Sawyer has thrown the towel.. Owlcat has abandoned us.. what do we have left?
 Ape Out Shirt $21.68 |
 Tip Your Landlord Shirt $21.68 |
Ape Out Shirt $21.68 |
rtwp bros.. did we just lose?
Sawyer has thrown the towel.. Owlcat has abandoned us.. what do we have left?
Ape Out Shirt $21.68 |
Tip Your Landlord Shirt $21.68 |
Ape Out Shirt $21.68 |
>Anno Domini MMXXIII
Why write it like that?
Better than BCE 2023
>BCE
No. Just write 2023. This just makes him come across like a smartaleck nerd. Is this what a redditor sounds like?
Idiots like to sound smarter than they really are. Smart people lower their sophistication when they talk because they have no issues with their egos, so they go for simpler words.
Reddit is the epitome of dunning kruger idiocy.
no, I do it to talk down to people because of my ego. I assume you won't understand and need to lay it out for you
Holy shit anon it's just a joke way of writing it. Same way sometimes you see here a variation on
>playing games in 2007+16
Not everything is a israelite conspiracy
You're the only one that talked about israelites though, Josh has always been a redditcore dev
he's a goon, unironically the most self-important group of pseudo intellectuals on the internet
This explains so much. I've always found it kinda cute that people constantly b***h about how annoying Redditors are when goons still exist.
that's great Josh.. but where's the Good Game?
I don't really give a frick about your beefs with other Dev's because you can't make good games anymore.
Why does he even have beef with Swen? Dude offered him and his crew a spot back when he was making D:OS2 and he turned him down. Like why the frick is he this mad at a guy that’s been nothing but friendly to him?
Because Swen is a passionate guy who makes decent games and Josh is a post-post-post-ironic SA poster who has never smiled in his life who makes incredibly boring games nobody likes
Short answer is everything Josh said couldn’t work or wouldn’t sell, Swenson has proven otherwise and it’s destroying his credibility. That’s the issue he has with BG3, 8 years ago he was saying making a AA crpg would bankrupt a dev team of his size. Swen and his crew made two with a team smaller than Josh’s. Then Josh was hand waving that saying they were outliners and back in 2018 he said we never see a AAA crpg that would be profitable or have wide appeal. Fast forward five years and we watch history happen as the first game MS compromises their X/S must be the same game is BG3 due to how much it’s selling on PC and PS5.
Josh can’t be friendly to a guy that indirectly is telling him he’s full of shit.
Underrated post. It makes sense, he's a veteran of the industry and has a lot of pride/ego.
Where the frick did I say anything about a conspiracy? And where is the joke? Writing the year out in Latin numerals out of nowhere is not a joke.
And yet it has the same effect as the example I gave
Seek help
You sound mad
Weirded out at best, try bringing up israelites when people call you a weirdo IRL, see how it goes.
nah I can't, I can't get a world edgewise past all the "Haha we hate Whitey (they are all white) and we just LUUUUV Black people" 24/7.
Its not a joke, he is a fricking moronic leftoid
?si=cAHIPD3FdabV49XW&t=19936
You can say that again
>Is this what a redditor sounds like?
Basically, Redditors like jerking their own "intelligence", not by being actually intelligent, but by constantly showing off random trivial crap and "fun facts" they learn from pop-sci Youtubers like Vsauce without actually understanding why things work the way they do.
>Before Christe
burgers, I swear
He's a San Francisco leftoid
This
Rightoids would be too dumb to understand roman numerals
mad lmao
Hi, JE Sawyer. Are you finally COPEing with the fact that BG3 shit on BG1-2 from a great height and you couldn't even copy Bioware in IWD?
anon I'm laughing at christcucks seething that people aren't praising their imaginary abuser every time they say the date, idgaf about bioware or BG1-2
What the bloody hell does that have to do with anything? Do you not know what anno Domini means?
newbies GTFO
nice discord raid you mega homosexuals
>here's the link comrade sisters! go tell those chuds off using the normal methods
>NO DONT RESPOND AT EXACTLY THE SAME TIME, THAT LOOKS REALLY SUSPICIOUS
He wrote TYOOL 2023 first, backspaced it and then typed Anno Domini MMXXIII with a smile on his face.
It's a funny way to say "CURRENT YEAR"
Because he's a pretentious homosexual.
because it's a funny way to say the current year
>everything must be as boring as possible because I say so
>and it isn't even how the source game (D&D) is played.
Woah, you can't actually pause time IRL? Say it ain't so!
You’re right, it would have been much more based if he had said “CURRENT YEAR + 8”
Leftoids can't be based
you’re boring
oh god i cant believe its been 8 years since current year
what the frick have i done with my life im in my mid 30s
Because only israelites write Common Era
He's a European history nerd.
to appear intelligent
>2012+11
>he doesn't write years like that
shiggydiggy
Real Time with Pause is shit, its always been shit, and it isn't even how the source game (D&D) is played.
I get it, Western Dev's, especially Lefty San fran types like Josh, fricking DESPISE turn based games, but its what players prefer over RTWP, I get it, they don't want to make what the players want, they want to make what they want, and this friction has caused all their problems.
but its time to relent, you homosexuals.
Even they don't want to make it, it was just easier. Look at Pathfinder. Just copy+paste the same demons everywhere and call it content. No one would accept that if the game was TB only
rtwp just gives you more options than "glacially slow". it does suck ass if you actually try to play on "real time" but I just play with -
>pause on combat start
>pause on spell cast
>pause when target lost
>pause if weapon ineffective
and that handles 95% of fights. you can turn on turn based in owlcat games now anyway.
>RTwP lost
Finally. Frick this shit. TB is the only correct way.
>you can turn on turn based in owlcat games now anyway.
And it's fricking dogshit because AI isn't not designed to use PF combat system. Even in real time.
what ai? party is non-existent and most encounters enemies are just taking actions off a list.
>what ai?
Did you even play TB games or PF? Picrelated is your core mechanic. Tell me how many enemies are using it in TB? Or in RT? Or wait there is special action that allow you to ignore Attacks Of Opportunity. You can use it in TB too. Except enemy doesn't use it. Enemy never fall back after attack or utilize any action shit because it's just too much for RTwP so Owlcat didn't bother with it. But enemy do all this in other TB games. The TB in PF is absolute dogshit.
I'm not sure what your point is. you seem to be agreeing with me
Turn based games avoid trash combat encounters though, so every combat is way better designed than the average encounter in RTwP games because the only real benefit of RTwP is that trash encounters are quick
>Turn based games avoid trash combat encounters though, so every combat is way better designed than the average encounter in RTwP games
>rtwp just gives you more options than "glacially slow".
The only RTWP game with fast forward options was FF12 which no C(ope)RPG player would touch due to their massive inferiority complex.
Funny, Pillars of Eternity 2 took some design details from FF12.
It had a version of the Gambit system to perfectly handcraft your partner AIs.
It has a speed adjustment (Which wasn't a thing in FF12 until the Zodiac edition).
It has infighting and patrolling npcs to join in fights.
It's actually a good evolution of RTwP, but nobody played it because the first game was shit.
>It had a version of the Gambit system to perfectly handcraft your partner AIs.
Dragon Age Origins pulled this from FF12 into CRPGs first.
Nobody played it because soiyer still didn't understand the shortcomings of RTWP.
There is a lot FF12 does to keep the combat system engaging that none of the modern RTWP games ever did. The developers behind FF12 knew its greatest strength was the ability to cut through trash fights faster so they added the chain system, giving you an incentive to chose your battles instead of slogging through every enemy.
Encounters are still leashed to their spawn points allowing you to escape them instead of just running to the loading zone.
Kiting isn't a thing but positioning and action economy is relevant.
Then you have hunts and boss fights which completely throw away their round cooldown at low HP so you can't just prebuff and autoattack them to death, forcing you to engage with their moveset.
>Real Time with Pause is shit, its always been shit, and it isn't even how the source game (D&D) is played.
Literally nobody knew about those games until BG3. Go ask any normal person on the street or at a college about Icewind Dale (what a dumb name, who is dale?) and 99.9% will have no idea what you're on about, especially pre-BG3. And sure some people will recognize the name D&D but they dont associate it with those obscure video games.
>Literally nobody knew about those games until BG3
Those games sold 1-2M back then. Not like anyone plays BG3 for it's gameplay, they play it for romance and dialogue. Similar reason why people loved Talking Sim 3 back in 2015.
>Those games sold 1-2M back then.
DOS2 sold more than that and people inarguably played that game for the gameplay, not the story
DOS2 sold 4x that. Did people also play DOS2 for the "romance and dialogue"?
>video game industry in 2000 made 8 billions
>video game industry in 2021 made 60 billions (not counting mobile/casual)
I guess DOS2 was a failure considering it only sold 4 times more in a market that's nearly 8 times bigger. Yikes.
Don't let the one TBC gay samegayging gaslight you.
I stopped playing BG3 because the combat is absolute garbage.
A dale is another name for a valley you dumb c**t.
None of those games are known for their combat. That's something you endure while experiencing the world, characters and stories.
>None of those games are known for their combat
Who the frick plays BG3 for it's combat? Wish Larian gave us how many refunds they got so I could laugh at turn based gays. Not even they were stupid enough to show gameplay during their trailers, they always showed cutscenes and character creator.
>DOS1 sold well for its genre
>DOS2 sold millions of copies
>BG3 sold millions of copies
>these games have nothing in common in terms of romance, setting or story, but all have similar combat
Do the math
Imagine if they were RTWP they wouldve sould triple that no one likes TB it sucks
Even the contrarians are struggling to defend RTwP lmao
Unironically one of my friend's because he actively refused any sort of RPG decision and eventually got bored because he finished the Creche at level 5 and had no real reason to be invested in any character
>some roastie wow prostitute
>Who the frick plays BG3 for it's combat
everyone?
the story and writing is fricking dogshit but then again thats the standard for D&D forgotten realms turds
People only bought this piece of shit because it's basically The Witcher 3 with moronic combat. No one but autists cares about the gameplay.
>gameplay doesn't matter, nobody cares about the gameplay
this is what is known as an unconditional surrender
an absolute obliteration, where the argument was lost in every single way
>DND games that made Dungeons and Dragons popular
Stopped reading right there.
None of those made DnD popular.
DnD wasn't popular until Stranger Things. Cope, Seethe, and Dial-8-1-1 for your nearest ACK station, RTwP gay.
BG3 outsold all of those combined
Zooms zooms hated him because he was right
i'm 33
then you dont have an excuse for moronation
all i said was bg3 outsold them, which is true
>BG1 3.5 million
>BG2 3.5 million
>NWN 2.7 million
>Icewind dale 580,000 thousand
>BG3 5.2 million
No it did not
i still think RTWP is mainly popular with CRPG devs in general because turn based combat takes a lot more effort to make into something serviceable. for the most part developers like obsidian just want to stack a bunch of systems into the game and just throw generic encounters at you, which really doesn't work for turn based combat. bad turn based combat fricking sucks and will actively ruin the game, while bad RTWP combat is always at worst going to be quick and forgettable.
larian puts in more effort into handcrafting encounters and making them meaningful. even basic ass encounters like the two skeletal necromancers in mountain pass are almost like a puzzle you need to solve. players don't mind the slow combat as long as it feels like they actively have to do something in the combat rather than just spam attack.
>players don't mind the slow combat as long as it feels like they actively have to do something in the combat rather than just spam attack.
spamming attack and action surge was literally what I did 90% of bg3. meaningful encounters my ass.
Why do you fricks keep missing the point of "handcrafted encounters"? Is this intentional bad faith seething? Or are you just too fricking dumb to finish reading the post?Yes, the game is easy, that's not the point he is trying to make.
>even the two skeletals in the mountain pass are like a puzzle
Nah the moment i saw the other skelly revving his mate i knew it was good old simultaneous overkill condition
Also, most players at that point have Shadowheart for that bless and guidance, so just spam turn undead
>Real Time with Pause is shit, its always been shit, and it isn't even how the source game (D&D) is played.
BASED and TTRPG PILLED.
>BASED and TTRPG PILLED.
Frick off. EVERYONE hates DND TT combat.
>DND TT combat.
Everyone hates DND.
DnD combat sucks. Leveling sucks. Spells suck. Gods suck. AC system sucks. There isnt a single redeemable thing in DnD. Go to /tg/, the number 1 advice is " Stop playing dnd"
I was really surprised just how shit D&D was after learning a bit more about it from BG3. Always assumed it was some well built classic ruleset before then.
That shit is more convoluted than Islam schisms.
DND and pathfinder are both bloated garbage. Since 1980 there are so much better role playing alternatives its not even funny.
>Since 1980 there are so much better role playing alternatives
name 5
No. I don't spoonfeed nor do I want the systems me and my friends use to get popular.
Popular = bad
Just try ANYTHING that isnt dnd, guaranteed its better.
I accept your concession.
No one who plays tabletop actually thinks DND is a good system.
Most use it simply because the D20 system is ubiquitous.
It sucks ass without a dm hedging the shit rules in real time
yeah D&D players totally hate D&D, that's why it's the most popular rpg system of all time
>D&D players
Subhumans?
D&D players is the equivalent of saying consoleplayers.
TABLETOP players know D&D suck ass.
>rolls dice to verify post
Sorry bro, maybe in the next stat-check.
>No one who plays tabletop actually thinks DND is a good system.
then why is it the most prevalent system? there's other systems out there like pathfinder (that nobody plays)
D&D is now mainstream so 4gays needs to hate it anon. Get with the program.
/tg/ has been bashing dnd since before you were born you stupid zoomer
DND is fricking dogshit
hahahahahahahahaha
It's funny that you present pathfinder
as a pathfindergay I can tell you it is basically d&d, it's like the pepsi to d&d coca cola
anyone who says d&d "fricking sucks" doesn't even play ttrpgs. stuff like fate etc. are so different they're basically a whole different genre and they will not satisfy in the same ways at ALL
D&D is easy to pick up and play for new players. In that sense it's good, because the hardest part of TT RPGs is finding a group of willing and able players.
That being said, the crunch in previous editions was terrible and 5e is very limiting/simplistic, there's no question about that.
I think it's better to say that in a perfect world, nobody is playing D&D. But since we live in an imperfect world, it's oftentimes the system people end up playing, which is more fun than not playing at all.
100% this. DND is trash. It only works because the DM can hedge the rules in real time.
And modify the shit rules on a whim to make the game more bearable.
Your loss kek.
Dude, the one thing BG3 has proven unequivocally is that the dungeons and dragons table top rules are absolute GARBAGE for combat.
No one enjoys TT DND rules, they suffer thru it because its all most have and you make it work cuz its among friends.
But in a video game where a million other solutions exist for combat, dungeons and dragons is the absolute worst of all
Pause buttons work fine for every game, ever, what's so bad about it?
Black person you're confusing just regular real time and rtwp. Get the frick out of here.
>Pause buttons
Are you underage? He isnt talking about pause buttons.
Nearly every major DND / Pathfinder game of the last 20 years has had real time with pause, now of course its almost never the most optimal way to play but its useful when you are doing a lot of menial shit with random encounters.
Yes its shit but it still should be an option.
based
rtwp was slapped onto baldur's gate 1 as a reaction to Diablo 1's commercial success. You can kinda tell from many of the claustrophobic level designs, with the narrow hallways and tight turns, that the game was originally planned for turn based. What a fricking mistake that was. rtwp is shit. You end up pausing to micromanage so much that it might as well be played the way the game rules were devised, in turns. This is not a genre for adhd zoomers
As that's without any verticality. Mixing Larian's multi-level encounter design with RTWP pathfinding would be a fricking nightmare.
I DESPISE real time combat and welcome turn based
Everyone who disagrees is a cretinoid
Realtime can be good. Unfortunately, Sawyer is not skilled enough to make ARPGs. So instead he makes rtwp throwback shit. He is the gamedev equivalent of a galapagos turtle, and he is complaining about the invasive species (Larian) entering his ecosystem and forcing him to improve.
>Unfortunately, Sawyer is not skilled enough to make ARPGs
Sawyer was the Director and Lead Designer for Fallout New Vegas.
...using an engine, assets and gameplay loop made by a completely different studio. Very dishonest post.
And yet it is much more highly regarded.
which is just a brain dead copy paste of the awful fallout 3 combat system
Turn based is nothing more than a fad.
Real time w/ pause is the natural state of CRPGs, it will never go away.
BG1&2 are inspiring game makers to this day. In a decade no one will remember the Larian games
Well the "fad" has been going strong for decades at this point, but I'm sure 2024 is the year of the RTwP games.
why are you obsessed with Sawyer? Literally no one cares about him
Real time with pause will always be shit simply because the AI teammates are moronic and never do what you want them to. You can try adding IFs and WHENs all you like, it will always be better to control everyone yourself
It's either that or you pause every second to dole out commands for everyone, which turns combat into a slideshow. I like to actually see combat and spell animations play out.
which one
people just hate YOU Josh, because you are the biggest fart sniffer in the biz.
Reality is that it had novelty for its time, but it wore off. The reason it’s not like is most people play it as a turn base where you the player control how fast the turns go, sounds great in theory but in practice most would rather have turn base or something closer to what Mobas do but the later is a nightmare to program and put together right for a massive rpg. Hell that’s my issue with rtwp is that they just make a turn base situation and hope you don’t realize the only difficulty is hitting the pause key just right.
RTWP was the original "button awesome".
You got to play an RPG just like the ones that came before it but WAIT! It's now FILLED WITH ACTION and you get to watch your guys actively beating the shit out of monsters rather than watching them take turns.
Why do they do this? Don’t they realize the whiny passive aggressive humor pushes people away?
is that a dev for bald gate?
He wishes he was one.
No, pillars of eternity dev after being mogged hard by owlcat
I'm laughing, not with him, mind.
man's like 50 years old and he acts like this on twitter, disgraceful
First part is true, second half of the second part is also true
Turn based is fine if the combat is fun and interesting, but in BG3 it's just not. RtwP would have been way better for getting through the shit slog fights more quickly
nearly every fight in BG3 is unique.
Unique in what sense? Because if you have basic understanding of character building from other rpgs and functioning prefrontal cortex capable of recognition you will build a party that demolishes every fight on tactician without allowing enemy to even have their turn.
This is what happened to me too.
>Face Ansur on Tactician
>600 hp
>Abuse dex and initiative items like the 18 dex gloves and shields
>My lvl 11 8 monk/3 thief Tav ends up dealing 450 damage in 1 turn after using 11 attacks including 3 flurry of blows
Honestly this could be done in 15 seconds using RTWP. TB defenders are just moronic shitters and normies who feel overwhelmed by RTWP.
What fricking benefit is there in blitzing through a boss in 15 seconds?
>Honestly this could be done in 15 seconds using RTWP
The way you're describing it isn't much different from how you concluded it. What? Not even a minute-long difference where you could just space spam through everyone else's turn and just do it again is a reason for RTWP? Lmao.
Are you a speed-running troony with a sour patch in your hand? What's with the RTWP dudes and pretending to be sooooooo fricking goooooood, bro, that they are just bending over the game soooooo haaaard, bro, that they can't even afford a two-round battle anymore. No time for that, real hustlers over here.
guess what, the markets has decided, no one gives a frick about your system.
>minmax as much as possible with the most broken build you found online to trivialize to every encounter
>"LOL WHY ISN'T THIS FIGHT 15 SECONDS LONG INSTEAD OF 1 MINUTE LONG TURN BASED FRICKING SUCKS DUDE"
Please take your adderall before playing video games.
In the sense that it's specific to location, a handcrafted encounter usually has a story or follow-up after the fight. There isn't a single 5-fire elemental drop on you every 10 steps you take. Everything we encounter is there for a reason. And just because the game is easy doesn't mean it's in any way a justification for a rtwp jank, the game doesn't assault you with encounters like some BG1 mob generation gauntlets as you move to locations. It's actually impressive how well-paced every encounter is.
>functioning prefrontal cortex capable of recognition
Josh, you get lost on your way to reddit?
Your fault for looking up guides on the internet.
Are we going to pretend that all CRPGs don't have a bunch of builds that trivialize the game?
This is literally incomprehensible to the RTwP player mind
haha, how? having high terrain advantage, throwing someone off a clif or using barrelsl? wow, such unqiue fights, you see those in games from 20-30 years ago, but can't expect al ot from baby first crpg, half of /v are just morons who are barely 18, this game was a curse for the crpg's, brought so many homosexuals/normal gays in and ruined it
>he said that while the previous games were real time
you should have a nice day or go back to redddit
I understand that you haven't played the game and operate on meme information just by the webm you posted but what he means is that there isn't an encounter that repeats or has formulaic and completely artificial spam, for the sake of spicing the location traversal. No overworld ambush, no enemies whose placement seems random. Everything has a purpose or clear story/location reason to be there.
Epic combaaaat
>you see those in games from 20-30 years ago
that's funny because that shit isn't available in WOTR
this is still effectively turn based though because only one character can do anything at a time
its like calling valkyrie chronicles real time. that would be moronic. its turn based except a walk/run animation is keeping your brain happy the whole time
in the months of constant threads on this game, this is the first gameplay webm I've seen
If this fight was rtwp all those npcs will be blobbed in the middle stabbing eachother once every 5 seconds and you'd pause every 6 seconds to cast a buff or drink a pot or refresh orders that will be outdated 5 seconds later when you re-pause, rinse & repeat until you either win or quickload and spend 3 minutes recasting your buffs
i'm gonna get my stupid girlfriend into the genre now because of this comment
>People have been complaining about how shit crpg gameplay is for decades
>Larian makes the wise decision of abandoning rwtp
Am I supposed to feel sad or something? Turn based has always been better, nobody played Baldurs Gate 2 because of the riveting combat.
these morons really don't understand that the reason real life ttrpgs are fun is because by giving everyone a turn everyone has a moment to "be the star" it makes everything "feel" more impactful
>nobody played Baldurs Gate 2 because of the riveting combat.
these contrarian homosexuals have now started praising BG1 and 2 combat as something cerebral as if they didn't spend the last two decades calling it shit and something you had to deal with to experience the "rich world and story"
RTWP is the definition of slop. Even as you're beating the final boss of BG you feel like you've barely done anything at all except watch a clusterfrick of nonsense unfold.
Why don't more CRPGs just copy the real time switch between turn based and RTWP like Owlcat did? You can even slap an AI system like PoE2/DA:O/FF12 on top and It's the perfect solution.
"more CRPGs"
this is one of the smallest genre's of games in the in fricking industry, "more" would imply that its just booming with competition.
Surely it would be easier to just stop making the boring trash fights that people want to use rtwp for.
>It's the perfect solution.
Except that TB in Pathfinder didn't fit the game and everyone switched to RTwP to speed through the trash encounters. TB and RTwP are different design philosophies. Owlcat probably knew their TB would be shit but cynically put it in the game because it's more popular
PF is the definition of bloat, and encounter design also suffer from it. People sped through encounters because only a handful of them are actually interesting. Most of them are just the most boring shit imaginable copy pasted dozen of times.
All those encounters designed for RTwP. RTwP is basically diablo. This is why you have so many trash mobs. Look at Rogue Trader it's pretty different
did they make the ai any better? that was my only gripe with wotr.
What gripes you had with AI? You're not fighting AIs in PF, you're dismantling AC golems of the difficulty you picked. That's all it is.
that was my gripe. the ai is non existent. no reactivity. companions are completely braindead
Oh I'm sorry I didn't read that you were talking about RTWP in PF. I don't use that "wienerroach at 3 AM action" unless I literally don't see the enemy, it will take several rounds for it to get to me or I'm trying to unbug the AI of the enemies.
iirc a modder did most of the hard work there and it was so good owlcat added it to the official build
Are we going to act like every CRPG doesn't have a bunch of builds that trivialize the game
RealtroonyWithPenis
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They ignored it because they have no counter. You won the thread.
>RTwP lost the war
OH NO NO NO NO RTWPsissies NOT LIKES THIS AIEEEEEEEEEEE
All paradox interactive games are basically RTwP games.
RTwP are always better. Turn based works if your game has fun & unique mechanics or at least allows for the AP system tied to weapon types like Xcom & Wasteland - this way you can at least do a lot in your turn.
BG3's combat especially in early to mid game boils down to swinging or shooting twice or using an aoe spell and ending your turn. DC mages are worthless, especially on tactician with the bullshit +2 to DC save and increased stats.
is he still seething
Um, it's obvious people like Baldur's Gate DESPITE the turn based combat NOT because of it. Just fricking look at the most popular games in the world, all real time combat. What a gay.
Just because there hasn't been a good RTWP game so far (except Space Hulk for DOS) doesn't mean the mechanic itself is bad.
Oh and FTL.
>real rtwp has never been tried
It has and it worked well.
7.62 has the best implementation of RTwP. Too bad that more games don’t copy its system.
I want some frozen synapse-style combat.
RTwP trannies getting uppity again. Someone post that pathfinder webm.
inb4: rtwptroony will post BG3 dragon webm
Just make a good game and people don't give a frick about the system.
There will always be problems like RTwP having too much trash encounter and turn-based being slower in general, unless we go dungeon crawler without animation.
>rtwp
Has always been shit. Its the low IQ, zoomer attention span version TB
you're not smart because you play turn-based rpgs, fren.
true, but you are objectively moronic if you play RTWP
RTWP just feels like it's the worst parts of a dungeon crawler and a turn based game crammed together. The fights have no variety and your party just zergs everything, but anytime the mob has 1 spell caster you have to pause the game 15 times in a second to dole out commands so your zerg isn't nuked in 1 round.
>a screenshot of a screenshot of a screenshot
first of all, rape OP and make his family watch, second who give a frick about 5E turn based combat? its shit and this is the only game who sold a lot in the last decade ( X-com doesn't count) and only did because they had Wotc and Tencent backing them up
Normal gays bought it because FOTM, 45% finished the first act, so more than half dropped the game fast, 10 % didn't even bother finishing the tutorial, aka 30 min of the game and only 10% finished the game, 2 months after launch
People who are crying about real time gameplay are just morons who can't beat the tutorial boss in AC6, a lot of /v morons that's for sure
>autist mistakes real time for rtwp bring in completely out of left field example
Real time with pause always felt like shit.
Bg3 is truly the gift that keeps on giving. Ganker remains mind broken by the turn based bear sex game.
ripe turd with pee
Pure real time is objectively better than RTwP.
RTwP is the worst out of the three systems, having all the weaknesses of TB and RT with no upside.
>i want to play the game!
>but actually, i don't want to play the game
I swear normies get more moronic every 4 to 5 years
rtwp should use the gambit system from ffxii
There isn't a single unique or interesting fight in BG1 or 2, they are all identical.
>explain why rtwp is shit
>rtwp because i cant micro
every time
Right where it BELONGS
>rtwp troonyshill is screaming about normalgays
Seems like he still doesn't know about his precious rtwp normiecore
Bioware only used RTwP for BG1 cause they were trying to capitalize on the RTS craze at the time and they played a lot of Diablo.
One dead genre trying to chase the tail of two other dead genres does not revive a genre.
If it did, we'd be arguing about Pathfinder more in BG3 threads than we argue about BG3 in Pathfinder threads.
But all PF now have TB and thier next game is TB only?
The game is designed around rtwp and it feels like it too. Turn based is extremely clunky in wotr
I'm sure the next pathfinder game will have much better combat but it's honestly a big reason why I've never replayed wotr
>it feels like it too
No? I've never fought a single fight in rtwp in both KM and WoTR after the first few fights because it looks awful; they run at the enemies at completely moronic angles with straight line pathing, and god awful AI doesn't utilize anything. It looks like shit. It looks like turning on lights in the kitchen at 3 AM and watching wienerroaches scurry away until you turn off the light five seconds later. Same with WoTR. RtWP should be gone from the next game.
And yet we're still talking more about the game that only has TB.
Rogue Trader?
>huge amount of players including myself
>triple their sales
ppfffffff lol
lmao
>the final RtwP cope is that no one plays BG3 for the gameplay
That's the level you're at now huh
6 billion refunds. Steam numbers are just rice bots. Trust the plan. The bear tremors are being felt to this day.
Why does liking RTwP turn you into a delusional schizo? Every poster I've seen for the last few months defending RTwP is a complete moron, there has to be a correlation.
The more I look into things, the more it feels like fans of RTwP had both Bioware and Blizzard leave to go get a pack of smokes in the early 2000's and they're still waiting for them to come back.
because its just a gimped version of TB combat.
>Skullfrick your entire core gameplay mechanic - combat - for a slight speed boost
>This is all so you can justify shit-tier random encounters being faster
>Which themselves are a bad design choice that detracts from the plot
It's just contrarianism. What's most annoying is when they pretend it adds complexity. It's like listening to someone defend the limit on unit selection in old RTS, or arrow keys over WASD in fps. Pure autism
I dunno man, I grew up with Diablo (later Torchlight) and Bioware as my only real experience with RPGs.
But I also played a lot of Geneforge too, so that probably saved me from going complete schizo like the RTwP gays.
I miss RTS.
RTWP is dogshit. Not because its worse than turn based but because devs are lazy.
With good AI and a customisable AI decision tree, it could be really fun and really enjoyable. But having to control all those AI yourself in real time is fricking awful as an experience.
Additionally Pathfinder is the WORST fricking DnD type to use for RTWP. You cant combine the hardest most indepth DnD combat system with real time combat, not without massive concessions to make it enjoyable.
why would you want a game where your party members control themselves
you'd barely be playing it
>you'd barely be playing it
Endgame of RTwP. Can't believe DA:O is still ahead of its time. If you don't remember it has similar to gambit system from FF12. You're programming AI.
BG had it aswell
I'm not sure. Played BG1/2 decades ago. This is what I talking about
Baldurs Gate has AI scripts for party members, they aren't as good as Dragon Age's though, you cant program them like that
And yet I had to micro them all day so they wouldn't cone of frost my melee units every 2 seconds. No RPG has good AI.
You're already barely doing anything. I'm currently playing bg1 cause I really liked bg3 and wanted to know more about Jaheira. Combat is a fricking slog though. I click on the enemy and then just watch my group beat it to death. It's like diablo without any of the screen clearing attacks or player input. If a fight does cause me to lose a member or my main hero I just buff everyone with everything I have and do the fight again.
Pretty much the only input I have in fights is buffing my team and summoning and shit load of monsters and skeletons to overwhelm everything.
you need to micro your characters a lot in BG2
>micro your characters
Your mage. Other characters have like no skills.
you'll have at least 2 casters, and your martial characters will have a few abilities too, there's more than enough micromanagement to do
I remember BG1 being pretty shit though
Playing Mages in RTwP was painful. I don't know how anyone can like that system.
Considering posts like
I'd assume it's because RTwP fans like to unga bunga encounters by performing basic attacks repeatedly. The strategic element of turn based combat is lost when they have a single answer to everything the game throws at them, so they want combat to be over sooner instead of waiting for everyone else to go, pausing only when they themselves need it.
I think that’s the great divide here. Turn base is like a tool box to play around with and Real Time with Pause is just the hammer.
A min/max player or someone that wants tier list as a means to play the best wants RTWP, a player that wants a wide variety of solutions and means to approach a situation wants turn base.
Neither is wrong, but it’s clear why one is doing better than the other.
A casual player or someone that wants to just play the game and experience the story wants RTWP, a player that wants to go total autism with the combat system wants turn base.
Neither is wrong but its clear baldurs gate 3 appeals greatly to the autists of the world.
>5E
>Total autism with the combat system
lol
lmao
rofl
>Dragon Age
The only good game in the franchise had rtwp
I’ll be blunt but a casual never thinks that far and will play either so long as the first few hours bait them well enough.
>I'd assume it's because RTwP fans like to unga bunga encounters by performing basic attacks repeatedly
You dishonest and illitterate little Black person. That's what I did in BG3 because the encounters NEVER (with one exception) required me to do more than the bare minimum unga bunga. Why would I go out of my way to make the encounter harder for myself? Is that the supposedly deep and meaningful strategical layer of BG3 I see you morons talking about? Intentionally gimping yourself like you can in every game ever conceived?
He quite literally talked about the actions you have to perform to win the encounter and how the player feels in the moment to moment gameplay. Please learn basic literacy before questioning people's intelligence.
>That's what I did in BG3 because the encounters NEVER (with one exception) required me to do more than the bare minimum unga bunga.
>Why would I go out of my way to make the encounter harder for myself?
This is the issue with balancing, not game design. Game isn't balanced for METAprostitutes like you. But encounter itself is properly designed for normal play. While encounters in rtwp is always unga bunga no matter of balance.
And btw you can do your METAwhoring in every game. Even in you precious rtwpslop. And yes you will kill everything in 10 seconds. People kill every boss in WotR in 10 second on Unfair. You have no point. The encounters in BG3 are properly using combat system. The encounters in rtwps are just stat blobs.
>Game isn't balanced for METAprostitutes like you
lmao, all I did was two have two fighters. no, optimized builds or anything like that. if you think that's an amazing feat of buildmastery I don't know what to tell you. the game's just laughably braindead
>While encounters in rtwp is always unga bunga no matter of balance.
no they aren't, the final boss of IWD on hard (which isn't even the hardest difficulty as insane and heart of fury mode exist) is harder than anything in BG3 on tactician and requires more thought as you have to think about positioning, disarming traps, which spells to bring, which enemies to kill first and how to survive Belhifet who is stronger than anyone in your party. Nothing like that in BG3.
>he still doesn't understand
Jesus. Your last boss does nothing. He's just auto attacking you after casting two spells. This is your peak of rtwp gameplay.
>He's just auto attacking you after casting two spells.
No he isn't. I accept your concession.
>No he isn't
You can just click on youtube wiki/guides and watch fight, check his stats. Normal mobs in BG3 have more abilities and skills than him. This fight is no different from typical stat bloat from wotr really.
No, he talked about the Death Shepard's road block and the crèche that is count three encounters in the whole game, and the mountain pass one is quite literally a level check that you can't overcome unless you either gain levels or use tactical autsim of stanlocking said Shepard's with ice or what not while burning them down so that they can't revive each other infinitely.
This encounter is unique. It is not spammed like some Elden Ring dragon drops, and there are many examples of this one-of-a-kind fight. That's what he means by handcrafted encounters.
And yes, I am questioning your intelligence, or even if you played the game, if you actually going to claim you action surged through horde of Black folk with battle wards.
I know what he's talking about, he brought that as an example of encounter that's just like a le puzzle when it's bruteforceable like every other encounter in the game. The only time you have to think in BG3 is when you wander into an area that you're severly underlevelled for and I only had to do that when I wanted to kill the phase spider matriarch - and even then, what I did was nothing that I couldn't have done in a rtwp game, I simply cleared the webs in a previous area then aggrod the spiders there and killed them one by one while I surivived chugging potions.
No, you do not know what he is talking about because you keep pretending that it's about difficulty and bolstering how big your gamer wiener is because your double action surged through 90% of encounters or something along those lines. A very gigantic wiener I hope she sees it, bro.
When it's about the variety of encounters and how they are constantly stacked with different foes and have completely different advantages or story reasons to never feel samey or trite like every single crpg slop usually does, the placement of these encounters always adheres to the internal logic of the location or the story reasons instead of being spammed for the sake of the encounter. No one gives a shit that it's easy and can be pushed with EB or fall damage it to death by burning webs when Matriarchs and her constant hatching are one of the kind encounters in the game. That is memorable instead of being spammed every 5 steps in the Underdark like your favorite "pause for 3 seconds unpause" would have done.
What's wrong with you, rtwp imbecils that you have a NEED to project your absolute irrelevant skill onto 5e game with no prebuffing that clearly had presentation as the main focus?
>you keep pretending that it's about difficulty
Let's reread the original post that, in combination with your aggressive illitteracy, sparked this whole reply chain, shall we? Here it is
>players don't mind the slow combat as long as it feels like they actively have to do something in the combat rather than just spam attack.
"But that's literally all you do in BG3!" I replied. And then felt the urge to barge in and start barking about some irrelevant shit like a rabig dog because someone - how dare he - critized your favourite company/game. Not reading the rest of your post.
>"But that's literally all you do in BG3!
No, that's literally all YOU do. I would repeat that "handcrafted line-up of encounters and the locations they take place in, plus the combination of foes leads the player to approach every encounter differently and not suffer through 6 billion Red Cap genocide spree" but I would be sounding like a broken record to person, who thinks that his way of playing is indicative of how every player approached Death Shepards and I guess action surged them to death despite blade wards when the game itself screams at you that it's moronic. I mean you're one step from calling me a shill they get it over is.
>Not reading the rest of your post.
So much for "basic literacy" from rtwp bros.
>No, that's literally all YOU do.
Yeah, cause the game's not hard enough for me to have to do anything else. The frick am I supposed to do? Intentionally gimp myself so I'm forced to use my brain?
>plus the combination of foes leads the player to approach every encounter differently
Doesn't happen, it's action surge action surge action surge. And no, it's not a "me" problem, it's the game being braindead.
>So much for "basic literacy" from rtwp bros
The ability to quickly extrapole the relavant bits of information from a text and discard the rest is one of cornestones of basic literacy. They teach it in middle school. Sorry you couldn't attend.
>And no, it's not a "me" problem
you made a conscious decision with that party composition, take some responsibility for your own actions
If I had known that rolling a basic b***h ass fighter was going to brutally trivialize the game I wouldn't have done it, believe me. But I only realized this halfway through act 2 and I'm too autistic to respecc halfway through a game, it kills my immersion.
anon the game is frickeasy whether its martials or caster
well the other anon is telling me that it's MY fault the game was too easy (???) so I don't even know what to say anymore
bg3 is not difficult at all
yeah well, that's what I've been saying this whole fricking time
Bg3 isn't difficult, but neither is whatever garbage CRPG. The only difference is that you don't have to fight the system more than the actual enemies like in RTWP.
Thats what smooth gameplay feels like. It doesn't fight you.
>but neither is whatever garbage CRPG
that's fricking bullshit
bg3 on the hardest difficulty is like any other crpg on the normal difficulty while playing on normal feels like you're playing story mode. I even think pathfinder core is harder than bg3 tactician.
Pathfinder difficulty is almost exclusively knowledge checks. If you know the system, you know exactly what buff combination you need on your martials to murder machine through any encounter with box click.
This is true. I enjoyed like 300+ hours of WOTR, but probably a third of that was just struggling with the system. Little wonder most people fall off the wagon before the first chapter is done.
>I'm forced to use my brain
You are not forced to use your brain in any of the rtwps you are supposedly sucking off here. You're choosing to limit yourself while simultaneously pretending you are being limited and that if you don't use double action surge, you are "gimping" yourself somehow. So is the game hard, or are you metameming with one class when you don't even need to? Please choose a chair.
>it's not a "me" problem
It's absolutely "you" problem since not every class has an action surge or needs action to crumbstomp the game on tactician. Or otherwise, no other class but fighters would be playable in the game, no?
>Not reading the rest of your post.
>Ackhually I read it. I just said I didn't just because I'm so smart and finished middle school.
Such eloquence with words; rtwp bros are such intellectuals.
Of course he used a team of action surging martials, that's exact the kind of gameplay that RTWP games promote.
You just get a part of martials, buff the frick out of them with your casters and box click them at shit.
He is literally exposing himself
I had my fighter Tav, Laezel (whose class is a Fighter incase you gentlemen forgot), Shadowheart and Astarion, who I kept as Cleric (respecced to thunder domain) and Rogue respectively. What an unusual party composition, amirite? My fault for not going with 4 bards!
I'm talking about your homosexual RTWP instincts. You intuitively understand that casters are a nightmare to play in RTWP unless they're buff bots, and you're playing the same brainless way in a turn based game.
You just cannot admit that RTWP encourages that very specific gameplay style because it's very low action requirement on the players part and you can avoid the clunkiest parts of the gameplay.
Why can't you just admit that because of its fricked nonexistent action economy, that RTWP encourages a kind of playstyle that you organically fall into?
>You intuitively understand that casters are a nightmare to play in RTWP
Actually, mage is my favourite class in bg2 because you get to stop time and cipher is my favourite class in pillars because you can dominate people's mind. Picked up a fighter in BG3 because I wanted to go with something easy and familiar and didn't want to accidentally pick a shit class (my mistake for thinking the game was going to pose a challenge). Don't know what you're talking about with all that shit about rtwp encouraging a specific style of play, there's people who do solo runs of these games on the bullshit difficulties with all sorts of builds, sounds like a you issue (ie, your brain can't handle multiple units moving at once and overloads).
You can look up achievements and patty comps. People primarily either do the lowest difficulty or they do braindead buffbot martial meat grinders because that minimizes the amount people interact with the combat.
Its a bad game if people don't want to use their actual combat.
that's fricking moronic, extrapolating anything at all from achievements is in particular is abismally stupid as most people (something like in 80+% range for crpgs) don't even finish the game. It must be a pretty shitty game if most people don't finish it: this could be said about any videogame ever made.
Also how do you get "party comps" from that?
>global achievement stats
you have officially reached the bottom of the barrel. you lost the argument if at any point you have to use these.
>You are not forced to use your brain in any of the rtwps you are supposedly sucking off here
Yes I do, plenty of times I had to use my brain in rtwp games. Twisted Rune in BG2, Sarevok in BG1, Belhifet, the market fight in act 4 of WOTR during the azata path. Plenty of times I had to stop and think "mmmh this is fricking bullshit, but maybe if I stop and think for a second I can figure out a strategy". Never had to do that in BG3, my slightly roided fighters started clearing every encounter with just the basic b***h autoattack and action surge (except for the aforementioned phase spider fight).
>It's absolutely "you" problem since not every class has an action surge or needs action to crumbstomp the game on tactician.
It's not a me problem because picking a fighter at the start of the game shouldn't be a enough to trivialize every encounter in the game. Jesus christ.
>Such eloquence with words; rtwp bros are such intellectuals.
I read up until that point, saw you were working off a faulty premise and discarded the rest of your post as the useless bullshit it probably is. If you think that's eloquent, wait until you open a book!
>mmmh this is fricking bullshit, but maybe if I stop and think for a second I can figure out a strategy.
>WOTR
Lmao. There is no strategy. You are conditioned to dismantling the AC of Russian nested dolls by clicking examine and looking what stat debuff they aren't immune to currently. Nothing about that is strategy, no matter how many Black folk the game throws at you.
>Sarevok in BG1
The gaw of rtwps of claiming they use brain
>Belhifet
The guy that melts to +3 and gets stunlocked by a variety of wis to int debufs, like many other? That's strategy?
>picking a fighter
There are hundreds of ways of trivializing the game, not just action surge. For the third time, the game isn't about difficulty; you rtwp sucking imbecile. Nothing you described above is difficult and can be trivialized in manyways either. But I guess we've established that you indeed metamemed yourself into using one move and never stepped away from it because you're just too smart for that in BG3. So I'm really wondering if you didn't use broken as frick pets and Wierd/Hellray spam in WOTR and convinced yourself it was difficult.
>I read up until that point
The wiener part? I know, honey, it's gigantic; you told me five times already. You took on a market in WOTR, so fricking epic and difficult. And the point I was making after that was once again reflected in my following posts. Shouldn't you be ignoring those too? I have an inkling suspicion you haven't actually used your middle school education to guess what's after the wiener part.
>Lmao. There is no strategy.
>There is no strategy because I say so!!!!! You're a poopy poopoo head!!!!
Great. It's like I'm arguing with a child. It's an objective difficulty spike that comes out of nowhere and that you HAVE to go through if you want to rescue your pet dragon. Unless you have a turbo optimized party, examining the stat sheet isn't going to be enough to get you through it.
>The gaw of rtwps of claiming they use brain
I don't even know what the frick this gibberish means
>The guy that melts to +3 and gets stunlocked by a variety of wis to int debufs, like many other? That's strategy?
Did you just fricking google that? Do you even know that he debuffs you at the start of the fight and he hits like a truck and there are traps and his minions everywhere and having all of these things at once makes for a very compelling final fight which you have to think how to get through? Of course you don't, you dishonest prick. You don't actually play rpgs!
>For the third time, the game isn't about difficulty
And for the NTH time, the anon's original point was that BG3's encounters are soooooooooo much better than other rpgs because you're forced to think because they're "like a puzzle" and you're forced to do more than "just spam attack", to which I replied saying that "hey, that's fricking bullshit!". That's it.
>The wiener part?
No, the part where you showed you didn't even understand what I was saying.
>It's difficult because I said so for the sake of the argument
>turbo optimized party
>examining the stat sheet isn't going to be enough to get you through it.
You mean a regular party? You need to be hardcore idiot to frick up leveling not know how to debuff the market and grind through their AC.
>Do you even know that he debuffs
He gimps to feeblemind like nothing you idiot just because you don't prioritize any stunts and just rush him dying again and again doesn't mean it's some googleable knowledge you rtwp idiot.
>And for the NTH time, the anon's original point
No it was
try actually finishing it
Because a part of the game becomes designing your party. Gear, skills, spells and AI. The reward is seeing that come together and beat encounters.
part of the game is playing out fightings and executing tactics aswell, most people dont want to just watch fights happen with no input
The biggest issue is the balance, it's either braindead easy and the base AI scripts beat the entire game for you or you need near perfect builds with every buff precast to not die instantly, and often if fluctuates between these two states from combat to combat.
Turn based combat can be fine, the problem with BG3 is it's based off a tabletop game so it's about rolling the fricking dice instead of skill, tactics or strategy
Rolling the dice is part of tactics. If your tactic was ruined by roll - it's a bad tactic. Plus enemy is affected too. Even in WotR we have real stats about RNG. It's not rigged. However big dices are the problem according to the math people. Games would be better with few small dices vs 1 big
risk management is a skill, but the more luck a game has, the less skill or strategy it requires. D&D is fricking huge on luck. You can go to great lengths to maximize your chance of success, or you can just fail, reload your game, try again and win because you rolled better
>Rolling the dice is part of tactics. If your tactic was ruined by roll - it's a bad tactic
Wow you actually make me seethe over this comment.
You're a fricking lying, disingenuous homosexual.
The ONLY reason that DND combat works in TT is because a DM can fix the major issues that crop up during a campaign.
RNG based systems suck, but they are the only real solution for Tabletop.
On the other hand, vidya fixes the issue of extreme RNG by offering an unlimited number of potential solutions that can be managed and calculated by the game system.
Skill issue. It's not a problem even for giga normalgays.
Only shitters are crying about rolls and RNG in every existing tb game threads (while other CHADS beating the same games on hardest difficulty without saves cumming and minmaxing).
>rtwp is shit
>why?
>because i feel overwhelmed and cant micro
>most arguments are about encounter and level design instead of rtwp
>cant micro
>rtwp shizos will lie to your face, acting like they aren't routinely pausing to tardwrangle the moronic AI to actually use the skill and spells
>trust me bro, just get good
found the moron who cant micro
>pauses every 5 seconds
is that a bad thing?
Other than that, it always looks moronic. That's not "microing." What are you fricking microing within those 3-second intervals only to pause again and give other orders? Rtwp Black folk will, of course, always lie that they don't do it, but it's never convincing. It's especially funny when they start bringing in other genres, but, you know, without pause.
>What are you fricking microing within those 3-second intervals only to pause again and give other orders?
Your party members? What the frick am I reading
>Your party members?
In three seconds, they are going to carry out the order, only for you to pause again to queue for the next orders? You call that microing? So high skill Rtwp bros, so high skill
Bro, I believe you completely. I bet you can last a whole TEN seconds before pausing again. Very high skill ceiling.
>as promised immediately brings in a genre where you can't pause queue
The might of rtwp shizos
>In three seconds, they are going to carry out the order, only for you to pause again to queue for the next orders? You call that microing?
Yes
More power to you in changing the meaning of the word then. I guess rtwp bros have to convince themselves they aren't shumcks huddling around dead system somehow.
>bro you have to pause just because
fricking schizo
not everyone is disabled like you
like i said
you cant micro for shit
as expected from the generation that cant play rts
>Pause
>Cast every buff in the game
>Right click enemy
Alternatively, if it a boss:
>Pause
>Cast every buff in the game
>Cast debuffs and protection-removing spells on the boss
>Right click it
Wow, such epic big brain gameplay.
and pic related turn based combat, 10/10 GOTY material
Yes
Real time with pause is shit because it's boring and causes combat to devolve into an auto battler
turn based even when your're cheesing it at least requires some small level of thought
as a tabletop pathfinder player I'm fricking apalled at how butchered the genuinely fun combat of the game is by these shitty crpgs with their rtwp obsession
I am not fundamentally against RTWP at all. But it feels more than a little awkward to play D&D, which are turnbased game systems, forcefully molded into RTwP.
Not the biggest fan.
>Micro
>When a pause button exists
Don't be moronic, RTwP is just turn based with extra steps except the game hides more information from you and the pathfinding bugs out.
RTWP nearly killed the genre. The fact that it has defenders blows my fricking mind.
You are really fricking stupid if you think it's good.
real time offers the potential for more complex game mechanics but they're harder for noobs to control
Shit devs killed the genre moron
shit devs are the reason RTWP exists
Genre was never alive to begin with. We're talking about CRPGs, right?
you're a moron, rtwp was killed by the developers and normal gays who can't play it, same reason why RTS strategy games died(+ gay esport)
IQ of gamers its going down, so they need low IQ games where you fight 5 baboons in 5 min or more while sipping from a fricking coffee, at that point go and "play" a fricking Sony game
>35+ posts and barely 7 new posters
we need id's on this shithole
i bet you never played something like Starcraft loser, you're only talking shit about Real time because you will get raped in those time of games , so you need 10 min to fight 4 enemies while jerking off to something
Pausing and queueing up actions is not difficult. You need to get this through your thick head. This is not a skill issue. I guarantee I am better than you at video games. It's just not FUN do you understand?
pausing and queuing up an action is literally all you do when you take your turn though
>Pausing and queueing up actions is not difficult
It's simple and tedious. You are talking to a moron that thinks doing menial tasks repeatedly is hard and takes skill, and because he can stomach doing it longer than someone with taste and standards he has deluded himself into thinking he's skilled and therefore the game is fun.
Good. RTwP was cancer. Fallout 1-2, Tactics had it right with the TTRPG pause-turn function for combat.
>Y-YOU JUST BAD AT MICRO
kek this rtwptroon is mindbroken
says the one who is to afraid to reply
>Game comes out and it's extremely successful with an established gameplay formula
>Normie morons b***h about and complain that game would be better with [insert gameplay change that doesn't even appeal to the people that buy these type of games]
>If such change was made, normies would've found another reason not to play the game ("too hard", "no diversity", "game doesn't let me play it however I want").
It's Souls genre all over again.
Larian's next game is the true test.
If they take even 1% of the dogshit feedback they are getting onboard, they are going to begin the long descent into AAA failure.
if they did waste time on rtwp, they would look at how sorcerers can cast 3 fireballs in one turn with tb and complain that they cant do it in rtwp but also not want to use macros because probably a consolegay ontop of that
people that want to change how the game works are never a consumer in the first place so dont cater to them
>Owlcat forced to turn change their game to turn based to appeal to the people
>guy asking for real time BG3 gets vicious mockery from across the board
Must suck being a rtwp cuck
>Rogue Traders is TB
Imagine Pathfinder 3 TB. Ideally Owlkek should design two different modes + TB AI but it is too expensive.
wait is rogue trader gonna be TB? I might actually have an interest in it in that case.
Yeah, it's fantastic. They released the first maybe 2 chapters in a sort of early access. Also barely any poz like you'd expect out of a modern CRPG and you can brutally kill or maim anything you don't like most of them time through dialogue/just shooting them, which is nice.
nice, consider me interested in that case, ty anon.
>Imagine Pathfinder 3 TB
I wish.
There are so many mechanics that aren't present in KM or WotR because it's been streamlined for RTWP.
Also we need an AI director for CRPGs like in L4D so we don't suffer the problems of having to min/max with regards to the game's content so much due to lack of DM.
>fight gnolls
>fight orcs
>fight gnolls again
>fight kobolds
>fight more kobolds
>fight gnolls again
>fight orcs again
>fight more orcs
>fight more orcs
>fight named orc (backed up by more orcs)
>didn't have to manually cast a spell or issue an attack once as the AI scripts deal with combat for me
>quest done, go to next quest
>fight gnolls
>repeat
Wow, what riveting gameplay.
I sure love having a dozen trash fights that are identical every time I try to go somewhere, having unique and designed fights is so boring.
This ruined the vibe of kingmaker for me. Why am I fighting through a bunch of wolves and frog people on my way to the bandit lair, which is itself a bunch of distraction mooks?
Having actually run a tabletop game, this kind of random encounter is tedious as shit and you learn quickly not to do them. WTF are the rtwp people thinking?
>WTF are the rtwp people thinking?
baldurs gate 3 is for women and children
When the entire system is built upon you going into a combat encounter, dying, reading the combat log for the reason(s) why you died, reloading and then pre-buffing based on what you read from the combat log to avoid getting instagibbed again, you have a pretty shitty system. God forbid you try to cast spells mid-combat to counter the enemy, when each spell takes like 10 seconds to cast the enemy has already CC'd your entire party holy shit what an idiotic combat system.
I absolutely hate RTwP.
TOTAL RTWP DEATH
Why do the Pillars of Eternity devs spend so much time on this board? Go away. Think of a less generic name for your game next time.
I dont get what the issue is. Isnt turn based used when you handle a party and RTWP used when you only handle a single character?
Many Rtwp crpgs of the 90s and 2000s were 4 to 8 man parties. Yes it’s awful as it sounds.
Yeah that does sound awful but I havent tried it so I dunno. Im used to turn based cuz of jrpgs anyway
>2000
>turn based sucks
>2023
>rtwp sucks
>2030
>turn based sucks
>rinse and repeat
You all know I'm right.
Who was saying it sucked in 2000? Most top selling and praised RPGs then were turn base.
I think it's time for "oldschool KLASSIK RPG GAMERS" to take the hard to swallow pill that RtwP was always a casualization of the genre. It was created solely to appeal to Diablo fans, and leech off the popularity of Diablo at the time. Early CRPGs like BG were conceived as real time first to bring in the Diablo fans, and pause was added afterwards because they realized that tabletop systems were totally incompatible with real time without a way to pause. So you're left with a shitty half-baked system with no real vision behind it. Mechanically, RtwP is DEEPLY flawed.
does the cum have any flavor?
yeah it's cum flavor
that doesnt sound very tasty. i think i will pass.
Salty coins and bags of milk
does your seat smell of ash after all this seething ITT?
The sad thing is that real time RPGs are totally possible. But for some reason they never emulated Diablo or Warcraft 3 or any of those, they just kept digging into the fricking pause hole. RTWP has ruined so many good games. Tyranny. BG2. Dragon Age.
RTWP is also relatively incompatible with multiplayer (anyone who's struggled through Paradox multiplayer understands that) so the devs are fricking themselves out of a relatively large market share. Larian games meanwhile, I have a blast multiplayer
Maybe it's childhood nostalgia, but I think Dungeon Siege and especially Dungeon Siege 2 avoid a lot of problems I have with RTwP. Minimal dice rolls and meaty combat feedback. It actually felt like playing Diablo with a party.
Their combat filtered the frick out of me, I've never managed to finish any playthrough of Divinity: OS 1 or 2. Shit is so god damn boring I lose all motivation as soon as I get into a battle.
It's called turn BASED for a reason, too bad all the fricking morons in the industry listened to add zoomers too braindead to do anything but button mash
i like both turn based and rtwp
i can't keep up with real-time
The only chad response.
The rest of you are homosexuals dickriding on the newest thing as usual.
I'd like a modern CRPG in the style of ultima 7,
I liked how RTWP worked in that game,
also just how combat in general was kinda cracked.
>nice discord raid you mega homosexuals
Josh Sawyer is a Fricking moron for doubling down on not giving romance options the highest priority in his games which is why they bombed so hard
BTW RTwp is shit just look at the Pathfinder games complete shitty gameplay
Turn based combat is for games with no budget or incompetent devs.
yeah for sure, it's why RTwP is doing so much better than-... wait... hold on...
FRICK
That’s RTWP. It’s stupidly exploitable and for most it just becomes turn base anyway. That’s the thing about turn base, you frick up the battle layout/skill level it’s obvious but with a RTWP it’s a mess that midwits won’t catch.
Isn't real time with "pause" just turn based? You're pausing to take your turn.
There is nothing wrong with RTwP and Turn based. You all sound like whiny b***hes pretending to be smart. Pseudo-intellectuals, all of you.
What strategy can you even do with rtwp? You just smash rmb so everyone attacks
RTWP is fricking shit
I'm sorry to break this 2 you, but ... turn based combat is the system of choice for women.
They also like puzzle games and prefer 3rd person shooters to 1st. They also eat and sleep too.
We have facts
and they conclude otherwise.
We're all ladies here.
Me, drilling your ass
rtwp just seems harder to sell over turn-based for noobs. These games are mechanically more complex than more casual shit so having it reduced to a more digestible form is better for business
It’s not harder to sell since we see success with very similar titles like Diablo series, Torchlight, Dragon Age series, and so on.
That’s what makes this thread so fricking weird. People are wanting to talk about a very specific and outdated version that Josh won’t give up on.
>It’s not harder to sell since we see success with very similar titles like Diablo series, Torchlight, Dragon Age series, and so on.
Diablo clones are not RTWP CRPGs dude what are you fricking nuts
Dragon Age 1 and 2 are the only games to do it right and even they are significantly dumbed down to what you can do in TB
>Diablo clones are not RTWP CRPGs
Anon didn’t say they were. If anything they are harder not having the pause at all.
He called them 'very similar' in the same vein as Dragon Age, you might as well be throwing Starcraft, Total War and the Anno games for how losely """similar""" they are with their controls
You say that but what does Diablo do that a rtwp doesn’t outside of pause?
Diablo is an action game with stats, not a strategy role-playing game. It lacks the core mechanical depth, breadth, complexity and encounter design of a CRPG because it's geared solely towards an action focus
>Diablo is an action game with stats
Not the first two by any measure
Diablo is a real time RPG without pause
BG1 & BG2 is a real time rpg with pause
StarCraft is a real time strategy game.
>Diablo clones are not RTWP CRPGs dude what are you fricking nuts
Yes they have no pause at all but are nearly the same.
I think that’s why rtwp is seen as shit. It’s a middle ground of two better thought out systems.
There is more customization and complexity to leveling in Diablo one than Dragon Age Origins.
This. RTWP plays like a RTS to the uninitiated and is straight up pussy repellent, which is key.
You think a winedrunk catlady wants to spend 10 minutes microing through all the pathfinding dogshit and still wonder why her party got wiped in the space of 12 real seconds? They're inevitably going to story mode the game out of frustration.
If the game was RtWP you'd constantly be suffering with stuff on the scale of the Dank Crypt's fire-trap party wipe.
It's actually worse if you think about it. Let's not talk about BG1/2. After all its system is primitive as frick.
Look at Pathfinder. Check move actions.
>https://pathfinderkingmaker.fandom.com/wiki/Actions
Every existing creature, NPC is obeying those rules. And Free/Swift actions are instant and you can turn spells into free/swift actions. This already sounds like a mess, huh? Look at
>A witch can cackle madly as a move action. Any creature that is within 30 feet that is under the effects of an evil eye hex, fortune hex, protective luck, or misfortune hex caused by the witch has the duration of that hex extended by 1 round.
Now imagine "proper" RTWP Kingmaker combat. You're facing 15 enemies. Every one of them is using all this shit. All their abilities. 5 Enemies have hexes. Now this is some competitive RTS microing. Obviously this is the madness so
>all 15 enemies are just rushing at you after casting 2 spells
>they have nothing but basic attack
What's the point in RTWP?
how come there isnt a real time crpg? Are rtwpbabs just too shit to micro?
There are over 600 spells in bg3. How does one micro that?
bg3 is turn based. Its a different genre entirely. Rtwp is real time with crutches
RtwP is turn-based except all turns take a mandatory 6 seconds and half the mechanics don't work.
We need to ask rtwp dudes that. They claim to be micro gods because they have 5k hours in Starcraft or something. I mean surely they can show something like that on the example of Pathfinder.
NO NO NO! RTWP chads would have microed the whole thing with no pause and it would have looked epic and not like a mosh pit of clipping models where hits don't even connect to model. They said so ITT.
Pillars I sucked because of RTwP. Sawyer wanted turnbased but at the time it was seen as too old hat. He fricked up, what else is new
Xcom and Wasteland 3 are much better games anyways.
Baldur's' Gate is for people who got molested by their Ojisan and play Dungeons and Dragons as an escape.
The real answer is turn based simultaneous move.
There is that in BG3. If initiative rolls right and there aren't a lot of enemies all party member turns are simultaneous.
>"D&D sucks" posting and samegayging out of nowhere
total rtwptroony death
5e does suck tho.
D&D haters are all lariaBlack folk, aka turn based tards.
BG3 is D&D garbage though, that's one of the reasons why it's shit
Yeah and lariaBlack folk hate it because it's closer to an actual rpg instead of a mylittlechemist game where you play with elemental puddles
Let me try to recap here
In those two posts you have rabidly attacked:
>People who like turn based "turn based tards"
>These people are also D&D haters? Even though D&D is and has always been turnbased?
>These people are also LariaBlack folk, even though BG3 is a d&d game
>You agree with the other anon that BG3 is shit. Saying that you hate D&D and BG3
>Then you go on to say that you hate Divinity Original Sin 2 more, because it's not D&D and uses mechanics that aren't in D&D
You do not have a personality. You do not have a single worthwhile thing to say. You have failed to make a single coherent point, just spewing mindless hatred in every possible direction. Take a break from posting holy shit.
It's so pathetic and obvious. Yeah D&D sucks so bad, that's why 90% of groups use it and shun other formats. Jesus christ.
Theyre called DnDrones for a fricking reason.
Its time to get BTFO, tranimegay.
Check the tg archive:
https://archive.4plebs.org/tg/search/text/%22Dnd%20sucks%22/
>Pausecore would TRIPLE the sales
Volvo hire this man!
>rtwp subhumans still screeching
Is there anyone more pathetic?
Josh has an hour long cope fest ablut divinty mogged deadfire and thats why it bombed.
Than they crowbarred in a really shitty doesnt fit into the game with tons of meaningless random encounters turn based mode into deadfire
>I-I don't suck at making games, people just don't like RTwP as much as they like TB!!
Is Sawyer ever gonna stop whining about and abdicating responsibility PoE being a failure?
Whats funny is that wven before dos2 came out, and poe was sailing on the “only crpg that plays like the old games” nostalgia wave people still had issues with its moronic systems and terrible snore inducing story.
It has nothing to do with gameplay. I dont care for the pathfinder games but i know many people do. The issue is that pillars is boring as frick and not the gameplay which is arguably the best part of those games anyways.
Looking at his feed, I think he's too vocal in general
If you tweet every thought that flits into your mind it's never going to be good
>RTwP lacks the clarity of turn based
>the harder the battle the less real time it is, might as well be turn based at that point
>it works even less well with multiplayer than TB does
Thats why.
Pathfinder wotr is actually the perfect example of this. People play that most of the time in turn based after awhile, shit just gets too confusing and you need the time. You either make the game simple like bg1/2 which half of your guys can’t do anything but autoattack and scoff down a potion/activate an item and the other half are literally sitting still in casting/waiting for the next round. Or you make something more complex and least add the option of turnbased.
RTWP just isn't fun, but I still do still turn it on to steamroll some trash mobs from time to time even though it's boring.
You're fricking insane if like playing something like pathfinder kingmaker or tyranny. The games are actively hurt by the dogshit RTWP combat.
for me it was using the toolkit mod to make myself much stronger to make combat less tedious
I played kingmaker in turnbased lol. RTWP is dogshit
No, you don't understand, I need to cast the same twenty buffs (manually, of course, macros go against the intended game design) and then click on an enemy and watch it explode via auto-attacks in 5-10 seconds. This is thrilling combat to me.
>look up mori calliope
>some gay vtube shit
>pause
>click spells
>unpause
>wait for the game to go through the turn cycle anyways
You don't understand, it's waaaaaay smarter that way!
>my turn
>click fireball
>it misses
>have to wait 5 days, 18 hour, 3 minutes and 25 seconds before I get to cast a spell again
That already happens when you're waiting for the 15 second cast time that you have to place a template for and guess whereever the dogshit pathfinding is gonna out monsters in.
You don't actually like this, there's no way.
no it doesn't, stop smocking crack
There were encounters towards the end of BG3 I wished had a RTWP toggle, there's a few which just have too many enemy turns to sit through not to be frustrating, but for the most part I didn't miss it. With those few exceptions the encounters are designed around the system perfectly.
>you cant shitpost in Anno Domini MMXXIII because twiter man did
>he gets mad at it while posting in 4chen
You newhomosexuals should go back to your discord, you are as shit as any normalgay for trying to shitrule fricking 4keks of all places.
You RTWP people are totally trolling, there's no way this is a real opinion.
You're telling me you like the finicky template placement with casters as everything is shitting around the field with whatever godawful pathfinding engine they have?
You guys are delusional, no one likes this dogshit.
Even back on release I thought BG2's combat was moronic. for BG1 it worked out because it was lower level, but at the higher level you practically micromanage and pause constantly.
where does the hatred for rtwp come from? is it just a vitriolic reaction to zoomers not liking turnbased?
people shat on rtwp before zoomers, it's just coming back because DnD games are more popular now
>where does the hatred for rtwp come from
Did you not read the thread?
Honestly I got like 20 posts into it and people just started yelling rtwp is for trannies so I figured I'd ask a genuine question and maybe get a genuine response instead of sifting through that
of all CRPG combat ive tried, i liked arcanum's the most
RTWP and turn based depending on the situation, and enemies arent' annoying damage sponges with too many hidden protection systems
there's a reason why BG3 is popular and everyone hates slog games like poe, tyranny and what the frick ever
RTWP is a SLOG. It never feels good. It always feels like moving characters through molasses as every little thing takes 8 minutes. Even minor things like coordination become a total slog in RTWP when they're completely seamless in turn based.
>buy d&d inspired game
>wtf why is it turn-based?
I fricking hate boomers on god
But anon, an out of touch executive made BG1 use rtwp to compete with Diablo. Therefore now, decades later, BG3 must also frick itself over!
DnD games aren't turn based tho
BG3 also isn't DnD since it has random homebrew rules
And above all DnD fricking sucks
Every dnd table in existence uses homebrewed rules. You don't play games.
>DnD games aren't turn based tho
Correct, all the old games are rtwp
Homebrew isn't dnd
Homebrewing is an explicit part of tabletop games. Gygax had a list of homebrewed rules a mile long.
YOU DONT PLAY GAMES.
As soon as you start homebrewing you aren't playing DnD, you're playing homebrew
Only what's published as dnd is dnd
If you start counting homebrew as dnd then where is the line? If I homebrew in robots and different stats and new classes and using 2d10 instead of a d20 and no more spellslots when does it stop being dnd you stupid homosexual?
The answer of course is ar the first homebrew
Rule 0 you stupid no game playing frick.
Optionality is the fundamental basis of tabletop games.
Please for the love of God, play ONE game
Neither of you brainlets answered me: where is the line when it stops being DnD? If I homebrew DnD to be Gurps is it still DnD?
You know I'm right but already made the mistake of picking the wrong side
>IT'S NOT DUNGEONS AND DRAGONS IF YOU ARE APPLYING THE RULING FROM THE FIRST PAGE OF THE DMG
>STOP HAVING FUN
yeah concession accepted Black person.
>still can't actually answer me
Embarassing. You lost this argument and you know it
You shouldn't talk back to your betters next time
>make health potions drinkable as a bonus action
WOW, NOT D&D AT ALL ANYMORE! TOTALLY UNIQUE! NO SIMILARITIES!
The point is that it doesn't matter in the slightest.
Adding and removing rules that don't work for your party are the very basis of the genre. Even 5e itself has an entire selection of optional rulesets; flanking for example.
In the example of Gurps, just because you're only using one or two splatbooks doesn't mean you're not playing gurps because you're not using all one hundred some odd books.
It's a meaningless distinction that only a nogamer would bring up. Show me a character sheet from a game you're playing right now or shut up.
They didn't "answer you" because your moronic ass criticism applies to literally any tabletop system, even fricking Fiasco which has no GM. Outing yourself for the billionth time as a friendless loser who thinks D&D is like a videogame.
>he doesn't know rule zero
You have never even played dungeons and dragons a single time, which begs the question: why does it make you seethe so much? Lmao.
You are one pathetic specimen.
my favorite parts of baldur's gate and neverwinter nights are the bandits and the bandits
>people actually saying that putting 30 buffs on your martials and box clicking your martials at the enemy is more involved than a game where you actually have the room to use non-combat actions in an fight
Uoooohhh, I'm boofing and drag boxing my martials!
>this is exciting gameplay for RTWPtards
Only mental midgets who love to be waterboarded played this on release instead of waiting for enchanted edition where they made the game playable.
Pros and cons to both. Turn based is definitely better for more tactical important engagements but sometimes I just want to throw my melee character at a pack of wolves and watch him mow them down without it taking 20 minutes. If you could somehow have turn based for boss fights or big fights but then have RTwP for smaller skirmishes in between that would be great.
RTwP is just the worst of both worlds. I prefer action combat to turn based, I barely even touch turn based games, and even then I will take turn based over RTwP 99 times out of 100.
Is chrono trigger considered a turn based game? It's certainly not real time but it's not exactly like the player and the enemy take orderly turns since the ability to take action is dictated by cooldowns. Not sure how common that system is, sorry, I haven't played many RPGs
back in the 2000s i was in a huge minority as a turn-based enjoyer. it's crazy how the tables have turned, i never expected this to happen but i'm enjoying it.
Same here man. All those dumb Black folk in 2007 Ganker who fellated RTwP just because "muh BG2" can suck my dick, we came out ahead in the end.
I prefer RTwP over TB; TB feels artificial and stunted. Fights don't naturally happen where everyone just takes their "turn".
The reason why people disliked turn based games is mostly due to jrpgs. Those games either involve hitting the attack button over and over(with an occassional potion), or running after having to watch a thirty second cutscene over and over. I will say that old wrpgs didnt have great turn based systems either, but in recent years, turn based games have added many strategic elements like emphasizing the importance of positioning that makes the gameplay more interesting and chess like. Meanwhile, RTWP has not really evolved in an interesting way. It still is usually the same hotbar management we always had.
>Those games either involve hitting the attack button over and over
That is exactly how you play a martial in DnD
I dont play DND
Martials are girlfriend characters in trpgs, you have to remember that when picking classes
The only rtwp game I enjoyed was Dragon Age Origins. All the other games felt off. I mean if it's not turn-based, then your character should attack at each click no? If you have to queue your attack, what's the point of it being real-time then?
In real time strategy games (starcraft, age of empires...) units don't attack on each click. You issue an attack command and they perform it until the opponent or they die.
It's in the name baby, if youre not turn BASED, you're cringe
rtwp is okay with fewer party members like kotor having 3
>gayBlack folk itt pretending every combat encounter in bg3 is le heckin unique and perfectly crafter instead of just a few mobs dumped into an obvious arena
Just because you're too dumb to realize doesn't mean it isn't so. Compared to the vast majority of CRPGs, almost every encounter in BG3 tries to be different in some way, either through enemy composition, terrain, etc.
In most CRPGs it's literally what you described, which is why the difference is so noticeable.
>passive-aggressively responds to no one because he considers essence of an encounter to be just enemies on a location and nothing else.
I have never ever seen or heard anyone argue about RTWP vs turnbased before BG3 came out. Maybe at most people stating a preference in passing, but mostly everyone seemed to be aware it's pretty different genres.
What an utterly fricking contrived fricking debate
>I must absolutely have a stance on [current issue] and defend my view!
you're all fake fricking people who don't have opinions of your own and only hold any views so that you may partake in controversy
>I have never ever seen or heard anyone argue about RTWP vs turnbased before BG3 came out.
2023 newbiesis...
Black person I've been posting on the vidya text board actually talking about video games before your underage ass even knew what the "board culture" you use as an excuse to shit this place up is
You're not tricking anyone, kid. It's moronic larp. Stop.
Obviously not moron because this argument happens ALL THE FRICKING TIME LURK MORE OR BETTER YET have a nice day
>this argument happens all the time
from 2019 onwards mentions went from 4000 to 18000 now
it's absolutely related to this game alone
actually, it's because fireden went down in 2019 leading to the new wave of archives which are much less complete re: pre-2019 stuff. but thanks for playing, newbie.
seriously, lurk more instead of talking out your ass. moron.
Keep making shit up, I'm sure some idiots will believe you
>bg3 is so good that it single handedly increased interest in the turn BASED mode
baldur's gate chads we keep winning
You must be a newbie, it's been a constant topic on Ganker since forever.
It literally happened every single day on /vrpg/ for 3 years before this game Black person
sawyer has been playing game since day 1. How is it you gays get hipster style assblasted when someone makes a microaggression towards your game
It should be an FPS
Throne of Darkness shows how bad infinity engine RTWP system really is.
Usually, the only situations RTWP is "faster" and "better" is if you're just death-balling though trash mobs or easy difficulty. Although can be fun if you're playing a backstab focused thief (Fighter/Thief usually) in BG2 if you're using boots of speed for repeated hit and run shit. Turning people into piles of gibs one by one can be fun.
they added auto-pause in the remasters of bg1 and bg2. that is as close as you can get to an admission that turn based would have been better
>manually ordering every character to run across the screen and manually selecting the same basic attack and waiting for 6 enemies to do the same when they could all just mosh in real time
autism
turnbased feels like my experience is being interrupted by an arbitrary board game like dicepoker or gwent, it can be enjoyable but it feels disconnected from the gameworld. rtwp has an organic dynamic quality to it that I think justifies itself even if it is somewhat problematic.
Turn based for party based RPGs. Real time for solo RPGs. Simple as.
This thread is Tarmon Gai'don of CRPGs. And The Dark One is already lost without reaching bumplimit. From this day RTWP will never tarnish CRPGs threads ever again.
Honestly based.
RTwP is annoying and mindless.
Same with ATB in Final Fantasy.
Make it full turn-based or full action.
Why does RTwP make zoomers seethe so much?
Fact: rtwp isn't actually the problem, all the 1413451385 trillion garbage trash fights are
I want to like RTWP as it's leaning into the strengths of a videogame, rather than just being D&D word for word with none of the strengths of tabletop.
But it even handicaps strategy. You just queue up as much shit as you can and then watch the clusterfrick ensue. As a thought experiment, it is a failure and we need to move on.
>You just queue up as much shit as you can and then watch the clusterfrick ensue
I agree this is generally how rtwp games end up, especially for trash fights
But many games have actual good rtwp boss fights (DA:O, PoE1/2 come to mind in recent memory) where the fights are actually slow and meaty, and require some strategizing to beat on higher difficulties
"""just""" adopt this design philosophy for trash fights too; have fewer combat encounters with fewer, but stronger enemies (I don't think many people enjoy endless combat in these games anyway, that's not really the main reason why most people play them, I wouldn't even mind having a dungeon level, or whatever, with only one meaty combat encounter with the rest being exploration/puzzles/RP/whatever
name one rtwp game where even casting fireball isn't an ordeal
PoE2 retargeting system worked pretty well for this I'd say
Vancian casting is designed around you having 6-8 fights per day
But of course turn based can't actually deliver on that, hence why both tabletop and bg3 are 15 minute adventuring days
The frequent long-resting definitely was a big fricking drawback of BG3, something that has had a far better feel in almost every rtwp game
RTwP fans blown the frick out holy shit
>. Owlcat has abandoned us
I like what they did in Wrath.
Being able to swap between the modes was really cool.
Sadly one mode is just half assed because game was designed for different one
I would pay for it tb.h
It's over
It has been all over RTWP gays for quite a few years now.
Finally validation and popularity! YES! The final argument!