Except that it’s 1 move that got banned, and said move is banned on all Pokemon that learn it.
If you banned all of Arceus’s moves besides Tackle (which it can’t learn btw), you ban said moves from being used on other Pokemon, like Calm Mind or Ice Beam.
>th-they're not banned! only thing that makes them usable is banned!
wow cool fanfic
Basculegion Female is plenty usable without Last Respects. Also there are plenty of Pokemon still usable when Baton Pass was banned, so your point is even less relevant.
speed boost, calm mind and stored power allowed it to truck most pokemon after a single turn any resist like a dark type would be beaten by dazzling gleam or it would just tera fighting. Unaware doesn't stop stored power's boosts either.
BST no longer means anything, it's about your abilities, moves, and synergies with other Pokemon's capabilities.
They literally banned Sneasler because Grassy Seed + Swords Dance enabled by Rillaboom was too good, something that was in no way an inherent quality of Sneasler specifically and could've been accomplished by any Swords Dancer with a respectable resistance chart and high attack + speed.
so you're saying we could get SD scyther, Grovyle, Combusken and maybe Gligar banned? and Dewott? all of them can use the same strategy, under the same conditions
I've said it before and I'll say it again. The idea that OU is the only tier that matters is poison to Smogon/Showdown discussion. You are not invalid because your favourite Pokemon got moved up to Ubers or higher, moved down to UU or lower, or has move or Ability restrictions to use it in OU.
>You are not invalid because your favourite Pokemon got moved up to Ubers or higher, moved down to UU or lower,
Ubers is not a tier, its a ban list.
OU and below can all be used, the rest is deemed too broken and thus invalid in a balanced meta.
I do wonder with how many mons are getting banned.
If you unban all of them would they balance eachother like espathra would check sneasler, palafin would check espathra and etc.
Or would it be more like if they all get unbanned rape ape rage fist spam would become the dominant strat and if you don't use it you auto lose and once you ban rape ape bloodmoon ursaluna spam would become the dominant strat and then it just goes on and on.
These are just examples by the way I have no idea if espathra could check sneasler or if rape ape with rage fist would become the dominant strat.
I have no stake in this since the only pvp pokemon I play is randbats when I am bored.
I am just wondering what the deal is with all these bans.
>I am just wondering what the deal is with all these bans.
They don't wanna ban Tera fast, like they did with Dynamax if I had to guess. They are probably waiting for DLC2 to finally do it.
Fwiw they're going to try and get tera banned again with DLC2 (the hope is that it adds some mechanic that undeniably breaks it), a lot of these will get retested then, at least that's what the current gameplan is according to inside scoop/discords you can only get in if you have certain badges on Smogon.
Some of these will never get unbanned though, Ursaluna BM for example is horrendously overpowered for singles even though it has "less than 600 bst". Like it's actually horribly powercrept and feels like it's designed by the older brother of the toddler who designed Flutter Mane.
Ultimately either tera goes or pokemon keep going, this gen is always going to have more bans than others because it's just heavily powercrept.
they can't make OUBL because then everybody knows that will be the real OU and this will just be fake OU aka UU
OUBL doesn't really that much traction outside of a pretty small playerbase on discord. Making a tier ABOVE OU is much harder than adding one below ZU or PU or whatever the frick shitmon tier.
>OUBL doesn't really that much traction outside of a pretty small playerbase on discord
maybe because it has no presence elsewhere outside of discord???
The problem is you can't really add a tier like that and make it official because, Smogon's entire system relies on usage stats and OUBL wouldn't have this meaning it would require a ton of balancing if it were to be made official, it's definitely not balanced by default lol. Ubers is the only exception and that becoming a real tier took YEARS.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>The problem is you can't really add a tier like that and make it official because, Smogon's entire system relies on usage stats and OUBL wouldn't have this
the UUbers decision was to treat Ubers as a tier and have low usage mons in it legal in this "OUBL"
In actuality, there is in fact a distinction between an uber and an oubl; an uber is a box legendary; an oubl is, typically, a non-legendary that pissed off timmy
consequently, you can neatly segregate actual ubers from this theoretical tier such that it really does become, essentially, what OU would actually be like if there were no bans, because the only strong mons in OUBL would thus be only mons that would not have been auto-banished to Uber---i.e., OU caliber mons.
6 months ago
Anonymous
You realize something like Flutter Mane is not a box legendary right.
6 months ago
Anonymous
you realize flutter mane is a minor legendary that started out as ou and remained as such for months, right?
the problem is mainly tera, but cuckgon will not admit it and is pushing off suspecting it until the next DLC, because if they ban the generational gimmick even the most brainwashed smogshills would start to ask questions about their Daddy Council's collective IQ. and if you unbanned everything now, they would simply all get rebanned one way or another.
This lol
Their behavior this gen is defeating the entire purpose of the tiering system, if you don’t like Espathra and Annihilape etc you are supposed to play UU
I think UUbers is a good idea, but the people that think there's a difference between Ubers and OUBL are delusional. If it's deemed too strong/noncompetitive for OU, it's an Uber.
Most of these Pokemon’s effective BSTs are higher than 600 though. >Sword of Ruin gives Chien-Pao effective 176 Atk so it has effective BST of 626 >Beads of Ruin gives Chi-Yu effective 196 SpA so if has effective BST of 631 >Unburden literally gives Sneasler more Speed that base 255 (even if Sneasler is Adamant and 255 has positive nature). If you could go past 255 in Base stats, Sneasler’s Speed would be fricking 289 Spe and would have a BST of 679. >If you want, you can also include the Def buff from Grassy Seed and Sneasler now has fricking 99 Def and making its BST 718, just 2 points shy of fricking Arceus and while MinMax itself too >Ogerpon goes back to being “reasonable” because she has 154 Atk and 99 SpA because masks power up all her moves, giving her 623 BST in mask forms >Also Ogerpon’s Tera forms get auto +1 to Atk, Def, SpD, and Spe respectfully, giving them all wildly different BSTs >Moody on all Pokemon in the image will have a BST that is constantly growing until it hits +6 cap. And since Moody is so easy to get boosts with (just spam protect and sub) you have Pokemon that have BSTs that easily reach the fricking thousands.
Why ban any pokemon at all???
No one wants to have a meta game where you need Mega Fug to survive.
Mega fug isnt even real
His return is soon, the bible foretold it sinner.
Why is GLALIE banned of all things? Couldn't they just ban moody like they did before?
This list isn't an actual list of bans. It also includes ability bans instead of the whole mon. This anon is disingenuous.
Yeah, how dare they ban Ogerpon. Who wouldn't want a meta where you either use Ogerpon or have made an objectively shit team?
Top
No switch ins
Middle
Snowballers
Bottom
Flinch and Spike/toxic spam with ground move for steels.
>banned bug type
Bros we made it...
>banned because it teras into a different type
bugsisters...
Darkrai could be tested imo
>shitgon
>"competitive" pokemon
Everything.
But Basculegion and Houndstone aren't banned?
Last Respects is banned because that move is ridiculous but otherwise the 'mons themselves are allowed.
Anon this has been a recent new bait image that people sometimes post to farm (You)s off of Compgays
>th-they're not banned! only thing that makes them usable is banned!
wow cool fanfic
>Ban all moved from Arceus except Tackle, then unban Arceus
>morons response "Arceus isn't banned, just his moves are banned!"
Except that it’s 1 move that got banned, and said move is banned on all Pokemon that learn it.
If you banned all of Arceus’s moves besides Tackle (which it can’t learn btw), you ban said moves from being used on other Pokemon, like Calm Mind or Ice Beam.
Basculegion Female is plenty usable without Last Respects. Also there are plenty of Pokemon still usable when Baton Pass was banned, so your point is even less relevant.
>NOOOOOO WE CANT JUST LET LANDORUS FALL TO UU WE HAVE TO BAN 20 POKEMON JUST SO WE CAN KEEP OUR ARBITRARY FANFIC TIER AT THE SAME POWER LEVEL FOREVER
Bros, I need Ogerpon and Chien Pao to play!
imagine banning zigzagoon and glalie
>Zigzagoon
Fricking WHERE?!
Bring her back
No thanks, the rapebird can stay in ubers where she belongs.
Give the rundown on why Espathra is banned.
speed boost, calm mind and stored power allowed it to truck most pokemon after a single turn any resist like a dark type would be beaten by dazzling gleam or it would just tera fighting. Unaware doesn't stop stored power's boosts either.
God damn. No wonder it got banned
BST no longer means anything, it's about your abilities, moves, and synergies with other Pokemon's capabilities.
They literally banned Sneasler because Grassy Seed + Swords Dance enabled by Rillaboom was too good, something that was in no way an inherent quality of Sneasler specifically and could've been accomplished by any Swords Dancer with a respectable resistance chart and high attack + speed.
so you're saying we could get SD scyther, Grovyle, Combusken and maybe Gligar banned? and Dewott? all of them can use the same strategy, under the same conditions
You very clearly have no idea what you're talking about.
shut the frick up. this is the dumbest thing Ive read in this entire thread. stab yourself in the throat, please.
not the point.
it's almost like you replied to the wrong post. what does ANY of that have to do with sneasler?
I've said it before and I'll say it again. The idea that OU is the only tier that matters is poison to Smogon/Showdown discussion. You are not invalid because your favourite Pokemon got moved up to Ubers or higher, moved down to UU or lower, or has move or Ability restrictions to use it in OU.
>You are not invalid because your favourite Pokemon got moved up to Ubers or higher, moved down to UU or lower,
Ubers is not a tier, its a ban list.
OU and below can all be used, the rest is deemed too broken and thus invalid in a balanced meta.
smogon is cringe for banning even a single pokemon
what should be banned is ONLY certain moves/abilities/modes
>what should be banned is ONLY certain moves/abilities/modes
how is this still defensible?
The real solution to this, is to ban Tera and the guy that keeps making gimmicks for the games.
I do wonder with how many mons are getting banned.
If you unban all of them would they balance eachother like espathra would check sneasler, palafin would check espathra and etc.
Or would it be more like if they all get unbanned rape ape rage fist spam would become the dominant strat and if you don't use it you auto lose and once you ban rape ape bloodmoon ursaluna spam would become the dominant strat and then it just goes on and on.
These are just examples by the way I have no idea if espathra could check sneasler or if rape ape with rage fist would become the dominant strat.
I have no stake in this since the only pvp pokemon I play is randbats when I am bored.
I am just wondering what the deal is with all these bans.
>I am just wondering what the deal is with all these bans.
They don't wanna ban Tera fast, like they did with Dynamax if I had to guess. They are probably waiting for DLC2 to finally do it.
Fwiw they're going to try and get tera banned again with DLC2 (the hope is that it adds some mechanic that undeniably breaks it), a lot of these will get retested then, at least that's what the current gameplan is according to inside scoop/discords you can only get in if you have certain badges on Smogon.
Some of these will never get unbanned though, Ursaluna BM for example is horrendously overpowered for singles even though it has "less than 600 bst". Like it's actually horribly powercrept and feels like it's designed by the older brother of the toddler who designed Flutter Mane.
Neither are banned, OP is baiting.
I'm ok with some bans remaining, but it's kinda ridiculous how many things are getting banned. DLC2 can't come fast enough.
Ultimately either tera goes or pokemon keep going, this gen is always going to have more bans than others because it's just heavily powercrept.
OUBL doesn't really that much traction outside of a pretty small playerbase on discord. Making a tier ABOVE OU is much harder than adding one below ZU or PU or whatever the frick shitmon tier.
>this gen is always going to have more bans than others because it's just heavily powercrept.
Facts. Gen 9 is the least fun I've had in a very long time because of all the powercreep. Not looking forward to gen 10.
>OUBL doesn't really that much traction outside of a pretty small playerbase on discord
maybe because it has no presence elsewhere outside of discord???
The problem is you can't really add a tier like that and make it official because, Smogon's entire system relies on usage stats and OUBL wouldn't have this meaning it would require a ton of balancing if it were to be made official, it's definitely not balanced by default lol. Ubers is the only exception and that becoming a real tier took YEARS.
>The problem is you can't really add a tier like that and make it official because, Smogon's entire system relies on usage stats and OUBL wouldn't have this
the UUbers decision was to treat Ubers as a tier and have low usage mons in it legal in this "OUBL"
In actuality, there is in fact a distinction between an uber and an oubl; an uber is a box legendary; an oubl is, typically, a non-legendary that pissed off timmy
consequently, you can neatly segregate actual ubers from this theoretical tier such that it really does become, essentially, what OU would actually be like if there were no bans, because the only strong mons in OUBL would thus be only mons that would not have been auto-banished to Uber---i.e., OU caliber mons.
You realize something like Flutter Mane is not a box legendary right.
you realize flutter mane is a minor legendary that started out as ou and remained as such for months, right?
the problem is mainly tera, but cuckgon will not admit it and is pushing off suspecting it until the next DLC, because if they ban the generational gimmick even the most brainwashed smogshills would start to ask questions about their Daddy Council's collective IQ. and if you unbanned everything now, they would simply all get rebanned one way or another.
dang Orthworm died for Cyclizar's sins
they can't make OUBL because then everybody knows that will be the real OU and this will just be fake OU aka UU
This lol
Their behavior this gen is defeating the entire purpose of the tiering system, if you don’t like Espathra and Annihilape etc you are supposed to play UU
I think UUbers is a good idea, but the people that think there's a difference between Ubers and OUBL are delusional. If it's deemed too strong/noncompetitive for OU, it's an Uber.
Most of these I can see but Orthworm and Dugtrio? Really? Why? I don't play comp.
Is baton pass still banned in ubers?
yes
Most of these Pokemon’s effective BSTs are higher than 600 though.
>Sword of Ruin gives Chien-Pao effective 176 Atk so it has effective BST of 626
>Beads of Ruin gives Chi-Yu effective 196 SpA so if has effective BST of 631
>Unburden literally gives Sneasler more Speed that base 255 (even if Sneasler is Adamant and 255 has positive nature). If you could go past 255 in Base stats, Sneasler’s Speed would be fricking 289 Spe and would have a BST of 679.
>If you want, you can also include the Def buff from Grassy Seed and Sneasler now has fricking 99 Def and making its BST 718, just 2 points shy of fricking Arceus and while MinMax itself too
>Ogerpon goes back to being “reasonable” because she has 154 Atk and 99 SpA because masks power up all her moves, giving her 623 BST in mask forms
>Also Ogerpon’s Tera forms get auto +1 to Atk, Def, SpD, and Spe respectfully, giving them all wildly different BSTs
>Moody on all Pokemon in the image will have a BST that is constantly growing until it hits +6 cap. And since Moody is so easy to get boosts with (just spam protect and sub) you have Pokemon that have BSTs that easily reach the fricking thousands.