What do you guys think of the region I have planned for my fan game?
Aesthetically its a rough draft, especially the background elements, but in terms of layout and overall design this is definitely the final product I've settled on. Obviously its based on Canada, where I live, but that's mainly in regards to the layout, the rest is only loosely based on Canada, like in terms of climate and maybe architecture for a few areas. Aside from that I'll just be doing whatever I feel works creatively.
Beige = routes (30 total), Blue = water routes (6 total), Dark Blue = divable water, Red = cities, Green = towns, Grey = dungeons, and purple is the safari zone. Most of it is to scale similar to the gen 4 maps, except for dungeons and the safari zone markers, which just indicate roughly where the entrances are.
Bad. Nobody lives in canada.
I'm trying and failing to figure out the order of the cities.
While I actually do have the entire progression path planned out, complete with roadblocks and when you get the tools to pass them, it’s actually pretty complicated and somewhat non-linear in certain areas, so I’m too lazy to really to fully explain it rn. Im actually about to go to sleep since its 12:30 where I am, if this threads still up tomorrow I’ll make a colour coded diagram + a detailed explanation making the entire thing crystal clear. For now I’ll just say that you start at the bottom town and generally progress north-west throughout the game, with a few areas requiring backtracking later in the game similar to Canalave city (whole Quebec area isn’t unlocked until after the 6th gym for example). Its not excessive until after you unlock fast travel though, so I don’t think it’ll be a problem. I wanted the way you progress to be unintuitive based on just looking at the map so that it feels like you’re actually discovering it all for yourself as you play, that was one of my favourite aspects of the old games.
Looks good, reminds me of sinnoh with its complex layout. Did you have something in mind in regards to the evil team?
Are you planning on using fakemons? I hope you at least make ice types available earlier.
>Are you planning on using fakemons?
I'll be making 250 fakemons for this region. Atm I have about 75, despite how far along this plan may seem I'm still in the very early stages. I've been working on making a pokemon game for years now and it will likely take me over a decade to finish it still. It's my passion project, I have dozens of pages of notes on google docs, everything from trainer teams, encounter tables, fakemon types/stats/abilities, etc etc. I tend to add things very incrementally, I spend much much more time revising and balancing what I have than I do actually adding stuff. This is my 10th region design for example, and I've probably come up with hundreds of fakemon but only about 75 are guaranteed to make it in so far, and those 75 have undergone a lot of balance changes.
>I hope you at least make ice types available earlier.
Ice types are mainly after gym 5 but there are some available as early as before the second gym.
As
says, canada is huge but its also not even remotely dense. There's little difference between otherwise incredibly disparate areas, so I felt making all of canada one region was a good idea, for the sake of having varied environments and locations across the region. Plus, who cares
I also wanna take this opportunity to mention some features my game will have.
>Difficulty modes
There will be 3 difficulty modes, casual, normal, and veteran. These difficulty modes actually don’t affect much, only exp gain, they’re less about difficulty and more about how you wanna play.
Casual will have party-wide exp-share, and you’ll be able to skip trainers and shuffle around team members as you please without needing to worry much about exp management. I recommend this mode for first playthroughs where you wanna be free to try everything. Normal mode won’t have the exp share but there will still be plenty enough exp to train mons with so you likely won’t end up needing to grind. I recommend this mode for players who want a more involved experience, needing to manage their training and exp investment more closely, while also being lenient enough to be able to swap around mons sometimes. Veteran mode will have no exp share and decreased exp gain, such that battling every trainer in the entire region will be just enough to train 6 mons caught throughout your adventure. I recommend this mode for replays where you preplan your teams
>Time capsule
This feature allows you to store mons from your PC in a capsule, which will preserve the Pokémon in it even after you delete your save file. This is kind of a new game+ type feature that’ll allow you to use late-game Pokémon from your previous save file from the start. The game isn’t really balanced with this in mind, hence why it’s a new-game + thing, but it shouldn’t be game breaking because overleveled mons won’t listen to you till you have enough badges. It’s mainly for if you wanna use a custom team you bred specifically for new playthrough, while also just letting you keep any old bros from your previous save alive when you start a new game.
In a game with infinite grinding, having the higher difficulties rely on lower xp gain will just increase tedium instead of difficulty.
>they’re less about difficulty and more about how you wanna play
Reading comprehension can be tough but don’t give up so easily.
>it’s actually pretty complicated and somewhat non-linear in certain areas
That sounds like a good time to me already.
One thing I’ll suggest for the sake of variety is maybe having dungeons with more than one entrance so they’re effectively routes to another part of the map. Like some of the caves in gen 1 were. I dont know what you have planned for dungeons though so I don’t know how well that would or wouldn’t work for your game, just throwing it out as something to consider.
7/10 not enough water
I'm not from Canada and my geography might be bad but I dont see Nova Scotia or New Foundland (the one with the island on the east of the country) included? Looks good I think atm
He cut off that chunk. If the map was larger (and more accurate to real life) they’d be to the right of what’s shown.
Bumping so the thread is still here in the morning.
Looks very interconnected, could be interesting.
canada is way too big to be a region
look at the first four regions, each is a small piece of japan
canada is the second largest country in the world
it's stupid
>one dive spot in the entire region
why even bother
Bump.
I'm working on the detailed explanation I promised, complete with pictures to make things a little easier to understand, but it's taking a while, I'm only about half done. Please be patient.
>diving in the Hudson Bay
Better be all ice types there
Alright guys, here I go
Ok, so as I said earlier, you start at the South-westernmost town of the map. From here, after you get your first pokemon, you progress north-west through route 1 to the second town. This place is fairly inconsequential outside of being where you first gain access to a place to buy pokeballs, potions, etc. You continue north west around the bend on route 2 before entering your first dungeon, a forest, which leads you to the first city. This city contains the first gym, which can be challenged right away but is a touch high level at that point. For extra training, there’s a trainers school with some trainers in it and a teacher mini-boss who gives you a TM. You cannot progress north onto route 4 as the road is currently a toll road that costs a large un-payable sum of money similar to the bike in gen 1. You can progress east onto route 26 to fight some trainers but there’s a river cutting down the middle creating a dead end. You can progress west across route 3 as well, which has trainers, and can even reach the next town over. In this town, there’s a ferry docked, but tickets to get onto the ferry are similarly unpayable to route 5.
(1/12)
Once you beat the first gym, there’s a guy in the dock town that'll be impressed and give you his ticket for free. You use this ticket to board the ferry, which will take you to the City across the water. This city is probably the most urban area of the games (think castelia), and it contains an arcade, a pawn shop where you can sell important items for decent sums of money, while being able to buy them back later if you want for higher prices, the dept store (Everything past the second floor is closed off to ‘members only’), and the 3rd gym, which is also closed off as it is in the local country club (Again, members only). You can progress north a bit onto route 8 but you won’t be able to enter the forest here (Again, unpayable toll). You can progress east onto route 6, but you’ll encounter a one way ledge on its far end, forcing you to turn north onto route 7. Route 7 leads you up and down a mountain trail, with a boardwalk and a lower grass path beneath it, kind of like route 110 in Hoenn but you can weave in and out of either path freely. There’s a cave at the top of the mountain that you optionally explore, but you’ll find yourself blocked by a heavy metal gate deep into it that requires a key.
(2/12)
>the most urban area
>The Sault
this has to be a cruel fricking joke anon wow
Idk, I feel like you're relying a bit too heavily on placing restrictions to keep people out of areas - all the unpayable tolls or membership places - which I can't say I'm all that big of a fan of.
You just have blockages everywhere, which I'll be honest does not lead to a good experience. Like I know it'll mess with your story that you have written out, but I'm of the opinion that it's a lot better that if there's all this stuff people can't do until later - just don't have it in the game until later. It's equally railroad-y or linear, and it is way less annoying than being told "no you can't actually go this way" over and over, even if you're able to open up later on..
Having the safiri zone that early also feels weird. It's supposed to be where you can find rare, unique pokemon, so having it at the same place as the second gym sorta takes away from that.
I mean, if you look at it geographically, most of it's just Ontario really stretched out. Maritimes are MIA, and the west pretty fricking squished in terms of how big they actually are.
>This has to be a cruel joke
Dude I already said its only very loosely based on Canada, don't expect any of the cities to be based on the real places in their respective locations with maybe 1 or 2 exceptions.
Also, I couldn't disagree with you harder about the roadblocks, the feeling of restriction they create is very much intentional, it's supposed to make defeating the third gym leader feel incredibly freeing. All at once you unlock a huge chunk of the map (11 routes, 6 dungeons, 6 towns/cities, and 2 gyms) while getting access to a large inventory of items, as well as gaining a few other minor privileges from the country club membership that'll be helpful later down the road. That seems to me to be a standard part of game design, to restrict the player a lot in the early game, while removing those restrictions as they progress. I do a similar thing with surf and the rock climbing gear; there are one way ledges and bodies of water all over the region that you restrict your navigation initially specifically so that gaining these items feels freeing. I always found it incredibly boring when a key item basically just exists to deal with a one time roadblock or unlock a single area.
As for the safari zone, you actually only have access to one part of it initially and gain access to other parts as you gain some of the aforementioned key items. There's a few unique Pokémon you can get there right away, and a few more for every new chunk that you gain access to. The rarest pokemon are obviously introduced later on.
At the bottom of the mountain trail is the City with the second gym, which you’ll be allowed to challenge right away. There’s also the safari zone here, also accessible right away. After beating the second the gym, you find out that the gym leader is upset about the expensive toll road (route 4) keeping people from visiting the safari zone, which is the city's main attraction. He explains that the Mayor of the urban city (the 3rd gym leader) has been buying up all the land around the city so he can charge tolls and rake in more money. He decides to help you in the hopes that you’ll be able to “knock some sense into the mayor one day”, and the 2 of you go and essentially tell the dude charging the tolls on route 4 to frick off. From here, you’re able to progress south, which connects you back to the previous chunks of the map. You can also progress west onto route 5, which will bring you to the junkyard, another dungeon, and in this dungeon you’ll find the key to the metal gate in the cave from earlier. Revisiting the cave (or visiting it for your first time), you use the key to get through the gate and find a huge hoard of money. There are guards in here that’ll be alerted by your entrance and run off to tell the major.
(3/12)
If you go back to the country club you’ll find the mayor and 3rd gym leader waiting to greet you at the entrance. You confront him about the hoard of money and how you want him to stop charging tolls everywhere and he basically says “sure, if you can beat me.” He’s quite tough for a third gym, similar to watson and whitney, but once you beat him he’ll stop charging tolls everywhere, and give you a membership, which lets you have full access to the country club and dept store. With the tolls gone, you can freely progress north-west through the forest, which will bring you to a small rural farm village. You can just go straight through, continuing west through route 9 before reaching route 10, which is easily the biggest route so far. This route is split down the middle, with the left side being up on a cliff with waterfalls and the right being the lower path with rivers, their main connecting point being the cave, kind of making it feel like 2 routes side-by-side. This is where the nonlinearity kicks in, as you can choose to head either north or south from here. I’ll address the northern path first, then the southern path.
(4/12)
Ok so if you choose to head north on the lower path, you’ll be brought to the lower part of the city with the 4th gym, which is split in half similar to route 10, and kind of mediaeval in theme, with the upper part being castle-y and the lower part being where the common-folk live. The lower part doesn’t contain the gym, and the higher part is only accessible through a gate at the centre of the city which is blocked by some tough guards who’ll challenge you to a double battle. You can also progress all the way east across route 19 from here, which is a spooky forest path with a haunted house near the end. It leads you to a small fishing village. The lower part of the city also contains the north exit onto route 18 but you can’t go very far because it’s snowy and requires snow-shoes to navigate. The routes 20 and 21 north of route 19 are also snowy and require snow-shoes. If you went through the cave on route 10 and went north from the upper path it’ll take you directly into the upper part of this city with the gym and you can skip the guards. The upper part also contains the western exit onto route 17 but it is blocked by one-way ledges.
(5/12)
If you choose to head south on the lower path it’ll lead you along the bottom of the cliff to a beach area, which contains another entrance to the cave (although this entrance isn’t marked). The cave itself is long and spans the whole route, with 2 entrances in the lower area and 2 exits in the higher area. You’ll have to get through the cave at some point to reach the higher area, although which entrances and exits you take is entirely up to you. You can effectively take either the upper or lower path down route 10, or you can skip either path and use the cave to travel the length of the route. Regardless of which of the 3 paths you choose, heading south will take you to the town at the south-west end of the route. Continuing west, you’ll go through route 11 and 12, with a tunnel maze in the middle similar to rock tunnel in Kanto. This is the first instance of a dark cave. You’ll be able to buy torches in the town (and some other towns ahead), and they can be lit with any fire or electric move. Alternatively having pokemon with illuminate be the first in your party has the same effect. At the end of route 12 is the City with the 5th gym (although you can challenge gym 4 and 5 is any order).
(6/12)
When will people stop turning massive areas of land into a single region? Literally no GF region uses that much of earth.
To be fair there really isnt anything going on between the cities in Canada except lakes in the east and endless prairie and mountains in the west. You can safely shrink the country into a single Pokemon region without losing anything.
Trying to head north, onto route 30 (the biggest route in the region) isn’t possible due to one way ledges blocking the way. Instead, you can head west through route 13, which will bring you to route 14, another large route. This route is also split down the middle similar to route 10, making it feel like 2 routes side by side, although the halves are more easily switched between since there’s no cave separating them and there are several paths that weave in and out of either half. The upper half is a rockier cliff than the one on route 10 (which is more lush with vegetation) and gives you a decent view of the rocky beach on the lower half. The whole route is rather grey, with the beach not having sand but rather rocky gravel, and the lower half by the beach is also quite misty. There’s an optional watery cove in the middle on the east side which is only accessible via a narrow path from the lower area, and the upper area has a bridge that leads right over it. At the northern end of the route is a Hotel overlooking the beach where you can have (paid) healing.
From the hotel, you’ll be able to head east up route 15, which leads you up a mountainside. It starts to get snowy near the top but not enough to need snow shoes. Once you get to the top, there’s a huge stone bridge which leads you over-top route 30 to the town on the other side. From this bridge you’ll have a view of route 30, which is a massive ravine between 2 mountain ranges, with a river cutting down the middle and multiple waterfalls pouring into it from either side. Directly below you is the pokemon league, a castle surrounded by a moat, which is effectively the river split in 2 going around the castle. It’ll be very aesthetically pleasing, and this bridge will host one of your rival battles (which I otherwise won’t mention here). The town is where you unlock the ability to fast travel, and an npc here will also give you the snowshoes if you have 5 gym badges. From the town, you’ll be able to head east through route 16 and 17, with a mandatory cave in the middle (another dark cave), down the mountains, hopping down the ledges on route 17 to get back to the mediaeval city. Technically, you can do this entire loop without beating gym 4 or 5, so you might need to revisit the town later to get the snow shoes, which is why I also give the player fast travel there.
(8/12)
Once you beat gyms 4 and 5 and get the snow shoes, you’ll be able to head north through one of 2 paths: route 18 from the mediaeval city, or routes 20 and 21 from the fishing town. Route 18 is the first big route to not be split down the middle, it’s just one huge snowy route that’ll be pretty hard to navigate, with lots of split paths and twists and turns and such, similar to route 119 in Hoenn. Route 20 and 21 are also wide but they’ll be a little easier to navigate as they’ll be wide open water-side tundras. Regardless of which path you take, it’ll take you to a northern settlement composed of tipis (I haven’t mentioned it so far but there'll be a lot of Native American representation in this game, especially in the northern segments. Dw, no moral-hamfisting whatsoever, I just think their culture is crucial to the aesthetic of Canada). From this tipi town, you can head west through a snowy forest that’ll be eerily silent due to the way snow absorbs sound. The forest exits into route 22, a small route, before veering onto route 23, another snowy route caught in a perpetual blizzard (think route 217 but sideways).
(9/12)
Route 23 will lead you to the city with the 8th gym, a metropolis of pure ice. Think igloos but they’re more like huge castles. The biggest ice castle is a dungeon here, which you can partially explore but only the outer section, getting in requires a key, and the basement section, accessible from a hidden door on the side, requires surf to properly navigate. The 8th gym leader has locked themselves in the castle, which they have dubbed their fortress of solitude. You can’t progress south onto route 30 due to, again, one way ledges. Heading west through route 24 and 25 will take you to a grey, drab oceanside city with brutalist architecture (think russia). This city has the 6th gym, which, once beaten, will let you get into the abandoned warehouse here, where you’ll get the ability to surf.
(10/12)
Now that you’ve gotten surf the game really opens up and you can basically do the rest in whatever order you want. If you want, you can go straight back to the fortress of solitude and do the basement section, where you'll find the key to the full dungeon. Completing this dungeon will allow you to challenge the 8th gym, but it’ll be QUITE overleveled so you’ll likely need to do other stuff first. Heading south from the brutalist city will take you through water-route 6, a snowy bay with icebergs, and from there you can land on the peninsula from the beach, which will let you enter the town, and from that town you go south and ascend a volcano in a spiral fashion. The volcano seems like a normal mountain on the outer sections, but the inside of the cave will be a fire themed area, with lava. You can alternatively veer onto water-route 5, which separates the peninsula from route 14. There’s a broken down ship between water-route 5 and 6, and here you’ll get the scuba gear, which lets you dive into the deep water within the ship, as well as on water-route 5. The ocean floor here actually has some hidden passages that connect to another section of the watery cove on route 14 which was previously inaccessible.
(11/12)
So that’s pretty much all the surf stuff in the west. You can also do the stuff in the east though. You can fly there if you want, although there are actually some items unlocked by surf along route 14, 13, 12 and 11 in order to incentivize players to backtrack all way east from the beach on route 14 all the way through water-route 3, 2, and 1. From here, you’re free to do the bracket that’s made of up route 26, 27, 28, 29, and water-route 4, entering from whichever side you want, which will take you through the seventh gym city, another town, and another dungeon. In this dungeon, you’ll meet an NPC who’ll give you the final tool you need to traverse the region, as long as you have 7 gym badges. If you don’t have 7 gym badges that’s fine though, he’ll move from the dungeon to the town after you meet him so he’s easy to return to. This tool is the rock-climbing gear, which will let you climb over one-way ledges, which are absolutely littered all over the region, namely along route 19, 17, and 16, but the main area this finally lets you access is route 30, from pretty much wherever you want. And with that all done, you’ll finally be able to reach the pokemon league, which you can challenge as soon as you have all 8 badges.
(12/12)
>almost entirely skipping over the actually geographically and culturally interesting half of Canada, that would also make the best real world connection to Unova
Your map is entirely prairie and Hongcouver, try again
Western Canada is the only part that matters, leasterners can get out.
Bros I did not just spend 3 hours writing all that only for no one to bother posting in this thread. Just look at the images if you can’t be fricked to read all the text.
New Game+ is a good option. I’m skeptical at the amount of fakemons especially with the development time.
Would using existing mons speed things up?
I’m settled on only fakemon, I heard someone say one time that trying to have both fakemon and real Pokémon in a fan game usually just leads to people defaulting to the real mons and tbqh I agree, I think if I’m gonna do any fakemon I should go all the way with it. Besides I’m really not in any rush, I’m mainly making this game because I just enjoy the process of making it. I’m autistically obsessed with RPG game design and needed a creative outlet, originally I wasn’t even gonna make it into a real game, but I kinda just figured I might as well if I’ve gotten this far
Tldr
Ok, fair enough.
For anyone who wants a simpler explanation, here's a color coded diagram showing when you unlock each section of the map: Yellow requires 0 badges, orange requires 1, Red requires 2, Purple requires 3, Magenta requires 5, Green requires 6, and Black requires 7. The only thing you need 8 gym badges for is challenging the league. If you wanna know more, you're free to scroll up.
should be much smaller in scope, canada is too huge to be one region.
Why does everyone keep saying this? It’s completely arbitrary. Hawaii is made up of a few small islands, Kalos is literally all of France, Kanto is basically just the greater Tokyo area, while Galar is the entire British isle. And guess what? Not one of these regions is even 1% as big as the real thing. Canada is vast but has very little going on, there’s no reason it can’t be condensed into one region. It’s not even supposed to be an exact translation of Canada anyway.
Well done anon.
OP here, I guess I'll try to ask more specific questions rather than asking for general thoughts.
What do you guys think of the non-linearity during the latter portions of the game?
I was trying to go for something similar to gen 1 where linear progression is semi-encouraged through the map design but ultimately things are left pretty loose so that the player still has a lot of freedom in choosing how they wanna go about things, especially after you get surf. No one wants to be tightly restricted by the vision of the creator in a fan game, I wanted the player to feel like the world is a sand-box that they're let loose in rather than a series of specific locations that they're closely guided through.
I played Black recently and kind of didnt like how the game just opens completely up after the 6th and 7th gyms. All the sudden there are a ton of places to explore and legendaries to capture, but then when you finally get on with it and go to Dragonspiral Tower you are enormously overleveled for the rest of the game.
So was your issue with how the game opens up or with the effect on levels?
levels. it would be hard to balance for those who dont do side stuff vs those who do. unless some side stuff was flagged to make the elite 4 stronger
Really that's kind of the main purpose of the difficulty modes mentioned here
If you're the sort of player to just do what you need to do to get through the story, you should pick a mode that offers more exp per battle, whereas if you're the sort of player who likes to be thorough, exploring every area and battling every trainer, then you should pick a mode that offers less exp per battle.
Tangentially related but I'll post it here anyways, bout a year back I plotted out a rough sequence for a Canadian region (obviously with way less time spent on it that OP) that I'll share. Everything below this being a repost of that.
Gym leaders - In order
>Lighthouse Keeper - St John's - Electric
>Anne of Green Gables - Fairy - Charlottetown
>Coureur de Bois - Quebec (they're gonna mix Montreal and Quebec City into one just because the walls are pretty cool) - Water
>Rob Ford - Toronto - Poison
>Cree Stereotype - Winnipeg - Ghost
>Rancher - Calgary (probably mixed with Edmonton) - Normal
>Prospector - Whitehorse - Ground
>Inuit Stereotype and Explorer Married Couple - Iqaluit - Ice Double Battle
Elite 4 at Niagara
>Hockey Player - Fighting
>Snowbird - Flying
>Pakistani Immigrant - Dark
>Mountie - Fire
Other Cities/Towns
>Starting at Halifax
>Ottawa exists i guess
>Churchill? Remote as frick but it's just in a good spot in the middle of the country
>Something in Yellowknife
>Frick BC they can be a post game area i guess
Good map OP, I like it.