>he thinks Hittites were white
They spoke an Indo-European language, that was it. They would have been about as white as modern Greeks with like 5-10% Steppe autosomal.
>>he thinks Hittites were white
Where did you get that? Why would I give a shit about playing as white people in a game about Egypt? The whites are all savage barbarians who chimped out, invaded their betters, and brought brown civilization to its knees. Okay I'll play as the Sea People too once they get added.
No they weren't. They were local Meditarranean pirates. Spastic. LMFAO! Meds are objectively not white, they're MENA. COPE!
9 months ago
Anonymous
dorian greeks came from the north and greece had a milder climate than today. you don't know and neither do i
9 months ago
Anonymous
Have you ever seen a fricking Greek? They had around 0-20% Steppe on average. They were objective not white. moron.
9 months ago
Anonymous
9 months ago
Anonymous
You need to understand the severe limitations of facial reconstructions. Spastic. See the Julius Caesar one.
We can look at Greeks today. And we can look at ancient Greek archaeogenetics.
We know they were swarthy.
They were swarthy as shit. Minimal Steppe admixture. EEF people.
Keep coping all you want. Greeks were not and have never been white.
9 months ago
Anonymous
White people aren't just Aryans. I think that the hellenic period and the roman period were important parts of white history. White race and culture isn't just from the Aryans, but the other native people's of europe. You wouldn't have a lot of white culture without the romans and greeks.
I have ancestors from Greece, and all over Europe and I 100% consider Greeks to be white.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>White people aren't just Aryans.
White people are people who look white. Greeks are not white. They do not look white. They are no more white than an East Asian is. moron.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>I have non-white ancestors so I must pretend these clearly non-white people were white simply so I can continue LARPing as a white person and not a filthy mutt abomination freak
Yeah. Case and point. Actual Greeks spent their entire existence enslaving and subjugating and brutalizing and hating on the 'white people' you think they are grouped with.
They detested white northern barbarians. Idiot.
Again white isn't just the aryan peoples. As I said before greeks are tan because of sunlight, which is why greek women were recorded as being pale and pale men were considered effeminate.
As long as the big umbrella idea of race existed, Europeans haven't excluded greeks and romans from being considered white, this is pushed by hostile groups to Europeans, who deconstruct as much as they can about European civilization.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>which is why greek women were recorded as being pale
No that's because their women were often literally slaves taken from northern barbarians.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>I have non-white ancestors so I must pretend these clearly non-white people were white simply so I can continue LARPing as a white person and not a filthy mutt abomination freak
Yeah. Case and point. Actual Greeks spent their entire existence enslaving and subjugating and brutalizing and hating on the 'white people' you think they are grouped with.
They detested white northern barbarians. Idiot.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Vikings did the same, Ranjeet
9 months ago
Anonymous
Your grandmother tell you that? And please let me guess, Romans weren't white either, at least according to your grandmother?
9 months ago
Anonymous
How was grey eyes so common back then? People keep telling me I'm the only grey-eyed person they know. Even the rest of my family has blue or light brown eyes.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Smaller gene pools I guess. Once people started traveling all over spreading their dominant non-grey eye genes it got bred out
9 months ago
Anonymous
What Romans/Greeks called blond isn't what we would call blond. It usually just meant slightly lighter dark brown hair.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Disproven. The contemporary historians use the same words to describe the hair color of their emperor as they use to describe gauls or germanic tribes.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Modern Greeks and southern Europeans even do this. They call objectively dark brown hair blond or red when it has a slightly reddish or yellow hue or tinge to it under bright lights. They are pathetic. They also claim brown eyes are 'light' when they aren't jet black.
9 months ago
Anonymous
thats some compelling evidence my man
>as they use to describe gauls or germanic tribes.
Yes and you realize those peoples were overwhelmingly darkhaired too, right? We know for a fact Vikings dyed their hair blond. They have found the dye they used in their graves and so forth and found and tested burials with black or brown hair and no blond gene. Lots of them had brown eyes too.
FFS Norse sagas and names literally speak about Norsemen with black hair and swarthy skin and carrying names like 'the Black' or 'the Dark' etc. etc.
>Yes and you realize those peoples were overwhelmingly darkhaired too, right?
According to who? This is all based on unproven conjecture that every contemporary historian didn't mean blonde hair when they wrote down blonde hair. If they had a word for "actually blonde" hair it would be more compelling.
Let's not even start on the golden hair description, which is used even more than blond. Please tell me that they didn't actually mean gold hair either when they wrote it, and romans didn't actually know what gold looked like.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>A study from 2013 for prediction of hair and eye colour from DNA of the Greek people showed that the self-reported phenotype frequencies according to hair and eye colour categories was as follows: 119 individuals – hair colour, 11 blond, 45 dark blond/light brown, 49 dark brown, 3 brown red/auburn and 11 had black hair; eye colour, 13 with blue, 15 with intermediate (green, heterochromia) and 91 had brown eye colour >Another study from 2012 included 150 dental school students from the University of Athens, and the results of the study showed that light hair colour (blonde/light ash brown) was predominant in 10.7% of the students. 36% had medium hair colour (light brown/medium darkest brown), 32% had darkest brown and 21% black (15.3 off black, 6% midnight black). In conclusion, the hair colour of young Greeks are mostly brown, ranging from light to dark brown with significant minorities having black and blonde hair. The same study also showed that the eye colour of the students was 14.6% blue/green, 28% medium (light brown) and 57.4% dark brown.
Greeks are not white. They're MENA.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Was your study done after several hundred years of ottoman rape or after? After, right?
>According to who?
Archaeogenetics. moron.
Go ahead then. Link me to an archaeogenetic study who can prove Gauls, as a collective people, were "overwhelmingly darkhaired". Up to that point it is you who is the moron.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Ancient Greeks had similar genetics and Steppe admixture. In fact modern Greeks have MORE Steppe admixture and are therefore considerably lighter and fairer than Ancient Greeks.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>source: my black grandmother
Between your grandmother and every contemporary greek historian telling that wasn't the case, I'll go with the historians.
There's little more pathetic than seeing some /misc/-addled muttcel argue about how everyone isn't white for hours.
It's funny because none of these people would actually have the balls to say it to face of greeks(or italians) that they aren't white.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Nah. No art or statues (which were painted btw) depict themselves as darker or less fair then they are today.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>Go ahead then. Link me to an archaeogenetic study who can prove Gauls, as a collective people, were "overwhelmingly darkhaired". Up to that point it is you who is the moron.
Well we can just look at modern French people, large percentages of whom descend directly from Gauls and have near identical genetic profiles to them.
Do you think modern French people are universally blond or redhaired? Do you? Do you think they all have chalkwhite skin and piercing blue eyes as the Romans and Greeks claimed they did? Do you?
9 months ago
Anonymous
>According to who?
Archaeogenetics. moron.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>as they use to describe gauls or germanic tribes.
Yes and you realize those peoples were overwhelmingly darkhaired too, right? We know for a fact Vikings dyed their hair blond. They have found the dye they used in their graves and so forth and found and tested burials with black or brown hair and no blond gene. Lots of them had brown eyes too.
FFS Norse sagas and names literally speak about Norsemen with black hair and swarthy skin and carrying names like 'the Black' or 'the Dark' etc. etc.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Modern Scandinavians are paler and blonder than Norsemen and even modern Scandinavians are overwhelmingly brownhaired with brown eyes being fairly common too.
>Norsemen have black hair too
So fricking what? Anon pointed out the words used for blonde hair are the same. The existence of dark haired germanics doesn't counter that unless you're trying to say that germanics aren't white either
9 months ago
Anonymous
The point is Romans and Greeks claimed ALL Germanic peoples were universally blond or red haired at different times from different sources. Same with Gauls. Some describe them as universally blond, others as universally red.
We know for a fact those sources are not accurate. So we know for a fact those source might also embellish and exaggerate the fairness of Romans or Greeks they're talking about.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>black or brown hair and no blond gene.
It's more complicated here, since as an example, early Aryans (Indo-Europeans) carried the blond gene but it wasn't expressing the phenotype yet.
>Lots of them had brown eyes too.
For the Gauls and Germans??
Doubt it, the Neolithic farmers had already mixed into the genome by then and they were blue eyed. If it was more then 10% brown (+black) i'd be very surprised.
For reference France in the 1800's was 70% blue eyes and the USA was 50% back in 1900.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>early Aryans (Indo-Europeans) carried the blond gene but it wasn't expressing the phenotype yet.
I know. But if they don't carry the gene at all they are confirmed to not have blond hair. So even the ones WITH the blond gene were likely rarely expressive of that gene in phenotype. Especially past childhood.
9 months ago
Anonymous
By early I am talking the time during the first invasion of Europe et al.
By 0AD Vikings were expressive blond hair. It wasn't only the Romans that said this, you can see accounts (later) from the Arabs as well.
Neolithic farmers were browneyed. Lol.
This is wrong, according to known science, currently.
Vikings were not overwhelmingly blondhaired. Why would they dye their hair blond if they already had blond hair. Why would modern Scandiavians who are overhwhelmingly descended from them be LESS BLOND than Vikings were, exactly?
What's the simplest explanation here. That ancient sources exaggerated blondness in populations or that Scandinavians are somehow massively less blond today than they were 2000 years ago? Hmm?
9 months ago
Anonymous
>European hunter-gatherers were much taller than EEFs, and the replacement of European hunter-gatherers by EEFs resulted in a dramatic decrease in genetic height throughout Europe. During the later phases of the Neolithic, height increased among European farmers, probably due to increasing admixture with hunter-gatherers. During the Late Neolithic and Bronze Age, further reductions of EEF ancestry in Europe due to migrations of peoples with steppe-related ancestry is associated with further increases in height.[14] High frequencies of EEF ancestry in Southern Europe might partly explain the shortness of Southern Europeans as compared to Northern Europeans, who carry increased levels of steppe-related ancestry.[15] >The Early European Farmers are believed to have been mostly dark haired and dark eyed, and light skinned.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Neolithic farmers were browneyed. Lol.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Modern Scandinavians are paler and blonder than Norsemen and even modern Scandinavians are overwhelmingly brownhaired with brown eyes being fairly common too.
9 months ago
Anonymous
Yes lets just ignore 2000+ years of crises, demographic shift, migration, and genocides. I bet you don’t even know Egypt and North Africa in 500 AD were both white and far greener than they are today because of the arab conquest muddying the demographics and environmental shift expanding the sahara
9 months ago
Anonymous
>greece had a milder climate than today.
What's your fricking point, bud? Are you suggesting Greeks were whiter back then because the climate was milder? LMFAO! There are fricking peoples that live in the Arctic and Siberia and northern Canada and they're all dark as shit swarthy Mongoloid chinks you fricking spastic. They've lived there for millennia.
Climate has FRICK ALL to do with paleness and blondness.
Its crazy that people are denying the whiteness of greeks.
Greek males were tan from the sun and the women were pale likely from not being exposed to sunlight.
Paler skin on men was seen as effeminate, again because this means they stayed indoors like women.
>Greek males were tan from the sun
No they were literally swarthy as shit, just like they are today, due to their high EEF ancestry and low Steppe ancestry. There is a direct, undeniable correlation between PIE ancestry and whiteness. See
Have you ever seen a fricking Greek? They had around 0-20% Steppe on average. They were objective not white. moron.
EEF is from Anatolia. It's the same stuff other MENA peoples are descended from.That's why southern Europeans and Greeks constantly get 'mistaken' for MENA all the time. Because they racially, undeniably are MENA.
Greeks are about as 'white' as an Arab who learns English is.
You can keep coping and engaging in denialism all you like. Greeks are closer genetically to MENA. They look more like MENA. And everyone 'mistakes' them as MENA whenever they see them.
They are not white.
Yes the statues were painted and probably looked lifelike, unfortunately recreations just slap one color on the statue because "that's the chemical residue we found" not understanding what they're looking at is just the base coat
This shit is looking so terrible even the usual shills are struggling to sound excited. You can't blame people for preferring Warhammer when history games are this bad.
WE
WUZ
thas rite
KREE APOPHIS!
>Donald White
How does he cope?
by naming his children DeAhmose, JaImhotep and LaNeferu
HOL UP
The United States Air Force
GOOLD?
egyptians (ramesses)
Cringe.
why?
You should be playing as Irsu (early Israelites).
I will ONLY play as the main man Suppiluliuma II
>he thinks Hittites were white
They spoke an Indo-European language, that was it. They would have been about as white as modern Greeks with like 5-10% Steppe autosomal.
>>he thinks Hittites were white
Where did you get that? Why would I give a shit about playing as white people in a game about Egypt? The whites are all savage barbarians who chimped out, invaded their betters, and brought brown civilization to its knees. Okay I'll play as the Sea People too once they get added.
Sea People weren't white either. moron. LMAO!
Yes they were. moron. LOL
No they weren't. They were local Meditarranean pirates. Spastic. LMFAO! Meds are objectively not white, they're MENA. COPE!
dorian greeks came from the north and greece had a milder climate than today. you don't know and neither do i
Have you ever seen a fricking Greek? They had around 0-20% Steppe on average. They were objective not white. moron.
You need to understand the severe limitations of facial reconstructions. Spastic. See the Julius Caesar one.
We can look at Greeks today. And we can look at ancient Greek archaeogenetics.
We know they were swarthy.
They were swarthy as shit. Minimal Steppe admixture. EEF people.
Keep coping all you want. Greeks were not and have never been white.
White people aren't just Aryans. I think that the hellenic period and the roman period were important parts of white history. White race and culture isn't just from the Aryans, but the other native people's of europe. You wouldn't have a lot of white culture without the romans and greeks.
I have ancestors from Greece, and all over Europe and I 100% consider Greeks to be white.
>White people aren't just Aryans.
White people are people who look white. Greeks are not white. They do not look white. They are no more white than an East Asian is. moron.
Again white isn't just the aryan peoples. As I said before greeks are tan because of sunlight, which is why greek women were recorded as being pale and pale men were considered effeminate.
As long as the big umbrella idea of race existed, Europeans haven't excluded greeks and romans from being considered white, this is pushed by hostile groups to Europeans, who deconstruct as much as they can about European civilization.
>which is why greek women were recorded as being pale
No that's because their women were often literally slaves taken from northern barbarians.
>I have non-white ancestors so I must pretend these clearly non-white people were white simply so I can continue LARPing as a white person and not a filthy mutt abomination freak
Yeah. Case and point. Actual Greeks spent their entire existence enslaving and subjugating and brutalizing and hating on the 'white people' you think they are grouped with.
They detested white northern barbarians. Idiot.
Vikings did the same, Ranjeet
Your grandmother tell you that? And please let me guess, Romans weren't white either, at least according to your grandmother?
How was grey eyes so common back then? People keep telling me I'm the only grey-eyed person they know. Even the rest of my family has blue or light brown eyes.
Smaller gene pools I guess. Once people started traveling all over spreading their dominant non-grey eye genes it got bred out
What Romans/Greeks called blond isn't what we would call blond. It usually just meant slightly lighter dark brown hair.
Disproven. The contemporary historians use the same words to describe the hair color of their emperor as they use to describe gauls or germanic tribes.
Modern Greeks and southern Europeans even do this. They call objectively dark brown hair blond or red when it has a slightly reddish or yellow hue or tinge to it under bright lights. They are pathetic. They also claim brown eyes are 'light' when they aren't jet black.
thats some compelling evidence my man
>Yes and you realize those peoples were overwhelmingly darkhaired too, right?
According to who? This is all based on unproven conjecture that every contemporary historian didn't mean blonde hair when they wrote down blonde hair. If they had a word for "actually blonde" hair it would be more compelling.
Let's not even start on the golden hair description, which is used even more than blond. Please tell me that they didn't actually mean gold hair either when they wrote it, and romans didn't actually know what gold looked like.
>A study from 2013 for prediction of hair and eye colour from DNA of the Greek people showed that the self-reported phenotype frequencies according to hair and eye colour categories was as follows: 119 individuals – hair colour, 11 blond, 45 dark blond/light brown, 49 dark brown, 3 brown red/auburn and 11 had black hair; eye colour, 13 with blue, 15 with intermediate (green, heterochromia) and 91 had brown eye colour
>Another study from 2012 included 150 dental school students from the University of Athens, and the results of the study showed that light hair colour (blonde/light ash brown) was predominant in 10.7% of the students. 36% had medium hair colour (light brown/medium darkest brown), 32% had darkest brown and 21% black (15.3 off black, 6% midnight black). In conclusion, the hair colour of young Greeks are mostly brown, ranging from light to dark brown with significant minorities having black and blonde hair. The same study also showed that the eye colour of the students was 14.6% blue/green, 28% medium (light brown) and 57.4% dark brown.
Greeks are not white. They're MENA.
Was your study done after several hundred years of ottoman rape or after? After, right?
Go ahead then. Link me to an archaeogenetic study who can prove Gauls, as a collective people, were "overwhelmingly darkhaired". Up to that point it is you who is the moron.
Ancient Greeks had similar genetics and Steppe admixture. In fact modern Greeks have MORE Steppe admixture and are therefore considerably lighter and fairer than Ancient Greeks.
>source: my black grandmother
Between your grandmother and every contemporary greek historian telling that wasn't the case, I'll go with the historians.
It's funny because none of these people would actually have the balls to say it to face of greeks(or italians) that they aren't white.
Nah. No art or statues (which were painted btw) depict themselves as darker or less fair then they are today.
>Go ahead then. Link me to an archaeogenetic study who can prove Gauls, as a collective people, were "overwhelmingly darkhaired". Up to that point it is you who is the moron.
Well we can just look at modern French people, large percentages of whom descend directly from Gauls and have near identical genetic profiles to them.
Do you think modern French people are universally blond or redhaired? Do you? Do you think they all have chalkwhite skin and piercing blue eyes as the Romans and Greeks claimed they did? Do you?
>According to who?
Archaeogenetics. moron.
>as they use to describe gauls or germanic tribes.
Yes and you realize those peoples were overwhelmingly darkhaired too, right? We know for a fact Vikings dyed their hair blond. They have found the dye they used in their graves and so forth and found and tested burials with black or brown hair and no blond gene. Lots of them had brown eyes too.
FFS Norse sagas and names literally speak about Norsemen with black hair and swarthy skin and carrying names like 'the Black' or 'the Dark' etc. etc.
>Norsemen have black hair too
So fricking what? Anon pointed out the words used for blonde hair are the same. The existence of dark haired germanics doesn't counter that unless you're trying to say that germanics aren't white either
The point is Romans and Greeks claimed ALL Germanic peoples were universally blond or red haired at different times from different sources. Same with Gauls. Some describe them as universally blond, others as universally red.
We know for a fact those sources are not accurate. So we know for a fact those source might also embellish and exaggerate the fairness of Romans or Greeks they're talking about.
>black or brown hair and no blond gene.
It's more complicated here, since as an example, early Aryans (Indo-Europeans) carried the blond gene but it wasn't expressing the phenotype yet.
>Lots of them had brown eyes too.
For the Gauls and Germans??
Doubt it, the Neolithic farmers had already mixed into the genome by then and they were blue eyed. If it was more then 10% brown (+black) i'd be very surprised.
For reference France in the 1800's was 70% blue eyes and the USA was 50% back in 1900.
>early Aryans (Indo-Europeans) carried the blond gene but it wasn't expressing the phenotype yet.
I know. But if they don't carry the gene at all they are confirmed to not have blond hair. So even the ones WITH the blond gene were likely rarely expressive of that gene in phenotype. Especially past childhood.
By early I am talking the time during the first invasion of Europe et al.
By 0AD Vikings were expressive blond hair. It wasn't only the Romans that said this, you can see accounts (later) from the Arabs as well.
This is wrong, according to known science, currently.
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_European_Farmers
Vikings were not overwhelmingly blondhaired. Why would they dye their hair blond if they already had blond hair. Why would modern Scandiavians who are overhwhelmingly descended from them be LESS BLOND than Vikings were, exactly?
What's the simplest explanation here. That ancient sources exaggerated blondness in populations or that Scandinavians are somehow massively less blond today than they were 2000 years ago? Hmm?
>European hunter-gatherers were much taller than EEFs, and the replacement of European hunter-gatherers by EEFs resulted in a dramatic decrease in genetic height throughout Europe. During the later phases of the Neolithic, height increased among European farmers, probably due to increasing admixture with hunter-gatherers. During the Late Neolithic and Bronze Age, further reductions of EEF ancestry in Europe due to migrations of peoples with steppe-related ancestry is associated with further increases in height.[14] High frequencies of EEF ancestry in Southern Europe might partly explain the shortness of Southern Europeans as compared to Northern Europeans, who carry increased levels of steppe-related ancestry.[15]
>The Early European Farmers are believed to have been mostly dark haired and dark eyed, and light skinned.
Neolithic farmers were browneyed. Lol.
Modern Scandinavians are paler and blonder than Norsemen and even modern Scandinavians are overwhelmingly brownhaired with brown eyes being fairly common too.
Yes lets just ignore 2000+ years of crises, demographic shift, migration, and genocides. I bet you don’t even know Egypt and North Africa in 500 AD were both white and far greener than they are today because of the arab conquest muddying the demographics and environmental shift expanding the sahara
>greece had a milder climate than today.
What's your fricking point, bud? Are you suggesting Greeks were whiter back then because the climate was milder? LMFAO! There are fricking peoples that live in the Arctic and Siberia and northern Canada and they're all dark as shit swarthy Mongoloid chinks you fricking spastic. They've lived there for millennia.
Climate has FRICK ALL to do with paleness and blondness.
dumb dumb
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_Peoples
Frickoff with your dogshit settings. Give Empire 2 or more Warhammer content.
Its crazy that people are denying the whiteness of greeks.
Greek males were tan from the sun and the women were pale likely from not being exposed to sunlight.
Paler skin on men was seen as effeminate, again because this means they stayed indoors like women.
>Greek males were tan from the sun
No they were literally swarthy as shit, just like they are today, due to their high EEF ancestry and low Steppe ancestry. There is a direct, undeniable correlation between PIE ancestry and whiteness. See
EEF is from Anatolia. It's the same stuff other MENA peoples are descended from.That's why southern Europeans and Greeks constantly get 'mistaken' for MENA all the time. Because they racially, undeniably are MENA.
Greeks are about as 'white' as an Arab who learns English is.
You can keep coping and engaging in denialism all you like. Greeks are closer genetically to MENA. They look more like MENA. And everyone 'mistakes' them as MENA whenever they see them.
They are not white.
Am*ricans just shut up about race.
You don't actually care what greeks hitites and egyptians looked like.
Video games?
Will I get to marry my sister as Pharaoh for the, uh... immersion?
anglo's wanna have a culture so badly jej
my ancestor 🙂
LMFAO!
Yes the statues were painted and probably looked lifelike, unfortunately recreations just slap one color on the statue because "that's the chemical residue we found" not understanding what they're looking at is just the base coat
me on the left
none, i will not play a lazy fricking troy spinoff
This shit is looking so terrible even the usual shills are struggling to sound excited. You can't blame people for preferring Warhammer when history games are this bad.
Egyptian Faction
There's little more pathetic than seeing some /misc/-addled muttcel argue about how everyone isn't white for hours.
Imagine playing any total war game after attila.
True, attila was the peak of total war games, nothing can beat it.
Shardana. I will come for you. There is no escape. Only death.
The american goblino human genome aberration and it's consequences have been a disaster for the human race
It's the Bulgarian division, so expect Troy quality. Last I checked, most of the factions are TBA along with the fricking dlc shit.
Also, no yahweh no buy/pirate
>no yahweh
Irsu is the early Israelites.