>shame, so is a fun little game
I played it recently and it was honestly unbearable. Every weapon was unfun to use, every character was obnoxious, every mission boring, and the world design was annoying to traverse.
Absolutely insane that they're literally begging Sony to spend 1/3rd as much on the same games because it's not profitable or even worth anyone's time by any metric
This. They were schooled at managing businesses and communicating with other guys in gray suits, not at video games. Slideshows and meetings is how these people communicate.
It's very obvious that all the mergers and acquisitions have played a large part in ruining gaming by pushing all the enthusiastic CEOs of smaller companies out of the picture so some suit can take the helm of the gigantic conglomerate they've created. The most celebrated developers are the ones that haven't been bought out yet and still ran by gamers. Valve is the obvious example but even then you have the head of Larian talking about how it's okay to pirate their games because he pirated in the past and knows that if they release good products, people will support them in the future when they have money.
That is the key difference, those smaller studios think on different scales. The CEOs are going to be running it for decades and are okay with building up a base over time, as opposed to SIE's CEOs that last like 5 years and try to maximize profits in that period without having to care about what Sony looks like 10 years in the future. Think about how much money could be saved on marketing if more companies understood their audience like the BG3 devs, that stupid fricking bear sex clip that trended because of how ridiculous it is did hundreds of millions if not a billion dollars worth of advertising for them by going viral. It got everyone talking about the game and they were able to invest more money into the game itself instead of having to spend $200 million on marketing.
This. They were schooled at managing businesses and communicating with other guys in gray suits, not at video games. Slideshows and meetings is how these people communicate.
but surely they can see that spending gorillions on one game isn't working out, right? they don't need to play video games to understand that huge budgets don't equal huge profits
>they don't need to play video games to understand that huge budgets don't equal huge profits
you will never convince suits that all the kids that play among us and fortnight now but will never touch a game again when it's no longer trendy that it's not the road to infinite money
In the businessman's mind, if you can make Minecraft for 20k, imagine what you can make with 200 million. It would have to be a trillion dollar game. The problem is gaming, and movies as well, don't get better just because you hurl money at them, there has to be a solid frame, a director who actually wants to make the product, and a talented crew to bring it to life. Disney keeps proving it, by throwing huge budgets at ideas that didn't have legs to begin with, getting big name directors who don't care for the product, and hiring big names who don't really want to be there, but love the 0s on the check.
It's the MCU effect. They saw how much money the AAA Marvel movies were making and think gaming is the same. They ALWAYS think gaming is the same as other media.
>everyone loves streaming music and tv shows, why don't we allow them to stream games too? how has no one thought of this?! we'll be rich!
Switch was made almost to-cost when it launched, anon-domo
5 months ago
Anonymous
Yet somehow the joycons break after a month
I just want to play the games Nintendo insists on making exclusive to their consoles, at something better than 15 frames a second >just emulate it
I want Nintendo to make a system that works first
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Yet somehow the joycons break after a month
what are you doing with them? if it's the sticks, get a fricking screwdriver and put gulikit hall effect sticks in
5 months ago
Anonymous
Are you one of those gorilla Black folk that smash your analog sticks and allow them to snap back into place rather than easing the tension in your thumb? Why don't you practice treating your things with respect before complaining that they don't work.
5 months ago
Anonymous
My launch switch's original joycons lasted 5 years, either stop being a moron, or most likely, take a fricking shower so your grime doesn't corrode through them, stinky.
>Comes at the cost of overpriced shitty hardware,
too powerfull of a system makes developers lazy
5 months ago
Anonymous
>too powerfull of a system makes developers lazy
they will be fricking lazy anyways, have you seen some of the switch port triple a devs made, shit is just laughable.
Nintendo is the only one that subsists solely off video games. Sony and Microsoft have way more than that going on and even Nintendo is slowly branching into movies and theme parks.
Sony is closer to Nintendo's end of the spectrum than Microsoft's. MS has the unlimited security blankets of Office 365 subscriptions and Windows' near-monopoly on operating systems before gaming even enters the picture. PlayStation has carried Sony while so many of their other divisions (like cell phones, or movies pre-Spiderverse) have failed.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Sony Music is doing good, even their games like Fate/Grand Order are still doing exceptionally well and Sony controls the entire western anime market. Which is where the money is, so they kind of control the entire anime market in general thanks to Aniplex.
5 months ago
Anonymous
They own a large part of the Asian anime market as well and their TV line is doing alright as well. They've been voted to have the best quality TV on the market (it's also the most expensive)
I mean, yeah, video games are like their entire business. Compared to snoy and micropenis where vidya is just one of the many things they do. They're in the vidya business to make money, not to make good games.
I would recommend against defending a known pedophile hive.
5 months ago
Anonymous
qrd?
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Get an official license >Do it without profit as your main goal. You can still give monetary prizes, but nothing of that sports super star shit, you're playing a fricking videogame >Adhere to a simple code of conduct if you want to keep the "official" tag >Mantain a minimum image (shower, some deodorant, etc.) >Don't diddle kids
It's like Nintendo doesn't want people to associate their games with smelly greasy dorito-stained basement-dweller pedofiles that use tourneys to laundry money
>drones defending corporate power and crying "pedo" at everyone that disagrees
>snoys on competitive smash 99% of the time >"ugh, what a bunch of losers, I bet they're all pedophiles too!" >snoys on competitive smash when nintendo shuts down a tournament >"HOW COULD EVIL NINTENDO PICK ON THESE POOR INNOCENT LITTLE FLOWERS, THIS IS THE GREATEST INJUSTICE OF OUR TIME!"
Wasn't it that you needed a license to hold tournaments for it? I think it's because the organizers were trying to profit from it. So if you don't have that you're basically making money off shit that isn't yours. I can understand that viewpoint.
>he fricking corporation that sent C&Ds to tournaments??? no you fricking moron
The company that sent C&D to unlicensed, unsponsored for profit tournaments yes you fricking shitheel.
>Get an official license >Do it without profit as your main goal. You can still give monetary prizes, but nothing of that sports super star shit, you're playing a fricking videogame >Adhere to a simple code of conduct if you want to keep the "official" tag >Mantain a minimum image (shower, some deodorant, etc.) >Don't diddle kids
It's like Nintendo doesn't want people to associate their games with smelly greasy dorito-stained basement-dweller pedofiles that use tourneys to laundry money
5 months ago
Anonymous
>doesn't want people to associate their games with smelly greasy dorito-stained basement-dweller pedofiles
then why do they keep making games exclusively for this audience?
(you)
Iwata gave a shit because he actually used to make games for a living himself and was able to put himself in their shoes.
Modern Nintendo is being run by a Pokemon Company financial guy and a former EA executive, so I don't have much optimism about the future.
Nintendo don't make 3D platformers outside of Mario lol
5 months ago
Anonymous
What about Kirby?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Literally just became a 3D platformer so technically counts I guess. But that's just part of them trying to get more mass appeal with their games. Kirby was already a proven entity and everyone knows moving 2D > 3D always increases sales so it was a safe bet. Now when Nintendo make a new IP that's a 3D platformer then I'd believe that they actually care about the genre outside of safe bets. I love Nintendo btw, but I also love 3D platformers and am not going to pretend they care about the genre past where they're proven to be strong.
You do realize that they are literally following the same path of making games bigger, in higher resolutions which require more development time and costs will rise as a result, they're just effectively entering the PS4 era. You will see because games will take longer to come out, even for Nintendo (except for their remasters)
>they're just effectively entering the PS4 era. You will see because games will take longer to come out, even for Nintendo
Yeah and it already took them six years to asset flip botw and they charged 70 smackers for it so that's not a great sign.
>the worst mario tennis with no content >the worst mario strikers with no content >the worst mario parties with no content >the worst mario golf with no content >mario maker, but again >zelda botw, but again >links awakening remake >bunch of wii u ports >Gamefreak continuing to make the worst games in the series >porting over mobile fun tracks into mario kart as DLC
DO NOT GIVE ME THAT SHIT. nintendo is at an all time low
Don't forget animal crossing is a disaster now and they just turned splatoon into a fomo gaas that you have to pay full price for every few years to keep participating in.
Just about the only thing they haven't outright fricked up at this point is metroid.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>splatoon into a fomo gaas that you have to pay full price for every few years to keep participating in.
What? They've had 3 games in 9 years if they're going for the FIFA monetization model they'd doing a shit job at it
5 months ago
Anonymous
Who said anything about it having to be a fifa model? Every 3 years they come out with nearly the same game that could easily have just been an update for the old one and they charge $60 for it plus dlc and amiibo. All while still retaining those obnoxious risk averse design decisions the original had back when it was a new online focused multiplayer ip, but is now just pants on head moronic to keep doing.
>bunch of wii u ports
yeah? wii u had a bunch of solid titles that sold basically nothing due to the low number of wii u owners. porting most of the major ones to a new console that actually sold worth a damn is a pretty reasonable thing to do
5 months ago
Anonymous
iirc mario kart 8 is the bestselling in the whole franchise
*nintendo releases one movie for their major IP for the first time in 40 years and is under extreme scrutiny because of the last one*
OH MY GAWD THEY'RE LITERALLY SONY NOW
5 months ago
Anonymous
>is under extreme scrutiny because of the last one
lol
It was a shit movie and people still went out in drove to see it, praise it, and handwave away all the criticism, and now they're quadrupling down on the bad decisions with a live action zelda flick just because mario was so profitable.
5 months ago
Anonymous
he's referring to the SMB movie from the 80s moron-doko
5 months ago
Anonymous
Okaym then that's not true either, the old mario movie is utterly irrelevant to consumers these days. And nintendo's still showing they learned absolutely nothing from it and that profit is all that matters.
No any person who views any "investment" as an "asset" should be killed. Parasites trying to live off daddy's money, "investing" should be illegal, you should only be able to donate and not get anything in return period.
Iwata was one of the very few, rapidly dwindling CEOs to care about video games, there needs to be more CEOs like him who are willing to take pay cuts in order to preserve the culture of their company and not induce massive layoffs.
Iwata is an angel honestly. We've yet to see how the future will be for Nintendo but I hope for the best given they're the only platform that have the sorts of games I want (other than PC)
because you like money. Most investments are made through ETFs and asset managers so people don't even know what they own. Are you so naive that you think people invest in something because they like it?
>biggest media form, bigger than movies and music together >its growing like crazy
So suits jump in, get mad when a videogame doesnt make them mad money ,and then start meddling. They see something like WOW or COD and say "we want that"
Videogames turning into israelite business has been a disaster for the industry. 'member when games were made by 4-5 dudes in someone's basement and they were fun as frick and full of soul, unshackled by corporate bullshit and shareholder meetings?
>remember
i played noita yesterday, my memory isn't THAT short.
People need to stop buying and playing the wrong games. CoD's filesize should have cratered the fricking company.
It's just consoletard shit, disregard it. They've been claiming a doomsday of the industry for more than a decade now, as if the slop they get fed on their billionaire-approved baby toy is indicative of how much passion the rest of the industry has for making games.
*ehem* 5 dudes in a basement can still make a video game if they so choose
yes i remember literally right now
people are still doing it, they're all over the place, just stop buying trash
'Member? The frick are you talking about? Pizza Tower came out this year and it was made by 1-2 guys. Banger games are still made every single year, you just don't feel like it because everyone here has utter dogshit taste
>'member when games were made by 4-5 dudes in someone's basement and they were fun as frick and full of soul, unshackled by corporate bullshit and shareholder meetings?
Take the indiepill. Let the AAAslop slingers sink under their own incompetence and greed.
Ok that's great and all but maybe we can have threads about these indie games once in a while instead of a gorillion AAA shitflinging threads 24/7?
>member when games were made by 4-5 dudes in someone's basement and they were fun as frick and full of soul?
Indies always try hard with be another Earthbound copycat with fake SNES graphics. Videogame are too complex for be created by few people except if you want games with the graphics of a Atari 2600
Video games aren’t TURNING into business, they’ve been a business well over 20 years ago. You think EA was a benevolent corporate entity when releasing Sims? Its fricking wild to me that anons are still going “muh industry greed” while they were buying and demanding better products every time.
'Member? The frick are you talking about? Pizza Tower came out this year and it was made by 1-2 guys. Banger games are still made every single year, you just don't feel like it because everyone here has utter dogshit taste
>'member when games were made by 4-5 dudes in someone's basement and they were fun as frick and full of soul, unshackled by corporate bullshit and shareholder meetings?
Take the indiepill. Let the AAAslop slingers sink under their own incompetence and greed.
I firmly believe that shareholder capitalism is pure cancer and humanity would be better off if we just executed everyone who has ever attended a boardroom meeting.
Reminds me of how Hasbro, a company whose products are not selling because they lack artistic vision and are israeliteing everyone in every way, just fired all their artists and designers to give their CEO and shareholders bonuses and plan to fill the void with AI.
Shareholder capitalism has literally ruined the world worse than anything.
today Ganker learns that publicly owned companies are absolute dogshit and maybe there's a very specific reason why we jerk valve off all day (private company, no sweetbaby/esg/corposhill/hotdogwaterinjections)
>why we jerk valve off all day (private company, no sweetbaby/esg/corposhill/hotdogwaterinjections)
Anon, you may want to see who is one of the main clients of sweetbaby. Valve also hired them and they had their logo in their website
I do not understand these million dollar big wig suits who already have enough money to do whatever they want forever and still devote their entire lives to shitting the entire world up just to get more. It feels psychopathic.
He speaks from experience, as he was technically sacked after the Macintosh's success, then the market guys drove apple to the ground and basically begged Steve Ligma to come back and save the company.
>then the market guys drove apple to the ground and basically begged Steve Ligma to come back and save the company.
That era of Apple was kinda interesting. They either had lots of conceptually quite forward-thinking ideas they couldn't flesh out yet or massively stagnated ideas, with no in-between.
People idolize Jobs too much, but the guy knew how to make products people wanted. You can argue that he appealed to morons, but that's what made his company one of the most successful tech companies in history.
They definitely did not understand the contents of that slide at Nintendo because spending six years on a game with mostly reused assets is the exact opposite of observation #2.
you do understand nintendo doesn't work on just one thing at a time and everybody knew tears was gonna be a sequel taking place in the same hyrule, right
Yes yet 6 years on that is abysmal. Nintendo are following the same trends just admit it, they're just further behind the curve. It's fricking over. Took them like 10 years to release a new 2D Mario and it's mostly still an NSMB game but TikTok edition with them smartly reusing and rebranding old features and adding a wacky ADHD tier gimmick to each 1 min level
>Nintendo are following the same trends just admit it,
admit what, they don't even use a third of the same budget on games of similar or greater scope and development process
5 months ago
Anonymous
In the next few years you'll realize how wrong you are. The reason they have budgets at 1/3 of Sony's current games is because they're still making PS3-tier games when it comes to complexity. Which is not an issue for me mind you. But with the Switch 2 they will jump to PS4-tier games and that's where this whole mess really deepened itself for most developers. Watch, I guarantee you their output rate of new original content will slow down (obviously ignoring remasters, ports etc.. which is how they will try to fill out their lineup to avoid droughts and keep the software pipeline going)
5 months ago
Anonymous
Basically, dev times will be so long that you will have mario 1 gen then zelda the next.
5 months ago
Anonymous
what are we talking about with complexity here, like, graphics complexity? that's not much of an issue for nintendo which mainly deals with super stylized games. they don't chase the realism dragon. gameplay complexity is a spook and you don't need a Hollywood budget for that, people were raving about the physics, environmental interaction and weather/environmental effects in breath and tears, or the wizardry behind getting a light GMOD working in tears on switch
5 months ago
Anonymous
With all due respect, what you're saying shows how little you know about game development and tbh I cannot blame you. But just because a game is stylized or cartoony and doesn't focus on realism doesn't mean it avoids the realities of game development. Expanded scopes, open worlds and complex features all take time. Anything bigger in scope than the previous game expontentially takes more times since they all require TESTING. Waits between Zeldas are getting longer and longer, waits between all Nintendo games are getting longer
Levels in a platformer evolving/changing is pretty normal, even within Nintendo's games? The only difference is that in Wonder it changes due to the items rather than naturally over the level
5 months ago
Anonymous
So what trend was it chasing?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Gimmicks/flashiness/spectacle over good level design which is replayable. This isn't unique to Mario Wonder though, Mario 3D Land and Mario 3D World started the trend, but it only got bothersome for me in Mario Wonder.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Level design is good, go start a youtube channel, your crits suck ass.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Replay Wonder and you'll see
5 months ago
Anonymous
most levels are fine ,it's just that the game is too easy for how powerful you are.
5 months ago
Anonymous
P-Switches. Wonder Flowers/Seeds are basically glorified P-Switches.
Also DKC Animal Buddy barrels. When you turn into a slime, platform, stretch up/down those are typical platformer transformations.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Wonder Flowers/Seeds are basically glorified P-Switches.
I don't remember P-switches changing stage layouts, giving unique powerups and transformations, or causing enemy stampedes.
>6 years on that
I really don't buy that anyone would be less inclined to b***h about TOTK for this kind of thing if its development took even half as long
Nioh 2 comes to mind as having been developed in that exact timeframe (at most), as well as in general a much smaller brand with less mass hype behind it, and still getting called Nioh 1.5 often enough pre-release that the director commented on it once
5 months ago
Anonymous
People will get more bitter as times goes on as they realize they effectively waited 12 years or so between BOTW and the next non-BOTW linked game
5 months ago
Anonymous
Audiences already are more bitter though is what I was saying, the amount of time an iterative sequel takes to make has no effect on how subject to reductionism it'll inevitably be.
>Nintendo are following the same trends just admit it, they're just further behind the curve
Fricking this. Nintendo only every avoids the cancer temporarily because they're so goddamn slow. But they've shown themselves to still be all on board with everything that ails the industry, especially now that Iwata is dead.
5 months ago
Anonymous
They definitely did not understand the contents of that slide at Nintendo because spending six years on a game with mostly reused assets is the exact opposite of observation #2.
Are both you moron?
Nintendo this year released more games than Xbox and PS5 combined. >Zelda took too loooong wahh wahh
Yeah and again they released more games than the other two.
bussines gays are not human beings
you expect human behaviour and reasoning from them because they look human, but that's just you being fooled by their mimicry
Because there only successful mid-sized game is Miles Morales, which is directly built off of a AAA game, and which was developed in tandem with a remaster of that game (which was ridiculously expensive for some reason).
The remaster was thorough in its graphical improvements, and involved a generational leap, its costs make sense, its spiderman 2 that makes no sense, just casually 3x the budget.
The assets that were remade were also used in Miles (so should really be included within that games budget). The cost also doesn’t make sense for assets alone, very few were actually changed, with the main changes being to the engine itself (which would have cost less than $1 million).
But the assets are only paid for once, miles features a lot of new content, but its still too high, also miles launched on 2 platforms, spiderman 2 being 3x the cost is the most confusing.
The weird thing is that sony films operated under this business model. Throw a bunch of low/medium budget shit at the wall and if at least a couple stick you end up being able to show a profit and cover the costs of all the other projects that didn't stick.
Of course bean counters are always going to push back and ask why you're trying to make 100,000 dollars when you could be making 1,000,000 dollars.
Dan Houser talked about how the model was unsustainable before he left rockstar. He wanted gtavi to be the last of the massive projects that cost a billion dollars and required a decade of development across all your studios. He wanted to scale back to having the different studios filling the pipeline with smaller projects instead of putting all your eggs in one basket.
The problem is that the Playstation niche is lush high production value movie-games with extensive, mocapped cutscenes. Mid-sized games don't sell consoles, which is why Sony has quietly retired all their lower budget franchises (Gravity Daze, Wipeout, the entirety of Studio Japan, etc.). Unless they manage to get the GaaS runaway hit they're looking for, they're stuck doing these high risk low reward games to stay alive.
>Mid-sized games don't sell consoles
Its just a symptom of publishers thinking they can get all the money in one go with some mega blockbuster game instead of actually making some fricking variety for their console
>Mid-sized games don't sell consoles
Are you fricking moronic? The biggest selling game on the Switch is Mario Kart, which is nowhere NEAR the budget of dumb shit like GTA or CoD.
It's wild that Mario Wonder probably had a budget that was probably 15-20% of Spider-Man 2's at best, and sold just as much and Nintendo doesn't have to pay Disney shit. That turnaround is insane.
I dont see how spiderman 2 cost 3x as much as spiderman to make anyway, even the remaster only cost 35mil showing that the higher fidelity characters were not a large drive for dev costs.
I doubt wonder even cost that much, xeno games have more than double the staff and a sub mil break even.
How do you think that happened moron? Mario's name slapped on a turd will sell because Mario has had consistently good output for 40 years. If Nintendo ever drops the ball (like the formerly "invincible" Disney) he will subsequently stop selling tens of millions of units. It's called commitment to brand image and quality, something every business used to do.
Mario's not had consistently good output for decades, it's all about cultivating a captive audience through persistence, brand recognition and polished games that FEEL complete. It's not actually about whether the game is good or not.
>If Nintendo ever drops the ball (like the formerly "invincible" Disney) he will subsequently stop selling tens of millions of units.
They already do this, 3D Mario sells like laughable dogshit and gets the huge budget with the grand orchestral music, while 2D Mario sells 10s of millions as an evergreen game while selling Nintendo consoles, and 2D Mario gets a WiiWare tier budget with midi tunes
Meanwhile my team and I are struggling to get a publisher to drop less than half a million on our game that has 50,000 wishlists on steam. No I will not name the game.
Publishers burnt all money on crypto scams and NFT shit, no joking. They only want finished games with lots of wishlists to minimize risks, at least you have the wishlists
Just stop spending so much on marketing
Just a big online event from console makers to announce your games. There's already their youtube channel for that. If you need celebrities, just get a host and invite a couple of bigger devs.
I'm not sure what midsized game means to these people when a vast majority of AAA slop is a 5 hour linear pseudo-movie that just walks you through a few narrow corridors
It's wording "please let us shrink the budget" softly in a way that's palatable to dumb shareholders and executives. They're morons who really do think MORE MONEY POURED IN = GOODER
It means "maybe Ratchet's fur can just be like, a flat texture instead of us wasting a bajillion dollars on figuring out a way to render each individual strand at the same time"
Technology progresses and will not stop progressing just because you have arrested development and want nothing to change from your childhood.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Graphics have plateaued hard to the point that The Last Of Us getting a remaster doesn't look noticeably different, what the frick is blud talking about
5 months ago
Anonymous
It looked noticeably worse because all the character models were smudgy faced, poorly animated abominations, the lighting was fricked and all of the colors were washed out.
imagine if you got rid of half the people in corporate overhead and marketing, they didn't exist when all the big publishers were killing it with shit like halo or uncharted yet here we are with game budgets bloated to 50x what they needed for the same product a decade ago
The fact that indie games keep coming out of nowhere with no real marketing and blowing everyone away perfectly shows that the bloated marketing campaigns are not needed. Even Nintendo's model of keeping costs low is fine.
>woman literally harasses coworkers to get her way >lies about who even came up with the name "Rivet"
Yeah how "damning"
can i not discuss how far sony is into the fricking toilet without some /LULZ/ castaway moaning about roasties being completely at fault? like i get it, when AAA goes extinct because of unsustainable business practices and incompetence while the japanese market survives completely untouched there's gonna be an insane amount of racist cope from western studios that infinite-growth-forever isn't real (but maybe if the japanese just tried putting impossible amounts of money into a furnace themselves they'd see the light), but we gotta wait for that to actually happen first and we can't bridge the gap with shrieking about a femoid who worked on a game that released two and a half years ago
>Women, gays, minorities, and California are 100% part of the reason
Yeah not the hundreds of millions of dollars literally thrown down the fricking toilet or anything. Get a grip you moron
That's fricking hilarious. As if you couldn't see why. Rivet is fricking sexless. She looks like an anemic troony. Nothing about her design is inherently feminine. She needed to have a personality and look hot. Actually have breasts and a fricking shape to her not just be "gray Ratchet". Her story sucks too.
This. Just take a couple steps to fix her character, and they'll go a long way for appeal.
https://static1.e621.net/data/6d/5a/6d5a5db8494ed9ec3883bebdb9d2611e.png
Weren't both these games a xbox exclusive at first? I know Sunset Overdrive was. AAA dev games don't get to fricking cry about low sales when they play the exclusive card.
I sure find it hilarious how all these outspokenly feminist women keep coincidentally being involved in projects that crash and burn financially. Probably just a coincidence.
bro the lack of a vegana in development is not going to make rift apart magically cost less to break even than breath of the wild
there is epic internet MY SOGGY KNEES and there is mental moronation to try and correlate the loss of hundreds of millions of dollars with one "roastie" on the team
>and there is mental moronation to try and correlate the loss of hundreds of millions of dollars with one "roastie" on the team
But it's not about that, you're missing the point. It's fundamentally about development teams that are led by people that are more concerned with the politics and ESG optics of a product than the quality of the actual product itself. There are definitely outspoken feminists that work on good games, like you said it's impossible that a single person's politics can ruin a game, but if the people in charge of the game care more about using a certain type of politics to push a game, than things that consumers actually care about, then that's how you get the current "Go Woke Go Broke" trend.
Outspoken feminists keep being attached to these projects because they want to work on stuff that pushes their agenda, rather than making good products. It's their own fault that they keep putting themselves in a position that makes it so easy to make fun of them.
>development teams that are led by people that are more concerned with the politics and ESG optics of a product
what fricking development teams are you talking about here? it's not insomniac, these people gladly ship builds out with "politics and ESG optics" stripped out for saudi markets. i think you are significantly more concerned about thinkgood politics than insomniac is and not specifying the teams you're thinking of is the most damning part of your whole post
what "outspoken feminists"? what politics, what ESG optics? weasel words and vagueness everywhere and this is still not getting into how completely insane it is to pretend these people are even a noteworthy factor in why AAA is spinning down the toilet and not the fricking 300 million dollar budgets, decade long development times and capped-out market penetration of consoles
Black person if you are incapable of getting the context from the thread you're in then it's time to stop huffing paint and step away from the internet.
if you openly refuse to go beyond vagueblogging and expect me to read the room on your own posts that purposefully don't go into details and purposefully avoid THE ENTIRE SUBJECT of money and time for these video games then i'm sorry but i am way too white for you to waste my time like this
Barbie went Woke because Warner are BEYOND Broke
So broke in fact they are very likely to go bankrupt / are in talks to merge with Paramount.
And this is AFTER Barbie became the highest grossing movie in Warner History (Not counting inflation)
>one woman i don't like inflated the budget by 200 million dollars and you're moronic if you don't agree >no bro no you don't understand bro i ACTUALLY mean the hundreds, no THOUSANDS of useless workers standing right behind her. why are you getting mad that i'm getting mad at my own imagination
Actually, Insomniac shouldn't be paid in relation to game sales, and the game had a cost of $42M and a turnover of $49M, which is still little but much more than the $546 reported
Yeah I agree, everyone seems to be putting their eggs in one basket.
Armored Core 6 felt so refreshing to me. The design and ethos behind it felt like it came from 2008. Just a tight, solid game with an extremely clear sense of what it wanted to be. No meandering gimmicks, no parasitic microtransactions or DLCs. It was pure gameplay. I don't know if because it's FromSoft it counts as a AAA game, but it feels like it was built as a AA B-Team game and that made it so much better
AAA still makes money but its true games do flop a lot harder when they do. AA games dont sell nearly as many units so that's why publishers dont want to pursue them even if its cheaper to make and less of a risk. Nintendo are a special case and can get away with it because of their brand recognition and fanbase expect it from them. Sony or Microsoft cant do that as evidenced from their AA games like Knack and Grounded.
>Sony or Microsoft cant do that as evidenced from their AA games like Knack and Grounded.
Or games like Ori which was not a financial failure but was barely even associated with Microsoft.
I can see the problem. Sam Maggs is one of those women who comes from an upper-middle class family, never had to worry about anything, went to school to study English, realized she wasn't talented enough to make it in the fields she wanted to work in as a creative, and so jumped on the feminism grift like so many of her equally low-talent peers did to carve out a niche for themselves as "consultants".
She recently went from being bisexual to lesbian, I'm guessing because she knows if she dated a man her overweight blue-haired uggo fans would turn on her, like they did on Taylor Swift when she said she wasn't gay. Funny how the people that claim that sexuality is something you're born with are the ones that keep changing their sexuality as they get older and their work and social circles keep getting more and more extreme with the anti-male gender shit.
>she is literally married with a husband
She is not anymore. Why does a woman who was married for four years suddenly say she is only attracted women? You tell me.
if you openly refuse to go beyond vagueblogging and expect me to read the room on your own posts that purposefully don't go into details and purposefully avoid THE ENTIRE SUBJECT of money and time for these video games then i'm sorry but i am way too white for you to waste my time like this
>if you openly refuse to go beyond vagueblogging
Shut up you illiterate moron, everybody else can figure out what everybody else is talking about except your moronic ass. Go back.
>Shut up you illiterate moron, everybody else can figure out what everybody else is talking about except your moronic ass. Go back.
Nobody has issue parsing your posts, you're mad somebody cottoned on that everything you have to say is completely irrelevant. Just say you're mad that there's a vegana in game development you won't ever have access to, even in your imagination, and it'll be about as relevant and probably explain the sheer seething on display a lot better
Her husband was the one who got her the job at Insomniac and other studios (her career path’s chronology starts after her husband’s and follows from company to company), i assume after she got let go from Insomniac and failed to find other jobs in the industry since she has no talent, she felt no more use for him and started the divorce proceedings.
>However, thanks to writers like me or Neil Druckmann, female protagonists no longer receibe that treatement, now they are realistic characters that women can relate to instead of competing with them
No matter what I do I can't escape the Cuckmann
Oh hey, 'member how rivetgays kept saying sam wasn't actually apart of RA in any meaningful capacity and lied about being a writer because she wasn't listed in the credits? Turns out they were wrong.
Sam Maggs is the most troony looking biological woman I ever seen. I had to watch a video to find out if she was a troony and even then it didnt convince me
Sam Maggs can go suck a dick. R&C 4 didn't flop. But that is expecting Journalists the abblity to fricking READ! All this 8 million loss is from a projections page, not the actual sales numbers. Roundhouse kick all "journalists". And frick you Sam Maggs.
>Sam Maggs can go suck a dick. R&C 4 didn't flop.
Per Insomniac's own numbers, from their internal leak, it had a bigger budget and needed to rake in more money to break even than fricking Breath of the Wild
I fricking hate game "journalists". They can't even get off their desgenic asses to do a basic fact check on a publicly released document.
See pic related, took me a while to find it. The slide this "profit loss" is from was made 1 year before the game even came out. It was just a projections page.
Bro, turn your brain on for 1 second and see that Wolverine, a game that isn't even out, is there. Again, [...], this is a projections page, not an actual sales page.
>citation is a random tweet that seems to think all $70 goes straight to insomniac and retailers don't keep a single cent out of the goodness of their hearts
morons like you need to realize that a game's earnings do not all go into the producer's pocket. It's like the fricking dumbasses that look at box office gross and think a movie making 1 billion means the production company got 1 billion dollars. Nothing in that image ever says the game made any sort of profit, either.
You can see the slide for yourself
I think you have it the other way around, you dumb bald troony. Insomniac is proof the AAA model is the way to go. The smaller budget games are flopping. The big ones are massive successes.
Wolverine isn't even out of Alpha. yet alone made a total revenue of $390M. It isn't a sales page where this -$8M profit loss came from.
>insomniac projected a flop >still went through with it >mount breathers unironically believe this
Insomniac based that projection on the PS5 reception. They forecasted retracted sales from supply issues.
What does that have to do with anything I'm talking about? Nothing you referenced in the "official sales data" ever mentions that the game made a profit.
5 months ago
Anonymous
How many times do I have to say that slide isn't "official sales data", it is a projection from Insomniac.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I'm talking about the other image, you moron. the one pointed out in
I fricking hate game "journalists". They can't even get off their desgenic asses to do a basic fact check on a publicly released document.
See pic related, took me a while to find it. The slide this "profit loss" is from was made 1 year before the game even came out. It was just a projections page.
and
Bro, turn your brain on for 1 second and see that Wolverine, a game that isn't even out, is there. Again, [...], this is a projections page, not an actual sales page.
. Pay attention.
5 months ago
Anonymous
My point is that this isn't a sales page, just a projection that was made a year before R&C4 came out. You said "Nothing in that image ever says the game made any sort of profit, either." Because it was made a year before it even was released. There was other slides in the official documentation that talked about the actual sales. In the actual leaks, the latest figures are from Feb 2022 with 2.7+ mil sold, 500,000 units over the initial projection.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You stupid sack of shit, I'm not talking about the projections page. Keep up, dumb frick.
5 months ago
Anonymous
All I have posted was the projections page that this theard's OP references as sales numbers. I have not shown any other slides, the twitter picture just showed the creation date of the slide. Which was in 2020, a year before R&C4 came out. To me, this is still the same information, it just is a timestamp of when that projection was made.
5 months ago
Anonymous
So you jumped into a conversation then acted like an idiot when people told you that you weren't even replying to them properly? What a surprise.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>So you jumped into a conversation
You were the one that replied to me. Unless you have some kind of split personality disorder.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Then you must be moronic because I already told you which slide I was talking about yet you keep referencing the projections page, yet that was never what I was talking about in the first place. Are you brain damaged?
5 months ago
Anonymous
If you have the actual Sales page, then I would like to see it. But as far as I am aware from reportings of the leak, in FY21, Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart had 2.34 million units sold. Which again, is still higher that the projection.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Read the thread, dumbass. holy fricking shit, this has to be bait.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Listen, you troglodyte. Even if you take the sales data from the right chart and compare it to the left chart, it is still 500,000 units less (
[...]
It sold 2.7m copies and made over $60m in its first 6 months. By now, and including the PC port, it's almost certainly cleared $80m, doubling its original investment.
).
Assuming, they were projecting to make about $33 a copy, with the amount of units sold, they would roughly had a total revenue of $89.1M with their own numbers. And this is still outdated info before the PC release.
5 months ago
Anonymous
The only troglodyte here is you, Black person. You are so laughably stupid that you've been arguing around what I've said time and time again just so that you can trick yourself into thinking that you're smart. Neither image says that the game made, or would make, a profit; either the projections or the supposed official sales data. That was what I said from the very start, and you still haven't even proved this wrong (because you can't). Shut the frick up, you dumb ESL.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>or the supposed official sales data
That is Insomniac's own internal sales data. There is nothing speculative about it.
What does that have to do with anything I'm talking about? Nothing you referenced in the "official sales data" ever mentions that the game made a profit.
>What does that have to do with anything I'm talking about? Nothing you referenced in the "official sales data" ever mentions that the game made a profit.
Which referenced this
I think you have it the other way around, you dumb bald troony. Insomniac is proof the AAA model is the way to go. The smaller budget games are flopping. The big ones are massive successes.
as official sales data, which, again, it is not sales data, is a projection made 1 year before R&C4 was released.
Do you have the memory of a goldfish?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Holy shit, you are actually arguing in circles while completely ignoring the point. This is some prime bait. >Which referenced this
I think you have it the other way around, you dumb bald troony. Insomniac is proof the AAA model is the way to go. The smaller budget games are flopping. The big ones are massive successes. as official sales data
No, you illiterate moron, I was not calling that official sales data. You need to learn how to read you dumb mother fricker. This is the 3rd or 4th time I've told you that.
Take your meds you god damn schizo.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>take the ROI at face value that it didn't make money >get told that it is just a projection >WELL SHOW ME THE DATA THAT SHOWS IT MADE MONEY WITH A STATEMENT >*gets shown official sales data* >WELL UH IT SOLD MORE THAN THE PROJECTION BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN IT MADE MONEY IN 2022!!!
This whole conversation was a mess driven by you. Even if I try to keep it straight, you have not been transparent about any of your points.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I was never talking about the projection slide that lists ROI for released and unreleased games and I told you this multiple times. I even directly linked to the slide that I was talking about, yet you just blatantly ignored it. You are screaming at a wall and it's pathetic how you're still going at this. You might actually me a schizophrenic.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>I even directly linked to the slide that I was talking about, yet you just blatantly ignored it
Not once did you link it in our conversation, nor ever uploaded any pictures pertaining to what you were referring to. You could have easily have referred back to it if I did supposedly miss it, yet you made no attempt to do so. I made my point as clear while you continue to operate with obfuscating your own information or just plain did not post it to begin with. I made an earnest check over the thread and searched the links in the thread, not one showed up for this supposed link.
I wish I could murder you.
I genuinely wish you harm and hope your third world ass is murdered.
Very epic
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Not once did you link it in our conversation,
So you're not just moronic, but also blind. you replied to the post I made earlier where I quotes two posts talking about which slide I was referencing and you just decided that it never happened. You need to see a doctor, schizo.
5 months ago
Anonymous
So the only post that has 2 replies that fits that description is this.
[...] >citation is a random tweet that seems to think all $70 goes straight to insomniac and retailers don't keep a single cent out of the goodness of their hearts
which replies to the image which contained this slide
I think you have it the other way around, you dumb bald troony. Insomniac is proof the AAA model is the way to go. The smaller budget games are flopping. The big ones are massive successes.
. I have maintained that this was a sales projection that was made before R&C4 was even launched; While you keep referring to it as official sales data. My point was never tied to the claim made in the tweet above, but the timestamp of the slide which confirmed when the projection was made. Nothing here contradicts what I have said since the beginning. Only that you have been belligerently been holding onto that one image made an assertion which I was not using for my main point. And further doubted the validity of internal sales data directly from Insomniac.
5 months ago
Anonymous
This entire discussion was about
[...]
It sold 2.7m copies and made over $60m in its first 6 months. By now, and including the PC port, it's almost certainly cleared $80m, doubling its original investment.
you blind Black person. have a nice day immediately. You kept thinking I was talking about a projections slide when I told you, repeatedly, that I was talking about the official one. The other one, you stupid sack of shit. I couldn't imagine being this stupid yet thinking you're intelligent. Seriously, shut the frick up.
5 months ago
Anonymous
1. I did not post that picture. While I did refer to the information in it as that was sales from 2022. It wasn't my point. I never claimed that it "doubled its original investment". There is no official documents released about the current sales, which would include the PC sales. But given their sales at that given time compared to their projections, I would say it was safe to say that R&C4 broke even in a worst case scenario. That is assuming with the sales per copy used in the projection.
No wonder why this made no sense and your refusal to be clear what you thought the main argument was further hampered your argument.
2. You replied to me, jumping into my argument from the beginning (
Sam Maggs can go suck a dick. R&C 4 didn't flop. But that is expecting Journalists the abblity to fricking READ! All this 8 million loss is from a projections page, not the actual sales numbers. Roundhouse kick all "journalists". And frick you Sam Maggs.
) that the projection page was bogus and all the news reports based on that are citing a projection rather than real sales data. As far as I am concerned, you dragged me into your disagreement with a claim I did not make there.
Most of this would have been avoided if you took this anon's advise
[...]
[...]
[...]
[...]
[...] >REEEE THAT'S NOT WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT
Why don't you just post whatever the frick point you're trying to make in a nice succinct sentence and then shut the frick up?
and cut straight to your point rather than running with your initial assumption.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>1. I did not post that picture.
No one said you did, you idiot. That's irrelevant. Seriously, take your meds. You are clearly unhinged.
5 months ago
Anonymous
[...]
[...]
[...]
[...]
[...] >REEEE THAT'S NOT WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT
Why don't you just post whatever the frick point you're trying to make in a nice succinct sentence and then shut the frick up?
I'm loving this autistic back and forth where you're just saying "GET TO THE POINT" when the point was made ages ago yet you just ignored it for some completely inane reason.
The posts in
[...] >citation is a random tweet that seems to think all $70 goes straight to insomniac and retailers don't keep a single cent out of the goodness of their hearts
morons like you need to realize that a game's earnings do not all go into the producer's pocket. It's like the fricking dumbasses that look at box office gross and think a movie making 1 billion means the production company got 1 billion dollars. Nothing in that image ever says the game made any sort of profit, either.
made it very clear that the point was there is no known profit data anywhere, then you decided to have a random sperg-out over nothing, constantly bringing up completely meaningless points just to say something that people were never talking about to begin with.
And posting a reaction image with every new post doesn't make you look refined, it makes you look autistic.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>the point was there is no known profit data anywhere
Oh, well you're wrong.
[...]
It sold 2.7m copies and made over $60m in its first 6 months. By now, and including the PC port, it's almost certainly cleared $80m, doubling its original investment.
shows the break even and that they surpassed it, so it made profit. Good day.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Everything on the left is a prediction (the game wasn't even out yet). Everything on the right is sales without known price points per unit sold. The budget of the game is not known so far. So no, There is no profit info for the game. Thank for the reply.
5 months ago
Anonymous
See
Because they lowballed their numbers due to the PS5 shortage. Also, early console exclusives tend to have a smaller sales due to smaller console base. Somehow, it doubled its projection from 2020 by beginning of 2022.
[...]
Holy shit. They literally have a slide in the leaks saying they are profitable, picrel. Quit grasping at straws simply because things don’t suit your narrative or go your way. Just take the L. The only argument left is that those numbers are fake. This is unlikely as faking sales numbers is a federal offense; 80-100 million dollar projects is small in the business world and not worth going to prison for.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Well it took this long
This entire discussion was about [...] you blind Black person. have a nice day immediately. You kept thinking I was talking about a projections slide when I told you, repeatedly, that I was talking about the official one. The other one, you stupid sack of shit. I couldn't imagine being this stupid yet thinking you're intelligent. Seriously, shut the frick up.
for him to actually link a single post. And he missed my point that these news articles are not based on actual sales.
>1. I did not post that picture.
No one said you did, you idiot. That's irrelevant. Seriously, take your meds. You are clearly unhinged.
What is irrelevant was you pulling into this in the beginning on claims I didn't make or statements I did not make.
5 months ago
Anonymous
It's a good thing I was never talking about what you said. I was talking about known facts that pertaind to the sales data slides. You, for some strange reason, decided to make this entire moronic "argument" about yourself. And it's probably because you have a massive ego for some unknown reason. To the point where you will incorrectly read what people say and interpret it as them talking about you and your words when no such thing happened. >stops avatargayging as soon as someone points out it looks moronic
Lmao.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You pulled me into your argument
I'm talking about the other image, you moron. the one pointed out in [...] and [...]. Pay attention.
(read your own damn post), with a point which I wasn't specifying. Berated me for a point which I never stated myself and had to have your teeth pulled out just to even clarify yourself. >avatargayging
I think you have no idea what that means, newbie. I am sure you can read the rules to actually understand what it means.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>IT'S A PROJECTION >Yeah, and I'm referencing not the projection but the actual sales that these two posts are referencing >why are you talking about the projection like it's official sales data?
Meds, ASAP.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>news articles claim that R&C4 lost $8M >show where this figure came from >figure is only referenced in a future projection chart >actual sales page does not show a negative revenue as articles claim >sales on the sales chart outpace the projection which further casts doubt on the validity of said articles
What is it that you are arguing against in my point? You say I was talking about known facts that pertains to the sales data chart. But yet you have not concretely done anything with this data. If your main point was >"official sales data" ever mentions that the game made a profit.
Because they lowballed their numbers due to the PS5 shortage. Also, early console exclusives tend to have a smaller sales due to smaller console base. Somehow, it doubled its projection from 2020 by beginning of 2022.
[...]
Holy shit. They literally have a slide in the leaks saying they are profitable, picrel. Quit grasping at straws simply because things don’t suit your narrative or go your way. Just take the L. The only argument left is that those numbers are fake. This is unlikely as faking sales numbers is a federal offense; 80-100 million dollar projects is small in the business world and not worth going to prison for.
You can see the net sales on that same chart. How that breaks down to revenue, only Insomniac accountants would know definitively. But it a far larger sum than just $89M. And this was from 2022, before the PC launch, from 2021 sales. You are right that these documents don't say in big stupid red letters, "this game did not sell well" nor does it say "this game made us money". This is all old information compiled for internal review and is not a true reflection of a sale actively being sold. I gave a decent estimate previously saying that it at worst, broke even with the information given at this specific time.
Still not what I was talking about when I got dragged into this by you.
5 months ago
Anonymous
sales page does not show a negative revenue as articles claim
Good thing it would do that because net sales is not profit. You're still not even getting that you're actually misinterpreting what everyone aid and I even just pointed out how in
>IT'S A PROJECTION >Yeah, and I'm referencing not the projection but the actual sales that these two posts are referencing >why are you talking about the projection like it's official sales data?
Meds, ASAP.
. I was never arguing in favor of the journalists. You have completely misread everything you replied to yet tried acting like this wasn't the case.
Also nice job waiting until page 10 to try and get "win".
5 months ago
Anonymous
Replies take time, but you have argued in bad faith since the start.
5 months ago
Anonymous
There's no bad faith arguments from me because you l haven't actually replied to anything that I stated. You completely ignored all my points to scream like an autist about things I never said, like claiming I was using predictions as official data. As pointed out in
>IT'S A PROJECTION >Yeah, and I'm referencing not the projection but the actual sales that these two posts are referencing >why are you talking about the projection like it's official sales data?
Meds, ASAP.
. you're just an idiot who wants to be really smart.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I wish I could murder you.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I genuinely wish you harm and hope your third world ass is murdered.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Actually being this moronic online
yikes
See
Rift apart made profit though? does Ganker just like being fed bullshit? I'm confused, took 30 seconds to look this up, this isn't rocket science.
"Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart had sold over 1.1 million units by July 2021.[70][71] In December 2023, Insomniac Games were the victim of a leak because of a ransomware attack. This leak revealed that Rift Apart was projected to sell 2.2 million units and generate $73 million in revenue, however these numbers initially had no context behind them making it seem as if they were actual sales numbers. Also from the leak another slide has shown sell-in and sell-through numbers from multiple PlayStation games including Rift Apart listing it as 2.34 million (sell-through) and 2.72 million (sell-in) as of early (Feb) 2022 and made $145 million in net sales. Therefore considering the budget was $81 million, the game has made at least $64 million in profit and was a commercial success"
5 months ago
Anonymous
Read the thread, dumbass. holy fricking shit, this has to be bait.
The only troglodyte here is you, Black person. You are so laughably stupid that you've been arguing around what I've said time and time again just so that you can trick yourself into thinking that you're smart. Neither image says that the game made, or would make, a profit; either the projections or the supposed official sales data. That was what I said from the very start, and you still haven't even proved this wrong (because you can't). Shut the frick up, you dumb ESL.
Holy shit, you are actually arguing in circles while completely ignoring the point. This is some prime bait. >Which referenced this [...] as official sales data
No, you illiterate moron, I was not calling that official sales data. You need to learn how to read you dumb mother fricker. This is the 3rd or 4th time I've told you that.
Take your meds you god damn schizo.
I was never talking about the projection slide that lists ROI for released and unreleased games and I told you this multiple times. I even directly linked to the slide that I was talking about, yet you just blatantly ignored it. You are screaming at a wall and it's pathetic how you're still going at this. You might actually me a schizophrenic.
>Not once did you link it in our conversation,
So you're not just moronic, but also blind. you replied to the post I made earlier where I quotes two posts talking about which slide I was referencing and you just decided that it never happened. You need to see a doctor, schizo.
>REEEE THAT'S NOT WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT
Why don't you just post whatever the frick point you're trying to make in a nice succinct sentence and then shut the frick up?
I think you have it the other way around, you dumb bald troony. Insomniac is proof the AAA model is the way to go. The smaller budget games are flopping. The big ones are massive successes.
It sold 2.7m copies and made over $60m in its first 6 months. By now, and including the PC port, it's almost certainly cleared $80m, doubling its original investment.
Well there's no numbers beyond that, so it can only be speculation. They did forecast the PC port at $20m profit though, so with the additional 2 years and that, yeah it's almost a certainty that it made at least $80m profit.
>no mention of overhead or taxes >no mention of retailer cuts >no mention of development or marketing costs >but it says net sales is 100 million so it must have been a success even though insomniac says it failed!
>>no mention of overhead or taxes >>no mention of retailer cuts >>no mention of development or marketing costs
Learn what 'net' means.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Net Sales is Revenue, you dumbfrick. It has nothing to do with profit margins. It's the total amount of money the game made before anything is deducted.
You should take your own advice and go look up what it means.
>even though insomniac says it failed
They thought it was going to, not that it did. It was a forecast before the game came out. Or do you think that Spider-Man 3 has already sold 5.5m copies?
Nintendo is an absolute master of budgeting is why. This is a company that was never in any serious financial trouble during the Wii U which is an objective flop of a console generation.
>PPG cuts off the teacher's breasts, PPG flops >Space Jam 2 removes bunny tiddies, Space Jam flops >Ratchet and Clank remove Lombax tiddies, R&C flops
I'm seeing a trend here and I don't think it's the lack of tiddies, but rather that the kind of person that looks at an existing IP and thinks "You know what would really make these designs pop? Removing secondary sex characteristics" is probably not the kind of person you want heading your multi-million-dollar media project.
>Removing secondary sex characteristics" is probably not the kind of person you want heading your multi-million-dollar media project.
Yet they're specifically trying to hire as many people as possible who removed their own secondary sex characteristics.
Game journalism can't even catch up on the news that Maggs' work was completely discarded and rewritten as she got ousted from the company during mid-production
is it really surprising that sunset overdrive flopped? I mean, look a this trailer and tell me it wasn't made by some out-of-touch boomer trying to appeal to the "Hip young gamer" generation. This is like a bad parody of the Poochie character from Sneedsons.
>it wasn't made by some out-of-touch boomer trying to appeal to the "Hip young gamer" generation
Its funny cause thats how all the dialogue feels in game too
gameplay wise it feels like its got good ingredients but it expects the player to be moronic so it never achieves anything more than mediocrity
I have thought this ever since the game was revealed. The out-of-touch megacorps the characters are rebelling against are the same that created this game.
The humor here is actually pretty similar to ratchet and clank. Some of the social commentary even. The problem is it's super on the nose. Imagine that scene in going commando where ratchet has to pay 10,000 bolts to view a video and instead of saying "Now even the COMPUTERS are charging us!?" he turns to the camera and goes "capitalism, am I right kids?"
I think you have it the other way around, you dumb bald troony. Insomniac is proof the AAA model is the way to go. The smaller budget games are flopping. The big ones are massive successes.
Bro, turn your brain on for 1 second and see that Wolverine, a game that isn't even out, is there. Again,
I fricking hate game "journalists". They can't even get off their desgenic asses to do a basic fact check on a publicly released document.
See pic related, took me a while to find it. The slide this "profit loss" is from was made 1 year before the game even came out. It was just a projections page.
, this is a projections page, not an actual sales page.
morons like you need to realize that a game's earnings do not all go into the producer's pocket. It's like the fricking dumbasses that look at box office gross and think a movie making 1 billion means the production company got 1 billion dollars. Nothing in that image ever says the game made any sort of profit, either.
>The AAA model is collapsing.
no, it's working as intended, it doesn't matter how much money you lose, just make some slop that appeals to the lowest common denominator and moronic investors will fund your next ten projects
>sunset overdrive only made $500
man that fricking sucks considering the game was actually pretty fun for what it was. guess its just another AAA game that would have been profitable made on the budget of a higher scaled indie game
that probably wasnt even the problem, its the fricking budget for a game like this. apparently it was 42 million and people bought the game enough to put it into profit, but the budget was so big that the amount of people you expect to buy this to make a sizable profit would be insane for a new IP
The profit is revenue - costs. It didn't only sell $500 worth of copies, it just cost so much to make that the sales were just barely enough to cover the cost of making and advertising it.
It cost them/Sony $315 million. They are only expecting to make $85 million from Spider-Man 2.
Everything Jim Ryan said about Playstation in the summer during the MS Vs FTC case was true. Sony first party doesn't make the money third party games like Call Of Duty does.
And all signs point towards that being before marketing costs are accounted for, POSSIBLY even before retailer cuts for physical copies, and before disney takes their share.
From the information gathered from the leaks. Sony's first party need to be doing the same numbers of upper echelon of Nintendo first party sales to actually make money. They need to be hitting 30 million copies plus to see significant return. That Insomniac estimate of $85 million is still best case scenario of selling 15 million copies. That's how fricked it is.
They're not intended to make money, they're intended to be bundle fodder so that sony can keep cod and fifa Black folk using playstation by default and buying microtransactions through psn so they can take a 30% cut.
he’s right, the reason studios shut down instead of repurposing is because they are functioning off of blackrock loan money to make these flop games with diverse casts and DEI ideology. When they fail in cases such as forspoken the studio failed to repay the ESG loan thus they are bankrupt and disintegrated.
and youre just gullible thinking its greedy capitalism at fault
$10 games like lethal company are major successes because at the core theyre designed as being games, not soapboxes for female writers to smear their diarrheac feminist ideology all over. Tlou as a franchise was headed by a white male protagonist to thank and about the only woke game that’s survived not being shoved into a bundle to artificially boosr copies sold like the horizon titles
Now you're doing the same thing to me. I have no problem with capitalism, I never mentioned capitalism.
You didn't even play the game. You just see a failure and assume it must have been woke shit that killed it. There's nothing ideological about this game.
You live in a very small world.
And for every lethal company there are mountains of shovelware that went nowhere. A firm isn't going to invest in thousands of low budget titles in the hopes that one of them pops off. Most of those games only got made because the sole developer didn't have to pay himself, something that a production company doesn't get to do
>release console exclusive games to minorities that only play cod and hold them hostage for 5 years >why arent we making money?
The reason nintendo is successful is because they market to people who actually play their games, not liberals who don’t play games but clap on twxtter whenever they announce a new female or black protagonist or both if they really want that esg loan.
>The reason nintendo is successful is because they market to people who actually play their games
lmao. i have zero horses in the console war race but shit the frick up the reason nintendo is succesful is because theyve managed to cultivate a fanbase who will buy anything they shit out regardless of quality, then defend it to the heavens. theyre no different than the people who buy and push shit like CoD and fifa into the most bought games of the year, except those people at least admit the games are trash.
>theyre no different than the people who buy and push shit like CoD and fifa into the most bought games of the year
To their credit, I don't really remember CoD or Fifa ever releasing with gamebreaking bugs, except for that one time they released a FIFA with buggy ragdoll engine
>Game studios can't support 1000 person teams making games for more than half a decade before they release
Shocker, no game should take 6 fricking years unless you're making dwarf fortress or something.
Most games have almost no mechanical complexity yet still take years to make, completely moronic.
No, AI won't help the situation either, will just make it easier to make crappy games with shared assets
Games used to be made in a few years, alongside the engine they run on, now everyone is taking 6 years to make an Unreal Engine game
rockstar can only afford to do that because they sell exploitative microtransactions to children in an M rated game, none of this shit is sustainable long term
Insomniac doesn’t use Unreal, they use their own shitty engine. Had they used Unreal, they wouldn’t have all these fricking issues in the finished product.
Rmemeber the globohomosexual is pullingbthe plugs on ESG for the most part because they had to fund the Ukraine and Israel war. This is what is going on now and woke companies are going bankrupt and doing layoffs
It was artificially maintained by ESG money
Who the hell would actually want to buy woke crap?
At least they finally are getting consequences of stabbing their audience
Ok I am breaking my 7 year long silence, lads, so congrats. This thread got me fired up. What the everloving frick is the reason why executives are put in position such as video games where they are hired to make money but no fricking zero when it comes to the company they work for? Where is the logic in that? Why are they literally hired? I am extremely, extremely confused. How the absolute frick does that make any sense?
There is a belief that people with business acumen can lead any ship. It worked for Sega with Tom Kalinsky but he was a master toy marketer and games were (are) toys. There's a good Steve jobs quote in thread about quality leaving after success as sales Black folk enter.
Basically corpos chase short term gains and ignore the soul root of the game medium which is about making good game. Though GTA and TLOU are what people copy now for max gains. (at a loss)
>Basically corpos chase short term gains and ignore the soul root of the game medium which is about making good game.
Anon this post makes too much sense. Aren't you forgetting to blame women and minorities?
this is literally why the only good video games that exist are only designed by men who love video games, small companies that love games, and indie single devs WHO LOVE GAMES.
>peter moore knew nothing about games before running sega because he was running reebok beforehand >learned from his son after being hired >led the Dreamcast to a lot of sales, selling as much as the saturn in half the time >went on to oversee the Xbox 360 launch and led the company to insane success until he left and mattrick took over >then became the head of ea sports, who have the best selling games that normies can't get enough of and made them billions off loot boxes
Moore knew his shit. In 2012 he called the current state of the industry
https://archive.is/sqscF
From what I heard, finance graduates are taught how to milk the company for short-term profit to get that sweet stock market growth and then to skip town before the firm falls apart. They're pretty much taught to cannibalize the stuff they're being trusted with.
>I think, ultimately, those microtransactions will be in every game, but the game itself or the access to the game will be free
Fricking Genshin Impact
Falling upwards and doing well as money men at other companies. Jim Ryan in particular had that gaffe about old games that pissed people off. >"I was at a Gran Turismo event recently where they had PS1, PS2, PS3 and PS4 games, and the PS1 and the PS2 games, they looked ancient, like why would anybody play this?"
Any gamer knows how dumb that statement is, even if he's worked in the industry for years.
because investors don't care about individual companies
investors dump their money in a ton of different ventures and make their money by selling them to other investors
they don't care where a company will be 10 years from now and long term growth
they want to make their money back and then frick off
so they hire people who can make them money in their projected desired period by any means necessary
they don't care about the company, work culture, the employees, the industry or the market, just the money they can make from it
Money is a score and if you don't have much you're losing
I believe the people narcissistic enough to become a CEO all have this ideaology. Gaming also started to swarm with insane money so people that wanted easy cash saw gaming as their golden ticket. These vampires only exist to drain the blood from gaming and turn it into a dead industrialized husk
its the same as career politicians.
its mostly nepotism and an education that focuses on one specific thing that has been done the same for decades.
a ceo knows how to run a company at a macro scale.
their workflow more often than not is hire people cheap to keep costs down and barely create a somewhat product whose sole purpose is increasing the stock value.
they dont need to know what their actual company does or how the underlying assembly line works in a factory(the company as it were).
you can literally blame the israelites unironically for this.
before modern capitalism most people that were in leadership positions were the ones that made it there themselves.
henry ford was a mechanical engineer. satoru iwata was a software programmer.
old politicians were similar.
ministers of agriculture were farmers. health ministers were docors or chemists.
this is not the case anymore.
people that go to business school hardly ever have run their own business in a certain niche. they get hired by a company and lead it with no experience in the field the company works in due to nepotism and favoritism.
>makes a woke game that spits on the face of old fans, or a woke game that panders to NOBODY >it doesnt profit >SHOCKED PIKACHU FACE DOT JPEG
SJW GAMES/GAMES MADE BY SJW's THAT BOMBED >BattleFieldV >Mirrors Edge Catalyst >Wolfenstein 2 >Wolfenstein young lesbians >Anthem >Mafia 3 >Watch Dogs 2 >Mass Effect Andromeda >Lawbreakers >Sunset@ "NOT THE FRICKING OVERDRIVE ONE" >Revolution 60 >Depression quest >Life is strange 2 >Battleborn >Pillars of Eternity 2 >Dishonored 2 >Dishonored 2: Death of the Outsider >Tacoma >Virginia >Where The Water Tastes Like Wine >River City Girls >Tyranny >Drawn to Death >Agents of Mayhem >Bless Online >Hyper Universe >Telltale Games- the whole company >Baldur's Gate: Siege of Dragonspear >Dead Rising 4 >Bleeding Edge >2064: Read Only Memories >INVISIBLE >Orphan >DmC: DMC >Thi4f >MARVEL AVENGERS >Sam & Max Remastered >Medal of honor VR >=GOOGLE STADIA= >VTMB2 = BEFORE IT EVEN LAUNCHED >Crash 4 >RETURNAL >Destruction all stars >Magic: Legends >CRUCIBLE >DoubleFine = the whole company >deathflop >joyless adventures of empathy woman >RESIDENT EVIL 4 VR >BATTLEFIELD 2042 >battletoads 2020 >KOTOR REMAKE = BEFORE IT EVEN LAUNCHED >AI the troony files >AI the troony files 41% initiative >Grid Legends >Back 4 blood >phantasy star online 2 >watch doges region >MANKIND DIVIDED >VODEO GAMES = WHOLE COMPANY >saints row HUZZAH >potionomics >GOTHAN CITY QUEERS >Marvel Rising Sun >FORESKIN >We Are OFK >paraplegic dream tour >Waypoint =THE WHOLE COMPANY >red FAIL >omen-of-sorrow >PREY >TLOU2 >WHORIZON FORBIDEN WEST >tales of borderlands >Volition - the whole company >SEGA HYENAS >prototype 2 >THE DAY BEFORE >TLOU ONLINE >ratchet and clank a rift in my wallet
NON SJW GAMES THAT GOT POZZLED AND SUFFERED FROM IT >Control >GEARS 5 >Wildstar >REmake 3 >FF7R PS4 >WoW >no more heroes 3 >TABLETOP SIMULATOR >tokyo mirage sessions >guardians of the galaxy >ex-cool girls
>Xbone exclusive sells like shit, re-releases well after everyone has forgotten about it >PS5 exclusive sells like shit, re-releases well after everyone has forgotten about it
Hmm... I'm noticing a pattern here...
You mean putting way too much money in singular projects can be risky due to the possibility of it not providing a good return on investment?
Colour me shocked.
>budget $42 million >revenue just over 42 million
it unironically did good but got fricked by a budget that probably shouldnt have been so big for a new IP
Damn what do you mean games with ZERO fricking marketing dont sell, yet dog shit games like Last of Us 2 sell a zillion copies because they have commericals and ads (and pander to the queers but thats a whole other thing)
Ratchet was never meant to have a AAA budget. The games used to be made on a yearly basis and even with rising development costs and HD development in the PS3 era, they were still able to consistently produce games for the series.
Why the frick would you give a furgay pixar platformer game (that's not even as edgy as it used to be and is now more kid friendly) such a big budget and expect a return? And according to the leaks the next game won't be out until 2029, the frick? Again it's a kiddy platformer. Shit makes no sense
Wasn't sunset overdrive set to "not giving revenue to the studio" becaue it was a "commision work" or somehing? like you get paid 100 dollars to make a product, these 100 dollars cover the production and your actual profit, and any revenue generate goes to the publisher afterwrds?
Good. They're getting cannibalized by indies with ever growing capabilities and how easy it is for anyone to make games these days. They can learn how to manage all their money and make the best use of it, or they can die. They can start by rethinking all the useless or detrimental types of people they hire.
I really hope these slides get them to pump out a quicker R&C game. 40 dollar, 10 hour simple game with replayability via arena planets or co-op. Cut back the setpieces and crazy animations.
Plans change. The X-Men shit is stuck because of a deal but they can absolutely change up how they approach their own IP and the scale of it. A 2029 R&C game means a launch title to show off new visuals/graphics aka nonprofitable flop
>hire undesirables to fill quotas >has to redo a lot of work >panders to boring cinematics in a desperate attempt to please new crowd that will not buy product >fail
Get woke, go broke.
Rift apart made profit though? does Ganker just like being fed bullshit? I'm confused, took 30 seconds to look this up, this isn't rocket science.
"Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart had sold over 1.1 million units by July 2021.[70][71] In December 2023, Insomniac Games were the victim of a leak because of a ransomware attack. This leak revealed that Rift Apart was projected to sell 2.2 million units and generate $73 million in revenue, however these numbers initially had no context behind them making it seem as if they were actual sales numbers. Also from the leak another slide has shown sell-in and sell-through numbers from multiple PlayStation games including Rift Apart listing it as 2.34 million (sell-through) and 2.72 million (sell-in) as of early (Feb) 2022 and made $145 million in net sales. Therefore considering the budget was $81 million, the game has made at least $64 million in profit and was a commercial success"
>AAA is DYING because two games nobody gives a flying frick about didn't do well
Why is Ganker of all places filled with effeminate creatures falling for sensationalist statements that are complete bullshit?
aaa is dying because insomniac is literally begging to not have such horrible horrible budgets going towards just one video game and because hundreds of millions of dollars on one project is fricking moronic
aaa is dying because aaa is moronic and so is every single person on this godforsaken blue marble that thinks hundreds of millions of dollars being put towards one mediocre game is in any way sensible
Insomniac is begging for more money because they're one of the few studios where the employees aren't treated like slaves which means labor is expensive. The biggest cost of any business is payroll
We have internal presentations and other corpo bullshit where they're asking for the same amount of money or less and for it to not be spent on just one project. "Insomniac is begging for more money" is completely imaginary.
aaa is dying because insomniac is literally begging to not have such horrible horrible budgets going towards just one video game and because hundreds of millions of dollars on one project is fricking moronic
aaa is dying because aaa is moronic and so is every single person on this godforsaken blue marble that thinks hundreds of millions of dollars being put towards one mediocre game is in any way sensible
AAA isn't dying, Insomniac's AAA games are making a shitload of money. It's only their AA games were purportedly floundering, but even that's only true of Sunset Overdrive, Rift Apart did well and Miles Morales made fricking bank compared to what it cost.
>AAA isn't dying, Insomniac's AAA games are making a shitload of money
THIS DOESN'T MATTER WHEN YOUR BUDGET BEFORE SHIPMENT IS $300M
YOU HAVE TO MAKE $300M IN SALES TO BREAK EVEN
YOU FRICKING moron
THAT'S NOT WORTH IT BY ANY STRETCH OF IMAGINATION WHY WOULD YOU BANK HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS ON ONE PROJECT TO MAKE SOLELY ENOUGH TO BREAK EVEN AND *MAYBE* FUND THE NEXT ONE
>SOLELY ENOUGH TO BREAK EVEN
500 is more than 300, not the same as. They're making 2x the profit with a AAA game than a AA game.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Insomniac put out slides asking "let's make a game with a 100 million budget instead of a 300 million budget if nobody is going to notice the difference between the two" and your dumb enabling ass is here arguing that instead of 100 million to make 500 million they should keep on with doing 300 million to make 500 million.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>let's make a game with a 100 million budget instead of a 300 million budget if nobody is going to notice the difference between the two >100 million to make 500 million they should keep on with doing 300 million to make 500 million
No. Just straight up, flat out, No. You're wrong. You didn't comprehend the slides. You didn't look at the sales data.
Their AA games do not make the same profit as their AAA games.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>You didn't comprehend the slides.
don't pull this shit
5 months ago
Anonymous
>2 (two) AA games profit = 1 (one) AAA game profit
That's 2 AA, not 1.
And it takes the same time to make 2 (two) AA games as it does 1 AAA.
5 months ago
Anonymous
your argument is that instead of two games of equal quality and higher profitability they could make one game of the same quality and way lower profitability due to the budget increase? you're bad at math
5 months ago
Anonymous
No, it's that you can't say AAA is dying from Insomniac's leak. >equal quality >same quality
homosexual.
5 months ago
Anonymous
i am loving your horrible delusion that AAA games are inherently quality just because they've got a lot of money pumped into them
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Their AA games do not make the same profit as their AAA games.
You can make more of them in less time for the same or more money with greater profit margins on each one. AAA games make no sense for anyone.
>100mil is mid sized >alan wake 2 was 50mil and is called an AAA game
these definitions are really stupid
They aren't intended to make sense to You The Consumer, obviously, these are internal slides for meetings and for The Board. It's intended to sway over moron suits that are addicted to throwing money into a septic tank.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Dude, you can literally charge whatever you want for a game. Making a AA game and charging AAA prices means you WILL make the EVEN MORE profit than AAA games.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Oh well gee, why don't they just charge $1000 per game and make billions then?
5 months ago
Anonymous
That's what they're doing. Making A games and charging A AAA prices
Anyone who agrees games should be 70 dollars is a moron
>YOU HAVE TO MAKE $300M IN SALES TO BREAK EVEN
No, you need to make more than that to break even. Retailers take a cut of all product sales and even on a first party digital storefront the company pays taxes.
Spider-Man 2 has already made more than that barely 2 months in, it's going to be profitable. People also forget that Sony has never treaty their first party titles as a crutch, they're vanity projects to bring people into the ecosystem. They're primary profit comes from services and subscriptions and third party game royalties. People have this misconception about any company not named Nintendo needing their first party titles to Stat afloat
It's projected to lose $8million overall. If they weren't a Sony 1st party now that'd probably end the company. By comparison it only took Alphadream being in $4million debt to declare bankruptcy.
It was. Before the game came out.
But it ended up making double its cost.
[...]
It sold 2.7m copies and made over $60m in its first 6 months. By now, and including the PC port, it's almost certainly cleared $80m, doubling its original investment.
By median, if game development time and costs keep going up forever, it's inevitable that it will eventually break apart. Only the strongest games in the world like GTA can succeed, but for everything else it's going to be a lot more difficult.
Hell GTA6 is gonna have to struggle really hard itself. It's going to be on fewer platforms than GTA5, costed more to make and the higher price of games now isn't going to make up the difference. It's gonna take longer to break even than GTA5 did and might not be able to brute-force the break even point.
Good, I hope a crash happens same with the movie industry. I'm tired of soulless nostalgia bait slop of established IPs being pumped for their name alone to treat consumers like cattle. I want things to actually come out again by people passionate about what they're making.
What is making it so that games and movies and TV shows cost 300+ million to make. How does something like a crappy LOTR Amazon show cost over a billion dollars when it still has bad CGI, camera work and E-List actors. How does an asset flip sequel take 5 years to make and cost over 300 million when it has less content, more MJ sections and a large segment of helping gay and deaf people. How does an Indiana Jones movie with an 86 year old man cost 300 million? How do so many games in the last fifteen years cost more than fricking Avatar to make and still turn out shit. Over half a billion dollars is pissed away, multiple times by Californian corporations for a product thats a 3/10 at best.
Mismanagement, the reason why every recent Disney movie's costs is 250+M is because they spend a good chunk of the money on overvalued celebrities, then you have the fact that they use incredibly expensively technollogy like mocap and greenscreen.
The final part is that since there are tight deadlines there is no time to plan out development so if there are rewrites/reshoots they will throw money to fix the problem at a point where costs for that are incredibly expensive.
>~2008 >Budget for games was a few potatoes and some twine for development with the rest going into marketing >Crap out games literally once a year >Turn a massive profit as a result
>~2018 >Budget for games is enough to make some south american countries blush with envy >Games take 5 years or more to develop >It flops
AAA Games used to be 6-13 hours unless they were turn based rpgs with few exceptions. Now games are 25+ hours minimum and you still have zoomers screaming about how it isn't long enough. Not sustainable.
microsoft's xbox sales declined 15% this year, WITH starfield as an incentive, and PS5 sales are on the exact same pace as the PS4's sales were at the same point in its lifetime
>women ACTUALLY fought to NOT sexualize a FRICKING CAT
Are women actually moronic? Do they really think some time down the line some beta male won't support them because they're busy jerking off to a cat? Or is it just instinctual for women to suppress shit like this?
i imagine it's the female equivalent of being super vocal about e-girl but then wanting to diddle kids. she was super against sexualizing the animal because well...you just know.
>n-n-NOOO HOW CAN INSOMNIAC DARE TO MAKE ANYTHING OTHER THAN GAY CAPESHIT 1 and 2 ANYMORE? >pssh no i did not support them in anything prior are you nuts?
This is Ganker so playstation has literally never made money and every year its on the market snoy goes further into debt despite it being one of their most successful product lines and nintendo has never spent a dollar without at least quadrupling it.
Ignoring the quality of Rift Apart (it's shit), why did they project/estimate it to be a flop? Even if that's not the case the data they were working with up until release said it would be.
Why would they release a game they thought was going to lose them money? It makes no sense
Because they lowballed their numbers due to the PS5 shortage. Also, early console exclusives tend to have a smaller sales due to smaller console base. Somehow, it doubled its projection from 2020 by beginning of 2022.
[...]
I'm loving this autistic back and forth where you're just saying "GET TO THE POINT" when the point was made ages ago yet you just ignored it for some completely inane reason.
The posts in [...] [...] made it very clear that the point was there is no known profit data anywhere, then you decided to have a random sperg-out over nothing, constantly bringing up completely meaningless points just to say something that people were never talking about to begin with.
And posting a reaction image with every new post doesn't make you look refined, it makes you look autistic.
Holy shit. They literally have a slide in the leaks saying they are profitable, picrel. Quit grasping at straws simply because things don’t suit your narrative or go your way. Just take the L. The only argument left is that those numbers are fake. This is unlikely as faking sales numbers is a federal offense; 80-100 million dollar projects is small in the business world and not worth going to prison for.
I'm not arguing it's false or anything since it's from the horses mouth, but it seems the pic rel misrepresented a bunch of things.
Net Sales is not net revenue. Net sales, if used accurately, does not take into account COGS, which would include the 30% or so distributor cut for the ~63% physical sales, (1st party digital sales probably don't incur license/Playstation store cut.)
I also doubt that 83 million include marketing cost, which is typically a double digit percentage of dev budget (I think there were cases of 100% or higher, but no way that's the case for Ratchet).
Also taxes and shit.
Tldr game profitable. But the 64m profit number thrown around by outlet is calculated by sub 80 IQs.
Agreed. My comment was to address a couple anons claiming the game was not profitable, as claimed by the media initially. We can argue how profitable they are, but that slide claiming they are profitable was from Feb 2022. So if we accept that at face value, then the initial media claims and from some people here are wrong, about its non-profitability. We also need to consider potential sales after Feb 2022 to now. From a business standpoint, it is actually a success, accounting for business risks such as the console shortage, shaky consumer confidence and market, early console exclusive, scalpers. Any sane investor would be pleasantly surprised with the results.
>This is unlikely as faking sales numbers is a federal offense
I'm not even going to argue that this is what they are doing, but I'm laughing that you think someone couldn't do something because it's illegal. Companies break laws all the time. Being illegal doesn't stop something from happening.
Of course anything can be possible. However, people—and businesses—are innocent until proven innocent. Historically, multi-million businesses and projects very rarely have significant levels of business fraud. Usually, the large multi billion dollar projects and businesses are the common offenders. Enron is the most common example. Like I said, 80-100 mill dollar projects are not worth failing an audit, destroying your company, and going to prison for.
>This is unlikely as faking sales numbers is a federal offense
I'm not even going to argue that this is what they are doing, but I'm laughing that you think someone couldn't do something because it's illegal. Companies break laws all the time. Being illegal doesn't stop something from happening.
What the actual frick are they spending all the money on with these AAA games anyway? $300 MILLION fricking dollars for one game with like 5 voice actors, running on an engine they didn't even need to make, with the visual design just being "check literally every single filter UE5 has". Where the frick is the money going?
Corporate bureaucracy bloats up projects massively. I think it's largely because as a company grows the average employee becomes more and more dispassionate and unexceptional. A small team of passionate talented people can pull off the same project, but when you expand you end up having a shitload of passionless cogs that just want to sit there half heartedly plinking away at a computer, and then collect their paycheck and go home instead. And honestly I don't blame them, the average person isn't going to be passionate about their job, but it does hurt a creative focused industry like videogame development.
Then why does every company try to grow infinitely instead of staying focused on their objective? If I ran a vidya company I'm not hiring someone unless I am certain they are a strong contributor to our work.
Because on paper bigger company = bigger projects = better projects. People think about all the struggles they might have had during development due to a lack of manpower and want more and then you slowly end up crossing over into a corporate office environment.
Or they sell their company and their parent company makes them expand.
>spend thousands of hours modeling invididual hairs on a character >"wtf this workflow isn't sustainable?"
who could have guessed. developers need to learn to focus on gameplay and not graphics
>John Romero estimated Doom cost roughly $300k total, with the vast majority going towards just keeping their own office up and running while they spent a few years making the game >only other substantial expenses were pizza, new monitors, and beer
I'm sorry, why do they need $300 million to make one game now?
What the actual frick are they spending all the money on with these AAA games anyway? $300 MILLION fricking dollars for one game with like 5 voice actors, running on an engine they didn't even need to make, with the visual design just being "check literally every single filter UE5 has". Where the frick is the money going?
It's even worse with movies and television, that dogshit LotR show nobody watched had a budget of $1,000,000,000 and 90% of it was no name actors in front of a green screen. Nobody seems to be able to explain where the frick all the cash is going
I've worked in gaming now for about 10 years and started in a small/medium size company that's gotten pretty big.
It's kinda surprising to see how things have changed. Companies start off small and scrappy. Teams of 10-50 people will put out something that's unpolished gold. Everyone's doing everything. Devs doing QA. Accounting doing CS. Owner making pizza runs and cleaning up the mess at 4AM as their team is passed out under their desks, in the break room, or snorting lines in the bathroom before getting back to work. No HR is really "needed" though there might be 1 HR employee so they can meet state/federal requirements.
They make something good and things start to blow up and now you have to top yourself. So now you need more devs, which means more QA, which means more IT, which means more project managers, which means more Accounting, which means more HR. And it's an endless cycle. This is where the problem really starts. The larger your team grows, the more dead weight you naturally pick up. No longer is your company consisting of 75% talented engineers. It's now 35% engineers, and 50% of them are useless pajeets. But that's the same in almost every department because they're all hired by some HR bawd who goes around making TikTok videos about how great her life is.
So now you have this bloated team with dead weight all using expensive hardware designing shit which might not be in the final product. Everyone's afraid of losing their jobs so now instead of just doing whatever needs to be done, it has to be assigned essentially by the PM during committee (stand-ups). Then you find 75% of your day is spent in useless meetings about bullshit HR rules that can be covered in an email or trying to explain to some moronic pajeet why a pull has to be done.
tl;dr: Everything is ruined by success because it attracts women, and essentially women ruin everything.
Personally I agree. But you can't tell that to the Type A people who are in charge. They almost always see their previous success as a challenge. "We did this good, but we got some criticism. Now we have to do better!" It gets even worse when your company goes public because now you have to answer to shareholders that are pissed off about their dividends.
shame, so is a fun little game
I imagine part of the issue came from it having an exclusivity deal (PS4 i think), and only reached PC when everyone had forgotten about it.
>PS4 i think
lol no. It might've sold then. It was an Xbox One exclusive.
>shame, so is a fun little game
I played it recently and it was honestly unbearable. Every weapon was unfun to use, every character was obnoxious, every mission boring, and the world design was annoying to traverse.
it's really not
>why do they keep making marvelslop?
Absolutely insane that they're literally begging Sony to spend 1/3rd as much on the same games because it's not profitable or even worth anyone's time by any metric
i'd like to think the studios were so pissed that they got jim ryan fired for pushing aaa and gaas.
why does this slide need to be shown to fricking business executives? reggie understood this at nintendo and had to drill it back to japan.
BECAUSE
EXECUTIVES
ARE
moronS
>BEAR
Oh no my stocks!!!!!!!!
Go frick yourself Bobo. Now is the time of Mumu.
Because they have no idea about video games. They're business majors that don't even play them.
This. They were schooled at managing businesses and communicating with other guys in gray suits, not at video games. Slideshows and meetings is how these people communicate.
It's very obvious that all the mergers and acquisitions have played a large part in ruining gaming by pushing all the enthusiastic CEOs of smaller companies out of the picture so some suit can take the helm of the gigantic conglomerate they've created. The most celebrated developers are the ones that haven't been bought out yet and still ran by gamers. Valve is the obvious example but even then you have the head of Larian talking about how it's okay to pirate their games because he pirated in the past and knows that if they release good products, people will support them in the future when they have money.
That is the key difference, those smaller studios think on different scales. The CEOs are going to be running it for decades and are okay with building up a base over time, as opposed to SIE's CEOs that last like 5 years and try to maximize profits in that period without having to care about what Sony looks like 10 years in the future. Think about how much money could be saved on marketing if more companies understood their audience like the BG3 devs, that stupid fricking bear sex clip that trended because of how ridiculous it is did hundreds of millions if not a billion dollars worth of advertising for them by going viral. It got everyone talking about the game and they were able to invest more money into the game itself instead of having to spend $200 million on marketing.
but surely they can see that spending gorillions on one game isn't working out, right? they don't need to play video games to understand that huge budgets don't equal huge profits
>they don't need to play video games to understand that huge budgets don't equal huge profits
you will never convince suits that all the kids that play among us and fortnight now but will never touch a game again when it's no longer trendy that it's not the road to infinite money
In the businessman's mind, if you can make Minecraft for 20k, imagine what you can make with 200 million. It would have to be a trillion dollar game. The problem is gaming, and movies as well, don't get better just because you hurl money at them, there has to be a solid frame, a director who actually wants to make the product, and a talented crew to bring it to life. Disney keeps proving it, by throwing huge budgets at ideas that didn't have legs to begin with, getting big name directors who don't care for the product, and hiring big names who don't really want to be there, but love the 0s on the check.
It's the MCU effect. They saw how much money the AAA Marvel movies were making and think gaming is the same. They ALWAYS think gaming is the same as other media.
>everyone loves streaming music and tv shows, why don't we allow them to stream games too? how has no one thought of this?! we'll be rich!
Nintendo really may be the only one of the big three that actually gives a shit about video games on any level, huh.
Comes at the cost of overpriced shitty hardware, because they insist on 'wacky gimmicks' on everything since losing the Gamecube era
Switch was made almost to-cost when it launched, anon-domo
Yet somehow the joycons break after a month
I just want to play the games Nintendo insists on making exclusive to their consoles, at something better than 15 frames a second
>just emulate it
I want Nintendo to make a system that works first
>Yet somehow the joycons break after a month
what are you doing with them? if it's the sticks, get a fricking screwdriver and put gulikit hall effect sticks in
Are you one of those gorilla Black folk that smash your analog sticks and allow them to snap back into place rather than easing the tension in your thumb? Why don't you practice treating your things with respect before complaining that they don't work.
My launch switch's original joycons lasted 5 years, either stop being a moron, or most likely, take a fricking shower so your grime doesn't corrode through them, stinky.
>Comes at the cost of overpriced shitty hardware,
too powerfull of a system makes developers lazy
>too powerfull of a system makes developers lazy
they will be fricking lazy anyways, have you seen some of the switch port triple a devs made, shit is just laughable.
Where were you getting a 300 dollar portable PS3 in 2017
Nintendo is the only one that subsists solely off video games. Sony and Microsoft have way more than that going on and even Nintendo is slowly branching into movies and theme parks.
Sony is closer to Nintendo's end of the spectrum than Microsoft's. MS has the unlimited security blankets of Office 365 subscriptions and Windows' near-monopoly on operating systems before gaming even enters the picture. PlayStation has carried Sony while so many of their other divisions (like cell phones, or movies pre-Spiderverse) have failed.
Sony Music is doing good, even their games like Fate/Grand Order are still doing exceptionally well and Sony controls the entire western anime market. Which is where the money is, so they kind of control the entire anime market in general thanks to Aniplex.
They own a large part of the Asian anime market as well and their TV line is doing alright as well. They've been voted to have the best quality TV on the market (it's also the most expensive)
I mean, yeah, video games are like their entire business. Compared to snoy and micropenis where vidya is just one of the many things they do. They're in the vidya business to make money, not to make good games.
the fricking corporation that sent C&Ds to tournaments??? no you fricking moron
I would recommend against defending a known pedophile hive.
qrd?
>drones defending corporate power and crying "pedo" at everyone that disagrees
The other guy got to it before I did, did we forget that the Smash tourneys are absolutely rife with pedophiles?
It's way worse actually. When you get past the pedophiles you may be even unlucky enough to encounter some FGC players.
>snoys on competitive smash 99% of the time
>"ugh, what a bunch of losers, I bet they're all pedophiles too!"
>snoys on competitive smash when nintendo shuts down a tournament
>"HOW COULD EVIL NINTENDO PICK ON THESE POOR INNOCENT LITTLE FLOWERS, THIS IS THE GREATEST INJUSTICE OF OUR TIME!"
Wasn't it that you needed a license to hold tournaments for it? I think it's because the organizers were trying to profit from it. So if you don't have that you're basically making money off shit that isn't yours. I can understand that viewpoint.
>he fricking corporation that sent C&Ds to tournaments??? no you fricking moron
The company that sent C&D to unlicensed, unsponsored for profit tournaments yes you fricking shitheel.
if they took baths im sure nintendo would go easy on them
>Get an official license
>Do it without profit as your main goal. You can still give monetary prizes, but nothing of that sports super star shit, you're playing a fricking videogame
>Adhere to a simple code of conduct if you want to keep the "official" tag
>Mantain a minimum image (shower, some deodorant, etc.)
>Don't diddle kids
It's like Nintendo doesn't want people to associate their games with smelly greasy dorito-stained basement-dweller pedofiles that use tourneys to laundry money
>doesn't want people to associate their games with smelly greasy dorito-stained basement-dweller pedofiles
then why do they keep making games exclusively for this audience?
(you)
Only good thing they've done
Iwata gave a shit because he actually used to make games for a living himself and was able to put himself in their shoes.
Modern Nintendo is being run by a Pokemon Company financial guy and a former EA executive, so I don't have much optimism about the future.
NoA has very little executive status in the hierarchy, Japan still pulls the major strings, don't worry about it
Sure, back before Iwata died
Nintendo died with him
We're due for Fun being back on the menu if the SNES colored buttons showing up in recent games is anything to go by
Theres a reason no one makes 3d platformers anymore outside of Nintendo
Nintendo don't make 3D platformers outside of Mario lol
What about Kirby?
Literally just became a 3D platformer so technically counts I guess. But that's just part of them trying to get more mass appeal with their games. Kirby was already a proven entity and everyone knows moving 2D > 3D always increases sales so it was a safe bet. Now when Nintendo make a new IP that's a 3D platformer then I'd believe that they actually care about the genre outside of safe bets. I love Nintendo btw, but I also love 3D platformers and am not going to pretend they care about the genre past where they're proven to be strong.
You do realize that they are literally following the same path of making games bigger, in higher resolutions which require more development time and costs will rise as a result, they're just effectively entering the PS4 era. You will see because games will take longer to come out, even for Nintendo (except for their remasters)
>they're just effectively entering the PS4 era. You will see because games will take longer to come out, even for Nintendo
Yeah and it already took them six years to asset flip botw and they charged 70 smackers for it so that's not a great sign.
>the worst mario tennis with no content
>the worst mario strikers with no content
>the worst mario parties with no content
>the worst mario golf with no content
>mario maker, but again
>zelda botw, but again
>links awakening remake
>bunch of wii u ports
>Gamefreak continuing to make the worst games in the series
>porting over mobile fun tracks into mario kart as DLC
DO NOT GIVE ME THAT SHIT. nintendo is at an all time low
mobile phone tracks**
>Best Mario games in decades
Who gives a frick about 3rd party sports games you stupid Black person
Idk if Nintendo are at an all time low, but as a sincere tendie, they're probably at their most inconsistent quality wise.
Don't forget animal crossing is a disaster now and they just turned splatoon into a fomo gaas that you have to pay full price for every few years to keep participating in.
Just about the only thing they haven't outright fricked up at this point is metroid.
>splatoon into a fomo gaas that you have to pay full price for every few years to keep participating in.
What? They've had 3 games in 9 years if they're going for the FIFA monetization model they'd doing a shit job at it
Who said anything about it having to be a fifa model? Every 3 years they come out with nearly the same game that could easily have just been an update for the old one and they charge $60 for it plus dlc and amiibo. All while still retaining those obnoxious risk averse design decisions the original had back when it was a new online focused multiplayer ip, but is now just pants on head moronic to keep doing.
>DO NOT GIVE ME THAT SHIT. nintendo is at an all time low
I am sorry but the wii u was a thing.
>bunch of wii u ports
yeah? wii u had a bunch of solid titles that sold basically nothing due to the low number of wii u owners. porting most of the major ones to a new console that actually sold worth a damn is a pretty reasonable thing to do
iirc mario kart 8 is the bestselling in the whole franchise
paid online
Do you think they would be moronic enough not to follow what the other big two did?
Nintendo's moving in the same direction just slower cause they have their own niche
Nintendo very clearly does not give a shit about video games anymore. It just seems that way because people are far more attached to the brand.
*nintendo releases one movie for their major IP for the first time in 40 years and is under extreme scrutiny because of the last one*
OH MY GAWD THEY'RE LITERALLY SONY NOW
>is under extreme scrutiny because of the last one
lol
It was a shit movie and people still went out in drove to see it, praise it, and handwave away all the criticism, and now they're quadrupling down on the bad decisions with a live action zelda flick just because mario was so profitable.
he's referring to the SMB movie from the 80s moron-doko
Okaym then that's not true either, the old mario movie is utterly irrelevant to consumers these days. And nintendo's still showing they learned absolutely nothing from it and that profit is all that matters.
No company cares about video games, they're a product at the end of the day they try to sell to losers like you.
I'm not going to spoil the ending to this story but just you wait lmao
>I invested in something I don't like and now I'm MAD, how can this be happening to me
I still have big respect for iwata for taking a sizable pay reduction to avoid laying off people. The man made mistakes but he owes up to them
The fact that it was other shareholders holding those topics is relieving. "Muh assets" Black folk should be ostracized.
No any person who views any "investment" as an "asset" should be killed. Parasites trying to live off daddy's money, "investing" should be illegal, you should only be able to donate and not get anything in return period.
basado
we need to get rid of the stock market just delete everything and gas anyone that complains.
Still have mad respect for Iwata for taking a paycut and not firing hundreds of employees.
And yet Ganker rages at everything Nintendo despite all of this. Nintendo unironically likes video games more than this place does.
Iwata liked video games. His passing moved into the current Nintendo that cares about nothing but profit and IP protection.
>I do not understand video games
Iwata was one of the very few, rapidly dwindling CEOs to care about video games, there needs to be more CEOs like him who are willing to take pay cuts in order to preserve the culture of their company and not induce massive layoffs.
Iwata is an angel honestly. We've yet to see how the future will be for Nintendo but I hope for the best given they're the only platform that have the sorts of games I want (other than PC)
Why would you invest in a video game company if you hate video games?
because you like money. Most investments are made through ETFs and asset managers so people don't even know what they own. Are you so naive that you think people invest in something because they like it?
most people who invest don't care about the product
>biggest media form, bigger than movies and music together
>its growing like crazy
So suits jump in, get mad when a videogame doesnt make them mad money ,and then start meddling. They see something like WOW or COD and say "we want that"
Videogames turning into israelite business has been a disaster for the industry. 'member when games were made by 4-5 dudes in someone's basement and they were fun as frick and full of soul, unshackled by corporate bullshit and shareholder meetings?
No? Like id existed that way, but corporate suits and bullshit has been around since at least the atari, if not earlier.
late 90s silicon&synapse was exactly that, zoomie
>remember
i played noita yesterday, my memory isn't THAT short.
People need to stop buying and playing the wrong games. CoD's filesize should have cratered the fricking company.
It's just consoletard shit, disregard it. They've been claiming a doomsday of the industry for more than a decade now, as if the slop they get fed on their billionaire-approved baby toy is indicative of how much passion the rest of the industry has for making games.
>indie pixelshit
You're the cancer killing bad videogames
Thanks
>indie pixelshit
>cancer
Other way around, moron.
>can't read
Ok that's great and all but maybe we can have threads about these indie games once in a while instead of a gorillion AAA shitflinging threads 24/7?
*ehem* 5 dudes in a basement can still make a video game if they so choose
yes i remember literally right now
people are still doing it, they're all over the place, just stop buying trash
>member when games were made by 4-5 dudes in someone's basement and they were fun as frick and full of soul?
Indies always try hard with be another Earthbound copycat with fake SNES graphics. Videogame are too complex for be created by few people except if you want games with the graphics of a Atari 2600
Video games aren’t TURNING into business, they’ve been a business well over 20 years ago. You think EA was a benevolent corporate entity when releasing Sims? Its fricking wild to me that anons are still going “muh industry greed” while they were buying and demanding better products every time.
'Member? The frick are you talking about? Pizza Tower came out this year and it was made by 1-2 guys. Banger games are still made every single year, you just don't feel like it because everyone here has utter dogshit taste
>'member when games were made by 4-5 dudes in someone's basement and they were fun as frick and full of soul, unshackled by corporate bullshit and shareholder meetings?
Take the indiepill. Let the AAAslop slingers sink under their own incompetence and greed.
>B-b-b-b-but the blue haired people hate my peepee!
I firmly believe that shareholder capitalism is pure cancer and humanity would be better off if we just executed everyone who has ever attended a boardroom meeting.
Reminds me of how Hasbro, a company whose products are not selling because they lack artistic vision and are israeliteing everyone in every way, just fired all their artists and designers to give their CEO and shareholders bonuses and plan to fill the void with AI.
Shareholder capitalism has literally ruined the world worse than anything.
today Ganker learns that publicly owned companies are absolute dogshit and maybe there's a very specific reason why we jerk valve off all day (private company, no sweetbaby/esg/corposhill/hotdogwaterinjections)
>why we jerk valve off all day (private company, no sweetbaby/esg/corposhill/hotdogwaterinjections)
Anon, you may want to see who is one of the main clients of sweetbaby.
Valve also hired them and they had their logo in their website
>Ganker becomes a shareholder
I do not understand these million dollar big wig suits who already have enough money to do whatever they want forever and still devote their entire lives to shitting the entire world up just to get more. It feels psychopathic.
Business executives are lizard people who need tard wranglers
Ironic coming from a grimy salesman.
He speaks from experience, as he was technically sacked after the Macintosh's success, then the market guys drove apple to the ground and basically begged Steve Ligma to come back and save the company.
>then the market guys drove apple to the ground and basically begged Steve Ligma to come back and save the company.
That era of Apple was kinda interesting. They either had lots of conceptually quite forward-thinking ideas they couldn't flesh out yet or massively stagnated ideas, with no in-between.
This interview clip is pertinent
People idolize Jobs too much, but the guy knew how to make products people wanted. You can argue that he appealed to morons, but that's what made his company one of the most successful tech companies in history.
I always noticed that when Steve Jobs was in charge of Apple, he would always push the 'creative people' up into the forefront of Apples user base.
?t=2501
They definitely did not understand the contents of that slide at Nintendo because spending six years on a game with mostly reused assets is the exact opposite of observation #2.
you do understand nintendo doesn't work on just one thing at a time and everybody knew tears was gonna be a sequel taking place in the same hyrule, right
Yes yet 6 years on that is abysmal. Nintendo are following the same trends just admit it, they're just further behind the curve. It's fricking over. Took them like 10 years to release a new 2D Mario and it's mostly still an NSMB game but TikTok edition with them smartly reusing and rebranding old features and adding a wacky ADHD tier gimmick to each 1 min level
>Nintendo are following the same trends just admit it,
admit what, they don't even use a third of the same budget on games of similar or greater scope and development process
In the next few years you'll realize how wrong you are. The reason they have budgets at 1/3 of Sony's current games is because they're still making PS3-tier games when it comes to complexity. Which is not an issue for me mind you. But with the Switch 2 they will jump to PS4-tier games and that's where this whole mess really deepened itself for most developers. Watch, I guarantee you their output rate of new original content will slow down (obviously ignoring remasters, ports etc.. which is how they will try to fill out their lineup to avoid droughts and keep the software pipeline going)
Basically, dev times will be so long that you will have mario 1 gen then zelda the next.
what are we talking about with complexity here, like, graphics complexity? that's not much of an issue for nintendo which mainly deals with super stylized games. they don't chase the realism dragon. gameplay complexity is a spook and you don't need a Hollywood budget for that, people were raving about the physics, environmental interaction and weather/environmental effects in breath and tears, or the wizardry behind getting a light GMOD working in tears on switch
With all due respect, what you're saying shows how little you know about game development and tbh I cannot blame you. But just because a game is stylized or cartoony and doesn't focus on realism doesn't mean it avoids the realities of game development. Expanded scopes, open worlds and complex features all take time. Anything bigger in scope than the previous game expontentially takes more times since they all require TESTING. Waits between Zeldas are getting longer and longer, waits between all Nintendo games are getting longer
nah it was good
Look at how much it sold at $70 price tag then promptly shut down your embarrassing Schizo posting.
>sales means game is good
aight I'll keep that in mind when Nintendo inevitably isn't on top anymore and you'll move the goalposts
What other game has wonder seeds like mechanic?
Levels in a platformer evolving/changing is pretty normal, even within Nintendo's games? The only difference is that in Wonder it changes due to the items rather than naturally over the level
So what trend was it chasing?
Gimmicks/flashiness/spectacle over good level design which is replayable. This isn't unique to Mario Wonder though, Mario 3D Land and Mario 3D World started the trend, but it only got bothersome for me in Mario Wonder.
Level design is good, go start a youtube channel, your crits suck ass.
Replay Wonder and you'll see
most levels are fine ,it's just that the game is too easy for how powerful you are.
P-Switches. Wonder Flowers/Seeds are basically glorified P-Switches.
Also DKC Animal Buddy barrels. When you turn into a slime, platform, stretch up/down those are typical platformer transformations.
>Wonder Flowers/Seeds are basically glorified P-Switches.
I don't remember P-switches changing stage layouts, giving unique powerups and transformations, or causing enemy stampedes.
>6 years on that
I really don't buy that anyone would be less inclined to b***h about TOTK for this kind of thing if its development took even half as long
Nioh 2 comes to mind as having been developed in that exact timeframe (at most), as well as in general a much smaller brand with less mass hype behind it, and still getting called Nioh 1.5 often enough pre-release that the director commented on it once
People will get more bitter as times goes on as they realize they effectively waited 12 years or so between BOTW and the next non-BOTW linked game
Audiences already are more bitter though is what I was saying, the amount of time an iterative sequel takes to make has no effect on how subject to reductionism it'll inevitably be.
>Nintendo are following the same trends just admit it, they're just further behind the curve
Fricking this. Nintendo only every avoids the cancer temporarily because they're so goddamn slow. But they've shown themselves to still be all on board with everything that ails the industry, especially now that Iwata is dead.
Are both you moron?
Nintendo this year released more games than Xbox and PS5 combined.
>Zelda took too loooong wahh wahh
Yeah and again they released more games than the other two.
Business executives outside of tech don't understand how to manage large scale software projects.
bussines gays are not human beings
you expect human behaviour and reasoning from them because they look human, but that's just you being fooled by their mimicry
Because there only successful mid-sized game is Miles Morales, which is directly built off of a AAA game, and which was developed in tandem with a remaster of that game (which was ridiculously expensive for some reason).
The remaster was thorough in its graphical improvements, and involved a generational leap, its costs make sense, its spiderman 2 that makes no sense, just casually 3x the budget.
it also had significantly uglier faces and forced peter parker to look like his MCU actor
Yes, but thats besides the point.
The assets that were remade were also used in Miles (so should really be included within that games budget). The cost also doesn’t make sense for assets alone, very few were actually changed, with the main changes being to the engine itself (which would have cost less than $1 million).
But the assets are only paid for once, miles features a lot of new content, but its still too high, also miles launched on 2 platforms, spiderman 2 being 3x the cost is the most confusing.
Most people who run games corporations don't really know the video game industry, they see fads and growth
At least they are aware that mid sized games are better than AAA
The weird thing is that sony films operated under this business model. Throw a bunch of low/medium budget shit at the wall and if at least a couple stick you end up being able to show a profit and cover the costs of all the other projects that didn't stick.
Of course bean counters are always going to push back and ask why you're trying to make 100,000 dollars when you could be making 1,000,000 dollars.
Dan Houser talked about how the model was unsustainable before he left rockstar. He wanted gtavi to be the last of the massive projects that cost a billion dollars and required a decade of development across all your studios. He wanted to scale back to having the different studios filling the pipeline with smaller projects instead of putting all your eggs in one basket.
The problem is that the Playstation niche is lush high production value movie-games with extensive, mocapped cutscenes. Mid-sized games don't sell consoles, which is why Sony has quietly retired all their lower budget franchises (Gravity Daze, Wipeout, the entirety of Studio Japan, etc.). Unless they manage to get the GaaS runaway hit they're looking for, they're stuck doing these high risk low reward games to stay alive.
>Mid-sized games don't sell consoles
Its just a symptom of publishers thinking they can get all the money in one go with some mega blockbuster game instead of actually making some fricking variety for their console
>Mid-sized games don't sell consoles
Are you fricking moronic? The biggest selling game on the Switch is Mario Kart, which is nowhere NEAR the budget of dumb shit like GTA or CoD.
It's wild that Mario Wonder probably had a budget that was probably 15-20% of Spider-Man 2's at best, and sold just as much and Nintendo doesn't have to pay Disney shit. That turnaround is insane.
I dont see how spiderman 2 cost 3x as much as spiderman to make anyway, even the remaster only cost 35mil showing that the higher fidelity characters were not a large drive for dev costs.
I doubt wonder even cost that much, xeno games have more than double the staff and a sub mil break even.
Yes because literally Mario's face slapped on a turd would sell, it's not really indicative of any merit anon
you've to consider that tendies games release exclusively on tendie console meanwhile snoy games eventually comes to PC
How do you think that happened moron? Mario's name slapped on a turd will sell because Mario has had consistently good output for 40 years. If Nintendo ever drops the ball (like the formerly "invincible" Disney) he will subsequently stop selling tens of millions of units. It's called commitment to brand image and quality, something every business used to do.
Mario's not had consistently good output for decades, it's all about cultivating a captive audience through persistence, brand recognition and polished games that FEEL complete. It's not actually about whether the game is good or not.
>If Nintendo ever drops the ball (like the formerly "invincible" Disney) he will subsequently stop selling tens of millions of units.
They already do this, 3D Mario sells like laughable dogshit and gets the huge budget with the grand orchestral music, while 2D Mario sells 10s of millions as an evergreen game while selling Nintendo consoles, and 2D Mario gets a WiiWare tier budget with midi tunes
>3D Mario sells like laughable dogshit
Didn't Mario Odyssey sell like 25 million
yeah odyssey sold huge, guy's moronic
>How do you think that happened moron?
Nostalgia: Mario = childhood for a lot of millenials
You could say the same about Spider-man t b h
Meanwhile my team and I are struggling to get a publisher to drop less than half a million on our game that has 50,000 wishlists on steam. No I will not name the game.
I'm in the same boat. Wish you luck.
Publishers burnt all money on crypto scams and NFT shit, no joking. They only want finished games with lots of wishlists to minimize risks, at least you have the wishlists
Just stop spending so much on marketing
Just a big online event from console makers to announce your games. There's already their youtube channel for that. If you need celebrities, just get a host and invite a couple of bigger devs.
I'm not sure what midsized game means to these people when a vast majority of AAA slop is a 5 hour linear pseudo-movie that just walks you through a few narrow corridors
It's wording "please let us shrink the budget" softly in a way that's palatable to dumb shareholders and executives. They're morons who really do think MORE MONEY POURED IN = GOODER
Midsized doesn't refer to the length of the game.
It means "maybe Ratchet's fur can just be like, a flat texture instead of us wasting a bajillion dollars on figuring out a way to render each individual strand at the same time"
but then furries would be upset!
Call it a hunch but I don't think they care?
Translated:
>make it as if tech halted in 2002 so I can play it on my dumpster-picked thinkpad because I have no money
brain rotted shareholder mindset
graphics go up forever
Technology progresses and will not stop progressing just because you have arrested development and want nothing to change from your childhood.
Graphics have plateaued hard to the point that The Last Of Us getting a remaster doesn't look noticeably different, what the frick is blud talking about
It looked noticeably worse because all the character models were smudgy faced, poorly animated abominations, the lighting was fricked and all of the colors were washed out.
>100mil is mid sized
>alan wake 2 was 50mil and is called an AAA game
these definitions are really stupid
the shitty game model should collapse too
>wasn't overly sexualized
There's your problem, she shoulda been SEXO
Lombax breasts!!!
why did they make Rivet so hot?
Was messing around in photo mode with various poses and facial expressions and got a boner. Help me, I’be never had a thing for furrys before this
imagine if you got rid of half the people in corporate overhead and marketing, they didn't exist when all the big publishers were killing it with shit like halo or uncharted yet here we are with game budgets bloated to 50x what they needed for the same product a decade ago
The fact that indie games keep coming out of nowhere with no real marketing and blowing everyone away perfectly shows that the bloated marketing campaigns are not needed. Even Nintendo's model of keeping costs low is fine.
>exclusives
hmmmm
>N-N-N-NO YOUR GAME FLOPPED BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T LISTEN TO THE RAGING FEMINIST
yeah this sounds totally plausible
>woman literally harasses coworkers to get her way
>lies about who even came up with the name "Rivet"
Yeah how "damning"
Yeah, frick Sam Maggs.
can i not discuss how far sony is into the fricking toilet without some /LULZ/ castaway moaning about roasties being completely at fault? like i get it, when AAA goes extinct because of unsustainable business practices and incompetence while the japanese market survives completely untouched there's gonna be an insane amount of racist cope from western studios that infinite-growth-forever isn't real (but maybe if the japanese just tried putting impossible amounts of money into a furnace themselves they'd see the light), but we gotta wait for that to actually happen first and we can't bridge the gap with shrieking about a femoid who worked on a game that released two and a half years ago
Because both are part of the overall reason that AAA gaming in the west is dying.
Women, gays, minorities, and California are 100% part of the reason that these studios can't get it right anymore.
Dang they should put you in charge anon
I find your ideas original as well as intriguing. May I subscribe to your newsletter?
I'm sure you think you're very original and intriguing but that's not the issue at hand.
>Women, gays, minorities, and California are 100% part of the reason
Yeah not the hundreds of millions of dollars literally thrown down the fricking toilet or anything. Get a grip you moron
The developers themselves MIGHT have something to do with the video games being made.
this is the most AIDS ridden screed I have read on this board since yesterday
>like i get it
You clearly do not get it.
I don't think you read his post.
they did listen to her, the frick are you talking about
>Rivet with larger breasts and makeup
Sunset overdrive was a massive success for the studio.
And that's a good thing.
That's fricking hilarious. As if you couldn't see why. Rivet is fricking sexless. She looks like an anemic troony. Nothing about her design is inherently feminine. She needed to have a personality and look hot. Actually have breasts and a fricking shape to her not just be "gray Ratchet". Her story sucks too.
This. Just take a couple steps to fix her character, and they'll go a long way for appeal.
https://static1.e621.net/data/6d/5a/6d5a5db8494ed9ec3883bebdb9d2611e.png
anyone have that sequence of tweets from that other woman on the development staff about how much they all hated sam maggs?
Weren't both these games a xbox exclusive at first? I know Sunset Overdrive was. AAA dev games don't get to fricking cry about low sales when they play the exclusive card.
Rift Apart was a PS5 exclusive, and came out during that time where it was nearly impossible to get one.
$300 million budget could fund annual Yakuza games for another 15 years
I sure find it hilarious how all these outspokenly feminist women keep coincidentally being involved in projects that crash and burn financially. Probably just a coincidence.
bro the lack of a vegana in development is not going to make rift apart magically cost less to break even than breath of the wild
there is epic internet MY SOGGY KNEES and there is mental moronation to try and correlate the loss of hundreds of millions of dollars with one "roastie" on the team
>and there is mental moronation to try and correlate the loss of hundreds of millions of dollars with one "roastie" on the team
But it's not about that, you're missing the point. It's fundamentally about development teams that are led by people that are more concerned with the politics and ESG optics of a product than the quality of the actual product itself. There are definitely outspoken feminists that work on good games, like you said it's impossible that a single person's politics can ruin a game, but if the people in charge of the game care more about using a certain type of politics to push a game, than things that consumers actually care about, then that's how you get the current "Go Woke Go Broke" trend.
Outspoken feminists keep being attached to these projects because they want to work on stuff that pushes their agenda, rather than making good products. It's their own fault that they keep putting themselves in a position that makes it so easy to make fun of them.
>development teams that are led by people that are more concerned with the politics and ESG optics of a product
what fricking development teams are you talking about here? it's not insomniac, these people gladly ship builds out with "politics and ESG optics" stripped out for saudi markets. i think you are significantly more concerned about thinkgood politics than insomniac is and not specifying the teams you're thinking of is the most damning part of your whole post
what "outspoken feminists"? what politics, what ESG optics? weasel words and vagueness everywhere and this is still not getting into how completely insane it is to pretend these people are even a noteworthy factor in why AAA is spinning down the toilet and not the fricking 300 million dollar budgets, decade long development times and capped-out market penetration of consoles
Black person if you are incapable of getting the context from the thread you're in then it's time to stop huffing paint and step away from the internet.
if you openly refuse to go beyond vagueblogging and expect me to read the room on your own posts that purposefully don't go into details and purposefully avoid THE ENTIRE SUBJECT of money and time for these video games then i'm sorry but i am way too white for you to waste my time like this
>Current "go woke go broke trend"
What trend? The Barbie movie made more than a billion dollars.
Barbie went Woke because Warner are BEYOND Broke
So broke in fact they are very likely to go bankrupt / are in talks to merge with Paramount.
And this is AFTER Barbie became the highest grossing movie in Warner History (Not counting inflation)
>are in talks to merge with Paramount.
REPORTEDLY in talks to merge with Paramount.
You are right, sorry for not having that detail.
>Budget inflation due to useless workers doesn't have an impact on financial performance
Holy shit you are moronic
>one woman i don't like inflated the budget by 200 million dollars and you're moronic if you don't agree
>no bro no you don't understand bro i ACTUALLY mean the hundreds, no THOUSANDS of useless workers standing right behind her. why are you getting mad that i'm getting mad at my own imagination
>take AA games
>give them AAA budgets
>be surprised when they don't bring AAA money
>Be surprised if all AAA games looks like the same boring photorealistic shit.
well well well
look at how the cookie crumbles
Actually, Insomniac shouldn't be paid in relation to game sales, and the game had a cost of $42M and a turnover of $49M, which is still little but much more than the $546 reported
Yeah I agree, everyone seems to be putting their eggs in one basket.
Armored Core 6 felt so refreshing to me. The design and ethos behind it felt like it came from 2008. Just a tight, solid game with an extremely clear sense of what it wanted to be. No meandering gimmicks, no parasitic microtransactions or DLCs. It was pure gameplay. I don't know if because it's FromSoft it counts as a AAA game, but it feels like it was built as a AA B-Team game and that made it so much better
>that mspaint artstyle
I thought lego robot would have killed himself by now
AAA still makes money but its true games do flop a lot harder when they do. AA games dont sell nearly as many units so that's why publishers dont want to pursue them even if its cheaper to make and less of a risk. Nintendo are a special case and can get away with it because of their brand recognition and fanbase expect it from them. Sony or Microsoft cant do that as evidenced from their AA games like Knack and Grounded.
>Sony or Microsoft cant do that as evidenced from their AA games like Knack and Grounded.
Or games like Ori which was not a financial failure but was barely even associated with Microsoft.
I can see the problem. Sam Maggs is one of those women who comes from an upper-middle class family, never had to worry about anything, went to school to study English, realized she wasn't talented enough to make it in the fields she wanted to work in as a creative, and so jumped on the feminism grift like so many of her equally low-talent peers did to carve out a niche for themselves as "consultants".
She recently went from being bisexual to lesbian, I'm guessing because she knows if she dated a man her overweight blue-haired uggo fans would turn on her, like they did on Taylor Swift when she said she wasn't gay. Funny how the people that claim that sexuality is something you're born with are the ones that keep changing their sexuality as they get older and their work and social circles keep getting more and more extreme with the anti-male gender shit.
Lesbianism isn’t even real. Women are either bi or straight.
she is literally married with a husband how the hell is she a lesbian?
>she is literally married with a husband
She is not anymore. Why does a woman who was married for four years suddenly say she is only attracted women? You tell me.
>if you openly refuse to go beyond vagueblogging
Shut up you illiterate moron, everybody else can figure out what everybody else is talking about except your moronic ass. Go back.
what an evil rotten woman, she needs to kill herself.
>Shut up you illiterate moron, everybody else can figure out what everybody else is talking about except your moronic ass. Go back.
Nobody has issue parsing your posts, you're mad somebody cottoned on that everything you have to say is completely irrelevant. Just say you're mad that there's a vegana in game development you won't ever have access to, even in your imagination, and it'll be about as relevant and probably explain the sheer seething on display a lot better
Her husband was the one who got her the job at Insomniac and other studios (her career path’s chronology starts after her husband’s and follows from company to company), i assume after she got let go from Insomniac and failed to find other jobs in the industry since she has no talent, she felt no more use for him and started the divorce proceedings.
>However, thanks to writers like me or Neil Druckmann, female protagonists no longer receibe that treatement, now they are realistic characters that women can relate to instead of competing with them
No matter what I do I can't escape the Cuckmann
Oh hey, 'member how rivetgays kept saying sam wasn't actually apart of RA in any meaningful capacity and lied about being a writer because she wasn't listed in the credits? Turns out they were wrong.
It makes so much sense now
Ganker communism arc taking down the bourgeois class?
The Thing: Champagne Socialists
Sam Maggs is the most troony looking biological woman I ever seen. I had to watch a video to find out if she was a troony and even then it didnt convince me
Sam Maggs can go suck a dick. R&C 4 didn't flop. But that is expecting Journalists the abblity to fricking READ! All this 8 million loss is from a projections page, not the actual sales numbers. Roundhouse kick all "journalists". And frick you Sam Maggs.
>Sam Maggs can go suck a dick. R&C 4 didn't flop.
Per Insomniac's own numbers, from their internal leak, it had a bigger budget and needed to rake in more money to break even than fricking Breath of the Wild
I fricking hate game "journalists". They can't even get off their desgenic asses to do a basic fact check on a publicly released document.
See pic related, took me a while to find it. The slide this "profit loss" is from was made 1 year before the game even came out. It was just a projections page.
>citation is a random tweet that seems to think all $70 goes straight to insomniac and retailers don't keep a single cent out of the goodness of their hearts
You can see the slide for yourself
Wolverine isn't even out of Alpha. yet alone made a total revenue of $390M. It isn't a sales page where this -$8M profit loss came from.
Insomniac based that projection on the PS5 reception. They forecasted retracted sales from supply issues.
>Insomniac based that projection on the PS5 reception.
kek only casuals brought a ps5 and all they play is fortnight or genshin
What does that have to do with anything I'm talking about? Nothing you referenced in the "official sales data" ever mentions that the game made a profit.
How many times do I have to say that slide isn't "official sales data", it is a projection from Insomniac.
I'm talking about the other image, you moron. the one pointed out in
and
. Pay attention.
My point is that this isn't a sales page, just a projection that was made a year before R&C4 came out. You said "Nothing in that image ever says the game made any sort of profit, either." Because it was made a year before it even was released. There was other slides in the official documentation that talked about the actual sales. In the actual leaks, the latest figures are from Feb 2022 with 2.7+ mil sold, 500,000 units over the initial projection.
You stupid sack of shit, I'm not talking about the projections page. Keep up, dumb frick.
All I have posted was the projections page that this theard's OP references as sales numbers. I have not shown any other slides, the twitter picture just showed the creation date of the slide. Which was in 2020, a year before R&C4 came out. To me, this is still the same information, it just is a timestamp of when that projection was made.
So you jumped into a conversation then acted like an idiot when people told you that you weren't even replying to them properly? What a surprise.
>So you jumped into a conversation
You were the one that replied to me. Unless you have some kind of split personality disorder.
Then you must be moronic because I already told you which slide I was talking about yet you keep referencing the projections page, yet that was never what I was talking about in the first place. Are you brain damaged?
If you have the actual Sales page, then I would like to see it. But as far as I am aware from reportings of the leak, in FY21, Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart had 2.34 million units sold. Which again, is still higher that the projection.
Read the thread, dumbass. holy fricking shit, this has to be bait.
Listen, you troglodyte. Even if you take the sales data from the right chart and compare it to the left chart, it is still 500,000 units less (
).
Assuming, they were projecting to make about $33 a copy, with the amount of units sold, they would roughly had a total revenue of $89.1M with their own numbers. And this is still outdated info before the PC release.
The only troglodyte here is you, Black person. You are so laughably stupid that you've been arguing around what I've said time and time again just so that you can trick yourself into thinking that you're smart. Neither image says that the game made, or would make, a profit; either the projections or the supposed official sales data. That was what I said from the very start, and you still haven't even proved this wrong (because you can't). Shut the frick up, you dumb ESL.
>or the supposed official sales data
That is Insomniac's own internal sales data. There is nothing speculative about it.
>What does that have to do with anything I'm talking about? Nothing you referenced in the "official sales data" ever mentions that the game made a profit.
Which referenced this
as official sales data, which, again, it is not sales data, is a projection made 1 year before R&C4 was released.
Do you have the memory of a goldfish?
Holy shit, you are actually arguing in circles while completely ignoring the point. This is some prime bait.
>Which referenced this
I think you have it the other way around, you dumb bald troony. Insomniac is proof the AAA model is the way to go. The smaller budget games are flopping. The big ones are massive successes. as official sales data
No, you illiterate moron, I was not calling that official sales data. You need to learn how to read you dumb mother fricker. This is the 3rd or 4th time I've told you that.
Take your meds you god damn schizo.
>take the ROI at face value that it didn't make money
>get told that it is just a projection
>WELL SHOW ME THE DATA THAT SHOWS IT MADE MONEY WITH A STATEMENT
>*gets shown official sales data*
>WELL UH IT SOLD MORE THAN THE PROJECTION BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN IT MADE MONEY IN 2022!!!
This whole conversation was a mess driven by you. Even if I try to keep it straight, you have not been transparent about any of your points.
I was never talking about the projection slide that lists ROI for released and unreleased games and I told you this multiple times. I even directly linked to the slide that I was talking about, yet you just blatantly ignored it. You are screaming at a wall and it's pathetic how you're still going at this. You might actually me a schizophrenic.
>I even directly linked to the slide that I was talking about, yet you just blatantly ignored it
Not once did you link it in our conversation, nor ever uploaded any pictures pertaining to what you were referring to. You could have easily have referred back to it if I did supposedly miss it, yet you made no attempt to do so. I made my point as clear while you continue to operate with obfuscating your own information or just plain did not post it to begin with. I made an earnest check over the thread and searched the links in the thread, not one showed up for this supposed link.
Very epic
>Not once did you link it in our conversation,
So you're not just moronic, but also blind. you replied to the post I made earlier where I quotes two posts talking about which slide I was referencing and you just decided that it never happened. You need to see a doctor, schizo.
So the only post that has 2 replies that fits that description is this.
which replies to the image which contained this slide
. I have maintained that this was a sales projection that was made before R&C4 was even launched; While you keep referring to it as official sales data. My point was never tied to the claim made in the tweet above, but the timestamp of the slide which confirmed when the projection was made. Nothing here contradicts what I have said since the beginning. Only that you have been belligerently been holding onto that one image made an assertion which I was not using for my main point. And further doubted the validity of internal sales data directly from Insomniac.
This entire discussion was about
you blind Black person. have a nice day immediately. You kept thinking I was talking about a projections slide when I told you, repeatedly, that I was talking about the official one. The other one, you stupid sack of shit. I couldn't imagine being this stupid yet thinking you're intelligent. Seriously, shut the frick up.
1. I did not post that picture. While I did refer to the information in it as that was sales from 2022. It wasn't my point. I never claimed that it "doubled its original investment". There is no official documents released about the current sales, which would include the PC sales. But given their sales at that given time compared to their projections, I would say it was safe to say that R&C4 broke even in a worst case scenario. That is assuming with the sales per copy used in the projection.
No wonder why this made no sense and your refusal to be clear what you thought the main argument was further hampered your argument.
2. You replied to me, jumping into my argument from the beginning (
) that the projection page was bogus and all the news reports based on that are citing a projection rather than real sales data. As far as I am concerned, you dragged me into your disagreement with a claim I did not make there.
Most of this would have been avoided if you took this anon's advise
and cut straight to your point rather than running with your initial assumption.
>1. I did not post that picture.
No one said you did, you idiot. That's irrelevant. Seriously, take your meds. You are clearly unhinged.
I'm loving this autistic back and forth where you're just saying "GET TO THE POINT" when the point was made ages ago yet you just ignored it for some completely inane reason.
The posts in
made it very clear that the point was there is no known profit data anywhere, then you decided to have a random sperg-out over nothing, constantly bringing up completely meaningless points just to say something that people were never talking about to begin with.
And posting a reaction image with every new post doesn't make you look refined, it makes you look autistic.
>the point was there is no known profit data anywhere
Oh, well you're wrong.
shows the break even and that they surpassed it, so it made profit. Good day.
Everything on the left is a prediction (the game wasn't even out yet). Everything on the right is sales without known price points per unit sold. The budget of the game is not known so far. So no, There is no profit info for the game. Thank for the reply.
See
Well it took this long
for him to actually link a single post. And he missed my point that these news articles are not based on actual sales.
What is irrelevant was you pulling into this in the beginning on claims I didn't make or statements I did not make.
It's a good thing I was never talking about what you said. I was talking about known facts that pertaind to the sales data slides. You, for some strange reason, decided to make this entire moronic "argument" about yourself. And it's probably because you have a massive ego for some unknown reason. To the point where you will incorrectly read what people say and interpret it as them talking about you and your words when no such thing happened.
>stops avatargayging as soon as someone points out it looks moronic
Lmao.
You pulled me into your argument
(read your own damn post), with a point which I wasn't specifying. Berated me for a point which I never stated myself and had to have your teeth pulled out just to even clarify yourself.
>avatargayging
I think you have no idea what that means, newbie. I am sure you can read the rules to actually understand what it means.
>IT'S A PROJECTION
>Yeah, and I'm referencing not the projection but the actual sales that these two posts are referencing
>why are you talking about the projection like it's official sales data?
Meds, ASAP.
>news articles claim that R&C4 lost $8M
>show where this figure came from
>figure is only referenced in a future projection chart
>actual sales page does not show a negative revenue as articles claim
>sales on the sales chart outpace the projection which further casts doubt on the validity of said articles
What is it that you are arguing against in my point? You say I was talking about known facts that pertains to the sales data chart. But yet you have not concretely done anything with this data. If your main point was
>"official sales data" ever mentions that the game made a profit.
You can see the net sales on that same chart. How that breaks down to revenue, only Insomniac accountants would know definitively. But it a far larger sum than just $89M. And this was from 2022, before the PC launch, from 2021 sales. You are right that these documents don't say in big stupid red letters, "this game did not sell well" nor does it say "this game made us money". This is all old information compiled for internal review and is not a true reflection of a sale actively being sold. I gave a decent estimate previously saying that it at worst, broke even with the information given at this specific time.
Still not what I was talking about when I got dragged into this by you.
sales page does not show a negative revenue as articles claim
Good thing it would do that because net sales is not profit. You're still not even getting that you're actually misinterpreting what everyone aid and I even just pointed out how in
. I was never arguing in favor of the journalists. You have completely misread everything you replied to yet tried acting like this wasn't the case.
Also nice job waiting until page 10 to try and get "win".
Replies take time, but you have argued in bad faith since the start.
There's no bad faith arguments from me because you l haven't actually replied to anything that I stated. You completely ignored all my points to scream like an autist about things I never said, like claiming I was using predictions as official data. As pointed out in
. you're just an idiot who wants to be really smart.
I wish I could murder you.
I genuinely wish you harm and hope your third world ass is murdered.
>Actually being this moronic online
yikes
See
>REEEE THAT'S NOT WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT
Why don't you just post whatever the frick point you're trying to make in a nice succinct sentence and then shut the frick up?
>projections list the break even for rift apart at 2m+
>likely didn't make that
It sold 2.7m copies and made over $60m in its first 6 months. By now, and including the PC port, it's almost certainly cleared $80m, doubling its original investment.
>almost
Well there's no numbers beyond that, so it can only be speculation. They did forecast the PC port at $20m profit though, so with the additional 2 years and that, yeah it's almost a certainty that it made at least $80m profit.
>no mention of overhead or taxes
>no mention of retailer cuts
>no mention of development or marketing costs
>but it says net sales is 100 million so it must have been a success even though insomniac says it failed!
>>no mention of overhead or taxes
>>no mention of retailer cuts
>>no mention of development or marketing costs
Learn what 'net' means.
Net Sales is Revenue, you dumbfrick. It has nothing to do with profit margins. It's the total amount of money the game made before anything is deducted.
You should take your own advice and go look up what it means.
>even though insomniac says it failed
They thought it was going to, not that it did. It was a forecast before the game came out. Or do you think that Spider-Man 3 has already sold 5.5m copies?
>it had a bigger budget and needed to rake in more money to break even than fricking Breath of the Wild
How????
Nintendo is an absolute master of budgeting is why. This is a company that was never in any serious financial trouble during the Wii U which is an objective flop of a console generation.
That's not true. Breath of the Wild had a budget of around 120 million.
Astounding how thoroughly removing Lombax breasts can ruin a game.
>PPG cuts off the teacher's breasts, PPG flops
>Space Jam 2 removes bunny tiddies, Space Jam flops
>Ratchet and Clank remove Lombax tiddies, R&C flops
I'm seeing a trend here and I don't think it's the lack of tiddies, but rather that the kind of person that looks at an existing IP and thinks "You know what would really make these designs pop? Removing secondary sex characteristics" is probably not the kind of person you want heading your multi-million-dollar media project.
Space jam 2 was a hit what are you on about
>Space jam 2 was a hit
It made $160 mil off a $150 mil budget (not including marketing). It was a financial flop.
>Removing secondary sex characteristics" is probably not the kind of person you want heading your multi-million-dollar media project.
Yet they're specifically trying to hire as many people as possible who removed their own secondary sex characteristics.
Game journalism can't even catch up on the news that Maggs' work was completely discarded and rewritten as she got ousted from the company during mid-production
is it really surprising that sunset overdrive flopped? I mean, look a this trailer and tell me it wasn't made by some out-of-touch boomer trying to appeal to the "Hip young gamer" generation. This is like a bad parody of the Poochie character from Sneedsons.
>it wasn't made by some out-of-touch boomer trying to appeal to the "Hip young gamer" generation
Its funny cause thats how all the dialogue feels in game too
gameplay wise it feels like its got good ingredients but it expects the player to be moronic so it never achieves anything more than mediocrity
I have thought this ever since the game was revealed. The out-of-touch megacorps the characters are rebelling against are the same that created this game.
i remember when the this trailer dropped and i was completely disinterested with the whole "hello fellow kids" atmosphere emanating from it.
The humor here is actually pretty similar to ratchet and clank. Some of the social commentary even. The problem is it's super on the nose. Imagine that scene in going commando where ratchet has to pay 10,000 bolts to view a video and instead of saying "Now even the COMPUTERS are charging us!?" he turns to the camera and goes "capitalism, am I right kids?"
exactly it's time for AAAA
I think you have it the other way around, you dumb bald troony. Insomniac is proof the AAA model is the way to go. The smaller budget games are flopping. The big ones are massive successes.
Bro, turn your brain on for 1 second and see that Wolverine, a game that isn't even out, is there. Again,
, this is a projections page, not an actual sales page.
>insomniac projected a flop
>still went through with it
>mount breathers unironically believe this
morons like you need to realize that a game's earnings do not all go into the producer's pocket. It's like the fricking dumbasses that look at box office gross and think a movie making 1 billion means the production company got 1 billion dollars. Nothing in that image ever says the game made any sort of profit, either.
>two games in this slide aren't even out yet
>somehow made several million dollars in profit
huh?
>The AAA model is collapsing.
no, it's working as intended, it doesn't matter how much money you lose, just make some slop that appeals to the lowest common denominator and moronic investors will fund your next ten projects
not surprising, both games look like shit
AAA gaming was a mistake.
AAA games are a natural evolution and sign of the medium growing. It's not a mistake and it wasn't chosen. moron.
Games and movies are becoming too expensive and taking too long to produce.
>sunset overdrive only made $500
man that fricking sucks considering the game was actually pretty fun for what it was. guess its just another AAA game that would have been profitable made on the budget of a higher scaled indie game
Their own fault for making it exclusive to the fricking Xbox One of all platforms.
that probably wasnt even the problem, its the fricking budget for a game like this. apparently it was 42 million and people bought the game enough to put it into profit, but the budget was so big that the amount of people you expect to buy this to make a sizable profit would be insane for a new IP
How? Wasn't it selling really well in its 2014 release.
Did insomniac only get like <1% of the profit?
The profit is revenue - costs. It didn't only sell $500 worth of copies, it just cost so much to make that the sales were just barely enough to cover the cost of making and advertising it.
It was work for hire and they got 0% royalties.
How long until the bubble bursts? The model clearly isn't sustainable
>The AAA model is collapsing.
Didnt spiderman make them 300m
Seems like the shitty AAA grindset is working
that's how much it cost
It cost them/Sony $315 million. They are only expecting to make $85 million from Spider-Man 2.
Everything Jim Ryan said about Playstation in the summer during the MS Vs FTC case was true. Sony first party doesn't make the money third party games like Call Of Duty does.
And all signs point towards that being before marketing costs are accounted for, POSSIBLY even before retailer cuts for physical copies, and before disney takes their share.
From the information gathered from the leaks. Sony's first party need to be doing the same numbers of upper echelon of Nintendo first party sales to actually make money. They need to be hitting 30 million copies plus to see significant return. That Insomniac estimate of $85 million is still best case scenario of selling 15 million copies. That's how fricked it is.
They're not intended to make money, they're intended to be bundle fodder so that sony can keep cod and fifa Black folk using playstation by default and buying microtransactions through psn so they can take a 30% cut.
>The AAA model is collapsing.
When considering it's all ugly people and black people, FRICKING LET IT COLLAPSE.
To be fair, I think what rift apart hurt a lot aswell was the simple unavailability of the ps5
The amount of people seething over muh no lombax tiddies is fricking crazy
How horny can you possibly be
go woke go broke
Not the point at all lmao. How does this even apply?
When you are a moron with a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
triggered
You just wake up from a coma or something?
he’s right, the reason studios shut down instead of repurposing is because they are functioning off of blackrock loan money to make these flop games with diverse casts and DEI ideology. When they fail in cases such as forspoken the studio failed to repay the ESG loan thus they are bankrupt and disintegrated.
You're speaking in vague concepts that you see everywhere. The facts of this particular case do no map to those concepts.
Another moron with a hammer.
and youre just gullible thinking its greedy capitalism at fault
$10 games like lethal company are major successes because at the core theyre designed as being games, not soapboxes for female writers to smear their diarrheac feminist ideology all over. Tlou as a franchise was headed by a white male protagonist to thank and about the only woke game that’s survived not being shoved into a bundle to artificially boosr copies sold like the horizon titles
Now you're doing the same thing to me. I have no problem with capitalism, I never mentioned capitalism.
You didn't even play the game. You just see a failure and assume it must have been woke shit that killed it. There's nothing ideological about this game.
You live in a very small world.
And for every lethal company there are mountains of shovelware that went nowhere. A firm isn't going to invest in thousands of low budget titles in the hopes that one of them pops off. Most of those games only got made because the sole developer didn't have to pay himself, something that a production company doesn't get to do
Go Broke, get Woke, ultimately CROAK
?si=dxfiYGADuRwRKncE
finally libshits don't have a monopoly on the cringey whining nerd industry
no way it made that less profit
>release console exclusive games to minorities that only play cod and hold them hostage for 5 years
>why arent we making money?
The reason nintendo is successful is because they market to people who actually play their games, not liberals who don’t play games but clap on twxtter whenever they announce a new female or black protagonist or both if they really want that esg loan.
>The reason nintendo is successful is because they market to people who actually play their games
lmao. i have zero horses in the console war race but shit the frick up the reason nintendo is succesful is because theyve managed to cultivate a fanbase who will buy anything they shit out regardless of quality, then defend it to the heavens. theyre no different than the people who buy and push shit like CoD and fifa into the most bought games of the year, except those people at least admit the games are trash.
>theyre no different than the people who buy and push shit like CoD and fifa into the most bought games of the year
To their credit, I don't really remember CoD or Fifa ever releasing with gamebreaking bugs, except for that one time they released a FIFA with buggy ragdoll engine
>Game studios can't support 1000 person teams making games for more than half a decade before they release
Shocker, no game should take 6 fricking years unless you're making dwarf fortress or something.
Most games have almost no mechanical complexity yet still take years to make, completely moronic.
No, AI won't help the situation either, will just make it easier to make crappy games with shared assets
Games used to be made in a few years, alongside the engine they run on, now everyone is taking 6 years to make an Unreal Engine game
>Game studios can't support 1000 person teams making games for more than half a decade before they release
Game studios can't support this model unless you're Rockstar. Problem is that Sony is no Rockstar.
rockstar can only afford to do that because they sell exploitative microtransactions to children in an M rated game, none of this shit is sustainable long term
>person
>AAA devs
Insomniac doesn’t use Unreal, they use their own shitty engine. Had they used Unreal, they wouldn’t have all these fricking issues in the finished product.
Unreal isn't the end-all solution to everything, stop being moronic and think you know how gamedev works
TOTK took 6 years
Rmemeber the globohomosexual is pullingbthe plugs on ESG for the most part because they had to fund the Ukraine and Israel war. This is what is going on now and woke companies are going bankrupt and doing layoffs
>muh "ITS ESG AAHHHHH" homosexuals here to add nothing of value to the topic
>Truth
>ACK! WHYYYYYYYY!!?!!??
>HELP ME ADVERTISER SAMA!!!!
The globalists are getting exposed for the ESG scheme
They learn a new acronym and think they know how the whole world works
>ESG shills already here to deflect and damage control
esg shills shat my pants
Sucks to be you, homosexual.
Just like movies
It was artificially maintained by ESG money
Who the hell would actually want to buy woke crap?
At least they finally are getting consequences of stabbing their audience
The frick are you talking about
This is a thread about Ratchet and Clank
Ok I am breaking my 7 year long silence, lads, so congrats. This thread got me fired up. What the everloving frick is the reason why executives are put in position such as video games where they are hired to make money but no fricking zero when it comes to the company they work for? Where is the logic in that? Why are they literally hired? I am extremely, extremely confused. How the absolute frick does that make any sense?
ESG investment money and globohomosexual cabal put them in charge of companies to push woke agenda
I was under the impression that they're shareholders or investors, ie. they bought their way into the company because they saw that it was profitable
There is a belief that people with business acumen can lead any ship. It worked for Sega with Tom Kalinsky but he was a master toy marketer and games were (are) toys. There's a good Steve jobs quote in thread about quality leaving after success as sales Black folk enter.
Basically corpos chase short term gains and ignore the soul root of the game medium which is about making good game. Though GTA and TLOU are what people copy now for max gains. (at a loss)
>Basically corpos chase short term gains and ignore the soul root of the game medium which is about making good game.
Anon this post makes too much sense. Aren't you forgetting to blame women and minorities?
this is literally why the only good video games that exist are only designed by men who love video games, small companies that love games, and indie single devs WHO LOVE GAMES.
the market selects for profit margins not passion
>peter moore knew nothing about games before running sega because he was running reebok beforehand
>learned from his son after being hired
>led the Dreamcast to a lot of sales, selling as much as the saturn in half the time
>went on to oversee the Xbox 360 launch and led the company to insane success until he left and mattrick took over
>then became the head of ea sports, who have the best selling games that normies can't get enough of and made them billions off loot boxes
Moore knew his shit. In 2012 he called the current state of the industry
https://archive.is/sqscF
From what I heard, finance graduates are taught how to milk the company for short-term profit to get that sweet stock market growth and then to skip town before the firm falls apart. They're pretty much taught to cannibalize the stuff they're being trusted with.
>I think, ultimately, those microtransactions will be in every game, but the game itself or the access to the game will be free
Fricking Genshin Impact
>if games are toys than literally anything that provides entertainment is a toy.
I tried of seeing this old shit.
Falling upwards and doing well as money men at other companies. Jim Ryan in particular had that gaffe about old games that pissed people off.
>"I was at a Gran Turismo event recently where they had PS1, PS2, PS3 and PS4 games, and the PS1 and the PS2 games, they looked ancient, like why would anybody play this?"
Any gamer knows how dumb that statement is, even if he's worked in the industry for years.
because investors don't care about individual companies
investors dump their money in a ton of different ventures and make their money by selling them to other investors
they don't care where a company will be 10 years from now and long term growth
they want to make their money back and then frick off
so they hire people who can make them money in their projected desired period by any means necessary
they don't care about the company, work culture, the employees, the industry or the market, just the money they can make from it
Money is a score and if you don't have much you're losing
I believe the people narcissistic enough to become a CEO all have this ideaology. Gaming also started to swarm with insane money so people that wanted easy cash saw gaming as their golden ticket. These vampires only exist to drain the blood from gaming and turn it into a dead industrialized husk
its the same as career politicians.
its mostly nepotism and an education that focuses on one specific thing that has been done the same for decades.
a ceo knows how to run a company at a macro scale.
their workflow more often than not is hire people cheap to keep costs down and barely create a somewhat product whose sole purpose is increasing the stock value.
they dont need to know what their actual company does or how the underlying assembly line works in a factory(the company as it were).
you can literally blame the israelites unironically for this.
before modern capitalism most people that were in leadership positions were the ones that made it there themselves.
henry ford was a mechanical engineer. satoru iwata was a software programmer.
old politicians were similar.
ministers of agriculture were farmers. health ministers were docors or chemists.
this is not the case anymore.
people that go to business school hardly ever have run their own business in a certain niche. they get hired by a company and lead it with no experience in the field the company works in due to nepotism and favoritism.
Good. Stop Hollywoodizing everything and hiring celebrities or even worse trying to make the CEOs weird "relatable" quasi celebrities
Well, yeah, you really think you can rely on the ESG funding forever?
>makes a woke game that spits on the face of old fans, or a woke game that panders to NOBODY
>it doesnt profit
>SHOCKED PIKACHU FACE DOT JPEG
SJW GAMES/GAMES MADE BY SJW's THAT BOMBED
>BattleFieldV
>Mirrors Edge Catalyst
>Wolfenstein 2
>Wolfenstein young lesbians
>Anthem
>Mafia 3
>Watch Dogs 2
>Mass Effect Andromeda
>Lawbreakers
>Sunset@ "NOT THE FRICKING OVERDRIVE ONE"
>Revolution 60
>Depression quest
>Life is strange 2
>Battleborn
>Pillars of Eternity 2
>Dishonored 2
>Dishonored 2: Death of the Outsider
>Tacoma
>Virginia
>Where The Water Tastes Like Wine
>River City Girls
>Tyranny
>Drawn to Death
>Agents of Mayhem
>Bless Online
>Hyper Universe
>Telltale Games- the whole company
>Baldur's Gate: Siege of Dragonspear
>Dead Rising 4
>Bleeding Edge
>2064: Read Only Memories
>INVISIBLE
>Orphan
>DmC: DMC
>Thi4f
>MARVEL AVENGERS
>Sam & Max Remastered
>Medal of honor VR
>=GOOGLE STADIA=
>VTMB2 = BEFORE IT EVEN LAUNCHED
>Crash 4
>RETURNAL
>Destruction all stars
>Magic: Legends
>CRUCIBLE
>DoubleFine = the whole company
>deathflop
>joyless adventures of empathy woman
>RESIDENT EVIL 4 VR
>BATTLEFIELD 2042
>battletoads 2020
>KOTOR REMAKE = BEFORE IT EVEN LAUNCHED
>AI the troony files
>AI the troony files 41% initiative
>Grid Legends
>Back 4 blood
>phantasy star online 2
>watch doges region
>MANKIND DIVIDED
>VODEO GAMES = WHOLE COMPANY
>saints row HUZZAH
>potionomics
>GOTHAN CITY QUEERS
>Marvel Rising Sun
>FORESKIN
>We Are OFK
>paraplegic dream tour
>Waypoint =THE WHOLE COMPANY
>red FAIL
>omen-of-sorrow
>PREY
>TLOU2
>WHORIZON FORBIDEN WEST
>tales of borderlands
>Volition - the whole company
>SEGA HYENAS
>prototype 2
>THE DAY BEFORE
>TLOU ONLINE
>ratchet and clank a rift in my wallet
NON SJW GAMES THAT GOT POZZLED AND SUFFERED FROM IT
>Control
>GEARS 5
>Wildstar
>REmake 3
>FF7R PS4
>WoW
>no more heroes 3
>TABLETOP SIMULATOR
>tokyo mirage sessions
>guardians of the galaxy
>ex-cool girls
nice copypasta homosexual, too bad it has nothing to do with sunset overdrive or rift apart.
>Xbone exclusive sells like shit, re-releases well after everyone has forgotten about it
>PS5 exclusive sells like shit, re-releases well after everyone has forgotten about it
Hmm... I'm noticing a pattern here...
sunset overdrive isnt aaa or good
Good. Indie roguelikes are far superior in every way and can be made on a budget less than 1% of a "AAA" game.
You mean putting way too much money in singular projects can be risky due to the possibility of it not providing a good return on investment?
Colour me shocked.
>budget $42 million
>revenue just over 42 million
it unironically did good but got fricked by a budget that probably shouldnt have been so big for a new IP
the vr studio that made firewall ultra just got shut down as i write this post
Damn what do you mean games with ZERO fricking marketing dont sell, yet dog shit games like Last of Us 2 sell a zillion copies because they have commericals and ads (and pander to the queers but thats a whole other thing)
>Last of Us 2 sell a zillion copies
That game sold like shit too, according to the leaks.
That's good to hear
>a zillion copies
10 million is now a zillion?
>A bunch of nongamers work their ways in game industries AAA developers, start putting focus on things gamers dont care about
>AAA games start to flop
Ratchet was never meant to have a AAA budget. The games used to be made on a yearly basis and even with rising development costs and HD development in the PS3 era, they were still able to consistently produce games for the series.
Why the frick would you give a furgay pixar platformer game (that's not even as edgy as it used to be and is now more kid friendly) such a big budget and expect a return? And according to the leaks the next game won't be out until 2029, the frick? Again it's a kiddy platformer. Shit makes no sense
Wasn't sunset overdrive set to "not giving revenue to the studio" becaue it was a "commision work" or somehing? like you get paid 100 dollars to make a product, these 100 dollars cover the production and your actual profit, and any revenue generate goes to the publisher afterwrds?
How is that a flop?
>make one game
>buy 9 games with the profit
That is 10 games. What else do you need you selfish fricks?
well maybe they should stop charging $70 for 10hr game, just a thought.
too bad the shittie game model isnt collapsing
>2 shitty games fail
oh no the AAA are doomed
Good. They're getting cannibalized by indies with ever growing capabilities and how easy it is for anyone to make games these days. They can learn how to manage all their money and make the best use of it, or they can die. They can start by rethinking all the useless or detrimental types of people they hire.
FRICKING LOMBAX TIDDIES
>Metroid Prime 4
>Beyond Good and Evil 2
>New Perfect Dark
>New Fable
What's your favorite "announced years ago with zero gameplay shown" game?
At this point is blank noise
I will forget those were announced in some hours
bean counters deserve death
I really hope these slides get them to pump out a quicker R&C game. 40 dollar, 10 hour simple game with replayability via arena planets or co-op. Cut back the setpieces and crazy animations.
Sorry, but the next R&C is gonna be the same as RA. And it's not releasing until 2029.
Plans change. The X-Men shit is stuck because of a deal but they can absolutely change up how they approach their own IP and the scale of it. A 2029 R&C game means a launch title to show off new visuals/graphics aka nonprofitable flop
>hire undesirables to fill quotas
>has to redo a lot of work
>panders to boring cinematics in a desperate attempt to please new crowd that will not buy product
>fail
Get woke, go broke.
Seems to me like the trend is a smaller percentage of women working at the company.
I love how soulless corporatism keeps getting shielded by moronic rightoid nerds who are too dumb to not seethe at minorities.
You mean how lefties are shielding soulless corporatism by saying that criticizing it is RAYCISS?
Rift apart made profit though? does Ganker just like being fed bullshit? I'm confused, took 30 seconds to look this up, this isn't rocket science.
"Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart had sold over 1.1 million units by July 2021.[70][71] In December 2023, Insomniac Games were the victim of a leak because of a ransomware attack. This leak revealed that Rift Apart was projected to sell 2.2 million units and generate $73 million in revenue, however these numbers initially had no context behind them making it seem as if they were actual sales numbers. Also from the leak another slide has shown sell-in and sell-through numbers from multiple PlayStation games including Rift Apart listing it as 2.34 million (sell-through) and 2.72 million (sell-in) as of early (Feb) 2022 and made $145 million in net sales. Therefore considering the budget was $81 million, the game has made at least $64 million in profit and was a commercial success"
Good.
I can't believe that generic 3d platformer Ratchet cost them over 81 million fricking US dollars to make.
That's insane and stupid.
It's failure was largely because it was a launch game during the initial PS5 shortge.
>AAA is DYING because two games nobody gives a flying frick about didn't do well
Why is Ganker of all places filled with effeminate creatures falling for sensationalist statements that are complete bullshit?
aaa is dying because insomniac is literally begging to not have such horrible horrible budgets going towards just one video game and because hundreds of millions of dollars on one project is fricking moronic
aaa is dying because aaa is moronic and so is every single person on this godforsaken blue marble that thinks hundreds of millions of dollars being put towards one mediocre game is in any way sensible
Insomniac is begging for more money because they're one of the few studios where the employees aren't treated like slaves which means labor is expensive. The biggest cost of any business is payroll
We have internal presentations and other corpo bullshit where they're asking for the same amount of money or less and for it to not be spent on just one project. "Insomniac is begging for more money" is completely imaginary.
AAA isn't dying, Insomniac's AAA games are making a shitload of money. It's only their AA games were purportedly floundering, but even that's only true of Sunset Overdrive, Rift Apart did well and Miles Morales made fricking bank compared to what it cost.
>AAA isn't dying, Insomniac's AAA games are making a shitload of money
THIS DOESN'T MATTER WHEN YOUR BUDGET BEFORE SHIPMENT IS $300M
YOU HAVE TO MAKE $300M IN SALES TO BREAK EVEN
YOU FRICKING moron
>YOU HAVE TO MAKE $300M IN SALES TO BREAK EVEN
well nd they're making >$500m, so...
THAT'S NOT WORTH IT BY ANY STRETCH OF IMAGINATION WHY WOULD YOU BANK HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS ON ONE PROJECT TO MAKE SOLELY ENOUGH TO BREAK EVEN AND *MAYBE* FUND THE NEXT ONE
>SOLELY ENOUGH TO BREAK EVEN
500 is more than 300, not the same as. They're making 2x the profit with a AAA game than a AA game.
Insomniac put out slides asking "let's make a game with a 100 million budget instead of a 300 million budget if nobody is going to notice the difference between the two" and your dumb enabling ass is here arguing that instead of 100 million to make 500 million they should keep on with doing 300 million to make 500 million.
>let's make a game with a 100 million budget instead of a 300 million budget if nobody is going to notice the difference between the two
>100 million to make 500 million they should keep on with doing 300 million to make 500 million
No. Just straight up, flat out, No. You're wrong. You didn't comprehend the slides. You didn't look at the sales data.
Their AA games do not make the same profit as their AAA games.
>You didn't comprehend the slides.
don't pull this shit
>2 (two) AA games profit = 1 (one) AAA game profit
That's 2 AA, not 1.
And it takes the same time to make 2 (two) AA games as it does 1 AAA.
your argument is that instead of two games of equal quality and higher profitability they could make one game of the same quality and way lower profitability due to the budget increase? you're bad at math
No, it's that you can't say AAA is dying from Insomniac's leak.
>equal quality
>same quality
homosexual.
i am loving your horrible delusion that AAA games are inherently quality just because they've got a lot of money pumped into them
>Their AA games do not make the same profit as their AAA games.
You can make more of them in less time for the same or more money with greater profit margins on each one. AAA games make no sense for anyone.
They aren't intended to make sense to You The Consumer, obviously, these are internal slides for meetings and for The Board. It's intended to sway over moron suits that are addicted to throwing money into a septic tank.
Dude, you can literally charge whatever you want for a game. Making a AA game and charging AAA prices means you WILL make the EVEN MORE profit than AAA games.
Oh well gee, why don't they just charge $1000 per game and make billions then?
That's what they're doing. Making A games and charging A AAA prices
Anyone who agrees games should be 70 dollars is a moron
>YOU HAVE TO MAKE $300M IN SALES TO BREAK EVEN
No, you need to make more than that to break even. Retailers take a cut of all product sales and even on a first party digital storefront the company pays taxes.
Spider-Man 2 has already made more than that barely 2 months in, it's going to be profitable. People also forget that Sony has never treaty their first party titles as a crutch, they're vanity projects to bring people into the ecosystem. They're primary profit comes from services and subscriptions and third party game royalties. People have this misconception about any company not named Nintendo needing their first party titles to Stat afloat
Sony keeps shelving all their smaller projects, franchises and studios, what the hell are you talking about with their Ecosystem?
>Rift Apart did well
It's projected to lose $8million overall. If they weren't a Sony 1st party now that'd probably end the company. By comparison it only took Alphadream being in $4million debt to declare bankruptcy.
It was. Before the game came out.
But it ended up making double its cost.
By median, if game development time and costs keep going up forever, it's inevitable that it will eventually break apart. Only the strongest games in the world like GTA can succeed, but for everything else it's going to be a lot more difficult.
Hell GTA6 is gonna have to struggle really hard itself. It's going to be on fewer platforms than GTA5, costed more to make and the higher price of games now isn't going to make up the difference. It's gonna take longer to break even than GTA5 did and might not be able to brute-force the break even point.
Maybe Ganker just isn't for you, toxic chud.
Cartoony and non-realistic games failing shouldn't be celebrated.
Good, I hope a crash happens same with the movie industry. I'm tired of soulless nostalgia bait slop of established IPs being pumped for their name alone to treat consumers like cattle. I want things to actually come out again by people passionate about what they're making.
>BUDGET BLOAT INSOMNIAC THREAD #1894874782
Is this a joke? All of a sudden leaks made Insomniac and sony the only companies to blow millions in games now? Lmao.
>The woke AAA model is collapsing.
ftfy
What is making it so that games and movies and TV shows cost 300+ million to make. How does something like a crappy LOTR Amazon show cost over a billion dollars when it still has bad CGI, camera work and E-List actors. How does an asset flip sequel take 5 years to make and cost over 300 million when it has less content, more MJ sections and a large segment of helping gay and deaf people. How does an Indiana Jones movie with an 86 year old man cost 300 million? How do so many games in the last fifteen years cost more than fricking Avatar to make and still turn out shit. Over half a billion dollars is pissed away, multiple times by Californian corporations for a product thats a 3/10 at best.
money laundering
Mismanagement, the reason why every recent Disney movie's costs is 250+M is because they spend a good chunk of the money on overvalued celebrities, then you have the fact that they use incredibly expensively technollogy like mocap and greenscreen.
The final part is that since there are tight deadlines there is no time to plan out development so if there are rewrites/reshoots they will throw money to fix the problem at a point where costs for that are incredibly expensive.
>~2008
>Budget for games was a few potatoes and some twine for development with the rest going into marketing
>Crap out games literally once a year
>Turn a massive profit as a result
>~2018
>Budget for games is enough to make some south american countries blush with envy
>Games take 5 years or more to develop
>It flops
I'm sensing a pattern...
AAA Games used to be 6-13 hours unless they were turn based rpgs with few exceptions. Now games are 25+ hours minimum and you still have zoomers screaming about how it isn't long enough. Not sustainable.
is profit accounted after CEO and shareholder take ? if so it's already a miracle
No, just Sony is collapsing.
microsoft's xbox sales declined 15% this year, WITH starfield as an incentive, and PS5 sales are on the exact same pace as the PS4's sales were at the same point in its lifetime
the two big computer boxes are both collapsing
The only legacy Starfield will have will be a British man complaining about pronouns.
that and "todd's dream game, the one he's always imagined" will be remembered as a significantly shittier skyrim
>but Xbox
Nobody's talking about Xbox, b***h! Read the room!
Anon-kun... there was no defense of Xbox in that post...
Good, let Larry Fink dumb his money into an endless pit
>women ACTUALLY fought to NOT sexualize a FRICKING CAT
Are women actually moronic? Do they really think some time down the line some beta male won't support them because they're busy jerking off to a cat? Or is it just instinctual for women to suppress shit like this?
i imagine it's the female equivalent of being super vocal about e-girl but then wanting to diddle kids. she was super against sexualizing the animal because well...you just know.
The frick is it with white women and animals?
>pixar pozzed rachet
They get what they fricking deserve
Why is so expansive to make a AAA game?
Don't they fricking reuse their own assets?
>n-n-NOOO HOW CAN INSOMNIAC DARE TO MAKE ANYTHING OTHER THAN GAY CAPESHIT 1 and 2 ANYMORE?
>pssh no i did not support them in anything prior are you nuts?
>YOU NEED TO HAVE $300 MILLION IN THE BANK TO EVEN THINK ABOUT MAKING A GOOD GAME
>inflate budgets into the tens of millions, some in the hundreds
>expect a profit to be anywhere near achievable
Kill all capitalists and their magical infinite growth mindset
Nobody gonna bring up how Ratchet & Clank wasn't actually a flop, or are we just gonna ignore that and run with the false narrative?
This is Ganker so playstation has literally never made money and every year its on the market snoy goes further into debt despite it being one of their most successful product lines and nintendo has never spent a dollar without at least quadrupling it.
That's how this board operates.
it was mentioned a few times
i mentioned it
Ignoring the quality of Rift Apart (it's shit), why did they project/estimate it to be a flop? Even if that's not the case the data they were working with up until release said it would be.
Why would they release a game they thought was going to lose them money? It makes no sense
Because the chip shortage and scalping, barely anyone had PS5s then. It was just a brief window of uncertainty.
Because they lowballed their numbers due to the PS5 shortage. Also, early console exclusives tend to have a smaller sales due to smaller console base. Somehow, it doubled its projection from 2020 by beginning of 2022.
Holy shit. They literally have a slide in the leaks saying they are profitable, picrel. Quit grasping at straws simply because things don’t suit your narrative or go your way. Just take the L. The only argument left is that those numbers are fake. This is unlikely as faking sales numbers is a federal offense; 80-100 million dollar projects is small in the business world and not worth going to prison for.
I'm not arguing it's false or anything since it's from the horses mouth, but it seems the pic rel misrepresented a bunch of things.
Net Sales is not net revenue. Net sales, if used accurately, does not take into account COGS, which would include the 30% or so distributor cut for the ~63% physical sales, (1st party digital sales probably don't incur license/Playstation store cut.)
I also doubt that 83 million include marketing cost, which is typically a double digit percentage of dev budget (I think there were cases of 100% or higher, but no way that's the case for Ratchet).
Also taxes and shit.
Tldr game profitable. But the 64m profit number thrown around by outlet is calculated by sub 80 IQs.
Doesn't the 80 million figure come from the pre-launch predictions slide or is there some other slide with the budget data?
Agreed. My comment was to address a couple anons claiming the game was not profitable, as claimed by the media initially. We can argue how profitable they are, but that slide claiming they are profitable was from Feb 2022. So if we accept that at face value, then the initial media claims and from some people here are wrong, about its non-profitability. We also need to consider potential sales after Feb 2022 to now. From a business standpoint, it is actually a success, accounting for business risks such as the console shortage, shaky consumer confidence and market, early console exclusive, scalpers. Any sane investor would be pleasantly surprised with the results.
Of course anything can be possible. However, people—and businesses—are innocent until proven innocent. Historically, multi-million businesses and projects very rarely have significant levels of business fraud. Usually, the large multi billion dollar projects and businesses are the common offenders. Enron is the most common example. Like I said, 80-100 mill dollar projects are not worth failing an audit, destroying your company, and going to prison for.
faaaaaaaaaag
>This is unlikely as faking sales numbers is a federal offense
I'm not even going to argue that this is what they are doing, but I'm laughing that you think someone couldn't do something because it's illegal. Companies break laws all the time. Being illegal doesn't stop something from happening.
Here's your sexualised Rivet, thank god Maggs saved us from it
LOMBAX breasts!
Sunset Overdrive was terrible I played it for 20 minutes and got bored.
What the actual frick are they spending all the money on with these AAA games anyway? $300 MILLION fricking dollars for one game with like 5 voice actors, running on an engine they didn't even need to make, with the visual design just being "check literally every single filter UE5 has". Where the frick is the money going?
Corporate bureaucracy bloats up projects massively. I think it's largely because as a company grows the average employee becomes more and more dispassionate and unexceptional. A small team of passionate talented people can pull off the same project, but when you expand you end up having a shitload of passionless cogs that just want to sit there half heartedly plinking away at a computer, and then collect their paycheck and go home instead. And honestly I don't blame them, the average person isn't going to be passionate about their job, but it does hurt a creative focused industry like videogame development.
Then why does every company try to grow infinitely instead of staying focused on their objective? If I ran a vidya company I'm not hiring someone unless I am certain they are a strong contributor to our work.
Because on paper bigger company = bigger projects = better projects. People think about all the struggles they might have had during development due to a lack of manpower and want more and then you slowly end up crossing over into a corporate office environment.
Or they sell their company and their parent company makes them expand.
>bigger company = bigger projects
right
> = better projects
whoa hold on there
They must pay six figures to thousands of employees who live in California where a single one-bedroom flat costs $3000/month
>spend thousands of hours modeling invididual hairs on a character
>"wtf this workflow isn't sustainable?"
who could have guessed. developers need to learn to focus on gameplay and not graphics
>John Romero estimated Doom cost roughly $300k total, with the vast majority going towards just keeping their own office up and running while they spent a few years making the game
>only other substantial expenses were pizza, new monitors, and beer
I'm sorry, why do they need $300 million to make one game now?
It's even worse with movies and television, that dogshit LotR show nobody watched had a budget of $1,000,000,000 and 90% of it was no name actors in front of a green screen. Nobody seems to be able to explain where the frick all the cash is going
finally
I've worked in gaming now for about 10 years and started in a small/medium size company that's gotten pretty big.
It's kinda surprising to see how things have changed. Companies start off small and scrappy. Teams of 10-50 people will put out something that's unpolished gold. Everyone's doing everything. Devs doing QA. Accounting doing CS. Owner making pizza runs and cleaning up the mess at 4AM as their team is passed out under their desks, in the break room, or snorting lines in the bathroom before getting back to work. No HR is really "needed" though there might be 1 HR employee so they can meet state/federal requirements.
They make something good and things start to blow up and now you have to top yourself. So now you need more devs, which means more QA, which means more IT, which means more project managers, which means more Accounting, which means more HR. And it's an endless cycle. This is where the problem really starts. The larger your team grows, the more dead weight you naturally pick up. No longer is your company consisting of 75% talented engineers. It's now 35% engineers, and 50% of them are useless pajeets. But that's the same in almost every department because they're all hired by some HR bawd who goes around making TikTok videos about how great her life is.
So now you have this bloated team with dead weight all using expensive hardware designing shit which might not be in the final product. Everyone's afraid of losing their jobs so now instead of just doing whatever needs to be done, it has to be assigned essentially by the PM during committee (stand-ups). Then you find 75% of your day is spent in useless meetings about bullshit HR rules that can be covered in an email or trying to explain to some moronic pajeet why a pull has to be done.
tl;dr: Everything is ruined by success because it attracts women, and essentially women ruin everything.
>now you have to top yourself
No you do not.
Personally I agree. But you can't tell that to the Type A people who are in charge. They almost always see their previous success as a challenge. "We did this good, but we got some criticism. Now we have to do better!" It gets even worse when your company goes public because now you have to answer to shareholders that are pissed off about their dividends.