>mana
it's a worse strategy game than stellaris, which at least requires actual pops to be working jobs to get science and unity instead of your random-ass polynesian islanders having better guns and artillery than england/france/spain because the AI spent its mana on random bullshit while you clicked the tech button more than they did.
>least requires actual pops to be working jobs to get science
This is represented with advisors and rulers >your random-ass polynesian islanders having better guns and artillery than england/france/spain
This never happens to AI since they never dev enough to spawn missing institutions.
Seems to me you're just bad at the game and blame the game mechanics instead.
>This never happens to AI since they never dev enough to spawn missing institutions.
I'm saying YOU as random ass polynesians can easily get better tech than england/spain/france. Which is stupid. The game should have an actual economy not moronic mana that's the same for byzantium as it is random OPMs
paradox will listen to the playerbase, get rid of mana and quickly find out that there is no better alternative
by that time it is too late though and they will go bankrupt after 15 years of no good games
moral of the story: don't listen to players
The alternative is to make strategy games that are actually good with reduced scopes that allow for actual mechanical depth and well-defined gameplay instead of grand sloppagy.
You aren’t smart or clever for pointing this out, yes it’s still abstraction, but it’s abstraction that makes sense and is good, rather then random diplo points that mean literally nothing
paradox will listen to the playerbase, get rid of mana and quickly find out that there is no better alternative
by that time it is too late though and they will go bankrupt after 15 years of no good games
moral of the story: don't listen to players
Eu3 already did it and it was better then eu4 in that regard
>mana
redpill me about this stuff.
i have only played ck2 and some ck3.
do you mean by mana the needed piety and/or prestige to declare wars?
and the tech points accumulation that allow better stuff?
what's the alternative?
Monarch Power (mana) is an abstraction of how much your ruler can get done. A good ruler can do more. It's divided into administrative, diplomatic/trade, and military mana. A ruler with good points can get techs earlier, integrate a lot of provinces, develop provinces to be richer, etc.
People hate it because it's so abstract that it becomes an arbitary point value that you increase to get a better country. I don't know why bombarding forts means I delay getting my military technologies, but the point system means that doing one action limits your ability to do the other.
Gameplay-wise, I think it's serviceable for making the game fun. It creates incentives to hire good advisers, choose a good heir, and the fact that you can't invest your points everywhere means you have to think about what you want to do instead of micro-managing and being an omniscient dictator. But I get why they're scrapping it, it's not immersive and people want to play these games to feel like an actual ruler in a historical setting.
The difference is that CK2 and 3 have stats like piety and prestige that are very important and required to do stuff, but they're not the focus of the game, more like bottlenecks that require you playing your ruler a long time before he can conquer entire kingdoms or form a new religion. You could play the game for hours, interacting with other mechanics, before you interact with something where you lack the necessary stat. EU4 on the other hand is all about maximizing your point gain. Mana is so broad in its uses that it basically represents your country's growth. There are massive sacrifices that are worth making for the sake of mana gain, like going up to your eyeballs in debt, or fighting a massive war with a rival. It's broad enough with enough ways to generate it and spend it that you can strategize instead of just waiting for it to reach a certain threshold before you can do more fun stuff.
The difference is that CK2 and 3 have stats like piety and prestige that are very important and required to do stuff, but they're not the focus of the game, more like bottlenecks that require you playing your ruler a long time before he can conquer entire kingdoms or form a new religion. You could play the game for hours, interacting with other mechanics, before you interact with something where you lack the necessary stat. EU4 on the other hand is all about maximizing your point gain. Mana is so broad in its uses that it basically represents your country's growth. There are massive sacrifices that are worth making for the sake of mana gain, like going up to your eyeballs in debt, or fighting a massive war with a rival. It's broad enough with enough ways to generate it and spend it that you can strategize instead of just waiting for it to reach a certain threshold before you can do more fun stuff.
What a nice post. I think people hate it because they are unable to imagine. It's far from perfect but I can see the logical explanation for most monarch point spends.
She was also a huge Star Trek fan and would joke that she never had me she'd spend her time and money travelling the world going to Star Trek conventions
it sucks, and it's going to suck even more. the relationship doesn't end, it changes, it continues. you're going to miss her, and at those times there's nothing better, than doing something you did together - i still put on shitty tv series i used to watch with my mom, when it gets rough. monk, fraiser.
besides, what you say is bullshit. like the fact your mother was into men won't stop you from being a little crying homosexual, won't it
It's hardly a strategy game, you can play this with your brain completely turned off and still paint the map in whatever colour you want. You need some time to understand the mechanics but once you did, you can effortlessly win and do whatever.
Games like this are for "history" (actually modern politics and general edgelordism) obsessed incels the same thing visual novels were for tumblr trannies, it's their wet dream sim.
gsgs, a detailed and specific niche hobby, attract autists and there's a direct link between autism and transgenderism (which is not exactly linked with that femboy shit going far beyond just crossdressing but there's some noticeable overlap too).
same can be seen in the it field
Ironman game, I'm Dithmarschen and Burgundy just joined the HRE.
I'm going to eat Holland at least, was able to get both Bremen and Hamburg annexed within the first 20 years.
Didn't see what happened here, but I want to know what series of wars in the Balkans caused this Greece.
I want to see what's going to happen with this AI formed Latin Empire.
This is my Ante Bellum campaign with some mods for AI and admin and military stuff. I love-hate this Europe. Everyone hates each other but the alliance blocs prevent most world wars from breaking out. The mods keep the AI competent so I'm only #5 great power and I have to be very cautious not to over-extend or neglect my economy.
Also I hate the fact that there's three countries with identical colors that border each other.
Actually I've looked it over and it seems doable. It's not quite 2 to 1 odds, although I expect Andalusia to do frick-all. I have fantastic generals and fully drilled armies. The Seljuks declared the war and their capital is a mountain fort bordering on my own. I'm sure I can rush it and hold the line in the east. I'm just worried about being besieged on both sides of my empire. Even with forced marches and fully-built roads, it could be dicey; but if I have to, I can yield Croatia and focus on making the Seljuks come to terms.
Actually I've looked it over and it seems doable. It's not quite 2 to 1 odds, although I expect Andalusia to do frick-all. I have fantastic generals and fully drilled armies. The Seljuks declared the war and their capital is a mountain fort bordering on my own. I'm sure I can rush it and hold the line in the east. I'm just worried about being besieged on both sides of my empire. Even with forced marches and fully-built roads, it could be dicey; but if I have to, I can yield Croatia and focus on making the Seljuks come to terms.
It wasn't even close, lol. They swarmed me fast, tore down my forts, and wouldn't let me rush the capital.
How do you Mehmed? I tried doing it by the vibes and I got sloppy with vassal swarm using 200+ relation with muslims exploit. Would diplo/admin conquest be a better way of doing this? And should I make mameluk into eylet or just core it myself with that one mission?
PS. Last campaign I play was 2 versions ago.
I played a LOT of the game from release until mid 2015 or so. Ultimately, I started to get really tired of the additional uninteresting micromanagement. Managing estates is horrendously tedious and it only seemed to get worse from there. Those early paradox developer multiplayer clashes were pretty fun though, there was some genuine rage.
I'M DEVVVVVVIIIIIIINNNNGGGG!
literally me
>mana
it's a worse strategy game than stellaris, which at least requires actual pops to be working jobs to get science and unity instead of your random-ass polynesian islanders having better guns and artillery than england/france/spain because the AI spent its mana on random bullshit while you clicked the tech button more than they did.
>least requires actual pops to be working jobs to get science
This is represented with advisors and rulers
>your random-ass polynesian islanders having better guns and artillery than england/france/spain
This never happens to AI since they never dev enough to spawn missing institutions.
Seems to me you're just bad at the game and blame the game mechanics instead.
>This never happens to AI since they never dev enough to spawn missing institutions.
I'm saying YOU as random ass polynesians can easily get better tech than england/spain/france. Which is stupid. The game should have an actual economy not moronic mana that's the same for byzantium as it is random OPMs
>It's a worse cookie clicker than stellaris
Fixed that for you
paradox will listen to the playerbase, get rid of mana and quickly find out that there is no better alternative
by that time it is too late though and they will go bankrupt after 15 years of no good games
moral of the story: don't listen to players
The alternative is to make strategy games that are actually good with reduced scopes that allow for actual mechanical depth and well-defined gameplay instead of grand sloppagy.
Pops fix mana issues
clerical/administrative pops
merchant class pops
soldier/nobility pops
You aren’t smart or clever for pointing this out, yes it’s still abstraction, but it’s abstraction that makes sense and is good, rather then random diplo points that mean literally nothing
Eu3 already did it and it was better then eu4 in that regard
>mana
redpill me about this stuff.
i have only played ck2 and some ck3.
do you mean by mana the needed piety and/or prestige to declare wars?
and the tech points accumulation that allow better stuff?
what's the alternative?
Monarch Power (mana) is an abstraction of how much your ruler can get done. A good ruler can do more. It's divided into administrative, diplomatic/trade, and military mana. A ruler with good points can get techs earlier, integrate a lot of provinces, develop provinces to be richer, etc.
People hate it because it's so abstract that it becomes an arbitary point value that you increase to get a better country. I don't know why bombarding forts means I delay getting my military technologies, but the point system means that doing one action limits your ability to do the other.
Gameplay-wise, I think it's serviceable for making the game fun. It creates incentives to hire good advisers, choose a good heir, and the fact that you can't invest your points everywhere means you have to think about what you want to do instead of micro-managing and being an omniscient dictator. But I get why they're scrapping it, it's not immersive and people want to play these games to feel like an actual ruler in a historical setting.
thanks but i wanted to know about mana in ck2 and ck3 to understand it properly.
i now partially understand it thanks to you.
there is no mana in ck2/ck3. gold and prestige arent mana just like they arent in eu4
huh
didn't see this coming tbh
thanks for the thorough explanation
The difference is that CK2 and 3 have stats like piety and prestige that are very important and required to do stuff, but they're not the focus of the game, more like bottlenecks that require you playing your ruler a long time before he can conquer entire kingdoms or form a new religion. You could play the game for hours, interacting with other mechanics, before you interact with something where you lack the necessary stat. EU4 on the other hand is all about maximizing your point gain. Mana is so broad in its uses that it basically represents your country's growth. There are massive sacrifices that are worth making for the sake of mana gain, like going up to your eyeballs in debt, or fighting a massive war with a rival. It's broad enough with enough ways to generate it and spend it that you can strategize instead of just waiting for it to reach a certain threshold before you can do more fun stuff.
What a nice post. I think people hate it because they are unable to imagine. It's far from perfect but I can see the logical explanation for most monarch point spends.
People hate it because it turn the game into how to min max paper mana by stacking modifiers to blob faster
OK your right, having mana increase tax, production and manpower in your provinces is simply moronic, but other than that EU4 is the best game
what do you do in eu4 other than "click the button to spend the resource to make the number get bigger" and "move the stack onto the fort"
>EU4 is the best game
IS NOT LIKE THERE IS MUCH CHOICE
Im hyped for new update. Venice formable seems fun
buy an ad johan
Literally never been paat 1500 because of how awful and convoluted the game is
>mom died recently
>grew up watching her play previous versions
>can't bring myself to play anymore because it reminds me of her
>woman playing grand strategy and procreate
thats impossible
She was also a huge Star Trek fan and would joke that she never had me she'd spend her time and money travelling the world going to Star Trek conventions
She would want you to keep enjoying the games you played together
She'd be sad to see you drop the hobby
it sucks, and it's going to suck even more. the relationship doesn't end, it changes, it continues. you're going to miss her, and at those times there's nothing better, than doing something you did together - i still put on shitty tv series i used to watch with my mom, when it gets rough. monk, fraiser.
besides, what you say is bullshit. like the fact your mother was into men won't stop you from being a little crying homosexual, won't it
you're an evil little ghoul.
the pain, it goes away eventually. and the weirdest thing, you miss it. it was the last thing that made you feel connected with that person.
man thats fricked, how dare she die and ruin the game for you. jk man i hope you can get through this.
>mana system
pass
Mana is based and I'm tired of pretending it's not.
>Use real life mana to become a woman
>Doesn't work
why was the other thread deleted
It's hardly a strategy game, you can play this with your brain completely turned off and still paint the map in whatever colour you want. You need some time to understand the mechanics but once you did, you can effortlessly win and do whatever.
Games like this are for "history" (actually modern politics and general edgelordism) obsessed incels the same thing visual novels were for tumblr trannies, it's their wet dream sim.
if eu4 is the best strategy game to you then you haven't played many strategy games in your life and are most likely underage.
It's rather the best paradox game
Okay, it's the best, but is it good?
Not even a strategy game
turning into a racist I get, but what is it about Paradox games that makes someone turn into a femboy?
Because Paradox games are enjoyed mainly by autists and autists are highly susceptible into being groomed into feminization and eventually troondom
gsgs, a detailed and specific niche hobby, attract autists and there's a direct link between autism and transgenderism (which is not exactly linked with that femboy shit going far beyond just crossdressing but there's some noticeable overlap too).
same can be seen in the it field
jokes on you I was already racist
my counsellor died simulator
why do you play this shit? i'm not judging, but, you're a bit moronic
Ironman game, I'm Dithmarschen and Burgundy just joined the HRE.
I'm going to eat Holland at least, was able to get both Bremen and Hamburg annexed within the first 20 years.
Didn't see what happened here, but I want to know what series of wars in the Balkans caused this Greece.
I want to see what's going to happen with this AI formed Latin Empire.
This is my Ante Bellum campaign with some mods for AI and admin and military stuff. I love-hate this Europe. Everyone hates each other but the alliance blocs prevent most world wars from breaking out. The mods keep the AI competent so I'm only #5 great power and I have to be very cautious not to over-extend or neglect my economy.
Also I hate the fact that there's three countries with identical colors that border each other.
>Also I hate the fact that there's three countries with identical colors that border each other
Can't you change the colour in the save files?
this most still lacks some flavour. Illyria, Britain, Andalusia are ALWAYS blobbing
>Illyria, Britain, Andalusia are ALWAYS blobbing
Ugh....
the only way to play is to roleplay and make ridiculous, nation-ruining choices based on what your ruler would do.
playthrough over, lol
Actually I've looked it over and it seems doable. It's not quite 2 to 1 odds, although I expect Andalusia to do frick-all. I have fantastic generals and fully drilled armies. The Seljuks declared the war and their capital is a mountain fort bordering on my own. I'm sure I can rush it and hold the line in the east. I'm just worried about being besieged on both sides of my empire. Even with forced marches and fully-built roads, it could be dicey; but if I have to, I can yield Croatia and focus on making the Seljuks come to terms.
It wasn't even close, lol. They swarmed me fast, tore down my forts, and wouldn't let me rush the capital.
kys paradog
>dev 1 province
>realize I forgot to turn the edict on and my burghers are 59% loyalty
>start crying, pissing, and shitting myself
How do you Mehmed? I tried doing it by the vibes and I got sloppy with vassal swarm using 200+ relation with muslims exploit. Would diplo/admin conquest be a better way of doing this? And should I make mameluk into eylet or just core it myself with that one mission?
PS. Last campaign I play was 2 versions ago.
I did the steam achievement unlocker and became the first person on the planet to get the achievement. Saved me a good bit of time as well.
Is it? I can only afford about a quarter of the full game so I cant be certain myself
I played a LOT of the game from release until mid 2015 or so. Ultimately, I started to get really tired of the additional uninteresting micromanagement. Managing estates is horrendously tedious and it only seemed to get worse from there. Those early paradox developer multiplayer clashes were pretty fun though, there was some genuine rage.