Can WoW lore being saved at this point?
Or has to be rebooted in a WoW 2 or Warcraft 4?
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Warcraft/WoW Kerrigan
Can WoW lore being saved at this point?
Or has to be rebooted in a WoW 2 or Warcraft 4?
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>Can WoW lore being saved at this point?
No
>Or has to be rebooted in a WoW 2 or Warcraft 4?
Yes. They had the chance to do it with BFA (Jailer does a Thanos and snaps reality in half, followed by canon-friendly re-write), but that would require a developer & writer team that gives a shit
WoW had been in milking mode for years, they just don't want to invest real time & money into it because addicts who won't quit until they die already pay them $1000 a year
>tfw there's a literal real money paypig mount
I remember that Warcraft lore was interesting in 2015 when WoW still gave a shit about being Warcraft.
>Warcraft lore was interesting in 2015
No it fricking wasn't. They had already jumped the time traveling shark by then, not to mention the pandas. Try 2009 for the last decent warcraft lore.
Just blowing up the setting wouldn't be satisfying though, even if the revised setting worked better. Look at Warhammer End Times: even if Age of Sigmar is fine, lots of people weren't happy with the way the Warhammer setting ended.
"Oops, this guy we just recently introduced destroyed the setting and made a new one" would just make the old setting completely meaningless for anyone invested in it, and prejudice them against the new.
>Just blowing up the setting wouldn't be satisfying though, even if the revised setting worked better. Look at Warhammer End Times: even if Age of Sigmar is fine, lots of people weren't happy with the way the Warhammer setting ended.
As far as I know, the End Times itself was what's wrong with Warhammer Fantasy. It wasn't a mercy killing, it was the cancer itself.
End Times only happened after 2 editions (each lassting several years) of awful sells. It wasn't mercy killing, it was a burrial of an already rotten corpse
The problem with End Times is the same problem with Total War Warhammer trilogy, in WF books before End Times there were tactics and strategies, even magical creatures need to have plans to achieve their goals.
With End Times, GamesWorkshop wanted to finish WF as soon as posible, so writers threw tactics and strategy out the window and started doing plot armors and deus ex machinas constantly, and every time a fan complained they responded with ItS MaGiC bRoO.
This is what happened with the Total War Warahmmer trilogy, CA threw out the window all the tactics and made the combat based in demigods, monsters and magic, ruining forever the Total War franchise.
>so writers threw tactics and strategy out the window and started doing plot armors and deus ex machinas constantly
WoW had this since the mmo launch
>literal ten thousand year old eldritch gods manipulating the fabric of reality
>oops die within a year of world of warcraft launching because THE POWER OF HUMAN POTENTIAL or some shit
Also the other way around where they actively ignore the power of the gods & tech / battlefield superiority to let Black person orcs create another plot where the alliance for 2342th time needs to defeat them, but also not kill them because HUMAN POTENTIAL or some shit
like the anon above succintly noted, there is no workaround because the 2-faction system is too rigid to accommodate meaningful story progression without creating huge gameplay imbalances
space goats, horde elves, gnome death knights, pandas, it was all over before it even began
I find more cool and interesting the non-playable factions, Idk if its because are different and I'm tired of both Horde and Alliance, or because they aren't the main protagonists, writers have more creative freedom with them.
Warcraft is about faction warfare, not specifically Horde vs Alliance. The Horde vs Alliance story ended in WC3, and TFT did not feature either at all (only in the bonus campaign). TFT showed that you can have faction war but with new factions (in TFT's case, Night Elves, Scourge, and the Legion). WoW's current problem is that the Horde vs Alliance conflict has been beaten to death, but dropping faction warfare altogether is not the solution. What needs to happen is we need new factions to join and a new war to participate in. Covenants in Shadowlands could have been that, allowing players to join a new conflict with their preexisting characters rather than having to reroll, though the Covenants in Shadowlands were botched because 1. they were not at war with each other and 2. the Covenant themes weren't compelling (meek blue/greek angels in WARCRAFT, diluted Scourge rehash, freaking tumblr fairies and furries in WARCRAFT, and Revendreth was almost okay but aesthetically they were very generic).
There's no saving it anon. There's no changing time, there's no changing writers.
It's dead, Jim.
WoW lore ended in legion.
You mean WoLK
it was already done when they made the Scarlet Crusade the villains
Hypothetically anyone could take something from the mess of lore they currently have and craft something interesting from it.
Realistically though they don't have the will, interest, or even company culture to do that.
Game is dead. Wow is heading toward the whatever you call modern day Everquest, where they pile expansion after expansion on a corpse.
Move on become like one of the 500 60 year old's still playing it lol.
Mmos destroy the lore of any setting they are based on.
Warcraft and Starcraft are both doomed at this point. There's been too much damage done over a long period of time which has completed eroded public trust in the series. Recovery is impossible because even if the game did a 180 and something amazing was written, the games would have have to start growing their fanbases from scratch again and there would still be people who would refuse to touch either game again on principle.
That goes for Blizzard as whole too, over a decade of mismanagement, a decline in quality, and deviation from the practices that established a die-hard group of fans in the first place means that the company now has a negative connotation it can't shake. It wasn't just that their games got worse over time, many fans took the state of their games to be an outright betrayal on account of Blizzard shifting its target demographic. I don't think there's a single other company out there that can elicit that sort of response from people, not Square-Enix, not Bioware, all of those are simply met with indifference and apathy.
Frick off, Blizzard Black personcattle.
>Chris Metzen
Chris Metzen
They should End of Evengelion it with Azeroth waking up, turning them all to soup.
no. just bury it.
>Can WoW lore being saved at this point?
Shadowlands single handedly killed any chance of redemption.
It's over.
You'd have to snap back to The Dark Portal and have all of this just be Ner'zhul's acid trip when passing through the Twisting Neather.
None of this bullshit Night Elves, carribean spearchucker trolls and buffolo indians.
you will find out in 5 days
>Or has to be rebooted in a WoW 2 or Warcraft 4?
If they cant get a self contained expansion done in retail, they can not do a full new game
Literally the only way to save the Warcraft story is to reveal that World of Warcraft was just a vision Thrall was having about a potential future, then launch into a campaign of probably killing Sylvanas, and going on a scavenger hunt of stopping various developments with very butterfly effect things.
Which would be cathartic, but, probably not worth it.
Honestly it is at the point where "It was just a dream" would be met with cheers.
Nah.
They trashed the frick out of it because the new writer's didn't give a frick.
The story became so convoluted and they destroyed the old lore for reasons...
It's like some hack destroying an IP because they think they know what's best.
>They trashed the frick out of it because the new writer's didn't give a frick.
That and the 2 faction mmo framework means nothing ever gets resolved because a faction can't truly lose, or win
They just fight for a while then <the latest big bad> shows up and they stop to stomp it
It all turned into a moronic sitcom where this same beat will repeat until the end of time and the promise of 'the WORLD of warcraft' will never be fulfilled, because the world has to be static, else the mmo does not work
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>Can wow lore being saved
I don’t think there’s any way they could ‘save’ it. What could they do?:
1) Make it all a dream/vision/time snap as people have said? This is impossible without invalidating wow and essentially ruining the game for the people still playing it. So they would need to choose between the future of the franchise, or their current milking cow, and I’m pretty sure they will choose the latter. Once the game is dead this could work.
2) Go back to an earlier period of the franchise? The Warcraft movie has already covered that basically. You can’t go further back without separating humans and orcs from fighting and at that point it’s not Warcraft.
3) Go into the future? Could possibly work. But they’d have to go so far that you can basically forget everything that happened during WoW, which would mean really, really far. I don’t mean space orcs, but basically anyone currently relevant would be dead and you’d be starting with entirely new characters from scratch. I think this might be the best option. But not much will be ‘saved’ except the franchise itself. Everyone needs to die.
>Go back to an earlier period of the franchise? The Warcraft movie has already covered that basically. You can’t go further back without separating humans and orcs from fighting and at that point it’s not Warcraft.
It's funny because warcraft movie had re-told the story of warcraft 1, except in the WoW videogame canon the orcs won and destroyed Stormwind. In the movie, they didn't, so this invalidates the movie from being in any way tied to the modern WoW canon. It was a very strange decision.
The movie also apparently flopped / barely broken even (I liked it), so I doubt they'd do anything like this again.
>Go into the future? Could possibly work. But they’d have to go so far that you can basically forget everything that happened during WoW, which would mean really, really far.
They could 100% do it the way Elder Scrolls does it, where hundreds of years pass but nothing really majorly changes within the setting because the gods of the world stall and stagnate technological development for <schizoteric elder scrolls lore reasons>
But like you said, they probably won't because it's cheaper to just milk the addicts who probably don't even care for the lore of the setting
>all hope for a decent reboot rests on microsoft green lighting it
Grim, but I'm still holding on to a sliver of hope for a vanilla+ announcement at blizzcon. It's the only way out of the timeline that gives us dragonflight.
>maybe not now, but they will, eventually
there is zero demand for cata classic so the 2019 relaunch is coming to a close, the majority of people have gotten their classic wow fix and won't pay to come back to bot-infested servers
every positive development has been player driven
private servers led to the 2019 relaunch
the hardcore community led to official HC servers
there are now multiple pservers with additional vanilla content
all Blizzard has to do is follow the fricking OSRS model, no need to innovate
Paradise is lost anon.
You can never go back.
Warcraft's lore shit the bed with the cancelled point-and-click adventure game.
Portraying medieval nations who were ravaged by a completely genocidal race of aliens, and yet, decided to set up large-scale internment camps to feed and shelter several armies worth of monsters, as the bad guys is absurd.
And then, they enthusiastically chugged their demonic blood of mannoroth because those evil night elves were evilly trying to stop them from deforesting their precious woodlands.
But wait! The orcs did a small last-minute gesture in a cutscene, and totally redeemed themselves of allllll the horrendous shit they did!
And that's just the strategy games!
In the MMO, It became obvious that the "Redemption Arc" was Chris Metzen's favorite, and only plot device, because the horde were constantly starting wars, nuking cities, and awakening ancient evils only to be "redeemed" by token efforts when it came time for a new expansion to hit.
And now I hear that the company was taken over by women, so I don't think any of Blizzard's games can be saved.
>only to be "redeemed" by token efforts when it came time for a new expansion to hit.
They weren't even redeemed, everyone just went
>noooo you cant kill the orcs because then we wont have a mmo any more and reddit who are 85% horde will be mad about it
>ok
maybe that's the reason mmos just aren't a thing any more, it's impossible to tell stories that aren't regurgitated filth when you're unable to progress the story because other side's players will be upset if you do
Warcraft (as a whole) is one of the most ugly things I've ever seen.
High-fantasy is shit since the death of Sir Tolkien.
>
Completely beside the point but I hate her design too. It's ugly and tacky, the hair, bow, and neck and shoulder armour are cute but she'd have been so much cuter with an armour pieces with a cute babydoll style dress.
WoW lore was kind of shit before it even became WoW, AKA in Warcraft, WoW really fricked it all up, frankly from the start with it's gamey mmo shit influencing storytelling, but if you ignore WoW then Warcraft 4 could be ok.
You take a time machine back with all of your future knowledge and you now have full creative/design control over WoW from the very beginning of development. What is your design philosophy and what major changes do you make/keep?
>No hard 2 faction system, players can talk/group with anyone
>Horde vs. Alliance is still a theme but the players are more insulated from it
>Forsaken and Night Elves belong to neither
>Player never rises up as a lore character, should always be a "nameless champion"
>Use asymmetrical design principle. Not everything needs to be perfectly balanced. This applies to class design and plot lines.
>Classic, TBC, WoTLK and Legion mostly the same, but don't do Illidan dirty this time
>Kill off WoD, Shadowlands
>Refactor MoP into some kind of "South Seas" expansion
>Refactor Cata, BFA and DF, change the plot, keep the continents
PvE Design:
>Raids are designed around only one specific size, 10 man or 25 man
>There is no adjustable difficulty (normal/heroic etc.) for raids, but there are Ulduar style hard modes that provide more loot, or even higher iLevel loot
>Use Traditional loot model where the boss drops loot and the raid has to decide how it is distributed (roll, DKP, loot council, w/e)
I'm conflicted about 5 mans, I know a lot of people don't like the mythic style with creeping difficulty but I kinda dig it.
>No LFD or LFR
PvP:
>Frick e-sports, there's no arena in my WoW
>For battlegrounds, build out more CTF and Domination levels with different design/locations.
>Keep AV but kill off the other ones like Isle of Conquest and Strand of the Ancients.
Other specifics:
>No cross-realm servers or content
>Attentive care to realm populations - change the game's name system so you can merge servers and not worry about losing identity (last names? family names? frick if I know)
>No garrisons or mission board style content
>No cash shop, boosts or even TCG items
>Actually monitor and ban bots
those changes actually sound really good
make it die in a fire like ffxiv 1.0
then reboot it with less woke, better graphics, no portals (just zepellins/ships/trains) and a harvesting + weight + trade mechanic for the newly improved professions/tradecrafts.
They fixed it. Did y'all see blizzcon? They finally fixed it.