Schafer wanted autistic RTS.
EA wanted GoW-like hack'n'slash.
Marketing was messy and the gameplay's vision was messy.
I agree with EA. I have no idea what Schafer was smoking when he thought Heavy Metal setting game should be a real time strategy/Sacrifice clone when it's perfect for some action.
Still everything else was top notch. Even though it was typical "do X activity at Y spot", i loved the Open World. Story was cool in the classic 80's masculine fantasy metal way too.
Too bad we will never see a game like it again, because licenses it managed to get would be 10 times more expensive today.
This. I honestly think of all things EA was right in this case, it should have just been a straight action game. The demo that sold everyone as:
>Demo was all hack and slash and fun car shit to hide the RTS gameplay. >Hack and slash gameplay is mediocre but fun, using guitar solos to blow heads off etc. is on-brand. >RTS gameplay is fricking awful as a fan of RTS.
This could have been Tim Schafer's #1 mainstream hit if it didn't decide to go all fricking weird with the gameplay. The writing still has bits that make me laugh, and I love how much it shits on goths/emos/pop-punk which was the huge fad at the time. Now it'd be a bunch of homosexual cloud rappers with face tattoos.
said was all hackyslash and car combat, which was basic but enjoyable. The second it starts getting into unit management is when it starts getting really lame.
It was made in time when he was at the peak of popularity and the icon of Metal after shit like School of Rock and Pick of Destiny. Not to mention voicing kung fu Panda. There is no way EA would let them get some other guy.
i was expecting a Zelda type game going in
instead it turned into some boring strategy crap
massive bait and switch , literal false advertising bullshit
Why is everyone so godawful at this game? I’ve never played an rts in my life and did fine with the stage battles except the very first one and the final ophelia one with the b***h ass tree homie. My only serious complaint about the game is really helpful abilities are locked away in shrines and its very easy to miss them. the control to select units on the field aint great either. Besides that, The game literally tells you in the beginning to use double teams often and missions outside of stage battles are straight up tutorials.
The game is about being aggressive, if you’re micromanaging units you’ve already lost.
>Demo was all hack and slash and fun car shit to hide the RTS gameplay. >Hack and slash gameplay is mediocre but fun, using guitar solos to blow heads off etc. is on-brand. >RTS gameplay is fricking awful as a fan of RTS.
This could have been Tim Schafer's #1 mainstream hit if it didn't decide to go all fricking weird with the gameplay. The writing still has bits that make me laugh, and I love how much it shits on goths/emos/pop-punk which was the huge fad at the time. Now it'd be a bunch of homosexual cloud rappers with face tattoos.
"I've never met him in my life – I've never had anything to do with him. I never had any involvement in the Vivendi project that they were doing, Brütal Legend, other than I was in one meeting where the guys looked at it and said, 'He's late, he's missed every milestone, he's overspent the budget and it doesn't seem like a good game. We're going to cancel it.'
"And do you know what? That seemed like a sensible thing to do. And it turns out, he was late, he missed every milestone, the game was not a particularly good game..."
>Tim did this again with Broken Age. >Did it again with Psychonauts 2, which at least ended up good.
Dude is a shit manager/director, he was a great creative when he had Lucasarts telling him what to do, not so much when he's heading his own projects/studio. Dude can't manage a budget or reach a milestone to save his fricking life.
Is there any game that has ever NOT gone over budget and missed all deadlines? I don't give a frick about Schafer, but that's all you ever hear out of any game project
Lots of games, you just don't hear about them. Yeah, it happens often, but Tim Schafer is known for doing this repeatedly. He's done it with studio money, he's done it with crowdfunding money, etc. I watched that Double Fine documentary and the guy is on the verge of a mental breakdown because all of his big ideas get the better of him. >I want a full orchestral soundtrack instead of hiring one composer/multi-instrumentalist to make tracks. >I want Elijah Wood and Jack Black and cameos from A-list celebrities. >I want one artist to do all the backgrounds, and the one artist is a huge autist who makes ugly art anyway. >Oh no we're over budget, shit.
Yeah I wasn't trying to defend Schafer, just asking a general question. Like I said I don't care about him at all, the literal only thing I know is the absolute state of that one kickstarted game lel
Bobby Kotick was right about Tim Schafer and it's probably the only time I have ever agreed with him
Was he really right though?
Honestly with the absurd amount of licensed songs and cameos in this game it's a miracle it's actually a functional, good title all things considered.
It could easily have been like many other shitty movie etc. license games that were being shit out at that time.
From our perspective, it was a pretty good game. But from a CEO's perspective, what matters (unfortunately) is sales. Were the sales strong enough to justify the time spent on it, when they could have made something that sold better instead?
I’ve watched videos of the now dead multiplayer and it actually looked pretty fun, like the proper way to do a console RTS with elements of Battlezone/Sacrifice before Halo Wars came along. I agree the game would have been better received if it was pure hack n’ slash, but it didn’t help that the RTS missions in the campaign were shit. If all but one of them weren’t so scripted and the game had the confidence to with more than 5 RTS segments total then it might have been better received.
The gameplay was fine for the year it came out, but it's hopelessly miserable today. 5% more dev time making some QoL improvements would make it top tier
The RTS segments wouldn't even be so bad if there was any substance to them.
Instead you basically get what are essentially a bunch of tutorial missions for the multiplayer mode and it even fails at that given that it's only for one faction and doesn't even explain some stuff like all the shit you can do with your stage.
So its a bad game?
not entirely. but mostly.
many such cases
Schafer wanted autistic RTS.
EA wanted GoW-like hack'n'slash.
Marketing was messy and the gameplay's vision was messy.
I agree with EA. I have no idea what Schafer was smoking when he thought Heavy Metal setting game should be a real time strategy/Sacrifice clone when it's perfect for some action.
Still everything else was top notch. Even though it was typical "do X activity at Y spot", i loved the Open World. Story was cool in the classic 80's masculine fantasy metal way too.
Too bad we will never see a game like it again, because licenses it managed to get would be 10 times more expensive today.
all of this, plus the UNGODLY amount of bugs in the PC version.
I don't remember any bugs
For me, there were countless graphical glitches. Polygons randomly spiking out of nowhere, textures getting corrupted, etc.
Are you sure your card wasn't dying
This. I honestly think of all things EA was right in this case, it should have just been a straight action game. The demo that sold everyone as:
said was all hackyslash and car combat, which was basic but enjoyable. The second it starts getting into unit management is when it starts getting really lame.
I thought the RTS sections weren't bad.
The issue is that the game is clearly pulled in 2 directions and neither part of gameplay can truly shine.
nice game but the music sucks
I once saw this game on a gamestop bargain bin and i assumed it was just another Guitar Hero clone
And the voice of the MC sucks
Frick jack black
It was made in time when he was at the peak of popularity and the icon of Metal after shit like School of Rock and Pick of Destiny. Not to mention voicing kung fu Panda. There is no way EA would let them get some other guy.
i was expecting a Zelda type game going in
instead it turned into some boring strategy crap
massive bait and switch , literal false advertising bullshit
oops forgot image
nowhere does it say strategy...action adventure my ass
maybe try clicking that little + icon
Darksiders is more of what you are looking for.
Why is everyone so godawful at this game? I’ve never played an rts in my life and did fine with the stage battles except the very first one and the final ophelia one with the b***h ass tree homie. My only serious complaint about the game is really helpful abilities are locked away in shrines and its very easy to miss them. the control to select units on the field aint great either. Besides that, The game literally tells you in the beginning to use double teams often and missions outside of stage battles are straight up tutorials.
The game is about being aggressive, if you’re micromanaging units you’ve already lost.
>Demo was all hack and slash and fun car shit to hide the RTS gameplay.
>Hack and slash gameplay is mediocre but fun, using guitar solos to blow heads off etc. is on-brand.
>RTS gameplay is fricking awful as a fan of RTS.
This could have been Tim Schafer's #1 mainstream hit if it didn't decide to go all fricking weird with the gameplay. The writing still has bits that make me laugh, and I love how much it shits on goths/emos/pop-punk which was the huge fad at the time. Now it'd be a bunch of homosexual cloud rappers with face tattoos.
I felt like the game was rushed at the end. A lot of plot points went nowhere.
Either that or they planned a sequel which never happened.
Bobby Kotick was right about Tim Schafer and it's probably the only time I have ever agreed with him
"I've never met him in my life – I've never had anything to do with him. I never had any involvement in the Vivendi project that they were doing, Brütal Legend, other than I was in one meeting where the guys looked at it and said, 'He's late, he's missed every milestone, he's overspent the budget and it doesn't seem like a good game. We're going to cancel it.'
"And do you know what? That seemed like a sensible thing to do. And it turns out, he was late, he missed every milestone, the game was not a particularly good game..."
>Tim did this again with Broken Age.
>Did it again with Psychonauts 2, which at least ended up good.
Dude is a shit manager/director, he was a great creative when he had Lucasarts telling him what to do, not so much when he's heading his own projects/studio. Dude can't manage a budget or reach a milestone to save his fricking life.
Is there any game that has ever NOT gone over budget and missed all deadlines? I don't give a frick about Schafer, but that's all you ever hear out of any game project
Lots of games, you just don't hear about them. Yeah, it happens often, but Tim Schafer is known for doing this repeatedly. He's done it with studio money, he's done it with crowdfunding money, etc. I watched that Double Fine documentary and the guy is on the verge of a mental breakdown because all of his big ideas get the better of him.
>I want a full orchestral soundtrack instead of hiring one composer/multi-instrumentalist to make tracks.
>I want Elijah Wood and Jack Black and cameos from A-list celebrities.
>I want one artist to do all the backgrounds, and the one artist is a huge autist who makes ugly art anyway.
>Oh no we're over budget, shit.
Yeah I wasn't trying to defend Schafer, just asking a general question. Like I said I don't care about him at all, the literal only thing I know is the absolute state of that one kickstarted game lel
Was he really right though?
Honestly with the absurd amount of licensed songs and cameos in this game it's a miracle it's actually a functional, good title all things considered.
It could easily have been like many other shitty movie etc. license games that were being shit out at that time.
From our perspective, it was a pretty good game. But from a CEO's perspective, what matters (unfortunately) is sales. Were the sales strong enough to justify the time spent on it, when they could have made something that sold better instead?
Lmao i wish times when games like this were made came back. Also had cool chicks too. Unlike modern muttoids like that Fable chick.
I remember actually enjoying the third person combat sections but yeah the RTS hybrid parts were painful
I really liked it. Especially riding around while listening to the radio. RTS parts weren't that bad
I’ve watched videos of the now dead multiplayer and it actually looked pretty fun, like the proper way to do a console RTS with elements of Battlezone/Sacrifice before Halo Wars came along. I agree the game would have been better received if it was pure hack n’ slash, but it didn’t help that the RTS missions in the campaign were shit. If all but one of them weren’t so scripted and the game had the confidence to with more than 5 RTS segments total then it might have been better received.
Would've been better as an Adult Swim series with the same visuals.
The gameplay was fine for the year it came out, but it's hopelessly miserable today. 5% more dev time making some QoL improvements would make it top tier
You don't know what QoL changes entail.
MAJORITY of dev time of a modern game is polishing stuff up.
The RTS segments wouldn't even be so bad if there was any substance to them.
Instead you basically get what are essentially a bunch of tutorial missions for the multiplayer mode and it even fails at that given that it's only for one faction and doesn't even explain some stuff like all the shit you can do with your stage.