It literally did. Forums and message boards dried up literally everywhere. Almost every major face in the community decided they weren't interested in playing 6e in the current form with how fricked the gameplay is and went back to their preferred edition.
5e used to at least be a conversation center because people were interested to see what the would update/add to it and new players were trying to jump in all the time and needed the same half dozen warnings about how janky the system is.
But nobody cares about 6e. Anywhere.
They rushed it out the door to try to cash in on the impending popularity of the hot new Cyberpunk game and to beat Cyberpunk Red to market and ended up neutering a game known for its gear and crunch and number autism to try to make it more accessible to a wider audience, making it appeal to no one in the process.
>ended up neutering a game known for its gear and crunch and number autism to try to make it more accessible to a wider audience, making it appeal to no one in the process.
Nah, worse, they ignored the hacks other people had put together for a more narrative approach to Shadowrun. It was like reverse market research drove 6E.
>They rushed it out the door to try to cash in on the impending popularity of the hot new Cyberpunk game and to beat Cyberpunk Red to market
This is the funny bit. The competition against RED and the attempt to exploit 2077 for their own gain. Then 2077 actually came out and effective double-tapped all interest in the entire cyberpunk genre.
It was facelift of 2020 with some lore ties to 2077 more than proper new edition. If you already have 2020 there isn't really much need to "upgrade" but the new netrunning rules are arguably better than stock 2020.
If you never played 2020 might as well go straight to RED.
I heavily dislike the overall low damage of all presented weaponry that, coupled with the amount of armor characters start with, meant even RPGs could be survivable.
2 years ago
Anonymous
You can just tweak the numbers or use 2020 weapon stats. Players spending all their eurobucks on insane amount of armour to the point where they could eat AT round to the face was always a problem with Cyberpunk because the alternative was dropping dead when someone farted nearby.
Their publisher sells internationally, DTRPG included. There are piratey collections all over the place. I'm pretty sure the share thread has at least one.
Publisher that cares enough to issue errata. That's it really. Pegasus should be the owner of the license since it's the only publisher that cares about Shadowrun. But we're stuck with CGL and their judaism and incompetence.
Tons of fixes, clarifications and rewrites in each and every book, outright removing some really moronic parts, polish, plus lots of additional content.
i dont think any were ever ubiquitous, except probably using cyber leg agility for movement which most didnt realize was a house rule at all
some to consider: >cheaper cyberdecks >allowing upgrading augs in grade/rating instead of having to replace them entirely >free knowledge skills in karmagen on same basis as priority
5kraut. "Upgrading augs" and some other stuff which that other anon mentioned is (optional) RAW there. Other than using 5kraut basically as written we don't use that many houserules. Small shit like "SIN scanning/verification processes have a limit equal to their rating" and so on, but nothing major.
Why was it forgotten?
Forgotten by whom? It's a great read, and there are tons of amazing 2e splats that I still regularly look at today. I wouldn't play it over 5e/3e nowadays, but that doesn't mean it's forgotten.
Why would you expect people to talk about it? If you ask me the system itself doesn't get recommended that much simply because 3e exists, but the splats are still cool. As is the art by the way.
2 years ago
Anonymous
That's mostly what I was wondering. Is there any reason at all to run 2 at all or is it pretty much entirely made obsolete by 3?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Personal opinion? The latter. 2e was better than 1e, 3e is better than both. 4e was a huge letdown, 5e, despite all its failings, got back on track. The world has changed though, and so did its style. Hence: 5kraut if you can handle kraut (since it's just 5e++), 5e if you can't, and 3e if you want an oldschool FASArun experience. Anarchy and 6e, well, there's a reason no one ever talks about those.
2 years ago
Anonymous
4e really isn't that bad.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Not as bad as 6e or Anarchy, but it was bad enough for us to skip it after getting familiar with it. We stuck to 3e until 5e won us over. Who knows, maybe 7e will achieve the same. And if it doesn't that's no biggie either, no one's forcing you to switch editions.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Bold of you to assume that we'll get a 7e at this point. 6e turned away veteran players and failed to bring in a new playerbase which is the worst case scenario for a new edition. D&D 5e might not be the most well liked among the hardcore playerbase, but the system itself has never been more popular since it managed to bring in a ton of new players which is something Shadowrun failed spectacularly at. Does 6e even have a sizable playerbase anymore?
2 years ago
Anonymous
>shadowrun 6e failed so bad fasa makes shadowrun for 5e d20
2 years ago
Anonymous
When did it ever have a decent playerbase?
Far as I've heard they can't not move on to 7e eventually. They have to keep doing Battletech and Shadowrun as part of how they were offered both licenses.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Fair enough. I just feel like the IP is on its last legs unless 7e is absolutely amazing. People will obviously still play older versions, but probably won't see much new stuff.
2 years ago
Anonymous
What's insane to me is that I feel like it wouldn't be insanely hard to make a shadowrun that is slightly simpler and more approachable. It doesn't seem like a herculean task or anything. But both Anarchy and 6e went about it in such a bafflingly bad way.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Yup, it's just poorly done all the way through and failed to attract old or new players. Not even VtM's 5e failed it this hard.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>slightly simpler
I don't know, anon. If "simple" is what you're looking for then Shadowrun might just not be for you. Some games just are on the more complex side. Simple Shadowrun is like D&D ditching d20.
2 years ago
Anonymous
But that's obviously what most people want, and what the gaming zeitgeist is moving towards. I'm not saying it has to be fate, or even d&d 5e, but something that was a little more elegant and approachable would be nice.
Hell, a move back to the basic game/advanced game approach that d&d had in the eighties and nineties would be great.
2 years ago
Anonymous
While I think some aspects are a bit too streamlined, I think D&D's 5e managed to do a good job at still appealing to its core base while also bringing in new players. And, like I said earlier, it worked since D&D is more popular than ever although there are definitely more factors than just a new ruleset that lead to it becoming more popular.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>But that's obviously what most people want
Most people want D&D 5e. It's selling like crazy. Niches are good, and not every game has to cater or appeal to the masses.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Most people want 5e.
I tried to like 5e. I really did. It's just such a bland inconsistent disappointment.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Not my cup of tea either. Don't get me wrong, I did play D&D for quite a few years, albeit mostly 3.5 back then, but single-dice class-based level-based systems just aren't where my heart is. It doesn't have to be though. As I said, niches are good. The more the better.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I like a bunch of the d&d setting stuff, but I can't honestly say any edition of it is good. Though I did play a lot of 3.x and PF. 5e - I like more than 3.x, but I still don't like it.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>But that's obviously what most people want, and what the gaming zeitgeist is moving towards.
Not everybody is a little-souled bugman, you know. Your reasoning leads to a samey-same mass culture without any spice or salt in it.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>every edition of shadowrun is bad
Why not make a version that is more elegant and approachable? >no, it wouldnt be shadowrun if it wasn't bad!
You people deserve 6th edition.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Basically, Shadowrun is a crunchy rules-heavy cyberpunk/fantasy RPG with fun background/lore. It's very appealing on the surface. It just so happens that the sourcebooks and community are actively hostile and do an excellent job of turning away new players. So, sit in your dying niche, seething about not getting new players as you actively tell them to frick off and get a German sourcebook that they have to compile themselves to try playing Shadowrun.
[...]
Example right here. If I want to play Shadowrun, I should just play GURPS instead and change the names. I might as well play D&D 5E and call it Shadowrun.
As someone who has only ever played 5th Edition Shadowrun, what is the best alternative play set for it? I share your sentiments, I love Shadowruns setting and lore (though I have made a heft amount of modifications) but the mechanics, especially the way magic and spells work turns me off and I long for something better. Though I do like the character customization. Any ideas for better systems?
2 years ago
Anonymous
There's this Genesys splat that turns any cyberpunk/modern setting into Shadowrun in all but name, mechanically.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Many thanks anon, you are well endowed
2 years ago
Anonymous
This.
Games are not all meant to be one and the same. Each has a different feel and different mechanics to achieve that feel. Saying that the market wants simplicity, because the oldest and largest game got some success because of marketing tricks to get the normies to pay attention is false logic and a bad conclusion as well as not applicable to all games and gamer levels.
Yes, 5E D&D dumbed itself down to get morons to try to play it more. Yes, they had some success selling it. No, that does not mean everyone who wants success needs to dumb it down. No, it does not mean that is where the market is heading.
Truth is, different strokes for different folks. Veterans of a complex system do not want simplicity. Newbies/Normies do not want a difficult to understand system with tons of lore lasting decades of real life.
Shadowrun forgot who their base was.
2 years ago
Anonymous
You get that there is a difference between "I want an orgainized, consistent, and elegant system that has learned from the past 20 years of game design" and "I want fare accelerated," right? Streamlined and simplified doesn't mean immediately going to the route of 5e.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I think Shadowrun (and cyberpunk games in general) suffer from a divided fanbase that wants two very different things. I suspect it probably follows along pink mohawk and mirrorshades play style lines too. Some people want to play a punk adventure and fight the power and want a light fast system to do so and some people want operators operating operationally with carefully crafted plans and nothing but cut-throat business.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I don't think it needs to be simpler - just better designed and edited.
CGL's problem is that they've made a consistent reputation for themselves, and the people who work with them regardless are ignorant, plain don't care, or are those hardcore fans who have been offered control over whatever parts of the setting creams their socks. ie; people you generally don't want running an edition.
Which was just as true in 5e, where the answer to multiple frickups was "We played the previous edition and had internalised the rules we didn't include", or "We didn't talk with each other before we started writing this and that", or even "Yeah, I just thought the base item had those numbers and didn't fricking look at it ever, so now you're stuck with a mod that doesn't fit / similar item that costs 20,000¥ more".
2 years ago
Anonymous
>I don't think it needs to be simpler - just better designed and edited.
And that's why krauts tend to not even understand what the international community is talking about unless they bothered to read the English books.
And if you ask me that's the big difference between 5e and 6e. 5e's flaws could be fixed, and the krauts pretty much did. 6e is fricked from the ground up, rotten to the core, unfixable.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>6e is fricked from the ground up, rotten to the core, unfixable.
This
2 years ago
Anonymous
I don't even think the concept of 6th would be that bad as way to streamline it IF they pretty much wrote the rules from ground up for the whole edge mechanic. But they didn't, they literally took 5th ed, gutted it and slapped edge mechanics on without giving shit about it working or not to the point where some rules simply don't work at all.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>And that's why krauts tend to not even understand what the international community is talking about unless they bothered to read the English books.
I talked to one of the German game designers at the Spiel Essen and he nodded as if he knew exactly what I was talking about (while staying within the NDA he's probably under).
I also asked the guys at the CGL booth at the same event how much the CRB costs. First they gave me a dollar price (at a German event), then they told me it's €45. When I told them that Pegasus sells the same content for €20, the CGL homosexuals accused Pegasus of either selling the starter rules or fake product.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Pegasus also had a 5kraut A5 softcover CRB for €10 that they sold for quite a while. They're a good bunch, really are. Really sad that they're stuck with 6e now.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Really sad that they're stuck with 6e now.
Wait, has Pegasus made a German Translation for 6e yet?
Did they try to errata that clusterfrick or have they not even bothered?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Years ago. They tackled the things they could tackle but they can't rewrite the entire system.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Ah, I see. Too many rough Edges even for them to smooth over.
2 years ago
Anonymous
CGL won't lose the license over "just" some bad PR and Battletech will keep them afloat basically forever. So yeah, a 7th edition by CGL is pretty much a given at some point. And even if CGL should lose the license/go under, Shadowrun is an IP with almost 35 years of history by now. It won't just disappear.
Nta, but if I ran SR again I would be willing to run SR20th anniv (4e revised). I suppose I would consider 5e - I haven't checked out the revised 5e stuff. I would also consider the unisystem and gurps conversion documents I've come across over the years. If someone were running it, I'd be willing to play any of those 4 options.
4A, with a few houserules - but supposedly 5e with houserules is good... but I don't like the setting changes, which came from the scabs (like Bull) being rewarded for sticking with Catalyst during the embezzlement and general frickery.
GURPS would also do it well. Better, probably - but if I were using GURPS I'd use their Technomancer setting (where tech works with magic) instead.
Something like this, or one of the other ones floating around. Just run it with gurps action! With a write-up of the Shadowrun specific parts. Probably using powers for magic rather than the basic set magic.
https://pdfcoffee.com/gurps-4e-unofficial-shadowrun-v13pdf-pdf-free.html
>It wasn't trolling
That sure as shit was what made me lose interest in it and drove lots of people away that actually played the game. Then the downward spiral set in. Can't expect too much of a general that only consists of fetish posters, trolls, bumpgays, and people who neither do nor know how to play the game.
Plenty of systems and settings survive new garbage editions, and the wholesale rejection of 6e should actually be in the favor of that, as there are no edition wars or anything to that effect.
If you make a thread, it will die, but it won't be because of trolls or 6e. It will die due to a lack of activity, and that lack of activity is because the core moved on from the thread, and we moved on because of one truly insufferable unironic autist that was present almost 24/7 and would be actively hostile to anyone taking an interest in the system or asking any questions, or generally any discussion at all. No shit it died.
>It will die due to a lack of activity, and that lack of activity is because the core moved on
Yes. A lot of people were primed to move on when a lacklustre 5e went downhill, CGL promised better (gave it a half-assed effort late 5e), and then released 6e.
>one truly insufferable unironic autist that was present almost 24/7 and would be actively hostile to anyone taking an interest in the system or asking any questions
Link to screencaps or archive of their posts? I wanna see this.
To me the issues mostly break down into two categories: >If you have played D&D for much time you might have been around for the uproar that 4th edition caused. Similar issue here: Substantial changes were made to how the game feels, and of course existing players were often existing players because they liked the old feel of the game. As someone new to the franchise you won't have that point of comparison. >The editing is terrible. It can be super frustrating when a character just goes to punch someone for the first time, and you go to quickly look up how much damage it does and can't find it anywhere (base damage value looks like it should be strength/2). Note that 5th also had a lot of editing issues, but by this point some errata had been issued, and people were used to it.
Depending on what you like, you may or may not be bothered by the issues of point one. That is, for example: >In 6th edition user strength doesn't change melee weapon damage. While in 5th, weapon damage scales directly with strength. >In 6th, armor only changes the opportunity for one side or the other to get edge in combat (and that edge may, in turn, be used things which increase or decrease damage), while in 5th armor was included in your roll to 'soak' in-coming damage, which added a lot more dice to roll, and made lighter weapons largely useless against heavily armored foes, while the weapons that could damage heavily armored foes would one-shot unarmored opponents. The method in 6th may be quicker, but depending on how you like to play you may prefer one method over the other.
So here's a major complaint: core resolution mechanic is fricked. The previous editions of Shadowrun already had issues with most actions taking too many rolls and modifiers, i.e. most required at least 2 (PC and opposition's defence), attacks requiring 3. So to simplify all this 6E decided to roll every modifier into the Edge system, which has you compare every advantage and disadvantage both sides get and awarding special currency to the winner, who then can spend it in various ways. The obvious problem with this is that this system is bolted on top of the three rolls required to resolve any attack and the nature of gainingspending Edge slows down the combat even more. It also does nothing to simplify the modifiers as you still have to count those and compare them.
Also: >editing >minor complaint
Until you have experienced how awful CGL Shadowrun layouts have become, you don't get to speak how minor that issue is.
6e started in such a state that they couldn't fix the core system this many years later. That whatever internet-famous group was going to stream their sessions instead put out a video explaining why they won't. That the main discussion surrounding 6e remains, "... is it really so bad?"
6e is so great, it made people excited for 7e on release.
It's bad. The editing complaints are valid - the book is basically unusable as rules reference, finding shit is hard and important shit is given less space and highlight than irrelevant fluff. Core mechanics shifted too much from what players were used to - that's not saying older editions weren't hot mess but if goal was to 'streamline' it failed miserably because edge doesn't make shit less obtuse, just different flavor of obtuse.
It alienated old players and at the same time failed to bring new ones. Add the usual israeli CGL pricing and you got recipe for killing the game.
So I heard one of the reasons 6e was so shitty was because some bigwig embezzled a bajillion dollars, and CGL rushed this out both to get some cash and to beat Cyberpunk Red. Anyone got any details?
>So I heard one of the reasons 6e was so shitty was because some bigwig embezzled a bajillion dollars
That was more 5e's problem, but 5e was still salvageable as a game.
>CGL rushed this out both to get some cash and to beat Cyberpunk Red
There's the real reason. They were worried that Red would be a bigger deal than it turned out to be. Both were planned for 2020.
Honestly, they should have kept at it, because Red is still working at becoming a good game. 6e is the 2077 of tabletop cyberpunk. A cruel irony when you think about it.
People keep saying this, but none of them appear to have played at release. It worked fine for me. I didn't actually encounter a crash bug until after I beat the game for the first time. Prior to that, all of the bugs were the kind of shit that's typical of AAA games these days.
Of course, I wasn't trying to play on an ancient console.
>People keep saying this, but none of them appear to have played at release.
Hard disagree.
The cops were my biggest issue. You literally could not hide from them because they would spawn within ten feet of you while you were being hunted. It was quite ridiculous.
There was also a huge item crafting bug that could completely corrupt your save if you crafted too many items. That's the one that ultimately made me demand a refund.
I played on PC, so ancient console isn't an excuse for this utter shite.
2 years ago
Anonymous
2 years ago
Anonymous
Lol
2 years ago
Anonymous
2 years ago
Anonymous
What's happening here? Committing crimes in a spawn point?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Basically, the game would spawn cops on top of the player anytime a crime was committed, but they'll spawn in a place that's outside of the player's field of vision so everytime the player there turns around the game triggers another spawn. It's been fixed now, but the police system still isn't even as good as something like GTA's.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>The cops were my biggest issue. You literally could not hide from them because they would spawn within ten feet of you while you were being hunted. It was quite ridiculous.
Didn't run into this one until after beating the game the first time either. Of course...I didn't run around randomly mercing people either.
>It worked fine for me.
Ditto. Yknow, except for not being the game they said they were making before they signed on Keanu. But there's straight up recording of the bullshit other people experienced.
I'm not sure how to feel on this as I basically ignore the hype train around games. They said it was a branching story-driven game and it was, although the branching was weird because early mission results could wipe out a potential ending for you w/o any understanding of how or why.
lol
the game actually was unplayable at release
like the charger would be glitching the frick out and the peds would all be respawk g in t poses every time you moved the camera, same with cars
you’d have cops constantly teleporting all around you the second you got a star
the scripted car chases would bug out and not let you shoot and the cars and drones and shit would be randomly exploding on their own as npcs praised your shooting
Like I said, never ran into any of these bugs until after beating it for the first time. A lot of this feels like it falls under "frick around, find out." Not exactly the first time CDPR has made the game shitty for people not playing to their liking.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>LALALALALALA.ALALA.A
ok, moron
2 years ago
Anonymous
Legit cannot imagine being this mad about a game.
>Didn't run into this one until after beating the game the first time either.
Congratulations on your Blue Lives Matter run. We'll inform your local constabulary and they can give you a nice framed certificate for respecting police in your open world game.
It's pretty sad because I had a blast driving at high speed through the streets, and that's how you run into a large number of the glitches. Simply moving fast enough to cause rapid loads caused some of the worst anomalies and physics glitches in the game. But obviously you didn't go beyond the speed limit to avoid traffic fines and thus didn't have the problems that others might have.
I mean, I had plenty of fun driving a high speed through the streets too. I just...didn't hit anything. I didn't start messing with pulling stars and stuff until after that first finish.
>I'm not sure how to feel on this as I basically ignore the hype train around games.
I wasn't talking about the hype (which was, as per usual for AAA, excessive and bullshit), but the builds of the game that existed and were shown and talked about before they decided on throwing buckets of cash at a big name celebrity. It wasn't impossible to separate the two. Even after that point, they were trying to make a game that needed something like a thousand people under well-managed teams, and they had half that with no prior experience with this scale of game dev. Internally, the guys at the top were talking shit while the people who actually had to do the work were taking bets on what they would cut, what the next release date would be, and how this would all fail.
Oh, I mean I ignore it all. I find a lot of people lead themselves around the wrong side of what's being said because it's what they want. But I feel for people who feel like they were promised something they didn't get.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Oh, I mean I ignore it all.
Sure. It just was clear the game was pivoted into what it is and will remain, rather than being the original design.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Oh, I mean I ignore it all. I find a lot of people lead themselves around the wrong side of what's being said because it's what they want. But I feel for people who feel like they were promised something they didn't get.
Oh please, they spent a generation selling a RPG that didn't exist and all they had was a barely functioning borderlands clone.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>they spent a generation selling a RPG that didn't exist
It was in development. They were never going to do everything they wanted in the timeframe they wanted, with the people they were paying, on the budget available - but they could have stuck to creating the full RPG they originally had in mind.
There was something reasonable in there, provided they could have pulled it off - the singleplayer game was the initial investment in the GTA-esque multiplayer game. They just weren't ready to handle doing it.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>I'm not sure how to feel on this as I basically ignore the hype train around games.
I wasn't talking about the hype (which was, as per usual for AAA, excessive and bullshit), but the builds of the game that existed and were shown and talked about before they decided on throwing buckets of cash at a big name celebrity. It wasn't impossible to separate the two. Even after that point, they were trying to make a game that needed something like a thousand people under well-managed teams, and they had half that with no prior experience with this scale of game dev. Internally, the guys at the top were talking shit while the people who actually had to do the work were taking bets on what they would cut, what the next release date would be, and how this would all fail.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Didn't run into this one until after beating the game the first time either.
Congratulations on your Blue Lives Matter run. We'll inform your local constabulary and they can give you a nice framed certificate for respecting police in your open world game.
It's pretty sad because I had a blast driving at high speed through the streets, and that's how you run into a large number of the glitches. Simply moving fast enough to cause rapid loads caused some of the worst anomalies and physics glitches in the game. But obviously you didn't go beyond the speed limit to avoid traffic fines and thus didn't have the problems that others might have.
>It worked fine for me.
Ditto. Yknow, except for not being the game they said they were making before they signed on Keanu. But there's straight up recording of the bullshit other people experienced.
lol
the game actually was unplayable at release
like the charger would be glitching the frick out and the peds would all be respawk g in t poses every time you moved the camera, same with cars
you’d have cops constantly teleporting all around you the second you got a star
the scripted car chases would bug out and not let you shoot and the cars and drones and shit would be randomly exploding on their own as npcs praised your shooting
>The cops were my biggest issue. You literally could not hide from them because they would spawn within ten feet of you while you were being hunted. It was quite ridiculous.
Didn't run into this one until after beating the game the first time either. Of course...I didn't run around randomly mercing people either.
[...]
I'm not sure how to feel on this as I basically ignore the hype train around games. They said it was a branching story-driven game and it was, although the branching was weird because early mission results could wipe out a potential ending for you w/o any understanding of how or why.
[...]
Like I said, never ran into any of these bugs until after beating it for the first time. A lot of this feels like it falls under "frick around, find out." Not exactly the first time CDPR has made the game shitty for people not playing to their liking.
Anon, I cannot take you seriously when CGL managed to have the dishonor of successfully getting their shit pushed in by angry investors. Normally publishers ignore angry investors in this industry. You are the epitome of "works on my machine" that people make fun of. i got respect for you not reading the news though.
It's been 2 years where is even half of the shit they promised on release? Face the music they are off to make Witcher 4 to by their legal bills after the Polish government gets done fricking them in the ass.
It was only truly shit on release on last-gen consoles. It was fine on PC and current-gen; bit buggy but nothing frequent quick saves (and the game is pretty generous with auto saves too) couldn’t solve. I played it back then and enjoyed it and now that I have a beefier GPU with the prices being sane I’m playing it again with max graphics. Gameplay’s the same but it’s a lot prettier of course.
It was of course overhyped but what AAA release that isn’t an annual sequel game isn’t?
It was AAA teflon blockbuster that coasted mainly on a fun story that pretended to have player input, but boiled down to "Here's your three buttons for different starts and endings" with the middle chopped into smaller chunks to hide how it's always the same middle. Not every AAA release is "all hype, no filler".
Do you think they'd be stupid enough to try and save themselves with a 7E that is just more of the same? In fact, if they released it I would call it. They'll double down on everything from 6E thinking it was great and no one got it and are just nay sayers.
As long as the same line developer stays, there's no reason to expect anything good. Jason Hardy has proven that he is not a learning animal and he indeed has the capacity to double down on his mistakes.
In my limited direct interactions with the game developers they are unwilling to admit any mistakes or concede room for development. The only hope is Topps revokes the license, but Topps is a shadow of it's former self so I don't see it happening.
Errata is included.
Attributes are no longer cheaper to increase than skill groups (same price in 20th iirc).
Those are the main things I remember being different. I don't remember any reasons to prefer 4th over 20th. But its been a while.
>CP77
It’s never getting “fixed”, deal with it, the game is a disaster at every level. Forget all the bugs and amateur hour looter shooter gameplay loop, just look at the driving in the open world urban cityscape first person game. A good 1/4-1/3 of the cars you can’t even see over the road over the dashboard. Hitting a truck head on on a motorcycle wedges the bike under the truck and flips it over with the rider remaining on the bike, sometimes not even slowing down. All chases had to be scripted with zero player agency, with set places where the pursuers would get run off the road or explode. The racing quests aren’t even racing, the cars constantly teleport behind you when you’re in the lead and they literally wait on the road for you to catch up if you fall behind, not to mention the totally epic 100% cosmetic shootouts because street racing in riced out nuclear powered cars wasn’t cyberpunky enough or how a fricking truck is faster than super cars with literally 5-10 times the horsepower, I guess the troony flag makes it go fasta.
Shadow Run is really just that bad. Last semi decent, professional fluff written for the setting was back in 3rd Edition. Still wasn't that great, but it at least had some money.
There was a period from late 5e onwards where the shadowrun threads were still going up, but the conversation had already ended and all that kept them from dropping off page 11 was trolling and bullshit arguments. As opposed to before that, where it was just part of the scenery.
So talk about your games then. And answer rules questions about sr3 or 4 or 5 or whatever edition you play. What's stopping you?
2 years ago
Anonymous
You have no idea how incredibly mad the hyperautist got if you asked questions about... anything, really. Just anything.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Oh. GURPSGen has one or two of those.
New official content has been kind of meh lately, but if you talk about any unofficial stuff people are coming up with on the forums or a couple blogs (where new content is actually coming out, even if not from the company) - it's *reeeeeeee ecelebs this*; *reeeeeeeee ecelebs that* - you're not allowed to talk about that stuff here. And definitely don't talk about it to the easteuro Anon who writes one of them and hangs out here, because that breaks the anon-bro-code or something.
I do it anyways. Especially if nobody is talking about anything else in the thread and it's dead for a few hours.
Ignore the censorious threadkilling hyperautist(s).
I realized that it couldn't scratch my itch when I had a shaman in my party but she couldn't use any of her class abilities outside of combat to help us solve a murder
Oh my god finally a shadowrun thread. So I'm thinking about running this game for my group soon. Which edition do you dorks recommend? I hear 4e is the best one but is there any reason why maybe 5e isn't as good?
4e is probably the easiest for new players to pick up it simplifies a lot of stuff that was basically a separate system in previous editions particularly the matrix rules. Whether that a good thing is obviously subjective but it's what I'd recommend.
If you're prepared to put a bit more work in 3e is the most Shadowrun Shadowrun gets. It can get pretty crunchy but it has the advantage of being mostly compatible with material from the previous editions and the 20th anniversary edition is probably the most complete core book out of all of them.
I assume you can only play "5kraut" if you're fluent in German? Or has it been bacm-translated?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Since there's not one document that collects all the little and big changes and additions in all of the books I doubt we'll ever see a complete back-translation. But in my experience flipping back and forth and using translation software does the job quite well.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Shame. A list of changes would be handy.
But translation software is doable. I did that with a German TDE book that didn't have an English release yet, a few years back.
Help a 2nd edition player out. What's 5kraut? Google ain't helping shit
2 years ago
Anonymous
NTA, but 5kraut, at least around here on 4ch, is the colloquial name given to the German version of 5e.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Where can I get it? I have dirty German friends who I will force to translate?.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Their publisher sells internationally, DTRPG included. There are piratey collections all over the place. I'm pretty sure the share thread has at least one.
Since there's not one document that collects all the little and big changes and additions in all of the books I doubt we'll ever see a complete back-translation. But in my experience flipping back and forth and using translation software does the job quite well.
This is probably a big fat no, but has anyone looked at the 6e companion book that recently came out? Apperently it exists to fix some or all of the problems people had with the game, but the only reviews I've seen are from people who either hate cgl-run with a burning passion, or people with hardcore Stockholm syndrome. I'm wondering if the errata have gotten the game to an even vaguely playable state.
So now that Shadowrun has shat the bed and Cyberpunk Red and 2020 is tainted by 2077, who is going to become the standard in tabletop cyberpunk settings?
Android: Shadow of the Beanstalk is an official splatbook for Genesys (the generic version of FFG Star Wars) that adopts the Android setting (of Netrunner fame) into a playable setting.
Apart from slightly expanding the rules/lists for cybernetics and hacking, A:SotB also introduces the favor economy, a narrative-based system that is basically a streamlined combination of Obligation and Duty from FFG Star Wars, where you track favors of different sizes both coming and going, what they may be worth and so on. It represents the tangle of the city and how hard it is to escape the web.
Apart from slightly expanding the rules/lists for cybernetics and hacking, A:SotB also introduces the favor economy, a narrative-based system that is basically a streamlined combination of Obligation and Duty from FFG Star Wars, where you track favors of different sizes both coming and going, what they may be worth and so on. It represents the tangle of the city and how hard it is to escape the web.
This is on top of the unique skills, talents, and armory pieces it introduces. On top of being an Android setting book, it provides the pieces to more easily run your own cyberpunk/science fiction game.
>FFG >Publishing new good Genesys content >supporting existing Genesys settings
Good joke. All of the books are proof-of-concept outlines, nothing more.
It'll continue to be Shadowrun 5 from playerbase inertia, with a melange of D&D 5e hacks clustering the front page of DTRPG and everything else relegated to being a minor niche game.
Shadow of the Beanstalk
The only bit of Genesys of significant size is the Star Wars license.
It has gone full SJW in the lore department, with the Policlub and all. They are inserting current ethical discussions into a setting which is an extremely different world from ours.
Shadowrun is bad regardless of edition. It's always a monumental clusterfrick mechanically and the setting went from cartoonishly moronic to just moronic over the years.
Don't get me wrong, the core concept - cyberpunk with magick and shiet - is workable. It's just that it doesn't work in Shadowrun itself and never did.
Basically, Shadowrun is a crunchy rules-heavy cyberpunk/fantasy RPG with fun background/lore. It's very appealing on the surface. It just so happens that the sourcebooks and community are actively hostile and do an excellent job of turning away new players. So, sit in your dying niche, seething about not getting new players as you actively tell them to frick off and get a German sourcebook that they have to compile themselves to try playing Shadowrun.
[...] >beyond
Yeah. Beyond (or something like archives of nethys) - some kind of app or web database - are the way to go. I would even say putting out paper books or PDFs for game rules is not worth doing as a company in 2022 but the companies are just out of touch with reality.
>Problems with Shadowrun.
Yes. Those are problems. Agreed. Shadowrun has been very sloppily handled for a long time. I'm the guy who said "run it with GURPS Action! or unisystem; convert stuff as needed".
>Stay in your niche screeching about how nobody wants to join.
I've played d&d5e a bunch at this point because it's popular. Mostly found it a bland un-fun experience. If all tabletop rpging becomes 5e and I can't get a game for anything else, and I can't get the stars to align for a 5e game I would actually want to play and can't get players interested in a heavily houseruled 5e game with more 3pp than included wotc content that I would be willing to run - then I'll just play wargames or videogames or boardgames. I'm not going to force myself to play or run a game that I'm not going to enjoy. It's not like I'm getting paid.
Example right here. If I want to play Shadowrun, I should just play GURPS instead and change the names. I might as well play D&D 5E and call it Shadowrun.
>seething about not getting new players
Never had a problem with that. Never been seething about anything remotely close to that. No, the playerbase is not as large as D&D's, but who cares? Are you b***hing at fans of, I don't know, certain music genres, because the genre they happen to like is not actively trying to turn into whatever is topping the charts that year?
>tell them to frick off and get a German sourcebook
Where? 5kraut is objectively better, but if you can't use it, just use 5e.
>errata of the core rules
It's much much more than that.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Did Pegasus make 6e playable?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Better? I guess so, but it's still 6e, and as such inherently fricked. See
>I don't think it needs to be simpler - just better designed and edited.
And that's why krauts tend to not even understand what the international community is talking about unless they bothered to read the English books.
And if you ask me that's the big difference between 5e and 6e. 5e's flaws could be fixed, and the krauts pretty much did. 6e is fricked from the ground up, rotten to the core, unfixable.
Does anybody have 5Kraut?
Why don't you try looking at the thread you're posting in, maybe someone had the same question? Maybe even more than once?
>gurps Shadowrun? How dare you! I might as well play d&d5e and call it shadowrun!
Gurps is a universal system. Unlike d&d 5e, you could actually do gurps Shadowrun. It's also reasonably similar in many ways (not superficially, but under the hood in broad strokes of how stuff works) to Shadowrun 4e, but a bit less fiddly at the table and more consistent.
If you want to run an "official Shadowrun"? Sr20th anniversary was alright if a bit clunky. Sr5 was fine but I liked it less than sr20th and it was very poorly edited and has a bunch of issues, which is why people here want the German version that's 5e but better. People have also said sr3 is good, but I haven't played it.
You also shouldn't assume everyone who posts in a thread about SR is a die-hard SR fan. I haven't played an SR game since 2016 or so, this is the first SR thread I've joined in a few years. I mean. I would play it, if a friend wanted to run 20th again, or ran it with gurps. I'd consider running it myself in gurps if players wanted the Shadowrun setting. And I might play, if they wanted to run sr5. I wouldn't mind trying playing SR3 since I keep hearing good things. But I'm not a guy running a ton of SR. (I like it more than d&d5e though). My current game I'm playing in is an ICRPG game being used to run a 3rd party 5e setting. I haven't run a game since December 2019. It was 5e. I have run a variety of games over the years, but SR is one I've always been on the player side of the screen. I never got hyped enough about the system to want to run it.
>Seething about not getting new players
What makes you think I'm looking for Shadowrun players? What makes you think other people here are looking for players? Complaining that the threads die because people got sick of dealing with one butthole who b***hes all the time so nobody wants to listen to him screech, is very different than complaining that they want to run SR and can't because they can't find players. Where are you getting this "we can't find players for SR woe is me" idea from?
>beyond
Yeah. Beyond (or something like archives of nethys) - some kind of app or web database - are the way to go. I would even say putting out paper books or PDFs for game rules is not worth doing as a company in 2022 but the companies are just out of touch with reality.
>Problems with Shadowrun.
Yes. Those are problems. Agreed. Shadowrun has been very sloppily handled for a long time. I'm the guy who said "run it with GURPS Action! or unisystem; convert stuff as needed".
>Stay in your niche screeching about how nobody wants to join.
I've played d&d5e a bunch at this point because it's popular. Mostly found it a bland un-fun experience. If all tabletop rpging becomes 5e and I can't get a game for anything else, and I can't get the stars to align for a 5e game I would actually want to play and can't get players interested in a heavily houseruled 5e game with more 3pp than included wotc content that I would be willing to run - then I'll just play wargames or videogames or boardgames. I'm not going to force myself to play or run a game that I'm not going to enjoy. It's not like I'm getting paid.
Are there fellow krauts present that have the german 6e files and are willing to share them? I'm mostly after the Datapulses, but the SOTAs and general fluff books interest me as well.
the core rules for 5G and some of the Datapuls should be in the pastebin here
https://pastebin.com/SsWTY7qr
it should be in the mediafire link, the first pastebin listed doesn't work
Thanks, but I already have all the 5D stuff. I'm looking for the 6D content, but nobody seems to have that despite the fact that the german fluff is supposed to be really good.
The only things I use FB for are messaging friends and family who don't use discord; and a couple TTRPG communities.
And I keep it off my phone so I don't end up scrolling the Facebook wall.
Does anyone have the PDFs of the Shadowrun reskin for the Forged in the Dark system?
"Runners in the Shadows"
https://markcleveland.itch.io/runners-in-the-shadows
the core rules for 5G and some of the Datapuls should be in the pastebin here
https://pastebin.com/SsWTY7qr
it should be in the mediafire link, the first pastebin listed doesn't work
How bad is 6e? No one, anywhere, has a functioning pdf character sheet.
And nobody noticed until last month.
Even CGL doesn't have one, theirs is broken on their website - in at least two places where there should be a table, its just an unstructured text field. You can't even print it and try to fill it in old school, you would have to draw the tables in yourself and write illegibly small. Is *anyone* playing this shit, if nobody is even trying to grab a character sheet to make a few pcs? How long has this game been out with no one even trying? Or did players try to make a character, realize that even the character sheet was unusable garbage, and give up without even giving feedback?
How many dumpsters need to be throwing greasy flames into the sky before you try to put out the fire?
Let's be honest here, no one uses one page character sheets instead of spreadsheets for Shadowrun, no matter the edition. And there is a kraut 6e chummer-like that also supports English, IIRC. That said, your point's obviously valid.
To put things into perspective, I wanted to start a SR campaign, so i bought a hundred dollars worth of starter kit bullshit, the core book, a lore book, plus dice and edge tokens. I opened up the book, and after reading through the basic rules, due to how fricking awful the editing is, failed to understand how anything works other than rolling a dice pool. So I closed the book, downloaded the 4e corebook and have been running that ever since. Basically, It's so bad I literally took a hundred dollar loss right on the head rather than decipher the moon logic editing.
How do you call someone who gets through security systems not by remotely accessing and hacking them, but by physical access and messing around with circuitry and wires?
Yes
Roses are red
I smell my farts
You could say of them all
6e is the worst part
N!Jivebot
So bad it killed all interest in Shadowrun.
It literally did. Forums and message boards dried up literally everywhere. Almost every major face in the community decided they weren't interested in playing 6e in the current form with how fricked the gameplay is and went back to their preferred edition.
5e used to at least be a conversation center because people were interested to see what the would update/add to it and new players were trying to jump in all the time and needed the same half dozen warnings about how janky the system is.
But nobody cares about 6e. Anywhere.
They rushed it out the door to try to cash in on the impending popularity of the hot new Cyberpunk game and to beat Cyberpunk Red to market and ended up neutering a game known for its gear and crunch and number autism to try to make it more accessible to a wider audience, making it appeal to no one in the process.
>ended up neutering a game known for its gear and crunch and number autism to try to make it more accessible to a wider audience, making it appeal to no one in the process.
Nah, worse, they ignored the hacks other people had put together for a more narrative approach to Shadowrun. It was like reverse market research drove 6E.
>They rushed it out the door to try to cash in on the impending popularity of the hot new Cyberpunk game and to beat Cyberpunk Red to market
This is the funny bit. The competition against RED and the attempt to exploit 2077 for their own gain. Then 2077 actually came out and effective double-tapped all interest in the entire cyberpunk genre.
>Then 2077 actually came out and effective double-tapped all interest in the entire cyberpunk genre.
Jesus.
Was Cyberpunk RED actually any good, though?
It was facelift of 2020 with some lore ties to 2077 more than proper new edition. If you already have 2020 there isn't really much need to "upgrade" but the new netrunning rules are arguably better than stock 2020.
If you never played 2020 might as well go straight to RED.
I heavily dislike the overall low damage of all presented weaponry that, coupled with the amount of armor characters start with, meant even RPGs could be survivable.
You can just tweak the numbers or use 2020 weapon stats. Players spending all their eurobucks on insane amount of armour to the point where they could eat AT round to the face was always a problem with Cyberpunk because the alternative was dropping dead when someone farted nearby.
Interlock, so no.
Oh frick off. Yes, it is.
Speak for yourself. Our game couldn't be more alive.
What's the mantra? Something along the lines of "5kraut if you can, 5e if you can't, 3e if you're explicitly looking for something oldschool".
That was the trolling, not 6e.
Where do you even get 5kraut? New to Shadowrun.
Their publisher sells internationally, DTRPG included.
There are piratey collections all over the place. I'm pretty sure the share thread has at least one.
What makes 5kraut superior to 5e?
Publisher that cares enough to issue errata. That's it really. Pegasus should be the owner of the license since it's the only publisher that cares about Shadowrun. But we're stuck with CGL and their judaism and incompetence.
Tons of fixes, clarifications and rewrites in each and every book, outright removing some really moronic parts, polish, plus lots of additional content.
>s-shadowrun is alive and fine! you just have to use a fan sourcebook and translate it if you don't speak the language
Does that 5kraut have rules for buying and using copium? Because you seem to have it nailed.
>fan sourcebook
You're moronic.
Even the diehard fans want nothing to do with it. They busted their asses to make 5e more functional and gave up on 6e
So in your opinion whats the best version of shadowrun?
I would go with 5e with all of the fan homebrew and rebalancing and people you know
What are the commonly applied brews and rulesets applied to 5e? What are the things they most commonly aim to "fix"?
I noticed a lot of you mentioning rebalances for 5e like they're ubiquitous and I'd like to familiarize myself with these.
i dont think any were ever ubiquitous, except probably using cyber leg agility for movement which most didnt realize was a house rule at all
some to consider:
>cheaper cyberdecks
>allowing upgrading augs in grade/rating instead of having to replace them entirely
>free knowledge skills in karmagen on same basis as priority
5kraut. "Upgrading augs" and some other stuff which that other anon mentioned is (optional) RAW there. Other than using 5kraut basically as written we don't use that many houserules. Small shit like "SIN scanning/verification processes have a limit equal to their rating" and so on, but nothing major.
Forgotten by whom? It's a great read, and there are tons of amazing 2e splats that I still regularly look at today. I wouldn't play it over 5e/3e nowadays, but that doesn't mean it's forgotten.
I've never seen anyone talk about 2e.
Why would you expect people to talk about it? If you ask me the system itself doesn't get recommended that much simply because 3e exists, but the splats are still cool. As is the art by the way.
That's mostly what I was wondering. Is there any reason at all to run 2 at all or is it pretty much entirely made obsolete by 3?
Personal opinion? The latter. 2e was better than 1e, 3e is better than both. 4e was a huge letdown, 5e, despite all its failings, got back on track. The world has changed though, and so did its style. Hence: 5kraut if you can handle kraut (since it's just 5e++), 5e if you can't, and 3e if you want an oldschool FASArun experience. Anarchy and 6e, well, there's a reason no one ever talks about those.
4e really isn't that bad.
Not as bad as 6e or Anarchy, but it was bad enough for us to skip it after getting familiar with it. We stuck to 3e until 5e won us over. Who knows, maybe 7e will achieve the same. And if it doesn't that's no biggie either, no one's forcing you to switch editions.
Bold of you to assume that we'll get a 7e at this point. 6e turned away veteran players and failed to bring in a new playerbase which is the worst case scenario for a new edition. D&D 5e might not be the most well liked among the hardcore playerbase, but the system itself has never been more popular since it managed to bring in a ton of new players which is something Shadowrun failed spectacularly at. Does 6e even have a sizable playerbase anymore?
>shadowrun 6e failed so bad fasa makes shadowrun for 5e d20
When did it ever have a decent playerbase?
Far as I've heard they can't not move on to 7e eventually. They have to keep doing Battletech and Shadowrun as part of how they were offered both licenses.
Fair enough. I just feel like the IP is on its last legs unless 7e is absolutely amazing. People will obviously still play older versions, but probably won't see much new stuff.
What's insane to me is that I feel like it wouldn't be insanely hard to make a shadowrun that is slightly simpler and more approachable. It doesn't seem like a herculean task or anything. But both Anarchy and 6e went about it in such a bafflingly bad way.
Yup, it's just poorly done all the way through and failed to attract old or new players. Not even VtM's 5e failed it this hard.
>slightly simpler
I don't know, anon. If "simple" is what you're looking for then Shadowrun might just not be for you. Some games just are on the more complex side. Simple Shadowrun is like D&D ditching d20.
But that's obviously what most people want, and what the gaming zeitgeist is moving towards. I'm not saying it has to be fate, or even d&d 5e, but something that was a little more elegant and approachable would be nice.
Hell, a move back to the basic game/advanced game approach that d&d had in the eighties and nineties would be great.
While I think some aspects are a bit too streamlined, I think D&D's 5e managed to do a good job at still appealing to its core base while also bringing in new players. And, like I said earlier, it worked since D&D is more popular than ever although there are definitely more factors than just a new ruleset that lead to it becoming more popular.
>But that's obviously what most people want
Most people want D&D 5e. It's selling like crazy. Niches are good, and not every game has to cater or appeal to the masses.
>Most people want 5e.
I tried to like 5e. I really did. It's just such a bland inconsistent disappointment.
Not my cup of tea either. Don't get me wrong, I did play D&D for quite a few years, albeit mostly 3.5 back then, but single-dice class-based level-based systems just aren't where my heart is. It doesn't have to be though. As I said, niches are good. The more the better.
I like a bunch of the d&d setting stuff, but I can't honestly say any edition of it is good. Though I did play a lot of 3.x and PF. 5e - I like more than 3.x, but I still don't like it.
>But that's obviously what most people want, and what the gaming zeitgeist is moving towards.
Not everybody is a little-souled bugman, you know. Your reasoning leads to a samey-same mass culture without any spice or salt in it.
>every edition of shadowrun is bad
Why not make a version that is more elegant and approachable?
>no, it wouldnt be shadowrun if it wasn't bad!
You people deserve 6th edition.
As someone who has only ever played 5th Edition Shadowrun, what is the best alternative play set for it? I share your sentiments, I love Shadowruns setting and lore (though I have made a heft amount of modifications) but the mechanics, especially the way magic and spells work turns me off and I long for something better. Though I do like the character customization. Any ideas for better systems?
There's this Genesys splat that turns any cyberpunk/modern setting into Shadowrun in all but name, mechanically.
Many thanks anon, you are well endowed
This.
Games are not all meant to be one and the same. Each has a different feel and different mechanics to achieve that feel. Saying that the market wants simplicity, because the oldest and largest game got some success because of marketing tricks to get the normies to pay attention is false logic and a bad conclusion as well as not applicable to all games and gamer levels.
Yes, 5E D&D dumbed itself down to get morons to try to play it more. Yes, they had some success selling it. No, that does not mean everyone who wants success needs to dumb it down. No, it does not mean that is where the market is heading.
Truth is, different strokes for different folks. Veterans of a complex system do not want simplicity. Newbies/Normies do not want a difficult to understand system with tons of lore lasting decades of real life.
Shadowrun forgot who their base was.
You get that there is a difference between "I want an orgainized, consistent, and elegant system that has learned from the past 20 years of game design" and "I want fare accelerated," right? Streamlined and simplified doesn't mean immediately going to the route of 5e.
I think Shadowrun (and cyberpunk games in general) suffer from a divided fanbase that wants two very different things. I suspect it probably follows along pink mohawk and mirrorshades play style lines too. Some people want to play a punk adventure and fight the power and want a light fast system to do so and some people want operators operating operationally with carefully crafted plans and nothing but cut-throat business.
I don't think it needs to be simpler - just better designed and edited.
CGL's problem is that they've made a consistent reputation for themselves, and the people who work with them regardless are ignorant, plain don't care, or are those hardcore fans who have been offered control over whatever parts of the setting creams their socks. ie; people you generally don't want running an edition.
Which was just as true in 5e, where the answer to multiple frickups was "We played the previous edition and had internalised the rules we didn't include", or "We didn't talk with each other before we started writing this and that", or even "Yeah, I just thought the base item had those numbers and didn't fricking look at it ever, so now you're stuck with a mod that doesn't fit / similar item that costs 20,000¥ more".
>I don't think it needs to be simpler - just better designed and edited.
And that's why krauts tend to not even understand what the international community is talking about unless they bothered to read the English books.
And if you ask me that's the big difference between 5e and 6e. 5e's flaws could be fixed, and the krauts pretty much did. 6e is fricked from the ground up, rotten to the core, unfixable.
>6e is fricked from the ground up, rotten to the core, unfixable.
This
I don't even think the concept of 6th would be that bad as way to streamline it IF they pretty much wrote the rules from ground up for the whole edge mechanic. But they didn't, they literally took 5th ed, gutted it and slapped edge mechanics on without giving shit about it working or not to the point where some rules simply don't work at all.
>And that's why krauts tend to not even understand what the international community is talking about unless they bothered to read the English books.
I talked to one of the German game designers at the Spiel Essen and he nodded as if he knew exactly what I was talking about (while staying within the NDA he's probably under).
I also asked the guys at the CGL booth at the same event how much the CRB costs. First they gave me a dollar price (at a German event), then they told me it's €45. When I told them that Pegasus sells the same content for €20, the CGL homosexuals accused Pegasus of either selling the starter rules or fake product.
Pegasus also had a 5kraut A5 softcover CRB for €10 that they sold for quite a while. They're a good bunch, really are. Really sad that they're stuck with 6e now.
>Really sad that they're stuck with 6e now.
Wait, has Pegasus made a German Translation for 6e yet?
Did they try to errata that clusterfrick or have they not even bothered?
Years ago. They tackled the things they could tackle but they can't rewrite the entire system.
Ah, I see. Too many rough Edges even for them to smooth over.
CGL won't lose the license over "just" some bad PR and Battletech will keep them afloat basically forever. So yeah, a 7th edition by CGL is pretty much a given at some point. And even if CGL should lose the license/go under, Shadowrun is an IP with almost 35 years of history by now. It won't just disappear.
>people you know
?
Nta, but if I ran SR again I would be willing to run SR20th anniv (4e revised). I suppose I would consider 5e - I haven't checked out the revised 5e stuff. I would also consider the unisystem and gurps conversion documents I've come across over the years. If someone were running it, I'd be willing to play any of those 4 options.
4A, with a few houserules - but supposedly 5e with houserules is good... but I don't like the setting changes, which came from the scabs (like Bull) being rewarded for sticking with Catalyst during the embezzlement and general frickery.
GURPS would also do it well. Better, probably - but if I were using GURPS I'd use their Technomancer setting (where tech works with magic) instead.
Something like this, or one of the other ones floating around. Just run it with gurps action! With a write-up of the Shadowrun specific parts. Probably using powers for magic rather than the basic set magic.
https://pdfcoffee.com/gurps-4e-unofficial-shadowrun-v13pdf-pdf-free.html
>Is Shadowrun 6e really that bad?
It's worse.
Yes. It killed the shadowrun general we used to have on /tg/. And those people put up with 5e Shadowrun.
It wasn't 6e or trolling that killed /srg/, it was 100% unironic dead-ass hyperautism and moderator abuse.
>It wasn't trolling
That sure as shit was what made me lose interest in it and drove lots of people away that actually played the game. Then the downward spiral set in. Can't expect too much of a general that only consists of fetish posters, trolls, bumpgays, and people who neither do nor know how to play the game.
>moderator abuse
What?
>It wasn't 6e or trolling that killed /srg/
Then make one and watch it quietly die.
>make one and watch it die slowly.
Whether the general is dead here, and whether 6e is the cause, are separate questions.
Plenty of systems and settings survive new garbage editions, and the wholesale rejection of 6e should actually be in the favor of that, as there are no edition wars or anything to that effect.
If you make a thread, it will die, but it won't be because of trolls or 6e. It will die due to a lack of activity, and that lack of activity is because the core moved on from the thread, and we moved on because of one truly insufferable unironic autist that was present almost 24/7 and would be actively hostile to anyone taking an interest in the system or asking any questions, or generally any discussion at all. No shit it died.
was it greg?
>It will die due to a lack of activity, and that lack of activity is because the core moved on
Yes. A lot of people were primed to move on when a lacklustre 5e went downhill, CGL promised better (gave it a half-assed effort late 5e), and then released 6e.
>one truly insufferable unironic autist that was present almost 24/7 and would be actively hostile to anyone taking an interest in the system or asking any questions
Link to screencaps or archive of their posts? I wanna see this.
It's so bad it killed the game. Only White Wolf has managed a frick up as bad as it
4e was okay afaik, 5e was Dogshit, 20th was a dumpster fire.
I can only assume that 6th is nothing but a crater filled with feces
4th and 20th are most of what I played, admittedly, like a decade ago. I don't remember them being wildly different. A few point cost changes.
>6th edition
WHAT?
>5th edition
SHUT THE HELL UP!
>4th edition
STONE COLD STUNNER
>3rd edition
*cracks open two cold ones*
AND THATS THE BOTTOM LINE
'Cause Stone Cold Anon said so?
*pops*
Having never read it, what's so wrong with it?
To me the issues mostly break down into two categories:
>If you have played D&D for much time you might have been around for the uproar that 4th edition caused. Similar issue here: Substantial changes were made to how the game feels, and of course existing players were often existing players because they liked the old feel of the game. As someone new to the franchise you won't have that point of comparison.
>The editing is terrible. It can be super frustrating when a character just goes to punch someone for the first time, and you go to quickly look up how much damage it does and can't find it anywhere (base damage value looks like it should be strength/2). Note that 5th also had a lot of editing issues, but by this point some errata had been issued, and people were used to it.
Depending on what you like, you may or may not be bothered by the issues of point one. That is, for example:
>In 6th edition user strength doesn't change melee weapon damage. While in 5th, weapon damage scales directly with strength.
>In 6th, armor only changes the opportunity for one side or the other to get edge in combat (and that edge may, in turn, be used things which increase or decrease damage), while in 5th armor was included in your roll to 'soak' in-coming damage, which added a lot more dice to roll, and made lighter weapons largely useless against heavily armored foes, while the weapons that could damage heavily armored foes would one-shot unarmored opponents. The method in 6th may be quicker, but depending on how you like to play you may prefer one method over the other.
That honestly feels like some minor complaints.
So here's a major complaint: core resolution mechanic is fricked. The previous editions of Shadowrun already had issues with most actions taking too many rolls and modifiers, i.e. most required at least 2 (PC and opposition's defence), attacks requiring 3. So to simplify all this 6E decided to roll every modifier into the Edge system, which has you compare every advantage and disadvantage both sides get and awarding special currency to the winner, who then can spend it in various ways. The obvious problem with this is that this system is bolted on top of the three rolls required to resolve any attack and the nature of gainingspending Edge slows down the combat even more. It also does nothing to simplify the modifiers as you still have to count those and compare them.
Also:
>editing
>minor complaint
Until you have experienced how awful CGL Shadowrun layouts have become, you don't get to speak how minor that issue is.
6e started in such a state that they couldn't fix the core system this many years later. That whatever internet-famous group was going to stream their sessions instead put out a video explaining why they won't. That the main discussion surrounding 6e remains, "... is it really so bad?"
6e is so great, it made people excited for 7e on release.
It's bad. The editing complaints are valid - the book is basically unusable as rules reference, finding shit is hard and important shit is given less space and highlight than irrelevant fluff. Core mechanics shifted too much from what players were used to - that's not saying older editions weren't hot mess but if goal was to 'streamline' it failed miserably because edge doesn't make shit less obtuse, just different flavor of obtuse.
It alienated old players and at the same time failed to bring new ones. Add the usual israeli CGL pricing and you got recipe for killing the game.
>purple
Yes,
So I heard one of the reasons 6e was so shitty was because some bigwig embezzled a bajillion dollars, and CGL rushed this out both to get some cash and to beat Cyberpunk Red. Anyone got any details?
>So I heard one of the reasons 6e was so shitty was because some bigwig embezzled a bajillion dollars
That was more 5e's problem, but 5e was still salvageable as a game.
>CGL rushed this out both to get some cash and to beat Cyberpunk Red
There's the real reason. They were worried that Red would be a bigger deal than it turned out to be. Both were planned for 2020.
Honestly, they should have kept at it, because Red is still working at becoming a good game. 6e is the 2077 of tabletop cyberpunk. A cruel irony when you think about it.
>6e is the 2077 of tabletop cyberpunk.
2077 isn't that bad. At least it looks nice.
2077 was absolute shit on release. The only difference is that CDPR cares enough to fix their frickup, while CGL does not.
People keep saying this, but none of them appear to have played at release. It worked fine for me. I didn't actually encounter a crash bug until after I beat the game for the first time. Prior to that, all of the bugs were the kind of shit that's typical of AAA games these days.
Of course, I wasn't trying to play on an ancient console.
>People keep saying this, but none of them appear to have played at release.
Hard disagree.
The cops were my biggest issue. You literally could not hide from them because they would spawn within ten feet of you while you were being hunted. It was quite ridiculous.
There was also a huge item crafting bug that could completely corrupt your save if you crafted too many items. That's the one that ultimately made me demand a refund.
I played on PC, so ancient console isn't an excuse for this utter shite.
Lol
What's happening here? Committing crimes in a spawn point?
Basically, the game would spawn cops on top of the player anytime a crime was committed, but they'll spawn in a place that's outside of the player's field of vision so everytime the player there turns around the game triggers another spawn. It's been fixed now, but the police system still isn't even as good as something like GTA's.
>The cops were my biggest issue. You literally could not hide from them because they would spawn within ten feet of you while you were being hunted. It was quite ridiculous.
Didn't run into this one until after beating the game the first time either. Of course...I didn't run around randomly mercing people either.
I'm not sure how to feel on this as I basically ignore the hype train around games. They said it was a branching story-driven game and it was, although the branching was weird because early mission results could wipe out a potential ending for you w/o any understanding of how or why.
Like I said, never ran into any of these bugs until after beating it for the first time. A lot of this feels like it falls under "frick around, find out." Not exactly the first time CDPR has made the game shitty for people not playing to their liking.
>LALALALALALA.ALALA.A
ok, moron
Legit cannot imagine being this mad about a game.
I mean, I had plenty of fun driving a high speed through the streets too. I just...didn't hit anything. I didn't start messing with pulling stars and stuff until after that first finish.
Oh, I mean I ignore it all. I find a lot of people lead themselves around the wrong side of what's being said because it's what they want. But I feel for people who feel like they were promised something they didn't get.
>Oh, I mean I ignore it all.
Sure. It just was clear the game was pivoted into what it is and will remain, rather than being the original design.
>Oh, I mean I ignore it all. I find a lot of people lead themselves around the wrong side of what's being said because it's what they want. But I feel for people who feel like they were promised something they didn't get.
Oh please, they spent a generation selling a RPG that didn't exist and all they had was a barely functioning borderlands clone.
>they spent a generation selling a RPG that didn't exist
It was in development. They were never going to do everything they wanted in the timeframe they wanted, with the people they were paying, on the budget available - but they could have stuck to creating the full RPG they originally had in mind.
There was something reasonable in there, provided they could have pulled it off - the singleplayer game was the initial investment in the GTA-esque multiplayer game. They just weren't ready to handle doing it.
>I'm not sure how to feel on this as I basically ignore the hype train around games.
I wasn't talking about the hype (which was, as per usual for AAA, excessive and bullshit), but the builds of the game that existed and were shown and talked about before they decided on throwing buckets of cash at a big name celebrity. It wasn't impossible to separate the two. Even after that point, they were trying to make a game that needed something like a thousand people under well-managed teams, and they had half that with no prior experience with this scale of game dev. Internally, the guys at the top were talking shit while the people who actually had to do the work were taking bets on what they would cut, what the next release date would be, and how this would all fail.
>Didn't run into this one until after beating the game the first time either.
Congratulations on your Blue Lives Matter run. We'll inform your local constabulary and they can give you a nice framed certificate for respecting police in your open world game.
It's pretty sad because I had a blast driving at high speed through the streets, and that's how you run into a large number of the glitches. Simply moving fast enough to cause rapid loads caused some of the worst anomalies and physics glitches in the game. But obviously you didn't go beyond the speed limit to avoid traffic fines and thus didn't have the problems that others might have.
>It worked fine for me.
Ditto. Yknow, except for not being the game they said they were making before they signed on Keanu. But there's straight up recording of the bullshit other people experienced.
lol
the game actually was unplayable at release
like the charger would be glitching the frick out and the peds would all be respawk g in t poses every time you moved the camera, same with cars
you’d have cops constantly teleporting all around you the second you got a star
the scripted car chases would bug out and not let you shoot and the cars and drones and shit would be randomly exploding on their own as npcs praised your shooting
Anon, I cannot take you seriously when CGL managed to have the dishonor of successfully getting their shit pushed in by angry investors. Normally publishers ignore angry investors in this industry. You are the epitome of "works on my machine" that people make fun of. i got respect for you not reading the news though.
It's been 2 years where is even half of the shit they promised on release? Face the music they are off to make Witcher 4 to by their legal bills after the Polish government gets done fricking them in the ass.
It was only truly shit on release on last-gen consoles. It was fine on PC and current-gen; bit buggy but nothing frequent quick saves (and the game is pretty generous with auto saves too) couldn’t solve. I played it back then and enjoyed it and now that I have a beefier GPU with the prices being sane I’m playing it again with max graphics. Gameplay’s the same but it’s a lot prettier of course.
It was of course overhyped but what AAA release that isn’t an annual sequel game isn’t?
It was AAA teflon blockbuster that coasted mainly on a fun story that pretended to have player input, but boiled down to "Here's your three buttons for different starts and endings" with the middle chopped into smaller chunks to hide how it's always the same middle. Not every AAA release is "all hype, no filler".
Do you think they'd be stupid enough to try and save themselves with a 7E that is just more of the same? In fact, if they released it I would call it. They'll double down on everything from 6E thinking it was great and no one got it and are just nay sayers.
As long as the same line developer stays, there's no reason to expect anything good. Jason Hardy has proven that he is not a learning animal and he indeed has the capacity to double down on his mistakes.
In my limited direct interactions with the game developers they are unwilling to admit any mistakes or concede room for development. The only hope is Topps revokes the license, but Topps is a shadow of it's former self so I don't see it happening.
Are there any notable differences between 4e and 20AE or is just that the latter has color for all illustrations?
Errata is included.
Attributes are no longer cheaper to increase than skill groups (same price in 20th iirc).
Those are the main things I remember being different. I don't remember any reasons to prefer 4th over 20th. But its been a while.
Cheers
>CP77
It’s never getting “fixed”, deal with it, the game is a disaster at every level. Forget all the bugs and amateur hour looter shooter gameplay loop, just look at the driving in the open world urban cityscape first person game. A good 1/4-1/3 of the cars you can’t even see over the road over the dashboard. Hitting a truck head on on a motorcycle wedges the bike under the truck and flips it over with the rider remaining on the bike, sometimes not even slowing down. All chases had to be scripted with zero player agency, with set places where the pursuers would get run off the road or explode. The racing quests aren’t even racing, the cars constantly teleport behind you when you’re in the lead and they literally wait on the road for you to catch up if you fall behind, not to mention the totally epic 100% cosmetic shootouts because street racing in riced out nuclear powered cars wasn’t cyberpunky enough or how a fricking truck is faster than super cars with literally 5-10 times the horsepower, I guess the troony flag makes it go fasta.
But /tg/, didn't you hear? We're having a
SUMMER
OF
SHADOWRUN
http://www.shadowrunsixthworld.com/2022/06/a-shadowrun-summer/
This will surely bring Shadowrun back, right?
I'd sooner remake Sega Genesis Shadowrun with ugly bloom filters and glowing shit then play anything new with Shadowrun.
Returns was a good series.
It's not real Shadowrun, and that doesn't fit my narrative anyway.
Shadow Run is really just that bad. Last semi decent, professional fluff written for the setting was back in 3rd Edition. Still wasn't that great, but it at least had some money.
To put it in perspective for you - once upon a time there were regular Shadworun threads on /tg/.
Then 6e came out.
Now there are not.
Which is a shame, I recently started a 5e game and could use some advice on streamlining things for my newbie Techno
There is consistently a shadowrun thread up, it just doesn't have a general Op and topic anymore.
"We never have a shadowrun thread/I never see a shadowrun thread" is pure fricking fantasy.
There was a period from late 5e onwards where the shadowrun threads were still going up, but the conversation had already ended and all that kept them from dropping off page 11 was trolling and bullshit arguments. As opposed to before that, where it was just part of the scenery.
Why?
The GURPS thread stays up most of the time even with most of us having minimal interest in the recent offerings.
Why not just talk about the version of SR you actually play?
Because I actually want to talk about my games rather than jerking off to a system.
GURPS is a pretty good system, though.
So talk about your games then. And answer rules questions about sr3 or 4 or 5 or whatever edition you play. What's stopping you?
You have no idea how incredibly mad the hyperautist got if you asked questions about... anything, really. Just anything.
Oh. GURPSGen has one or two of those.
New official content has been kind of meh lately, but if you talk about any unofficial stuff people are coming up with on the forums or a couple blogs (where new content is actually coming out, even if not from the company) - it's *reeeeeeee ecelebs this*; *reeeeeeeee ecelebs that* - you're not allowed to talk about that stuff here. And definitely don't talk about it to the easteuro Anon who writes one of them and hangs out here, because that breaks the anon-bro-code or something.
I do it anyways. Especially if nobody is talking about anything else in the thread and it's dead for a few hours.
Ignore the censorious threadkilling hyperautist(s).
Are any of the Shadowrun video games worth playing?
No
I realized that it couldn't scratch my itch when I had a shaman in my party but she couldn't use any of her class abilities outside of combat to help us solve a murder
i liked dragonfall and hong kong. returns is a bit threadbare
The Sega Genesis version is good and also closely accurate to the tabletop games.
The counter strike knock off one is good. TheRPGS are shit
Oh my god finally a shadowrun thread. So I'm thinking about running this game for my group soon. Which edition do you dorks recommend? I hear 4e is the best one but is there any reason why maybe 5e isn't as good?
>Which edition do you dorks recommend?
If it's not 1e or 6e, you're probably fine going with whatever.
HAHAHA, let's feed the funny guy who's definitely not lying!
Okay schitzo what am I lying about???
fricking moron
4e is probably the easiest for new players to pick up it simplifies a lot of stuff that was basically a separate system in previous editions particularly the matrix rules. Whether that a good thing is obviously subjective but it's what I'd recommend.
If you're prepared to put a bit more work in 3e is the most Shadowrun Shadowrun gets. It can get pretty crunchy but it has the advantage of being mostly compatible with material from the previous editions and the 20th anniversary edition is probably the most complete core book out of all of them.
>What's the mantra? Something along the lines of "5kraut if you can, 5e if you can't, 3e if you're explicitly looking for something oldschool".
It says something about how bad 6e is that it's completely eclipse what a shit show 5e was
>SR 5e
>Shitshow
Outside of 'Silencer that can detect if people hear the shot' was there any actual issues with 5e?
>'Silencer that can detect if people hear the shot'
Fixed/removed in 5kraut by the way.
I assume you can only play "5kraut" if you're fluent in German? Or has it been bacm-translated?
Since there's not one document that collects all the little and big changes and additions in all of the books I doubt we'll ever see a complete back-translation. But in my experience flipping back and forth and using translation software does the job quite well.
Shame. A list of changes would be handy.
But translation software is doable. I did that with a German TDE book that didn't have an English release yet, a few years back.
Help a 2nd edition player out. What's 5kraut? Google ain't helping shit
NTA, but 5kraut, at least around here on 4ch, is the colloquial name given to the German version of 5e.
Where can I get it? I have dirty German friends who I will force to translate?.
So many, but standardising select sound filter tech in silencers wasn't one of them.
Limits system tacked on to prevent massive dice pools that does nothing to prevent massive dice pools.
You have just witnessed the STRENGTH of Mormon game design.
I personally like 20th anniversary edition. It's 4th edition with errata.
Why was it forgotten?
Because 3e is an overall improvement of it, specially by making Deckers and Spellcasters less fiddly.
This is probably a big fat no, but has anyone looked at the 6e companion book that recently came out? Apperently it exists to fix some or all of the problems people had with the game, but the only reviews I've seen are from people who either hate cgl-run with a burning passion, or people with hardcore Stockholm syndrome. I'm wondering if the errata have gotten the game to an even vaguely playable state.
My opinion is that nothing can fix shit editing and current era social politics in a TTRPG release. They won't get my money nor attention.
Bad enough it let me kill off the general without any outside help
Yes
So now that Shadowrun has shat the bed and Cyberpunk Red and 2020 is tainted by 2077, who is going to become the standard in tabletop cyberpunk settings?
overwatch d20
Cleanse your taint and prepare for tactical Jesus entry.
Shadow of the Beanstalk
Never heard of it so that disqualifies it.
Android: Shadow of the Beanstalk is an official splatbook for Genesys (the generic version of FFG Star Wars) that adopts the Android setting (of Netrunner fame) into a playable setting.
The worlds of android - can give extra lore
The art of the android universe - can give extra art
Does it add anything unique rules-wise to Genesys, or is it just lore and worldbuilding?
Apart from slightly expanding the rules/lists for cybernetics and hacking, A:SotB also introduces the favor economy, a narrative-based system that is basically a streamlined combination of Obligation and Duty from FFG Star Wars, where you track favors of different sizes both coming and going, what they may be worth and so on. It represents the tangle of the city and how hard it is to escape the web.
This is on top of the unique skills, talents, and armory pieces it introduces. On top of being an Android setting book, it provides the pieces to more easily run your own cyberpunk/science fiction game.
>Is Shadowrun 6e really that bad?
No. It's worse.
>FFG
>Publishing new good Genesys content
>supporting existing Genesys settings
Good joke. All of the books are proof-of-concept outlines, nothing more.
It'll continue to be Shadowrun 5 from playerbase inertia, with a melange of D&D 5e hacks clustering the front page of DTRPG and everything else relegated to being a minor niche game.
The only bit of Genesys of significant size is the Star Wars license.
It has gone full SJW in the lore department, with the Policlub and all. They are inserting current ethical discussions into a setting which is an extremely different world from ours.
Shadowrun is bad regardless of edition. It's always a monumental clusterfrick mechanically and the setting went from cartoonishly moronic to just moronic over the years.
Don't get me wrong, the core concept - cyberpunk with magick and shiet - is workable. It's just that it doesn't work in Shadowrun itself and never did.
>Have fun sitting in your niche screeching about why no one else wants to join.
Thanks, but what?
Basically, Shadowrun is a crunchy rules-heavy cyberpunk/fantasy RPG with fun background/lore. It's very appealing on the surface. It just so happens that the sourcebooks and community are actively hostile and do an excellent job of turning away new players. So, sit in your dying niche, seething about not getting new players as you actively tell them to frick off and get a German sourcebook that they have to compile themselves to try playing Shadowrun.
Example right here. If I want to play Shadowrun, I should just play GURPS instead and change the names. I might as well play D&D 5E and call it Shadowrun.
>stop liking what I don't like
I think I'll take my niche.
>seething about not getting new players
Never had a problem with that. Never been seething about anything remotely close to that. No, the playerbase is not as large as D&D's, but who cares? Are you b***hing at fans of, I don't know, certain music genres, because the genre they happen to like is not actively trying to turn into whatever is topping the charts that year?
>tell them to frick off and get a German sourcebook
Where? 5kraut is objectively better, but if you can't use it, just use 5e.
>german sourcebook
>sourcebook
high speed moronation there
What is it then and why is it so good?
It's official German errata of the core rules by the publisher that has rights for translating and publishing SR in Germany.
>errata of the core rules
It's much much more than that.
Did Pegasus make 6e playable?
Better? I guess so, but it's still 6e, and as such inherently fricked. See
Why don't you try looking at the thread you're posting in, maybe someone had the same question? Maybe even more than once?
>gurps Shadowrun? How dare you! I might as well play d&d5e and call it shadowrun!
Gurps is a universal system. Unlike d&d 5e, you could actually do gurps Shadowrun. It's also reasonably similar in many ways (not superficially, but under the hood in broad strokes of how stuff works) to Shadowrun 4e, but a bit less fiddly at the table and more consistent.
If you want to run an "official Shadowrun"? Sr20th anniversary was alright if a bit clunky. Sr5 was fine but I liked it less than sr20th and it was very poorly edited and has a bunch of issues, which is why people here want the German version that's 5e but better. People have also said sr3 is good, but I haven't played it.
You also shouldn't assume everyone who posts in a thread about SR is a die-hard SR fan. I haven't played an SR game since 2016 or so, this is the first SR thread I've joined in a few years. I mean. I would play it, if a friend wanted to run 20th again, or ran it with gurps. I'd consider running it myself in gurps if players wanted the Shadowrun setting. And I might play, if they wanted to run sr5. I wouldn't mind trying playing SR3 since I keep hearing good things. But I'm not a guy running a ton of SR. (I like it more than d&d5e though). My current game I'm playing in is an ICRPG game being used to run a 3rd party 5e setting. I haven't run a game since December 2019. It was 5e. I have run a variety of games over the years, but SR is one I've always been on the player side of the screen. I never got hyped enough about the system to want to run it.
>Seething about not getting new players
What makes you think I'm looking for Shadowrun players? What makes you think other people here are looking for players? Complaining that the threads die because people got sick of dealing with one butthole who b***hes all the time so nobody wants to listen to him screech, is very different than complaining that they want to run SR and can't because they can't find players. Where are you getting this "we can't find players for SR woe is me" idea from?
>beyond
Yeah. Beyond (or something like archives of nethys) - some kind of app or web database - are the way to go. I would even say putting out paper books or PDFs for game rules is not worth doing as a company in 2022 but the companies are just out of touch with reality.
>Problems with Shadowrun.
Yes. Those are problems. Agreed. Shadowrun has been very sloppily handled for a long time. I'm the guy who said "run it with GURPS Action! or unisystem; convert stuff as needed".
>Stay in your niche screeching about how nobody wants to join.
I've played d&d5e a bunch at this point because it's popular. Mostly found it a bland un-fun experience. If all tabletop rpging becomes 5e and I can't get a game for anything else, and I can't get the stars to align for a 5e game I would actually want to play and can't get players interested in a heavily houseruled 5e game with more 3pp than included wotc content that I would be willing to run - then I'll just play wargames or videogames or boardgames. I'm not going to force myself to play or run a game that I'm not going to enjoy. It's not like I'm getting paid.
Are there fellow krauts present that have the german 6e files and are willing to share them? I'm mostly after the Datapulses, but the SOTAs and general fluff books interest me as well.
the core rules for 5G and some of the Datapuls should be in the pastebin here
https://pastebin.com/SsWTY7qr
it should be in the mediafire link, the first pastebin listed doesn't work
Thanks, but I already have all the 5D stuff. I'm looking for the 6D content, but nobody seems to have that despite the fact that the german fluff is supposed to be really good.
yes
Does SR have a group somewhere to find a game? I sear it's nigh impossible to find a shadowrun game.
There's one on Facebook that has an LFG sometimes.
Frick I guess I'll finally have to make a facebook account.
The only things I use FB for are messaging friends and family who don't use discord; and a couple TTRPG communities.
And I keep it off my phone so I don't end up scrolling the Facebook wall.
Has anyone tried running shadowrun with "the sprawl" rules?
Does anyone have the PDFs of the Shadowrun reskin for the Forged in the Dark system?
"Runners in the Shadows"
https://markcleveland.itch.io/runners-in-the-shadows
Does anybody have 5Kraut?
A wild bumpgay appears!
see
How bad is 6e? No one, anywhere, has a functioning pdf character sheet.
And nobody noticed until last month.
Even CGL doesn't have one, theirs is broken on their website - in at least two places where there should be a table, its just an unstructured text field. You can't even print it and try to fill it in old school, you would have to draw the tables in yourself and write illegibly small. Is *anyone* playing this shit, if nobody is even trying to grab a character sheet to make a few pcs? How long has this game been out with no one even trying? Or did players try to make a character, realize that even the character sheet was unusable garbage, and give up without even giving feedback?
How many dumpsters need to be throwing greasy flames into the sky before you try to put out the fire?
Let's be honest here, no one uses one page character sheets instead of spreadsheets for Shadowrun, no matter the edition. And there is a kraut 6e chummer-like that also supports English, IIRC. That said, your point's obviously valid.
To put things into perspective, I wanted to start a SR campaign, so i bought a hundred dollars worth of starter kit bullshit, the core book, a lore book, plus dice and edge tokens. I opened up the book, and after reading through the basic rules, due to how fricking awful the editing is, failed to understand how anything works other than rolling a dice pool. So I closed the book, downloaded the 4e corebook and have been running that ever since. Basically, It's so bad I literally took a hundred dollar loss right on the head rather than decipher the moon logic editing.
How do you call someone who gets through security systems not by remotely accessing and hacking them, but by physical access and messing around with circuitry and wires?
Jacker
Sparky.
yes
Anyone knows what happens when Troll SURGEs and develops a Dermal Alternation: Granite Shell? Does it stack with natural Troll's Dermal Deposits?
>Dermal Alteration is incompatible with any other natural or artificial skin modification.
How does a question like that come about? Just clicking around in Chummer?
Well, it's not by carefully reading the relevant qualities.