Wo Long
>allow the moveset customization that Nioh and Stranger of Paradise offered instead of this moronic shit where weapon skills are bound to individual loot drops
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ITT: Flawed games that would be good with a few tweaks
Wo Long
>allow the moveset customization that Nioh and Stranger of Paradise offered instead of this moronic shit where weapon skills are bound to individual loot drops
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You could do it now through rewards in Thousand Miles Journey, which takes about 30 min. But yea that is royally fricked up, especially since some moves are absolute must for certain weapons. Still fricking great game, deflecting feels fricking good.
the loot system drives me insane. you get multiple copies of the same weapon like Nioh but you also have to upgrade individual ones? I have to grind my ass off for materials each time I wanna try the same weapon with a different skillset
You don’t have to grind in wo long. I went through multiple cycles without doing so
Already implemented chud
>with a few tweaks
It would be good if it was literally Nioh 3 in China. A dev willing to experiment with their game mechanic is generally praiseworthy, but this time it didn't pay off.
imagine playing games where you have to get "drops"
to do things
a single player game where you have to grind
Grinding is kino and I'm tired pretending it isnt.
Grind on brother
You are correct on that, attaching MAs to the weapons and then having your moveset be based on RNG was awful and one of my biggest issues with the game. On release, you could only have two and then eventually they upgraded the max to six but only higher rarities could have six thus making it only possible to have three at most on your first run. They did add a way to finally change the ones on the weapon but it was implemented terribly because you didn't unlock the MAs for each weapon. It was somewhat expensive to change them and if you wanted to change back to a previous MA, you had to re-buy it. Then there's the issue of only being able to do this at the blacksmith lady, they didn't let you do this from the pause menu or even a battle flag. All this nonsense for something they already had solved in Nioh: a simple skill customization screen that could be accessed via pause menu and a skill tree with clear progression for unlocking your moveset. Wo Long was still alright but it had some awful design choices like this that we're made by someone who had no idea what they were doing. Then you had cool new Wizardry spells via free updates but the method for obtaining them was horrible. The drop rates were abysmally low on anything but the highest difficulty and there was no reason they couldn't just implement new challenge missions with these as set rewards. I think Ronin has a style menu and I hope it has clear progression for gaining your moveset that's not bound to awful systems like what Wo Long had.
How do you change MAs?
That was another issue, you don't gain the ability to do that until you unlock the Thousand Mile Journey which can only be unlocked on the third difficulty if I remember right. Basically you don't get the privilege of move-set customization until after you've already gone through the game twice.
Ah I see, thank you. I've tried to look this stuff up earlier but most of the results were about swapping the inputs for MAs at the blacksmith.
I love this game. Moving away from soulslike and nioh was a fantastic choice, like SOP. It was so close to being Ninja Gaiden in china especially with the long sword. If they got rid of lock on and switched to NG style, threw more enemies, and allowed for UT to replace instant charge on the longsword it would be perfect. Oh and give me flying swallow.
Yeah I would have liked if the enemy encounters threw more enemies at you instead of fighting the same tiger over and over again (Nioh also had this problem until the later difficulties). I haven't finished Wo Long yet so IDK if that changes in later NG cycles
My favorite weapon in Nioh is the splitstaff, and it pains me that I cannot bash through hordes of enemies like with the lunar staff in NG. I hope one day team ninja gets rid of lock on and opt for directional soft lock on.
>got rid of lock on and switched to NG style, threw more enemies
Seems like it only used Souls lock-on because that's what Nioh did. Fighting off several of those assassin enemies would've been really fun if you didn't have to fight with the camera stuck to your back.
camera is always a perennial issue with action games. the god of war PS2 games got it right by having a zoomed out, fixed camera
The main things I dislike in this game are morale and the fact that parry works on everything.
Morale makes the game too easy if you don't rush like a moron.
Parry working on everything makes the combat look dumb especially vs. large monsters.
I wouldn't mind a Wo Long 2 if they fixed these things and giving you a customizable moveset would be good as well.
I would like parrying more if it was like Nioh where certain parries would shift around enemy positioning or allow you to do certain setups, instead of this sekiro rhythm-like thing that is all execution with not much depth to the mechanic
parrying working on everything is very wuxia, I like it.
It should work on things that make sense to be parried, not on shit like puddles on the ground.
I'll parry puddles all I like
I think that would be cool, yeah.
In general, I liked Wo Long's combat more than Nioh's and abotu on par with Stranger of Paraidse
The only other thing I'd do is change a bit about how Reinforcements work. I'd give them a variety of AI + give them their own estus supply
The other thing I want from any Wo Long sequel is the opportunity to do shit with our bros. Give us some mini games we can do to raise our bond level, not just combat.
Elden Ring.
Basically it needs a Wo Shlong treatment: more ashes of war per weapon, Bloodborne style dodge (roll while unlocked, quickstep while locked, put bhstep on some talisman) and no action on the left stick press cause it fricks up my inputs when I accidentally hold it too tigtht.
I would make defensive options more interesting for ER so it's not just rolling and rolling. maybe something like Nioh where the different stances have different types of dodges with their own strengths and weaknesses (i.e. low stance has fast dash but doesn't go very far, high stance has a roll that goes far but long recovery, all with varying levels of i-frames).
maybe add more depth to shields too, guard counters are a good start
you forgot the most important thing, blocking should actually do something. kind of silly how in all of the dark souls games, blocking with anything weaker than a greatshield either doesn't block much damage to be worthwhile, or has stability so low you get guardbroken if you try it.
Elden Ring being "Just Dark Souls 3.5" was the lamest shit ever.
I tried to convince myself when I first saw the gameplay, like maybe the horse would be fun. No. It just sucked.
DS3's estus system sucked too. I play grug Str so I don't use much Mana
I end up with a bazillion HP Estus and zero mana estus and I can just faceroll the game
>Elden Ring being "Just Dark Souls 3.5"
you are a fricking moron
>Basically it needs a Wo Shlong treatment: more ashes of war per weapon
No it doesn't, they would be insanely OP if you could chain them instantly
>Bloodborne style dodge (roll while unlocked, quickstep while locked, put bhstep on some talisman)
No, rolling is perfectly fine. It should be clunky and have an high recovery so that you are incentivized to walk and run
>I would make defensive options more interesting for ER so it's not just rolling and rolling. maybe something like Nioh where the different stances have different types of dodges with their own strengths and weaknesses (i.e. low stance has fast dash but doesn't go very far, high stance has a roll that goes far but long recovery, all with varying levels of i-frames).
No, that's trash. Rolling needs to be a quick far away roll for quick evasion and with iframes. Nioh is entirely centered on dash spamming, which is why you Niohgays want to downgrade the game with 10 iframes zero recovery sidesteps
>maybe add more depth to shields too, guard counters are a good start
There's nothing missing in Elden Ring shields
>you forgot the most important thing, blocking should actually do something
Blocking in Elden Ring can make attack bounce and interrupt, counter, shield bash, parry, cast magic or has several special attacks. It also allows shield poking or counters, the latter which is considered a special skill in Wo Long but is basic block moveset
> kind of silly how in all of the dark souls games, blocking with anything weaker than a greatshield either doesn't block much damage to be worthwhile, or has stability so low you get guardbroken if you try it.
That's ot true at all
frick off pvpBlack person
seethe
Pennys big flop.
They're doing tweaks now. they're going to fix a number of gameplay problems and bugs aswell as fix the pixelated visuals.
I just hope they can fix everything and I think the game could be really good. unfortunately they're not going to redesign them main character.
All this game needs is a fricking lock-on. That's it.
I would have actually liked this game if 90% of the npcs you beat up werent woman. its just ridiculous.
i actually liked sifu because you beat women
Just finished the first DLC. Honestly, it's way better than I expected. Doesn't fix any of the issues people complained about but I was okay with them in the main game so more of the same good combat is good enough for me.
It helps that the new enemies and bosses in the DLC are proper tough
Dian Wei is a tricky frick
>Dian Wei is a tricky frick
I may be a bit overleveled or just have an OP build but I didn't find him too difficult. Amazing boss fight though. When I looked up the name just to double check that's the boss I have in mind a r*ddit thread came up calling him completely broken and unfair. Just block wtf...
He was fixed since release (less shitting the screen with wind and lighting effects) and the player was extremely buffed overall.
I'm telling you team ninja are cursed, they know how to make good combat(probably the best) but lack on every other department and their game feel rushed
Anyway, i played this and enjoyed it even though it's not good as nioh 2, i hope they ronin turn out to be a good game without any bugs and they get enough money to make another nioh or ninja gaiden
>I'm telling you team ninja are cursed, they know how to make good combat(probably the best) but lack on every other department and their game feel rushed
I like their games and have been shilling them since the first Nioh. But I do think they should hire new lvl/visual designers and story writers. They have someone amazing designing combat and a bunch of shitters doing everything else which makes no sense at this point. Ronin does seem like their attempt to try to add more than combat to their games but we're yet to see how that works out.
What's wrong with the animations?
NTA, but the animations in Wo Long are kinda jank especially in some situations where you're parrying big mobs. Still, I wouldn't call the terrible. Terrible animations is when you play some wester game and pressing attack makes your character skate towards the enemy and then the enemy does a barely readable twitch motion and hits you even though you were standing behind him.
objectively bad combat animations are like in the first lords of the fallen game where the animations are slow and deliberate but lack the smooth-in/smooth out motion (+hitstop) that gives attacks weight. the result looks like swinging a weapon underwater.
capcom japan devs complained about this when developing DmC with ninja theory. the filthy gaijins didn't know basic principles like smooth-in/smooth out so the nips had to be brought in to fix up the animations
You can't fix shit animations. That has consistently been Team Ninja's Achilles heel and they have made no progress over 4 games. If LoP can nail it on their first try then it is a skill issue.
imo wo long's animations were nice and flowy like a wuxia film. their real achilles heel is level design. wo long was an improvement in exploration but still lots of reused assets and ugly same-y environments
also what's LoP?
I agree with everything you said
>also what's LoP?
Lies of P, really good game, I'd rate it almost as high as From Software games.
I don't know, maybe if I watched it in slow-mo I would know what you mean but during actual gameplay everything looks great to me. I like the sounds of parrying and the way it looks.
Hopefully Ronin will do just that. People are hating on the visuals in that game already too but the trailers look great to me personally. But I'm also not a graphic gay.
Yeah, I thought about that. Right now it feels balanced and fair imo.
is there a video on this I can watch? sounds really interesting
"Slow in and slow out" is part of the 12 basic principles of animation. not necessary however to follow them all or you just get a disney cartoon, but slow in and slow out is important for action games to convey weightiness. I read that according to the aforementioned interviews with capcom jp devs working on DmC, so im assuming it's industry standard there
Looks really interesting, will watch the whole series, thanks anon
nioh 2 definitely has that problem too
Not to the same extent. It had like 50-60 unique normal enemies, while wo long has like 25. The problem is that like a third of them were intorduced in the DLCs and you don't get to encounter DLC enemies in the main campaign until NG++.
>That has consistently been Team Ninja's Achilles heel
Shocking hearing this when Ninja Gaiden 2 and 3RE's animations are better 99% of the industry and haven't been topped.
Then again, that's a very different Team Ninja
I hope team ninja become the next fromsoft because there's literally no one who make combat system like them but they need to fix and improve their level design, world building/art direction and loot system
this
i wish you didn't have to wade through so much shit to enjoy the combat, it really ruins it
Animation are ok and never bothered me but god please hire some good level designers, worldbuilder
I really like wo long and from its release I never saw a problem with the game. wo long with all its dlc was the game from 2023 in my view.
Eh the only thing good about the game is how your weapon swings. Bosses suck, design sucks, post game sucks, ending sucks, dlcs suck. So as long as you enjoy hitting buttons it's great. But beyond that it's just lmao.
imo the bosses are the high point of the game for me that kept me playing. fighting demon soldiers over and over got boring
Modern team ninja games have a pretty low enemy variey with Nioh 2 being the sole exception, but that wouldn't be a problem if you could easily fight more than 1 enemy at a time, so they could design their maps like DMC/NG where you're constantly fighting groups of enemies. They need to drop the soulslike 1v1 bullshit asap.
Enemy variety doesn't matter if fighting them boils down to pressing deflect at the right time.
sekiro was a mistake. everyone's trying to copy their parry based system now. it's a shallow way to design combat around a silver bullet mechanic that fits every situation.
sekiro and wo long were still decent but this trend has to end
>This game would be good if only I could spam samey bloated attack moves all eith the same purpose
why are Niohgays like this?
yeah longsword is OP as fuark
>turns into a demon
>becomes a jobber
This boss fight was a travesty