So is a large dex a good thing or bad thing?

So is a large dex a good thing or bad thing?

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  1. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    300-400 is the sweetspot.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Agree. 400 is nearly perfect for a main series game.

      PLA made it work with 242, but PLA feels bigger because things like trade evolutions are accessible without trading and there are no version exclusives. In fact, I would argue that PLA has the perfect Dex because it is the only game where I can get all 242 on a single player ID.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        I would agree but only getting access to a single A-Vulpix pissed me of to no end. Sure I could fill up the dex, but the living dex would always be missing a mon.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      What game has more than 400 in its regional dex?

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Kalos

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Kalos; had 450~ across three separate sets of 150, and given it only hit 721 at the time with no more than 80 new Pokemon, that's an insane quantity.
        400 has been the standard since USUM, and while it feels smaller the more species get added over the years, it really is one of the best numbers for a regional dex right now.
        Might hit 500 in gen X depending on how many new ones get added, or how big they make the region.

  2. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >everything must belong to extreme polarities, there is no such thing as nuance, compromise, or middle ground
    most intelligent discussion on Ganker.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      That's been the internet in general for the past half a decade.

  3. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Hoenn did it right, 200 Pokemon available, but all new Pokemon until after the first gym.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      This
      Hoenn helps establish itself as its own thing by front-loading the new mons early.Afterwards it does a pretty good job of mixing new and old mons. A number of those old mons are also in the Safari Zone, where having mons that feel like they're from another region is a positive.

      It also helps that certain types are basically locked to new mons. If you want a Dark type, there's no Gen 2 mons. Ice? Ghost? Same deal, nothing from Gen 1/2. Dragon? The only option outside of Gen 3 mons is Kingdra, which needs a trade.

  4. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Gen 1 dex = Perfect
    >Gen 2 dex = Perfect
    >Gen 3 dex = Unfocused
    >Gen 4 dex = Deeply flawed until postgame
    >Gen 5 dex = Poorly designed, with no Gen 1-4 mons to balance out
    >Gen 6 dex = Bloated
    >Gen 7 dex = Bloated
    >Gen 8 dex = Bloated
    >Gen 9 dex = Bloated

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      not trying to flamewar but what did Gen 1 do better than 5 when they have roughly the same number of mons in the campaign?
      It's not like Kanto isn't packed with Rattatas, Pidgeys, Zubats, & Spearows.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        not him and I actually like gen 5 a lot but gen 5 has an issue with a lot of the cooler/good mons have pre evos catchable only just before the e4 at like roughly late 30s early 40s but then also don't evolve until mid 50s early 60s making them very annoying to use if you want to have one of them for the finale and compounds really hard if you like multiple of them. Like I did my last BW1 run before bank shuts down recently and I wanted Mienshao, Bisharp, Braviary on my team for the finale but trying to level their pre evos around victory road/e4 was a real pain in the ass

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The Kanto designs are good. The Unova designs are bad.

        >Gen 2 dex = Perfect
        >Gen 3 dex = Unfocused
        Shut up you fricking moron

        Gen 2 dex is perfect as it includes all mons from both Gens. Literally perfect.
        Gen 3 dex is a mish mash of Gen 1, 2 and 3 mons with no coherence.
        Seethe harder.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >Gen 2 dex is perfect as it includes all mons from both Gens
          and stuffs a ton of them, including big hitter new mons into the postgame Kanto, parts of Johto just feel like I'm literally playing a Kanto reskin for this reason.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            See

            >same with johto. 251 pokemon feels like a lot, but between trade evos, stone evos, swarms, and postgame exclusives, it's surprisingly slim pickings.
            Stop. Lying.

            Stop lying.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >Gen 3 dex is a mish mash of Gen 1, 2 and 3 mons with no coherence.
          I don't know man, I live in a tropical country and it really captures that vibe well. If you go through the entire dex the weakest inclusions are Vulpix and Jigglypuff. Maybe Abra.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The monsters are available at an even pace, which means that a reasonably high number are only available in the very late game.
        Including some of the best.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >what did Gen 1 do better than 5

        designs

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Only after sugimori came in and fixed them all. Gen 5s designs still look better than most of the dogshit gen 1 sprites.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Gen 5s designs still look better than most of the dogshit gen 1 sprites
            You wish. I will take anything, even the shitty 3d models over the laziest and most garbage attempt at animating 2d sprites I have ever seen on my life.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >the laziest and most garbage attempt at animating 2d sprites I have ever seen on my life.
              but enough about emerald

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >what did Gen 1 do better than 5
        Original of everything will always be better because the characters are simple imaginative and the creators had no stress making them. They created something brand new and built around it. I'm honestly curious what the very first pokemon Satoshi created was of the original 151

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Rhydon.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Non linearity. Your options open up considerably after exiting Cerulean, and even more after Rock Tunnel.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The pace in GB games is a lot faster due to simpler animations, making the time spent in routes and caves comparatively shorter while the routes themselves feel larger. If 10 battles take 10 minutes in gen 1, the same 10 battles take 15 minutes in gen 5 and 20 minutes in gen 4. Neither the actual times nor the exact ratios are accurate here, I just want to illustrate why an adventure can feel repetitive when extended over a longer timeframe. If you play for 15 minutes and see only 3 different pokemon because you haven't advanced to the next route yet, it's gonna feel more boring than if you have the same issue in 10 minutes, but in the 11th minute you make it to the next route and find something different.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Gen 5 actually has less when you consider the fact that it has way more legendary bloat

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        well if we are strictly speaking, gen 1 has the caveat of pseudo free roam once you get the bike and give the border guards a bottle of water to share. gen 5 is known as the linear generation for a reason. As to why I personally dislike it, BW2 did try to remedy it, but adding extra spots doesn't stop the fact the game is still point A to B until you reach the end. Plus most of the mons I want on my team are stuck in the last half of the game and ruins some of my fun is all. Gen 3 imo had the best world layout from a traversal standpoint, you can always loop back somehow, meteor falls loops back to rustboro. Once you get rock smash you open mauville to rustboro . Surf can get you from slateport to oldedale (for whatever reason you'd want to) and surf unlocks the east from mauville. and once you get fly it doesn't matter.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Kys genwunner

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Gen 2 dex = Perfect
      >Gen 3 dex = Unfocused
      Shut up you fricking moron

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >gen 2 dex = perfect
      >cries about gen 5 being poorly designed because it only introduced 150 brand new pokemon but didn't include the same ones from the previous games
      >cries about all gens onwards being bloated
      Actually frick you, you massive fricking homosexual. You're the problem.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Gen 2
      >perfect
      Thanks, I needed a good laugh.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Gen 2 dex = Perfect

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Gen 2 dex = perfect
      >The same gen you literally couldn't get a new gen 2 Mon in the new region
      I love gen 2, but not being able to catch Houndour and murkrow until the Kanto half of the game was fricking moronic.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Gen 2 = Perfect
      lmao

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      this can't be serious, Johto's dex is mid as frick

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Gen 3 is like the best dex in the series

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Too many single stage shitmons
        Also unlike the Sinnoh dex the Hoenn dex includes post game locked mons and event locked mythicals so it’s smaller than Platinum and actually not that much bigger than DP
        Applies to Kanto and Unova too actually, DP is bigger than these

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          What is a shitmon?

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Mons that you can’t rely on for the late game without overleveling them

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              There's not a single pokemon in Hoenn that fits that description.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You’re talking to someone who tried to use Sableye and Castform in Hoenn
                Yes there is

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You're just bad and stupid if that's the case. They're not so much weaker that they need extra levels to beat the game.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Castform is slow, frail and needs a turn of setup to do anything
                Sableye has shit stats and no moves

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Castform is 70 across the board and learns some of the best moves in series history through TMs. Sableye is resistant or immune to some of the most common attacks and has 75 attack with shadow ball, brick break, fakeout. What do you need for something to not be shit in your eyes?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Gen 3 dex is perfect, gen 2 dex has no identity

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      dumbass johtoddler

      redundant I know

  5. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    why does /vp/ always seethe whenever sinnoh is mentioned?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >why does /vp/ always seethe
      Fixed that for you

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      the only people who use the moronic "bloated dex" meme complaint are sinnoh fanboys trying to pretend their game is good

      why does /vp/ always seethe whenever galar is mentioned?

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        why does /vp/ always seethe whenever unova is mentioned?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Sinnoh hate is unironically correlated with mental illness
      You could argue that actively hating on anything is some form of mental disorder, but Sinnoh haters are something else. They are all terminally online and feel the need to claim that they hate Sinnoh at every chance they get, they build their entire identity around the fact that they hate it.
      It’s no wonder a lot of them are part of the pronouns army too
      I mean, for god’s sake, look at the two most recurring Sinnoh haters we have on this board. One is a schizo who’s been shitting up the board for literal years and the other is an actual voregay.

  6. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I always like it when regions use certain Pokemon really well to characterize the environment, even Pokemon not introduced in that region.
    Things like Skarmory at the ash heap route, Meditite dotted all over Sinnoh, Slugma in Fiery Path, Litwick at celestial Tower. We need more of that.

  7. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >we need to get rid of the exp share toggle because too many options are a bad thing
    >we do need massive dexes every game having too many options is a good thing
    Really makes you think.....

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Options are a bad thing when they have no reason to be in the game

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Indeed, options are bad as proven by the dexcut being necessary. Bloated dexes are bad game design.

  8. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    200 - 400 for regional.
    All for post-game national.

  9. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Dexbloat is when the game gives you moronic shit like picrel and says “new wholesome Pokemon!”
    More legitimate team building options is a good thing.

  10. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    There's such a thing as too much. I think Gen 2 and 3 hit a nice balance, especially the availability in 3. Gen 1 and especially DP struggle to have a good pool with only 150-ish Pokemon, there's a reason Platinum expanded the options and Gen 1 originally planned for 190 Pokemon instead (look at how the Oddish/Bellsprout lines are used as mid-game filler). Gen 5 manages to make a 150-ish Pokedex work, but has negative knock-on effects on putting some of the Pokemon in other games since they were designed very specifically for Unova's level curve. On the other hand, B2W2 struggles to make the vast Pokedex work in it's favor (and does mostly by attempting to limit the Pokemon on each route) while the games afterwards just put like a dozen Pokemon on a route without considering much about balance and calling it a day. I will say though, I don't blame the later games for doing that, at a certain point there's too many Pokemon for them to not use. You either make the game way too fricking long, jam Pokemon in the post-game (which no longer exists), put them in something external (the DLCs of modern games accomplish this in a different way), or just swarm the player with options. There's positives and negatives to each approach but I feel like just shoving as many Pokemon as possible in is the "safe" one.

  11. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    it depends on a lot of factors
    firstly: how easily can the pokemon be obtained? platinum's size of 210 is healthy on paper, version exclusives notwithstanding, but a lot of the mons require trading to fully evolve. for someone playing singleplayer, this is a problem. same with johto. 251 pokemon feels like a lot, but between trade evos, stone evos, swarms, and postgame exclusives, it's surprisingly slim pickings.
    secondly: how many new pokemon are there? it's nice having your old favorites in a new region, but when people buy a new pokemon game they're going to be looking for new pokemon to use. BW has a dex of 152 new mons, not counting mythicals. this would seem small, except all of the pokemon are brand new so there's plenty of replay value alone in wanting to try everything out. BW2 is in the opposite position. it has a dex of 300 but nothing is new. balancing gen 5 mons with older mons isn't an issue because everything has had their chance to shine in a previous game.
    contrast both of these with XY who has an even larger dex of 450 but only 69 new mons, again not counting mythicals. the large dex size is a detriment here, the old completely overshadows the new. frick's sake the aces of both the evil team leader and champion are just megas of older pokemon.
    thirdly: how good are the mons? johto and hoenn both have a lot of pokemon that just suck complete dick and nobody in their right mind would use, they don't even count as options when teambuilding.

    attached is a tier list of how i think each game's dex stacks up. note that this doesn't correspond to my opinion of each game as a whole, just in this specific department. and i'm excluding the switch gens because i never played them.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >same with johto. 251 pokemon feels like a lot, but between trade evos, stone evos, swarms, and postgame exclusives, it's surprisingly slim pickings.
      Stop. Lying.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Sneasel, a Pokemon you literally cannot get until you're on Mount Silvers doorstep
        >Readily Available

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >Mount Silver
          *Ice Cave, actually. Play the games before you talk shit.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            only in crystal...

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >5% in Crystal only
              here's what Ice Path will be in the majority of the Johto games including your beloved remakes.

              If you're counting HGSS, then the way the GTS works in that game means that any Pokemon you can easily see can be traded for. Now, there's significant chances it's not there, online is kind of dead even with the DNS exploit, but it's not like Gen 4 trade evo levels of rigamarole. It's like borderline version exclusive level of readily available. If you want it in exactly GS then yeah you're SoL, that's what happens when they're busy finishing the game when they should be debugging it.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >the GTS counts for Pokemon availability
                might as well just count transfer mons and trading Pokemon in from other games.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >5% in Crystal only
              here's what Ice Path will be in the majority of the Johto games including your beloved remakes.

              That original chart was literally talking about Crystal (the definitive Johto games). Cope harder.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                ok? nowhere does the anon mention he's referring to Crystal, just Johto, and most Johto games don't let you get Sneasel until after the postgame.
                People who criticize DP's dex aren't suddenly invalid just because of Platinum.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >all the baby egg mons in 'readily available' and mons like Sneasel also in the same category (literally Crystal)
                >hurr durr I dina realise it was crystall hurrrr
                Stop blaming your ignorance on everyone else.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >just Johto
                Crystal is the finished Johto. It's like saying that Hoenn doesn't have the battle frontier because ruby and sapphire didn't have it.
                I'm sure not even a moron like you wouldn't say that battle frontier isn't a hoenn thing.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                and yet nobody defends Ruby/Sapphire’s postgame by pointing to Emerald’s battle frontier. Unlike you who continuously pretends Gold/Silver criticism is invalid because of Crystal.
                But thats fine, because I know you’re not actually a Johto fan and you’re only here to make bait after bait to occupy yourself from committing suicide.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                HGSS are the definitive versions of Johto and everybody knows that. ORAS also got plenty of criticism for not having the battle frontier, and rightfully so.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Crystal is immediately the inferior version for not having Mareep.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Wrong. You morons need to stop pretending Mareep is the only Johto mon, no-one is falling for it. Mareep is a completely average Johto mon and there are FAR better selections.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >5% in Crystal only
            here's what Ice Path will be in the majority of the Johto games including your beloved remakes.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          ice path you dumb b***h

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >hitmontop
        >readily available

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >readily available if you have Stadium 2
        >needing an entirely different console and game

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Remorioid or whatever it's called is a swarm encounter you can get before the post game if I remember correctly

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        nah Johto dex is arguably the worst in the series

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >if I put a red cross through some of these, people will think they're unobtainable
          No-one here is falling for your BS.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Tell me how do I get Elekid before Kanto

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Crystal mystery egg

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >RNG egg hatch

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                By your logic, all encounters that are 50% or lower also shouldn't be counted because that's relying on RNG.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Not really because with wild encounters you can just run around the grass until you get what you want. With the Mystery Egg you only have 1 chance to get what you want until Kanto

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >I-I-I-I can't get the mon because *personal inadequacy*
                Git gud and stop lying about Johto.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        I like how you didn't even list every Johtomon, on top of listing bullshit on par with Munchlax honey trees as 'readily available'

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Go on, which Johto mons are missing?
          Also notice how every dex thread always turns into everyone seething about Johto. It still stuns me that Johto being the best region can make people seethe so hard.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Half of the "readily available" pokemon aren't readily available.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Yeah. Almost as bad as the people who try to act like Sinnoh has no Fire types.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          you do understand most people are referring to DP when they say that, right? we know Platinum addressed it, that's not the point

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          The frick is Volcanion doing there? I was about to say "oh, is that a meme addition from Luminescent Platinum?" but then noticed the Litwick line wasn't there.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Since when are Chaizard or Typhlosion 'readily available' in DPPt?
          You're trying way too hard and it's sad you even made that out of spite, lmfao.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Sorry that your moronation has caused you to seethe

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Could you please explain to the class how Charmander, Cyndaquil and Torchic are "readily available" without trading from HGSS (and in Charmander and Torchic's cases, that requires you to be Post-Red in HGSS, which is a weird metric to consider "readily available") or transferring through Pal Park (which is post-National Dex only)?
              And if we're counting trade/transfer Pokemon as "readily available", then shouldn't every single Pokemon that isn't natively obtainable Pre-League also be considered "readily available" including the unobtainable Entei and Ho-Oh, who are ALSO "readily available" by trading from HGSS or transferring through Pal Park?

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I get the feeling you're autistic.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You're not explaining what "readily available" means by your definition, therefore I see it necessary to point out how strange the terminology is based on MY definition of "readily available".

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Babymons are all locked to Kanto outside of the 1 (one) you get from the Mystery Egg.
        >Aipom, pineco, heracross locked to gimmick.
        >Bellosom and sunflora locked to stone evo where you need to win the bug contest on a specific day.
        >Yanma, dunsparce, snubbull are 1%
        >Qwilfish requires super rod
        >Teddiursa, sneasel, swinub, delibird, skarmory, phanpy and tyrogue are near the end.
        >Hitmontop has moronic evo

        Readily available my ass.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          In crystal you can get phanpy in the early game before the first gym

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >5% encounter in the morning only that runs away

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >Mystery egg
          Available, git gud
          >NOOOO HEADBUTT TREES IS HARDD
          Git gud
          >NOOOO I HAVE TO WIN BUG CATCHING CONTEST
          Git gud
          >RRREEEEEEE 1% MONS
          Git gud
          >Qwilfish requires super rod
          Incorrect
          >Teddiursa and Phanpy
          Literally available before the first badge in Crystal + every Pokemon game ever made has lategame mons
          >NOOOOOO I'M TOO moronic TO EVOLVE TYROGUE TO HITMONTOP
          Git gud

          According to the standards of your pic, Johto requires just as many hoops [...]
          In no world is Mantyke a problem for only being available after Gym 8 while Tyrogue is 'readily available'.

          Git gud

          Stop blaming your personal inadequacies on the games. It is your fault that you are struggling with this.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Thank you, seriously how are people on /vp/ too moronic to play a literal Pokemon game, literally whining about basic game mechanics and cool features like the bug catching contest.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Stop blaming your personal
            I'm not the one who suggested the Sinnoh dex requires jumping through hoops while listing requirements that exist in Johto.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I'M TOO moronic TO EVOLVE TYROGUE TO HITMONTOP
            No, it's that Hitmontop has an evolution method that was explicitly made to encourage players to buy a guide.
            Nowhere does any NPC or flavor text indicate how Tyrogue evolves, you have to discover this buy purchasing a guide and reading it there.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >Nowhere does any NPC or flavor text indicate how Tyrogue evolves
              I worked it out myself when I was 9 years old through trial and error. My first Tyrogue evolved into Hitmonchan. I then bred a new Tyrogue again and it evolved into Hitmonlee. Then I worked out the stats caused the change, so I made them even for the third one, and hey presto, Hitmontop. It's not hard.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I'll take shit that literally never happened for five dollars, Alex.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                you are a homosexual and a liar

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >No argument.
            Concession accepted.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              My argument is that you're shit at the game

              >5% encounter in the morning only that runs away

              And so are you. Git gud.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Behold: "Readily available"!

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          how’s that debunk her post

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            because "readily available" never means "unlikely"

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        this was debunked

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          It wasn't, it's a matter of fact that the distribution in Johto is good and almost every Johto mon is available before the postgame. This is not debatable.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >counting babymons that just turn into Kantomons
            >counting multiple pokemon of the same line to make the list look bigger

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >counting babymons as “new” johtomons when they just evolve into Kanto pokemon
        >counting unown at all
        >counting multiple pokemon of the same line to make the list seem bigger
        Yea this is a max moron list.
        The problem with Johto wasn’t the lack of Johtomon, evening ignoring the moron picks on that list, there still are alot of johto options. The problem is so many require you to go way out of your way to get with no ingame way of knowing that ahead of time and are often just worse that other options easier to obtain. Oh man Yanma is a 1% encounter on a optional route and your reward is a shitty bug pokemon that learns mostly normal type moves. Or damn I wonder why no one uses Marill, can’t be because it’s a low level 1% encounter in a cave you barely spend 2 minutes in.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >no Houndoom
        >no Tyranitar (only lone pseudo locked to postgame)
        >5%> spawns

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >only lone pseudo locked to postgame
          Hydreigon
          Also Salamence is post Gym 8 so extremely lategame

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I don't think hydreigon being sort of postgame only because of the BW level curve not being designed with a lot of pokemon's evolution levels in mind for some reason is the same as tyranitar and metagross. You can get hydreigon in BW at the cost of a shit ton of grinding and trivializing the ending sequence because you're 10 levels over the final boss, but larvitar and beldum are unobtainable before the credits roll.

  12. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    around 450 is the perfect number of mons to have in the dex
    but the problem with sinnoh dex isnt the number, but the bloat of flying and water types introduced/included in its dex and the type overlap among so many of its mons that makes it impossible to build a well balanced team
    i have never had a problem like this with other games, but with sinnoh, i feel like every time i decide on a few mons, i cant add any more from the dex that would go along with these
    even unova's bw dex of just ~150 mons is more balanced across the types

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >around 450 is the perfect number of mons to have in the dex
      frick no

  13. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >bloat
    is this the new meme?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      it's a valid concern held by Gamefreak as proven by the dexcut, which Switchchads love so very much

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        That's because the new pokemon created are overlooked and not given a chance to shine. It's a direct result of people crying about not being able to use Pikachu and Charizard before the post game

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Why didn't this go into effect after GS then? You couldn't use Charizard period without the Time Machine and Pikachu was Post-League.
          Why didn't this go into effect after RS then? You couldn't use Charizard period without buying FRLG and trading and Pikachu was Mid-Hoenn.
          Why didn't this go into effect after DP then? You couldn't use Charizard period without transferring from FRLG or buying HGSS (where Charizard is a post-Red Pokemon) and trading.
          Why was Unova the straw that broke the camel's back if Charizard and Pikachu's absence are the focal point of why we have bloated dexes when GS was the first offender?

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Because Charizard is the stand in for all the old Pokemon you autist.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >it's an "autist takes everything 100% literally" episode

              Then say "homosexuals whined that they couldn't use any gen 1 Pokemon in BW pre-credits" instead of boiling it down to the Golden Children, because referring exclusively to Charizard and Pikachu does a disservice to the less-oft spoken of Pokemon and makes them feel irrelevant despite literally being the focal point of your explanation.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >because referring exclusively to Charizard and Pikachu does a disservice to the less-oft spoken of Pokemon and makes them feel irrelevant
                Pokemon aren't real, man.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Then why was there such a big stink about the lack of gen 1 Pokemon if "it doesn't matter, they aren't real" in the first place?
                Stick to a fricking narrative, damn.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >it's an "autist takes everything 100% literally" episode

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Why was it the straw that broke the camels back?
            Because everyone freaked out over how Gen 5 didn't have any of their favorites and it was just the new Pokemon until post-game.
            Everyone hated it, which is why they fixed it for B2/W2, and is among the many reasons why it is lauded as a core premium game.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              The ironic part is if the argument genuinely was only about zard and chu, B2W2 did nothing to make them available natively.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          interesting how people supposedly only complained about this during Unova when every game prior also mostly focused on new mons

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Because there are still old Pokemon available to catch in the regular game

  14. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >galar is cutting so many mons what the frick!
    >but also noooo there's too many mons available!!
    autism

  15. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    All the pics you spammed about same team this one is 100% accurate if you played online with randoms and comp teams aren't much diff.

  16. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I don't play pokemon so maybe I get this wrong here, but the solution should be to make more pokemon viable, not to remove the OP ones? the frick?

  17. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >PLA literally doesn't have Charizard in it
    >no one cares
    wow it's almost like the real reason people didn't like gen 5 was because it was stagnated and boring as frick and flooding the game with a bunch of forgettable unappealing new pokemon doesn't magically make the game interesting

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >it's an "autist takes everything 100% literally" episode

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        what favorites are people constantly using in gens 1-4? gyarados, crobat, and tenacruel are it

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >it's an "autist takes everything 100% literally" episode

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            schizo

  18. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >OP image is comparing Sinnoh and Galar
    >thread beelines for Johto & Unova
    What is this phenomenon called?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      i thought it was about the series in general. i didn't know that was galar's dex

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        it's a summary of most of the lines available in the Wild Area + galar starter, but it is more about the series in general

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      It’s called OBSESSION

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      common sense

  19. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Why are Johtocucks so insecure?

  20. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    postgame is fine
    or is that a loaded question too?

  21. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It’s good if there’s a lot of new Pokemon.

  22. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    200-350 is the sweetspot

  23. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    >all 251
    no it doesn't.

    lol nice deletion moron. learn to post

    [...]

    >Gen 2 dex has all 251 Pokemon
    nope

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >no it doesn't
      It does. Literally. By definition.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        nope. how do i catch zapdos in gsc

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >NOOO THERE'S NO JOHTO MONS IN JOHTO
          >actually anon, yes there is *posts proof*
          >YEAH BUT WHERE'S *Kanto mon*
          Lmfao, so NOW you care about the Kanto mons when it serves you. You really are pathetic. Not my fault you don't have friends to trade in RBY mons. They are in the regular dex, so they are in the game.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >They are in the regular dex, so they are in the game.
            Jobto cope.

  24. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    people complaining about Johtomon availability don't understand they were supposed to be "newly discovered species" and thus rare.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      That's the other thing - Gen 2 has the smartest implementation of the new mons. Whereas Gens 3 and onward is just
      >LET'S SQUIRT A BUNCH OF RANDOM MONS INTO THE REGION/DEX LMAO

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Yeah, so dumb for Slugma to be in a volcano. It should be on a cycling road instead!

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          The cycling road is where the ash from the cinnabar island eruption fell. I'm sorry you were too stupid to pick up on it

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Does your flying slugma headcanon also explain why there aren't any on Cinnabar island?

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              The volcano erupted bro. It shot all of them out of the volcano. I get the feeling you are autistic

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              What, do you want to be able to surf on the lava or fish in it to scoop out more Slugma?

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Why would you need to? Can't Slugma survive outside of lava? They should be flying freely through the skies all around Cinnabar.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Do you not know how volcanoes work?

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Is it like an artillery piece that erupts in a big arcing shot across the ocean, depositing a pile of lava and volcanic ash along a single stretch of roadway?
                That's why volcanoes themselves are never covered in any ash or lava, because volcanoes are known for their precision.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                There's a ton of debris just to the south of Fuchsia, pretty nearby to both Cycling Road and Cinnabar, they clean it up during the story. It seems to have become rock by that point. Same with the stuff on Cinnabar itself. There's no debris near Palette Town, so clearly the eruption didn't dump anything there. Why did Slugma only get to one area? Well, there's no patch of grass directly south of Fuchsia. It's the only place that has an appropriate encounter table, it's not like there's a volcano you can go into in the game.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >There's a ton of [autistic headcanon]
                k

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Kanto_Route_19
                >In Pokémon Gold, Silver, Crystal, HeartGold, and SoulSilver, Route 19 is initially blocked off by giant boulders sent there by a volcanic eruption on Cinnabar Island.
                https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/gbc/198308-pokemon-gold-version/faqs/49457
                >CINNABAR's volcano erupted. It hurled boulders that cut off ROUTE 19 indefinitely. I wonder if the people of CINNABAR are safe...

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Yeah, I agree it would have been pretty smart to put Slugma as a Rock Smash encounter inside brekable rocks on Route 19, rather than being in tall grass next to Celadon.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Careful now, none of that dialogue explicitly implicates that there were Slugma being carried by those boulders, therefore you're going to get called out for having a "nice fanfiction" because it isn't directly spelled out for autist chan.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >bulbapedo

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >The cycling road is where [schizo fanfiction]

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Thanks autism chan

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Thank you for admitting you're a liar.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Is it like an artillery piece that erupts in a big arcing shot across the ocean, depositing a pile of lava and volcanic ash along a single stretch of roadway?
                That's why volcanoes themselves are never covered in any ash or lava, because volcanoes are known for their precision.

                Thanks autism chan

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Slugma is only on Cycling Road because the developers MAY HAVE (and I say MAY HAVE because we do not have any official interviews or statements to fully understand the development process of GS, therefore this is an ASSUMPTION at best) thought it would be funny to put it there and not have it appear anywhere else, including areas where the literal magma slug would be appropriate thematically such as Cinnabar Island itself or Burned Tower.
              Happy?

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Not everyone is an autist who tracks the prevailing winds in a video game.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Not really.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Go play gen 2. It's directly mentioned in game and the game manual

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Cool headcanon.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >the game itself is head cannon

            Thanks autism chan

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            GS on the Gameboy Color did in fact have a narrative that was based on "it's been three years since the original Pokemon journey, and since then 100 new species and aspects we originally didn't know about Pokemon have been discovered!"
            Jasmine in GS quite literally states the Steel Type was a recent discovery, and the thing that kickstarts your journey is the Togepi Egg, which features both a species of Pokemon that has never been documented before as well as a glimpse into the emerging phenomenon of egg-like cradles, which are a completely different sect of Pokemon behavior from more traditional real world eggs that we've read about in the Pokedex of RGB and seen in supplementary media such as the Zukan.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      GS on the Gameboy Color did in fact have a narrative that was based on "it's been three years since the original Pokemon journey, and since then 100 new species and aspects we originally didn't know about Pokemon have been discovered!"
      Jasmine in GS quite literally states the Steel Type was a recent discovery, and the thing that kickstarts your journey is the Togepi Egg, which features both a species of Pokemon that has never been documented before as well as a glimpse into the emerging phenomenon of egg-like cradles, which are a completely different sect of Pokemon behavior from more traditional real world eggs that we've read about in the Pokedex of RGB and seen in supplementary media such as the Zukan.

      explaining the reasoning behind a design decision doesn't magically make it not shit

  25. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    Where do I catch the Kanto starters, Legendary birds, and fossils in GSC?

  26. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I guess this thread proves that /vp/ likes big dexs, lest they spend hours discussing limited options.

  27. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    once again, if I criticize Gold/Silvers/HeartGold/SoulSilver dex, you can't just say "But muh Crystal!" and my argument goes away.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >you can't just say "But muh Crystal!"
      Yes I can. Crystal exists, it is the last Gen 2 game, and it is therefore THE Gen 2 game for which we set the standard. Same as Yellow, Emerald and Platinum. End of story.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        HG/SS are the definitive Johto games and you know they are.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          No, Crystal is. HGSS are good but Crystal is maximum comfy soul.

  28. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    your shitty graph was already disproven. kys

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      No it wasn't, the graph is quite literally objective fact. You literally cannot disagree because it's a matter of fact (except Octillery is not postgame, other than that it is correct)

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        If it's meant to be Crystal, then the Remoraid line is correctly placed.
        Mareep's line isn't though. Nor is Girafarig, since neither are in Crystal.
        And if you switched to Gold/Silver, then it'd require moving Sneasel and the Odd Egg mons, so it'd still be more of a loss than a gain.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        See

        nah Johto dex is arguably the worst in the series

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >lying edit image that pretends mons aren't available
          Nah, no-one is believing your BS kek

  29. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Qrd?

  30. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >n-no you don't get it, no johto pokemon in johto is actually good!

  31. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    more pokemon = bloated?
    no such thing
    the more pokemon the better
    frick you.

  32. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    the mental gymnastics johotogays will go through lmao.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >the amount of times Pokemon fans need to defend GSC and HGSS from obvious lies
      FTFY

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >the truth = lying
        meds

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Same. I love catching Mareep on every Crystal playthrough.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >it's another 'Mareep is the only Johto Pokemon' episode
          You need to get new material.

          >same with johto. 251 pokemon feels like a lot, but between trade evos, stone evos, swarms, and postgame exclusives, it's surprisingly slim pickings.
          Stop. Lying.

          BTFOs any argument you have about le distribution.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I'm agreeing with you though? Mareep and Girafarig are both listed as readily available on that list, which is obviously referring to Crystal since it also lists Sneasel and mons from the Odd Egg, and excludes Remoraid while keeping Qwilfish.

  33. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    if i cant readily walk into grass and find the pokemon i want it is not readily available.
    post brought to you by business dog

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      This is what separates Johto and Sinnoh
      Johto - almost all mons available in grass, surfing, or fishing
      Sinnoh - you have to jump through 800 hoops to get the mons you want (pic related)

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        According to the standards of your pic, Johto requires just as many hoops

        >Babymons are all locked to Kanto outside of the 1 (one) you get from the Mystery Egg.
        >Aipom, pineco, heracross locked to gimmick.
        >Bellosom and sunflora locked to stone evo where you need to win the bug contest on a specific day.
        >Yanma, dunsparce, snubbull are 1%
        >Qwilfish requires super rod
        >Teddiursa, sneasel, swinub, delibird, skarmory, phanpy and tyrogue are near the end.
        >Hitmontop has moronic evo

        Readily available my ass.

        In no world is Mantyke a problem for only being available after Gym 8 while Tyrogue is 'readily available'.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        hur

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        hur

        also have to remove unown requirements for hippowdon and add happiness evo for lopunny

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        See

        My argument is that you're shit at the game
        [...]
        And so are you. Git gud.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >*remakes your games in Sinnoh giving your entire dex to DPPt*
        Pssh, nothin personal, kid.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >He doesn't find the pokemon he wants on the first try
      ngmi + skill issues

  34. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    so are these 2 falseflagging discord Black folk just going to bait you people until bump limit

  35. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >you are not allowed to criticize Johto

  36. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I really wish people here were willing to accept that their favorite games in the series aren't flawless masterpieces instead of obsessively defending the most obtuse things to defend a video game's honor from someone pointing out that something wasn't a very good decision

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >I really wish people here were willing to accept that their favorite games in the series aren't flawless masterpieces
      they very well might be to them, there's no objective measure to measure such things in the first place so arguing about it is a pointless exercise, when a fandom descends into cynical nitpicking instead of celebrating the things they like it just leads to an unending cycle of genwarring autism

  37. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Both of these examples are bad. A good region has a LARGE DEX of NEW POKEMON. Like Unova.

  38. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >stealth galar defense thread
    kys op

  39. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Top: reddit meme
    Bottom: actual unironic criticism
    You tell me anon

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Explain why more teambuilding options is suddenly bad

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It’s not the team building options per say, it’s when everything is very easy to obtain, including overpowered options like pseudo legendaries
        Pokemon is about collecting monsters, some of them have to be rare in order for it to work, this view of pokemon being limited to just "team building options" during the campaign is very recent
        Also limiting options is a way to make the game more difficult as well, especially in the early game. Imagine if Sinnoh gave you a steel type before Roark for example, that would be stupid

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          novelty mons meant solely for collecting or gimmicks are fun, the problem with sinnoh and johto that leads to samey teams is that your options are split cleanly between strong, reliable mons that will carry you through the entire game with little effort and novelties that suck shit in battle and are just meant as something for the player to collect.
          sinnoh has some mid-tier mons, but they're locked but their encounter methods require time and/or effort that they aren't good enough to justify.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            yea the reason why so many teams look the same is low and behold they’re pokemon the player is likely to come across with little effort and by the time they might find a pokemon later, they’ve already invested half of their journey on Luxray or Staraptor like why change pokemon this late? Fricking sorry I didn’t halt progress on my adventure to find a fricking female combee in my blind run when I was 11 back in 2007.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              the reason everyone uses Ampharos as their johto electric type is what the frick else are they going to use? pikachu and electabuzz aren't until kanto, chinchou and voltorb require the good rod (or you could get an electrode from the rocket hideout) that really only leaves magnemite, which can't be fully evolved in HGSS, and ampharos.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Exactly, wow shocker that pokemon that are easily found are often used in teams. Especially for a blind first time run

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                umm actually Elekid can be obtain with the odd egg in Crystal, checkmate Black person

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Not everyone uses Ampharos or an Electric type at all on their team. Why are you assuming people HAVE to use an Electric type? Also Pikachu/Electabuzz is pre-3rd Gym. Here are your electric options in GSC prior to the postgame:
                Raichu (C)
                Electabuzz (C)
                Lanturn
                Ampharos (GS)
                Electrode
                Magneton
                Raikou
                So between 5 and 6 depending on the game. Plenty. Stop lying about Johto and inventing barriers that don't exist. Your gaslighting is not going to work anymore.

                he’s saying that all of them but 1 require the player to know about when Amphraos is so easily obtainable compared to the rest.
                On top of that, you’re including changes made to Johto in Crystal but ignoring the problems the base game had that they shouldn’t have had to begin with

                crystal is even worse if you want an electric type because it removes ampharos and locks the two replacement options besides the RNG egg. hope you like savescumming!

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >you're obligated to use an Electric type because...you just are okay?!?!
                If getting one of those 5-6 Electric types is too hard for your little brain, maybe try one of the other 15 types? Lmao. Stop blaming Game Freak for your own moronation.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Mandatory type gays are moronic even by genwargay standards
                "Dude fire types electric types" Black person who cares use something else

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                In fairness fire type has pretty good coverage and is usually a staple in teams

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                It isn’t. It’s always been a pretty rare and usually late game type if you don’t pick the fire starter. I often end up not having one on my team, as is the case for most people who aren’t specifically trying to have a fire type.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Not everyone uses Ampharos or an Electric type at all on their team. Why are you assuming people HAVE to use an Electric type? Also Pikachu/Electabuzz is pre-3rd Gym. Here are your electric options in GSC prior to the postgame:
                Raichu (C)
                Electabuzz (C)
                Lanturn
                Ampharos (GS)
                Electrode
                Magneton
                Raikou
                So between 5 and 6 depending on the game. Plenty. Stop lying about Johto and inventing barriers that don't exist. Your gaslighting is not going to work anymore.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                he’s saying that all of them but 1 require the player to know about when Amphraos is so easily obtainable compared to the rest.
                On top of that, you’re including changes made to Johto in Crystal but ignoring the problems the base game had that they shouldn’t have had to begin with

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >I want to focus on the bad points of Gold/Silver, not the good points of Crystal!!!
                That's a you problem.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Gold and Silver were GF’s initial plans for Johto.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >No mention of the FREE gift Pokémon in Goldenrod
                My boy...he is forgotten...

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                It's hard to remember everything when you haven't played the game.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                It came to mind immediately for me because I use Jolteon in every game where he's available. I was kinda taken aback that the Lucky egg of all things gets mentioned, but not, y'know, Eevee.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I agree with you, it's one of the most classic giftmons. I just thought it was telling that the other anon knows all those weird specifics but didn't know about something that every kid found on their own.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                It came to mind immediately for me because I use Jolteon in every game where he's available. I was kinda taken aback that the Lucky egg of all things gets mentioned, but not, y'know, Eevee.

                Jolteon is only obtainable Pre-Kanto in Crystal, so I don't blame him for forgetting it if he's only going off of GS memory, where you only get one Thunder Stone per save file from Bill's grandfather.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Mystery Gift.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Which isn't something you're going to be able to actively use if we're talking strictly within "natively singleplayer" terms. And if you're going to count Mystery Gift as a viable and non-tedious option to get Jolteon in GS Pre-Kanto, then you might as well say all Pokemon are equally viable to obtain as soon as you unlock trading.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I'll admit my mind was on HGSS where it's like 6 Pokéathalon rounds to a Thunderstone.

                >OP image is comparing Sinnoh and Galar
                >thread beelines for Johto & Unova
                What is this phenomenon called?

                Average Gankerner is an early 20's male.
                Early 20's = around 10 when HG/SS (Johto) and B/W (Unova) came out. I would know, I turn 21 this year.
                They're the 2 regions /vp/ on average remember the best, and can talk the most about as a result.

                Heartgold was my first game, and Black after that, although I'm personally more familiar with gen 3 than 5, but I like everything before gen 6 (and OR/AS are okay).

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >I like everything before gen 6 (and OR/AS are okay).
                This is the only way

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >stone evo
                nah

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            In Sinnoh’s case it’s mostly just Staraptor, Luxray and Lucario being strong, popular and easy as frick to get

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Like you won’t really have any trouble to use other mons but why would you when the game gives you such cool and powerful options for free

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                It’s like with the abilities of Sprucifix in Clover, they’re all good in their own rights, but one of them is fricking wonder guard do yeah of course people use wonder guard. Does that mean regenerate is a bad ability? No, it’s just not wonder guard

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            yea the reason why so many teams look the same is low and behold they’re pokemon the player is likely to come across with little effort and by the time they might find a pokemon later, they’ve already invested half of their journey on Luxray or Staraptor like why change pokemon this late? Fricking sorry I didn’t halt progress on my adventure to find a fricking female combee in my blind run when I was 11 back in 2007.

            >using vespiquen as an example of a shitmon
            Vespiquen is actually really good in a Sinnoh run and she carried her weight when my 7-yr old self just happened to have a female combee.
            >evolves at level 21 and immediately comes with a 90bp bug move and bug type recover
            Just because a mon is not good in competitive formats doesn’t mean it’s bad in game too

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              no, i like vespiquen. hell, i love vespiuen. i used one in my last platinum playthrough. but at the same time, i wasn't planning to use one until i stumbled upon a female combee by pure happenstance. i can't imagine going out of my way to look for one.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        I would point to Kalos as an easy example of why certain mons need space to breathe.

        To start with, say you want a dragon type in Kalos. Your very first options would be Axew immediately followed by Bagon, both very strong returning dragon types, both available before the first gym.
        That drastically reduces the motivation for anyone to track down or use other dragon types.

        Putting something too strong very early or where it's easily accessed just ends up reducing team variety because more people are going to pick that instead of waiting for something later. Strong mons should be rare or out of the way to help encourage exploration.
        If you suddenly took Sinnoh and added to areas after the 7th gym places where you could catch every non-legendary Johto/Hoenn mon that was single-stage at the time (Girafarig, Luvdisc, etc.) you'd add over 20 mons to the dex, but you wouldn't actually change anything about the 'generic Sinnoh team' meme, because nobody is dropping one of their team-members at Gym 8 for a Luvdisc.

        Poor distribution can ruin all of the positives of simply having a larger dex.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >Your very first options would be Axew immediately followed by Bagon, both very strong returning dragon types, both available before the first gym.
          *second gym

  40. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I prefer a large dex since it gives players more choices

  41. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I dunno about gen 2 or 4, but I really enjoyed XY's availability. ORAS with the DexNav was also comfy.

  42. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The only thing that matters is that there are Pokemon I like early on. I'll take a Pokedex of 80 Pokemon I like over one of 400 where I struggle to make a team of 6.

  43. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Galar’s roster would be fine if 90% of it wasn’t available in the Wild Area before the damn first gym, front loading the game is great for replay value but it makes the future routes thoroughly uninteresting when I was able to assemble a balanced team of 6 in my first couple hours of playing.

  44. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Gen 1: Good, leans on repeats in a few places.
    >Gen 2: Kanto with what was essentially a DLC pack. Gets the job done and fills the gaps Kanto needed.
    >Gen 3: Perfect
    >Gen 4: Utter shit in D/P; Perfect in Platinum
    >Gen 5: Felt hollowed out in B/W, near-perfect in B2/W2
    >Gen 6: Bloated on paper, alright in actual gameplay.
    >Gen 7: Bloated
    >Gen 8: Bloated
    >Gen 9: Bloated

  45. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    [...]

    >Gen 2 dex has all 251 pokemon
    Not arguing over that since it's a moot point these turbo autists can't seem to grasp since it has been the fundamental basis of the games since the beginning.
    My personal issue is more to do with when those pokemon from gen 2 could actually be accessed - i.e. Houndour/Murkrow
    It could be argued that it's just a flavor thing they did, but it was still fricking moronic to do that.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >have a place called BURNED TOWER
      >No Houndaur
      like come on

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Im all for adding flavor and lore to a game but if it comes with the expense of good game design then frick it. Oh wow it’s really cool that there are still new pokemon to discover in Kanto except trainers in Johto have them and all it goes it mean they never get used in playthroughs. Then you have 1% garbage mons that are like cool, world building. But At least make it worthwhile

  46. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    an extremely good thing and i'll never forgive genwunners for trashing kinova so hard gamefreak never even bothered to try again

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      But Unova’s dex is small, this isn’t about number of mons introducing its number of options available

  47. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >bait image about Sinnoh and nugen games
    >turns into a Johto seethe thread almost immediately
    Lmfao, Johtochads can't stop winning. The eternal seethe continues forever.

  48. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Dexbloat
    The frick does this even mean? A big regional dex means there is replay value.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >The frick does this even mean?
      “I’m upset that the newer games have elements that are objectively better than my heckin le peak of the series golden era DS games so I’m going to make up a buzzword to pretend the objectively better thing is actually bad”

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >I’m upset that the newer games have elements that are objectively better than my heckin le peak of the series golden era DS games
        Like the dexcut?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      It's dumb to put 500 creatures in unnatural locations just for the sake of having them.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Please show the class the natural and unnatural locations. You can start from Gen 1 and go all the way to Gen 9.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      What replay value does it add if using old mons is bad like typical sinnoh team gays claim?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      It's a meme from the same people who brought you #ThankYouGameFreak in response to BBND back during the SWSH Hype Era.
      They unironically want Pokedexes to go back to only having 151 Pokemon because they don't like keeping track of so many species of Pokemon and their attributes, even though the game practically does all the weight lifting (showing what moves are super effective or not) for them already.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        But games with bloated dexes introduced the least amount of new pokemon to keep track of

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Yes, but they still have to actively memorize and keep track of all Pokemon that aren't from their childhood game because there's no nostalgic memories clinging to them.
          They'd also much prefer there be as few new Pokemon as possible and that their design perfectly conveys their type from a single five second glance, so we're effectively talking a Pokedex of about 50 new Pokemon, 75 Kanto Pokemon and some filler mixture of other generations.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            What the hell are you babbling on about

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            > They'd also much prefer there be as few new Pokemon as possible
            So they like gens 6+ and hate BW?

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Now you get it! But the high dex counts still make them piss their pants, so their dream game is a lot closer to something like LGPE or LA.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I think you’re making up people to get mad at anon.

                Castform is 70 across the board and learns some of the best moves in series history through TMs. Sableye is resistant or immune to some of the most common attacks and has 75 attack with shadow ball, brick break, fakeout. What do you need for something to not be shit in your eyes?

                Being actually able to ko things and not dying all the time

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Being actually able to ko things and not dying all the time
                Which sableye and castform both do.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          This. It makes sense to lean on old mons but every gen since Kalos has been suffocating it’s new mons in favor of old ones. Is there any reason mons from older gens are still vastly more popular than mons from newer gens even in spite of Kaloskeks growing up?

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Yes, but they still have to actively memorize and keep track of all Pokemon that aren't from their childhood game because there's no nostalgic memories clinging to them.
        They'd also much prefer there be as few new Pokemon as possible and that their design perfectly conveys their type from a single five second glance, so we're effectively talking a Pokedex of about 50 new Pokemon, 75 Kanto Pokemon and some filler mixture of other generations.

        Now you get it! But the high dex counts still make them piss their pants, so their dream game is a lot closer to something like LGPE or LA.

        >gen 6+ fans who hate the ds games hate larger regional dexes (like XY, USUM, SWSH, and SV which all have at least 400 pokemon) and want a regional dex of 151 or so pokemon (like DP and BW)
        Why are genwarrers unable to follow basic logic?

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Pokemon fans don't actually know what they want to begin with. Remember when 2ch hikikomoris shat on Mallow for being "pandering" and then she ended up as one of the most popular Alola girls?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      shoving anything and everything into the game robs it of flavor.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        damn bro i thought people wanted all the content

  49. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It's a good thing. We've never had a dex that was too big. The very idea that someone could be mad about dexit and also mad about a "bloated dex" is an insane contradiction, and reveals the type of person who doesn't actually like or dislike anything other than a trendy bandwagon hate of the newer games.

  50. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Large dexes are good if they're able to space the pokemon out in a believable way while not making it too easy to bump into them, I guess in a weird way it's a pacing issue?
    When you can come across Tsareena and Sandaconda within a few feet of each other it's a bit shit.

  51. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Having a big dex for a big region is fine
    But having 20 different encounters on a route then 20 completely different ones on the next is just lazy
    If you want your dex to be big then have many routes, and many different ways to get mons. Have some of them be trade exclusive, why is gen 1 the only one that does this? Have others be gift mons, have some be locked behind some kind of gimmick, have a day/night cycle and seasons, etc. It's not that hard to have a big dex without the routes being bloated. But putting content in games takes more time than just spamming species on random routes

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >gating Pokemon behind criteria that requires me to wait when I just want to blitz the game as quickly as possible in order to have access to all of the postgame QoL that makes teambuilding a breeze
      I will not use your Pokemon in my campaign team. Simple as.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Good, my game isn't for you, qoltard

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Okay, cool, don’t care.
          Remember when Pokemon was about collecting them all rather than picking and choosing a perfect roster of 6 to use for the whole game and ignoring everything else?

          I don't really get how guys like him decided that "Quality of Life" means "Get me to the end as fast as possible because I don't actually like the game."

          That's why IMO Pokémon should take after Call of Duty and have a Singleplayer campaign (AKA the game as we know it), and then a separate, Showdown-esque online multiplayer. Give them their treat and then let the game be, you know, an actually well-made game.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            qol has always been slang for casualization and instant gratification, it's exclusively used by people who hate playing the games

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Maybe if you're a zoomer it may seem like it always has been. But it hasn't for those with a longer memory.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Okay, cool, don’t care.
        Remember when Pokemon was about collecting them all rather than picking and choosing a perfect roster of 6 to use for the whole game and ignoring everything else?

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          No.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Probably because you weren't alive at the time

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              No, I just always played that way. Your experiences are not universal.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Yeah i remember, SV was a pretty good game.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Yeah, and I'll collect them all when I have the resources to make that an easier job rather than slogging them against underleveled opponents for ten hours just so a novelty Pokemon can become another novelty Pokemon.
          Rather, I'll wait until I can amass EXP Candy aplenty to simplify the process, or, in a game where EXP Candy doesn't exist, I'll wait until I have a dedicated Pokemon League Buster I can use to make multiple sweeps of the E4 and Champion while those shitters kick back and soak up the benefits of the EXP from five teams worth of high-yield Level 70+ Pokemon.
          Fun fact about that, Scarlet and Violet was the first time I felt truly motivated to complete the Pokedex because of how easy it was to fill it out despite there being 400 bastards in Paldea, 200 in Kitakami and 240 mandatory bastards in Blueberry. Wild how that works despite there being so many Pokemon to put up with, right?

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            USUM had a good balance for “qol” level grinding, easy Chansey spot at Poni Island to SOS farm while not trivializing the level curve by giving you xp candies aplenty before you even hit the first gym.

  52. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Flygon, Tyranitar, Haxorus. & Kommo-o all static encounters and catchable in Wild Area after 8th gym
    >Dreepy is a 1% random encounter in 1 specific part of Wild Area catchable after 7th gym
    I’m all for making Pokemon rare and needing to put the effort in to get it, but what was the rationale here?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      dreepy is a new pokemon therefore it has more value

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Well yea, but doesn’t a lot of the motivation to get it kind of fade away when you have so many other options right in front of you and way easier to grab?

  53. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Dex is less important, more important is the map, story and gameplay. There are so many pokemon now that dex amount and quality is practically irrelevant.

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