At least Obsidian can claim time crunch to get the game out. Bethesda could release the game any time they wanted and they chose that garbage ending before patching it and trying to memory hole it out of existence after everyone raged at them for it.
>At least Obsidian can claim time crunch to get the game out.
And even then the Speech option is still better written and actually an option. Bethesda is a fricking joke and they only survive on people loving the taste of shit in their mouth.
Yeah, I prefer fnv's postgame more. The way ron perlman slightly changes his dialog based on your choices really immersed me and made me feel like my choices of the last 30 hours were good. Maybe I'll play again and get him to say other slightly different words.
Weird that fo3, the direct predecessor and, let's face it, the exact same game, has post game content. And it changes the world based on what you do with the FEV in the ending. But no, go ahead and listen to ron perlman talk over a slideshow from his trip to las vegas.
11 months ago
Anonymous
Broken Steel was DLC, in case you had forgotten.
Also recall that New Vegas was planned to have post-game content, but was likely cut for console limitations. Fallout 3 is an 8gb game with all dlc installed, new vegas is not.
11 months ago
Anonymous
Are you fricking stupid? It was on the 360. I had all that shit no problem. New vegas had 5 dlc's and not fricking one of them let you continue playing your version of the wastes. Don't give me that excuse about console limitations, you fricking moron.
11 months ago
Anonymous
Genuine moron. Go away
11 months ago
Anonymous
You're the moron. They bloated the dlc with bear vs bull shit when they could've worked on making different versions of the wastes depending on your choices but instead we get finger penises
11 months ago
Anonymous
Samegayging. Who wouldn't give up lonesome road for post-game content that reflects your choices?
11 months ago
Anonymous
Because it's not a choice you get to make. Obsidian scrapped the post-game content in exchange for the 4 main dlc the game got.
Even after patching it its still moronic because the narrator will basically call you a coward for not being willing to sacrifice yourself when there is literally no point to it if you have someone to radiation. Like legit who fricking thinks this shit up, what kind of terminal Hollywood brain morality do these Americans have where accomplishing the exact same thing without unnecessary cost is dishonorable? WTF man
unironically they were thinking that they wanted to have a big tearjerker ending like a hollywood movie because this was just on the cusp of movie games becoming huge.
That isn't what I said. It's too fricking easy to max out. It should be like Underrail, with scaling to core attribute and restrictions on how much you can increase per level
>It should be like
Bro, the game came out more than 10 years ago. There are no fallout games being made right now. Most of the people who worked on New Vegas from Obsidian aren't with the company anymore.
Get a fricking grip.
>'uhhh m-maybe we we can talk t-this through?' >'Negotiating is gay. Time to die gay.'
Best villain in the franchise. No sappy backstory to try and get you to 'understand them'. Is completely loyal to his nation and its cause, and cannot be swayed or bought to think otherwise. Just a plain mean evil bastard who has zero redeeming qualities, who doesn't want peace, just wants to squash the little shit that is you.
The insistence that every RPG should have non-combat solutions to every situation has ruined an entire generation of RPGs. I love Horrigan because he's the antithesis to this, he's not someone who can be reasoned with or talked out of murdering you and the devs embraced this rather than make some bullshit speech check that makes the villain frick off magically.
>The insistence that every RPG should have non-combat solutions to every situation has ruined an entire generation of RPGs.
It does when your game allows builds that are not combat oriented in the first place.
That being said yes, those different options should make sense.
I very sincerely doubt you played fallout 2 because while horrigan always has to be fought, there are several ways to make the fight easier. Including using speech to convince an Enclave squad to fight with you, as well as hacking some turrets.
Furthermore, horrigan's fight came at the end of an area where there is no other mandatory combat. You can go through the entire Oil Rig without firing a shot.
The circumstances of talking to Lanius are the opposite. You had just fought your way across Hoover Dam and into his raid camp. You have already completed the "combat section" of NV's endgame by the time you reach Lanius, and even then, you can still kill him if you want to.
Did you miss all the other skill checks throughout New vegas? >non-combat skills and exploration useful
OK, you definitely didn't play fallout 2. Go ahead and tell me how useful the repair and traps skills are.
The non-combat way to deal with Master was so much better because it wasn't just a speech check. You had to talk to certain people and get the evidence that the FEV made the muties sterile so that his plan was a dead end.
Yes, it would have been better if all options were locked behind information you have to gather, that you have to prove that Mojave is a trap for the Legion. And also more bad options to choose from plus no stating of stat requirement plus which stat. Let people figure that out on their own
Why it is so hard to comprehend that this Black person was following Ceasar’s orders to conquer the east? He wasnt as invested as his brain damaged leader so just a little push and he will do what he sees as the best for the legion.
WE HAVE THIS THREAD EVERYDAY >EVERYDAY WE HAVE THIS THREAD
WE HAVE THIS THREAD EVERYDAY >EVERYDAY WE HAVE THIS THREAD
WE HAVE THIS THREAD EVERYDAY >EVERYDAY WE HAVE THIS THREAD
Face it chuds fallout 3 is the superor game. Theirs no better game acsept for starfeild thats is coming out this yer. Todd has done a new goat just like fallout 3 is a goat its the best weres youre troony game now b***h?
What's even funnier is when you realise that everything the player asked could and SHOULD have been answered by what is literally an AI parroting the Enclave.
But I guess Eden must have had a stroke hearing the stupid shit coming out of the player's mouth.
I am surprised at how much hate this conversation gets. I think the developers were really trying to get a message across here.
>It is not the strength of the West that will slow you, it is their weakness.
This is the first line in the conversation that is a 100 Speech check, and thus it is probably the most important line. To the Legion, strength is all that matters. Victory or defeat is all about strength and anything else is a sentimentalism. If you are trying to argue on terms of pure strength with Lanius you will never win because he will always think that he is stronger than you. Trying to convince him that the NCR simply has more strength would just make him double down
This line basically destabilizes him and sort of knocks him off balance ("Your....weakness?"). He is not expecting it, and being thrown off, his mind is now more open to having his mind changed. The conversation is no longer really on terms he is used to communicating in. When you say it is effectively the WEAKNESS of the NCR - its often criticized large bureaucracy and being spread thin - that will give the Legion trouble, its just not how he is used to thinking, and his moment of confusion is what changes his mind
I think the developers are largely sympathetic to the NCR, and what they were trying to say with this line was: the future does not have to be all about strength and violence. Pure brute strength does not have to be the values of the future that we are trying to rebuild. Things that we make think are "weak" may be worth valuing.
You convince him that his supply lines are stretched too thin. You apparently know this because you're good at couponing at shops.
>You convince him that his supply lines are stretched too thin
its less his supply lines and more his ability to recuperate losses, which is kinda within the purview of Barter
None of you were ever going to be satisfied with a speech check ending because convincing the final boss to frick off is inherently silly. Maybe if you had to get hard evidence to show why the Legions plan wouldn't work then it may have been more believable. Personally, I think 100 speech + evidence + improve the writing a little = kino ending.
>add a fetch quest >now it's kino
I rather not, unless there's some triforce gathering that gives another avenue for people who don't level those skills.
Adding just as another wall in the conversation seems unnecessary to me if your build already allows it.
They do let you side with them, but they make the Legion into such cartoon misogynists that they shouldn't be taken seriously. Instead of introducing rational values in women, the Legion just wants to make them into frickpigs. The fault lies with Obsidian and every other game developer that wants to tiptoe around what is ultimately true.
I just don't think simply adding a Macguffing would improve it. At least not this way.
Maybe gathering it would reduce the level, so 0 evidence means 100 skill needed, 1-85 skill, 2-70 skill and 3 you bypass it. Or something like that.
No it doesn't. It happens organically as part of the story. Do you even know how to write?
Point is it shouldn't be given to the player at face value. It's an alternative route therefore the player should get to it on its own. Just mention the existence but don't railroad it.
Bro, what don't you get? The main quest involves you figuring that shit out, whether as the stated goal or as little tidbits along the way. Only speech/intelligence/charisma/whatever characters get to use them as options in the end. Requires no new quests, just a bit of story tweaking and it makes logical sense. Don't try to tell me I convinced him that the ncr's weakness is its strength after I just pushed his shit in across the hoover damn. That's why barter is the most ridiculous ending ever and should take the place of speech ending in the public consciousness.
What we disagree is that i don't think it should be tied to some main quest gathering this. It's an alternative win condition and just like leveling up a stat shouldn't be tied, the Macguffins shouldn't either. Your main quest is defeating it. How to do it is up to the player to go out there and get the tools depending on your build.
11 months ago
Anonymous
You don't get it. Everyone does the stuff you talk to the boss about but only high speech/intelligence/whatever get access to using them in the final conversation. Dont give me the shit about ncr being weak after we just pushed his shit in.
There's basically no possible way to solve that particular situation peacefully, what kind of commander would be able to march his troops across a fricking radioactive desert and when they finally reach their destination go "look guys we're turning back lol my bad"? The entire legion would fall apart on the spot.
The only way I can imagine this working out is having killed Caesar as a prerequisite, maybe opening up some questlines involving sowing dissension over his succession from within the Legion, and then finally having done all that you get a speech check where you convince Lanius that he should deal with the Legion's internal matters first.
If you're fighting the Legion, Caesar is probably already dead, or at the least brain dead, since the courier isn't there to intervene with his health
There's no way Lanius would go back to Caesar peacefully considering what happened to Graham
>desert and when they finally reach their destination go "look guys we're turning back lol my bad"?
Because the legion already fricking lost the battle. Their attempt to infiltrate the dam failed. Their base was bombed or destroyed by securitrons. You speak to lanius outside his own fricking tent.
Are you Black folk for real, or ai generated?
>None of you were ever going to be satisfied with a speech check ending because convincing the final boss to frick off is inherently silly.
FO1 did it.
Stupid thing about Fallout games is that Speech is so fricking useful that it doesn't really make sense not to immediately level it to 100 in every playthrough.
>New Reddit has good wr-
Hm? Bye.
Based charls poster
>throw ring in volcano lmaooo
>the end
anything sounds moronic if you're reductionist enough
Fallout 3 has a much better end...
what were they thinking?
At least Obsidian can claim time crunch to get the game out. Bethesda could release the game any time they wanted and they chose that garbage ending before patching it and trying to memory hole it out of existence after everyone raged at them for it.
>At least Obsidian can claim time crunch to get the game out.
And even then the Speech option is still better written and actually an option. Bethesda is a fricking joke and they only survive on people loving the taste of shit in their mouth.
Yeah, I prefer fnv's postgame more. The way ron perlman slightly changes his dialog based on your choices really immersed me and made me feel like my choices of the last 30 hours were good. Maybe I'll play again and get him to say other slightly different words.
What are you b***hing about? That's literally how all Fallout games ended
Weird that fo3, the direct predecessor and, let's face it, the exact same game, has post game content. And it changes the world based on what you do with the FEV in the ending. But no, go ahead and listen to ron perlman talk over a slideshow from his trip to las vegas.
Broken Steel was DLC, in case you had forgotten.
Also recall that New Vegas was planned to have post-game content, but was likely cut for console limitations. Fallout 3 is an 8gb game with all dlc installed, new vegas is not.
Are you fricking stupid? It was on the 360. I had all that shit no problem. New vegas had 5 dlc's and not fricking one of them let you continue playing your version of the wastes. Don't give me that excuse about console limitations, you fricking moron.
Genuine moron. Go away
You're the moron. They bloated the dlc with bear vs bull shit when they could've worked on making different versions of the wastes depending on your choices but instead we get finger penises
Samegayging. Who wouldn't give up lonesome road for post-game content that reflects your choices?
Because it's not a choice you get to make. Obsidian scrapped the post-game content in exchange for the 4 main dlc the game got.
Even after patching it its still moronic because the narrator will basically call you a coward for not being willing to sacrifice yourself when there is literally no point to it if you have someone to radiation. Like legit who fricking thinks this shit up, what kind of terminal Hollywood brain morality do these Americans have where accomplishing the exact same thing without unnecessary cost is dishonorable? WTF man
unironically they were thinking that they wanted to have a big tearjerker ending like a hollywood movie because this was just on the cusp of movie games becoming huge.
Jesus. People were actually paid to write this.
>hey, could you turn it on since you're immune to radiation and all?
>nah, it's your destiny, you'll have the honor 🙂
lmfao
>trust me, it'll build character
>homie I'M GONNA DIE
Am I crazy? I remember he DID walked in for me, it was a little silly but it happened, you pass out anyway
Broken Steel DLC allows you to send him to the purifier, before the DLC it wasn't an option
But the narrator chews you for not being stupid and entering a irratiated chamber when there is people that could do the same without problems.
>But the narrator chews you
Emil's christcuck narrative is like poetry, it rhymes
You can't just... just use common sense
Kino.
3-sirs… they’re laughing at us again…
why did you choose to roleplay and build a character that has the power to say anything to anyone and they will believe it if you don't like it?
It's to easy
Charisma in RPGs should be something like Alpha Protocol.
Woah now let's not go crazy. You'll get your colored text and some bracketed skill checks and you'll like it.
The problem is that there's no restrictions on skill gain. You can get to speech 100 in 5-6 levels, while also having god tier combat stats
>I put all my skill points into speech and now I'm mad. How could this happen to me?
That isn't what I said. It's too fricking easy to max out. It should be like Underrail, with scaling to core attribute and restrictions on how much you can increase per level
>It should be like
Bro, the game came out more than 10 years ago. There are no fallout games being made right now. Most of the people who worked on New Vegas from Obsidian aren't with the company anymore.
Get a fricking grip.
>shoot a bunch of molerats
>become a charisma master
rpgs have always been shit
Name 5 games with good writing.
its hard to understand OP but yeah people talk to more people than the cashier at the store
later
why did they all say that though. was it a wasteland thing?
it's kinda like how everyone in DS3 ended all their dialogue with a little evil laugh
>'uhhh m-maybe we we can talk t-this through?'
>'Negotiating is gay. Time to die gay.'
Best villain in the franchise. No sappy backstory to try and get you to 'understand them'. Is completely loyal to his nation and its cause, and cannot be swayed or bought to think otherwise. Just a plain mean evil bastard who has zero redeeming qualities, who doesn't want peace, just wants to squash the little shit that is you.
The insistence that every RPG should have non-combat solutions to every situation has ruined an entire generation of RPGs. I love Horrigan because he's the antithesis to this, he's not someone who can be reasoned with or talked out of murdering you and the devs embraced this rather than make some bullshit speech check that makes the villain frick off magically.
>The insistence that every RPG should have non-combat solutions to every situation has ruined an entire generation of RPGs.
It does when your game allows builds that are not combat oriented in the first place.
That being said yes, those different options should make sense.
I very sincerely doubt you played fallout 2 because while horrigan always has to be fought, there are several ways to make the fight easier. Including using speech to convince an Enclave squad to fight with you, as well as hacking some turrets.
Furthermore, horrigan's fight came at the end of an area where there is no other mandatory combat. You can go through the entire Oil Rig without firing a shot.
The circumstances of talking to Lanius are the opposite. You had just fought your way across Hoover Dam and into his raid camp. You have already completed the "combat section" of NV's endgame by the time you reach Lanius, and even then, you can still kill him if you want to.
That's the thing, the game found ways to make non-combat skills and exploration useful without resorting to speech checking the final boss.
Did you miss all the other skill checks throughout New vegas?
>non-combat skills and exploration useful
OK, you definitely didn't play fallout 2. Go ahead and tell me how useful the repair and traps skills are.
The non-combat way to deal with Master was so much better because it wasn't just a speech check. You had to talk to certain people and get the evidence that the FEV made the muties sterile so that his plan was a dead end.
Yes, it would have been better if all options were locked behind information you have to gather, that you have to prove that Mojave is a trap for the Legion. And also more bad options to choose from plus no stating of stat requirement plus which stat. Let people figure that out on their own
What's the solution to shitty speech checks in RPGs?
There's no shitty speech check, just shitty writing that can be associated with it.
>yes
>[speech 30] no
Why it is so hard to comprehend that this Black person was following Ceasar’s orders to conquer the east? He wasnt as invested as his brain damaged leader so just a little push and he will do what he sees as the best for the legion.
WE HAVE THIS THREAD EVERYDAY
>EVERYDAY WE HAVE THIS THREAD
WE HAVE THIS THREAD EVERYDAY
>EVERYDAY WE HAVE THIS THREAD
WE HAVE THIS THREAD EVERYDAY
>EVERYDAY WE HAVE THIS THREAD
>he doesn't do the joshua graham humiliation threat speech option
NGMI
G
M
I
Face it chuds fallout 3 is the superor game. Theirs no better game acsept for starfeild thats is coming out this yer. Todd has done a new goat just like fallout 3 is a goat its the best weres youre troony game now b***h?
SIR
>have a nice day
>why?
>just do it
>ok
this is even dumber than i remember
What's even funnier is when you realise that everything the player asked could and SHOULD have been answered by what is literally an AI parroting the Enclave.
But I guess Eden must have had a stroke hearing the stupid shit coming out of the player's mouth.
>make meme speech cheat build
>complain about bad results
All speech is is a "skip gameplay" button. Speechgays deserve their shit endings.
Lmao, did they make an AI based on W. Bush?
Was it really this bad? I don't remember this being so unspeakably moronic, good lord.
>[Science] You can't be President. You're an abortion of science. You need to die...
Did they mean to write abomination?
hegelian
I am surprised at how much hate this conversation gets. I think the developers were really trying to get a message across here.
>It is not the strength of the West that will slow you, it is their weakness.
This is the first line in the conversation that is a 100 Speech check, and thus it is probably the most important line. To the Legion, strength is all that matters. Victory or defeat is all about strength and anything else is a sentimentalism. If you are trying to argue on terms of pure strength with Lanius you will never win because he will always think that he is stronger than you. Trying to convince him that the NCR simply has more strength would just make him double down
This line basically destabilizes him and sort of knocks him off balance ("Your....weakness?"). He is not expecting it, and being thrown off, his mind is now more open to having his mind changed. The conversation is no longer really on terms he is used to communicating in. When you say it is effectively the WEAKNESS of the NCR - its often criticized large bureaucracy and being spread thin - that will give the Legion trouble, its just not how he is used to thinking, and his moment of confusion is what changes his mind
I think the developers are largely sympathetic to the NCR, and what they were trying to say with this line was: the future does not have to be all about strength and violence. Pure brute strength does not have to be the values of the future that we are trying to rebuild. Things that we make think are "weak" may be worth valuing.
You can also win with barter 100. That should be the meme because it's so fricking stupid.
>You can also win with barter 100
Lol what do you do, offer him 1000 caps to frick off?
You convince him that his supply lines are stretched too thin. You apparently know this because you're good at couponing at shops.
>You convince him that his supply lines are stretched too thin
its less his supply lines and more his ability to recuperate losses, which is kinda within the purview of Barter
No it's not. Shut up.
None of you were ever going to be satisfied with a speech check ending because convincing the final boss to frick off is inherently silly. Maybe if you had to get hard evidence to show why the Legions plan wouldn't work then it may have been more believable. Personally, I think 100 speech + evidence + improve the writing a little = kino ending.
>add a fetch quest
>now it's kino
I rather not, unless there's some triforce gathering that gives another avenue for people who don't level those skills.
Adding just as another wall in the conversation seems unnecessary to me if your build already allows it.
>fetch quest
You railroad the evidence gathering into the main quest so the ending makes logical sense, moron.
>railroading it
That only makes it worse.
No it doesn't. It happens organically as part of the story. Do you even know how to write?
>evidence
New Vegas still does that via a decisive military victory against the legion.
Yeah, because obsidian are such dogshit writers that they didn't let you side with the legion.
Every other post in this thread is so moronic that I cannot tell if you're being sarcastic or if you're a bot
They had it planned but cut it cause they can't meet any deadlines. That's literally historical fact, you dumbass.
Bot post.
They do let you side with them, but they make the Legion into such cartoon misogynists that they shouldn't be taken seriously. Instead of introducing rational values in women, the Legion just wants to make them into frickpigs. The fault lies with Obsidian and every other game developer that wants to tiptoe around what is ultimately true.
What quest isn't a "fetch quest". What is the criteria that can't be attributed to every single mission in a Bethesda game.
I just don't think simply adding a Macguffing would improve it. At least not this way.
Maybe gathering it would reduce the level, so 0 evidence means 100 skill needed, 1-85 skill, 2-70 skill and 3 you bypass it. Or something like that.
Point is it shouldn't be given to the player at face value. It's an alternative route therefore the player should get to it on its own. Just mention the existence but don't railroad it.
Bro, what don't you get? The main quest involves you figuring that shit out, whether as the stated goal or as little tidbits along the way. Only speech/intelligence/charisma/whatever characters get to use them as options in the end. Requires no new quests, just a bit of story tweaking and it makes logical sense. Don't try to tell me I convinced him that the ncr's weakness is its strength after I just pushed his shit in across the hoover damn. That's why barter is the most ridiculous ending ever and should take the place of speech ending in the public consciousness.
What we disagree is that i don't think it should be tied to some main quest gathering this. It's an alternative win condition and just like leveling up a stat shouldn't be tied, the Macguffins shouldn't either. Your main quest is defeating it. How to do it is up to the player to go out there and get the tools depending on your build.
You don't get it. Everyone does the stuff you talk to the boss about but only high speech/intelligence/whatever get access to using them in the final conversation. Dont give me the shit about ncr being weak after we just pushed his shit in.
There's basically no possible way to solve that particular situation peacefully, what kind of commander would be able to march his troops across a fricking radioactive desert and when they finally reach their destination go "look guys we're turning back lol my bad"? The entire legion would fall apart on the spot.
The only way I can imagine this working out is having killed Caesar as a prerequisite, maybe opening up some questlines involving sowing dissension over his succession from within the Legion, and then finally having done all that you get a speech check where you convince Lanius that he should deal with the Legion's internal matters first.
If you're fighting the Legion, Caesar is probably already dead, or at the least brain dead, since the courier isn't there to intervene with his health
There's no way Lanius would go back to Caesar peacefully considering what happened to Graham
>desert and when they finally reach their destination go "look guys we're turning back lol my bad"?
Because the legion already fricking lost the battle. Their attempt to infiltrate the dam failed. Their base was bombed or destroyed by securitrons. You speak to lanius outside his own fricking tent.
Are you Black folk for real, or ai generated?
>None of you were ever going to be satisfied with a speech check ending because convincing the final boss to frick off is inherently silly.
FO1 did it.
What RPGs have good speech systems?
Disco Elysium.
But to be fair, the dialogue system is the core of the gameplay.
Stupid thing about Fallout games is that Speech is so fricking useful that it doesn't really make sense not to immediately level it to 100 in every playthrough.
Lanius doesn't seem like the kind of guy that should be able to be reasoned with