No. Legit no. Objectively no. Even the '2D is good though' dolts have to admit OG 2D sonic is chock full of unfair poorly designed levels you simply got used to. The amount of instant death pits, spikes and enemies in a game that makes you go so fast is borderline incompetence.
No they werent. "b-but for the time they were okay"
NO, go back to the year they released and look at the games that released within that time frame, a year prior even. Adventure/A2 isnt good and it never was, people just have massive nostalgia for it as being a kid its all sega drones had to play, so they didnt even notice it was below par in almost every aspect sans music when compared to its peers.
Now revisionism kicked in and people think "well FOR THE TIME" works here.
Dont get me wrong >I loved Adventure as a kid too
But loving a game and it being good are two different things.
2D mario always get's mogged by 2D sonic so unless they actually get rid of the soulless "New" aesthetic and actually do some interesting level themes instead of the same grass snow lava levels idgaf
Yes, SMB3, SMW, and 64 were all great. I never played Mario from Gamecube onwards so I dunno about those ones but I've heard positive about Sunshine and Odyssey.
Galaxy was many many peoples "game of the generation" and to be fair, it was both incredibly good, a step up in quality and production in games (not just nintendos) and was unique and new with its gravity stuff.
Sunshine is great, its M64 but better, refined, and polished. People just pretend to hate it because they really like to fangirl over M64 and cant move on and sunshine was unfortunately the next 3D game beyond it so its the fall guy.
Its basically M64 but different enough for spergs to whine about "muh options" since they make you do most of the stars in a level in order now, but thats it, the rest is revisionism and denial from little timmies who cant think straight
Like this guy
>but I've heard positive about Sunshine
You were doing well until here.
The SA2 story is kind of try hard in retrospect and is at odds with the Genesis titles and even the first Adventure in tone. While Adventure leaned a bit darker than the originals, it still retained the lighthearted nature from them. SA2 purposely didn’t.
heroes is bad but i liked it a lot. Playing Frontiers right now and I swear its a lot better than trailers and fans made it look. Maybe its worse on other consoles but it runs great on PS5 with surprisingly no glitches. I like the homosexual screamo soundtrack a lot, it just works. VERY excited for the new 2D game as I can never get enough 2d physics gameplay. I fricking love sonic and I love the friends I will be enjoying the new game with.
this. this is a really good retort actually to the people who insist on compaining about a certain series autistically. It flips the debate back unto them so now they have to defend the entire concept. If any videogame can be defended as being worthwhile, then sonic can
I've never played unleashed. It got bad reviews and the forums said the ps3 version was not as good as the 360 version so I kind of waited. All these years later and its certified beloved zoomer-core, quite the public opinion turn around. but I cant find a used copy anywhere
Unless you grew up with these games you've no idea how popular Sonic was. Sonic 1 was rough around the edges, Sonic 2 was the best Mega Drive game and Sonic 3 was the most polished but still preferred 2. All the cartoons and shit that came out. McDonalds used to put Sonic LCD games with their happy meals. It was a great time to be a sonic fan. The downturn started, I would say, with Shadow The Hedgehog
this. Id argue the downturn was the death of the Dreamcast and the sliced budgets/multiplatform hell. Heroes was so promising in the conceptual stage but came out padded for length and unpolished. It was many people's first disappointment with the series. (the gamecube adventure remakes were carried by momentum from the dreamcast) Something died in Sonic team when they went 3rd party.
The absolute state of moronic boostBlack folk that killed the franchise I used to love so much.
What do you mean was? Yes theyre good.
However a majority of them are never gonna blow your pants off like some JRPG with extensive lore and power rush mechanics does which is where the dumbfrickery comes from. Sonic games are made to be relaxed with. Its not Dark Souls nor is it Persona.
>Persona
Yeah bro Persona is so hardcore bro like for real
this is almost right
take out SA and SA2
replace sonic battle with sonic riders
take out 06 and secret rings
then replace sonic advance trilogy with one of the most underrated sonic games lost world
Sonic 2 is good
Sonic 3 is good
Sonic & Knuckles is good
The connected S&K3 is good
Sonic Mania is good
Sonic Adventure is good
Sonic Adventure 2 is good
>Sonic 2 good
Stopped reading there, frick that game. >Majority of the zones are generic slop (first stage might as well be green hill) >Special stages are half pipe bullshit. You need to memorize every pixel of said special stages and know ahead of time to not have Tails with you; the game's selling point. >Final boss is 1 hit bullshit. Can't even get to use Super Sonic when you went to the trouble of unlocking it. >Level design blows: the unescapable pit in tbe cave zone, the weird lava sections in hill top,etc. >Hey kids plug in a controller and play as Tails!...For 5 seconds until your off screend. >Sonic no longer has a speed cap, so you can outrun the screen and get hit by shit off screen.
Sonic was never good. Adventure 1 and 2 are enjoyably bad and thats it.
Filtered by Death Egg, Unironically have a nice day and do it slowly on a livestream so everyone can see. The check's in the mail for your parents to try again only without the excessive alcohol abuse.
However a majority of them are never gonna blow your pants off like some JRPG with extensive lore and power rush mechanics does which is where the dumbfrickery comes from. Sonic games are made to be relaxed with. Its not Dark Souls nor is it Persona.
No, and it's worthlessness is why it's ok that Sega holds the copyright to Sonic indefinitely. No good Sonic game can be made, Sonic Team has tried repeatedly, so Sega shoulders the burden and keeps the people safe from trying to make serious Sonic projects that could have made money.
I like classic Sonic for the same reason I like 3D Mario. Both really take advantage of the environment for movement. Every little curve can be used in 2D Sonic, every wall can be used for a jump in 3D Mario. Really makes it feel like you're using the environment to its limits. In 2D Mario the level often just feels like there's random obstacles and platforms, nothing too exciting and post Adventure the linearity and automation killed that excitement.
It's one of the reasons why a lot of 3D platfomers come across as bland for me. The games might be cool to look at but the actual level of interactivity might be too restrictive. Like how you can't really do any cool jumps in Spyro outside of the pre-determined places.
It's pretty jank in some ways but I was surprised to find that Ys IX displayed more freedom of movement than so many 3D platformers. A lot of them are too incidental, only letting you move certain ways in very specific spots.
An entire franchise dedicated to 4 games that were kinda good but in comparison to everything afterwards basically 10/10
Mario 3 and World by themselves are more replayable than sonic 1-3 and knuckles.
>more replayable
nah, more based around courses yeah but that doesn't remove the emergent gameplay of sonic games which make them infinitely more replayable thanks to his physics engine, the sonic series mantained a lot of his quality in later games so the franchise was on the same state as mario until 2006 (excellent quality on main games with spinoffs being from excellent to mediocre) and even after that there has been one game which could be called shit (forces)
Absolutely. Movement and level design in a platformer is very important, and Mario lacked in both fronts. Very simple, linear levels without many alternating paths so every playthrough looks identical. And movement didn't become interesting until SMW added the cape, but then every game afterward forgot about it.
>playing a level for the first time >go fast >gets hit by unseen enemy >go fast
hit a wall >go fast >hit a spring
No wonder they made it so you can pretty much get hit forever and not die in this.
The entire series is good, bad games are more of an exception rather than the rule.
There's a rather minor issue that specifically Sonic Heroes and Shadow the Hedgehog had, where you were superfluously expected to play the same stages over and over not merely for ranks, but also for basic progression.
With Heroes having the issue of needing to play Easy, Normal and Hard on every stage, and Shadow the hedgehog
AT MINIMUM expecting you to play Westopolis 10 times and every final stage twice for the Final stage
and playing westopolis and any combination of final stages
TWENTY ONE TIMES to unlock every stage
Like, sure, 326 possible unique story mode playthroughs that's all fun and good, and they even named them all, and you could probably get All A Ranks for every mission through all those playthroughs
BUT HOLY SHIT is it a lot they ask of you.
Also "Sonic was bad" was some shit an IGN journalist made up after Sonic '06 came out, and was also fired.
You get real.
I'm not living in a fantasy defined by a fricking game journalist where I pretend every sonic game is '06 or Dark Brotherhood levels of fricked.
>Classic era
Absolutely >Adventure era
I'd say so for the Adventure games themselves, Heroes kinda sucks >Dark age
No, everything from this era sucks, Rush is alright but that's it >Meta
It's mixed, it has some of the best and worst games in the series.
The classic games are solid. Sonic 3 and Knuckles is still one of my favorite games of all time, just solid. Plus Mania is a close 2nd, very good. Hoping Superstars is good. I also like SA1, parts of SA2, and just one playthrough of Heroes. Generations is fun too. Everything else is pretty shit.
>The classic games are solid. Sonic 3 and Knuckles is still one of my favorite games of all time, just solid.
False memories, revisionism and denial.
The level design is objectively shit, you just got used to the BS and know to avoid it so now you forgot its there. All classic sonics are plagued with BS trapfalls and such. Couldnt even run properly on the hardware kek
Sonic 1 - 7/10
Sonic 2 - 5/10
Sonic CD - 6/10
Sonic 3 - 9/10
Sonic Adventure - 6/10
Sonic Adventure 2 - 9/10
Sonic Heroes - 4/10
Shadow the Hedgehog 5/10
Sonic 06 - 3/10
Sonic and the Secret Rings - 2/10
Sonic Unleashed - 5/10
Sonic and the Black Knight - 4/10
Sonic Colors - 7/10
Sonic Generations - 9/10
Sonic Lost World - 6/10
Sonic Mania - 9/10
Sonic Forces - 5/10
Sonic Frontiers - 6/10
That comes out to an average of like 6/10 so it's a passing grade at least.
the level design, you fricking imbecile
almost every past green hill zone is awful
not that i should expect intelligence from someone who thinks fricking sonic adventure 2 is a 9/10 game
the only good sonic games are 3&K and generations
>almost every past green hill zone is awful
Why? If you can't substantiate this then you have no right to call anyone an imbecile.
i'm not going to spoonfeed you, but it's pretty sad if you can't notice because it's pretty obvious (the painful slowness and repetitiveness of labyrinth zone, the placement of springs in spring yard zone, the bottomless pits in star light zone and so on)
if i'm ever motivated enough to make a youtube analysis i'll post it here so that you can become enlightened yourself, homosexual
11 months ago
Anonymous
>the painful slowness and repetitiveness of labyrinth zone
Labyrinth Zone is a deliberate endgame challenge after you've gotten used to Sonic's unwieldy controls - part of the challenge of the original Sonic is learning how to control him in various different environments because he's so different from any other platforming character at the time, and Labyrinth zone challenges you in a way that fundamentally changes what's been ingrained into your mind for 9 levels up until then.
It's also not repetitive at all, Labyrinth Zone's level design is always throwing new types of challenges at you, they only do the triple spike ball platforms once for example. >the placement of springs in spring yard zone
You mean the spring that launches you back into an enemy if you're not paying attention and don't realize that going into a tunnel means you're going into a dangerous area? Yeah, how bullshit of them to easily telegraph a hazard like that and reward you for being observational and learning when to slow down. >the bottomless pits in star light zone
It's the second to last level and it's already pretty damn forgiving as is, if you've come this far into the game and still think you can just blindly rush through with no consequences then I think that's on you for being a dumbass and being unable to meet the game on its own terms that it's already established for five whole zones at this point.
>>it's bad and i'm not gonna bother telling you why because i'm so much smarter than you >actually it's good and here's why >>erm it's a game for children lol filtered you're stupid owned
I certainly wouldn't want to watch your youtube analysis lmao
>>it's bad and i'm not gonna bother telling you why because i'm so much smarter than you >actually it's good and here's why >>erm it's a game for children lol filtered you're stupid owned
I certainly wouldn't want to watch your youtube analysis lmao
>moron who doesn't know how to use greenarrows thinks we can't see through his samegayging
you're the only moron who would use ">>" in that way
just stop posting
The series would be good if:
- The 32X didn’t exist (no Knuckles Chaotix)
- Sonic 3 didn’t have to be rushed out of the door (no split between the two games)
- Sonic Spinball didn’t exist
- Sonic 3D Blast didn’t exist
- Sonic R was given time for more polish
- Sonic Adventure was given time for more polish (They released the game a whole year before DC launched in US. I assure you, the Japanese did not give any fricks about the game)
- Sonic Adventure 2 wasn’t modified mid-development to add Tails and ruin half the game because the devs had to put double the work into unnecessary stuff
- Sonic Heroes did not exist
- Shadow the Hedgehog did not exist
- Sonic 06 was given more time in the oven. It’s astonishing how much they managed to achieve in such short time, with half the workforce and without their captain.
- Yuji Naka didn’t leave SEGA to do whatever the frick he wants mid-game-development. He could train a new team first before leaving
- Sonic Unleashed didnt have the werehog stages
- Sonic Colors didn’t put as much focus into 2D stages
- SEGA didn’t sign the contract with Nintendo which made them release Sonic Lost World, Sonic Boom Wii U and Sonic Boom 3DS
- Sonic Forces didn’t exist
- Sonic Frontiers got a new, yet competent development team, just like Sonic Unleashed did
These are the most barebones changes that would’ve made the franchise a cult classic like Mario, instead of what we ended up with today.
Depends on the homework. Math and history are okay, but literature is homosexual shit and nobody reads books nowadays except for stuck up pretentious nonces.
Unless you grew up with these games you've no idea how popular Sonic was. Sonic 1 was rough around the edges, Sonic 2 was the best Mega Drive game and Sonic 3 was the most polished but still preferred 2. All the cartoons and shit that came out. McDonalds used to put Sonic LCD games with their happy meals. It was a great time to be a sonic fan. The downturn started, I would say, with Shadow The Hedgehog
Sonic started great in 2D, easier than other platformers but unique and thrilling with its fast pace, and a lot of potential in just the physics alone. SA1/2 also stood out for their time as ambitious games no doubt, but also marked the beginning of Sonic trading those technical feats for mindless Temple Runs, half-assed gimmicks and direction based entirely off its generation's appeals to consistency's detriment. And then it only got worse until Sonic '06 and Penders' comics-autism marked an unforgettable low-bar. One that persuaded SEGA to slash the IP's budget and ambitions for the entirety of the '10s and is why the series is now mostly known for shovelware that's 50/50 good/dogshit at best, passable for small kids on average and even lamer than '06 at worst. Then glossed it over with a shitton of retro-appeal and, later on, a good tribute game like Mania.
We're now at the point where an unfinished Unreal-testmap collectathon (that's still half-automated, lol) trying to imitate the more-competent FANGAMES is the greatest game in the series, one that if pulled off in other platformers would've been drowned in the juices of thrown tomatoes. The only reason I'm actually hopeful for once is solely on the back of Kishimoto finally taking an interest in both proper design/physics and talking to fans on Twitter. Oh yeah and Superstars looks decent... maybe.
tl;dr Sonic was good and almost fantastic, then like a suicidal rockband lead it burnt out with the era it appealed towards most, survived off obsessive fans/merch and is currently in its throwback-concert days (assuming post-arcades SEGA is still making their hail mary).
2 and 3K are mastepieces. Adventure games are good to great even if they aged.
The franchises went to hell with the transition to 3D: >redesigns >voice acting >too focused on speed rather than momentum to the point that they always have a side gimmick to prevent the games from being too short. My favorite 3D Sonic Game is not even official.
Sonic 1-3K, Sonic Adventure 1, Sonic Advance 1-3, and Sonic Generations are all objectively good games at the bare minimum. There are some very enjoyable games elsewhere in the series depending on your tolerance for jank and various issues.
Yes. Most casual players' issues with the series boil down to skill issues. Sonic Robo Blast 2 and Sonic Mania are 2 of the best platformers ever made.
both adventure games are good
No. Legit no. Objectively no. Even the '2D is good though' dolts have to admit OG 2D sonic is chock full of unfair poorly designed levels you simply got used to. The amount of instant death pits, spikes and enemies in a game that makes you go so fast is borderline incompetence.
No they werent. "b-but for the time they were okay"
NO, go back to the year they released and look at the games that released within that time frame, a year prior even. Adventure/A2 isnt good and it never was, people just have massive nostalgia for it as being a kid its all sega drones had to play, so they didnt even notice it was below par in almost every aspect sans music when compared to its peers.
Now revisionism kicked in and people think "well FOR THE TIME" works here.
Dont get me wrong
>I loved Adventure as a kid too
But loving a game and it being good are two different things.
filtered
Yes. He only wasn't good in 2005-2007
Sonic Riders invalidates that argument.
Was Mario ever good? Be honest
Mario is getting a new sidescroller just in time to btfo superstars. It's actually over this time.
2D mario always get's mogged by 2D sonic so unless they actually get rid of the soulless "New" aesthetic and actually do some interesting level themes instead of the same grass snow lava levels idgaf
Better than Sonic at least.
Yes, SMB3, SMW, and 64 were all great. I never played Mario from Gamecube onwards so I dunno about those ones but I've heard positive about Sunshine and Odyssey.
>but I've heard positive about Sunshine
You were doing well until here.
Like I said, I never played it but my friend said he liked it.
play mario galaxy it's so good
Sunshine is good despite what shitposters on Ganker say
Galaxy was many many peoples "game of the generation" and to be fair, it was both incredibly good, a step up in quality and production in games (not just nintendos) and was unique and new with its gravity stuff.
Sunshine is great, its M64 but better, refined, and polished. People just pretend to hate it because they really like to fangirl over M64 and cant move on and sunshine was unfortunately the next 3D game beyond it so its the fall guy.
Its basically M64 but different enough for spergs to whine about "muh options" since they make you do most of the stars in a level in order now, but thats it, the rest is revisionism and denial from little timmies who cant think straight
Like this guy
NSMB series sucks shit and I won't back down from it. Terrible level design. 3 is still peak.
I disagree, the games are generally good even if they're kind of samey.
2 was bad, U/Luigi was great, the rest are generic but still above average.
Was Sonic ever a rival to Mario? Be honest.
My first Sonic game was Sonic 2 on the Genesis.
Sonic was honestly great until Heroes.
Adventure 1 aged worse, but Adventure 2 was the end of the road. Heroes was never fricking good and even my stupid child brain knew this.
Your stupid child self should have been put in a gas chamber
Pretty much this, except Adventure 1 is better than 2. Some of the spinoffs were stinkers but the main Sonic games were good until Heroes.
1 aged worse in cutscenes but 2 aged way worse in gameplay.
CD and R aren't the same game.
The SA2 story is kind of try hard in retrospect and is at odds with the Genesis titles and even the first Adventure in tone. While Adventure leaned a bit darker than the originals, it still retained the lighthearted nature from them. SA2 purposely didn’t.
Was vidya ever good? Be honest
sonic fricking rocks
heroes is bad but i liked it a lot. Playing Frontiers right now and I swear its a lot better than trailers and fans made it look. Maybe its worse on other consoles but it runs great on PS5 with surprisingly no glitches. I like the homosexual screamo soundtrack a lot, it just works. VERY excited for the new 2D game as I can never get enough 2d physics gameplay. I fricking love sonic and I love the friends I will be enjoying the new game with.
this. this is a really good retort actually to the people who insist on compaining about a certain series autistically. It flips the debate back unto them so now they have to defend the entire concept. If any videogame can be defended as being worthwhile, then sonic can
I've never played unleashed. It got bad reviews and the forums said the ps3 version was not as good as the 360 version so I kind of waited. All these years later and its certified beloved zoomer-core, quite the public opinion turn around. but I cant find a used copy anywhere
this. Id argue the downturn was the death of the Dreamcast and the sliced budgets/multiplatform hell. Heroes was so promising in the conceptual stage but came out padded for length and unpolished. It was many people's first disappointment with the series. (the gamecube adventure remakes were carried by momentum from the dreamcast) Something died in Sonic team when they went 3rd party.
Sonic is (at least generally) indisputably a good series up until Heroes. Sonic 1 was probably the best.
Based Sonic 1 chad. Sonic 1 is the peak of game design. Spin dash was the beginning of dumbing down the importance of physics in Sonic games
>character runs fast
>lets not have mechanics that makes him go more fast
This is what you are saying right now. BAKA
The absolute state of moronic boostBlack folk that killed the franchise I used to love so much.
>Persona
Yeah bro Persona is so hardcore bro like for real
>Persona is so hardcore
Did you read the post and what its claiming? Because hardcore isnt mentioned at all.
Persona games are notoriously relaxing high school sims.
Sonic was really more of a multi-level platformer that had sections where you go fast before the spin dash and speed marketing took over.
>made for american audiences
No.
Sega was founded by one.
not as true as tendie shills want you to believe.
It was literally founded in American soil aka Hawaii by an Irish israelite.
explain why they had more Japanese games than Nintendo did then for the longest time.
Sega was an amusement company before they made video games
SEGA started in the 40s and was founded making games and shit for soldiers to play.
That's what I said
I love CD's/R's OST.
Yes and only sheeple say otherwise.
He's the less-is-more version of the TMNT.
SA, SA2, Heroes, Advance trilogy, Battle, Shadow, Rush, Rush Adventure, 06, Secret Rings, Unleashed, Black Knight. Everything else is trash.
this is almost right
take out SA and SA2
replace sonic battle with sonic riders
take out 06 and secret rings
then replace sonic advance trilogy with one of the most underrated sonic games lost world
Sonic 2 is good
Sonic 3 is good
Sonic & Knuckles is good
The connected S&K3 is good
Sonic Mania is good
Sonic Adventure is good
Sonic Adventure 2 is good
Sonic 1 is ok
Sonic Cd is ok
Sonic Heroes is bad
Sonic 2006 is bad
Haven't played anything else
>Sonic 2 good
Stopped reading there, frick that game.
>Majority of the zones are generic slop (first stage might as well be green hill)
>Special stages are half pipe bullshit. You need to memorize every pixel of said special stages and know ahead of time to not have Tails with you; the game's selling point.
>Final boss is 1 hit bullshit. Can't even get to use Super Sonic when you went to the trouble of unlocking it.
>Level design blows: the unescapable pit in tbe cave zone, the weird lava sections in hill top,etc.
>Hey kids plug in a controller and play as Tails!...For 5 seconds until your off screend.
>Sonic no longer has a speed cap, so you can outrun the screen and get hit by shit off screen.
Sonic was never good. Adventure 1 and 2 are enjoyably bad and thats it.
Filtered by Death Egg, Unironically have a nice day and do it slowly on a livestream so everyone can see. The check's in the mail for your parents to try again only without the excessive alcohol abuse.
Keep seething you balding, overweight, entry level job working (if not NEET), 30 something boomer.
Skill issue.
I beat Sonic 2 death egg at 7 years old
Shit is incredibly easy as an adult
yes
It's decent but no Mario
original trilogy, CD, adventure 1 and mania are
everything else is trash
>fanmade version of the sprite with wrong colors
>it's the first result and it's from reddit
of course it is
Who cares
Looks like you and the picture have something in common, then
Of course, like any game series. But Heroes is the best, no contest.
Sonic 1, 2, 3 & the game gear sonic game were good. Sonic 2 was my favorite. Chemical plant zone & metropolis zone rocks.
Yes but only in the 90's. His anti Mario attitude has no place outside of it.
Sonic has been consistently good but janky and buggy as hell
Just like kirby has been consistently mediocre as shit
I still can’t believe Sonic and Crash are on the Switch. Mario won.
What do you mean was? Yes theyre good.
However a majority of them are never gonna blow your pants off like some JRPG with extensive lore and power rush mechanics does which is where the dumbfrickery comes from. Sonic games are made to be relaxed with. Its not Dark Souls nor is it Persona.
>Was Sonic ever good?
Shit homie, just play the games yourself and answer your own question wtf
No, and it's worthlessness is why it's ok that Sega holds the copyright to Sonic indefinitely. No good Sonic game can be made, Sonic Team has tried repeatedly, so Sega shoulders the burden and keeps the people safe from trying to make serious Sonic projects that could have made money.
i say this without a hint of irony.
Sonic was better than Mario back in the sega/genesis days
I like classic Sonic for the same reason I like 3D Mario. Both really take advantage of the environment for movement. Every little curve can be used in 2D Sonic, every wall can be used for a jump in 3D Mario. Really makes it feel like you're using the environment to its limits. In 2D Mario the level often just feels like there's random obstacles and platforms, nothing too exciting and post Adventure the linearity and automation killed that excitement.
It's one of the reasons why a lot of 3D platfomers come across as bland for me. The games might be cool to look at but the actual level of interactivity might be too restrictive. Like how you can't really do any cool jumps in Spyro outside of the pre-determined places.
It's pretty jank in some ways but I was surprised to find that Ys IX displayed more freedom of movement than so many 3D platformers. A lot of them are too incidental, only letting you move certain ways in very specific spots.
>they will NEVER know the greatness of Angel Island into Hydrocity after the superfortress flies over
I pity them.
>they will NEVER know the greatness of time-wasting cutscene garbage
Oh le noes!
>complaining about a 5 second cutscene
Based ADHD anon
>this time-wasting scripted interruption isn't bad because it's short
How about not having it at all?
>NOOOOOOOO STOP BUILDING A STORY
>I MUST PRESS LE BUTTON
I can't say that I didn't know how good I had it, because I knew all the fricking way back in 94-95 that this was the pinnacle of Sonic.
I completely agree. Sonic 3&K is my favorite 2D platformer of all time.
The games are a lot easier than Mario though.
Were they? I only ever played the gameboy mario game so I don't know
An entire franchise dedicated to 4 games that were kinda good but in comparison to everything afterwards basically 10/10
Mario 3 and World by themselves are more replayable than sonic 1-3 and knuckles.
>more replayable
nah, more based around courses yeah but that doesn't remove the emergent gameplay of sonic games which make them infinitely more replayable thanks to his physics engine, the sonic series mantained a lot of his quality in later games so the franchise was on the same state as mario until 2006 (excellent quality on main games with spinoffs being from excellent to mediocre) and even after that there has been one game which could be called shit (forces)
Absolutely. Movement and level design in a platformer is very important, and Mario lacked in both fronts. Very simple, linear levels without many alternating paths so every playthrough looks identical. And movement didn't become interesting until SMW added the cape, but then every game afterward forgot about it.
>playing a level for the first time
>go fast
>gets hit by unseen enemy
>go fast
hit a wall
>go fast
>hit a spring
No wonder they made it so you can pretty much get hit forever and not die in this.
The entire series is good, bad games are more of an exception rather than the rule.
There's a rather minor issue that specifically Sonic Heroes and Shadow the Hedgehog had, where you were superfluously expected to play the same stages over and over not merely for ranks, but also for basic progression.
With Heroes having the issue of needing to play Easy, Normal and Hard on every stage, and Shadow the hedgehog
AT MINIMUM expecting you to play Westopolis 10 times and every final stage twice for the Final stage
and playing westopolis and any combination of final stages
TWENTY ONE TIMES to unlock every stage
Like, sure, 326 possible unique story mode playthroughs that's all fun and good, and they even named them all, and you could probably get All A Ranks for every mission through all those playthroughs
BUT HOLY SHIT is it a lot they ask of you.
Also "Sonic was bad" was some shit an IGN journalist made up after Sonic '06 came out, and was also fired.
>bad games are more of an exception rather than the rule
I like Sonic too but get real
You get real.
I'm not living in a fantasy defined by a fricking game journalist where I pretend every sonic game is '06 or Dark Brotherhood levels of fricked.
>perfect Sonic's design in S3K
>never use it again
FRICKING W H Y ?
His model in SA1 DC is literally the same thing but in 3d
Yeah, 1/2/3 were peak 90s gaming. Imagine getting Michael fricking Jackson to make music for your video game.
Buxer did those songs, not MJ.
>games and shit
So....amusement.
Sonic was always good. Any time there was an awful game there was a good game released around it. ex: Forces/Mania or 06/Rush
>Classic era
Absolutely
>Adventure era
I'd say so for the Adventure games themselves, Heroes kinda sucks
>Dark age
No, everything from this era sucks, Rush is alright but that's it
>Meta
It's mixed, it has some of the best and worst games in the series.
I like the sonic boom cartoon but that's 90% of my exposure to the sonic franchise aside from uuuhhhhhhhh fanart
Unironically try The Murder of Sonic on steam
Sonic 1,2,3&K, adventure 1,2, Advance 1-3, Rush, Rush adventure, generations, Mania
Yes Sonic was always good.
The classic games are solid. Sonic 3 and Knuckles is still one of my favorite games of all time, just solid. Plus Mania is a close 2nd, very good. Hoping Superstars is good. I also like SA1, parts of SA2, and just one playthrough of Heroes. Generations is fun too. Everything else is pretty shit.
Based Sonic appreciator. I thought Generations was a great return to form and that Mania's stages were a little too long but was otherwise excellent.
>The classic games are solid. Sonic 3 and Knuckles is still one of my favorite games of all time, just solid.
False memories, revisionism and denial.
The level design is objectively shit, you just got used to the BS and know to avoid it so now you forgot its there. All classic sonics are plagued with BS trapfalls and such. Couldnt even run properly on the hardware kek
3 and knuckles
Sonic 1 - 7/10
Sonic 2 - 5/10
Sonic CD - 6/10
Sonic 3 - 9/10
Sonic Adventure - 6/10
Sonic Adventure 2 - 9/10
Sonic Heroes - 4/10
Shadow the Hedgehog 5/10
Sonic 06 - 3/10
Sonic and the Secret Rings - 2/10
Sonic Unleashed - 5/10
Sonic and the Black Knight - 4/10
Sonic Colors - 7/10
Sonic Generations - 9/10
Sonic Lost World - 6/10
Sonic Mania - 9/10
Sonic Forces - 5/10
Sonic Frontiers - 6/10
That comes out to an average of like 6/10 so it's a passing grade at least.
>generations higher than the games it copied from
You don't need to do it first, you just need to do it better.
>do it better
>game has no physics
>3D sections
>Sonic 1 - 7/10
you're hopelessly delusional
Name one thing actually wrong with Sonic 1 that would put it below that "good but not great" score.
the level design, you fricking imbecile
almost every past green hill zone is awful
not that i should expect intelligence from someone who thinks fricking sonic adventure 2 is a 9/10 game
the only good sonic games are 3&K and generations
>complains about level design
>puts sonic 3 on a pedestal
cope
i'm not going to spoonfeed you, but it's pretty sad if you can't notice because it's pretty obvious (the painful slowness and repetitiveness of labyrinth zone, the placement of springs in spring yard zone, the bottomless pits in star light zone and so on)
if i'm ever motivated enough to make a youtube analysis i'll post it here so that you can become enlightened yourself, homosexual
>the painful slowness and repetitiveness of labyrinth zone
Labyrinth Zone is a deliberate endgame challenge after you've gotten used to Sonic's unwieldy controls - part of the challenge of the original Sonic is learning how to control him in various different environments because he's so different from any other platforming character at the time, and Labyrinth zone challenges you in a way that fundamentally changes what's been ingrained into your mind for 9 levels up until then.
It's also not repetitive at all, Labyrinth Zone's level design is always throwing new types of challenges at you, they only do the triple spike ball platforms once for example.
>the placement of springs in spring yard zone
You mean the spring that launches you back into an enemy if you're not paying attention and don't realize that going into a tunnel means you're going into a dangerous area? Yeah, how bullshit of them to easily telegraph a hazard like that and reward you for being observational and learning when to slow down.
>the bottomless pits in star light zone
It's the second to last level and it's already pretty damn forgiving as is, if you've come this far into the game and still think you can just blindly rush through with no consequences then I think that's on you for being a dumbass and being unable to meet the game on its own terms that it's already established for five whole zones at this point.
>almost every past green hill zone is awful
Why? If you can't substantiate this then you have no right to call anyone an imbecile.
>Sonic 2 on the same level as Shadow
>also
>game has no physics
>3D sections
The rest is mostly agreeable, also bonus points for seeing Frontiers accurately.
>criticize some design flaw with sonic
it's a game for toddlers, all you're doing announcing YOU found it a challenge
>>it's bad and i'm not gonna bother telling you why because i'm so much smarter than you
>actually it's good and here's why
>>erm it's a game for children lol filtered you're stupid owned
I certainly wouldn't want to watch your youtube analysis lmao
L+ratio+cope+seethe+you're white
I never even said it was bad, I said there's some flaws you fricking moron
>moron who doesn't know how to use greenarrows thinks we can't see through his samegayging
you're the only moron who would use ">>" in that way
just stop posting
>zoom zoom doesn't know how quotes work
nice self report moron
cope, >>tard
yes, you're coping we know.
still is
The series would be good if:
- The 32X didn’t exist (no Knuckles Chaotix)
- Sonic 3 didn’t have to be rushed out of the door (no split between the two games)
- Sonic Spinball didn’t exist
- Sonic 3D Blast didn’t exist
- Sonic R was given time for more polish
- Sonic Adventure was given time for more polish (They released the game a whole year before DC launched in US. I assure you, the Japanese did not give any fricks about the game)
- Sonic Adventure 2 wasn’t modified mid-development to add Tails and ruin half the game because the devs had to put double the work into unnecessary stuff
- Sonic Heroes did not exist
- Shadow the Hedgehog did not exist
- Sonic 06 was given more time in the oven. It’s astonishing how much they managed to achieve in such short time, with half the workforce and without their captain.
- Yuji Naka didn’t leave SEGA to do whatever the frick he wants mid-game-development. He could train a new team first before leaving
- Sonic Unleashed didnt have the werehog stages
- Sonic Colors didn’t put as much focus into 2D stages
- SEGA didn’t sign the contract with Nintendo which made them release Sonic Lost World, Sonic Boom Wii U and Sonic Boom 3DS
- Sonic Forces didn’t exist
- Sonic Frontiers got a new, yet competent development team, just like Sonic Unleashed did
These are the most barebones changes that would’ve made the franchise a cult classic like Mario, instead of what we ended up with today.
Oh, and no Sonic 4. That just got memoryholed, woe
Thread is full of nerds
Depends on the homework. Math and history are okay, but literature is homosexual shit and nobody reads books nowadays except for stuck up pretentious nonces.
Unless you grew up with these games you've no idea how popular Sonic was. Sonic 1 was rough around the edges, Sonic 2 was the best Mega Drive game and Sonic 3 was the most polished but still preferred 2. All the cartoons and shit that came out. McDonalds used to put Sonic LCD games with their happy meals. It was a great time to be a sonic fan. The downturn started, I would say, with Shadow The Hedgehog
Sonic started great in 2D, easier than other platformers but unique and thrilling with its fast pace, and a lot of potential in just the physics alone. SA1/2 also stood out for their time as ambitious games no doubt, but also marked the beginning of Sonic trading those technical feats for mindless Temple Runs, half-assed gimmicks and direction based entirely off its generation's appeals to consistency's detriment. And then it only got worse until Sonic '06 and Penders' comics-autism marked an unforgettable low-bar. One that persuaded SEGA to slash the IP's budget and ambitions for the entirety of the '10s and is why the series is now mostly known for shovelware that's 50/50 good/dogshit at best, passable for small kids on average and even lamer than '06 at worst. Then glossed it over with a shitton of retro-appeal and, later on, a good tribute game like Mania.
We're now at the point where an unfinished Unreal-testmap collectathon (that's still half-automated, lol) trying to imitate the more-competent FANGAMES is the greatest game in the series, one that if pulled off in other platformers would've been drowned in the juices of thrown tomatoes. The only reason I'm actually hopeful for once is solely on the back of Kishimoto finally taking an interest in both proper design/physics and talking to fans on Twitter. Oh yeah and Superstars looks decent... maybe.
tl;dr Sonic was good and almost fantastic, then like a suicidal rockband lead it burnt out with the era it appealed towards most, survived off obsessive fans/merch and is currently in its throwback-concert days (assuming post-arcades SEGA is still making their hail mary).
2 and 3K are mastepieces. Adventure games are good to great even if they aged.
The franchises went to hell with the transition to 3D:
>redesigns
>voice acting
>too focused on speed rather than momentum to the point that they always have a side gimmick to prevent the games from being too short. My favorite 3D Sonic Game is not even official.
Sonic 1-3K, Sonic Adventure 1, Sonic Advance 1-3, and Sonic Generations are all objectively good games at the bare minimum. There are some very enjoyable games elsewhere in the series depending on your tolerance for jank and various issues.
Le ebin Redditchan meme is that le Sonic was never le good.
Yes. Most casual players' issues with the series boil down to skill issues. Sonic Robo Blast 2 and Sonic Mania are 2 of the best platformers ever made.