they don’t actually own it’ add
The point is that anon was a tard
moronic take. So we agree they are doing something illegal by selling it/hoarding it, right? They also make it public, which is Black personish behavior too. And yet they refuse to do the safer act of sharing it online anonymously...
Not only that, doing something illegal for your own good is good and moral but doing it for the community and history is not?
A lot of this abandonware stuff is owned by banks that don't even know they have it from when the original devs and publishers went bacnkrupt
>Are data hoarders right
I barely know anything about this issue and have not thought about it carefully, but I can confidently say no, no they are not.
>I can confidently say something about something I barely know anything about
literally moronic
>/vr/ gets mad someone does as they wish with their own property
I would say that I am surprised but that is a lie. Plenty of people who get rare games dump them online, others do not as that is their choice and that is the key issue here - choice. Nobody is under any obligation to do anything just to conform to a bunch of people screeching on the internet.
See
>freedom of choice is freedom from criticism
But the Castlevania Resurrection guy never said that. Not only that, it has been out since April 2021.
https://en.sega-dreamcast-info-games-preservation.com/castlevania-resurrection-release
I remember this and the person who posted that was a homosexual then and is a homosexual now. It got released and they mostly all do. Anyone defending people like this or these thoughts should fricking kill them selves.
Wasn't released by the same person though.
They may die without ever releasing the shit ever(they don't do it now so it will never happen) and it might end up in the trash when the house is dealt with.
it's not preservation. i get that they might get cold feet from piracy accusations later on since everybody can trace the rom but i doubt companies would sue for these.
If I can't fire it up in an emulator and play it right now, it's not preserved
>BRUHHH
>I PRESERVED THIS SOFTWARE IN HARD DRIVE
>IN MY BASEMENT
>WHEN I DIE SOMEONE IS GOING TO TOSS IT INTO THE TRASH
>BUT I PRESERVED IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
moronic homosexuals
So the answer is no. I can understand how you could get so angry over something like this. It must be hard. If you ever want to talk, I’ll listen.
Lmao someones a little seething b***h they got called a homosexual. Which is what you are a homosexual b***h for defending this. So like i said have a nice day you homosexual.
If the copyright holder hasn't given permission for them to release it, yes. Why expose yourself to legal risk for the benefit of strangers? People should be angry with copyright law, not somebody taking common sense precautions.
Don't look for fame on the internet and upload it annoymously.
>The owner has backed it up and preserved it so it won't be lost
I can't imagine the person who wrote this honestly believes this.
your point?
It's just one example of someone saying it unironically.
Yeah, it's fine if it's legitimately preserved and public. Like how Galloping Ghost keeps their prototype arcade games on display and have multiple people holding onto a copy of the dumps in case the machines burn out. The only issue is that it's extremely annoying for people in other countries.
It's clearly bait.
>Have access to huge libraries of videogames of every generation, all of them archived by thousands of other people all around the world who chose to distribute them for free, with no questions asked
>Refuse to do the same for a game only you have, even when asked
>Pretend its everyone else who's entitled
If you're gonna be a self-serving Black person, be upfront about it. You didn't preserve jack shit, you mongrel.
This is where I've always stood on the issue, too. Internet piracy functions on the basis of everyone contributing what they can. If you pirate ANYTHING online, then when it's your turn go "I don't wanna", that's just being a dick. You can argue that you'd do the same thing in his position, but it doesn't make it any less of a dick move.
Sounds like you have a data hoarding problem. All those games, and in a hypothetical scenario you don’t have one demo and it sends you into a rage.
The biggest problem about muh hoarders is that underages keep hyping unreleased games up to an absurd degree with their antics, ensuring a game that's most likely a piece of shit to rocket up in perceived value. Just look at the neo-geo scene where 1 guy is hoarding more than a couple of finished but unreleased test market rejects but gets his dick sucked every time for scraps of info on it (eg: NGH number).
It's always refreshing to see people go on a small vidya community to ask why his game doesn't look like the ROM online, and ends up dumping and sharing the data like it was nothing, no show of ego, no donation drive, no nothing. Sadly this is getting really rare nowadays aside from Hidden Palace which kind of does the same thing but in scale.
Based. You're 100% correct.
One day it'll happen to a game you want to play and you'll understand. I don't care about Castlevania personally but I still think hoarders who claim to be preservers are absolute Black folk. If everyone else thought like you do (if you can even call it thinking) there'd be no roms online, ever.
This is a thread about unreleased games, though. Not released games. Who here is arguing against released games being dumped? Nobody.
>One day it'll happen to a game you want to play and you'll understand.
Gee I guess I'll have to play one of my other millions of children's toys instead.
This is why people should prioritize things that only exist in digital form on one site and not things with multiple physical releases. The physical releases are the "backups" that still last longer than the average hard drive. Two I remember in particular are browser games -
Command & Conquer: Attack Copter (Flash) & Darius: The Origin (HTML5).
https://cnc.fandom.com/wiki/Command_%26_Conquer:_Attack_Copter
https://darius.fandom.com/wiki/Darius_(Mobile_Phone)
I beat Attack Copter around 2008-09 and was a decent game. I found out about the other one when it was too late and wanted to submit it to BlueMaxima's Flashpoint. While TOSEC always accepted whatever hacks & homebrew ROMs you can find, no one joins them to help rename the files. Since No-Intro started doing so for homebrew, I hope enough people decide to join either of them & just go through itch.io and wherever to keep tabs on them.
For Docomo i-Mode games, there's a site named appget.com that used to have ~800 or so free games. It was never scraped, and those types of free games are typically embedded in browsers that can only be played through the phone. You'll find the .jam in the page source, which is just a text file, that has the name of the game's .jar file in it which is usually hosted in the same directory unless the .jam states a different location. I wonder if they still have them on hard drives on their end.
I personally don't care that much about the protos. There are still full, free games & mods in need of a simple scrape & reuploading like vector.co.jp, freem.ne.jp (ftp server scraped - archive.org/details/freem-7001-end-2019-09-15), freegame-mugen.jp (nothing to do with the fighting game engine), etc.
If theres one thing I hate man is data hoarders.
Why? Cause they got nothing else going on in their lives so they gotta find something to make them feel special, thats why.
It's called hoarding and it's a dangerous mental illness.
There is no wrong or right. Legally, they Have no claim to it, but you also have no claim to it.
In a case like this, basically "possession is 9/10s of the law" is the rule you go buy
They Have it, you want it, nobody can legally claim it, so the guy holding all the cards decides.
No amount of name calling or guilting will ever change that
>No amount of name calling or guilting will ever change that
Don't care.
>Legality and morality are the same thing
Okay Hobbes
>"""preservation""" foundations when they're asked to release their own finds instead of begging everyone else to share their shit
Most people that whine about hoarders and claim to be preservationists are just consumer degenerates. Every time someone posts 100s of previously-unavailable games/scans/etc, and it inevitably disappears because of copyright/hd failure/discord drama a few years later, people begin crying "OH NOOOO ALL THAT LOST HISTORY" when they had years to make their own backups.
There are people working around the clock to preserve relevant data, obviously they have human limitations but you have no idea what the frick you’re talking about
Those people working around the clock are the uploaders and the small minority, not the majority of moronic consumers with no skin like you
Collectors owning something notorious instead of another copy of super mario bros are also in the minority.
Are they legally required? No
Are they morally obligated? No
Is it kinda shitty not to? Yeah
And they've preserved nothing but want credit for doing so, anyway.
>hoardBlack person dies (of AIDS) or loses his backup drive (up his own ass)
>data lost forever
>hoardBlack person allows the entire internet to download his precious ROM files
>at least one stinky neet will be able to keep the data preserved after the hoardBlack person's untimely ACK-ing
Simple as that.
At least you admit you're a stinky neet
This guy on Youtube called Pinstripe has several alpha/beta releases of Hogs of War on the Playstation and it pisses me off he hasn't released them. They were given to him by one of the original devs.
What a fricking hog!
The "people" who do this hoarding shit are always fat, unhealthy, greasy middle-aged slobs who've never done any exercise in their entire lives. We're only one inevitable early heart attack away from losing their data forever.
LMAO.
Discord doesn't seem to ever delete anything. I asked for my chat logs and they still have images backed up I uploaded 6 years ago
They won't delete you chat logs. They will delete the data. Speaking from experience, they've destroyed the Megadrive server twice, and they've fled into something named Matrix. Granted, those guys are pretty much pirates rather than preservationists, but still the precedent is there.
Byuu’s preservation morality was all a show, he was almost certainly a dumper. There are multiple instances of him putting a prototype in his database, claiming it was private and the rom image would never be public, then a few weeks later a rom with the exact same hash shows up on all the big sites.
byuu still redumped the entire Murican SNES catalog as verification, then sent the whole 5 different carts to someone at No-Intro to redump them. Multiple dumps = extra proof it was done correctly as most people are just faceless usernames. Pretty much everything in No-Intro starts as a scene dump, and many of the DS games have underdumped headers.
>byuu
oh yeah, haven't thought about this dude since last year.
he faked his "death"
Source?
can't argue with a government database
Holy shit! He died 5 times in as many months!
moron
When we have no argument I guess all we can do is use ad homi ems
Ego is also a problem, sometimes I swear they get a kick out of not sharing the stuff they find.
The really juicy things to preserve are PC game source codes because then they're open source ported and everyone can enjoy modern versions, which is awesome, also older game roms are the top tier stuff, long forgotten things, arcade games, stuff of the sorts.
I like preservation and the sharing of these obscure things, it opens posibillities of new ideas and lets us see things that could have been possible.
>The really juicy things to preserve are PC game source codes because then they're open source ported and everyone can enjoy modern versions
But only if they're legally released. Preservation groups can't grant such rights for very obvious reasons. And pretty much no one makes anything with leaked source code. It is quite useful, however, for MMOs.
Reverse-egineered code is as bad as leaked one yet people think they can get away with it.
Surprise, it turns out you can!
And even if you couldn't, scene groups have been releasing cracks and sharing all sorts of media since forever. Maybe it's time those tranoids in the reverse engineering world start considering fricking over corporations like the leftists they are.
Modders and fangame creators should consider creating anonymous groups too btw.
True. I remember that recent Spyro fan-game that was banned, so they've had to remake it completely. Wouldn't happened if they would've been anonymous. On the other side, some modders and most romhackers actually are all but anonymous.
I don't get the point of not letting others enjoy it but telling everyone that you have X in your possession or that you've backed it up.
There's definitely spergs on both sides, tho
Because they want attention and to show off that they got something rare and one of a kind that no one else has. They don't actually give a frick about preservation, they just say that so they don't look bad.
I just wanna laugh at autistic manchildren. Aww baby can't have rare protos duh nuh nuh nuh-nuh.
no they are homosexuals who like to sit in irc rooms and circlejerk that they have it
The real issue is he told everyone about owning some ultra rare game, never showed it, then got his ass chewed out. He's free to do what he wants with his property but it's still a dick move.
On one hand it makes soys and manchildren seethe uncontrollably when you do this, but then you lose it and they are proven correct. It's not a good gamble.
who gives a shit
Support your public preservers innstead of giving this butthole your thoughts and praryers. Support Archive.org, the Videogame History Foundation, and the Museum of Art and Digital Entertainment. They are all non-profit institutions, and they all release their stuff publicly, for the most part. The VHF holds some source code they haven't released, but they will eventually. It's legal stuff.
>The VHF holds some source code they haven't released, but they will eventually. It's legal stuff.
So were they given code by devs under the agreement that they have to wait X amount of time before releasing it or what?
I would add sites like Forest of Illusion, ObscureGamers, The Hidden Palace, SNES Central and The Cutting Room Floor.
>The VHF holds some source code they haven't released, but they will eventually.
Yeah, I don't see them releasing the source code to Monkey Island and Aladdin ever.
What's wrong bros, I thought consumerism was le unbased and blue pill? Why are you so attached to pieces of plastic?
Without plastic, we can't make red pills. How are we gonna be redpilled without red pills?
How is it "preserved" if no human can ever interact with it apart from the owner
and when the owner died it will be literally no one, and it will be lost forever
I had some games in my collection and the roms of them disappeared off the face of the public internet. I ripped them and put them out there and the games I ripped are now in packs so people are playing them.
What really happened?
You reuploaded some of your garbage romhacks after they get deleted for being shit?
Let me put this in simple terms.
I bought something. I paid for it and it is MY right to show it to other people with no intention of doing anything beyond that. Capiche?
And you WILL respect the decisions I make with MY life.
How is it preserved if only he has access to a copy of it? It's effectively in the same situation it was before
My son will be able to own it after my death.
Now I have written into my will if the content of the game is ever found somewhere outside our family any other inheritance is hence forfeit in perpetuity (so the little shit can't bequeath it to his son just for them to spread it around without losing the rest of the estate).
Good idea. Gonna update my will tomorrow.
And add a requirement that whoever currently owns it has to make a public announcement at least one every 5 years stating that they have it and it will never be released to entitled poorgays who call themselves preservationists because they want games for free.
The announcement will be required to include the exact phrase "seethe, cope, dilate"
>I preserved it, trust me bro.
Announcing you have something historically relevant everyone wants and then refusing to share it for attention should be punishable by a severe ass beating and mugging. If you don't want to share it, don't announce you have it to people looking to share and preserve things with one another. homosexual.
I don't trust the "guys I totally backed it up it's safe" claim considering how many source codes and builds have been lost due to drive failures or pure negligence.
people shouldn’t be forced to dump shit especially since they would be risking jail time in some countries but I still think some of the people who who hold games in private collections like byuu are buttholes. It’s easy enough to just share the game anonymously instead of on twitter
ctrl+f starcraft
Nobody? Oh well.
>he hasn't preserved it correctly
Do we even have standards for preserving something correctly? Have we even decided on what preserving means, what things we should preserve, and who should hang on to them? The library of congress has Dook, which seems like quite a bit of acknowledgement from normies/non-gamers to me.
>preservationgays just want free shit
Some prevervationgays want free shit, some don't. Remember, some people will preserve god awful games for the sake of it.
>are hoarders right to refuse release of abandonware
They can do anything they want. Seems odd to me they'd announce they've got the damn thing and not expect people to rapidly stroke their shafts over it. It's hard to understand his motivation, unless he's scared of getting letters from Konami's attorneys. That has to be it, right?
Also, my personal thoughts on preservation is we should preserve as much media as possible. Given there isn't that much of an actual technical limitation to keeping the data, I think it's something worth an investment. Distributing the data would be pretty difficult. But we're just talking about preservation. So while I'm a preservationist, it's not because I need to play a CV demo that probably sucks, it's because I hate the idea of interesting things getting lost forever.
Also, a CV demo is a wienertease because the odds of Konami doing any good games with CV soon is a huge joke.
>we preserved a totally rare orototype dumpo and yes we are sharing it!
>Oh and is just a near finished release that looks exactly the samenas retail.
>BUT THERE ARE SOME BUTE DIFFERENCES
Why even bother?
https://mobile.twitter.com/forestillusion/status/1547939875214700544
These "Usual suspects" have subverted (shit up) what was once aomething great.
Look at that cringe frogposter in the replies. Probably you.
>Why even bother?
Why not?
i mean he's under no obligation to release it, but it's hypocritical if he ever downloaded someone elses preserved abandonware.
Video games are meant to be played. If your "preservation" doesn't allow anyone to seek it out and play it, it is not preserved. That's like recovering a book from 500 years ago, and placing it in a vault in a museum in France where no one can read it, saying its preserved.
>That's like recovering a book from 500 years ago, and placing it in a vault in a museum in France where no one can read it, saying its preserved.
Yeah. It's exactly like that. And you'd be exactly correct for saying that's preserved.
Preserved for who? If you can't read it, it's not preserved.
>Preserved for who?
For Dino Cifaldi, Frank's father. He's an avid book preserver.
>That's like recovering a book from 500 years ago, and placing it in a vault in a museum in France where no one can read it, saying its preserved.
That's funny because that book in France would get scanned, OCR'd, and put on the internet for free.
Every video game published in France is also preserved, but can't be accessed as easily for obvious reasons: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3TwbUFs3fU
The issue with video game preservation is that unlike books, video games won't last 500 years. Archivists and associations are tied by copyright laws, so at best they can copy the data and hoard it, which is indeed stupid as frick. Piracy is the only viable way right now to preserve video games.
Sometimes it's a matter of preserving something until it's legal to release. Like one of Ken Akamatsu's big platforms was a reform of Japanese copyright law. It's HORRIBLY outdated, but nobody's ever really given enough of a shit to fix it.
There's nothing wrong with free shit, especially when it comes to games made by developers who would not see a single cent of any modern purchase.
Whatever happened to not being an butthole?
There's so many mental gymnastics people go through to try to feel good about being a bad person. And yet you know deep down it doesn't work, they still feel ashamed which is why they lash out.
If they bought it they can use it for anything. If we were talking about a cure for cancer I might change my mind.
Why preserve it if he's not distributing it? Konami owns it. Even preserving it is illegal, if you don't work for Konami. It's a bit obnoxious to announce that you have a copy of it, but won't share it.
I don't really want this particular game, though. It's just an unfinished demo of something that (given the track record of 3D Castlevania games) probably would have sucked even if it was finished.
data is valuable, why do you think facebook and google collect it and sell it?
Has anyone here ever tried messaging former devs on Twitter or whereever for potential releases?
Plenty have. Generally the reply is a no because the rights aren't 100% in their hands.
Guys like John Romero used to share alpha and beta stuff of Doom and what not every now and then, back in like 2014 or 2015 he released a big dump of unused/WIP assets for Doom and Doom 2 which had lots of sprites and textures people had never seen before, as well as a beta level build of Doom 2. This was a massive treasure trove which isn't just interesting to look at as is, but for textures and sprites, there's stuff which was readily usable or which could easily be adapted for use. Some may think of that as "seeing the sausage get made", but as a mapper/spriter it was like learning a couple of the secrets to making sausage.
ZeniMax owns iD Software, and Zenimax isn't very interested in having some former dev give away stuff like this (they probably already hate that John Carmack gave away the source code in 1997), and with Romero insinuating that there's a lot left he hasn't shown, he won't release it becasue ZeniMax threatened him.
tl;dr it's usually not in individual dev's hands
Interesting to see the skybox like that
There's a lot, you also had the old 0.5, 0.4, 0.3, 0.2, and 0.1 alpha builds which were leaked way back in the 90s, as well as the Press Release Beta, which unlike the previously mentioned ones is something actually playable, just with no sound or music, and it still had a Wolfenstein 3D like score and extra lives system.
The PR Beta has a lot of earlier versions of a lot of sprites, like the missing rotations for a bunch of them (cut to save space, as you can mirror existing ones and most people won't pay much attention to that), along with some unimplemented alternate death animations for Doomguy (pictured here).
This is the last dump Romero made. Hehe, dump.
https://files.catbox.moe/ykz56i.7z
I'm surprised that the Doom devs even kept it all, outside of Carmack they didn't seem the sort
Carmack and Romero are kind of opposite in that way, Romero is a very sentimental person who saves everything, including old paystubs from side jobs as a burger flipper in his teens and twenties (and he also claims to have partially photographic memory). Meanwhile Carmack doesn't save nearly as much, he abandoned quite a lot of old stuff he did before the iD days, and has historically had little compulsion to 'jettisoning' things/people from his professional life for the sake of efficiency.
Carmack never kept any of the graphics stuff or beta builds for himself to my knowledge (because he never worked directly on that, short of some gameplay suggestions), but what he does keep is the code, and not just because it's valuable. Carmack has this ideology that code should (sooner or later) be made free to the public so that anyone can just build onto it, because he himself got his start tinkering with program and game code as a kid, and fundamentally looks at programming as a kind of science which shouldn't be held back by patent law. He published the source code for many of iD's games, Doom's source code was released under GNU GPL because he was convinced by a fan (Andrew Stine) that it was the right thing to do.
As time went though, the legal environment changed and made this kind of stuff a larger and larger legal risk due to software patents, which is why fewer and fewer devs overall publish their source code in this day and age. Some butthole could come and launch a big suit on you because they own something infinitesimally insignificant such as the exact way your mouse grabs onto a scrollbar in some miscellaneous interface, and now they have evidence you used it. You wouldn't generally know which parts these are given how broad this stuff is.
If you're a publisher, you don't want to deal with that headache and cost, and if you're just a lone old dev, you can usually not even afford this happening, so you're not gonna do it unless the coast is clear.
Worth noting also is that Romero is essentially his own fan, with games like Doom he worked to make the game what he wanted it to be, and loved the result of it, as well as what fans have done with his game in all this time. His love for Doom and deathmatch actually took focus away from the development of Doom 2, which is why he has fewer map credits in that game.
Carmack isn't the same way, Doom and Quake are achievements he's proud of, but he doesn't get into frequent bouts of deathmatch, he has other hobbies, and other interests in games. One of his favorite games in recent years was the VR rhythm game Beat Saber, and in part because he used it as a workout.
simple
romera is real human
carmack is code monkey and an npc robot
just look at carmack's twitter. this doesnt look like posts made by human. i wont be srurprised if his whole twitter is just carmack testing his own ai he is developing
I see nothing wrong with stealing from one like the Chad who dumped that one arcade game a few years back.
A lot of abandonware is owned by banks that may not even know they owned it, and the documents showing the ownership of a former dev company's assets may or may not be digitised by a data entryist. So it could just be in some old filing cabinet. Anyway, when dev company's went under 99% of the time it would be in debt and the banks would collect the dev's assets and and that includes the ownership of software that the devs owned. So the banks don't give a shit about that, and it got lost before the fad started about rehashing ancient IPs.
Anyway, it's abandonware and the bank that owns it may not even know they own it and they certainly don't give a shit about it.
Fun fact: Star Insurance Company was the owner of System Shock 2 as seen in the GOG.com re-release trailer.
Hardwar is one of them games where no-one knows who owns it
If I came into ownership of lost media I could smash the original copy and delete any backups. Frick preservationists.
That's great, sweetie.
>waaaah why don't you get fricked in the ass by megacorps abusing moronic copyright laws so i can play gaem.
it sucks but i don't really blame them especially when for example nintendo loves to go hard against 100 year old roms
Even the Video Game History Foundation dumped a Nintendo game (the NES port of SimCity) and Nintendo didn't gave a shit.
Short answer: No.
Are you entitled to some piece of shit shovelware crap you didn't even know existed till someone said you can't have it?
The only reason they don't share publicly is so someone else can buy it off them for a much higher price later.
What is your opinion on Lex Luthor preserving video games?
This week they've finally worked out how to dump Pioneer Laseractive games so they're being preserved.
But even as someone who agrees generally with game preservation, I still do find it really hard to give a shit about it in 99% of cases. A dump of say the Spaceworld version of Pokemon G/S I can see the point of, also some of the games in the gigadump were really quite interesting such as Golf Robot, but when it's from a few days before a release going gold and there's only a few bytes difference it feels pointless