>NOOOOOOO I HAVE TO TRAIN MY HECKIN TEAMERINO NOOOOO WHAT ARE YOU DOING WITH YOUR LEVEL 80 STARTERINO BY THE 5TH GYM STOP RAPING ME NO NO NOOOOO YAWNF-ACK!!!!!!!!!
Lmao borts suck so much just like their "games"
There's a surefire way to win. It's a little strategy called "not being shit at children's games". You killed a thread in cold blood just so you could tell us how bad you are at video games.
Yeah? It's not like there's any way to utilize skill to beat what's effectively a statcheck. You could hope for crits / misses, but at that point you would have already been grinding on his Patrat to even attempt that multiple times
Not sure what discussion you're expecting OP, it's a known fact /vp/ doesn't actually play the games but will still use meme arguments to discredit people who do
Anyway this guy is the reason picking Tepig is a necessity
I've always considered Roark from the Sinnoh games to be a big difficulty spike and tough 1st gym leader, especially when compared to the similar Brock and Roxanne who also use rock type. Geodude and Onix all have stealth rock. Onix gets meme'd on but it has Sturdy which prevents a 1hko to Water Gun and because Onix is decently fast for that point of the game it can likely get a screech off to wear you down even more. Then Cranidos comes in with its fricking 125 attack and proceeds to sweep you with Headbutt and Stealth Rock damage. It also has a cheeky Pursuit if you try to switch out.
Roark is a well designed fight, but I wouldn’t call it difficult because, despite the extra effort, it can still be easily countered by any grass or water type. Cheren is a cut above the rest because there is no single mon or strategy that will win you the fight. your starter is going to get outdamaged after a few Work Ups, Riolu doesn’t have a fighting move and has to rely on counter, Mareep at this stage is only really good for spreading paralysis, and everything else is simply not that good. if you want to win, you’ve got to use these options together, make them more than the sum of their parts.
Piplup and Turtwig aren't strong enough yet to 1hko or even 2hko Cranidos with Water Gun or Razor Leaf respectively. To make matters worse Cranidos outspeeds both of them and can nearly 1hko both with Headbutt, it becomes a 1hko with stealth rock chip or if Onix managed to get a screech off earlier. The other pokemon you have available don't fare much better with.
I can't remember for Piplup, but Turtwig has no problem dealing with Roark.
Absorb until Cranidos, and then you can just deal with it since you're not squishy.
If you really want to tryhard, it also learns Withdraw iirc.
Roark is a well designed fight, but I wouldn’t call it difficult because, despite the extra effort, it can still be easily countered by any grass or water type. Cheren is a cut above the rest because there is no single mon or strategy that will win you the fight. your starter is going to get outdamaged after a few Work Ups, Riolu doesn’t have a fighting move and has to rely on counter, Mareep at this stage is only really good for spreading paralysis, and everything else is simply not that good. if you want to win, you’ve got to use these options together, make them more than the sum of their parts.
It is when you have nothing to fall back on. A factor attributing to Cheren's difficulty is your limited options at that point in the game. Grinding is outright discouraged due to the low amount of exp available and as a result, without investing near hours of your time to grinding, you're going to have either a similarly levelled to the gym leader starter and fodder or a team of all equally low levelled mons.
Later bosses don't have this issue: you have a wider variety of options, opportunities to gain exp and your team will most likely be more balanced, so if your plan A does go down, plan B can most likely stand a chance. Unlike sending a level 3 Patrat to face a +2 work up level 14 Lillipup with stab.
nta but crits are more of an issue if you sit around stacking Defense because >A. Crits ignore Defense buffs >B. The more hits you take the more likely you are to be crit
Especially since you're using Defense Curl and not Iron Defense, you're making yourself a sitting duck
>Riolu doesn't learn STAB, Force Palm, until level 15 >The boss' Pokemon are in the level 12-14 range
What part of "not overleveling" do you not understand? Can you read?
If you don't grind, Tepig might be a good choice? You can use defence curl and assuming you don't get crit, you should be alright? There's also a possibility to burn, albeit a 10% chance every ember. Oshawott has focus energy. So you're pretty much setting that up turn 1 and hoping for the best. Of course giving your mons the gifted oran berries would help.
Mareep might be helpful to: it has thunder wave as early as level 4, it knows thunder shock (again, 10% chance) and the ability static having a 30% chance to paralyze on contact, which is likely due to Cheren's moves being physically offensive. Regardless, it's harder than any other fight in the mainline series to consistently win.
Lets talk about this seriously. We all know without restrictions, even without grinding, this is piss easy. Items are OP, just having 6 mons at level 10+ for this would be OP, etc.
But lets say you have 2 mons at the same level range as him and you're on a nuzlocke and you can't use items. How do you win?
>lets say you have 2 mons at the same level range as him and you're on a nuzlocke and you can't use items. How do you win?
Equip Oran Berry on mons, use status moves while working up and pray you don’t die.
Paralysis setup works too if using Mareep.
>But lets say you have 2 mons at the same level range as him and you're on a nuzlocke and you can't use items. How do you win?
Would depend on what you caught. Mareep at level 13 with an oran berry could do work with static/t-wave and thundershock, there's azurill (which I assume you'd evolve to marill) that has Charm to shut down Work Up, and Sewaddle is actually a monster at this point in the game with bug bite, it would 2HKO patrat and lets you double dip an oran berry if lillipups pick up ability activates. There's also flinching with bite if you have your own lillupup (good combo with mareep). At this point in the game your options are limited so itll depend on if you get screwed with a crit or not, but the oran berries are a huge help.
>catch Riolu >take 100,000 steps, so I can get the Honored Footprints medal and no other reason >Riolu evolves into Lucario while fighting gym trainers >wreck Cheren
>Whitney in GSC >May/Brendan under the bridge in RSE >Lenora in BW >Cheren in B2W2 >the Furfrou double battle in XY >Totem Lurantis in SM
What other early/mid-game casual filters are there?
>"HARDEST BOSS, GUYS!" >Gets several examples of how to bruise Cheren's bussy without grinding >"Y-YOU DIDN'T PLAY THE GAME!"
We get it, OP. You're bad at vidya. It's not our fault that you can't beat a boss that children can curbstomp without much effort on their first try. So try getting good, instead of begging us to beat an easy game for you.
>"HARDEST BOSS, GUYS!" >Gets several examples of how to bruise Cheren's bussy without grinding >"Y-YOU DIDN'T PLAY THE GAME!"
We get it, OP. You're bad at vidya. It's not our fault that you can't beat a boss that children can curbstomp without much effort on their first try. So try getting good, instead of begging us to beat an easy game for you.
Most of the suggestions rely on grinding (kids wont do and gen 5 exp gain discourages grinding)
Doing all the steps to get Lucario early is a decent suggestion, albeit still time consuming. But an option. Mareep could be a good strat to.
Anyone who says spam the starter hasn't actually done it or over levels.
The point being that this fight alone is harder than any other required battle in the series.
Here's how you beat Cheren with under level 10 Pokemon. There, we beat the boss for you. Now you can brag to your mom about how you beat a kids game while being under leveled.
He uses a berry, but still beat Cheren at levels 11 and 12 without much of a problem. Why are you bringing up items, when all you said was Cheren's hard without grinding?
Based Lueroi. >Why are items relevant
Because it's a testament to the difficulty that you needed to use said items. For example: Brock is so easy in Red/Blue that you can beat his whole team with a level 8 Squirtle and no items; because he's easier.
4 months ago
Anonymous
You personally gimping yourself on that game specifically doesn’t mean that it’s objectively harder.
4 months ago
Anonymous
Parroting is an admission of defeat.
4 months ago
Anonymous
>NOOOOO STOP USING MY DOGSHIT ARGUMENT AGAINST ME Y-Y-YOU LOST NOT ME
4 months ago
Anonymous
The argument only works if it properly applies to the thing you’re replying to.
4 months ago
Anonymous
>guise this gym leader is so hard >but only under my arbitrary rules that i only bring up 60 posts into the thread
what are you trying to gain from this?
You personally gimping yourself on that game specifically doesn’t mean that it’s objectively harder.
>NOOOOO STOP USING MY DOGSHIT ARGUMENT AGAINST ME Y-Y-YOU LOST NOT ME
>guise this gym leader is so hard >but only under my arbitrary rules that i only bring up 60 posts into the thread
what are you trying to gain from this?
Oh no, guys! I found a video of someone effortlessly beating Cheren with under level 14 Pokemon and not using items! And he only used 2 Pokemon, the same amount Cheren used! How will OP cope?
Anon, it’s a successful paralysis four times in a row. This is an identical type of argument to “just crit” or “just wait until the opponent misses every time”. It does nothing to compare difficulty BETWEEN the games.
>send out starter
>click STAB
wow so hard
>Send out starter
>Don't kill it in 2 hits
>Foe has used work up both turns
>Kills you with work up + stab tackle
Nothing personal kid.
>Kills you with work up + stab tackle
nope
I played it multiple times even in Challenge Mode.
>NOOOOOOO I HAVE TO TRAIN MY HECKIN TEAMERINO NOOOOO WHAT ARE YOU DOING WITH YOUR LEVEL 80 STARTERINO BY THE 5TH GYM STOP RAPING ME NO NO NOOOOO YAWNF-ACK!!!!!!!!!
Lmao borts suck so much just like their "games"
>tch, these games are really easy
>All you have to do is run back and forwards for 2 hours till you're stronger than the gym leader to brute force it.
>play as a Pokémon trainer
>doesn't enjoy training his Pokémon
>Building a team, move sets and progression is the same as tedious grinding for hours.
Do contrariahomies really?
you didn’t play the game
frick you and your bullshit game, you disgusting furgay
trick question, there is no guaranteed way to beat him. you have to change your approach based on the situation and what you have at your disposal.
There's a surefire way to win. It's a little strategy called "not being shit at children's games". You killed a thread in cold blood just so you could tell us how bad you are at video games.
->
I was at ToysRUs and my parents made me choose between Mario 64 DS or B2W2. I already had BW so I picked Mario, kinda regret it now.
Same level as gym, uses 2 potions and still loses:
Uses Xdefends and still loses:
?list=PLgYcvjQqu5W5Dg2HrYiQPoLdf6iEZ8Rhj
Literally both these videos have people trying to use +1 stat boosts and debuffs for no reason lol
>Get Riolu in Flocessy Ranch
>Train it exclusively until you defeat Cheren
ezpz
>Grinding
Yeah? It's not like there's any way to utilize skill to beat what's effectively a statcheck. You could hope for crits / misses, but at that point you would have already been grinding on his Patrat to even attempt that multiple times
>grinding to level 15 for the first gym
Making the effort to build up the Riolu's happiness is how you can get a Lucario as soon as possible. It's just common sense
i'm just talking about learning force palm
Not sure what discussion you're expecting OP, it's a known fact /vp/ doesn't actually play the games but will still use meme arguments to discredit people who do
Anyway this guy is the reason picking Tepig is a necessity
>picking Tepig is a necessity
Or you grind for five minutesm
she won
I got a Riolu for that. Incidentally I also dropped this bad game at Pokestar Studios.
nope, work up is too strong
I've always considered Roark from the Sinnoh games to be a big difficulty spike and tough 1st gym leader, especially when compared to the similar Brock and Roxanne who also use rock type. Geodude and Onix all have stealth rock. Onix gets meme'd on but it has Sturdy which prevents a 1hko to Water Gun and because Onix is decently fast for that point of the game it can likely get a screech off to wear you down even more. Then Cranidos comes in with its fricking 125 attack and proceeds to sweep you with Headbutt and Stealth Rock damage. It also has a cheeky Pursuit if you try to switch out.
>Roark
Not really... Only hard if you choose Chimchar. Turtwig and Piplup sweep through his mons easily, even a Budew helps
Piplup and Turtwig aren't strong enough yet to 1hko or even 2hko Cranidos with Water Gun or Razor Leaf respectively. To make matters worse Cranidos outspeeds both of them and can nearly 1hko both with Headbutt, it becomes a 1hko with stealth rock chip or if Onix managed to get a screech off earlier. The other pokemon you have available don't fare much better with.
Piplup/Turtwig + Geodude/Onix to finish the job might work
I can't remember for Piplup, but Turtwig has no problem dealing with Roark.
Absorb until Cranidos, and then you can just deal with it since you're not squishy.
If you really want to tryhard, it also learns Withdraw iirc.
Roark is a well designed fight, but I wouldn’t call it difficult because, despite the extra effort, it can still be easily countered by any grass or water type. Cheren is a cut above the rest because there is no single mon or strategy that will win you the fight. your starter is going to get outdamaged after a few Work Ups, Riolu doesn’t have a fighting move and has to rely on counter, Mareep at this stage is only really good for spreading paralysis, and everything else is simply not that good. if you want to win, you’ve got to use these options together, make them more than the sum of their parts.
Sturdy didn't work that way in the original gen 4
>Defense Curl
ggez
>Crits
>You die
>No viable back ups in your team.
A crit isn’t an argument, I could just say “crits” to the whole premise
It is when you have nothing to fall back on. A factor attributing to Cheren's difficulty is your limited options at that point in the game. Grinding is outright discouraged due to the low amount of exp available and as a result, without investing near hours of your time to grinding, you're going to have either a similarly levelled to the gym leader starter and fodder or a team of all equally low levelled mons.
Later bosses don't have this issue: you have a wider variety of options, opportunities to gain exp and your team will most likely be more balanced, so if your plan A does go down, plan B can most likely stand a chance. Unlike sending a level 3 Patrat to face a +2 work up level 14 Lillipup with stab.
>use starter
>click stab
>it crits
>his moron puppy dies
Easy game
nta but crits are more of an issue if you sit around stacking Defense because
>A. Crits ignore Defense buffs
>B. The more hits you take the more likely you are to be crit
Especially since you're using Defense Curl and not Iron Defense, you're making yourself a sitting duck
I’m not saying they aren’t an issue, but that’s not really an answer. Like crits can happen to anyone at any time with any strategy
Cant you get a fricking Riolu at the nearby farm? WHAT THE FRICK IS WRONG WITH YOU?
>Riolu doesn't learn STAB, Force Palm, until level 15
>The boss' Pokemon are in the level 12-14 range
What part of "not overleveling" do you not understand? Can you read?
FRICK YOU FRICK YOU FRICK YOU FRICK YOUFRICK YOU FRICK YOUT
*lvl 11
There's no way you're this bad at videogames
shhhh, the adults are talking
Why is he sweating and blushing
Based Sewaddle is great against this gay, if you are playing Challenge Mode you can even steal Lillipup's berry with Bug Bite
A Cheren thread? In 2024?
Quick, post Cheren!
Normal type gyms are the best casual filters.
If you don't grind, Tepig might be a good choice? You can use defence curl and assuming you don't get crit, you should be alright? There's also a possibility to burn, albeit a 10% chance every ember. Oshawott has focus energy. So you're pretty much setting that up turn 1 and hoping for the best. Of course giving your mons the gifted oran berries would help.
Mareep might be helpful to: it has thunder wave as early as level 4, it knows thunder shock (again, 10% chance) and the ability static having a 30% chance to paralyze on contact, which is likely due to Cheren's moves being physically offensive. Regardless, it's harder than any other fight in the mainline series to consistently win.
Lets talk about this seriously. We all know without restrictions, even without grinding, this is piss easy. Items are OP, just having 6 mons at level 10+ for this would be OP, etc.
But lets say you have 2 mons at the same level range as him and you're on a nuzlocke and you can't use items. How do you win?
>lets say you have 2 mons at the same level range as him and you're on a nuzlocke and you can't use items. How do you win?
Equip Oran Berry on mons, use status moves while working up and pray you don’t die.
Paralysis setup works too if using Mareep.
>But lets say you have 2 mons at the same level range as him and you're on a nuzlocke and you can't use items. How do you win?
Would depend on what you caught. Mareep at level 13 with an oran berry could do work with static/t-wave and thundershock, there's azurill (which I assume you'd evolve to marill) that has Charm to shut down Work Up, and Sewaddle is actually a monster at this point in the game with bug bite, it would 2HKO patrat and lets you double dip an oran berry if lillipups pick up ability activates. There's also flinching with bite if you have your own lillupup (good combo with mareep). At this point in the game your options are limited so itll depend on if you get screwed with a crit or not, but the oran berries are a huge help.
>catch Riolu
>take 100,000 steps, so I can get the Honored Footprints medal and no other reason
>Riolu evolves into Lucario while fighting gym trainers
>wreck Cheren
Its really that simple
>Slightly better grinding.
Time consuming, but at least the steel type would resist.
>catch azurill
>run around the starting area then level it up to evolve it to marill
>defense curl and rollout at level 10
>???
>win
>Whitney in GSC
>May/Brendan under the bridge in RSE
>Lenora in BW
>Cheren in B2W2
>the Furfrou double battle in XY
>Totem Lurantis in SM
What other early/mid-game casual filters are there?
Brock in Yellow iirc
>clicks growth once
>wins
>Exposes to everyone she didn't play the game
Yikes.
What about it says I didn't play the game anon? You didn't really struggle with the first gym leader did you?
->
>"HARDEST BOSS, GUYS!"
>Gets several examples of how to bruise Cheren's bussy without grinding
>"Y-YOU DIDN'T PLAY THE GAME!"
We get it, OP. You're bad at vidya. It's not our fault that you can't beat a boss that children can curbstomp without much effort on their first try. So try getting good, instead of begging us to beat an easy game for you.
Most of the suggestions rely on grinding (kids wont do and gen 5 exp gain discourages grinding)
Doing all the steps to get Lucario early is a decent suggestion, albeit still time consuming. But an option. Mareep could be a good strat to.
Anyone who says spam the starter hasn't actually done it or over levels.
The point being that this fight alone is harder than any other required battle in the series.
Here's how you beat Cheren with under level 10 Pokemon. There, we beat the boss for you. Now you can brag to your mom about how you beat a kids game while being under leveled.
>Used items
Kek
Good throwback video though.
?t=305
He uses a berry, but still beat Cheren at levels 11 and 12 without much of a problem. Why are you bringing up items, when all you said was Cheren's hard without grinding?
Based Lueroi.
>Why are items relevant
Because it's a testament to the difficulty that you needed to use said items. For example: Brock is so easy in Red/Blue that you can beat his whole team with a level 8 Squirtle and no items; because he's easier.
You personally gimping yourself on that game specifically doesn’t mean that it’s objectively harder.
Parroting is an admission of defeat.
>NOOOOO STOP USING MY DOGSHIT ARGUMENT AGAINST ME Y-Y-YOU LOST NOT ME
The argument only works if it properly applies to the thing you’re replying to.
>guise this gym leader is so hard
>but only under my arbitrary rules that i only bring up 60 posts into the thread
what are you trying to gain from this?
How the FRICK is that arbitrary?!!
Only morons get stuck in a childs game, same for withney and cynthia
you can point to literally any boss in usum and it would be harder than this
You personally gimping yourself on that game specifically doesn’t mean that it’s objectively harder.
hi yawngay
I wonder what Cheren thinks of Nate being a clone of his friend with fricked up hair.
>I wonder what Cheren thinks of Nate being a clone of his friend with fricked up hair.
Does he even know they're clones?
The biggest challenge in a Nuzlocke for this game, you either make it or die trying and you will die a lot
brock in yellow is even worse
>dude just catch x
that already makes him hard as frick moron
you don’t need to catch anything in yellow to beat brock.
>Spam Growl
>giggle at his pokemon unable to do shit
?t=372
Oh no, guys! I found a video of someone effortlessly beating Cheren with under level 14 Pokemon and not using items! And he only used 2 Pokemon, the same amount Cheren used! How will OP cope?
>muh paralysis working four times in a row
Even the player was surprised you fricking idiot.
>"D-DOESN'T COUNT BECAUSE THE PLAYER WAS SURPRISED!"
I knew the cope was going to be pathetic, but holy shit! So now you need a video of:
1.Cheren losing to Pokemon with levels no higher than 13
2.No items used
3.Nothing beyond deadpan reaction from the player or no commentary at all
Anything else you'd like to add?
Anon, it’s a successful paralysis four times in a row. This is an identical type of argument to “just crit” or “just wait until the opponent misses every time”. It does nothing to compare difficulty BETWEEN the games.
->
same logic
>That voice.
No way he isn't autistic.
Autism and Pokemon are inseparable.
How to win literally any npc battle?
>Spam Stat buffing move six times
>Sweep