It’s funny because you can see how much better the Pixar worlds were handled and by all accounts Pixar was pretty hands off with SE compared to the mainline Disney animation studio.
Makes you wonder why? They haven't had this much executive meddling since the very first game
Its really just frozen where disney really limited what the devs can do. BH6 was pretty bad. Herc's world was too short granted it was the tutorial level. Monsters inc was overstaying its welcome and should have been a different world. POTC felt disconnected until and because of its ending. Rest of the worlds were fine. 3 does have the worst version of 100acre woods.
>worst version of 100acre woods
Are you fricking moronic? That's the fricking best one, cause it doesn't force you to come back every time you beat a world, doesn't force boring ass walking sections with shit gimmicks, and it's not obnoxiously boring. You just go in, do a minigame and frick off forever out of Winnie Hole. That shit and Little Mermaid world were the worst thing ever
Pixar was actually very involved with the writing and gameplay of their worlds. They wanted to treat KH shenanigans as canon and make it fun.
Meanwhile Disney refused to bend the status quo at all and had their worlds play out like a theme park attraction. Sora and co were just along for the ride and had no impact.
Because modern Disney has become very aggressive with their image and trying to mass appeal to everyone. They seemed to have forgotten that, for the most part, KH fans care about the Disney aspect the least, or rather they don't care how accurate it is to the source material. In fact, I feel like KH fans LIKE when the DIsney worlds are weird and silly. That's why people like the Pixar worlds so much
It depends on who owns what. Toy Story for instance and Tangled let them do as they pleased. I imagine Endor will be the same in RotJ, they'll let them do as they please, barring Sora beating Vader or something, might make a funny interaction with him thinking he's Xemnas.
Where Disney worlds work best is when their natural progression is an implicit foil to the events that transpire because of the Heartless. We know Beauty and the Beast by rote, so what does Beast look like when there's a genuine threat to validate his paranoia and anger? Jack Skellington is more than happy to embrace new ideas, so of course he'd get in too deep trying to figure out Heartless. 3 had glimmers of this with Woody telling Xehanort to frick off, but there are constant missed chances to intermingle stories; Sora showing Elsa ice magic, sharing stories with Rapunzel about feeling trapped on the island, or the Monsters Inc factory trying to use heartless for fuel instead of fear.
3 was trying to do too much at once between wrapping up every game's plot threads, dance to nu-Disney's fiddle, and live up to a decade of hype, but it still failed to really make the best of what it had.
I thought BBS did the best with this. Every world felt like it belonged in the journey because of how each protagonist interacted with it. KH2 kinda just felt like we were chasing Organization XIII through a Hollywood studio and stumbling through different sets. And then most other games are just rehashes of the same shit again.
I really wish BBS had been willing to give up a little bit of its verisimilitude for gameplay and had just locked in the Terra -> Ventus -> Aqua story progression but let you actually carry levels/decks through the playthroughs so you didn't have the same progression curve three times over. Storywise it was reasonably strong at showing the same scene through three different lenses by dint of its structure, but it had the fatal flaw that because the order of routes was unknown, the story couldn't have the near misses and the motifs of each of the characters show up in each other's routes. You got the big meetup at the middle but it would've been interesting to see how characters spoke about each of the trio to the others.
3 months ago
Anonymous
That'd have been nice, it'd be less of a pain filling out the journal. First time I was going for Platinum, I had completed everything on Critical on Aqua, including YX and everything. Found out after I completed all that shit on Terra/Ventus that I had fricked up how the journal carries over into the secret episodes and had to restart everything to do it properly, including that fricking Ice Cream minigame fantastic bullshit for it.
3 months ago
Anonymous
I played it while a buddy was watching so I both had a friend to shoot the shit with and also wasn't as laser-focused on completion. We gave a shit about stickers, that was the only thing we doubled-back for. Huge shoutouts to terra's high jump being in an unmarked chest in a random corner in the stitch jail cells, the frick was that.
I will forever contend that KH3 skipping almost two entire console generations was the worst thing to happen to the series.
Because modern Disney has become very aggressive with their image and trying to mass appeal to everyone. They seemed to have forgotten that, for the most part, KH fans care about the Disney aspect the least, or rather they don't care how accurate it is to the source material. In fact, I feel like KH fans LIKE when the DIsney worlds are weird and silly. That's why people like the Pixar worlds so much
>Because modern Disney has become very aggressive with their image and trying to mass appeal to everyone.
This made me laugh, anon. Not because YOU'RE wrong, but because current Disney really have no position to be snotty about how anyone else might treat their IPs. They've been on a downward spiral of increasingly common and severe failures, and being appallingly out-of-touch with their audiences, for nearly a decade now.
But it's full of darkness in KH1 after the light kills Ansem
In KH2 it's full of nothingness
BBS was darkness again
Explain this
3 months ago
Anonymous
In KH2 its full of nothingness because OG Ansem shoots a fricking laser at it and makes it spill all the hearts out leaving only the shell. BBS I fricking can't remember but something something Xehanort corrupts it with darkness or something.
Speaking of not understanding things, why did they change the music track that plays when Xehanort kills Kairi from a fitting sad tune to cheesy and melodramatic, and why did they remove Kingdom Hearts shitting out darkness everywhere?
The door was the door to the realm of Darkness where all the hearts of the worlds were fed. Kingdom Hearts Ansem made was like a big night light inside RoD.
I waited 15 years for a mainline sequel and they couldn't even end the trilogy in a legitimate way. Instead they planted seeds for ANOTHER FRICKING SEQUEL and now Sora is the Ash Ketchum of the franchise
At least it was a good jumping off point. Shilling a mobile game was just disgusting. There were some serious rewrites happening in the last decade and a half before 3 was released that seriously screwed up the story's internal logic.
Still salty about Ventus and Roxas apparently being completely unrelated to each other.
>Little plot at the very start >No plot Disney filler for 20 hours >Plot going 100 mph the last 5 hours of the game >Roll credits
Why is Nomura such a shit writer?
Because he was trying to wrap the Xehanort stuff up in a singular game after Pixar's teams were ridiculous with their demands (they had to remake the Frozen level 3 times for instance because they had fits about the direction it was going in, for instance it was originally the city with Elsa as the final boss). He just wanted to move onto the new story with MoM/Demyx and VsXIII basically.
I mean it still has to connect to MoM/Xigbar/Black Box/Marluxia/etc. None of that's been wrapped up. Plus we also have the Verum Rex shit on top of it now too.
Don't forget Luxord. He's the only one who has been able to actually spar with Xigbar verbally and come out even, and we know frickall about who he was or what he's doing.
Wouldn't surprise me at all if he's MoM and all these fan theories about Demyx, and Vanitas, etc. are wrong. He clearly knows how the Power of Waking and the other world too. Hell for all we know he could be the original Luxu too and we have a Ventus/Vanitas situation going on with him and Xigbar. Him and Demyx are the only two without their names revealed after all.
>New arc
Mate there's already like 3 gachas about it and the lore is already convoluted (arguably not as much as the Xehanort arc, but we've already got a billion characters, time travel and all that shit)
>arguably not as much
Frick no. The worst Nort ever got was the time travel rules at the end because the heroes (of all people) never obey them. I dare fricking ANYBODY to explain to me the shit that happens in the last chapter of Union X. The Player tricking everybody into thinking he was possessed is fine, that I get. But The Ark? Two different towns? Make that make any sense.
>arguably not as much
Frick no. The worst Nort ever got was the time travel rules at the end because the heroes (of all people) never obey them. I dare fricking ANYBODY to explain to me the shit that happens in the last chapter of Union X. The Player tricking everybody into thinking he was possessed is fine, that I get. But The Ark? Two different towns? Make that make any sense.
I didn't play any of the gachas and didn't watch the gacha movie so the big Xigbar reveal was lost on me. Same with Axel and Saix suddenly talking about some girl they wanted to save (that came out of nowhere)
I have no interest in the mobile shit. The Verum Rex stuff seems interesting
>after Pixar's teams were ridiculous with their demands (they had to remake the Frozen level 3 times
pixar did not make frozen, disney switched to 3d animation after the princess and the frog. tangled, zootopia, big hero 6, frozen, all those were disney animation studios
by the account i heard, pixar was pretty nice to them, praising the graphical fidelity of their output but just telling them that they needed to make the story fit in between 2 and 3 because "the story was already told"
it was disney that was like "okay you need to have this and this happen in frozen world and you cant have elsa doing violence etc etc
Pixar is the one that rejected Toy Story & Monster's Inc. story because it was a rehash. They said they need to make a new story that fits the timeline cause they take their IPs seriously.
Yes, he did homie I don't lie, it's one of the many interviews before KH3 was released. Nomura said KH is remaking the movies with Sora in them, but Pixar said "NO", unlike Disney.
3 months ago
Anonymous
They said "no", but not because they take their IP seriously.
+ The frozen director was a total fricking c**t and demanded nothing be changed about their "masterpiece", hence Sora, Donald & Goofy awkwardly standing around in the background interacting with nothing and saying nothing as the movie plays out in front of them. They should've immidiately told them to go frick themselves, and replace the Frozen world with actual kino like Black Cauldron.
Nomura really wanted Frozen in, so he'd do anything they asked to get it. He was also confused why people cared more about Aqua turning dark than the Frozen reveal.
Nomura really wanted Frozen in, so he'd do anything they asked to get it. He was also confused why people cared more about Aqua turning dark than the Frozen reveal.
Frozen is the biggest animation out there rn. Ofc they wanted Frozen in and they were gonna suck whatever BBC they were told to suck.
I think 2 is largely overrated and 3 is largely underrated. Both games are second rate next to 1 which remains the only really great KH game. I remember being obsessed with 2 in anticipation because I loved 1 so much, but 2 just ended up feeling rushed as hell, a game for set pieces. The world's were such a huge step down from 1, and the episodic nature of the game that has you replaying worlds to go fight a single extra boss was really obnoxious like the game had no idea what it wanted to be. Nobody remembers but you didn't even fight Roxas in the original version of the game, it was like the one thing the game was hyped around and it was cutscene'd only. 3's story is a huge mess, but it's largely a product of the series meandering through infinite sidequels. The individual worlds I liked way more than 2's worlds, hell the entire world map being open up instead of pre-made railshooter stages was weirdly compelling to me. Also I really like all the end bosses ganging up on you, fighting all the main villains at once then fighting the entire replica organization XIII at once like they're weird MP Eva stand-ins especially
2 was rated around 80s when it first came out. It is just that every teenager from then based their personas on one of the characters. It just got to the cult status AFTER FM2+ and before BBS.
>build up all these characters and plotlines over 15 years of games >speed through all of it in 3 hours because you want to get to the part where you set up your sequel where you revive your failed game
wtf is nomuras problem
up all these characters and plotlines over 15 years of games
through all of it in 3 hours
This is what pissed me off the most. Some of these plotlines started at the very first game. And instead Nomura just rushes this shit out with no time to take it all in. I mean for frick sakes we save Aqua and then literally 5 minutes later we save Ven
This. I have no idea some of the pants on the head moronic decisions. Riku even makes a comment about how Aqua sacrificed herself to save him in KH 1 ending so he can close the Door to Darkness. You had Riku and Mickey (who also has loose ends to tie up with Aqua) and they both fail their mission just for you to literally push the Sora button and save the day. Frick Nomura
agree, considering Riku's arc, him saving someone from darkness in the realm of darkness would've been kino.
instead we have the most homo-erotic fricking event
Yep and Sora completing his arc with finding out about another heart in his and the room in Castle Oblivion, would have completed that arc from the data games too.
>you know all that character development and growth of Riku’s character? You know having him fall to darkness, redeem himself and now accepts his darkness so he can use the power of darkness and light. You know how he wants to save Aqua who is trapped in the realm of darkness and completes his character arc? >yeah let’s ignore all this have him job so Sora can magically be the big hero and lets make it as gay as humanly possible
Why do we like Nomura again?
Don't forget it would have been kino for Aqua to see Terra in Riku but he's conquered it, giving her more hope with Terra as well. What's crazy to me is that it was always a point that Riku was massively better than Sora, especially when he was in the right mental space, Sora just had a way to connect hearts and house hearts, which made him special, but everything else Riku was better.
Nah, frick Riku. He hogged all the spotlight in DDD just to have the same arc he already did before, only worse. He then proceeded to be absolutely useless in 3. I'm sick of him, the BBS trio and especially the Days trio. This is Sora's story first and foremost, as Nomura himself confirms, and I'm sick of being sidetracked by all these boring ass shitty side characters who feel like fan characters of fan characters and never do anything worthwhile. I'm glad Sora sidelined those scrubs for the finale and that things are finally focusing on him again.
I've had zero desire to replay any KH games since finishing 3. I've played several of the games more than once and loved them, and had kept up with the lore. But the payoff was so monumentally disappointing. Just a bunch of short shitty cameos and then we didn't even get closure at the end. No classic happy endings for anyone. Utter bullshit.
>Everyone gets a happy ending but Kairi and Sora, and I guess technically Riku by extension.
Hm, yeah I guess so. I just rewatched some of the ending and epilogue cutscene. Maybe I was misremembering how rushed the reunion between all the characters felt. That was the part that actually bothered me. The ending is actually decent.
I'm still pissed about all the build up we had for the final battles to be so fricking lackluster. All the organization battles and character resolutions should been fricking epic. All the battles and character returns happen so fast like the Roxas, Axel, and Xion comeback. RE mind fixed some of the problems but man what a letdown.
>nomura gets cucked from his vision of versus xiii/xv >gets cucked from kh by disney >gets cucked from verum rex allegedly
why is everyone doing this to him? i hope he completely fricks up the ff7r trilogy just to spite everyone and this is coming from a fan of the first remake but i can definitely see it getting off the rails bad
>What is Nomura's endgame? >There is an effort by Square to forget that XV under Tabata ever existed.
>Tabata already gave FF the status it used to have in America so he pretty much did what the suits asked him to do even if Tokyo Team anon is furious they made the writing MCU tier. This allowed Nomura to come back onto the spotlight with 7R even if it was essentially assigned to him against his will.
>But moment they found out XV's momentum was flagging and Project Athia wounded profits in 2018, they kicked him out. Considering that new fans kept associating Tabata with XV since 2016, they probably thought it would be in bad taste to let it continue so they cut him off and dropped him just before Episode Ardyn. They're probably only letting Forspoken out on the open world so Luminous Productions wipes their hands off the project that Tabata kept on talking about for years after XV's release.
>At the same time though everyone suddenly asked Square Enix about Versus in those surveys and Nomura suddenly added the Verum Rex trailer in KH3. With him suddenly leading multiple projects in supervisory positions and even getting promoted internally things seem to be looking up for him, and in the FF11 interview between Nomura and the producer that got released today no mention of XV is made in any form whatsoever even if he was credited as creator.
>Forspoken looks underwhelming, I'm surprised that S-E didn't cancel it. Unless they're trying to recoup the costs that were spent on Luminous engine and the formation of Luminous productions.
>I think that's exactly what they're doing. It's squarely aimed at the XV demographic, but unfortunately the entire reason why Forspoken exists is the same reason why NEO TWEWY and 7R didn't do as well as Square Enix expected: because serious anime plots with lots of meaning and good and substantiated political commentary is cringe, and vidya like MCU movies exist for spectacles and nothing else.
>I thought about something similar before. Assigning a mobile/handheld developer on a AAA project with already troubled development was moronic. But having Tabata be a scapegoat for it's failure totally makes sense.
>It's just weird to me Tabata went into FFXV with the mindset "even if we fail it's OK" when he started changing it into a Westernized open world kusoge as if it's some indie project he's experimenting with. There is also that insane marketing campaign that practically shoved FFXV down everyone's throats. S-E is really run by a bunch of monkeys.
>Did you hear about the theory with the legacy of Tabata's XV being actively covered up? >I mean, Tabata left SE and took some people with him. I would be surprised if anyone would want to defend his legacy as the opportunity he got to direct a mainline FF game was a huge honor. That he would just leave and take some talented people with him, no doubt hurt SE, even if it was an amicable parting. I personally don't believe the talk that he was fired, but I do think that the way the FFXV DLC was canned after he left meant SE was ditching whatever direction Tabata was taking his team and sending it in another direction. And with Nomura still a powerful force at SE, I'm sure he'll be very happy to help everyone forget about that time so he can redo things the way he always wanted to.
>Kujiraoka: This costume was actually from Versus XIII's costume... >Nomura: Wait are we allowed to say that name? >Kujiraoka: Yeah, it's ok. >Nomura: Because before it was not allowed... >Hazama: Uh, it's complicated.... but it's ok now.
>This memory holing is even [happening] likely because Nomura has been getting so much power and pull within the company, [so Stellagay says] NEO and SoP getting his final sign off on every aspect are indicators of influence and more likely making a team being set up for bigger things.
>What is Nomura's endgame? (Blocked by Suits) >Why is Nomura so unlucky? hasn't he done enough for square? hasn't he given them kingdom hearts? hasn't he created an iconic jrpg style? hasn't he contributed to ff7 significantly?
>Because people want the opposite of what he makes. They want simple handholdy stories with simple handholdy combat systems. The Tokyo Team battle system was scrapped to praise from Tabata, journalists and zoomers alike. And the original Nomura-authored political conflict was taken out and 15 was successful because it was 'made less anime'. SoP and Days were shat on for making people experience negative emotions and drama that got in the way of their gameplay. >Note: You can argue that 16 still hasn't captured the elusive American/European mainstream market for this reason (aka breaking 5 mil like 15 did). This market calls the above KH nonsense.
>Edgy and dark still really isn't cool enough for the mainstream. I saw someone on Twitter say that RPG fans will only play Final Fantasy games if it had the combat system and writing of Borderlands and the aesthetics and quips of a Marvel movie. Even Zelda has too much plot for people who don't play Japanese games. Square will do anything to become as big as Ubisoft even if they shouldn't.
>People don't want a good RPG; they want a lame power fantasy with fancy presentation. All hype, no substance. >That's why Versus XIII was retooled into XV.
>What is Nomura's endgame? (Dreamgame Development Denied) >CEO asks you to direct KH3 and assign a guy who helped you make CCFF7 and T-0 to co-direct your other game >You cannot make a trilogy and have to compress the game into a single entry >You fight with the CEO since you worked your ass off and you really want to finish this passion project >He lets you work on the project a little bit more and tells you to watch E3 >"Wow a fricking FF7R remake that's cool" >Directed by Tetsuya Nomura >WAT >You are removed from your 'weird' and 'dark' passion project to work on 'more lucrative' products >Be told Tabata will faithfully finish the project provided you can fit your vision into a single game >He doesn't >Develop KH3 with a shitty engine that barely fricking works only to delay it because of said shitty engine >Everyone blames you since no one has a fricking clue about how shitty Square management is >Meanwhile you are forced to direct FF7R >Outsourcing is so bad you take it upon yourself to develop 7R in-house due to the love for the game >15 releases and it's completely different from your vision. You hate is so much you make VERSUS references left and right in KH3 >Meanwhile Disney fricks you over and over again with extremely heavy restrictions >KH3 releases but it's not what many expected thanks to mismanagement, restrictions and juggling development with another equally as huge AAA game >You are so angry about VERSUS you want to make another game which is kind of sort-of a reference to it but isn't as ambitious and dark as VERSUS would have been >Get news that FF7R has a new director to help you out
Now: >Tabata got fired. Luminous dissolved. Kitase is too busy with FF7 and Nomura has two directors on FF7R-2 to watch his office for signs of Kitase looking for him. >Nothing can stop Nomura. He's making a game about an angry man, one that's as angry as he is. Angry about Versus. Angry about Chaos.
>What is Nomura's endgame? (Part 3) >He's definitely fantastic at what he's good at, but I'd like to think by now he also recognizes both his shortcomings and the particular strengths the company has. From the things already said and done with how he's gotten the right writers and developers for the right projects and those comments about him trying to pull together a particular team, that very much seems like the case, and even reminds me of a certain recent SE protagonist with a knack for leadership. (This is Kanade Rindo from NEO The World Ends With You (TWEWY)).
>The comments about how [Nomura is] trying to reform Tokyo Team [spoiler[(more on that later)[/spoiler[ as well as aiding on all these different projects not by managing them himself but by finding and placing the most talented people for them in that position and assisting them in getting to that path is not unlike the leadership style Rindo shows especially at the end of the game, where his awareness and understanding of the qualities and relations of each and every one of his allies and the capacity to connect them is what allows him to put in motion the plan that ultimately reawakens the city.
>There's likely more parallels to draw from, after all the game prominently features people from Shinjuku encroaching upon Shibuya but settling their differences, and even Rindo himself from the start of the game is very adverse to taking responsibility and putting himself out there to make decisions out of choice paralysis and the fear of what could happen, instead just drifting along and passing on details that could be crucial.
>After all, imagine you got the chance at a project that could be everything you want to make and have it taken from you due to all kinds of circumstances, while your other prized project is subject to all kinds of corporate meddling.
>That sort of thing might make you never want to take such decisions again, at least for a while.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>What is Nomura's endgame? Limit(ed Filesize, So Two Games and Half My Team Got) Cut >When Versus XIII was cancelled, Nomura's heart found a home in CBU3 and suddenly took Naoki Yoshida twice during the production of Shadowbringers and Endwalker, which is why KH2 battle planners, programmers, designers, modelers and artists joined the FFXVI team. The Nomura Tetsuya we know at CBU1 is Xamuron Sexyutta, his angry Nobody.
>And Versus was itself sundered into Shards: >Stranger of Paradise Final Fantasy Origin >Kingdom Hearts 3 and 4 >Final Fantasy XV and Forspoken >Final Fantasy VII Remake, Rebirth and Regame 3 >NEO The World Ends With You >Final Fantasy XVI >Verum Rex >Final Fantasy XIV Shadowbringers and Endwalker (pic related) >All complement one another. When they reunite the market will remember and ask, "When is Versus XV?"
>That means Nomura should join CBU3, the disciples of Yasumi Matsuno and have Maehiro and Akiyama work their magic at a political narrative with high octane Nitroplus drama. We will have our late night anime kino.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>What is Nomura's endgame? (Part 4)
Pay attention. The rule of good writing is to show, but not tell, and Nomura knows that.
>It's not telling Jack that he'll remember the past, but that he will be *forced* to, and that that makes him a liability because he chose to ignore it and has immediately started feeling the effects. >The only "telling" part in terms of a narrator insert is how it echoes and reflects Nomura's thoughts on the Versus XIII situation. >The line in question which is before the "liability" remark is awful and stands out as a conversation the characters absolutely wouldn't have.
https://arch.b4k.co/v/thread/633824571/#q633852707
https://arch.b4k.co/v/thread/633824571/#633852893
>"Hey, Nomura-kun. We need to have a talk. Now that Kitase and Hashimoto can't protect us from Matsuda like what happened with Wada, Versus XIII is a liability. You depended on your tenure to keep it in development." >"In other words, you'll be forced to do your favorite thing: acquiesce." >"Uh-oh! Well, it was nice knowing you, Tetsu!" >"Shut up. [Laughs] I don't care about any of that crap." >"If it's not Versus XIII, making Versus XIII, or edgy and dark, who cares right?" >"Wrong. All of that's just background noise. All I care about is-" >"Finding something to replace that purpose you lost?" >"You got it. I need a game - something to create. I'm nothing without a story to tell." >"I wouldn't say that." >"It's a matter of principle, you wouldn't understand. [Laughs]"
https://arch.b4k.co/v/thread/634121843/#q634185118
?t=781
This is Nomura's story. There may be one more chance.
>gets two sets of friends group >gets to wield TWO?! Keyblades naturally >fricked Namine and now is fricking Xion >gets the best return in the game >is OP as frick
Roxaschads we won
>MoM is actually Darkness who gave birth to Vanitas, Darkness is actually Demyx, name is probably Edym or (Adam), the first man, who was born with Darkness in his heart because he saw what was in the forbidden box.
>All other Darknesses captured for him to reabsorb >Keybearers hopelessly subverted for centuries thanks to intentionally contradictory orders
Where were you when Vanitas won
>There are now 7 Darknesses and 13 Lights >Darkness has become the Seven Deadly Sins
>the power of waking grants you the ability to kill the grim reaper and bring your friends back from the dead and then create an entire fricking new timeline
Why is it so OP?
Because it requires you to have a nice day basically
>the power of waking grants you the ability to kill the grim reaper and bring your friends back from the dead and then create an entire fricking new timeline
Why is it so OP?
>Zipper is the Unversed sigil clasping the X-Blade
I believe it.
>All other Darknesses captured for him to reabsorb >Keybearers hopelessly subverted for centuries thanks to intentionally contradictory orders
Where were you when Vanitas won
>There are now 7 Darknesses and 13 Lights >Darkness has become the Seven Deadly Sins
[...]
Because it requires you to have a nice day basically
Why do you think Vanitas/Superbia/Pride named the Foretellers that way?
>Implying present Vanitas didn't time travel back to the past to become MoM in a fricked up Uroboros
We're gonna find out that the "otherworld" is actually the real world and all this fantasy stuff was a recreation of events that actually happened in this world that MoM created, much like the phone game was just a book. The only weird thing, everyone says Yozora looks like Sora in TS world, are they all blind as frick? Are they gonna ignore that he's identical to Riku?
>The only weird thing, everyone says Yozora looks like Sora in TS world, are they all blind as frick? Are they gonna ignore that he's identical to Riku?
You act like Rex and the others have met Riku.
Hamm isn't stupid though, not entirely. Rex is sure. I mean you could argue that because they're 'animals' their vision is fricked, but then they might as well not notice a difference between Andy, Sid, or any other kid, which they clearly do. We're gonna get something dumb knowing Nomura where Yozora is the real world Sora, and has split his soul between Riku/Sora in this 'fantasy world' or some dumb shit, one darkness and one light. You know it's Nomura, we're gonna get something fricking stupid out of it. It'll be kino, but moronic.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Hamm was the one pointed out the Yozora-Sora connection first.
3 months ago
Anonymous
The only connection that they have is Yozora can use a keyblade. Toys are dumb.
>Lets turn the badass anti hero assassin who did whatever the frick he wanted into an even more homosexual Deadpool who jobs like a b***h comic relief character who loves making meta jokes
Nomura please have a nice day
>Axel makes a meta joke about the confusing as frick story while the gang is all reunited before the Keyblade War >Axel breaks the fourth wall to say how popular he is >Axel makes a meta joke about them being late because "they had a couple plot points that needed ironing out as the camera cuts to Ven and Roxas looking at each other >Axel literally says "just bring out the big bad"
Shut your stupid ass up you dumb fricking homosexual. Axel has been reduced to deadpool
Remember when Axel was a cool, chaotic, mysterious wild card of a character who was manipulative and murderous as hell with a hint of a deeper side to him? I miss that Axel.
.
He's right, Japan are like 20 years behind when it comes to fashion and arts compared to the west. Every guy in their 50's and above have been dressing like emo band members for the past decade.
He only stuck around because people liked him so much in KH2 anyway. He was originally supposed to stay dead, and then he got revived because of that popularity with fans... and given a keyblade for the same reason. Both of these things precipitated lore changes to explain the whole Somebodies thing and how passing on a keyblade works. So Axel being hot (heh) fujobait ended up being one of the most impactful things in the series.
as moronic as the core plot of that game was, the banter and characterization was still miles ahead of the shitshow that is kh2 and everything afterwards
how time flies
I mean if you basically work with the good guys more than you work with your own team for most of your existence, or lack thereof, your not much of an “antihero” are yah. You’re just a hero at that point. Like he’s helped Sora and the rest more than he’s actually fought them even before he got a Keyblade.
He was definitely more of an antihero narratively in CoM. In KH2 was when he was undoubtedly a hero and had one of the best conclusions to his arc in vidya. Shame they shat all over it in DDD and 3, but I guess he was a victim of being too popular.
The funny thing is that Axel was only able to kill two people within the Organization in CoM and that was after Sora and Riku had already weakened them. Hell, he didn’t even kill Zexion, he had Repliku do it.
There's no way she's going toe to toe with Master Xehanort let alone the weakest member of Org13. Besides the whole series is power of friendship so makes sense she wins via Sora.
3 months ago
Anonymous
They could have made a boss that was just for her
Instead they just recorded some footage of KH3 and called it the final boss
Lazy and funny
3 was a mistake and should have been rewritten.
Its fricking short compared to the previous games, too. 1 and 2 had you revisit worlds and their final world was pretty damn long. I didn't even know that I was on the last world in 3 with how fricking small it was because it was just a boss arena.
Then he should have let TAV handle Xehanort, hell Riku handling him makes more sense than Sora. Sora has become Super Goku now, he has to get all the big fights and glory now. No other character gets a moment outside of random schmucks that don't matter in the end.
I feel like that's a meme and half-truth, the plot gets better but the world design and meme-worthy moments happen during the disney worlds, especially those of pixar.
Keyblade Graveyard should have had personalized fights from the get go.
>Riku vs. Dark Riku/Ansem >Kairi vs. Larxene >Roxas vs. Xion >Axel vs. Saix >Sora vs. Luxord >Ventus vs. Vanitas/Marluxia >Aqua vs. Xigbar/Terranort >Mickey vs. Young Xehanort >Sora vs. Xemnas >Terra vs. Xehanort
>aqua is stuck in the realm of darkness for a decade >sora just pulls some deus ex machina out of his ass and saves her >she proceeds to job immediately after to vanitas
kek kh3 was such a shitshow
What's crazy is that she was kicking Riku and Mickey's asses both, and Sora just pops in with magic, beats her ass, and then she beats Vanitas' ass, and gets girl confused and loses.
The Disney worlds have always been filler. Literally the only reason you even go to the Disney worlds in KH3 is because Sora is a moron who forgot how to use the Power of Waking so he goes to the worlds to waste time while trying to remember.
>Ven literally tells Sora he had the power of waking the entire time which is the biggest slap in the face because the game basically said you wasted almost 20 hours for nothing
Sora still had to go on a journey to regain his powers bro. Even if he had the Power of Waking from the getgo, he would’ve been too weak to actually do anything with it.
I've only played the mainline games (1, CoM, 2, 358/2, BBS, DDD, 3), what's the whole story around the mobile game? Does it tie into the actual KH story, or is that exclusively the main line titles?
It's a fricking rhythm game! How the frick can it be important? FFS you just play as random KH characters running on music tracks
3 months ago
Anonymous
>It's a fricking rhythm game! How the frick can it be important?
There's still story to it.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Something something about Kairi searching for Sora in her memories or some shit
and then Sora possesses her body to fight the memory of Xehanort and then more of this
RANDOM
moronic
MULTIVERSE
SHIT
THATS ALREADY FRICKING BORING AND STUPID
ON TOP
OF EVERY OTHER RIDICULOUS THING IN THE STORY
TWENTY SOMETHING EVIL CLONES OF THE BAD GUY
A DOZEN OR SO CLONES OF THE GOOD GUY
AMNESIA
MISTAKEN IDENTITY
SECRET PASTS
REINCARNATION
ACTUALLY THERE COOLER PEOPLE IN THE PAST THAT DID THINGS TOO
POSSESSION
IMPERSONATION
CONSPIRACY
BETRAYAL
NOW ACTUALLY THERE ARE LIKE EVEN MOOOORE ANCIENT CHARACTERS THAT DO FRICKALL AND SAY FRICKALL
TIME TRAVEL
TIME TRAVEL
TIME TRAVEL
AND NOW MULTIVERSE SHIT
and none of it is remotely coherent or interesting
i think i just decided not to buy 4
3 months ago
Anonymous
KH has always been a multiverse.
3 months ago
Anonymous
sure dude
3 months ago
Anonymous
>litetally travel to other dimensions with vastly different art styles >not a multiverse
It ties in insanely heavily. In 'short' >all the worlds were one >they were 7 keyblade wielders and a master >master had a book of the future and a black box >made all the other masters make unions/groups and gave them each a task >they all got suspicious of each other >shit went to hell and a keyblade war happened splitting the worlds >one of the unions had a group of young keyblade wielders to carry on the light >some of them were human marluxia/larxene/ventus/etc. >ventus was taken over and killed marluxia's sister but was thrown out of this world which was a book he was in and into the future basically >one of the guys that had no union took the master of master's keyblade no name and passed it down to his apprentices and the black box >he then body jacked people until he was xigbar and could have his own plan >queue the sequel setup at the end of KH3 for KH4
Like it's A LOT of fricking shit that even the movie in 2.8 barely even covers.
Nomura really skimmed over it with Back Cover and synopsis stuff, but still decided it would be an extremely important part of KH3 and the lore going forward.
Well the Xehanort stuff was resolved in his game, you're actually reincarnated into the guy that would pass No Name to Xehanort and train him and Eraqus. But yeah, it's a lot of shit, it's hard to explain overall. It's like all those old meme pictures of people trying to explain BBS and DDD with Vanitas being a clone of Sora but there's also Ventus who is a not a clone, but he's Roxas. It's better to just play the games yourself and actually understand it, but in this case, especially on Ganker, I don't have time to write a thesis paper on the plot.
If it has Kingdom Hearts in the title, it's important. Period.
Is the series worth playing? Only played the first one way back when it released, always been a little intrigued by the sequels, but just got confused by all the side games and re-releases that I just never bothered with it.
It's worth playing, honestly the story isn't confusing if you actually play it, it only gets confusing because of the phone games, which are kind of a mess to get into and best left to just read about.
>I've only played the mainline games
No you haven't. All the games are mainline. There is no spinoffs. The mobile games are mainline (and literally the set up for the next arc) and even the rhythm based game Melody of Memories is canon and mainline
The phone games have the best stories and are the best written. They are also dark as frick. Some shit I wonder how Disney to allow Nomura to put that in
>just straight up executes him >blank stare on his face because he literally just watched his entire classmates and friends die and he had to kill the one responsible for it
Fricking brutal
>The phone games have the best stories and are the best written
No, they fricking aren't, they're 90% filler and 10% vague waffling about with cliffhangers and half-formed plotlines.
The mobile games were fricking awful. They had shit gameplay, shit style, and shit story. The fact the moronic writers actually made them more important to 3 than any other game shows that it's time to put KH to bed. Things have run their course.
Is the series worth playing? Only played the first one way back when it released, always been a little intrigued by the sequels, but just got confused by all the side games and re-releases that I just never bothered with it.
>B-B-B-BUT IT HAS STATS! THAT MEANS ITS AN RPG! >YOURE PLAYING THE ROLE OF A CHARACTER SO ITS AN ROLE PLAYING GAME!
I wish everyone who has ever made these arguments would get hit with a brick
We know a year has passed between CoM to KH2. Beyond that you can probably figure in another year between all the time spent between KH1 to end of CoM and KH2 -> DDD -> KH3.
If this was a comic book I'd agree with you, but the point of killing everyone wasn't for shock value, it was literally to make Sora learn the power of Waking properly. Then also use it so wrong so hard, he erased himself from reality.
>it was literally to make Sora learn the power of Waking properly
except the entire point is that he isn't using it properly, he's literally distorting reality and fricking up his own Heart's existence in it just to bring everyone back from the dead and rewind time
Of course he wouldn't. No one ever tells Sora anything until it's way too late and then act like it's his fault when he literally had no way of knowing in the first place. Xehanort does a better job of warning Sora than anyone else, but why the frick would he trust him?
>but why the frick would he trust him?
Because if anyone's dark Sora, its Xehanort.
Also Xehanort is totally coming back in some capacity in 4. What was it, he might've shunted off a clone of his into unreality or something?
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Xehanort fully returns after a big cutscene showing him and Eraqus being shunted off to the deader-than-dead afterlife
Bullshit but I wouldn't put it past Nomura
3 months ago
Anonymous
Oh he's absolutely coming back. He did correct himself to say he'd prepare a 14th life for the new world and there's that Nomura sketch of silver eyed Xehanort in Quadratum. He's coming back and I'm willing to be he'll be on Sora's side this time. And he'll still be a smartass dickhead, cause he always was.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>angsty Young Xehanort and Young Erquus show up in Quadratum as Sora's allies because uh...Nomura liked writing them
Truly, an autist savant.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Nah, no Eraqus. Just another Xehanort that's somehow not the same one in the afterlife. Because that's much more Nomura.
NEO:TWEWY had the benefit of the entire game being built from the ground up around the themes of taking responsibility for your actions and having the willingness to proactively fight for what you want rather than fade into the background of someone else's decision. KH3 was Sora getting mocked for falling into the trap that Yen Sid threw him face-first into, told to master the power of waking but forbidden from using it and never told what it actually does, and then rebuked by his peers and yote from reality when he discovered he'd had the power the whole time. There was no through-line emotionally or narratively to support the emotional whiplash.
>Nomura literally created Nameless Star as a way to vent about the changes from his vision for Versus XIII and how Yozora (Noctis) was changed too much and how they (Tabata) took away everything from her (Stella)
Will Nomura ever let this shit go? It's been almost 10 years now
>Nomura literally created Verum Rex as a way to vent about the changes from his vision for Versus XIII (Stella/The Nameless Star) and how Yozora (Noctis) was changed too much and how they (Tabata) took away everything from it (his story)
Based on recent theories, fixed that for you.
>nomura gets cucked from his vision of versus xiii/xv >gets cucked from kh by disney >gets cucked from verum rex allegedly
why is everyone doing this to him? i hope he completely fricks up the ff7r trilogy just to spite everyone and this is coming from a fan of the first remake but i can definitely see it getting off the rails bad
Square Enix is trying to create a future without him, so they're cucking him instead of letting him blow his load with his projects (admit it, SoP was kino) and teach younger Square Enix devs and then stepping back like he wants to not unlike Sakaguchi.
This is to curry favor with the Western market that liked the changes Tabata made to XV, including removing Nomura's edgy Matsuno-style political plotline and the KH2 battle system. Because XV was less anime than Versus, it was well-received from release to mid-2017. Square Enix wants every Square game to be that well-received forever.
XVI seems to have accepted that it isn't as mass market friendly so Yoshi-P went ham on the social commentary story and action combat by getting someone from DmC. It sold 3 million but the high PS5 attach rate showed that going for a niche yet very big market (like A24, etc) is the right idea for Final Fantasy. Nomura should leverage this for a Versus reboot.
>This is to curry favor with the Western market that liked the changes Tabata made to XV >Because XV was less anime than Versus, it was well-received from release to mid-2017.
Seriously? Do we know what people hated about Versus 13? Was this the 'Japanese games are bad era?'
Feels like SE is listening to the westerners who criticized japanese anime and games 20 years ago, despite naruto, zelda, and final fantasy being extrememly popular. You the kind of people who think they have the solution to “fix” the multimillion dollar franchise by making it more american
Zelda is popular enough because it doesn't have a story for you to follow. Most people watch Marvel movies and sitcoms will argue that anything with drama or character gaiden spinoffs already muddies the water and so KH/Nomura games get that criticism. They don't even follow narratives anyway, they just think scripted dialogue and action scenes are plot and it should stay that way.
>namegay >Who? >be a normal anon poster >post like it's a phpBB forum in 2005 >discuss Square RPGs and Xeno, and sometimes Sonic/SEGA games and Fire Emblem on the side >someone won't stop comparing said RPGs unfavourably to FF15 and threatening other Nomura fans >it's Barry >try to reason with him after he calls The World Ends With You a QTE game >Barry won't change >is somehow called based in TWEWY and Xeno threads >expose a fake Versus leaker by entering his Discord >out him as a Nazi >get called the same name as the Nazi because they are associated with Versus >begin namegayging >Barry posts gorn and cp so jannies can quickly archive a thread >they don't >remind Barry a few days later he did that and ask him why he isn't in jail >remind Barry he threatened to rape an FF fan who also likes Stella >more bickering >be so fed up with Barry's lies and slander against flawed but innocent Square Enix devs >do an ungodly amount of research >make a bunch of headcanon writeups >post them a few times for fun before SoP and NEO launch >gets excited for SoP and NEO >fights Barry again >realize Barry isn't worth it and then fricks off >but then says 7R needs Gambits because his favorite FF, FF12 used it to improve party AI before he disappears >the headcanon writeups take off with a bunch of autists called the Whispers of Stellagay (I'm Magun anon and will shoot) >those same autists ruin discussion of the Gambit system >FF16 is said to have political intrigue mixed with dark anime tropes >this appeals to the namegay's tastes directly almost 1:1 >Tokyo Team involvement >FF16 launches >FF15 fans are shown to have the same opinions as Barry and hate 16
No wonder he doesn't post anymore. You triggered him, Barry. You triggered Stellagay.
But Toriyama is subservient, Tabata excised, Nomura and Yoshida ascend, 7R gets Gambits, 16 is Versus 2.0, SoP is kino. In time, Stellagay won.
He must not be forgotten. I kneel to the namegay, for he did nothing wrong.
>TL;DR for Stellagay Writeup, Side Black (Part 2) >The black image AKA Stellagay writeup Part 2 talks about why changes were made to pander/appeal to the Western (North US American) market and how they ensured success and the longevity of the FF brand along with how Nomura felt about these changes.
>Nomura was incredibly pissed that the original, dark and chuuni as frick Versus 13 was dumped for making a product with mass market appeal thanks to changing sensibilities in the western market, as such, he included links to the corporate politics that led to it in Kingdom Hearts 3 via Verum Rex, an in-universe video game. Stellagay speculates the next game will be Verum Rex and it'll be a retelling of how the internal corporate politics of square that led to the downfall of his baby (Versus).
>Stellagay says that Versus 13 was decringed into 15 to save the Final Fantasy brand at the cost of removing everything Nomura wanted to put in it in terms of story and gameplay like the Kingdom Hearts combat and all the dark shit you saw in 2000s anime which became cringe in 2010 so it could sell outside of Japan and save the Final Fantasy brand. It made Japanese games semi okay because it saved Square financially but Forspoken is now the fruit of Nomura's pain and suffering.
>XIII turned off a lot of consumers, it was expected to be a BIG success and a lot of money went into the trilogy. Nomura wanted Versus to be a more "serious" story about contemporary modern day problems [compare: FF12, Vagrant Story, 14, 16, Code Geass, Gundam, Death Note] but SE felt this was too risky, would cut out certain markets like China and risk being another failure. XV was made readily appealing to FF fans and fans in general and overall it separated itself from XIII. But the sales were not good enough and consumers didn't stick around while long time fans felt the game was lacking. Elements of Versus got recycled into KH3 and Nomura took cancellation of the project hard.
>Reading all the final thoughts of all the people who died but can't accept they are dead >That one about the guy who is pissed that his friends already replaced him and he questions if he even mattered at all >That one about the twins who did everything together but only one of them is dead now >That one about the little boy who is dying but doesn't know he's passing over and thinks his fricking father is playing hide n seek with him
Fricking Christ
Well one is Endor, so it'll probably deal with Force Ghosts and letting go of hate and angry and darkness. Can't wait to see Sora try to talk no jutsu Palpatine or start swinging Ewoks around like a psychopath.
lmao I really hope we do get Star Wars of some kind, but I'll believe it when I see something more concrete than a shot of a vaguely redwood-tree forest. I want a lightsaber keyblade.
Oh, yeah I see it now. I saw the trailer back when it came out, but never caught that. Hype. I don't know why exactly the dumbfrick crossovers of KH appeal to me so much.
That was one of the highlights of the game for me. Especially the guy whose buddies already replaced him. Funny that a bunch of last thoughts of completely nameless, faceless voices impacted me more than a dozen characters we've had for years and years.
Sora wiener is so much bigger than riku’s. That’s why Riku acts like an autist socially awkward moron around others while Sora gives off chad energy to everyone he just meets
>the power of waking grants you the ability to kill the grim reaper and bring your friends back from the dead and then create an entire fricking new timeline
Why is it so OP?
bro i cannot think of anything more embarassing than having to explain the plot of KH to a fellow adult
literal kids game, thus only kids and manchildren play it
>First game is a simple story about a boy wanting to go on a big adventure to other worlds with his friends and darkness makes his friends disappear and he has an adventure with Donald Duck and Goofy to find them >Now the story is about some psychopath who wants to kill Darkness for good by coming up with a 4D plan which involves a war resulting in the death of thousands of kids, body swapping, time travel and unreality
They forgot the only reason most players gave it chance in the first place was the Final Fantasy portion of the mix. Said players did discover the crossover was actually kind of neat but as usual Disney doesn't understand what people actually like about the things they own and fricked everything up by forcing more their bullshit into the ratio while simultaneously also segregating it somehow.
>murdered countless amounts of people and spread evil to numerous worlds and wanted to be God >It was just a prank bro I was a good guy all along my bad >gets to go to heaven and play chess with his boyfriend who he himself murdered
What the frick was Nomura thinking
There isn't really a hell in Kingdom Hearts, everyone returns to the Light regardless. You either go there or end up in Limbo, where you're not dead, but more erased from existence because of Waking or some other shenanigan.
she dies too fast, the Zodiac version in 0.2 was much more fun.
also frick this shit series for pumping out shit mobile games with most of the plot.
only gonna play 4 for the superbosses and a chill playthrough. story went to complete shit
Fun fact Nomura is a self proclaimed Star Wars fanboy and it was his decision to cast Mark Hamill as Eraqus for the English release (he also is a Star Trek fanboy and he made the decision to cast Spock as Xehanort)
Rape me with that Keyblade baby jam it up my ass GOOD thank you for letting me be your cum bawd your fat cum bawd prostitute . I love when you violate me I love to bleed out my ass and use my blood to jerk off to you as you call me your filthy fat cum bawd prostitute yes baby yes
What if Ventus or Terra were in enchanted dominion at the same time as Aqua, with the former two being tiny and the latter being normal size? What if they got themselves stuck in a toilet right when Aqua had to poop? Asking for a friend.
Where the frick is my manga, light novel or movie that summarizes all of the phone game? Why the frick did Nomura put half the plot required to know what's going on in a shitty phone game?
Should've been the final boss. Makes no sense why Xehanort stayed in his old man body with the X-Blade instead of the chad body he worked the entire BBS to steal. He was stronger in Terra's body anyway.
What's up with morons suddenly pretending kingdom hearts disney worlds were not always about the characters in the worlds and barely advanced the plot forward? This has been the case since the very first kh, is it rose tinted glasses, nostalgia, growing up?
Kingdom Hearts 1 Disney worlds at least had the story importance of saving the worlds from the heartless by sealing the keyholes. Every other game they were pointless though.
Sure, but the overall story of the game was about how the heartless were destroying the worlds. Several worlds were destroyed before the game started, Destiny Island itself was destroyed at the beginning, and the all of the worlds were restored at the end.
The best part of these games is the Disney Worlds. The endgame of KH1 worked because it felt like you were playing through a Disney movie and the end part was your character's movie. None of the other games got this dynamic right but SDG hopping through movies was always alright.
Idk, I like visiting Disney worlds as long as they're not Frozen/Atlantica tier. The recreation of the movie environments is honestly really impressive.
Would you give it a rest? Soul Eater fricking sucks, Riku wracking things with a dumb bat wing is just as trash as the car key. The only good edgy weapons are Nameless and Oblivion.
When is our girl Aqua gonna get the respect she deserves? >Jobs to Vanitas after fighting for ten years in the RoM >Succumbs to depression mid fight in the doomed timeline >Doesn't say get fricked to Xehanort by shacking his ghostly ass at the very end >Ends the game wasting time looking for Sora in the RoD still having to babysit dipshits 1 and 2.
>was one of the first scenes that connected the main story to the mysterious armored figures from the KH2 secret ending >you'd think the Chamber of Repose would play a role in Aqua's rescue, as Riku and Mickey were searching for clues related to her at Radiant Garden >Ienzo and the other apprentices never bring it up >Aqua just retrieves her original keyblade and armor offscreen after the ending
KH3 had so many missed opportunities
kingdom hearts 3 was fricking shit
where was the mad af trio? literally everything is sora being a gary stu and every other characters being thrown in the garbage can, that reaction about roxas and ven was lame as frick too
Could have done some KINO as frick story, there was lingering will, mad af trio, could have gotten aqua to see roxas and think he lost his memory or some stuff like that and try to make him remember
I remember tearing up at the secret ending of BBS.
Where the entire cast of characters across the entire universe universally realizes Sora is the key to their salvation and chant his name.
Nope, just homosexualy fricking smiling moron with zero understanding of all the suffering and evil going on around himself.
None of the story or themes are integrated into disney worlds just big fat load of turds dumped at the end of the game, to finally conclude the "Xehanort Saga" in the quickest most unsatisfying way possible.
To be honest his bootleg versus 13 also looks souless as frick, what the frick went through his mind? If he wanted versus 13 completed he shouldn't have screwed the ffxv development which was a massive mess like kh3, anything this moron touched turned to shit recently
Was it Nomura's fault? I'd say he was responsible for letting the project too big (it was FF12 meets KH2 after all) but splitting it into 3 games seemed like the right idea. The problem was exacerbated with the PS3 and Tabata trying to pull the rug from under him (which is why his team members and all his level designers left, but Kanemori's people are still at Square anyway).
>Was it Nomura's fault?
I'm no jap, but the concurrency of Nomura and Kojimas issues leads me to project a similar situation on to Squarenix.
Nomura is too much of an auteur.
His public credibility endangers projects because he's too popular to challenge or remove.
This conflicts with absurdly inflated budgets and mass market expectations of incredibly broad open world games with 3 or 4 basic gameplay pilllars (exploration, combat, stealth, crafting, etc)
In order to realize Nomura/Kojima's vision in a way that scales from their prior success as auteurs would require a decade of dedicated work (not just preprod and high level design) and a billion dollars.
Kojima is just more talented in general and had a stronger hold over Konami (being family owned didnt help).
3 months ago
Anonymous
I dunno, I hear Kojima's more of an idea guy and he doesn't seem to get in the trenches with his people. Nomura meanwhile solves level design problems like it's fricking nothing according to one of his team members.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>he doesn't seem to get in the trenches with his people.
Kojima exhudes extremely detailed controlled over his projects.
It's why he can jump engines and his games still affect the same lighting and visual dynamics.
He has a very distinctive visual style that is present in every one of his projects.
Nomura's style is flamboyant character design and a similar cringey sentimental melodrama to Kojima but lacking historical and dramatic gravity.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Nta but he wanted to prove he was capable of that in Versus and wanted to blow his load on current year political wars because he didn't like that KH let him do so. Not sure though if an FF spinoff was the appropriate way for him to do that
3 months ago
Anonymous
And now he's killing so many kids in KH like it's nothing. WTF Nomura
3 months ago
Anonymous
Kamen Rider Black Sun, Higurashi, Psycho Pass, toku, anime and manga are at their best when the authors ascribe their principles in it better than Westerners doing the same. Versus was going to be no different and Nomura wanted to do the same.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Kamen Rider Black Sun, Higurashi, Psycho Pass
What are these?
My headcanon is that Nomura wanted XV to be episodic like 7R, but higher ups at Square Enix wanted the game to be a multimedia product to quickly generate revenue in the shorter term. Nomura disagreed with the idea, and that's why they kicked him out of the project and replaced him with Tabata
3 months ago
Anonymous
I think what you said combined with what people are saying about Japanese media was a double whammy that allowed Square Enix to remove Nomura just like that.
Do you have anything to go on about the 'too anime' argument though? Did normies like Versus in 2006 or was it too emo/dark for the general public?
3 months ago
Anonymous
nomura got deleted from versus 13 so he could work on kh3
vs13 was his baby but the project's development halted immensely due to some factors >ff13 development was a mess due to lack of vision and slowed due to the creation of the crystal tools so staff from every team grouped together to make the game happen >ff14 on release was also a fricking disaster and they needed staff from every project to make the game happen
by the time development on ffxv could kickstart for real or potentially already started, the project was handed over to tabata so nomura could focus on kh3, which was already a troubled project on its own right
the osaka team that worked on kh2 and was working on vs13 got slowly disbanded and scattered all aroud the company during the spikes i mentioned earlier
the entire thing was a fricking mess all across the company, the issues here were far bigger than vs13's development
the ceo at that time (yoichi wada) was also known to be a fricking moron that famously took million dollar corporate decisions according to what his personal fortune teller told him (yes I am not exaggerating and this is real, you can look this up)
this company is just fricked
3 months ago
Anonymous
So that's why 16's emperor had the fortune teller with him.
>Was it Nomura's fault? >TL;DR for Stellagay Writeup, Side Green (Part 1) >The green image AKA Stellagay writeup Part 1 (picrel) talks about the events in Square Enix that caused Versus XIII to turn into XV. Crystal Tools and mismanagement turned XIII and XIV raging dumpster fires that almost killed the company under Wada, forcing the Versus team to be split across any and all Crystal Tools games to make development easier.
>It mentions the Crystal Tools graphics engine and how it affected development. It also talks about how trying to get mass-market appeal affected gameplay (changing from a more complex KH2 like battle system to the simpler one we see in FFXV).
>Nomura's team was constantly taken away to finish XIII, then XIV and then help again with ARR. His game was never in constant development like some morons think it was, because more than half of the time he didnt even have a team. With no team or deadline he thought of new ideas like any director would in that time to keep the ball rolling. Square restructured like 3 times during that period and in an effort to fast track production; they told Nomura to start working on both Kingdom hearts 3 and FF7 Remake. All the production work done thus far was given to Tabata with Nomura overseeing the transfer. Tabata who unfortunately was a layman of a director and a mediocre one at that.
>Tokyo Team anon's comments >I'm surprised Stellagay didn't pick up on this but other KH2FM/Versus team devs worked on XIV or under Yoshi P during Endwalker apart from Ohdachi and how many other KH2FM devs that weren't former FFXI team members also worked on Parasite Eve 2 when all of them were known as Square's Osaka Team. Yes, even the guy who (note, no longer) works at DeNA for Pokémon Masters after wasting his battle design talent in XV after KH2FM and early Versus is from Osaka, everyone's former favorite battle director Yuichi Kanemori
>I remember tearing up at the secret ending of BBS.
homosexual. If you didn't boot up BBS, and immidiately recognize the quality of the gameplay, dialogue, and story writing took a fricking nosedive off a cliff and the franchise was officially out of ideas and therefore dead, you're literally moronic.
Wrong. II and Days are pure Kino in terms of writing, which you would recognize if you weren't a tasteless mongoloid. Everything related to BBS was a complete fricking mess, including the secret ending in II.
KH2 is narrative Kino. The intelligent nobodies are the perfect villains to one-up the animalistic heartless in terms of the narrative. The organization members are all memorable and unique, and they are also tragic victims of circumstance. They are empty husks that just want to get their hearts (souls) back. BBS is a soulless prequel retcon bonanza. Aqua, Ven and Terra are just a poor man's rip off of the destiny island trio and their character arcs.
When it comes to Days, no-one can defend the abysmal gameplay. However, the character writing and Roxas' arc is pure Kino, and the narrative highpoint of the entire series.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Days
The same battle designer made coded was recently trained further by another KH2 dev (Masanori Sato) on 3 and now we have NEO TWEWY thanks to him.
You can expect similar writing quality from Days in SoP, because Kanemaki who wrote Days also did the story for SoP.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>KH2 is narrative Kino.
and then Roxas's prologue ends
And Sora is wandering utterly irrelevant Disney worlds exactly like 3 until the end of the game.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>and then Roxas's prologue ends
True, tbh
>And Sora is wandering utterly irrelevant Disney worlds exactly like 3 until the end of the game.
Well, he already defeated the Heartless in 1. The only reason Sora doesn't just go back to Destiny Islands is because he wants to find Riku. Then he gets introduced to the nobody threat, and because he's got one of the THREE KEYBLADES IN EXISTENCE, he can't just ignore it.
>gets played or manipulated by almost every Disney villain in the game
Aqua was in the right for calling him out, Terra was being a dumbass for most of the game. The only character acting dumber than Terra was Eraqus
>waiting to see super sentai doom guy sperg rage all over terranort for like 15 years >he appears 2 minutes and dies offscreen >well, m-maybe on the dlc... >the followup is that he appears for 10 seconds on a cutscene and gets killed instantly
t-thanks nomura...
The entire Key Blade Graveyard level in KH 3 was such a huge disappointment.
Instead of a proper boss rush against Organisation XIII, we fight 2 or 3 members at time and they've been completely toned down to the point that they might as well be trash mobs with bloated health bars and a gimmick. The constant cutscene interruptions that happen during the fights get old really quick and frick the pacing of the fight.
The fight before the final boss with Ansem, Xemnas and Young Xehanort all at once is just fricking lame.
All I can remember about the final boss is that it was annoying to fight against and overall pretty forgettable. Also the fact that everyone forgave him for all of the irredeemable shit he did, including murdering Kairi in cold blood about an hour before you fight him.
Imagine if Lingering Will vs Terranort was an actual fight.
Imagine if Disney rides weren't in the game and you actually had to fight off that massive hoard of Nobodies and Heartless.
Imagine if you had to individually fight every single member of Organistion XIII in all of their glory.
Imagine if you had to fight Ansem, Xemnas and then Young Xehanort back to back, in ALL of their final boss glory and then some.
Imagine if the final boss was actually memorable, asides from the goat head and the awkward flying controls I legitimately can't remember anything about him.
keyblade transformations was always kind of dumb
if they were that flexible and had that much utility their default form wouldnt be a sword
just another (relatively minor comparison) absurdism on the pile
the gameplay in 3 is so uninteresting I didnt even remember the keyblade transforms
you barely get to swing it before the game slaps you in the face with 3 or 4 free/easy/no cost room clearing cinematic moves where Sora literally rides the tea cup ride at disneyworld and expels existentially threatening soul demons from the world
I recommend playing it on Critical. Not only is the difficulty much more fun, you get a bunch of unique abilities, one of which disables the Attraction Flows in favor of giving you more Situation gauge which means more formchanges more often. Replaying KH3 really has made me appreciate Formchanges more, they're way more functional than they seem at first glance. Tied or even exceeded Drive Forms for me.
I dont want to have to play on a harder difficulty to be able to manually disable shit that ruins the base game.
3 months ago
Anonymous
You know you can choose not to use them if it bothers you so?
3 months ago
Anonymous
hate this argument
it diminishes the fun of gameplay if theres a giant red WIN button on the side of screen i can press at any time
theres a distinct differences between setting self limitations
and when the easy way is staring you in the face and screaming at you the entire time and it would take 10th of a second to activate
I get it. I've done runs of games where I disallowed certain strategies or techniques.
But this is not the same.
What an newbie. But that is fine, you will be dealt with. >The sharp anger that cuts even daggers, Edgy Grey! >The schizoposting that births abundant replies, Cringe Purple! >The delusion that melodrama creates good stories, Emo Black!
Scatter, needlessly reposted autism!
I summon you, Whispers of Stellagay!
KH is literally the light of all worlds, what's moronic is how Ansem SoD forgot about that when he's known this his whole life as Xehanort and Terra.
Hack writing I guess.
>uuuuuuh Kingdom Hearts is the door between dark and light >uuuuuuuh actually its Light >uuuuuuh actually that was just Light trapped behind the door >uuuuuuh actually the door wasnt Kingdom Hearts >Kingdom Hearts is a moon that gives people hearts >uuuuuuuh nevermind the nobodies just regrow hearts on their own >Kingdom Hearts is actually some kind of balance between dark and light that does..... >uuuuuuuuh 7 lights and 13 darknesses >uuuuh and you need a sword with a terrible pun for a name and you can only get it by cutting a guys heart in half >what happens when you do the Kingdom Hearts thing? >uuuuuuuh who knows pay no further attention to Kingdom Hearts because multiverses or something >LOOK AT THE MULTIVERSES
I don't know how anyone treats it seriously, it's a disney game
Singing with mermaids and stuff and then having a serious discussion about the plot is such tonal whiplash it just comes across as comical
Kingdom Hearts 1 was a perfect mind virus.
Cringey melodramatic teenage angst set inside beautiful nostalgic recreations of renaissance Disney movies, releasing EXACTLY as 90s Disney kids were hitting adolescence, losing friends, discovering romance, leaving their childhood behind
Just a real miracle of timing and creativity and talent hitting at the exact right moment.
It's not a serious property, but it pulled the exact right strings at the exact right time to invoke strong nostalgic emotions in its target audience.
I think 2 is largely overrated and 3 is largely underrated. Both games are second rate next to 1 which remains the only really great KH game. I remember being obsessed with 2 in anticipation because I loved 1 so much, but 2 just ended up feeling rushed as hell, a game for set pieces. The world's were such a huge step down from 1, and the episodic nature of the game that has you replaying worlds to go fight a single extra boss was really obnoxious like the game had no idea what it wanted to be. Nobody remembers but you didn't even fight Roxas in the original version of the game, it was like the one thing the game was hyped around and it was cutscene'd only. 3's story is a huge mess, but it's largely a product of the series meandering through infinite sidequels. The individual worlds I liked way more than 2's worlds, hell the entire world map being open up instead of pre-made railshooter stages was weirdly compelling to me. Also I really like all the end bosses ganging up on you, fighting all the main villains at once then fighting the entire replica organization XIII at once like they're weird MP Eva stand-ins especially
Me too. Now everything has to have a quip and be less impressive stuntwise just so it's more fun, and it's better to be fun than to be cool apparently. Frick this shit
The biggest sin was not having Aqua turn into a Darkling since that's what it looks like she was starting to turn into based on her arms and hands. I mean hell, there's a Darkling on the cover of the game.
Just another victim of the DBZ-tier powercreep, asspulls, retcons, flanderisation, main character wank, etc etc. I don't know what the frick it is with Japs and being unable to write a fricking story. I understand if the megacorporations that make games and manga use tropes to get the mass appeal, but even the light/web novel amateur scene is nothing but
>rise of the morbidly obese asian incel powerfantasy hero: how my foreskin got trapped in my zipper resulting in me getting run over by a truck and being reincarnated in a western fantasy setting as a mythic hero!! >i was a loser in the real world, but now i'm the most powerful being in the universe and all the little 13 year old white girls want my 2 inch smegma covered ricedick >obligatory evil racist white man stereotype >"uwaah mr asian man sama, we are just so fricking stupid and moronic, we can't possibly rule our kingdom. Please become the supreme dictator and also please frick my wife" >"fufufufu, i guess i have no choice hwitey"
It's so fricking bad, i don't even bother reading or playing Jap shit anymore, unless the author is a woman.
No, he came back naturally because his heartless and nobody was destroyed. Both Xehanort and Terra returned to their bodies, but Xehanort immediately kicked Terra back into Cum Guardian, and put his BBS self into Terra's body instead of hijacking the body himself for some reason.
it was stated that whenever both heartless and nobody of a person are defeated they come back for some fricking reason. that's why all the other org members came back like Lea came back to life as well
toy box was fricking great and the only new world to actually put a smile on my face with the attention to the source movie and I'll slap anyone who says otherwise
More like kingdom FARTS
I was just gonna say that
i prefer the term kingpoop farts
That's not even word play, even an 8 year old could think of KingDUMB Farts. You're worse than a 3rd grader. Go to hell!
Disney had too much of a chokehold on how the disney parts were going to be handled
It’s funny because you can see how much better the Pixar worlds were handled and by all accounts Pixar was pretty hands off with SE compared to the mainline Disney animation studio.
Its really just frozen where disney really limited what the devs can do. BH6 was pretty bad. Herc's world was too short granted it was the tutorial level. Monsters inc was overstaying its welcome and should have been a different world. POTC felt disconnected until and because of its ending. Rest of the worlds were fine. 3 does have the worst version of 100acre woods.
>worst version of 100acre woods
Are you fricking moronic? That's the fricking best one, cause it doesn't force you to come back every time you beat a world, doesn't force boring ass walking sections with shit gimmicks, and it's not obnoxiously boring. You just go in, do a minigame and frick off forever out of Winnie Hole. That shit and Little Mermaid world were the worst thing ever
Pixar was actually very involved with the writing and gameplay of their worlds. They wanted to treat KH shenanigans as canon and make it fun.
Meanwhile Disney refused to bend the status quo at all and had their worlds play out like a theme park attraction. Sora and co were just along for the ride and had no impact.
Makes you wonder why? They haven't had this much executive meddling since the very first game
Because modern Disney has become very aggressive with their image and trying to mass appeal to everyone. They seemed to have forgotten that, for the most part, KH fans care about the Disney aspect the least, or rather they don't care how accurate it is to the source material. In fact, I feel like KH fans LIKE when the DIsney worlds are weird and silly. That's why people like the Pixar worlds so much
It depends on who owns what. Toy Story for instance and Tangled let them do as they pleased. I imagine Endor will be the same in RotJ, they'll let them do as they please, barring Sora beating Vader or something, might make a funny interaction with him thinking he's Xemnas.
Where Disney worlds work best is when their natural progression is an implicit foil to the events that transpire because of the Heartless. We know Beauty and the Beast by rote, so what does Beast look like when there's a genuine threat to validate his paranoia and anger? Jack Skellington is more than happy to embrace new ideas, so of course he'd get in too deep trying to figure out Heartless. 3 had glimmers of this with Woody telling Xehanort to frick off, but there are constant missed chances to intermingle stories; Sora showing Elsa ice magic, sharing stories with Rapunzel about feeling trapped on the island, or the Monsters Inc factory trying to use heartless for fuel instead of fear.
3 was trying to do too much at once between wrapping up every game's plot threads, dance to nu-Disney's fiddle, and live up to a decade of hype, but it still failed to really make the best of what it had.
I thought BBS did the best with this. Every world felt like it belonged in the journey because of how each protagonist interacted with it. KH2 kinda just felt like we were chasing Organization XIII through a Hollywood studio and stumbling through different sets. And then most other games are just rehashes of the same shit again.
I really wish BBS had been willing to give up a little bit of its verisimilitude for gameplay and had just locked in the Terra -> Ventus -> Aqua story progression but let you actually carry levels/decks through the playthroughs so you didn't have the same progression curve three times over. Storywise it was reasonably strong at showing the same scene through three different lenses by dint of its structure, but it had the fatal flaw that because the order of routes was unknown, the story couldn't have the near misses and the motifs of each of the characters show up in each other's routes. You got the big meetup at the middle but it would've been interesting to see how characters spoke about each of the trio to the others.
That'd have been nice, it'd be less of a pain filling out the journal. First time I was going for Platinum, I had completed everything on Critical on Aqua, including YX and everything. Found out after I completed all that shit on Terra/Ventus that I had fricked up how the journal carries over into the secret episodes and had to restart everything to do it properly, including that fricking Ice Cream minigame fantastic bullshit for it.
I played it while a buddy was watching so I both had a friend to shoot the shit with and also wasn't as laser-focused on completion. We gave a shit about stickers, that was the only thing we doubled-back for. Huge shoutouts to terra's high jump being in an unmarked chest in a random corner in the stitch jail cells, the frick was that.
I will forever contend that KH3 skipping almost two entire console generations was the worst thing to happen to the series.
>Because modern Disney has become very aggressive with their image and trying to mass appeal to everyone.
This made me laugh, anon. Not because YOU'RE wrong, but because current Disney really have no position to be snotty about how anyone else might treat their IPs. They've been on a downward spiral of increasingly common and severe failures, and being appallingly out-of-touch with their audiences, for nearly a decade now.
Why was Kingdom Hearts light?
Because you touch yourself at night
Better yet, it's revealed that the KH in KH1 was a fake created by Ansem SoD. So why was it light?
It's always Light. He made KH from the hearts of worlds but those hearts all still light
But it's full of darkness in KH1 after the light kills Ansem
In KH2 it's full of nothingness
BBS was darkness again
Explain this
In KH2 its full of nothingness because OG Ansem shoots a fricking laser at it and makes it spill all the hearts out leaving only the shell. BBS I fricking can't remember but something something Xehanort corrupts it with darkness or something.
>kingdom hearts... is light!
>light pours out of it
>look inside
>darkness as far as the eye can see
As far as I can tell this was never explained.
don't try to understand these games, it's a gateway to madness.
Speaking of not understanding things, why did they change the music track that plays when Xehanort kills Kairi from a fitting sad tune to cheesy and melodramatic, and why did they remove Kingdom Hearts shitting out darkness everywhere?
The door was the door to the realm of Darkness where all the hearts of the worlds were fed. Kingdom Hearts Ansem made was like a big night light inside RoD.
>the moment everyone posts to say KINGDOM HEARTS IS KINO
>updated to no longer be kino
Bravissimo Nomura
it didn't really weigh a lot
>Game decides to suddenly get good
Did you play a different game than me?
I waited 15 years for a mainline sequel and they couldn't even end the trilogy in a legitimate way. Instead they planted seeds for ANOTHER FRICKING SEQUEL and now Sora is the Ash Ketchum of the franchise
We always knew it would continue, but I wish they had created a better ending for people who wanted to get off the ride.
At least it was a good jumping off point. Shilling a mobile game was just disgusting. There were some serious rewrites happening in the last decade and a half before 3 was released that seriously screwed up the story's internal logic.
Still salty about Ventus and Roxas apparently being completely unrelated to each other.
huh? how? isn't roxas sora and sora is also ventus?
Sora, Roxas, Ventus, and Vanitas are all completely separate people now. Each of them can just go there own way.
picrec is common fanon
I just hate how they gave Roxas Ventus shouts in the KH2 rereleases.
We all knew the series would go on but I think most assumed 3 would end Sora's story and not specifically turn the next game into Versus 13.
The main trilogy is KH1 - CoM (GBA version) - KH2
Even Ash has bowed out by now though
I hear ya, they ended the 365 Days storyline with a family hug. Nomura wanted off this ride to write Verum Rex asap.
Roxas, Namine and Xion deserved to be whole and happy.
>Little plot at the very start
>No plot Disney filler for 20 hours
>Plot going 100 mph the last 5 hours of the game
>Roll credits
Why is Nomura such a shit writer?
Because he was trying to wrap the Xehanort stuff up in a singular game after Pixar's teams were ridiculous with their demands (they had to remake the Frozen level 3 times for instance because they had fits about the direction it was going in, for instance it was originally the city with Elsa as the final boss). He just wanted to move onto the new story with MoM/Demyx and VsXIII basically.
they're starting a new arc entirely, should mean the anime-side of the plot will be good right?
I mean it still has to connect to MoM/Xigbar/Black Box/Marluxia/etc. None of that's been wrapped up. Plus we also have the Verum Rex shit on top of it now too.
Don't forget Luxord. He's the only one who has been able to actually spar with Xigbar verbally and come out even, and we know frickall about who he was or what he's doing.
Wouldn't surprise me at all if he's MoM and all these fan theories about Demyx, and Vanitas, etc. are wrong. He clearly knows how the Power of Waking and the other world too. Hell for all we know he could be the original Luxu too and we have a Ventus/Vanitas situation going on with him and Xigbar. Him and Demyx are the only two without their names revealed after all.
>New arc
Mate there's already like 3 gachas about it and the lore is already convoluted (arguably not as much as the Xehanort arc, but we've already got a billion characters, time travel and all that shit)
>arguably not as much
Frick no. The worst Nort ever got was the time travel rules at the end because the heroes (of all people) never obey them. I dare fricking ANYBODY to explain to me the shit that happens in the last chapter of Union X. The Player tricking everybody into thinking he was possessed is fine, that I get. But The Ark? Two different towns? Make that make any sense.
I didn't play any of the gachas and didn't watch the gacha movie so the big Xigbar reveal was lost on me. Same with Axel and Saix suddenly talking about some girl they wanted to save (that came out of nowhere)
I have no interest in the mobile shit. The Verum Rex stuff seems interesting
>after Pixar's teams were ridiculous with their demands (they had to remake the Frozen level 3 times
pixar did not make frozen, disney switched to 3d animation after the princess and the frog. tangled, zootopia, big hero 6, frozen, all those were disney animation studios
by the account i heard, pixar was pretty nice to them, praising the graphical fidelity of their output but just telling them that they needed to make the story fit in between 2 and 3 because "the story was already told"
it was disney that was like "okay you need to have this and this happen in frozen world and you cant have elsa doing violence etc etc
Larxene has ice powers now I guess
Pixar is the one that rejected Toy Story & Monster's Inc. story because it was a rehash. They said they need to make a new story that fits the timeline cause they take their IPs seriously.
No they fricking dont.
Yes, he did homie I don't lie, it's one of the many interviews before KH3 was released. Nomura said KH is remaking the movies with Sora in them, but Pixar said "NO", unlike Disney.
They said "no", but not because they take their IP seriously.
+ The frozen director was a total fricking c**t and demanded nothing be changed about their "masterpiece", hence Sora, Donald & Goofy awkwardly standing around in the background interacting with nothing and saying nothing as the movie plays out in front of them. They should've immidiately told them to go frick themselves, and replace the Frozen world with actual kino like Black Cauldron.
>Black Cauldron
>kino
Not only you're a froghomosexual that uses a homosexual word, but you think a boring ass trash movie deserves a spot
>unironically using the word "froghomosexual"
>not recognizing the pure, absolute kinography of Black Cauldron
Nomura really wanted Frozen in, so he'd do anything they asked to get it. He was also confused why people cared more about Aqua turning dark than the Frozen reveal.
Frozen is the biggest animation out there rn. Ofc they wanted Frozen in and they were gonna suck whatever BBC they were told to suck.
2 was rated around 80s when it first came out. It is just that every teenager from then based their personas on one of the characters. It just got to the cult status AFTER FM2+ and before BBS.
BBS was the beginning of the end.
KH3 was garbage.
>build up all these characters and plotlines over 15 years of games
>speed through all of it in 3 hours because you want to get to the part where you set up your sequel where you revive your failed game
wtf is nomuras problem
Look man, taking away Versus XIII broke him
seeing this for the first time was a legitimate mindfrick
up all these characters and plotlines over 15 years of games
through all of it in 3 hours
This is what pissed me off the most. Some of these plotlines started at the very first game. And instead Nomura just rushes this shit out with no time to take it all in. I mean for frick sakes we save Aqua and then literally 5 minutes later we save Ven
Should have had Riku save Aqua, while Sora saved Ven simultaneously.
This. I have no idea some of the pants on the head moronic decisions. Riku even makes a comment about how Aqua sacrificed herself to save him in KH 1 ending so he can close the Door to Darkness. You had Riku and Mickey (who also has loose ends to tie up with Aqua) and they both fail their mission just for you to literally push the Sora button and save the day. Frick Nomura
Yep and Sora completing his arc with finding out about another heart in his and the room in Castle Oblivion, would have completed that arc from the data games too.
agree, considering Riku's arc, him saving someone from darkness in the realm of darkness would've been kino.
instead we have the most homo-erotic fricking event
>you know all that character development and growth of Riku’s character? You know having him fall to darkness, redeem himself and now accepts his darkness so he can use the power of darkness and light. You know how he wants to save Aqua who is trapped in the realm of darkness and completes his character arc?
>yeah let’s ignore all this have him job so Sora can magically be the big hero and lets make it as gay as humanly possible
Why do we like Nomura again?
Don't forget it would have been kino for Aqua to see Terra in Riku but he's conquered it, giving her more hope with Terra as well. What's crazy to me is that it was always a point that Riku was massively better than Sora, especially when he was in the right mental space, Sora just had a way to connect hearts and house hearts, which made him special, but everything else Riku was better.
KH3 throws ALL of that out the window.
Nah, frick Riku. He hogged all the spotlight in DDD just to have the same arc he already did before, only worse. He then proceeded to be absolutely useless in 3. I'm sick of him, the BBS trio and especially the Days trio. This is Sora's story first and foremost, as Nomura himself confirms, and I'm sick of being sidetracked by all these boring ass shitty side characters who feel like fan characters of fan characters and never do anything worthwhile. I'm glad Sora sidelined those scrubs for the finale and that things are finally focusing on him again.
I've had zero desire to replay any KH games since finishing 3. I've played several of the games more than once and loved them, and had kept up with the lore. But the payoff was so monumentally disappointing. Just a bunch of short shitty cameos and then we didn't even get closure at the end. No classic happy endings for anyone. Utter bullshit.
Everyone gets a happy ending but Kairi and Sora, and I guess technically Riku by extension.
Willa Holland was hot though and she was better in 3 at least. That's just her voice though, she's probably high off her ass the entire time.
>Everyone gets a happy ending but Kairi and Sora, and I guess technically Riku by extension.
Hm, yeah I guess so. I just rewatched some of the ending and epilogue cutscene. Maybe I was misremembering how rushed the reunion between all the characters felt. That was the part that actually bothered me. The ending is actually decent.
I'm still pissed about all the build up we had for the final battles to be so fricking lackluster. All the organization battles and character resolutions should been fricking epic. All the battles and character returns happen so fast like the Roxas, Axel, and Xion comeback. RE mind fixed some of the problems but man what a letdown.
What the frick is his endgame
He's Nomura and his goal is maximum shitposting.
>nomura gets cucked from his vision of versus xiii/xv
>gets cucked from kh by disney
>gets cucked from verum rex allegedly
why is everyone doing this to him? i hope he completely fricks up the ff7r trilogy just to spite everyone and this is coming from a fan of the first remake but i can definitely see it getting off the rails bad
>What is Nomura's endgame?
>There is an effort by Square to forget that XV under Tabata ever existed.
>Tabata already gave FF the status it used to have in America so he pretty much did what the suits asked him to do even if Tokyo Team anon is furious they made the writing MCU tier. This allowed Nomura to come back onto the spotlight with 7R even if it was essentially assigned to him against his will.
>But moment they found out XV's momentum was flagging and Project Athia wounded profits in 2018, they kicked him out. Considering that new fans kept associating Tabata with XV since 2016, they probably thought it would be in bad taste to let it continue so they cut him off and dropped him just before Episode Ardyn. They're probably only letting Forspoken out on the open world so Luminous Productions wipes their hands off the project that Tabata kept on talking about for years after XV's release.
>At the same time though everyone suddenly asked Square Enix about Versus in those surveys and Nomura suddenly added the Verum Rex trailer in KH3. With him suddenly leading multiple projects in supervisory positions and even getting promoted internally things seem to be looking up for him, and in the FF11 interview between Nomura and the producer that got released today no mention of XV is made in any form whatsoever even if he was credited as creator.
>Forspoken looks underwhelming, I'm surprised that S-E didn't cancel it. Unless they're trying to recoup the costs that were spent on Luminous engine and the formation of Luminous productions.
>I think that's exactly what they're doing. It's squarely aimed at the XV demographic, but unfortunately the entire reason why Forspoken exists is the same reason why NEO TWEWY and 7R didn't do as well as Square Enix expected: because serious anime plots with lots of meaning and good and substantiated political commentary is cringe, and vidya like MCU movies exist for spectacles and nothing else.
>I thought about something similar before. Assigning a mobile/handheld developer on a AAA project with already troubled development was moronic. But having Tabata be a scapegoat for it's failure totally makes sense.
>It's just weird to me Tabata went into FFXV with the mindset "even if we fail it's OK" when he started changing it into a Westernized open world kusoge as if it's some indie project he's experimenting with. There is also that insane marketing campaign that practically shoved FFXV down everyone's throats. S-E is really run by a bunch of monkeys.
>Did you hear about the theory with the legacy of Tabata's XV being actively covered up?
>I mean, Tabata left SE and took some people with him. I would be surprised if anyone would want to defend his legacy as the opportunity he got to direct a mainline FF game was a huge honor. That he would just leave and take some talented people with him, no doubt hurt SE, even if it was an amicable parting. I personally don't believe the talk that he was fired, but I do think that the way the FFXV DLC was canned after he left meant SE was ditching whatever direction Tabata was taking his team and sending it in another direction. And with Nomura still a powerful force at SE, I'm sure he'll be very happy to help everyone forget about that time so he can redo things the way he always wanted to.
>Kujiraoka: This costume was actually from Versus XIII's costume...
>Nomura: Wait are we allowed to say that name?
>Kujiraoka: Yeah, it's ok.
>Nomura: Because before it was not allowed...
>Hazama: Uh, it's complicated.... but it's ok now.
https://arch.b4k.co/v/thread/598946567/#q598974141
https://arch.b4k.co/v/thread/587326452/#q587391902
>This memory holing is even [happening] likely because Nomura has been getting so much power and pull within the company, [so Stellagay says] NEO and SoP getting his final sign off on every aspect are indicators of influence and more likely making a team being set up for bigger things.
>What is Nomura's endgame? (Blocked by Suits)
>Why is Nomura so unlucky? hasn't he done enough for square? hasn't he given them kingdom hearts? hasn't he created an iconic jrpg style? hasn't he contributed to ff7 significantly?
>Because people want the opposite of what he makes. They want simple handholdy stories with simple handholdy combat systems. The Tokyo Team battle system was scrapped to praise from Tabata, journalists and zoomers alike. And the original Nomura-authored political conflict was taken out and 15 was successful because it was 'made less anime'. SoP and Days were shat on for making people experience negative emotions and drama that got in the way of their gameplay.
>Note: You can argue that 16 still hasn't captured the elusive American/European mainstream market for this reason (aka breaking 5 mil like 15 did). This market calls the above KH nonsense.
>Edgy and dark still really isn't cool enough for the mainstream. I saw someone on Twitter say that RPG fans will only play Final Fantasy games if it had the combat system and writing of Borderlands and the aesthetics and quips of a Marvel movie. Even Zelda has too much plot for people who don't play Japanese games. Square will do anything to become as big as Ubisoft even if they shouldn't.
>People don't want a good RPG; they want a lame power fantasy with fancy presentation. All hype, no substance.
>That's why Versus XIII was retooled into XV.
>What is Nomura's endgame? (Dreamgame Development Denied)
>CEO asks you to direct KH3 and assign a guy who helped you make CCFF7 and T-0 to co-direct your other game
>You cannot make a trilogy and have to compress the game into a single entry
>You fight with the CEO since you worked your ass off and you really want to finish this passion project
>He lets you work on the project a little bit more and tells you to watch E3
>"Wow a fricking FF7R remake that's cool"
>Directed by Tetsuya Nomura
>WAT
>You are removed from your 'weird' and 'dark' passion project to work on 'more lucrative' products
>Be told Tabata will faithfully finish the project provided you can fit your vision into a single game
>He doesn't
>Develop KH3 with a shitty engine that barely fricking works only to delay it because of said shitty engine
>Everyone blames you since no one has a fricking clue about how shitty Square management is
>Meanwhile you are forced to direct FF7R
>Outsourcing is so bad you take it upon yourself to develop 7R in-house due to the love for the game
>15 releases and it's completely different from your vision. You hate is so much you make VERSUS references left and right in KH3
>Meanwhile Disney fricks you over and over again with extremely heavy restrictions
>KH3 releases but it's not what many expected thanks to mismanagement, restrictions and juggling development with another equally as huge AAA game
>You are so angry about VERSUS you want to make another game which is kind of sort-of a reference to it but isn't as ambitious and dark as VERSUS would have been
>Get news that FF7R has a new director to help you out
Now:
>Tabata got fired. Luminous dissolved. Kitase is too busy with FF7 and Nomura has two directors on FF7R-2 to watch his office for signs of Kitase looking for him.
>Nothing can stop Nomura. He's making a game about an angry man, one that's as angry as he is. Angry about Versus. Angry about Chaos.
>What is Nomura's endgame? (Part 3)
>He's definitely fantastic at what he's good at, but I'd like to think by now he also recognizes both his shortcomings and the particular strengths the company has. From the things already said and done with how he's gotten the right writers and developers for the right projects and those comments about him trying to pull together a particular team, that very much seems like the case, and even reminds me of a certain recent SE protagonist with a knack for leadership. (This is Kanade Rindo from NEO The World Ends With You (TWEWY)).
>The comments about how [Nomura is] trying to reform Tokyo Team [spoiler[(more on that later)[/spoiler[ as well as aiding on all these different projects not by managing them himself but by finding and placing the most talented people for them in that position and assisting them in getting to that path is not unlike the leadership style Rindo shows especially at the end of the game, where his awareness and understanding of the qualities and relations of each and every one of his allies and the capacity to connect them is what allows him to put in motion the plan that ultimately reawakens the city.
>There's likely more parallels to draw from, after all the game prominently features people from Shinjuku encroaching upon Shibuya but settling their differences, and even Rindo himself from the start of the game is very adverse to taking responsibility and putting himself out there to make decisions out of choice paralysis and the fear of what could happen, instead just drifting along and passing on details that could be crucial.
>After all, imagine you got the chance at a project that could be everything you want to make and have it taken from you due to all kinds of circumstances, while your other prized project is subject to all kinds of corporate meddling.
>That sort of thing might make you never want to take such decisions again, at least for a while.
>What is Nomura's endgame? Limit(ed Filesize, So Two Games and Half My Team Got) Cut
>When Versus XIII was cancelled, Nomura's heart found a home in CBU3 and suddenly took Naoki Yoshida twice during the production of Shadowbringers and Endwalker, which is why KH2 battle planners, programmers, designers, modelers and artists joined the FFXVI team. The Nomura Tetsuya we know at CBU1 is Xamuron Sexyutta, his angry Nobody.
>And Versus was itself sundered into Shards:
>Stranger of Paradise Final Fantasy Origin
>Kingdom Hearts 3 and 4
>Final Fantasy XV and Forspoken
>Final Fantasy VII Remake, Rebirth and Regame 3
>NEO The World Ends With You
>Final Fantasy XVI
>Verum Rex
>Final Fantasy XIV Shadowbringers and Endwalker (pic related)
>All complement one another. When they reunite the market will remember and ask, "When is Versus XV?"
>That means Nomura should join CBU3, the disciples of Yasumi Matsuno and have Maehiro and Akiyama work their magic at a political narrative with high octane Nitroplus drama. We will have our late night anime kino.
>What is Nomura's endgame? (Part 4)
Pay attention. The rule of good writing is to show, but not tell, and Nomura knows that.
>It's not telling Jack that he'll remember the past, but that he will be *forced* to, and that that makes him a liability because he chose to ignore it and has immediately started feeling the effects.
>The only "telling" part in terms of a narrator insert is how it echoes and reflects Nomura's thoughts on the Versus XIII situation.
>The line in question which is before the "liability" remark is awful and stands out as a conversation the characters absolutely wouldn't have.
https://arch.b4k.co/v/thread/633824571/#q633852707
https://arch.b4k.co/v/thread/633824571/#633852893
>"Hey, Nomura-kun. We need to have a talk. Now that Kitase and Hashimoto can't protect us from Matsuda like what happened with Wada, Versus XIII is a liability. You depended on your tenure to keep it in development."
>"In other words, you'll be forced to do your favorite thing: acquiesce."
>"Uh-oh! Well, it was nice knowing you, Tetsu!"
>"Shut up. [Laughs] I don't care about any of that crap."
>"If it's not Versus XIII, making Versus XIII, or edgy and dark, who cares right?"
>"Wrong. All of that's just background noise. All I care about is-"
>"Finding something to replace that purpose you lost?"
>"You got it. I need a game - something to create. I'm nothing without a story to tell."
>"I wouldn't say that."
>"It's a matter of principle, you wouldn't understand. [Laughs]"
https://arch.b4k.co/v/thread/634121843/#q634185118
?t=781
This is Nomura's story. There may be one more chance.
Harness the burning anger.
>gets two sets of friends group
>gets to wield TWO?! Keyblades naturally
>fricked Namine and now is fricking Xion
>gets the best return in the game
>is OP as frick
Roxaschads we won
One of the girls will end up with Ventus instead.
Frick you I need Ventus with Aqua for mjaximum oneeshota.
Aqua is for Zac and that's why he got revived
Welp Zack in KH is a shota so still counts. Unless he ages.
Xion is trash but everything else is good
>xion
>trash
You can frick right off
So Even 100% gave his daughter a boob upgrade, right?
Xion is easily the worst character in KH. Stupid concept.
engh
We really did bros. we really did, seeing him return still makes me feel emotions.
>Dear Xion, who is the goat in KH?
also has the only VA worth a shit in KH3. I don't know if it was the voice direction or what, but the english dub was garbage
Terra is the only character Nomura handled well.
No
He certainly has the most compelling, most masculine story.
Vanitas is MoM
>Zipper is the Unversed sigil clasping the X-Blade
I believe it.
>MoM is actually Darkness who gave birth to Vanitas, Darkness is actually Demyx, name is probably Edym or (Adam), the first man, who was born with Darkness in his heart because he saw what was in the forbidden box.
We getting deep.
>All other Darknesses captured for him to reabsorb
>Keybearers hopelessly subverted for centuries thanks to intentionally contradictory orders
Where were you when Vanitas won
>There are now 7 Darknesses and 13 Lights
>Darkness has become the Seven Deadly Sins
Because it requires you to have a nice day basically
Why do you think Vanitas/Superbia/Pride named the Foretellers that way?
>these anons are Nomura in disguise
You sneaky bastard, we know your plan. There's 7 fricking Union members too.
>13 lights
>12 apostles and Jesus Christ
so, who's judas?
Vanitas https://youtu.be/l9VZ6XPFTlA?t=615
Except Sora is still alive.
Be real anon.
Do you genuinely think Nomura would let "Dark Sora" be a side villain?
no moron
unironically play/watch the shitty mobile games
>Yozora reminds me of Noctis
>Aegis reminds me of Ignis and Gladiolus
>Magia reminds me of Prompto and Ardyn
>the Nameless Star reminds me of Stella
Nomura Won
Disney Lost
Square-Enix Lost
We're gonna find out that the "otherworld" is actually the real world and all this fantasy stuff was a recreation of events that actually happened in this world that MoM created, much like the phone game was just a book. The only weird thing, everyone says Yozora looks like Sora in TS world, are they all blind as frick? Are they gonna ignore that he's identical to Riku?
>The only weird thing, everyone says Yozora looks like Sora in TS world, are they all blind as frick? Are they gonna ignore that he's identical to Riku?
You act like Rex and the others have met Riku.
Yeah, but it doesn't take a genius to see that Yozora looks nothing like Sora and vice versa. It's like them saying Donald and Goofy look the same.
Ok but only Rex and Hamm were saying that.
Hamm isn't stupid though, not entirely. Rex is sure. I mean you could argue that because they're 'animals' their vision is fricked, but then they might as well not notice a difference between Andy, Sid, or any other kid, which they clearly do. We're gonna get something dumb knowing Nomura where Yozora is the real world Sora, and has split his soul between Riku/Sora in this 'fantasy world' or some dumb shit, one darkness and one light. You know it's Nomura, we're gonna get something fricking stupid out of it. It'll be kino, but moronic.
Hamm was the one pointed out the Yozora-Sora connection first.
The only connection that they have is Yozora can use a keyblade. Toys are dumb.
Just like they kept saying Roxas looked like Sora when he really didn't
Characters will have Unreality counterparts, Yozora is Sora's
>Lets turn the badass anti hero assassin who did whatever the frick he wanted into an even more homosexual Deadpool who jobs like a b***h comic relief character who loves making meta jokes
Nomura please have a nice day
>"breaks" the fourth wall once while talking smack to his former boss
>hurrr he's like deadpool
have a nice day, you tryhard little homosexual
>Axel makes a meta joke about the confusing as frick story while the gang is all reunited before the Keyblade War
>Axel breaks the fourth wall to say how popular he is
>Axel makes a meta joke about them being late because "they had a couple plot points that needed ironing out as the camera cuts to Ven and Roxas looking at each other
>Axel literally says "just bring out the big bad"
Shut your stupid ass up you dumb fricking homosexual. Axel has been reduced to deadpool
Remember when Axel was a cool, chaotic, mysterious wild card of a character who was manipulative and murderous as hell with a hint of a deeper side to him? I miss that Axel.
>he was a soft gay all along
has this series developed anything right?
Literally half the people in this game are dressed like Noctus, normura needs to fricking move on already.
To be fair, it does look real good on Riku, prob would have looked good on Aqua too.
I always thought it was weird how everyone decided to wear plaid in KH3.
Well nomura also dresses like noctis, the dude never grew out of his 13 year old edge lord phase
That's just Japanese fashion in general.
.
He's right, Japan are like 20 years behind when it comes to fashion and arts compared to the west. Every guy in their 50's and above have been dressing like emo band members for the past decade.
He went from cool antihero to jobber clown in the span of a single game.
He only stuck around because people liked him so much in KH2 anyway. He was originally supposed to stay dead, and then he got revived because of that popularity with fans... and given a keyblade for the same reason. Both of these things precipitated lore changes to explain the whole Somebodies thing and how passing on a keyblade works. So Axel being hot (heh) fujobait ended up being one of the most impactful things in the series.
It wasn't even fans it was the devs. It similar to Kojima not killing Snake in 4
Axel has never been cool, stop the cap
i never liked him because he killed Zexion but he was menacing in chain of memories
He was pretty good in Chain of Memories zoomie.
as moronic as the core plot of that game was, the banter and characterization was still miles ahead of the shitshow that is kh2 and everything afterwards
how time flies
I mean if you basically work with the good guys more than you work with your own team for most of your existence, or lack thereof, your not much of an “antihero” are yah. You’re just a hero at that point. Like he’s helped Sora and the rest more than he’s actually fought them even before he got a Keyblade.
He was definitely more of an antihero narratively in CoM. In KH2 was when he was undoubtedly a hero and had one of the best conclusions to his arc in vidya. Shame they shat all over it in DDD and 3, but I guess he was a victim of being too popular.
The funny thing is that Axel was only able to kill two people within the Organization in CoM and that was after Sora and Riku had already weakened them. Hell, he didn’t even kill Zexion, he had Repliku do it.
>train for an infinite amount of time in Merlin's hyperbolic time chamber with Kairi
>both instantly job
>Kairi
>Jobber
Someone didn't play REMIND
>post release retcon
It’s literally final mix. The finished product which has been a staple since the first game
>just straight up copies her all but official boyfriends battle stance
Top cute.
Copied so hard that Sora straight up hijacks the final boss fight in MoM
A game that was supposed to be HER game
The funniest shit
There's no way she's going toe to toe with Master Xehanort let alone the weakest member of Org13. Besides the whole series is power of friendship so makes sense she wins via Sora.
They could have made a boss that was just for her
Instead they just recorded some footage of KH3 and called it the final boss
Lazy and funny
He cucks Sora though, so that's funny
3 was a mistake and should have been rewritten.
Its fricking short compared to the previous games, too. 1 and 2 had you revisit worlds and their final world was pretty damn long. I didn't even know that I was on the last world in 3 with how fricking small it was because it was just a boss arena.
Hey guys lay off Nomura is trying to fix his wrongs
Then he should have let TAV handle Xehanort, hell Riku handling him makes more sense than Sora. Sora has become Super Goku now, he has to get all the big fights and glory now. No other character gets a moment outside of random schmucks that don't matter in the end.
I agree. KH has literally become Dragon Ball. None of the side characters matters. It’s just the Sora and Riku (Goku and Vegeta) power hour
Sora's the main character you dipshits
He hasn't let me make my OC yet so I can frick all the girls, and the boys too.
KH is KINO. I'm not surprised that troons here were filtered by 3.
I absolutely love KH, even 3. But 3 was definitely rushed and could have been better.
1, 2 and 3 are all fantastic games and neck and neck in quality.
I hope keyblade transformations stay, but I absolutely hate the arrow system
I feel like that's a meme and half-truth, the plot gets better but the world design and meme-worthy moments happen during the disney worlds, especially those of pixar.
Keyblade Graveyard should have had personalized fights from the get go.
>Riku vs. Dark Riku/Ansem
>Kairi vs. Larxene
>Roxas vs. Xion
>Axel vs. Saix
>Sora vs. Luxord
>Ventus vs. Vanitas/Marluxia
>Aqua vs. Xigbar/Terranort
>Mickey vs. Young Xehanort
>Sora vs. Xemnas
>Terra vs. Xehanort
>suddenly remember Aqua's voice acting
I wish i could give as less of a shit about the job i was doing like Willa Holland.
Her voice is so fricking hot she could be reading out of a phone book and make me want to cum.
>aqua is stuck in the realm of darkness for a decade
>sora just pulls some deus ex machina out of his ass and saves her
>she proceeds to job immediately after to vanitas
kek kh3 was such a shitshow
What's crazy is that she was kicking Riku and Mickey's asses both, and Sora just pops in with magic, beats her ass, and then she beats Vanitas' ass, and gets girl confused and loses.
have you literally ever played a KH game before? That's how they all are
Apparently you didn't play KH 1 or KH 2
The Disney worlds have always been filler. Literally the only reason you even go to the Disney worlds in KH3 is because Sora is a moron who forgot how to use the Power of Waking so he goes to the worlds to waste time while trying to remember.
>Ven literally tells Sora he had the power of waking the entire time which is the biggest slap in the face because the game basically said you wasted almost 20 hours for nothing
Sora still had to go on a journey to regain his powers bro. Even if he had the Power of Waking from the getgo, he would’ve been too weak to actually do anything with it.
I've only played the mainline games (1, CoM, 2, 358/2, BBS, DDD, 3), what's the whole story around the mobile game? Does it tie into the actual KH story, or is that exclusively the main line titles?
Everything is mainline, there are no side games.
that's moronic, they're pulling some Nier bullshit
KH has been doing canon side shit for almost as long as Taro has.
Except at no point in the franchises history has there been side games. They have always been canon.
isn't KH unchained a side game? It's all taking place in VR or something
sorry I meant Re:Coded
Re:Coded content is literally referenced in KH3. Also Maleficent find out about the Book of Prophecies in Re:Coded.
its all canon even the rhythm game
Nope, Re:Coded is important too, it mentions the Book of Prophecies, gives Mickey and the gang knowledge about Ventus being in Sora's heart, etc.
Come on, even the music game? Bullshit.
>even the music game?
Yes
It's a fricking rhythm game! How the frick can it be important? FFS you just play as random KH characters running on music tracks
>It's a fricking rhythm game! How the frick can it be important?
There's still story to it.
Something something about Kairi searching for Sora in her memories or some shit
and then Sora possesses her body to fight the memory of Xehanort and then more of this
RANDOM
moronic
MULTIVERSE
SHIT
THATS ALREADY FRICKING BORING AND STUPID
ON TOP
OF EVERY OTHER RIDICULOUS THING IN THE STORY
TWENTY SOMETHING EVIL CLONES OF THE BAD GUY
A DOZEN OR SO CLONES OF THE GOOD GUY
AMNESIA
MISTAKEN IDENTITY
SECRET PASTS
REINCARNATION
ACTUALLY THERE COOLER PEOPLE IN THE PAST THAT DID THINGS TOO
POSSESSION
IMPERSONATION
CONSPIRACY
BETRAYAL
NOW ACTUALLY THERE ARE LIKE EVEN MOOOORE ANCIENT CHARACTERS THAT DO FRICKALL AND SAY FRICKALL
TIME TRAVEL
TIME TRAVEL
TIME TRAVEL
AND NOW MULTIVERSE SHIT
and none of it is remotely coherent or interesting
i think i just decided not to buy 4
KH has always been a multiverse.
sure dude
>litetally travel to other dimensions with vastly different art styles
>not a multiverse
>Except at no point in the franchises history has there been side games.
Kingdom Hearts VCAST, checkmate
>Kingdom Hearts VCAST
Jokes on you, that game is vital to understanding the inner machinations of Kingdom Hearts.
>I've only played the mainline games
It ties in insanely heavily. In 'short'
>all the worlds were one
>they were 7 keyblade wielders and a master
>master had a book of the future and a black box
>made all the other masters make unions/groups and gave them each a task
>they all got suspicious of each other
>shit went to hell and a keyblade war happened splitting the worlds
>one of the unions had a group of young keyblade wielders to carry on the light
>some of them were human marluxia/larxene/ventus/etc.
>ventus was taken over and killed marluxia's sister but was thrown out of this world which was a book he was in and into the future basically
>one of the guys that had no union took the master of master's keyblade no name and passed it down to his apprentices and the black box
>he then body jacked people until he was xigbar and could have his own plan
>queue the sequel setup at the end of KH3 for KH4
Like it's A LOT of fricking shit that even the movie in 2.8 barely even covers.
...what? That literally makes no sense
Welcome to Kingdom Hearts. It only makes sense if you actually play it, hearing/reading about it will leave you more confused than ever.
huh, thought I knew about the story but apparently not. Thanks for the write-up though
Nomura really skimmed over it with Back Cover and synopsis stuff, but still decided it would be an extremely important part of KH3 and the lore going forward.
You're leaving out other kooky essential big shit like
>Darkness being a sapient entity
>YOU getting Xehanort'd
Well the Xehanort stuff was resolved in his game, you're actually reincarnated into the guy that would pass No Name to Xehanort and train him and Eraqus. But yeah, it's a lot of shit, it's hard to explain overall. It's like all those old meme pictures of people trying to explain BBS and DDD with Vanitas being a clone of Sora but there's also Ventus who is a not a clone, but he's Roxas. It's better to just play the games yourself and actually understand it, but in this case, especially on Ganker, I don't have time to write a thesis paper on the plot.
If it has Kingdom Hearts in the title, it's important. Period.
It's worth playing, honestly the story isn't confusing if you actually play it, it only gets confusing because of the phone games, which are kind of a mess to get into and best left to just read about.
How on earth did half the shit in KH3 make sense to you if you didn't play 0.2, watch back cover or play the mobile games?
oh yea I guess I did play 0.2, completely slept through back cover though, that shit was boring as frick. Didn't play the mobile game either
>I've only played the mainline games
No you haven't. All the games are mainline. There is no spinoffs. The mobile games are mainline (and literally the set up for the next arc) and even the rhythm based game Melody of Memories is canon and mainline
The phone games have the best stories and are the best written. They are also dark as frick. Some shit I wonder how Disney to allow Nomura to put that in
>Some shit I wonder how Disney to allow Nomura to put that in
probably because disney couldn't be fricked to play the mobile game either
>dark as frick
>dude just turns into light and fades away
kek I know what you mean but it's still funny
for KH that's pretty dark
>just straight up executes him
>blank stare on his face because he literally just watched his entire classmates and friends die and he had to kill the one responsible for it
Fricking brutal
who's the gandalf looking mf
Gandalf from the Disney Lord of the Rings movies.
>The phone games have the best stories and are the best written
No, they fricking aren't, they're 90% filler and 10% vague waffling about with cliffhangers and half-formed plotlines.
The mobile games were fricking awful. They had shit gameplay, shit style, and shit story. The fact the moronic writers actually made them more important to 3 than any other game shows that it's time to put KH to bed. Things have run their course.
Is the series worth playing? Only played the first one way back when it released, always been a little intrigued by the sequels, but just got confused by all the side games and re-releases that I just never bothered with it.
I think so yeah, the first 2 at the very least
yes, KH2FM is still to this day the best action RPG ever made imo
>action RPG
>little to no actual RPG elements
>B-B-B-BUT IT HAS STATS! THAT MEANS ITS AN RPG!
>YOURE PLAYING THE ROLE OF A CHARACTER SO ITS AN ROLE PLAYING GAME!
I wish everyone who has ever made these arguments would get hit with a brick
Its an RPG. Cope and seethe
There's tons of rpg elements, are you moronic??
Aqua is so fricking hot, why can't i sex her.....
I want Verum Rex frick everything else
Sex with Namine
the disney worlds felt even more pointless than kh2 it's honestly pretty impressive
how much has Sora actually aged since KH1?
He's about 16 in KH3, so 2 years since KH1. Nomura regrets aging him, so he tries not to age him anymore now.
We know a year has passed between CoM to KH2. Beyond that you can probably figure in another year between all the time spent between KH1 to end of CoM and KH2 -> DDD -> KH3.
>Let's kill every off for shock value
>Bring them back 30 minutes later
If this was a comic book I'd agree with you, but the point of killing everyone wasn't for shock value, it was literally to make Sora learn the power of Waking properly. Then also use it so wrong so hard, he erased himself from reality.
>it was literally to make Sora learn the power of Waking properly
except the entire point is that he isn't using it properly, he's literally distorting reality and fricking up his own Heart's existence in it just to bring everyone back from the dead and rewind time
Did you stop reading my fricking post or something?
Yeah and that's the first time he actually uses it. You'd think Yen Sid would have told them this in the first place honestly.
Of course he wouldn't. No one ever tells Sora anything until it's way too late and then act like it's his fault when he literally had no way of knowing in the first place. Xehanort does a better job of warning Sora than anyone else, but why the frick would he trust him?
Sora really needs better friends.
>but why the frick would he trust him?
Because if anyone's dark Sora, its Xehanort.
Also Xehanort is totally coming back in some capacity in 4. What was it, he might've shunted off a clone of his into unreality or something?
>Xehanort fully returns after a big cutscene showing him and Eraqus being shunted off to the deader-than-dead afterlife
Bullshit but I wouldn't put it past Nomura
Oh he's absolutely coming back. He did correct himself to say he'd prepare a 14th life for the new world and there's that Nomura sketch of silver eyed Xehanort in Quadratum. He's coming back and I'm willing to be he'll be on Sora's side this time. And he'll still be a smartass dickhead, cause he always was.
>angsty Young Xehanort and Young Erquus show up in Quadratum as Sora's allies because uh...Nomura liked writing them
Truly, an autist savant.
Nah, no Eraqus. Just another Xehanort that's somehow not the same one in the afterlife. Because that's much more Nomura.
People only die when they're killed.
would have been better if the trailers didn't spoil fricking everything
NEO TWEWY basically did the same but handled it much, much better. It’s baffling
NEO:TWEWY had the benefit of the entire game being built from the ground up around the themes of taking responsibility for your actions and having the willingness to proactively fight for what you want rather than fade into the background of someone else's decision. KH3 was Sora getting mocked for falling into the trap that Yen Sid threw him face-first into, told to master the power of waking but forbidden from using it and never told what it actually does, and then rebuked by his peers and yote from reality when he discovered he'd had the power the whole time. There was no through-line emotionally or narratively to support the emotional whiplash.
>NEO:TWEWY
The difference is that's an actual good game, masterpiece even, compared to everything nomura has put out since KH2
NEO sucks. That's why nobody bought it, gays.
I do not care about the mobile games.
I do not care about the excess of OCs.
The game will never be complete without the Jungle Book world.
>Nomura literally created Nameless Star as a way to vent about the changes from his vision for Versus XIII and how Yozora (Noctis) was changed too much and how they (Tabata) took away everything from her (Stella)
Will Nomura ever let this shit go? It's been almost 10 years now
No, it's like a girlfriend you wanted to marry and things just ended. A part of you will never let it go.
>Nomura literally created Verum Rex as a way to vent about the changes from his vision for Versus XIII (Stella/The Nameless Star) and how Yozora (Noctis) was changed too much and how they (Tabata) took away everything from it (his story)
Based on recent theories, fixed that for you.
Square Enix is trying to create a future without him, so they're cucking him instead of letting him blow his load with his projects (admit it, SoP was kino) and teach younger Square Enix devs and then stepping back like he wants to not unlike Sakaguchi.
This is to curry favor with the Western market that liked the changes Tabata made to XV, including removing Nomura's edgy Matsuno-style political plotline and the KH2 battle system. Because XV was less anime than Versus, it was well-received from release to mid-2017. Square Enix wants every Square game to be that well-received forever.
XVI seems to have accepted that it isn't as mass market friendly so Yoshi-P went ham on the social commentary story and action combat by getting someone from DmC. It sold 3 million but the high PS5 attach rate showed that going for a niche yet very big market (like A24, etc) is the right idea for Final Fantasy. Nomura should leverage this for a Versus reboot.
>This is to curry favor with the Western market that liked the changes Tabata made to XV
>Because XV was less anime than Versus, it was well-received from release to mid-2017.
Seriously? Do we know what people hated about Versus 13? Was this the 'Japanese games are bad era?'
Feels like SE is listening to the westerners who criticized japanese anime and games 20 years ago, despite naruto, zelda, and final fantasy being extrememly popular. You the kind of people who think they have the solution to “fix” the multimillion dollar franchise by making it more american
Zelda is popular enough because it doesn't have a story for you to follow. Most people watch Marvel movies and sitcoms will argue that anything with drama or character gaiden spinoffs already muddies the water and so KH/Nomura games get that criticism. They don't even follow narratives anyway, they just think scripted dialogue and action scenes are plot and it should stay that way.
Why do people still hate Japanese media anyway? Is it really too dark/edgy or 'sincere' as the namegay says it is? It can't be that bad.
>namegay
Who?
>namegay
>Who?
>be a normal anon poster
>post like it's a phpBB forum in 2005
>discuss Square RPGs and Xeno, and sometimes Sonic/SEGA games and Fire Emblem on the side
>someone won't stop comparing said RPGs unfavourably to FF15 and threatening other Nomura fans
>it's Barry
>try to reason with him after he calls The World Ends With You a QTE game
>Barry won't change
>is somehow called based in TWEWY and Xeno threads
>expose a fake Versus leaker by entering his Discord
>out him as a Nazi
>get called the same name as the Nazi because they are associated with Versus
>begin namegayging
>Barry posts gorn and cp so jannies can quickly archive a thread
>they don't
>remind Barry a few days later he did that and ask him why he isn't in jail
>remind Barry he threatened to rape an FF fan who also likes Stella
>more bickering
>be so fed up with Barry's lies and slander against flawed but innocent Square Enix devs
>do an ungodly amount of research
>make a bunch of headcanon writeups
>post them a few times for fun before SoP and NEO launch
>gets excited for SoP and NEO
>fights Barry again
>realize Barry isn't worth it and then fricks off
>but then says 7R needs Gambits because his favorite FF, FF12 used it to improve party AI before he disappears
>the headcanon writeups take off with a bunch of autists called the Whispers of Stellagay (I'm Magun anon and will shoot)
>those same autists ruin discussion of the Gambit system
>FF16 is said to have political intrigue mixed with dark anime tropes
>this appeals to the namegay's tastes directly almost 1:1
>Tokyo Team involvement
>FF16 launches
>FF15 fans are shown to have the same opinions as Barry and hate 16
No wonder he doesn't post anymore. You triggered him, Barry. You triggered Stellagay.
But Toriyama is subservient, Tabata excised, Nomura and Yoshida ascend, 7R gets Gambits, 16 is Versus 2.0, SoP is kino. In time, Stellagay won.
He must not be forgotten. I kneel to the namegay, for he did nothing wrong.
That's Jill. You can't convince me otherwise.
Jill is not some namegay on Ganker
right shes a resident evil character
I meant the girl in the picture, dumbfrick. That's clearly Jill Warrick.
I don't think they look alike at all.
>TL;DR for Stellagay Writeup, Side Black (Part 2)
>The black image AKA Stellagay writeup Part 2 talks about why changes were made to pander/appeal to the Western (North US American) market and how they ensured success and the longevity of the FF brand along with how Nomura felt about these changes.
>Nomura was incredibly pissed that the original, dark and chuuni as frick Versus 13 was dumped for making a product with mass market appeal thanks to changing sensibilities in the western market, as such, he included links to the corporate politics that led to it in Kingdom Hearts 3 via Verum Rex, an in-universe video game. Stellagay speculates the next game will be Verum Rex and it'll be a retelling of how the internal corporate politics of square that led to the downfall of his baby (Versus).
>Stellagay says that Versus 13 was decringed into 15 to save the Final Fantasy brand at the cost of removing everything Nomura wanted to put in it in terms of story and gameplay like the Kingdom Hearts combat and all the dark shit you saw in 2000s anime which became cringe in 2010 so it could sell outside of Japan and save the Final Fantasy brand. It made Japanese games semi okay because it saved Square financially but Forspoken is now the fruit of Nomura's pain and suffering.
>XIII turned off a lot of consumers, it was expected to be a BIG success and a lot of money went into the trilogy. Nomura wanted Versus to be a more "serious" story about contemporary modern day problems [compare: FF12, Vagrant Story, 14, 16, Code Geass, Gundam, Death Note] but SE felt this was too risky, would cut out certain markets like China and risk being another failure. XV was made readily appealing to FF fans and fans in general and overall it separated itself from XIII. But the sales were not good enough and consumers didn't stick around while long time fans felt the game was lacking. Elements of Versus got recycled into KH3 and Nomura took cancellation of the project hard.
Good. Nomura is a hack and I'd love see someone else handle the series.
>Muh wild ride
Unrelated, but Nameless Star's English VA is surprisingly great.
Nameless Star's japanese VA is the same VA as Stella from XV 2013 tralier
what a coincidence, huh
Damn dude, right in the gut.
>Stella
He did nothing wrong. Reminder.
Just popping in to announce politely but firmly that Aqua is the best girl.
Farewell.
>arrive
>speak the truth
>leave
>Just popping in to announce politely but firmly that Dark Aqua is the best girl.
FTFY
Right you are, Anon!
>Reading all the final thoughts of all the people who died but can't accept they are dead
>That one about the guy who is pissed that his friends already replaced him and he questions if he even mattered at all
>That one about the twins who did everything together but only one of them is dead now
>That one about the little boy who is dying but doesn't know he's passing over and thinks his fricking father is playing hide n seek with him
Fricking Christ
KH4 if it will deal with themes of death and the afterlife better have kino like this and worlds that complement it
Well one is Endor, so it'll probably deal with Force Ghosts and letting go of hate and angry and darkness. Can't wait to see Sora try to talk no jutsu Palpatine or start swinging Ewoks around like a psychopath.
Donald is almost certainly smacking one in the head with his staff.
lmao I really hope we do get Star Wars of some kind, but I'll believe it when I see something more concrete than a shot of a vaguely redwood-tree forest. I want a lightsaber keyblade.
It was in the KH4 trailer, you can see an AT-ST's foot during the forest bit of the trailer. It's 100% Endor.
Oh, yeah I see it now. I saw the trailer back when it came out, but never caught that. Hype. I don't know why exactly the dumbfrick crossovers of KH appeal to me so much.
That was one of the highlights of the game for me. Especially the guy whose buddies already replaced him. Funny that a bunch of last thoughts of completely nameless, faceless voices impacted me more than a dozen characters we've had for years and years.
Do you think Sora and Riku ever compared wiener sizes
Sora wiener is so much bigger than riku’s. That’s why Riku acts like an autist socially awkward moron around others while Sora gives off chad energy to everyone he just meets
Riku's way taller and older so he probably has the bigger one, he always beats Sora after all.
>the power of waking grants you the ability to kill the grim reaper and bring your friends back from the dead and then create an entire fricking new timeline
Why is it so OP?
Because it literally erases you from existence going against the laws/rules of reality.
should i give this another try? i remember playing the first one and the tutorial being so fricking long
Tutorial is like 5 min, if you mean Destiny Islands as a whole, then its maybe like 30 min if you don't know what you're doing or what to look for.
Yeah go for it and just laugh and the batshit insanity
bro i cannot think of anything more embarassing than having to explain the plot of KH to a fellow adult
literal kids game, thus only kids and manchildren play it
A teenager boy goes through disney worlds to fight evil, there, plot explained.
embarassing
>i only play mature rated games for mature gamers such as myself
>First game is a simple story about a boy wanting to go on a big adventure to other worlds with his friends and darkness makes his friends disappear and he has an adventure with Donald Duck and Goofy to find them
>Now the story is about some psychopath who wants to kill Darkness for good by coming up with a 4D plan which involves a war resulting in the death of thousands of kids, body swapping, time travel and unreality
>In reality it's all because a dude above him just wanted to shitpost in real life
yeah yeah gramps go eat your bran flakes
The Kingdom Hearts trilogy is KH1, CoM, and KH2. Everything else is fanfiction of varying quality.
>he was a good guy the entire time
SEXO. She should have permanently looked and acted like this.
Disney worlds are the good part you dumb Black person
Sex with aqua
Sex with Dark Aqua too
Especially her, especially her doing the sexing instead.
I'll take em both, I'm hardcore.
Yes
Gentlemen.
Both at once.
They forgot the only reason most players gave it chance in the first place was the Final Fantasy portion of the mix. Said players did discover the crossover was actually kind of neat but as usual Disney doesn't understand what people actually like about the things they own and fricked everything up by forcing more their bullshit into the ratio while simultaneously also segregating it somehow.
I kinda want kh4 to have ff in it again but only shit like ff12 or 16, just imagine people like Balthier or Clive having to humor Soras bullshit
they forced yuffie to zip up her pants hahaha
Free belts and fixed pants from the Walt Disney Company.
>murdered countless amounts of people and spread evil to numerous worlds and wanted to be God
>It was just a prank bro I was a good guy all along my bad
>gets to go to heaven and play chess with his boyfriend who he himself murdered
What the frick was Nomura thinking
Even bad guys deserve redemption
Naa he deserved to get fricked. Nomura's a moron
He was into Naruto too much that he ripped off the "Totally bad dude gets into not heaven"
There isn't really a hell in Kingdom Hearts, everyone returns to the Light regardless. You either go there or end up in Limbo, where you're not dead, but more erased from existence because of Waking or some other shenanigan.
I want to lick aquas ZR.
she dies too fast, the Zodiac version in 0.2 was much more fun.
also frick this shit series for pumping out shit mobile games with most of the plot.
only gonna play 4 for the superbosses and a chill playthrough. story went to complete shit
>I know I committed genocide and ruined the lives of many, but let's play some chess while being philosophical and theological!
Mark Hamil: sure thing bro, I forgive you, this game is basically Star Wars anyway
Fun fact Nomura is a self proclaimed Star Wars fanboy and it was his decision to cast Mark Hamill as Eraqus for the English release (he also is a Star Trek fanboy and he made the decision to cast Spock as Xehanort)
Yeah but they killed those roles.
Well both were good VAs in general
KH 4 news when?
Re:Mind fixed the game
Bullshit it did, it didn't fix didly-doo.
Rape me with that Keyblade baby jam it up my ass GOOD thank you for letting me be your cum bawd your fat cum bawd prostitute . I love when you violate me I love to bleed out my ass and use my blood to jerk off to you as you call me your filthy fat cum bawd prostitute yes baby yes
Aqua should be a more prominent character
Looking back now, it’s kinda insane Disney gave Nomura so much creative freedom but was on Warren Spector’s ass the entire development of Epic Mickey
So what is Vanitas' origins?
Darkness.
He's the Master of Masters, who pretended to be Ventus' darkness as a centuries-long plan to get someone to forge the x-blade for him.
>Implying present Vanitas didn't time travel back to the past to become MoM in a fricked up Uroboros
Could also be the case.
What if Ventus or Terra were in enchanted dominion at the same time as Aqua, with the former two being tiny and the latter being normal size? What if they got themselves stuck in a toilet right when Aqua had to poop? Asking for a friend.
You could have stopped partway through that post with pristine giantess conditions but then you had to make it weird.
GAR?
BBS was a mess but goddamn this moment alone justifies its existence.
Where the frick is my manga, light novel or movie that summarizes all of the phone game? Why the frick did Nomura put half the plot required to know what's going on in a shitty phone game?
>weaponize loregay autism to force them to pay gachabux
DAMN YOU, NOMURA
It’ll come after the KH3 manga is finished.
So just like every KH game?
looking at that thigh gap
So...will this scene be Kairi vs Sora in the next game
Should've been the final boss. Makes no sense why Xehanort stayed in his old man body with the X-Blade instead of the chad body he worked the entire BBS to steal. He was stronger in Terra's body anyway.
What's up with morons suddenly pretending kingdom hearts disney worlds were not always about the characters in the worlds and barely advanced the plot forward? This has been the case since the very first kh, is it rose tinted glasses, nostalgia, growing up?
What is it?
Kingdom Hearts 1 Disney worlds at least had the story importance of saving the worlds from the heartless by sealing the keyholes. Every other game they were pointless though.
Except for Hollow Bastion, every other world is mostly about the characters in said world, same shit as kh3
Sure, but the overall story of the game was about how the heartless were destroying the worlds. Several worlds were destroyed before the game started, Destiny Island itself was destroyed at the beginning, and the all of the worlds were restored at the end.
And Deep Jungle
And Monstro
And Atlantica
And Neverland
KH1 had plot in them though
2 was filler.
The best part of these games is the Disney Worlds. The endgame of KH1 worked because it felt like you were playing through a Disney movie and the end part was your character's movie. None of the other games got this dynamic right but SDG hopping through movies was always alright.
KH1 actually tied the world's loosely into the plot, KH2 and onwards was fricking filler
Idk, I like visiting Disney worlds as long as they're not Frozen/Atlantica tier. The recreation of the movie environments is honestly really impressive.
this homie looks cool as frick and is the reason I was mkultra'd into wanting longhair.
>getting rid of the best keyblade design for a fricking car key
KH3s biggest sin
Would you give it a rest? Soul Eater fricking sucks, Riku wracking things with a dumb bat wing is just as trash as the car key. The only good edgy weapons are Nameless and Oblivion.
Ah, yeah that fricking hurts, a lot.
I've been out of the loop for awhile, so what's the deal with the latest KH game, is it finally getting rid of disney shit?
honestly riku's whole design in kh3 is pretty wack.
WHEN YOU WALK AWAY
YOU DON"T HEAR ME SAY
When is our girl Aqua gonna get the respect she deserves?
>Jobs to Vanitas after fighting for ten years in the RoM
>Succumbs to depression mid fight in the doomed timeline
>Doesn't say get fricked to Xehanort by shacking his ghostly ass at the very end
>Ends the game wasting time looking for Sora in the RoD still having to babysit dipshits 1 and 2.
It's weird how the character files and dialog have a ton of respect for her. "Wow, Aqua, heart of steal, so strong, yes ma'am!!"
I don't think the writers intended for her to be embarrassed ryona material but that's how it came out.
Frick Terra
Darkness
Light!!!!!!!!
OK, I believe you.
Kairi handjobs
>was one of the first scenes that connected the main story to the mysterious armored figures from the KH2 secret ending
>you'd think the Chamber of Repose would play a role in Aqua's rescue, as Riku and Mickey were searching for clues related to her at Radiant Garden
>Ienzo and the other apprentices never bring it up
>Aqua just retrieves her original keyblade and armor offscreen after the ending
KH3 had so many missed opportunities
KH3 was shit all the way through. At least the Disney worlds looked pretty.
I really liked how riku yells burn here and the dark firaga sound effect
Reminder that this is the definitive end to the series, and the only game released after 2 that actually matters is Days. Don't (you) me.
>dude just watch 100 hours of phone game cutscenes on youtube, you want to know about xehanort’s mom and maleficent’s cloak don’t you
>you want to know about xehanort’s mom and maleficent’s cloak don’t you
more like
>you want to even remotely understand what is going on
Aqua is the worst of the playable characters. Boring c**t
How will you react if KH is revealed to be FF all along?
kingdom hearts 3 was fricking shit
where was the mad af trio? literally everything is sora being a gary stu and every other characters being thrown in the garbage can, that reaction about roxas and ven was lame as frick too
>the only person to care that Roxas and Ventus are identical is Axel
>never comes up again
What a disappointment
Could have done some KINO as frick story, there was lingering will, mad af trio, could have gotten aqua to see roxas and think he lost his memory or some stuff like that and try to make him remember
Dark Aqua fight is bullshit. Can't lock-on, no Donald+Goofy, and you are randomly using your 3rd equipped keyblade.
KH3 was so frickin bad.
I remember tearing up at the secret ending of BBS.
Where the entire cast of characters across the entire universe universally realizes Sora is the key to their salvation and chant his name.
Nope, just homosexualy fricking smiling moron with zero understanding of all the suffering and evil going on around himself.
None of the story or themes are integrated into disney worlds just big fat load of turds dumped at the end of the game, to finally conclude the "Xehanort Saga" in the quickest most unsatisfying way possible.
The game looks rushed as frick and also the new engine makes the characters look souless as frick compared to the previouses games
Nomura was too angry and obsessed with preparing his bootleg Versus13. He can't focus one anything else for shit.
To be honest his bootleg versus 13 also looks souless as frick, what the frick went through his mind? If he wanted versus 13 completed he shouldn't have screwed the ffxv development which was a massive mess like kh3, anything this moron touched turned to shit recently
Was it Nomura's fault? I'd say he was responsible for letting the project too big (it was FF12 meets KH2 after all) but splitting it into 3 games seemed like the right idea. The problem was exacerbated with the PS3 and Tabata trying to pull the rug from under him (which is why his team members and all his level designers left, but Kanemori's people are still at Square anyway).
>Kanemori
Also who?
>the KH2 level design team is gone
I can see people say this is a good thing TBF. Wonder why he didn't just get more 12 level designers.
I was gonna ask about that, starting 2 soon. Is its level design any good/were we robbed level design wise for Versus?
>Was it Nomura's fault?
I'm no jap, but the concurrency of Nomura and Kojimas issues leads me to project a similar situation on to Squarenix.
Nomura is too much of an auteur.
His public credibility endangers projects because he's too popular to challenge or remove.
This conflicts with absurdly inflated budgets and mass market expectations of incredibly broad open world games with 3 or 4 basic gameplay pilllars (exploration, combat, stealth, crafting, etc)
In order to realize Nomura/Kojima's vision in a way that scales from their prior success as auteurs would require a decade of dedicated work (not just preprod and high level design) and a billion dollars.
Kojima is just more talented in general and had a stronger hold over Konami (being family owned didnt help).
I dunno, I hear Kojima's more of an idea guy and he doesn't seem to get in the trenches with his people. Nomura meanwhile solves level design problems like it's fricking nothing according to one of his team members.
>he doesn't seem to get in the trenches with his people.
Kojima exhudes extremely detailed controlled over his projects.
It's why he can jump engines and his games still affect the same lighting and visual dynamics.
He has a very distinctive visual style that is present in every one of his projects.
Nomura's style is flamboyant character design and a similar cringey sentimental melodrama to Kojima but lacking historical and dramatic gravity.
Nta but he wanted to prove he was capable of that in Versus and wanted to blow his load on current year political wars because he didn't like that KH let him do so. Not sure though if an FF spinoff was the appropriate way for him to do that
And now he's killing so many kids in KH like it's nothing. WTF Nomura
Kamen Rider Black Sun, Higurashi, Psycho Pass, toku, anime and manga are at their best when the authors ascribe their principles in it better than Westerners doing the same. Versus was going to be no different and Nomura wanted to do the same.
>Kamen Rider Black Sun, Higurashi, Psycho Pass
What are these?
My headcanon is that Nomura wanted XV to be episodic like 7R, but higher ups at Square Enix wanted the game to be a multimedia product to quickly generate revenue in the shorter term. Nomura disagreed with the idea, and that's why they kicked him out of the project and replaced him with Tabata
I think what you said combined with what people are saying about Japanese media was a double whammy that allowed Square Enix to remove Nomura just like that.
Do you have anything to go on about the 'too anime' argument though? Did normies like Versus in 2006 or was it too emo/dark for the general public?
nomura got deleted from versus 13 so he could work on kh3
vs13 was his baby but the project's development halted immensely due to some factors
>ff13 development was a mess due to lack of vision and slowed due to the creation of the crystal tools so staff from every team grouped together to make the game happen
>ff14 on release was also a fricking disaster and they needed staff from every project to make the game happen
by the time development on ffxv could kickstart for real or potentially already started, the project was handed over to tabata so nomura could focus on kh3, which was already a troubled project on its own right
the osaka team that worked on kh2 and was working on vs13 got slowly disbanded and scattered all aroud the company during the spikes i mentioned earlier
the entire thing was a fricking mess all across the company, the issues here were far bigger than vs13's development
the ceo at that time (yoichi wada) was also known to be a fricking moron that famously took million dollar corporate decisions according to what his personal fortune teller told him (yes I am not exaggerating and this is real, you can look this up)
this company is just fricked
So that's why 16's emperor had the fortune teller with him.
>Was it Nomura's fault?
>TL;DR for Stellagay Writeup, Side Green (Part 1)
>The green image AKA Stellagay writeup Part 1 (picrel) talks about the events in Square Enix that caused Versus XIII to turn into XV. Crystal Tools and mismanagement turned XIII and XIV raging dumpster fires that almost killed the company under Wada, forcing the Versus team to be split across any and all Crystal Tools games to make development easier.
>It mentions the Crystal Tools graphics engine and how it affected development. It also talks about how trying to get mass-market appeal affected gameplay (changing from a more complex KH2 like battle system to the simpler one we see in FFXV).
>Nomura's team was constantly taken away to finish XIII, then XIV and then help again with ARR. His game was never in constant development like some morons think it was, because more than half of the time he didnt even have a team. With no team or deadline he thought of new ideas like any director would in that time to keep the ball rolling. Square restructured like 3 times during that period and in an effort to fast track production; they told Nomura to start working on both Kingdom hearts 3 and FF7 Remake. All the production work done thus far was given to Tabata with Nomura overseeing the transfer. Tabata who unfortunately was a layman of a director and a mediocre one at that.
>Tokyo Team anon's comments
>I'm surprised Stellagay didn't pick up on this but other KH2FM/Versus team devs worked on XIV or under Yoshi P during Endwalker apart from Ohdachi and how many other KH2FM devs that weren't former FFXI team members also worked on Parasite Eve 2 when all of them were known as Square's Osaka Team. Yes, even the guy who (note, no longer) works at DeNA for Pokémon Masters after wasting his battle design talent in XV after KH2FM and early Versus is from Osaka, everyone's former favorite battle director Yuichi Kanemori
I want to have sex with Stella and Luna
>I remember tearing up at the secret ending of BBS.
homosexual. If you didn't boot up BBS, and immidiately recognize the quality of the gameplay, dialogue, and story writing took a fricking nosedive off a cliff and the franchise was officially out of ideas and therefore dead, you're literally moronic.
It nose-dived well before BBS, cuck.
Wrong. II and Days are pure Kino in terms of writing, which you would recognize if you weren't a tasteless mongoloid. Everything related to BBS was a complete fricking mess, including the secret ending in II.
2 is peak KH, 3 is massive garbage, and that's fricking pathetic considering it's the game that took the longest time to release
BBS is exactly on par with 2.
Youre giving 2 too much credit because the gameplay is the best.
Youre just flat out wrong about Days and no amount of revisionism or franchise decline will redeem that game.
Terra & Ventus' stories were on par with 2. Aqua just drags the story down & a big reason as to why the game is so divisive other than the gameplay.
Ven is way worse than Aqua.
>BBS is exactly on par with 2.
KH2 is narrative Kino. The intelligent nobodies are the perfect villains to one-up the animalistic heartless in terms of the narrative. The organization members are all memorable and unique, and they are also tragic victims of circumstance. They are empty husks that just want to get their hearts (souls) back. BBS is a soulless prequel retcon bonanza. Aqua, Ven and Terra are just a poor man's rip off of the destiny island trio and their character arcs.
When it comes to Days, no-one can defend the abysmal gameplay. However, the character writing and Roxas' arc is pure Kino, and the narrative highpoint of the entire series.
>Days
The same battle designer made coded was recently trained further by another KH2 dev (Masanori Sato) on 3 and now we have NEO TWEWY thanks to him.
You can expect similar writing quality from Days in SoP, because Kanemaki who wrote Days also did the story for SoP.
>KH2 is narrative Kino.
and then Roxas's prologue ends
And Sora is wandering utterly irrelevant Disney worlds exactly like 3 until the end of the game.
>and then Roxas's prologue ends
True, tbh
>And Sora is wandering utterly irrelevant Disney worlds exactly like 3 until the end of the game.
Well, he already defeated the Heartless in 1. The only reason Sora doesn't just go back to Destiny Islands is because he wants to find Riku. Then he gets introduced to the nobody threat, and because he's got one of the THREE KEYBLADES IN EXISTENCE, he can't just ignore it.
SOVL.
I want to draw Aqua but I am bad at drawing...
Practice then. You'll improve with time.
Reminder.
>gets played or manipulated by almost every Disney villain in the game
Aqua was in the right for calling him out, Terra was being a dumbass for most of the game. The only character acting dumber than Terra was Eraqus
everything after 1 is trash.
Biggest crime in 3 was not letting this be a playable fight but let you shit up the place with Kairi.
>waiting to see super sentai doom guy sperg rage all over terranort for like 15 years
>he appears 2 minutes and dies offscreen
>well, m-maybe on the dlc...
>the followup is that he appears for 10 seconds on a cutscene and gets killed instantly
t-thanks nomura...
>Got you, Xehanort
why the frick did they make him speak?
The entire Key Blade Graveyard level in KH 3 was such a huge disappointment.
Instead of a proper boss rush against Organisation XIII, we fight 2 or 3 members at time and they've been completely toned down to the point that they might as well be trash mobs with bloated health bars and a gimmick. The constant cutscene interruptions that happen during the fights get old really quick and frick the pacing of the fight.
The fight before the final boss with Ansem, Xemnas and Young Xehanort all at once is just fricking lame.
All I can remember about the final boss is that it was annoying to fight against and overall pretty forgettable. Also the fact that everyone forgave him for all of the irredeemable shit he did, including murdering Kairi in cold blood about an hour before you fight him.
Imagine if Lingering Will vs Terranort was an actual fight.
Imagine if Disney rides weren't in the game and you actually had to fight off that massive hoard of Nobodies and Heartless.
Imagine if you had to individually fight every single member of Organistion XIII in all of their glory.
Imagine if you had to fight Ansem, Xemnas and then Young Xehanort back to back, in ALL of their final boss glory and then some.
Imagine if the final boss was actually memorable, asides from the goat head and the awkward flying controls I legitimately can't remember anything about him.
>We could have used & seen what real keyblade transformations look like.
Nomura needs to go.
>Xehanort's Keyblade transformations: Double edged sword, chakrams, chain whip, giant floating cannons
>Sora's Keyblade transformations: Hammer, claws, drill, flying plan, nerf guns
T-Thanks, Nomura....
Filtered, unironically. The silly shit is pure KH, and it's not like you don't have the likes of Highwind or Ultima Weapon anyway.
keyblade transformations was always kind of dumb
if they were that flexible and had that much utility their default form wouldnt be a sword
just another (relatively minor comparison) absurdism on the pile
the gameplay in 3 is so uninteresting I didnt even remember the keyblade transforms
you barely get to swing it before the game slaps you in the face with 3 or 4 free/easy/no cost room clearing cinematic moves where Sora literally rides the tea cup ride at disneyworld and expels existentially threatening soul demons from the world
I recommend playing it on Critical. Not only is the difficulty much more fun, you get a bunch of unique abilities, one of which disables the Attraction Flows in favor of giving you more Situation gauge which means more formchanges more often. Replaying KH3 really has made me appreciate Formchanges more, they're way more functional than they seem at first glance. Tied or even exceeded Drive Forms for me.
I dont want to have to play on a harder difficulty to be able to manually disable shit that ruins the base game.
You know you can choose not to use them if it bothers you so?
hate this argument
it diminishes the fun of gameplay if theres a giant red WIN button on the side of screen i can press at any time
theres a distinct differences between setting self limitations
and when the easy way is staring you in the face and screaming at you the entire time and it would take 10th of a second to activate
I get it. I've done runs of games where I disallowed certain strategies or techniques.
But this is not the same.
Why didn't Aqua rape Sora?
Someone should post the writeups
>writeups
?
What an newbie. But that is fine, you will be dealt with.
>The sharp anger that cuts even daggers, Edgy Grey!
>The schizoposting that births abundant replies, Cringe Purple!
>The delusion that melodrama creates good stories, Emo Black!
Scatter, needlessly reposted autism!
I summon you, Whispers of Stellagay!
Was Sora right?
KH is literally the light of all worlds, what's moronic is how Ansem SoD forgot about that when he's known this his whole life as Xehanort and Terra.
Hack writing I guess.
>uuuuuuh Kingdom Hearts is the door between dark and light
>uuuuuuuh actually its Light
>uuuuuuh actually that was just Light trapped behind the door
>uuuuuuh actually the door wasnt Kingdom Hearts
>Kingdom Hearts is a moon that gives people hearts
>uuuuuuuh nevermind the nobodies just regrow hearts on their own
>Kingdom Hearts is actually some kind of balance between dark and light that does.....
>uuuuuuuuh 7 lights and 13 darknesses
>uuuuh and you need a sword with a terrible pun for a name and you can only get it by cutting a guys heart in half
>what happens when you do the Kingdom Hearts thing?
>uuuuuuuh who knows pay no further attention to Kingdom Hearts because multiverses or something
>LOOK AT THE MULTIVERSES
kingdom retcons
I don't know how anyone treats it seriously, it's a disney game
Singing with mermaids and stuff and then having a serious discussion about the plot is such tonal whiplash it just comes across as comical
>I don't know how anyone treats it seriously
Kingdom Hearts 1 was a perfect mind virus.
Cringey melodramatic teenage angst set inside beautiful nostalgic recreations of renaissance Disney movies, releasing EXACTLY as 90s Disney kids were hitting adolescence, losing friends, discovering romance, leaving their childhood behind
Just a real miracle of timing and creativity and talent hitting at the exact right moment.
It's not a serious property, but it pulled the exact right strings at the exact right time to invoke strong nostalgic emotions in its target audience.
>FFVII Rebirth next month.
>KH4 is next.
>We will probably see it as soon as May.
It's already been 4 years since Remind DLC, there is no way this shit isn't coming out early next year, Square has no other AAA games.
I think 2 is largely overrated and 3 is largely underrated. Both games are second rate next to 1 which remains the only really great KH game. I remember being obsessed with 2 in anticipation because I loved 1 so much, but 2 just ended up feeling rushed as hell, a game for set pieces. The world's were such a huge step down from 1, and the episodic nature of the game that has you replaying worlds to go fight a single extra boss was really obnoxious like the game had no idea what it wanted to be. Nobody remembers but you didn't even fight Roxas in the original version of the game, it was like the one thing the game was hyped around and it was cutscene'd only. 3's story is a huge mess, but it's largely a product of the series meandering through infinite sidequels. The individual worlds I liked way more than 2's worlds, hell the entire world map being open up instead of pre-made railshooter stages was weirdly compelling to me. Also I really like all the end bosses ganging up on you, fighting all the main villains at once then fighting the entire replica organization XIII at once like they're weird MP Eva stand-ins especially
>play disney shit
>surprised when disney shit , is shit
woah
I miss cool shit like this.
>has the best arc
>has the cooler moveset
>has the better waifus
>isn't a complete moron like Sora
Roxas-sama, i kneel..
Me too. Now everything has to have a quip and be less impressive stuntwise just so it's more fun, and it's better to be fun than to be cool apparently. Frick this shit
deep dive is the coolest vidya trailer/movie.
BBS>Deep Dive
No.
DUAL WIELD!
Look how wet Aqua is here.
Terrachads won. Vencucks on suicide watch.
Aqua is Terra's wife and Ventus's mom
Where did it all go wrong?
Making Chain of Memories mandatory to understanding the plot
It hasn't.
I want to throatfrick Kairi
Donald...
Goofy!
Aqua sexo
The biggest sin was turning Aqua into a fricking idiot jobber. KH 3 Aqua was character assassination
The biggest sin was not having Aqua turn into a Darkling since that's what it looks like she was starting to turn into based on her arms and hands. I mean hell, there's a Darkling on the cover of the game.
strong people dont become mook heartless
A Darkling isn't a mook heartless. They're literally created from keyblade wielders who fall to darkness.
Forgot to add they can also speak
having a keyblade doesn't make you not a weakling
Sora had one and turned into a Shadow.
Darklings arent Shadows
didnt say they were
good luck figuring that one out
Just another victim of the DBZ-tier powercreep, asspulls, retcons, flanderisation, main character wank, etc etc. I don't know what the frick it is with Japs and being unable to write a fricking story. I understand if the megacorporations that make games and manga use tropes to get the mass appeal, but even the light/web novel amateur scene is nothing but
>rise of the morbidly obese asian incel powerfantasy hero: how my foreskin got trapped in my zipper resulting in me getting run over by a truck and being reincarnated in a western fantasy setting as a mythic hero!!
>i was a loser in the real world, but now i'm the most powerful being in the universe and all the little 13 year old white girls want my 2 inch smegma covered ricedick
>obligatory evil racist white man stereotype
>"uwaah mr asian man sama, we are just so fricking stupid and moronic, we can't possibly rule our kingdom. Please become the supreme dictator and also please frick my wife"
>"fufufufu, i guess i have no choice hwitey"
It's so fricking bad, i don't even bother reading or playing Jap shit anymore, unless the author is a woman.
And then the 3rd part is only Disney worlds
KH is kino from second 1 and if you disagree you got filtered.
Terranort should've been the main villain of KH3. Makes no sense why he wasn't.
I forget how old man xehanort came back anyway, time travel shit in ddd? ddd was such fricking dogshit
No, he came back naturally because his heartless and nobody was destroyed. Both Xehanort and Terra returned to their bodies, but Xehanort immediately kicked Terra back into Cum Guardian, and put his BBS self into Terra's body instead of hijacking the body himself for some reason.
oh right
jesus christ
it was stated that whenever both heartless and nobody of a person are defeated they come back for some fricking reason. that's why all the other org members came back like Lea came back to life as well
toy box was fricking great and the only new world to actually put a smile on my face with the attention to the source movie and I'll slap anyone who says otherwise
ROXAS
WHATDIDYOUDOWITHKAIRI
YOU'RE A NOBODY
https://files.catbox.moe/2kcx71.jpg
You should be able to play KH with japanese voices for the OCs and english voices for the Disney characters
Sata andagi!
Isn't NEO considered the /real/ successor to KH2 anyway? Compared to KH3, 7R and even 16?
ye
Again
Make it stop
>He's here
You are too late, the thread is dead
It took me years but I think I finally accept that kh3 is shit.
take your meds before posting holy shit