I've been a fan of Zelda since Link to the Past, but one thing I've never been able to reconcile was the inter-game consistency the timeline theory* was meant to instill. This line from The Wind Waker establishes, for me, that each game falls loosely within the backdrop or context of some other game in the franchise, but that each story should be interpreted like writers of comics do their stories—standalone, save for a few major plot points.
The Wind Waker doesn't cast Ganondorf as the epitome of evil. He's morally gray, at most, and the internal consistency of the story works best when the player takes Ganondorf at face value when he claims that the reason he invaded Hyrule was because his people were impoverished and dying.
The strange, obsessive desire to back-compat each game into its own static place in the "timeline" is borne of pure weaponized autism and nothing more.
*theory = I understand it's technically canon, but not even the game devs felt good about the decision to create a hard timeline. Why else do you think they flat-out refuse to give a BotW/TotK a place in the timeline?
They shouldn’t have made direct sequels or callbacks (like the Hero of Time in Twilight Princess) to begin with, then. Otherwise people will keep speculating
No they had to because OoT is the only game anyone gives two shits about.
Yeah normies will lap up whatever the latest trash Zelda game is puked out, but no one thinks back fondly about any of them except for OoT or MM or Link to the Past maybe.
All a callback or reference is 90% of the time is just a cute nod or eye wink like "heh, remember that?" for older player's dopamine receptors to activate. Any speculation beyond it is retarded. The Hero's Shade being OOT Link doesn't actually add anything to the game or the lore of the world in the same way that the history of the Fused Shadows or the Twili do. It's just autism and a desire to connect your lego blocks to each other even when they logically shouldn't.
You act like there’s a problem with this series in Nintendo’s eyes, there isn’t. The lore stuff hasn’t decreased sales or interest at all
>He enjoys Tears of mom's Tendies.
Not what I said dumbasses. But please keep calling me the nintendie for your own hanging on every one of Nintendo’s words
Modern Nintendo is trash.
Modern Sony is trash.
Modern Microsoft is trash.
Modern media in general is trash.
Books are still good, even though mostly older ones are the only ones worth reading.
Lol they’re calling me a tendie for saying Nintendo drops meaningless references to other Zelda games which don’t matter. Right I guess the best way to not be a tendie is to play every Zelda game and get mad while doing self-assigned homework about them lol
What authors do you like anon?
>trusting rotten tomatoes
Couldn't be me
Brainlet take, expected. Nobody said anything about sales or popularity, chud.
so according to your ""opinion"" they should have scrapped an absolutely kino moment and character that not only is a neat callback but also a great solution to add more depth to the gameplay content through it as a device just because some autist MIGHT have made a spreadsheet?
go basejumping off a dock, retard.
That means we wouldn't have gotten any of the games, moron. All of them are tied to another game.
>Otherwise people will keep speculating
speculating is really fun
Best post. It’s just standalone games with some themes in commons and references. Trying to tie them in is just dumb autism. The developers don’t care and neither should anyone else.
>Oracle of S/A after Link's Awakening.
>When it's about Link returning to Hyrule after having a personal journey.
For what possible reason? Did some retard look at Malon in OoS and go
>"Duuuh, Marin must be based on her and Link didn't see her in ALttP, this HAS to come first!"
Link gets on a boat at the end of Seasons/Ages. He's on a boat at the beginning of Link's Awakening.
The only thing, and I repeat, the ONLY thing I care about the timelines is the fact that it supports my ship. Otherwise it is incoherent nonsnse.
Link being horny for red heads is obvious without timeline nonsense.
I guess. Them retconning Marin to be related to Malon and not Zelda in Link's Awakening was just about the only timeline related shenanigans I can support. Well that and Hero's Shade was cool.
>I understand it's technically canon, but not even the game devs felt good about creating a timeline
that's fucking horseshit and I am sick and tired of your morons purporting that like it's true. they purposely made games sequels and prequels to one another and said as much. when they were asked about a timeline they confirmed there was not just a split in Ocarina of Time but a double split into three separate continuities.
To be fair, WW was also after Majora at one stage too
Why does franchise having a timeline make people seethe so much?
>Why does franchise having a timeline make people seethe so much?
It's not that it has a timeline, it's more of the fact that the games, outside of their direct sequels, were obviously made without considering the story beats from any other game and then crammed into a nonsensical triple timeline.
Hell, I'd argue that Tears of the Kingdom doesn't even take place after Breath of the Wild and that they're just similar games. You can't tell me all that sheikah shit, including those huge ass columns surrounding the castle, just magically disappeared overnight. Zonai shit seems like a step down from sheikah tech and everyone is all flummoxed by how their hot air balloons work? Gimme a break.
>You can't tell me all that sheikah shit, including those huge ass columns surrounding the castle, just magically disappeared overnight
Yeah why wouldn't it? Sheikah stuff dematerializes all the time in BoTW. Hell, Link dematerializes when using the Sheikah slate. The calamity was stopped, it served its purpose and it all unanimously fucked off out of existence.
>Yeah why wouldn't it? Sheikah stuff dematerializes all the time in BoTW. Hell, Link dematerializes when using the Sheikah slate. The calamity was stopped, it served its purpose and it all unanimously fucked off out of existence.
Because they didn't 10k years ago when diet coke not-even-the-real-deal ganon attacked and they repelled him. There are entire battlefields in BoTW with broken shiekah shit that lasted 100 years. Those shrines stay long after they are "used," .etc
The devs are hoping you won't think about it to reduce their frame rates: simple as.
Breath of the Wild even ends with Vah Ruta breaking down and Zelda and Link going to investigate. Tears of the Kingdom even has a sidequest that acknowledges that all the old Sheikah shit mysteriously going away makes it hard to teach the history of the Calamity to Hateno's schoolchildren.
You have no proof
Yes, that's the problem Symin has with teaching the schoolkids. You gotta photograph the Calamity mural in Impa's house and bring it back to class.
This. Symin also outright tells the kids about the calamity 100 years ago AND Link beating the calamity recently and even mentions the Divine Beasts so it's not like TotK is a separate reality. It's a direct sequel like it was advertised to be.
The columns disappeared in BotW itself. Those are where the Guardians are housed.
There are NPCs that clearly talk about BotW events, the issue is they didn't explain it clearly what they did in the 5 years. Getting rid of the inactive guardians is a no brainer since the calamity took them over, and then you have shit like the hollowed out shrine of resurrection where directly below it underground is a healing spring.
I can buy they cleared the guardians and even the beasts blued away like Links bike because of that chosen one bullshit they did in the DLC suggesting they won't be needed again for a subsequent calamity.
It didn't disappear overnight, Zelda says the elephant is breaking in the epilogue of BotW and its like a five year gap
It did disappear overnight. The calamity still happened and is documented. Purah and Robbie tech are all still Sheikah tech from the calamity. Why it disappear? I don't fucking know.
I'm so tired of morons like you. Yes, it's very obvious that the games were not developed with a single coherent timeline in mind, and Nintendo was retarded for trying to put every single zelda game into a definitive canon, especially when it meant creating a third timeline out of OoT even though that makes no sense.
However, this doesn't mean that there aren't Zelda games that are explicit, obvious sequels to each other. Zelda 2 is a sequel to Zelda 1. Link's Awakening is a sequel to Link to the Past. Ocarina of time's child timeline has Majora's Mask and Twilight Princess. OoT's adult timeline lead to Wind Waker and then Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks. Minish Cap leads to Four Swords which leads to Four Swords Adventures.
Obviously these different continuities were not ever intended to intertwine. But that doesn't mean that Zelda games being sequels should be wholly discarded, because they very frequently inform character attitudes and decisions, and ignoring this aspect in favor of "it's just zelda lol" both underappreciates the well written zelda games and also allows Nintendo to get away with lazy and shitty writing in the modern day.
>Yes, it's very obvious that the games were not developed with a single coherent timeline in mind, and Nintendo was retarded for trying to put every single zelda game into a definitive canon, especially when it meant creating a third timeline out of OoT even though that makes no sense.
I think that's all most of us are saying (Not that I speak for 'most' of us anons). There is one autist trying to claim that certain games aren't direct sequels of each other, but I think we can all agree he is fucking retarded as you eloquently point out here:
>However, this doesn't mean that there aren't Zelda games that are explicit, obvious sequels to each other. Zelda 2 is a sequel to Zelda 1. Link's Awakening is a sequel to Link to the Past. Ocarina of time's child timeline has Majora's Mask and Twilight Princess. OoT's adult timeline lead to Wind Waker and then Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks. Minish Cap leads to Four Swords which leads to Four Swords Adventures.
this is why skyward sword sucks, it robs the world and it's characters of their motivations. link cannot be just someone with the balls to challenge destiny, he's literally the same fag reborn. Zelda is the reincarnation of a super secret, never before talked about goddess, ganondorf is literally just someone else's grudge which makes him a puppet with no real goal. even the fucking sword has a spirit within it and only responds to link, going against what other games told us about who can wield it. the entire fucking hame ought to be reconnected, it feels like fucking fan fiction.
Wind Waker is an example of a hero earning the mantle, not being born to it so I don't think it means Link is some destined thing. There isn't even a Link around for the sealing of Ganondorf in past Hyrule, and you can question if the Zonai hero is even a Link.
Skyward Sword retconned it. Every Link is THE Link now
Incorrect, it doesn't fuck with WW at all, it strengthens it with the King and jabun speech
Wrong, WW Link is now a reincarnation
Except THE Link doesn't exist in the WW Timeline, until WW Link comes along and establishes that he's now THE Link of that timeline.
>Except THE Link doesn't exist in the WW Timeline
Ganondorf says otherwise.
Ganondorf explicitly says WW Link is the reincarnation of OoT Link.
Doesn't really matter what the senile old fuck says because the goddesses made his ass work for the triforce instead of just giving it to him like the other pansy links
Some Links don't even have the Triforce, so a reborn Link having to earn it isn't necessarily unheard of.
yeah they aren't reincarnations of OoT link though
All of them are reincarnations. Skyward Sword and Hyrule Historia are both pretty clear about that.
Show a single source in Skyward Sword.
Skyward Sword is the source, play the game. Not gonna spoonfeed you.
Have fun being blissfully ignorant about a series that constantly namedropped the concept of reincarnation for like 20 years now, then.
And you're stupid.
Keep going lazybones
Shut the fuck up and prove otherwise retard, you have nothing.
I have Wind Waker, Skyward Sword, Hyrule Historia and Hyrule Encyclopedia.
>Hyrule Historia and Hyrule Encyclopedia
Lmao, so nothing in game. got it
You got nothing
>retard moves goalposts when he's disproven
I have official materials. You have literally nothing outside of your own headcanon.
>I have official materials. You have literally nothing outside of your own headcanon.
Not that I have a dog in your current debate, but "official canon" means jack shit. Nintendo could retcon it all tomorrow for all it matters anon: it happens all the god damn time. Who knows what Nintendo will acknowledge as canon ten years from now? Both of you have as much clout in this as some random sido/link slash fic author. About the only thing someone can reasonably be sure about is what is said in the actual game and only then as a slice of that game's continuity.
So you admit Termina is a dream world that stopped existing when Link left?
If that is the current canon, then yes, so be it.
King of Red Lions tells the fish that WW Link has no connection to the Hero of Time and does NOT have the Goddess' favor, but he's shown courage and he's the best option they have.
In Wind Waker's setting, the Spirit of the Hero completely vanished from Hyrule when the Hero of Time was sent back to the past until Wind Waker Link restored the Master Sword and the Triforce of Courage himself
>King of Red Lions tells the fish that WW Link has no connection to the Hero of Time
He's just talking about blood relation. Ganondorf said what he said, it's directly mentioned in the game's script.
Can you cite the exact line? Not saying you're wrong, just can't recall it.
>the same fag reborn
maybe you're just a gay anon
The good thing is that your shitty headcanon will never be true.
>The strange, obsessive desire to back-compat each game into its own static place in the "timeline" is borne of pure weaponized autism and nothing more.
the only game imo that really forced this was Skyward Sword. the rest is just fans being stupidly obessisive over MUH TIMELINE YOOO WHERE DOES THIS FIT IN THE TIMELINE
when the 3 way split is just so comically fucking stupid in the first place
>the rest is just fans being stupidly obessisive over MUH TIMELINE YOOO WHERE DOES THIS FIT IN THE TIMELINE
Anon, 3 timelines are official
yeah, they threw them a bone once like 10 years ago. you do not see nintendo or zelda games intricately trying to weave together new theories and timeline placements, that is all fans.
>yeah, they threw them a bone once like 10 years ago
And there wasn't a single new game until botw since, which specifically takes place shitton years in the future
Totk is after skyward
Wiki has proved it
>Zelda 2 is a sequel to Zelda 1
>ALTTP is a prequel to Zelda 1
>OOT is a prequel to ALTTP
>MM is a direct sequel to OOT
>WW is a sequel to OOT
>PH/ST are sequels to WW
>TP is a sequel to OOT
>SS is a prequel to OO
The rest of the games don't have a concrete place in any timeline
LTTP is not a prequel to anything other than Link's Awakening. OOT is not a prequel to LTTP even though it's kind of close.
I mean the timeline is a pittance because fans asked for a timeline every instance despite each game being clearly seperate except for the few that are direct sequels like 1 and 2, lttp and it's handheld sequels, MM, etc.
and they decided to screw with all the timelines and do a soft reboot with BOTW and ToTK (which replaces OOT) so they can repeat the cycle again
bravo Nintend𐐬, all for the neverending franchise and infinite money
Every game until Four Swords had a clear relation to every other game. TP was the first time we saw major continuity errors, covered up with
>O-oh, well, the timeline!!
is this true with 3d zeldas only? Or are the 2d zeldas up until 2005 also all connected?
Four Swords was like 2003, man.
But yeah, 2 is a direct sequel to 1, 3 is a prequel, Awakening is a sequel to 3, Oracles were sequels to Awakening.
He's also returning to Hyrule in Oracles. Where is he returning from?
>Le morally GRAY!
Right.. that's why he attacks children, tries to kidnap princesses, laughs VERY devilishly, tries to steal power, assumes the form of a monster and commands other monsters, uses dark magic, etc, etc.
Oh yeah poor little orphan ganondorf. He just wants a loaf of bread.
He could have simply gone to Hyrule, like other Gerudo women were known to do, but instead of picking up a sexual partner, just found a job and earned an honest living. That's what a decent person does.
He did what he did in TWW in order to restore Hyrule.
>To gain power and dominion over everyone again
You spelled it wrong, chap.
The reason he needed to restore Hyrule in the first place was because he completely assravaged and destroyed it to the point where the gods themselves decided to wipe the slate clean and try again.
Even his motivation for bringing it back is pretty easily implied that he feels like conquering the small amount of civilization left is beneath him.
tl;dr around blacks...you can finish it.
Anon, the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Ganondorf is a textbook example.
>that's why he attacks children, tries to kidnap princesses
Weak shit. TotK Dorf would have slaughtered them.
>He could have simply gone to Hyrule, like other Gerudo women were known to do, but instead of picking up a sexual partner, just found a job and earned an honest living. That's what a decent person does.
Wow, get a look at this idiot. That's what a loser does. No one remembers a loser. Everyone remembers Alexander the great and idolizes, some even deify him to the point of literally worshipping him as a god to this day and he murdered hundreds of thousands.
If Ganon did anything wrong, it was turning into a literal pig demon monster: that has never helped any time it's been tried.
>He should have abandoned his throne, left the women to suffer in the desert.
No real king would be content to let his subjects suffer. We know he would still fuck up once he gained Hyrule, but the years after his defeat left him with time to reflect. Beyond humiliation of losing again and being locked away from the sacred realm, flooding Hyrule was not the right wish. The King of Red Lions was trying to kill the past, not create a better future. And in doing so, caused even more death than Ganondorf had in OoT’s future timeline. The largest being the genocide of the Gerudo women.
Ganondorf himself killed his own clan in the ALttP backstory
You will never be the Champion of Hyrule. You have no Master Sword, you have no rupees, you have no heart containers. You are a blond twink twisted by Zonai tech and implants into a crude mockery of nature’s perfection, Ganon. All the “validation” you get is two-faced and half-hearted. Behind your back, the goddesses mock you. Your fellow soldiers are disgusted and ashamed of you, the champions laugh at your girlish appearance behind closed doors. Gerudo are utterly repulsed by you. Thousands of years of evolution have allowed Gerudo to sniff out frauds with incredible efficiency. Even Hyruleans who “pass” look uncanny and unnatural to a Gerudo. Your triforce of courage is a dead giveaway. And even if you manage to get a champion to go home with you, he’ll turn tail and bolt the second he gets a whiff of your low durability, 10 minute recharge master sword. You will never be happy. You wrench out a fake "HYUT" every single morning and tell yourself it’s going to be ok, but deep inside you feel Ganon's supremacy creeping up like a weed, ready to crush you under the unbearable weight. Eventually it’ll be too much to bear - you’ll spend all your zonai charges, tie a noose, attach it to a rocket platform construction, and plunge into the unforgiving skies. The champions will find you, heartbroken but relieved that they no longer have to live with the unbearable shame and disappointment of a 'hero' like you. They’ll bury you with a headstone marked with unreadable Hyrulean squiggles, and every Korok for the rest of eternity will use you as fertilizer. Your body will decay and go back to the dust, and all that will remain of your legacy is a skeleton that clearly never defeated Ganondorf.
It's a shit game for retards like OP who derive pleasure from monotonous tasks like reposting the same thread over and over.
>The Wind Waker doesn't cast Ganondorf as the epitome of evil.
Dude, he steals your sister, and then the game ends with you stabbing him in the forehead. It's not some morally grey story, it's for kids, ganon is evil/bad/the enemy and that's it.
Zelda games have a significant focus on archaeology and discovering new exotic fantasy cultures in the world and in the world’s history - every Zelda game includes a separate, unforeseen history and people for you to discover and learn about. This has been a huge appeal of the series since forever. Though they have a timeline, the specific point of each game is to establish a whole new world. There’s like eight threads right now puzzling themselves over the game’s place in the lore, fact is part of the Zelda formula is to reinvent the worlds history and culture every time, so you can discover it. It’s that simple
Most modern Zelda games are based on some point in history which is a really interesting part of the games (to me) at least
Wind Waker literally directly connects itself to ocarina of time specifically. Of all the games you could have picked, you picked one which sets the story of its game explicitly on the back of another (and then it gets two explicit sequels.)
This is such a midwit take.
This isn't Ganondorf being morally gray, this is Ganondorf trying to justify his own actions to himself after centuries of imprisonment and self-reflection.
He was once blinded by pure rage and malice, but after his defeat and subsequent capture he calmed down, but because he's still actually evil he feels the need to justify his own actions as being out of jealousy or for the sake of his people.
Think about it - what is Ganon even fighting for in The Wind Waker?
The Gerudo are gone, Hyrule is gone. What does he stand to gain here outside of some sense of self-gratification from beating up the descendants of the people that defeated him centuries prior?
He's clinging on to a world and a conflict that's long moved past him for no other reason than that same old lust for power and domination.
While I agree with you, especially because it became popular for Ganker to shitpost him as morally grey lately
>Think about it - what is Ganon even fighting for in The Wind Waker?
He fights to restore Hyrule, this is why he goes upshit when king makes a wish in the end to destroy Hyrule for good in the end
He could conquer islands whenever he wanted, but he really fucked wanted Hyrule, kingdom that was long gone
>The Gerudo are gone, Hyrule is gone. What does he stand to gain here outside of some sense of self-gratification from beating up the descendants of the people that defeated him centuries prior?
Defeating your enemies is what you should do. Can't defeat them anymore? Punish their descendants. This is humanity 101 level shit.
>He's clinging on to a world and a conflict that's long moved past him for no other reason than that same old lust for power and domination.
Based? If I had the power and means to do so I would absolutely go conquer that chicken shit hyrule. I fucking hate those guys and their pansy ass society. You know what I'd do to the castle town? Fill it with zombies. And lava. Lots of lava. That shit is cool. You know what's even cooler? A fucking pipe organ. That shit has style.
Your school bully isn't here, you don't have to pretend to be hard.
>He's morally gray, at most
Yeah I remember the quest where you have to make the Master Sword sparkle with the power to repel morally gray.
>STOP ASKING FOR DEPTH CHUD, EVERYTHING NEEDS TO BE BLACK AND WHITE LIKE MY MARVEL MOVIES
>LIKE MY MARVEL MOVIES
MCU's to blame for MUH MORALLY GRAY shit for the most part.
>Here's a guy who wants to kill half of the entire Universe
>But his planet died 🙁
What depth? He's a self-proclaimed evil man who says something sappy just to bitch slap Link when he's off guard and steal his triforce. You're basing this entire character's personality on one line he said that completely contradicts his actions.
How do you go from this to THIS and THIS?! Can someone explain to me what the fuck connects these things together other than they lived in the sky? And also that Rauru looks nothing like OoT Rauru? But that is a whole other thing to talk about.
OoT Rauru and nu-Rauru are different. The Hyrule in BoTW/ToTK is a different Hyrule founded after the other Hyrules. BoTW-era Zeldas are effectively a reboot.
So it's a different Ganondorf too then?
That's kinda lame. Seeing a shriveled up corpse Ganondorf was kinda sick in the trailer, like the one you fought in OoT has been shriveled up for tens of thousands of years just waiting to be released.
yeah no sorry. spoilers, it's literally a new universe. I kind of hate it but I feel like it's also fine and welcomed. I hate timeline gayry, it puts my mind to ease that it's not a thing with these games.
>spoilers, it's literally a new universe
*zora tablets mentioning ruto blocks your path*
Teba's wife literally calls the top of Rito Village "Vah Medoh's Perch" IIRC
I liked the fan theory that lore from the other timelines seeped into one timeline due to them all being merged at one point in Hyrule Warriors.
but apparently Hyrule Warriors isn't considered canon, because fuck the one thing that could make BotW referencing every timeline make sense canonically, right?
The next official timeline will probably jam Hyrule Warriors in there to explain the convergence. I bet it'll also include Age of Calamity as an alternate branch to BotW, so we'll have another split anyway kek.
in TotK, doesn't Rauru state at one point that Zelda comes from a world where she didn't help in the past? That implies another timeline split in that game as well
That line makes no sense because Ganondorf recognizes Zelda and Link's name at the start of the game. Rauru was just speculating, probably.
But that would mean there's a canon femcel idol girl witch crying and dancing because no hero bf
what? I'm saying the botw-verse is a new universe. They deleted the events of skyward sword etc. everything happens different than the timeline we knew.
How did they delete the events of SS?
They never founded a kingdom in that game and Fi is still present
and i'm saying you're literally wrong if you played botw
There's multiple links, zeldas, ganons, etc. There can be multiple hyrules too. The events of Zelda just repeat themselves over and over.
Hyrule had fallen to a shell of itself twice during the fallen timeline (AoL suggests a refounded with the Zelda 1 thing at some stage) and even adult had a completely new one.
But it doesn't matter, the wiki has spoken.
>what? I'm saying the botw-verse is a new universe. They deleted the events of skyward sword etc. everything happens different than the timeline we knew.
>Why are so many people in absolutely denial about Zelda having a timeline?
Because the one proposed in historia is shit and all alternate explanations are dumb. Everything works out much better when you think of each one and its direct sequels as their own alternate reality. The Japanese do this all the time so there should be no issues.
So you're just butthurt your headcanon was wrong?
>So you're just butthurt your headcanon was wrong?
Why are you butthurt at us pointing out that the idea that there is a timeline is retarded? What stake do you have in us laughing at it?
Why are you so butthurt at the idea of a timeline being canon?
>What stake do you have in us laughing at it?
Ah, so now laughing at anti-timelinefags is wrong but when you fags shit on timelinefags is awright.
>Why are you so butthurt at the idea of a timeline being canon?
1. Because it's obviously a fucking lie Nintendo made for marketing, Zelda has sequels of course, but there are a half dozen continuities which obviously were never considered to be related to one another
2. The way it was implemented was sloppy and lazy, with the most egregious example being the "link dies" timeline, because that doesn't make any fucking sense, that's not how time travel works.
3. The Hyrule Historia timeline is inextricably tied to the retarded Skyward Sword story involving Demise and Hylia, which permanently and retroactively ruined the main characters of every Zelda game by removing all of their agency.
I'm confused, are you saying simping for Nintendo's bad writing is laughing at those laughing at it or are you laughing at the anons laughing at the bad fan timelines? Or are you laughing at life? Or are you just retarded?
The silly thing is then producing a timeline, adding and amending to it, creating a Warriors game that pulls directly from three different timelines in the game itself, and then making BotW talk about heroes of oceans, time, skies and twilight in reference to the sword.
Nintendo encourages it themselves, even if they didn't initially.
>creating a Warriors game that pulls directly from three different timelines in the game itself
That reminds me
Isn't Cia basically an immortal demigod existing outside of but around the timelines?
That's my biggest issue here.
Nintendo pumps the game full of clapbait but never truly goes balls deep into it. It's always some superficial crap.
They want to have their cake and eat it too. It's obnoxious.
Especially now with canonising the amiiboap and dlc items.
Japan also does "Let's just use disconnected works as building blocks for a universe/timeline" all the time too. Like look at Godzilla and Ultraman.
>So it's a different Ganondorf too then?
Old Ganondorf is dead in every timeline. Aonuma says BoTW-era Zelda takes place in the distant future after every other Zelda. Presumably, after the previous games, Hyrule gets destroyed or something and Rauru founds nu-hyrule, Ganondorf gets sealed away, and then BoTW/ToTK happen 10,000 years later.
No, the past events of Tears after before Minisj Cap
It's a lazy ass reboot too because it still calls back to the old timeline way too fucking much.
Like the Master Sword existing, which has Fi's voice in it meaning the events of SS still happened, where the founding of Hyrule went completely differently.
Also never mind that the MS exists because it was originally forged to kill Demise, but Demise doesn't exist in this new Zelda because it's a reboot.
So Master Sword is just some random demon killing sword that just happens to exist just because?
>where the founding of Hyrule went completely differently
They never founded Hyrule is Skyward Sword.
Demise was only a title for the Demon King in the Japanese SS, not his actual name. He could very well have been a Dorf incarnation the whole time.
They're clear in interviews that he is something else.
>Demise was only a title for the Demon King in the Japanese SS
Misinfo spread by some dipshit claiming to know Japanese doesn't make it accurate. Demise isn't a Dorf but he is the predecessor to one.
I guess, but it is still clear and evident that the Master Sword was originally and specifically forged to KILL Demise, doesn't matter if it's a title or not.
Hell, for all we know the "Demise" title, could just be the demon's term for a king, which it most likely is.
They're just reusing ideas. TotK clearly has no connection to the other Zelda games anymore, they stopped trying. Note this is the FIRST time Ganondorf has appeared in a way that makes it impossible for him to be the OoT Ganondorf.
SOMEONE didn't play Four Swords Adventures.
>This never happened.
>THAT DOESN'T COUNT!
Developed by Nintendo, eat shit.
Actually FSA is considered a mainline game by Nintendo.
Its writers also handled Twilight Princess.
The problem is Skyward Sword. The rest of the games match fairly well in canon and tone, but Skyward Sword basically retcons a bunch of stuff.
The Hylia/Demise backstory fucks with the characterization of Zelda/Link/Ganon.
Before Skyward Sword, Ganon could be a nuanced villain who initially invaded to help his people and got overwhelmed with the power. Now he's just a host for pure evil.
>Ganon could be a nuanced villain who initially invaded to help his people
He never did this in any of the prior games
He was always evil.
The first thing he does in the first game he's in is steal the Triforce of Power, which overwhelms him. He's corrupted by the power.
The only indication of his characterization prior to that is that his speech from Windwaker which gives nuance to his actions. He did bad things for a good reason.
To go "He's evil, he's always evil" undermines how he's actually portrayed in OoT and WW just to make a worse narrative.
>The first thing he does in the first game he's in is steal the Triforce of Power, which overwhelms him. He's corrupted by the power.
He did evil shit like kill the deku tree before he even got the triforce, and Zelda could sense his evil aura
>He did bad things for a good reason.
He was buttering up Link with a somewhat sympathetic speech before literally sucker punching him lol
>Ganon could be a nuanced villain who initially invaded to help his people
Ganondorf didn't want to help the Gerudo. He wanted to help himself. How many Gerudo moved into castle town when Ganondorf took the triforce of power in OoT? Zero. Instead, the town was filled with ReDeads.
WW is a direct sequel to OoT and has to be considered in light of OoT.
Ganondorf isn't suddenly not evil anymore. Rather, he explains that his obsession with the kingdom of Hyrule comes from a place of jealousy. Covetousness doesn't make a person not evil, it makes them evil
>thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife
>thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's goods
Ganondorf is pure evil in OoT and the Gerudos were mostly all complicit goons in Ocarina of Time and I'm so glad I don't care enough about timelines to start needlessly complicating a series for children.
>Gerudos were mostly all complicit goons in Ocarina of Time
The Gerudos took the first chance they got on a random dude who was happened to be good at sneaking and stabbing things and immediately helped him get to where he needed to go in a quest to overthrow their leader. By and large, none of them liked Ganondorf much and only put up a token resistance.
That's still being complicit and the Gerudos are still evil. I don't even think I'm disagreeing with your main point I prefer simpler Ganondorf and hate that Gerudos were pushed into these morally gray/good people in Breath of the Wild.
>each game is a retelling of the same basic story in the same way bards would retell Arthurian legends with added flourish and content
Why is this so hard to grasp? Why do people insist on some kind of elaborate interconnected lore?
Cause it's not true and you're retarded lol
the games are connected though. ocarina-twilight princess are all pretty much spelled out for you how they connect.
Because they're vastly different and Link/Zelda being reincarnations is far more interesting than each tale being a spin on the same people. That's just retarded and even lazier than what Nintendo did.
>Link/Zelda being reincarnations is far more interesting
Is it? Even if you somehow tie all of these disparate games together, what are you left with thematically that isn't also achieved by just recognizing that it's all the same story told in different ways that justify whatever gameplay/world designs the developers ahd thought up at the time? So what if they're direct reincarnations, it's not like any of the games ever really do anything with that concept, there's exactly one game that references it and it still doesn't really change anything
they're legends due to the length of time that passes between each entry, the subject of myth and folk lore, but when push comes to shove the people their hero find themselves repeating the events in a cycle, that was revealed to have been due to a powerful curse afflicting the villain and the reincarnations of the heroes
that's better than whatever you came up with, sorry
Ocarina of Time got 3 sequels all individually following up on separate plot threads.
That's more about OoT's massive success casting a shadow over future games.
>Gotta make a quick cash-in sequel, may as well use the same characters
>Okay, we want to break away from OoT definitively
>Oh fuck oh God it didn't sell UHHHHH SEQUEL
why do retards keep insisting on this when zelda 1 had zelda 2 and they both had a prequel named a link to the past and then that game had a prequel called ocarina of time which has 3 direct sequels, and its direct sequels have direct sequels
Morally gray villains. Ganondorf just wanting to be a dick and rule the world is far more entertaining.
The timeline is literally nothing but an afterthought, I bet they were sick of seeing video essays on youtube and created it to silence the bullshit. Play Zelda for gameplay and the story is a nice dressing, focus too much on the continuity and you'll never be rewarded by anything more than a cheeky reference to the ancient Hero of ___.
>the timeline theory*
Doesn't BOTW and TOTK shit all over anything that tried to establish though?
BoTW doesn't take place on the timeline, it's so far away from the other games they are consider the era of myth and basically aren't connected. It's essentially a soft-reboot going forward.
daily reminder that any male gerudo is physically unable to be anything but the man responsible for fucking shit up
the crossdresser in BOTW was a male Gerudo
He was a Hylian.
official art describes him as HYLIAN not gerudo
even then, promoting chud gayry is debatably worse than being the demon king
Ah, I see. I thought this was a real thread to discuss the series, but you are just an assblasted gay who's mad his gay fanfics where Ganondorf is the misunderstood, tragic hero from the mural got BTFO by the game.
Remember that Ganondorf was already a Jafar-tier evil witch king in OoT whom Nabooru was attempting to overthrow for the sake of her people. He's simply a bitter, tired looser in WW clinging to an ambition that no longer serves any purpose.
WW is very clear about Ganon still being evil, but it also tries to contextualize him as a man rather than some pure concept of evil. People who don't get that he's still absolutely in the wrong are weird.
My theory is that the Ganondorf in TotK is the first Ganondorf (call him Ganondorf I) considering he seems to have stronger ties to Demise than the other dorfs. So Hyrule's founding depicted in TotK really is Hyrule's founding and not some new kingdom. While Ganondorf I is sealed underground his malice leaks to the surface every several millenia and reincarnates into a new form, be it another Gerudo like Ganondorf II or something mindless and beastly like Calamity Ganon (depends on the era). These malice incarnations act independently so Ganondorf I has no recollection of whatever they're doing on the surface.
Now that the original Ganondorf is destroyed, he can no longer reincarnate.
botw/totk is effectively a reboot dude, none of it is connected to the other games
Except BotW by itself makes a lot of references to the other games.
easter eggs =/= continuity
>the ancient tablets in Zora's Domain
>Zelda's speech about the past weilders of the Master Sword
If that qualifies as an "easter egg" then you can call anything an easter egg no matter how lore driven it is.
who the fuck would name their once-in-100-years male gerudo baby ganondorf after the first one turned out to be the demon king?
kinda seems like tempting fate a bit much, don't you think?
It might be a custom. We don't actually know that much about what the Gerudo do when a male is born, other than that they declare him a king (which you could also argue is tempting fate).
Yeah, another reason I don't think TotK's kingdom is a "new" kingdom is the temple of time. Rauru's temple of time is different, and when it gets launched into the sky it becomes replaced by one that looks like the OoT temple of time. It's kinda hard to believe that there's an OoT temple of time that gets replaced with Rauru's version that gets replaced AGAIN with an OoT-like version so it seems to me that the past in TotK is the bona fide founding of Hyrule just like it says.
Even the OoT Temple moves between OoT and TP. Its inconsistent with itself between games.
>Even the OoT Temple moves between OoT and TP.
Is this actually acknowledged in the lore or is that just stylistic liberties between game maps?
It's the same temple, hence the flashbacks and theme. Either the temple moved, or the castle and town did. More likely the temple because there has never been issue moved the sword pedestal.
>It's the same temple
Exactly, so it didn't move. You're just talking about the maps being different in gameplay which is a completely separate thing to series lore.
It did move though. Its said in game by Shad or Impaz
Where? I don't recall anyone stating it moved.
It doesn't work with the castle breaking the seal.
The seal doesn't break until BotW's era because that's the only time the castle is destroyed enough to break the seal.
Did you not see OoT?
The castle also moves around too.
I said "enough to break the seal". Just because the castle has been destroyed and rebuilt several times doesn't mean the original seal was, which didn't happen until BotW.
It's nonsensical and also suggests a Ganondorf under the castle for the whole series.
>also suggests a Ganondorf under the castle for the whole series
Well yeah, that's the idea.
We've had two simultaneous Links, we can have two Gamons.
Three Zeldas at the same time now
>Ganondorf betrays Hyrule.
>Reincarnation is born centuries later.
>Gets fucked in multiple timelines.
>Evil juice has been flowing out of grandpa Ganon's gaping ass for millennia.
>Finally bursts out the ground.
>Hand is removed from ass.
>Ganon gets to reincarnate in his original body.
>His brain is still there, so he has his memories.
He doesn't have his memories of the other Ganondorfs. He only knew of Link from Rauru.
That's what I said. Reborn Ganons don't remember past Ganons, but this bro remembered Rauru because same body.
Well he doesn't have the memories of other Dorfs but he still could be the original Dorf.
Read Ganondorfs bio. He should have been released millenia ago. The most likely case is that jsut how long Rauru could hold him so he lost his strength at the exact moment Link and Zelda appeared.
That's also possible, it doesn't contradict the idea that TotK Ganondorf is the OG one though.
It's wrecked in the timelines in one game alone to the point its gone and replaced with a lava pit. Make more sense if the TotK past era is just it's own new Kingdom.
Era of the Goddess > Skyward Sword > Tears of the Kingdom (past) > rest of the games/timelines > Breath of the Wild > Tears of the Kingdom
I don't even particularly mind this outside of feeling like it diminishes the main Ganon of the series. It gives a nice reason why OoT Rauru has his name after a King of Hyrule and also as an architect of a Hylian version of the temple of time (over the sacred grounds if you see them tied to that).
Its just an odd concept that there was a Ganondorf under the castle (which moves about and gets wrecked/rebuilt) and a Zelda Dragon flying over everything for like 20k years at least. However, it sort of also suggests a merged timeline, otherwise you have two other on3s that have the exact same Zelda and Ganondorf over and under the land that we don't know of.
Hyrule castle fucking sinks into the ocean in a timeline retard
Do you want to know why this doesn't matter?
Rock salt. That's the cope for everything
And the ocean at some point recedes again. Big fucking deal brother.
The timelines merged, cope splitshitter
>considering he seems to have stronger ties to Demise than the other dorfs
Oh yeah? How
His hair glows and has black skin and has an outfit that looks like scales
>GANONDORF WAS THE HERO BROOOOOOOOO
the timeline before historia came out was fun because speculating and theorizing is fun
Everyone complains that TotK ruins Ganon's backstory.
Nobody complains that Skyward Sword invalidates Zelda 2's backstory.
OOT MM WW and TP are clearly connected by in-game proof, during WW there's so much dialogue about the Hero of Time it's almost a joke (if you didn't know the lines of dialogue that are giberrish are translated in subsequent playthroughs and there's transcriptions on the wiki)
ALttP has some story on the manual that resembles OOT so they tried to connect both with the retarded timeline, and failed because it doesn't make any sense
Zelda 1 and 2 are connected by in-game dialogue
MC and FS are connected by in-game dialogue
WW PH ST are clearly connected
ALBW is strange because ALttP was clearly a complete story but they did the ultimate nostalgiabait with this game and tried to excuse a sequel in the same exact map (the game is good though)
You can argue that Link's Awakening takes place after the Oracle games ending but those games are so vague about those things you can't be sure about them taking place after ALttP too
I can't say anything about TH or FSA because I haven't played them
You can argue that BotW is connected to OOT because of the direct mentions of Nabooru and Princess Ruto being a sage and you can also create some bullshit thory about it being connected to SS because of the Hylia shit too
That's ALL you can say about any connection of the games, anything else is fanfiction-tier
>You can argue that Link's Awakening takes place after the Oracle games ending but those games are so vague about those things you can't be sure about them taking place after ALttP too
The boat he sails off in doesn't match at all and he sees a new Zelda.
The games were released 8 years apart too, I really don't see the connection ever being he is the same Link.
Yes I agree completely specially the Zelda thing
What you can say for sure however is LA Link is ALttP one because his nightmares are the bosses from that game.
ALTTP Link apparently lived for like 500 years, given he's an old man in ALBW and Maple's there too.
The old man is 80 in the game.
He's "supposedly 80, but I doubt it."
He's a mysterious old man nobody knows. If he was just 80 everyone would know who he is. ALttP was so long ago it only exists as legends and people don't even recognize the old Hyrule Knight armor.
It's just fanwank the old man is ALttP Link
I wish he was though, I like the idea.
He literally calls himself a "Shadow Link." It's even more direct than the Hero's Shade.
Wait, Hero's Shade is ALTTP Link? All this time people said it was Ocarina of Time, which I appreciate because I think OoT Link deserved a happy ending raising his children and after a few generations leading into TP Link.
The shade is OoT Link.
Yeah, that makes more sense. Shame but I guess he wasn't upset about his life just that nobody (could) remembered him which lead to the decadence of Hyrule.
Why is ESL an insult you're in a Japanese forum and imagine being an*lo
You weren't being insulted, stupid.
No, ESL. They're saying Gramps is more overtly a Link than Hero's Shade was.
I mean Nintendo obviously doesn't give a shit about canon, so we might as well believe whatever fanwankery we want
it's the same fucking boat, fuck you
the sails don't "match" because you don't keep your sails open during a fucking storm
>completely different rigging
It's a ship retard
samest fucking boat I've ever seen.
it's so obviously supposed to be the same boat, there's no other reason to include a random unrelated boat that happens to look the fucking same in your secret ending to your zelda game
I'm sure you'll handwave this one too lmao
Get over it kid
All that proves is that it's not the same Link as the one from Link to the Past, not that Link's Awakening came before the Oracle games
(And besides, what she says doesn't completely rule out that it's a different Zelda either:
>Thank you for rescuing me. My name is Zelda. You are Link, right? I knew it at first glance.
You could argue that her saying she knew he was Link at first glance is proof they already knew each other)
It's even more evident in Japanese they don't know each other.
>Koholint shaped cloud
K I N O
Makes more sense as being after Awakening to me because
>No Wind Fish Egg
>No storm in the horizon
Yep. This is the end of ALttP Link's journey.
>He's morally gray
He kills the two sword sages and bounds their souls to the temples. Play the fucking game
it's pretty clear that around Skyward Sword someone at Nintendo got the word back "NO THE GAMES ARE GETTING TOO DARK AND COMPLEX MAKE IT FOR BABIES AGAIN" from the investors.
We could be playing the Elden Ring of Zelda by now if they had kept developing the franchise the way they had been, but then it became all waggleshit controls and "I detect there is a 99% chance you must use the item you just picked up to solve the puzzles you've been seeing the whole dungeon please douse for those puzzles now beep boop." Now we've settled into some weird middle ground in BotW and TotK where there's clearly a more adult version of this story someone wants to tell, but they're shackled by the kid-friendly face of the company.
Anyone who thinks the memories are after SS is a certified moron. It's well after everything just like BotW.
What is your point exactly? Or like why did you make this thread?
The Hylian gods are unworthy of worship. What was there response to the prayers of their suppliants? Drown them.
No, that was their response to "oh shit oh fuck we can't stop Ganon aaaaaAAAAAAA".
Did the gods even attempt to negotiate? A calm and rational discussion may have avoided countless deaths and suffering. Instead, they let their emotions get the better of them and flooded the land. Perhaps they did it out of spite to stop the incessant whining of their worshippers.
They warned them
Not enough. Not nearly good enough.
>Negotiate with Ganon
Anon, look what happens every time Hyrule tries this.
Guess the zelda game this character is from, Ganker:
>man/animal hybrid with the power of light builds temple dedicated to time
Rauru is not a hybrid. KP is his spirit
The timelines are fluid, they split apart and converge at several points in the franchise. Such as when the fallen timeline Link teaches Twilight Link sword skills. Presumably afterwards he continues to yet another timeline, possibly becoming mortal once again.
it's a piece of artwork, the game is a better reflection of canon
>Such as when the fallen timeline Link teaches Twilight Link
Stop this shit, it's boring.
just because you can't keep up
Give it up
See you next time
see you at the finish line
This is the earliest canonical incarnation of Ganondorf.
The shiekah's evil secret is that they merged the three timelines which scattered their people across time.
The three lashes combine into a singular tear.
This would be so based but Aonuma is a hack and has no balls
>ganondorf is an entirely new character in TotK
TotK Dorf is the earliest canonical Dorf
We dont know why no Link emerged in this timeline tho
Ganondorf is definitely youngest in OoT
>acts more juvenile
past TotK is a reboot of OOT sweetie
This is headcanon currently. He is either the first or the last
Why wouldn't Ganondorf reincarnate just like Link and Zelda do?
Like with Zelda and Link they are not the same people every single time, they are both just named the same as past versions of the princess and the Hero.
So why can't Ganondorf be the same?
Like it isn't the same guy every time but he still gets the same name because some vague legends get passed down about some "Ganondorf" in Gerudo's history and folktales and only information there is that he was a former king of the Gerudo, so when the new male is born, a king by birth right, he gets a name that they'd view as fit for a king, Ganondorf.
In FSA he is exactly that. You speak to the Gerudo and they say that Ganondorf was just their king until he went bad, he wasn't always.
only SS Zelda is a reincarnation of Hylia.
the rest are her blood descendants
>Why wouldn't Ganondorf reincarnate just like Link and Zelda do?
WW is special because he literally let's go of his shit, and breaks his cycle of reincarnations in that timeline
>He literally lets go of his shit
Kek, what? He's driven entirely by obsession over a kingdom that no longer exists. He has let go of nothing.
>>WW is the timeline where Demise and his curse got what they wanted, the destruction and erasure of Hyrule, even if it was done by the Golden Goddesses
That's kinda dark when you think about it.
Not canon according to totk
Zelda is just blood relation, not reincarnation.
Ganondorf is seemingly reincarnation
Link is a spirit. It isn't obvious if it's reincarnation like Ganondorf (different guy, but similar fate) or a position some kid with actually fulfill through his actions, like Wind Waker. The Zonai hero is actually interesting because the way Zelda talks about the master Sword in Tears it it indeed specifically Links, which would make the Zonai thing a Link of that age which suggests it doesn't have to be blood either.
Skyward Sword Link was explicitly a reincarnation, Hylia already knew from the time he was born who he was
No, that manga is not canon. The hero from the past is SS Link because he goes to the past. Its cyclical. He is the very first Link.
>Skyward Sword Link was explicitly a reincarnation
>Source = your ass
>he doesn't know
>manga included with Hyrule Historia as a prologue to Skyward Sword
Which is explicitly not canon.
It's cool though, I would like it to be because that's a chad OoT looking Link
Sure, but the character still is.
You retard, this is the event she is talking about. Its cyclical
Zelda didn't know she was Hylia until she met Impa
And they she does and goes back in time. He is the very hero Hylia selected. There is no prior Link
That's actually one thing I never got about Skyward Sword.
Is the implication that Hylia isn't actually real and the legend about her at the start is actually Zelda after going back in time?
Demise talks to Zelda like she is Hylia when he goes back, and while she is not Hylia, she has regained the memories of her.
Yeah but that wasn't my point.
Imagine it like this: Zelda knows about the legend of Hylia obviously, then she gets tasked with going back in time to relive it as, supposedly, Hylia reborn.
She basically lives through "Hylia's" life while bringing the legend to reality and also fully convinced she's Hylia, so she'd have supposedly sealed away Demise like it was stated in the prologue.
Maybe I missed something that explains this better and contradicts it but it seems like a really cool placebo kind of thing that justifies Hylia's sudden inclusion in the lore.
I see what you mean. Hylia is involved in lifting Skyloft before the event of the game and has a physical presence however.
>before the event of the game
But isn't that exactly the point in time to which Zelda travels? Or did I completely miss why Zelda had to time travel in the first place?
Zelda travels to when Demise was sealed and after lifting Skyloft. There are events leading to this
No, Zelda is Hylia herself.
Hylia sacrificed her own godhood and immortality to be reborn as a mortal, this is Zelda.
And she did this because gods cannot use the power of the triforce, which she was then planning to use erase Demise and his bullshit.
And that required her to become mortal.
You are so close to not being retarded anon. This is that actual moment which is recounted via their time in the past when Demise is sealed
He doesn't even get the sailcloth in the manga and he uses the Sword. Not canon
SS has its own little timeloop going on where Link is the very Link he was based on.
Yeah it's not canon babe
I'm not looking forward to BotW 3.
At best we'll get Lorule and they'll ruin Hilda.
BotW 3 will be about them
>Nutendo ruining Majora's Mask
for the love of god no
The dark horse books already did.
Termina faded away after the fourth day because it was just Skull Kids dreamworld.
This is somehow canon thanks to that dark horse book
>source: my ass
It's a fucking shame anon, it's true.
source: my ass
You were given the source you stupid fuck. You also don't seem to understand what it means when clearly incorrect canon is what everyone repeats. Majora has been fucked by that book and its already spread to other retards
if mangas and comic books are canon then so is HW
You don't decide. The retards in charge of the wiki have, which means the youtubers repeat it, which means more people who ever play MM now think its a fucking dream world. Its a disaster
no i decide, i also decide that Link is gay with Sidon
Man you retarded trannies say anything for (You)s
Wait until someone explains what devil's advocate is, you'll throw a fit eslkun
No one is talking about manga and comic books in reference to encyclopedia
>clearly incorrect canon is
Seething about it because you disagree with it doesn't make it non-canon thoughever
We agree Majora is a dream world
No we don't
It's canon whether you like it or not
>source: my ass
Reminds me of the YouTube video game essayist who told people Azure Dreams was a bad game developed by Konami Nagoya because he played one of their other games, decided the studio was bad, and looked up a list of their games.
Konami Nagoya developed the Azure Dreams GBC port. The actual PS1 game has
>Developed by Konami Tokyo
on the title screen.
He's right. Look at the wiki all the secodnaries will use now.
>I want to rule over hyrule
>to fucking ruin it
Hence why the gods drowned Hyrule. Ganon is such a bad idea for King that the people were literally better off in the great flood
>The Wind Waker doesn't cast Ganondorf as the epitome of evil. He's morally gray
i know your baiting but WW ganondorf literally admits he did it all because he was jealous of hyrules resources. thats literally the opposite of morally gray
WW Ganon was a fucking moron and the fact that he knows how stupid he was back in OOT doesn't fucking mean jack fucking shit, because he couldn't stop himself from doing it all over again. He's not just drunk on power, he's white girl wasted. He's basically an alcoholic who went to prison for the shit he did when he was hammered, and starts looking for the nearest liquor store the moment he gets out. The word "rehab" never entered his mind at any point.
>Gerudo had pointy ears, lost them then gained them
>rito and Zora always existed right after SS
Nah, all of Tears is after everything.
>"covets" Hyrule's lush greenery and life
>finally takes over the kingdom
>turns it into a hellscape anyway
That's the point, yes. Ganon is a bad, selfish man who lets his greed ruin everything.
Why are so many people in absolutely denial about Zelda having a timeline?
It exists. It always existed. A book about it got released. It's canon.
>Hurr the nerds forced Nintendo to do it durr
Oh yeah because Nintendo has always been the kind of person to kneel to the fans autism rather than tell them to fuck off and that things are as they think they are and you're supposed to play their games like they think you should otherwise you're wrong.
Stop coping and seething. You call timelinefags autists but you are 100000 times more autistic on trying to deny something that's so very obviously on your face.
It's just a few secondaries posting the same thing each thread to rile you up and have you produce the links between them all again
>>Hurr the nerds forced Nintendo to do it durr
quite literally, yes. they started focusing on an overarching timeline with wind waker but prior to that it was just sequels and shit that didn't really properly connect with other games in the series. hence why we have the downfall timeline which is just a dumping ground for games that can't fit into the OoT continuity
Except LTTP being marketed as a prequel to the NES games and OOT being marketed as a prequel to LTTP and Aonuma going "OOT had multiple endings actually" when Wind Waker was new.
Twilight Princess only exists as a reaction to fan demands. So yeah, Nintendo absolutely does nonsense just to pander.
And it worked.
Doesn't Age of Calamity make absolutely zero fucking sense now?
There's now a Dragon Zelda with Master Sword flying somewhere still that will never be saved because they killed Calamity 100 years earlier, Ganondorf will go and wake up 100 years later and fuck up everything because there won't be Link and Zelda to stop him. Furthermore, how will Dragon Zelda with Master Sword flying somewhere be in existence if she won't be sent back to the past? In fact, everything about TotK happened because Zelda got sent back to the past. How can there be a Dragon Zelda with Master Sword flying somewhere now? How can Calamity be if without Zelda being sent to the past the whole clusterfuck with Ganondorf wouldn't have happened?
>Doesn't Age of Calamity make absolutely zero fucking sense now?
it's a dynasty warriors game with a zelda coat of paint, why would you take it seriously in the first place?
That answers the question of the Fortune Teller and foreshadows Tulin being the sage of Wind.
Sorry, in AoC timeline*. Rauru's arm probably gave in because he finally saw Zelda and Link
They can investigate the ruins for whatever reason you like.
Was there a single moment in TotK as powerful as Ganondorf's mindbreak?
All it would take is Zelda and Link exploring the bottom of the Castle in TotK timeline. That solves every plot hole.
The gloom issue was only because the calamity was cleared after 100 years
New Link and Zelda like spirit tracks
Lmao, there is a Zelda up there who will forever be mindbroken when Link dies of old age
Link would be with Mipha in AoC's timeline
AoC's story fucking sucked in the first place because they didn't have the balls to follow through with it. OG Hyrule Warriors genuinely had a better story than it.
what's the point of making a game where you already know what happens?
>Show the Champions in their prime as powerful warriors
>Show the increasingly desperate conflict and show details as to how it ultimately was doomed
>Introduce characters from that time who wouldn't be present 100 years later, who would have actual goals and stakes bebind which people could be invested
>Show the Champions in their prime as powerful warriors
we already knew that
>Show the increasingly desperate conflict and show details as to how it ultimately was doomed
we already knew that
>Introduce characters from that time who wouldn't be present 100 years later, who would have actual goals and stakes bebind which people could be invested
they were already introduced
There's a reason why the majority of media doesn't replicate the original work completely 1:1, its predictable, boring and you learn nothing new
Good, now we don't have to merely pretend that AoC isn't canon. Musou games are shit.
I'm a little confused about the Zelda lore now but i think Rauru's time is literally after skyward sword. The triforce gods are not the same kind of gods as the furry ones. The furry freaks are probably some kind of aliens that crashlanded into hyrule while the triforce gods are actual immortal and powerful beings. I only did two main quest dungeons and saw some tears visions so i don't know much.
They aren't gods but they are like gods or described as being them to normal people, purely because they came from the sky.
it's a different hyrule
according to the devs, botw takes place a gorillion years after all of the other timelines. hyrule has risen and fallen plenty of times even in the pre-botw era already. the easiest and most logical explanation is that the hyrule rauru founded is a new hyrule in the distant future, after all previous hyrules.
I'm genuinely butthurt that a goat and some random lady were the ones who founded Hyrule rather than SS Zelda and Link.
They got fucking robbed.
It's not concrete at all, you can just decide to ignore it and say its a later kingdom. It doesn't create the same issues placing it after SS does in respect to the other races and even their own internal canon.
The most accepted theory it's that this Hyrule it's Hyrule 3.0
SS Hyrule, founded by people of Skyloft and the native tribes of the realm. Remains the same in 2 timelines, the Fallen / Adult one.
ST Hyrule, after the Great Flood, WW Link & Tetra sailed the Great Sea and found new land, creating a new Hyrule alongside the Lokomos & previous tribes.
(somehow?) Classic Hyrule + New Hyrule turned into a new land and meshed a bunch of references to older games. Goat people came down form the skies (or outer space, they have rockets n shit) and co-opted the name Hyrule again.
>Classic Hyrule + New Hyrule turned into a new land
I guess if you take the names of places as more than offhand references sure, but I saw it more as just the orignal one that had the seas recede
The real answer is that BOTW and TOTK are obviously in a completely new continuity and that Nintendo stopped paying attention to the retarded Hyrule Historia timeline immediately after publishing it.
>it's another HURR DURR WIND WANKER GANONDERP WAS SO LE HECKIN DEEP AMIRITE GUISE HE WANTS LE HECKIN WINDERINO!!!! thread
>All of BotW/TotK takes place after everything else, including the founding of a new Kingdom, staying consistent with BotW.
>BotW/TotK takes place after everything else, except the founding of Hyrule which is post Skyward Sword, pre Minish Cap
Retarded but pushed by wiki
>All of BotW/TotK takes place after SS only, splitting off and forming a three game timeline
Retarded and irrelevant
>All of BotW/TotK takes place in a new universe and is a full reboot disconnected from everything that came before outside of references
In fairness FF has been like that forever. Each entry is seemingly a new universe but Bahamut and Chocobos seem to always be in them
Maybe Zelda is going that route.
I want Darknuts back
he's similar to Lucifer in smtv in the sense that he's aware of the ties that bind him, which made him realize the true meaning of his existence. he's definitely wiser and methodical, which is a shame because we'll probably never have another ganon with this type of personality ever again.
>the shiekah are completely irrelevant to the kingdom after Impa 1 dies until OoT
I wonder why the hero shade doesn't turn up in anything past TP in that timeline?
Nintendo could have made him a recurring mentor.
Because it finally passed on after teaching his shit to TP Link? His regret was fulfilled.
I think I would prefer the Hero of Time to live in Ganondorf's head forever. The one kid that got the best of him more than any other.
Because Ganondorf has always been the same guy. the Links have always been various young men who possess the qualites Hylia laid out for the hero. (which is why the Shade and TP Link can exist at the same time)
And Hylia only reincarnated once. the rest of the zeldas are just very removed demigods.
>Because Ganondorf has always been the same guy
TotK and FSA are a new guy
Demise says he will always be back. Ganondorf himself is a reincarnation of demise. I don't know why multiple Ganondorfs is totally infallible to you.
I have no problem with multiple Demises.
It's the multiple Ganondorfs
It could be the Buddhist take on reincarnation. Instead of a literal same guy it's the collection of qualities that make up the Hero.
"The Buddhist take" isn't a singular take and the Japanese script singles out literal physical reincarnation.
>It's the multiple Ganondorfs
Why? Just because it took them 25 years to make a new Ganondorf it doesn't really look out of place with how Zelda has handled the cyclical nature of reincarnation.
>which is why the Shade and TP Link can exist at the same time
They don't really exist at the same time though. The Hero's Shade is just a lingering manifestation of OoT Link's regret and TP Link encounters it in some other dimension anyway which could be his own mind for all we know.
Wind Waker literally mentions that the Links are reincarnations.
>Waker literally mentions that the Links are reincarnations
Closest I can think of is Ganondorf saying something along the lines of Link being 'the Hero of Time reborn', though I don't think he was being literal.
I think OoT is the most ass blasted Ganon has ever been at a Link for foiling his plans and defeating him.
The Hero of Time next to Downfall Link has to be the most powerful of all of them.
>The Hero of Time next to Downfall Link has to be the most powerful of all of them.
Oh harr harr
>Because Ganondorf has always been the same guy.
Ganondorf is just the reincarnation of Demise, even if he was to be killed a new "Ganondorf" would eventually take his place.
For fuck sake, that's how the Demise's curse works.
He wasn't killed and OoT took his place
You guys misunderstand.
The reincarnation of Demise? Cool. I'm all for it. He incarnates in multiple ways.
But why are more than one a Gerudo guy named Ganondorf? Why isn't one a Hylian guy named Bob? It's lame name recognition, lazy writing, and pointless rehashing of the same character we know to be dead.
>But why are more than one a Gerudo guy named Ganondorf?
There's only one Gerudo born every 100 years so it could simply just be tradition to name him Ganondorf. It's not really that complicated. Why is every just happened to be named Link? It's not important.
Demise returned as Bellum, Vaati and Maladus. He is never said to be Ganondorf in any game media
Existed while Ganondorf was alive. Impossible
Existed while Ganon was alive. Impossible
Could be this one.
In Tears we have two Ganondorfs that exist at the same time retard
No, we have Ganondorf and Calamity Ganon, IE Ganondorf being too angry to die.
Ganondorf in Tears is pre OoT. Its the founding of Hyrule. While he is bound under the castle, there are other Ganondorfs being born
But Hyrule Castle gets destroyed in OoT, and IIRC damaged in TP as well
Calamity ganon was the result of Ganondorf's gloom/malice leaking from the seal.
Demise just saw that his hatred would return to oppose Hylia and his knight.
That doesn't mean that he exclusively has to return as a dorf. And actually he doesn't return, just his power goes to an adversary of the goddess.
Probably just a cultural custom. Why do the Gerudo always make their males king even knowing that that's probably not a wise thing to do given their history? Just cause.
>But why are more than one a Gerudo guy named Ganondorf?
Why is more than 1 hylian dude named Link and why is 1 hylian girl named Zelda all the time?
I dunno man, maybe it's because of the whole reincarnation thing and they are always fated to be named that.
And like these anons said
The name Ganondorf might just be out of tradition because every 100 years a singular male is born to the Gerudo and crowned their king.
There have been three Links canonically
>more than 1 hylian dude named Link
Has he ever had an official name until BotW? You could always name him, no?
>hylian girl named Zelda
Also, that's a tard-tier argument. Demise's name wasn't Ganondorf.
A Link to the Past, Links Awakening and Adventure of Linkmare fairly explicit
>Link to the Past
Plausible deniability there
>Link's Awakening, Adventure of Link
oh right fair enough
>But why are more than one a Gerudo guy named Ganondorf? Why isn't one a Hylian guy named Bob?
A popular theory is that there's actually only one Ganondorf, the "reincarnations" that we know of from OoT and FSA are the result of TotK Ganondorf's malice leaking to the surface from Hyrule's founding just like how Calamity Ganon was born.
So maybe the next time Demise reincarnates he'll be a different villain now that OG Dorf is dead.
FSA is a sequel to FS which is a sequel to Minish Cap and none of these games have anything to do with any of the other Zelda games.
His work was done.
>Old and tired men who can't let go finally let go and the youth charge ahead
Great ending to close the chapter
>The 2 DS games
See yes we can move on and do new things!
>TP, the reimagine of OOT
They are really getting themselves into a knot with the bullshit reincarnation thing
I thought the new game would have plot about something else but it's turn out to be Ganondorf again and from the previous game
Are there no evil people in Hyrule that are just evil for reasons that are not reincarnation of demise?
>people like the good games and want them tied into the story
not seeing the problem here
>Are there no evil people in Hyrule that are just evil for reasons that are not reincarnation of demise?
Isekai me into that shit senpai. I will have hyrule fucked up beyond repair within a few years.
>Isekai me into that shit senpai. I will have hyrule fucked up beyond repair within a few years
Enjoy being a midboss that Link runs circles around exploting an obvious weakness.
That’s not Ganondorf it’s Ganon. Replay the game. He has already ascended.
>BRO MM IS A DREAM BRO
This bait was lazy a decade ago and it's lazy now
Stop taking the HRT, it's frying your brain alongside your porn addiction
It's been retconned.
Thank Dark Horse
Look at all the fucking mistakes in its own page too lmao
How do they post this seriously? It's a travesty
Dark Horse just did the translations, and they unfortunately were accurate. The writers of Hyrule Encyclopedia were from some official Nintendo publication.
They do this with every game lmfao
You should see UT and DR's atrocious pages where they spam it with fag, chudand nonbinary ignorance
You can red 3 sentences in and see "space travel" and then realize it's bullshit if your IQ is higher than double digits
It creates a tide of retards who don't play the games and just read wiki but feel the need to inject their thoughts into discussions of games. Trannies , man.
Why did a thread about Ganondorf devolve into timeline autism? Wasn't it already established that BoTW takes place waaaaaay after the other games in a unified timeline? Isn't the simple explanation that he's a new Ganondorf trying to take over a new Hyrule?
this "unified timeline" makes zero shit sense when they constantly contradict with other games
Because the events of Ganondorf in Tears of the Kingdok take place well over ten k years before in the founding of Hyrule.
So now you have people unable to think this is just the Hyrule founded long after everything fell apart, as has happened before and it ,ust in fact be at the start of the timeline, more or less.
That doesn't mean it can't be a new Hyrule? Timeline could just be old games > Hyrule falls at some point > Rauru Hyrule > 10,000 year gap > BoTW
No, it doesn't at all. It's mostly likely too because of the issues it creates in regards to Ganondorf and several races of Hyrule in their histories.
But it doesn't matter because the zeldatubers now say its founding of Hyrule before minish can, and that's all that matters now
Anon, 10k years gap isn't between Rauru and botw
it's between last time Ganon tried shit, and sheikahs sealing him with guardians
I mean unless Sonia is immortal (she's a Hylian) the amount of time between them founding Hyrule and Ganondorf being imprisoned can't be much time passed. But regardless, it doesn't really matter. 10,000 years or 100,000 years, it's all the same. It's just a nebulous time gap for the sake of exposition. "This bad stuff happened a REALLY long time ago". There's no reason to try and cram all of the other games into that gap and insist that this Hyrule is the same Hyrule from the past games. Especially when Hyrule has already been destroyed and re-founded in old games. Hyrule isn't one, static kingdom throughout Zelda's history.
>There's no reason to try and cram all of the other games into that gap and insist that this Hyrule is the same Hyrule from the past games. Especially when Hyrule has already been destroyed and re-founded in old games. Hyrule isn't one, static kingdom throughout Zelda's history.
Plus you would think we're the thencase Ganondorf should have woken up before, when in TotK the royal passages say the castle is the thing keeping him bound and should never fall into ruin...which a few games have managed to do
There obviously some time fuckery going on that planned for the future games, for example every single entrance to the depth is at the same place where sheikahs shrines were in botw
Could that not just because its weaker ground because shrines bore up through the earth too them?
Yes, it was good explanation
specially with 10k timeline skip after his klast attempt
But in totk zelda goes to the past, when kingdom is founded, and fights very first ganondorf there, who got sealed under castle until after botw
So, part of totk takes place right after ss, and playable part takes place at the end of timelines
>very first ganondorf
Explain the Rito, Zora and Gerudo ears switch
Yeah, le morally grey cartoon villain in a children's game
Just fucking have a nice day. You played WW as a child, that's why you like it.
>finding the cliff bargainer statue
Totk is fucking kino
There is no timeline. Nintendo does not give a fuck about a timeline and they only pretend to, to sell art books. I don't remember if it was Miyamoto or Aounma but a long time ago one of them said that they see link, zelda, and and all the other characters and the general story like a play. If you see a different version of Hamlet you don't say "where does this fit chronologically in the Shakespeare Universe?" no it's just a different version of the play. That's all the games are. There is no timeline except for the ones that are explicitly direct sequels.
>so many sets of 10000 years
>they're still in the middle ages
botw literally explained it
Hyrule king got paranoid about je... sheikah scheming something bad and lead genocide against them. As result Hyrule went from highly advanced society into barbaric ages and regressed in general
On top of that,
>advanced technology existed in the past
>we will never get a game set in that high-tech society
Ganon keeps destroying all of the technology and prevents progression.
>People from the desert keep fucking over the world's progress
There's the same problem with dark souls.
I don't mind the aimless plot, the timeline being inconsistent while some people want a streamlined narrative.
Just take the vibe.
Tears is an OOT remake, move along everyone
cant be bothered to find the original post but stfu pls
Jesus christ dude.
Even then this isn't reincarnation at all
Hyrule Historia elaborates even further on what Demise said and talks about them being reincarnations. This is all in addition to Ganondorf's line in WW about the Hero of Time reincarnating.
Have fun being blissfully ignorant.
>Hyrule Historia elaborates
Not in game, not canon
You can leave now.
WW and SS are the in game proof, HH just puts the last nail in the coffin. I'm sorry your headcanon got obliterated.
>zero in game proof
Termina is a dream, cope.
Sure, why not? Meanwhile you have no rebuttal because you're literally coping about your headcanon getting falsified by official sources.
You jsut got dabbed on by me for near,y an hour lol
>line in WW about the Hero of Time reincarnating.
Ah yes this mysterious unsourceable line that suddenly exists.
I said I wouldn't spoonfeed you with SS and I won't do it with WW either. Maybe the other anon who posted the screenshot of Demise will.
And it would be wrong too
In Japanese it's even more explicit cause it's straight up referred to as the soul of the hero lmao
Lamo made you look
76 yous btw
It's even more literal in Japanese as well as Hyrule Historia.
>blood relation is reincarnation now
>spirit of the hero
>ignores the context of blood relation
The blood of the goddess refers to Zelda
The spirit of the hero refers to Link
You're an actual ESLtard
And I was talking about Zelda you stupid fuck. You've been claiming both are reincarnations, and you posted the English translation which doesn't even match the original language. You're an utter fool.
There are multiple anons in this thread talking about reincarnation. The ONLY thing I claimed was that the Links are all reincarnations, which is true.
Not in game
Yes in game, in WW and SS.
Literally not true
Killing this thread, with no survivor's
It was all me
If you care about the story in any Zelda game, you're playing it wrong, anon.
I fucking hate lorefags. I'd rather shit myself than watch 1 second of some nerd's video essay about the Zelda timeline. just play the game and enjoy it for what it is.
>Where'd all the Sheikah tech go?!
Ganon used the Sheikah tech to do two seperate Hylian holocausts, why the fuck would they keep that shit around outside of the most harmless utilities
>two seperate Hylian holocausts
Not 6 million Hylians, no matter how many Hyliancausts you stack.
>Ganon used the Sheikah tech to do two seperate Hylian holocausts, why the fuck would they keep that shit around outside of the most harmless utilities
How the fuck did they get rid of it? Where did they get rid of it? Moreoever, why is that stuff super effective against ganon then but not now? His ganon aids even looks exactly the same?
Simple answers: lazy devs, want to ignore old story in favor of new one which plays out exactly the same. It's bigger batman.
Sheikah shrines are replaced with rauru shrines. Sheikah Towers are replaced with ...sheikah towers. Sheikah Slate tech replaced with furry arm magic. Sheikah collossi replaced by zonai temples even to the point where they similarly fuck up their regions due to ganon interference. Four heroes replaced by sages. Camera memories replaced by nazca drawing flashbacks.
It's the fucking same except somehow worse.
They threw it all in the ocean
We had sheikah's shit, including books and already claimed artifacts "mysteriously disappearing" in botw, if you actually fucking played game and talked with characters
And shrines weren't replaced by rauru's ones, they literally became holes in the earth leading to depths.
And let's not even start with what going on in village in totk
They obviously planning something with it
Sages are obvious reference to oot, champions from botw weren't
>How the fuck did they get rid of it? Where did they get rid of it? Moreoever, why is that stuff super effective against ganon then but not now? His ganon aids even looks exactly the same?
Sheikah shit was powered with ancient mummy monk technology, after you BTFO the Calamity most of it stopped working, and right now, Purah and Robbie are repurposing it into bootleg versions.
>two seperate Hylian holocausts
one. The prior 10k years ago it worked so well that the people thought the sheikah were too advanced and raged against them in lore giving birth to everyone's favorite banana junkies the yiga. Also, Ganon aids infecting guardians would presumably apply to all sheikah tech, but the towers, shrines, and giant pillars surrounding the castle all did their jobs in containing him. Hell, even the collossi were basically super weapons in stopping him. Sounds like a dumb move to decom them especially in hindsight of the real ganon. Hah! That big sacrifice you all made a hundred years ago? I mean, it's sad, but that was just the pre game and didn't count.
BotW itself would be one, what with the fresh batch of guardians and monsters running around killing people
I won the thread
I get it, you want daddy ganondorf to choke you while he pounds you but he's not morally grey.
I keep getting filtered stubs in the thread suddenly, i wonder why
Whats with the chud schizo
Those dudes in the Age of Calamity timeline are fucked lmao
they have 100 years to find out about the corpse since the calamity isn't fucking them in the ass anymore
>Dorf wakes up
>Immediately gets nuked by the Divine Beasts
Nah, they'll find the Ganondorf mummy anyway since Zelda is predestined to go to the past.
what seems depressing in the zelda games is that after thousands of years civilization is unchanged, and if anything is regressing since often older civilizations have better tech
This is very common in Japanese games (older=better), but it seems dialed up to eleven in Zelda, especially because game after game it keeps happening
Like 100 years ago (BOTW) I can see things not being so different. But ancient hyrule is like thousands of years before and virtually no different than present, and even then it seemed like they were inheriting older mystery tech/artifacts.
They're just copying dark souls at this point, except it doesn't really work because they can't commit to the pessimistic defeatism
Anon, TLoZ is about three immortal demigods beating the shit out of each other while three actual goddesses sit around making sure the world doesn't get COMPLETELY destroyed.
The last time the evil demigod won for real the goddesses decided to just flood the fucking planet instead of dealing with his shit.
It isn't exactly a happy fantasy setting.
Except that the retarded reincarnation shit was only retroactively added, and also almost none of the games are written with a somber tone except for Link to the Past and Majora's Mask, the latter of which has fuck all to do with this alleged divine conflict.
The games don't have somber tones because they're the times where Link won.
So what, the point of the games is that Samsara and perpetual conflict and stagnation is good as long as you survive?
It's about a knight fighting evil to save the princess. Digging into it more than that is asking philisophical questions which have no true answer.
>It's about a knight fighting evil to save the princess.
Well then why are BOTW and TOTK filled with so fucking much intrusive dialogue and retarded non-linear stories if the devs didn't care about the writing?
Anon you can go fight the final boss of each the moment you leave the tutorial zone and have all the information you need.
The Princess is missing and that evil fucker in/under the castle is part of the problem, go murder him.
Yeah and you can beat dark souls with a +0, it's not actually viable for most people
what's the Turn A of zelda
I feel like I should play OoT
Unfortunately I like "RPG"-elements in my adventure games (i.e. I like the idea that my character gets stronger even when I'm just wandering around blindly, hence BotW and TotK were great for me), and OoT is much weaker on that front.
I hate gen z so much, glad all you fuckers are trannies so that you won't spread your retarded genes any further
>there are now potentially two Ganondorfs, two Raurus and two/three Zeldas co-existing across time, assuming TotK really does retcon OG Hyrule’s past
This series kind of sucks ass
Idk that's actually kinda kino
How? It just undermines every other game
Because it means every adventure and past incarnation of good guys and bad guys were leading up to this grand moment where the last Link shoves his Master Sword right into the original Ganondorf's fucking head after he turns into a big demon dragon
Kino as fuck
I wasn't a fan of the execution of the final fight. Too dragged out, also no sage involvement.
I liked it
I remember during the leaks when people were saying BotW's final boss was better which made me sad but then I played it myself and found out they were all spewing pure gayry because it's a vast, vast improvement over Calamity Ganon
it's been years since I played BotW, but calamity canon you were at least on horseback/on the ground, i.e. able to use a lot of your usual tools. Also slow-mo shooting arrows into Ganon's eye is more dramatic. In TotK you're fumbling around mid-air and have shit mobility (no Tulin), and then you awkwardly bop some scales.
I think the dragon fight could be good, but it needed to be refined.
I know TotK tries to downplay BotW, but I really think that having the Champions show up at the last moment to help the sages would have been really cool. It'd also drive home the whole idea of lineages of heroism.
Back to the dragon, three of the four work naturally well in the dragon fight, and you could probably find a way for the fourth. Tulin for air maneuverability, Riju for ranged attack, shooting Yunobo while riding on dragon's back. Find some way to use Sidon's ability and we'd be golden.
I would have liked the Sages being more involved but they had their big moment fighting the Army and them showing up to give Link some backup felt good, but it felt a lot better having a 1 on 1 duel.
The Dragon is also far better than the Pig.
>ackshually the original Ganondorf was always there and is 20,000 years old and Links fights him with a super Master Sword powered up over 20,000 years and he turns into a dragon and Link stabs him in the sky
Cringy shonen bullshit
The timeline crap was okay when it was just two timeline splits before Nintendo decided to do a third split. But none of that matters because I personally prefer that each game is just a retelling of the same legend/story, but over time people have changed or at least forgotten key elements of the "legend" which causes them to fill in the blanks which is why each game is different but the gist is the same.
Funny to think that all throughout Hyrule's history there was a golden dragon flying above the clouds and it was originally a Zelda that came from a very distant future.
I think it's unfortunate that they pussied out and said Zelda felt like she was sleeping while she was a dragon.
It's more suffering if she was conscious and waiting for 10,000+ years