>Ultima, you can never defeat humans you created because you don't understand power of friendship
What the frick?
Why?
How the frick writers even got paid for writing that?
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Awful game.
are you moronic?
I can reduce every plot in every game to those levels and call it bad.
Shut up moron.
name 5
Hearts
>>Mass Effect
Evil
Oh yeah? Tell me whats so bad about collecting baloons in order to race a giant pig in space
>I can reduce every plot in every game to those levels and call it bad.
Too bad this is almost literally the dialog in the final encounter, not some absurd reductionist take on it.
>Clive defeating other dominants and absorbing their eikons
>Some characters like Cid and Jill voluntarily gave their eikons to Clive
>Ultima considered Clive as the best vessel and despised humans as lesser things without free will
>Clive saying before the final fight with Ultima that he didn't predict the free will of people and that's why Ultima will lose
You manipulative morons didn't even play the game, right?
moron. Ultima didn’t like humanity because they developed free will. He wanted to strip them of their free will and turn them all akashic.
That wasn't Ultimas aim, thats the lie he told Barnabas to get him onside.
He wanted humanity dead because its purpose (to create the vessel) was served.
>GankerintendoGAF
what do you think?
>B-BUT NINTENDO
every time
every fricking FF16 thread gets derailed into "lmao pikmin sold more in one week flop flop flop"
>You manipulative morons didn't even play the game, right?
It's a PS exclusive what do you think? Watch it as it comes to PC and people praising it to heavens. It will be another Death Stranding.
He should've turned into Diabolos rather than Tri-Disaster. Would match with Clive's outfit too.
>He should've turned into Diabolos
that was the original idea but they said it felt too much like Devilman lol
They have Vincent for that.
I really wanna see how much Dirge shit they're gonna put in lmao
Terrible decision. Both Devilman and Persona 5 are old enough to be considered not similar.
It just feels arbitrary.
I'd rather have Clive win on an actual mechanical technicality, one which would be [a] caused by trusting somebody (or some other selfless human virtue) and [b] serves to highlight Ultima's arrogance.
That's what an actual writer would do when given this scenario, it's the same plot points but it has that "gotcha" moment that makes it all satisfying when the villain realises he fricked up. The Wheel of Time does this, even fricking Harry Potter does this.
I love how Ultima is "I'm not mad, I'm actually very calm right now" embodied
it's the classic Naruto vs Sasuke trope all over again. One person with bonds with tons of people will always triumph over someone going at it alone and rejecting bonds and connections
Once you realise they just wanted to copy a Lawgay route from SMT it all makes sense. XVI is fundamentally lazy because it only exists to funnel people into XIV, the real cash cow.
>a collective is better than a single person
NO FRICKING WAY
Friendship != collectivism.
Eh, you know what I mean.
Anyway I don't even think that 16 pulled it off that well, those random quotes didn't even really fit what was happening on screen; if every Dominant was heard during their Eikon's move it would've been better imo.
Also maybe a guilty pleasure but I love the way AC did it.
?t=207
>Anon is angry a jrpg devolves into the power of friendship
Another case of Ganker doesn't play video games. I'm curious if there exists a jrpg that doesn't devolve into the power of friendship
What the frick were they thinking with the gay shit and shape-shifting troony shit?
It's more like
>Create and rely on sentient gun to solve your problems at said gun's expense.
>act surprised when said gun turns on you and BTFOs you
>Seethe and cry as you die with a softball sized whole in your chest
Hole*
>Ha ha I'm a genius!
>OH NO
does he straight up NANI!? in jp?
>human form barely emotes most of the time
>prime form though seems more given to emotions even if only subtly
>Dion still getting that final 'frick you' in
what a chad
He's a homosexual
and still more of man than you'll ever be
>unironically simping for homosexuals
LMAO
nta but while dion is indeed a homosexual, you're a homosexual.
Why do leftists always insist that anyone who finds gays repulsive is le secretly gay? Like it fits into their moronic fairy tale narrative and they deserve a pat on the back for being so heckin progressive and tolerant.
I'm not even a leftoid I'm just not a delicate flower when it comes to a chaste gay kiss that happens for like 2 secinds in a videogame
>I'm not even a leftoid
>defending homosexual shit
LOL
You're a crybaby, noted. You can leave the thread now homokun
>leftoid cuck simping for gay shit
>calling others homo
Pathetic
You're still whining over a gay kiss in a game you deem to be gay homoshit. Why are you even in this thread?
This trash game deserves to be shit on. What are you doing here? Simping for homosexuals?
The game has been out for nearly a month, it's time to move on with your life
>literally cannot stop thinking about wieners.
You lost. Dion is based and will hopefully get a DLC so we can dragoon jump ourselves. Frick Olivier, all my homies hate that kid.
Barry lost.
>now wants to play as the homosexual
LMAO
If you've ever played as a woman in a videogame you are a troon who enjoys sucking wiener. Strange but true!
Yet somehow you manage to inhale more wiener than the prince of dragoons could ever hope to.
>Not wanting to play as this smooth motherfricker.
homosexual.
Damn I wish they went more in a Tales Of direction where it's a party based action rpg. Just playing as Clives kinda sucks but I guess it wouldn't work with how cinematic the game is.
I'm hoping they expand in that direction in the future. Clive had a fun moveset, and they'd have likely fricked it up if they tried to make Josh, Jill, and Dion actually playable.
I wouldn't be surprised if they couldn't figure it out in time and cut development on more playable characters.
I still hope we get an expansion or another game in this style, but with more characters.
just split the eikons between 3 different characters, maybe even allow the player to assign them
and then let the player switch between characters like Remake
Dion is gay yet had more hugs from a female than you ever will
Dion was a genuinely decent character. The fact that you cannot stop thinking about the kiss scene every time you see him is a you problem tbqhwy famalam
He should've gotten his heart-to-heart with Harpocrates
The first thing I want to be done, is to get that piece of crap out of my ring. Don't just get him out of the
ring, get him out of Valisthea because I've proved son, without a
shadow of a doubt, you ain't got what it takes anymore! You sit there and you thump your Eikonomachy, and you say your prayers, and it didn't get you anywhere. Talk about your psalms, talk about Odin 3:16.. Clive 3:16 says I just whipped your ass!
All he's gotta do is go buy him a cheap bottle of aether and try to dig back some of that courage he had in his prime.
As the King Of The Ring, I'm serving notice to every one of the gods. I don't give a damn what they are, they're all on the list, and that's Cid the Outlaw’s list, and I'm fixing to start running through all of 'em.
And as far as this championship match is considered son, I don't give a damn if it's Ultima or Genova, Clive Rosfield's time is come, and when I get that shot you're looking at the age of free men.
And that's the bottom line, because Cid the Outlaw said so.
>you can never defeat humans you created because you don't understand power of friendship
This sounds like something from an AI generated Kingdom Hearts game.
He doesn't say it in game dumbass, OP is doing the comical oversimplification
This is literally just the neir plot with some bottom ends switched out.
>We made this creation to save ourselves from destruction
>Oops, after waiting too long, it seems our creation has evolved to have significant consciousness and free will
>mutated creation goes on to kill its creator in desperate attempt to live, destroying its original reason for existence
That’s pretty standard Japanese writing.
>90% of the dialogue in the last 10-15 hours of the game
>will
>will
>will
>will
>will
up until this point, the game had an average plot and story, but once you hit Odin and Ultima's sections of the game the story just plummets and is reduced to this garbage.
I think Adderall will help you with that problem.
>Consciousness
>Primogenesis
>Mythos
>Logos
>oh
Anon, Ultima was fricking with Clive since the start of the game.
Ultima is a mental creature. You genuinely never see the 'real' Ultima until Ultima Risen, which is his actual body. Every other time you see Ultima it's one of him fricking with people's minds, hence why he can do all kinds of weird shit.
His goal was to strip Clive of concious thought to hijack his body, something he couldn't accomplish because Clive's connections to his friends kept reinforcing his willpower and Joshua's protection kept shoving Ultima back.
The final boss fight quite literally takes place in Clive's mind as he overpowers and destroys the re-completed Ultima.
Think you mean Prime. Risen is inside Clive's mind too.
You're right, I mixed the two.
Technically speaking Interdimensional Ultima is also him in a physical body, just semi-primed
I thought the Interdimensional Rift segment was Ultima pulling Clive and Joshua into his own mind, or at least that of his portion in Drake's Spine?
You could be right, but Interdimenaional Rift is a physical location in previous games.
>"Ugh villains these days always have to have some tragic backstory and misunderstood who just have to talk about their feelings! Why cant we just have a straight up villain??"
>Okay here you go.
>"NOOO not like that! He's too simple and not complicated enough"
You all fundamentally misunderstand the concept of will. The will, in this game, must be understood under Hegelian conventions. It is the Geist, a manifestation of greatness reserved for certain individuals. Maybe we are delving into Nietzschean territory in our focus on the individual, but it's a natural synthesis that has been well-developed in philosophy for a while now.
Of course, you must also look at the Luciferian implications of Ultima, and perhaps, even delve into the very nature of man. Of course, the Geist can't be manifested in animals without a rational soul, very Aristotelian, but the Gnostic and Satan allegories suggest an even more specific relationship between man and will, beyond necessary and or sufficient ideas of its existence/channeling.
the Luciferian implications.. are for Clive, not Ultima, Clive is the Paradise Lost Lucifer, but this time, rebelling against God is good, because this God is Unjust, and has no love for Angels (the Dominates) or Man.
I thought this game was really good but there are three things I want to see added in PC release.
1) Add in Torgal cut content. The frost wolf stuff was obviously not finished.
2) Add more things like charge earings or beserker ring. Gear that actually changes how action combat plays.
3) Completly change sword progression. Ideally by adding abilities or aspects to each sword, or at least a substantial amount of them.
>half assed baby easy combat
>uninspired art direction that could be blended into several other fantasy franchises because it lacks personality
>Clive, the "i pretend to have a personality so I can appeal to everyone" protagonist
>Big useless doggo for cheap animal lover pandering
>instead of being the rulling class, people with cheat magic powers are instead slaves who are hated for literally no reason
>geopolitics trown around here and there but it never goes anywhere, the game's central plot would be completely unaffected by lacking it all
>Odin is boring. Nothing more boring than a cool villain who does not act of his own volition and ambitions
Not to mention Jill and Clive traveled together for years, and they've always liked it each other, yet they me to believe that nothing sexual happened in those years.
It's worse than the people who claim that it makes sense for Chris and Jill to be just "partners"
FRICK OFF.
This game wasn't bad but it definitely wasnt the saving grace the franchise needed to be back on its fit
And yeah, by aesthetics alone pic related seemed way more interesting
Cool diary entry
of being the rulling class, people with cheat magic powers are instead slaves who are hated for literally no reason
They're hated because they used to be a major portion of the ruling class, and had begun to institute new offices exclusively for themselves to gain more power.
I don't remember ever seeing that in the game.
You probably skipped all the sidequests then
Yes, I skipped some of the sidequests because I've concluded Square simply can't into sidequests
I cant say I blame you but some of those last side quests are really worth it if for the character moments/worldbuilding. It's a shame that they turned people off with lackluster sidequest design
I will just watch these sidequests on YT then. No reason to replay the game for this
they're very shitty gameplay-wise, but if you like the game's world and lore enough, try and do them, it's worth it for 90% of them
>it's worth it
the only positive thing about them is that their foreshadowing allows you to make that huge downer of an ending less soulcrushing
>he isn't hopepilled about clive's fate
Ngmi
i'm gonna be honest i had the ending spoiled so when i saw it i was shocked at how less 'ambiguous' it was then Ganker made it out to be. 85% sure he's dead
100% sure he's alive
And that's where the sidequest shit comes in; it's really the odd line here and there that gives you enough context and information to realize that he might live.
You were rused it's 85% sure he's alive. Everything lines up with him being alive. Not even the Phoenix can bring back the dead, Clive is shown to be the only physical survivor of Origin battle, Hapocrates questlines ends with him telling him to pick up the pen and write his own story, Final Fantasy is a line Clive tells Ultima inside his own mind, Clive/Wyvern/Cid/Mythos/Ifrit/Logos Clive is a man of many names who takes up his fallen comrades name to honor his legacy, the red star Metia is actual Ultima's observation station in the secret reports the star fades because its master was defeated, Clive's first promise was on the star but his promise at the end of Jill's questline is on the dawn, Jill sees the star fade and starts to cry but then the dawn breaks and she smiles, the in real life FF book they made for the game has Hapocrates pen with it, Clive narrates the beginning and end of the game like he's reading a story, one story ends a new one begins, Cid's dream was a world were men could die on their own terms, Clive's was that men could live on their own terms, etc.
> the red star Metia is actual Ultima's observation station in the secret reports the star fades because its master was defeated
hey where's that report ? I've done everything on NG/NG+ and can't remember reading that ? The Metia lore entry doesn't mention it either
load your save after beating the final boss (or maybe it's there in NG+, dunno), I think it's actually in the Beasts section under ultimalus or whatever
>When Origin was buried beneath the earth in order to absorb the aether it would need to rebuild the world, a great shrine was placed in the sky above it.
Huh, I guess it could be Metia. I just assumed it was the big spike emerging from twinside. I wish they'd give a definitive answer. I'd be 100% sure Clive survived then
>I wish they'd give a definitive answer.
me too
>dude its not ambiguous at all
>still gets it wrong
I kinda love that you need to have done almost everything in the game to realize that Clive fricking won.
If you weren't paying attention it really does look like he died.
I saw an interpretation I really liked the other day.
Since the side quests adds context that changes how the ending can be interpreted, the outcome for Clive actually depends on how the player/Clive exorcised his WILL, of what quest he wanted to do, and who he ended up being able to lean on when he falls.
>only those who had the strength to stomach those fricking sidequests get to see him live
based?
>"We see the horizon ever out of reach, yet still we march on... certain that the answers lie just beyond it. Because that is our way."
>you need to have done almost everything in the game to realize that Clive fricking won
It's kind of like a more interesting way of 100%ing the game to unlock the true ending. The ending is the same, but instead, you unlock the true understanding.
Frick Clive, " let's create le normal world" is thw soul-crushing part.
well other than that there's a lot of quests with interesting world building, honestly i like most of them, weirdly enough
There are two that really got me (in a bad way):
The entire Lostwing storyline was kinda moronic with Quentin going Oppenheimer on us and the Dalimil shit was so fricking cliche that my eyes rolling could've created enough electricity to keep my house running for a couple of hours.
Everything with Byron was great, though.
well high five because that's the two questlines I dislike too, it was too on the nose for me, like really bad lol. But maybe it was their intention who knows.
It's probably just that we've seen that kind of story too many times already but man, there were moments where I could tell what was gonna happen way before it happened lol
one of the sidequests has you find a big book of big crimes that could basically ruin society because of BIG LIES
it's mentioned in that quest
It's in Vivian's end-game quest.
It's part of the Bookmen sidequest plotline or whatever they're called. Secret society that makes sure the history of the Bearers is kept lost to time. Bearers used to be revered for being able to use magic.
Fair enough, I skipped this sidequest. My other points still stand though.
>>half assed baby easy combat
Just because you waste your life playing games 24/7; doesn't mean a casual didn't have trouble with it. A bunch of homosexual streamers died playing.
>A bunch of homosexual streamers died playing.
WTF this game should be pulled off the shelves.
Brainlet here, please help me out:
So Ultima put the other survivors of his race into the Mothercrystals/turned them into the hearts of the crystals? Or did he split himself into those?
And in the final fight he basically got what he wanted but still got his ass kicked by Clive?
Also was the implication that his race was originally a bunch of Ifrits or was that again because he split hismelf into several parts?
His race is like the Anti-Spiral, they're all the same being. So the others of his kind are also him. The final fight he recombined with all of him to get to full power then tried to take over Clive's body by force, the last fight takes place inside his mind. I think all the previous Ifrits were just attempts at making a new body that failed, they can't handle Ultima and they turn to ash, I don't think they were his original bodies. Or maybe his race were all furries and Ultimaleus is his mansona, but I think that's rather silly.
>Ultimaleus is his mansona
who the frick would want to be us
we're kinda uggos
thanks, appreciate it
Ultima is a singular entity that exists as a collective conciousness of several minds.
He put one of these minds at the heart of each Mothercrystal, using them as catalysts to keep the aether flowing to Origin.
Each time a Mothercrystal falls, a portion of Ultima is freed and becomes independently capable of action. It should be noted that prior to the start of the game, two Mothercrystals had already been destroyed by natural causes; Drake's Eye in the lands north of Rosaria, and Drake's Horn in southern Ash. This allowed Ultima to appear during the events at Phoenix Gate and force Clive to turn into Ifrit for the first time.
The "real" Ultima was dormant beneath Twinside, and appears as Ultima Prime in Origin.
The Ultima(s) shown are thought-based entities effectively projecting themselves into the minds of others, with the Ifrit bodies being their apparent physical forms.
"What he Wanted" was Clive's body, he needed his full "race" to inhabit it, and all the Aether drawn up over the centuries also put into Clive's Body so he can cast "Raise". and reality shift the planet to a form that can withstand the concept of Magic without dying.
this task is likely impossible, as Clive denotes that his body cannot contain the power, he likely would never survive casting Raise.
the only being in the FF Multiverse so far, that could, is likely Athena from FFXIV, who is about as strong as any entity in the franchise has ever gotten, but she too is not immune from being Warrior of Light'd, just as everything else in FF, if it has Aether it can die.
this is basically what the Ultima(s) wishes they were, and ironically, share a thematic relation.
why didn't they just make Ultima a hot crazy woman?
Because it's 2023
in their "Ultimate" forms they look like male/female twins, which is a cute nod that they share a thematic origin, Athena taking that form due to Ultimanian influence from the Black Auracite "Heart of Sabik".
I imagine Jenova's "True Form" is similar, (also why Sephiroth's final form is the basis of all the others, combined with Altima/Ultima from FF tactics, Sephiroths being a sort of Half Ultimanian form)
question is.. where do they come from? these planet devouring "Angels".
Kefka could only dream of being as insane and evil as this b***h.
honestly despite her low body count, she's by far the most conceptually evil villain in the series, she'd put the whole MULTIVERSE under the microscope and tear all life in all worlds to bits and sow them back together again just to see what happens.
>this task is likely impossible, as Clive denotes that his body cannot contain the power, he likely would never survive casting Raise
You are still missing Leviathan though, so you are still an incomplete vessel. Unless a DLC for Leviathan is just supposed to take place before the final fight and it's assumed you had it.
that wouldn't matter, Clive cannot contain the power he has in THAT moment, he'd never contain more.
he was an imperfect vessel, as basically 99.999999999999% of people would be, even with an infinite amount of eugenics time.
Athena made her perfect vessel with far better magic than anything the Ultima's had in the 16 universe, and far better "tech" that being, the Heart of Sabik, and even her shot at Godhood wasn't a true success, though by far the closest to being a "real" god in FF's history.
so what hope did the Ultima's have? none, zero, the percentage success for them is a rounding error, the feat to become a God in the FF Multiverse is as close to nil as there is, all "Gods" in the setting fall pray to the same folly, they are all born "not" Gods, all of them, FF has no true divinity, the only close shot at making one was Athena's true form, so far, and it was still not quite enough.
>don't beat Leviathan and be an imperfect vessel
normal shit ending
>beat Leviathan and become the the perfect vessel
perfect happy ending
I can only hope.
him becoming "perfect" wouldn't matter, Clive's GOAL is to destroy magic, and he does so.
he survives the outcome, one hand down, what would change? he sure as frick isn't going to cast Raise, and he still wouldn't be powerful enough to ressurect the dead.
only 2 beings have done that, Athena, and Warrior of Light through Azem's crystal and all of Hydaelyn's remaining magic, and in WoL's case, it was only the RECENTLY dead, Athena's feat is greater, she was able to pluck the much longer dead out of the Life Stream.
IDGAF about Clive surviving. I care about Joshua and Dion surviving.
Clive doesn't survive. That's some Mass Effect 3 indoctrination theory-level bullshit that fans have convinced themselves of. And yes, I did all the sidequests.
he did, he took his brothers name like he took Cid's, he's the only one who's seen the whole story of the game and could possibly be alive to write about it.
why him surviving is weird to people I don't know, the last scene we see of him he's still alive, just his arm is now petrified.
>he's the only one who's seen the whole story of the game
there's several parts of the game that he wasn't there for, like anything to do with Joshua pre-Twinside or Dion, unless magically THOSE parts aren't part of the book
he absorbed their powers, and memories with it.
Unironically has precedent
broski I got some bad news for you
Yep, Clive and Dion dies.
lol no.
the ENTIRE point of the game is Clive finding a meaning to live beyond being a slave to others.
well absolutely no fricking way, to pull a soul of the Aetherial Sea is a huge feat, and they'd need NEW bodies, not the dead ones on the ground, so also Creation Magic.
its literally easier to turn off Magic for a whole world than do this.
Educate yourself on buddhism, gnosticism and western esotericism.
>Clive and Jill not getting together for 5 years.
I found this rather believable. Each one has scores of dead bodies in their pasts and believes themselves unworthy of the other or simply unclean in general. They had to get over their own shit before they could bang it out.
Who's your favorite Eikon? I always liked Ramuh personally.
Odin is the coolest in this game. I'm not a big fan of Bahamut's or Shiva's design this time but of those are usually winners in my book.
in term of gameplay ? Shiva
in term of design ? Shiva
I fricking love permafrost and how rime melts everything.
And love the "noble" and very elegant aspect of her design
This game is dogshit because it retcons how the world was created in FFX. makes no fricking sense
come again?
U wot
I didn’t like the game, but there are some very mindbroken people in this thread. Get a life instead of whining about a vidya this much you absolute gayots.
>you can never defeat humans you created because you don't understand power of friendship
And it was undeniably ludo.
>power of friendship
>"I never could've made it without those around me"
>Single character controlled game without a party
How did they screw it up so bad?
Squeenix is creatively dead.
I can't believe Mario and Link and Kirby don't have the power of friendship, even after meeting so many people.
Did I misunderstand or did Clive actually cut off Benedikta's head from her lifeless body, put it in a box, wrap it up, and mail it to Titan?
If so, did no one else find that really out of character?
Naw, barney and Sliepnir did that and blamed it on CID. It was an important step in cucking Hugo to death.
I believe it was Sleipnir that did it, under orders from Barnabas. Why he would order it I believe was to trigger the frick out of Kupka since it is implied he's aware of what Cid was up to with all the Bearers but didn't act on it. By involving Kupka this would inevitably lead to him clashing with Clive which is what Baranabas and Ultima want.
Yes, it was Barnabas and his men that desecrated her corpse and sent it to Kupka. Probably at the behest of Ultima. Cid even had a throw away line about them "having his head in a box" for freeing the bearers from Caer Norvant. Clive's whole "IT WAS ME HUGO" moment is just in regards to killing her. They never mention him receiving her head in a box in that scene
false flag to force Clive and Hugo into a confrontation, where Clive was supposed to absorb Titan
But I'm told by mainstream figures that people never do false flags.
Of course, what was I thinking!
Carry on, citizen. Nothing to see here.
>false flag to force Clive and Hugo into a confrontation
Next you will tell me one of the strongest kingdoms on the eastern continent are ran by a mysterious cult with mommy issues
>my honest reaction to that information
Amazing how 16gays can squeeze so much out of so little with this game. Can't wait until this is overshowed by Rebirth once it comes out.
So another 4-5 years? Damn you're patient
If you thought the Seethe for this game was bad Rebirth will be a whole other level since now the real pants on head moronic changes will begin. I am looking forward to the game but discussion will be impossible until a year after release.
>mute bahamut's final phase music
>turn on undefeatable
There, that's better.