>the video quality of this youtube tier streaming headset is fine and you're just a cablecuck for not wanting the image to be like on a monitor
meta shills are the worst
>Nobody does this, it exists to be a slave device to an actual PC unless you want to dwell in N64 graphics land.
A lot of people do, that was the main reason why the Quest 2 was super popular during the holiday
Keep in mind, gamers don't move products but rather normies do.
It was a great standalone product for normies, for the people that wanted more power can plug it into the pc and get great quality pcvr gaming done.
Not to mention no base stations and 200+ accesories to set up and just one simple wire was a huge selling point to even people that had a VR setup already.
I dislike Meta as a company as anyone else but they manage to make a good headset.
>10 millions active questies per month
It doesn't matter if you sell even 100 million units by heavily subsidizing the product, if people are just going to use it once for 30 minutes and put it in the attic, you fricking moron.
And that's exactly what happened with quest.
Zucc lost billions.
>10 millions active questies per month
lol, that's total headset sold, cretin.
>And that's exactly what happened with quest. >Zucc lost billions.
He lost billions on investing too much money on tjhe Metaverse
The Quest 2 sold extremally well, instead of giving users core features they wanted and UI upgrades within it's limitation they went to invest and bet on Metaverse being the next big thing.
When people seen that the Metaverse wasn't exactly what was advertised and possibly decades off the whole company fell off.
The metaverse avatars was lacking when games like VRchat already achieved what they were trying to do made it into even bigger joke
7 months ago
Anonymous
zuck invested in destroying PCVR, removed the oculus home with all collectible items
7 months ago
Anonymous
>zuck invested in destroying PCVR, removed the oculus home with all collectible items
>I played Skyrim VR on a gtx 970 at full resolution and it ran perfectly and it's way easier to optimize for set hardware
Yeah, with 640x640 DK2 maybe.
[...] >The Quest 2 sold extremally well, instead of giving users core features they wanted and UI upgrades within it's limitation they went to invest and bet on Metaverse being the next big thing.
You think they spent all those billions on fricking horizon world lmao?
Quest 2 was THE metaverse bet, moron.
Zucc sold every headset at $100+ loss.
>Quest 2 was THE metaverse bet, moron. >Zucc sold every headset at $100+ loss.
Dislike or like the Quest 2, but that's objectively wrong.
Metaverse was setup to be a social & businesses hangout that was shown to be much like "ready player 1" to the mass normie market.
With no idea how to even begin or where to start designing such a virtual world with rumors of teams fighting in-house what exactly to add as features such as mixed reality to make this world more lively.
The metaverse was a big world with big plans with no proper leadership and in reality so far off from what they wanted to do.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Metaverse was setup to be a social & businesses hangout that was shown to be much like "ready player 1" to the mass normie market.
They didn't release anything other than horizon world. It's simply impossible to waste that much money on it.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>They didn't release anything other than horizon world. It's simply impossible to waste that much money on it. >what is R&D >technology development
They literally wasted 15 billions anon on Metaverse, they were trying be first to the game and getting nowhere with technology improvements both software and hardware such as mixed reality for the software.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>what is BUZZWORD
Your level of understanding of VR is "I've watched one clickbait video on youtube and now I'm an expert".
7 months ago
Anonymous
>what is BUZZWORD
Anon 15 billion doesn't just disappear without being R&D invested into servers, hardware + software developments.
You think simply making the Quest 3 and Quest Pro ate 15 billion dollars?
7 months ago
Anonymous
>servers, hardware + software developments.
lol >You think simply making the Quest 3 and Quest Pro ate 15 billion dollars?
Subsidizing Quest 2, bribing all the random gamedev fricks (who end up never released any games lmao), paying salaries to morons who post food videos on tiktok instead of working.
That ate 15b, not the "LE METAVERSE (tm)".
>Anon literally posted the correct information on why the Quest was a top seller for Christmas and a hot seller for that year. >moronic POST
Anon are you okay? Like it or not he's right, normie controls the market and not gamers at the end of the day.
All I'm saying is that you are moronic thinking herd mentality is more important than actual content.
You can be disingenuous by saying you were only talking about units sold, not actual headset success, but it's a fact that zucc lost billions on quest overall.
Normalgays were buying the headsets, but they are not using them.
You just can't have a truly successful console (which quest basically is) without good games.
>All I'm saying is that you are moronic thinking herd mentality is more important than actual content. >awful reading comperhension
Anon, I literally just said "that Anon is correct
the only selling point of the meta quests compared to pcvr is being completely stand alone.
>Nobody does this, it exists to be a slave device to an actual PC unless you want to dwell in N64 graphics land.
A lot of people do, that was the main reason why the quest 2 was super popular during the holiday
Keep in mind, gamers don't move products but rather normies do.
It was a great standalone product for normies, for the people that wanted more power can plug it into the pc and get great quality pcvr gaming done.
Not to mention no base stations and 200+ accesories to set up and just one simple wire was a huge selling point to even people that had a VR setup already.
I dislike Meta as a company as anyone else but they manage to make a good headset.
The thing is that If you dont use a PC you can't play 90% of the actual VR full videogames.
I mean, playing half life alyx, fallout 4/skyrim VR or blade and sorcery in a stand alone device anywhere without the wire and shit would be awesome but its not possible.
There's no way a quest 3 can't play Skyrim VR. Skyrim and Fallout VR are shit anyway... I have no idea why you would want to play that. There are way better games that run natively on Quest than that shit.
>There's no way a quest 3 can't play Skyrim VR
lol
you do realize 600W PC's struggle to run that garbage, right? >There are way better games that run natively on Quest
No, there aren't. Skyrim is indeed trash, but other quest games are on that level or worse.
Fricking this, after the initial amazement and seeing how awful the ai is and how often the physics fricking bug out I have no hopes for VR. Considering no one has even been able to make something even comparable to this besides boneworks.
Shit like contractors and breachers are all fun for a time, Alyx mods were a fun time, but even just simple full body tracking is still jank, expensive and rarely implemented and there's 0 standards for simple fricking things like gun angle alignment.
I played Skyrim VR on a gtx 970 at full resolution and it ran perfectly and it's way easier to optimize for set hardware
>There are way better games that run natively on Quest than that shit.
Like...?
Basically anything actually made for VR, Skyrim VR is lazy garbage. You just waggle the controller with your wrist and nothing interacts with anything, you just point at an object and it teleports to your hand. Bow isn't much better you can shoot super fast barely pulling it back. I think there are mods now that make it better but it's still shit
>I played Skyrim VR on a gtx 970 at full resolution and it ran perfectly and it's way easier to optimize for set hardware
Yeah, with 640x640 DK2 maybe.
>And that's exactly what happened with quest. >Zucc lost billions.
He lost billions on investing too much money on tjhe Metaverse
The Quest 2 sold extremally well, instead of giving users core features they wanted and UI upgrades within it's limitation they went to invest and bet on Metaverse being the next big thing.
When people seen that the Metaverse wasn't exactly what was advertised and possibly decades off the whole company fell off.
The metaverse avatars was lacking when games like VRchat already achieved what they were trying to do made it into even bigger joke
>The Quest 2 sold extremally well, instead of giving users core features they wanted and UI upgrades within it's limitation they went to invest and bet on Metaverse being the next big thing.
You think they spent all those billions on fricking horizon world lmao?
Quest 2 was THE metaverse bet, moron.
Zucc sold every headset at $100+ loss.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Yeah, with 640x640 DK2 maybe.
With a CV1. Had to put the graphics down but it runs great. Skyrim came out in 2011 it's not very hard to run...
7 months ago
Anonymous
>With a CV1
lol >Had to put the graphics down but it runs great
It doesn't. Look at the framegraph to see the reality of the monkey programming.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Thank you for telling me how the game ran on my own PC
Skyrim VR is probably the best performing VR game I played. Literally everything else ran worse.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>unknow rendering res which looks like 240i >no frame graph visible >vignette
Yikes.
7 months ago
Anonymous
You don't need a frame graph... when oculus games start dropping frames it cuts to half frame rate (45 FPS) and start uses reprojection up to 90 FPS and you can see wobble artifacts on moving objects.
There's no way a quest 3 can't play Skyrim VR. Skyrim and Fallout VR are shit anyway... I have no idea why you would want to play that. There are way better games that run natively on Quest than that shit.
>The thing is that If you dont use a PC you can't play 90% of the actual VR full videogames.
I mean, playing half life alyx, fallout 4/skyrim VR or blade and sorcery in a stand alone device anywhere without the wire and shit would be awesome but its not possible.
I get what you're saying, but most costumers aren't trying to play those games.
They're happy with what they got, the same way if you view the Steam Charts most people got entry level $300 or less GPU in each category that barely scraps by for VRgaming.
Which is the same reason why you got an outage for CS2 not performing well on low end machines.
People aren't upgrading to the top hardware, the Quest 2 is designed to be an entry level VR headset that just happens to be good for PCVR gaming too if you have the setup for it.
>The thing is that If you dont use a PC you can't play 90% of the actual VR full videogames.
I mean, playing half life alyx, fallout 4/skyrim VR or blade and sorcery in a stand alone device anywhere without the wire and shit would be awesome but its not possible.
I get what you're saying, but most costumers aren't trying to play those games.
They're happy with what they got, the same way if you view the Steam Charts most people got entry level $300 or less GPU in each category that barely scraps by for VRgaming.
Which is the same reason why you got an outage for CS2 not performing well on low end machines.
People aren't upgrading to the top hardware, the Quest 2 is designed to be an entry level VR headset that just happens to be good for PCVR gaming too if you have the setup for it.
Literally just put your router on your window sill and play in your backyard? Have you guys seriously never done this?
>Literally just put your router on your window sill and play in your backyard? Have you guys seriously never done this?
Base Anon, I've done that a few times along with the extended beat saber mod.
It's extremally fun having a bunch of extra space.
I honestly wish they would do more shit like the RE4 VR port. Low fidelity, but it really didn't matter cause it was ported from a Gamecube/PS2 game anyways.
I know they were planning a San Andreas port, but that shit seems to be a no-show for nearly two years now.
They announced it as a big reveal at an Oculus event almost two years ago now, so there was at least a plan to either gut the radio stations or re-up the licenses. Who knows where that is now though. Honestly VR just needs more games. Not "experiences" but actual fricking games.
It's so irritating. Honestly the pubs for VR games with crossplay are worse than for regular flatscreen games. The leavers have made it impossible for me to play After the Fall. Singleplayer games are nice and comfy at least.
MicroOLED is way too expensive for VR still.
The only headset that uses it is Bigscreen Beyond and that costs $1000 even before the needed tracking stations and controllers.
>Won't Asgard's Wrath 2 be downsized compared to the first since it's being developed for Quest 2?
The graphics are but the game itself is larger. I don't really care about the graphics as long as the gameplay is good.
>Sad to see after 8 years it's still the same shit.
MicroOLED uses monocrystal panels, mura is not a thing there.
Do any good headsets even use it besides bigscreen beyond? I heard that headset still has weird glare even with pancake lens which is another dealbreaker tbh.
>as long as the gameplay is good. >Asgard's Wrath
lol
MicroOLED is way too expensive for VR still.
The only headset that uses it is Bigscreen Beyond and that costs $1000 even before the needed tracking stations and controllers.
Factory price of each panel in Apple Vision Pro is $1k+.
The price will go down eventually, the progress in that area has started.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>The price will go down eventually
well I can bet you the delayed consumer version of Apple Vision probably won't use MicroOLED, or at least not as high resolution panels.
7 months ago
Anonymous
They would not lower the res.
New factories just to supply apple with screens are getting built right now. The price will go down 100%.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Asgard's Wrath was good idk what you are talking about. Closest thing I've played in VR that felt like a Zelda game.
>hardware comparable to a mobile 1060
ARM is not the same thing as desktop architecture, certain calculations will make it choke. HL2 level post process or shadows will still kill a Quest 3.
It's not a smooth "yes/ no" of spec target.
HDR rendering calculations is still considered very expensive on Quest 2, which is part of why all Quest 2 games have that washed out look. Meanwhile this was considered fine in 2004.
My source is an Oculus employee.
I don't understand what's with this obsession of comparing ARM devices with PC GPUs.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Write a rendering engine before talking next time, alright?
7 months ago
Anonymous
>google search for 2 seconds >confirmation from oculus engineers HDR rendering is not well suited for their hardware >confirmation from indie developers it will tank performance
Did you actually do any development work on Quest, or are you just saying things?
7 months ago
Anonymous
huh i googled for 2 seconds and found the opposite
7 months ago
Anonymous
Here's official Oculus documentation. >https://developer.oculus.com/blog/how-to-optimize-your-oculus-quest-app-w-renderdoc-quest-hardware-and-software-offerings/ >https://developer.oculus.com/blog/how-to-optimize-your-oculus-quest-app-w-renderdoc-walkthroughs-of-key-usage-scenarios-and-optimization-tips-part-1/?locale=en_GB
Then you can look at the developer forums at Unity and Unreal and see what developers have to say.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>midwit misunderstands the dev docs
always love to see it
7 months ago
Anonymous
You didn't read it. >High Dynamic Range (HDR) texture formats are a no-no on Oculus Quest for the most part. HDR requires a temporary buffer with a different format than the swapchain texture, typically with a format of R11G11B10_FLOAT rather than the normal R8G8B8A8_SRGB.
The sheer amount of programmers actively hostile towards learning anything 3DCG is insanity.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Look up how valve implemented HDR in lost coast, moron.
They literally just hacked it by overbrightening the textures.
It's not R11G11B10.
>it's 15 (fifteen) times more
not exactly. The Steam Deck had a pixel density of 206 PPI, the Quest 2 had a pixel density of 773 PPI.
Also Pixel density doesn't matter as much as render resolution and the Quest 2's default resolution was lower than the native one at 1440×1584.
>Also Pixel density doesn't matter as much
Yeah, I have no idea why you bring it up, it's irrelevant. >Quest 2's default resolution was lower than the native one at 1440×1584.
It also looks like shit.
To make quest 2 look half decent, you need to render at at least 5408x2736 (2704x2736 per eye), which is the real "native" rendering res for that panel.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Look up how valve implemented HDR in lost coast, moron.
It outputs as SDR but the lighting is done in HDR. Source: https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/HDR
They literally use an image from Half Life Lost Coast for that page. If you know that they specifically (did not) use HDR calculations to generate the final image, it would imply the Valve documentation is wrong and a source would be nice.
7 months ago
Anonymous
No it isn't I don't give a frick what you think is going on, even if the internally rasterized image is distorted before being rendered to offset for barrel distortion. The physical panel itself is only 3664x1920 and it's a singular one. Also, the lenses will be entirely different on the quest 3, so the level of distortion happening should be significantly reduced, meaning the image needs to be distorted less, thus less supersamplng is needed for the final outputted image to be parallel to the native resolution of the panel.
7 months ago
Anonymous
and Quest 3 has dual panels too
7 months ago
Anonymous
Thus should also reduce the necessary cost to achieve parallel results in the panel without excessive supersampling. Thus this factored into my decision when upgrading from the quest 2.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>The physical panel itself is only 3664x1920 and it's a singular one.
Oh, you are that schizo moron!
Hello!
You still didn't learn how vr rendering works?
Please read this thread and stop posting. Supersampling is supersampling, the physical panel is not higher than what I posted. Take your meds.
7 months ago
Anonymous
It's not supersampling, it's distortion compensation, you moronic poorgay.
Quest 3 with your 3070 is not going to look any better btw.
7 months ago
Anonymous
If your outputted image is higher than the native resolution of the physical panel itself, it is supersampling. I don't give a frick what you say, you are wrong and I'm not replying to you again, you made me snap at my boyfriend when he went to cuddle me because you're such a massive fricking moron that you ignore physical facts.
Not that anon, but no clue why you're being pedantic. And if you want to be pedantic, you're still wrong. Once you are compensating for the fragment distortion there is no concept of native. Also it is the same thing as supersampling by definition.
Your definition of native is a guesstimate that looks nice (not even accounting for interpolation shenanigans), meanwhile "panel resolution" is an objective metric.
Honestly I think you're just baiting at this point. I do not know why.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Once you are compensating for the fragment distortion there is no concept of native.
Stopped reading here. You are moronic. "Native" means 1:1 rendered pixel to panel pixel.
>Quest 3 with your 3070 is not going to look any better btw.
considering the Quest 3 has a higher resolution panel with better pancake lenses and proper dual displays it most certainly will.
Good luck. Keep believing that.
Pico 4 starts looking good 3k by 3k per eye btw
If your outputted image is higher than the native resolution of the physical panel itself, it is supersampling. I don't give a frick what you say, you are wrong and I'm not replying to you again, you made me snap at my boyfriend when he went to cuddle me because you're such a massive fricking moron that you ignore physical facts.
>the native resolution of the physical panel itself, it is supersampling.
Yeah, exactly. That's why distortion compensation is not supersampling, because it makes panel's pixels in the center of the screen correspond to rendered pixels one to one.
If you are not compensating for distortion with increased rendering res, the middle of the screen is technically subsampled.
We were trying to explain that to your stupid ass for so fricking long. Glad you understand now.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>"Native" means 1:1 rendered pixel to panel pixel
Yes and since the native panel resolution is 3664x1920, going higher to 5408x2736 is supersampling
7 months ago
Anonymous
>>If you are not compensating for distortion with increased rendering res, the middle of the screen is technically subsampled.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>technically
that's not what that word means
7 months ago
Anonymous
>rest of panel because of said distortion is still being supersampled, especially because of single panel design
How fricking WRONG can one guy be? Just shut the frick UP already. I HATE you.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The most important part of the screen, the middle, is subsampled unless you render at 140+% of panel resolution.
I don't make the rules, sorry.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>unless you render at 140+% of panel resolution
which is what's known as supersampling, yes
7 months ago
Anonymous
What do you think "supersamping" means?
Explain to me how it's SUPERsampling if there is only one sample per pixel?
7 months ago
Anonymous
>one sample per pixel >140+% of panel resolution
which is it?
7 months ago
Anonymous
For displayed image to have 1:1 panel pixel/rendered pixel ratio, the predistorted image has to be rendering at 140% res.
So both.
7 months ago
Anonymous
then you agree it's supersampling
7 months ago
Anonymous
it isn't supersampling. it has to render more pixels to be 1:1 due to the shape of the lens distortion
7 months ago
Anonymous
It's impossible to argue with that moron. He doesn't read.
It's the second thread he does that shit.
7 months ago
Anonymous
It's impossible to argue with that moron. He doesn't read.
It's the second thread he does that shit.
Tell me the resolution of the panel of the quest 2 right now, the physical hardware. Tell the class what you think the reality is. So we can clear it up. Because it's been stated multiple times, throughout the thread.
No it isn't I don't give a frick what you think is going on, even if the internally rasterized image is distorted before being rendered to offset for barrel distortion. The physical panel itself is only 3664x1920 and it's a singular one. Also, the lenses will be entirely different on the quest 3, so the level of distortion happening should be significantly reduced, meaning the image needs to be distorted less, thus less supersamplng is needed for the final outputted image to be parallel to the native resolution of the panel.
>"Native" means 1:1 rendered pixel to panel pixel
Yes and since the native panel resolution is 3664x1920, going higher to 5408x2736 is supersampling
[...] >But the reality is that 5408x2736 is just the native res of the Quest 2 display
Actual panel resolution of quest 2 is 3664x1920. >I thought you were calling the inflated distortion correction "native"
Yeah, that's what I was doing.
>Also you're way too confrontational for no reason.
There is a certain schizo who is refusing to learn. We were trying to teach him with no success in the previous thread.
He is refusing to understand word.
7 months ago
Anonymous
no. you're a fricking moron. it's more fun to just laugh at you
7 months ago
Anonymous
You're the moron. Keep being delusional. I'm gonna go have sex now, something that I can tell never happens in your life.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Stop abusing your dog, you sick frick.
7 months ago
Anonymous
it's ok. the dogs dead. it won't mind much
7 months ago
Anonymous
based on what most furries look like, the dog probably unironically overpowered him
7 months ago
Anonymous
if only games rasterized with barrel distortion in mind, we could have 4x better resolution at center with no performance cost
the advantage of 3d is that it dosnt have to make sense, so including a barrel deformation in rasterization pass wouldnt be a problem, shading is per pixel anyway.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>if only games rasterized with barrel distortion in mind
they already do. see "fixed foveated rendering" >we could have 4x better resolution at center with no performance cost
it's nice to dream
7 months ago
Anonymous
>they already do. see "fixed foveated rendering"
FFR isnt the same as rendering with the distortion, its just less resolution in corners, but you could use a vertex shader or some other gimmick to distort the games world to match the lenses perfectly >it's nice to dream
its more a matter that game devs dont use tech that already exists, thats the problem with most VR games being made by unexperienced indies
7 months ago
Anonymous
I know about that google meme. It doesn't make that much of a difference perf wise but EXTREMELY overcomplicates the rendering pipeline.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>I know about that google meme.
what? > It doesn't make that much of a difference perf wise but EXTREMELY overcomplicates the rendering pipeline.
Its not about performance, its about the quality of image so your pixels dont get distorted by any barrel filter and instead are as sharp as possible
its not that complicated, games already use a lot of screen space gimmick, slapping in a filter after the edge rasterization but before pixel shading would be as simple as adding a single shader
7 months ago
Anonymous
>what? >>use a vertex shader
>slapping in a filter after the edge rasterization
lol, you have no idea what you are talking about.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>lol, you have no idea what you are talking about.
no you
7 months ago
Anonymous
>so including a barrel deformation in rasterization pass wouldnt be a problem,
that's exactly what it does you moron.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Because of said distortion there will NEVER be a parallelled 1:1 sample as the interpolation would diverge significantly as you deviated from the center. Which is resampling the image. In the case of whether it is sub sampling or supersampling is factoring into the native resolution of the panel. In this case, it would be supersampling. Now suck my dick.
7 months ago
Anonymous
And that factor to achieve that will not be the same on a device with proper independent panels and entirely different lenses. This means that lower resolutions will look even better on the next gen device and the interally rasterized image won't need to be supersampled nearly as much to achieve native level results. Also, if you're willing to use subsambling within your linguistics then I think even with trying to move goalposts, I'll accept your concession.
7 months ago
Anonymous
You're and idiot, have a nice day.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Quest 3 with your 3070 is not going to look any better btw.
considering the Quest 3 has a higher resolution panel with better pancake lenses and proper dual displays it most certainly will.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Considering you wasted my time with the HDR rant, still looking for a source to that claim.
>Once you are compensating for the fragment distortion there is no concept of native.
Stopped reading here. You are moronic. "Native" means 1:1 rendered pixel to panel pixel.
[...]
Good luck. Keep believing that.
Pico 4 starts looking good 3k by 3k per eye btw
[...] >the native resolution of the physical panel itself, it is supersampling.
Yeah, exactly. That's why distortion compensation is not supersampling, because it makes panel's pixels in the center of the screen correspond to rendered pixels one to one.
If you are not compensating for distortion with increased rendering res, the middle of the screen is technically subsampled.
We were trying to explain that to your stupid ass for so fricking long. Glad you understand now.
>Stopped reading here. You are moronic. "Native" means 1:1 rendered pixel to panel pixel.
That's exactly what I'm arguing if you put the effort to read the rest of the post.
The Quest 2 panel is 1,920 by 3,664, not 5408x2736. Once you open the can of worms that is distortion correction, there is no concept of native, as opposed to visual diminishing returns.
At this point, 100% convinced you're a troll. Just not replying from here. Tried to give yo the benefit of the doubt but nah.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Considering you wasted my time with the HDR rant, still looking for a source to that claim.
I couldn't care less about that honestly. Last Coast was a tech demo which barely worked in the first place.
If you want to understand why you were wrong learn vulkan, then write a rendering engine for tilers.
>Once you open the can of worms that is distortion correction, there is no concept of native
It's common sense of vr rendering. It's not my problem you don't know anything.
Even valve lists 140% of panel, distortion compensated framebuffer as 100% rendering res for index.
then you agree it's supersampling
Middle of the screen is 1:1.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Even valve lists 140% of panel, distortion compensated framebuffer as 100% rendering res for index.
where?
7 months ago
Anonymous
In steam vr.
7 months ago
Anonymous
got a screenshot?
7 months ago
Anonymous
Explain to me how you believe that suddenly interpolated distorted images being reprojected onto an lcd panel is not resampling and how using a resampled image that is being mostly downsampled to a lower resolution panel isn't considered supersampling. I'm truly fascinated by your mythical stupidity.
Because on present 1 sample (rendered pixel) corresponds only to one panel pixel.
It's simple, really, you moronic furry.
7 months ago
Anonymous
But it doesn't. It diverges completely once you leave the center, which isn't as much of a range than you think. There is no way to achieve 1:1 panel to rasterized output with the panel design of either devices. And LCD is not a CRT. moronic troony, Truly Mythical This man's stupidity. Take your Meds.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Keep coping with your garbage gpu and blurry image, your moronic frick.
7 months ago
Anonymous
i have a 7900 xtx, moron. furry supremacy.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>7900 xtx
pffff
yiff in hell, subhuman
7 months ago
Anonymous
is that a rex?
Fricking chads of vrchat. Moar.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Explain to me how you believe that suddenly interpolated distorted images being reprojected onto an lcd panel is not resampling and how using a resampled image that is being mostly downsampled to a lower resolution panel isn't considered supersampling. I'm truly fascinated by your mythical stupidity.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>I couldn't care less about that honestly. Last Coast was a tech demo which barely worked in the first place.
The discussion (honestly it's more like a highschool debate) was about Quest 2 not being able to handle HL2's post processing and lighting tech, because of how badly it handles HDR textures and render targets. >Oculus engineers and documentation say the Quest sucks for using this data and maintaining frametimes >Valve documentation says that they've been using this tech since the early 2000s
There is literally no other outcome to make here than the Quest 2 being badly suited for this kind of calculation. I can go right now on the developer forums on these engines and everything correlates this.
You aren't making an argument, you're looking for one liner victories like the discussion is some Yugioh deck. At this point I'll just drop it unless you have an actual "technical" and objective point to make.
You spent half the thread calling people morons with the least technical feedback or back and forth in this thread.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Even valve lists 140% of panel, distortion compensated framebuffer as 100% rendering res for index.
That does not conflict with what I said at all. As I have stated you're reaching diminishing returns. You're rendering at a higher res to make the difference of the lens distortion, but pixels will fundamentally not align with the display.
This is why MSAA is worshiped in VR so much. Nothing is perfectly aligned to the screen due to decisions made for compositing. although I'd argue MSAA looks awful too but that's its own 50 hour rant
7 months ago
Anonymous
>You're rendering at a higher res to make the difference of the lens distortion, but pixels will fundamentally not align with the display.
It's not that important as long as no physical pixels are subsampled. To achieve that you need 140% render target.
You talk like you don't really understand what rasterization is.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>It's not that important
proofs
7 months ago
Anonymous
Learn how rasterization works.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>I don't have to show you anything. You just need to do a computer course. I win
7 months ago
Anonymous
Well you're the one who thinks they need a computer course to understand how rasterization works
7 months ago
Anonymous
if I don't need a course you can just simply explain it then.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The concept isn't even complex.
Whenever this guy loses an argument he tries to derail the discussion and "win" by pure exhaustion.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I find it more fun to let people explain things and laugh at them when they get it wrong.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>It's not that important as long as no physical pixels are subsampled. To achieve that you need 140% render target.
Have you done the math yourself? Because every time this discussion comes up usually the numbers were based on *visual diminishing returns* but nothing objective.
Either way rendering an additional 40% of the screen just for barrel distortion is gross. If we're going full autist then the stitching from foveated rendering and sampling fuzziness from interpolation makes it (still) not enough.
>You talk like you don't really understand what rasterization is.
That word isn't even that relevant here. We're talking about compositing and sampling.
I swear to god it's like a university student just learned how to render a triangle in OpenGL and is on a power trip.
7 months ago
Anonymous
That word isn't even that relevant here. We're talking about compositing and sampling.
Very relevant. Rasterization is all about sampling.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Alright, fair enough. You get the lens profile, you do the math on the flat render buffer, that does count as rasterization.
Still not a counter argument to the actual point, though.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The point is, if you are not rendering at 140%+ the image is going to look like blurry shit.
Cope as much as you want.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I have never once argued against this. You are fighting the demons in your head.
I am saying that 140% being "native" to the display is mostly wishful thinking. The solution is to render 1:1 to the display to begin with. The more nonsense like Spacwarp you introduce, the more even 140% isn't technically sufficient
7 months ago
Anonymous
>I am saying that 140% being "native" to the display is mostly wishful thinking.
You have to call native something, the consensus for fresnel is to call raw image needed for distortion compensation "native".
You can try to argue semantics by saying "nothing is really native, because pixel sample ratio is not uniform for the whole display!" but nobody gives a shit
7 months ago
Anonymous
>You have to call native something
I just call it the panel resolution.
If distortion was done through the vertex shader instead (like Google did way back) then we wouldn't be having this conversation as you'd get that 40% increase in resolution for free.
That's the goal, that's true native, not this BS arms race because it's easier to composite.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>I just call it the panel resolution.
Panel resolution is physical resolution of the panel.
There is no need to add more confusion.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I'm not adding confusion, the people that set up the compositor created the confusion.
flat 4K screen means a 4K render buffer is native. The reason why this is not the case in VR is questionable decisions made for ease of development.
You can blast resolution like a mad man, but for me I'll always be pissed that if Valve, Oculus, and PlayStation trusted their developers then this would have never been an issue.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I wanted to say that manufacturers don't really advertise rendering res, so it's customer fault that they are misunderstanding the tech specs and assuming stuff, but then I realized that Zuccshed themselves were changing the definition of 100% rendering res based on fricking refreshrate with airlink.
So yeah, it's a mess.
You can, but then you need to get clever with blending the different resolutions, sometimes split into 2 buffers per eye.
The real solution is just doing it all in one go, 1:1 with the lens coordinates, but "muh interpolation, muh timewarp" got in the way.
Doesn't really matter at this point. Fresnel era is almost over.
But anyway, you still need a top of the line GPU for VR if you want a good looking image with usable ironsights.
This is what started this whole discussion back then.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Fresnel era is almost over.
if you think pancake lenses are good then you've not tried them
7 months ago
Anonymous
We are going to pancake whatever you like it or not.
Fresnels are gone.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Pico4, Quest and Beyond have pancake lenses. The rest don't.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The point is that we will not see a new fresnel headset from a major manufacturer in 2024+.
7 months ago
Anonymous
my point is that they're not very good so be careful what you wish for.
Look at the glare/bloom
7 months ago
Anonymous
it's not like I wish for it, it's just a matter of fact.
fresnels are not perfect too, glare and god rays are there, pancakes might still be better overal
7 months ago
Anonymous
>It's a fact
it isn't. >b-b-but
I have two headsets with pancakes and they both have glare. they're clear around the edges but they suffer with a lot more glare than my fresnel lenses.
7 months ago
Anonymous
It is a fact that the industry is switching to pancake, regardless of your wishes.
I'm not denying the artifacts.
7 months ago
Anonymous
what other headsets are announced other than Quest with pancakes?
7 months ago
Anonymous
Vision pro, which every dog will copy.
Fresnels are gone. Forget about them.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Vision pro
That's not a VR headset, that's an AR headset
7 months ago
Anonymous
Just because apple is allergic to the term VR in their marketing doesn't make it any less of vr headset in essence.
Somnium VR1 doesn't have pancake
Pimax Crystal doesn't have pancake
but the budget dogshit headsets like quests and picos do so that means everyone. lol
Pointless arguing, you know exactly what I mean.
7 months ago
Anonymous
yes. the shit headsets are getting pancake lenses. that's what you mean.
Actual vr headsets worth owning aren't.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Pimax >worth owning
lol
7 months ago
Anonymous
are you going to claim some shit Quest 3 is a better headset than a Crystal?
You're really going to climb to the top of the moron tree?
7 months ago
Anonymous
>are you going to claim some shit Quest 3 is a better headset than a Crystal?
I'll certainly say the Crystal isn't $1100 better than the Quest 3.
7 months ago
Anonymous
that's because you're broke
7 months ago
Anonymous
Then are you saying the Crystal is better than the Vision Pro?
7 months ago
Anonymous
I've not tried a vision pro. It isn't a gaming headset is it? Does it do PCVR? How does it do 4kx4k with video compression 90hz?
7 months ago
Anonymous
imagine having a battery which is required to be charged in wired headset and thinking that's acceptable
7 months ago
Anonymous
>that headset which has a battery and runs with 2800x2800 uncompressed resolution is bad because this other headset with a battery which runs at a much lower 2000x2000 resolution on extremely poor quality video compression is better
please explain your logic
7 months ago
Anonymous
Because that other headset costs more than 3x less.
If I’m paying $1600+ for a headset I shouldn’t have to deal with shit like battery charging.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>it's less so it's better
you sound extremely malnourished and possibly brown
7 months ago
Anonymous
>defending battery charging on a $1600+ headset
Xbox fan I’m guessing?
7 months ago
Anonymous
I'm not defending it at all. I'm saying it's better than a Quest 3. Your point is that it loses because of a battery to a different headset which requires a battery
derp
7 months ago
Anonymous
How much does it weight again?
7 months ago
Anonymous
can't your scrawny neck handle it or something?
7 months ago
Anonymous
why you get so defensive, bro ;^)
7 months ago
Anonymous
I asked you a question. Why can't you answer it bro?
7 months ago
Anonymous
it's not nice to answer question with a question
how many indexes is crystal weight wise?
7 months ago
Anonymous
You asked a rhetorical question, numbnuts
7 months ago
Anonymous
it's not nice to answer question with a question
how many indexes is crystal weight wise?
the weight of it would only be important to someone built like an 11 year old girl.
What's it like worrying about a VR headset being too heavy for you?
7 months ago
Anonymous
>I'm not defending it at all
Clearly you are if you’re shitting on the Quest 3 for being cheap yet praising a headset that costs more than 3x the price with several of the same limitations like the aforementioned battery.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The simple fact you believe the Quest 3 and Crystal are in any way comparable is hilarious.
The Quest is nothing but a toy. You dumb frickers lap it up because it's cheap junk and all you can afford
7 months ago
Anonymous
>You dumb frickers lap it up because it's cheap junk
Yet you’re literally lapping up a $1600 headset with a cheap limitation just like it
7 months ago
Anonymous
>if you are not wasting money on chinkshit with extemely bad track record, you are a poorgay
Is this the best you get?
7 months ago
Anonymous
it's the best headset you can buy right now and possibly will be until Somnium VR1 releases.
You're coping
7 months ago
Fuk Devs, Pay Modders
Remember it's failed devs pushing the graphics meme. They're mad people can have fun on a 300$ device with a mobile chip and don't want to play their unoptimized trash
7 months ago
Anonymous
you just own a shit pc
7 months ago
Anonymous
have a nice day.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>They're mad people can have fun on a 300$ device with a mobile chip
quest 2 has less games than even ps5 which has no games
7 months ago
Anonymous
That means it has more games because you can’t have negative nouns
7 months ago
Anonymous
>my toy is better than your toy
ayy lmao
7 months ago
Anonymous
I don't own a crystal.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>are you going to claim some shit Quest 3 is a better headset than a Crystal?
Yeah, unironically.
Simcucks might disagree, but for everyone else Q3 is better.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Crystal
You mean the one literally powered by the same chip as the Quest 2?
7 months ago
Anonymous
lol like anyone bought a crystal to run off that snapdragon chip you utter moron
7 months ago
Anonymous
I guess it’s not better than a Quest 3 if it’s worse at standalone VR then
7 months ago
Anonymous
if your only benchmark is that a headset can play phone games then yes some shit quest wins. congrats
7 months ago
Anonymous
I accept your concession
7 months ago
Fuk Devs, Pay Modders
Just give Chinese scammers thousands bro
7 months ago
Anonymous
have a nice day.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Just because apple is allergic to the term VR in their marketing doesn't make it any less of vr headset in essence.
It does though.
They even said that the "mixed reality dial" can't be used to create a full VR environment
7 months ago
Anonymous
Somnium VR1 doesn't have pancake
Pimax Crystal doesn't have pancake
but the budget dogshit headsets like quests and picos do so that means everyone. lol
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Pimax
7 months ago
Anonymous
Have you tried one though
Pancake lenses are so much fricking better it's unreal. My quest 2 is way more comfortable than my Pro, but I never wanna use it now because of the lenses.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I have Pico and QPro
I think both headsets are fricking shit so don't use them anyway
7 months ago
Anonymous
That's 3/4 of the last released VR headsets anon.
Only PSVR2 doesn't use pancake, presumably because they thought HDR OLED was more important.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Honestly I'd argue Sony's decision wasn't cursed. The problem is they also sacrificed low persistence.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Right now I put my cope in accidentally getting lens tech with more forgiving barrel distortion.
It's just when I realize we could've been getting that resolution for free if people played their cards right early in, I'm not exactly happy when I'm just *barely* not reaching frame targets knowing it was avoidable.
Either way, I guess you need a nuclear reactor for VR.
7 months ago
Anonymous
4090 is enough for Q2. And it looks decent too.
Honestly happy with the picture quality, would rather have new good vr games than new headsets.
7 months ago
Anonymous
*To be fair* that is a 4090.
I'm just shocked this was not addressed as a fundamental performance bottleneck on Quest, considering it is *hard* to find games running at even 1x panel resolution there.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Native standalone shit looks like absolute garbage.
After seeing what maxed out Q2 could look like it's impossible to go back.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Even without, native standalone is an actual eye soar. The res is so low it actually hurts my eyes to play.
If you want to laugh, download and install Grid Legends on the Quest 2, then refund after your face looks like that Walter White meme in pure disbelief.
7 months ago
Anonymous
hopefully that gets updated for Quest 3.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I wonder what the color range is on this thing, to help make those shadows look even better.
Red Matter 2, that was a world of difference. Walking Dead... Going to be honest, those are straight up different assets.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah some titles seem like they're getting more of an overhaul for Quest 3 than others
Thankfully even unupdated games will still get some benefits with improved performance and a higher base resolution (from 1440×1584 to 1680×1760)
7 months ago
Anonymous
For those that don't get updated, Sidequest commands to force render res and texture res will definitely be nice.
I'm noticing in these showcases they're like "omg grass", so I guess they can finally brute force overdraw.
7 months ago
Fuk Devs, Pay Modders
Graphics (res) gays are why games suck these days
7 months ago
Anonymous
Attention whoring namegays like you are the reason threads suck these days
have a nice day.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>If distortion was done through the vertex shader instead (like Google did way back)
You can compensate somewhat with fixed foveated rendering to bring periphery closer to 1:1, so for modern gpu's with variable rate shading it doesn't really matter that much.
7 months ago
Anonymous
You can, but then you need to get clever with blending the different resolutions, sometimes split into 2 buffers per eye.
The real solution is just doing it all in one go, 1:1 with the lens coordinates, but "muh interpolation, muh timewarp" got in the way.
As soon as that twitter nerd successuly hacks psvr2 (he already hacked the first one) a bunch of people will buy that one because of how relatively cheap it is while getting things like oled
no it's shit, the "game" part is a tech demo meant to sell the game for modding and custom content
the sequel has even less content, neither are worth full price and there's really not that much content for them
a pattern you'll notice is that the lack of actually good VR games mean VR shills end up overhyping otherwise mediocre games like boneworks or blade & sorcery
Literally impossible, Android doesn't work like that. Unless they make their own OS for the meta quests it's never going to happen, and if it does it would be unlikely to have your device bricked, maybe banned from certain apps.
It's definitely possible... You have to go through registration to even boot the OS. The people who got Quest 3 early can not use it. I'm pretty sure it is illegal to completely brick your device though. The most they will do is ban you from connecting to their servers like Nintendo does
I figure they would have done that stuff already if so.
The only thing they've done so far about sideloading is introduce App Lab as an alternative for people making apps.
Not a thing. Closest is some games have opted for a anti piracy check home base type of thing but it sucks and even the virtual desktop guy renigged on it cause it caused issues
>Steam deck announced before major production started >deckard isnt even announced
My guess is valve waits to see if q3 shits the bed and if not then they will see how they will compete against it and use whatever prototype fits best
Only thanks to the pandemic meme and heavy subsidizing.
There's Lynx but it probably sucks
Not a thing. Closest is some games have opted for a anti piracy check home base type of thing but it sucks and even the virtual desktop guy renigged on it cause it caused issues
I've bought every generation of oculus headsets
Every time I end up reselling it after a few months, usually due to them giving me headaches and being unable to find a comfortable fit for them. I hope with the quest 3 being slimmer and stuff that I can actually use it now. Especially with the pancake lenses, those seem nice
I did try the quest 2 elite strap with battery
Didn't really help. I mean, way better, but I still got so much pressure on my forehead. The battery wasn't enough to counter balance it. This time if a nice 3rd party strap still isn't enough, I'll just tape a damn weight to the back. That's what kills it for me I think, all the weight being in the front.
the bobo strap is really comfy, weight is distributed all over your head, if you go for the one with 2 batteries and dock you basically get unlimited battery life.
you don't need to add any of your private info
you just need to verify yourself via a phone app and make purchases with your credit card.
It's ok though, they don't take any of your private info during this process
Question
I have like 1TB of high quality VR JAV porn
Can I stream that shit to the quest 3 or I need the wire (too big filesizes to keep it in the quest native storage so they are in my PC).
if you are this paranoid then use virtual desktop and stream porn from PC, unless quest makes screenshots or realtime analysis they can't know if it's a game or a video
yes
pico is somehow way less intrusive and doesn't even need an account to use it with pcvr or sideload shit
7 months ago
Anonymous
What the frick. This totally kills the quest for me.
I mean, I hated when they forced me to use a fake fb account to keep using my oculus CV1 lol >pico
Dont they get a lot of problems with steam vr?
>1 year without touching my CV1 >just used google earth VR because I love traveling around listeting to podcasts
Aything cool released thiis 2023?
is it worth to jump from CV1 to quest3?
Fake numbers, the Valve Index made more money than the Quest because it cost more
While the Quest was selling their dumb headset for $300 valve was making 6x times the amount by selling their index for $1000
Gamers want better hardware and it shows, you don't see anyone talking about the Quest headsets anymore
https://www.inc.com/jason-aten/facebook-just-raised-prices-on-quest-2-100-august-1.html
Because Mr.ZUCC had to raise the price on the quest 2 headsets.
they were selling at a huge lost billions a year
7 months ago
Anonymous
first of all that lasted less than a year.
second of all that doesn't prove anything about the quest margins.
and third of all you still need a source for the index margins.
7 months ago
Anonymous
https://www.roadtovr.com/valve-index-best-selling-steam-products-streak/
The valve index is selling stronger than the quest 2, we don't need numbers it always top selling on Steam is proof enough that the Valve Index is a great device and makeup $800 profit per unit sold.
Mr.Zucc has to sell their quest 2 headset at a loss.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>we don't need numbers
so first you say the numbers are fake and now you're saying we don't need numbers
People need to realize that for technology like this to be a success it has to be palatable to non-gamers. The Wii didn't sell as well as it did because it appealed to gamers, it sold well because it appealed to parents, seniors, and everybody else. Something like this can take off but it absolutely has to be stand-alone, affordable, and comfortable to use. When it does that, it will take off.
Honestly I'm surprised Meta hasn't release dozens of great first party Games.
They spent so much money on the metaverse, you think they'd have the money to finance some Half Life Alyx Tier Games.
Imagine what Nintendo would do if the switch was a VR device. At this point the virtual boy has more interesting first party Games than the quest.
Tell me more. I haven't looked much into these sort of things. Are there enough games and videos?
>Are there enough games and videos?
It's not much but games like Virtamate allows you to just load ported models so you can just load Tifa or Cammy or Widowmaker or Kasumi or whatever and have fun.
No. VAM requires tons of paypigging/pirating hoping on paypigs generosity for mediocre scenes and good models. With blank expressions/very slight and generic expressions because one models smile is anothers vagineer nightmare fuel shit jankily riding your wiener.
You can however spend hours upon hours upon hours animating and make almost anything you want. Learn how to model/port models and assets and you can make anything you want.
For one scene. That has a high chance of having to be adjusted, sometimes minor sometimes major depending on the models, especially for expressions.
Oh and good luck with anime models because they all have human teeth and fricked up mouth collisions, as well as those with texture lashes looking terrible with their eyes closed, unless you make your own closed eye lashes to load on trigger, significantly reducing what you can do with their expressions.
Or do what it looks like most people do, have them stare at you blankly.
Considering how well new games turn out I'd rather have ports. I know some emulators can run in VR but I don't know if there are any games that run well this way..
Remakes and ports are better than new stuff.
Same with movies, why make anything new? That's how you end up with all female ghostbusters instead of doing the same story everyone loves.
I know nothing about VR but want to get into it. Can stuff like quest 3 connect to your PC and run all pcvr games or are they limited to what meta sells? Can you stream you PC desktop to a headset in order to play any game (not VR) or stream a movie?
Currently Pico 4 is probably the best one. It has Quest 3 specs but costs like 300$ and doesn't require any facebook bullshit. Unless you're paranoid about CCP spying on you it's a great start.
>has to be imported to the US
So? Just order it on aliexpress or something. >is owned by a Chinese TikTok company
Ok but the actual headset doesn't require any of meta bullshit. And considering the price it's simply a better bang for your buck.
>higher FOV
It has slightly higher horizontal fov but less vertical.
AHHHHHHH I JUST WANT TO UPGRADE MY CV1 WHY ARE YOU TELLING ME THAT QUEST 3 ARE SHIT OR I NEED A SMARTPHONE TO USE IT AAAAAAAHHH WHAT DO I BUY
Wait for Pico 5.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah but horizontal is more important imo
7 months ago
Anonymous
>wait for quest3! >wait for Pico5! >wait for steam deckard!
AHHHHHH
I HATE YOU ALL Black person homosexualS
7 months ago
Anonymous
If it helps the Quest 3 is literally 9 days away
7 months ago
Anonymous
no matter how moronic something is you can always find someone advocating for it. i know this is hard but you have to make a decision for yourself, either what to buy or who to listen to. if you aren't moronic you will end up with a quest 3
7 months ago
Anonymous
> if you aren't moronic you will end up with a quest 3
this post is pure pottery
Perhaps it will be very good with Wifi 6E and AV1 encoding. But apparently AV1 adds more lag so I will wait for people to actually get a Quest 3 and test it.
ive spent big bucks getting a new gaming rig, now I'm ready to add some VR to it, the main reason I want to get 'back' into gaming. (my wife is leaving me). and I'm ready to double down and do VR. I love VR, but I still don't have a headset.
I am considering buying an index NEW, because money is no object for me (as you can imagine, an adult male 6fig wfh software dev with no children -remember, my wife is leaving me-, I have a lot of spendable income)
I can't wait for the deckard, it's going to take at least 1 year
she will be leaving me within the next six months probably. she is not interested in video games. or anything for that matter. enjoy your youth lads, middle age is pretty fricking lame, other than having lots of money
>Don't buy on impulse. Get the Meta Quest 3,
don't buy on impulse guys. Just pre-order the Quest 3, a headset which has no reviews online and that the people showing previews have all had to sign a Meta contract stating they'll not show the headset in a bad light.
>which comes with full body tracking out of the box without wearing anything else
no it doesn't.
It will be getting approximated tracking of your wrist, elbows, shoulder, and torso along with estimated leg positioning (which can't be used to actually track leg movement) in December with only three games supporting it at launch (Supernatural, Swordsman VR, Drunken Bar Fight)
>which comes with full body tracking out of the box without wearing anything else.
so I have to be naked with just the headset on for the body tracking to work?
>need to render twice per eye, still expensive even with single pass stereo >need to render at higher resolutions than even the whole Steam Deck screen per-eye >shared ram >certain instructions just more expensive because ARM >Facebook's bulky OS eating resources in the background, where the Quest 3 is now doing all sorts of computer vision to make up for removing the tracking ring in the back
Those are all worth considering when comparing standalone VR to PC, I just don't think the teraflop comparisons are going to fall in line with expectations.
ASW can allow the headset to cheat by targeting only half frame-rates and still providing a smooth experience. As for the additional overhead, that's likely why they added 2gb of additional memory. Cpu performance should be about the same with devs getting access to three threads. As someone who really loves emulation, I was disappointed with this launch. However I still bought one.
>than even the whole Steam Deck screen per-eye
Deck is 1280x800, which is barely 1m pixels.
Just so you know, even Quest 2 at "native" is 15m+.
It's not "more than even the whole deck", it's 15 (fifteen) times more. >still expensive even with single pass stereo
Doesn't matter. It only saves one extra vertex shader run, fragment shader still has to run fully.
ASW can allow the headset to cheat by targeting only half frame-rates and still providing a smooth experience. As for the additional overhead, that's likely why they added 2gb of additional memory. Cpu performance should be about the same with devs getting access to three threads. As someone who really loves emulation, I was disappointed with this launch. However I still bought one.
>it's 15 (fifteen) times more
not exactly. The Steam Deck had a pixel density of 206 PPI, the Quest 2 had a pixel density of 773 PPI.
Also Pixel density doesn't matter as much as render resolution and the Quest 2's default resolution was lower than the native one at 1440×1584.
So what kind of specs are we looking at for the deckard? I'm using the reverb g2 and I might upgrade if it's a huge leap, but no fricking way I'm paying 1200+ for a marginal improvement.
Quest has a smartphone companion app and iirc it requires using it on first setup sometimes for stuff like developer mode
It's still by far the easiest for community software support and wireless desktop sharing, the pico controllers aren't as good. Which is fricking comedy considering "muh tracking" was the biggest reason PCVR chads said not to get the quest, and then suddenly the Pico is worth it with even worse tracking?
The improvements in passthrough makes me think there's been some kind of video decoding improvements. There's no way Qualcomm didn't look at how every single PCVR headset using their designs relies on video encode / decode to get the job done and didn't improve it
Best case scenario is AV1 hardware decoding, most likely is speed improvements to existing H264 and HEVC decoding blocks
Either way, it's good for the quality of wireless streaming
Quest 3 has huge improvements in passthrough which is massively underrated. I'd love to be able to use Virtual Desktop in an actual low latency color passthrough mode.
Vr is a dead meme, the limitations on what games you can make are too great. It’ll be good for a few fps’s some fun little chiv style games. But the limitations on the human range of motion means fighting games, and real action games wouldn’t work. Even something like souls slop is beyond the scope of what vr will ever be able to do.
You’re literally just using vr to be a head tracking camera controller which is fine but it’s not going to lend itself to most games and will be downright wasteful and distracting for most.
>You’re literally just using vr to be a head tracking camera controller
actually your camera is still a physical character within the game which reacts to stuff and enemies will attempt to target.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I've bought just about every headset and play all the VR games and Astro Bot is still one of my top games despite being stuck on the shit ass PSVR1.
no one except pimax dares to make the gigantic frick-off hmds that can give you wide FOV at the moment
there were some weird funny lenses that did right angle distortion to make the same FOV in a small package but we're not close to having it at the consumer level
>no one except pimax dares to make the gigantic frick-off hmds that can give you wide FOV at the moment
Why?
Also I literally NEVER hear about the pimax is this just a really shit headset with a meme pricetag? all you ever hear for "top end" is valve index, no one ever mentions this pimax
>Also I literally NEVER hear about the pimax is this just a really shit headset with a meme pricetag? all you ever hear for "top end" is valve index, no one ever mentions this pimax
its chinkshit but their latest crystal is more like index fov
the other stuff like 8kx and 5k models had really wide fov but tons of software issues from pitool and just general chinkware qualities to how shitty the screws are, audio solution etc.
their pricing brackets easily match stuff like the bigscreen beyond and varjo aero; somnium vr1 will prob be in a similar vein pricewise
>FOV is the most important thing for VR Immersion
No. The most important thing is interactivity which we won't get anytime soon because nobody going to develop such projects for limited VR userbase.
Bigger FOV also requires higher resolution and we already struggle with this stuff.
>But the reality is that 5408x2736 is just the native res of the Quest 2 display
Actual panel resolution of quest 2 is 3664x1920. >I thought you were calling the inflated distortion correction "native"
Yeah, that's what I was doing.
>Also you're way too confrontational for no reason.
There is a certain schizo who is refusing to learn. We were trying to teach him with no success in the previous thread.
He is refusing to understand word.
I don't know where you heard this, but that is incorrect. The display is correctly stated here
No it isn't I don't give a frick what you think is going on, even if the internally rasterized image is distorted before being rendered to offset for barrel distortion. The physical panel itself is only 3664x1920 and it's a singular one. Also, the lenses will be entirely different on the quest 3, so the level of distortion happening should be significantly reduced, meaning the image needs to be distorted less, thus less supersamplng is needed for the final outputted image to be parallel to the native resolution of the panel.
Hahahaha, NO. Buy a router. You don't need good internet, just a good router.
>Considering you wasted my time with the HDR rant, still looking for a source to that claim.
I couldn't care less about that honestly. Last Coast was a tech demo which barely worked in the first place.
If you want to understand why you were wrong learn vulkan, then write a rendering engine for tilers.
>Once you open the can of worms that is distortion correction, there is no concept of native
It's common sense of vr rendering. It's not my problem you don't know anything.
Even valve lists 140% of panel, distortion compensated framebuffer as 100% rendering res for index.
Distorted image is displayed on the panel, you autistic c**t.
If you don't render at 140% before you distort, the middle of distorted image wouldn't have 1:1 pixel sample ratio.
How hard is that to understand, you cretin?
I'm annoyed how vague Meta are still being about the Quest 3 launch library.
The most they've said is that "over" 50 new Quest games will be out by the end of the year and "over" 50 older games will be updated with Q3 support.
They said over half of them are MR titles. Expect basically nothing but silicon valley west coast investor bait. Stuff that makes the Hololens tech demos look innovative.
Be glad Vampire the Masquerade: Justice looks decent.
I'm not watching that cursed showcase again, but I don't believe they were specific about what qualified. Ultimately their showcase spending very little on games tells you everything you need to know.
>Ultimately their showcase spending very little on games tells you everything you need to know
Yeah they showed less than 15 titles.
https://www.uploadvr.com/meta-connect-2023-games/
Because it's from a fricking Crypto Bro company that also keeps missing their deadlines while digging Pimax for the same thing. I unironically would trust Pimax more than Crypto Bros. That doesn't mean I trust Pimax much either though.
>hardware comparable to a mobile 1060
closer to 1050 with more vram
in fact i was disappointed it wasnt a an Adreno 725+, the fast quest 3 uses a 3 year old middle tier chip and not something never will really hold it back, even a bit smaller battery life would be worth few times higher gpu power, adreno is only a small part of the chip, so leaving rest weak while pumping only gpu performance is what they should have aimed for
i got a perfect 100 in my highschool tech class including my final exam while usualy sleeping in class an anons wanna argue about tech with me. like lmao, who do you think put halo ce on every school pc through the internal usernetwork?
i made an infinite resource hack for robocraft using a generic packet sniffer and python and anons think they can argue with me about tech. like lmao even.
>Using the onboard hardware
Nobody does this, it exists to be a slave device to an actual PC unless you want to dwell in N64 graphics land.
>it exists to be a slave device to an actual PC
but the quality of the video feed sucks no matter which method you try
It's fine. Video quality is just a cope created by cablecucks and their leash stockholm syndrome.
My wifi is in the basement, so it fricks me hard.
Doesn't matter. You need a dedicated router anyway.
If you can use vr wired, you can use it wirelessly with the same setup.
>the video quality of this youtube tier streaming headset is fine and you're just a cablecuck for not wanting the image to be like on a monitor
meta shills are the worst
the only selling point of the meta quests compared to pcvr is being completely stand alone.
Yeah the PCVR connectivity has always been a side feature
>Nobody does this, it exists to be a slave device to an actual PC unless you want to dwell in N64 graphics land.
A lot of people do, that was the main reason why the Quest 2 was super popular during the holiday
Keep in mind, gamers don't move products but rather normies do.
It was a great standalone product for normies, for the people that wanted more power can plug it into the pc and get great quality pcvr gaming done.
Not to mention no base stations and 200+ accesories to set up and just one simple wire was a huge selling point to even people that had a VR setup already.
I dislike Meta as a company as anyone else but they manage to make a good headset.
what a moronic post
like every single point is wrong
10 millions active questies per month
keep seething tardlet
>10 millions active questies per month
It doesn't matter if you sell even 100 million units by heavily subsidizing the product, if people are just going to use it once for 30 minutes and put it in the attic, you fricking moron.
And that's exactly what happened with quest.
Zucc lost billions.
>10 millions active questies per month
lol, that's total headset sold, cretin.
Correction, just checked. It's 20m by 2023.
But the main point of the post still stands.
>And that's exactly what happened with quest.
>Zucc lost billions.
He lost billions on investing too much money on tjhe Metaverse
The Quest 2 sold extremally well, instead of giving users core features they wanted and UI upgrades within it's limitation they went to invest and bet on Metaverse being the next big thing.
When people seen that the Metaverse wasn't exactly what was advertised and possibly decades off the whole company fell off.
The metaverse avatars was lacking when games like VRchat already achieved what they were trying to do made it into even bigger joke
zuck invested in destroying PCVR, removed the oculus home with all collectible items
>zuck invested in destroying PCVR, removed the oculus home with all collectible items
>Quest 2 was THE metaverse bet, moron.
>Zucc sold every headset at $100+ loss.
Dislike or like the Quest 2, but that's objectively wrong.
Metaverse was setup to be a social & businesses hangout that was shown to be much like "ready player 1" to the mass normie market.
With no idea how to even begin or where to start designing such a virtual world with rumors of teams fighting in-house what exactly to add as features such as mixed reality to make this world more lively.
The metaverse was a big world with big plans with no proper leadership and in reality so far off from what they wanted to do.
>Metaverse was setup to be a social & businesses hangout that was shown to be much like "ready player 1" to the mass normie market.
They didn't release anything other than horizon world. It's simply impossible to waste that much money on it.
>They didn't release anything other than horizon world. It's simply impossible to waste that much money on it.
>what is R&D
>technology development
They literally wasted 15 billions anon on Metaverse, they were trying be first to the game and getting nowhere with technology improvements both software and hardware such as mixed reality for the software.
>what is BUZZWORD
Your level of understanding of VR is "I've watched one clickbait video on youtube and now I'm an expert".
>what is BUZZWORD
Anon 15 billion doesn't just disappear without being R&D invested into servers, hardware + software developments.
You think simply making the Quest 3 and Quest Pro ate 15 billion dollars?
>servers, hardware + software developments.
lol
>You think simply making the Quest 3 and Quest Pro ate 15 billion dollars?
Subsidizing Quest 2, bribing all the random gamedev fricks (who end up never released any games lmao), paying salaries to morons who post food videos on tiktok instead of working.
That ate 15b, not the "LE METAVERSE (tm)".
>calls post moronic
>posts something even more moronic
wew.jpg
>Anon literally posted the correct information on why the Quest was a top seller for Christmas and a hot seller for that year.
>moronic POST
Anon are you okay? Like it or not he's right, normie controls the market and not gamers at the end of the day.
All I'm saying is that you are moronic thinking herd mentality is more important than actual content.
You can be disingenuous by saying you were only talking about units sold, not actual headset success, but it's a fact that zucc lost billions on quest overall.
Normalgays were buying the headsets, but they are not using them.
You just can't have a truly successful console (which quest basically is) without good games.
>All I'm saying is that you are moronic thinking herd mentality is more important than actual content.
>awful reading comperhension
Anon, I literally just said "that Anon is correct
The thing is that If you dont use a PC you can't play 90% of the actual VR full videogames.
I mean, playing half life alyx, fallout 4/skyrim VR or blade and sorcery in a stand alone device anywhere without the wire and shit would be awesome but its not possible.
Blade and Sorcery has a Quest version with mod support
lol
>There's no way a quest 3 can't play Skyrim VR
lol
you do realize 600W PC's struggle to run that garbage, right?
>There are way better games that run natively on Quest
No, there aren't. Skyrim is indeed trash, but other quest games are on that level or worse.
>lol
I know it exists, it's just absolute garbage.
Fricking this, after the initial amazement and seeing how awful the ai is and how often the physics fricking bug out I have no hopes for VR. Considering no one has even been able to make something even comparable to this besides boneworks.
Shit like contractors and breachers are all fun for a time, Alyx mods were a fun time, but even just simple full body tracking is still jank, expensive and rarely implemented and there's 0 standards for simple fricking things like gun angle alignment.
I played Skyrim VR on a gtx 970 at full resolution and it ran perfectly and it's way easier to optimize for set hardware
Basically anything actually made for VR, Skyrim VR is lazy garbage. You just waggle the controller with your wrist and nothing interacts with anything, you just point at an object and it teleports to your hand. Bow isn't much better you can shoot super fast barely pulling it back. I think there are mods now that make it better but it's still shit
>I played Skyrim VR on a gtx 970 at full resolution and it ran perfectly and it's way easier to optimize for set hardware
Yeah, with 640x640 DK2 maybe.
>The Quest 2 sold extremally well, instead of giving users core features they wanted and UI upgrades within it's limitation they went to invest and bet on Metaverse being the next big thing.
You think they spent all those billions on fricking horizon world lmao?
Quest 2 was THE metaverse bet, moron.
Zucc sold every headset at $100+ loss.
>Yeah, with 640x640 DK2 maybe.
With a CV1. Had to put the graphics down but it runs great. Skyrim came out in 2011 it's not very hard to run...
>With a CV1
lol
>Had to put the graphics down but it runs great
It doesn't. Look at the framegraph to see the reality of the monkey programming.
Thank you for telling me how the game ran on my own PC
Skyrim VR is probably the best performing VR game I played. Literally everything else ran worse.
>unknow rendering res which looks like 240i
>no frame graph visible
>vignette
Yikes.
You don't need a frame graph... when oculus games start dropping frames it cuts to half frame rate (45 FPS) and start uses reprojection up to 90 FPS and you can see wobble artifacts on moving objects.
>gtx 970 at full resolution
my Black person you are having intermittent seizures because the stuttering is INTENSE at naitive even OCd
There's no way a quest 3 can't play Skyrim VR. Skyrim and Fallout VR are shit anyway... I have no idea why you would want to play that. There are way better games that run natively on Quest than that shit.
>There are way better games that run natively on Quest than that shit.
Like...?
https://www.meta.com/experiences/5638124899586470/
https://www.meta.com/experiences/2603836099654226/
>Sequel to a bad game now with microtransactions
>Worst New Blood shooter now with extra unresponsive controls
Skyrim can at least be modded with Enderal or something to be good. Get a good PC+VD and stop coping.
>Worst New Blood shooter
Amid Evil is not worse than Ultrakill
>The thing is that If you dont use a PC you can't play 90% of the actual VR full videogames.
I mean, playing half life alyx, fallout 4/skyrim VR or blade and sorcery in a stand alone device anywhere without the wire and shit would be awesome but its not possible.
I get what you're saying, but most costumers aren't trying to play those games.
They're happy with what they got, the same way if you view the Steam Charts most people got entry level $300 or less GPU in each category that barely scraps by for VRgaming.
Which is the same reason why you got an outage for CS2 not performing well on low end machines.
People aren't upgrading to the top hardware, the Quest 2 is designed to be an entry level VR headset that just happens to be good for PCVR gaming too if you have the setup for it.
Literally just put your router on your window sill and play in your backyard? Have you guys seriously never done this?
>Literally just put your router on your window sill and play in your backyard? Have you guys seriously never done this?
Base Anon, I've done that a few times along with the extended beat saber mod.
It's extremally fun having a bunch of extra space.
If you have a router less than 5 years old it supports vr over wi-fi and it works better than a cable
I honestly wish they would do more shit like the RE4 VR port. Low fidelity, but it really didn't matter cause it was ported from a Gamecube/PS2 game anyways.
I know they were planning a San Andreas port, but that shit seems to be a no-show for nearly two years now.
nobody will pay for the music license renewal
They announced it as a big reveal at an Oculus event almost two years ago now, so there was at least a plan to either gut the radio stations or re-up the licenses. Who knows where that is now though. Honestly VR just needs more games. Not "experiences" but actual fricking games.
>actual fricking games.
play flat2vr mods, portal 2 is recent
>Nobody uses the only feature that the device benefits from
90% of VR gamers are 8 year olds who got a Quest for christmas
Join literally any game that has crossplay and you'll see
It's so irritating. Honestly the pubs for VR games with crossplay are worse than for regular flatscreen games. The leavers have made it impossible for me to play After the Fall. Singleplayer games are nice and comfy at least.
>N64 graphics land.
more like ps3 graphics land, which is good enough for 95% of games
in 3 years, it'll be ps4 level, good enough for 98% of games
>not OLED
lol
>Mura right up in your eyeballs
no thanks
This absolutely ruined the CV1. Sad to see after 8 years it's still the same shit.
Asgard's Wrath is good and Asgard's Wrath 2 is coming out this year
>Sad to see after 8 years it's still the same shit.
MicroOLED uses monocrystal panels, mura is not a thing there.
MicroOLED is way too expensive for VR still.
The only headset that uses it is Bigscreen Beyond and that costs $1000 even before the needed tracking stations and controllers.
Won't Asgard's Wrath 2 be downsized compared to the first since it's being developed for Quest 2?
It's ok, but way too short and definitely not worth $40.
>Won't Asgard's Wrath 2 be downsized compared to the first since it's being developed for Quest 2?
The graphics are but the game itself is larger. I don't really care about the graphics as long as the gameplay is good.
Do any good headsets even use it besides bigscreen beyond? I heard that headset still has weird glare even with pancake lens which is another dealbreaker tbh.
>as long as the gameplay is good.
>Asgard's Wrath
lol
Factory price of each panel in Apple Vision Pro is $1k+.
The price will go down eventually, the progress in that area has started.
>The price will go down eventually
well I can bet you the delayed consumer version of Apple Vision probably won't use MicroOLED, or at least not as high resolution panels.
They would not lower the res.
New factories just to supply apple with screens are getting built right now. The price will go down 100%.
Asgard's Wrath was good idk what you are talking about. Closest thing I've played in VR that felt like a Zelda game.
simply eliminate the mura
That still has mura and glare issues
it has zero mura
I know because I have it
the glare is there but not really any worse than the other 8 hmds I can directly compare it against
>glare
>not wireless
>extra wire because no headphones
>$1000 with no controllers and no tracking stations
Yea, that's a no from me.
>hardware comparable to a mobile 1060
ARM is not the same thing as desktop architecture, certain calculations will make it choke. HL2 level post process or shadows will still kill a Quest 3.
This. Into the trash it goes.
>HL2 level post process
Like what exactly?
Tiled gpu's can easily handle hl2 level tech.
It's not a smooth "yes/ no" of spec target.
HDR rendering calculations is still considered very expensive on Quest 2, which is part of why all Quest 2 games have that washed out look. Meanwhile this was considered fine in 2004.
You don't really know what you are talking about.
My source is an Oculus employee.
I don't understand what's with this obsession of comparing ARM devices with PC GPUs.
Write a rendering engine before talking next time, alright?
>google search for 2 seconds
>confirmation from oculus engineers HDR rendering is not well suited for their hardware
>confirmation from indie developers it will tank performance
Did you actually do any development work on Quest, or are you just saying things?
huh i googled for 2 seconds and found the opposite
Here's official Oculus documentation.
>https://developer.oculus.com/blog/how-to-optimize-your-oculus-quest-app-w-renderdoc-quest-hardware-and-software-offerings/
>https://developer.oculus.com/blog/how-to-optimize-your-oculus-quest-app-w-renderdoc-walkthroughs-of-key-usage-scenarios-and-optimization-tips-part-1/?locale=en_GB
Then you can look at the developer forums at Unity and Unreal and see what developers have to say.
>midwit misunderstands the dev docs
always love to see it
You didn't read it.
>High Dynamic Range (HDR) texture formats are a no-no on Oculus Quest for the most part. HDR requires a temporary buffer with a different format than the swapchain texture, typically with a format of R11G11B10_FLOAT rather than the normal R8G8B8A8_SRGB.
The sheer amount of programmers actively hostile towards learning anything 3DCG is insanity.
Look up how valve implemented HDR in lost coast, moron.
They literally just hacked it by overbrightening the textures.
It's not R11G11B10.
>Also Pixel density doesn't matter as much
Yeah, I have no idea why you bring it up, it's irrelevant.
>Quest 2's default resolution was lower than the native one at 1440×1584.
It also looks like shit.
To make quest 2 look half decent, you need to render at at least 5408x2736 (2704x2736 per eye), which is the real "native" rendering res for that panel.
>Look up how valve implemented HDR in lost coast, moron.
It outputs as SDR but the lighting is done in HDR. Source: https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/HDR
They literally use an image from Half Life Lost Coast for that page. If you know that they specifically (did not) use HDR calculations to generate the final image, it would imply the Valve documentation is wrong and a source would be nice.
No it isn't I don't give a frick what you think is going on, even if the internally rasterized image is distorted before being rendered to offset for barrel distortion. The physical panel itself is only 3664x1920 and it's a singular one. Also, the lenses will be entirely different on the quest 3, so the level of distortion happening should be significantly reduced, meaning the image needs to be distorted less, thus less supersamplng is needed for the final outputted image to be parallel to the native resolution of the panel.
and Quest 3 has dual panels too
Thus should also reduce the necessary cost to achieve parallel results in the panel without excessive supersampling. Thus this factored into my decision when upgrading from the quest 2.
>The physical panel itself is only 3664x1920 and it's a singular one.
Oh, you are that schizo moron!
Hello!
You still didn't learn how vr rendering works?
https://www.reddit.com/r/OculusQuest/comments/prjj6q/trying_to_understand_the_oculus_quest_2_resolution/
Please read this thread and stop posting. Supersampling is supersampling, the physical panel is not higher than what I posted. Take your meds.
It's not supersampling, it's distortion compensation, you moronic poorgay.
Quest 3 with your 3070 is not going to look any better btw.
If your outputted image is higher than the native resolution of the physical panel itself, it is supersampling. I don't give a frick what you say, you are wrong and I'm not replying to you again, you made me snap at my boyfriend when he went to cuddle me because you're such a massive fricking moron that you ignore physical facts.
https://www.reddit.com/r/virtualreality/comments/ygmn34/question_supersampling_and_lens_technology/
Not that anon, but no clue why you're being pedantic. And if you want to be pedantic, you're still wrong. Once you are compensating for the fragment distortion there is no concept of native. Also it is the same thing as supersampling by definition.
Your definition of native is a guesstimate that looks nice (not even accounting for interpolation shenanigans), meanwhile "panel resolution" is an objective metric.
Honestly I think you're just baiting at this point. I do not know why.
>Once you are compensating for the fragment distortion there is no concept of native.
Stopped reading here. You are moronic. "Native" means 1:1 rendered pixel to panel pixel.
Good luck. Keep believing that.
Pico 4 starts looking good 3k by 3k per eye btw
>the native resolution of the physical panel itself, it is supersampling.
Yeah, exactly. That's why distortion compensation is not supersampling, because it makes panel's pixels in the center of the screen correspond to rendered pixels one to one.
If you are not compensating for distortion with increased rendering res, the middle of the screen is technically subsampled.
We were trying to explain that to your stupid ass for so fricking long. Glad you understand now.
>"Native" means 1:1 rendered pixel to panel pixel
Yes and since the native panel resolution is 3664x1920, going higher to 5408x2736 is supersampling
>>If you are not compensating for distortion with increased rendering res, the middle of the screen is technically subsampled.
>technically
that's not what that word means
>rest of panel because of said distortion is still being supersampled, especially because of single panel design
How fricking WRONG can one guy be? Just shut the frick UP already. I HATE you.
The most important part of the screen, the middle, is subsampled unless you render at 140+% of panel resolution.
I don't make the rules, sorry.
>unless you render at 140+% of panel resolution
which is what's known as supersampling, yes
What do you think "supersamping" means?
Explain to me how it's SUPERsampling if there is only one sample per pixel?
>one sample per pixel
>140+% of panel resolution
which is it?
For displayed image to have 1:1 panel pixel/rendered pixel ratio, the predistorted image has to be rendering at 140% res.
So both.
then you agree it's supersampling
it isn't supersampling. it has to render more pixels to be 1:1 due to the shape of the lens distortion
It's impossible to argue with that moron. He doesn't read.
It's the second thread he does that shit.
Tell me the resolution of the panel of the quest 2 right now, the physical hardware. Tell the class what you think the reality is. So we can clear it up. Because it's been stated multiple times, throughout the thread.
no. you're a fricking moron. it's more fun to just laugh at you
You're the moron. Keep being delusional. I'm gonna go have sex now, something that I can tell never happens in your life.
Stop abusing your dog, you sick frick.
it's ok. the dogs dead. it won't mind much
based on what most furries look like, the dog probably unironically overpowered him
if only games rasterized with barrel distortion in mind, we could have 4x better resolution at center with no performance cost
the advantage of 3d is that it dosnt have to make sense, so including a barrel deformation in rasterization pass wouldnt be a problem, shading is per pixel anyway.
>if only games rasterized with barrel distortion in mind
they already do. see "fixed foveated rendering"
>we could have 4x better resolution at center with no performance cost
it's nice to dream
>they already do. see "fixed foveated rendering"
FFR isnt the same as rendering with the distortion, its just less resolution in corners, but you could use a vertex shader or some other gimmick to distort the games world to match the lenses perfectly
>it's nice to dream
its more a matter that game devs dont use tech that already exists, thats the problem with most VR games being made by unexperienced indies
I know about that google meme. It doesn't make that much of a difference perf wise but EXTREMELY overcomplicates the rendering pipeline.
>I know about that google meme.
what?
> It doesn't make that much of a difference perf wise but EXTREMELY overcomplicates the rendering pipeline.
Its not about performance, its about the quality of image so your pixels dont get distorted by any barrel filter and instead are as sharp as possible
its not that complicated, games already use a lot of screen space gimmick, slapping in a filter after the edge rasterization but before pixel shading would be as simple as adding a single shader
>what?
>>use a vertex shader
>slapping in a filter after the edge rasterization
lol, you have no idea what you are talking about.
>lol, you have no idea what you are talking about.
no you
>so including a barrel deformation in rasterization pass wouldnt be a problem,
that's exactly what it does you moron.
Because of said distortion there will NEVER be a parallelled 1:1 sample as the interpolation would diverge significantly as you deviated from the center. Which is resampling the image. In the case of whether it is sub sampling or supersampling is factoring into the native resolution of the panel. In this case, it would be supersampling. Now suck my dick.
And that factor to achieve that will not be the same on a device with proper independent panels and entirely different lenses. This means that lower resolutions will look even better on the next gen device and the interally rasterized image won't need to be supersampled nearly as much to achieve native level results. Also, if you're willing to use subsambling within your linguistics then I think even with trying to move goalposts, I'll accept your concession.
You're and idiot, have a nice day.
>Quest 3 with your 3070 is not going to look any better btw.
considering the Quest 3 has a higher resolution panel with better pancake lenses and proper dual displays it most certainly will.
Considering you wasted my time with the HDR rant, still looking for a source to that claim.
>Stopped reading here. You are moronic. "Native" means 1:1 rendered pixel to panel pixel.
That's exactly what I'm arguing if you put the effort to read the rest of the post.
The Quest 2 panel is 1,920 by 3,664, not 5408x2736. Once you open the can of worms that is distortion correction, there is no concept of native, as opposed to visual diminishing returns.
At this point, 100% convinced you're a troll. Just not replying from here. Tried to give yo the benefit of the doubt but nah.
>Considering you wasted my time with the HDR rant, still looking for a source to that claim.
I couldn't care less about that honestly. Last Coast was a tech demo which barely worked in the first place.
If you want to understand why you were wrong learn vulkan, then write a rendering engine for tilers.
>Once you open the can of worms that is distortion correction, there is no concept of native
It's common sense of vr rendering. It's not my problem you don't know anything.
Even valve lists 140% of panel, distortion compensated framebuffer as 100% rendering res for index.
Middle of the screen is 1:1.
>Even valve lists 140% of panel, distortion compensated framebuffer as 100% rendering res for index.
where?
In steam vr.
got a screenshot?
Because on present 1 sample (rendered pixel) corresponds only to one panel pixel.
It's simple, really, you moronic furry.
But it doesn't. It diverges completely once you leave the center, which isn't as much of a range than you think. There is no way to achieve 1:1 panel to rasterized output with the panel design of either devices. And LCD is not a CRT. moronic troony, Truly Mythical This man's stupidity. Take your Meds.
Keep coping with your garbage gpu and blurry image, your moronic frick.
i have a 7900 xtx, moron. furry supremacy.
>7900 xtx
pffff
yiff in hell, subhuman
is that a rex?
Fricking chads of vrchat. Moar.
Explain to me how you believe that suddenly interpolated distorted images being reprojected onto an lcd panel is not resampling and how using a resampled image that is being mostly downsampled to a lower resolution panel isn't considered supersampling. I'm truly fascinated by your mythical stupidity.
>I couldn't care less about that honestly. Last Coast was a tech demo which barely worked in the first place.
The discussion (honestly it's more like a highschool debate) was about Quest 2 not being able to handle HL2's post processing and lighting tech, because of how badly it handles HDR textures and render targets.
>Oculus engineers and documentation say the Quest sucks for using this data and maintaining frametimes
>Valve documentation says that they've been using this tech since the early 2000s
There is literally no other outcome to make here than the Quest 2 being badly suited for this kind of calculation. I can go right now on the developer forums on these engines and everything correlates this.
You aren't making an argument, you're looking for one liner victories like the discussion is some Yugioh deck. At this point I'll just drop it unless you have an actual "technical" and objective point to make.
You spent half the thread calling people morons with the least technical feedback or back and forth in this thread.
>Even valve lists 140% of panel, distortion compensated framebuffer as 100% rendering res for index.
That does not conflict with what I said at all. As I have stated you're reaching diminishing returns. You're rendering at a higher res to make the difference of the lens distortion, but pixels will fundamentally not align with the display.
This is why MSAA is worshiped in VR so much. Nothing is perfectly aligned to the screen due to decisions made for compositing.
although I'd argue MSAA looks awful too but that's its own 50 hour rant
>You're rendering at a higher res to make the difference of the lens distortion, but pixels will fundamentally not align with the display.
It's not that important as long as no physical pixels are subsampled. To achieve that you need 140% render target.
You talk like you don't really understand what rasterization is.
>It's not that important
proofs
Learn how rasterization works.
>I don't have to show you anything. You just need to do a computer course. I win
Well you're the one who thinks they need a computer course to understand how rasterization works
if I don't need a course you can just simply explain it then.
The concept isn't even complex.
Whenever this guy loses an argument he tries to derail the discussion and "win" by pure exhaustion.
I find it more fun to let people explain things and laugh at them when they get it wrong.
>It's not that important as long as no physical pixels are subsampled. To achieve that you need 140% render target.
Have you done the math yourself? Because every time this discussion comes up usually the numbers were based on *visual diminishing returns* but nothing objective.
Either way rendering an additional 40% of the screen just for barrel distortion is gross. If we're going full autist then the stitching from foveated rendering and sampling fuzziness from interpolation makes it (still) not enough.
>You talk like you don't really understand what rasterization is.
That word isn't even that relevant here. We're talking about compositing and sampling.
I swear to god it's like a university student just learned how to render a triangle in OpenGL and is on a power trip.
That word isn't even that relevant here. We're talking about compositing and sampling.
Very relevant. Rasterization is all about sampling.
Alright, fair enough. You get the lens profile, you do the math on the flat render buffer, that does count as rasterization.
Still not a counter argument to the actual point, though.
The point is, if you are not rendering at 140%+ the image is going to look like blurry shit.
Cope as much as you want.
I have never once argued against this. You are fighting the demons in your head.
I am saying that 140% being "native" to the display is mostly wishful thinking. The solution is to render 1:1 to the display to begin with. The more nonsense like Spacwarp you introduce, the more even 140% isn't technically sufficient
>I am saying that 140% being "native" to the display is mostly wishful thinking.
You have to call native something, the consensus for fresnel is to call raw image needed for distortion compensation "native".
You can try to argue semantics by saying "nothing is really native, because pixel sample ratio is not uniform for the whole display!" but nobody gives a shit
>You have to call native something
I just call it the panel resolution.
If distortion was done through the vertex shader instead (like Google did way back) then we wouldn't be having this conversation as you'd get that 40% increase in resolution for free.
That's the goal, that's true native, not this BS arms race because it's easier to composite.
>I just call it the panel resolution.
Panel resolution is physical resolution of the panel.
There is no need to add more confusion.
I'm not adding confusion, the people that set up the compositor created the confusion.
flat 4K screen means a 4K render buffer is native. The reason why this is not the case in VR is questionable decisions made for ease of development.
You can blast resolution like a mad man, but for me I'll always be pissed that if Valve, Oculus, and PlayStation trusted their developers then this would have never been an issue.
I wanted to say that manufacturers don't really advertise rendering res, so it's customer fault that they are misunderstanding the tech specs and assuming stuff, but then I realized that Zuccshed themselves were changing the definition of 100% rendering res based on fricking refreshrate with airlink.
So yeah, it's a mess.
Doesn't really matter at this point. Fresnel era is almost over.
But anyway, you still need a top of the line GPU for VR if you want a good looking image with usable ironsights.
This is what started this whole discussion back then.
>Fresnel era is almost over.
if you think pancake lenses are good then you've not tried them
We are going to pancake whatever you like it or not.
Fresnels are gone.
Pico4, Quest and Beyond have pancake lenses. The rest don't.
The point is that we will not see a new fresnel headset from a major manufacturer in 2024+.
my point is that they're not very good so be careful what you wish for.
Look at the glare/bloom
it's not like I wish for it, it's just a matter of fact.
fresnels are not perfect too, glare and god rays are there, pancakes might still be better overal
>It's a fact
it isn't.
>b-b-but
I have two headsets with pancakes and they both have glare. they're clear around the edges but they suffer with a lot more glare than my fresnel lenses.
It is a fact that the industry is switching to pancake, regardless of your wishes.
I'm not denying the artifacts.
what other headsets are announced other than Quest with pancakes?
Vision pro, which every dog will copy.
Fresnels are gone. Forget about them.
>Vision pro
That's not a VR headset, that's an AR headset
Just because apple is allergic to the term VR in their marketing doesn't make it any less of vr headset in essence.
Pointless arguing, you know exactly what I mean.
yes. the shit headsets are getting pancake lenses. that's what you mean.
Actual vr headsets worth owning aren't.
>Pimax
>worth owning
lol
are you going to claim some shit Quest 3 is a better headset than a Crystal?
You're really going to climb to the top of the moron tree?
>are you going to claim some shit Quest 3 is a better headset than a Crystal?
I'll certainly say the Crystal isn't $1100 better than the Quest 3.
that's because you're broke
Then are you saying the Crystal is better than the Vision Pro?
I've not tried a vision pro. It isn't a gaming headset is it? Does it do PCVR? How does it do 4kx4k with video compression 90hz?
imagine having a battery which is required to be charged in wired headset and thinking that's acceptable
>that headset which has a battery and runs with 2800x2800 uncompressed resolution is bad because this other headset with a battery which runs at a much lower 2000x2000 resolution on extremely poor quality video compression is better
please explain your logic
Because that other headset costs more than 3x less.
If I’m paying $1600+ for a headset I shouldn’t have to deal with shit like battery charging.
>it's less so it's better
you sound extremely malnourished and possibly brown
>defending battery charging on a $1600+ headset
Xbox fan I’m guessing?
I'm not defending it at all. I'm saying it's better than a Quest 3. Your point is that it loses because of a battery to a different headset which requires a battery
derp
How much does it weight again?
can't your scrawny neck handle it or something?
why you get so defensive, bro ;^)
I asked you a question. Why can't you answer it bro?
it's not nice to answer question with a question
how many indexes is crystal weight wise?
You asked a rhetorical question, numbnuts
the weight of it would only be important to someone built like an 11 year old girl.
What's it like worrying about a VR headset being too heavy for you?
>I'm not defending it at all
Clearly you are if you’re shitting on the Quest 3 for being cheap yet praising a headset that costs more than 3x the price with several of the same limitations like the aforementioned battery.
The simple fact you believe the Quest 3 and Crystal are in any way comparable is hilarious.
The Quest is nothing but a toy. You dumb frickers lap it up because it's cheap junk and all you can afford
>You dumb frickers lap it up because it's cheap junk
Yet you’re literally lapping up a $1600 headset with a cheap limitation just like it
>if you are not wasting money on chinkshit with extemely bad track record, you are a poorgay
Is this the best you get?
it's the best headset you can buy right now and possibly will be until Somnium VR1 releases.
You're coping
Remember it's failed devs pushing the graphics meme. They're mad people can have fun on a 300$ device with a mobile chip and don't want to play their unoptimized trash
you just own a shit pc
have a nice day.
>They're mad people can have fun on a 300$ device with a mobile chip
quest 2 has less games than even ps5 which has no games
That means it has more games because you can’t have negative nouns
>my toy is better than your toy
ayy lmao
I don't own a crystal.
>are you going to claim some shit Quest 3 is a better headset than a Crystal?
Yeah, unironically.
Simcucks might disagree, but for everyone else Q3 is better.
>Crystal
You mean the one literally powered by the same chip as the Quest 2?
lol like anyone bought a crystal to run off that snapdragon chip you utter moron
I guess it’s not better than a Quest 3 if it’s worse at standalone VR then
if your only benchmark is that a headset can play phone games then yes some shit quest wins. congrats
I accept your concession
Just give Chinese scammers thousands bro
have a nice day.
>Just because apple is allergic to the term VR in their marketing doesn't make it any less of vr headset in essence.
It does though.
They even said that the "mixed reality dial" can't be used to create a full VR environment
Somnium VR1 doesn't have pancake
Pimax Crystal doesn't have pancake
but the budget dogshit headsets like quests and picos do so that means everyone. lol
>Pimax
Have you tried one though
Pancake lenses are so much fricking better it's unreal. My quest 2 is way more comfortable than my Pro, but I never wanna use it now because of the lenses.
I have Pico and QPro
I think both headsets are fricking shit so don't use them anyway
That's 3/4 of the last released VR headsets anon.
Only PSVR2 doesn't use pancake, presumably because they thought HDR OLED was more important.
Honestly I'd argue Sony's decision wasn't cursed. The problem is they also sacrificed low persistence.
Right now I put my cope in accidentally getting lens tech with more forgiving barrel distortion.
It's just when I realize we could've been getting that resolution for free if people played their cards right early in, I'm not exactly happy when I'm just *barely* not reaching frame targets knowing it was avoidable.
Either way, I guess you need a nuclear reactor for VR.
4090 is enough for Q2. And it looks decent too.
Honestly happy with the picture quality, would rather have new good vr games than new headsets.
*To be fair* that is a 4090.
I'm just shocked this was not addressed as a fundamental performance bottleneck on Quest, considering it is *hard* to find games running at even 1x panel resolution there.
Native standalone shit looks like absolute garbage.
After seeing what maxed out Q2 could look like it's impossible to go back.
Even without, native standalone is an actual eye soar. The res is so low it actually hurts my eyes to play.
If you want to laugh, download and install Grid Legends on the Quest 2, then refund after your face looks like that Walter White meme in pure disbelief.
hopefully that gets updated for Quest 3.
I wonder what the color range is on this thing, to help make those shadows look even better.
Red Matter 2, that was a world of difference. Walking Dead... Going to be honest, those are straight up different assets.
Yeah some titles seem like they're getting more of an overhaul for Quest 3 than others
Thankfully even unupdated games will still get some benefits with improved performance and a higher base resolution (from 1440×1584 to 1680×1760)
For those that don't get updated, Sidequest commands to force render res and texture res will definitely be nice.
I'm noticing in these showcases they're like "omg grass", so I guess they can finally brute force overdraw.
Graphics (res) gays are why games suck these days
Attention whoring namegays like you are the reason threads suck these days
have a nice day.
>If distortion was done through the vertex shader instead (like Google did way back)
You can compensate somewhat with fixed foveated rendering to bring periphery closer to 1:1, so for modern gpu's with variable rate shading it doesn't really matter that much.
You can, but then you need to get clever with blending the different resolutions, sometimes split into 2 buffers per eye.
The real solution is just doing it all in one go, 1:1 with the lens coordinates, but "muh interpolation, muh timewarp" got in the way.
>ARM is not the same thing as desktop architecture
even at 4nm?
As soon as that twitter nerd successuly hacks psvr2 (he already hacked the first one) a bunch of people will buy that one because of how relatively cheap it is while getting things like oled
virtual reality is dumb. Just play a real game on a real screen with a real controller, instead of a facebook gimick.
Are you implying that people who play VR have not played a game on a flat screen? What a moronic statement
>2024
>still no games after Alyx and Beatsaber
Is boneworks that good?
no it's shit, the "game" part is a tech demo meant to sell the game for modding and custom content
the sequel has even less content, neither are worth full price and there's really not that much content for them
a pattern you'll notice is that the lack of actually good VR games mean VR shills end up overhyping otherwise mediocre games like boneworks or blade & sorcery
wireless air link already makes the others obsolete
>winning in a fight where everyone loses
VR is already dead
Honestly i just want a standalone headset that i know isnt trying to screw me over somehow. I dont trust FB and i dont trust the CCP
At least with Quest you can just sideload pirated games easily.
Yes but if i want updates then i risk fb finding out through some backdoor shit eventually and briking my device... Dont want to deal with it
Literally impossible, Android doesn't work like that. Unless they make their own OS for the meta quests it's never going to happen, and if it does it would be unlikely to have your device bricked, maybe banned from certain apps.
It's definitely possible... You have to go through registration to even boot the OS. The people who got Quest 3 early can not use it. I'm pretty sure it is illegal to completely brick your device though. The most they will do is ban you from connecting to their servers like Nintendo does
I figure they would have done that stuff already if so.
The only thing they've done so far about sideloading is introduce App Lab as an alternative for people making apps.
Not a thing. Closest is some games have opted for a anti piracy check home base type of thing but it sucks and even the virtual desktop guy renigged on it cause it caused issues
There's Lynx but it probably sucks
Lynx?
>death blow for PSVR2
That shit was dead on arrival.
>Steam deck announced before major production started
>deckard isnt even announced
My guess is valve waits to see if q3 shits the bed and if not then they will see how they will compete against it and use whatever prototype fits best
They announced it with no fricking games
What are they doing.
They've sold 10 million headsets with no games so far
Only thanks to the pandemic meme and heavy subsidizing.
Frick off, moron. Stop namegayging.
this is a vr thread, not a ps5 thrrad anon
The PSVR2 hasn't even sold 1 million yet
I've bought every generation of oculus headsets
Every time I end up reselling it after a few months, usually due to them giving me headaches and being unable to find a comfortable fit for them. I hope with the quest 3 being slimmer and stuff that I can actually use it now. Especially with the pancake lenses, those seem nice
did you not bother with the elite straps before?
I did try the quest 2 elite strap with battery
Didn't really help. I mean, way better, but I still got so much pressure on my forehead. The battery wasn't enough to counter balance it. This time if a nice 3rd party strap still isn't enough, I'll just tape a damn weight to the back. That's what kills it for me I think, all the weight being in the front.
well apparently the thinner Quest 3 design makes it about 20-30% better weight distribution than Q2.
Yeah I'm hoping that helps a lot
the bobo strap is really comfy, weight is distributed all over your head, if you go for the one with 2 batteries and dock you basically get unlimited battery life.
Get a Bigscreen Beyond if you want a properly comfy headset. It's the size of a can of coke.
Yes I do want one but I don't have 2 thousand dollars for headset plus controllers and trackers and tax.
I do not have a Facebook account.
You haven't needed a facebook account to use quest headsets for like a year
A Meta account is the exact same shit
How the frick do you normalgays not see this
you don't need to add any of your private info
you just need to verify yourself via a phone app and make purchases with your credit card.
It's ok though, they don't take any of your private info during this process
heh
>israelitebook
On principle I refuse to give them my money even if those googles look interesting.
>quest 3 finally delivering mixed reality
I have been waiting since the hololens announcement for this day
Is there even any modern VR device that's not standalone?
I feel like putting a whole SOC and Battery in there is a waste of money.
Quest 3 is not selling even 5 million units unless they manufacture another pandemic.
Question
I have like 1TB of high quality VR JAV porn
Can I stream that shit to the quest 3 or I need the wire (too big filesizes to keep it in the quest native storage so they are in my PC).
Wire is completely pointless, you're not getting wired quality, you're just getting wireless quality with a leash.
>Can I stream that shit to the quest 3
you can stream that shit to quest2, I use skybox and open videos directly from synology NAS
will everybody +facebook know that im fapping to VR JAV videos of japanese schoolgirls?
if you are this paranoid then use virtual desktop and stream porn from PC, unless quest makes screenshots or realtime analysis they can't know if it's a game or a video
also turn off sharing to smartphone, if you accidentaly press record or copy porn to the headset it will get into your phone
Wait...what? You need to sincronize a smartphone to use the fricking quest?
yes
pico is somehow way less intrusive and doesn't even need an account to use it with pcvr or sideload shit
What the frick. This totally kills the quest for me.
I mean, I hated when they forced me to use a fake fb account to keep using my oculus CV1 lol
>pico
Dont they get a lot of problems with steam vr?
>1 year without touching my CV1
>just used google earth VR because I love traveling around listeting to podcasts
Aything cool released thiis 2023?
is it worth to jump from CV1 to quest3?
there's tokyo game show VR until sunday
>valve index flopped
No it didn't, that's why people have more of those than the Quest 2.
>that's why people have more of those than the Quest 2.
That's a fricking lie
Fake numbers, the Valve Index made more money than the Quest because it cost more
While the Quest was selling their dumb headset for $300 valve was making 6x times the amount by selling their index for $1000
Gamers want better hardware and it shows, you don't see anyone talking about the Quest headsets anymore
>Fake numbers
ah yes, because Valve would lie to make their own headset look bad
It also cost more to make.... you don't know their margins
The Quest 2 was selling at $100 lost
Meanwhile the Valve Index was selling at a $800 profit. The Valve index wins
and your source for that is...?
https://www.inc.com/jason-aten/facebook-just-raised-prices-on-quest-2-100-august-1.html
Because Mr.ZUCC had to raise the price on the quest 2 headsets.
they were selling at a huge lost billions a year
first of all that lasted less than a year.
second of all that doesn't prove anything about the quest margins.
and third of all you still need a source for the index margins.
https://www.roadtovr.com/valve-index-best-selling-steam-products-streak/
The valve index is selling stronger than the quest 2, we don't need numbers it always top selling on Steam is proof enough that the Valve Index is a great device and makeup $800 profit per unit sold.
Mr.Zucc has to sell their quest 2 headset at a loss.
>we don't need numbers
so first you say the numbers are fake and now you're saying we don't need numbers
hmm
>Selling at $800 profit
PFFFTAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
and even if the margins were similar, the valve index has definitely sold less than 1/6x the units of the quest 2
>Fake numbers
People need to realize that for technology like this to be a success it has to be palatable to non-gamers. The Wii didn't sell as well as it did because it appealed to gamers, it sold well because it appealed to parents, seniors, and everybody else. Something like this can take off but it absolutely has to be stand-alone, affordable, and comfortable to use. When it does that, it will take off.
>thinking gamers don't sell stuff
That's why the Steam Deck is selling more than every other console right now.
Because gamers want it more than a weak Nintendo Switch.
But it's selling well amongst gamers. For VR to get widespread appeal it needs to appeal to non-gamers.
VR got wide spread appeal because dumb gamers invested into it.
That's why the Nintendo switch is flopping compared to the Steam Deck right now
I got Pico 4 like a month ago and I just keep cooming to VR waifus non-stop since. Didn't even play a single game yet.
Honestly I'm surprised Meta hasn't release dozens of great first party Games.
They spent so much money on the metaverse, you think they'd have the money to finance some Half Life Alyx Tier Games.
Imagine what Nintendo would do if the switch was a VR device. At this point the virtual boy has more interesting first party Games than the quest.
Tell me more. I haven't looked much into these sort of things. Are there enough games and videos?
>Are there enough games and videos?
It's not much but games like Virtamate allows you to just load ported models so you can just load Tifa or Cammy or Widowmaker or Kasumi or whatever and have fun.
No. VAM requires tons of paypigging/pirating hoping on paypigs generosity for mediocre scenes and good models. With blank expressions/very slight and generic expressions because one models smile is anothers vagineer nightmare fuel shit jankily riding your wiener.
You can however spend hours upon hours upon hours animating and make almost anything you want. Learn how to model/port models and assets and you can make anything you want.
For one scene. That has a high chance of having to be adjusted, sometimes minor sometimes major depending on the models, especially for expressions.
Oh and good luck with anime models because they all have human teeth and fricked up mouth collisions, as well as those with texture lashes looking terrible with their eyes closed, unless you make your own closed eye lashes to load on trigger, significantly reducing what you can do with their expressions.
Or do what it looks like most people do, have them stare at you blankly.
>Honestly VR just needs more games.
I know, let's ask for more REMAKES and PORT!
Frick originality!
Considering how well new games turn out I'd rather have ports. I know some emulators can run in VR but I don't know if there are any games that run well this way..
Remakes and ports are better than new stuff.
Same with movies, why make anything new? That's how you end up with all female ghostbusters instead of doing the same story everyone loves.
Consider this
vr headsets have more exclusive games than the ps5
0 is not more than 0
I know nothing about VR but want to get into it. Can stuff like quest 3 connect to your PC and run all pcvr games or are they limited to what meta sells? Can you stream you PC desktop to a headset in order to play any game (not VR) or stream a movie?
yes to everything
Sick, thanks anons. From looking around for a few minutes it seems like the best "entry level" headset, is that the general consensus?
Currently Pico 4 is probably the best one. It has Quest 3 specs but costs like 300$ and doesn't require any facebook bullshit. Unless you're paranoid about CCP spying on you it's a great start.
CCP can watch porn with me if they want. Thanks man, I'll look into it
it works with pcvr just fine if you block the device's WAN access as well
Pico has to be imported to the US and is owned by a Chinese TikTok company which is not better...
>has to be imported to the US
So? Just order it on aliexpress or something.
>is owned by a Chinese TikTok company
Ok but the actual headset doesn't require any of meta bullshit. And considering the price it's simply a better bang for your buck.
It's sold on Aliexpress, just get it there.
I have a Pico 4 currently but I'm still buying a Quest 3 for the chest and arm tracking and the higher FOV
>higher FOV
It has slightly higher horizontal fov but less vertical.
Wait for Pico 5.
Yeah but horizontal is more important imo
>wait for quest3!
>wait for Pico5!
>wait for steam deckard!
AHHHHHH
I HATE YOU ALL Black person homosexualS
If it helps the Quest 3 is literally 9 days away
no matter how moronic something is you can always find someone advocating for it. i know this is hard but you have to make a decision for yourself, either what to buy or who to listen to. if you aren't moronic you will end up with a quest 3
> if you aren't moronic you will end up with a quest 3
this post is pure pottery
Yea, with Virtual Desktop (you have to buy the version on the Meta store, not Steam I believe)
Any breakthroughs that will give us wireless native video quality anytime soon?
Perhaps it will be very good with Wifi 6E and AV1 encoding. But apparently AV1 adds more lag so I will wait for people to actually get a Quest 3 and test it.
>wireless native video
there's a LG tv that transmits uncompressed video wirelessly
so it's possible, future looks bright
ive spent big bucks getting a new gaming rig, now I'm ready to add some VR to it, the main reason I want to get 'back' into gaming. (my wife is leaving me). and I'm ready to double down and do VR. I love VR, but I still don't have a headset.
I am considering buying an index NEW, because money is no object for me (as you can imagine, an adult male 6fig wfh software dev with no children -remember, my wife is leaving me-, I have a lot of spendable income)
I can't wait for the deckard, it's going to take at least 1 year
But what about your wife?
she's leaving him
she will be leaving me within the next six months probably. she is not interested in video games. or anything for that matter. enjoy your youth lads, middle age is pretty fricking lame, other than having lots of money
lets not pretend you were doing anything differently in your youth boomer nerd
Don't buy on impulse. Get the Meta Quest 3, which comes with full body tracking out of the box without wearing anything else.
>Don't buy on impulse. Get the Meta Quest 3,
don't buy on impulse guys. Just pre-order the Quest 3, a headset which has no reviews online and that the people showing previews have all had to sign a Meta contract stating they'll not show the headset in a bad light.
This, so much this.
Listen to this, madams and sirs, Meta Quest 3 (tm) is very good product. Much value.
I bought 5. How many did you buy. They're so great and don't cost much. I just couldn't help myself. Meta are such a great company to deal with.
>which comes with full body tracking out of the box without wearing anything else
no it doesn't.
It will be getting approximated tracking of your wrist, elbows, shoulder, and torso along with estimated leg positioning (which can't be used to actually track leg movement) in December with only three games supporting it at launch (Supernatural, Swordsman VR, Drunken Bar Fight)
>which comes with full body tracking out of the box without wearing anything else.
so I have to be naked with just the headset on for the body tracking to work?
Sorry not buying Zuckerberg bullshit. Especially not after Carmack left.
I vote with my wallet.
>which comes with full body tracking out of the box without wearing anything else.
What?
>quest 3 is about 2.4tflops
>steam deck is 1.6tflops
>gtx 1060 is 4.8tflops
>rog ally is somehow over 8tflops but with a huge io bottleneck.
Makes ya think
https://gadgetversus.com/graphics-card/nvidia-geforce-gtx-1060-3gb-vs-qualcomm-adreno-740/
This puts the GPU in the Quest 3 closer than that
>need to render twice per eye, still expensive even with single pass stereo
>need to render at higher resolutions than even the whole Steam Deck screen per-eye
>shared ram
>certain instructions just more expensive because ARM
>Facebook's bulky OS eating resources in the background, where the Quest 3 is now doing all sorts of computer vision to make up for removing the tracking ring in the back
Those are all worth considering when comparing standalone VR to PC, I just don't think the teraflop comparisons are going to fall in line with expectations.
ASW can allow the headset to cheat by targeting only half frame-rates and still providing a smooth experience. As for the additional overhead, that's likely why they added 2gb of additional memory. Cpu performance should be about the same with devs getting access to three threads. As someone who really loves emulation, I was disappointed with this launch. However I still bought one.
>than even the whole Steam Deck screen per-eye
Deck is 1280x800, which is barely 1m pixels.
Just so you know, even Quest 2 at "native" is 15m+.
It's not "more than even the whole deck", it's 15 (fifteen) times more.
>still expensive even with single pass stereo
Doesn't matter. It only saves one extra vertex shader run, fragment shader still has to run fully.
lol
>it's 15 (fifteen) times more
not exactly. The Steam Deck had a pixel density of 206 PPI, the Quest 2 had a pixel density of 773 PPI.
Also Pixel density doesn't matter as much as render resolution and the Quest 2's default resolution was lower than the native one at 1440×1584.
So what kind of specs are we looking at for the deckard? I'm using the reverb g2 and I might upgrade if it's a huge leap, but no fricking way I'm paying 1200+ for a marginal improvement.
AHHHHHHH I JUST WANT TO UPGRADE MY CV1 WHY ARE YOU TELLING ME THAT QUEST 3 ARE SHIT OR I NEED A SMARTPHONE TO USE IT AAAAAAAHHH WHAT DO I BUY
Quest has a smartphone companion app and iirc it requires using it on first setup sometimes for stuff like developer mode
It's still by far the easiest for community software support and wireless desktop sharing, the pico controllers aren't as good. Which is fricking comedy considering "muh tracking" was the biggest reason PCVR chads said not to get the quest, and then suddenly the Pico is worth it with even worse tracking?
pre owned quest 2 for cheap. the ones coming out are not worth the price, but 2 is a big upgrade over 1 if gotten for cheap.
The improvements in passthrough makes me think there's been some kind of video decoding improvements. There's no way Qualcomm didn't look at how every single PCVR headset using their designs relies on video encode / decode to get the job done and didn't improve it
Best case scenario is AV1 hardware decoding, most likely is speed improvements to existing H264 and HEVC decoding blocks
Either way, it's good for the quality of wireless streaming
Quest 3 has huge improvements in passthrough which is massively underrated. I'd love to be able to use Virtual Desktop in an actual low latency color passthrough mode.
Vr is a dead meme, the limitations on what games you can make are too great. It’ll be good for a few fps’s some fun little chiv style games. But the limitations on the human range of motion means fighting games, and real action games wouldn’t work. Even something like souls slop is beyond the scope of what vr will ever be able to do.
It's only because of the awkward insistence on remaining first person.
Play Demeo with some friends and you'll see the potential.
Because if it’s not first person movement isn’t 1-1 so the whole gimmick is a waste. Just play it on a flat screen at that point.
You can still make good use of VR without having first person movement
You’re literally just using vr to be a head tracking camera controller which is fine but it’s not going to lend itself to most games and will be downright wasteful and distracting for most.
>You’re literally just using vr to be a head tracking camera controller
actually your camera is still a physical character within the game which reacts to stuff and enemies will attempt to target.
I've bought just about every headset and play all the VR games and Astro Bot is still one of my top games despite being stuck on the shit ass PSVR1.
>souls slop is beyond the scope of what vr will ever be able to do
lol no
>same FOV as a fricking HTC VIVE
>A headset from 2017
Why the frick do these shitty companies never upgrade fricking anything? FOV is the most important thing for VR Immersion HOLY FRICKING SHIT
no one except pimax dares to make the gigantic frick-off hmds that can give you wide FOV at the moment
there were some weird funny lenses that did right angle distortion to make the same FOV in a small package but we're not close to having it at the consumer level
>no one except pimax dares to make the gigantic frick-off hmds that can give you wide FOV at the moment
Why?
Also I literally NEVER hear about the pimax is this just a really shit headset with a meme pricetag? all you ever hear for "top end" is valve index, no one ever mentions this pimax
>Also I literally NEVER hear about the pimax is this just a really shit headset with a meme pricetag? all you ever hear for "top end" is valve index, no one ever mentions this pimax
its chinkshit but their latest crystal is more like index fov
the other stuff like 8kx and 5k models had really wide fov but tons of software issues from pitool and just general chinkware qualities to how shitty the screws are, audio solution etc.
their pricing brackets easily match stuff like the bigscreen beyond and varjo aero; somnium vr1 will prob be in a similar vein pricewise
>FOV is the most important thing for VR Immersion
No. The most important thing is interactivity which we won't get anytime soon because nobody going to develop such projects for limited VR userbase.
Bigger FOV also requires higher resolution and we already struggle with this stuff.
>But the reality is that 5408x2736 is just the native res of the Quest 2 display
Actual panel resolution of quest 2 is 3664x1920.
>I thought you were calling the inflated distortion correction "native"
Yeah, that's what I was doing.
>Also you're way too confrontational for no reason.
There is a certain schizo who is refusing to learn. We were trying to teach him with no success in the previous thread.
He is refusing to understand word.
I don't know where you heard this, but that is incorrect. The display is correctly stated here
I’m going to watch so much pass through VR porn on this.
Are you able to use Oculus headsets with the Index controllers? I doubt I'll use it much for anything besides PCVR.
yes, but use virtual desktop, having to calibrate your controllers and trackers in airlink is moronic.
Doesn't work with the link cable? My internet is too shit for virtual desktop or airlink to work anymore which is annoying.
Hahahaha, NO. Buy a router. You don't need good internet, just a good router.
You're a troll, I skimmed the thread.
Well frick, guess I'll just stick with the controllers that come with it
You need to buy 2 base stations and a Vive or Tundra tracker. There are some janky calibrator tools but I think PCVR is already jank on a good day
it has nothing to do with the pixels on the display. it's compensating for the lens. why is this so difficult to grasp?
once again, the image is displayed on the screen, you absolute moron
>once again, the image is displayed on the screen, you absolute moron
frick me you're one dumb c**t.
Distorted image is displayed on the panel, you autistic c**t.
If you don't render at 140% before you distort, the middle of distorted image wouldn't have 1:1 pixel sample ratio.
How hard is that to understand, you cretin?
I'm with you you daft c**t. I thought you were the other moron saying you just need to run it native
I'm annoyed how vague Meta are still being about the Quest 3 launch library.
The most they've said is that "over" 50 new Quest games will be out by the end of the year and "over" 50 older games will be updated with Q3 support.
They said over half of them are MR titles. Expect basically nothing but silicon valley west coast investor bait. Stuff that makes the Hololens tech demos look innovative.
Be glad Vampire the Masquerade: Justice looks decent.
>They said over half of them are MR titles
You mean they're MR-only or they have MR modes?
I'm not watching that cursed showcase again, but I don't believe they were specific about what qualified. Ultimately their showcase spending very little on games tells you everything you need to know.
>Ultimately their showcase spending very little on games tells you everything you need to know
Yeah they showed less than 15 titles.
https://www.uploadvr.com/meta-connect-2023-games/
no
cv1 owner here
it's nice but now i get rekt by zoomers using psvr 2 on pavlov
As someone that has no skin in this fight, why didn't Pimax fans just wait for the Somnium VR1 instead? It seems better in every way.
there are no peemax fans, anyone who fell for that chink scam even once never buys another headset from them again
Because it's from a fricking Crypto Bro company that also keeps missing their deadlines while digging Pimax for the same thing. I unironically would trust Pimax more than Crypto Bros. That doesn't mean I trust Pimax much either though.
>hardware comparable to a mobile 1060
closer to 1050 with more vram
in fact i was disappointed it wasnt a an Adreno 725+, the fast quest 3 uses a 3 year old middle tier chip and not something never will really hold it back, even a bit smaller battery life would be worth few times higher gpu power, adreno is only a small part of the chip, so leaving rest weak while pumping only gpu performance is what they should have aimed for
>first consumer headset to have passthrough VR
neat
i got a perfect 100 in my highschool tech class including my final exam while usualy sleeping in class an anons wanna argue about tech with me. like lmao, who do you think put halo ce on every school pc through the internal usernetwork?
where do you think you are?
i made an infinite resource hack for robocraft using a generic packet sniffer and python and anons think they can argue with me about tech. like lmao even.
is this a good upgrade from the samsung O+?
Yes, those controllers and tracking suck