The content packs sound optional and just flavour, they're really not.
Sengoku sold so poorly they didn't even fix game breaking bugs preventing a full campaign playthrough. It literally felt like a testbed for CK2 after the fact
>It literally felt like a testbed for CK2 after the fact
Because it was literally a testbed for CK2 and they've announced it like... week after premiere? Maybe two. Part of it to put down the fire, since people were rightfully pissant about the state of Sengoku.
The fact it was never patched is just fricking insulting to your own buyers, but in retrospect, perfectly fitting nu-PDX that was forming back then.
The usual paradox wienertail >stripped down base game clearly made as a launchpad to sell you dozens of DLC
except the game is abandoned and there will be no more dlc >every faction feels the same besides superficial / unimportant mechanics >there's very little challenge once you 'solve' the game >the AI is horrible
overall it's playable but gets boring very quickly, even the kino time period does nothing to save it, mainly because it has little replay value because of how every faction feels exactly the same to play
>because it has little replay value because of how every faction feels exactly the same to play
I see how that may be a problem, but I'd say that's the case with every Paradox game. Like almost every single campaign in EU4 is Europe is "and then you fight the Ottomans", and if you play in Asia, it's "Ming blows up and now you can easily blob".
Europa is (slightly) better because at least each nation has some events & history attached to it, 98% of imperator's map are literal who generic barbarian tribes, who are generic because none of them have recorded history and most of them are supposed to just be food for 'the big regional empire'
Not to say europa is -much- better than this but you'd think a game that came out after EU4 would learn and improve upon this aspect, not degrade it further.
They can't connect themselves to random tribes of Argobonii and Pekonii and it makes them think that other pdx games have different nations.
Actually in imperator you have more diverse gameplay options than in eu4: you have migratory tribes and everyone else, so it's already a 100% increase.
This is genuinely why imperator never stood a chance. Paradox caters to an audience of very casual history fans who don’t know much outside of France, Austria, Prussia, England, ottomans lol. Guarantee 80% of the player based never heard of the Seleucids before playing the game, so they just don’t care
Ancient Rome autism is a stronger subject than Early Modern history, the setting of EU4. It's not lack of interest in the time period, but that the gameplay is uninteresting and milquetoast. Also, way fewer LARPing opportunities than in EU4. The only interesting options for most people are Rome, Carthage, Persia, some Greek city state, some diadochi, and some barbarian tribe. EU4 has more replayability inside the HRE alone
It has an overwhelming amount of modifieres and numbers, but most of them turn out to be pretty meaningless anyway.
It's decent, even though there is an awful lot of waiting involved.
Since they stopped working on it, it will never become truly great.
We already have two other threads dedicated to jerking off to this clusterfrick abandonware, what's the point of making 3rd? Is PDX really this fricking greedy they still try to market the game they themselves abandoned?
It starts off very intriguing but eventually just devolves into painting sim.
It has better tech trees, politics, trade, and overall bureaucracy than CK3 but it really lacks the flavour, intrigue and characters of CK3.
I played once through with Rome and once I finally defeated Carthage there was really nothing to do.
It has a lot of good ideas but it lacks a lot charm. I think it needed a happy medium of playing as Roman family a la CK3 but you can customise and choose all their traits and backgrounds (Plebe, Patrician, Equite)
I picked it up recently and think it's great. True, there's only a handful of countries actually worth playing, but in those cases the gameplay is good. Expect a game more focused on building and managing an empire than just painting the map.
you hear that, /vst/? This is your chance to crowdfund a company and buy the rights to a paradox title. Let's see how much better you can make it compared to parox
>releases after 7 years >buggy as frick >basically a glorified excel skin >sells 5 copies because the only people interested are /vst/ grognards, who just pirate it
They won't provide you with the source code, so you might as well just write your game from a scratch.
I don't understand why so many people seem to hate Imperator's pop so much.
Like if one mentions CK3 needs pops, they this reaction: >"Frick you frick you, Imperators were god-awful I don't wanna them"
Because pops in Imperator are just development in everything, but name. And made even more moronic than development ever was. It's like everything bad about soft-locked province stats of EU1-3, EU4 development and EU:Rome failed pops, without bringing AYTHING good to the game >inb4 the best way to control culture and religion
Which (a) are both useless and (b) a pie-chart can do just as well, since that's what the pops boil down to: two pie-charts.
you didn't bring up a solution only highlighted the issue
2 years ago
Anonymous
It just means you should re-read the post once more. And if by 3rd time you still won't notice it, you might need a tutor to re-learn how to read. And I'm not even being snide here, but genuinely pointing your issue with reading comprehension.
2 years ago
Anonymous
muh piecharts bro
How do you have piecharts without Vicky-style pops?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Ask the people who worked on MEIOU how did they made theirs. And they have them in a game with no actual pops in it at this point.
>A: Do you have any idea how to fix my car? >B: Just use the buss >A: But I want to use, the bus, so not? >B: Car is pointless when buss exists.
Yes
2 years ago
Anonymous
>A: Do you have any idea how to fix my car? >B: Just use the buss >A: But I want to use, the bus, so not? >B: Car is pointless when buss exists.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>A: Do you have any idea how to fix my car? >B: Don't bother, it's busted beyond repair, go catch a bus instead >A: But I want to use my car, not the bus! >B: Tough luck then, champ
Here, ftfy
I don't understand why so many people seem to hate Imperator's pop so much.
Like if one mentions CK3 needs pops, they this reaction: >"Frick you frick you, Imperators were god-awful I don't wanna them"
And remember to keep your slaves in numbers divisible by 4 and total population of given province divisible by 6, or else it's slave shufflin' simulator with a side-dish of perpetual demotion and promotion cycle, NEVER to finish or stop.
I like watching this game if you tweak majority of numbers by a single decimal point. Like promotions going within a month, rather than a decade. Or migration that actually happens in the same century it started.. Or pops that multiply in any way at all.
Entire Imperator gameplay, and especially pop part of it feels like they've dropped test values into the game during development and then never adjusted them toward the actual game once prepping it for release.
Seriously, just increase the speed of demotion and migrations by the factor of 10 and the game works completely different from there on.
Unfinished, while also broken game that was clearly designed to shit-out dozen or two DLCs, only to crash on release due to being unfinished and broken to a degree unacceptable even for Paradrones. There is close to zero replay value to it, and everyone plays exactly the same, while your starting situation barely matters, for you can climb your way to major power within 50-80 years regardless of anything.
Ive not played the game in a bit but I remember theres a balancing act you can do between stability, AE, Tyranny and War Exhaustion which is going to push AE down faster and cause the decay of stability to slow down. you want the tyranny to bleed off somewhat rapidly but you want to pus it to push down the war exhaustion but I think war exhaustion push AE down or something. Like I said I havent played the game in a bit so I'm not remembering exactly how I was doing it.
Ive not played the game in a bit but I remember theres a balancing act you can do between stability, AE, Tyranny and War Exhaustion which is going to push AE down faster and cause the decay of stability to slow down. you want the tyranny to bleed off somewhat rapidly but you want to pus it to push down the war exhaustion but I think war exhaustion push AE down or something. Like I said I havent played the game in a bit so I'm not remembering exactly how I was doing it.
Keep Stability, AE, Tyranny and War Exhaustion each as close to 33% as possible (and stability as high as you can get). As a result, they will all self-balance each other. And it doesn't matter if the value is displayed as a number or as a percentage, the game handles them all as a percentage anyway. 33,3 is the magic value.
If you want to have fun play the Ptolemies of Seleucids. They’re not tremendously challenging but they’ve actually got a good amount of unique content so you’re not dicking around in a bland sandbox.
Except their content is the same as generic one, just with names swapped. There is grand total of FIVE unique events for the Diadochi. And all five are for the opening years of the game.
>mission trees that rename cities, cause new recurring events, grant permanent buffs to specific provinces, grant optional rewards for going beyond just the main tree, and give unique flavor events upon completion of every single mission as well as completing the whole tree, plus the massive forced civil war and new culture when you finish uniting Alexander’s empire is the same level of content as bumfrick german barbarian tribe #27 with mad-lib tier events
You can just say you haven’t played the game.
>Any of this being in any way different from generic economic mission tree, especially the ones with temples involved. >B-but it changes names!
Weirdest cope of them all
I wish there was a mod that made battle casualties more dependant on winning or losing I always wanna alt+f4 when my heavy infantry just melts away even in battles I win
Ok, here is a main difference:
Vicky 2 pops are an actual population counter. And while the exact number is not as important as in Vicky 1, it means you get things going depending on how big your local population is (and how easy it is to manipulate its percentages, too). Each group of pops grows, migrates and interacts with the game on their own, separately, which is pretty big deal and the basis of the whole economic system
In Imperator, pops are complete abstraction, essentially a development from EU4 with different name. They don't correspond to anything at all, they always only interact one-at-a-time with their current location (both territory AND province) and are actually a finite resource, since you deplete them way fricking faster than they "multiply" (I won't even call it "breed").
So in the end of the day, the migration system of Imperator is a joke. It takes a SINGLE pop about 3 decades to move on its own to a different location, assuming nothing resets the counter. And it's not even "b-but it's ancient world, it has to be slow". It is so slow, because the script governing it is half-baked and modifiers governing it are about two decimal points too small to be of any use. You literally need a cheated governor to make immigration policies actually do something, rather than just be waste of time.
2 years ago
Anonymous
If the imperator pops are more abstracted and less granular than vic pops, doesn't it just make sense for them to take longer to migrate? Sure, a single person might be pretty quick but imp's pops are likely representing thousands of people each. It's not like they had railroads or steamboats in antiquity.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Vicky 2 pops are an actual population counter.
But pops are still objects and not integers?
[...]
Maybe not wealth, but they do have the happiness that needs to be satisfied.
[...] >imp's pops are likely representing thousands of people each.
really? I always imagine one pop represents a thousand people, cities have pop capacity of 22
A pop represents a single point of development, which is abstract as it goes: 1 tax for slave, 1 manpower for freemen and 1 trade for citizen. Noblemen are 0.5 in tax and trade and tribals are 0.5 tax and 0.5 manpower.
They are not population. They are abstract resource income values. Anyone claiming otherwise is either delusional or in ultra-deep denial.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Also:
How the frick you plan to justify a migration that takes DECADES? Not months, not years, but decades. Of a single pop, at that.
It's a fricked-up system, that Johan forced as 1:1 conversion from EU:Rome, without anyone asking "ok, but what does it do mechanically". Then Imperator defense squad, the 5 people of it, decided to act like the I:R pop system is this intricate, complex system of dependencies and the best thing since sliced bread, where it is not only development in all but name, but in the release state of the game it literally was development and part of the (scrapped) mana system. But it being scrapped didn't change an inch by how it all works mechanically and what it does.
Calling them pops to begin with is moronic, acting like this is in any way comparable to Vicky is a clear sign someone never in their life played Vicky.
>Maybe not wealth, but they do have the happiness that needs to be satisfied.
happiness and needs are completely different things.
victoria's pops spend wealth to buy clothes and food, their well-being depends on their income which depends on tech and occupation, while their needs and purchases drive your economy
imperator's pops only have a happiness meter which you change directly via techs/laws/integration and imports while they drive your economy with direct bonuses to tax
Nobody is saying that Imperator's pops are the same as victoria's, nor are they saying that they're the best thing evah, and to claim that people are is either you being legitimately moronic or dishonest. The claim is simply that imp's pops is a population system which is better than most other paradox games. Every time you bring up your "imp pops are just development!!" rant, you always devolve into just stating that it's not the exact same thing as vicky and when you dig deeper it's discovered that you're only assmad because they don't grow at the same rate as 1800s industrial England with vaccines and medicine. And your only solution for "fixing" it is to make it a dumbed down and simplified system (lmao).
In fact, I'm actualy wiling to bet that you've never even touched vic in your life, except for a 1-off trial run where you got filtered so hard it permanently fried your brain. And now you can only play goy$, which explains your obsession with wanting to dumb everything down and your paralyzing fear of calling anything other than vic's system a pop mechanic. Because secretly, you actually like imperator but you're too afraid to play it knowing that it has what's called a pop system, which promptly triggers your lizard brain to screech uncontrollably and piss your pants. So I guess in your worldview there's no such thing as a "true" population mechanic outside of vicky, which if that's the hill you want to die on, then you can be my guest.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>imp pops are just development!
I just love this argument, it is so farfetched it doesn't make sense.
In Imperator overpopulation of settlement will result in unhappy pops, which makes the entire region disloyal, meaning you lose all tax revenues. This means the only way to avoid is actually to build buildings that make them happy.
Remember how development in EU4 forces you to do anything? I don't.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>it is so farfetched it doesn't make sense.
Bird brain moment
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Nobody is saying that Imperator's pops are the same as victoria's
Except the original anon treated them as interchangeable, but hey, you tried
2 years ago
Anonymous
Except nobody did that. All I saw is someone asking a rather stupid question, presumably to bait some moron/ESL like yourself into making an even more embarrassing post which you ended up actually posting. If you weren’t so autistically obsessed about imp then you could have either avoided the question altogether or even responded with legitimate criticism, but all you did was respond with a half witted remark which only embarrassed you later on.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Also:
How the frick you plan to justify a migration that takes DECADES? Not months, not years, but decades. Of a single pop, at that.
It's a fricked-up system, that Johan forced as 1:1 conversion from EU:Rome, without anyone asking "ok, but what does it do mechanically". Then Imperator defense squad, the 5 people of it, decided to act like the I:R pop system is this intricate, complex system of dependencies and the best thing since sliced bread, where it is not only development in all but name, but in the release state of the game it literally was development and part of the (scrapped) mana system. But it being scrapped didn't change an inch by how it all works mechanically and what it does.
Calling them pops to begin with is moronic, acting like this is in any way comparable to Vicky is a clear sign someone never in their life played Vicky.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Vicky 2 pops are an actual population counter.
But pops are still objects and not integers?
main difference is that imp. pops don't have wealth and needs to satisfy
Maybe not wealth, but they do have the happiness that needs to be satisfied.
If the imperator pops are more abstracted and less granular than vic pops, doesn't it just make sense for them to take longer to migrate? Sure, a single person might be pretty quick but imp's pops are likely representing thousands of people each. It's not like they had railroads or steamboats in antiquity.
>imp's pops are likely representing thousands of people each.
really? I always imagine one pop represents a thousand people, cities have pop capacity of 22
2 years ago
Anonymous
>I always imagine one pop represents a thousand people
It's difficult to put an exact number on it since it never really says, but from earlier patches I remember that military colonies used to cost 3K manpower and would place a freeman pop there, and for migratory tribes you would convert 1 pop into 1 cohort and vice-versa, which seemingly represents about 500-1000 capable men but obviously doesn't include women, children, and elderly. So from this I'd guess that each pop is roughly equivalent to a few thousand productive people. And I say productive here because I imagine the pop count represents more of a "number of people you're able to tax and administrate effectively" rather than a defined specific pop count, which also helps explain why some events will just create pops, as these might have been people living in the wilderness that you found and started taxing. It's a little LARP-y but I think it explains things well enough.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>1 cohort and vice-versa, which seemingly represents about 500-1000 capable men but obviously doesn't include women, children, and elderly.
Honestly, I don't know why they bothered to change the cohort size from a thousand to five hundred.
I would have preferred a cohort size of 100 men, to represent the centuria.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Maybe not wealth, but they do have the happiness that needs to be satisfied.
happiness and needs are completely different things.
victoria's pops spend wealth to buy clothes and food, their well-being depends on their income which depends on tech and occupation, while their needs and purchases drive your economy
imperator's pops only have a happiness meter which you change directly via techs/laws/integration and imports while they drive your economy with direct bonuses to tax
2 years ago
Anonymous
does that mean they need to buy food not to starve and if you tax the poor to hell there is famine?
Recently I have managed to acquire multiple provinces in my game. Everytime the same scenerio happens: >some great or major power DOW me because they dont like me >move my legions to their border & rise some levies >they immediately chicken out without as much as losing a battle, usually me taking a few lands in the first 2-3 weeks of war
The AI wasnt that moronic at the beginning of the game
That was when AI had an actual ability to build armies. It no longer has it. But in the same time, it has still the old script for evaluating strength of both sides of the conflict. Meaning your few legions vs their none ends with the AI assuming it has no army and you have a huge edge against it, so better chicken out. But wait, there is more! Since the AE is still in place, conquering land makes the AI assume you're a baddie that should be attacked and stopped in his devious conquering ways... even if a different script tells the AI that it has zero army vs. your hordes.
Behold the true power of 2.0, the saviour of Imperator.
Levies, baby. You either have specific tech level and inventions unlocked, or you can't have a standing army. AI doesn't count potential army it can get from levies, for by the game script, those are treated the same as unhired mercs. In the same time, it does evaluate legions, aka what it was treating up until 2.0 to be just regular army.
Once levies are rised, AI still can't calculate them properly, because they are still treated as temporarily hired mercs (lesser "weight" for decisions) rather than a regular army it had prior.
Result: AI not only still can't compose armies for shit, but it now can't even evaluate them properly.
the guy in the screenshot literally has zero AE, you're just schizo ranting again
>Implying I even looked at his screen
That's a good one
Levies, baby. You either have specific tech level and inventions unlocked, or you can't have a standing army. AI doesn't count potential army it can get from levies, for by the game script, those are treated the same as unhired mercs. In the same time, it does evaluate legions, aka what it was treating up until 2.0 to be just regular army.
Once levies are rised, AI still can't calculate them properly, because they are still treated as temporarily hired mercs (lesser "weight" for decisions) rather than a regular army it had prior.
Result: AI not only still can't compose armies for shit, but it now can't even evaluate them properly.
[...] >Implying I even looked at his screen
That's a good one
damn. Otherwise Im really enjoying the game. One of the few instances when I was eager to finish the timeline. I completely lost the will to continue the campaign. Are the danish or british tribes any fun?
>Are the danish or british tribes any fun?
The only difference between them is the starting location. That's literally it. European tribals are so completely and thoroughly interchangeable, it literally doesn't matter who you pick. And before you ask - the other tribals are no different, but they just got different military traditions tied to them. But everything in Europe outside Greece and Italy is just the exact same shit with different name and different starting location.
>The only difference between them is the starting location. That's literally it. European tribals are so completely and thoroughly interchangeable, it literally doesn't matter who you pick. And before you ask - the other tribals are no different, but they just got different military traditions tied to them. But everything in Europe outside Greece and Italy is just the exact same shit with different name and different starting location.
thats a maybe?
They're only fun up to a point and depends on what you do. Playing Anglia and migrating to Britain is fun, LARPing as an early Anglo-Saxon invasion and then assimilating all the celts there is good for a few chuckles. But once you actually unite Britain it gets boring very fast, and typically you're just finishing up assimilation and building up your cities while raiding for slaves (assuming you aren't just blobbing). Outside of the LARP, there's not much else to do really aside from blobbing or migration shenannigans (since it's not too difficult to unite barbrian lands, unlike the mediterranean which has big empires everyhere), which itself is still pretty LARP-y.
>unlike the mediterranean which has big empires everyhere
tell me about big empires, is there some nice country which will let me grow and then perhaps join this bigger political theatre? I dont wanna get gobbled up from the start
2 years ago
Anonymous
syracuse
2 years ago
Anonymous
Other than Syracuse, there are:
- Sparta: outside the big clusterfrick that is Diadochi struggle, giving you nice breathing room
- Epirus: you are a "big" boy, but your actual capacities are that of a small fry and you have to carefully maneuver your early shit, or you get overwhelmed by just about anyone
- any of the Greeks in Spain and southern France: you are a small fry, but there are only barbarians around, so you can carve a place for yourself.
Bonus feature: Black Sea Greek city-states. They are not in the Med, but you can expand in all directions and there is always the looming threat of Scythian attack.
Is there ANY fricking way for the AI to NOT drop mission tree when you tag-switch? This is so fricking annoying... >Go through the Greek minors and city states to bolster them up with finishing their economic mission trees >Leave them on timers from various missions that can't be instantly finished >AI cancels the mission tree for no fricking reason, even if you put that specific AI into sleep
Why?! Am I asking too fricking much to get Syracuse finish their unique mission tree when under AI?
Here is my best memory with Imperator >be Rome >Greek alliance declares war >they gather 100K troops and slowly march the Balkans >they send another army to invade Italy >I keep jobbing >war is randomly invalidated and I'm saved
It gets bland pretty quickly, but it's got a pretty map and some really cool features, that are probably giong to be featured in newer Paradox titles.
Except nope. CK3 didn't make use of a single feature introduced in Imperator, and that was a test-bed for it and EU5
Same thing happened with March of eagles and eu4 kek
Or like Sengoku was to CK2. Except Imperator is actually good and if you don't like it then you are a brainlet who requires more FLAVOOR.
>Or like Sengoku was to CK2
But 3/4 of what made Sengoku got turned into CK2, so what the frick are you even sniffing? Glue or petrol?
The content packs sound optional and just flavour, they're really not.
Sengoku sold so poorly they didn't even fix game breaking bugs preventing a full campaign playthrough. It literally felt like a testbed for CK2 after the fact
>It literally felt like a testbed for CK2 after the fact
Because it was literally a testbed for CK2 and they've announced it like... week after premiere? Maybe two. Part of it to put down the fire, since people were rightfully pissant about the state of Sengoku.
The fact it was never patched is just fricking insulting to your own buyers, but in retrospect, perfectly fitting nu-PDX that was forming back then.
The usual paradox wienertail
>stripped down base game clearly made as a launchpad to sell you dozens of DLC
except the game is abandoned and there will be no more dlc
>every faction feels the same besides superficial / unimportant mechanics
>there's very little challenge once you 'solve' the game
>the AI is horrible
overall it's playable but gets boring very quickly, even the kino time period does nothing to save it, mainly because it has little replay value because of how every faction feels exactly the same to play
>because it has little replay value because of how every faction feels exactly the same to play
I see how that may be a problem, but I'd say that's the case with every Paradox game. Like almost every single campaign in EU4 is Europe is "and then you fight the Ottomans", and if you play in Asia, it's "Ming blows up and now you can easily blob".
Europa is (slightly) better because at least each nation has some events & history attached to it, 98% of imperator's map are literal who generic barbarian tribes, who are generic because none of them have recorded history and most of them are supposed to just be food for 'the big regional empire'
Not to say europa is -much- better than this but you'd think a game that came out after EU4 would learn and improve upon this aspect, not degrade it further.
They can't connect themselves to random tribes of Argobonii and Pekonii and it makes them think that other pdx games have different nations.
Actually in imperator you have more diverse gameplay options than in eu4: you have migratory tribes and everyone else, so it's already a 100% increase.
This is genuinely why imperator never stood a chance. Paradox caters to an audience of very casual history fans who don’t know much outside of France, Austria, Prussia, England, ottomans lol. Guarantee 80% of the player based never heard of the Seleucids before playing the game, so they just don’t care
Ancient Rome autism is a stronger subject than Early Modern history, the setting of EU4. It's not lack of interest in the time period, but that the gameplay is uninteresting and milquetoast. Also, way fewer LARPing opportunities than in EU4. The only interesting options for most people are Rome, Carthage, Persia, some Greek city state, some diadochi, and some barbarian tribe. EU4 has more replayability inside the HRE alone
It has an overwhelming amount of modifieres and numbers, but most of them turn out to be pretty meaningless anyway.
It's decent, even though there is an awful lot of waiting involved.
Since they stopped working on it, it will never become truly great.
We already have two other threads dedicated to jerking off to this clusterfrick abandonware, what's the point of making 3rd? Is PDX really this fricking greedy they still try to market the game they themselves abandoned?
It starts off very intriguing but eventually just devolves into painting sim.
It has better tech trees, politics, trade, and overall bureaucracy than CK3 but it really lacks the flavour, intrigue and characters of CK3.
I played once through with Rome and once I finally defeated Carthage there was really nothing to do.
It has a lot of good ideas but it lacks a lot charm. I think it needed a happy medium of playing as Roman family a la CK3 but you can customise and choose all their traits and backgrounds (Plebe, Patrician, Equite)
I picked it up recently and think it's great. True, there's only a handful of countries actually worth playing, but in those cases the gameplay is good. Expect a game more focused on building and managing an empire than just painting the map.
>Expected a game more focused on building and managing an empire, but was just painting the map.
ftfy
Imperatorsisters, I don't feel so good...
you hear that, /vst/? This is your chance to crowdfund a company and buy the rights to a paradox title. Let's see how much better you can make it compared to parox
>releases after 7 years
>buggy as frick
>basically a glorified excel skin
>sells 5 copies because the only people interested are /vst/ grognards, who just pirate it
maybe that. maybe a semi-coherent product picked up by an eceleb and casualized after the devanons got greedy.
They won't provide you with the source code, so you might as well just write your game from a scratch.
Because pops in Imperator are just development in everything, but name. And made even more moronic than development ever was. It's like everything bad about soft-locked province stats of EU1-3, EU4 development and EU:Rome failed pops, without bringing AYTHING good to the game
>inb4 the best way to control culture and religion
Which (a) are both useless and (b) a pie-chart can do just as well, since that's what the pops boil down to: two pie-charts.
I mean that how would fix them? (asking so that I can steal that idea)
I've stated that already in my post, you are encouraged to re-read it if you can't see it
you didn't bring up a solution only highlighted the issue
It just means you should re-read the post once more. And if by 3rd time you still won't notice it, you might need a tutor to re-learn how to read. And I'm not even being snide here, but genuinely pointing your issue with reading comprehension.
muh piecharts bro
How do you have piecharts without Vicky-style pops?
Ask the people who worked on MEIOU how did they made theirs. And they have them in a game with no actual pops in it at this point.
Yes
>A: Do you have any idea how to fix my car?
>B: Just use the buss
>A: But I want to use, the bus, so not?
>B: Car is pointless when buss exists.
>A: Do you have any idea how to fix my car?
>B: Don't bother, it's busted beyond repair, go catch a bus instead
>A: But I want to use my car, not the bus!
>B: Tough luck then, champ
Here, ftfy
Epic ESL moment, btw
I don't understand why so many people seem to hate Imperator's pop so much.
Like if one mentions CK3 needs pops, they this reaction:
>"Frick you frick you, Imperators were god-awful I don't wanna them"
It's just a slave shufflin' simulator
And remember to keep your slaves in numbers divisible by 4 and total population of given province divisible by 6, or else it's slave shufflin' simulator with a side-dish of perpetual demotion and promotion cycle, NEVER to finish or stop.
I like watching this game if you tweak majority of numbers by a single decimal point. Like promotions going within a month, rather than a decade. Or migration that actually happens in the same century it started.. Or pops that multiply in any way at all.
Entire Imperator gameplay, and especially pop part of it feels like they've dropped test values into the game during development and then never adjusted them toward the actual game once prepping it for release.
Seriously, just increase the speed of demotion and migrations by the factor of 10 and the game works completely different from there on.
you'll get a couple of games out of it, a few more if you like diadochi period
Unfinished, while also broken game that was clearly designed to shit-out dozen or two DLCs, only to crash on release due to being unfinished and broken to a degree unacceptable even for Paradrones. There is close to zero replay value to it, and everyone plays exactly the same, while your starting situation barely matters, for you can climb your way to major power within 50-80 years regardless of anything.
wrong moron
Play with Invictus dumbfrick.
>Play broken mod to a broken game
This isn't math. Two minuses won't turn into a plus
What are the best ways to avoid/manage AE?
Impossible to avoid, but it burns off faster the higher it is. If you are stable enough, you can maintain 100 AE and have it reduced quickly
Ive not played the game in a bit but I remember theres a balancing act you can do between stability, AE, Tyranny and War Exhaustion which is going to push AE down faster and cause the decay of stability to slow down. you want the tyranny to bleed off somewhat rapidly but you want to pus it to push down the war exhaustion but I think war exhaustion push AE down or something. Like I said I havent played the game in a bit so I'm not remembering exactly how I was doing it.
Keep Stability, AE, Tyranny and War Exhaustion each as close to 33% as possible (and stability as high as you can get). As a result, they will all self-balance each other. And it doesn't matter if the value is displayed as a number or as a percentage, the game handles them all as a percentage anyway. 33,3 is the magic value.
They didn't play it again after it got fixed. The pop mechanics alone make it one of the funnest Risk 2.0s I've ever seen.
Do you plan to keep this thread up until Christmas?
No.
>Pirated GOG version
>Try to install mods
>None of them work
wtf
Is your game version 2.0? I thought I’ve heard that some people have trouble finding the latest patch but it could also just be another issue
>t.
If you want to have fun play the Ptolemies of Seleucids. They’re not tremendously challenging but they’ve actually got a good amount of unique content so you’re not dicking around in a bland sandbox.
Except their content is the same as generic one, just with names swapped. There is grand total of FIVE unique events for the Diadochi. And all five are for the opening years of the game.
>mission trees that rename cities, cause new recurring events, grant permanent buffs to specific provinces, grant optional rewards for going beyond just the main tree, and give unique flavor events upon completion of every single mission as well as completing the whole tree, plus the massive forced civil war and new culture when you finish uniting Alexander’s empire is the same level of content as bumfrick german barbarian tribe #27 with mad-lib tier events
You can just say you haven’t played the game.
>Any of this being in any way different from generic economic mission tree, especially the ones with temples involved.
>B-but it changes names!
Weirdest cope of them all
Your entire point was about content, and if you're not talking about flavor then what sort of content are you asking for?
I'm not even that anon, you idiot. I'm just mocking you both.
I guess pretending to be a moron is a form of mocking both people, so I'll concede to you there.
I liked the region developer aspect of it, seeing your pops slowly grow reminded me of vicky in a way
>I like to bump dead threads, for I have necrophilia
ftfy
I wish there was a mod that made battle casualties more dependant on winning or losing I always wanna alt+f4 when my heavy infantry just melts away even in battles I win
Can somebody tell me how Vic2 pops are different Imperator?
The only thing that makes them similar is being called "pops"
don't both objects have religion and culture?
But they work differently in both games, so not really a connecting tissue here.
How do vic2 pops work? Don't they migrate like IMP pops?
Ok, here is a main difference:
Vicky 2 pops are an actual population counter. And while the exact number is not as important as in Vicky 1, it means you get things going depending on how big your local population is (and how easy it is to manipulate its percentages, too). Each group of pops grows, migrates and interacts with the game on their own, separately, which is pretty big deal and the basis of the whole economic system
In Imperator, pops are complete abstraction, essentially a development from EU4 with different name. They don't correspond to anything at all, they always only interact one-at-a-time with their current location (both territory AND province) and are actually a finite resource, since you deplete them way fricking faster than they "multiply" (I won't even call it "breed").
So in the end of the day, the migration system of Imperator is a joke. It takes a SINGLE pop about 3 decades to move on its own to a different location, assuming nothing resets the counter. And it's not even "b-but it's ancient world, it has to be slow". It is so slow, because the script governing it is half-baked and modifiers governing it are about two decimal points too small to be of any use. You literally need a cheated governor to make immigration policies actually do something, rather than just be waste of time.
If the imperator pops are more abstracted and less granular than vic pops, doesn't it just make sense for them to take longer to migrate? Sure, a single person might be pretty quick but imp's pops are likely representing thousands of people each. It's not like they had railroads or steamboats in antiquity.
A pop represents a single point of development, which is abstract as it goes: 1 tax for slave, 1 manpower for freemen and 1 trade for citizen. Noblemen are 0.5 in tax and trade and tribals are 0.5 tax and 0.5 manpower.
They are not population. They are abstract resource income values. Anyone claiming otherwise is either delusional or in ultra-deep denial.
Nobody is saying that Imperator's pops are the same as victoria's, nor are they saying that they're the best thing evah, and to claim that people are is either you being legitimately moronic or dishonest. The claim is simply that imp's pops is a population system which is better than most other paradox games. Every time you bring up your "imp pops are just development!!" rant, you always devolve into just stating that it's not the exact same thing as vicky and when you dig deeper it's discovered that you're only assmad because they don't grow at the same rate as 1800s industrial England with vaccines and medicine. And your only solution for "fixing" it is to make it a dumbed down and simplified system (lmao).
In fact, I'm actualy wiling to bet that you've never even touched vic in your life, except for a 1-off trial run where you got filtered so hard it permanently fried your brain. And now you can only play goy$, which explains your obsession with wanting to dumb everything down and your paralyzing fear of calling anything other than vic's system a pop mechanic. Because secretly, you actually like imperator but you're too afraid to play it knowing that it has what's called a pop system, which promptly triggers your lizard brain to screech uncontrollably and piss your pants. So I guess in your worldview there's no such thing as a "true" population mechanic outside of vicky, which if that's the hill you want to die on, then you can be my guest.
>imp pops are just development!
I just love this argument, it is so farfetched it doesn't make sense.
In Imperator overpopulation of settlement will result in unhappy pops, which makes the entire region disloyal, meaning you lose all tax revenues. This means the only way to avoid is actually to build buildings that make them happy.
Remember how development in EU4 forces you to do anything? I don't.
>it is so farfetched it doesn't make sense.
Bird brain moment
>Nobody is saying that Imperator's pops are the same as victoria's
Except the original anon treated them as interchangeable, but hey, you tried
Except nobody did that. All I saw is someone asking a rather stupid question, presumably to bait some moron/ESL like yourself into making an even more embarrassing post which you ended up actually posting. If you weren’t so autistically obsessed about imp then you could have either avoided the question altogether or even responded with legitimate criticism, but all you did was respond with a half witted remark which only embarrassed you later on.
Also:
How the frick you plan to justify a migration that takes DECADES? Not months, not years, but decades. Of a single pop, at that.
It's a fricked-up system, that Johan forced as 1:1 conversion from EU:Rome, without anyone asking "ok, but what does it do mechanically". Then Imperator defense squad, the 5 people of it, decided to act like the I:R pop system is this intricate, complex system of dependencies and the best thing since sliced bread, where it is not only development in all but name, but in the release state of the game it literally was development and part of the (scrapped) mana system. But it being scrapped didn't change an inch by how it all works mechanically and what it does.
Calling them pops to begin with is moronic, acting like this is in any way comparable to Vicky is a clear sign someone never in their life played Vicky.
>Vicky 2 pops are an actual population counter.
But pops are still objects and not integers?
Maybe not wealth, but they do have the happiness that needs to be satisfied.
>imp's pops are likely representing thousands of people each.
really? I always imagine one pop represents a thousand people, cities have pop capacity of 22
>I always imagine one pop represents a thousand people
It's difficult to put an exact number on it since it never really says, but from earlier patches I remember that military colonies used to cost 3K manpower and would place a freeman pop there, and for migratory tribes you would convert 1 pop into 1 cohort and vice-versa, which seemingly represents about 500-1000 capable men but obviously doesn't include women, children, and elderly. So from this I'd guess that each pop is roughly equivalent to a few thousand productive people. And I say productive here because I imagine the pop count represents more of a "number of people you're able to tax and administrate effectively" rather than a defined specific pop count, which also helps explain why some events will just create pops, as these might have been people living in the wilderness that you found and started taxing. It's a little LARP-y but I think it explains things well enough.
>1 cohort and vice-versa, which seemingly represents about 500-1000 capable men but obviously doesn't include women, children, and elderly.
Honestly, I don't know why they bothered to change the cohort size from a thousand to five hundred.
I would have preferred a cohort size of 100 men, to represent the centuria.
>Maybe not wealth, but they do have the happiness that needs to be satisfied.
happiness and needs are completely different things.
victoria's pops spend wealth to buy clothes and food, their well-being depends on their income which depends on tech and occupation, while their needs and purchases drive your economy
imperator's pops only have a happiness meter which you change directly via techs/laws/integration and imports while they drive your economy with direct bonuses to tax
does that mean they need to buy food not to starve and if you tax the poor to hell there is famine?
main difference is that imp. pops don't have wealth and needs to satisfy
help anon out
Recently I have managed to acquire multiple provinces in my game. Everytime the same scenerio happens:
>some great or major power DOW me because they dont like me
>move my legions to their border & rise some levies
>they immediately chicken out without as much as losing a battle, usually me taking a few lands in the first 2-3 weeks of war
The AI wasnt that moronic at the beginning of the game
That was when AI had an actual ability to build armies. It no longer has it. But in the same time, it has still the old script for evaluating strength of both sides of the conflict. Meaning your few legions vs their none ends with the AI assuming it has no army and you have a huge edge against it, so better chicken out. But wait, there is more! Since the AE is still in place, conquering land makes the AI assume you're a baddie that should be attacked and stopped in his devious conquering ways... even if a different script tells the AI that it has zero army vs. your hordes.
Behold the true power of 2.0, the saviour of Imperator.
>It no longer has it.
how does that even work
Levies, baby. You either have specific tech level and inventions unlocked, or you can't have a standing army. AI doesn't count potential army it can get from levies, for by the game script, those are treated the same as unhired mercs. In the same time, it does evaluate legions, aka what it was treating up until 2.0 to be just regular army.
Once levies are rised, AI still can't calculate them properly, because they are still treated as temporarily hired mercs (lesser "weight" for decisions) rather than a regular army it had prior.
Result: AI not only still can't compose armies for shit, but it now can't even evaluate them properly.
>Implying I even looked at his screen
That's a good one
the guy in the screenshot literally has zero AE, you're just schizo ranting again
damn. Otherwise Im really enjoying the game. One of the few instances when I was eager to finish the timeline. I completely lost the will to continue the campaign. Are the danish or british tribes any fun?
>Are the danish or british tribes any fun?
The only difference between them is the starting location. That's literally it. European tribals are so completely and thoroughly interchangeable, it literally doesn't matter who you pick. And before you ask - the other tribals are no different, but they just got different military traditions tied to them. But everything in Europe outside Greece and Italy is just the exact same shit with different name and different starting location.
>The only difference between them is the starting location. That's literally it. European tribals are so completely and thoroughly interchangeable, it literally doesn't matter who you pick. And before you ask - the other tribals are no different, but they just got different military traditions tied to them. But everything in Europe outside Greece and Italy is just the exact same shit with different name and different starting location.
thats a maybe?
They're only fun up to a point and depends on what you do. Playing Anglia and migrating to Britain is fun, LARPing as an early Anglo-Saxon invasion and then assimilating all the celts there is good for a few chuckles. But once you actually unite Britain it gets boring very fast, and typically you're just finishing up assimilation and building up your cities while raiding for slaves (assuming you aren't just blobbing). Outside of the LARP, there's not much else to do really aside from blobbing or migration shenannigans (since it's not too difficult to unite barbrian lands, unlike the mediterranean which has big empires everyhere), which itself is still pretty LARP-y.
>unlike the mediterranean which has big empires everyhere
tell me about big empires, is there some nice country which will let me grow and then perhaps join this bigger political theatre? I dont wanna get gobbled up from the start
syracuse
Other than Syracuse, there are:
- Sparta: outside the big clusterfrick that is Diadochi struggle, giving you nice breathing room
- Epirus: you are a "big" boy, but your actual capacities are that of a small fry and you have to carefully maneuver your early shit, or you get overwhelmed by just about anyone
- any of the Greeks in Spain and southern France: you are a small fry, but there are only barbarians around, so you can carve a place for yourself.
Bonus feature: Black Sea Greek city-states. They are not in the Med, but you can expand in all directions and there is always the looming threat of Scythian attack.
Is there ANY fricking way for the AI to NOT drop mission tree when you tag-switch? This is so fricking annoying...
>Go through the Greek minors and city states to bolster them up with finishing their economic mission trees
>Leave them on timers from various missions that can't be instantly finished
>AI cancels the mission tree for no fricking reason, even if you put that specific AI into sleep
Why?! Am I asking too fricking much to get Syracuse finish their unique mission tree when under AI?
Put AI of specific tag to sleep before you tag-switch. Then make sure it is still sleeping after you're done with it.
Boring and managing pops is tedious.
Here is my best memory with Imperator
>be Rome
>Greek alliance declares war
>they gather 100K troops and slowly march the Balkans
>they send another army to invade Italy
>I keep jobbing
>war is randomly invalidated and I'm saved