I have to admit I never understood the appeal. The stars in Mario 64 were fine, but collecting like 10 different categories of things just for the sake of collecting them just felt tedious and unrewarding.
>no decent 3D platformers released for like seven years >openly mock audience that desperately wants such games >kill the entire franchise
Great fricking move, Rare.
Which is exactly why Rare should've made a proper, good quality 3D platformer for the Xbox side of things. Instead they just did weird shit and then just sort of went away.
>Rare should've made a proper, good quality 3D platformer
They couldn't in the past, what would make this any different? 64kids wax nostalgic about banjo but both games are poor platform games with the most rigid 3d platforming ever. Half of the time you're playing mini games in them anyway.
Kazooie is shallower and half the game isn't platforming but playing minigames. That's why it was a bad idea to return to that.
3 months ago
Anonymous
No anon, you've got it backwards.
Kazooie was a more traditional platformer.
Tooie was minigame heavy, to the point where they added the ability to replay minigames from the file select screen.
So you're saying Nuts and Bolts would've been received with the same awe as TOTK if it wasn't a Banjo game?
No, because I think the overall structure of the game is still pretty bad. Having to adjust vehicles at the start of every mission is tedious, and you're placed into this giant environments with literally fricking NOTHING to do in them outside of missions. Look at the attached screenshot. There is absolutely fricking nothing to do in there. All that shit in the background? The giant gears and stuff? Nothing. There's nothing there.
3 months ago
Anonymous
No anon, you've got it backwards.
Kazooie was a more traditional platformer.
Tooie was minigame heavy, to the point where they added the ability to replay minigames from the file select screen.
[...]
No, because I think the overall structure of the game is still pretty bad. Having to adjust vehicles at the start of every mission is tedious, and you're placed into this giant environments with literally fricking NOTHING to do in them outside of missions. Look at the attached screenshot. There is absolutely fricking nothing to do in there. All that shit in the background? The giant gears and stuff? Nothing. There's nothing there.
That was an issue with Tooie, but not Kazooie. Your memory is faulty, anon.
>Rare should've made a proper, good quality 3D platformer
They couldn't in the past, what would make this any different? 64kids wax nostalgic about banjo but both games are poor platform games with the most rigid 3d platforming ever. Half of the time you're playing mini games in them anyway.
Banjo-Kazooie is an exploration-collectathon, and in the background it is also vaguely a 3D platformer.
Banjo-Tooie is just an adventure game, with collectathon aspects de-emphasized and platforming hardly existent
3 months ago
Anonymous
The core mechanics are platforming and they're poor. Just cuz zelda gets away with it doesn't mean others can.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>The core mechanics are platforming
Nah it's definitely exploration. Platforming bullshit it everywhere but it's almost always extremely mild and not the main focus. Very rarely you get parts like the Shock Jump pillars in TTC or the engine room where platforming becomes a focus but outside those specific areas Banjo really de-emphasizes the platforming elements in favor of exploration
Tears of the Kingdom maintained the same mechanics as Breath of the Wild, more of less.
It's basically the same style of game, just with construction elements added.
Banjo-Kazooie was a 3D-exploration-based platformer with progression based on unlocking more movies.
Banjo-Tooie expanded on this with larger, more interconnected levels, and some light metroidvania elements (having to return to previous levels via passageways unlocked later to obtain things, etc...). Same sort of game, just expanded and with new elements added.
Nuts and Bolts is a fricking mission-based vehicle-building game with no platforming at all and no exploration whatsoever. It's a completely different kind of game.
He's saying ToTK added onto BotW and expanded upon its gameplay. Nuts and Bolts took things away from what was established in Banjo Kazooie and Tooie by going a different direction entirely.
Nah, I think the genre has value. I actually really liked the direction Tooie went in. It drastically cut down on the amount of stuff to get (notes are obtained in bundles of five instead of individually, for example) and leaned into having levels be interconnected like a metroidvania. Had they continued in that direction and refined it, Banjo-Threeie could've been excellent. Instead, they fricked it up completely.
Nuts and Bolts didn't kill it, the whole genre went dormant because people weren't interested in those unless its Mario and the rise of FPS, Sandboxes and realistic sports games during 7th gen surely didn't help either, even during 6th gen the genre lost it focus trying too hard to appeal to what was hip at the time (more complex stories, more vehicles, TPS mechanics, "deeper" combat, etc...).
At least nowadays the indie scene is making them again (even if I'm getting tired of 90% of them being speedrun games inspired by Mario 64 or Sonic Adventure).
They were just admiting they didnt want to put in the effort to make a well crafted world. Banjo kazooie was fun to explore although alot of the novelty of early 3d games was just walking around and looking at shit even seemingly mundane places were neat because you were used to snes graphics
And don't forget Genshin Impact. >Generic collectibles (currency for gacha system, money, upgrade mats, food, equipment) scattered far and wide across the worlds >Your reward for collecting most of them.. is more of the same shit
this. I hate games where the story missions just serve the purpose of a tutorial for a gimmick they expect you to do 100 times in freeplay. Ubisoft is the worst offender of this.
platformers got phased out by kids by virtue of now (at the time) teenagers propping shooters, if you give a kid a game of both genres without any fanfare or promotion or cultural influence the kid is not going to complain, he will just play them and probably beat the platformer first
OH MY FRICKING GOD IT'S BEEN 16 FRICKING YEARS WILL YOU DROOLING IMBECILES SHUT THE FRICK UP?? HOW DO YOU READ THAT LINE OF DIALOGUE AND NOT UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE MOCKING *SHOOTERS*, NOT PLATFORMERS, CAN YOU PEOPLE GET A DAMN CLUE ALREADY
Collectathon is a misunderstanding of what makes mario 64 good.
They got the kludge made to stretch an 8MB game into something bigger and turned it into a genre.
It's like if there was a "Texturewarpaton" genre, or a "passwordaton" genre.
I genuienely believe that snarky self-aware commentary like in OP image is prime evidence that the devs gave up on caring if the game they're forced to shit out of the door has any actual merit of its own.
We're going to get a new 3D Mario collectathon soon and it'll be euphoric.
I love videogames! Even Nuts&Bolts was rad if you just ignore that it wasn't what anyone wanted from B&K
>gamers dont want rehashes they want sloppa gimmicks and open worlds >15 years later >TOTK sloppa gimmicks and open worlds >yooooooooo this is deadass the GOAT just make sure you pay $80+tip for this rehash that wont be getting updated post-launch even though all of BOTWs good content was post-launch DLC
colletathongs ruined 3d platformers
I have to admit I never understood the appeal. The stars in Mario 64 were fine, but collecting like 10 different categories of things just for the sake of collecting them just felt tedious and unrewarding.
Why isn't there a panty raid collectathon where you literally collectathongs?
STS
Banjo was always a bottom tier platformer. Awful gameplay wity no depth or challenge.
>no decent 3D platformers released for like seven years
>openly mock audience that desperately wants such games
>kill the entire franchise
Great fricking move, Rare.
>no decent 3D platformers released for like seven years
You bought the wrong console.
Which is exactly why Rare should've made a proper, good quality 3D platformer for the Xbox side of things. Instead they just did weird shit and then just sort of went away.
>Rare should've made a proper, good quality 3D platformer
They couldn't in the past, what would make this any different? 64kids wax nostalgic about banjo but both games are poor platform games with the most rigid 3d platforming ever. Half of the time you're playing mini games in them anyway.
That was an issue with Tooie, but not Kazooie. Your memory is faulty, anon.
Kazooie is shallower and half the game isn't platforming but playing minigames. That's why it was a bad idea to return to that.
No anon, you've got it backwards.
Kazooie was a more traditional platformer.
Tooie was minigame heavy, to the point where they added the ability to replay minigames from the file select screen.
No, because I think the overall structure of the game is still pretty bad. Having to adjust vehicles at the start of every mission is tedious, and you're placed into this giant environments with literally fricking NOTHING to do in them outside of missions. Look at the attached screenshot. There is absolutely fricking nothing to do in there. All that shit in the background? The giant gears and stuff? Nothing. There's nothing there.
Banjo-Kazooie is an exploration-collectathon, and in the background it is also vaguely a 3D platformer.
Banjo-Tooie is just an adventure game, with collectathon aspects de-emphasized and platforming hardly existent
The core mechanics are platforming and they're poor. Just cuz zelda gets away with it doesn't mean others can.
>The core mechanics are platforming
Nah it's definitely exploration. Platforming bullshit it everywhere but it's almost always extremely mild and not the main focus. Very rarely you get parts like the Shock Jump pillars in TTC or the engine room where platforming becomes a focus but outside those specific areas Banjo really de-emphasizes the platforming elements in favor of exploration
why did they go out of their way to spite the players
they could of just made their fancy car game without this bullshit
Was he wrong? People went wild for the original thing he came up with when it was in Zelda
This.
Tears of the Kingdom maintained the same mechanics as Breath of the Wild, more of less.
It's basically the same style of game, just with construction elements added.
Banjo-Kazooie was a 3D-exploration-based platformer with progression based on unlocking more movies.
Banjo-Tooie expanded on this with larger, more interconnected levels, and some light metroidvania elements (having to return to previous levels via passageways unlocked later to obtain things, etc...). Same sort of game, just expanded and with new elements added.
Nuts and Bolts is a fricking mission-based vehicle-building game with no platforming at all and no exploration whatsoever. It's a completely different kind of game.
See the difference?
*unlocking more moves
Sorry, autocorrect fricked me a bit there. My apologies for the mistake.
So you're saying Nuts and Bolts would've been received with the same awe as TOTK if it wasn't a Banjo game?
He's saying ToTK added onto BotW and expanded upon its gameplay. Nuts and Bolts took things away from what was established in Banjo Kazooie and Tooie by going a different direction entirely.
no one played flop of the kingdom & most gamers were still in diapers when botw came out
>zoom zoom thinks the majority of gamers are his age
This unwarranted self importance is remarkable
There is platforming and exploration thougheverbeit.
Can we start admitting all colecthatons are unfun padding garbage (besides Ape Escape) already?
Nah, I think the genre has value. I actually really liked the direction Tooie went in. It drastically cut down on the amount of stuff to get (notes are obtained in bundles of five instead of individually, for example) and leaned into having levels be interconnected like a metroidvania. Had they continued in that direction and refined it, Banjo-Threeie could've been excellent. Instead, they fricked it up completely.
Nuts and Bolts didn't kill it, the whole genre went dormant because people weren't interested in those unless its Mario and the rise of FPS, Sandboxes and realistic sports games during 7th gen surely didn't help either, even during 6th gen the genre lost it focus trying too hard to appeal to what was hip at the time (more complex stories, more vehicles, TPS mechanics, "deeper" combat, etc...).
At least nowadays the indie scene is making them again (even if I'm getting tired of 90% of them being speedrun games inspired by Mario 64 or Sonic Adventure).
They were just admiting they didnt want to put in the effort to make a well crafted world. Banjo kazooie was fun to explore although alot of the novelty of early 3d games was just walking around and looking at shit even seemingly mundane places were neat because you were used to snes graphics
Collectathons never died. They just got dressed up differently and the collectibles got scattered further and further apart.
And don't forget Genshin Impact.
>Generic collectibles (currency for gacha system, money, upgrade mats, food, equipment) scattered far and wide across the worlds
>Your reward for collecting most of them.. is more of the same shit
this. I hate games where the story missions just serve the purpose of a tutorial for a gimmick they expect you to do 100 times in freeplay. Ubisoft is the worst offender of this.
they were already dead when that came out.
Didn't A Hat in Time and Yooka do well enough?
Yooka did not.
Hat did.
I only used yooka because they made a sequel.
Also Psychonauts 2 was kickstarted after the first game wasn't received well commercially.
>they made a sequel
And they gave it away on Epic Games a week later.
It's not that bad if you like DKC, it's just not full 3D.
Why has no one on Ganker played snake pass?
nothing ruined 3D platformers, kids simply grew up and so should you
>no children have been born since 1990
if only
platformers got phased out by kids by virtue of now (at the time) teenagers propping shooters, if you give a kid a game of both genres without any fanfare or promotion or cultural influence the kid is not going to complain, he will just play them and probably beat the platformer first
OH MY FRICKING GOD IT'S BEEN 16 FRICKING YEARS WILL YOU DROOLING IMBECILES SHUT THE FRICK UP?? HOW DO YOU READ THAT LINE OF DIALOGUE AND NOT UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE MOCKING *SHOOTERS*, NOT PLATFORMERS, CAN YOU PEOPLE GET A DAMN CLUE ALREADY
Did you miss the mockery minigame
Except that they then killed a beloved franchise that nobody wanted so the ebin criticism falls right on its face
Elden Ring is a collectathon but you pick up weapons, spells, and armor.
And every game is an RPG because you play roles in them
The game was still a shitty collectathon.
No, because Mario was always kicking ass. Rare shifted to only making their games look pretty. Even BK is painfully slow compared to Mario 64
Collectathon is a misunderstanding of what makes mario 64 good.
They got the kludge made to stretch an 8MB game into something bigger and turned it into a genre.
It's like if there was a "Texturewarpaton" genre, or a "passwordaton" genre.
I genuienely believe that snarky self-aware commentary like in OP image is prime evidence that the devs gave up on caring if the game they're forced to shit out of the door has any actual merit of its own.
We're going to get a new 3D Mario collectathon soon and it'll be euphoric.
I love videogames!
Even Nuts&Bolts was rad if you just ignore that it wasn't what anyone wanted from B&K
>Mario was fast
>Spyro was fast
>Crash was fast
>meanwhile every single 3D Rare mascot was painfully slow
Why?
Sonic mafia
>gamers dont want rehashes they want sloppa gimmicks and open worlds
>15 years later
>TOTK sloppa gimmicks and open worlds
>yooooooooo this is deadass the GOAT just make sure you pay $80+tip for this rehash that wont be getting updated post-launch even though all of BOTWs good content was post-launch DLC
You're confusing gamers and normies