So I've been wondering about this while replaying the games cause it seems really weird to me.
The popular consensus with the Pokemon timeline seems to be that Gens 1 and 3 happen around the same time and the same is true for Gens 2 and 4, taking place 3 years after 1 and 3.
However one thing's always seemed kind of weird about this - Pokemon eggs.
In Gen 1 obviously eggs don't exist and after that in Gen 2 the origin of Pokemon and the existence of eggs is treated as a big deal.
But in Gen 3 eggs are just a common thing despite it supposedly taking place 3 years prior to their discovery in Johto.
But then comes Gen 4 and once again eggs are treated as this new unknowable thing that's been recently discovered by... professor Elm in Johto... so what about the eggs that were being hatched in Hoenn?
I guess you could say Gen 3 doesn't take place at the same time as Gen 1, since the games don't really seem to have any kind of connection or hints at that being the case like the Gen 4 games do, but then when they remade Gen 2 they changed it so that Pokemon Eggs are already commonplace likely because of their presence in the Hoenn games, despite DPPt still treating them as a new discovery made in Johto.
So what gives? When were eggs discovered? Which games are canon to what? Is everyone gonna stop talking to me because I care this much about obscure Pokemon lore?
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>The popular consensus
Stop. This isn't about "consensus", its about the info that was presented. The "consensus" is full of misinformation purposely spread.
It IS true gen 1 and 3 take place at the same time but we know this because the scenario writer confirmed it.
>When were eggs discovered?
Other than Elm we don't have a direct answer, and its not like there's a contradiction either as Gen 1 happened 2 years prior.
>Which games are canon to what?
canon is not relative.
>I care this much about obscure Pokemon lore?
If you did you would be making your own research instead on relying on a board who clearly has no idea about it.
>Other than Elm we don't have a direct answer, and its not like there's a contradiction either as Gen 1 happened 2 years prior.
But that IS the contradiction, if Gen 1 happens 2 years (I thought it was 3?) prior to Gen 2 that means Gen 3 does as well, and at that point you have to ask yourself why eggs exist in Hoenn if Elm is the one that discovers them in the Johto games, at least originally, which is what DPPt seems to be going off of while HGSS actually changes it.
You didn't point out a contradiction.
Elm discovered eggs, didn't invent them.
And its still a recent event for people to mention it.
I mean Newtwon has been dead for centuries and we still wank him.
> Even some gen 1 entries describe eggs.
They describe the regular reproductive eggs. Not the daycare cradles
>Do we really know that Elm really "discovered" eggs?
>https://digitalworldarchive.wordpress.com/2022/09/23/professor-elms-research-on-pokemon-eggs/
Mr Pokemon did thecnically.
Also Elm's dialogue when he entrust you to look for mr pokemon
>https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Professor_Elm/Quotes#HeartGold_and_SoulSilver
>GS
>Anyway, I just got an e-mail from him saying that this time it's real. It is intriguing, but we're busy with our Pokémon research. Could you look into it for us?
>HGSS
> have this acquaintance that people call Mr. Pokémon. He keeps finding weird things and raving about his discoveries. Anyway, I just got an email from him saying that this time it's real. It's probably another Pokémon Egg, but we're still so busy with our Pokémon research...
He has already seen eggs.
So is the implication just that Elm discovered Eggs sometime before the events of HGSS and likely RSE?
It still seems like kind of a weird retcon cause DPPt seems to treat them as a new discovery regardless.
>It still seems like kind of a weird retcon cause DPPt seems to treat them as a new discovery regardless.
Refer to the Newton example above.
gen 1 an 3 cannot happen at the same time. (This info was never confirmed nor officialised)
7th gen confirmed it via Red being older but not Wally.
This does not disprove anything i said. And this post was never confirmed to be true. This entire post is just moronic headcanon devoid of logic. Use ressources from the games.
>This does not disprove anything i said
It does. Its someone at GF saying Gen 1 and 3 do indeed happen at the same time.
>Use ressources from the games.
Says the one who repeats poketuber headcanon.
that's a dual perspective anon. stop making "head canons". What "your" consciousness observes matters. Now, can you run, say, pokemon blue and pokemon firered in parallel? Yes. So there we go. The are "isolated" pieces of software simulating parallel pokemon worlds 🙂
Canon IS relative.
This is why we have thousands of christians denominations.
>christians denominations
who differ by what they consider canon. Its "relative" in the same way that all this discussion assumes we're talking about pokemon and no one brought up digimon games.
But canon within a media franchise is absolute.
It makes no sense for eggs to be just discovered. Even some gen 1 entries describe eggs. Do we really know that Elm really "discovered" eggs? Or he just is an expert in egg research.
It's just like actual sciences.
>"Yep, we've figured it all out!"
>"Actually, it's more complicated than we realized"
>"What we thought we knew about [subject] is based on inaccurate information and we're essentially back at square one."
But really the answer is there's no consistent timeline because they make the lore up as they go with no regards to what happened already or what could happen in the future
there are no timelines
Everything and nothing is canon
They pick and choose what they want every time
Making sense of the Pokémon timeline after Gen 2 is a near futile effort. is quite correct in how everything and nothing is canon.
Because of contradictions such as the discovery of eggs and what kinds of berries exist, I just assume that the Kanto and Johto of Gens 1 and 2 are set in different universes and years compared to them in Gens 3 and 4 with the latter linked to Hoenn and Sinnoh.
HGSS retconned Mr Pokémon to discovering them, and with the dialogue change it is implied Eggs were already a known thing. There’s only two places prior to HGSS that are known for Pokémon breeding; the Daycare in Hoenn and the Daycare in the Sevii Islands. So the answer to your question is that Eggs were a thing that people knew about in limited capacity, and Elm is the one who helmed the research on them.
Every individual hardware that plays a pokemon version is its individual universe.
There can be no singular timeline if, for example, my Red didn't have the exact same journey as your Red.
I think that's kinda faulty logic since it could literally apply to any video game ever.
I can make Mario run into a wall for 3 hours in one of the games but that doesn't mean I would start going around saying "yeah in MY version of the Mario story he runs into a wall for 3 hours"
>I think that's kinda faulty logic since it could literally apply to any video game ever.
That anon hasn't figured out pokemon is a video game.
>gen 1 and 2 universe
>link to a post (and tweet) that do not account for different multiverses and simply refers to each individual entry
What about it?
If they fit in the same timeline they can be in the same universe.
>if you lump together the basic versions of each game without actually addressing how different versions of the games correlate to others you are effectively saying they all happen in the same timeline
So according to your logic Red and Green happen in the same timeline, Black and White happen in the same timeline, Ruby and Sapphire too... Good to know.
>if you lump together the basic versions of each game without actually addressing how different versions of the games correlate to others you are effectively saying they all happen in the same timeline
If they were incompatible, then they wouldn't fit in the same timeline at all.
The fact they do means they're compatible and not mutually exclusive. Learn to read.
>So according to your logic Red and Green happen in the same timeline, Ruby and Sapphire
Not really.
>Black and White happen in the same timeline
Its explicitly confirmed in the games that they're parallel worlds.
>circular reasoning
Sorry anon, but they are in the same timeline, therefore, they are compatible according to you. Pokemon X and Pokemon Y do happen in the same timeline, in the same world, in the same everything. Surely it's not a simplistic representation of each core game's position without taking into account the multiples versions of the same story that exist in the Pokemon multiverse, no, if they were incompatible, then they wouldn't fit in the same timeline at all.
Thanks for your wisdom.
>circular reasoning
How so?
> but they are in the same timeline, therefore, they are compatible according to you
The tweet makes a clear distinction between pairs of games and differnet pairs. The fact you don't notice this is your problem.
>Surely it's not a simplistic representation of each core game's position without taking into account the multiples versions of the same story that exist in the Pokemon multiverse
Its literally that and I never said otherwise, learn to read.
>if they were incompatible, then they wouldn't fit in the same timeline at all.
Exactly, if there was a "gen 1 and gen 2 universe" that was absolutely incompatible with later events happening in them then the gen 1 and gen 2 games would be a)completely excluded, b)single out apart from the rest or c)at least replaced with the remakes. None of this happened. Therefore they aren't incompatible with RS and beyond.
>Thanks for your wisdom.
Hey if you want to keep relying on poketubers to compensate your illiteracy go ahead, just then don't act as if you ever cared about evidence.
>how is circular reasoning basing my interpretation on what's written and then defend what's written based on my interpretation
I wonder
>there's a distinction... you just don't see it okay??
Kek okay
>Its literally that and I never said otherwise
Stopped reading here. We agree Matsumiya's timeline isn't a source for how different versions of each game's story correlate to the rest in the whole multiverse, making
post and the conversation spawed from it completely and utterly irrelevant.
Feel free to look up someone talking about ORAS to sperg about Zinnia or something like that now, I'm done with you
>my interpretation on what's written
Its not an interpretation.
>there's a distinction... you just don't see it okay??
Yes. a pair of games is represented by joining its initials and/or kanji.
Then, its separated from a game that happens at the same time with an = sign or a game that takes place after with an arrow.
>Stopped reading here.
No need to clarify since you can't read so its not like you started.
>making
That anon hasn't figured out pokemon is a video game.
[...]
>gen 1 and 2 universe
[...] (You) post and the conversation spawed from it completely and utterly irrelevant.
Not really, I already told you the difference and what a "gen 1 and gen 2 universe" would entail regarding the tweet if it were true. By text, sadly, so it will be hard for a person who isn't aware of equal sign to interpret but that's not my fault.
The games do clarify you needed to know how to read to play them too.
I do apply it to every video game ever, in fact, any piece of "simulation software"
This guy had the only right answer and the rest of you morons are still arguing. We literally know this is fact after Ultra Sun and Moon's Rainbow rocket saga telling us not only that the remakes of previous games exist in separate timelines from the originals, but that there are also timelines where the protagonist never existed or failed to stop the evil teams goals. Pokemon's current timeline is non existent, most of the games just are assumed to take place in a slightly alternate timeliness that allows those games to exist without contradicting the other games. That's how and why generational gimmicks have come and gone without much explanation, and we're even seeing it expanded into the lore of the new games with paradox pokemon being from other, more radically different timelines. If something doesn't make much sense logically or whatnot it can just be handwaved away like that, that's why they introduced the concept.
>Pocket Monsters Encyclopedia says Porygon was created in 1995
>SM, released for the 20 anniversary, says Porygon was created with technology from 20 years ago, meaning it would take place in 2015 or so
>SM concept art says Grimsely last appearance was 2 years ago (so around 2013), and the famous timeline tweet says BW2 is parallel to XY (released in 2013)
Gen 1 (and gen 3 by association) took place in 1995-1996, matching the release date.
Gen 2 (and gen 4 by association) took place in 1999-2000, matching the release date.
Gen 5 first game took place in 2009-2010, matching the release date.
Gen 5 second game and gen 6 took place in 2012-2013, matching the release dates.
Gen 7 took place in 2015-2016 like its release date.
Gen 8 and gen 9 must take place in 2019-2020 and 2022-2023 respectively.
We already debunked your headcanon.
What
said. Might as well link my theory from that thread.
https://arch.b4k.co/vp/thread/55374084/#55375771
In gen 1 and 2 universe the eggs aren't discovered until GSC with Elm. In gen 3 and 4 universe the eggs are discovered before but isn't until HGSS that Elm makes proper study of them.
Eggs aren't treated exactly the same in gen 2 and 4.
>pokemon eggs
It's a very simple explanation.
Gold and Silver were the first sequels in the history of the franchise. They were also Gamefreak's second major game.
Their approach to Gen 2 was to act like everything had just been discovered in the Pokemon world. It's also why so many Gen 2 mons are rare to find, because they wanted Gen 2 mons to be newly discovered, instead of just being there all along like all subsequent Gens did.
They dropped this philosophy right after Gen II.
Now, everything always existed, just in another region.
I don't think this is necessarily true.
Gen 6 also treats Mega Evolution and Fairy types as brand new never before seen things, they didn't just sweep it under the rug like "oh it was always there it was just never relevant"
>Gen 6 also treats Mega Evolution and Fairy types as brand new never before seen things
Not really. Mega Evolution was rare in XY, but it had existed in the past.
Fairy types were also introduced in the Gen, but since old pokemon got the Fairy type as well, it also falls under the "it always existed" camp.
It existed in the past but the idea was that nobody really knew anything about it, part of that game's initial plot hook is finding out more about mega evolution.
As for fairy types, there's literally a joke about how "the discovery of the fairy type threw the type match-ups on its head!", the game doesn't try and pretend like fairy type was always a thing at all.
I just headcannon that every game happens in the same year unless stated otherwise
The timeline is resetting with small differences when the world is destroyed
Timeline 1: RB -> Crystal (the first instance of a pokemon giving birth) -> Emerald (world is destroyed by deoxys
Timeline 2: FRLG -> HGSS -> ORAS -> Platinum -> BW12 -> XY -> USUM (world is destroyed by eternatus)
Timeline 3: LGPE -> BDSP -> SwSh -> SV
Oh also the events of platinum don't happen in bdsp because Legends Arceus is in timeline 3 which chills Giaratina out so he doesn't try to destroy the world
The events of Platinum don't happen in BDSP because Cyrus only summons one of Dialga/Palkia which is enough for the lake trio to stop. Giratina was enraged and intervened because if it didn't then the real world would be destroyed and so would the Distortion World since they are connected.
>megas weren't around to stop Deoxys
>Fairy type (and thus the galar dogs) weren't around to stop Eternatus
Kantonians are scientifically backwards and learned about eggs after big brained Hoennchads.
It's all real in a sense
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse#Level_IV:_Ultimate_ensemble
Fire Red and Leaf Green take place the same time as Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire
3 years later
Heart Gold and Soul Silver take place
A few days/weeks/months later, around the type of the Red Gyarados incident
Platinum takes place
2 years later
Black and White take place
2 years later
Black 2, White 2, X and Y take place (Blue is now studying overseas in Kalos ie college)
1 year later
Legends Arceus takes place (Dawn/Lucas and Ingo are set back in time)
1 year later
Sun and Moon take place (10 years since Red and Blue started their journeys)
?? years later
Sword and Shield take place
?? years later
Scarlet & Violet take place (Sonia’s book is now widespread and Leon is called the “former Galar Champion”
There you go OP
*3 years between Sinnoh and Unova
My bad
>Fire Red and Leaf Green take place the same time as Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire
there are multiple things that hint that ORAS takes place in a different time from RSE. Like how Wally shows up in SM and barely looks any older than he did in ORAS despite Red and Blue having aged notably when their adventures are supposed to have happened at the same time. Meanwhile Anabel who's from Emerald's Hoenn actually has aged like Red and Blue. There's also a Bug Catcher in ORAS that says "Pokémon Centers used to have two stories until 10 years ago"
>2 years later
>Black and White take place
There's never been any clear answer to how much time passed between gens 2/4 and gen 5. We only know Caitlyn was 14 in Platinum thanks to old interviews and have to guess her age in BW.
>1 year later
>Legends Arceus takes place (Dawn/Lucas and Ingo are set back in time)
I assume you just guessed that because they say the PLA protag is 15 and this would be 5 years after Platinum. Lucas/Dawn don't have a confirmed age so they could've been 11 like gen 1/7 protags or 12 like the ORAS rival for all we know.
Wally looking the same is just GameFreak being lazy. Cynthia also looks the same despite many years passing as well. The only characters they changed the design of were Grimsley and Colress and that’s because they are involved in the plot.
Cynthia was already an adult in her first appearance so you can make an excuse for her not changing much with age. I mean we have Lusamine in the same game that looks like she's in her early 20s despite being in her 30s/40s.
Wally sticks out more because he's a kid in ORAS, and in SM that's supposed to take place 10 or 20 years after Kanto/Hoenn games he's still a child while they aged up Anabel. You could dismiss this as them being lazy, but if they really didn't want to bother showing an aged up Wally then the more logical thing to do would be to swap Wally for Steven or some other adult Hoenn trainer.
>in SM that's supposed to take place 10 or 20 years after Kanto/Hoenn games
But what if SM took place 2 years after ORAS, would there be much change then? Probably if going by Grimsley's concept art.
Lusamine said that her age is over 40.
With this one post, you've put more thought into it then gamefreak ever did.
I guess it's just Kanto in particular that didn't know eggs exist.
Autism thread.