It makes me not care about the game, if that's what you mean.
Take Bioshock: Infinite, for example. >lofty nonsense about quantum physics etc >Booker eats out of trashcans every four seconds
What a pile of shit.
This, it makes me not care. I actually never play singleplayer / story games because of this, because there's always something like that that takes me out of it and makes it obvious that it's a game. I think video games are the worst way possible to tell a story because it takes control away from the creator and puts it in the hands of the player and the only way to make sure the narrative stays tight is to thoroughly restrict what the player can do, which then leads to a shitty game cause that's the opposite of the spirit of video games to begin with.
That's just because you are thinking in movie terms, player interaction allows games to do shit that no movie or book could actually do seamlessly
Sadly barely any games actually use that in their favor, and the ones that do are mostly text option based so whatever way you play is rarely taken into account
No. It's a meme term invented by journos to shit on game-like games. Who cares if Nathan Drake or Leon Kennedy or Duke Nukem or Doomguy etc. kills 1000 guys singlehandedly if those games are fun?
You got it backwards. It's to shit on games with stories that make no sense to the gameplay. Journos are fricking based for pointing this out. I've played plenty of games where the story matches with the gameplay.
>It's to shit on games with stories that make no sense to the gameplay.
Wrong. None of them cared about ludonarrative dissonance in Bioshock Infinite or Last of Us. Booker and Joel kills as much as people as Nathan. They praised those games as "thought provoking" thinking man's games because Uncharted had a campy story unlike those games' le serious le deep stories. No one cared about ludonarrative dissonance in U4 when they turned it into basically a Last of Us clone. Game journos gain validation with praising games that makes them seem le intellectual.
all of the examples you listed have reason to kill any and everyone they come across. you decided to throw out a term based on who uses it just to shit on "them damn journos!"
dissonance is TLOUII Naughty Dog disregarding the entirety of the players kills throughout the game to shove their own choice of action into the ending or any single GTA protagonist pretending theyre doing a little mass terrorism to "save" their hood/family. CJ drives a screaming woman off a pier for no reason and buries a man alive in a port a potty for cat calling his sister, ruins a major rapper for someone he doesnt even like and instead of killing him, decides to side with the rapper and then just tells OG Loc to "go get lunch" when he catches up to him. and then tries to act above drugs and the hood.
now thats not to say it MATTERS to the quality of the gameplay but the point is that the disconnect is infact there
TLD;DR Dissonance is real and trying to say it isnt just because c**t journalists are sensationalist is moronation. Like saying you dont like bread because you saw a black woman eat it- its contrarianism
>Journos are fricking based
They need to decorate lamp posts.
>Journos are fricking based
no they aren't lmao
journos are human trash, game journos... holy shit, I'm struggling to find the right word
human shit, maybe?
You incels are so pathetic. Do you also cry about games being left wing?
>Journos are fricking based
no they aren't lmao
journos are human trash, game journos... holy shit, I'm struggling to find the right word
human shit, maybe?
it's literally the >kill hundreds of John Evilguy's henchmen >beat him in combat, have him cornered >"if you kill him you'll be just like him!!"
everyone shitposts about
>I've never seen a game with a ludonarrative dissonance as strong as Uncharted.
Try nu-Tomb Raider, it's the same thing but worse. >"I... I can do this." >*guns down hundreds of men* >"I'm so fragile, and muh literal daddy issues." >*does infinite muscle-ups, can read 47 dead languages, upgrades guns, B-B-BUT MUH DAD*
I think it's actually worse than Uncharted, since that silly nepo-baby writer Rhianna Pratchett wanted to write nu-Lara as a SO REAL character, forgetting that she had previously been back-flipping while shooting a fricking tyrannosaurus rex in the face.
Tomb Raider is so much worse.
>character is practically invincible both in-game and lorewise >dies in a stupid way in a cutscene because muh plot
yes, it makes my want to facepalm every time
>character is easily thrashed up and down the fricking walls >wins in a cutscene because muh plot must continue >frick your abilities, you don't win because I said so nyah nyah
god I hated that homosexual
I literally oneshot him on the asari homeworld every single time
it was almost comical if it wasn't so stupid how hard he got wrecked and then the game STILL has me lose
not to mention the idiocy of a melee only character in mass effect
at the very least they could have given us the decency of a quick renegade prompt before his final battle while he twirls his swords to Indiana Jones him
He'd just block the shots becoz he iz bad@ss af and the plot is a trudging, rigid puppeteer
Just realised that all the "choices" in Mass Effect are done through dialog
Sekiro handled this perfectly. >Boss is meant to win.
Normally you are going to lose first time trying encounter the normal cutscene. >Git gud and replay game. >Beat his ass this time.
Game changes the cutscene son you win the fight but are defeated by other means.
I WANT to play a game where you literally kill thousands of people but then refuse to kill the big bad guy because "you would end up as bad as him", give me some titles.
literally most of them with a hero protagonist. i cant really even call to mind any games where you just put a bullet in the main antagonist, they always die from structural damage to the arena, the device/artifact they were powered by or from their injuries given by the player in "self defence".
straight up killing the antagonist destroys the b***hmade "lesson" that poor writers jam into the their narratives of the hero being a "good guy". Its a severe problem in Western commercial media wherein the writers treat the audience like 6 year olds or neurotic mothers that cant take the hero engaging in vices like revenge or poor language.
Last of Us 2, another game journos praised to hell.
all of the examples you listed have reason to kill any and everyone they come across. you decided to throw out a term based on who uses it just to shit on "them damn journos!"
dissonance is TLOUII Naughty Dog disregarding the entirety of the players kills throughout the game to shove their own choice of action into the ending or any single GTA protagonist pretending theyre doing a little mass terrorism to "save" their hood/family. CJ drives a screaming woman off a pier for no reason and buries a man alive in a port a potty for cat calling his sister, ruins a major rapper for someone he doesnt even like and instead of killing him, decides to side with the rapper and then just tells OG Loc to "go get lunch" when he catches up to him. and then tries to act above drugs and the hood.
now thats not to say it MATTERS to the quality of the gameplay but the point is that the disconnect is infact there
TLD;DR Dissonance is real and trying to say it isnt just because c**t journalists are sensationalist is moronation. Like saying you dont like bread because you saw a black woman eat it- its contrarianism
>east : is the game fun? >west : does the game feel INCLUSIVE enough, does it have LUDONARRATIVE DISSONANCE, is it ARTSY enough, does it have a LESBIAN SEX scene right after you watch your father get murdered?????
weeb take. east is >will it make money >whats the gimmick >what type of fanbase is this for
you make it sound like japanese developers just walk up the the directors desk and say "i have a fun game we can make" and he says "okay, as long as its fun"
yeah >play deus ex first time >stealth kill all the bad guys around American freedom statue and save the day >meet UNATCO boss Manderley for briefing >WOOOOOOW HOW COULD YOU DO THIS YOU KILLED THE EVIL TERRORISTS WTF IS WRONG WITH YOU HOLY SHIT EVERYONE'S DAY IS RUINED
dropped it right there and reinstalled Half-Life to blow off some steam killing evil scientists (nobody ever scolded me for this)
>gameplay is looking at fantasy spreadsheets
I unironically wish more RPGs were spreadsheet simulators. Stacking numbers through complex interactions between many different game elements, thorough preparation, and system mastery to completely clown on anything the game throws at me is peak gameplay, and I'm tired of watered down, casual bullshit like BG3.
Have you noticed the Uncharted franchise is completely forgotten by now and back in the day it was hailed as a one of the top 5 best games of all time?
The best games don't have to worry about it. Making your gameplay be at odds with your narrative is so unbelievably moronic it really could only happen to AAA Sony shit.
What do you call it when it's the other way around? When there's a dissonance between the writing, and the world you experience?
Like NPCs tell you you're in a huge cities, full with activities, and tons of people, but there are only 30 or so NPCs you can talk to, and not enough living space for all the other ones wandering aimlessly all day long without ever eating or sleeping? Or how you supposedly explore the uncharted universe, but everywhere you land there's an outpost nearby?
Does Starfield suffer from visionarrative dissonance?
>Like NPCs tell you you're in a huge cities, full with activities, and tons of people, but there are only 30 or so NPCs you can talk to
Literally every single open world game, the only game in the universe that has cities that are the size of actual cities is Daggerfall.
watched it when I wasn't very fluent, thought trigun was just a name the guy came up with because it sounded cool and vash has a gun
later realized that it's actually a very cool and fitting name
same for other anime, sure, you have shit like neon genesis evangelion, but then there's promised neverland, amazing name
don't try and hit me with a moral "I can't kill x" if I've been slaughtering people. I feel like it's a game making or story challenge that should be approached. if my character is an absolute badass killing thousands, don't treat him like he's some cowardly nobody.
the only way I feel opposite about this is if the killing was just you fricking around. ie. gta. when it's forced encounters you should make them fit into the story or make the story fit around the combat encounters.
Quit letting shit writing or shit game design go unchecked because they know you'll buy no matter what as the consoomer you are
I only care if they navigate it well. I liked how the Nier's treated it, treating it as part of the morbidity of the story yet still being fun and sufficiently present. Tlou2 had journo's cumming all over the place for it when it was just way too overt and subtle as a sledgehammer.
What games have the best story gameplay integration?
?si=-TmFnrzDJi2QSKOH
Fire Emblem Thracia 776 comes to mind, you have to rob enemies of their weapons and items to get money/actual weapons because you are a gurillea rebel force
i just wish more games considered their gameplay as a way to interact with the story, even as simple as a wink and a nod once in a while would make it better
i don't think i've played anything as interactive as westerado, and that's just because it has a very small scope
apparently bg3 has some of "pull a trick in gameplay, ignore the cutscene", but i'll wait for a year or so of patches first
i never got the complaint that drake killing a bunch of people doesn't make sense. he's never demonstrated to be any degree of pacifist, he's just a goofy gay.
It makes me not care about the game, if that's what you mean.
Take Bioshock: Infinite, for example.
>lofty nonsense about quantum physics etc
>Booker eats out of trashcans every four seconds
What a pile of shit.
This, it makes me not care. I actually never play singleplayer / story games because of this, because there's always something like that that takes me out of it and makes it obvious that it's a game. I think video games are the worst way possible to tell a story because it takes control away from the creator and puts it in the hands of the player and the only way to make sure the narrative stays tight is to thoroughly restrict what the player can do, which then leads to a shitty game cause that's the opposite of the spirit of video games to begin with.
That's just because you are thinking in movie terms, player interaction allows games to do shit that no movie or book could actually do seamlessly
Sadly barely any games actually use that in their favor, and the ones that do are mostly text option based so whatever way you play is rarely taken into account
How does white people throwing out perfectly fine food somehow negate quantum physics?
It's not a cohesive whole. ___________like ur mum
No. It's a meme term invented by journos to shit on game-like games. Who cares if Nathan Drake or Leon Kennedy or Duke Nukem or Doomguy etc. kills 1000 guys singlehandedly if those games are fun?
You got it backwards. It's to shit on games with stories that make no sense to the gameplay. Journos are fricking based for pointing this out. I've played plenty of games where the story matches with the gameplay.
>It's to shit on games with stories that make no sense to the gameplay.
Wrong. None of them cared about ludonarrative dissonance in Bioshock Infinite or Last of Us. Booker and Joel kills as much as people as Nathan. They praised those games as "thought provoking" thinking man's games because Uncharted had a campy story unlike those games' le serious le deep stories. No one cared about ludonarrative dissonance in U4 when they turned it into basically a Last of Us clone. Game journos gain validation with praising games that makes them seem le intellectual.
all of the examples you listed have reason to kill any and everyone they come across. you decided to throw out a term based on who uses it just to shit on "them damn journos!"
dissonance is TLOUII Naughty Dog disregarding the entirety of the players kills throughout the game to shove their own choice of action into the ending or any single GTA protagonist pretending theyre doing a little mass terrorism to "save" their hood/family. CJ drives a screaming woman off a pier for no reason and buries a man alive in a port a potty for cat calling his sister, ruins a major rapper for someone he doesnt even like and instead of killing him, decides to side with the rapper and then just tells OG Loc to "go get lunch" when he catches up to him. and then tries to act above drugs and the hood.
now thats not to say it MATTERS to the quality of the gameplay but the point is that the disconnect is infact there
TLD;DR Dissonance is real and trying to say it isnt just because c**t journalists are sensationalist is moronation. Like saying you dont like bread because you saw a black woman eat it- its contrarianism
You incels are so pathetic. Do you also cry about games being left wing?
lol, spotted the projecting journo
Try posting without meme terms.
>Journos are fricking based
They need to decorate lamp posts.
>Journos are fricking based
no they aren't lmao
journos are human trash, game journos... holy shit, I'm struggling to find the right word
human shit, maybe?
>Journos are fricking based
If this isn't proof this board is infested by redditors i don't know what is
I dont care if you and I both agree. journos should become street art. go back
it's literally the
>kill hundreds of John Evilguy's henchmen
>beat him in combat, have him cornered
>"if you kill him you'll be just like him!!"
everyone shitposts about
It makes sense in all of the ones you mentioned except Nathan Drake. I've never seen a game with a ludonarrative dissonance as strong as Uncharted.
>I've never seen a game with a ludonarrative dissonance as strong as Uncharted.
Try nu-Tomb Raider, it's the same thing but worse.
>"I... I can do this."
>*guns down hundreds of men*
>"I'm so fragile, and muh literal daddy issues."
>*does infinite muscle-ups, can read 47 dead languages, upgrades guns, B-B-BUT MUH DAD*
I think it's actually worse than Uncharted, since that silly nepo-baby writer Rhianna Pratchett wanted to write nu-Lara as a SO REAL character, forgetting that she had previously been back-flipping while shooting a fricking tyrannosaurus rex in the face.
Tomb Raider is so much worse.
Thought it was coined by a guy who made video essays on vidya, the same one responsible for "what do they eat?" as a worldbuilding metric.
>Thought it was coined by a guy who made video essays on vidya
moronic zoomie
>character is practically invincible both in-game and lorewise
>dies in a stupid way in a cutscene because muh plot
yes, it makes my want to facepalm every time
>character is easily thrashed up and down the fricking walls
>wins in a cutscene because muh plot must continue
>frick your abilities, you don't win because I said so nyah nyah
god I hated that homosexual
I literally oneshot him on the asari homeworld every single time
it was almost comical if it wasn't so stupid how hard he got wrecked and then the game STILL has me lose
not to mention the idiocy of a melee only character in mass effect
at the very least they could have given us the decency of a quick renegade prompt before his final battle while he twirls his swords to Indiana Jones him
He'd just block the shots becoz he iz bad@ss af and the plot is a trudging, rigid puppeteer
Just realised that all the "choices" in Mass Effect are done through dialog
yes, I hate when
>kill boss in gameplay
>lose in a cutscene
or
>reviving exists canonically in the setting
>people don't use it because ???
Sekiro handled this perfectly.
>Boss is meant to win.
Normally you are going to lose first time trying encounter the normal cutscene.
>Git gud and replay game.
>Beat his ass this time.
Game changes the cutscene son you win the fight but are defeated by other means.
I WANT to play a game where you literally kill thousands of people but then refuse to kill the big bad guy because "you would end up as bad as him", give me some titles.
literally most of them with a hero protagonist. i cant really even call to mind any games where you just put a bullet in the main antagonist, they always die from structural damage to the arena, the device/artifact they were powered by or from their injuries given by the player in "self defence".
straight up killing the antagonist destroys the b***hmade "lesson" that poor writers jam into the their narratives of the hero being a "good guy". Its a severe problem in Western commercial media wherein the writers treat the audience like 6 year olds or neurotic mothers that cant take the hero engaging in vices like revenge or poor language.
Last of Us 2, another game journos praised to hell.
Dumb homosexual.
>east : is the game fun?
>west : does the game feel INCLUSIVE enough, does it have LUDONARRATIVE DISSONANCE, is it ARTSY enough, does it have a LESBIAN SEX scene right after you watch your father get murdered?????
weeb take. east is
>will it make money
>whats the gimmick
>what type of fanbase is this for
you make it sound like japanese developers just walk up the the directors desk and say "i have a fun game we can make" and he says "okay, as long as its fun"
>east = japan
Did you feel smart typing all that
"will it make money" and "is it fun" are closely related questions you know
gambling is fun, millions of addicts can't be wrong
Scrapping the bottom of the barrel here, even for a Ganker drone
see gacha, booster backs and loot crates.
according to you logic, gambling makes a lot of money because it's fun
you forgot to ask if it has a Black person majority
Ludonarrative dissonance is a bad thing you moron.
so are all the other things in all caps you moron
yeah
>play deus ex first time
>stealth kill all the bad guys around American freedom statue and save the day
>meet UNATCO boss Manderley for briefing
>WOOOOOOW HOW COULD YOU DO THIS YOU KILLED THE EVIL TERRORISTS WTF IS WRONG WITH YOU HOLY SHIT EVERYONE'S DAY IS RUINED
dropped it right there and reinstalled Half-Life to blow off some steam killing evil scientists (nobody ever scolded me for this)
For me it's pf:wotr
>become mythical hero to vanquish archdemons from the land
>gameplay is looking at fantasy spreadsheets
>gameplay is looking at fantasy spreadsheets
I unironically wish more RPGs were spreadsheet simulators. Stacking numbers through complex interactions between many different game elements, thorough preparation, and system mastery to completely clown on anything the game throws at me is peak gameplay, and I'm tired of watered down, casual bullshit like BG3.
>WoW
>role-playing game
>but everyone is CHAMPION OF THE UNIVERSE
Have you noticed the Uncharted franchise is completely forgotten by now and back in the day it was hailed as a one of the top 5 best games of all time?
It happens in all media really for several reasons.
The best games don't have to worry about it. Making your gameplay be at odds with your narrative is so unbelievably moronic it really could only happen to AAA Sony shit.
It just shows they clearly didn't want to make a game.
What do you call it when it's the other way around? When there's a dissonance between the writing, and the world you experience?
Like NPCs tell you you're in a huge cities, full with activities, and tons of people, but there are only 30 or so NPCs you can talk to, and not enough living space for all the other ones wandering aimlessly all day long without ever eating or sleeping? Or how you supposedly explore the uncharted universe, but everywhere you land there's an outpost nearby?
Does Starfield suffer from visionarrative dissonance?
>Like NPCs tell you you're in a huge cities, full with activities, and tons of people, but there are only 30 or so NPCs you can talk to
Literally every single open world game, the only game in the universe that has cities that are the size of actual cities is Daggerfall.
There are games with impressive looking cities without feeling off, just like not all games suffer from ludonarrative dissonance.
That was also super small, didn't even felt like a small town.
gtav reference
>you're able to steal shit from every cupboard of every house and no one living there gives a shit
I think the term fits here too
If it's a boring Sony movie game I might care
If it's a game that's actually designed to be fun then no
>Killing is... le bad!
>Ends up indirectly killing thousands anyway
watched it when I wasn't very fluent, thought trigun was just a name the guy came up with because it sounded cool and vash has a gun
later realized that it's actually a very cool and fitting name
same for other anime, sure, you have shit like neon genesis evangelion, but then there's promised neverland, amazing name
The whole idea was the trolley experiment on a grand scale
webcomics literally wouldn't exist if you couldn't make a 4 panel comic about opening a menu and consuming something during a fight
yes j do care
don't try and hit me with a moral "I can't kill x" if I've been slaughtering people. I feel like it's a game making or story challenge that should be approached. if my character is an absolute badass killing thousands, don't treat him like he's some cowardly nobody.
the only way I feel opposite about this is if the killing was just you fricking around. ie. gta. when it's forced encounters you should make them fit into the story or make the story fit around the combat encounters.
Quit letting shit writing or shit game design go unchecked because they know you'll buy no matter what as the consoomer you are
I only care if they navigate it well. I liked how the Nier's treated it, treating it as part of the morbidity of the story yet still being fun and sufficiently present. Tlou2 had journo's cumming all over the place for it when it was just way too overt and subtle as a sledgehammer.
What games have the best story gameplay integration?
?si=-TmFnrzDJi2QSKOH
Fire Emblem Thracia 776 comes to mind, you have to rob enemies of their weapons and items to get money/actual weapons because you are a gurillea rebel force
Dishonored. The theme of the game is power corrupting and it translates perfectly to the gameplay, the Outsider's powers and all the arcs in the game.
i just wish more games considered their gameplay as a way to interact with the story, even as simple as a wink and a nod once in a while would make it better
i don't think i've played anything as interactive as westerado, and that's just because it has a very small scope
apparently bg3 has some of "pull a trick in gameplay, ignore the cutscene", but i'll wait for a year or so of patches first
it makes me care more about the game
As long as it isn’t too blatant or the game isn’t trying to hype itself as some narrative masterpiece I can live with it
i never got the complaint that drake killing a bunch of people doesn't make sense. he's never demonstrated to be any degree of pacifist, he's just a goofy gay.
>he's just a goofy gay
Exactly, he's Indiana Jones ripoff, which isn't exactly aligned with mass slaughter
Depends on what the game is trying to achieve.