he's just not a sue, anon, he's literally the reason the setting got so messed up in the first place and a lot of people don't think he's perfect either
the imperium does but they're fanatical to a degree the emperor isn't happy about
Mary Sues are bad because they are uninteresting, because they lack any traits which create drama or struggle, creating a boring story; and the plot revolves around them too. A good Mary Sue checklist is:
1 - Do they have any negative personality traits that create drama in the story?
2 - Do they do anything badly, due to lack of skill, stupidity, etc, that makes drama in the story?
3 - Do other characters dislike them, creating drama in the story?
4 - Is the character not a main character, so even if they are flawless it won't detract from other characters' ability to create drama?
You need all of these to have a Mary Sue.
Emperor only half -qualifies for 2 of these.
1 - he's a fricking mass murderer who treats his sons badly and has no care for individual human lives, so instantly not a Sue there
2 - he is hyper competent, so that's a Sue trait
3 - multiple characters dislike him, eg Horus
4 - he is a major character, but mainly in background in 40k
The bigger Mary Sues of the setting are the Votann. They have almost no character flaws except aggressive acquisitiveness, they do everything quite well except the risk of their computers dying off, they get along well enough with most factions, and they are a major faction. They don't qualify for Sue status either, but they're much more boring than the Emperor.
Bullshit >1 - he's a fricking mass murderer who treats his sons badly and has no care for individual human lives
And yet they get seen in a more positive light >3 - multiple characters dislike him, eg Horus
Many more like him >4 - he is a major character, but mainly in background in 40k
Doesn't matter if they're in the background, they're a sue
Also, he isn't dead. >The bigger Mary Sues of the setting are the Votann
The biggest Mary Sues in the setting next to the emperor are primarchs, then space marines, then custodes.
>Doesn't matter if they're in the background, they're a sue
You have it the wrong way around. If they're in the background, it doesn't matter.
The only problems with Mary Sues are being immersion-breaking, and removing most of the drama/tension from the story. If they don't do either of those things, it doesn't matter at all.
If you disagree, state your case.
The original "Mary Sues" were fanfics where the author would insert themselves into the story, usually under their own name, which was immersion breaking. They would make themselves perfect characters that did everything well and almost everyone liked, and the plot revolved around them, which removed the sources of tension. That's why the term got a negative connotation.
Also I forgot to mention here
Mary Sues are bad because they are uninteresting, because they lack any traits which create drama or struggle, creating a boring story; and the plot revolves around them too. A good Mary Sue checklist is:
1 - Do they have any negative personality traits that create drama in the story?
2 - Do they do anything badly, due to lack of skill, stupidity, etc, that makes drama in the story?
3 - Do other characters dislike them, creating drama in the story?
4 - Is the character not a main character, so even if they are flawless it won't detract from other characters' ability to create drama?
You need all of these to have a Mary Sue.
Emperor only half -qualifies for 2 of these.
1 - he's a fricking mass murderer who treats his sons badly and has no care for individual human lives, so instantly not a Sue there
2 - he is hyper competent, so that's a Sue trait
3 - multiple characters dislike him, eg Horus
4 - he is a major character, but mainly in background in 40k
The bigger Mary Sues of the setting are the Votann. They have almost no character flaws except aggressive acquisitiveness, they do everything quite well except the risk of their computers dying off, they get along well enough with most factions, and they are a major faction. They don't qualify for Sue status either, but they're much more boring than the Emperor.
that an obvious author self-insert, who is pretty much perfect, also qualifies for a Mary Sue. Doesn't have to be a self-insert though.
> The bigger Mary Sues of the setting are the Votann
No it’s the named Chapters. And just named Space Marines in general
Space Marines almost always refuse to ally with xenos, even when it could be beneficial. They can't make new technology, they rely on the Mechanicus who are extremely anti-advancement. They are vulnerable to Chaos corruption, it takes a very long time to make a Space Marine from a raw recruit, and many more flaws.
Votann have none of these issues. They're neatly immune to Chaos, reasonable in just about every situation, can make and advance their own tech, etc. On top of that, they have better technology than Marines. And because they're clones or robots, they can grow at a very rapid rate.
Votann aren't immersion breaking, but they are good at just about everything, with no real downsides other than "computer no work good some time", which makes them very uninteresting and the closest thing to Mary Sues in the 40k setting.
he's just not a sue, anon, he's literally the reason the setting got so messed up in the first place and a lot of people don't think he's perfect either
the imperium does but they're fanatical to a degree the emperor isn't happy about
Mary Sues are bad because they are uninteresting, because they lack any traits which create drama or struggle, creating a boring story; and the plot revolves around them too. A good Mary Sue checklist is:
1 - Do they have any negative personality traits that create drama in the story?
2 - Do they do anything badly, due to lack of skill, stupidity, etc, that makes drama in the story?
3 - Do other characters dislike them, creating drama in the story?
4 - Is the character not a main character, so even if they are flawless it won't detract from other characters' ability to create drama?
You need all of these to have a Mary Sue.
Emperor only half -qualifies for 2 of these.
1 - he's a fricking mass murderer who treats his sons badly and has no care for individual human lives, so instantly not a Sue there
2 - he is hyper competent, so that's a Sue trait
3 - multiple characters dislike him, eg Horus
4 - he is a major character, but mainly in background in 40k
The bigger Mary Sues of the setting are the Votann. They have almost no character flaws except aggressive acquisitiveness, they do everything quite well except the risk of their computers dying off, they get along well enough with most factions, and they are a major faction. They don't qualify for Sue status either, but they're much more boring than the Emperor.
>3 - Do other characters dislike them, creating drama in the story?
Being disliked is a common Mary Sue trait, in order to show how stupid and terrible those who dislike Mary Sue are, and giving Mary Sue either angst or justification for their actions.
[...]
[...]
Bullshit >1 - he's a fricking mass murderer who treats his sons badly and has no care for individual human lives
And yet they get seen in a more positive light >3 - multiple characters dislike him, eg Horus
Many more like him >4 - he is a major character, but mainly in background in 40k
Doesn't matter if they're in the background, they're a sue
Also, he isn't dead. >The bigger Mary Sues of the setting are the Votann
The biggest Mary Sues in the setting next to the emperor are primarchs, then space marines, then custodes.
Everyone else is fine for the most part.
Actually no. Put chaos ahead of custodes. Missed them.
I fricking WISH he was a Mary Sue. Nah, he's really just the Emperor that 40k deserves, not the one they need, yadayadayada.
Long story short, every horrible thing Emps did was a step in the plan of the largest social-engineering project in human history to create an empire equipped with adequate technology and weaponry so that it could have a chance to endure for 10,000 years while he consumes a bunch of Psyker souls to become "The Anathema" and actively erode Chaos away with the growing will of humanity.
The fact that it's working is a testament to his perfect understanding and exploitation of human nature. The fact that it happens to come in the form of Space Catholicism with an extra layer of xenophobia and tyranny is supposed to say more about humanity than it does the Emperor.
Nah, if he was a Mary Sue, he'd have actually solved most of the problems of 40k. The Emperor is an Edgy Sue.
He's a rotting corpse that's been dead for 10,000 years anon. He's a fricking McGuffin that keeps the psychic lighthouse running and sometimes gives one of his devoted servants a little nudge when using their fortune telling cards or a cryptic dream-vision, and that's all.
>Cadia falls >Chaos rises >Somehow bcomes more powerful
He's transcended humanity and become their Chaos God. If you canot beat Chaos, might as well join it.
The Turks (who were from the steppes of Asia) weren't the first to inhabit Anatolia. Considering he's prehistoric, the Emperor would be of one of the races of people who came before the Greeks (and who the Greeks wiped out/absorbed).
A Mary Sue is a flawless self-insert vehicle for the author. When Priestly and others first created the god-emperor of man he was already a rotting corpse leading the most repressive galaxy-spanning despotism unimaginable. All the nu-lore that was added has only expanded upon his faults,although that one writer did make him le rational atheist science man.
I'm getting even more purist as I age and I don't consider a character a mary-sue unless they're a writer self-insert. Which is funny because he wasn't before, but he sure is when they started up with the "oh uh don't worship me guys, big immortal man who shapes humanities history and fate walking here, but boy am I sure not divine or nothing"
He was over 30,000 years old when he took over humanity. That's plenty of time to develop a seething hatred for xenos and abominable intelligence, especially after living through the dark ages. How he handled the Heresy was a complete failure. It would have better for the Empire if the Emperor perished and Samguinius remained alive.
he skelyton
It doesn't really matter because he died years before when the game takes place. All the sperging about him is irrelevant.
Bullshit
>1 - he's a fricking mass murderer who treats his sons badly and has no care for individual human lives
And yet they get seen in a more positive light
>3 - multiple characters dislike him, eg Horus
Many more like him
>4 - he is a major character, but mainly in background in 40k
Doesn't matter if they're in the background, they're a sue
Also, he isn't dead.
>The bigger Mary Sues of the setting are the Votann
The biggest Mary Sues in the setting next to the emperor are primarchs, then space marines, then custodes.
Everyone else is fine for the most part.
>Doesn't matter if they're in the background, they're a sue
You have it the wrong way around. If they're in the background, it doesn't matter.
The only problems with Mary Sues are being immersion-breaking, and removing most of the drama/tension from the story. If they don't do either of those things, it doesn't matter at all.
If you disagree, state your case.
The original "Mary Sues" were fanfics where the author would insert themselves into the story, usually under their own name, which was immersion breaking. They would make themselves perfect characters that did everything well and almost everyone liked, and the plot revolved around them, which removed the sources of tension. That's why the term got a negative connotation.
Also I forgot to mention here
that an obvious author self-insert, who is pretty much perfect, also qualifies for a Mary Sue. Doesn't have to be a self-insert though.
Space Marines almost always refuse to ally with xenos, even when it could be beneficial. They can't make new technology, they rely on the Mechanicus who are extremely anti-advancement. They are vulnerable to Chaos corruption, it takes a very long time to make a Space Marine from a raw recruit, and many more flaws.
Votann have none of these issues. They're neatly immune to Chaos, reasonable in just about every situation, can make and advance their own tech, etc. On top of that, they have better technology than Marines. And because they're clones or robots, they can grow at a very rapid rate.
Votann aren't immersion breaking, but they are good at just about everything, with no real downsides other than "computer no work good some time", which makes them very uninteresting and the closest thing to Mary Sues in the 40k setting.
Xeno appendages typed these.
moron, "powerful, capable character" doesn't automatically mean ''mary sue''. Especially when said characters are the cornerstone of the lore.
>on of the central figures in a hubris tale is a shithead
weird
he's just not a sue, anon, he's literally the reason the setting got so messed up in the first place and a lot of people don't think he's perfect either
the imperium does but they're fanatical to a degree the emperor isn't happy about
He’s a loser and the average anon could use his powers better than he does
He is not even a character. He just here to reinforce the theme of the imperium.
>has character flaws
>plenty of people hate him or dislike him
Being a Mary Sue isn’t only a question of competence or strengthyou massive moron
Mary Sues are bad because they are uninteresting, because they lack any traits which create drama or struggle, creating a boring story; and the plot revolves around them too. A good Mary Sue checklist is:
1 - Do they have any negative personality traits that create drama in the story?
2 - Do they do anything badly, due to lack of skill, stupidity, etc, that makes drama in the story?
3 - Do other characters dislike them, creating drama in the story?
4 - Is the character not a main character, so even if they are flawless it won't detract from other characters' ability to create drama?
You need all of these to have a Mary Sue.
Emperor only half -qualifies for 2 of these.
1 - he's a fricking mass murderer who treats his sons badly and has no care for individual human lives, so instantly not a Sue there
2 - he is hyper competent, so that's a Sue trait
3 - multiple characters dislike him, eg Horus
4 - he is a major character, but mainly in background in 40k
The bigger Mary Sues of the setting are the Votann. They have almost no character flaws except aggressive acquisitiveness, they do everything quite well except the risk of their computers dying off, they get along well enough with most factions, and they are a major faction. They don't qualify for Sue status either, but they're much more boring than the Emperor.
> The bigger Mary Sues of the setting are the Votann
No it’s the named Chapters. And just named Space Marines in general
>3 - Do other characters dislike them, creating drama in the story?
Being disliked is a common Mary Sue trait, in order to show how stupid and terrible those who dislike Mary Sue are, and giving Mary Sue either angst or justification for their actions.
Actually no. Put chaos ahead of custodes. Missed them.
this is like calling a warrior who always wins a mass murderer
>The bigger Mary Sues of the setting are the Votann.
>They hate you because you tell them the truth.
I fricking WISH he was a Mary Sue. Nah, he's really just the Emperor that 40k deserves, not the one they need, yadayadayada.
Long story short, every horrible thing Emps did was a step in the plan of the largest social-engineering project in human history to create an empire equipped with adequate technology and weaponry so that it could have a chance to endure for 10,000 years while he consumes a bunch of Psyker souls to become "The Anathema" and actively erode Chaos away with the growing will of humanity.
The fact that it's working is a testament to his perfect understanding and exploitation of human nature. The fact that it happens to come in the form of Space Catholicism with an extra layer of xenophobia and tyranny is supposed to say more about humanity than it does the Emperor.
Nah, if he was a Mary Sue, he'd have actually solved most of the problems of 40k. The Emperor is an Edgy Sue.
That's fricking moronic. I fricking despise the Anathema lore.
well yeah hes literally a God and the most powerful being ever
He literally failed at everything he tried to achieve.
He's a rotting corpse that's been dead for 10,000 years anon. He's a fricking McGuffin that keeps the psychic lighthouse running and sometimes gives one of his devoted servants a little nudge when using their fortune telling cards or a cryptic dream-vision, and that's all.
>Cadia falls
>Chaos rises
>Somehow bcomes more powerful
He's transcended humanity and become their Chaos God. If you canot beat Chaos, might as well join it.
>he almost literally says that while disguised as Loken
Chances Abbnett reads this shithole?
people getting mad at the emperor will never stop being funny
Yeah, that's why the faction I play doesn't worship the guy.
he's a fricking plot device, not a character
He forgives you. Also he's a Turk, he does what he wants
The Turks (who were from the steppes of Asia) weren't the first to inhabit Anatolia. Considering he's prehistoric, the Emperor would be of one of the races of people who came before the Greeks (and who the Greeks wiped out/absorbed).
A Mary Sue is a flawless self-insert vehicle for the author. When Priestly and others first created the god-emperor of man he was already a rotting corpse leading the most repressive galaxy-spanning despotism unimaginable. All the nu-lore that was added has only expanded upon his faults,although that one writer did make him le rational atheist science man.
>unimaginable
er, imaginable rather. Is that even a word?
>Is that even a word?
Ye
>fricked up everything that physically possible
>thereby destroying any chance of humanity for a better future
>Mary sue
Ok moron.
I'm getting even more purist as I age and I don't consider a character a mary-sue unless they're a writer self-insert. Which is funny because he wasn't before, but he sure is when they started up with the "oh uh don't worship me guys, big immortal man who shapes humanities history and fate walking here, but boy am I sure not divine or nothing"
from what ive read hes basically like Dr Who but hes capable of being a warlord sometimes
Like what if Dr Who got sick of everyones shit
He was over 30,000 years old when he took over humanity. That's plenty of time to develop a seething hatred for xenos and abominable intelligence, especially after living through the dark ages. How he handled the Heresy was a complete failure. It would have better for the Empire if the Emperor perished and Samguinius remained alive.
... and dead, that's the whole point
Our one and only savior is dead and we will never get back what we lost
You're legitimately a fricking moron. I know this is bait. You're still a fricking moron.
He's made so many massive frickups thoughbeit.