Who gives a frick as long as the game is good
link in botw already looks like a little b***h the MC being zelda or a random girl would be barely any different
>Zelda-centric anyway
I mean, people have been asking for a spin-off game with that idea since the SNES days after ALttP.
All we got were two very bad CD-I games with Zelda as the lead, and one bad Link game
I want the next game to not have Zelda appear nor green guy as the baddie
Like why don't they do something weird like Majoras Mask again, why are the 2d games allowed to not have the same copy paste
> Zelda-centric > plant sized Zelda as the map > only way to save her is destroy her from within
That's the best I can imagine. Otherwise it would be regular world with Link having personality disorder as an excuse so "switch" to become Zelda.
I honestly do not get why people are frothing at the mouth and demanding that link either be a girl or zelda be playable and the main character. Nobody does this shit for mario, metroid, kirby, or even other non nintendo series with a hard locked protagonist. Is it because the game has zelda in the name? That's fricking moronic. The games are about a dude named link destined to fight evil because of some infinite curse loop.
That's my fear but I hope not. Nintendo, and Aonuma in particular, seem obsessed with doing something different and Tears was very much an exception to the norm. I hope we get something more traditional, and with much better narrative presentation.
TotK was obviously an one-off.
Especially after they said months ago that there won't be DLC because they've already done everything they wanted in that Hyrule.
The only ones insisting on "BotW 3" were shitposters, fearmongers and concern trolls.
And as always, even direct deconfirmation from developers themselves won't stop them from shitting up every Zelda thread until the first trailer drops.
That's my fear but I hope not. Nintendo, and Aonuma in particular, seem obsessed with doing something different and Tears was very much an exception to the norm. I hope we get something more traditional, and with much better narrative presentation.
They already said they'll continue the "open air" formula.
And there's nothing Ubishit about it.
Didn't know you get ice cube powers on command in Ubisoft games
5 months ago
Anonymous
You said runes, not specific runes. All nintendo did was thematically tie some runes to their game. And even then some are ripped directly from ubishit powers.
5 months ago
Anonymous
So you admitted some weren't.
Thanks for proving yourself wrong.
5 months ago
Anonymous
goalpost moving just proves you're wrong. enjoy that.
Yep, this play style, like being able to climb anything and traverse the world how you want, is here forever. All this does is greatly limit dungeon and world design.
but who wants a locked down linear game where you get better and better items, when you can aimlessly go through a floating puzzle box and replay each cutscene as if it were the first one 5 times in a row
>we're stuck with ubishit forever
This is the real problem. I feel about as much desire to play BotW/TotK as Wildlands/Breakpoint. Sometimes even less because the latter two have decent stealth mechanics. Nintendo failed.
Bullshit, there are tons of people on this board right now claiming that BotW was a masterpiece and TotK sucked. That was after the 6 years of Gankerirgins complaining that BotW sucked and SS was actually this underrated gem.
People might have their own theories as to what exactly makes the Zelda cycle real (maybe it's just different generations of players, or maybe the more "hardcore" fans truly don't know what they want) but there's no denying at this point that the cycle is fricking real.
Ganker generally doesn’t like totk/botw. Common consensus here is that series “”died”” after Aonuma became the lead director and that he needs to be fired for whatever reason. I think Wind Waker and Twilight Princess might be somewhat liked now. Most people generally like the game. You shouldn’t get so up in arms about a “zelda cycle” that this board barely follows.
The only nintendo franchises here that people like are generally the small ones, Pikmin/Xeno/Metroid etc
This board specifically and especially follows the Zelda cycle more than any other place on the internet.
5 months ago
Anonymous
following the zelda cycle implies that people look back and being to like certain games more over time.
I still see a lot of vitriol for everything after Majora's Mask and the Oracles.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Zelda Cycle on Ganker died with SS, anyone suggesting otherwise is underage.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Everyone has a different idea as to what the core identity of the series is. I never liked the 3D games well, I have a soft spot for Wind Waker because of the incomparable amount of SOUL, even though I do think it's a bad game, so BotW being a return to the "old games" was right up my alley. I've played ALttP and LoZ more than any other Zelda game, and I love the absolute freedom. I just wish there were more unlockables in the Hero of the Wild games so you feel like you're progressing more viscerally.
5 months ago
Anonymous
No one likes Skyward Sword here. GCN era zelda is sometimes discussed, but itd rare. Oot and majoras mask are rightfully praised but that’s about it.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I've seen at least 30 "ackshually SS was good" threads this year, and I don't even visit this board as often.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Those are made by spammers and most people here don’t agree
5 months ago
Anonymous
>I don't even visit this board as often.
Hence you don't pick up on obvious bait. The few SS defenders that do exist were humbled by how poorly the rerelease did on the Switch, despite being the only TRUE 3D Zelda for sale on the Switch.
5 months ago
Anonymous
It isn't bait when even morons like you are calling it the only "true" 3D Zelda for Switch.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You can't even pick up on the obvious sarcasm in that comment, no one should take what you consider to be bait or not seriously.
5 months ago
Anonymous
SSHD sold more on the Switch than original SS sold on the Wii
BotW for all the faults was a huge leap from SS and TP, the formula had potential it just needed more content since the main critique of BotW is that it was empty as frick.
TotK on the other had is 90% the same game but not catering to Roblox kiddies with the Gmod gimmick.
It's literally like RE3R and how many people were dissapointed with that game for using tons of assets from RE2R and being insanely short, cutting tons of streets and areas from the OG.
But at least RE3R has the excuse of being rushed in a single year and a half, the 6 year gap betwen the Zelda games being even more expectations.
>It's literally like RE3R and how many people were dissapointed with that game for using tons of assets from RE2R and being insanely short, cutting tons of streets and areas from the OG.
So then it's NOT literally like that, since TotK does absolutely none of those things? Did you even play the fricking game? The main quest is about twice is long, no areas were cut and there's a shitload of new assets and content.
5 months ago
Anonymous
The ratio if new content to reused content in TOTK is at best 1 to 4, it's like they made 1 temple + 30 shrines per year.
In before you tell me the Gmod and physics took 3+ years to get right.
Both TotK and BotW use Havok middleware for all their physics and making a Gmod clone isn't hard, lots of indie games do it, even phone shitty ones.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Cool, so you didn't play the game at all since most of TotK's content isn't remotely available in BotW.
5 months ago
Anonymous
~70% of BOTW and TOTK's content is technically Korok seeds.
But even if we don't count those, the game has the exact same formula if extremely small Shrines and enemy camps on the exact same map with mostly the same enemies/minobosses and anything new added is extemely minor.
Depths is an inverted heightmap with the same reused enemies from BOTW and a single new frog miniboss.
Sky Islands are 10% of the total map and only contain one new boss that gets reused at least 5-6 times. Also most Sky Islands have the same green crystal traversal puzzle.
It's really the ubisoft formula of spreading the content as thin as possible on a huge, making you do and redo the same 6-7 activities 100 times.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Formula =/= content, and the formula isn't even the same because the core mechanics around puzzle solving are fundamentally different. The rest of your dogshit post is just you coming up with mental gymnastics in response to points I didn't even make which really just reads as a concession more than anything.
Now stop replying to me and have a nice day already.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Have fun when the next game is the same map and the same bokoblins again for a third time LMAO
This is what you bootlickers deserve.
5 months ago
Anonymous
So not only did you not play TotK, you're so fricking moronic you didn't even read or comprehend the article linked in the OP. Get out of here you homosexual.
I guess the problem is that the "content" doesn't feel satisfying, and is more akin to filler. It's hard for me to justify 900+ pieces of korok turds as fun content. Their only justification is that "oh the player needs inventory space, so it should be easy to find upgrades". I disagree witht hat notion. Inventory upgrades should be stupidly hard to find, and they should be challenging ontop of it.
The Koroks are fun little distractions that take maybe 5 seconds of your time and were given more variety in TotK, quit being a b***h.
5 months ago
Anonymous
A puzzle that's not challenging is not fun, especially when it's taped to dialogue boxes and cutscenes.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>cutscenes >Koroks
Holy frick ACgay, is it too much to ask you to use a trip so I can filter you?
5 months ago
Anonymous
>just do this 1000000+ times, stop complaining chud!
5 months ago
Anonymous
How are you STILL obsessing over Zelda this much 7 years in? It's pathetic.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You only need to get like 50-60 koroks to get a good amount of inventory space. They put in so many to make sure you can find them reliably wherever you go. The devs make fun of people like you by giving you a literal piece of shit as your reward for finding them all. Take the hint. Not replying to you anymore Doug, frick you
5 months ago
Anonymous
I don't care about finding them all, but such a lackluster reward makes it so I don't want to explore.
5 months ago
Your Anal Nightmare
That's the best part of the game, homosexual.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Yiu are b***hing about people not liking boring ass filler
5 months ago
Anonymous
so dont do it
5 months ago
Anonymous
The fact that the original poster triggered some kind of hostile response in you at all is proof I am likely stronger, faster and smarter than you. Under the right circumstances I would cave your head in for something as void and meaningless as a mcchicken, or maybe a korok seed. I liked TOTK btw.
lol I thought Hyrule Castle in BotW was like the Forest Temple in OoT and the previous 4 beast dungeons were just smaller ones like Deku Tree, Dodongo Cavern, Jabu's belly, etc. because they were so small and I beat them in 15~ minutes. I remember thinking there were going to be more actually good dungeons like HC ahead of me but the fricking game just ended.
>I thought Hyrule Castle in BotW was like the Forest Temple in OoT
I see people always sucking on BOTW Hyrule Castle's nuts but I don't get the hype. There's no progression locks (small keys) so it doesn't feel at all like OOT's Forest Temple to me. You can walk in a straight line from start to Ganon without any detours and all of the detours just reward you with more common breakable weapons.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Not him but I had a similar experience, if they wanted to make zelda the actual exploration game then hyrule castle is what they should have focused on. Getting to ganon is a very easy task but exploring the rest of it can take some time, if only they put that amount of effort into the "main" "dungeons" instead of just that.
Totk's "dungeons" are at least significantly better than botw's, they aren't just 3 shrines stapled together and then you fight phantom ganon 5 times
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Totk's "dungeons" are at least significantly better than botw's, they aren't just 3 shrines stapled together and then you fight phantom ganon 5 times
I thought that they were actually pretty terrible and some of them were worse than the Divine Beasts. The only one I """liked""" was the Fire/Minecart one. Really didn't care for the electric/water/ice ones and the 'Shadow Temple' was literally 4 distinct mini-shrines
5 months ago
Anonymous
I've only done fire and wind so maybe the others are a lot shittier. Wind was comically easy but so far both of them at least seemed much more like proper zelda dungeons, even if much easier and much shorter.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Zelda dungeons are always comically easy. A lot of people say the Water Temple is bad, but it was my first one and I thought it was pretty kino.
botw is bereft of anything meaningful
totk at least tries to fix this issue, and somewhat succeeds, but its best parts are still exploring hyrule castle and now the underworld
it's all recycled junk. it's like how elden ring recycled everything twice, except everything is recycled 50 times. in fact. botw's success is probably the reason fromsoft felt it was ok to recycle so much shit in elden ring. in other words, botw fans have made video games worse. you deserve nothing but scorn.
You didn't read OP right. The "world" of BotW and TotK won't be used again. OoT formula is old, tired, dated, archaic, and would never work in the modern gaming landscape anymore. People were tired and drained from the OOT Zelda formula even back then, and going back to it again would only be taking the series in the wrong direction.
The next game will be BotW/TotK again in feel and gameplay, but expanded and tweaked. It just won't be in the same world. It will probably be somewhere else in the "Zelda timeline", but it's going be BotW/TotK in everything that matters.
People were not tired of Ocarinas formula, people don't realize the later games' issues were not the formula, it was literally everything else. There's a reason everyone still loves ocarina and plays it.
>People were not tired of Ocarinas formula, people don't realize the later games' issues were not the formula, it was literally everything else. There's a reason everyone still loves ocarina and plays it.
Ocarina Of Time is a masterpiece. Nothing wrong with OoT. The problem is all the games which came after, which also wanted to be OoT. Sales were dwindling for a reason. Even Nintendo knew it stale as frick by Twilight Princess. Which is why they spent a decade trying to freshen up the formula with ALBW and Skyward Sword before doing a complete back-to-basics reboot to course-correct the series.
The best solution is clearly a hybrid of both formulas.
BoTW formula offers some of the best traversal-based exploration in gaming - but the combat is flat-out bad, the the lore, immersion & environmental storytelling complete dogshit, the rewards and reward incentives are ass, the game balance and upgrading systems a complete mess, so on and so forth. You complain about the old formula, but don't realize that even the normiest of normies are tired of the stale map-markered ubisoft fomula teeming with recycled assets and towers.
Elden Ring's success is proof that even the most ADHD-ridden of zoomers and normies can find consistent engagement in long, sprawling dungeons, and BG3's success is proof that they crave worlds with replay value, unique gameplay scenarios, meaningful side quests and rich lore, worldbuilding and characters.
If Nintendo wants the next Zelda to be a massive success, it NEEDs to do all of this. ToTK might have made money but it was a disaster as far as genuine quality goes. There's a good chance that all of the newfound normies and zoomers they earned from BoTW will not return if the next game is more of the same barren, recycled, menu-scrolling, mat-induced ToTK sandbox bullshit.
They don't need to do any of that, they can make BotW with a new map and put in a different gimmick and sell just as much. Traditional Zelda is not popular.
Did you even read my fricking post? ToTK made bank, but that was because people had hopes and promises in BotW's sequel. TotK failed in this regard, with many now regarding it as trash or a massive disappointment - now that its honeymoon phase is over. So it's likely the next one will under-perform if it's more of the same.
The old Zelda formula was definitely running stale but normies are completely fed up of ubisoft sandbox bullshit. So the best thing to do is combine the best of both worlds for a slightly unique experience.
Dev time is limited, and a hybrid would require a significantly reduced map. The size of the map is the culprit. During playtesting BotW was designed around older principles, which is to say there were only a few major points of interest on the map (which represented where major dungeons would be). Players rushed these while ignoring 90% of the content in between.
In order to fix this, they started adding all the various micro content (shrines, weapons to collect, Koroks) and this changed the way players ran through the game. They now explored more "organically" and in line with the devs vision. But the unmentioned cost of this is that dev time had to go into all those various shrines and not in the large dungeons that have traditional been one of the series core gameplay pillars. It's impossible to have both, and sacrifices will need to be made somewhere.
That's bizarre. I expected more from Nintendo's devs.
A game doesn't need to have micro-content scattered every 25 meters. Not every area you cross needs to be useful. The idea of going from point of interest to point of interest isn't necessarily a bad thing, in fact, it's in my opinion a much better idea than the one offered by BOTW/TOTK, where you keep stumbling across "micro-content" instead of really feeling like you're making long journeys with a clear destination.
But who knows... the guys have sold almost 50 million copies with their formula, maybe they're right and gamers want to eat shit.
Eh, I think BOTW/TOTK combat is way better than any of it's predecessors. I love the freedom they give you with it. I just wish they made it so you didn't constantly pause the combat. Limiting heals would've also helped.
Read my comment moron. I don't like how cycling weapons constantly pauses the fight either. But BOTW/TOTK definitely has the funnest combat out of all the 3d Zeldas.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You're doing that for 90% of the fricking combat maybe read your own post before you click that post button
5 months ago
Anonymous
You have got to be a fricking moron if you seriously think any other 3d Zelda has better combat.
The only thing I'd be okay with getting from the older games are MAYBE longer dungeons that are easier to get lost in, that's it. TotK has basically everything I've ever wanted from the series personally.
>OOT formula
People say this as either a criticism or praise and I don't get it.
OOT is just 3D ALTTP (do 3 dungeons => get master sword => get access to a dark/alternative world with more dungeons).
MM doesn't follow this at all
WW follows the first half of the OOT/ALTTP formula (3 dungeons => Master Sword) but that's it.
TP follows the OOT/ALTTP formula, only instead of a dark world it's new parts of Hyrule
SS doesn't follow it at all
The ALTTP formula is great, I wish we could get a 3D Zelda with 11 dungeons and a mid-game difficulty spike coupled with a power level increase. But we'll never get that since nuZelda is so stunning and brave that they decided that dungeons and dungeon items were so outdated and got rid of them
>"Linear 3D adventure where the objective is to complete dungeons using items found in them, then beat the final boss"
Obviously OoT is the first 3D zelda game, but I find it so strange people "blame" OoT for things the franchise had been doing since ALttP and LA, if not sooner.
ALttP is not linear. You can do a large chunk of the game out of order. It's more linear than LoZ, but LoZ was basically free roam.
The OoT formula is explicitly about the linearity and lack of deviation. You might as well be watching a movie with QTEs for all it matters. You can get heart pieces "out of order" and some other small collectibles, but you're railroaded into playing the game the same way every time you replay it. OoT still had some things you could do out of order, but as the series progressed, your freedom of choice was severely diminished until it was effectively vestigial by the time of Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword. I hate the OoT formula for the same reason I hate Sony movie games, since I want the freedom to play how I want to, not the freedom to fail.
Link's Awakening was very linear. I'd argue that it was even more linear than OoT.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I'm also not a fan of Link's Awakening. Pretty much the only Zeldas I really like are LoZ, AoL, ALttP, the Oracles, BotW, and TotK.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>loz, alttp, oracles
congrats anon that's """""""the oot formula"""""""", i.e. a fricking zelda game
5 months ago
Anonymous
That's not the OoT formula you disingenuous bastard. The OoT formula is explicitly about following linear dungeon formulas with items that have little to no use outside of their requisite dungeon.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>The OoT formula is explicitly about following linear dungeon formulas with items that have little to no use outside of their requisite dungeon.
i like how you moronic Black folk can't even keep your own shitpost terms straight
5 months ago
Anonymous
>The OoT formula is explicitly about following linear dungeon formulas with items that have little to no use outside of their requisite dungeon.
You're the one being disingenuous you pretentious homosexual maybe actually play OoT and you'll see that you use previous weapons throughout the dungeons until you get said item of the dungeon to finish it proper.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>The OoT formula is explicitly about following linear dungeon formulas
but oot has one of the least linear sequences of dungeons in the franchise?
There are too many people talking about the OoT formula who haven't actually experienced the OoT formula firsthand. I blame Zelda's popularity on Youtube, and literal children who feel informed enough by Youtubers to comment.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I blame BotW/Tiktok and the influx of tendie zoomers who have only played that and nothing else
5 months ago
Anonymous
There's no such thing as the "oot formula", oot is alttp in 3d, and alttp is a fleshed out zelda 1.
5 months ago
Anonymous
This. There is only "the Zelda formula" and "the BotW firmula".
5 months ago
Anonymous
>The OoT formula is explicitly about following linear dungeon formulas
but oot has one of the least linear sequences of dungeons in the franchise?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Not really. Compared to the following 3D games? Sure, but it's way more linear than ALttP or LoZ.
>The OoT formula is explicitly about following linear dungeon formulas with items that have little to no use outside of their requisite dungeon.
i like how you moronic Black folk can't even keep your own shitpost terms straight
>The OoT formula is explicitly about following linear dungeon formulas with items that have little to no use outside of their requisite dungeon.
You're the one being disingenuous you pretentious homosexual maybe actually play OoT and you'll see that you use previous weapons throughout the dungeons until you get said item of the dungeon to finish it proper.
You've come up with a moronic definition of what the Ocarina formula is and are sticking to it. It's not a shitpost term, it's a meaningful distinction to point out why the LoZ franchise was so stagnant and shitty for about 15 years.
Twilight Princess is the purest distillation of the OoT formula. Everything people hate about OoT is distilled into pure sludge with TP. A game having dungeons with items is not the OoT formula. What IS part of the OoT formula is the weapons having very limited use cases outside of their respective dungeons, the bosses being exclusively weak to the weapon you found in said dungeon, and the dungeons having a rigid completion order.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>and the dungeons having a rigid completion order.
sooo the "oot formula" doesn't apply to oot
or majora's mask
glad we proved this this moronic notion was always made up bullshit by zoomers who only know ubishit
5 months ago
Anonymous
The OoT formula does apply to it, but it gets more and more concentrated as Nintendo kept trying to re-capture that lightning in the bottle. OoT and MM, instead of having rigid dungeon completion order, have item checkgates that effectively enforce a playing order. You don't have to beat the boss right away, but the choice to back out of the dungeon halfway through and go do something else is meaningless. OoT opens up in its latter half, to its credit, but everything through the Forest Temple is played the same every time. It's like an inversed Mega Man game where the first 4 stage are Wily's Castle and THEN you get to choose what levels to tackle after that.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>It's like an inversed Mega Man game where the first 4 stage are Wily's Castle and THEN you get to choose what levels to tackle after that.
This formula started with LttP. You have considerable freedom in dungeon order in the dark world.
5 months ago
Anonymous
that's just alttp
which is, again, the formula for a zelda game, because that's what they are
loz is a zelda game
alttp is an attempt at loz but more
oot is alttp but more (and 3d)
and every other game sans botw/totk is different stuff in 3d
the only game that isn't "the oot formula" is 2
and I guess link's crossbow training if you want to count that, even the countless handheld games, some of which are older than oot, follow this formula
5 months ago
Anonymous
>It's like an inversed Mega Man game where the first 4 stage are Wily's Castle and THEN you get to choose what levels to tackle after that.
This formula started with LttP. You have considerable freedom in dungeon order in the dark world.
A Link to the Past gives you considerably more freedom in the early game than does OoT. It is a fair bit more linear than LoZ, but it's also a fair bit more open than OoT. You could say there's a through-line where OoT is inbetween ALttP and TP, but Nintedo made the 3D Zelda games so terribly bland explicitly BECAUSE they were trying to recreate the hype around Ocarina of Time. They weren't trying to emulate A Link to the Past, they were trying to emulate Ocarina of Time, and that's precisely how Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword ended up so dogshit.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>A Link to the Past gives you considerably more freedom in the early game than does OoT.
No it doesn't. You need the boots from the first dungeon to get the book to open the second dungeon. You then need the gloves from the second dungeon to reach the third. Play games before you speak authoritatively on them.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You get the pegasus shoes from sahasrahla after beating the eastern palace specifically
5 months ago
Anonymous
Yes, are you just piggybacking off my point?
5 months ago
Anonymous
I am not disagreeing. But my autism did demand that clarification
5 months ago
Anonymous
Look at all that fricking word salad pretending you know what the frick you're even talking about. TP doesn't even follow OoT's formula, the over world is segregated into unlockable parts, again how about playing these games instead of larping like you have? You look like a fricking idiot.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You sound like the biggest pretentious homosexual on this board
>but I find it so strange people "blame" OoT for things the franchise had been doing since ALttP and LA, if not sooner.
because people shitposting in botw gays don't care about reality, they only want to shitpost
ever since totk came out and fixed some of botw's giant glaring flaws they've even gotten even more moronic by saying that anything different from botw, at all, is bad
I'd feel bad for them if I didn't think it was all a bit at this point.
He just hates those games because he cant' speedrun them and skip the whole game by ignoring dungeons. The presence of an intended progression is something most detestable to him.
Note how you have to complete half a temple in order to get the item you need in order to take alternate progression routes.
Which basically means you can't really call them alternate progression routes because you're just wasting time exiting a half-completed temple to go somewhere else. Just finish the fricking temple.
>Note how you have to complete half a temple in order to get the item you need in order to take alternate progression routes.
Maybe I'm blind, but I can't see that on the map. Which one are you talking about?.
Either way, I can tell you that you can do Forest, Fire and Water in any order, and you can do Spirit before Fire (but not Forest or Water), and Spirit and Shadow are interchangeable. Ice Caverns can be done whenever, the Well is only gated by Forest Temple, and Gerudo training grounds needs the Bow (Forest) and 1 other dungeon item to complete.
Once you put those together you get an incredibly flexible order. Child dungeons are linear, much like aLttP's first 3 dungeons. While not the last non-linear game (see MM and WW) it was the last one to really offer you any kind of freedom until ALBW was released.
And that's the issue people having with saying the OoT formula (it's not OoT's formula btw, it's either aLttP, or more generally LoZ) was stale. They stopped using it properly and games like TP and SS are not examples of the formula.
Nobody likes BOTW’s gameplay moron. Instead of having 5-10 large linear dungeons each filled with a variety of interlocking puzzles, they created a wide spread of small-scale puzzles spread throughout the map. This isn’t going to be the permanent formula for the franchise.
>Meet Zelda, collect three special items, get Master Sword, rescue Sages from an "alternate world," fight Ganon, win game >this derivative formula is considered miles better than anything ToTK/BOTW came up with
Instead of coming up with something new and original, they just recycled the exact same plot from the last game. How is this considered brilliant?
>Instead of coming up with something new and original, they just recycled the exact same plot from the last game. How is this considered brilliant?
i thought you were trying to defend totk here again
totk copies botw more than any other game previous
>Collect minor relics of power >Seemingly large confrontation -> Link gets major power up >Collect bigger relics of power >Final confrontation
That’s just the progression of most Zelda games anon, maybe the series isn’t for you.
>That’s just the progression of most Zelda games anon, maybe the series isn’t for you.
sorry progression systems were problematic
we had to remove them to make the game more accessible
but yes all the people who cry over zelda, to no one's surprise, do not like zelda
5 months ago
Anonymous
If anything removing the previous progression made it less accessible. See
If you wear the default clothing you will very quickly get one shot by almost every mob enemy as the game goes on, frick off with the skill issue shit
, for an example.
And yet people overall wanted it more by such a massive margin that these two games have nearly sold more than the entire rest of the series.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Game changes what it fundamentally is to "capture a wider audience" >Sells more
yep
Yeah. That progression started with LttP. Zelda doesn't have to stick with that formula forever. BotW/TotK were a refreshing new experience and while i don't want them to make BotW 3, 4, 5...I also don't want to go back to the OoT to SS formula that 3D Zelda was doing for so long prior to BotW.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Zelda NEVER had gated item progression, and never forced you to beat dungeons >the evil OOT and its rehashes started that
What did anon mean by this?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Of course all the games had item progression, even Zelda 1 and 2. However LttP was the first to do
-3 Dungeons to collect 3 Mcguffins.
-Get Master Sword/major story event.
- 3 to 7 more dungeons to collect other Mcguffins to access Ganon.
At least Majora's Mask deviated from that but LttP, OOT, WW, TP, and SS all used that. We don't need OOT 5.0 for the next 3D installment anymore than we need BotW 3.0.
Besides new tools that are only good for the dungeon they are found in, it was all the same Bow, Boomerang, Hookshot, etc with mild variations.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Besides new tools that are only good for the dungeon they are found in
I don't understand why nintendo could have just avoided that issue
5 months ago
Anonymous
i'd think (slightly) better of botwgays if they accurately called it lttp instead of oot formula
but they'll never do that, even when the games themselves move on like totk did
5 months ago
Anonymous
they should say frick it and make a zelda game similar to dark souls 1, but you use items to get to new areas instead of keys. so oot 5.0
5 months ago
Anonymous
i wouldn't mind a zelda game like dark souls as long as they retained link's mobility, don't like feeling like im rollin with bricks on my back
5 months ago
Anonymous
good mobility would be nice, fast and fluid combat would be amazing actually. where you can hookshot up on a boss for a few swings, maybe do aerial combos to extent your time in the air, but have to still dodge the boss trying to swipe you down. really i just want a focus on combat and dungeon diving along with exploration. going all in the exploration is what kinda ruins totk/botw for me. i never want to replay either of them again, once you're done exploring then there is nothing left. the combat sucks and there's too much dead space in the level design. kind of an issue with all open worlds, elden ring is the same to me.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Zelda has a great world for it too. Imagine Volvagia as a Souls boss.
5 months ago
Anonymous
yeah there's some real potential for cool fights even if they want to rehash older ones. i hope that the switch 2 hardware allows them to improve the combat for the next game..
?? You get the sidequest after completing the first dungeon. Do you have any actual complaints you can express without webms?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, and they never stop. No matter what point in the game you're at, the game vomits glorified tutorials in your face. No challenge, no skill required, just cinematics and cutscenes showing you things that you should already know how to do. it reminds me of my playthrough of BOTW.
>shrines and koroks that NEVER challenged me, and never even scaled to my challenge level, regardless of which divine beasts I beat >sidequests that were braindead fetch quests and often gave me crap I didn't need, especially if I held off on doing them
5 months ago
Anonymous
I’m sorry that happened to you, anon. Would you like a tissue?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Nah, I'm fine. It helps me when I play far better open world games. Ones that don't fall into the trappings of BOTW and TOTK.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Such as?
5 months ago
Anonymous
5 months ago
Anonymous
>2d >open world
kek
5 months ago
Anonymous
If I had said Minecraft (which I also enjoy) you'd call it bad too, likely for another shallow reason.
5 months ago
Anonymous
no, minecraft is good and terraria is godlike its just funny to call terraria an open world game
5 months ago
Anonymous
Terraria isn't open world. The devs also disabled a lot of the freedom in choosing your path through the game. Not saying it's a bad thing since I fricking hate the Reaver homosexuals who force us into Hardmode instead of playing the damn game, but there's very much a progression system in Terraria. It's the best example I can point to when I'm telling people why choices matter.
5 months ago
Anonymous
no, minecraft is good and terraria is godlike its just funny to call terraria an open world game
It's open world in the ways that matter. You can explore the whole map and pretty much get anywhere that you want, if you're willing to invest the time and effort into it. You can even sequence break into the dungeon and lihzard temple if you want. The only thing is that you still have to follow a certain progression if you want to affect the world in certain ways. Like you can get the loot from the dungeon if you know what you're doing, but if you don't kill Skeletron first, you have to deal with the dungeon guardians. Things like that matter to me in an open world game. No forced mandatory tutorials, no cinematics constantly shoved in the player's face, I'm not even asked to babysit NPCs. You can play the whole game without even meeting an npc for the most part, and the only one you might need is the guide for WOF spawning, and besides that you can just lock him up in an outhouse underground.
It's got freedom in the ways that matter.
Anon, it’s just dialogue and a loading screen… I think you’re losing touch with reality here.
Care to explain why 90% of the webm is spent on a loading screen? What in the hell do you need that justifies such a long time?
5 months ago
Anonymous
The switch is the weakest console on the market and every single game since botw in 2017 has suffered because of it
5 months ago
Anonymous
Don't reply to ACgay, he's a delusional obsessed moron
5 months ago
Anonymous
That's why I'm enjoying the recent backlash TOTK is receiving. I've even found threads on Reddit where a good portion (more than 50%) of the redditors are harshly criticizing the game, and as far as I know, redditors are usually much more complacent about the products they consume.
I don't want Nintendo to go back to the old formula, though, I just want them to learn how to make a decent open world that isn't a big playground for morons.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You should go back and stay there.
5 months ago
Anonymous
In fact, it's a very appropriate place for you. There you can downvote people who criticize the products you've consumed. You'll like the place.
The most intriguing is that this is considered a sidequest in the first place.
I get the impression it was added later on in development because nobody figured out the Korok puzzles using the exact mechanic. So they disabled the mini-stable and made you have to do a Korok puzzle to enable it.
And the best part is that a shitload of players still never realized that there were Korok puzzles exactly like it.
This leads to you finding his horse, causing the mini stable to show up. The “side quests” are generally smaller than the “side adventures”. The game distinguishes between the two. Anything else?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Anon, the "quest" consists of taking a board, lifting it up and placing it on the roof of the stable, a 3-second procedure whose solution is self-evident. Do you understand why this shouldn't be called a quest?
When you open a door in DOOM, do you think you're completing a quest?
5 months ago
Anonymous
The “SIDE quest” here has a narrative. The mans stable is broken. You help fix it. He notices his horse is gone. You help find it, return it to him. He gracefully lets you keep the horse and opens up the stable for you. It’s a comfy quest thats designed for players for all skill ceilings, in the case that a player may not even have a horse yet and has trouble catching them. (This horse in particular is named “spot” so anyone can distinguish it)
Side quests in video games consist of deivering fricking groceries to NPCs. Get out of here with your elementary school semantics.
Opening a door contributes to progression, it enhances your quest. Doors are literally used to emhance narrative in games such as resident evil. Do you even THINK about the games you play? Do you PLAY video games? Or are you only able to complain on imageboards about your incomprehension of general design concepts? I would consider suicide in your circumstance.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>this sidequest needs 50 hours of cutscenes so you can put a plank on a ceiling
Full on movieshit.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Anon, it’s just dialogue and a loading screen… I think you’re losing touch with reality here.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>I think you’re losing touch with reality here.
You're replying to ACgay, he lost touch with reality years ago.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Nintendo is definitely stuck in the mid 2000s when it comes to those "cutscense" where the camera lingers on what you just did. but you're exaggerating the issues. it's an early quest too.
5 months ago
Anonymous
This is ontop of the entire tutorial, which started the game with a walk-and-talk section, followed by an unskippable cutscene, and then that's followed by a very strict and frankly boring tutorial. The game does not start off on its best foot.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>it's an early quest too.
There's no such thing as "early anything" in TOTK. You can be playing for 150 hours, and enter a shrine that is a stealth tutorial, for example. This is the biggest problem with the game, in my opinion. The world should be built in such a way that some places are made for you to explore later in the game, even if they are accessible if the player really wants to visit them.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You're wrong, though. Those are considered two different quests, one is to bring the horse, the other is to repair the stable.
And there's a side-quest in the game which is literally opening a door, lol.
I died more in TotK/BotW than I did in every other Zelda game combined, and that's including the first 3 which made up 99% of my non-TotK/BotW death count. Never died once playing TP or SS.
The only contrarians here are literal ape-level IQ morons like yourself who didn't see the series taking BotW's direction long before BotW was even announced.
The funny thing is that it really has to be the same map. BotW's map is literally just the map of every other map combined into one. You can basically overlay every other map on top of it because they've always used the same world, just different parts of it at different times.
No shit, did anyone seriously think otherwise? They've said from the beginning that TotK was an attempt to perfect what BotW did in the same world so obviously they're not going to do the same thing twice. Literally every Zelda game is an experiment in some way.
Honestly the game was a massive disappointment on almost all levels, and it's the reality is that many are unwilling to face or admit it due to stupid peer pressure.
When it came to other big releases BotW and Elden Ring, people were talking feverishly about those games for MONTHS, even YEARS after their initial release. But with TotK, the hype and discussion dropped off massively after just 2-3 months outside of people posting their meme contraptions and korok torturing devices, the vast majority of players weren't discussing the game in an in-depth manner - like sharing tips & strats, their builds, their most memorable experiences in the game, so on and so forth. Especially when 2 fans + steering stick hover scooter became the go-to device for 95% of the game.
Meanwhile, most of the discussion generated by hardcore fans was were just complaints about the terrible incoherent story (told through flashbacks again) and how it completely messed up the previously established timeline as well as the barebones combat that had almost zero changes since the first game, not even a single new weapon class with new attack animations.
It was by no means a bad game, but considering the context of a 6 year wait, it's a nothingburger. It's a testament to modern-Nintendo quantity over quality mindset.
>Honestly the game was a massive disappointment on almost all levels, and it's the reality is that many are unwilling to face or admit it due to stupid peer pressure.
Nope. TotK is one of the best video games ever made. Name a better action adventure game this year. You cannot.
>not even a single new weapon class with new attack animations.
This bullshit here is why my hype died; no new weapons, no hammers except for the bullshit glue-on gimmick and you can't even use a cool elemental hammer because the endgame demands you use silver horns to have a chance to take on Silver Lynels.
This sums it up.
Tears is great. It's fun. The new systems are neat. But that's it. The wait from Breath to Tears was longer than SS to Breath. And we didn't get a massively new map. We didn't get a new engine or many new assets. We got a lot of cut and pasted content, identical progression and presentation, and most of what's new has little substance.
This game took Nintendo at LEAST 5 years to make if you use E3 2019 as the starting point (which is being generous).
It doesn't feel like they have much to show for it except for Ultrahand and Recall. The sky is empty (despite being the focus of marketing) and the Depths may as well not exist.
>The wait from Breath to Tears was longer than SS to Breath. And we didn't get a massively new map.
Nobody is going to be thinking about this 5 years from now. "Waaaah I had to wait this long" has nothing to do with the quality of a game, it's a meaningless complaint.
people should. botw was praised despite lacking many features expected as Zelda staples. after 6 years, hype exploded and botw became the game of the decade. why wouldn't people consider the hype factor that was also there for totk? Nintendo clearly did since they've been riding on nostalgia and hype since the early 2010s
No, they shouldn't. If you factor """hype""" into your judgment of any game at all then you have the mind of a fricking fifteen year old and are part of the problem.
Look at the original DotA. It took all its models and animations from Warcraft 3 even though the skills, and how you use them, are functionally entirely different.
It got a pity award that was far more deserved by either RE4 or Lies of P, those being far more action-adventure than Totk, a game that's mostly casual exploration and the mediocre button mashing combat.
I hope they get rid of the fricking ubishit towers and make caves more interesting.
Also nerf traveling speed really badly, BOTW had it almost perfect.
>every future Zelda will have ugly decayed weapons to justify the fusion mechanic >every future Zelda will have le ancient mysterious race with advanced technology for towers, shrines and gadgets >every future Zelda will have the story told through collectable flashbacks
I'm an OG fan and love BotW/TotK. If what you're saying is true then SS would have universal claim since it's a hallway simulator like the games you mentioned.
Holy frick I wont be able to take another one of those. Just make weapons and armors more interesting even if it means having less of them.
>inb4 people defending le ebin loot routes for weapon respawn or that the majority of the weapons you use are rusty shit + some random horn til this day
They should not have even made ToTK
The moment people realized it was the same world killed a ton of the hype a new Zelda game usually has
I'm sure Nintendo realized this
I’ll hopefully be off this site by then but I can’t wait until the next Zelda comes out and is relentlessly shat on here even if they adapt the oot formula again
>When asked about Ultrahand's return in future titles, they insisted that Tears is Ultrahand, and they want to "create something new" when approaching new titles, so it won't be seeing a return. >A sequel won't be coming to TotK. They believe they've exhausted "the possibilities of what we could put into that [BOTW's] world." Also a reaffirmation that DLC won't be coming either. >Regarding the timeline, they recognize that fans enjoy making theories and discussions. When weaving that into their games however, it's something they consider "to an extent", but not to the point where the development process may be restricted or constrained.
they must really be creatively bankrupt if it took them 5 years to add a grabby hands, a smattering of sky islands, and a underworld
The new Zelda formula has only been around for 2 games and I'm already sick of it
im not, all the 3d zeldas before it were too derivative of a link to the past (oot was practically a remake of alttp) with majora being the most creative they got with it without:
being a rushjob with tons of cut content like ww
being a remake of oot like tp
being a wagglefest like ss that feels like they ran out of money 2/3rds through with how much recycled content there is
To be honest Ulttahand is two generations old since Gary's Mod. I want something like magic rope to take advantage of physics via pulley systems. Would also allow the Hookshot to come back as it uses rope physics.
Three. The "give the player all the special abilities at the start and let him choose his way through the world" formula started with A Link Between Worlds.
3 games was enough tbh, what more could they do with it? Just go back to a dungeon focused game instead of mini dungeons that feel like some kind of tech demo
Why not?
They could change the position of the 1000 Koroks again, invent some new environment, I don't know, a water environment, copy and paste it into every body of water in the game, and release the same game again, but now with a third Hyrule creation myth, a third ancient race of founders, a third Zelda now trapped in a singularity, a third Master World, etc.
I want that to be an inbetween game where Link and Tetra explore more of the sea and find a bunch of new islands and some lands with scattered societies who eventually come together and lay the foundation for new Hyrule. Fishing, spelunking, naval battles, underwater movement, you name it. Hell, I'm mad Wind Waker had the iron boots and a setting that took place in the sea but no underwater shenanigans with the iron boots or in the boat, your boots become an entire diving suit.
Phantom Hourglass
We know that, genius. He's talking another game after PH but before ST. Plenty of time to squeeze in an adventure or two.
I hope they progress the series by incorporating classic Zelda features in to the open world. basically a oot/tp style game with dark souls level design in a larger scale.
There was no reason the ghosts had to reappear to restore Zelda. His arm had the ability to absorb sage stone power as was shown 5 fricking times in the story and Ganondorf had a shit load of it.
Instead they left her the story with her pretending a bunch of useless turds who needed ghosts to save her can help her moving forward.
>look, the games were totally callbacks to Zelda 1!
Interesting. How do you skip all the dungeons and rush right to ganon? And where's the mandatory, unskippable tutorial?
The mandatory tutorial area is necessary for the scope of the game. You can still breeze past it, but the game needed some way to introduce all of its mechanics early on rather than just tossing you out into the world. That's just a modern reality of developing games. You can't just throw people in the lake and say "sink or swim".
See: the dev commentaries in Half-Life 2 for further reading.
>>You can't just throw people in the lake and say "sink or swim".
IDK man the DS1 'tutorial' is fricking ass and makes the game way worse because it doesn't tell you how shit actually works meanwhile the Sekiro tutorial is nice and fast and teaches you the basics of the game
5 months ago
Anonymous
>DS1 'tutorial' is fricking ass and makes the game way worse because it doesn't tell you how shit actually works
It filters the casuals who want everything spoonfed to them. If anything the game should've punished them even more.
I mean, you COULD let them sink or swim, but then people will complain and your game will lose popularity. There is such a thing as over-tutorializing (see: M&L Dream Team), but games ought to have short tutorial sections to teach you the ropes.
Rabi-Ribi is so perfect because you can skip a lot of the tutorial if you know mechanics you learn way later in the game. If you're replaying it, you'll know how to wall jump your way out of the tutorial and get into the real game. If only more games could copy that.
>The Legend of Zelda 2
It was just called Zelda 2: The Adventure of Link.
I think it's literally the only one that doesn't have "The Legend of Zelda" as part of the title.
Translation: Don't worry people, we're not gonna use the same overworld a third time, expect the next open air game in 6 years.
The fact that they have to clarify this is baffling.
I have nothing to do with Zelink. I just like pointing out they never liked Zelda.
https://arch.b4k.co/v/search/image/XfCBypbeAz2oOiZ0L7gyAw/
oh great a schizo is here
One person telling people they've been gatekept because they have also has nothing to do with schizophrenia when the thing is true of multiple people as you can tell by their "arguments".
I don't understand why this board is still having a meltdown over this game, fricking spawned a handful of new schizos to shit up the board.
I just don't feel strongly about the game at all I thought it was just ok. Zelda was always a average to mediocre series
Jesus... Can't you frogposters just... Shut. The frick. Up. For once...? It's like every time you click that post button, it's almost the most mundane and idiotic shit in the thread.
true, I also think its cringe when people talk about this games lore as if Nintendo was cooking some Tolkien shit
like they so clearly dont give a frickt about story when its ''just kill green man''
That's always a very disingenuous argument. Everyone knows Zelda's setting is very fluid.
But it's also incorrect to assert that Nintendo never added nods to previous zelda games or made little connections. Spectacle Rock appears in so many games because Nintendo wanted to, not because there was some obligation.
It also ignores the potential value in the story of the individual games -- ignoring the larger context of the franchise. People like OoT's coming of age tale, people like Midna's story in TP even when those facets of the games don't tie into some tolkien-esque epic fantasy story.
>That's always a very disingenuous argument. Everyone knows Zelda's setting is very fluid.
yes, because it usually changes
with little exception each game has a drastically different setting, loz/loz2 is one of the few times where it's the same setting, and even ones where it's close like oot/mm and ww/the ds games are vastly different
botw>totk is the game taking place ??? time later except all of the guardian stuff disappeared and outside of that room at the school the first game is barely ever mentioned, since you have to do all the stuff about new ganondorf instead of the calamity
Similar things always appeared because it was always different parts of the same map across time. BotW's map is just all of Hyrule combined. There literally is nowhere else to go but not Hyrule in this formula if they aren't going to use the same map anymore because it is all of the existing maps save MM and LA.
I honestly feel like we're headed towards the same state as were in After Skyward Sword and A Link Between Worlds came out.
BotW game Zelda a another time to shine in the public consciousness, but I feel like now it's going to wane again.
>to shine in the public consciousness
Who gives a shit about that? The thing that matters is whether the games are good not whether it sells x million or y million
>but public interest in Zelda will fade again
You're not articulating why this matters. I don't own Nintendo stock, sales figures for the next Zelda game don't affect me at all
it matters if you want to talk about zelda on Ganker.
I should have added more context to my initial post. I was being reminded of the near total lack of interest in the Zelda franchise experienced on Ganker from Skyward Sword's until BotW's release. Only slightly picking up when ALBW and Hyrule Warriors came out.
>The thing that matters is whether the games are good
Apparently not since you guys jerk off the braindead shit for 9 year olds that is/was pre-BOTW Zelda. The design-philosophy they're doing/going for now for the series is an OBJECTIVE improvement.
No, it's a fact. I played the games when I was past the age of 9 and have no real emotional-attachment to Nintendo, therefore I don't suffer from delusion and pretend they were anything more than 7/10 adventure games for children. The only above-average thing most of the series had was the music. MM being good on music and atmosphere.
They have no design philosophy now, that's the problem, but you've spent so long screeching that even nintendo has move passed you and has slightly improved the game with totk.
Nah the next Zelda games will follow BOTW's design-philosophy.
>braindead shit for 9 year olds
how is that not still the case?
I mean that honestly. Do you really think nintendo stopped designing their games for children?
>how is that not still the case?
Really, Zelda was one Nintendo franchise to have actually gotten less casual, rather than more like all the other Nintendo franchises like Mario. Still pretty braindead most times, but compared to before? Might as-well be Dark Souls.
>Nah the next Zelda games will follow BOTW's design-philosophy.
they have already changed the philosophy, because botw's was dogshit
this is not an argument, you can go load up totk and see they put actual game design in it as opposed to botw
5 months ago
Anonymous
TOTK design isn't any more different. It's still open-ended and freedom focused. You probably just believe otherwise because there's a tiny bit more story-focus and "muh dungeons" are emphasized more.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Totk's design isn't any different >They just changed it to have more of an actual game and story
thank you for agreeing with me anon
5 months ago
Anonymous
>>They just changed it to have more of an actual game and story
NTA but TOTK >still has a story that happened in the past and is told through optional flashback cutscenes found throughout the map >still lacks true dungeons and replaces them with 100+ shrines
5 months ago
Anonymous
yes anon, more of one
2 is greater than 1
i honestly have no idea how people defended the blights, one of the worst cases of copy paste for enemy design there's been
They have no design philosophy now, that's the problem, but you've spent so long screeching that even nintendo has move passed you and has slightly improved the game with totk.
>braindead shit for 9 year olds
how is that not still the case?
I mean that honestly. Do you really think nintendo stopped designing their games for children?
Why? Zelda was a boring as frick series prior to BotW. Not that Breath and Tears are even that good, but they at least broke the mold from endless rehashes of LttP or OoT which weren't even that great for their time.
Do you guys not have any kind of reading comprehension? They're saying that there won't be another game in the BOTW/TOTK world/setting. Not that the the next game won't be open-world/open-ended in design and whatnot like BOTW.
>Won GOTY from the same people who gave The Last of Us 2 GOTY
That's like winning the Nobel Peace Prize after Obama won it for being black. There's always going to be an asterisk next to that "victory".
Fans praised BOTW for winning the journo awards, and now their next excuse is that "w-well the TGAs weren't always woke" ignoring how they worshipped Overwatch a year prior.
>Is Overwatch really that woke? Every character looks like a porn actor.
when's the last time you looked at the game anon
not to mention that even the original roster was literally designed with a fricking chart for how gay, black, and stupid you are
Is Overwatch really that woke? Every character looks like a porn actor.
Fans praised BOTW for winning the journo awards, and now their next excuse is that "w-well the TGAs weren't always woke" ignoring how they worshipped Overwatch a year prior.
Overwatch wasn't woke in 2016. Blizzard explicitly woke-ified it over time to try and draw away attention from their sexual harassment allegations. On release, there was 1 black guy, 1 lesbian (who everyone added into straight porn anyways), and everyone else was White/Asian and straight or a robot (or monkey).
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Overwatch wasn't woke in 2016.
anon those characters are in the base game and that metric has been in usage before the game came out
5 months ago
Anonymous
It's funny because Zarya is basically the only female in Overwatch that isn't bi or gay at this point. Well, her and Dva.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Curious how you ignore the other elements that made it woke, such as how it completely gutted everything good about arena shooters so it could be a safe space hugbox, where you could be literally banned for not playing the meta.
>YOU CAN'T HAVE FUN, YOU MUST PLAY IT EXACTLY THIS WAY, BANNED!
And need I remind you that, ON RELEASE, you could be banned from the game for spamming emotes or for any kind of "toxic behavior"? this included spamming certain voice lines. Even saying "GG" got you a ban. But please, go ahead and tell me that this isn't woke.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Curious how you ignore the other elements that made it woke, such as how it completely gutted everything good about arena shooters so it could be a safe space hugbox, where you could be literally banned for not playing the meta.
That wasn't present at release either. People were playing off-meta characters and could do silly things like roll 5x Winston. It very clearly had the seeds of wokeness within it, but at the time it seemed much more like a Punch-Out!! than a Coral Island.
5 months ago
Anonymous
And no, people weren't getting banned on release for being toxic, that came in later. Back in 2016, the only thing woke about OW was Lucio and Tracer. The woke-ification came over time after the game already proved itself a success.
Blizzard was only just transitioning into being a shitty company in the early-mid 2010s. Diablo 3 was a disaster and still a stain on the series, but people were still pretty hopeful about Blizzard after Starcraft II and Overwatch. They squandered it all away with every release since, and even WoW is dying now, but they seemed like they were pulling out of their tailspin before swerving through 6 lanes of traffic and slamming into a bus full of children.
>that wasn't present on release either
Bull crap. Blizzard was banning people left and right. Why else do you think they completely gutted any concept of a server browser? Because, to quote blizzard, "those evil toxic games like TF2 were too free and gave players too much freedom".
>it very clearly had the seeds of wokeness within it, but at the time it seemed much more like a Punch-Out!! than a Coral Island.
The entire game was based on blatantly stupid "muh racism" allegories with the dumb robots. They even had pixar trash cinematics to try and make them sympathetic.
This disgusting attempt at emotional manipulation makes me feel vile hatred from the depths of my heart. Any attempt at trying to make charcters sympathetic, especially through cinematics, is gross and unworthy of my pity, let alone my time.
5 months ago
Anonymous
And no, people weren't getting banned on release for being toxic, that came in later. Back in 2016, the only thing woke about OW was Lucio and Tracer. The woke-ification came over time after the game already proved itself a success.
Blizzard was only just transitioning into being a shitty company in the early-mid 2010s. Diablo 3 was a disaster and still a stain on the series, but people were still pretty hopeful about Blizzard after Starcraft II and Overwatch. They squandered it all away with every release since, and even WoW is dying now, but they seemed like they were pulling out of their tailspin before swerving through 6 lanes of traffic and slamming into a bus full of children.
Good point I guess, but if they were trying to make it woke they kinda failed given the massive amount of r34 this game gets on a daily basis.
5 months ago
Anonymous
the two are not inherently mutually exclusive
hell people make porn of the new randos don't they
5 months ago
Anonymous
Woketards hate sexuality so yes, yes they are.
5 months ago
Anonymous
They kind of are. Woke coomerism is exclusively focused on gays and trannies. This is what we call "safe horny". See: Kotaku simping over Bald Gay 3 adding wiener & ball jiggle physics but moaning over boob jiggle physics.
And no, people don't make porn of the new characters. Kiriko is basically the only character since Brig to get any sizeable amount of porn. I stopped following OW in 2017 and even I know of Kiriko because she's the only new character that gets any porn.
Nobel Peace Prize never cared about warmongers. Henry Kissinger won the Nobel Peace Prize. The Nobel Committee loves warhawks, but they love minorities even more.
I dunno if I'd say any of them are "truly" fixed because you'd probably just have to remove weapon durability entirely for that, but making bombs a resource again, focusing highly on arrows, and zoanite existing are already incredible leaps and bounds upon botw's item philosophy of "Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh maybe you get a better sword oh sorry full inventory"
even without any of the shitpost/fun usages and purely mechanical having the gmod shit around makes exploring (at least the underworld) something you'll want to do and actively engage with combat in to get more of it, something that botw is hilariously bad at to the point where it is actively harmful to get into fights in botw
i'd call it less of a glaring flaw and an annoying nitpick, but the master sword is also much less of a joke in totk
it still has a base power of 30 but you aren't swimming in guardian weapons that shit on it nonstop, I'm not at the endgame or anything but I've yet to find a weapon that has a base power above like, 15 or so.
>I'm railroaded into a tutorial area!!!!
Yes, that's every Zelda game after the first 2. That's not what everyone is talking about when it comes to the OoT formula >finally get out of the castle, only to find giant rocks and rows of pegs blocking several pathways
Yes, large swathes of the map are blocked off if you don't have the prerequisite upgrades. That doesn't mean that you're not given freedom of choice. You can explore a lot of the map after the first dungeon even though you're forced to beat the next 2 dungeons to fully open the map. That's much more freedom than what you get in OoT where you're forced from Kokiri Forest into Castle Town and then to Kakariko.
>botw - base map >totk - base map + underworld >
What do you guys think would have been the next frontier? I think the obvious answer would have been space or the ocean. Ocean would be hard though since the swimming controls in both games fricking sucked.
I wish Nintendo could make more 2D Zelda games on the same vein as Link's Awakening and Oracle of Seasons.
They have the money and talent to pump one of those every 3 years.
>Zelda producer doesn't think
You could just stop the headline there.
Aonuma is chronically moronic and the fact that he IMMEDIATELY went back to fumbling after BOTW means we're going right back to hell, but with a new coat of paint dumped over everything.
Here I want Nintendo to use the good things I like from all the Zelda games for the next title. And if there's going to be things like spoken voice acting then it needs to be a game mechanic rather than a cutscene. Let me amass a harem of seven pure maiden girlfriends.
I dont care if its open world I just want the optional stuff to be truly optional. I fricking despise the shrine system. Its not really optional because the game is otherwise a three heart challenge mode if you only want to focus on main stuff exclusively. Also bring back green link already you fricks
>Its not really optional because the game is otherwise a three heart challenge mode if you only want to focus on main stuff exclusively.
Anon, you literally get a full heart container after every major boss. It's optional and if you die that often you have nobody but yourself to blame.
The only time I died in TotK was when a horse moronicly acted like flat ground was a wall and refused to move in any direction before the things nearby killed both of us.
Since I was on a horse on a path and didn't expect that to happen I was only half paying attention so I didn't have as much reaction time as I would've had normally. In other words, even with the horse AI moronation it was still mostly my fault that it happened.
>frick off with the skill issue shit
It IS a skill issue, dipshit. TotK's combat mechanics aren't difficult to master, and once you've mastered them and use even a modicum of brain power you shouldn't be getting one shot at all.
Again, you get heart containers just from playing the main story. You will even get upgrade materials just by grabbing things on the way.
What about stamina upgrades to be able to use the Master Sword?
Now that's a good counterpoint, although even then the majority of shrines are totally optional.
Majora's Mask, Spirit Tracks, and TotK are the only times Nintendo made a direct asset sequel on the same console. Zelda 2 Nes is on the same console as Zelda 1 but isnt an asset sequel.
So it's not unusual that they are moving on from BotW/TotK style anf going to try something new for the next game. Hopefully it will be a good balance between the linearity of the previous 3D Zeldas and the freedom of the BotW Zelda's.
Sadly that may end up upsetting both sides as Classic formula fans will complain it isnt the same OoT formula that has been done to death and Open-World formula new Zelda fans will complain it isnt as open-ended as the previous 2 entries.
>he same OoT formula that has been done to death
i always think it's funny when people say this when there were like, 4 games in "the oot formula" after it
Because the oot formula isn't the oot formula. It's the zelda formula, that almost every game (aside from zelda 2 and the multiplayer ones) followed up until botw.
The buzz around these games were nothing but the emperor's new clothes. Tears was the safe option for a follow up sequel, but a third one is too much of a risk of losing their audience's favor. They know that they need an actually well designed game for the next entry.
Wouldn't even be mad.
Zelda has been dancing around RPG mechanics since its first game.
And it'd at least be an excuse for Nintendo actually try with the writing, npcs and quests
I have no faith in whatever is coming next. The past decade has been fricking awful for Zelda in general and I was already losing my patience after Wind Waker. The earlier games up to Majora's Mask are still incredible and I'm quite frankly sick of letting the Zelda team resting on those games laurels and names to carry their dogshit experiments.
If the next game has weapon durability and the same non linear focus where dungeons don't matter anymore again I'm not buying anymore of their games.
These are my thoughts after ~25 hours of TOTK, after seeing the few new things they added already repeating several times, getting dissapinted after a few hours in the depths and just rushing the main Temples ASAP.
Why are totk haters so disingenuous? There's plenty of valid criticisms about the game but everyone on Ganker resorts to the same cookie cutter strawmans that are quickly disproven if you've even put a couple of hours into the game
>Open up blueprint >Spawn hoverbike or flying machine >Strap Korok to said machine >Fly over all the hostile terrain and monsters and complete the 'puzzle' >Repeat 100 hundred times over
There's no winning with these puzzles. They're either lack mental stimulation (carrying the Korok with either a blue print vehicle or with ultrahand) or are tedious to execute (building a vehicle from scratch with whatever parts are lying about). Either way you will need to repeat it again and again until you've amassed a substantial amount of Korok seeds in order to counteract the tedium of weapon collecting.
It's just not a fun system, but the open world nature of the game requires the devs to repeat it again and again and again and again because they need content to fill the world they've created.
>implying the koroks aren't just a stopgap to convince the player to explore in that direction leading to something more interesting
This is pretty much how all korok puzzles work, you see something out of place, turns out it's a korok puzzle, you complete the puzzle, and turns out it lead you straight to a cave entrance or shrine or miniboss. The entire game is filled with these ant trails, the seeds you get from completing them are basically just afterthoughts.
>turns out it's a korok puzzle,
Yes, but the puzzles aren't interesting. At least most of them aren't too much of a hassle to complete. If a puzzle isn't mentally stimulating and it's also tedious (as a opposed to hard) to execute, it's just a shit puzzle.
no. usually you see a landmark and travel towards it and on the way you see a shitty rehashed korok structure you feel forced to deal with because your inventory is even more hellish otherwise.
>There's no winning with these puzzles. They're either lack mental stimulation
You Black folk talk like zelda puzzles were some next level big brain moment shit. It was always just step on switch and walk to new platform kinda puzzles. It's a game for stupid kids and teenagers.
Try to finish reading the post before replying. Stepping on a switch isn't a tedious action, because it's over in a moment. If a puzzle is easy to work out but executing the solution doesn't take much time, it's fine. Korok puzzles are both time wasting in execution (even the Blue Print version of the Korok webm takes over a minute) and easy to figure.
I don't get it, if you want easy puzzles then you don't care about any mental stimulation though. Just make an action game like elden ring or other souls games and call it a day is my honestly opinion. The only thing that didn't feel like zelda for me was all the zonai mechanic to fly and skip the entire game. I never gave a frick about the koroks because i never cared about doing all of them.
Brother, how are you struggling with this? I want puzzles that are mentally engaging and fun to execute. Failing that either mentally engaging or fun to execute. At the very least, I expect puzzles that aren't tedious to execute. If they're going to be dull as shit they better be over in a second or two and note waste my time.
Korok puzzles are both tedious and dull. They don't provide mental engagement, and the waste time. You can fortunately skip a lot of them, but if we're at the point where the ideal situation is to skip most things we've got a fundamental design issue.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I get you but the "design" was that they made most of these puzzle optional. You will waste at least 200 hours trying to do everthing in this game. They were designed to be skipped by most normal gays. This is why most of them have this "repetitive" nature. It's the unfortunate nature of a game that is too big and not linear. But i agree with you about frick koroks.
Tears of the Kingdom is fun but it lacks all defining aspects of previous Zelda games and solidifies that the series is essentially something completely different. Not a bad game though.
it's fine enough, actually better than botw which is a surprise
which makes it all the funnier that totk just proves how garbage botw was
maybe they'll actually make a real game next time too and this was just a decade-long joke
What aspects are those, exactly? Fujibayashi's core philosophy ever since the Oracles has always been to integrate the central mechanics and interactions into *everything* the player does from moment to moment so that they're always engaged, whether they're in a dungeon or not. In a series about exploration, puzzles and combat, content density is more important than dungeons. Most 3D Zelda games fail spectacularly at this, too often having bad overworlds with fluffy setpieces between dungeons or shallow mandatory minigames that are divorced from the core gameplay. Fuji does away with that bullshit entirely to focus on the fundamental pillars of Zelda. That's not to say he always succeeds – SS was a failed experiment and BotW is a little too sparse for its own good, but TotK is the logical endpoint of his design and perhaps the first truly successful translation of 2D style Zelda gameplay into 3D.
Other than TotK, the only other 3D game to be almost perfectly in sync with its main gimmick is Majora's Mask. I say "almost" because a lot of the masks are useless outside of one specific sidequest or task, but other than that it too is an exceptional game.
It's fully divorced from the formula that started blooming in a Link to the Past and was fully realized in Ocarina of Time. Yes, ALTTP had a vast overworld, but the meat of the gameplay in that game was always the dungeons you play through.
You can say that TotK is close to Zelda 1 like Breath of the Wild was, but that was the literal start of the series. Zelda 1 didn't make the series legendary. ALTTP and OoT did. The gameplay of Zelda 1 is hardly representative of the games released in the following 30 years.
Tears of the Kingdom is a game primarily about the features you use and the novelty of playing around with them. The puzzles are deliberately tuned to have so many solutions that you can solve them by accident. The areas you explore aren't fun to explore because they're actually interesting, they're fun to explore because you can do it with whatever cool contraption of your choice.
>Yes, ALTTP had a vast overworld, but the meat of the gameplay in that game was always the dungeons you play through.
No, the meat of the gameplay in that game was from the *actual gameplay itself*, not from color coded dungeons where you find an item to unlock arbitrary telegraphed gates then expose the boss's weakness. Dungeons are ultimately just set dressing for what you're actually doing in them which is exploring and solving puzzles, i.e. two things you don't actually need an interior environment for. Fujibayashi seems to have been the only Zelda director aside from Koizumi to understand this. >Zelda 1 didn't make the series legendary. ALTTP and OoT did. The gameplay of Zelda 1 is hardly representative of the games released in the following 30 years.
That's all completely subjective, not to mention that Zelda 1 actually was a pretty major hit when it came out. Either way, there are no shortage of players today who prefer the *actual* classic playstyle over the one that moved in a more linear, less explorative direction. >The puzzles are deliberately tuned to have so many solutions that you can solve them by accident.
I think you overstate the amount of puzzles that truly can be solved by "accident", and I enjoyed solving many of them regardless.
>No, the meat of the gameplay in that game was from the *actual gameplay itself*, not from color coded dungeons where you find an item to unlock arbitrary telegraphed gates then expose the boss's weakness. Dungeons are ultimately just set dressing for what you're actually doing in them which is exploring and solving puzzles, i.e. two things you don't actually need an interior environment for. Fujibayashi seems to have been the only Zelda director aside from Koizumi to understand this.
The "actual gameplay itself" is the repeated overworld that you go through over and over again in between dungeons. You see that one long hallway in the Dark World with those two cyclops like twenty times even in a casual playthrough. The dungeons are a large part of the gameplay and have various unique enemies, bosses, and gimmicks that make them memorable. I don't know who played A Link to the Past and thought "wow, finding that heart piece under that rock was awesome" instead of "wow, fighting that butterfly on a conveyor belt was awesome!" >That's all completely subjective, not to mention that Zelda 1 actually was a pretty major hit when it came out. Either way, there are no shortage of players today who prefer the *actual* classic playstyle over the one that moved in a more linear, less explorative direction.
Sure, Zelda 1 was huge for the time. It's also one game in a series that has been going for 35 years and counting, with 30 years of games between it and BotW. People always immediately jump to "BotW is what Zelda has always been because Zelda 1!" when that is obviously a disingenuous attempt to challenge the fact that every major Zelda game between 1 and BotW has been entirely different from the open world games. >I think you overstate the amount of puzzles that truly can be solved by "accident", and I enjoyed solving many of them regardless.
You can legit throw any variety of shit at the wall and come out fine because of how good Recall is.
>The dungeons are a large part of the gameplay and have various unique enemies, bosses, and gimmicks that make them memorable.
The dungeons, especially in A Link to the Past, tend to involve equally repetitive "puzzle" tasks like pushing a block, hitting a switch or killing all the enemies in the room. The best puzzles were the ones that required you to think outside the box for the solution, e.g. jumping from high up to break the web in the Deku Tree in Ocarina of Time, or some similar vertical based level ones in ALttP. That's pretty much a standard physics puzzle in BotW/TotK. >People always immediately jump to "BotW is what Zelda has always been because Zelda 1!"
You act like there's something wrong with this. Even if I didn't prefer Zelda 1's formula, in principle I'm not going to pretend that going back to their roots is something that should be discouraged. We had plenty of people longing for Zelda 1's playstyle to return to the series way before BotW was announced. >You can legit throw any variety of shit at the wall and come out fine because of how good Recall is.
Recall doesn't break every shrine in the game. It can be a bit broken, but like I said, you're overstating a bit.
I can't say I don't understand why traditional Zelda is dead and buried, given the obvious superior profit with the open world style, but I'll miss it. At least I can always replay OoT-TP-MM each year.
I wish they would decanonize all of the older games so the timeline moron shit could be over with. They bounce between obviously not thinking about a single game prior to the current one for even a fraction of a second and then going into an interview and saying "b-but maybe it could have happened!".
My guess is that they're currently in the same predicament that Riot found themselves in when they were restructuring the lore of their League IP. BotW was that weird in-between phase and now they're planning to retcon the old timeline and get serious with the lore in their next installment, as they're now attempting to establish Zelda as a massive multimedia franchise with movies, shows, theme park attractions, etc from this point forward. You can't have a traditional fantasy series with completely nonexistent lore & shit worldbuilding and expect it to sell well these days - especially when competing with heavy-hitters like LOTR, Harry Potter and whatnot.
The thing about that though is they don't just blatantly decanonize it for some reason. Not only do they reference Fi and have her be a major plot point in both games, they go out of their way to say that the timeline is up to player decision. It's just so sloppy.
I love wild and tears as games but I would have given anything for them to be new IPs. They gain nothing from being Zelda and got rid of the old style I liked. It's like having a great Chinese restaurant replace your favorite sushi place. I like having the Chinese restaurant, but I miss the sushi.
The point is that TOTK could be good even with all the problems it has, if only the guys had built interesting things into the empty world of the previous game. But they didn't. They created new "mini-content" and spread it around with copy paste.
An example of how TOTK could be interesting: >previously empty place (in BOTW) now has a big castle made by monsters >if you try to invade by air, those flying beasts immediately capture you and throw you away >there are some friendly gays nearby planning a raid >you use ultrahand to build a war machine (catapult) with their help >you need to build one that works well enough to destroy one of the castle walls (the game encourages you to explore the building system) >after succeeding, you can enter through the wall you destroyed, with the help of an NPC warrior >this warrior is captured, and now you have a mini dungeon to save him and kill the unique mini boss of that place >keys to collect, rooms that rotate, statues that move, mirror puzzles, all that shit you get in traditional dungeons >save the captured NPC, kill the leader of the area, the castle is now taken over by the NPCs and is pacified >The End
But I think it's too much to ask for Nintendo to really make an effort to make a game. It's easier to make the player repeat the same braindead tasks for 150 hours.
It's extremely disingenuous to imply the game was lazy especially given you're not a developer and it's always easier to look at things in hindsight. If you REALLY think they just sat on their asses and didn't work hard on this game then I don't know what to tell you. It be more accurate to say that they were misguided in their effort and should have focused it elsewhere than to just use some baseless "they didn't put effort in the game".
Anon, they didn't even bother with the fact that the game repeats the same cutscene 4x. This is something basic that you can solve with effort, if you don't, it's because you've chosen the path of laziness.
The entire Dephts and the flying islands are extremely lazy.
If the devs have really worked hard on this game, then they need to review a few things, because they're working too hard for too little.
The cutscene is about the only thing in the game I'd call lazy, and essentially as easy solution to the non-linearity issue . I wouldn't call anything else in the game "lazy", and more of a consequence of the game being open world. Like I implied earlier, they probably worked extremely hard on the physics again and despite the repetitive content like caves and shrines...they still had to be designed around those said mechanics of the game, with their own puzzles to solve or structure.
>It be more accurate to say that they were misguided in their effort and should have focused it elsewhere
I don't know if that's more accurate either, honestly. Even if someone doesn't particularly like the direction BotW or TotK went in, I'm not sure it's fair to say it was misguided when much of the beauty of the series is its willingness to try new things. As much as I like OoT, I sure as frick wouldn't want to play it over and over again with a new coat of paint.
I hope they make the next one like Dragon's Dogma, a full blown action RPG with a customizable 4 man party and puzzles designed around their abilities.
And that's a major problem. IT's disgusting sex fanservice that only attracts coomers. It's why Metroid Prime is the only genuinely good metroid game, since it gets rid of the putrid, vomit inducing sec fanservice.
Cute girls that didn't require retconning an entire fricking tribe of people into le smexy scientist waifus with iPads
You are the fricking cancer killing Zelda
I am seething that literal fricking carrot top looking morons want to rewrite my series with normalgay waifu bait that has no place in Zelda's setting. You are the equivalent to American consumerism abroad.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I mean I found Impa cute in OoT. As well as Cremia in MM
5 months ago
Anonymous
That's fine, it's not the point.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Just saying, I don't think you can really argue that Zelda never had normalgay waifu bait.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I'm saying that turning the Sheikah into a tribe of bimbo scientists with iPads is fricking moronic. That's far more normalhomosexualry than just cute girls, it's just twitter artist pandering at the expense of the series' history and lore being rewritten for the sake of popularity to appease people that won't even play the games.
Every mainline Zelda game is at worst "pretty good" and at best a masterpiece, and they've always kind of experimented with things. Sometimes I wish you people would celebrate the differences instead of admonishing anything that doesn't do what your favorite game did.
It's pretty generally accepted that the series really hasn't been truly GREAT since the SNES/Game Boy/N64 era. It's why Zelda threads often devolve into shitposting about everything after MM.
The series sucked between MM and BOTW save for a few 2d entries. Are you old enough to remember how completely irrelevent zelda was during the gamecube/wii eras?
The game being different is of very little consolation when you think the game is terrible, they've released two very similar mainline games in the 12 years between Skyward Sword and now, shit sucks.
the next game will be Zelda-centric anyway, Links era is over you chud
Give it a fricking rest.
But I'm a chud and I'd like a game where you play as Zelda. Sounds fun.
what does chud mean to you?
how?
>how?
they'll just give link boobs and call him zelda, it will be the same gameplay as usual
if zelda turns into link and has the triforce of courage then who would get the triforce of wisdom?
wtf im voting for donald trump now!
sheikbros.
it's time.
noooo muh space game that was totally gonna happen and not deluded headcanon
You've been saying this for 15 years now
I feel like they can't go away from BotW/TotK Link and Zelda because they're so popular since they characterized them more in the last two games
theyll give link voice lines after the movie, whatever game that is will be the hardest to let go
I will accept Link having speaking lines if it means I get to choose his responses in dialogue.
Who gives a frick as long as the game is good
link in botw already looks like a little b***h the MC being zelda or a random girl would be barely any different
you're all closeted trannies
At most I see them letting you choose between link and linkle in the next games.
I can only hope so
Linkle is not an actual chosen hero.
cute Fi
>monkey's paw curls
Good. It’s about time we’re getting a protagonist who isn’t a lifeless mute frick.
>Zelda-centric anyway
I mean, people have been asking for a spin-off game with that idea since the SNES days after ALttP.
All we got were two very bad CD-I games with Zelda as the lead, and one bad Link game
oh boy! I love NTR thanks nintendo
I want the next game to not have Zelda appear nor green guy as the baddie
Like why don't they do something weird like Majoras Mask again, why are the 2d games allowed to not have the same copy paste
> Zelda-centric
> plant sized Zelda as the map
> only way to save her is destroy her from within
That's the best I can imagine. Otherwise it would be regular world with Link having personality disorder as an excuse so "switch" to become Zelda.
I'm honestly fine with Zelda getting her own game for once, it's long-overdue.
I honestly do not get why people are frothing at the mouth and demanding that link either be a girl or zelda be playable and the main character. Nobody does this shit for mario, metroid, kirby, or even other non nintendo series with a hard locked protagonist. Is it because the game has zelda in the name? That's fricking moronic. The games are about a dude named link destined to fight evil because of some infinite curse loop.
>in the world
that just means they won't reuse the same map again. we're stuck with ubishit forever
That's my fear but I hope not. Nintendo, and Aonuma in particular, seem obsessed with doing something different and Tears was very much an exception to the norm. I hope we get something more traditional, and with much better narrative presentation.
TotK was obviously an one-off.
Especially after they said months ago that there won't be DLC because they've already done everything they wanted in that Hyrule.
The only ones insisting on "BotW 3" were shitposters, fearmongers and concern trolls.
And as always, even direct deconfirmation from developers themselves won't stop them from shitting up every Zelda thread until the first trailer drops.
They already said they'll continue the "open air" formula.
And there's nothing Ubishit about it.
>there's nothing Ubishit about it
you have 5 seconds to name a single feature not directly ripped from ubishit
Runes.
Tools. You lost.
Didn't know you get ice cube powers on command in Ubisoft games
You said runes, not specific runes. All nintendo did was thematically tie some runes to their game. And even then some are ripped directly from ubishit powers.
So you admitted some weren't.
Thanks for proving yourself wrong.
goalpost moving just proves you're wrong. enjoy that.
Shield surfing.
Not only in ubishit, but other adventure games. Also fail.
Yeah, other adventure games like Twilight Princess you fricking mong.
NTA, but the burden is on you to explain what makes it "ubishit". You people consistently fail at doing this every time.
Not an argument.
>sensational headline
>meaning anything
All failed.
Ubisoft now make their games like Zelda. They even made their own BotW copycat game Fenyx Rising. Time for the rope.
Game Design
botw can't even tie its own mechanics to an actual story without ubi style points of interests drip feeding you a half assed attempt
New Map with same engine, you can bet on it.
Nintendo knows how to make games with low budgets and high profit
>ubishit forever
BotW/ToTK have no ubisoft design elements
It has towers and bandit camps
Yep, this play style, like being able to climb anything and traverse the world how you want, is here forever. All this does is greatly limit dungeon and world design.
Please, just give us one more fricking classic formula zelda game.
You just got one this year.
title?
The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom
oh you must be confused
I wanted to know the title of the "classic formula zelda game" we "got this year"
Nope, no confusion. It's The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom.
but who wants a locked down linear game where you get better and better items, when you can aimlessly go through a floating puzzle box and replay each cutscene as if it were the first one 5 times in a row
>we're stuck with ubishit forever
This is the real problem. I feel about as much desire to play BotW/TotK as Wildlands/Breakpoint. Sometimes even less because the latter two have decent stealth mechanics. Nintendo failed.
Awesome. Can't wait for the retrospectives when the new Zelda comes out and how people wished it was more like BotW and TotK.
Death
Taxes
The Zelda Cycle
The only forces in the world that you can always depend on.
There's no Zelda Cycle between BOTW and TOTK as they're 90% the same game, that's the complaint.
Bullshit, there are tons of people on this board right now claiming that BotW was a masterpiece and TotK sucked. That was after the 6 years of Gankerirgins complaining that BotW sucked and SS was actually this underrated gem.
People might have their own theories as to what exactly makes the Zelda cycle real (maybe it's just different generations of players, or maybe the more "hardcore" fans truly don't know what they want) but there's no denying at this point that the cycle is fricking real.
Ganker generally doesn’t like totk/botw. Common consensus here is that series “”died”” after Aonuma became the lead director and that he needs to be fired for whatever reason. I think Wind Waker and Twilight Princess might be somewhat liked now. Most people generally like the game. You shouldn’t get so up in arms about a “zelda cycle” that this board barely follows.
The only nintendo franchises here that people like are generally the small ones, Pikmin/Xeno/Metroid etc
This board specifically and especially follows the Zelda cycle more than any other place on the internet.
following the zelda cycle implies that people look back and being to like certain games more over time.
I still see a lot of vitriol for everything after Majora's Mask and the Oracles.
Zelda Cycle on Ganker died with SS, anyone suggesting otherwise is underage.
Everyone has a different idea as to what the core identity of the series is. I never liked the 3D games well, I have a soft spot for Wind Waker because of the incomparable amount of SOUL, even though I do think it's a bad game, so BotW being a return to the "old games" was right up my alley. I've played ALttP and LoZ more than any other Zelda game, and I love the absolute freedom. I just wish there were more unlockables in the Hero of the Wild games so you feel like you're progressing more viscerally.
No one likes Skyward Sword here. GCN era zelda is sometimes discussed, but itd rare. Oot and majoras mask are rightfully praised but that’s about it.
I've seen at least 30 "ackshually SS was good" threads this year, and I don't even visit this board as often.
Those are made by spammers and most people here don’t agree
>I don't even visit this board as often.
Hence you don't pick up on obvious bait. The few SS defenders that do exist were humbled by how poorly the rerelease did on the Switch, despite being the only TRUE 3D Zelda for sale on the Switch.
It isn't bait when even morons like you are calling it the only "true" 3D Zelda for Switch.
You can't even pick up on the obvious sarcasm in that comment, no one should take what you consider to be bait or not seriously.
SSHD sold more on the Switch than original SS sold on the Wii
BotW for all the faults was a huge leap from SS and TP, the formula had potential it just needed more content since the main critique of BotW is that it was empty as frick.
TotK on the other had is 90% the same game but not catering to Roblox kiddies with the Gmod gimmick.
It's literally like RE3R and how many people were dissapointed with that game for using tons of assets from RE2R and being insanely short, cutting tons of streets and areas from the OG.
But at least RE3R has the excuse of being rushed in a single year and a half, the 6 year gap betwen the Zelda games being even more expectations.
>It's literally like RE3R and how many people were dissapointed with that game for using tons of assets from RE2R and being insanely short, cutting tons of streets and areas from the OG.
So then it's NOT literally like that, since TotK does absolutely none of those things? Did you even play the fricking game? The main quest is about twice is long, no areas were cut and there's a shitload of new assets and content.
The ratio if new content to reused content in TOTK is at best 1 to 4, it's like they made 1 temple + 30 shrines per year.
In before you tell me the Gmod and physics took 3+ years to get right.
Both TotK and BotW use Havok middleware for all their physics and making a Gmod clone isn't hard, lots of indie games do it, even phone shitty ones.
Cool, so you didn't play the game at all since most of TotK's content isn't remotely available in BotW.
~70% of BOTW and TOTK's content is technically Korok seeds.
But even if we don't count those, the game has the exact same formula if extremely small Shrines and enemy camps on the exact same map with mostly the same enemies/minobosses and anything new added is extemely minor.
Depths is an inverted heightmap with the same reused enemies from BOTW and a single new frog miniboss.
Sky Islands are 10% of the total map and only contain one new boss that gets reused at least 5-6 times. Also most Sky Islands have the same green crystal traversal puzzle.
It's really the ubisoft formula of spreading the content as thin as possible on a huge, making you do and redo the same 6-7 activities 100 times.
Formula =/= content, and the formula isn't even the same because the core mechanics around puzzle solving are fundamentally different. The rest of your dogshit post is just you coming up with mental gymnastics in response to points I didn't even make which really just reads as a concession more than anything.
Now stop replying to me and have a nice day already.
Have fun when the next game is the same map and the same bokoblins again for a third time LMAO
This is what you bootlickers deserve.
So not only did you not play TotK, you're so fricking moronic you didn't even read or comprehend the article linked in the OP. Get out of here you homosexual.
>That was after the 6 years of Gankerirgins complaining that BotW sucked
true
>and SS was actually this underrated gem.
never happened
>>and SS was actually this underrated gem.
Nope I do this, although I've been doing it since 2011.
Lol, lmao. I remember morons claiming that BotW was a much better game than TotK for months. Zeldagays will nevrr escape the cycle
The more or less general opinion I see is that BOTW is a more cohesive game.
how does saying one game is better than another reinforce the cycle?
>this moron doesn't know what the cycle is
explain it then.
If I say I liked BotW more than Totk with no other context, how does that invoke the Zelda Cycle meme?
It's a larger, overarching cycle.
OOT formula went on for decades, BOTW formula died after 2nd game. OOT will always be the GOAT
>OoT formula
>MM is nothing like OoT
Idiot.
Cope, empty open world Zelda is OVER
I’m not sure how anyone could seriously play BoTW or especially ToTK and call it empty.
Like holy frick, ToTK in particular has almost too much to do.
I guess the problem is that the "content" doesn't feel satisfying, and is more akin to filler. It's hard for me to justify 900+ pieces of korok turds as fun content. Their only justification is that "oh the player needs inventory space, so it should be easy to find upgrades". I disagree witht hat notion. Inventory upgrades should be stupidly hard to find, and they should be challenging ontop of it.
The Koroks are fun little distractions that take maybe 5 seconds of your time and were given more variety in TotK, quit being a b***h.
A puzzle that's not challenging is not fun, especially when it's taped to dialogue boxes and cutscenes.
>cutscenes
>Koroks
Holy frick ACgay, is it too much to ask you to use a trip so I can filter you?
>just do this 1000000+ times, stop complaining chud!
How are you STILL obsessing over Zelda this much 7 years in? It's pathetic.
You only need to get like 50-60 koroks to get a good amount of inventory space. They put in so many to make sure you can find them reliably wherever you go. The devs make fun of people like you by giving you a literal piece of shit as your reward for finding them all. Take the hint. Not replying to you anymore Doug, frick you
I don't care about finding them all, but such a lackluster reward makes it so I don't want to explore.
That's the best part of the game, homosexual.
Yiu are b***hing about people not liking boring ass filler
so dont do it
The fact that the original poster triggered some kind of hostile response in you at all is proof I am likely stronger, faster and smarter than you. Under the right circumstances I would cave your head in for something as void and meaningless as a mcchicken, or maybe a korok seed. I liked TOTK btw.
Shrines are such a big chunk of the game yet they're throwaway garbage in the same tier as Riddler trophies in Batman.
>ToTK in particular has almost too much to do.
More like too much you're forced to do.
Frick linear whining homosexuals who demanded it be made to have no replay value for them.
lol I thought Hyrule Castle in BotW was like the Forest Temple in OoT and the previous 4 beast dungeons were just smaller ones like Deku Tree, Dodongo Cavern, Jabu's belly, etc. because they were so small and I beat them in 15~ minutes. I remember thinking there were going to be more actually good dungeons like HC ahead of me but the fricking game just ended.
>I thought Hyrule Castle in BotW was like the Forest Temple in OoT
I see people always sucking on BOTW Hyrule Castle's nuts but I don't get the hype. There's no progression locks (small keys) so it doesn't feel at all like OOT's Forest Temple to me. You can walk in a straight line from start to Ganon without any detours and all of the detours just reward you with more common breakable weapons.
Not him but I had a similar experience, if they wanted to make zelda the actual exploration game then hyrule castle is what they should have focused on. Getting to ganon is a very easy task but exploring the rest of it can take some time, if only they put that amount of effort into the "main" "dungeons" instead of just that.
Totk's "dungeons" are at least significantly better than botw's, they aren't just 3 shrines stapled together and then you fight phantom ganon 5 times
>Totk's "dungeons" are at least significantly better than botw's, they aren't just 3 shrines stapled together and then you fight phantom ganon 5 times
I thought that they were actually pretty terrible and some of them were worse than the Divine Beasts. The only one I """liked""" was the Fire/Minecart one. Really didn't care for the electric/water/ice ones and the 'Shadow Temple' was literally 4 distinct mini-shrines
I've only done fire and wind so maybe the others are a lot shittier. Wind was comically easy but so far both of them at least seemed much more like proper zelda dungeons, even if much easier and much shorter.
Zelda dungeons are always comically easy. A lot of people say the Water Temple is bad, but it was my first one and I thought it was pretty kino.
botw is bereft of anything meaningful
totk at least tries to fix this issue, and somewhat succeeds, but its best parts are still exploring hyrule castle and now the underworld
>but its best parts are still exploring hyrule castle and now the underworld
Why are you citing this like its a problem?
because ideally the entire game should be fun and have a compelling reason to go through it
granted, it's a massive improvement over botw, but still
>Like holy frick, ToTK in particular has almost too much to do.
And most of the "content" was lazy, recycled, tedious and repetitive to play.
Lots of content, but too much of the same and completely shallow.
it's all recycled junk. it's like how elden ring recycled everything twice, except everything is recycled 50 times. in fact. botw's success is probably the reason fromsoft felt it was ok to recycle so much shit in elden ring. in other words, botw fans have made video games worse. you deserve nothing but scorn.
You didn't read OP right. The "world" of BotW and TotK won't be used again. OoT formula is old, tired, dated, archaic, and would never work in the modern gaming landscape anymore. People were tired and drained from the OOT Zelda formula even back then, and going back to it again would only be taking the series in the wrong direction.
The next game will be BotW/TotK again in feel and gameplay, but expanded and tweaked. It just won't be in the same world. It will probably be somewhere else in the "Zelda timeline", but it's going be BotW/TotK in everything that matters.
Finally. Made my morning seeing this shit.
People were not tired of Ocarinas formula, people don't realize the later games' issues were not the formula, it was literally everything else. There's a reason everyone still loves ocarina and plays it.
>People were not tired of Ocarinas formula, people don't realize the later games' issues were not the formula, it was literally everything else. There's a reason everyone still loves ocarina and plays it.
Ocarina Of Time is a masterpiece. Nothing wrong with OoT. The problem is all the games which came after, which also wanted to be OoT. Sales were dwindling for a reason. Even Nintendo knew it stale as frick by Twilight Princess. Which is why they spent a decade trying to freshen up the formula with ALBW and Skyward Sword before doing a complete back-to-basics reboot to course-correct the series.
>Ocarina Of Time is a masterpiece
It's just as bad as TP and SS. You just didn't play those when you were a kid.
The best solution is clearly a hybrid of both formulas.
BoTW formula offers some of the best traversal-based exploration in gaming - but the combat is flat-out bad, the the lore, immersion & environmental storytelling complete dogshit, the rewards and reward incentives are ass, the game balance and upgrading systems a complete mess, so on and so forth. You complain about the old formula, but don't realize that even the normiest of normies are tired of the stale map-markered ubisoft fomula teeming with recycled assets and towers.
Elden Ring's success is proof that even the most ADHD-ridden of zoomers and normies can find consistent engagement in long, sprawling dungeons, and BG3's success is proof that they crave worlds with replay value, unique gameplay scenarios, meaningful side quests and rich lore, worldbuilding and characters.
If Nintendo wants the next Zelda to be a massive success, it NEEDs to do all of this. ToTK might have made money but it was a disaster as far as genuine quality goes. There's a good chance that all of the newfound normies and zoomers they earned from BoTW will not return if the next game is more of the same barren, recycled, menu-scrolling, mat-induced ToTK sandbox bullshit.
They don't need to do any of that, they can make BotW with a new map and put in a different gimmick and sell just as much. Traditional Zelda is not popular.
Did you even read my fricking post? ToTK made bank, but that was because people had hopes and promises in BotW's sequel. TotK failed in this regard, with many now regarding it as trash or a massive disappointment - now that its honeymoon phase is over. So it's likely the next one will under-perform if it's more of the same.
The old Zelda formula was definitely running stale but normies are completely fed up of ubisoft sandbox bullshit. So the best thing to do is combine the best of both worlds for a slightly unique experience.
>many
Dev time is limited, and a hybrid would require a significantly reduced map. The size of the map is the culprit. During playtesting BotW was designed around older principles, which is to say there were only a few major points of interest on the map (which represented where major dungeons would be). Players rushed these while ignoring 90% of the content in between.
In order to fix this, they started adding all the various micro content (shrines, weapons to collect, Koroks) and this changed the way players ran through the game. They now explored more "organically" and in line with the devs vision. But the unmentioned cost of this is that dev time had to go into all those various shrines and not in the large dungeons that have traditional been one of the series core gameplay pillars. It's impossible to have both, and sacrifices will need to be made somewhere.
That's bizarre. I expected more from Nintendo's devs.
A game doesn't need to have micro-content scattered every 25 meters. Not every area you cross needs to be useful. The idea of going from point of interest to point of interest isn't necessarily a bad thing, in fact, it's in my opinion a much better idea than the one offered by BOTW/TOTK, where you keep stumbling across "micro-content" instead of really feeling like you're making long journeys with a clear destination.
But who knows... the guys have sold almost 50 million copies with their formula, maybe they're right and gamers want to eat shit.
Eh, I think BOTW/TOTK combat is way better than any of it's predecessors. I love the freedom they give you with it. I just wish they made it so you didn't constantly pause the combat. Limiting heals would've also helped.
Yeah dude I love the freedom of fricking menu cycling for arrows and new weapons after my last one broke
Read my comment moron. I don't like how cycling weapons constantly pauses the fight either. But BOTW/TOTK definitely has the funnest combat out of all the 3d Zeldas.
You're doing that for 90% of the fricking combat maybe read your own post before you click that post button
You have got to be a fricking moron if you seriously think any other 3d Zelda has better combat.
The only thing I'd be okay with getting from the older games are MAYBE longer dungeons that are easier to get lost in, that's it. TotK has basically everything I've ever wanted from the series personally.
>OOT formula
People say this as either a criticism or praise and I don't get it.
OOT is just 3D ALTTP (do 3 dungeons => get master sword => get access to a dark/alternative world with more dungeons).
MM doesn't follow this at all
WW follows the first half of the OOT/ALTTP formula (3 dungeons => Master Sword) but that's it.
TP follows the OOT/ALTTP formula, only instead of a dark world it's new parts of Hyrule
SS doesn't follow it at all
The ALTTP formula is great, I wish we could get a 3D Zelda with 11 dungeons and a mid-game difficulty spike coupled with a power level increase. But we'll never get that since nuZelda is so stunning and brave that they decided that dungeons and dungeon items were so outdated and got rid of them
OoT formula is a shorthand for "Linear 3D adventure where the objective is to complete dungeons using items found in them, then beat the final boss"
>"Linear 3D adventure where the objective is to complete dungeons using items found in them, then beat the final boss"
Obviously OoT is the first 3D zelda game, but I find it so strange people "blame" OoT for things the franchise had been doing since ALttP and LA, if not sooner.
ALttP is not linear. You can do a large chunk of the game out of order. It's more linear than LoZ, but LoZ was basically free roam.
The OoT formula is explicitly about the linearity and lack of deviation. You might as well be watching a movie with QTEs for all it matters. You can get heart pieces "out of order" and some other small collectibles, but you're railroaded into playing the game the same way every time you replay it. OoT still had some things you could do out of order, but as the series progressed, your freedom of choice was severely diminished until it was effectively vestigial by the time of Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword. I hate the OoT formula for the same reason I hate Sony movie games, since I want the freedom to play how I want to, not the freedom to fail.
Link's Awakening was very linear. I'd argue that it was even more linear than OoT.
I'm also not a fan of Link's Awakening. Pretty much the only Zeldas I really like are LoZ, AoL, ALttP, the Oracles, BotW, and TotK.
>loz, alttp, oracles
congrats anon that's """""""the oot formula"""""""", i.e. a fricking zelda game
That's not the OoT formula you disingenuous bastard. The OoT formula is explicitly about following linear dungeon formulas with items that have little to no use outside of their requisite dungeon.
>The OoT formula is explicitly about following linear dungeon formulas with items that have little to no use outside of their requisite dungeon.
i like how you moronic Black folk can't even keep your own shitpost terms straight
>The OoT formula is explicitly about following linear dungeon formulas with items that have little to no use outside of their requisite dungeon.
You're the one being disingenuous you pretentious homosexual maybe actually play OoT and you'll see that you use previous weapons throughout the dungeons until you get said item of the dungeon to finish it proper.
There are too many people talking about the OoT formula who haven't actually experienced the OoT formula firsthand. I blame Zelda's popularity on Youtube, and literal children who feel informed enough by Youtubers to comment.
I blame BotW/Tiktok and the influx of tendie zoomers who have only played that and nothing else
There's no such thing as the "oot formula", oot is alttp in 3d, and alttp is a fleshed out zelda 1.
This. There is only "the Zelda formula" and "the BotW firmula".
>The OoT formula is explicitly about following linear dungeon formulas
but oot has one of the least linear sequences of dungeons in the franchise?
Not really. Compared to the following 3D games? Sure, but it's way more linear than ALttP or LoZ.
You've come up with a moronic definition of what the Ocarina formula is and are sticking to it. It's not a shitpost term, it's a meaningful distinction to point out why the LoZ franchise was so stagnant and shitty for about 15 years.
Twilight Princess is the purest distillation of the OoT formula. Everything people hate about OoT is distilled into pure sludge with TP. A game having dungeons with items is not the OoT formula. What IS part of the OoT formula is the weapons having very limited use cases outside of their respective dungeons, the bosses being exclusively weak to the weapon you found in said dungeon, and the dungeons having a rigid completion order.
>and the dungeons having a rigid completion order.
sooo the "oot formula" doesn't apply to oot
or majora's mask
glad we proved this this moronic notion was always made up bullshit by zoomers who only know ubishit
The OoT formula does apply to it, but it gets more and more concentrated as Nintendo kept trying to re-capture that lightning in the bottle. OoT and MM, instead of having rigid dungeon completion order, have item checkgates that effectively enforce a playing order. You don't have to beat the boss right away, but the choice to back out of the dungeon halfway through and go do something else is meaningless. OoT opens up in its latter half, to its credit, but everything through the Forest Temple is played the same every time. It's like an inversed Mega Man game where the first 4 stage are Wily's Castle and THEN you get to choose what levels to tackle after that.
>It's like an inversed Mega Man game where the first 4 stage are Wily's Castle and THEN you get to choose what levels to tackle after that.
This formula started with LttP. You have considerable freedom in dungeon order in the dark world.
that's just alttp
which is, again, the formula for a zelda game, because that's what they are
loz is a zelda game
alttp is an attempt at loz but more
oot is alttp but more (and 3d)
and every other game sans botw/totk is different stuff in 3d
the only game that isn't "the oot formula" is 2
and I guess link's crossbow training if you want to count that, even the countless handheld games, some of which are older than oot, follow this formula
A Link to the Past gives you considerably more freedom in the early game than does OoT. It is a fair bit more linear than LoZ, but it's also a fair bit more open than OoT. You could say there's a through-line where OoT is inbetween ALttP and TP, but Nintedo made the 3D Zelda games so terribly bland explicitly BECAUSE they were trying to recreate the hype around Ocarina of Time. They weren't trying to emulate A Link to the Past, they were trying to emulate Ocarina of Time, and that's precisely how Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword ended up so dogshit.
>A Link to the Past gives you considerably more freedom in the early game than does OoT.
No it doesn't. You need the boots from the first dungeon to get the book to open the second dungeon. You then need the gloves from the second dungeon to reach the third. Play games before you speak authoritatively on them.
You get the pegasus shoes from sahasrahla after beating the eastern palace specifically
Yes, are you just piggybacking off my point?
I am not disagreeing. But my autism did demand that clarification
Look at all that fricking word salad pretending you know what the frick you're even talking about. TP doesn't even follow OoT's formula, the over world is segregated into unlockable parts, again how about playing these games instead of larping like you have? You look like a fricking idiot.
You sound like the biggest pretentious homosexual on this board
>The OoT formula is explicitly about the linearity and lack of deviation.
You can do the Adult dungeons in multiple different orders
Read, Zoomer. Read.
>read the post of double digit IQ posters in their entirety
No
>but I find it so strange people "blame" OoT for things the franchise had been doing since ALttP and LA, if not sooner.
because people shitposting in botw gays don't care about reality, they only want to shitpost
ever since totk came out and fixed some of botw's giant glaring flaws they've even gotten even more moronic by saying that anything different from botw, at all, is bad
I'd feel bad for them if I didn't think it was all a bit at this point.
>the objective is to complete dungeons using items found in them
Is that supposed to be a bad thing
>"Linear 3D adventure
This wasn't true for LoZ, AoL, aLttP or OoT.
He just hates those games because he cant' speedrun them and skip the whole game by ignoring dungeons. The presence of an intended progression is something most detestable to him.
But OoT is one of the easiest games to speedrun.
or majora's mask
and iirc you could dick around in ww after a little while too
It's technically true for both MM and WW, in that both games have 2 dungeons that can have their order swapped (GB and ST, Earth and Wind).
Note how you have to complete half a temple in order to get the item you need in order to take alternate progression routes.
Which basically means you can't really call them alternate progression routes because you're just wasting time exiting a half-completed temple to go somewhere else. Just finish the fricking temple.
>N-n-no it doesn't count
>Note how you have to complete half a temple in order to get the item you need in order to take alternate progression routes.
Maybe I'm blind, but I can't see that on the map. Which one are you talking about?.
Either way, I can tell you that you can do Forest, Fire and Water in any order, and you can do Spirit before Fire (but not Forest or Water), and Spirit and Shadow are interchangeable. Ice Caverns can be done whenever, the Well is only gated by Forest Temple, and Gerudo training grounds needs the Bow (Forest) and 1 other dungeon item to complete.
Once you put those together you get an incredibly flexible order. Child dungeons are linear, much like aLttP's first 3 dungeons. While not the last non-linear game (see MM and WW) it was the last one to really offer you any kind of freedom until ALBW was released.
And that's the issue people having with saying the OoT formula (it's not OoT's formula btw, it's either aLttP, or more generally LoZ) was stale. They stopped using it properly and games like TP and SS are not examples of the formula.
>OOT is just 3D ALTTP
stopped reading there
He's right, you know
>died after 2nd game
Who said that they’re culling the open-word gameplay, are you illiterate?
Nobody likes BOTW’s gameplay moron. Instead of having 5-10 large linear dungeons each filled with a variety of interlocking puzzles, they created a wide spread of small-scale puzzles spread throughout the map. This isn’t going to be the permanent formula for the franchise.
>Meet Zelda, collect three special items, get Master Sword, rescue Sages from an "alternate world," fight Ganon, win game
>this derivative formula is considered miles better than anything ToTK/BOTW came up with
Instead of coming up with something new and original, they just recycled the exact same plot from the last game. How is this considered brilliant?
>Instead of coming up with something new and original, they just recycled the exact same plot from the last game. How is this considered brilliant?
i thought you were trying to defend totk here again
totk copies botw more than any other game previous
That's not the formula, that's just the plot of alttp/oot. The formula revolves around dungeons, items and exploration
>Collect minor relics of power
>Seemingly large confrontation -> Link gets major power up
>Collect bigger relics of power
>Final confrontation
That’s just the progression of most Zelda games anon, maybe the series isn’t for you.
>That’s just the progression of most Zelda games anon, maybe the series isn’t for you.
sorry progression systems were problematic
we had to remove them to make the game more accessible
but yes all the people who cry over zelda, to no one's surprise, do not like zelda
If anything removing the previous progression made it less accessible. See
, for an example.
And yet people overall wanted it more by such a massive margin that these two games have nearly sold more than the entire rest of the series.
>Game changes what it fundamentally is to "capture a wider audience"
>Sells more
yep
Yeah. That progression started with LttP. Zelda doesn't have to stick with that formula forever. BotW/TotK were a refreshing new experience and while i don't want them to make BotW 3, 4, 5...I also don't want to go back to the OoT to SS formula that 3D Zelda was doing for so long prior to BotW.
>Zelda NEVER had gated item progression, and never forced you to beat dungeons
>the evil OOT and its rehashes started that
What did anon mean by this?
Of course all the games had item progression, even Zelda 1 and 2. However LttP was the first to do
-3 Dungeons to collect 3 Mcguffins.
-Get Master Sword/major story event.
- 3 to 7 more dungeons to collect other Mcguffins to access Ganon.
At least Majora's Mask deviated from that but LttP, OOT, WW, TP, and SS all used that. We don't need OOT 5.0 for the next 3D installment anymore than we need BotW 3.0.
Besides new tools that are only good for the dungeon they are found in, it was all the same Bow, Boomerang, Hookshot, etc with mild variations.
>Besides new tools that are only good for the dungeon they are found in
I don't understand why nintendo could have just avoided that issue
i'd think (slightly) better of botwgays if they accurately called it lttp instead of oot formula
but they'll never do that, even when the games themselves move on like totk did
they should say frick it and make a zelda game similar to dark souls 1, but you use items to get to new areas instead of keys. so oot 5.0
i wouldn't mind a zelda game like dark souls as long as they retained link's mobility, don't like feeling like im rollin with bricks on my back
good mobility would be nice, fast and fluid combat would be amazing actually. where you can hookshot up on a boss for a few swings, maybe do aerial combos to extent your time in the air, but have to still dodge the boss trying to swipe you down. really i just want a focus on combat and dungeon diving along with exploration. going all in the exploration is what kinda ruins totk/botw for me. i never want to replay either of them again, once you're done exploring then there is nothing left. the combat sucks and there's too much dead space in the level design. kind of an issue with all open worlds, elden ring is the same to me.
Zelda has a great world for it too. Imagine Volvagia as a Souls boss.
yeah there's some real potential for cool fights even if they want to rehash older ones. i hope that the switch 2 hardware allows them to improve the combat for the next game..
Not a single game ever did the OOT formula other than OOT.
Nintendo literally hasn't topped OOT or Majora.
Just give me 8 giga hype temples to conquer and a true heroes journey tale.
>Not a single game ever did the OOT formula other than OOT.
Can't wait for The epic of Zorborb: Sweat of Town.
Good
Can't wait for linear garbage with zelda-tier difficulty and plot and a focus on ""dungeons"".
We're in for a shitshow
Totk was babby level easy
>implying
Just look at this masterful craft of zelda puzzle design.
This is just a sidequest to introduce the mini stable mechanic. This is the most disingenuous board around
>we need tutorial sidequests 50 hours into the game
?? You get the sidequest after completing the first dungeon. Do you have any actual complaints you can express without webms?
Yeah, and they never stop. No matter what point in the game you're at, the game vomits glorified tutorials in your face. No challenge, no skill required, just cinematics and cutscenes showing you things that you should already know how to do. it reminds me of my playthrough of BOTW.
>shrines and koroks that NEVER challenged me, and never even scaled to my challenge level, regardless of which divine beasts I beat
>sidequests that were braindead fetch quests and often gave me crap I didn't need, especially if I held off on doing them
I’m sorry that happened to you, anon. Would you like a tissue?
Nah, I'm fine. It helps me when I play far better open world games. Ones that don't fall into the trappings of BOTW and TOTK.
Such as?
>2d
>open world
kek
If I had said Minecraft (which I also enjoy) you'd call it bad too, likely for another shallow reason.
no, minecraft is good and terraria is godlike its just funny to call terraria an open world game
Terraria isn't open world. The devs also disabled a lot of the freedom in choosing your path through the game. Not saying it's a bad thing since I fricking hate the Reaver homosexuals who force us into Hardmode instead of playing the damn game, but there's very much a progression system in Terraria. It's the best example I can point to when I'm telling people why choices matter.
It's open world in the ways that matter. You can explore the whole map and pretty much get anywhere that you want, if you're willing to invest the time and effort into it. You can even sequence break into the dungeon and lihzard temple if you want. The only thing is that you still have to follow a certain progression if you want to affect the world in certain ways. Like you can get the loot from the dungeon if you know what you're doing, but if you don't kill Skeletron first, you have to deal with the dungeon guardians. Things like that matter to me in an open world game. No forced mandatory tutorials, no cinematics constantly shoved in the player's face, I'm not even asked to babysit NPCs. You can play the whole game without even meeting an npc for the most part, and the only one you might need is the guide for WOF spawning, and besides that you can just lock him up in an outhouse underground.
It's got freedom in the ways that matter.
Care to explain why 90% of the webm is spent on a loading screen? What in the hell do you need that justifies such a long time?
The switch is the weakest console on the market and every single game since botw in 2017 has suffered because of it
Don't reply to ACgay, he's a delusional obsessed moron
That's why I'm enjoying the recent backlash TOTK is receiving. I've even found threads on Reddit where a good portion (more than 50%) of the redditors are harshly criticizing the game, and as far as I know, redditors are usually much more complacent about the products they consume.
I don't want Nintendo to go back to the old formula, though, I just want them to learn how to make a decent open world that isn't a big playground for morons.
You should go back and stay there.
In fact, it's a very appropriate place for you. There you can downvote people who criticize the products you've consumed. You'll like the place.
I get the impression it was added later on in development because nobody figured out the Korok puzzles using the exact mechanic. So they disabled the mini-stable and made you have to do a Korok puzzle to enable it.
And the best part is that a shitload of players still never realized that there were Korok puzzles exactly like it.
The most intriguing is that this is considered a sidequest in the first place.
This leads to you finding his horse, causing the mini stable to show up. The “side quests” are generally smaller than the “side adventures”. The game distinguishes between the two. Anything else?
Anon, the "quest" consists of taking a board, lifting it up and placing it on the roof of the stable, a 3-second procedure whose solution is self-evident. Do you understand why this shouldn't be called a quest?
When you open a door in DOOM, do you think you're completing a quest?
The “SIDE quest” here has a narrative. The mans stable is broken. You help fix it. He notices his horse is gone. You help find it, return it to him. He gracefully lets you keep the horse and opens up the stable for you. It’s a comfy quest thats designed for players for all skill ceilings, in the case that a player may not even have a horse yet and has trouble catching them. (This horse in particular is named “spot” so anyone can distinguish it)
Side quests in video games consist of deivering fricking groceries to NPCs. Get out of here with your elementary school semantics.
Opening a door contributes to progression, it enhances your quest. Doors are literally used to emhance narrative in games such as resident evil. Do you even THINK about the games you play? Do you PLAY video games? Or are you only able to complain on imageboards about your incomprehension of general design concepts? I would consider suicide in your circumstance.
>this sidequest needs 50 hours of cutscenes so you can put a plank on a ceiling
Full on movieshit.
Anon, it’s just dialogue and a loading screen… I think you’re losing touch with reality here.
>I think you’re losing touch with reality here.
You're replying to ACgay, he lost touch with reality years ago.
Nintendo is definitely stuck in the mid 2000s when it comes to those "cutscense" where the camera lingers on what you just did. but you're exaggerating the issues. it's an early quest too.
This is ontop of the entire tutorial, which started the game with a walk-and-talk section, followed by an unskippable cutscene, and then that's followed by a very strict and frankly boring tutorial. The game does not start off on its best foot.
>it's an early quest too.
There's no such thing as "early anything" in TOTK. You can be playing for 150 hours, and enter a shrine that is a stealth tutorial, for example. This is the biggest problem with the game, in my opinion. The world should be built in such a way that some places are made for you to explore later in the game, even if they are accessible if the player really wants to visit them.
You're wrong, though. Those are considered two different quests, one is to bring the horse, the other is to repair the stable.
And there's a side-quest in the game which is literally opening a door, lol.
I never even finished this quest and I put 180 hours into TotK. I fricking love this game. Easy GOTY.
wait is that what those random piles of wood everywhere are for
I was wondering what they were for and I'm like halfway or more done the game
I died more in TotK/BotW than I did in every other Zelda game combined, and that's including the first 3 which made up 99% of my non-TotK/BotW death count. Never died once playing TP or SS.
It will be in the Twilight world.
I'd like to see cities and towns in the next game. I do not want a bigger map. I want a more densely packed one with more monsters and events.
The fact that they can't be definitive about this is deeply concerning
But if its going to be the same old open world garbage anyway, then it doesn't really say much.
Zelda was always open world, OoT was just a bad one. Shut up and get over it.
t. contrarian homosexual trying too hard to troll
The only contrarians here are literal ape-level IQ morons like yourself who didn't see the series taking BotW's direction long before BotW was even announced.
Not him, and I don't think Zelda was always open world (LoZ to ALttP was all of 8 years and 3 games), but OoT is a bad game.
>shitposter ignoring LA again
What does Link's Awakening have to do with anything?
it's a zelda game that came out 5 years before oot, which goes against the "oot formula" narrative you moronic cretins have spouted for ages
This just means it's not going to literally be in the same map. It's going to be the same gameplay style.
Yeah they're gonna flip the map Left=>Right and recolor the biomes in reverse and call it a day.
The funny thing is that it really has to be the same map. BotW's map is literally just the map of every other map combined into one. You can basically overlay every other map on top of it because they've always used the same world, just different parts of it at different times.
>no more open world
No shit, did anyone seriously think otherwise? They've said from the beginning that TotK was an attempt to perfect what BotW did in the same world so obviously they're not going to do the same thing twice. Literally every Zelda game is an experiment in some way.
Honestly the game was a massive disappointment on almost all levels, and it's the reality is that many are unwilling to face or admit it due to stupid peer pressure.
When it came to other big releases BotW and Elden Ring, people were talking feverishly about those games for MONTHS, even YEARS after their initial release. But with TotK, the hype and discussion dropped off massively after just 2-3 months outside of people posting their meme contraptions and korok torturing devices, the vast majority of players weren't discussing the game in an in-depth manner - like sharing tips & strats, their builds, their most memorable experiences in the game, so on and so forth. Especially when 2 fans + steering stick hover scooter became the go-to device for 95% of the game.
Meanwhile, most of the discussion generated by hardcore fans was were just complaints about the terrible incoherent story (told through flashbacks again) and how it completely messed up the previously established timeline as well as the barebones combat that had almost zero changes since the first game, not even a single new weapon class with new attack animations.
It was by no means a bad game, but considering the context of a 6 year wait, it's a nothingburger. It's a testament to modern-Nintendo quantity over quality mindset.
>6 year wait
>quantity over quality
???
>Honestly the game was a massive disappointment on almost all levels, and it's the reality is that many are unwilling to face or admit it due to stupid peer pressure.
Nope. TotK is one of the best video games ever made. Name a better action adventure game this year. You cannot.
RE4
Alan Wake 2
Jedi Survivor
Dead Space
Lies of P
Lords of the Fallen
Remnant 2
>not even a single new weapon class with new attack animations.
This bullshit here is why my hype died; no new weapons, no hammers except for the bullshit glue-on gimmick and you can't even use a cool elemental hammer because the endgame demands you use silver horns to have a chance to take on Silver Lynels.
>Mobilegay can't even read 219 words
Nobody cares about your pretentious blog, homosexual.
This sums it up.
Tears is great. It's fun. The new systems are neat. But that's it. The wait from Breath to Tears was longer than SS to Breath. And we didn't get a massively new map. We didn't get a new engine or many new assets. We got a lot of cut and pasted content, identical progression and presentation, and most of what's new has little substance.
This game took Nintendo at LEAST 5 years to make if you use E3 2019 as the starting point (which is being generous).
It doesn't feel like they have much to show for it except for Ultrahand and Recall. The sky is empty (despite being the focus of marketing) and the Depths may as well not exist.
>The wait from Breath to Tears was longer than SS to Breath. And we didn't get a massively new map.
Nobody is going to be thinking about this 5 years from now. "Waaaah I had to wait this long" has nothing to do with the quality of a game, it's a meaningless complaint.
people should. botw was praised despite lacking many features expected as Zelda staples. after 6 years, hype exploded and botw became the game of the decade. why wouldn't people consider the hype factor that was also there for totk? Nintendo clearly did since they've been riding on nostalgia and hype since the early 2010s
No, they shouldn't. If you factor """hype""" into your judgment of any game at all then you have the mind of a fricking fifteen year old and are part of the problem.
>not even a single new weapon class with new attack animations.
You're entire post is laughable bullshit but this one comment shows what an utter moron you are.
1) animations are not gameplay (you don't understand the difference because you're an idiot
2) the game let's you create any weapon you want (which IS gameplay)
Don't even bother responding to me you clown shows moron.
animations are a part of gameplay, however, if not gameplay itself.
Look at the original DotA. It took all its models and animations from Warcraft 3 even though the skills, and how you use them, are functionally entirely different.
not sure if using a literal mod is a good example if you're trying to defend the game. .
>1) animations are not gameplay
lmao of course a ninten-year-old would write something this fricking stupid
>do all this
>takes longer to kill and drops worthless horns and items
>that framerate chug and menu hopping
anyone got the korok wemb
This webm?
If I'm being honest, if I do play this game ever, I'm not going to frick around with that Lego shit.
This webm feels disingenuous.
TotK seethers in general are disingenuous, it's basically their whole identity.
how so?
It's a make-your-own-fun game. Definitely good for some people but not for me, gets tiring so fast
Wanna know what else is make-your-own-fun? Play-Doh.
I didn't see single new weapon type in this webm, tendie
>Game introduces a building mechanic
>99% of the enemies in the game have no ways of dealing with the player's buidings
but considering the context of a 6 year wait, it's a nothingburger.
Agree with everything and especially this. If it was made in, say, 2 years I think I'd look at it more leniently.
quality post, have a (you)
>stupid peer pressure.
I've been seeing some pushback against TotK now that it came out of the TGA with only one award that wasn't even the big one.
It got a pity award that was far more deserved by either RE4 or Lies of P, those being far more action-adventure than Totk, a game that's mostly casual exploration and the mediocre button mashing combat.
I will never get over the fact that we waited 6 fricking years for a $70 dlc. Its actually unforgivable.
It almost seems you don't like the "press f to fall" mechanic.
No shit they're not using the same map again. It's still going to be open world and physics based. They're not going back to the shitty OoT formula.
I hope they get rid of the fricking ubishit towers and make caves more interesting.
Also nerf traveling speed really badly, BOTW had it almost perfect.
This sounds stupid but I want to go back to parchment maps. I want maps to be vague with details until you fill them in by walking there.
>every future Zelda will have ugly decayed weapons to justify the fusion mechanic
>every future Zelda will have le ancient mysterious race with advanced technology for towers, shrines and gadgets
>every future Zelda will have the story told through collectable flashbacks
I can see why soo many OG Zelda fans have migrated to FROMsoft games as well as metroidvanias.
I'm an OG fan and love BotW/TotK. If what you're saying is true then SS would have universal claim since it's a hallway simulator like the games you mentioned.
Funny I just got myself Elden Ring to try it out and see what all the fuzz is about.
>tfw you're a Metroidvania fan that migrated to Zelda because of Breath of the Wild
I can't stop winning. 2024 is the year of Metroid Prime 4.
Holy frick I wont be able to take another one of those. Just make weapons and armors more interesting even if it means having less of them.
>inb4 people defending le ebin loot routes for weapon respawn or that the majority of the weapons you use are rusty shit + some random horn til this day
BotW was the trigger being pulled on the Zelda franchise
I'm glad that BotW exists but I hope this is true as well
They should not have even made ToTK
The moment people realized it was the same world killed a ton of the hype a new Zelda game usually has
I'm sure Nintendo realized this
Welp, I guess I'll just have to wait for modders to make a 'hyrule restored' mod.
Seriously did no one else want to see a functional castle town?
The amount of unhinged seethe this game generates is testament to Nintendo supremacy
I’ll hopefully be off this site by then but I can’t wait until the next Zelda comes out and is relentlessly shat on here even if they adapt the oot formula again
how would you guys have rated TOTK if it was a 40 dollar DLC.
much better considering all it does is finish up some of the incomplete mechanics and ideas in botw. a 6/10 dlc
>When asked about Ultrahand's return in future titles, they insisted that Tears is Ultrahand, and they want to "create something new" when approaching new titles, so it won't be seeing a return.
>A sequel won't be coming to TotK. They believe they've exhausted "the possibilities of what we could put into that [BOTW's] world." Also a reaffirmation that DLC won't be coming either.
>Regarding the timeline, they recognize that fans enjoy making theories and discussions. When weaving that into their games however, it's something they consider "to an extent", but not to the point where the development process may be restricted or constrained.
they must really be creatively bankrupt if it took them 5 years to add a grabby hands, a smattering of sky islands, and a underworld
im not, all the 3d zeldas before it were too derivative of a link to the past (oot was practically a remake of alttp) with majora being the most creative they got with it without:
being a rushjob with tons of cut content like ww
being a remake of oot like tp
being a wagglefest like ss that feels like they ran out of money 2/3rds through with how much recycled content there is
its possible that making the gimmicks work took them a frickload of time.
like at best its extreme waste of resources.
To be honest Ulttahand is two generations old since Gary's Mod. I want something like magic rope to take advantage of physics via pulley systems. Would also allow the Hookshot to come back as it uses rope physics.
The new Zelda formula has only been around for 2 games and I'm already sick of it
Three. The "give the player all the special abilities at the start and let him choose his way through the world" formula started with A Link Between Worlds.
Wait a minute.
You're fricking right.
3 games was enough tbh, what more could they do with it? Just go back to a dungeon focused game instead of mini dungeons that feel like some kind of tech demo
It's going to be another Ubisoft open world with no dungeons, don't get your hopes up
My autism can't handle korok seeds.
It's okay, neither can ACgay's tism.
self control is the most important skill you'll ever learn in your life
Why not?
They could change the position of the 1000 Koroks again, invent some new environment, I don't know, a water environment, copy and paste it into every body of water in the game, and release the same game again, but now with a third Hyrule creation myth, a third ancient race of founders, a third Zelda now trapped in a singularity, a third Master World, etc.
>slowpoke.png
that "news" is already weeks if not months old
Why would you thank something you’ve never experienced?
from software will handle the next zelda
lmao you will have to endure elden ring DLC for 10 years until they make the sequel
For me, TotK was everything I wished BotW was. It having the same map but remixed didn't bother me at all.
Yeah no shit. Nearly every Zelda game has a new setting and theme. Its how they keep the series fresh.
finally
What about an underwater zelda
Atlantis-style underwater society or a flooded post apoc - Never mind, do the former. Enough of the apocalyptic shit.
Windwaker sequel
Phantom Hourglass
I want that to be an inbetween game where Link and Tetra explore more of the sea and find a bunch of new islands and some lands with scattered societies who eventually come together and lay the foundation for new Hyrule. Fishing, spelunking, naval battles, underwater movement, you name it. Hell, I'm mad Wind Waker had the iron boots and a setting that took place in the sea but no underwater shenanigans with the iron boots or in the boat, your boots become an entire diving suit.
We know that, genius. He's talking another game after PH but before ST. Plenty of time to squeeze in an adventure or two.
I want to see pre-apocalypse Zelda where the leaders of the kingdom are so corrupt they enable Ganon to return.
>S-SORRY OUR GLORIFIED DLC DIDN'T WIN AWARDS, WE WON'T DO IT AGAIN
Baldur's Gate 3 winning literally saved Nintendo, that's funny.
fricking KNEEL
Anon this interview happened before the TGAs.
it's all part of the script.
>the the game awards
Good, we are healing again.
The Zelda franchise is over then. There's no point even going on.
I hope they continue the botw formula for the next game because I prefer it over the old 3D zeldas
I hope they progress the series by incorporating classic Zelda features in to the open world. basically a oot/tp style game with dark souls level design in a larger scale.
Shit taste
Well of course they won't make a sequel. It's prequel time.
If there's one lesson you should have taken from totk, it's that they really don't give a shit about the setting.
>Link saves Zelda by absorbing Ganondora's power into his arm and then linking with the stone in her
I'm sorry what?
It's what should've happened.
There was no reason the ghosts had to reappear to restore Zelda. His arm had the ability to absorb sage stone power as was shown 5 fricking times in the story and Ganondorf had a shit load of it.
Instead they left her the story with her pretending a bunch of useless turds who needed ghosts to save her can help her moving forward.
I'm having trouble figuring out how absorbing Ganondorf's power is going to somehow save Zelda
>the legend of zelda - smells of the dilation
>The Legend of Zelda (2017) and The Legend of Zelda 2
Stay gatekept though.
>look, the games were totally callbacks to Zelda 1!
Interesting. How do you skip all the dungeons and rush right to ganon? And where's the mandatory, unskippable tutorial?
The mandatory tutorial area is necessary for the scope of the game. You can still breeze past it, but the game needed some way to introduce all of its mechanics early on rather than just tossing you out into the world. That's just a modern reality of developing games. You can't just throw people in the lake and say "sink or swim".
See: the dev commentaries in Half-Life 2 for further reading.
>You can't just throw people in the lake and say "sink or swim".
I disagree.
>>You can't just throw people in the lake and say "sink or swim".
IDK man the DS1 'tutorial' is fricking ass and makes the game way worse because it doesn't tell you how shit actually works meanwhile the Sekiro tutorial is nice and fast and teaches you the basics of the game
>DS1 'tutorial' is fricking ass and makes the game way worse because it doesn't tell you how shit actually works
It filters the casuals who want everything spoonfed to them. If anything the game should've punished them even more.
I mean, you COULD let them sink or swim, but then people will complain and your game will lose popularity. There is such a thing as over-tutorializing (see: M&L Dream Team), but games ought to have short tutorial sections to teach you the ropes.
Rabi-Ribi is so perfect because you can skip a lot of the tutorial if you know mechanics you learn way later in the game. If you're replaying it, you'll know how to wall jump your way out of the tutorial and get into the real game. If only more games could copy that.
>The Legend of Zelda 2
It was just called Zelda 2: The Adventure of Link.
I think it's literally the only one that doesn't have "The Legend of Zelda" as part of the title.
What is this from, anon?
Nintendo's channel. They put up a behind the scenes video around the time BotW released.
Oh nice, will watch it. Thanks.
Here we go, I just went and grabbed them.
Specifically it was from
but they also had ones on other parts of the process:
>some guy recreated the prototype for fun
>nintendo sued him into the ground
Did someone? Never heard about it.
https://linziofficial.itch.io/breath-of-the-nes-zelda-fangame
>yeah, im trans
im sorry 4 u anon
Zelda 1 and BotW are absolutely nothing at all alike
Okay but Nintendo disagrees
Translation: Don't worry people, we're not gonna use the same overworld a third time, expect the next open air game in 6 years.
The fact that they have to clarify this is baffling.
They have to clarify it because it likely means going to shit now since it contains all of the existing Hyrule maps.
Leaving Hyrule should not happen.
https://arch.b4k.co/v/search/image/XfCBypbeAz2oOiZ0L7gyAw/
oh great a schizo is here
That's ZeLinktroony
I have nothing to do with Zelink. I just like pointing out they never liked Zelda.
One person telling people they've been gatekept because they have also has nothing to do with schizophrenia when the thing is true of multiple people as you can tell by their "arguments".
Nobody is as bad as this schizo:
https://arch.b4k.co/v/search/image/ju1tVXK46QnciT_teJFcMw/
wanna bet?
https://arch.b4k.co/_/search/image/sRbRGxczk9bT4ouLrbjSNw/
FINALLY
I don't understand why this board is still having a meltdown over this game, fricking spawned a handful of new schizos to shit up the board.
I just don't feel strongly about the game at all I thought it was just ok. Zelda was always a average to mediocre series
Nah Ocarina and Majora are great.
Jesus... Can't you frogposters just... Shut. The frick. Up. For once...? It's like every time you click that post button, it's almost the most mundane and idiotic shit in the thread.
This, but I actually liked the earliest Zeldas and the recent ones. Everything between '96 and '16 was mediocre to bad.
They weren't. MM is a great story with wonderful atmosphere, but the gameplay isn't great. Can't say much of note about OoT at all.
It’s just OoT cultists acting like unbearable spergs again, nothing’s changed.
true, I also think its cringe when people talk about this games lore as if Nintendo was cooking some Tolkien shit
like they so clearly dont give a frickt about story when its ''just kill green man''
That's always a very disingenuous argument. Everyone knows Zelda's setting is very fluid.
But it's also incorrect to assert that Nintendo never added nods to previous zelda games or made little connections. Spectacle Rock appears in so many games because Nintendo wanted to, not because there was some obligation.
It also ignores the potential value in the story of the individual games -- ignoring the larger context of the franchise. People like OoT's coming of age tale, people like Midna's story in TP even when those facets of the games don't tie into some tolkien-esque epic fantasy story.
>That's always a very disingenuous argument. Everyone knows Zelda's setting is very fluid.
yes, because it usually changes
with little exception each game has a drastically different setting, loz/loz2 is one of the few times where it's the same setting, and even ones where it's close like oot/mm and ww/the ds games are vastly different
botw>totk is the game taking place ??? time later except all of the guardian stuff disappeared and outside of that room at the school the first game is barely ever mentioned, since you have to do all the stuff about new ganondorf instead of the calamity
Similar things always appeared because it was always different parts of the same map across time. BotW's map is just all of Hyrule combined. There literally is nowhere else to go but not Hyrule in this formula if they aren't going to use the same map anymore because it is all of the existing maps save MM and LA.
I honestly feel like we're headed towards the same state as were in After Skyward Sword and A Link Between Worlds came out.
BotW game Zelda a another time to shine in the public consciousness, but I feel like now it's going to wane again.
>to shine in the public consciousness
Who gives a shit about that? The thing that matters is whether the games are good not whether it sells x million or y million
Every time I see this thumbnail I think it's some HL2-like model. And then I expand the image.
BotW will be remembered because it has some merit, but public interest in Zelda will fade again because Totk failed to be a proper follow-up.
>but public interest in Zelda will fade again
You're not articulating why this matters. I don't own Nintendo stock, sales figures for the next Zelda game don't affect me at all
it matters if you want to talk about zelda on Ganker.
I should have added more context to my initial post. I was being reminded of the near total lack of interest in the Zelda franchise experienced on Ganker from Skyward Sword's until BotW's release. Only slightly picking up when ALBW and Hyrule Warriors came out.
>The thing that matters is whether the games are good
Apparently not since you guys jerk off the braindead shit for 9 year olds that is/was pre-BOTW Zelda. The design-philosophy they're doing/going for now for the series is an OBJECTIVE improvement.
>if I state my opinion and say it is OBJECTIVE that makes it true
No, it's a fact. I played the games when I was past the age of 9 and have no real emotional-attachment to Nintendo, therefore I don't suffer from delusion and pretend they were anything more than 7/10 adventure games for children. The only above-average thing most of the series had was the music. MM being good on music and atmosphere.
Nah the next Zelda games will follow BOTW's design-philosophy.
>how is that not still the case?
Really, Zelda was one Nintendo franchise to have actually gotten less casual, rather than more like all the other Nintendo franchises like Mario. Still pretty braindead most times, but compared to before? Might as-well be Dark Souls.
>Nah the next Zelda games will follow BOTW's design-philosophy.
they have already changed the philosophy, because botw's was dogshit
this is not an argument, you can go load up totk and see they put actual game design in it as opposed to botw
TOTK design isn't any more different. It's still open-ended and freedom focused. You probably just believe otherwise because there's a tiny bit more story-focus and "muh dungeons" are emphasized more.
>Totk's design isn't any different
>They just changed it to have more of an actual game and story
thank you for agreeing with me anon
>>They just changed it to have more of an actual game and story
NTA but TOTK
>still has a story that happened in the past and is told through optional flashback cutscenes found throughout the map
>still lacks true dungeons and replaces them with 100+ shrines
yes anon, more of one
2 is greater than 1
i honestly have no idea how people defended the blights, one of the worst cases of copy paste for enemy design there's been
They have no design philosophy now, that's the problem, but you've spent so long screeching that even nintendo has move passed you and has slightly improved the game with totk.
>braindead shit for 9 year olds
how is that not still the case?
I mean that honestly. Do you really think nintendo stopped designing their games for children?
Why? Zelda was a boring as frick series prior to BotW. Not that Breath and Tears are even that good, but they at least broke the mold from endless rehashes of LttP or OoT which weren't even that great for their time.
Do you guys not have any kind of reading comprehension? They're saying that there won't be another game in the BOTW/TOTK world/setting. Not that the the next game won't be open-world/open-ended in design and whatnot like BOTW.
id fricking hope so, the story is over
ELDEN CHADS?
BALDUR'S CHADS?
WE
FRICKING
WON
>Won GOTY from the same people who gave The Last of Us 2 GOTY
That's like winning the Nobel Peace Prize after Obama won it for being black. There's always going to be an asterisk next to that "victory".
Fans praised BOTW for winning the journo awards, and now their next excuse is that "w-well the TGAs weren't always woke" ignoring how they worshipped Overwatch a year prior.
Is Overwatch really that woke? Every character looks like a porn actor.
>Is Overwatch really that woke? Every character looks like a porn actor.
when's the last time you looked at the game anon
not to mention that even the original roster was literally designed with a fricking chart for how gay, black, and stupid you are
Overwatch wasn't woke in 2016. Blizzard explicitly woke-ified it over time to try and draw away attention from their sexual harassment allegations. On release, there was 1 black guy, 1 lesbian (who everyone added into straight porn anyways), and everyone else was White/Asian and straight or a robot (or monkey).
>Overwatch wasn't woke in 2016.
anon those characters are in the base game and that metric has been in usage before the game came out
It's funny because Zarya is basically the only female in Overwatch that isn't bi or gay at this point. Well, her and Dva.
Curious how you ignore the other elements that made it woke, such as how it completely gutted everything good about arena shooters so it could be a safe space hugbox, where you could be literally banned for not playing the meta.
>YOU CAN'T HAVE FUN, YOU MUST PLAY IT EXACTLY THIS WAY, BANNED!
And need I remind you that, ON RELEASE, you could be banned from the game for spamming emotes or for any kind of "toxic behavior"? this included spamming certain voice lines. Even saying "GG" got you a ban. But please, go ahead and tell me that this isn't woke.
>Curious how you ignore the other elements that made it woke, such as how it completely gutted everything good about arena shooters so it could be a safe space hugbox, where you could be literally banned for not playing the meta.
That wasn't present at release either. People were playing off-meta characters and could do silly things like roll 5x Winston. It very clearly had the seeds of wokeness within it, but at the time it seemed much more like a Punch-Out!! than a Coral Island.
>that wasn't present on release either
Bull crap. Blizzard was banning people left and right. Why else do you think they completely gutted any concept of a server browser? Because, to quote blizzard, "those evil toxic games like TF2 were too free and gave players too much freedom".
>it very clearly had the seeds of wokeness within it, but at the time it seemed much more like a Punch-Out!! than a Coral Island.
The entire game was based on blatantly stupid "muh racism" allegories with the dumb robots. They even had pixar trash cinematics to try and make them sympathetic.
This disgusting attempt at emotional manipulation makes me feel vile hatred from the depths of my heart. Any attempt at trying to make charcters sympathetic, especially through cinematics, is gross and unworthy of my pity, let alone my time.
And no, people weren't getting banned on release for being toxic, that came in later. Back in 2016, the only thing woke about OW was Lucio and Tracer. The woke-ification came over time after the game already proved itself a success.
Blizzard was only just transitioning into being a shitty company in the early-mid 2010s. Diablo 3 was a disaster and still a stain on the series, but people were still pretty hopeful about Blizzard after Starcraft II and Overwatch. They squandered it all away with every release since, and even WoW is dying now, but they seemed like they were pulling out of their tailspin before swerving through 6 lanes of traffic and slamming into a bus full of children.
Good point I guess, but if they were trying to make it woke they kinda failed given the massive amount of r34 this game gets on a daily basis.
the two are not inherently mutually exclusive
hell people make porn of the new randos don't they
Woketards hate sexuality so yes, yes they are.
They kind of are. Woke coomerism is exclusively focused on gays and trannies. This is what we call "safe horny". See: Kotaku simping over Bald Gay 3 adding wiener & ball jiggle physics but moaning over boob jiggle physics.
And no, people don't make porn of the new characters. Kiriko is basically the only character since Brig to get any sizeable amount of porn. I stopped following OW in 2017 and even I know of Kiriko because she's the only new character that gets any porn.
Obama won it for not being George W Bush. That's literally the only reason, they wanted to suck up to the idea of "don't be like Dubya".
Nobel Peace Prize never cared about warmongers. Henry Kissinger won the Nobel Peace Prize. The Nobel Committee loves warhawks, but they love minorities even more.
I dunno if I'd say any of them are "truly" fixed because you'd probably just have to remove weapon durability entirely for that, but making bombs a resource again, focusing highly on arrows, and zoanite existing are already incredible leaps and bounds upon botw's item philosophy of "Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh maybe you get a better sword oh sorry full inventory"
even without any of the shitpost/fun usages and purely mechanical having the gmod shit around makes exploring (at least the underworld) something you'll want to do and actively engage with combat in to get more of it, something that botw is hilariously bad at to the point where it is actively harmful to get into fights in botw
i'd call it less of a glaring flaw and an annoying nitpick, but the master sword is also much less of a joke in totk
it still has a base power of 30 but you aren't swimming in guardian weapons that shit on it nonstop, I'm not at the endgame or anything but I've yet to find a weapon that has a base power above like, 15 or so.
EricCHAD won.
That fact that he doesn't "think" it will is disturbing enough
>I'm railroaded into a tutorial area!!!!
Yes, that's every Zelda game after the first 2. That's not what everyone is talking about when it comes to the OoT formula
>finally get out of the castle, only to find giant rocks and rows of pegs blocking several pathways
Yes, large swathes of the map are blocked off if you don't have the prerequisite upgrades. That doesn't mean that you're not given freedom of choice. You can explore a lot of the map after the first dungeon even though you're forced to beat the next 2 dungeons to fully open the map. That's much more freedom than what you get in OoT where you're forced from Kokiri Forest into Castle Town and then to Kakariko.
>botw - base map
>totk - base map + underworld
>
What do you guys think would have been the next frontier? I think the obvious answer would have been space or the ocean. Ocean would be hard though since the swimming controls in both games fricking sucked.
bet
Aonuma is a hack and loves his open world bullshit
They ran out of Dlc ideas.
RAN AWAY LIKE COWARDS WHEN ELDEN RING RELEASED
GOT FRICKING DESTROYED BY BALDUR'S GATE 3 INSTEAD
L M A O
Any zelda game post windwaker was shit and I don't care about your zoomie opions, grow up.
I wish Nintendo could make more 2D Zelda games on the same vein as Link's Awakening and Oracle of Seasons.
They have the money and talent to pump one of those every 3 years.
>Zelda producer doesn't think
You could just stop the headline there.
Aonuma is chronically moronic and the fact that he IMMEDIATELY went back to fumbling after BOTW means we're going right back to hell, but with a new coat of paint dumped over everything.
Here I want Nintendo to use the good things I like from all the Zelda games for the next title. And if there's going to be things like spoken voice acting then it needs to be a game mechanic rather than a cutscene. Let me amass a harem of seven pure maiden girlfriends.
If BotW and Totk has proven anything, it's that the zelda franchise doesn't need voice dialogue
I dont care if its open world I just want the optional stuff to be truly optional. I fricking despise the shrine system. Its not really optional because the game is otherwise a three heart challenge mode if you only want to focus on main stuff exclusively. Also bring back green link already you fricks
>Its not really optional because the game is otherwise a three heart challenge mode if you only want to focus on main stuff exclusively.
Anon, you literally get a full heart container after every major boss. It's optional and if you die that often you have nobody but yourself to blame.
If you wear the default clothing you will very quickly get one shot by almost every mob enemy as the game goes on, frick off with the skill issue shit
Getting hit is a skill issue though.
The only time I died in TotK was when a horse moronicly acted like flat ground was a wall and refused to move in any direction before the things nearby killed both of us.
Since I was on a horse on a path and didn't expect that to happen I was only half paying attention so I didn't have as much reaction time as I would've had normally. In other words, even with the horse AI moronation it was still mostly my fault that it happened.
>frick off with the skill issue shit
It IS a skill issue, dipshit. TotK's combat mechanics aren't difficult to master, and once you've mastered them and use even a modicum of brain power you shouldn't be getting one shot at all.
Again, you get heart containers just from playing the main story. You will even get upgrade materials just by grabbing things on the way.
Now that's a good counterpoint, although even then the majority of shrines are totally optional.
What about stamina upgrades to be able to use the Master Sword?
Say goodbye to technology and hello to magic and underwater.
>magic and underwater
Thank GOD
I want shrines back
its pathetic that it was even considered.
Majora's Mask, Spirit Tracks, and TotK are the only times Nintendo made a direct asset sequel on the same console. Zelda 2 Nes is on the same console as Zelda 1 but isnt an asset sequel.
So it's not unusual that they are moving on from BotW/TotK style anf going to try something new for the next game. Hopefully it will be a good balance between the linearity of the previous 3D Zeldas and the freedom of the BotW Zelda's.
Sadly that may end up upsetting both sides as Classic formula fans will complain it isnt the same OoT formula that has been done to death and Open-World formula new Zelda fans will complain it isnt as open-ended as the previous 2 entries.
>he same OoT formula that has been done to death
i always think it's funny when people say this when there were like, 4 games in "the oot formula" after it
Because the oot formula isn't the oot formula. It's the zelda formula, that almost every game (aside from zelda 2 and the multiplayer ones) followed up until botw.
obviously, but they've spent the past 6 years crying to the contrary
Nintendo just needs to hire Fromsoft for the next Zelda, maybe even the studio that made Lies of P or Lords of the Fallen 2.
Ocarina of Time is the greatest game of all time. Cry more about it Slop of the Wild zoomers.
BotW is better than OoT and I've been playing Zelda since before the accident that resulted in your birth.
>Buh buh botw...
Shut up, and sit down, you are an obese man that thinks he's a child with cuckold porn addiction.
Nice projection there, millenial.
Cope.
The buzz around these games were nothing but the emperor's new clothes. Tears was the safe option for a follow up sequel, but a third one is too much of a risk of losing their audience's favor. They know that they need an actually well designed game for the next entry.
my favorite thing is that the best argument against botw is its own sequel
i can only hope their next thing shits on botw even more
wow losing GOTY really mindbroke nintendo
New Zelda will be turn based crpg.
Wouldn't even be mad.
Zelda has been dancing around RPG mechanics since its first game.
And it'd at least be an excuse for Nintendo actually try with the writing, npcs and quests
TOTK is already half way there into being turn based.
I have no faith in whatever is coming next. The past decade has been fricking awful for Zelda in general and I was already losing my patience after Wind Waker. The earlier games up to Majora's Mask are still incredible and I'm quite frankly sick of letting the Zelda team resting on those games laurels and names to carry their dogshit experiments.
If the next game has weapon durability and the same non linear focus where dungeons don't matter anymore again I'm not buying anymore of their games.
>Please, wrap it up
These are my thoughts after ~25 hours of TOTK, after seeing the few new things they added already repeating several times, getting dissapinted after a few hours in the depths and just rushing the main Temples ASAP.
Why are totk haters so disingenuous? There's plenty of valid criticisms about the game but everyone on Ganker resorts to the same cookie cutter strawmans that are quickly disproven if you've even put a couple of hours into the game
They just desperately want to pretend OoT is still relevant, ignore and move on.
>Open up blueprint
>Spawn hoverbike or flying machine
>Strap Korok to said machine
>Fly over all the hostile terrain and monsters and complete the 'puzzle'
>Repeat 100 hundred times over
There's no winning with these puzzles. They're either lack mental stimulation (carrying the Korok with either a blue print vehicle or with ultrahand) or are tedious to execute (building a vehicle from scratch with whatever parts are lying about). Either way you will need to repeat it again and again until you've amassed a substantial amount of Korok seeds in order to counteract the tedium of weapon collecting.
It's just not a fun system, but the open world nature of the game requires the devs to repeat it again and again and again and again because they need content to fill the world they've created.
>implying the koroks aren't just a stopgap to convince the player to explore in that direction leading to something more interesting
This is pretty much how all korok puzzles work, you see something out of place, turns out it's a korok puzzle, you complete the puzzle, and turns out it lead you straight to a cave entrance or shrine or miniboss. The entire game is filled with these ant trails, the seeds you get from completing them are basically just afterthoughts.
>turns out it's a korok puzzle,
Yes, but the puzzles aren't interesting. At least most of them aren't too much of a hassle to complete. If a puzzle isn't mentally stimulating and it's also tedious (as a opposed to hard) to execute, it's just a shit puzzle.
no. usually you see a landmark and travel towards it and on the way you see a shitty rehashed korok structure you feel forced to deal with because your inventory is even more hellish otherwise.
>There's no winning with these puzzles. They're either lack mental stimulation
You Black folk talk like zelda puzzles were some next level big brain moment shit. It was always just step on switch and walk to new platform kinda puzzles. It's a game for stupid kids and teenagers.
Try to finish reading the post before replying. Stepping on a switch isn't a tedious action, because it's over in a moment. If a puzzle is easy to work out but executing the solution doesn't take much time, it's fine. Korok puzzles are both time wasting in execution (even the Blue Print version of the Korok webm takes over a minute) and easy to figure.
I don't get it, if you want easy puzzles then you don't care about any mental stimulation though. Just make an action game like elden ring or other souls games and call it a day is my honestly opinion. The only thing that didn't feel like zelda for me was all the zonai mechanic to fly and skip the entire game. I never gave a frick about the koroks because i never cared about doing all of them.
Brother, how are you struggling with this? I want puzzles that are mentally engaging and fun to execute. Failing that either mentally engaging or fun to execute. At the very least, I expect puzzles that aren't tedious to execute. If they're going to be dull as shit they better be over in a second or two and note waste my time.
Korok puzzles are both tedious and dull. They don't provide mental engagement, and the waste time. You can fortunately skip a lot of them, but if we're at the point where the ideal situation is to skip most things we've got a fundamental design issue.
I get you but the "design" was that they made most of these puzzle optional. You will waste at least 200 hours trying to do everthing in this game. They were designed to be skipped by most normal gays. This is why most of them have this "repetitive" nature. It's the unfortunate nature of a game that is too big and not linear. But i agree with you about frick koroks.
Tears of the Kingdom is fun but it lacks all defining aspects of previous Zelda games and solidifies that the series is essentially something completely different. Not a bad game though.
it's fine enough, actually better than botw which is a surprise
which makes it all the funnier that totk just proves how garbage botw was
maybe they'll actually make a real game next time too and this was just a decade-long joke
What aspects are those, exactly? Fujibayashi's core philosophy ever since the Oracles has always been to integrate the central mechanics and interactions into *everything* the player does from moment to moment so that they're always engaged, whether they're in a dungeon or not. In a series about exploration, puzzles and combat, content density is more important than dungeons. Most 3D Zelda games fail spectacularly at this, too often having bad overworlds with fluffy setpieces between dungeons or shallow mandatory minigames that are divorced from the core gameplay. Fuji does away with that bullshit entirely to focus on the fundamental pillars of Zelda. That's not to say he always succeeds – SS was a failed experiment and BotW is a little too sparse for its own good, but TotK is the logical endpoint of his design and perhaps the first truly successful translation of 2D style Zelda gameplay into 3D.
Other than TotK, the only other 3D game to be almost perfectly in sync with its main gimmick is Majora's Mask. I say "almost" because a lot of the masks are useless outside of one specific sidequest or task, but other than that it too is an exceptional game.
It's fully divorced from the formula that started blooming in a Link to the Past and was fully realized in Ocarina of Time. Yes, ALTTP had a vast overworld, but the meat of the gameplay in that game was always the dungeons you play through.
You can say that TotK is close to Zelda 1 like Breath of the Wild was, but that was the literal start of the series. Zelda 1 didn't make the series legendary. ALTTP and OoT did. The gameplay of Zelda 1 is hardly representative of the games released in the following 30 years.
Tears of the Kingdom is a game primarily about the features you use and the novelty of playing around with them. The puzzles are deliberately tuned to have so many solutions that you can solve them by accident. The areas you explore aren't fun to explore because they're actually interesting, they're fun to explore because you can do it with whatever cool contraption of your choice.
>Yes, ALTTP had a vast overworld, but the meat of the gameplay in that game was always the dungeons you play through.
No, the meat of the gameplay in that game was from the *actual gameplay itself*, not from color coded dungeons where you find an item to unlock arbitrary telegraphed gates then expose the boss's weakness. Dungeons are ultimately just set dressing for what you're actually doing in them which is exploring and solving puzzles, i.e. two things you don't actually need an interior environment for. Fujibayashi seems to have been the only Zelda director aside from Koizumi to understand this.
>Zelda 1 didn't make the series legendary. ALTTP and OoT did. The gameplay of Zelda 1 is hardly representative of the games released in the following 30 years.
That's all completely subjective, not to mention that Zelda 1 actually was a pretty major hit when it came out. Either way, there are no shortage of players today who prefer the *actual* classic playstyle over the one that moved in a more linear, less explorative direction.
>The puzzles are deliberately tuned to have so many solutions that you can solve them by accident.
I think you overstate the amount of puzzles that truly can be solved by "accident", and I enjoyed solving many of them regardless.
>No, the meat of the gameplay in that game was from the *actual gameplay itself*, not from color coded dungeons where you find an item to unlock arbitrary telegraphed gates then expose the boss's weakness. Dungeons are ultimately just set dressing for what you're actually doing in them which is exploring and solving puzzles, i.e. two things you don't actually need an interior environment for. Fujibayashi seems to have been the only Zelda director aside from Koizumi to understand this.
The "actual gameplay itself" is the repeated overworld that you go through over and over again in between dungeons. You see that one long hallway in the Dark World with those two cyclops like twenty times even in a casual playthrough. The dungeons are a large part of the gameplay and have various unique enemies, bosses, and gimmicks that make them memorable. I don't know who played A Link to the Past and thought "wow, finding that heart piece under that rock was awesome" instead of "wow, fighting that butterfly on a conveyor belt was awesome!"
>That's all completely subjective, not to mention that Zelda 1 actually was a pretty major hit when it came out. Either way, there are no shortage of players today who prefer the *actual* classic playstyle over the one that moved in a more linear, less explorative direction.
Sure, Zelda 1 was huge for the time. It's also one game in a series that has been going for 35 years and counting, with 30 years of games between it and BotW. People always immediately jump to "BotW is what Zelda has always been because Zelda 1!" when that is obviously a disingenuous attempt to challenge the fact that every major Zelda game between 1 and BotW has been entirely different from the open world games.
>I think you overstate the amount of puzzles that truly can be solved by "accident", and I enjoyed solving many of them regardless.
You can legit throw any variety of shit at the wall and come out fine because of how good Recall is.
>The dungeons are a large part of the gameplay and have various unique enemies, bosses, and gimmicks that make them memorable.
The dungeons, especially in A Link to the Past, tend to involve equally repetitive "puzzle" tasks like pushing a block, hitting a switch or killing all the enemies in the room. The best puzzles were the ones that required you to think outside the box for the solution, e.g. jumping from high up to break the web in the Deku Tree in Ocarina of Time, or some similar vertical based level ones in ALttP. That's pretty much a standard physics puzzle in BotW/TotK.
>People always immediately jump to "BotW is what Zelda has always been because Zelda 1!"
You act like there's something wrong with this. Even if I didn't prefer Zelda 1's formula, in principle I'm not going to pretend that going back to their roots is something that should be discouraged. We had plenty of people longing for Zelda 1's playstyle to return to the series way before BotW was announced.
>You can legit throw any variety of shit at the wall and come out fine because of how good Recall is.
Recall doesn't break every shrine in the game. It can be a bit broken, but like I said, you're overstating a bit.
All it took was losing 3-1 to fricking Alan Wake 2 for Zelda devs to fix their shit. Better late than never I guess.
Baldurs Gate 3 blew them the frick out at the VGA
now they wont make any more BOTW games
KWABOTY
the open world fad is dogshit and its sad to see nintendo steep so low copying that when they used to be trend setters.
Zelda was always open world.
Tears was like a shit test Nintendo made to see how low they can go before fans start to wise up.
PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD NO MORE CRINGE ASS YOUTUBE VOICE ACTING IN ANY FUTURE ZELDA GAME!! NO MORE VOICE ACTING AT ALL
I can't say I don't understand why traditional Zelda is dead and buried, given the obvious superior profit with the open world style, but I'll miss it. At least I can always replay OoT-TP-MM each year.
I wish they would decanonize all of the older games so the timeline moron shit could be over with. They bounce between obviously not thinking about a single game prior to the current one for even a fraction of a second and then going into an interview and saying "b-but maybe it could have happened!".
My guess is that they're currently in the same predicament that Riot found themselves in when they were restructuring the lore of their League IP. BotW was that weird in-between phase and now they're planning to retcon the old timeline and get serious with the lore in their next installment, as they're now attempting to establish Zelda as a massive multimedia franchise with movies, shows, theme park attractions, etc from this point forward. You can't have a traditional fantasy series with completely nonexistent lore & shit worldbuilding and expect it to sell well these days - especially when competing with heavy-hitters like LOTR, Harry Potter and whatnot.
The thing about that though is they don't just blatantly decanonize it for some reason. Not only do they reference Fi and have her be a major plot point in both games, they go out of their way to say that the timeline is up to player decision. It's just so sloppy.
I love wild and tears as games but I would have given anything for them to be new IPs. They gain nothing from being Zelda and got rid of the old style I liked. It's like having a great Chinese restaurant replace your favorite sushi place. I like having the Chinese restaurant, but I miss the sushi.
both games should've been fused together in the first place
The point is that TOTK could be good even with all the problems it has, if only the guys had built interesting things into the empty world of the previous game. But they didn't. They created new "mini-content" and spread it around with copy paste.
An example of how TOTK could be interesting:
>previously empty place (in BOTW) now has a big castle made by monsters
>if you try to invade by air, those flying beasts immediately capture you and throw you away
>there are some friendly gays nearby planning a raid
>you use ultrahand to build a war machine (catapult) with their help
>you need to build one that works well enough to destroy one of the castle walls (the game encourages you to explore the building system)
>after succeeding, you can enter through the wall you destroyed, with the help of an NPC warrior
>this warrior is captured, and now you have a mini dungeon to save him and kill the unique mini boss of that place
>keys to collect, rooms that rotate, statues that move, mirror puzzles, all that shit you get in traditional dungeons
>save the captured NPC, kill the leader of the area, the castle is now taken over by the NPCs and is pacified
>The End
But I think it's too much to ask for Nintendo to really make an effort to make a game. It's easier to make the player repeat the same braindead tasks for 150 hours.
It's extremely disingenuous to imply the game was lazy especially given you're not a developer and it's always easier to look at things in hindsight. If you REALLY think they just sat on their asses and didn't work hard on this game then I don't know what to tell you. It be more accurate to say that they were misguided in their effort and should have focused it elsewhere than to just use some baseless "they didn't put effort in the game".
Anon, they didn't even bother with the fact that the game repeats the same cutscene 4x. This is something basic that you can solve with effort, if you don't, it's because you've chosen the path of laziness.
The entire Dephts and the flying islands are extremely lazy.
If the devs have really worked hard on this game, then they need to review a few things, because they're working too hard for too little.
The cutscene is about the only thing in the game I'd call lazy, and essentially as easy solution to the non-linearity issue . I wouldn't call anything else in the game "lazy", and more of a consequence of the game being open world. Like I implied earlier, they probably worked extremely hard on the physics again and despite the repetitive content like caves and shrines...they still had to be designed around those said mechanics of the game, with their own puzzles to solve or structure.
>It be more accurate to say that they were misguided in their effort and should have focused it elsewhere
I don't know if that's more accurate either, honestly. Even if someone doesn't particularly like the direction BotW or TotK went in, I'm not sure it's fair to say it was misguided when much of the beauty of the series is its willingness to try new things. As much as I like OoT, I sure as frick wouldn't want to play it over and over again with a new coat of paint.
>were not going to make another game like our two most successful
Uhhuh lol
Yeah I'm sure
>what is Zelda 2
can I just get a Zelda RPG? it's way more built for party based JRPG than Mario
I hope they make the next one like Dragon's Dogma, a full blown action RPG with a customizable 4 man party and puzzles designed around their abilities.
Long as we can still get more Sheikah like Purah it's all good.
God I hope not
That shit isn't even Shiekah it's just Xenoblade waifu homosexualry
Frick off dude Zelda has definitely had cute girls in it before now. Hell, people have obsessed over fricking Midna of all characters.
And that's a major problem. IT's disgusting sex fanservice that only attracts coomers. It's why Metroid Prime is the only genuinely good metroid game, since it gets rid of the putrid, vomit inducing sec fanservice.
Cute girls that didn't require retconning an entire fricking tribe of people into le smexy scientist waifus with iPads
You are the fricking cancer killing Zelda
You are seething over good looking people existing in fiction lmao you are ugly inside and out.
>I don't care about gameplay
What did anon mean by this?
I am seething that literal fricking carrot top looking morons want to rewrite my series with normalgay waifu bait that has no place in Zelda's setting. You are the equivalent to American consumerism abroad.
I mean I found Impa cute in OoT. As well as Cremia in MM
That's fine, it's not the point.
Just saying, I don't think you can really argue that Zelda never had normalgay waifu bait.
I'm saying that turning the Sheikah into a tribe of bimbo scientists with iPads is fricking moronic. That's far more normalhomosexualry than just cute girls, it's just twitter artist pandering at the expense of the series' history and lore being rewritten for the sake of popularity to appease people that won't even play the games.
Every mainline Zelda game is at worst "pretty good" and at best a masterpiece, and they've always kind of experimented with things. Sometimes I wish you people would celebrate the differences instead of admonishing anything that doesn't do what your favorite game did.
It's pretty generally accepted that the series really hasn't been truly GREAT since the SNES/Game Boy/N64 era. It's why Zelda threads often devolve into shitposting about everything after MM.
The series sucked between MM and BOTW save for a few 2d entries. Are you old enough to remember how completely irrelevent zelda was during the gamecube/wii eras?
No, it's pretty generally accepted that all the Zelda games except for the GCN and Wii eras are truly great.
Except most of them are item gated and you can't skip dungeons, which makes them bad according to you. It's the evil OOT formula, remember?
OoT isn't even item gated for most of its adult dungeons
When did I say the OoT formula was evil? Quite the opposite. Read the reply chain before replying to me.
The game being different is of very little consolation when you think the game is terrible, they've released two very similar mainline games in the 12 years between Skyward Sword and now, shit sucks.
Look at how awesome the OoT promotional manga is.
That's not a promotional manga.
Can't wait to see how much higher that next bar goes since nintendo confirmed totk is their fastest selling zelda game.
>Made Monolith waste 6 years for this asset flip
Sad