Baba Is You design

Why do people love this game so much, it's just the barrel from Carnival Night Zone. The game throws conditions you to assume things work one way, and then has the solution require something you'd never done before, like "weak" meaning background decorations, which previously had no means of actually interacting, are now lethal to whatever is weak. I've been trying to find explanations for why people like this kind of design, but even when acknowledging levels like that, the sentiment is that if the devs outright told you how each new mechanic worked, it would ruin the solving process. I've never really felt a deduction process in these solves, either, because any time I'm stumped it's always relying on a mechanic that was never previously introduced. In essence, it's like throwing the player into the hardest part of a Mega Man stage, in the tutorial, only you have to hold a third button to do something new now, instead of just jumping and shooting like you were used to.

I don't get it, why would knowing the rules ruin the game? Having played most of the Zachtronics games, knowing the rules should be the baseline for how a puzzle works. I get that Zach's games are essentially just low level programming languages, but I really struggle to see any sense of satisfaction in figuring these levels out. Especially since once you know the solution to a Baba puzzle, there's no real replay value to them, where as even the simplest Zachtronics game (Opus Magnum) is a joy to replay, since you can apply knowledge towards optimization.

Why do people even enjoy this puzzle game, when every bit of logic in it is crafted to specifically go against logical thinking.

  1. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    fun

  2. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    anon
    is
    fag

  3. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    They were told it's brilliant and lack critical thinking. Anyone actually interested in puzzles knows that this game has a decent concept but horrendous execution.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      They will call your execution horrendous

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The fact the dev seethes at people outsmarting him and patches out solutions says it all.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          he literally doesnt do that
          outside of rare few ridiculous oversights that ruin the level, which happened like two times out of over a hundred levels

  4. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I
    TEST
    Q

  5. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >knowing the rules should be the baseline for how a puzzle works
    Boy you'd fucking hate this game then.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      In my opinion, Baba Is You is interesting for 2 reasons - for the cleverness of the game's mechanics and how the game uses them and for the unexpected, yet perfectly reasonable ways the mechanics work together.
      The mechanic of weak is completely logical - if it is ever on top of anything else, it is destroyed, be it itself, text, or anything that's not empty. Even the concept behind text stacking and it's effects with Shift are still very reasonable. Discovering these interactions is rewarding because you can deduce them, even if it's really unexpected, and because it is surprising and exciting to see just how much the game will push it's concepts.
      I also don't really know what you mean by "knowing the rules ruin the game" as the majority of the puzzles use straightforward rule interaction that are not difficult to deduce or introduce them. Only some introduce niche and unexpected interactions between rules, that are usually later reused in levels as concepts you are familiar with that you have to apply.
      As for Zachtronics, their games are completely separate from the experience that games like Baba Is You provide. Personally, I find them really unfocused and unrewarding as just solving the puzzle isn't hard or interesting, it's nowhere near the experience of solving a finely tuned puzzle like Baba. On the other hand, optimizing for the best solution is an infinitely iterative process, where you can essentially always improve your solution. Similarly to speedrunning, this isn't fun because whatever I can make can always be surpassed, so, there is no sense of "being done" with a puzzle.
      A while ago, I actually believed in Ganker that Baba had shit design, but after playing it and getting almost 100%, I can say that people who say that are the usual retards, though, that doesn't mean the game is for everyone and it's not as if you have to enjoy it.

      Man, I forgot about this, even I can't deal with it, but the concept is really cool.

  6. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >dude just glitch the words using rules that have never been explained before or after

  7. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Are you autistic?

  8. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >conditions you to assume things work one way
    then stop doing that. Rules do exactly what they say and nothing else.
    I don't understand how you can have trouble understanding weak. It's a fairly easy concept to understand based on the level that introduces it. Surely by now you know that the only difference between what you call a background object and any other object is if there is rules text giving it properties.

  9. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >sonicfag is retarded
    more at 11

  10. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    There is literally only 1 rule in the entire game that isn't told to you, and that's Text Is Push.
    Every other rule depends on the stage explicitly forming those rules, and said rules can apply to every tile so long as a rule includes them. You can just say you got filtered by the concept of overlapping tiles, because that's precisely what Weak depends on; if you're too stupid to understand the tutorial, you'll never get even a third of the way to the real game.
    You fucking idiot.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      There's plenty of other implicit rules too. I remember some level where I was trying to make "not X is you", and that doesn't mean "text is you", for instance.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Not is also a jank operator that has some inconsistencies based on quirks of diction… mainly because “IS NOT” has its own rules, where NOT normally modifies the tile it precedes but has a special case for IS

        You can still figure it out, but
        >BABA IS NOT HEDGE
        should work like
        >BABA IS ALL
        From a consistency perspective, rather than working like
        >BABA IS BABA

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          It’s so funny this game still has dedicated shitposters and brainlets

          It’s not jank. It would be more jank to try to opt for consistency of “not x” as a singular term instead of having it be a bespoke modifier that makes sense linguistically and intuitively. Besides, you didn’t even get your proposed logic right. In your proposed rules it would equate to
          >BABA IS ALL (except baba)

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            It would also not work like BABA IS BABA technically, unless you tried to make BABA IS HEDGE.

            It’s still finicky.

            LEVEL is also a finicky word, sometimes operating on the entire map and sometimes on its overworld tile.

  11. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >accidentally create not baba is you
    >entire screen moves

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      The best moment in the game is still
      LEVEL IS BABA

  12. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    So OP gave up already? I wanted a baba thread

  13. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Why do people love this game so much
    Indie game devs are all friends with journalists and they all support each other financially. Journos give good coverage in return.
    It also has reddit appeal ("cute" minimalistic art direction).

  14. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I think the author chose to not explicitly tell you how each condition works because he thought it would be more fun for players to discover their meaning on their own. This game is purposely built to have lots of "aha" moments like that.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Hempuli could also be a demon who delights in the mental suffering of others, and I'm having trouble dismissing that theory.

      Ok so whats a good puzzle game?

      All of them

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Hempuli could also be a demon who delights in the mental suffering of others, and I'm having trouble dismissing that theory.
        didn't he work on ESA and noita? seems very believable

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Does Noita have weird esoteric puzzles too? I thought it was just a difficult roguelite. Some anon said that they played it for 70 hours but still didn't beat it.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            It has a lot of shit that isn't really explained at all, and there's supposedly still a puzzle that hasn't been solved yet

  15. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Ok so whats a good puzzle game?

  16. 2 weeks ago
    sage goes in all fields

    It's a fun game. Your post is going to be forgotten in an hour. Loser.

  17. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    So many anti-Baba threads lately. Either it's one guy or this game got too popular.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Seems like one guy that struggles to figure out how the rules work.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Some people aren't good at making interesting threads, so they make insulting threads that they know people will reply to. OP is probably posting what he actually wants to say about the game in this thread while keeping it bumped by shitting on it and letting people argue with him.

  18. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Why do people love this game so much
    my oshi liked it so I like it

    simple as

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >baecuck

  19. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    IS BABA good for YOU?

  20. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    There's no such thing as "background decorations" in the game. Everything you see on screen is an object with equal rights and can be affected by any rule provided the corresponding sentence to apply the rule can be formed.

  21. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    This games way too fucking hard. I got stuck on like level 2, looked up a vid on how to do the level, watched the next few levels and noped the fuck out after seeing what was ahead. Literally impossible to solve and I don't believe anyone who says they didn't use a guide.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      if no one can solve it without a guide then who makes the guide?

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The people who made the game, obviously. Fucking idiot. I know it's hard for an American, but please try use your one braincell to think for a moment before you comment.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          why would the dev tell people how to beat his game when the dev clearly enjoys watching people suffer instead? that would be completely out of character for him.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Because otherwise noone would be able to complete it? Fucking hell it's a task talking with Americans. I'm out, later you spasticated retarded mutts.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              yes, the dev would enjoy having a game that no one would finish. How many times do you need to be told before you understand?

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      unfortunately you are probably a brainlet. i got around 120 levels in before i started struggling. some of the later levels took me hours

  22. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Filtered

  23. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Remember me Ganker?

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I can't say I really "remember" swap, because basically every level with it, I just stumbled my way into a win.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      i love this block. felt like a beast when i solved coronation

  24. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    every baba criticism thread ultimately boils down to
    >i overlooked or didnt remember something i experienced in previous levels, that equates to the game not explaining the rules properly and not letting me know the solution was possible[/spoiler]

  25. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >why doesn’t the game tell me what to do
    because you are supposed to figure it out. it’s not that hard.

  26. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Imo baba is you and zachtronic games are just different conceptually and to compare them is kinda disingenuous.
    To win in baba you need to reach the win condition flag or anything in any possible way with specific rules, in space chem for example you win as long as you reach enough production cycles with given tools, and you can be more efficient in it, whereas being more efficient in baba doesnt really mean anything.
    I would consider baba is you a puzzle game, and zachtronic games are more like an engineering problem as a genre

  27. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I want to fuck Baba

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      BABA IS HOT
      ON
      BED
      MAKE
      POMF

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        I want to fuck Baba

        [...]
        BABA IS NOT SEXUAL
        IS
        PURE

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          BABA
          IS
          POO

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      BABA IS HOT
      ON
      BED
      MAKE
      POMF

      BABA IS NOT SEXUAL
      IS
      PURE

  28. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

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