Yeah, my bad on that post. I meant Sega Channel as an example of them being way ahead of the curve on some things. I still don’t fully understand how it worked.
Data through the cable line, and a cart that could keep the game memory stored while power was on. Pretty ingenious for the time though. Cable modems were definitley not a thing in my area when Sega channel was rocking.
Wasn't the cart supposed to have a battery backup, but all the US Sega Channel carts were either sold with dead batteries, or didn't have them installed due to fears of piracy (or something)?
Yeah, every single one of Sega's consoles that aren't the Genesis lost literally just because Sony and Nintendo used evil underhanded tricks. The Saturn had both better hardware and software than the PS1 but Sony used evil black magic to brainwash the entire world population and force them to buy a product that's vastly inferior in everyway
6 months ago
Anonymous
>saturn sold bad therefore its as bad as the rotting writhing nuclear waste that atari pumped out in the 80s and 90s
>Dreamcast >JP: November 27, 1998 >PS2 >JP: 4 March 2000
Dreamcast was outdated when it came out with an inacceptable controller and the PS2 ran circles around it a year later
Graphically, the Dreamcast couldn’t have kept up with the main three sixth gen consoles, I agree. However it still had some very ahead-of-its-time features like online play and a web browser. Only the Xbox had online connectivity straight out of the box, and XBL didn’t even launch until 2002.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>However it still had some very ahead-of-its-time features like online play and a web browser.
Maybe you should have specified something so niche and pointless to most people in the OP. Hardware was what you could expect in 1998 and the controller is a joke years after the DualShock or even the N64's C buttons
Circus console that flopped for a reason
7 months ago
Anonymous
>online play >niche and pointless
Mmhmm.
7 months ago
Anonymous
If I sell you a car with the ability to autopilot perfectly if you have the second generation iBrain chip, would you buy it? It's pretty damn ahead of its time, innit?
7 months ago
Anonymous
You’re clearly too young to have experienced it, but Dreamcast online worked quite well. I have fond memories of the DC Quake III port.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Iirc i got 250ping on my old 56k modem which wasn't perfect but still playable.
7 months ago
Anonymous
You really think going online on the Dreamcast is like riding in a car with no driver? Why?
7 months ago
Anonymous
Probably born in the 90s. He thinks no one was playing consoles online before 2007.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I was born in the 90's and I don't think that. Why would he?
7 months ago
Anonymous
Because he’s a moron, presumably.
7 months ago
Anonymous
So the 90's thing was completely irrelevant? K got it.
7 months ago
Anonymous
It’s relevant because he clearly doesn’t have firsthand experience with playing the Dreamcast online back in 2000. You seem to have done your research at least.
7 months ago
Anonymous
i used the dreamcast browser back in 99 and that shit was fricking garbage
7 months ago
Anonymous
Compared to PC browsers, sure. But it worked well enough for a console in 1999. My main point is SegaNet online play performed overall quite well via the 56k modem.
7 months ago
Anonymous
yeah it was awful
i remember pages being broken and it being very slow
i dont remember shit else the online had or i didnt use it, i never got PSO
I think i remember i got some sonic adventure christmas tree downloadable or some shit when it was near the 24th of december, think i had to go online for that
7 months ago
Anonymous
You missed out on some fun online games actually. My family didn’t have a capable gaming PC in 1999, so Dreamcast was how I played Unreal Tournament and Quake III.
7 months ago
Anonymous
yeah see, i had unreal 99 and q3 on pc with my voodoo2 and PII, i remember seeing ut99 for sale at best buy but the idea of playing that on a controller seemed awful
7 months ago
Anonymous
I actually owned this back in the day.
7 months ago
Anonymous
that definitely would have made it a better experience
7 months ago
Anonymous
Wish I still had it. I was a dumbass and traded in all my Dreamcast stuff toward an Xbox in 2002.
7 months ago
Anonymous
hah, i know that feeling, mine was necessity thoguh, didnt have a good home, i pawned all my dreamcast shit and went into the military'
i have a dc now and just burn discs but i never really feel like playing it anymore, i tried to play beserk and sonic adventure again like 2 years ago and i just couldnt do it, both were worse than i remembered
6 months ago
Anonymous
>but the idea of playing that on a controller seemed awful
It was a lot of fun.
6 months ago
Anonymous
It was, but the great thing was it was fully compatible with the Dreamcast keyboard/mouse.
6 months ago
Anonymous
You couldn't play quake arena 4 player split screen with keyboard and keyboard.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Never tried the splitscreen mode, but online was a lot of fun on the DC.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Quake Arena and Virtua Tennis were my go to party games.
6 months ago
Anonymous
The strafe buttons sucked for this. Ps2 got it right with the dual analog
6 months ago
Anonymous
Using face buttons to strange is no different than using keyboard.
6 months ago
Anonymous
and that would make sense had the second joystick been a trackball. Unfortunately the only one who ever tried that was Apple/Bandai Pippin years before (and they misplaced it to the middle, were said to have been of shit quality and ofcourse had no games other than Myst and Marathon because it was just a Macintosh on a television set)
7 months ago
Anonymous
And that is related to being born in the 90's how?
7 months ago
Anonymous
I doubt many kids born in the early to mid 90s were playing the Dreamcast online unless they had older siblings.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I was and so were the other kids my age who had Dreamcast's, all 2 of them.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>me and all the other 4 year olds had Dreamcasts
doubt.jpg
7 months ago
Anonymous
I wasn't 4 when the Dreamcast came out. I was 9.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Which online games did you try? I’m having a hard time believing that a kid back then wouldn’t have been delighted by the idea of using their console to play online with their friends.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>I’m having a hard time believing that a kid back then wouldn’t have been delighted by the idea of using their console to play online with their friends.
I was. Why do you think I wasn't?
7 months ago
Anonymous
Oh, okay then. I thought you were trying to shit on the ’cast.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Why did you think that?
The only thing I've said is that I was online with my Dreamcast in 1999 when I was 9.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Sounds pretty rad.
7 months ago
Anonymous
It was okay. My only online game was Chu Chu Rocket tho
6 months ago
Anonymous
nobody needed online multiplayer because we still knew our neighbours back then.
>inacceptable controller
If you think that dual analog sticks were common place then you are wrong. If you play any game from the late 90s/early 2000s, you'll know that they did not utilize the second analog stick in the way that we use them today. The controller is perfectly serviceable for the time period.
Had maybe the dreamcast lasted longer than we might've gotten a controller with 2 analog sticks, but it didn't.
>literally only one stick on the main controller, years after the DualShock
Sick of zoomers saying this. Doubt any of you guys have even held a dreamcast pad.
>Boomer here. The Dreamcast pad is pretty bad, especially by Sega standards.
I know it has its flaws but the amount of buttons and analog sticks were not one of them.
>Sega really cheaped out by making it all plastic with no rubber coating of any kind.
I never had an issue with my finger slipping off the analog stick. Now the madcatz pad went overboard with rubber coating. Face buttons were unmashable without ripping the skin off your hand.
I still remember going to Best Buy when it got released, they had some Football game on demo and I thought it was a real football game. I was like 16 or so at the time.
Seeing so many 3D games run in 60 fps was also really fricking cool.
The Dreamcast was the first affordable mainstream console to bridge the gap between arcade tier 3D graphics and home systems. SoulCalibur was absolutely stunning.
The Dreamcast was a great product. Piracy didn’t kill it, nor did the upcoming PS2. Sega’s beleaguered financial situation in the console market and the declining North American arcade market were the primary factors behind the Dreamcast’s early demise.
>Sega’s beleaguered financial situation
It was this mostly. Sega had no money left. They blew their reserves all on the 32x and Sega Saturn. The Saturn was a massive worldwide flop. It only did moderately well in Japan. But Sega spent way too much money. Doing only well in Japan was not even close to good enough. Sega took out risky loans to fund the Sega Dreamcast.
And it's a damn shame it wasn't taken. I vastly prefer better antialiasing and higher frame rates compared to other 6th gen consoles at the cost of lower poly counts on Dreamcast.
>PS2 is debatable,
PS2 didn't have AA. There's nothing to debate.
>GameCube
Gamecube has an optional AA, but 99% of games didn't use it because the Gamecube took a big hit in performance with it turned on. Most Developers decided to rely on a deflicker filter to hide the aliasing, and CRTs to blur out aliasing too.
>Xbox both had at least equally sharp looking textures and AA as the Dreamcast.
Xbox had optional AA but again, most devs opted to not have it turned on because the hardware took a big performance hit. They relied on SDTVs to hide the aliasing.
Dreamcast can't put as many textures on screen like the other consoles. However it was pretty much the only system that focused on having GPU hardware that could do AA and have extra sharp textures without a big hit to performance. Gotta give credit where credit is due.
We're discussing a hypothetical timeline where other manufacturers and developers decided to copy Dreamcast's approach. Obviously the priorities would change in that case.
>We're discussing a hypothetical timeline where other manufacturers and developers decided to copy Dreamcast's approach. Obviously the priorities would change in that case.
If manufacturers copied Dreamcast's approach, then they would sacrifice amount of textures for better Anti-Aliasing.
It doesn't matter what hypothetical timeline you come up with since late 90s/early 2000s technology limited what you could do.
You could either get sharper and crisper textures on screen like Dreamcast.
Or you could have a lot of textures and many things happening on screen. But at the cost of having jagged lines and flickering everywhere.
Sacrificing the amount of textures naturally lends itself to smaller, more linear level design, which also makes optimizing a game to run at a higher frame rate easier.
Normally I have contentions with phrases like this but shit
It was the first console that gen to launch with the internet shit ready to go
had a browser in the box
big leap in 3D graphics
while it didn't last it was definitely ahead of its time, high res 60fps high fidelity 3D in an era where 20fps was considered smooth. it's a console genuinely deserving of the phrase ahead of its time.
I never owned a DC but I stayed at my cousin's place a lot and he had one. The thing that was most surprising to me was how bad the online functionality was compared to my home PC playing Diablo. It seemed to crap out all the time and have these really inexplicable latency spikes.
Was that normal or did my cousin just have a shitty dreamcast modem?
6th generation console with 5th generation design sensibilities due to being forced to launch in 1998.
>Single analog stick because N64/Saturn used a single analog stick and the Dual Shock was brand new >No integrated rumble pack because rumble was still new >GD-ROM instead of DVD because DVD drives were prohibitively expensive in 1998 >Online service based around 56k dial-up because DSL wasn't mainstream yet >Tiny 128kb memory cards because flash was expensive
In some ways it was forward thinking, but in other ways it just seemed premature. Would have been a futuristic beast if it had somehow launched in 1996, but the console seemed half-baked compared to the PS2 in 2000.
>6th generation console with 5th generation design sensibilities due to being forced to launch in 1998.
I always see it as a 5th gen console. The fact that it launched the same year as Tony Hawk should count for something
>Was the Dreamcast ahead of its time?
In many ways yes. Online play in 1998, and VMU memory cards with a screen that let you do exclusive things on your controller. For example, in football games you could choose plays on your controller so your opponent couldn't see. And really great graphics at an affordable price.
Sega created a really great economical system. It had solid hardware with an easy to understand design, it was much easier to develop games for, and Sega provided great support to developers. They learned all the lessons of the failures of the Sega Saturn.
It's just so bad that Sega was in a terrible financial situation. The Sega Saturn's huge failure really hurt the company badly. If the Sega Saturn had done a little better, then Sega would have had more money for Dreamcast.
>Online play in 1998, and VMU memory cards with a screen that let you do exclusive things on your controller
The former negates the latter. There's no point when each player has their own TV. That's why it didn't catch on.
>There's no point
There will always be a way to utilise a vmu be it clearing screen clutter or making warning sounds. I will never understand the hate for VMUs when you don't see that with any other add ons like Rumble packs which you could easily make the exact same stupid arguments.
Imagine in Diablo 2 walking over an item pickup the name of the item pops up on your phone, taking your eyes off the game. Fricking insanity. Terrible idea.
Warning sounds, your TV has two speakers.
And for the record, I hate vibration as well. I turn it off everywhere.
The DS successfully pulled off having gameplay on one screen while having your map/inventory on another. IIRC, the Wii U version of Breath of the Wild was originally supposed to have this feature, which actually would’ve been very useful.
Kinda agree with this other than a few racing games for it. That taxi games was fun but even that had a weird turbo boost feature that was awkward. Need to see if it's more fun on another console maybe
No, it was chronically behind the times >No DVD player
This fricked it up, many people, including me, got their first DVD player with their PS2 or XBOX. Prices for DVD players were over 200$ at the time, getting a DVD player with your console was a big draw >Arcade ports galore
They really thought 1:1 ports of arcade games were the future of gaming, while most developers were leaning into immersive environments
>This fricked it up, many people, including me, got their first DVD player with their PS2 or XBOX.
Not really. Gamecube didn't play DVDs. Xbox didn't either unless you bought the accessory remote.
>Prices for DVD players were over 200$ at the time, getting a DVD player with your console was a big draw
Sony lost billions putting the DVD player into the PS2. Each condole sold was a huge loss.
>Not really. Gamecube didn't play DVDs. Xbox didn't either unless you bought the accessory remote.
No, it's correct, for a lot of people a PS2 was the first thing they could watch DVDs on. It was a triple whammy, it could play DVDs, PS1 games, and PS2 games too.
Xbox came out like three years later and I haven't seen a single one of them that wasn't modded (usually with Evolution X) and could play back DVDs but also DivX/XVID movies, mp3s, and so on.
Gamecube sold like shit.
>Sony lost billions putting the DVD player into the PS2. Each condole sold was a huge loss.
Nah, Sony has been making money on the Playstation throughout all of its life, expect for 1994 and 2006-7 (the PS3 was a VERY big frickup).
>No, it's correct, for a lot of people a PS2 was the first thing they could watch DVDs on.
Learn to read what I said.
>Nah, Sony has been making money on the Playstation throughout all of its life
Sony doesn't make money from console sales. All Playstation sell for a loss. They make money from software and game sales.
In some ways. Something like the PSP was more obviously forward-thinking than the Dreamcast, though. The "ahead of its time" narrative is best understood as undergirding the tragic failure story. There's truth in it, but it depends on what you're prioritizing.
AMOLED was what some phones went with around the vitas release
Samsung and Motorola most notably I think
However they have similar problems that the vita had with the Mura effect
6 months ago
Anonymous
Okay, that makes sense. I’d still argue that the OLED Vita was way ahead of its time as a handheld gaming system though. The AMOLED screen smartphones you’re talking about must have been considerably more expensive.
6 months ago
Anonymous
What the frick does oled even matter when it was a complete flop? Vita was complete trash compared to any gameboy.
6 months ago
Anonymous
The Vita hardware is excellent. Sony just didn’t support it with quality software.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>The Vita hardware is excellent
You could say the exact same for gamegear and lynx.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Yes, but the Vita has both great tech and solid battery life. Early 90s AA batteries just couldn’t cut it.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>Vita was complete trash compared to any gameboy.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Name a gameboy that loses to vita. I owned a vita and had two games. Resistance and some jap import ragnarok. I'd have bought better games had they existed.
6 months ago
Anonymous
How did you own a Vita and not at least get Persona 4 Golden or Soul Sacrifice? People like you are so bizarre.
6 months ago
Anonymous
I don't know what those games are but they sound like a lot of cut scenes. 15-20 mins of cut scenes before I could even move in its tutorial type games.
6 months ago
Anonymous
So you owned a Vita and it never once occurred to you to simply Google "Best Vita games"? Are you stupid?
6 months ago
Anonymous
>Google search best PlayStation games >it's all movie shit and jrpg's
Great advice.
6 months ago
Anonymous
I specifically said Vita, not PlayStation, didn’t I? So I ask again: Are you stupid?
6 months ago
Anonymous
I feel I could own the entire vita library and still never play a good game.
That's exactly what Persona is like. And when you finally get to the game, it's barebones and doesn't last long. Absolute junk
>Absolute junk
Exactly why I don't listen to best ps vita games of all time by Anita Sarkeesian. You can tell half of online reviews know nothing about what they are reviewing. Often they don't even play the game.
6 months ago
Anonymous
That's exactly what Persona is like. And when you finally get to the game, it's barebones and doesn't last long. Absolute junk
6 months ago
Anonymous
The Persona games are quite long so that part isn’t true. But yeah, it’s definitely not for everyone.
6 months ago
Anonymous
What I mean is, the dungeon crawler segments are quite basic and clipped. The game itself is long, but there are frequent and drawn out interruptions for the story to progress. Anon there definitely wouldn't like it.
6 months ago
Anonymous
That’s true, but this
Name a gameboy that loses to vita. I owned a vita and had two games. Resistance and some jap import ragnarok. I'd have bought better games had they existed.
is still one of the dumbest posts I’ve seen in a while. Who the frick buys a Vita and then chooses Resistance as their first game for it lol
6 months ago
Anonymous
>Who the frick buys a Vita and then chooses Resistance as their first game for it lol
Online reviews gave it 10/10.
6 months ago
Anonymous
No they didn’t. You’re dumb, bro.
6 months ago
Anonymous
What would you know about good games. You recommended persona lol
6 months ago
Anonymous
No saving face now. You chose terribly so this one is on you.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>You chose terribly
I know Vita was a really bad purchase.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Now the truth comes out. You’re moronic.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Dreamcast, Vita, and Wii U, all three publishers had their own version of whatever this is called. lol
very cool gadgets and gizmos, that felt ahead of the curve, but held back in damnable ways.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Sony shot themselves in the foot big time with the Vita. Lots of cool technology borrowed from their Xperia smartphones, but a weird weeb-heavy library plus those crazy expensive proprietary memory cards.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, but the main factor to its death was Mobile Gaming on smartphones.
The cards and lack of varied titles was Sony's absolute fault. I'll never forgive them for what they did to the Vita ffs
Aiming for a console experience with an eye on being a media hub (UMDs being an embarrassing failure notwithstanding). It wasn't novel in an absolute sense but even the aspect ratio made it clear what their ambitions were. The PSP came out before the video iPod. The PSP's browser was pretty decent for the time, even. The iPhone it was not, but you could do a lot worse in 2004-2005.
You people need to understand that DVD was coming no matter what. It didn't matter whether or not it was put in the PS2. We were all going to get DVD players within a few years eventually. It was pretty much standard in video electronics by 2003.
if the VM2 wasn't so atrociously priced that would deserve a spot on the list too, like god damn i wish it was like 2015 again where a VMU was 3 bucks. they store like 4 save games
I got Dreamcast the week it came out, was really hyped for it.
However as I was a lil kid (like 9 at the time) I got stuck on Sonic Adventure 1 quite early (shortly after the first Eggman fight as I couldnt figure out where to go next).
After that I pretty much only played Marvel vs Capcom 2 and Gundam Side Story 0079. The lack of games killed it for me but I never hated it.
My friend found an import store in a mall the next county over and had them bring one in for him with a few games. I don’t even think he had his license yet, and he certainly didn’t have a credit card either. I don’t even know what he paid for it all said and done, but it must’ve been every penny he made at McDonald’s that year. When it finally came, around Christmas 98, we went over to our other friends house and stayed up all night playing virtua fighter and Godzilla. The graphics blew our minds, especially with the S-video on a brand new 36” Wega (which is why we chose that friends house). It certainly blew away the N64 in that respect. I personally loved the controller, particularly shining on Soulcalibur.
Absolutely, and anybody who argues otherwise is a dumb zoomer, period. Sega way back in 1998 (though one could argue even earlier), saw the writing on the wall, knew that online gaming, especifically shooters, were going to be the next thing and they made a console prepared for just that, having dedicated online games, DLC, mouse and keyboard support, etc. The Dreamcast just wasn’t a DVD player, plain and simple. It even took MS 2 consoles to fulfill what Sega already had down pat, Sony didn’t even catch on properly until the next decade. I suppose the focus on the “arcade at home” was a bit outdaded, but then again, I don’t think anybody imagined arcades crashing the way they did in the 00’s.
The Dreamcast was like the 3do. It was ahead of its time, but releasing a console then was fricking stupid and was obviously going to fail when the next gen came.
It didn't even have 32 megabytes of RAM, let alone the 4 gigabytes address space of 32 bit, let alone the 16 exabytes address space of 64 bit, let alone the 18446744073709551615 exabytes address space of 128 bit. 128 bit, more like 128 units sold.
While at the time when the Dreamcast released I still rather and preferred the Saturn, even so far as foregoing SFA3 and was rewarded with a Saturn release. In the end, it was the right time for the Dreamcast because otherwise the technology would not be enough for the kinds of games released on PS2/Xbox/GC. Aside from its lack of popularity, there's very little I would change about the Dreamcast as it is still perfect the way it was in its time. A top 10 non-portable/non-variant/non-PC gaming console for me.
In certain ways, yes. But the controller and the library was rather behind the times. Even the things on the console that weren't arcade ports mostly reeked of arcade sensibilites. What actual good games are their on the console that aren't fighting games, STG's, racing games, puzzle games? Where are the platformers or action-adventure games, first or third-person shooters that will come to typify the mid-2000's? What is there, like, Shenmue, Rayman, and Jet Set Radio? I love the Dreamcast, because I love the arcade sensibilities with which most of these games were designed, but Sega was way behind the times in terms of game design. Their way wasn't really the future, and it wasn't until they were forced to develop for Sony or Microsoft that they started making games that fit with the Zeitgeist of the era, like Gunvalkyrie or Yakuza. Whatever you might think about the shift in quality, gamer tastes were changing.
All correct. I’d like to once again openly mock that one anon that keeps claiming the Dreamcast would’ve been easily capable of a GTA3 port in Dreamcast threads. You’re moronic.
GTA3 was originally being worked on the dreamcast. Literally nothing about the game looks impossible for the dreamcast, all the GTA games graphically look like shit even for PS2 standards (see something like true crime or that tony montana game for actual good open world graphics).
Easily possible, as opposed to GTA3, which would’ve been downgraded in every way.
6 months ago
Anonymous
OK So why didn't you make it happen?
6 months ago
Anonymous
Okay, it’s going to be way easier than porting GTA3 to the Dreamcast. You’re an idiot if you believe otherwise.
6 months ago
Anonymous
I highly doubt it. You can't port OoT.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Why? The Dreamcast is way more powerful than the N64. On the other hand, it’s less power than the PS2 and therefore a port of GTA3 would be a huge downgrade.
6 months ago
Anonymous
less powerful than the PS2*
6 months ago
Anonymous
They'd have to nerf the amount of npcs on screen, add loading times during some parts of the map and cut some of the music, but graphicwise it would've been mostly the same.
6 months ago
Anonymous
They'd also have to nerf the vehicle physics (cpu too slow) and reduce the size and complexity of the map (not enough ram).
a version of gta iii which is running on the dreamcast would hardly resemble the real thing.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>They'd also have to nerf the vehicle physics (cpu too slow)
Is it?
6 months ago
Anonymous
Yes, anon, it is. The Dreamcast doesn’t run on magic, it was more or less a NAOMI chipset in a small console form factor. Shenmue II was one of the best looking games on the system and it had a ton of slowdown in larger, crowded areas.
>and GameCube
Way to expose yourself.
[...]
Dreamcast gta3 had a running alpha. You should shut up now.
Do you have any proof of GTA3 actually running on the Dreamcast? Any screenshots or interviews where devs are saying the game runs properly? Or is this just "It WOULD run bro"?
Nope because there is none. There’s some nebulous prototype that Rockstar made using the Dreamcast hardware that’s never seen the light of day and that’s it. The actual game was always developed as a PS2 exclusive.
The Dreamcast was the perfect "gamer's" console. It focused on the games and how the games could take advantage of the exansion slot. PS2's selling point was a DVD. I suppose GameCube was also a "gamer's" console as all you could do with it was play games, but Sega had a stronger brand for appealing to arcade game fans.
>I suppose GameCube was also a "gamer's" console as all you could do with it was play games
Gamecube was the "affordable party console" that you played with many friends. It was cheaper than other consoles, relatively smaller, and had 4 controller ports.
Xbox was the Halo, FPS shooter, and first online multi-player console.
I dont think you read any bit of my post because nowhere did I shit on arcade games and nowhere did I ask for more JRPGs
What the frick are you asking for then Black person. It's the swan song of the arcade era, it had online connectivity, was a step behind other sixth gen systems but came out 3 years earlier and for a life span of like two and a half years it has one of the most unbelievably stacked game libraries out there, ports excluded. Seriously, what kind of concrete criticism do you have for the system besides >muh no games, which is 100% a problem of you just having shit taste.
I think you're just too used to arguing online man. I'm not really criticizing anything at all. You act like I'm submitting a formal thing here. Chill out bro. I just wish Sega consoles had more games for me to play. I think you're making really weird and wild assumptions as to what kind of games I like. We probably share a lot of favorite games and would be friends in any other thread.
So your favorite console is "honestly boring" and you enjoy it for what games exactly, considering you ran out of games that interest you? I mean, half of what makes the Dreamcast the best console were the 2K sports games and arcade perfect ports, if you don't like those and you weren't interested in the online capabilities of the console or the "western shovelware" then the only thing you're really left with is Sonic and 5th gen ports. So are you the type of gay who played Crazy Taxi and Jet Grind Radio once and now decided the DC is his favorite console or do you really want to falsegay into oblivion?
6 months ago
Anonymous
Think about what you're even arguing at this point because I don't know either.
6 months ago
Anonymous
We're not arguing, I just want to know how much more shit can come out of you mouth.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Can you just stop being mean to me man. I like the Dreamcast. Isn't that enough?
6 months ago
Anonymous
Not if you spout baseless shit and then act like the victim after falsegayging, no. Nobody who liked or calls the dreamcast their favorite console would say it was "boring". So I'm more than fine with being mean to liars.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Why would I possibly lie about this? If you can recommend me games I'm all for it.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Why would I need to recommend you games for your favorite console?
6 months ago
Anonymous
I struggle to find games to play on it.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>Vsrecommendedlist
Have fun
6 months ago
Anonymous
What hell it must be to find games for other consoles when you're struggling to find ones for your favorite.
6 months ago
Anonymous
lol who the frick played 2k sports? when i get those in a bundle i just toss them. are you like some old normie or something?
6 months ago
Anonymous
Don’t be that moron, anon. 2K sports was an excellent franchise and it’s a true shame that Sega’s sports division lost to EA. They were legitimately good games even if they weren’t for you, just like I hate the anime shit you like.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>hurr dont like sports games? must be a weeb
nope
sports games are fricking boring. youd like jrpgs if you liked to 'play' sports games.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Refer back to
Don’t be that moron, anon. 2K sports was an excellent franchise and it’s a true shame that Sega’s sports division lost to EA. They were legitimately good games even if they weren’t for you, just like I hate the anime shit you like.
and replace anime with whatever it is you like. Sega’s sports titles for Dreamcast were objectively great across the board.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>shitting on crazy taxi and jet grind >only likes sport games
are you sure you like the dreamcast as much as you think?
6 months ago
Anonymous
Don’t be that moron, anon. 2K sports was an excellent franchise and it’s a true shame that Sega’s sports division lost to EA. They were legitimately good games even if they weren’t for you, just like I hate the anime shit you like.
Refer back to [...] and replace anime with whatever it is you like. Sega’s sports titles for Dreamcast were objectively great across the board.
6 months ago
Anonymous
huh?
6 months ago
Anonymous
I don’t think that anon was shitting on JSR or Crazy Taxi. I’m just saying you shouldn’t rag on sports games just because you’re not into them. Sega’s sports titles have always been held in high regard.
6 months ago
Anonymous
im not ragging on sports games though but he shat on good dreamcast games to make his point so im just not clear on what hes saying
6 months ago
Anonymous
Maybe learn to read before embarrassing yourself
6 months ago
Anonymous
I'm not shitting on those games, you should maybe read carefully before replying (I'm shitting on you btw). I've only played one 2K game since I'm a Europoor and grew up with Fifa and PES on PS, I just know they were quite well received in Muttland and were a big selling point for the DC.
>muh no games
Dreamcast had no games. I don't like Sonic, Phantasy Star, Shenmue, fighters, racers, jrpg's or arcade games so what was I suppose to play?
How is it a gamers console? its honestly boring. I dont play fighting games and I dont care about sports games. That basically cuts off most of segas library on both the genesis and the dreamcast. It doesnt help that most of the library is actual literal non-weaboo biased western shovelware because they couldnt court any desirable companies to their machines.
The rare exceptions on the Dreamcast(and genesis) are well known and what everyone talks about. Or they cope and pretend Im only talking about JRPGs(im not) or that a very clear and shameless copy of a SNES game is somehow superior to the original.
And I say this as a dreamcast fan. I feel like I ran out of games to play really fast.
Nobody gives a shit about what you play Black person. The Dreamcast is the only console that had perfect one to one arcade conversions when there still great arcade games coming out, if you don't get the appeal of that you're one hell of a fricking moron. If you want JRPG trash and movie games, then why even bother with a console which is clearly not for you.
>And I say this as a dreamcast fan. I feel like I ran out of games to play really fast.
Least obvious falsegay I have ever seen.
Yes and no. >first system to do 3D graphics right, 480i 60fps clear textures no fog in the distance >internet >the memory card thing was cool
But not really… >controller is so bad and lacking function of the N64 one >everyone was just going to wait until the much more powerful Ps2 and GameCube
Does anyone know the deal with this? Did they really have some major manufacturing blunder? I know I remember hearing that "NEC made a fairly negligent mistake."
Last time I tried it, there used to be some websites actually dedicated to bring browsable on the DreamBrowser or whatever that disc was called. I used to frequent onlineconsoles.com and I remember that being one of the browsable websites.
It does but how well it works for websites depends on the website.
You could probably browse Ganker and maybe post if you had a pass to get around the captcha.
Yes, it was.
Honestly, the Dreamcast only failed because it was a Sega console. The Sega name was trash at that point whereas Sony's was golden, especially in the US. If they had sold to Microsoft and used the Microsoft name, the Microsoft Dreamcast would have dominated the market.
The Dreamcast failed because Sega ran out of money. I mean literally ran out of money. They declared bankruptcy.
The Dreamcsst was a solid design that was on track to sell 20 to 30 million units if it had another 2 to 3 years.
But it died after 18 months and only selling 10 million Dreamcast.
Sega was broke. Sega didn't even really have enough money to make the Dreamcast. The failure of 32x and Saturn drained Sega of too much money. So they took out loans to make the Dreamcast.
>The Dreamcsst was a solid design that was on track to sell 20 to 30 million units if it had another 2 to 3 years
In a vacuum? Maybe. But once the PS2 came out it was over for Sega
Dreamcast could've done 20 or even 30 Million. It had software and some decent momentum.
To put the Dreamcast in context it sold ≈10 million systems in 1.5 years. The Wii U sold ≈10 million in 3 years. At the 1.5 year mark the Wii U had sold like 5 million units.
It's pretty frickin safe to say the Dreamcast could've easily made it to 20 million if it had a normal lifespan. Particularly considering how at the time the Dreamcast had the best launch of any system up until that point in North America. The Wii U was basically a dead from the start and still managed to double its unit sales over another year and a half.
The problem is it’s difficult to imagine what software Sega would’ve put out for the Dreamcast in say 2002 or 2003. The aging NAOMI arcade board was being phased out in favor of more advanced hardware.
The Dreamcast's sales was front-loaded, and tapered off big time when the PS2 was released. Pile on the Gamecube and Xbox, I think cracking 15 millions would have been a minor miracle.
>In a vacuum? Maybe. But once the PS2 came out it was over for Sega
Uh no. Of course the PS2 was going to be a mega big hit. But Many families and kids owned multiple systems. Dreamcast would probably hit 20 or 30 million in sales if it had a full 4 to 5 years on the market with a continuous release of new games. Not PS2 levels of sales. But a solid base of fans.
Dreamcast simply came too late for Sega because the company was doing very bad financially before Dreamcast was even released.
They'd also have to nerf the vehicle physics (cpu too slow) and reduce the size and complexity of the map (not enough ram).
a version of gta iii which is running on the dreamcast would hardly resemble the real thing.
Just look at Headhunter or Omikron the Nomad Soul on Dreamcast. Open world games. Upgrade the graphics slightly, and that's what GTA3 would look like. Dreamcast GTA3 would probably have lower draw distance than PS2, and fewer NPCs but it can be done.
>(not enough ram)
Dreamcast has more VRAM than PS2.
The problem is it’s difficult to imagine what software Sega would’ve put out for the Dreamcast in say 2002 or 2003. The aging NAOMI arcade board was being phased out in favor of more advanced hardware.
>The problem is it’s difficult to imagine what software Sega would’ve put out for the Dreamcast in say 2002 or 2003. The aging NAOMI arcade board was being phased out in favor of more advanced hardware.
Just look at all Naomi and Atomiswave games ever released. Now imagine them also on Dreamcast. Then add sequels to them.
Also Imagine all current games made on Dreamcast and add sequels to them. So Power Stone 3, Sonic Adventure 3, Soul Calibur 2, etc. Also leave room for multi-platform releases too.
>Just look at Headhunter or Omikron the Nomad Soul on Dreamcast. Open world games. Upgrade the graphics slightly, and that's what GTA3 would look like. Dreamcast GTA3 would probably have lower draw distance than PS2, and fewer NPCs but it can be done.
Therein lies the rub. What incentive would third party devs have to support the Dreamcast when they would have to put in extra work to get sixth gen multiplats running on it? Look at how badly third party support for the GameCube dropped off after the first couple of years.
This is a stupid fricking point to make when the dreamcast stopped being made. you can't run numbers against eachother like this
6 months ago
Anonymous
Well yeah, obviously we’re talking about a hypothetical scenario where Sega had attempted to continue support for it. I think best case scenario they could have sold it at $50 to $75 and marketed it as a budget friendly alternative to the big three sixth gen systems.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Possibly I think the lowest Sega would go would be $99, or match whatever the lowest price of the Gamecube was selling at. Sega would still want to make a small profit on it.
They look at the install base of consoles sold to determine it.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Sure, but you’d still run into the situation where Dreamcast would get the worst version of any multiplat.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Didn't it get one of the better versions of Rayman 2?
6 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah but Rayman 2 is more fifth gen than sixth. That’s the whole thing with the Dreamcast. It went from being the most powerful console on the market to being the weakest once all three sixth gen consoles were out in late 2001.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Okay. But it still had the best version of a multiplat.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Yes, anon, you’re right.
6 months ago
Anonymous
The best version would be Xbox or PC.
But people would just be happy to have any version released for whatever system they owned. That's how it usually goes.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>Dreamcast would get the worst version of any multiplat >Almost all dreamcast multiplats are better than gc, ps2 and Xbox
6 months ago
Anonymous
I’m talking about actual sixth gen multiplats like Beyond Good & Evil or Prince of Persia for example. The Dreamcast versions would be a major downgrade compared to the other systems.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>The Dreamcast versions would be a major downgrade compared to the other systems.
I'm not so sure about that. Yu Suzuki stated PS2 wasn't even able to run Shenmue.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Citation needed.
Also, Shenmue was never even planned on their competitors console, the PS2. Xbox though...
6 months ago
Anonymous
>Xbox though...
Shenmue 2 looks better on dreamcast than Xbox too. The special effects Xbox added look worse.
6 months ago
Anonymous
That’s the not the same thing as a multiplatform game. Shenmue II was made for the Dreamcast and then later ported to Xbox. Again, I’m talking about multiplats that are released across the different consoles at the same time.
6 months ago
Anonymous
So it has to be ported to absolutely everything for it to count?
PS2 is able to run Yakuza. Yu Suzuki is full of shit, as he always was.
>Yu Suzuki is full of shit
If you can provide any other examples of him lying I will believe you.
Headhunter is a cool game, but yeah it’s mainly a third person action game and plays nothing like the sixth gen era GTAs.
Dreamcast ran more graphic intensive games than gta3. Doom 3 has been ported to dreamcast recently too.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>any other examples of him lying
The entire marketing campaign of Shenmue 3.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Oh you're one of those Shenmue 3 haters. I don't really care to hear the opinions of those who know nothing about the series in the first place.
6 months ago
Anonymous
6 months ago
Anonymous
There was a kick starter and eventually a Shenmue 3. Once again no lies just more hate from reddit zoomers who never played Shenmue before.
6 months ago
Anonymous
No lies bro, none at all.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>No lies bro, none at all.
Glad you admitted you were wrong.
6 months ago
Anonymous
I don't admit shit. Yu Suzuki lied, has always lied, and the PS2 can run Shenmue and more.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>and the PS2 can run Shenmue >Only other console that got a Shenmue game was xbox
6 months ago
Anonymous
That doesn't really prove anything.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Lines up with what Yu claimed.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Lines up with what Yu claimed.
Because Microsoft paid for exclusivity. Yakuza looks better, and doesn't look like some morons turned on full bright unlike Shenmue.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>Microsoft paid for exclusivity.
Only in america
6 months ago
Anonymous
The Xbox port of Shenmue II got a European release as well.
6 months ago
Anonymous
mate, please think we live in a round world, USA is not the only place with vidya.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Yes, anon, I’m aware that Shenmue II was released in Europe on Dreamcast. Microsoft did pay for Xbox exclusivity for the port which is why this post
>Microsoft paid for exclusivity.
Only in america
is incorrect.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>I’m aware
You compare yakuza with Shenmue. You're aware of nothing. >which is why this post
>Microsoft paid for exclusivity.
Only in america (You) # is incorrect.
Dc Shenmue 2 was not released in America.
>Dreamcast ran more graphic intensive games than gta3.
Such as? The Shenmue games have a ton of loading times and slowdown in the large NPC-crowded areas which are nowhere near as complex as anything in GTA3.
>Such as?
The image I posted.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Anon, Microsoft paid for exclusivity for Shenmue II on Xbox, meaning that it wasn’t also ported to the PS2 or GameCube. That has nothing to do with the original Dreamcast release coming out in Europe.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>meaning that it wasn’t also ported to the PS2
Ps2 couldn't run Shenmue.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Even if that’s true, that doesn’t change anything I said. Microsoft paid for Shenmue II to be an exclusive port for the Xbox. That deal had nothing to do with the game being released on the Dreamcast in Europe.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Even if that’s true, that doesn’t change anything I said. Microsoft paid for Shenmue II to be an exclusive port for the Xbox. That deal had nothing to do with the game being released on the Dreamcast in Europe.
That said, it’s complete bullshit. Shenmue and Shenmue II often ran like shit on the Dreamcast hardware.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>ran like shit >still looks better than Xbox version
Even if that’s true, that doesn’t change anything I said. Microsoft paid for Shenmue II to be an exclusive port for the Xbox. That deal had nothing to do with the game being released on the Dreamcast in Europe.
So you claim.
>Doom 3 has been ported to dreamcast recently too
Have you seen what it looks like lmao? If you think that looks anywhere near the Xbox port you're completely delusional. Yes, it runs, but it looks like complete ass with no lighting
Xbox doom 3 wasn't one dude working on it in his spare time.
Dreamcast tards are legitimately on a whole other level of delusion when it comes to the PS2.
>I highly doubt the DC versions would have looked worse than the PS2 versions
Yes, I'm sure SH3 would look exactly like this on the Dreamcast
You cannot deny almost every multiplat looks and usually runs better on dreamcast. The only wins you can get is with games released in 2005+ when dreamcast wasn't able to defend itself.
6 months ago
Anonymous
2002+
6 months ago
Anonymous
Why would you ever think the Dreamcast could handle GTA3 when the Shenmue can’t even run smoothly on its own native hardware?
6 months ago
Anonymous
the Shenmue games*. Shenmue’s city streets are almost all narrow corridors and there’s still a ton of frame rate drops.
6 months ago
Anonymous
nta but Shenmue had incredible detail, a lot more than GTA3 on PS2. Dreamcast could also do fast vehicles smoothly as clearly shown in Crazy Taxi. Dreamcast would likely just cut the detail of GTA3 even more and it would then start to fit on the gd-rom. You would make concessions and it would run, same as any other game on any other console that has lower performance than it.
Give any reason why GTA3 couldn't be made to run on dreamcast.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Crazy Taxi has small areas with lots of invisible walls. Nothing like GTA3’s large open world. Yeah Shenmue’s character models are detailed, but again the city environments are mostly narrow corridors with loading times between areas. Again, nothing like GTA3’s much more dynamic world. Nothing about either of those games is really comparable.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Why would you ever think the Dreamcast could handle GTA3 when the Shenmue can’t even run smoothly on its own native hardware?
Blue shift is not only comparable it's more impressive than gta3 to be running on a dc.
2002+
Dc had been axed by then.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>so you claim
No, anon. Microsoft buying Shenmue II exclusivity isn’t a theory. It’s what they did.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>Dreamcast ran more graphic intensive games than gta3.
Such as? The Shenmue games have a ton of loading times and slowdown in the large NPC-crowded areas which are nowhere near as complex as anything in GTA3.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Multiplatform ≠ port. A port typically refers to a game that was originally released exclusively for one platform later being released on other systems. Multiplatform releases on the other hand are typically developed concurrently with each other and released at the same time, like the newest Assassin’s Creed or Call of Duty coming out for Windows/PS5/Xbox all at once.
6 months ago
Anonymous
The Dreamcast Doom 3 port looks about as primitive as you’d expect given the limitations of the hardware. It’s impressive that it exists as a fan-made thing, but it’s not like it stacks up against Doom 3 on Xbox graphically.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>Doom 3 has been ported to dreamcast recently too
Have you seen what it looks like lmao? If you think that looks anywhere near the Xbox port you're completely delusional. Yes, it runs, but it looks like complete ass with no lighting
6 months ago
Anonymous
At this point people like
>meaning that it wasn’t also ported to the PS2
Ps2 couldn't run Shenmue.
are most likely just trolling. They can’t possibly believe it.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>I’m talking about multiplats that are released across the different consoles at the same time.
Seems arbitrarily specific. If it released on multiple platforms it's a multiplatform game. None of the other shit you mentioned matters even slightly.
6 months ago
Anonymous
The Xbox getting an exclusive port of Shenmue II is totally different than say SoulCalibur II which was developed for the PS2, GameCube and Xbox at the same time and released on all platforms on the same day. That’s what most people are referring to with the term multiplatform.
6 months ago
Anonymous
PS2 is able to run Yakuza. Yu Suzuki is full of shit, as he always was.
6 months ago
Anonymous
People also forget that Shenmue and Shenmue II didn’t exactly run silky smooth on the Dreamcast hardware. There was plenty of slowdown and long loading times.
6 months ago
Anonymous
PS2 is also able to run GTA:SA, a game where you can jump from a jet, and land in a street where there's pedestrians and AI traffic with cars you can steal. People who think the DC could do that are delusional >inb4 Headhunter
6 months ago
Anonymous
Headhunter is a cool game, but yeah it’s mainly a third person action game and plays nothing like the sixth gen era GTAs.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>Sure, but you’d still run into the situation where Dreamcast would get the worst version of any multiplat.
Lmao
6 months ago
Anonymous
See
I’m talking about actual sixth gen multiplats like Beyond Good & Evil or Prince of Persia for example. The Dreamcast versions would be a major downgrade compared to the other systems.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Now show me a 2001 multiplat
6 months ago
Anonymous
It’s a bit dishonest to refer to Quake III as a multiplat release. It was ported to Dreamcast first in 2000 with the PS2 version coming in early 2001, so they weren’t released day and date with each other.
I think in this scenario Sony would’ve still easily dominated in Japan and Europe, but maybe not as much in North American. The PlayStation brand was just way too strong at that point to have real competition.
It would be a severely gimped port for sure. Just like the GameCube’s mini discs quickly became a hindrance for third party multiplat developers, but worse.
>Dreamcast was ahead of its time
Nah, if it was ahead of its time it would've sucked harder like the PS3, 360, Xbone, PS4, PS5 and SeX. The Dreamcast was just too good for this world.
I'll never understand the people who waste all day arguing about the technical specs of the Dreamcast and muh console wars shit while literally ignoring all the unique innovative soulful games it birthed in its short time that are the reason it has a place in history and peoples' hearts. Literal non-human beings shambling around shrieking about price sheets and waving line graphs at each other like some kind of alien pod people experiment.
I love the Dreamcast, but I’m also not unreasonable and believe that it was capable of things that it simply wasn’t like some of the delusional anons on this board.
funfact: thanks to bleem the DC could actually EMULATE playstation
sony btfo etc etc
but those bleem guys were cool man
on one hand, i feel like a goober for buying a hard copy of an emulator from EB games in 1999 so i could play THPS
on the other hand, that was a really fricking nice PS1 emulator for back then. like wtf it was better than most PS emus up until like 2010 or so
also, without them and their totally hopeless uphill legal battle, emulation wouldve probably been made illegal by nintendo or some other gay corporation
noice
i only had it for PC but thought it was the coolest fricking thing ever that i could play spyro and FF7 on PC at a higher resolution. it was undoubtedly what started my fascination with emulation, piracy, and older games in general
thx bleem <33
6 months ago
Anonymous
The fact that bleemcast was actually being commercially sold at Electronics Boutique in America is insane to think about. Truly the wild west days.
6 months ago
Anonymous
i never saw the actual bleemcast software tbh. i heard about bleem from some PC mag and went to EB games and bought it like early 99 iirc
>Truly the wild west days.
i think at that point they knew it was fricking ogre and they were just trying to get any money they could. hence the single-game "packs" for bleemcast
all i know was after reading on some forum prolly SA but idk tbh online and figuring out there was an easy way to run bleem emu without the disks, my next big investment was another hard drive lol
then going around to all my friends house and borrowing their PS games and ripping them
yea i forget the card i had since it was hand-me-down from my dad, but it was a legit 3D acceleration card so i could play rogue squadron 3D. and when i saw my buddy playing sonic adventure i was fricking floored. first time, and prolly the last time, i was ever jelly of consoles
Yes but was severely limited by GD-ROMs instead of DVDs and just one analog stick.
Both of these changes would have made it a closer competitor to the PS2 and would have made it easier for multiplatform games to make the jump to Dreamcast. One example is the Half-Life 1 prototype that has to rely on face buttons to replace a stick.
Even if it was the least popular, the Dreamcast was easier to develop for than the PS2 and could have survived with more ports to augment the first party titles.
An internet-capable arcade-quality games system with built-in DVD playback would appeal to a much wider audience, more games would have been made for it, and more people would have probably bought it even if it was less powerful than the competition.
Yes and no.
Pros: >Online Support out the gate. >Trading(some) files over the web. >Web Browser. >Emphasis on 3D games and Arcade Titles. >Great future homebrew support. >Producing a lot of games in-house. >What the Saturn should have been.
Cons: >Four Years of support means limited titles. >Region Lock. >Piracy was an actual problem. >Controller was a holdover of the 3D controller from the Saturn(one stick limits freedom of movement) >Was designed to combat the PS1 and N64, didn't consider their future rivals(PS2 and GC). >Discs were cheaply made, and small to boot. >No DVD power, thus it couldn't have been used as a cheap DVD player like so many did with the PS2. >Third Party support was iffy.
Agree with all of this. The Dreamcast’s GD-ROM storage size would have become an issue for multiplat developers just like it did on the GameCube and its mini DVDs.
Multi-Discs will always have that issue. If a single disc is damaged beyond repair, you lost anywhere from two-to-five discs and can't play. They're far harder to collect for, as well.
If they adopted DVD, yes, the DC would've been more expensive - but it would've been better.
>yeah bro please give me a DVD player in a 1998 console for $200
It's a game console, not a video player. If Sega ever decided to do this shit that you idiots keep parroting they would have been billions in debt, not millions
Agree with all of this. The Dreamcast’s GD-ROM storage size would have become an issue for multiplat developers just like it did on the GameCube and its mini DVDs.
Multiplat games were never all that big to begin with, if it was on the GCN I doubt devs would have skipped the Dreamcast, the main issue is they broke ties with EA and that's basically half the sixth gen multiplats gone. No FIFA, NFS, Burnout, Harry Potter, the Dreamcast was doomed for this reason alone.
>if it was on the GCN I doubt devs would have skipped the Dreamcast
I don’t know about that. Yeah the GameCube’s mini discs were an issue, but otherwise the hardware was about on par with the PS2/Xbox. Dreamcast multiplats would’ve had to take a major hit graphically.
In polygon count maybe, but visual quality was excellent on the dreamcast. Sadly, there's nothing to really compare to because the Dreamcast died so early and there were no games developed for the PS2 and DC at the same time, but I highly doubt the DC versions would have looked worse than the PS2 versions, considering that DC ports on the PS2 were mostly downgrades. The CPU tho is another story, that could have been a big bottleneck and games could have had pretty big drops, especially since Renderware was pretty big at the time and that ran like shit on the DC.
whatever, if it was a little more ahead of the curve I can see it being a more popular choice
The console came 2 years earlier than other sixth gen systems, had online play, lots of 60 fps games and one of the best launches of any console to this day. It literally shared its entire lifespan with the N64, the console could not have possibly been any more on the curve, except maybe having 2 analog sticks. The reality is Sega's brand died after the launch of the Saturn and Sony's was absolutely soaring. The PS2 could have been half as powerful as the Dreamcast, thrice as expensive and people still would have bought it for the DVD player and the logo saying Sony and not Sega.
The Dreamcast excelled at having really clean, sharp looking textures that sort of fooled your brain into thinking character models and environments were more high poly than they actually were. The main characters in the Shenmue games still look pretty good to me.
>I highly doubt the DC versions would have looked worse than the PS2 versions
Yes, I'm sure SH3 would look exactly like this on the Dreamcast
6 months ago
Anonymous
Dreamcast tards are legitimately on a whole other level of delusion when it comes to the PS2.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Ya thats an actual delusion because I just played one of the last fps for ps2 and DAYUM. That game still beats anything out now. They put all the best games for that one. The only game that is close now is Dark Souls or that Star wars game and I only liked the worlds for it. The game wasn't that great just OK. Ps2 even beats that I think
Dreamcast isn't that bad it's basically a polished ps1 with no need for speed games. It has a few arcade racers, some OK 3rd person shmups and a few arcade style games that are fun. It's somewhere between a ps1 and ps2 but with only 5 games worth playing
The Dreamcast was already dead by the time it became more common for ROM sites to carry a wide selection of Dreamcast games. Not really a major issue in first world markets like North America.
>not really a major issue >literally killed the console
Sega was in deep shit from their prior frickups, but refusing the impact that piracy did is fricking moronic. The Dreamcast still could have had another 2 or 3 years on the market and maybe had a niche as the cheapest console if it wasn't for that, it being discontinued so early in 2001 was pretty much damage control. Releasing their new software on a system just so people pirated it and played it on their console which you sold for a loss was a double whammy for Sega. Triple whammy with developers abandoning them. If you can't understand that from a business perspective then you're actually moronic.
I repeat: Piracy was only an issue in irrelevant third world territories where they already pirate everything. It had no major impact on the first world markets that actually matter, eg NA, Western Europe and Japan.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>source: trust me bro
6 months ago
Anonymous
People in America in 2000 weren’t buying burned Dreamcast games at street markets like they were in shitholes like Brazil. Dreamcast ROMs didn’t become widely available online until closer to 2003/2004.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>People in Brazil were selling burned discs in 2000 >Americans were yet to discover ROM sites until 2004
so which was the shithole again?
6 months ago
Anonymous
There’s a difference between buying pirated games on the street versus being able to simply download them yourself at home and burn them to a CD-R which didn’t come until a couple years later when ROM sites had most of the Dreamcast library up and broadband internet was more widely adopted.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Plus consumer grade CD burner speeds improving.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Plus consumer grade CD burner speeds improving.
Personally I didn’t have a big book of burned Dreamcast games until like 2005-2007 when I was in college.
6 months ago
Anonymous
I'm proud that you're trying so hard to make this argument work but it's truly pathetic seeing to tumble your way from one embarrassing statement to the other. Even with dial up it would have taken someone at most 10 hours or so to download a standard Dreamcasst ROM. Also wouldn't these theoretical Brazilians also need pretty advanced technolgy to rip content directly from a DC, a DC itself and the game as opposed to just getting on the Internet and downloading a ROM before burning it? Sounds like a pretty convoluted scenario you've made up
6 months ago
Anonymous
How old are you and where are you from? What year were you burning a lot of Dreamcast games on your home computer? For me it wasn’t until around 2005.
6 months ago
Anonymous
I don't fricking know, I'm not poor nor a deadbeat so I'm not too involved with piracy, but I remember watching a lot of pirated anime around the late 90s, couldn't imagine dumping Dreamcast ROMs and downloading them could have been that much different.
6 months ago
Anonymous
I’m not saying it didn’t exist in the U.S. around 2000/01, I’m just saying it wasn’t a direct cause of the Dreamcast’s ultimate failure. Me personally, I bought a Dreamcast for $50 in late 2001 when Target was clearing out their inventory. Games were offered at a steep discount so there was no need to pirate.
>literally killed the console
Literally your headcanon, nobody who bought burned DC games would even think of buying original games had it been their only option of playing games.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Nobody who bought a Dreamcast would think about buying original games when piracy became common. Are you ignoring the fact that Sega literally sold 10 million units of hardware, pretty much every single one at a loss and the majority of people who were pirating or going to pirate games also had a solid library and were waiting for future releases? The only reason why we now won't know whether that gamble of having a solid user base while taking a loss would have paid off is because of piracy. Sega/Publishers can not release games nor support a system that will just see them losing money. It's that simple.
I’m not saying it didn’t exist in the U.S. around 2000/01, I’m just saying it wasn’t a direct cause of the Dreamcast’s ultimate failure. Me personally, I bought a Dreamcast for $50 in late 2001 when Target was clearing out their inventory. Games were offered at a steep discount so there was no need to pirate.
That's what people call "cutting your losses". The Dreamcast was dead as soon as the MIL-CD exploit was found, Sega just wanted to minimize the damage before jumping ship to Xbox/Gamecube/PS2
6 months ago
Anonymous
>piracy
Burnt cds killed your dreamcast.
6 months ago
Anonymous
>when piracy became common.
By the time it became common Sega was already too deep in the coffin to recover.
6 months ago
Anonymous
This. I’m
Nobody who bought a Dreamcast would think about buying original games when piracy became common. Are you ignoring the fact that Sega literally sold 10 million units of hardware, pretty much every single one at a loss and the majority of people who were pirating or going to pirate games also had a solid library and were waiting for future releases? The only reason why we now won't know whether that gamble of having a solid user base while taking a loss would have paid off is because of piracy. Sega/Publishers can not release games nor support a system that will just see them losing money. It's that simple.
[...]
That's what people call "cutting your losses". The Dreamcast was dead as soon as the MIL-CD exploit was found, Sega just wanted to minimize the damage before jumping ship to Xbox/Gamecube/PS2
and when I bought that $50 Dreamcast in 2001, it had already been discontinued months prior. Thinking Sega pulled out of the console market mainly due to Dreamcast piracy is beyond stupid.
6 months ago
Anonymous
Oops. I’m
I’m not saying it didn’t exist in the U.S. around 2000/01, I’m just saying it wasn’t a direct cause of the Dreamcast’s ultimate failure. Me personally, I bought a Dreamcast for $50 in late 2001 when Target was clearing out their inventory. Games were offered at a steep discount so there was no need to pirate.
6 months ago
Anonymous
It's really not stupid at all. Piracy came very soon and very easily on the dreamcast, unlike other consoles that had to wait years for a decent solution. Sega would have been able to foresee future losses due to piracy.
I think abandoning the dreamcast was one of the dumbest decisions they ever made.
6 months ago
Anonymous
How old were you when the Dreamcast launched in North America?
Ideally Sega would've to make a new console in late 2002 or 2003 had the dreamcast/saturn been more successful, if they even had enough money to create a console that could actually compete that is.
The best version of SA1 is Dreamcast version (US 1.005, animated title screen) or SADX with SADX Mod Installer.
>Dreamcast
Sonic Adventure original GDI (US 1.005, animated title screen)
https://cdromance.com/dc-iso/sonic-adventure-usa/
Sonic Adventure DC-HD first release (60 FPS, widescreen, skippable cutscenes, restored objects etc.)
https://dcmods.unreliable.network/index.php/2021/08/27/sonic-adventure-dc-hd-first-release/
>Windows (Windows 7 or later)
Sonic Adventure DX PC, 2004 version
https://archive.org/details/SonicAdventureDXPC
Sonic Adventure Mod Manager
https://github.com/X-Hax/SA-Mod-Manager/releases
>List of available Sonic Adventure (+DX) builds. SA1 can barely manage 30 fps on Dreamcast and had performance issues thanks to it using its own lighting engine, which is probably a huge factor into why SA2 runs at 60.
https://dcmods.unreliable.network/index.php/2021/09/03/list-of-available-sonic-adventure-builds/
>This blog examines the differences between Dreamcast, Gamecube and PC versions of Sonic Adventure/Sonic Adventure DX, focusing on changes in the Gamecube and PC ports that can be considered downgrades from the original Dreamcast version.
https://dreamcastify.unreliable.network/index.php/category/level-specific-downgrades/
The best version of SA2 is Dreamcast version or Steam version (along with the Battle DLC which is sold separately for some reason) with SA2 Render Fix mod
>Dreamcast
https://cdromance.com/dc-iso/sonic-adventure-2-usa/ >SA2 PC mods
https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/Sonic_Adventure_2#Featured_mods >SA2 Render Fix mod
https://github.com/shaddatic/sa2b-render-fix/releases >Sonic Adventure 2 Comparison: 700+ Changes from Dreamcast to Gamecube (20th Anniversary special)
Slightly, it was the only console that I downloaded/installed games to before the year 2000.
Most definitely, Sega always was in general. It’s just that they dumped R&D money into a bunch of dumb shit that didn’t quite pan out.
LOL, I doubt the Sega Channel was the cause of their undoing. That's one of the cool things Sega actually pulled off.
Yeah, my bad on that post. I meant Sega Channel as an example of them being way ahead of the curve on some things. I still don’t fully understand how it worked.
Data through the cable line, and a cart that could keep the game memory stored while power was on. Pretty ingenious for the time though. Cable modems were definitley not a thing in my area when Sega channel was rocking.
Wasn't the cart supposed to have a battery backup, but all the US Sega Channel carts were either sold with dead batteries, or didn't have them installed due to fears of piracy (or something)?
Atari did it almost a decade earlier.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/GameLine
If only Atari had ever been competent.
Sega was ever competent?
Briefly during the genesis days
their consoles made actual advancements in hardware every generation and actually had games, so yes.
Yeah, every single one of Sega's consoles that aren't the Genesis lost literally just because Sony and Nintendo used evil underhanded tricks. The Saturn had both better hardware and software than the PS1 but Sony used evil black magic to brainwash the entire world population and force them to buy a product that's vastly inferior in everyway
>saturn sold bad therefore its as bad as the rotting writhing nuclear waste that atari pumped out in the 80s and 90s
How?
>came out 1999, a year before PS2
>literally only one stick on the main controller, years after the DualShock
The opposite of anything, which is why it died
It did Little Big Planet's sharing your levels thing before it was cool.
Yep. Sony didn’t even have online functionality ready for the PS2 until 2001 in Japan and 2002 in North America.
...which is why it's such a good console.
SegaNet on Dreamcast was honestly better than Sony’s somewhat shoddy PS2 online service imo. That’s never been Sony’s strength.
It launched in fall of 1998 in Japan, a full year before the North American launch. That’s why the 9/9/99 day one game lineup was so good.
Damn, so one year and four months before the PS2
I think you need to check that math, anon.
>Dreamcast
>JP: November 27, 1998
>PS2
>JP: 4 March 2000
Dreamcast was outdated when it came out with an inacceptable controller and the PS2 ran circles around it a year later
>inacceptable
ESL detected.
Graphically, the Dreamcast couldn’t have kept up with the main three sixth gen consoles, I agree. However it still had some very ahead-of-its-time features like online play and a web browser. Only the Xbox had online connectivity straight out of the box, and XBL didn’t even launch until 2002.
>However it still had some very ahead-of-its-time features like online play and a web browser.
Maybe you should have specified something so niche and pointless to most people in the OP. Hardware was what you could expect in 1998 and the controller is a joke years after the DualShock or even the N64's C buttons
Circus console that flopped for a reason
>online play
>niche and pointless
Mmhmm.
If I sell you a car with the ability to autopilot perfectly if you have the second generation iBrain chip, would you buy it? It's pretty damn ahead of its time, innit?
You’re clearly too young to have experienced it, but Dreamcast online worked quite well. I have fond memories of the DC Quake III port.
Iirc i got 250ping on my old 56k modem which wasn't perfect but still playable.
You really think going online on the Dreamcast is like riding in a car with no driver? Why?
Probably born in the 90s. He thinks no one was playing consoles online before 2007.
I was born in the 90's and I don't think that. Why would he?
Because he’s a moron, presumably.
So the 90's thing was completely irrelevant? K got it.
It’s relevant because he clearly doesn’t have firsthand experience with playing the Dreamcast online back in 2000. You seem to have done your research at least.
i used the dreamcast browser back in 99 and that shit was fricking garbage
Compared to PC browsers, sure. But it worked well enough for a console in 1999. My main point is SegaNet online play performed overall quite well via the 56k modem.
yeah it was awful
i remember pages being broken and it being very slow
i dont remember shit else the online had or i didnt use it, i never got PSO
I think i remember i got some sonic adventure christmas tree downloadable or some shit when it was near the 24th of december, think i had to go online for that
You missed out on some fun online games actually. My family didn’t have a capable gaming PC in 1999, so Dreamcast was how I played Unreal Tournament and Quake III.
yeah see, i had unreal 99 and q3 on pc with my voodoo2 and PII, i remember seeing ut99 for sale at best buy but the idea of playing that on a controller seemed awful
I actually owned this back in the day.
that definitely would have made it a better experience
Wish I still had it. I was a dumbass and traded in all my Dreamcast stuff toward an Xbox in 2002.
hah, i know that feeling, mine was necessity thoguh, didnt have a good home, i pawned all my dreamcast shit and went into the military'
i have a dc now and just burn discs but i never really feel like playing it anymore, i tried to play beserk and sonic adventure again like 2 years ago and i just couldnt do it, both were worse than i remembered
>but the idea of playing that on a controller seemed awful
It was a lot of fun.
It was, but the great thing was it was fully compatible with the Dreamcast keyboard/mouse.
You couldn't play quake arena 4 player split screen with keyboard and keyboard.
Never tried the splitscreen mode, but online was a lot of fun on the DC.
Quake Arena and Virtua Tennis were my go to party games.
The strafe buttons sucked for this. Ps2 got it right with the dual analog
Using face buttons to strange is no different than using keyboard.
and that would make sense had the second joystick been a trackball. Unfortunately the only one who ever tried that was Apple/Bandai Pippin years before (and they misplaced it to the middle, were said to have been of shit quality and ofcourse had no games other than Myst and Marathon because it was just a Macintosh on a television set)
And that is related to being born in the 90's how?
I doubt many kids born in the early to mid 90s were playing the Dreamcast online unless they had older siblings.
I was and so were the other kids my age who had Dreamcast's, all 2 of them.
>me and all the other 4 year olds had Dreamcasts
doubt.jpg
I wasn't 4 when the Dreamcast came out. I was 9.
Which online games did you try? I’m having a hard time believing that a kid back then wouldn’t have been delighted by the idea of using their console to play online with their friends.
>I’m having a hard time believing that a kid back then wouldn’t have been delighted by the idea of using their console to play online with their friends.
I was. Why do you think I wasn't?
Oh, okay then. I thought you were trying to shit on the ’cast.
Why did you think that?
The only thing I've said is that I was online with my Dreamcast in 1999 when I was 9.
Sounds pretty rad.
It was okay. My only online game was Chu Chu Rocket tho
nobody needed online multiplayer because we still knew our neighbours back then.
I didn't have any neighbours back then
>inacceptable controller
If you think that dual analog sticks were common place then you are wrong. If you play any game from the late 90s/early 2000s, you'll know that they did not utilize the second analog stick in the way that we use them today. The controller is perfectly serviceable for the time period.
Had maybe the dreamcast lasted longer than we might've gotten a controller with 2 analog sticks, but it didn't.
only one stick on the main controller, years after the DualShock
insane stupidity on sega's part
It is actually kind of weird to consider that console controller layouts weren’t truly standardized until Gen 7.
>Dualshock released in 1997
>Dreamcast released in 1998
>years after
???
This. Dual analog controls were far from the standard in 1998. Even throughout the sixth gen, not all PS2 games used the right stick in the same way.
>literally only one stick on the main controller, years after the DualShock
Sick of zoomers saying this. Doubt any of you guys have even held a dreamcast pad.
Boomer here. The Dreamcast pad is pretty bad, especially by Sega standards.
>Boomer here. The Dreamcast pad is pretty bad, especially by Sega standards.
I know it has its flaws but the amount of buttons and analog sticks were not one of them.
The analog stick is serviceable, but Sega really cheaped out by making it all plastic with no rubber coating of any kind.
>Sega really cheaped out by making it all plastic with no rubber coating of any kind.
I never had an issue with my finger slipping off the analog stick. Now the madcatz pad went overboard with rubber coating. Face buttons were unmashable without ripping the skin off your hand.
That button layout looks utterly miserable
It was doing online long before the Xbox and VMU long before the Switch.
What’s the VMU/Switch connection?
Maybe closer to Wii U's Gamepad, but you can take it anywhere and play minigames on it, like Chao Adventure
You mean like a Game Boy? Pretty sure Nintendo beat them to the punch there lol.
Doesn't connect to a controller though
True. I wish the Xbox had adopted a VMU style design instead of just regular memory cards that went into the controllers.
>Doesn't connect to a controller
Yes it does.
VMU is closer to
in terms of functionality
Ans the Wii U flopped like no other.
>Maybe closer to Wii U's Gamepad, but you can take it anywhere and play minigames on it
You can't take the Wii U anywhere.
DualShock was fricking gay and barely any PS1 games even supported it
Yeah I just know of ape escape and alien trilogy supporting it.
Even without it dreamcast was able to do multi stick shooter styles of game like bangai o, where you fly with the d-pad and shoot with face buttons.
Nah you're fkn gay. Ps1 and ps2 had the best controllers and you don't know sht
You are a moron.
I still remember going to Best Buy when it got released, they had some Football game on demo and I thought it was a real football game. I was like 16 or so at the time.
Seeing so many 3D games run in 60 fps was also really fricking cool.
The stage 1 beach area of Sonic Adventure is one of the best tech demos ever conceived.
Absolutely. Too bad the rest of the game didn't live up to it.
A game console being shipped pre-2000 with internet connectivity was ahead of its time. Not so sure if anything else was.
The Dreamcast was the first affordable mainstream console to bridge the gap between arcade tier 3D graphics and home systems. SoulCalibur was absolutely stunning.
The VGA display adapter was amazing (though also quite pricey). The first time a console had PC video output quality, and years before HDMI at that!
Nah, it was of its time
Many people hadn’t yet upgraded to 56k modems when the Dreamcast launched in the U.S.
So Sega is dumb and this is another thread where we point it out and laugh about them
I meant that people still had slower modems in their home computers. The Dreamcast’s 56k modem is an example of Sega being ahead of the curve.
Sounds like a you problem
Being right at the wrong time is the same as being wrong.
There's no such thing as "ahead of its time." There's only a bad product.
>Being right at the wrong time is the same as being wrong.
No it isn't. If you're wrong, you were never right.
The Dreamcast was a great product. Piracy didn’t kill it, nor did the upcoming PS2. Sega’s beleaguered financial situation in the console market and the declining North American arcade market were the primary factors behind the Dreamcast’s early demise.
>Sega’s beleaguered financial situation
It was this mostly. Sega had no money left. They blew their reserves all on the 32x and Sega Saturn. The Saturn was a massive worldwide flop. It only did moderately well in Japan. But Sega spent way too much money. Doing only well in Japan was not even close to good enough. Sega took out risky loans to fund the Sega Dreamcast.
Damn, someone travel back in time to Ancient Greece and tell Anaximander of Miletus that he was wrong about evolution.
No.
The Dreamcast was sidereal to its time. It was the path not taken.
And it's a damn shame it wasn't taken. I vastly prefer better antialiasing and higher frame rates compared to other 6th gen consoles at the cost of lower poly counts on Dreamcast.
PS2 is debatable, but the GameCube and Xbox both had at least equally sharp looking textures and AA as the Dreamcast.
And yes, you can bring up VGA, but the vast majority of Dreamcast owners back then were using basic composite.
>PS2 is debatable,
PS2 didn't have AA. There's nothing to debate.
>GameCube
Gamecube has an optional AA, but 99% of games didn't use it because the Gamecube took a big hit in performance with it turned on. Most Developers decided to rely on a deflicker filter to hide the aliasing, and CRTs to blur out aliasing too.
>Xbox both had at least equally sharp looking textures and AA as the Dreamcast.
Xbox had optional AA but again, most devs opted to not have it turned on because the hardware took a big performance hit. They relied on SDTVs to hide the aliasing.
Dreamcast can't put as many textures on screen like the other consoles. However it was pretty much the only system that focused on having GPU hardware that could do AA and have extra sharp textures without a big hit to performance. Gotta give credit where credit is due.
>higher frame rates
This isn't the fault of the other consoles, though. That's just devs optimizing for a different set of priorities.
We're discussing a hypothetical timeline where other manufacturers and developers decided to copy Dreamcast's approach. Obviously the priorities would change in that case.
>We're discussing a hypothetical timeline where other manufacturers and developers decided to copy Dreamcast's approach. Obviously the priorities would change in that case.
If manufacturers copied Dreamcast's approach, then they would sacrifice amount of textures for better Anti-Aliasing.
It doesn't matter what hypothetical timeline you come up with since late 90s/early 2000s technology limited what you could do.
You could either get sharper and crisper textures on screen like Dreamcast.
Or you could have a lot of textures and many things happening on screen. But at the cost of having jagged lines and flickering everywhere.
Sacrificing the amount of textures naturally lends itself to smaller, more linear level design, which also makes optimizing a game to run at a higher frame rate easier.
>library of mostly arcade ports
No, it was behind the times.
Normally I have contentions with phrases like this but shit
It was the first console that gen to launch with the internet shit ready to go
had a browser in the box
big leap in 3D graphics
while it didn't last it was definitely ahead of its time, high res 60fps high fidelity 3D in an era where 20fps was considered smooth. it's a console genuinely deserving of the phrase ahead of its time.
No.
others consoles have yet to catch up
had to cream fast cause i owned a dreamcast
I never owned a DC but I stayed at my cousin's place a lot and he had one. The thing that was most surprising to me was how bad the online functionality was compared to my home PC playing Diablo. It seemed to crap out all the time and have these really inexplicable latency spikes.
Was that normal or did my cousin just have a shitty dreamcast modem?
Dial-up modem speeds could be pretty unpredictable depending on where you lived. Just like today, rural areas were slower.
6th generation console with 5th generation design sensibilities due to being forced to launch in 1998.
>Single analog stick because N64/Saturn used a single analog stick and the Dual Shock was brand new
>No integrated rumble pack because rumble was still new
>GD-ROM instead of DVD because DVD drives were prohibitively expensive in 1998
>Online service based around 56k dial-up because DSL wasn't mainstream yet
>Tiny 128kb memory cards because flash was expensive
In some ways it was forward thinking, but in other ways it just seemed premature. Would have been a futuristic beast if it had somehow launched in 1996, but the console seemed half-baked compared to the PS2 in 2000.
>6th generation console with 5th generation design sensibilities due to being forced to launch in 1998.
I always see it as a 5th gen console. The fact that it launched the same year as Tony Hawk should count for something
I remember when i saw a DVD player for the first time in 98, and it had Godzilla 98 in it, but i dont remenber the price.
In some ways. But if it had DVD support, it might have succeeded.
Are there even ay dreamcast games left that did't get upgraded ports on another system somewhere down the track?
>upgraded
lol
>muh textures
Sonic Adventure autists can shoo
>textures
no anon, lighting issues and bugs not present in the original games
Ports always have issues within the same generation
It's not a perfect port but it's not shit either and personally I'll take sonic at 60fps over 30 any day
You can increase the framerate on the DC version through emulation
>portgay
You are a subhuman
If SEGA cut their name in half and double it it would be called SEES
This is funny to me because sega means blind woman in my language
What language?
Portuguese, sega with a c at the start means blind woman.
>Was the Dreamcast ahead of its time?
In many ways yes. Online play in 1998, and VMU memory cards with a screen that let you do exclusive things on your controller. For example, in football games you could choose plays on your controller so your opponent couldn't see. And really great graphics at an affordable price.
Sega created a really great economical system. It had solid hardware with an easy to understand design, it was much easier to develop games for, and Sega provided great support to developers. They learned all the lessons of the failures of the Sega Saturn.
It's just so bad that Sega was in a terrible financial situation. The Sega Saturn's huge failure really hurt the company badly. If the Sega Saturn had done a little better, then Sega would have had more money for Dreamcast.
lol, I love this copium
Yeah. Sega never made a good game let alone a console that could compete with Nintendo.
They made plenty of games for genesis. Dreamcast just needs a different controller (they make a different one for that reason) and more games
>Online play in 1998, and VMU memory cards with a screen that let you do exclusive things on your controller
The former negates the latter. There's no point when each player has their own TV. That's why it didn't catch on.
>There's no point
There will always be a way to utilise a vmu be it clearing screen clutter or making warning sounds. I will never understand the hate for VMUs when you don't see that with any other add ons like Rumble packs which you could easily make the exact same stupid arguments.
Imagine in Diablo 2 walking over an item pickup the name of the item pops up on your phone, taking your eyes off the game. Fricking insanity. Terrible idea.
Warning sounds, your TV has two speakers.
And for the record, I hate vibration as well. I turn it off everywhere.
>I hate vibration as well. I turn it off everywhere.
Rumble packs add to gameplay. Its pointless talking to you.
The DS successfully pulled off having gameplay on one screen while having your map/inventory on another. IIRC, the Wii U version of Breath of the Wild was originally supposed to have this feature, which actually would’ve been very useful.
It was shit then, and it is shit now, like all sega consoles after the genesis
Kinda agree with this other than a few racing games for it. That taxi games was fun but even that had a weird turbo boost feature that was awkward. Need to see if it's more fun on another console maybe
No, it was chronically behind the times
>No DVD player
This fricked it up, many people, including me, got their first DVD player with their PS2 or XBOX. Prices for DVD players were over 200$ at the time, getting a DVD player with your console was a big draw
>Arcade ports galore
They really thought 1:1 ports of arcade games were the future of gaming, while most developers were leaning into immersive environments
>This fricked it up, many people, including me, got their first DVD player with their PS2 or XBOX.
Not really. Gamecube didn't play DVDs. Xbox didn't either unless you bought the accessory remote.
>Prices for DVD players were over 200$ at the time, getting a DVD player with your console was a big draw
Sony lost billions putting the DVD player into the PS2. Each condole sold was a huge loss.
>Not really. Gamecube didn't play DVDs. Xbox didn't either unless you bought the accessory remote.
No, it's correct, for a lot of people a PS2 was the first thing they could watch DVDs on. It was a triple whammy, it could play DVDs, PS1 games, and PS2 games too.
Xbox came out like three years later and I haven't seen a single one of them that wasn't modded (usually with Evolution X) and could play back DVDs but also DivX/XVID movies, mp3s, and so on.
Gamecube sold like shit.
>Sony lost billions putting the DVD player into the PS2. Each condole sold was a huge loss.
Nah, Sony has been making money on the Playstation throughout all of its life, expect for 1994 and 2006-7 (the PS3 was a VERY big frickup).
Xbox came out one year later
>No, it's correct, for a lot of people a PS2 was the first thing they could watch DVDs on.
Learn to read what I said.
>Nah, Sony has been making money on the Playstation throughout all of its life
Sony doesn't make money from console sales. All Playstation sell for a loss. They make money from software and game sales.
Gamecube looked fine other than the controller. Would get a different one for that too. Probably still not bad as the DC controller
>leaning into immersive environments
And now modern gaming is a complete joke.
Using the VMU to reload in re2 was pretty cool. Also had Sword of the Berserk, jank but more guts than the psx ever had
In some ways. Something like the PSP was more obviously forward-thinking than the Dreamcast, though. The "ahead of its time" narrative is best understood as undergirding the tragic failure story. There's truth in it, but it depends on what you're prioritizing.
>Something like the PSP was more obviously forward-thinking than the Dreamcast
In what ways?
The PSP was of its time, but the original model Vita with the OLED screen was unbelievably ahead of its time. Like by a decade.
I don’t think so
I’m pretty sure phones were using AMOLED at the same time
Which phones? Actual OLED screens definitely didn’t become the standard until much later.
AMOLED was what some phones went with around the vitas release
Samsung and Motorola most notably I think
However they have similar problems that the vita had with the Mura effect
Okay, that makes sense. I’d still argue that the OLED Vita was way ahead of its time as a handheld gaming system though. The AMOLED screen smartphones you’re talking about must have been considerably more expensive.
What the frick does oled even matter when it was a complete flop? Vita was complete trash compared to any gameboy.
The Vita hardware is excellent. Sony just didn’t support it with quality software.
>The Vita hardware is excellent
You could say the exact same for gamegear and lynx.
Yes, but the Vita has both great tech and solid battery life. Early 90s AA batteries just couldn’t cut it.
>Vita was complete trash compared to any gameboy.
Name a gameboy that loses to vita. I owned a vita and had two games. Resistance and some jap import ragnarok. I'd have bought better games had they existed.
How did you own a Vita and not at least get Persona 4 Golden or Soul Sacrifice? People like you are so bizarre.
I don't know what those games are but they sound like a lot of cut scenes. 15-20 mins of cut scenes before I could even move in its tutorial type games.
So you owned a Vita and it never once occurred to you to simply Google "Best Vita games"? Are you stupid?
>Google search best PlayStation games
>it's all movie shit and jrpg's
Great advice.
I specifically said Vita, not PlayStation, didn’t I? So I ask again: Are you stupid?
I feel I could own the entire vita library and still never play a good game.
>Absolute junk
Exactly why I don't listen to best ps vita games of all time by Anita Sarkeesian. You can tell half of online reviews know nothing about what they are reviewing. Often they don't even play the game.
That's exactly what Persona is like. And when you finally get to the game, it's barebones and doesn't last long. Absolute junk
The Persona games are quite long so that part isn’t true. But yeah, it’s definitely not for everyone.
What I mean is, the dungeon crawler segments are quite basic and clipped. The game itself is long, but there are frequent and drawn out interruptions for the story to progress. Anon there definitely wouldn't like it.
That’s true, but this
is still one of the dumbest posts I’ve seen in a while. Who the frick buys a Vita and then chooses Resistance as their first game for it lol
>Who the frick buys a Vita and then chooses Resistance as their first game for it lol
Online reviews gave it 10/10.
No they didn’t. You’re dumb, bro.
What would you know about good games. You recommended persona lol
No saving face now. You chose terribly so this one is on you.
>You chose terribly
I know Vita was a really bad purchase.
Now the truth comes out. You’re moronic.
Dreamcast, Vita, and Wii U, all three publishers had their own version of whatever this is called. lol
very cool gadgets and gizmos, that felt ahead of the curve, but held back in damnable ways.
Sony shot themselves in the foot big time with the Vita. Lots of cool technology borrowed from their Xperia smartphones, but a weird weeb-heavy library plus those crazy expensive proprietary memory cards.
Yeah, but the main factor to its death was Mobile Gaming on smartphones.
The cards and lack of varied titles was Sony's absolute fault. I'll never forgive them for what they did to the Vita ffs
Aiming for a console experience with an eye on being a media hub (UMDs being an embarrassing failure notwithstanding). It wasn't novel in an absolute sense but even the aspect ratio made it clear what their ambitions were. The PSP came out before the video iPod. The PSP's browser was pretty decent for the time, even. The iPhone it was not, but you could do a lot worse in 2004-2005.
You people need to understand that DVD was coming no matter what. It didn't matter whether or not it was put in the PS2. We were all going to get DVD players within a few years eventually. It was pretty much standard in video electronics by 2003.
>online play
>internet browser
>you can download saves to your vmu
basic dreamcast features didn't become standard until ps3/360/wii era.
a dreamcast with dvd support would have be interesting and could have handled a lot of ps2/xbox/gc multiplats.
This is my favorite retro console, and I never even had one back in the day. GDEMU + Noctua fan is *chefs kiss*
>GDEMU
>DreamPSU
>VGA to HDMI adapter
>DreamPi
>Wingman SD
as soon as I replace the clock battery I'm all set
if the VM2 wasn't so atrociously priced that would deserve a spot on the list too, like god damn i wish it was like 2015 again where a VMU was 3 bucks. they store like 4 save games
I totally want the VMU2 but it's hard to justify when the wingman allows you to dump saves to the PC and I already have my original VMU
lightgun games are a b***h in the LCD era
>I totally want the VMU2
I don't get the point of this one
best port of Marvel vs Capcom 2 and Street Fighter 3
>and Street Fighter 3
Arcade players refused to play it due to it being a jank port.
I got Dreamcast the week it came out, was really hyped for it.
However as I was a lil kid (like 9 at the time) I got stuck on Sonic Adventure 1 quite early (shortly after the first Eggman fight as I couldnt figure out where to go next).
After that I pretty much only played Marvel vs Capcom 2 and Gundam Side Story 0079. The lack of games killed it for me but I never hated it.
Microsoft offered to buy Sega after they released Dreamcast. But Sega refused.
I often wonder how it would have turned out if Sega said yes.
We would’ve got Sega Phoenix.
Considering Microsoft's track record sega made the right call
The controller sucks and is awkward and uncomfortable
Cringe
At home, yes. In the arcade, no. Sega Model 3 is visibly more powerful than naomi. Especially in the texture memory department.
It will always hold a special place in my heart.
My friend found an import store in a mall the next county over and had them bring one in for him with a few games. I don’t even think he had his license yet, and he certainly didn’t have a credit card either. I don’t even know what he paid for it all said and done, but it must’ve been every penny he made at McDonald’s that year. When it finally came, around Christmas 98, we went over to our other friends house and stayed up all night playing virtua fighter and Godzilla. The graphics blew our minds, especially with the S-video on a brand new 36” Wega (which is why we chose that friends house). It certainly blew away the N64 in that respect. I personally loved the controller, particularly shining on Soulcalibur.
being ahead of your time is as much a criticism as it is a compliment so yeah the dreamcast was ahead of its time
i like the dreamcast but i cant really find much to play on it at all to be honest.
It literally has no games. Gamecube and especially N64 have much richer libraries.
Absolutely, and anybody who argues otherwise is a dumb zoomer, period. Sega way back in 1998 (though one could argue even earlier), saw the writing on the wall, knew that online gaming, especifically shooters, were going to be the next thing and they made a console prepared for just that, having dedicated online games, DLC, mouse and keyboard support, etc. The Dreamcast just wasn’t a DVD player, plain and simple. It even took MS 2 consoles to fulfill what Sega already had down pat, Sony didn’t even catch on properly until the next decade. I suppose the focus on the “arcade at home” was a bit outdaded, but then again, I don’t think anybody imagined arcades crashing the way they did in the 00’s.
The Dreamcast was like the 3do. It was ahead of its time, but releasing a console then was fricking stupid and was obviously going to fail when the next gen came.
Dreamcast WAS next gen. It was the first 128 Bit console of that era.
Just like the 3do
It didn't even have 32 megabytes of RAM, let alone the 4 gigabytes address space of 32 bit, let alone the 16 exabytes address space of 64 bit, let alone the 18446744073709551615 exabytes address space of 128 bit. 128 bit, more like 128 units sold.
>first 128 Bit console of that era
what
While at the time when the Dreamcast released I still rather and preferred the Saturn, even so far as foregoing SFA3 and was rewarded with a Saturn release. In the end, it was the right time for the Dreamcast because otherwise the technology would not be enough for the kinds of games released on PS2/Xbox/GC. Aside from its lack of popularity, there's very little I would change about the Dreamcast as it is still perfect the way it was in its time. A top 10 non-portable/non-variant/non-PC gaming console for me.
>otherwise the technology would not be enough for the kinds of games released on PS2/Xbox/GC.
Well, the Dreamcast technology wasn’t enough for those kinds of games. It was quickly outclassed once the 'main' sixth gen consoles were out.
In certain ways, yes. But the controller and the library was rather behind the times. Even the things on the console that weren't arcade ports mostly reeked of arcade sensibilites. What actual good games are their on the console that aren't fighting games, STG's, racing games, puzzle games? Where are the platformers or action-adventure games, first or third-person shooters that will come to typify the mid-2000's? What is there, like, Shenmue, Rayman, and Jet Set Radio? I love the Dreamcast, because I love the arcade sensibilities with which most of these games were designed, but Sega was way behind the times in terms of game design. Their way wasn't really the future, and it wasn't until they were forced to develop for Sony or Microsoft that they started making games that fit with the Zeitgeist of the era, like Gunvalkyrie or Yakuza. Whatever you might think about the shift in quality, gamer tastes were changing.
All correct. I’d like to once again openly mock that one anon that keeps claiming the Dreamcast would’ve been easily capable of a GTA3 port in Dreamcast threads. You’re moronic.
GTA3 was originally being worked on the dreamcast. Literally nothing about the game looks impossible for the dreamcast, all the GTA games graphically look like shit even for PS2 standards (see something like true crime or that tony montana game for actual good open world graphics).
GTA3 on Dreamcast never made it past the proof of concept prototype phase before going to PS2. You’re moronic and I’m mocking you.
what about OoT on dreamcast?
Easily possible, as opposed to GTA3, which would’ve been downgraded in every way.
OK So why didn't you make it happen?
Okay, it’s going to be way easier than porting GTA3 to the Dreamcast. You’re an idiot if you believe otherwise.
I highly doubt it. You can't port OoT.
Why? The Dreamcast is way more powerful than the N64. On the other hand, it’s less power than the PS2 and therefore a port of GTA3 would be a huge downgrade.
less powerful than the PS2*
They'd have to nerf the amount of npcs on screen, add loading times during some parts of the map and cut some of the music, but graphicwise it would've been mostly the same.
They'd also have to nerf the vehicle physics (cpu too slow) and reduce the size and complexity of the map (not enough ram).
a version of gta iii which is running on the dreamcast would hardly resemble the real thing.
>They'd also have to nerf the vehicle physics (cpu too slow)
Is it?
Yes, anon, it is. The Dreamcast doesn’t run on magic, it was more or less a NAOMI chipset in a small console form factor. Shenmue II was one of the best looking games on the system and it had a ton of slowdown in larger, crowded areas.
Do you have any proof of GTA3 actually running on the Dreamcast? Any screenshots or interviews where devs are saying the game runs properly? Or is this just "It WOULD run bro"?
Nope because there is none. There’s some nebulous prototype that Rockstar made using the Dreamcast hardware that’s never seen the light of day and that’s it. The actual game was always developed as a PS2 exclusive.
Giving it less buttons than the Saturn was backwards thinking.
The Dreamcast was the perfect "gamer's" console. It focused on the games and how the games could take advantage of the exansion slot. PS2's selling point was a DVD. I suppose GameCube was also a "gamer's" console as all you could do with it was play games, but Sega had a stronger brand for appealing to arcade game fans.
>I suppose GameCube was also a "gamer's" console as all you could do with it was play games
Gamecube was the "affordable party console" that you played with many friends. It was cheaper than other consoles, relatively smaller, and had 4 controller ports.
Xbox was the Halo, FPS shooter, and first online multi-player console.
PS2 was just DVD and the strong Sony brand.
>expansion slot
?
I assume he means the VMU.
What the frick are you asking for then Black person. It's the swan song of the arcade era, it had online connectivity, was a step behind other sixth gen systems but came out 3 years earlier and for a life span of like two and a half years it has one of the most unbelievably stacked game libraries out there, ports excluded. Seriously, what kind of concrete criticism do you have for the system besides >muh no games, which is 100% a problem of you just having shit taste.
I think you're just too used to arguing online man. I'm not really criticizing anything at all. You act like I'm submitting a formal thing here. Chill out bro. I just wish Sega consoles had more games for me to play. I think you're making really weird and wild assumptions as to what kind of games I like. We probably share a lot of favorite games and would be friends in any other thread.
So you have no criticism for the Dreamcast? Cool, shut the frick up. Also, no, you have shit taste.
Its literally my favorite console
So your favorite console is "honestly boring" and you enjoy it for what games exactly, considering you ran out of games that interest you? I mean, half of what makes the Dreamcast the best console were the 2K sports games and arcade perfect ports, if you don't like those and you weren't interested in the online capabilities of the console or the "western shovelware" then the only thing you're really left with is Sonic and 5th gen ports. So are you the type of gay who played Crazy Taxi and Jet Grind Radio once and now decided the DC is his favorite console or do you really want to falsegay into oblivion?
Think about what you're even arguing at this point because I don't know either.
We're not arguing, I just want to know how much more shit can come out of you mouth.
Can you just stop being mean to me man. I like the Dreamcast. Isn't that enough?
Not if you spout baseless shit and then act like the victim after falsegayging, no. Nobody who liked or calls the dreamcast their favorite console would say it was "boring". So I'm more than fine with being mean to liars.
Why would I possibly lie about this? If you can recommend me games I'm all for it.
Why would I need to recommend you games for your favorite console?
I struggle to find games to play on it.
>Vsrecommendedlist
Have fun
What hell it must be to find games for other consoles when you're struggling to find ones for your favorite.
lol who the frick played 2k sports? when i get those in a bundle i just toss them. are you like some old normie or something?
Don’t be that moron, anon. 2K sports was an excellent franchise and it’s a true shame that Sega’s sports division lost to EA. They were legitimately good games even if they weren’t for you, just like I hate the anime shit you like.
>hurr dont like sports games? must be a weeb
nope
sports games are fricking boring. youd like jrpgs if you liked to 'play' sports games.
Refer back to
and replace anime with whatever it is you like. Sega’s sports titles for Dreamcast were objectively great across the board.
>shitting on crazy taxi and jet grind
>only likes sport games
are you sure you like the dreamcast as much as you think?
huh?
I don’t think that anon was shitting on JSR or Crazy Taxi. I’m just saying you shouldn’t rag on sports games just because you’re not into them. Sega’s sports titles have always been held in high regard.
im not ragging on sports games though but he shat on good dreamcast games to make his point so im just not clear on what hes saying
Maybe learn to read before embarrassing yourself
I'm not shitting on those games, you should maybe read carefully before replying (I'm shitting on you btw). I've only played one 2K game since I'm a Europoor and grew up with Fifa and PES on PS, I just know they were quite well received in Muttland and were a big selling point for the DC.
>muh no games
Dreamcast had no games. I don't like Sonic, Phantasy Star, Shenmue, fighters, racers, jrpg's or arcade games so what was I suppose to play?
Nice try but you couldn't pretend to be me in time.
Where do you connect the broadband adapter?
Eh… Calling an adapter making use of an "expansion slot" is a bit of a stretch, no?
the dreamcast comes with an RJ-11 port by default.
How is it a gamers console? its honestly boring. I dont play fighting games and I dont care about sports games. That basically cuts off most of segas library on both the genesis and the dreamcast. It doesnt help that most of the library is actual literal non-weaboo biased western shovelware because they couldnt court any desirable companies to their machines.
The rare exceptions on the Dreamcast(and genesis) are well known and what everyone talks about. Or they cope and pretend Im only talking about JRPGs(im not) or that a very clear and shameless copy of a SNES game is somehow superior to the original.
And I say this as a dreamcast fan. I feel like I ran out of games to play really fast.
Nobody gives a shit about what you play Black person. The Dreamcast is the only console that had perfect one to one arcade conversions when there still great arcade games coming out, if you don't get the appeal of that you're one hell of a fricking moron. If you want JRPG trash and movie games, then why even bother with a console which is clearly not for you.
>And I say this as a dreamcast fan. I feel like I ran out of games to play really fast.
Least obvious falsegay I have ever seen.
I dont think you read any bit of my post because nowhere did I shit on arcade games and nowhere did I ask for more JRPGs
Yes and no.
>first system to do 3D graphics right, 480i 60fps clear textures no fog in the distance
>internet
>the memory card thing was cool
But not really…
>controller is so bad and lacking function of the N64 one
>everyone was just going to wait until the much more powerful Ps2 and GameCube
>and GameCube
Way to expose yourself.
Dreamcast gta3 had a running alpha. You should shut up now.
>Dreamcast gta3 had a running alpha
No it didn’t.
>dreamcast alone is over $150 now
>gdemu is over $200
>dreampsu another $100
this is why the dreamcast failed
Does anyone know the deal with this? Did they really have some major manufacturing blunder? I know I remember hearing that "NEC made a fairly negligent mistake."
For online play, yes (though I guess that makes the XBand or even the NetLink fricking Galileo by comparison).
Does the web browser on this thing still work at all?
Last time I tried it, there used to be some websites actually dedicated to bring browsable on the DreamBrowser or whatever that disc was called. I used to frequent onlineconsoles.com and I remember that being one of the browsable websites.
It does but how well it works for websites depends on the website.
You could probably browse Ganker and maybe post if you had a pass to get around the captcha.
Yes, it was.
Honestly, the Dreamcast only failed because it was a Sega console. The Sega name was trash at that point whereas Sony's was golden, especially in the US. If they had sold to Microsoft and used the Microsoft name, the Microsoft Dreamcast would have dominated the market.
The Dreamcast failed because Sega ran out of money. I mean literally ran out of money. They declared bankruptcy.
The Dreamcsst was a solid design that was on track to sell 20 to 30 million units if it had another 2 to 3 years.
But it died after 18 months and only selling 10 million Dreamcast.
Sega was broke. Sega didn't even really have enough money to make the Dreamcast. The failure of 32x and Saturn drained Sega of too much money. So they took out loans to make the Dreamcast.
>The Dreamcsst was a solid design that was on track to sell 20 to 30 million units if it had another 2 to 3 years
In a vacuum? Maybe. But once the PS2 came out it was over for Sega
Dreamcast could've done 20 or even 30 Million. It had software and some decent momentum.
To put the Dreamcast in context it sold ≈10 million systems in 1.5 years. The Wii U sold ≈10 million in 3 years. At the 1.5 year mark the Wii U had sold like 5 million units.
It's pretty frickin safe to say the Dreamcast could've easily made it to 20 million if it had a normal lifespan. Particularly considering how at the time the Dreamcast had the best launch of any system up until that point in North America. The Wii U was basically a dead from the start and still managed to double its unit sales over another year and a half.
The problem is it’s difficult to imagine what software Sega would’ve put out for the Dreamcast in say 2002 or 2003. The aging NAOMI arcade board was being phased out in favor of more advanced hardware.
The Dreamcast's sales was front-loaded, and tapered off big time when the PS2 was released. Pile on the Gamecube and Xbox, I think cracking 15 millions would have been a minor miracle.
This. Similar to the Nintendo with the N64, Sega would’ve been heavily reliant on North America for the bulk of console sales.
>In a vacuum? Maybe. But once the PS2 came out it was over for Sega
Uh no. Of course the PS2 was going to be a mega big hit. But Many families and kids owned multiple systems. Dreamcast would probably hit 20 or 30 million in sales if it had a full 4 to 5 years on the market with a continuous release of new games. Not PS2 levels of sales. But a solid base of fans.
Dreamcast simply came too late for Sega because the company was doing very bad financially before Dreamcast was even released.
Just look at Headhunter or Omikron the Nomad Soul on Dreamcast. Open world games. Upgrade the graphics slightly, and that's what GTA3 would look like. Dreamcast GTA3 would probably have lower draw distance than PS2, and fewer NPCs but it can be done.
>(not enough ram)
Dreamcast has more VRAM than PS2.
>The problem is it’s difficult to imagine what software Sega would’ve put out for the Dreamcast in say 2002 or 2003. The aging NAOMI arcade board was being phased out in favor of more advanced hardware.
Just look at all Naomi and Atomiswave games ever released. Now imagine them also on Dreamcast. Then add sequels to them.
Also Imagine all current games made on Dreamcast and add sequels to them. So Power Stone 3, Sonic Adventure 3, Soul Calibur 2, etc. Also leave room for multi-platform releases too.
That would be the Dreamcast library.
>Just look at Headhunter or Omikron the Nomad Soul on Dreamcast. Open world games. Upgrade the graphics slightly, and that's what GTA3 would look like. Dreamcast GTA3 would probably have lower draw distance than PS2, and fewer NPCs but it can be done.
Therein lies the rub. What incentive would third party devs have to support the Dreamcast when they would have to put in extra work to get sixth gen multiplats running on it? Look at how badly third party support for the GameCube dropped off after the first couple of years.
This is a stupid fricking point to make when the dreamcast stopped being made. you can't run numbers against eachother like this
Well yeah, obviously we’re talking about a hypothetical scenario where Sega had attempted to continue support for it. I think best case scenario they could have sold it at $50 to $75 and marketed it as a budget friendly alternative to the big three sixth gen systems.
Possibly I think the lowest Sega would go would be $99, or match whatever the lowest price of the Gamecube was selling at. Sega would still want to make a small profit on it.
They look at the install base of consoles sold to determine it.
Sure, but you’d still run into the situation where Dreamcast would get the worst version of any multiplat.
Didn't it get one of the better versions of Rayman 2?
Yeah but Rayman 2 is more fifth gen than sixth. That’s the whole thing with the Dreamcast. It went from being the most powerful console on the market to being the weakest once all three sixth gen consoles were out in late 2001.
Okay. But it still had the best version of a multiplat.
Yes, anon, you’re right.
The best version would be Xbox or PC.
But people would just be happy to have any version released for whatever system they owned. That's how it usually goes.
>Dreamcast would get the worst version of any multiplat
>Almost all dreamcast multiplats are better than gc, ps2 and Xbox
I’m talking about actual sixth gen multiplats like Beyond Good & Evil or Prince of Persia for example. The Dreamcast versions would be a major downgrade compared to the other systems.
>The Dreamcast versions would be a major downgrade compared to the other systems.
I'm not so sure about that. Yu Suzuki stated PS2 wasn't even able to run Shenmue.
Citation needed.
Also, Shenmue was never even planned on their competitors console, the PS2. Xbox though...
>Xbox though...
Shenmue 2 looks better on dreamcast than Xbox too. The special effects Xbox added look worse.
That’s the not the same thing as a multiplatform game. Shenmue II was made for the Dreamcast and then later ported to Xbox. Again, I’m talking about multiplats that are released across the different consoles at the same time.
So it has to be ported to absolutely everything for it to count?
>Yu Suzuki is full of shit
If you can provide any other examples of him lying I will believe you.
Dreamcast ran more graphic intensive games than gta3. Doom 3 has been ported to dreamcast recently too.
>any other examples of him lying
The entire marketing campaign of Shenmue 3.
Oh you're one of those Shenmue 3 haters. I don't really care to hear the opinions of those who know nothing about the series in the first place.
There was a kick starter and eventually a Shenmue 3. Once again no lies just more hate from reddit zoomers who never played Shenmue before.
No lies bro, none at all.
>No lies bro, none at all.
Glad you admitted you were wrong.
I don't admit shit. Yu Suzuki lied, has always lied, and the PS2 can run Shenmue and more.
>and the PS2 can run Shenmue
>Only other console that got a Shenmue game was xbox
That doesn't really prove anything.
Lines up with what Yu claimed.
Because Microsoft paid for exclusivity. Yakuza looks better, and doesn't look like some morons turned on full bright unlike Shenmue.
>Microsoft paid for exclusivity.
Only in america
The Xbox port of Shenmue II got a European release as well.
mate, please think we live in a round world, USA is not the only place with vidya.
Yes, anon, I’m aware that Shenmue II was released in Europe on Dreamcast. Microsoft did pay for Xbox exclusivity for the port which is why this post
is incorrect.
>I’m aware
You compare yakuza with Shenmue. You're aware of nothing.
>which is why this post
Only in america (You) # is incorrect.
Dc Shenmue 2 was not released in America.
>Such as?
The image I posted.
Anon, Microsoft paid for exclusivity for Shenmue II on Xbox, meaning that it wasn’t also ported to the PS2 or GameCube. That has nothing to do with the original Dreamcast release coming out in Europe.
>meaning that it wasn’t also ported to the PS2
Ps2 couldn't run Shenmue.
Even if that’s true, that doesn’t change anything I said. Microsoft paid for Shenmue II to be an exclusive port for the Xbox. That deal had nothing to do with the game being released on the Dreamcast in Europe.
That said, it’s complete bullshit. Shenmue and Shenmue II often ran like shit on the Dreamcast hardware.
>ran like shit
>still looks better than Xbox version
So you claim.
Xbox doom 3 wasn't one dude working on it in his spare time.
You cannot deny almost every multiplat looks and usually runs better on dreamcast. The only wins you can get is with games released in 2005+ when dreamcast wasn't able to defend itself.
2002+
Why would you ever think the Dreamcast could handle GTA3 when the Shenmue can’t even run smoothly on its own native hardware?
the Shenmue games*. Shenmue’s city streets are almost all narrow corridors and there’s still a ton of frame rate drops.
nta but Shenmue had incredible detail, a lot more than GTA3 on PS2. Dreamcast could also do fast vehicles smoothly as clearly shown in Crazy Taxi. Dreamcast would likely just cut the detail of GTA3 even more and it would then start to fit on the gd-rom. You would make concessions and it would run, same as any other game on any other console that has lower performance than it.
Give any reason why GTA3 couldn't be made to run on dreamcast.
Crazy Taxi has small areas with lots of invisible walls. Nothing like GTA3’s large open world. Yeah Shenmue’s character models are detailed, but again the city environments are mostly narrow corridors with loading times between areas. Again, nothing like GTA3’s much more dynamic world. Nothing about either of those games is really comparable.
Blue shift is not only comparable it's more impressive than gta3 to be running on a dc.
Dc had been axed by then.
>so you claim
No, anon. Microsoft buying Shenmue II exclusivity isn’t a theory. It’s what they did.
>Dreamcast ran more graphic intensive games than gta3.
Such as? The Shenmue games have a ton of loading times and slowdown in the large NPC-crowded areas which are nowhere near as complex as anything in GTA3.
Multiplatform ≠ port. A port typically refers to a game that was originally released exclusively for one platform later being released on other systems. Multiplatform releases on the other hand are typically developed concurrently with each other and released at the same time, like the newest Assassin’s Creed or Call of Duty coming out for Windows/PS5/Xbox all at once.
The Dreamcast Doom 3 port looks about as primitive as you’d expect given the limitations of the hardware. It’s impressive that it exists as a fan-made thing, but it’s not like it stacks up against Doom 3 on Xbox graphically.
>Doom 3 has been ported to dreamcast recently too
Have you seen what it looks like lmao? If you think that looks anywhere near the Xbox port you're completely delusional. Yes, it runs, but it looks like complete ass with no lighting
At this point people like
are most likely just trolling. They can’t possibly believe it.
>I’m talking about multiplats that are released across the different consoles at the same time.
Seems arbitrarily specific. If it released on multiple platforms it's a multiplatform game. None of the other shit you mentioned matters even slightly.
The Xbox getting an exclusive port of Shenmue II is totally different than say SoulCalibur II which was developed for the PS2, GameCube and Xbox at the same time and released on all platforms on the same day. That’s what most people are referring to with the term multiplatform.
PS2 is able to run Yakuza. Yu Suzuki is full of shit, as he always was.
People also forget that Shenmue and Shenmue II didn’t exactly run silky smooth on the Dreamcast hardware. There was plenty of slowdown and long loading times.
PS2 is also able to run GTA:SA, a game where you can jump from a jet, and land in a street where there's pedestrians and AI traffic with cars you can steal. People who think the DC could do that are delusional
>inb4 Headhunter
Headhunter is a cool game, but yeah it’s mainly a third person action game and plays nothing like the sixth gen era GTAs.
>Sure, but you’d still run into the situation where Dreamcast would get the worst version of any multiplat.
Lmao
See
Now show me a 2001 multiplat
It’s a bit dishonest to refer to Quake III as a multiplat release. It was ported to Dreamcast first in 2000 with the PS2 version coming in early 2001, so they weren’t released day and date with each other.
dumb nocoder
I think in this scenario Sony would’ve still easily dominated in Japan and Europe, but maybe not as much in North American. The PlayStation brand was just way too strong at that point to have real competition.
But could the dreamcast handle simpsons hit and run?
It would be a severely gimped port for sure. Just like the GameCube’s mini discs quickly became a hindrance for third party multiplat developers, but worse.
>Dreamcast was ahead of its time
Nah, if it was ahead of its time it would've sucked harder like the PS3, 360, Xbone, PS4, PS5 and SeX. The Dreamcast was just too good for this world.
I'll never understand the people who waste all day arguing about the technical specs of the Dreamcast and muh console wars shit while literally ignoring all the unique innovative soulful games it birthed in its short time that are the reason it has a place in history and peoples' hearts. Literal non-human beings shambling around shrieking about price sheets and waving line graphs at each other like some kind of alien pod people experiment.
I love the Dreamcast, but I’m also not unreasonable and believe that it was capable of things that it simply wasn’t like some of the delusional anons on this board.
Can Sonic Adventure run on a playstation 1? Can OoT run on a playstation 1? What about Ico?
I think that answers the question. The Dreamcast was something else.
Weird, nonsensical post.
SA1's lighting engine could barely run 30fps on the Dreamcast. It was ahead of its time.
Okay but why compare it to the PS1? Obviously the Dreamcast was significantly more powerful than the fifth gen consoles.
funfact: thanks to bleem the DC could actually EMULATE playstation
sony btfo etc etc
but those bleem guys were cool man
on one hand, i feel like a goober for buying a hard copy of an emulator from EB games in 1999 so i could play THPS
on the other hand, that was a really fricking nice PS1 emulator for back then. like wtf it was better than most PS emus up until like 2010 or so
also, without them and their totally hopeless uphill legal battle, emulation wouldve probably been made illegal by nintendo or some other gay corporation
I actually owned MGS on Bleem before it got pulled from stores kek.
noice
i only had it for PC but thought it was the coolest fricking thing ever that i could play spyro and FF7 on PC at a higher resolution. it was undoubtedly what started my fascination with emulation, piracy, and older games in general
thx bleem <33
The fact that bleemcast was actually being commercially sold at Electronics Boutique in America is insane to think about. Truly the wild west days.
i never saw the actual bleemcast software tbh. i heard about bleem from some PC mag and went to EB games and bought it like early 99 iirc
>Truly the wild west days.
i think at that point they knew it was fricking ogre and they were just trying to get any money they could. hence the single-game "packs" for bleemcast
all i know was after reading on some forum prolly SA but idk tbh online and figuring out there was an easy way to run bleem emu without the disks, my next big investment was another hard drive lol
then going around to all my friends house and borrowing their PS games and ripping them
sure it totally btfo my pretty decent (at the time) PCs gfx
Yeah PC to Dreamcast ports like Quake III were very good and definitely comparable to most PC setups at the time.
yea i forget the card i had since it was hand-me-down from my dad, but it was a legit 3D acceleration card so i could play rogue squadron 3D. and when i saw my buddy playing sonic adventure i was fricking floored. first time, and prolly the last time, i was ever jelly of consoles
Same. SoulCalibur’s graphics were mind blowing for 1999.
Yes but was severely limited by GD-ROMs instead of DVDs and just one analog stick.
Both of these changes would have made it a closer competitor to the PS2 and would have made it easier for multiplatform games to make the jump to Dreamcast. One example is the Half-Life 1 prototype that has to rely on face buttons to replace a stick.
Even if it was the least popular, the Dreamcast was easier to develop for than the PS2 and could have survived with more ports to augment the first party titles.
An internet-capable arcade-quality games system with built-in DVD playback would appeal to a much wider audience, more games would have been made for it, and more people would have probably bought it even if it was less powerful than the competition.
Sega in general was
Yes and no.
Pros:
>Online Support out the gate.
>Trading(some) files over the web.
>Web Browser.
>Emphasis on 3D games and Arcade Titles.
>Great future homebrew support.
>Producing a lot of games in-house.
>What the Saturn should have been.
Cons:
>Four Years of support means limited titles.
>Region Lock.
>Piracy was an actual problem.
>Controller was a holdover of the 3D controller from the Saturn(one stick limits freedom of movement)
>Was designed to combat the PS1 and N64, didn't consider their future rivals(PS2 and GC).
>Discs were cheaply made, and small to boot.
>No DVD power, thus it couldn't have been used as a cheap DVD player like so many did with the PS2.
>Third Party support was iffy.
Agree with all of this. The Dreamcast’s GD-ROM storage size would have become an issue for multiplat developers just like it did on the GameCube and its mini DVDs.
Multi-Discs will always have that issue. If a single disc is damaged beyond repair, you lost anywhere from two-to-five discs and can't play. They're far harder to collect for, as well.
If they adopted DVD, yes, the DC would've been more expensive - but it would've been better.
if it played DVDs I bet Sega would have pulled through and still been in the hardware business
Maybe, but unlike Sony, Sega probably wasn’t in a position to take a large upfront loss on initial console sales.
>yeah bro please give me a DVD player in a 1998 console for $200
It's a game console, not a video player. If Sega ever decided to do this shit that you idiots keep parroting they would have been billions in debt, not millions
Multiplat games were never all that big to begin with, if it was on the GCN I doubt devs would have skipped the Dreamcast, the main issue is they broke ties with EA and that's basically half the sixth gen multiplats gone. No FIFA, NFS, Burnout, Harry Potter, the Dreamcast was doomed for this reason alone.
>if it was on the GCN I doubt devs would have skipped the Dreamcast
I don’t know about that. Yeah the GameCube’s mini discs were an issue, but otherwise the hardware was about on par with the PS2/Xbox. Dreamcast multiplats would’ve had to take a major hit graphically.
In polygon count maybe, but visual quality was excellent on the dreamcast. Sadly, there's nothing to really compare to because the Dreamcast died so early and there were no games developed for the PS2 and DC at the same time, but I highly doubt the DC versions would have looked worse than the PS2 versions, considering that DC ports on the PS2 were mostly downgrades. The CPU tho is another story, that could have been a big bottleneck and games could have had pretty big drops, especially since Renderware was pretty big at the time and that ran like shit on the DC.
The console came 2 years earlier than other sixth gen systems, had online play, lots of 60 fps games and one of the best launches of any console to this day. It literally shared its entire lifespan with the N64, the console could not have possibly been any more on the curve, except maybe having 2 analog sticks. The reality is Sega's brand died after the launch of the Saturn and Sony's was absolutely soaring. The PS2 could have been half as powerful as the Dreamcast, thrice as expensive and people still would have bought it for the DVD player and the logo saying Sony and not Sega.
The Dreamcast excelled at having really clean, sharp looking textures that sort of fooled your brain into thinking character models and environments were more high poly than they actually were. The main characters in the Shenmue games still look pretty good to me.
>the console could not have possibly been any more on the curve
D
V
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K
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>I highly doubt the DC versions would have looked worse than the PS2 versions
Yes, I'm sure SH3 would look exactly like this on the Dreamcast
Dreamcast tards are legitimately on a whole other level of delusion when it comes to the PS2.
Ya thats an actual delusion because I just played one of the last fps for ps2 and DAYUM. That game still beats anything out now. They put all the best games for that one. The only game that is close now is Dark Souls or that Star wars game and I only liked the worlds for it. The game wasn't that great just OK. Ps2 even beats that I think
Dreamcast isn't that bad it's basically a polished ps1 with no need for speed games. It has a few arcade racers, some OK 3rd person shmups and a few arcade style games that are fun. It's somewhere between a ps1 and ps2 but with only 5 games worth playing
whatever, if it was a little more ahead of the curve I can see it being a more popular choice
>Piracy was an actual problem.
Not this meme again.
>dindu nuffin
The Dreamcast was already dead by the time it became more common for ROM sites to carry a wide selection of Dreamcast games. Not really a major issue in first world markets like North America.
>not really a major issue
>literally killed the console
Sega was in deep shit from their prior frickups, but refusing the impact that piracy did is fricking moronic. The Dreamcast still could have had another 2 or 3 years on the market and maybe had a niche as the cheapest console if it wasn't for that, it being discontinued so early in 2001 was pretty much damage control. Releasing their new software on a system just so people pirated it and played it on their console which you sold for a loss was a double whammy for Sega. Triple whammy with developers abandoning them. If you can't understand that from a business perspective then you're actually moronic.
I repeat: Piracy was only an issue in irrelevant third world territories where they already pirate everything. It had no major impact on the first world markets that actually matter, eg NA, Western Europe and Japan.
>source: trust me bro
People in America in 2000 weren’t buying burned Dreamcast games at street markets like they were in shitholes like Brazil. Dreamcast ROMs didn’t become widely available online until closer to 2003/2004.
>People in Brazil were selling burned discs in 2000
>Americans were yet to discover ROM sites until 2004
so which was the shithole again?
There’s a difference between buying pirated games on the street versus being able to simply download them yourself at home and burn them to a CD-R which didn’t come until a couple years later when ROM sites had most of the Dreamcast library up and broadband internet was more widely adopted.
Plus consumer grade CD burner speeds improving.
Personally I didn’t have a big book of burned Dreamcast games until like 2005-2007 when I was in college.
I'm proud that you're trying so hard to make this argument work but it's truly pathetic seeing to tumble your way from one embarrassing statement to the other. Even with dial up it would have taken someone at most 10 hours or so to download a standard Dreamcasst ROM. Also wouldn't these theoretical Brazilians also need pretty advanced technolgy to rip content directly from a DC, a DC itself and the game as opposed to just getting on the Internet and downloading a ROM before burning it? Sounds like a pretty convoluted scenario you've made up
How old are you and where are you from? What year were you burning a lot of Dreamcast games on your home computer? For me it wasn’t until around 2005.
I don't fricking know, I'm not poor nor a deadbeat so I'm not too involved with piracy, but I remember watching a lot of pirated anime around the late 90s, couldn't imagine dumping Dreamcast ROMs and downloading them could have been that much different.
I’m not saying it didn’t exist in the U.S. around 2000/01, I’m just saying it wasn’t a direct cause of the Dreamcast’s ultimate failure. Me personally, I bought a Dreamcast for $50 in late 2001 when Target was clearing out their inventory. Games were offered at a steep discount so there was no need to pirate.
>literally killed the console
Literally your headcanon, nobody who bought burned DC games would even think of buying original games had it been their only option of playing games.
Nobody who bought a Dreamcast would think about buying original games when piracy became common. Are you ignoring the fact that Sega literally sold 10 million units of hardware, pretty much every single one at a loss and the majority of people who were pirating or going to pirate games also had a solid library and were waiting for future releases? The only reason why we now won't know whether that gamble of having a solid user base while taking a loss would have paid off is because of piracy. Sega/Publishers can not release games nor support a system that will just see them losing money. It's that simple.
That's what people call "cutting your losses". The Dreamcast was dead as soon as the MIL-CD exploit was found, Sega just wanted to minimize the damage before jumping ship to Xbox/Gamecube/PS2
>piracy
Burnt cds killed your dreamcast.
>when piracy became common.
By the time it became common Sega was already too deep in the coffin to recover.
This. I’m
and when I bought that $50 Dreamcast in 2001, it had already been discontinued months prior. Thinking Sega pulled out of the console market mainly due to Dreamcast piracy is beyond stupid.
Oops. I’m
It's really not stupid at all. Piracy came very soon and very easily on the dreamcast, unlike other consoles that had to wait years for a decent solution. Sega would have been able to foresee future losses due to piracy.
I think abandoning the dreamcast was one of the dumbest decisions they ever made.
How old were you when the Dreamcast launched in North America?
14.
And where are you from?
Ideally Sega would've to make a new console in late 2002 or 2003 had the dreamcast/saturn been more successful, if they even had enough money to create a console that could actually compete that is.
>9 games per console
Surely, that number would've been 3 times higher had it not been for piracy!
The best version of SA1 is Dreamcast version (US 1.005, animated title screen) or SADX with SADX Mod Installer.
>Dreamcast
Sonic Adventure original GDI (US 1.005, animated title screen)
https://cdromance.com/dc-iso/sonic-adventure-usa/
Sonic Adventure DC-HD first release (60 FPS, widescreen, skippable cutscenes, restored objects etc.)
https://dcmods.unreliable.network/index.php/2021/08/27/sonic-adventure-dc-hd-first-release/
>Windows (Windows 7 or later)
Sonic Adventure DX PC, 2004 version
https://archive.org/details/SonicAdventureDXPC
Sonic Adventure Mod Manager
https://github.com/X-Hax/SA-Mod-Manager/releases
>List of available Sonic Adventure (+DX) builds. SA1 can barely manage 30 fps on Dreamcast and had performance issues thanks to it using its own lighting engine, which is probably a huge factor into why SA2 runs at 60.
https://dcmods.unreliable.network/index.php/2021/09/03/list-of-available-sonic-adventure-builds/
>This blog examines the differences between Dreamcast, Gamecube and PC versions of Sonic Adventure/Sonic Adventure DX, focusing on changes in the Gamecube and PC ports that can be considered downgrades from the original Dreamcast version.
https://dreamcastify.unreliable.network/index.php/category/level-specific-downgrades/
The best version of SA2 is Dreamcast version or Steam version (along with the Battle DLC which is sold separately for some reason) with SA2 Render Fix mod
>Dreamcast
https://cdromance.com/dc-iso/sonic-adventure-2-usa/
>SA2 PC mods
https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/Sonic_Adventure_2#Featured_mods
>SA2 Render Fix mod
https://github.com/shaddatic/sa2b-render-fix/releases
>Sonic Adventure 2 Comparison: 700+ Changes from Dreamcast to Gamecube (20th Anniversary special)
Is he baiting or is he legitimately delusional?
Combination of both. I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt.
Love me some coping Sega thread.