I THOUGHT THIS GAME WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A SPIRITUAL SUCCESSOR TO MYST?
ITS JUST FRICKING LINES
ITS BEEN 90 MINUTES AND IM BORED TO TEARS
SORRY I AM LATE TO THE PARTY ON THIS ONE I GUESS
JESUS CHRIST ITS JUST FRICKING LINES
ITS JUST LINES
I THOUGHT THIS GAME WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A SPIRITUAL SUCCESSOR TO MYST?
ITS JUST FRICKING LINES
ITS BEEN 90 MINUTES AND IM BORED TO TEARS
SORRY I AM LATE TO THE PARTY ON THIS ONE I GUESS
JESUS CHRIST ITS JUST FRICKING LINES
talos principle mogs this piece of blow
This. The first Talos game is unironically a 9/10 puzzle game and shits all over The Witness in every way possible.
>9/10 puzzle game
Just say you think the narration is cool, the puzzles are braindead easy.
Talos is a dudebro "existential" puzzle game where the puzzles are so easy you can solve them at first glance of an area, not a bad game but nothing special.
Talos is good, but Witness is definitely better. Puzzle games where you can die and have to time things are lame. Executing the puzzles are more difficult than solving them (outside of the DLC) The annoying beeping terminals in Talos that pretend to be 2 deep 4 u are also much worse than The Witness audio tapes.
Spending five minutes figuring out a puzzle and then in the next one failing on the first try and getting sent back having to find the solution again is not fun
NTA, but unless you are mentally handicapped, that does not happen.
You have to reset in TTP more often than Witness, because you can actually lock yourself out of being able to solve a puzzle.
But that shouldn't be a problem in either game, really.
I just got extremely frustrated in the witness having to redo puzzles multiple times, I can't remember the solution so I have to redo it.
What puzzle do you have to redo? That happened maybe one time for me... any time the game makes you do that it's because you're trying to brute force it.
Apple trees and some really weird ones next to a laser I think. I'm not brute forcing them, I just get it a bit wrong, and then I need to fricking redo the last puzzle. No thank you gimme my money back.
If you're failing the apple puzzles and then failing to resolve the previous puzzle, you don't understand the rules and are just brute forcing them. They're among the least obtuse puzzles in the game.
>I can't remember the solution
You don't have to remember solutions, but understand the rules.
>I just get it a bit wrong
Then you didn't understand the rules.
This shouldn't happen more than once.
Even with the rules I still gotta slide the line through and sometimes I get it wrong. I don't see why this should be punished. The ones with invisible lines were basically impossible.
Skill issue. The only puzzle in the game I'd say is actually unfair is the door in the ship. The sound puzzles in general are kinda fricking ass.
It was too difficult and unforgiving to me yes. I wouldn't have had the patience to redo puzzles over and over again. I played for like 1h50m and refunded.
>and sometimes I get it wrong
Why...?
If you understand the rules there is no reason to "sometimes get it wrong".
I don't mean this necessarily as a joke, but you don't sound like the brightest bulb around the block.
>I don't see why this should be punished.
So people don't brute force it and actually understand the rules.
But I need to try stuff to understand the rules. I need to drag the line to see where I'm going. That's how you solve things.
Yeah, that's something that takes like 2 or 3 minutes per individual mechanic.
The game is over 30h long if you want to do everything, even the optional stuff with the hardest puzzle in the whole game.
>I played for like 1h50m and refunded.
You had these problems so early on already!?
Then the game is obviously way too difficult for me, and that's okay. Not every game is for everyone. Having to redo things is what I hate the most in games. Fall down a hole in mario? Next game.
>Not every game is for everyone
I agree.
TW is definitely not for everybody. You really have to allow yourself to study and remember the rules.
I played it right at release and was in the Ganker threads theorycrafting with other Anons and it was quite amazing. We showed each other all the puzzles we had missed and things we didn't notice.
>"trying out things" is basically brute forcing
No.
Brute forcing is just randomly trying inputs, not having any interest in learning the reason why certain inputs worked.
There's just way too much stuff to remember then. Applying logic while you drag that thing around? Jesus christ that's fricking impossible.
I watched a playthrough of some sudoku players on YouTube instead, much more enjoyable. They solved them instantly which was really fascinating. I can't even add two numbers in my head.
>There's just way too much stuff to remember then.
Not for the people who enjoy this type of puzzle. Or at least how TW did them.
>I can't even add two numbers in my head.
I'm a software dev, failed Math class and suck at mathematics too.
But I love sudoku!
It's all about how your brain functions, you know.
I'm also a software dev and failed math class but still can't do math and I just brute force algorithms in my programs. It does function differently. I hope talos is better for me, but there's always refunding.
if you just want to pretend you like puzzles, go for talos . If you actually like puzzles, go for the Witness.
Your game sucked, Jonathan Blow.
If you like hour long pretentious dialog go for the Frickness.
Go frick yourself.
>A SPIRITUAL SUCCESSOR TO MYST?
I think you made this up. Myst got mentioned in the promo stuff before the game came out but not much more than "it's on a mysterious island and has puzzles".
how_is_cyberbullying_real.jpg
The fricking looker mogged your game, jonathon
The Looker adds to the enjoyment of The Witness. It's the perfect counterpart.
I flailed my way through a lot of puzzles in The Witness until I realized the game was trying to show me something about what happens when you do that
I tried Talos Principle and it was absolute garbage. Horrible asset flip environments, horrible "story" they force you to take part in, and the puzzles themselves are horrible.
The Witness is far from perfect, but at least it's not a fricking slog to go through.
>I THOUGHT THIS GAME WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A SPIRITUAL SUCCESSOR TO MYST?
why did you think that?
>The Witness is far from perfect, but at least it's not a fricking slog to go through.
As someone who loves almost all puzzle games, The Witness is probably the most slog game to go through, simply because it's so fricking incredibly boring and uninspired.
The Shitness is literally 500 variations of the same puzzle in a row
>The Witness is far from perfect, but at least it's not a fricking slog to go through.
You played the same game as us, right?
Talos did everything great except the core of the game, puzzles. There wasn't a single one that was interesting or challenging or anything remarkable at all. You almost instantly figure out what the answer is and then just go through the motions to do it. That's boring.
Cool setting and it ran well, but it's a really mediocre puzzle game unless you're 10 years old or something.
Thanks for reminding me, just bought it on 85% sale. Will play it one day.
And I'll add to that I refunded the witness, fricking bullshit game requiring tons of working memory kicking you back to the previous puzzle if you do it wrong
>mogs
Nobody uses that word anymore, except for braindead e-girls.
But anyway, the one thing The Witness has over TPP 1 (and especially 2) is that it has way more difficult puzzles. Not saying TW is overall incredibly difficult, but it certainly has more actually intriguing puzzles.
However, the best among TW, TTP 1 and TTP 2 is the Gehenna DLC. That's the pinnacle of puzzle gaming.
I probably wouldn't describe OW as a puzzle game, more like just exploration.
That being said, it is the best game out of these four. It's a masterpiece, DLC included. But I don't think it competes in the same genre at all.
what's the deal with Talos principal anyways? It seems like every puzzle is just a variation on getting lasers to point at a certain place. does it mix it up and get really weird like the witness?
what makes it so good dude? It seems so bland to me.
I liked them both.
>I THOUGHT THIS GAME WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A SPIRITUAL SUCCESSOR TO MYST?
You thought wrong.
https://blog.playstation.com/archive/2015/09/21/the-witness-creator-jonathan-blow-on-creating-one-of-2016s-most-intriguing-games/
>“Myst is definitely an inspiration in terms of the mood. There’s something a little intangible about it. Obviously the setting is very similar — there’s an island, you’re alone on it, and there are puzzles. From day one I was like ‘Okay, we’re doing Myst, but with modern design sensibilities.’ There have been lots of Myst-like games in the past, but I don’t think I’ve ever played an homage to Myst.
>>From day one I was like ‘Okay, we’re doing Myst, but with modern design sensibilities.’
>completely misses the fact what made the Myst games great was the puzzles IN ADDITION to the lore and environmental storytelling
>makes a game centered around puzzles but zero environmental storytelling and philosophical quotes scattered around just for the sake of making the game seem deeper than it really is
>what little half-assed story exists is shoved off into the secret endgame area
>my fricking mfw when
>I have kneejerk reactions based on out-of-context snippets I read on Ganker
You have twitterbrain.
>“I actually take a lot of adventure game things that happen from the Myst era as anti-examples: you’re never going to enter a room where there’s a machine with a bunch of buttons, you don’t know what they do, some of them aren’t even interactive because they’re part of the background, and you just click around until something moves. That was very common in those days, but from day one we decided we’re not doing that.
>“But part of the reason I can have that kind of reaction to things I don’t like about games of that era is because they mapped that space out. If they hadn’t come before us, we wouldn’t have that reference point. Even if I take things from Myst and say I don’t like them, it has to be a respectful ‘I don’t like them,’ because we’re building on what they did.
Now you're ready for the real game:
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1985690/The_Looker/
It's kinda crazy that the parody game is 100x more entertaining than The Shitness.
I like the witness and I really enjoyed the looker. i still don't get why jblow got in such a hissy fit over it, it's one of the best love letters in gaming.
well actually i know why jblow got mad, he's an idiot, but still.
he hates it because it was made by one dude with AN ENGINE and didn't require 10 years of nonstop coding to produce
unironically this
jblow is seriously like a terry davis tier elitist with his programming, except instead of schizophrenic genius he has autism tinker brain
so jon blow has youtube videos where he expounds for hours on end about how programmers need to 'go low level' and understand how everything works to be a TRUE programmer who REALLY knows what they are doing and are ACTUALLY competent
so he spends 10 years making the homosexual witness by making his OWN ENGINE, and then the guy shits out the looker with 100% of all the same functionality in a month lmfao
it hurts his ego and autism brain
Braid really wasn't that interesting of a game, and Blow being propped up as some sort of fricking legendary once-in-a-lifetime prodigy by any even remotely gaming-adjacent outlet unnecessarily inflated his ego to astronomical proportions.
writing the engine to the witness probably wasn't even 20% of development time
40% was jerking off while huffing his own farts
Jonathan's Blow opinion on basically everything is completely moronic. It's a shame he turned off vods on his Twitch channel. Watching him play anything is hilarious.
oh frick thanks for reminding me to get this. it's extra awesome that it's free.
The Looker was peak bants
BEEP
I can't believe the dev tricked me into drawing a wiener
>Pick up a tape recording
>It's one of those fricking 90's car radio advertisements
I lost it when one of the tapes started quoting deepak chopra
I'm sorry, you just aren't smart enough to enjoy this masterpiece.
Frick the sound puzzles. I'm tone deaf and that shit was just torture.
I got stuck on the puzzle with the Michael Jackson tiles and after trying for about 30 minutes I was just done and never played again.
Blow got mogged so hard by Outer Wilds. OW is the ideal evolution of the Myst-like into 3D, because it's highly dynamic instead of static (best uses of physics engine since Valve's portal/gravity guns) and its problem solving is deeply tied to level design and narrative environments, it's the very core of the game, a deeply cohesively designed experience. OW opened up a completely new way of game design, the non-linear open-world mystery. Someone came up with the "MetroidBrainia" term for The Witness (I'm gonna keep using it because it's fun to shitpost with it and I'm fascinated with this concept kek) but it's really OW that is leading the way.
>the puzzles aren't related to the environment at all
That's just flat out false. Besides the full-on environmental puzzles where you need to line up aspects of the environment to make solvable puzzle, there's tons of hybrid panel/environment puzzles, where aspects of the environment are used to show the correct path on the grid.
If you don't like the game, fine, but don't just make shit up.
>but don't just make shit up.
Do you know where you are?
What they mean is that the puzzles are just puzzles, there on the world, like in Layton, where everyone wants you to solve brain teasers for some reason.
Meanwhile in Outer Wilds the "puzzles" are you figuring out how to get into places and where to go next, not the game throwing a riddle at you for no reason.
So? The Witness isn't trying to be an adventure game. It's unfair to judge it as one.
To what should one compare the witness to for the dogshit game category?
Any game that's just logic puzzles. I think people get confused with The Witness because there's a 3D world to walk around in.
Because they're both marketed as 3D successors to Myst
OW is a puzzle game at its core
OW is unironically trash
Only low-IQ low-T redditors enjoyed it
so Ganker basically
ow is trash for pseuds im glad i refunded it after 30 minutes
There's no way you got even to the first statue
>There's no way you got even to the first statue
You can usually tell if a game is good or bad in the first 10 minutes, but I gave it an extra 20 for all the stuff I heard about it
It just wasn't interesting
That can be fair, but did you even blast off into space?
Yes
Yes I did do that how did you know
If you didn't skip the dialogue it wouldn't have taken just 20 minutes to fly away. And if that's not the case, it definitely isn't for you since the entire game is reading.
I've read dozens of vns and books some of which are 200+ hours long. Reading isn't the problem for me
>how did you know
I have beaten over five puzzle games in the past ten years, the bounding intellect of my vast mind is myriad and obscured to mortal kind.
Confirmed for jumping into the geyser at minute 2 and dying.
holy Christ those are two completely separate games. why you even comparing them?
op's line
>I THOUGHT THIS GAME WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A SPIRITUAL SUCCESSOR TO MYST?
Sadly Zelda is the only game to do environmental puzzles correctly. Frick laser and lines for hours on end. Be creative and innovative ffs.
Play Outer Wilds its environmental puzzles aren't even presented as puzzles, the whole world is one giant dynamic puzzlebox
Hitman gets close but its a little cookie cutter.
this game is dogshit, go do some sudokus or a jigsaw puzzle instead
I've never played The Talos Principle.
BUT
I love The Room series.
Lets see how long this takes me to beat.
Imagine being filtered by lines
Myst had bad puzzles but at least there was some variety
If you aren't moronic they aren't hard, just time consuming and a slog. The atmosphere is top tier though, especially Riven.
I didn't finish The Witness because it was boring and tedious for me, but I remember laughing out loud when doing one of the early puzzles. When it is teaching you about the black and white dots. I was struggling for like 15 minutes trying to figure out what the pattern was. "Is it like, the white squares need to be surrounded by the line on three sides, and black squares can only touch the line on one side? What is going on?"
Then it clicked for me all at once. Ohhhhhhhh, you have to keep the races separate
I kek'd quite heartily at that
Puzzle game king.
For me, it's baba is you
It's not just lines but there are lots of lines. Go climb the mountain and you'll find the other kind of puzzle
Yeah
Myst is one of the most denerate things in existance. You don't deserve any better, and knowing any better would be a degredation of better things.
I liked it, but my god is the "story" pretentious as frick. No, Jonathan Blow, I'm not going to watch the fricking hour-long rambling video twice just to get a couple bonus environmental puzzles.
I bruteforced half of the must puzzles
you are supposed to brute force the first few levels when a new mechanic is introduced, but its easy since the line can only go in like 3 different places
>you are supposed to brute force the first few levels when a new mechanic is introduced
No, you are supposed to think what the rules could be by trying out things.
>trying out things
yes, exactly. when there are only like 3 different options, "trying out things" is basically brute forcing
Lol.
I didn't think it was that bad, but yeah it's no Myst. Much closer to those abstract euro-puzzle games that pop up from time to time.
Give the Looker a try if you haven't.
Haha, yes, have a breakdown, you earned it.
Ended this recently, I hated it. The environmental/obelysk puzzles are more fun than the main game.
> game created by an atheist
> spiritual successor to myst
kek
Never trust someone who has the name that sounds like a drug dealer alias.
>Jonathan Blow
>Jon
>johnson
>dick
>Blow
>suck
>name is basically "Dick Suck"
You can imagine his school experience. And suddenly you will understand why he is the way he is.
bro this is one of those shit games all the games urinalists who paraded against having proper ethical standards heralded.
I for one am looking forward to J Blow's 700 hour long 30 million dollar Sokoban game.
it's not just lines, keep going gay
Why does he make Ganker seethe so much?