How pissed would you be if your DM used loaded dice?
Do you think my players will catch me if I use picrel? They are pretty recognizable I feel, but not many on the market and I'm not going through the hassle of making my own for a one off villain.
I've not decided anything yet, if EVERYONE hates the idea I'll scrap it. Seems like a good dungeon tho, especially since I'm going for a horror theme and want them to feel afraid for once. I'll pretend I did not expect that many 6s and that they might be a walking TPK, causing them the panic I hoped to give.
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If this isnt bait then why are you even rolling dice if you just decide the outcome yourself? Might as well play pretend at that point.
The DM can already stack the deck in his favor without breaking the rules.
I might not be pissed if I were your player, but I *would* call you a liar and a cheat, and if I didn't quit your game, I'd definitely lose all interest and investment.
>The DM can already stack the deck in his favor without breaking the rules.
This. You don't need to roll a single die, what's the purpose of your weird stunt?
What would make you more afraid?
1) Dm spawns a frickton of monsters for an encounter and you realize you should run away.
2) You run into a den, Dm spawns an explosive d6 worth of monsters for an encounter, then you get Waaaay too many, and need to flee.
It's just a way of making it seem like I'm no longer in control, and that the dungeon has taken on a life of it's own!
But hey if it's immoral or whatever I'll drop it- not like I WANT to spend 12 bucks for a single session just draw people in my game.
it's not immoral, but you don't need to get weighed dice to do that shit either, just fudge the rolls normally
shit like this is why I like games without a unified resolution mechanic. I also like to let my players roll for damage they receive, so good luck with that.
DMs only roll dice because they feel like it. Using weighted dice instead of just saying "he hits for a gorillion damage" is pointless.
Why are you cheating as the DM anyway? The point is to provide a fun time for the players, not to "win" some game of pretend.
Isn't the whole point of dice to create random results? If he really don't care for that he could just say, "that thing happened" and be over with it.
If you do it, just plop one amongst some non loaded dice. If done RIGHT it could be fun.
Seems I need to explain myself better. I COULD spawn 10 giant spiders and have the players run away. I COULD.
But, in for the purposes of horror I'd like to give my players the illusion that things are going off the rails with slanted rolls. I'm not trying to win, I'm trying to show them a good time through a lie.
Getting mad at me for this is like getting mad that the horror movie isn't really "based on a true story"
Yes I am lying, to further the fun at the table.
nah man, that's just being a penis.
Just to be clear: I'm allowed to spawn 20 spiders but not allowed to spawn 20 spiders after rolling a dice behind the DM screen and saying it's a 20?
Yes. It's not hard to follow how abusing the trust of your players adds to the violation.
I feel like intent should matter a whole lot in this conversation.
If I tell you your sweater is cool even if it's awful I'm being a bad friend GENERALLY. Unless It's the last thing your grandma knit for you.
In 12 angry men the scene where they time the walk is fake, they SAY it takes like 45 seconds while if you take the time it's different. Still regarded as one of the greatest cinematic experiences of it's time. I should be lucky to make something that compelling for my players. AND YET it lies to it's audience. Successfully, so nobody knew it until a second or third viewing, but lied all the same. I do appreciate the trust players put in me. If I lie to them it's not to get a leg up over them, it's to give them the best I possibly can. Illusion is a key part of entertainment. I want to foster that. Gears of war and system shock gave you bonuses to damage on your last bullets to make you feel better. Mass effect had FAKE SPRINTING during combat, I can't fudge rolls?
I wrote the game system, the setting, the adventure, but I can't do what game devs do basically every game?
From your OP it was really unclear why you wanted to use the weighted dice, if you think you can build some kind of meta horror about a game that's much tougher than the GM expected go ahead, no-one loses anything from your experiment and anyone whining about an "abuse of trust" his far too in their own head about some abstract TTRPG philosophy.
Good luck selling your fake surprise.
Rolling loaded dice in front of everyone isn't the same thing as rolling dice behind a screen for effect while you say the results are whatever you want.
I know, doing it in the open is so much cooler. Hence my post.
lol, for effect. none of your players give a shit you embarrassing sperg
>Dunning-Kruger poster child
I like the idea. The players decide on a certain course of action, you say, "are you sure about that? Ok" and then roll a die, get a 6, sharp intake of breath in dismay, roll again for another 6 and under your breath mutter "oh frick."
I think it's a cool way to get them to shit bricks
I would think it's neat if we didn't find out for half the campaign. It would be one of those "of fricking course I KNEW IT" moments. Neat things like this are under utilized.
LIKE FOR INSTANCE, I remember someone punishing their player for clowning on a god of luck all the time. He was forced to use a novelty dice, a 19 sided dice, that of course can never crit. Repent motherfricker.
I see what you mean. I can do it, but it would be better if I weaved the dice into the lore and give them a chance to upend their ill fortune through the story.
Like: the dungeon is cursed, but when they lift the curse I stop using the dice and go back to regular odds?
This anon fricks. Hell, OP could add a mechanic for the players to remove the loaded dice one at a time. Each "relic" located by the party would cause one dice to be replaced by a normal one, wrestling power away from the unseen foe.
Or vice versa, locating relics could increase the power of the dungeon, making things crazier as it progresses, maybe with the players realizing the relics are not a boon but a curse. God damn OP, thanks for stirring my imagination.
I do feel like this is getting away from the point, tricking the player into a false sense of dread by imagining that their luck is so bad this time around that they might bight the dust for real.
If Dead space can spawn monsters behind you when you just checked that spot and there's no way they could have got there, I can use weighted dice to frick with my players' confidence.
I grew up watching the "Castle" series on stickpage and never once did I think "Wow I wish this didn't make me feel afraid. Seems kind of unfair that the main characters have the worst luck"
That shit creates dramatic tention. That's what memorable sessions are made of! But I also like the curse aspect of removing the dice. Perhaps we can START with the dread of not understanding why they have bad luck THEN the players can figure out that the dice are weighted and need to upend the curse to save their skins. From Sword and sorcery to survival horror then back to sword and sorcery at the end of the dungeon when their encounters become easier.
Do you think if I rewarded them for understanding that the dice are weighted they would avoid loosing trust in me in the future? As in, the weighted dice are a mechanic they were meant to interact with NOT me trying to get one over them.
Thanks, glad someone is getting what I'm trying to do. These are my best friends, I wanna show them a good time not frick with them for my amusement.
I get what you mean, I think I'm like you in this way a bit. Gotta be careful to craft the experience in a way that makes them feel overwhelmed but not powerless.
Maybe you should present the loaded dice to the players, then mix in regular look alike dice, shake them up, and take out the dice you need for a roll. That way they know there's a possibility you're using loaded dice, but even you don't know which is which. (but of course idk how you would separate them afterwards, lol)
Or you can take the loaded dice and the regular dice behind a screen, and then choose whichever you want when you want to roll without them seeing which.
(I honestly don't know why so many anons ITT act like this is a violation of trust, especially when many have already stated you could just do things without rolling anyway, I think they're taking an arbitrary leap in logic.)
So you think I NEED more, non weighted, similar dice to sell the illusion? I can probably get them but Im not sure. I'll look for lookalikes online, if they don't break the bank I'll get them.
Lot of effort for a one off dungeon tho. Probably won't. Would you be fooled by just the dice?
I might not be the best person to ask, I wouldn't be mad if you revealed the dice were weighted in a dramatic way in some cursed dungeon.
>halfway into dungeon
>characters are worn out
>enter DM:
>"you're having some bad luck in this dungeon aren't you?"
>rolls die
>"[calls the result]"
>rolls die
>"[calls the result]"
>rolls die
>"[calls the result]"
>"how likely are you going to get out of here alive? you should probably turn back now"
Shakespeare has something to say about this approach in midsummer-night's dream. The bit where the acting troupe reassures the audience that the lion is indeed not a real lion, and that the audience can rest easy.
It's the death of immersion, according to him and I tend to agree.
>Do you think if I rewarded them for understanding that the dice are weighted they would avoid loosing trust in me in the future?
The dice are fine as a prop, but should never be used in damage rolls.
If you're using them to generate numbers of creatures, make a show of it. Put the dice in a separate container with skull and crossbones or something and make it obvious when you're using them in lieu of normal dice. Reward them for point out the trick if you want, but come clean if no one's calling your hand and they're all looking annoyed.
Unless these dice will be used as a prop in a scene, don't do it.
Do you have dice that look exactly like these? If you're playing in-person, they'll figure it out. Are you willing to live with your regular players convinced that you cheat in a game that you're also an arbiter of outcomes? YOU decide what the players face - not the published adventure and not what you roll on a random encounter table - YOU have the final say.
>especially since I'm going for a horror theme and want them to feel afraid for once
Now this is outside your control no matter what the dice yields and you must come to terms with that. Everyone reacts to stress differently and some players will skip fear and go straight to frustration and exasperation. On the rare chances I have to play instead of run games, I don't experience fear in the face of extreme misfortune and impending doom - I get pissed off. I lean back and start thinking about the new character I'll end up creatiing with limited attention paid to current session. If you have any players like me, they'll not thank you for this farce.
Its a cool idea for a baddie who is just downright lucky. But otherwise you can obviously just stat them as OP.
Do you think I'll get away with it? Do these dice look anonymous enough to fly under the radar?
How many rolls would you say I can reasonably do before players catch on?
I want to sell it! Make them think that the walls are closing in and only their wits can save their characters from doom. Like the old Conan stories! Always one step away from death.
OP don't listen to the morons, yes it adds to the adrenaline to be overwhelmed by bad luck, rather than just having a DM say 'yeah i want bad shit to happen so it will happen'
I think your players will catch you if you roll all 18s for every stat, yes.
You are terrible and should never DM again.
I'll be sure to disband my group I've been DM-ing for years because an internet randomer said so.
If I do that I might as well give him advantage or something. I wanted to use the effect to mess with my player's perception of the dungeon, NOT as a buff. Buffing things is easy, getting in the player's head and making them feel concerned about what's going down less so.
>Because you're trying to make your players think it's an UNEXPECTADLY hard fight. They should feel like I'm on their side, and that the dice gods are twisting fate horribly. We all know DMs, me included, don't want to kill PCs. I want them to think I'm no longer in control. I want them to arrive to the conclusion that they need to survival horror in staid of the usual medieval SWAT team sweeping rooms.
What's this?
I think I'd accept it if you gave some meta excuse for it. The villain has made a deal with the Fates, or has siezed the thread of Destiny directly, or something like that where he's manipulating reality in his favor beyond the scope of what is usually represented by the game.
I think the best way to do this would be to be up front about it. When you have the party engage him for the first time, slap the dice on the table and say "he'll be rolling with THESE." Instantly they'll know something is different and it won't take them long to cotton on what's going on. There's even the opportunity for them to, say, disable these "fated dice" one by one before they battle him again to literally improve their odds. Three dice, three fates, three bargains to strike.
Makes me think about the classic movie trope, where someone has their lucky dice, and someone calls them on it and forces them to use theirs, and they're sweating bullets.
This pretty much sums up my thoughts. I'd even work it into the plot more, drop hints that the villain is stacking the odds in his favor and build to the players realizing that it's the villain breaking the rules, not you. And now they have a quest to make him beatable.
Just roll the dice where they can't see it and modify the results.
Regular Roll: 1d6
Altered Roll: 2+1d6, or roll two dice and take the higher one
I'm the GM. Why use weighted dice when I can through down 2,000 zombies in front, behind, aside, above, and below my players all at once?
Personally I like bending my players over and traumatizing them for life with my errect penis.
Incorporate the concept of 'cheating' into the theme like picrel and no one will complain
I don't think I would be able to tell as a player. Even statistically unlikely outcome could be just a fluke. And it's not like I keep track of every roll to take the data to run statistical tests in the first place.
>I'm not going through the hassle of making my own for a one off villain.
just get blank face dice and mark them as you want (eg. d6 marked 6,2,3,4,5,6 with 6's opposite of each other will go unnoticed unless examined up close)
That's not that powerful statistically. The ones I'm looking at have 75% 6s as result. Real fricking high rolls.
At the point you think you need loaded dice to play a game a specific way, you should just play a different fricking game. The system you are using cannot achieve the kind of game you want using intended mechanics, so you need different mechanics.
Independent of that, horror tabletop is stupid and tabletop is not scary.
>The system you are using cannot achieve the kind of game you want using intended mechanics
they can when you use dice appropriately, take this anon for example
one way to achieve that would be a DM just handwaving away their 20 roll. However it wouldn't be as impactful as a player who cannot physically roll a 20 using their 19 sided die. It will be one of the *most* memorable roleplaying experiences they ever had, when a God removes their ability to critical.
Had an idea about a trickster boss who uses loaded dice. If the players notice they get to use the loaded dice instead of the boss.
I'm so glad I don't play with anyone from this board
just use a DM screen, like some folders or some shit, so they don't see your actual roll, ya dip.
"hey remember that time the GM told me my actions in the world don't matter? good times! sure am glad I wasted four hours of my life on that session!"
OP gave the example that a dugeon could be cursed or have cursed relics, and that could be why the odds are slanted against players. It's not like the players are forced into a cursed dungeon, they went there, and they stay inside of their own volition.
Is Curse of Strahd any lesser for varying the content using tarot cards, or is it More?
"ermmm God removed ur ability to critical" (asthma inhaler noises) "wh-why are you l-l-leaving???" (body odor)
I hate you nogamers like you wouldn't believe.
was it the asthma or the body odor that got you
>ermm uhh the goblin....... hits you for 6 damage
wtf is this nerd shit bro?
you're the guy whose players walked out on him and you're calling other people nogames lmaoooooooooooooo
Done right this could be very cool. Frick the moron haters.
I agree with the idea of, if/when the players realise something is up, giving them the ability to break the curse (or whatever) and replace the die with normal ones over time.
If I were in a scenario where I had a DM, I wouldn't be pissed at all, because I'd be predisposed to expecting bullshit anyway.
I just thought of something interesting. OP could roll openly where players see it with normal dice, and then lie about the results. If the players call the DM out on it, then the fake results get a buff or the players get a nerf on their rolls. The solution would be for the players to openly fudge their own dice. lol
Show the grave danger they face without a cheap gimmick. Let them find out in a fun way
As a GM I cheat all the time, because the game is players vs me, the evil gm.
I remember once they were having an easy time with some gnolls so I sneakily added 4d6 more, and they never noticed HAHAHAHAHAH!!!
I don't play games with homosexual gms trying to "win". All it does is encourage players to powergame and even cheat as well.
Bad idea. If you want your players to feel panic/fear, make them feel it. They learn that the bad guy is immune to most damage except from a specific magical item/that their own magic items won't work in that specific dungeon because of a curse/etc. There. You have scared players expecting a TPK. Also making some future consequences might be good. Like one of the known patron/NPC ally was taken hostage and will be sacrificed or their daughter is under a curse and if the PC fail she will die which will be taken advantage of by enemy kingdoms to start a war with the grieving father, whatever. Something that will have an impact on the PC's ability to get quests, items or go to certain places.
Anyway invincible enemy with a specific weakness is better than loaded dice. Or just make more traps/encounters.
Roll behind a screen like a proper GM and every game will be like that.