They don't even study journalism, all of these game bloggers only got their jobs through nepotism and collusion who only serve to regurgitate whatever crap their bosses tell them to write. Shit, they don't even write their own articles anymore, they've used ghost-writing interns for years and now they rely on AI to do the work for them.
You don't belong here, brainrotted politics homosexual.
This is easily the goty. Zelda will probably get the awards, but this is a massively better game. You being angry at options just shows how little you care about video games actual quality, you just care about "TROONS TROONS AAAAHH THERES WOMEN AND GAYS IS THAT A Black person AAAAAAAAAH"
>This is easily the goty.
come on man
rng diceroll shit is awful
i haven't had LESS fun with a game all year >inb4 get good
even if my gameplay was perfect i would still get assraped by missing a 95% hit chance and die
>but I wouldn't want every game to be like that.
but you would want baldurs gate to be like that, THE real-time with pause game.
but of course, BG3 isnt baldurs gate in any way but the eponymous.
I wouldn't, because the game is designed from the ground up with turn-based gameplay in mind. Changing it wouldn't work, not without changing up the whole design of the game.
>Are turn based games simply obsolete?
They're anachronistic and lazy most of the time, but it makes sense in a DND context since it's emulating tabletop rules. Would be cool to see the game with RTWP though.
I don't care for turn-based combat, but it doesn't make me lose interest in a game by itself.
What really grinds my gears is card-games inside of video games, that's beyond moronic. Flip cards over that represent monsters and read the attacks instead of making those monsters and having them do those attacks in real time? The card games are imitating what we can actually do with video games today. You're using your great technology to pretend you're playing a game where you pretend you're seeing something that PC/console is capable of delivering. It's a purposeful downgrade. What's next? Downloadable vouchers to use at your local arcade get included with your AAA title?
>The card games are imitating what we can actually do with video games today.
Such as? I'm trying to think of what would exactly translate deck building and resource management as you say, and the only thing that really comes to mind is RTS games with how you get resources and decide on what to build and then what you have access to. And even then it's not a perfect translation of the mechanics of card games.
It's based on D&D, which is inherently a turn based experience. What the frick did these people want, Dark Souls 4?
this is why keeping troons out of hobbies is important
The implication that BG3 isn't a gormlessly different game from BG1 that's cynically piggy-backing off the franchise's reputation to drive sales is insulting.
It did, the average moron buys things based on brand, not if the product actually works. It's actually amazing how the average moron will never change brands because they're "comfortable" with something or they "know" the brand.
That's why half the consumer grade shit in the US breaks in 2 weeks because it's made in china but still has the old brand names
Baldurs Gate name does not have mainstream appeal in 2023, it's funny that you think it does, grandpa.
9 months ago
sage
It doesn't have to, you don't understand basic human psychology. Impulse buyers like the child target audience of this game will hear Baldur's Gate and use that subconsciously to strike down their inhibitions for impulse buying the game because "they've heard the name before"
9 months ago
Anonymous
If I asked my normalgay acquantences they would've maybe heard of fortnite or dark souls but not baldurs gate
>It's actually amazing how the average moron will never change brands because they're "comfortable" with something or they "know" the brand.
are you working for AMD by any chance?
9 months ago
Anonymous
Funny, I hate AMD because my first ever GPU from them died in like 8 months.
>wonder why my mixer that's older than me is still working fine >read label >"made in the netherlands"
Ditto for almost any appliance I have that's lasted more than a few years (replace netherlands with any non china country)
9 months ago
Anonymous
To be fair I have a power washer engine that's like 5 years old they snuck under my nose with "Made in PRC" that hasn't gone supercritical and embedded molten aluminum into my shins yet
9 months ago
Anonymous
Chinks are capable of making quality stuff. It's just that no one moves production to china for the quality, they do it to squeeze a few more pennies out of profit margins. Being manufactured in china is just a sign that the company doesn't care that deeply about quality.
9 months ago
Anonymous
China sells stainless steel on the market meant for technical stuff so the measurements have to be precise with wildly varying degrees of thickness and when questioned about it they go "it's soviet grade" or something to that order
The terrible revelation that I share a planet with individuals that are as easy to deceive, or as eager to deceive, as yourself is profoundly troubling to me.
RTWPkek spent years making garbage threads like this one on Ganker every day. And every time he got BTFOed by logic and fakts. Same shit happens on RPG Codex. You just can't win. RTWP exist only as bio product of RTS boom during end of 90s. To catch bigger audience of normalgays RTWP was made. It's inferior in every aspect to TB. Even so called "trash mobs" exist because of RTWP.
It's faster, doesn't make you repeat the same actions over and over again, doesn't make you wait for enemy turns, and still allows for tactical decision making. It's just straight up better than turn based
>I haven't seen a single argument
You did see all of them.
They're in Ganker archives.
There is no point to repost them again.
You will remake same thread next day.
I'm begging you to defend your position instead of baiting, but you can't because you're a terminal baiter, thus proving my assertion there isn't actually anything you can say to defend turn based games versus regular games
9 months ago
Anonymous
You're not getting anything. Just enjoy empty (You)s. And make this thread again.
9 months ago
Anonymous
I'm not OP
and I'm still right that there's not a single reason why anybody should think turn based is better
I'm also saging ever post so you can sage with me and OP wont get any attention
9 months ago
Anonymous
>and I'm still right that there's not a single
There is. Use this tool >https://arch.b4k.co/v/
You can find walls of text explaining why. Feel free to visit RPG shitcodex too.
Hint: watch rtwp gameplay above easy mode on youtube. The only good game with rtwp is troony and PoE2
Have yet to see a single justification why every game should be a generic action movie game like TLOU and FFXVI. There are infinitely more over-the-shoulder boring slop to chose from, so why does one game not being the same formulaic forgettable shit piss off the FOTM zoomer. They get suicidal FOMO the second something doesn’t cater specifically to them so they seethe nonstop about it. It wasn’t made for you, go play something else.
>every game should be a generic action movie game
I think turn based games definitely have a place in gaming, I don't think they have a place in a Baldur's gate game
I was specifically replying to that person because I know they didn't actually have a response for "why" turn based games are good, probably because they've never actually played one and were baiting
>boohoo dnd games plays like dnd
have a nice day. Turn based is better for most rpgs that aren't leh cuhrazy action games. It also more thought and actual role play during combat but more effectively than other methods. Not to mention, not everyone is an ADD stricken zoomer who has to see flashing lights every .5 seconds to have fun or be engaged.
I don't know why I'm arguing though, you clearly are very aware why this game is turn-based and know that there is not "objective" better between turn based and RT. You're just a shit stirring homosexual looking for replies.
>Have yet to see a single justification why every game should be a generic action movie game
They shouldn't, but your common typical consumer will always choose less complicated games.
That's why Spider Man 2 will sell 10x better, that's why God of War sells better and even FF16 that was hated by fans still sells better moron-kun.
FFXVI is a colossal flop and was completely memory holed a week after release. It sold like shit and no one will ever make a remake out of it in 10+ years. It’s forgettable shovelware that failed in every regard.
wasn't it actually pretty good performance wise for an exclusive?
9 months ago
Anonymous
Not at all, there are tons of posts explaining the console user base for every recent Final Fantasy game it was not even close. Even if you just use one console as the counterpoint it still sold less comparatively. It failed so hard the xiv-troons have actually started trying to gaslight people to save face by lying about it selling 4 million when it hasn’t shipped/sold anything beyond 3 million since June 28th.
9 months ago
sage
Final fantasy 12 has had 17 years to build up sales, it seems you're ignoring metrics to try and pretend 16 was worse performing than it is
9 months ago
Anonymous
It was outsold by Tomb Raider and that game didn’t cost over a $100 million to produce, yet it was also considered a disappointment. FFXVI is worse than a flop, it’s an expensive flop like TLOU2.
9 months ago
Anonymous
It was, it has an PS5 attachment on the level of ToTK and was deemed a success by SE and sells as much only on PS5 as biggest multiplatform Resident Evil 4.
It just Barry seething as always.
I'm glad FFXVI success makes you seethe this much kek
9 months ago
Anonymous
Care to debunk this pic
Not at all, there are tons of posts explaining the console user base for every recent Final Fantasy game it was not even close. Even if you just use one console as the counterpoint it still sold less comparatively. It failed so hard the xiv-troons have actually started trying to gaslight people to save face by lying about it selling 4 million when it hasn’t shipped/sold anything beyond 3 million since June 28th.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Care to debunk this pic
The picture which shows that a game being on a market for 20 years have more sold copies than a game being on a market for 3 days?
What is to debunk here, troony?
Turn based games have less fights. Owlcat as I remember talked about it recently in Rogue Trader interviews. Every fight must be carefully designed. Hell look at BG3.
>Turn based games have less fights.
That's an inherent restriction of turn-based systems, though. Nothing prevents real-time combat from having fights designed equally as carefully. The "carefully designed encounters" is a cope that tries to present an objective weakness as if it's a strength.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Nothing prevents real-time combat from having fights designed equally as carefully.
You want to click mobs for dopamine hit. Otherwise why even play real-time for tactical combat?
9 months ago
sage
To roleplay?
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Otherwise why even play real-time for tactical combat
Real-time has plenty of tactical depth. Try playing any real time strategy game.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Try playing any real time strategy game.
Heh.
9 months ago
Anonymous
So you haven't played any. Good to know
9 months ago
Anonymous
>missing the point
You're really grasping at straws hard. BTW your apm clicker is pretty shitty CRPG compared to FAS
9 months ago
Anonymous
You haven't played any strategy games, and probably think tic-tac-toe is the height of tactical depth.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>You haven't played any strategy games
Ah I see. You don't know what FAS is. Funny, asiaticbro. But really makes sense why you're in this thread.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>You don't know what FAS is.
Fight Action Sandbox? It's a shitty indie action game with 30 reviews, and I bet you're some sort of shill for it
9 months ago
Anonymous
newbie
9 months ago
Anonymous
Oh, so you're referring to Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. Sorry, but I can't do anything about that for you.
Maybe your mother shouldn't have downed 5 bottles of vodka a week when she had you.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>hurrr durr
Next time don't bring rts into discussion when you don't know shit, underage moron.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>No argument
I would say your moronation is astounding, but it does explain the fact that you're talking about a literal who game from April of this year as if it's board culture.
Anybody implying there aren't "things to figure out" in a real time game is a moron. Everything still operates on a turn basis allowing devs to tailor encounters
Anybody implying there aren't "things to figure out" in a real time game is a moron. Everything still operates on a turn basis allowing devs to tailor encounters
Don't forget that RTwP is also inferior to a real time action game in every aspect too. Remember that if you mention turn based then RTwPgays will cry and talk shit, and if you also mention action games they will either just talk shit about turn based or complain about it being "too hard" if it was real time because they are all huge homosexuals.
>RTwP is also inferior to a real time action game in every aspect too.
It isn't. Real time action games only let you control 1 character. RTwP lets you control multiple characters. >if you also mention action games
It isn't relevant when discussing CRPGs. CRPGs are devolved strategy games, just as TTRPGs are devolved wargames. Comparing CRPG combat to action combat is as asinine as comparing football to chess.
Icewind Dale
Neverwinter Nights
Baldur's Gate
Shit, DAO pulled it in a 3D environment.
You mean the complete, utter control of every slight action on both sides and combat is often about denying your opponents turns?
At best that would mean RTwp has very little to no real time aspects at all. It just auto-plays turns by set repeating actions akin to FF12's gambit system.
Which is passable, but more boring than full TB.
>You mean the complete, utter control of every slight action on both sides and combat is often about denying your opponents turns?
If you're gonna simplify it like that, isn't that every combat that exists? what is boxing if not hitting your opponent and making sure he can't hit you. >that would mean RTwp has very little to no real time aspects at all. It just auto-plays
But it doesn't, demonstrably so, you set up active skills, change positions, combine attacks...
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Icewind Dale >Neverwinter Nights >Baldur's Gate >DAO
Ok. Still waiting for you to name one "done right" rtwp game.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Literally some the most well regarded CRPGs of all time
Cope
9 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah. Not for their combat, though.
9 months ago
Anonymous
That is true. Icewind dale only succeeded due to waifus
9 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, everyone hated every second of playing those games
Great argument.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Combat is easily the worst part of early infinity engine games, get out of your time bubble, gramps.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>get out of your time bubble, gramps
You say that, while whining that a system that replicates people talking with each other is better
9 months ago
Anonymous
Turn-based is better, yes. You've been given several reasons why already. Meanwhile your only defence of rtwp is "hurr durr them's be well-regarded arr pee gee" nostalgia schlop.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Turn-based is better, yes
It very much isn't. >You've been given several reasons why already.
None of them remotely convincing. Yours earlier was "it's old" >Meanwhile your only defence of rtwp is "hurr durr them's be well-regarded arr pee gee" nostalgia schlop.
Kek. What a moron. Ofc some of the most well regarded examples of the genre wouldn't matter, not when my gacha games use TB and they're so much better
9 months ago
Anonymous
It is. You're repeating yourself and getting mad at scenarios that you create in your head.
turn based is inferior because it turns every fight into a slog
rtwp is superior because it gives the player more choice so that you don't get bogged into combat over trivial encounters, but also can go turnbased when needed
>rtwp is superior because it gives the player more choice
What? >you don't get bogged into combat over trivial encounters
Games that are made with turn-based in mind don't have "trivial" aka "trash" encounters to begin with.
9 months ago
Anonymous
rtwp gives you both real time and turnbased
and Baldur's Gate: Original Sin is literally full of trash encounters, because that's actually part of how DnD combat
9 months ago
Anonymous
Oh, you're trolling. Goodbye.
9 months ago
Anonymous
utterly assblasted
9 months ago
Anonymous
>rtwp gives you both real time and turnbased
It doesn't, it gives you the worst of both, a real-time game that's not balanced around playing in real time.
9 months ago
Anonymous
that's false, those older crpgs play nothing like tabletop, they were actually rebalanced because real 2nd ed AD&D is heavily steeped in autistic minutiae
rtwp helps to alleviate some of that because spending 3 rounds missing attacks against level 1 enemies feels like shit
9 months ago
Anonymous
I'm saying that RTWP games don't feel good when playing without ever pausing, but pausing doesn't help it feel good, either. It's a bandaid over an awkward system.
9 months ago
Anonymous
and turn based doesn't feel good when you apply the DnD combat model to a video game system (except 4th edition but that's a whole other discussion)
DnD is built on shitty encounters with challenge rating bloat, but it's one of those "fun with friends" things where you don't notice it at the table with the addition of combat being less heavy at the table because it can take a long time to resolve
9 months ago
Anonymous
>a turn based system doesn't feel good as a turn based game
The worst part about all the old RTWP games is that they're based on 6-second rounds in the background despite having real-time gameplay moment to moment. It's why they feel so bad to play compared with a turn based game that just embraces the turn based mechanics and presents the game in the way it was meant to be played.
9 months ago
Anonymous
yeah, spending 20-30 seconds to finish a combat feels so much worse than spending that same amount of time to just finish a round
9 months ago
Anonymous
What I'm hearing from this is that you just don't want to play an RPG or think about strategy, preferring to just mash buttons and get through combat as fast as possible.
9 months ago
Anonymous
there is no more strategy to be found in turnbased games than there is in real time ones, real time just also needs you to have good reaction time
thankfully for rpg fans, the devs behind crags knew that the average person who likes those has the reaction time of a drunk toddler and gave you a pause button so you can plan out how you're gonna auto attack those goblins to death
9 months ago
Anonymous
If RTWP games were true real-time games (like RTS, ARPGs, MOBAs, etc) I think a better argument could be made for them. Like I said, though, the biggest problem is that they play out in real time and you react in real time but everything is actually ticking away by 6-second rounds under the hood. It makes the game feel sluggish and unresponsive, because you can react perfectly to an enemy's attack and move out of the way before the animation lands but it won't matter because the to-hit roll already happened 2 seconds ago so no matter what you do you'll get hit with that attack. On the other end it can feel unresponsive when you select an action to use and have to wait a few seconds before it actually starts. What you see is not what you get and when you throw pause into the mix you just add more sluggishness on top of this awkward system.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>It is
It is not >You're repeating yourself
Only because you're deaf dumb and blind. >and getting mad at scenarios that you create in your head.
Lmao, "u mad" to you too
9 months ago
Anonymous
Prove that it isn't.
turn based is inferior because it turns every fight into a slog
rtwp is superior because it gives the player more choice so that you don't get bogged into combat over trivial encounters, but also can go turnbased when needed
at least tried, but he made it too obvious that he's trolling. Calling me names and getting mad at me being a "gacha player" (something that you made up in your head) isn't proving anything, btw.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>prove that it isn't
I have. >Calling me names and getting mad at me being a "gacha player"
Oh my God you hypocritical homosexual, your entire argument consisted of calling me Grandpa, cope harder
9 months ago
Anonymous
>I have.
Where, gramps?
9 months ago
Anonymous
In all my posts
9 months ago
Anonymous
But all you ever said in your posts was along the lines of "old good", gramps. I think your dementia's kicking in.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>But all you ever said in your posts was along the lines of "old good"
No I explained why, then gave examples of to illustrate my point, meanwhile all you did this entire conversation was type the tired "ok boomer" meme only echoed by the gayest of homosexuals
9 months ago
Anonymous
Damn, that's crazy.
Isn't it about time you've taken a nap, gramps?
9 months ago
Anonymous
your concession has been noted
9 months ago
Anonymous
9 months ago
Anonymous
>arguing that giving players choice and agency is better is trolling
what a butthurt little gay you are
9 months ago
Anonymous
turn based is inferior because it turns every fight into a slog
rtwp is superior because it gives the player more choice so that you don't get bogged into combat over trivial encounters, but also can go turnbased when needed
9 months ago
Anonymous
the entire point of iwd was combat
9 months ago
Anonymous
Had you only named DAO you'd've at least made some sort of sense, but naming iwd, nwn and bg first just shows that you've no fricking clue what you're talking about.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, you're right, it's just some of the most well regarded CRPGs of all time, I'm sure homosexualy John Anon from Ganker knows better
You mean the complete, utter control of every slight action on both sides and combat is often about denying your opponents turns?
At best that would mean RTwp has very little to no real time aspects at all. It just auto-plays turns by set repeating actions akin to FF12's gambit system.
Which is passable, but more boring than full TB.
once again i will inform you that there is one good rtwp game and that is dragon age origins and its not because its rtwp its because you can "code" the ai behavior yourself so the weakness of rtwp is reduced
I don't even get what you're saying, that lack of auto setups on players behavior in RT that's the problem?
Also, yeah dragon Age likely was the peak of it, too bad BW decided shitty action button smashing was the way to go
9 months ago
Anonymous
>that lack of auto setups on players behavior in RT that's the problem?
mostly the fact that rtwp ends up being an autoattack simulator where you pause to perfectly place a spell every now and then
in dragon age it runs much smoother because you can "code" the ai to place important spells like shielding your 10% hp tank or casting an emergency stun when surrounded
9 months ago
Anonymous
>mostly the fact that rtwp ends up being an autoattack simulator where you pause to perfectly place a spell every now and then
Why does everyone say that? You set up spells and active skills all the time in these games, martial classes have abilities too
>Game aims to adapt D&D 5e to a video game >To the point where it can be used to play actual DMed campaigns of D&D using custom games >Surprised a D&D 5e tool with a built-in module is turn based
>Square Enix: We can't make turn based RPGs anymore, the audience won't buy them >Western dev churns out turn based crpg slop with waifu romances at 106GB in 2023 >It sells like crazy
Square Enix: T-t-hat's different.
Frick no if anything is returning RPG back to its heavy strategy turn based roots. Unlike Square Enix who turning all its RPG franchises in Devil May cry button spam a thon.
No.That's why new turn-based games are made constantly.
Same thing with point&click. It's not because it's old that it's inherently inferior. It's just a type of gameplay among others.
Some people simply have brains that makes them unable to enjoy slow games because they need constant stimulation.
I find turn-based games extremely comfy. And, with RTS, it's pretty much the only genre that asks you to plan things out way in advance. It would be sad if we lost that because planning in RTWP definitely isn't the same, it's more like some kind of constant adjustment.
The people b***hing about “le turn based is le bad” are brainless zoomer r*dditards that would b***h about chess not being like Rock-em Sock-em Robots in the before times. They don’t have the capacity appreciate something because they are too dumb to understand it’s merits. Their entire argument is “I like this other thing, why isn’t everything like the thing I like, it’s not fair!”. I truly despise everyone born after 2000.
I would not say the problem is the game being turn-based. The problem is it being turn-based and having DnD rules where the difficulty is not figuring strategy and tactics but having knowledge of abilities and how to make broken builds and interactions which suits more real time gameplay.
WoTC wanting their on-brand 5e frickfest is definitely a huge detriment to the game, but lets be real here, it's larian and they wouldn't have done any better on their own
turn-based is as obsolete as animation
it's easier to make something cheap and overwhelm you with canned spectacle than it is to put a ton of effort into something where the minor details can be noticed.
neither are obsolete, but the audience that spends the most money today doesn't appreciate them.
Square enix are morons who committed sudoku to their studio after dominating the world of vidya for years. All they can do now is reboot their old games that were actually good.
If game is designed around turn-based it would not have trash encounter so rtwpgays would be bored. The swtich between turn based and real time will be abused (see how it's done in Pathfinder) to gain unfair advantage against enemies. The ai in real time mode would work in tb game (people would abuse real time for ez AI).
NTA, but are you more interested in seeing the arguments for turn-based or more into arguing about them?
Because if it's former, you have archives for multiple threads. If you just wanna argue, or "debate", just say so. I just have a feeling like with many people on this site, you have decided already that you don't like turn-based stuff and it's bad.
If however you actually want a discussion about it, I recommend making a thread where you say "Nobody can prove that turn-based combat is good in any way" and slap some flamewar bait on it. There you get some "debate" and "discussion" about it.
Otherwise, use the archive. You'll find all arguments and points you are looking for from there.
>If however you actually want a discussion about it, I recommend making a thread where you say "Nobody can prove that turn-based combat is good in any way" and slap some flamewar bait on it. There you get some "debate" and "discussion" about it.
Nah I like debating people the old way, Ganker can't handle this anymore it seems because the only people that reply to me are baiters, that's why I mostly post on Ganker these days where people actually have balls (but don't say Black person there)
>Nah I like debating people the old way
Then make more proper thread about it.
There you go, shouldn't be too hard. You also do have the archive where you can already look up for previous discussion about it and learn already established arguments and points for your future discussion.
So dunno why you don't want to do that, handicapping yourself isn't noble and usually leads to you either being ignorant or embarrassing yourself.
So do read the already discussed points and make a thread where you want to discuss it.
But in the end you are trying to discuss something in Ganker which is 90% of the time pointless.
Also
When you start the debate with "I haven't seen a single argument for why turn based is good, ever" which is fricking impossible if you have browsed any RTWP game or turn-based game thread(like BG3 threads recently), then it is in general hard to even bother to start any discussion with you. Because you aren't doing much better than the "baiters" you are talking about and in fact just trying to make yourself look better when you start like that.
2nd option is that you aren't that person and didn't bother to make it clear in your post.
3rd option is that you are very new.
I'm off to my evening jog tho. If you want proper discussion, make a proper thread and don't reply to baiters or such. That's your best shot
>Then make more proper thread about it.
I never make threads on principle, I create my own discussion. Most thread topics I would make would probably get removed by mods for being too meta so I don't even bother
What would there be to talk about hmm? There's already Baldur's gate threads, I should waste my time making Baldur's Gate real time purity threads? I'd rather shitpost/talk about history
Black person you've been here since 2017, frick off and die. Your compulsive need to post pics like that with every post clearly shows you're some homosexual election tourist from reddit.
No. Turn-based games are as obsolete as RTwP games are dead. I prefer RTwP as a format, but that's because its strengths better complement the medium. However, that doesn't RTwP is always the best decision.
Baldur's Gate 3 is a game using the mechanics from a tabletop game designed around turn-based combat. Using turn-based combat means that they can implement the combat system in a natural way and focus more on making good content than on trying to make a half-assed combat system.
Philosophically why shouldn't actual Baldur's gate fans be upset that BG3 has nothing to do with Baldur's gate
pre scripted responses: >of course it's a Baldur's gate game, the city Baldur's gate is in it! >uh.. the tabletop is turn-based! >there are no Baldur's Gate fans!
I realize my post was made out of ignorance. I was under the assumption that the previous BG games were turn-based. So my post is a purely unintended shit post. Baldur's Gates fans have a right to be angry. I'd be too if I played the games.
I fricking hate RT With a Passion.
It was what made me not play a ton of BG 2 back in the day and more recently Pillars of Eternity too.
It's absolutely insufferable.
Fallout Tactics lets you switch between "real time with pause" and "turn based" with an option. You can play it like a classic Fallout game where everyone takes their turns and spends their AP or you can go "real time" and you spend your APs, then queue an action and wait for enough APs to regenerate to perform it.
It was only until a few years later that I actually gave the "turn based" option a try and there's a huge difference in how you aproach combat. I was actually flanking, targeting shots and using grenades or other items during combat instead of just shooting at people until they were dead.
Once you have all the time in the world to consider a static state and ponder a move, there's a lot more options that become viable to consider and the game grows more complex and satisfying as a result.
Go ask most RTS fans and they'll tell you that this happens in their genre as well. In Starcraft, there are some units like High Arkons for the Protoss that are not used very often because there's no time or attention spawn to mix their abilities and movement in the rest of the micro.
However, if the game was entirely turn based (something like Gladius, I suppose), those kind of units would probably appear far more often.
Stop trying to mix genre's just because you have a specific preference for one of them.
Tactical RPGs are about the tactics that you employ, not fast-paced action. You have Hack&Slash or Action RPG for that.
"But Anon! You can ponder the scenario in front of you all you want while the game is paused and make decisions afterwards, so isn't it the same for Turn Based and RTWP?"
If every fight was 1v1, sure enough. But since you have a party against groups of enemies, once you release pause, you'll have several things happening at the same time and if you want to process what just happened, you'll have to pause and read the logs. You're just back at "Turn Based" but you have to manually start and end the turns instead.
Neverwinter Nights 2 is a good example, especially due to the 3.5 DnD rules.
Mid-game the first 2-3 rounds are just going to be a spell spam where half your oposition dies or figuring out how many enemies did Khelgar Cleave'd and who you have to focus next. You're pretty much just pausing every 6 seconds to retarget or reposition.
>Go ask most RTS fans and they'll tell you that this happens in their genre as well. In Starcraft, there are some units like High Arkons for the Protoss that are not used very often because there's no time or attention spawn to mix their abilities and movement in the rest of the micro. >However, if the game was entirely turn based (something like Gladius, I suppose), those kind of units would probably appear far more often.
you should play other RTS besides Starcraft
for instance, Company of Heroes, the most perfect RTS ever made, real time is crucial for the experience because it tests your ability to respond quickly to a changing strategic situation, it also punishes careless mistakes
for instance, in company of heroes, you have weapon teams, mortars, machinegun, anti-tank guns, etc, these guns are very effective against their respective targets, but they have a limited arc of fire and take time to reposition and rotate, meaning you have to be very careful to avoid being flanked when using them, if an enemy flanks you machinegun, you have to react quickly, either rotate the weapon to face the flanking troops or retreat, failure to react quickly could cost you the weapon team
I HAVE to be rolling and jumping around like a moron every SECOND of gameplay I NEED to swing my blade and do an epic parry CONSTANTLY. Do NOT make me STOP MOVING AND THINK FOR MORE THAN 5 SECONDS OR I WILL START FREAKING OUT AND SCREAMING AND BREAKING SHIT.
I actually intensely dislike TB and much prefer RTwP, but now that a gaming journo has echoed the same opinion I'm pondering whether changing my previously held conviction or seppuku is the most honorable choice
pretty sure in context OP's image is about how they thought that putting a turn based mode in deadfire would take away polish time, and they were 100% right
>if you automatically doubt a previously held belief
There's zero doubt, it is correct as all my beliefs and actions are, but the shame of being associated with the scum of the known universe still hangs heavy
>I don't think they have a place in a Baldur's gate game
I can illustrate why real time sucks in one simple example any larper can understand
We're going to use Pathfinder >Cackle >A witch can cackle madly as a move action. Any creature that is within 30 feet that is under the effects of an evil eye hex, fortune hex, protective luck, or misfortune hex caused by the witch has the duration of that hex extended by 1 round.
Every round you can cast Evil Eye (standard action) and Cackle (move action). Round is 6 seconds. Casting for Evil Eye is 3 seconds. Cackle is instantaneous.
Every round you can additionally use (free action) and (standard action) both are instantaneous. You can use Quicken Metamagic to turn spell into (swift action).
So in those 6 seconds your character can click >Evil Eye (standard action) >Quicken Fireball (swift action) >Cackle (move action) >(free action)
And every round you will use Cackle if you want to have Evil Eye online.
This is just one character. You have 6 characters and all of them use the same action rules. Wait a second...actually in good turn based game your enemies obeys same rules. Now imagine playing such game in real time. your enemies in real time with pause kusoge don't use any of those actions at all. At best they use one swift buff. All can do is unga bunga.
You can compare that to Diablo (any of them) where your oponents pretty much just have a basic attack and maybe a special ability they use every now and then. All extra depth must be added by passive abilities so they don't have to cast or use anything besides the basic attacks.
>I can illustrate why real time sucks >Uses a game system that was entirely built around turn-based combat
Your example is as idiotic as saying swords are better than guns at killing people because the guns aren't loaded.
Isn't that where homebrew kicks in and you nerf the spell? >if mages were competent they'd melt you
some of the most popular mods for baldur's gate were AI changes and balance changes to make fights harder, not easier. I mean the beauty of real time is you can fast forward the fight until you have a winning strategy against even stat monster enemies by DPSing them down.
Rather than being a criticism of real time having even moderately powerful enemies is a problem in turn based, which is probably why the game gives you 30 different debuffs you can put on enemies
They can make better encounters with turn based. I imagine its harder to code good real time AI responding to a constant stream of changing variables vs turn based AI.
Turn based is obsolete, yes. BG3 has good sales and playercount right now because of shilling and the viral bear sex meme. If you look at achievements, almost nobody is playing the game.
Turn based has turned them off already. Most probably didn't even know it was turn based.
There is no defense for RTwP, turn based systems are clear in what they are attempting aka devs are lazy and just port tabletop rules into the game, RT games are balanced around having limited time for reaction, RTwP is like that shitty kid who want to play "adult" games like his older brother RT but he's a brainlet so he can't pass a single level without cheating.
So no, in the ideal world turn based games would be limited to autismo tabletop sims and every other RPG would have real time combat without some dumb pause, but we don't live in the ideal world and most devs can't balance shit so turn based is the best you can get since doing something as simple as making AI use healing spell when allies hp is below 40% is beyond the most developers.
RTwP speeds up gameplay so that the combat->exploration is closer to seamless while still being tactical, slow a real time game down enough (which you can do in games like pillars of eternity) and it's basically turn based. On higher difficulties you're forced on turning the game into a glorified turn based game with how much you're pausing, only you're not forced into that from the get-go.
>RTwP speeds up gameplay
If you like simplifying the game by having your party members perform actions automatically without your input, you should check out other bangers like Final Fantasy 13, Super Auto Pets, or just play Total War and click auto resolve every time an encounter happens. Hell you can just go play Idle Champions of the Forgotten Realms and stay in a D&D setting. Either way, you should know that people make fun of you behind your back.
>or just play Total War and click auto resolve every time an encounter happens
That'd be more akin to TB then the actual combat, where you constantly pause to analyze what's happening and give orders
Stop being moronic
I think having the actual feeling of progression in the game reflected in the way you play the game. When you first start you might pause for a gibberling and then eventually you're just running through them. Or when you get to a werewolf hive that would one shot you and you're tanking the entire ship and filling its belly with heaps of mangled bodies
The best feeling turn based games have is casting fireball and one hitting everything inside of it (which also exists in real time)
>RT games are balanced around having limited time for reaction, RTwP is like that shitty kid who want to play "adult" games like his older brother RT but he's a brainlet so he can't pass a single level without cheating.
But that limited time can vary greatly. Real Time systems are filled with tools for controlling the pace of the game. Pause functionality is one of those tools, and it enables more complex micromanagement, in the same vein as quick keys or control groups. If you play a Total War game or any other RTS with sufficiently large scope, you'll see pause functionality and speed control.
> Pause functionality is one of those tools, and it enables more complex micromanagement, in the same vein as quick keys
That's the thing, you have over 30 buttons on your keyboard, that's millions possible inputs, you don't really need pause unless you're playing with controller. >If you play a Total War game or any other RTS with sufficiently large scope, you'll see pause functionality and speed control.
Only in singleplayer and even then the game won't let you issue commands during the pause on highest difficulty.
>you have over 30 buttons on your keyboard, that's millions possible inputs, you don't really need pause unless you're playing with controller
It depends a lot on the game. Older games don't have as many hotkeys, so you need pause functionality to use features like special abilities. >Only in singleplayer and even then the game won't let you issue commands during the pause on highest difficulty
The latter feature is only in the newer games.
I think all RPGs should be turn based. Otherwise they should focus on being action games. >RPG >the only thing character builds are is how much health you have and how much damage you do
Theres more gamey shit you can do with turn based that you cant do with real time, even with pause. The combat is simply a field in which the choices youve made are made making your character are laid bare in RPGs, in non turn based, you can get away with just being good at the game, your build is second to your capabilty of playing the game. You can be level 1 and kill the strongst enemy by just timing rolls, or aiming good. Thats not what RPGs should be, where your build choices are secondary to your ability to simply play the game well.
Did you know that dnd was purposefully made to be garbage so that some fat israelite wouldn't need to pay royalties to the game's actual creator?
It's true, look it up.
Isn't real time way more popular when compared to Turn-based? If anything, turn-based games are the ones that need defending.
Everyone nowadays shits on Turn-based games
I hate the attitude of "all games should be for everyone". I can't get into rts games, even though conceptually I find them cool I just don't enjoy almost any of them, and the ones I do would probably fall under "rts for people that don't like rts". But that's fine, I don't want all rts games to become like those few simplistic ones that I like. But these people want everything to come down to their level, I hate it.
holy based
every game "for everyone" would ultimately end up bland and uninteresting, but thats what guarantees the most sales since you'll be covering every potential buyer group
>oh no you cannot add killable children in our PEGI 18 game about postapocalypse, where people cannibal and rape each other!!! >oh no you cannot add complex story with gray moral characters, because the whole concept of moral relativism will fly over our core audiences read - moronic goys heads! >oh no, you cannot add engaging and challenging gameplay with mechanics so deep it's a mariana trench at this point, because candy crush housewives and FIFA players might not buy the next game in this franchise which we most certainly be milking
Turn based combat is an archaic mechanic from a time when CPUs weren't powerful enough to deliver any kind of complex real-time action. I'm not sure why they still make so many games with it.
No, but we should have new fantasy rpg IPs that aren't turn based games. There hasn't been a huge fantasy rpg game that wasn't turn based since skyrim nor the level of rpg mechanics in fps/tps like New Vegas.
I don't know why people still do this song and dance anymore, these people come here only to mock others for having any kind of beliefs or thoughts on anything, i bet the same people shitting on turn-based games now are the exact same people that shat on Final Fantasy for not being turn-based anymore
The userbase here is such a fricking farce, im sure some moron will say "Ganker isn't one person" but yes you are, you are the exact same type of homosexual replying to your exact same irony-overdosed clone over and over again and i don't know why, i guess im not as autistic as you
okay i don't care about pause but holy frick i wish the game would stop fricking running in the background when i open the menu, i seriously hate seeing these stupid fricks run around AND use voicelines while i'm trying to go afk
the game not pausing while opening the save/load menu is moronic
Same shit different day.
Same arguments. Same bait. Same OP. Same games. Same strawmans. Same shitposting. Same stances. Same posters.
Same shit different day.
I think I'm too smart for turn based combat. My brain is not that slow for that kind of gameplay. I need to make fast decisions to have fun, being in constant chaos.
I used to swear by turn based combat but I've been playing Pathfinder with RTwP and while I get overwhelmed sometimes it feels a lot better and faster than turn based
Turn based games are more strategic, and having played Pathfindder, which used tabletop rules and gave you the option of both real time with pause and turn based, it become immediately apparent that turn based was the way the game was meant to be played. It's really a night and day difference.
The idea that real time is always better is utter nonsense. Some of the world's most classic and enduring games are turn based.
>friend does 'unbeatable move if you don't know what to do' sequence or some shit >haha horsie comes out after bishop >friend goes 'wtf you said you didn't know'
i don't think a single turn ahead and somehow manage to get close ties, i usually lose though because i'm easily baited
The last RTwP game I played was Diofield, and it was a mess. Playing on the hardest difficulty, the enemy can basically never touch you if you know what you’re doing. Granted, it’s a Japanese game, and they suck shit at balancing their rpgs, but I don’t think the actual gameplay itself is bad - it’s the balancing. RTwP is much superior to turn-based in regards to pacing, but I’m not sure how you can add complexity to its systems without everything falling apart, or pausing so frequently to queue actions that it basically becomes turn based.
I don't mind the actual combat in BG3 but initiating it is incredibly painful. it's impossible to plan a proper ambush and if you do you get punished for it. Lame. Kind of regretting making my MC a sneakygirl
>[CONTROVERSIAL STATEMENT]
>Heres Why.
seems thats all you learn if you study journalism.
the equivalent of this shit in video documentaries
>It all started at the beginning
Woah, this guy sounds smart.
I like this guy's stuff
>god is dead
HELLO R-EDDIT!
Congratulations anon you got the joke. Sort of.
>hehe it's meta humor *tilts up glasses*
even more leddit
They don't even study journalism, all of these game bloggers only got their jobs through nepotism and collusion who only serve to regurgitate whatever crap their bosses tell them to write. Shit, they don't even write their own articles anymore, they've used ghost-writing interns for years and now they rely on AI to do the work for them.
The AI shit is actually funny. Didn't they fall for this over some fake WoW news recently too?
>journalism
what? are you moronic
they used to be banned. they still are against the rules but mods are all discord trannoids
>Published February 28, 2020
people do these clickbait threads and I don't understand why
The OP is clickbait but the discussion of RTwP vs TB has been ongoing since fricking BG1 and it was recently reignited by the third game.
Turn based with poz or real time with poz it's still pozzed troony shit regardless.
This this this. You tell them them schizo sister!
You don't belong here, brainrotted politics homosexual.
This is easily the goty. Zelda will probably get the awards, but this is a massively better game. You being angry at options just shows how little you care about video games actual quality, you just care about "TROONS TROONS AAAAHH THERES WOMEN AND GAYS IS THAT A Black person AAAAAAAAAH"
>This is easily the goty.
come on man
rng diceroll shit is awful
i haven't had LESS fun with a game all year
>inb4 get good
even if my gameplay was perfect i would still get assraped by missing a 95% hit chance and die
>You being angry at options
bet you're a troon who gets mad at boob sliders
Whatever you say troony
The game let me dominate a stronk female warrior and made her submit to me in bed
How exactly is this game pozzed?
>homosexuals
Were in video games even before wokeness
>Trannies
Outside the character creator there are none
Additionlly, you can kill everyone in the game. So if you really hate gays and Black folk that much you can just kill them.
Hard to play action games with just one hand.
I like real time with pause
I prefer real-time without pause, but I wouldn't want every game to be like that. It's nice to have some variety.
>but I wouldn't want every game to be like that.
but you would want baldurs gate to be like that, THE real-time with pause game.
but of course, BG3 isnt baldurs gate in any way but the eponymous.
I wouldn't, because the game is designed from the ground up with turn-based gameplay in mind. Changing it wouldn't work, not without changing up the whole design of the game.
>but I wouldn't want every game to be like that. It's nice to have some variety.
nowadays it seems most CRPGs, and strategy games are turn based, relatively few real time titles
>Are turn based games simply obsolete?
They're anachronistic and lazy most of the time, but it makes sense in a DND context since it's emulating tabletop rules. Would be cool to see the game with RTWP though.
Its great. I can literally go for a smoke any time. They are also way chiller than OH OH YOU DIDN'T ROLL/BARRY FRAME PERFECTLY GET FRICKED LMAO
>a defence
what is going on with editors...
He's not speaking Clapistani English (Simplified)
Spelling words properly and not the 70IQ way?
ESL
>Defense = color
>Defence = colour
Remember this when trying to throw off chat model identifiers
I don't care for turn-based combat, but it doesn't make me lose interest in a game by itself.
What really grinds my gears is card-games inside of video games, that's beyond moronic. Flip cards over that represent monsters and read the attacks instead of making those monsters and having them do those attacks in real time? The card games are imitating what we can actually do with video games today. You're using your great technology to pretend you're playing a game where you pretend you're seeing something that PC/console is capable of delivering. It's a purposeful downgrade. What's next? Downloadable vouchers to use at your local arcade get included with your AAA title?
Slay the Spire is one of the greatest games of all time your argument is invalid and stupid
/tg/ here, your taste is shit. That's not even in top 3 card games of the year it came out, let alone "greatest" anything.
/noonegivesafrickhere/, you're wild. Slay the Spire is godlike.
>The card games are imitating what we can actually do with video games today.
Such as? I'm trying to think of what would exactly translate deck building and resource management as you say, and the only thing that really comes to mind is RTS games with how you get resources and decide on what to build and then what you have access to. And even then it's not a perfect translation of the mechanics of card games.
Very based opinion. I too hate it but couldn't conjure into words why beyond "its lame". Thanks anon.
Same here anon. It just seems like a silly system to waste time with virtually. Like the fantasy football of video games.
It's based on D&D, which is inherently a turn based experience. What the frick did these people want, Dark Souls 4?
this is why keeping troons out of hobbies is important
Original Balder’s Gate was real time, so it’s not a completely out of left-field complaint.
The implication that BG3 isn't a gormlessly different game from BG1 that's cynically piggy-backing off the franchise's reputation to drive sales is insulting.
The fact that you think it being called BG did anything for sales is actually hilarious.
It did, the average moron buys things based on brand, not if the product actually works. It's actually amazing how the average moron will never change brands because they're "comfortable" with something or they "know" the brand.
That's why half the consumer grade shit in the US breaks in 2 weeks because it's made in china but still has the old brand names
The biggest issue is that you corporate slave cucks have 0 quality control.
Baldurs Gate name does not have mainstream appeal in 2023, it's funny that you think it does, grandpa.
It doesn't have to, you don't understand basic human psychology. Impulse buyers like the child target audience of this game will hear Baldur's Gate and use that subconsciously to strike down their inhibitions for impulse buying the game because "they've heard the name before"
If I asked my normalgay acquantences they would've maybe heard of fortnite or dark souls but not baldurs gate
bro is trying so hard to sound smart
>basic human psychology
>smart
>It's actually amazing how the average moron will never change brands because they're "comfortable" with something or they "know" the brand.
are you working for AMD by any chance?
Funny, I hate AMD because my first ever GPU from them died in like 8 months.
>wonder why my mixer that's older than me is still working fine
>read label
>"made in the netherlands"
Ditto for almost any appliance I have that's lasted more than a few years (replace netherlands with any non china country)
To be fair I have a power washer engine that's like 5 years old they snuck under my nose with "Made in PRC" that hasn't gone supercritical and embedded molten aluminum into my shins yet
Chinks are capable of making quality stuff. It's just that no one moves production to china for the quality, they do it to squeeze a few more pennies out of profit margins. Being manufactured in china is just a sign that the company doesn't care that deeply about quality.
China sells stainless steel on the market meant for technical stuff so the measurements have to be precise with wildly varying degrees of thickness and when questioned about it they go "it's soviet grade" or something to that order
The terrible revelation that I share a planet with individuals that are as easy to deceive, or as eager to deceive, as yourself is profoundly troubling to me.
are you stupid?
Who gives a shit about Baldur's Gate 1 & 2 in 2023?
"Journalists" should all be set on fire
Why would it be anything else?
DnD is turn based.
RTWP would have saved the gameplay of BG3.
RTWPkek spent years making garbage threads like this one on Ganker every day. And every time he got BTFOed by logic and fakts. Same shit happens on RPG Codex. You just can't win. RTWP exist only as bio product of RTS boom during end of 90s. To catch bigger audience of normalgays RTWP was made. It's inferior in every aspect to TB. Even so called "trash mobs" exist because of RTWP.
I haven't seen a single argument for why turn based is good, ever
There's not a single argument for RTWP's superiority in this thread besides "i like it"
Thanks for proving my point
It's faster, doesn't make you repeat the same actions over and over again, doesn't make you wait for enemy turns, and still allows for tactical decision making. It's just straight up better than turn based
>doesn't make you repeat the same actions over and over again
Kek
>I haven't seen a single argument
You did see all of them.
They're in Ganker archives.
There is no point to repost them again.
You will remake same thread next day.
thanks for proving my point
You're begging for (You)s.
I'm begging you to defend your position instead of baiting, but you can't because you're a terminal baiter, thus proving my assertion there isn't actually anything you can say to defend turn based games versus regular games
You're not getting anything. Just enjoy empty (You)s. And make this thread again.
I'm not OP
and I'm still right that there's not a single reason why anybody should think turn based is better
I'm also saging ever post so you can sage with me and OP wont get any attention
>and I'm still right that there's not a single
There is. Use this tool
>https://arch.b4k.co/v/
You can find walls of text explaining why. Feel free to visit RPG shitcodex too.
Hint: watch rtwp gameplay above easy mode on youtube. The only good game with rtwp is troony and PoE2
Have yet to see a single justification why every game should be a generic action movie game like TLOU and FFXVI. There are infinitely more over-the-shoulder boring slop to chose from, so why does one game not being the same formulaic forgettable shit piss off the FOTM zoomer. They get suicidal FOMO the second something doesn’t cater specifically to them so they seethe nonstop about it. It wasn’t made for you, go play something else.
>every game should be a generic action movie game
I think turn based games definitely have a place in gaming, I don't think they have a place in a Baldur's gate game
I was specifically replying to that person because I know they didn't actually have a response for "why" turn based games are good, probably because they've never actually played one and were baiting
>boohoo dnd games plays like dnd
have a nice day. Turn based is better for most rpgs that aren't leh cuhrazy action games. It also more thought and actual role play during combat but more effectively than other methods. Not to mention, not everyone is an ADD stricken zoomer who has to see flashing lights every .5 seconds to have fun or be engaged.
I don't know why I'm arguing though, you clearly are very aware why this game is turn-based and know that there is not "objective" better between turn based and RT. You're just a shit stirring homosexual looking for replies.
>Have yet to see a single justification why every game should be a generic action movie game
They shouldn't, but your common typical consumer will always choose less complicated games.
That's why Spider Man 2 will sell 10x better, that's why God of War sells better and even FF16 that was hated by fans still sells better moron-kun.
FFXVI is a colossal flop and was completely memory holed a week after release. It sold like shit and no one will ever make a remake out of it in 10+ years. It’s forgettable shovelware that failed in every regard.
wasn't it actually pretty good performance wise for an exclusive?
Not at all, there are tons of posts explaining the console user base for every recent Final Fantasy game it was not even close. Even if you just use one console as the counterpoint it still sold less comparatively. It failed so hard the xiv-troons have actually started trying to gaslight people to save face by lying about it selling 4 million when it hasn’t shipped/sold anything beyond 3 million since June 28th.
Final fantasy 12 has had 17 years to build up sales, it seems you're ignoring metrics to try and pretend 16 was worse performing than it is
It was outsold by Tomb Raider and that game didn’t cost over a $100 million to produce, yet it was also considered a disappointment. FFXVI is worse than a flop, it’s an expensive flop like TLOU2.
It was, it has an PS5 attachment on the level of ToTK and was deemed a success by SE and sells as much only on PS5 as biggest multiplatform Resident Evil 4.
It just Barry seething as always.
I'm glad FFXVI success makes you seethe this much kek
Care to debunk this pic
>Care to debunk this pic
The picture which shows that a game being on a market for 20 years have more sold copies than a game being on a market for 3 days?
What is to debunk here, troony?
It's incredibly obvious.
You can control multiple characters every single action.
Yes yes, this is good. But then you run into the problem of every single fight is a slog and "clutter fights"
Turn based games have less fights. Owlcat as I remember talked about it recently in Rogue Trader interviews. Every fight must be carefully designed. Hell look at BG3.
>owlcat
>careful encounter design
lmao
Rogue Trader is tb only bro. Are you living under rock?
Never even heard of it. Are you under the impression that Owlcat make good games
>40k
might have to check it out
>Turn based games have less fights.
That's an inherent restriction of turn-based systems, though. Nothing prevents real-time combat from having fights designed equally as carefully. The "carefully designed encounters" is a cope that tries to present an objective weakness as if it's a strength.
>Nothing prevents real-time combat from having fights designed equally as carefully.
You want to click mobs for dopamine hit. Otherwise why even play real-time for tactical combat?
To roleplay?
>Otherwise why even play real-time for tactical combat
Real-time has plenty of tactical depth. Try playing any real time strategy game.
>Try playing any real time strategy game.
Heh.
So you haven't played any. Good to know
>missing the point
You're really grasping at straws hard. BTW your apm clicker is pretty shitty CRPG compared to FAS
You haven't played any strategy games, and probably think tic-tac-toe is the height of tactical depth.
>You haven't played any strategy games
Ah I see. You don't know what FAS is. Funny, asiaticbro. But really makes sense why you're in this thread.
>You don't know what FAS is.
Fight Action Sandbox? It's a shitty indie action game with 30 reviews, and I bet you're some sort of shill for it
newbie
Oh, so you're referring to Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. Sorry, but I can't do anything about that for you.
Maybe your mother shouldn't have downed 5 bottles of vodka a week when she had you.
>hurrr durr
Next time don't bring rts into discussion when you don't know shit, underage moron.
>No argument
I would say your moronation is astounding, but it does explain the fact that you're talking about a literal who game from April of this year as if it's board culture.
It's logic puzzles vs button mashing. I'd take turn based over that action shit any day.
>it's good because it's boring
Bro, why don't we even eliminate any visual actions, just make all games text adventures
Your favorite rpg games suck ass, but whatever.
They're better than yours, you silly billy
Anybody implying there aren't "things to figure out" in a real time game is a moron. Everything still operates on a turn basis allowing devs to tailor encounters
it’s good for low iq morons who can’t think quickly in the moment
Don't forget that RTwP is also inferior to a real time action game in every aspect too. Remember that if you mention turn based then RTwPgays will cry and talk shit, and if you also mention action games they will either just talk shit about turn based or complain about it being "too hard" if it was real time because they are all huge homosexuals.
>RTwP is also inferior to a real time action game in every aspect too.
It isn't. Real time action games only let you control 1 character. RTwP lets you control multiple characters.
>if you also mention action games
It isn't relevant when discussing CRPGs. CRPGs are devolved strategy games, just as TTRPGs are devolved wargames. Comparing CRPG combat to action combat is as asinine as comparing football to chess.
RTwp is always the inferior option.
It tries to mix RT with TB but gets rid of the main draw of both options by doing so.
When done right actually gets the main draw of TB, without the dullness
>When done right
Name 1 (one).
Icewind Dale
Neverwinter Nights
Baldur's Gate
Shit, DAO pulled it in a 3D environment.
>You mean the complete, utter control of every slight action on both sides and combat is often about denying your opponents turns?
If you're gonna simplify it like that, isn't that every combat that exists? what is boxing if not hitting your opponent and making sure he can't hit you.
>that would mean RTwp has very little to no real time aspects at all. It just auto-plays
But it doesn't, demonstrably so, you set up active skills, change positions, combine attacks...
>Icewind Dale
>Neverwinter Nights
>Baldur's Gate
>DAO
Ok. Still waiting for you to name one "done right" rtwp game.
>Literally some the most well regarded CRPGs of all time
Cope
Yeah. Not for their combat, though.
That is true. Icewind dale only succeeded due to waifus
Yeah, everyone hated every second of playing those games
Great argument.
Combat is easily the worst part of early infinity engine games, get out of your time bubble, gramps.
>get out of your time bubble, gramps
You say that, while whining that a system that replicates people talking with each other is better
Turn-based is better, yes. You've been given several reasons why already. Meanwhile your only defence of rtwp is "hurr durr them's be well-regarded arr pee gee" nostalgia schlop.
>Turn-based is better, yes
It very much isn't.
>You've been given several reasons why already.
None of them remotely convincing. Yours earlier was "it's old"
>Meanwhile your only defence of rtwp is "hurr durr them's be well-regarded arr pee gee" nostalgia schlop.
Kek. What a moron. Ofc some of the most well regarded examples of the genre wouldn't matter, not when my gacha games use TB and they're so much better
It is. You're repeating yourself and getting mad at scenarios that you create in your head.
>rtwp is superior because it gives the player more choice
What?
>you don't get bogged into combat over trivial encounters
Games that are made with turn-based in mind don't have "trivial" aka "trash" encounters to begin with.
rtwp gives you both real time and turnbased
and Baldur's Gate: Original Sin is literally full of trash encounters, because that's actually part of how DnD combat
Oh, you're trolling. Goodbye.
utterly assblasted
>rtwp gives you both real time and turnbased
It doesn't, it gives you the worst of both, a real-time game that's not balanced around playing in real time.
that's false, those older crpgs play nothing like tabletop, they were actually rebalanced because real 2nd ed AD&D is heavily steeped in autistic minutiae
rtwp helps to alleviate some of that because spending 3 rounds missing attacks against level 1 enemies feels like shit
I'm saying that RTWP games don't feel good when playing without ever pausing, but pausing doesn't help it feel good, either. It's a bandaid over an awkward system.
and turn based doesn't feel good when you apply the DnD combat model to a video game system (except 4th edition but that's a whole other discussion)
DnD is built on shitty encounters with challenge rating bloat, but it's one of those "fun with friends" things where you don't notice it at the table with the addition of combat being less heavy at the table because it can take a long time to resolve
>a turn based system doesn't feel good as a turn based game
The worst part about all the old RTWP games is that they're based on 6-second rounds in the background despite having real-time gameplay moment to moment. It's why they feel so bad to play compared with a turn based game that just embraces the turn based mechanics and presents the game in the way it was meant to be played.
yeah, spending 20-30 seconds to finish a combat feels so much worse than spending that same amount of time to just finish a round
What I'm hearing from this is that you just don't want to play an RPG or think about strategy, preferring to just mash buttons and get through combat as fast as possible.
there is no more strategy to be found in turnbased games than there is in real time ones, real time just also needs you to have good reaction time
thankfully for rpg fans, the devs behind crags knew that the average person who likes those has the reaction time of a drunk toddler and gave you a pause button so you can plan out how you're gonna auto attack those goblins to death
If RTWP games were true real-time games (like RTS, ARPGs, MOBAs, etc) I think a better argument could be made for them. Like I said, though, the biggest problem is that they play out in real time and you react in real time but everything is actually ticking away by 6-second rounds under the hood. It makes the game feel sluggish and unresponsive, because you can react perfectly to an enemy's attack and move out of the way before the animation lands but it won't matter because the to-hit roll already happened 2 seconds ago so no matter what you do you'll get hit with that attack. On the other end it can feel unresponsive when you select an action to use and have to wait a few seconds before it actually starts. What you see is not what you get and when you throw pause into the mix you just add more sluggishness on top of this awkward system.
>It is
It is not
>You're repeating yourself
Only because you're deaf dumb and blind.
>and getting mad at scenarios that you create in your head.
Lmao, "u mad" to you too
Prove that it isn't.
at least tried, but he made it too obvious that he's trolling. Calling me names and getting mad at me being a "gacha player" (something that you made up in your head) isn't proving anything, btw.
>prove that it isn't
I have.
>Calling me names and getting mad at me being a "gacha player"
Oh my God you hypocritical homosexual, your entire argument consisted of calling me Grandpa, cope harder
>I have.
Where, gramps?
In all my posts
But all you ever said in your posts was along the lines of "old good", gramps. I think your dementia's kicking in.
>But all you ever said in your posts was along the lines of "old good"
No I explained why, then gave examples of to illustrate my point, meanwhile all you did this entire conversation was type the tired "ok boomer" meme only echoed by the gayest of homosexuals
Damn, that's crazy.
Isn't it about time you've taken a nap, gramps?
your concession has been noted
>arguing that giving players choice and agency is better is trolling
what a butthurt little gay you are
turn based is inferior because it turns every fight into a slog
rtwp is superior because it gives the player more choice so that you don't get bogged into combat over trivial encounters, but also can go turnbased when needed
the entire point of iwd was combat
Had you only named DAO you'd've at least made some sort of sense, but naming iwd, nwn and bg first just shows that you've no fricking clue what you're talking about.
Yeah, you're right, it's just some of the most well regarded CRPGs of all time, I'm sure homosexualy John Anon from Ganker knows better
You mean the complete, utter control of every slight action on both sides and combat is often about denying your opponents turns?
At best that would mean RTwp has very little to no real time aspects at all. It just auto-plays turns by set repeating actions akin to FF12's gambit system.
Which is passable, but more boring than full TB.
once again i will inform you that there is one good rtwp game and that is dragon age origins and its not because its rtwp its because you can "code" the ai behavior yourself so the weakness of rtwp is reduced
I don't even get what you're saying, that lack of auto setups on players behavior in RT that's the problem?
Also, yeah dragon Age likely was the peak of it, too bad BW decided shitty action button smashing was the way to go
>that lack of auto setups on players behavior in RT that's the problem?
mostly the fact that rtwp ends up being an autoattack simulator where you pause to perfectly place a spell every now and then
in dragon age it runs much smoother because you can "code" the ai to place important spells like shielding your 10% hp tank or casting an emergency stun when surrounded
>mostly the fact that rtwp ends up being an autoattack simulator where you pause to perfectly place a spell every now and then
Why does everyone say that? You set up spells and active skills all the time in these games, martial classes have abilities too
>Game aims to adapt D&D 5e to a video game
>To the point where it can be used to play actual DMed campaigns of D&D using custom games
>Surprised a D&D 5e tool with a built-in module is turn based
Yes. They are an artifact of a time when computers weren't powerful enough to crunch the numbers in real-time.
Nowadays, "turn-based" is more akin to "turn-cringe", if you will.
this is bait, and poor bait at that. surely you can do better anon
video game journalists are obsolete
>Square Enix: We can't make turn based RPGs anymore, the audience won't buy them
>Western dev churns out turn based crpg slop with waifu romances at 106GB in 2023
>It sells like crazy
Square Enix: T-t-hat's different.
>People love the original BGT
>RTWP is the antichrist and shit and unplayable
Huh?
Frick no if anything is returning RPG back to its heavy strategy turn based roots. Unlike Square Enix who turning all its RPG franchises in Devil May cry button spam a thon.
Pathfinder figured it out. Let me do both.
I agree. Adds a lot of versatility for different playthroughs, is always a nice option to have.
>Pathfinder figured it out.
No. Pathfinder designed around RTWP. The TB in Pathfinder is trash.
>pathfinder
Brah, Might and Magic had that.
No.That's why new turn-based games are made constantly.
Same thing with point&click. It's not because it's old that it's inherently inferior. It's just a type of gameplay among others.
Some people simply have brains that makes them unable to enjoy slow games because they need constant stimulation.
I find turn-based games extremely comfy. And, with RTS, it's pretty much the only genre that asks you to plan things out way in advance. It would be sad if we lost that because planning in RTWP definitely isn't the same, it's more like some kind of constant adjustment.
The people b***hing about “le turn based is le bad” are brainless zoomer r*dditards that would b***h about chess not being like Rock-em Sock-em Robots in the before times. They don’t have the capacity appreciate something because they are too dumb to understand it’s merits. Their entire argument is “I like this other thing, why isn’t everything like the thing I like, it’s not fair!”. I truly despise everyone born after 2000.
id rather read a book then play a turn based game. which I do.
If you really think about it, Ganker is like a turnbased game
>new
That's a SNES game.
>zoomer Black person brains cannot into turn based
This has been known. They are stupid monkey dog pebians who shouldnt be allowed access to video games in the first place
Turn based only sucks ass.
Battle Network has the best system.
No
I would not say the problem is the game being turn-based. The problem is it being turn-based and having DnD rules where the difficulty is not figuring strategy and tactics but having knowledge of abilities and how to make broken builds and interactions which suits more real time gameplay.
Or just save scumming which is what virtually everyone who plays this trash does.
WoTC wanting their on-brand 5e frickfest is definitely a huge detriment to the game, but lets be real here, it's larian and they wouldn't have done any better on their own
Somewhat valid point
turn-based is as obsolete as animation
it's easier to make something cheap and overwhelm you with canned spectacle than it is to put a ton of effort into something where the minor details can be noticed.
neither are obsolete, but the audience that spends the most money today doesn't appreciate them.
>buy a turn based RPG
>GUH THIS SUCKS THAT ITS TURN BASED!
these are the people developers make games for.
>real time with pause
That literally is just turn based but with an extra step
But with worse AI, trash mobs everywhere, fricked up mechanics, broken flow and pause abuse.
Depends
Bros...was Square Enix right? Are turn based games ba-ba-bad?
To the bone, baby
Square enix are morons who committed sudoku to their studio after dominating the world of vidya for years. All they can do now is reboot their old games that were actually good.
Ability to switch between RTWP and Turn-Based is best of both worlds.
If game is designed around turn-based it would not have trash encounter so rtwpgays would be bored. The swtich between turn based and real time will be abused (see how it's done in Pathfinder) to gain unfair advantage against enemies. The ai in real time mode would work in tb game (people would abuse real time for ez AI).
WELCOME TO THE KUMMU FIELDS N'WA
NTA, but are you more interested in seeing the arguments for turn-based or more into arguing about them?
Because if it's former, you have archives for multiple threads. If you just wanna argue, or "debate", just say so. I just have a feeling like with many people on this site, you have decided already that you don't like turn-based stuff and it's bad.
If however you actually want a discussion about it, I recommend making a thread where you say "Nobody can prove that turn-based combat is good in any way" and slap some flamewar bait on it. There you get some "debate" and "discussion" about it.
Otherwise, use the archive. You'll find all arguments and points you are looking for from there.
>If however you actually want a discussion about it, I recommend making a thread where you say "Nobody can prove that turn-based combat is good in any way" and slap some flamewar bait on it. There you get some "debate" and "discussion" about it.
Nah I like debating people the old way, Ganker can't handle this anymore it seems because the only people that reply to me are baiters, that's why I mostly post on Ganker these days where people actually have balls (but don't say Black person there)
>Nah I like debating people the old way
Then make more proper thread about it.
There you go, shouldn't be too hard. You also do have the archive where you can already look up for previous discussion about it and learn already established arguments and points for your future discussion.
So dunno why you don't want to do that, handicapping yourself isn't noble and usually leads to you either being ignorant or embarrassing yourself.
So do read the already discussed points and make a thread where you want to discuss it.
But in the end you are trying to discuss something in Ganker which is 90% of the time pointless.
Also
When you start the debate with "I haven't seen a single argument for why turn based is good, ever" which is fricking impossible if you have browsed any RTWP game or turn-based game thread(like BG3 threads recently), then it is in general hard to even bother to start any discussion with you. Because you aren't doing much better than the "baiters" you are talking about and in fact just trying to make yourself look better when you start like that.
2nd option is that you aren't that person and didn't bother to make it clear in your post.
3rd option is that you are very new.
I'm off to my evening jog tho. If you want proper discussion, make a proper thread and don't reply to baiters or such. That's your best shot
>Then make more proper thread about it.
I never make threads on principle, I create my own discussion. Most thread topics I would make would probably get removed by mods for being too meta so I don't even bother
Sounds like you're just a whiney homosexual too cowardly to make his own thread lmao
What would there be to talk about hmm? There's already Baldur's gate threads, I should waste my time making Baldur's Gate real time purity threads? I'd rather shitpost/talk about history
Black person you've been here since 2017, frick off and die. Your compulsive need to post pics like that with every post clearly shows you're some homosexual election tourist from reddit.
No. Turn-based games are as obsolete as RTwP games are dead. I prefer RTwP as a format, but that's because its strengths better complement the medium. However, that doesn't RTwP is always the best decision.
Baldur's Gate 3 is a game using the mechanics from a tabletop game designed around turn-based combat. Using turn-based combat means that they can implement the combat system in a natural way and focus more on making good content than on trying to make a half-assed combat system.
Yeah, thats why bg 3 sold millions, while poe is dead in the water
I never imagined the fights in TTRPGS going like they do in any video game depictions like this.
It sucks that Mario Kart 8 is a racing game
Philosophically why shouldn't actual Baldur's gate fans be upset that BG3 has nothing to do with Baldur's gate
pre scripted responses:
>of course it's a Baldur's gate game, the city Baldur's gate is in it!
>uh.. the tabletop is turn-based!
>there are no Baldur's Gate fans!
I realize my post was made out of ignorance. I was under the assumption that the previous BG games were turn-based. So my post is a purely unintended shit post. Baldur's Gates fans have a right to be angry. I'd be too if I played the games.
I fricking hate RT With a Passion.
It was what made me not play a ton of BG 2 back in the day and more recently Pillars of Eternity too.
It's absolutely insufferable.
I am incredibly happy BG 3 is turn-based.
Zoomers will utterly destroy the strategy genre due to their awful attention spans.
Fallout Tactics lets you switch between "real time with pause" and "turn based" with an option. You can play it like a classic Fallout game where everyone takes their turns and spends their AP or you can go "real time" and you spend your APs, then queue an action and wait for enough APs to regenerate to perform it.
It was only until a few years later that I actually gave the "turn based" option a try and there's a huge difference in how you aproach combat. I was actually flanking, targeting shots and using grenades or other items during combat instead of just shooting at people until they were dead.
Once you have all the time in the world to consider a static state and ponder a move, there's a lot more options that become viable to consider and the game grows more complex and satisfying as a result.
Go ask most RTS fans and they'll tell you that this happens in their genre as well. In Starcraft, there are some units like High Arkons for the Protoss that are not used very often because there's no time or attention spawn to mix their abilities and movement in the rest of the micro.
However, if the game was entirely turn based (something like Gladius, I suppose), those kind of units would probably appear far more often.
Stop trying to mix genre's just because you have a specific preference for one of them.
Tactical RPGs are about the tactics that you employ, not fast-paced action. You have Hack&Slash or Action RPG for that.
"But Anon! You can ponder the scenario in front of you all you want while the game is paused and make decisions afterwards, so isn't it the same for Turn Based and RTWP?"
If every fight was 1v1, sure enough. But since you have a party against groups of enemies, once you release pause, you'll have several things happening at the same time and if you want to process what just happened, you'll have to pause and read the logs. You're just back at "Turn Based" but you have to manually start and end the turns instead.
Neverwinter Nights 2 is a good example, especially due to the 3.5 DnD rules.
Mid-game the first 2-3 rounds are just going to be a spell spam where half your oposition dies or figuring out how many enemies did Khelgar Cleave'd and who you have to focus next. You're pretty much just pausing every 6 seconds to retarget or reposition.
>Go ask most RTS fans and they'll tell you that this happens in their genre as well. In Starcraft, there are some units like High Arkons for the Protoss that are not used very often because there's no time or attention spawn to mix their abilities and movement in the rest of the micro.
>However, if the game was entirely turn based (something like Gladius, I suppose), those kind of units would probably appear far more often.
you should play other RTS besides Starcraft
for instance, Company of Heroes, the most perfect RTS ever made, real time is crucial for the experience because it tests your ability to respond quickly to a changing strategic situation, it also punishes careless mistakes
for instance, in company of heroes, you have weapon teams, mortars, machinegun, anti-tank guns, etc, these guns are very effective against their respective targets, but they have a limited arc of fire and take time to reposition and rotate, meaning you have to be very careful to avoid being flanked when using them, if an enemy flanks you machinegun, you have to react quickly, either rotate the weapon to face the flanking troops or retreat, failure to react quickly could cost you the weapon team
I just wanted the combat to be like 1 & 2. Each encounter is such a fricking slog in 3.
I just hate dungeons and dragons as a hobby, system, game and social club tbh, give me loner RPGs like The Elder Scrolls anyday
I HAVE to be rolling and jumping around like a moron every SECOND of gameplay I NEED to swing my blade and do an epic parry CONSTANTLY. Do NOT make me STOP MOVING AND THINK FOR MORE THAN 5 SECONDS OR I WILL START FREAKING OUT AND SCREAMING AND BREAKING SHIT.
I actually intensely dislike TB and much prefer RTwP, but now that a gaming journo has echoed the same opinion I'm pondering whether changing my previously held conviction or seppuku is the most honorable choice
pretty sure in context OP's image is about how they thought that putting a turn based mode in deadfire would take away polish time, and they were 100% right
if you automatically doubt a previously held belief because of who you share it with you are as moronic as the people you so perfomatively deride.
>if you automatically doubt a previously held belief
There's zero doubt, it is correct as all my beliefs and actions are, but the shame of being associated with the scum of the known universe still hangs heavy
>I don't think they have a place in a Baldur's gate game
I can illustrate why real time sucks in one simple example any larper can understand
We're going to use Pathfinder
>Cackle
>A witch can cackle madly as a move action. Any creature that is within 30 feet that is under the effects of an evil eye hex, fortune hex, protective luck, or misfortune hex caused by the witch has the duration of that hex extended by 1 round.
Every round you can cast Evil Eye (standard action) and Cackle (move action). Round is 6 seconds. Casting for Evil Eye is 3 seconds. Cackle is instantaneous.
Every round you can additionally use (free action) and (standard action) both are instantaneous. You can use Quicken Metamagic to turn spell into (swift action).
So in those 6 seconds your character can click
>Evil Eye (standard action)
>Quicken Fireball (swift action)
>Cackle (move action)
>(free action)
And every round you will use Cackle if you want to have Evil Eye online.
This is just one character. You have 6 characters and all of them use the same action rules. Wait a second...actually in good turn based game your enemies obeys same rules. Now imagine playing such game in real time.
your enemies in real time with pause kusoge don't use any of those actions at all. At best they use one swift buff. All can do is unga bunga.
You can compare that to Diablo (any of them) where your oponents pretty much just have a basic attack and maybe a special ability they use every now and then. All extra depth must be added by passive abilities so they don't have to cast or use anything besides the basic attacks.
>I can illustrate why real time sucks
>Uses a game system that was entirely built around turn-based combat
Your example is as idiotic as saying swords are better than guns at killing people because the guns aren't loaded.
>Uses a game system that was entirely built around turn-based combat
This is CRPG thread.
And not all CRPGs are flat copies of the D&D ruleset
But only two of them have good real time combat.
That's 2 more than zero.
Isn't that where homebrew kicks in and you nerf the spell?
>if mages were competent they'd melt you
some of the most popular mods for baldur's gate were AI changes and balance changes to make fights harder, not easier. I mean the beauty of real time is you can fast forward the fight until you have a winning strategy against even stat monster enemies by DPSing them down.
Rather than being a criticism of real time having even moderately powerful enemies is a problem in turn based, which is probably why the game gives you 30 different debuffs you can put on enemies
They can make better encounters with turn based. I imagine its harder to code good real time AI responding to a constant stream of changing variables vs turn based AI.
>posted Feb 28 2020
Turn based is obsolete, yes. BG3 has good sales and playercount right now because of shilling and the viral bear sex meme. If you look at achievements, almost nobody is playing the game.
Turn based has turned them off already. Most probably didn't even know it was turn based.
There is no defense for RTwP, turn based systems are clear in what they are attempting aka devs are lazy and just port tabletop rules into the game, RT games are balanced around having limited time for reaction, RTwP is like that shitty kid who want to play "adult" games like his older brother RT but he's a brainlet so he can't pass a single level without cheating.
So no, in the ideal world turn based games would be limited to autismo tabletop sims and every other RPG would have real time combat without some dumb pause, but we don't live in the ideal world and most devs can't balance shit so turn based is the best you can get since doing something as simple as making AI use healing spell when allies hp is below 40% is beyond the most developers.
RTwP speeds up gameplay so that the combat->exploration is closer to seamless while still being tactical, slow a real time game down enough (which you can do in games like pillars of eternity) and it's basically turn based. On higher difficulties you're forced on turning the game into a glorified turn based game with how much you're pausing, only you're not forced into that from the get-go.
Maybe it's a freedom of choice thing?
>RTwP speeds up gameplay
If you like simplifying the game by having your party members perform actions automatically without your input, you should check out other bangers like Final Fantasy 13, Super Auto Pets, or just play Total War and click auto resolve every time an encounter happens. Hell you can just go play Idle Champions of the Forgotten Realms and stay in a D&D setting. Either way, you should know that people make fun of you behind your back.
>or just play Total War and click auto resolve every time an encounter happens
That'd be more akin to TB then the actual combat, where you constantly pause to analyze what's happening and give orders
Stop being moronic
I think having the actual feeling of progression in the game reflected in the way you play the game. When you first start you might pause for a gibberling and then eventually you're just running through them. Or when you get to a werewolf hive that would one shot you and you're tanking the entire ship and filling its belly with heaps of mangled bodies
The best feeling turn based games have is casting fireball and one hitting everything inside of it (which also exists in real time)
*I like
>RT games are balanced around having limited time for reaction, RTwP is like that shitty kid who want to play "adult" games like his older brother RT but he's a brainlet so he can't pass a single level without cheating.
But that limited time can vary greatly. Real Time systems are filled with tools for controlling the pace of the game. Pause functionality is one of those tools, and it enables more complex micromanagement, in the same vein as quick keys or control groups. If you play a Total War game or any other RTS with sufficiently large scope, you'll see pause functionality and speed control.
> Pause functionality is one of those tools, and it enables more complex micromanagement, in the same vein as quick keys
That's the thing, you have over 30 buttons on your keyboard, that's millions possible inputs, you don't really need pause unless you're playing with controller.
>If you play a Total War game or any other RTS with sufficiently large scope, you'll see pause functionality and speed control.
Only in singleplayer and even then the game won't let you issue commands during the pause on highest difficulty.
>you have over 30 buttons on your keyboard, that's millions possible inputs, you don't really need pause unless you're playing with controller
It depends a lot on the game. Older games don't have as many hotkeys, so you need pause functionality to use features like special abilities.
>Only in singleplayer and even then the game won't let you issue commands during the pause on highest difficulty
The latter feature is only in the newer games.
Ok someone is a fan of rtwp that's understandabl-
>Pillars of Shitternity
Dropped
Don't mind turn based, but i hate strategic rpg
I dont play action shit
Or pause shit
so I never even touched pathfinderslop
except POExile but thats just 1 character
I hope more do good turn based rpgs
It's time
I think all RPGs should be turn based. Otherwise they should focus on being action games.
>RPG
>the only thing character builds are is how much health you have and how much damage you do
Theres more gamey shit you can do with turn based that you cant do with real time, even with pause. The combat is simply a field in which the choices youve made are made making your character are laid bare in RPGs, in non turn based, you can get away with just being good at the game, your build is second to your capabilty of playing the game. You can be level 1 and kill the strongst enemy by just timing rolls, or aiming good. Thats not what RPGs should be, where your build choices are secondary to your ability to simply play the game well.
Real time with pause is literally the worst possible aspects of real time and turn based for the genre
What if I don't want carpal tunnel
It's literally the best aspects of TB, only without boring me to tears
I heard FF16 is pretty fire no cap
>I heard FF16 is pretty fire no cap
FF16 is the best FF since FF10 and BG3 is the best CRPG in a long time too.
Did you know that dnd was purposefully made to be garbage so that some fat israelite wouldn't need to pay royalties to the game's actual creator?
It's true, look it up.
You mean before they made advanced right? The original DnD was shit so they could pretend Advanced was a different IP? Pretty shady
Enlarge person looks so fricking stupid in pathfinder, I can't get over it.
>sneak attack
>not sneaking
wtf is this shit
>Greater Invisibility
That's why/
He's probably got greater invisibility on his or some shit, can't make it out under all the sfx.
>a defence of real time
Isn't real time way more popular when compared to Turn-based? If anything, turn-based games are the ones that need defending.
Everyone nowadays shits on Turn-based games
Ganker and /vrpg/ threads are full of insecure turn-based gays who constantly shit on real-time. Real-time gays are also insecure, though
i play both lul, in wotr i did a full paladin playthrough in real time then a full inquisitor playthrough in turn based
NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!
Why can't i play Civilization like Age of Empires?
>It sucks that this game that wasnt made for me is from a genre I don't like like
I hate the attitude of "all games should be for everyone". I can't get into rts games, even though conceptually I find them cool I just don't enjoy almost any of them, and the ones I do would probably fall under "rts for people that don't like rts". But that's fine, I don't want all rts games to become like those few simplistic ones that I like. But these people want everything to come down to their level, I hate it.
holy based
every game "for everyone" would ultimately end up bland and uninteresting, but thats what guarantees the most sales since you'll be covering every potential buyer group
>oh no you cannot add killable children in our PEGI 18 game about postapocalypse, where people cannibal and rape each other!!!
>oh no you cannot add complex story with gray moral characters, because the whole concept of moral relativism will fly over our core audiences read - moronic goys heads!
>oh no, you cannot add engaging and challenging gameplay with mechanics so deep it's a mariana trench at this point, because candy crush housewives and FIFA players might not buy the next game in this franchise which we most certainly be milking
Turn based combat is an archaic mechanic from a time when CPUs weren't powerful enough to deliver any kind of complex real-time action. I'm not sure why they still make so many games with it.
Because it's easier to do. It's why so many indie games use 2D pixel art instead of using 3d. Even if they use 3d it's some jank ass style.
turn based combat is popular in CRPGs because the original rulesets they are based on were played in a turn-based format
i wont speculate why JRPG turn based combat a la the "FNIR" style of combat was/is so popular though
JRPGs were also originally inspired by D&D and D&D-adjacent computer games like Wizardry.
No, but we should have new fantasy rpg IPs that aren't turn based games. There hasn't been a huge fantasy rpg game that wasn't turn based since skyrim nor the level of rpg mechanics in fps/tps like New Vegas.
if 99% of game """journalists""" were thrown into an active volcano not a single thing of value would be lost
But they attract normies and normies are a thousand times better at receiving a lot of sales than simply catering to you NEETs.
RTWP is shit and I've always hated it.
>The turn-based "Discussion" again
I don't know why people still do this song and dance anymore, these people come here only to mock others for having any kind of beliefs or thoughts on anything, i bet the same people shitting on turn-based games now are the exact same people that shat on Final Fantasy for not being turn-based anymore
The userbase here is such a fricking farce, im sure some moron will say "Ganker isn't one person" but yes you are, you are the exact same type of homosexual replying to your exact same irony-overdosed clone over and over again and i don't know why, i guess im not as autistic as you
I would have prefered Dragon Age 1 or even Inquisitions action rpg combat. BG3 is fun but its combat is stale.
RTWP was the dumbest RPG system, and that's saying a lot because RPGs are notorious shitty combat.
okay i don't care about pause but holy frick i wish the game would stop fricking running in the background when i open the menu, i seriously hate seeing these stupid fricks run around AND use voicelines while i'm trying to go afk
the game not pausing while opening the save/load menu is moronic
No.
Frick zoomers
Frick you
And most of all and MOST ESPECIALLY FRICK JANNIES
It'd be fine if the gameplay wasnt so tedious, takes 30 seconds to finish a turn, move attack
dnd combat is obsolete
yes especially when you're leeching off a 25 year old franchise that solved the problem in their first attempt
Same shit different day.
Same arguments. Same bait. Same OP. Same games. Same strawmans. Same shitposting. Same stances. Same posters.
Same shit different day.
I have to play this game with cheats because turn based is just boring
I think I'm too smart for turn based combat. My brain is not that slow for that kind of gameplay. I need to make fast decisions to have fun, being in constant chaos.
That's just ADHD, not intelligence.
I used to swear by turn based combat but I've been playing Pathfinder with RTwP and while I get overwhelmed sometimes it feels a lot better and faster than turn based
Turn based games are more strategic, and having played Pathfindder, which used tabletop rules and gave you the option of both real time with pause and turn based, it become immediately apparent that turn based was the way the game was meant to be played. It's really a night and day difference.
The idea that real time is always better is utter nonsense. Some of the world's most classic and enduring games are turn based.
Go and chess are literally just a test of how many steps you've memorized from the official list of correct solved plays.
>friend does 'unbeatable move if you don't know what to do' sequence or some shit
>haha horsie comes out after bishop
>friend goes 'wtf you said you didn't know'
i don't think a single turn ahead and somehow manage to get close ties, i usually lose though because i'm easily baited
The last RTwP game I played was Diofield, and it was a mess. Playing on the hardest difficulty, the enemy can basically never touch you if you know what you’re doing. Granted, it’s a Japanese game, and they suck shit at balancing their rpgs, but I don’t think the actual gameplay itself is bad - it’s the balancing. RTwP is much superior to turn-based in regards to pacing, but I’m not sure how you can add complexity to its systems without everything falling apart, or pausing so frequently to queue actions that it basically becomes turn based.
I don't mind the actual combat in BG3 but initiating it is incredibly painful. it's impossible to plan a proper ambush and if you do you get punished for it. Lame. Kind of regretting making my MC a sneakygirl
Every single piece of marketing I have seen about this game was about romancehomosexualry
This is a porn game
That's cause the gameplay is shit, because... you guessed it! Turn based.
After pathfinder, which felt like a fricking diablo game with how many encounters there were, I don't want to touch RTwP ever again.
FRICK RTWP