What are your thoughts "1 credit clearing" games? Do you think that you can give an opinion of a game before you have achieved the "1 credit clear"?
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>What are your thoughts "1 credit clearing" games?
It's cool if people want to do that, but I don't have the time/energy
>Do you think that you can give an opinion of a game before you have achieved the "1 credit clear"?
yes, why not?
It's the bare minimum level of mastery of a game. It's basically the equivalent of "beating" the game. Of course you can still give an opinion on a game without clearing it, but it won't be a well-informed opinion as you don't understand the intricacies of the game, just as if you had quit playing something like Deus Ex halfway through.
Once you've achieved the basic 1CC, from there you can go on to more advanced playstyles such as no-miss, score, challenge runs, or speedrunning.
im sure ive done it on some games without realizing it but its never something ive sought out to do. the people who harp over this are probably the most insufferable people in vidya, and thats saying something
exhibit a
The more this thread goes on, the more this post gets proven right
You can always deflate them by saying how autofire 1CCs don't count, or how 1CCs of arcade games completed via emulation don't count either. It invariably causes them to go on seething rants about superplayers, autofire circuits, and muh Japanese gamers.
You're really underselling what a commitment this "base level mastery" entails. It's 100+ hours for a great many famous arcade games.
It's really not you dumb shitter. Name 10. There are some brutal 2all clears, but those are very small percentage, and vast majority of clears can be done in 25 hours or less
You're not going to no-miss any capcom beat'em up in 25 hours.
This was not about no-miss clears, this was about basic shitclears with default settings. And there are easier Capcom beat em ups you can absolutely clear in under 25 hours, especially if you have some experience with the genre.
Okay, basic shitclears. Still not going to do it under 25 hours.
>especially if you have some experience with the genre.
Those hours count towards your total if it's the same game. If you've been fricking around with Final Fight for the last 30 years and finally get off your ass to try to 1cc it those years still count towards your total.
I said "majority of clears can be done in under 25 hours". The original anon said "it's 100+ hours for a great many"
Honestly I can't think of any 100+ hour clears (again, one loop shitclears with default settings), aside from games that are impossible, games that are broken garbage, or meme shit like Futari Ultra
I have about 75 no miss clears and haven't spent 100 hours on a single one of them.
If you're just talking about one loop, ignoring score, playing for survival, with default settings, I honestly can't even think of a single clear that would take over 100 hours aside from meme shit like Futari Ultra.
>shitter anon is back
How many of those were done with autofire? How many were done on original hardware?
See
LARP
Cope. I literally have recordings and handcams for all of them.
LARP
i 1cc'd dodonpachi DFK black label novice in about 6 hours of playtime with very little cave game experience prior, just dicking around with mushihemesama. you are fricking terrible at video games if it takes you 100 hours to 1cc anything besides the absolute hardest of the hard meme tier games.
ok kid
>novice
gtfo shitter. you should be doing novice on your first attempt blind. It's a mode designed for people who have never played a videogame in their life
I know this is bait, but whatever some people actually have an opinion that is like this, so I'm going to argue anyway. Even though I like the idea of 1CCing a game, and have done it with a fair few. Its not a requirement to feeling like you've beaten the game. You have beaten the game once you see the credits sequence. Don't care if you cheated, if you savescummed, if you used a guide, or if you used all of your continues and did it on your last life. If you got to the end of the game, you beat the game. Mastering a game and beating a game are two different things, and there are obviously different levels of achievement. But this bullshit is just autists trying to justify the fact that they spent 10x as much time on a game than anyone else. By discounting everyone who didn't do exactly what they did, they try to make it seem like it wasn't a waste of time.
If you're going to be autistic about a game that's fine, you're in good company here, but just accept it. I know that spending way too much time on a single difficult game is autistic, but I enjoy it anyway and that's why I do it. I don't need to justify it by making out like you have to do it or you didn't really play the game.
>have done it with a fair few.
Post em shitter
>Don't care if you cheated, if you savescummed,
This is absolute nonsense.
By your rules I can bowl a 300 and count it even if I give myself infinite redos.
You do know we are in competition with each other here, right? When someone says they have 1cc'd a video game that is entering themselves into a social competition. One which has rules, which are being discussed in this thread.
>inb4 I don't care what anyone thinks, I'm not competing with anyone.
Then exit the thread. This place is not for you.
>install game
>search the credits sequence on youtube
>uninstall game
>throw shit at the game for hours on Ganker
Trans pipeline
Troons don't 1cc games, they speedrun them.
>It's basically the equivalent of "beating" the game
even a game like contra which limits your continues to 3?
Yes
frick off, moron. i can figure out if the gameplay is shit in the first 5 minutes
>intricacies
kek maybe the hitboxes and controls get better in the end-game! homosexual
Seething shitter
There are so many games where you can't possibly have a real idea 5 minutes in, even in arcades. Some of the best arcade games of all time are so stupidly obtuse
I can. Many other people can. But some weak minded people can't form their own opinions and need to ask strangers on the internet to give them one.
But all opinions aren't equally valid, and their validity isn't nearly as simplistic as you imagine. The opinion of a no skill zoomie who says a game sucks "cause artificial difficulty" is worthless. Then again, so is the opinion of an aspie who devoted two years of "her" "life" to mastering a game because there's literally nothing else remotely interesting about they/them. At the same time, some who's played many games but not 1CCd one might be able to offer many useful opinions.
1CC stuff is only brought up here on /vr/ for the express purpose of shitposting.
1cc itself shouldn't be a goal, just a natural consequence of appreciating and investing some time in the game
It can be a fun way to master a game you like, but picking up a game just to 1cc it is so stupid. I've seen OPs here ask what game they should 1cc next, and if any of them are reading this thread they should know they're wasting their lives.
Contrary to what NEETs say, 1cc is not a critically important element to play an arcade game. Continuing is a game mechanics, the only reason one would restrict himself from it is for a self-imposed challenge. It's like playing Castlevania without sub-weapons, or Dark Souls without healing. You might be a better player in all measurable metrics for accomplishing it, but there's no real reason for everyone not to engage with a core mechanics of the game.
Uneducated zoomer take. Continues didn't exist for a long time and they were implemented to milk the most casual players, japanese arcades always encouraged skilled play on few/1 credit as the main appeal.
You are mega autistic if you think you can equate a continue with an actual game mechanic. Playing word games to the point you have lost track of reality
That said there is nothing wrong with continued, they just have a weird dynamic if you aren't literally playing on an arcade machine and paying
this
You have a fundamental misunderstanding of arcade culture.
My question to you is: are you open to changing your opinion at all?
Most people who go to arcades just dump some money in a game and dick around. That's like saying the average fighting game player is a FGC wannabe, when most just like playing against the CPU or playing against a casual friend.
I reiterate my earlier statement: you have a fundamental misunderstanding of arcade culture.
The question is: are you open to learning why you are wrong?
Either post primary sources, preferably in Japanese, or stop posting.
That doesn't answer the question: are you willing to change your opinion and admit it in this thread?
Yes. Post a source.
The idea that you need a "source" is telling.
It can't be an anon explaining to you firsthand on this site. It has to be something off-site.
Why is that?
Playing on emulators in your bedroom, jerking off to 1CC videos, and reading icycalm's articles isn't a firsthand account.
Can you stop being glib for one thread?
No!
I don't trust internet randoms with no evidence and neither should you. The other guy posted an interview with devs. Now it's your turn.
Why do you care what developers of 25+ years ago had to say? Is arcade culture not allowed to evolve separately? Is it a thing that was set in stone in the 20th century and all you can do now is try to recreate it?
Arcade culture can evolve however it wants, but I won't believe it's what you say it is until you provide some evidence.
So what evidence would be good enough for you?
Do you believe developers dictate arcade culture?
If not, who?
Do you believe any of the anons in this thread even have a say in the matter?
I'd consider any of the following evidence: developers/games/advertisements inviting players to try to beat a game in 1 credit, old forum posts from the 90s or 00s discussing 1ccs, old arcade games with rewards for not using any continues, etc.
Devs don't dictate culture, but they're part of it.
I don't think anyone in this thread has a say.
Your idea of arcade culture is fundamentally incompatible with my own.
Good day sir.
Care to explain why Terminator 2, a game which is notorious for being impossible to 1CC, was one of the best earning games of its time, even in Japan's arcade culture?
Not until you answer
It's pointless to spend time and effort making posts if the anons are never going to consider the information presented to them.
No one's going to kiss your feet just so you grace us with this magical knowledge. Post sources or gtfo.
>didn't answer the question.
Sure.
>inb4 the icycalm blogpost
>lose state is a game mechanic
A meme like all other "ignore basic game mechanics" challenges
Yes, inserting quarters to continue is a basic game mechanic seeing as how arcade is p2w trash by definition
honestly? I'm too much of a storygay. Once I get to the pot of gold at the end either through unlimited continues(castlevania, ninja gaiden etc.) or scraping by with 2 or 3 continues in home console ports I'm sated.
reminder that a legit 1cc requires you to never have emulated the game and only played when paying money at the arcade.
So free play 1cc's don't count?
What if I played the official console port?
What if the controls were changed from the original LS-32 to a JLF?
Lots of memorization and trial and error until you do it. It doesn't interest me but it's pretty much the only way a player can really show skill in arcade games because of the flawed pay to continue system. I'm not sure any devs really balanced the game with 1cc in mind and they had a clear incentive to extract more quarters with bullshit and make sure the arcade owners made a profit in a reasonable amount of time.
Literally every arcade game in existence is balanced around a 1CC, and that is the authentic way of beating the game.
>Literally every arcade game in existence is balanced around a 1CC
doubt
Every jap arcade*
90s american arcades were mostly dumb midway crap that didn't reward/encourage skilled play, which is why a lot of zoomers have that warped take on arcades as a whole.
>90s american arcades were mostly dumb midway crap
nope
Show me your nba jam and nfl blitz and 1cc
What?
there are plenty of arcade games that are quite literally impossible to 1cc
Like what?
>every arcade game is balanced around robbing you blind
FTFY
Continues in arcade games make sense from a business perspective, but they're fundamentally broken from a game design perspective. So long as you have more quarters, the game has no fail state. This problem is only exacerbated in home console ports. In a well designed game, mechanics should complement each other, not negate one another. Continues are so powerful and centralizing that all other mechanics are negated by them. For this reason, I think any arcade game which doesn't enforce 1CCs, or at least place a cap on the number of times you can continue, is fundamentally broken beyond repair.
That said, 1CCs and scoreplay are the only two approaches to arcade games which can produce meaningful critique. If you're just a casual looking to quarter feed an Espgaluda II cab for an hour, you probably won't learn much about how the game actually works. You'll probably never discover that Kakusei Over leveling is a stupid formality which serves no purpose other than to ensure the first 15 seconds of stage 1 plays the same every single time. You probably won't even notice that Kakusei Over has levels in the first place. In order to properly critique a game, you need to engage with all of its mechanics and understand how they intersect with one another. Continues, like playing on easier difficulties in home console games, hinders this process by allowing you skate by with an incomplete understanding of a game's systems.
That said x2, 1CCs are just a cute side-challenge like speed running. A game that is only fun when placing voluntary restrictions on yourself is one which is fundamentally poorly designed (even if I do love a lot of them dearly).
It doesn't matter how many credits you can feed in because any past the first are just for practice
>A game that is only fun when placing voluntary restrictions on yourself is one which is fundamentally poorly designed
According to who? Does having cheats make a game fundamentally poorly designed? Does having an easy mode or debug mode? You can't just say something and that makes it true when it doesn't stand up to scrutiny.
Arcade games (aside from western kusoge) are intended to be cleared with one credit; that is the authentic way to complete the game, and credits let you practice and explore the game. Arcade culture differed greatly in Japan vs. the west which is why you have this disconnect.
>According to who?
Any sensible person. If a game is full of mechanics that you have to actively ignore for the game to be tolerable, then it begs the question: why are they there in the first place? In the case of credit systems in arcades, the answer is pretty obvious: money.
>Does having cheats make a game fundamentally poorly designed?
If they're post-game bonuses, no. If they can be activated before the game has been completed, yes. It also depends on the nature of the cheats. If it's just aesthetic differences, like playing with a big head or whatever, I think that's fine even before the game has been completed as a cute little easter egg. If it's god mode, yeah that's stupid.
>Does having an easy mode or debug mode?
Easy modes aren't intrinsically poorly designed, but they usually are in practice. If they still force the player to meaningfully engage with the game's mechanics, I think they're fine as an accessibility option. Regardless, I still think they should exist for the benefit of casuals. What I said about cheats applies to debug tools: it depends on their nature and when they become accessible.
>Arcade games (aside from western kusoge) are intended to be cleared with one credit.
It's too bad that they decided to implement systems which fly in the face of their supposed "intended" design, then.
>A 1CC is not a self-imposed challenge, it's something that was ingrained within the development, the design, and the culture surrounding the games.
If I can just put another quarter in to continue, 1CCs are definitionally a self-imposed challenge. If I can just press start on my controller to continue, 1CCs definitionally a self-imposed challenge.
>If I can just put another quarter in to continue, 1CCs are definitionally a self-imposed challenge. If I can just press start on my controller to continue, 1CCs definitionally a self-imposed challenge.
If I can just [lower the difficulty, turn on a cheat, abuse a glitch, turn the power off and do something else], anything the game throws at me is definitely a self-imposed challenge.
The logic just makes no sense.. You are just arbitrarily defining what's self-defined, as if doing anything but the lowest common-denominator playthrough is self-imposed, and arbitrarily categorizing anything that is self-imposed as bad and.... shouldn't count... because reason... or something...
>Lower the difficulty
I don't think a game should allow you to change difficulty mid-playthrough. Most don't, and for good reason.
>Turn on a cheat
I don't think that cheats which have mechanical relevance should be accessible prior to a legitimate completion.
>Abuse a glitch
I think bug abuse is fine. The presence of bugs which are overly-centralizing is another indicator of bad design.
>Power off and do something else
Then you're no longer playing the game. You're doing something else.
>You are just arbitrarily defining what's self-defined
I'm not. If the game allows you to do something, choosing not to do it is definitionally self-imposed. This isn't difficult to understand.
>How is the game "not tolerable" if you continue?
My 58 year old mother could clear Futari on ultra by credit feeding. A game without a failstate is hardly a game. Forcing the player to come up with self-imposed failstates for your game to be enjoyable is bad game design. I say this as someone with quite a few 1CCs at this point. I think these games would be better designed if they didn't have credit systems at all. They were a financial necessity, not a wise game design choice.
>Have you literally never played anything but a linear cinematic movie game in your life? Everything you're saying is just complete nonsense.
I mostly play Quake Live and arcade games.
Not an argument.
>If the game allows you to do something
I can just afk in the starting area. Completing the game is self-imposed. You just have to be trolling at this point. Your argument is just so utterly asinine. That a game can only be judged on the absolute barebones, lowest common denominator experience is just nonsense. The appeal of arcade games is learning and mastering their systems and finding different ways to approach the game, but you just go full pedantic sperg and go "well, *technically* since I can just credit feed and still see the credits so there is no point in me ever learning or mastering the game because the title screen doesn't explicitly tell me to clear it on one credit!"
>My 58 year old mother could clear Futari on ultra by credit feeding
No she couldn't, because that isn't clearing you stupid frick. "Clearing" a game implies beating it on a single credit, which you would know if you actually played these games. She could credit feed, see the end of the game eventually, and only have an extremely surface-level experience of the game.
>Completing the game is self-imposed
Not really, no. Games have states which indicate failure and success. The act of playing a game is avoiding its fail states on your path to success. Short of this, you're engaging in some sort of digital sight seeing. This is like saying you can "play soccer" by sitting on the grass while a game goes on around you. You're kind of just being pedantic at this point. Words have meaning, y'know?
>The appeal of arcade games is learning and mastering their systems and finding different ways to approach the game
Yes. I agree with you. And this is undermined by allowing continues. It would be like having a a rule in chess where you can win by simply stating "I win". You could choose not to use that mechanic and have a great time, but including it in the game's rules is a design error.
>No she couldn't, because that isn't clearing you stupid frick. "Clearing" a game implies beating it on a single credit, which you would know if you actually played these games.
Huh, why do we use the term 1CC instead of just C? Makes you think, doesn't it?
>She could credit feed, see the end of the game eventually, and only have an extremely surface-level experience of the game.
That's my entire point, buddy. Mechanics should complement each other, not negate each other. Unlimited continues in the way they are implemented in most arcade games negate all other mechanics. R-Type with its checkpointing system is a good example of how to do continues somewhat reasonably (although checkpointing in STGs sucks for other reasons).
None of my clears are very impressive. Futari on Maniac and Galuda II are probably my best. I'm not out here 2-ALLing Strikers or whatever.
>with one exception, all you play is arcade games
>despite this, only have two low-scoring shitclears
why are you even here? how are you this fricking bad?
I didn't know that the word "mostly" and "exclusively" were synonymous.
Also, not an argument.
>not an argument
argue with yourself, I don't engage with shitters.
>I mostly play Quake Live and arcade games.
LMAO
post those clears buddy. I'd love to see the arcade player who has never cleared a single game.
>If a game is full of mechanics that you have to actively ignore for the game to be tolerable
?????????????????????????????
How is the game "not tolerable" if you continue? Where the frick did you even make this absurd jump in logic? Continuing is a fundamental part of exploring, learning, and practicing the game. What are you even saying moron? It's like training wheels before you learn to ride a bike.
Have you literally never played anything but a linear cinematic movie game in your life? Everything you're saying is just complete nonsense.
smoothbrain zoomers like you are why the modern gaming industry is cancer. might as well just cut out the middle man of even playing the game and just watch some basedfacing homosexual streamer play it.
frick off back to Ganker you mong.
Arcade games are meant to be replayed and mastered, learning all the nuances of survival and scoring. Saying a 1CC is a "cute side-challenge" is like saying anything above the easiest difficulty setting is similarly a "cute side challenge". Frame arcade games as having parallels to something like Tetris, and the monetization model makes a lot more sense.
A 1CC is not a self-imposed challenge, it's something that was ingrained within the development, the design, and the culture surrounding the games.
>A 1CC is not a self-imposed challenge, it's something that was ingrained within the development, the design, and the culture surrounding the games.
No evidence of that.
Most arcade Games recognize 1cc completions. They don't recognize "self imposed" challenges like a knife only run or Speedrun.
If you don't know how they recognize and display this info you aren't informed enough.
>Most arcade Games recognize 1cc completions.
doubt
Do you have any evidence whatsoever to support that? It's obvious that arcade games are designed around getting you to say "just one more" and put another quarter in because you want to see the next section of the game. If they were truly designed around 1CCs they wouldn't have continue systems at all. Most of the difficulty of arcade games is tuned for this express purpose, of making the player think they almost beat that section and with just one more quarter they can do it. A lot of the supposed difficulty of arcade games comes from the fact that most people play solo when emulating when they were balanced around, and encouraged, co-op most of the time.
Meanwhile, the developers themselves...
>Miyoshi: For bug checking, we preferred to let the person who designed the stage see if he could clear it or not, so you become a specialist regarding your own stage. But since each stage was checked individually, with each person saying “its all good!” if they could clear their own stage, I don’t know if anybody checked it all from stage 1…?
>Kaneda: I don’t think any of us even could. (laughs)
>Miyoshi: I remember someone bug checked the complete playthrough by credit feeding.
What game are they talking about?
Gradius III.
Thanks.
Developers were always surprised at how quickly players learned and mastered their games, so they made the games harder than they thought they should be so that they would stand the test of time. That doesn't speak to the fact that they aren't designed for 1CC. If anything, the fact that he laughs and mentions how it was funny that they had to resort to credit feeding just to test just reinforces the idea that that wasn't the intended way to play, but due to time constraints and lack of skill, they had to test them in that way, knowing full well that superplayers would soon share strategies and crack the game open.
You are reading a lot into (laughs) my man.
Devs may have been aware that skilled players might find ways to beat their games in 1 try (which isn't implied by the interview excerpt), but that doesn't mean the games were balanced around that. Devs today are aware that speedrunners will play their game, but that doesn't mean their games are necessarily designed around speedrunning.
A well designed arcade game can be cleared in one credit, I'd say that's pretty much a given. That said, the point of an arcade game is to milk money from players, so a game which feels unfair due to being literally impossible to clear on a single credit will tend to repel players after a while, because even people who credit feed don't want something which feels like it is inherently pay to win - they just pay to win because they choose to do so.
Wasn't this in reference to Gradius 2?
Gradius III.
A game which is notorious for being insanely hard.
And was made in 1989 in the early days of arcade games with clear conditions and endings.
It's a cherry picked example that shouldn't be taken as the rule.
Developers not playing through their games is more common than you think. Their job is to make the game, and to make sure the part/thing they did works as intended.
The rest is the job of the testers. A developer doesn't waste time playing through his game, he has better things to do, his skills and time is too precious.
Not to mention that playing through a game while it's being made is stupid and pointless, and by the time the game is almost complete, it's usually crunch time to wrap things up, they don't have time for this.
Again, you leave that to testers, who are at the bottom of the food chain.
So stop thinking devs were gods at their own games, or that the games were "balanced for them". They didn't even play it. But that doesn't mean they didn't know what they were doing or that it wasn't generally balanced right, they knew what they were doing without having to sit through the entire game in one go (without even mentionning 1CC).
You are a bonified idiot.
>bonified
Yeah, it's like saying bone apple teeth before eating.
>A 1CC is not a self-imposed challenge, it's something that was ingrained within the development, the design, and the culture surrounding the games.
If that was true why didn't the games ever convey this at all?....ever? No mention of 1cc on the cabs or a snarky comment at the end saying you didn't beat the game if you credit fed or how about a special ending for 1cc? secret boss for 1cc?
For a playstyle that was supposedly so prevalent in Japan that literally every arcade dev balanced the games around it they sure hid this fact very well and for no apparent reason.
>secret boss for 1cc
SDOJ has its TLB locked behind a 1CC (well, the requirements are much stricter than that, actually). It's been over a decade since the game came out, and nobody has beaten it outside of practice mode, so it's kind of a meme.
People say this but DDP:SDOJ only got 1cc'd last month after literally 12 years
Plenty of games are designed for probably 1% of people who touch them to 1cc them, if that; I wouldn't say the other 99% weren't still capable of having a meaningful experience with the game.
>People say this but DDP:SDOJ only got 1cc'd last month after literally 12 years
Unless I'm moronic, I'm not seeing any Inbachi clears on the shmup wiki. Got a link? I'd love to watch.
Kinda surprised they haven't updated it yet, here ya go https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCRI69pQpY0&t=1612s he got it on both the pcb and the port too. Crazy shit
>Do you think that you can give an opinion of a game before you have achieved the "1 credit clear"?
Of course. But your opinion on certain topics is more likely to be taken seriously if you're able to play the game well. Like if you're giving opinions on the game's balancing or scoring system, etc. It's possible to have an educated opinion on those things without doing it yourself, but it'll be harder for you to communicate certain things about it without having done it yourself, and high level players won't be as likely willing to take you seriously.
>What are your thoughts "1 credit clearing" games?
1. It has to be done on original hardware. No emulation.
2. No cheats like autofire, save states, speed hacks, etc.
3. The game must be played as originally released as developers intended. No playing on modded hardware like "consolized" arcade boards.
Sorry. I don't care about your Metal Slug 1CC where you used an inaccurate emulator with autofire, save states, and other cheats. That goes for any game too. If you want to set a world record, then you must play under the same conditions everyone else did.
Simple as that.
Why would anyone care about arbitrary rules set by a zero clears shitter? Only reason you say this is so you can try to disqualify genuine clears to bring them down to zero clears like you.
Using autofire and emulation/ports has been standard for Japanese players for decades.
>Using autofire and emulation
You mean using Emulators that the West created? Lmao.
The best Japanese players are still capable of playing on original hardware if they want. They can go from emulator to arcade cabinet with no problems. They are masters of the game and can play the game with full manual controls with no issue.
When was the last time YOU touched an arcade cabinet?
When was the last time you even WENT to an arcade??
That's what I thought.
>standard for Japanese players for decades.
You aren't Japanese. You aren't even in the same league as Japanese players in terms of skills. You aren't even in the top 100 of American players (which are weaker than Japanese players). You are nobody, and have no right to bring up Japan.
Japanese players can go to the arcades because they actually have large local arcades (for now) with candy cabs and autofire circuits and Japanese versions of games. American arcades are much fewer and far between, are shitty stand-up cabs with garbage sticks and buttons, non-default settings, western versions of games, and no autofire. The experience is not remotely comparable. If anything it's much easier to play on authentic hardware in Japan because it's more kinetic, lower input lag, better motion handling, better control input, better community, more competition, and more shared game knowledge. You are at a significant disadvantage as a western player.
I don't play on stick, but that's mostly just because I find standalone sticks to be large, cumbersome, and uncomfortable. It's different when they are built directly into and flush with the cabinet.
So yes, my skills with these games would be directly transferable to the Japanese arcade, given I took a couple weeks to learn stick (which is another advantage).
In any case, the appeal of these games is much moreso the games themselves rather than mimicking some specific authentic arcade experience. Nobody would say you need to play, for example, Dark Souls with a controller on the 360 version for your experience to be authentic. The gameplay and design is the appeal, regardless of controller or platform you play it on. My favorite arcade games are just great games at the end of the day, regardless of whether playing them with emulation or original hardware, pad or stick.
>Japanese players can go to the arcades because they actually have large local arcades (for now) with candy cabs and autofire circuits and Japanese versions of games.
Different anon here. I've see Japanese players beat games without any autofire or support or mods. Just original cabinet only. So autofire doesn't count (unless it's an option within the game itself) if it can done with manual. Japanese players can do it. So can you.
Ok, good for you? Point still stands that the overwhelming vast majority of Japanese players and even many western players universally use autofire, especially if playing on pad. Mashing is a defunct skill, I don't give a shit about it, nor do I care seeking validation from some random shitter by proving my mashing ability. I use autofire in every single game without a care, and if you only want to compare my clears to other autofire clears, that's fine with me.
>Ok, good for you? Point still stands that the overwhelming vast majority of Japanese players
We are talking about the top Japanese players. Not everyone. Japanese super players are on my side of the argument. They can tackle any challenge and don't whine about it.
>and even many western players universally use autofire,
Western players? Doesn't count.
>especially if playing on pad
Then this isn't the arcade version which uses a stick. You are playing the console version. Or it's some emulator or some unauthorized controller.
>Japanese super players are on my side of the argument. They can tackle any challenge and don't whine about it.
>Western players? Doesn't count.
Answer honestly: what's the upper limit you'd be willing to pay for a pair of SPS's used underwear?
>We are talking about the top Japanese players. Not everyone. Japanese super players are on my side of the argument.
For Japanese players it's like 95% autofire, for superplayers it's like 99% autofire.
>Then this isn't the arcade version which uses a stick. You are playing the console version. Or it's some emulator or some unauthorized controller.
I never claimed I played on original hardware, nor do I care about seeking approval from some random zero clears shitter. If I lived in Japan or had hundreds of thousands of dollars to waste on a warehouse and hundreds of autofire circuit candy cabs, then I would play like that because it is clearly advantageous. Again, I don't think you realize that playing in Japan is an ADVANTAGE; it's much easier to play on original hardware in Japan because it's more kinetic, lower input lag, better motion handling, better control input, better community, more competition, and more shared game knowledge. You are at a significant DISADVANTAGE as a western player. But fundamentally, the games, the routing, the strategies, the mechanics, the frantic gameplay are the same.
>for superplayers it's like 99% autofire.
Superplayers are 100% capable of doing both. That's the point you are missing.
You are not in their league.
Superplayers almost always use autofire given the choice, but given no other option will resort to mashing obviously. Are you implying that I am incapable of manually pressing a button? I don't like mashing, especially on a pad, and will always use autofire if given the choice, but if mashing was the only way to play the game, I would begrudgingly do so.
I just don't understand what your point is here? You don't have any clears, so you're just some random shitter sucking off superplayers..? Did I ever claim to be a superplayer? Did I ever claim to care at all about mashing ability? I do not fricking care, at all. I don't know how much more apparent I can make that. I prefer autofire and there is no reason for me to ever not use it so I don't even think about mashing other than when you spergs keep bringing it up.
SDOJ has been 1CC'ed many thousands of times since release. You are specifically talking about the meme TLB.
>Are you implying that I am incapable of manually pressing a button?
All evidence points to no you can't do it without autofire. Post a single 1CC in metal slug without autofire, and I will take back my words. We have seen Japanese superplayers do it but we haven't seen you do it.
>I don't like playing without autofire
>but let me go back and waste time mashing to get a clear in a game I haven't played in over a year for the validation of some random moron shitter on the internet
Again, for the hundredth time: I DO NOT CARE ABOUT MASHING. I DO NOT CARE ABOUT VALIDATION FROM SOME RANDOM moron ON THE INTERNET.
It's hilarious to see some random moron shitter who couldn't clear a single game to save his life be on some little fricking crusade against autofire. No one fricking cares, just frick off
>cheating with autofire
you didn't beat the game, no better than save states or, yes, continuing
That's your opinion. No one cares about your opinion, least of all me.
Was there already the annual no autofire Metal Slug superplayer meetup? Huh, I must have missed it
>no one cares about your opinion
>takes the time out of his day to have the argument
seems like you care a great deal
Haha epic trole bro!!! XD
Japanese super players are disappointed in you.
Japanese super players can do it without complaint. Why can't you?
Western superplayers (iconoclast, juno, jaimers, synthricardo, pasky, cps, mark msx) say mashing is lame or optional at best. If you use autofire just say so or not.
Heck iconoclast uses autofire even in beat em ups.and he's literally best in the west
Not that anon, but the argument isn't about whether button mashing is good or bad. It's tiring and hard on your hands. We know this. We also know top players prefer autofire, but we do know that they can do 1cc runs without autofire. It's just not something top players like doing.
The argument here is if OP can at least do a single 1cc run without autofire. Just one. OP talks about how skilled he is and insults others in the thread. From what I can see, he's avoided answering the question or just uses sarcasm.
If OP is legit good, then he should be able to put up at least a single 1cc run w/o autofire. Then everyone would take him seriously. Without showing that, then I don't blame others for not taking OP seriously.
OP is anonymous so who cares. Anyone can get a 1cc run without autofire in some games even morons
I see no reason to assume OP is the person you think they are.
I didn't get a reply in the last thread about 1ccs so asking again
>Out of curiosity, what would you consider the easiest clear or set of clears that would make someone at least competent? Or at least not a shitter in your eyes?
If your name isn't fufufu or clover-tac, you have no right to bring up Japan, or something.
gold standard clear any of the top 10 games on mariax's no-miss difficulty list and you should be golden.
You can give an opinion on anything, doesn't mean that people need to agree with or even consider it. If someone 1CCs a game I don't like they won't convince me to like it.
I think it's a fine challenge for those that enjoy such things. For me it can get quite repetitive and un-fun.
>Do you think that you can give an opinion of a game before you have achieved the "1 credit clear"?
Absolutely you can.
I get the feeling the people arguing in this thread haven't been in an arcade in years. Maybe even decades.
The guy carrying in about arcade culture is a zoomer who has only ever played arcade games in MAME with a keyboard.
It doesn't matter unless the game has a special ending that you only get for not using continues, final stage you only get for not continuing, etc. Those sorts of things indicate that the game is meant to be played like that.
When does arcade culture end?
It hasn't ended. It continues to exist and evolve.
In Japanese too.
These people are insane.
>When does arcade culture end?
Which era?
Pong era - ends in the early 80s
Pac Man era - started mid 80s and ends in early 90s
Fighting Game era/arcade 90s resurgence - started in 1993 and ended around 2002
Modern era - 2015 to current
It's funny how all the top arcade players in the world universally play on stick and original cabinet and yet nonplayer morons still somehow think that western players are using emulators and controllers as some kind of secret cheating advantage, and not just because it's what they have available.
It's almost like we don't have massive fricking well-maintained arcades with candy cabs with autofire circuits and LS-32 sticks and superplayer communities that share information amongst themselves. It's almost like that would make it easier and would explain why Japan is so dominant. Nahhhh, that would require too much critical thinking.
>candy cabs with autofire circuits
Your obsession with autofire is lame.
The point isn't that anybody actually cares about how you play, it's that you act like a self-righteous expert on the subject, when in reality the way you yourself play is entirely removed from the community you're extolling. It also overlooks the fact that the average arcadegoer isn't going to to play an arcade game to posture and show off their elite skills (sure, some do), they're just going to play games for a bit and have fun, even if that fun might mean credit feeding through some licensed beat em up or playing scrub matches against their friend on SFII.
Why do you always bring up the average person, the average arcade goer, the casual, the normie, etc?
These people are irrelevant to arcade culture.
The average bowler can't bowl above 150.
The average pool player can't sink more than 1 ball in a row.
These people are not part of the bowling and pool playing community.
And they know it and respect the opinions of people who make it a big part of their life.
So where is the difference for the arcade community?
Where is the respect for the serious player?
>unironically no true Scotsmaning
That's not a no-true-scotsman argument.
Do serious players always look for approval from casuals or is it just arcade players?
Serious players tend to look for approval from other serious players imo.
Fundamentally the games, the routing, the strategies, the mechanics, the frantic gameplay are the same.
I have slightly higher input lag, slightly worse motion handling, a smaller screen, an (arguably) inferior control method, and less access to the Japanese community, but the games and how you approach them are still the same.
I never claimed to be a "self-righteous expert on the subject" of anything. I just claim to have clears in games that I have clears in, and those aren't invalidated just because I don't have access to an original Japanese cabinet. I also know about Japanese arcade culture from reading many interviews and accounts of it, even if I am not in Japan experiencing it firsthand (or what's left of it). I do have experience of western arcades and can see how the culture and mindset around them is fundamentally different than it is in Japan, and I am explaining that difference to people who have only ever experienced western arcade culture and thus view arcade gaming as nothing more than mindless, unfair, quarter munching fun.
That credit bullshit is the reason I tend to avoid arcade games. They're all designed to rob you out of quarters, so 1CC always feels inadequately difficult, but using more credits feels like cheating, as there is no clear limitation for how much you can use for the fair challenge.
It's just a lot more simple on consoles. Even if the game is difficult, it was at least meant to be beaten with that amount of challenge.
If you grew up playing arcade games and getting 1ccs then their style would seem fair and normal to you, while console and PC games would seem piss easy and poorly designed casual trash most of the time, and the exceptions would be games that basically play like arcade games (console Contras and Ninja Gaiden, etc)
A lot of arcade game give points for everything in multiples of 10s, and when you continue they add 1 to your score.
So if you want an intermediate challenge between 1CC and credit feeding, you can try and beat games like that with 9 continues or less- the maximum amount before the digit in your score that tracks continues stops iterating.
It's also worth noting that Shmups, which is where a lot of the "1cc elitism" tends to come from, often have an autobomb feature on home ports that functionally turn your bombs into a health bar as a middleground between single-credit play and continuing.
>often have an autobomb feature on home ports
Name 10 examples moron
https://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?t=40439
I can also add Game Tengoku to that list.
It was specifically about home ports adding autobomb.
I want a fight to the death between the ms"autofire" schizo vs the mHz"3 TIMES" schizo that ends in a draw with both dead.
But your bogeymen can never die. They live forever. In your head. Rent free.
You can always trust on the ms schizo to come and ruin a thread with his unwarranted sperging. Fricking homosexual spammer, get out and never come back.
You can easily 1CC with savestates, so it's an useless metric. Looks like you got outsmarted again
Time taken to beat a game should only correlate to how good you are playing at the game.
Yeah, I did it on Metal Slug X and the truth of the matter is I spent way, way too long on it. Shouldn't have done it.
>Do you think that you can give an opinion of a game before you have achieved the "1 credit clear"?
Validity of game opinions has less to do with that and way more with how many OTHER games you have played. Minimum amount of games to have a valid opinion is ten thousand.
>surface level experience with a sea of goyslop
Think I've 1cc'd dozens of games countless times, if fighting games count. But people get asshurt over that, so to most people it doesn't count. Funny how that genre intimidates people so much even today.
fighting games have some of the easiest 1cc because they are meant to be a competitive multiplayer genre. only reason people would get "asshurt" over that is because it is just padding your clears with a genre that isn't really designed for solo play.
>fighting games have some of the easiest 1cc
Only the Capcom fighting games made after Super Turbo.
Beating an SNK fighting game on the hardest difficulty is a good challenge. But many more people are good at fighting games so even those are more commonly 1cc'd than shmups and beat'em ups.
Fighting games are my favorite genre and to me I consider the game "beat" when I've 1cc'd the game on default with every character. Not as easy as it sounds.
>eating an SNK fighting game on the hardest difficulty is a good challenge
It also has almost nothing to do with actually being good at the game, though. Most SNK bosses are just about finding a way to loop the AI. Knowing optimal combos and stuff obviously helps, but the core of fighting games is reading an opponent, and you can't really get that with an AI.
>beating the game is not being good at the game
I simply don't agree with your view that only beating human opponents matters.
The same logic could be applied to shmups. A 1cc is meaningless because you're just learning patterns, not "getting good" at the game. Which is impossible since the game doesn't include a vs. mode. Making the whole genre rather pointless.
>The same logic could be applied to shmups.
Not really, because shmups aren't designed to be played against another person.
But they are. There's a score counter right there. That score is you competing against the other players. Which makes the 1cc a very small achievement, you're supposed to be competing for score.
Fighting games are a fine genre of video game just as single player games. It's silly to disregard them completely. That's black and white thinking, small-minded.
>Fighting games are a fine genre of video game just as single player games.
I didn't say they weren't, I said that being able to beat the computer has very little to do with actually being good at the game. It's not like that's some rule I've personally decided on either, it's just what the popular perception of being "good" at a fighting game is.
>it's just what the popular perception of being "good" at a fighting game is.
By who? Do posters in this thread not count towards the "popular perception"?
I wonder how many of the posters in this thread would think someone was good at KOF98 because they know how to do this
That's not as easy to do as you think it is.
And this really isn't. That guy is doing all kinds of tricks that require a lot of knowledge of CPU patterns. He makes it look easy, but it isn't. His wall dives and throws are perfectly timed.
>That's not as easy to do as you think it is.
Yeah it is. I've done it.
I've done it too. You're taking fighting game skill for granted. I have 10k+ hours in the genre. I don't know how many you have but it's likely over 1000 even for a casual player.
When you've got 1000 hours in a genre yeah this is "easy".
For someone who never 1cc'd something difficult anything will seem hard.
The boss fight match before this against either the Boss Team or Iori's team is much harder, and there's no real way to cheese either one of them.
Fighting game single player modes are different genre than versus human opponents. Consider it to be a boss-rush type of game like Punch-Out!!
Many fighting games incentivize a 1cc attempt by allowing the player to fight hidden boss characters or displaying secret credit rolls if you can beat the game without losing a fight or even a single round.
>Most SNK bosses are just about finding a way to loop the AI.
Literally the same as any other game where you play the CPU.
The difference is the cpu system in figjting games is more barebones and require simplistic strats that people find boring, it's kinda too simon says.
post clears on hardest setting, shitter.
What a moronic spammer
?si=Ktq6SbV0MN1mae70
Low iq single player games require low iq shitter strats
>Most SNK bosses are just about finding a way to loop the AI
So.. like every arcade game? What's with the extraordinary mental gymnastics? Everything from Metal Slug to Strider is about exploiting the game's enemy AI.
>So.. like every arcade game?
If that's how you want to think of it, then understand that you're the one saying all arcade games are simple, not me. I'd never say looping a fighting game boss's AI is the same as beating something like Metal Slug.
>I'd never say looping a fighting game boss's AI is the same as beating something like Metal Slug.
But that's exactly what it is.
Put as many hours into playing Metal Slug as people put into playing fighting games and Metal Slug suddenly becomes "piss easy".
You're just going to keep acting like difficulty is completely subjective even when almost everyone finds other genres much more difficult, and there being extremely few standout difficult clears out of the hundreds of fighting games out there.
You're once again completely ignoring the time investment difference.
Time taken is one of the largest determining factors for difficulty. Someone like dumplechan barely plays fighting games but finds them very easy and has cleared 150+ with relative ease. Fighting games just don't really have any notoriously hard clears like other genres do. Playing against CPU in these games is just meant as a barebones training method for the real game against other players, so it's no surprise that it's easy and no one is going to care about your stack of fighting game clears because... you should just be playing PvP lol
>still posting about this literally who
okay we're just going to disregard everything you say from now on
>there being extremely few standout difficult clears out of the hundreds of fighting games out there.
It's the other way around.
There are several easy clears among the popular fighting games.
Mostly the latter era Capcom and Namco games.
All of the less popular games are challenging to clear. All of the ArcSys games for instance.
We're talking about arcade games moron. You already named 14 games that were supposed to be some of the hardest in the genre and most of them were rated as Low/Very Low difficulty by a player who barely even plays fighting games... you just are very new and inexperienced so have a very poor gauge of difficulty.
The amount of difficult fighting game clears is a drop in the bucket compared to shmups, beat em ups, run and guns, puzzle, or platformer.
Dumplechan has cleared 171 fighting games, and zero were High, one was Medium/High, seven were Medium, and the rest of the 163 were all Low/Medium or lower (with most being Very Low). It's truly just a genre for shitters, it's meant to be played PvP and it shows in the very low difficulty.
>STILL
Do you have OCD or something? Actual autism?
Post your fighting game clears, shitter.
Do you actually play arcade games yourself, or do you spend 100% of your time sucking e-celeb wiener?
Go buy a fricking ad.
It's impossible to have a discussion on this board sometimes. It really does seem like many posters here either just collect plastic garbage without playing it or just want to reminisce over games they haven't played in decades and barely remember
Do.
You.
Actually.
Play?
>have a discussion
All you have done so far is e-celeb worship. Not one post about your own experiences playing these games.
Sorry, but I don't have interest in farming fighting game shitclears for social credit.
You haven't made a single post about *any* kind of arcade game in terms of your own experiences.
Haven't mentioned one game you personally have cleared. What are *your* clears?
We have a massive spreadsheet documenting the difficulty of these games from a player with extensive arcade experience and hundreds of other clears to gauge the difficulty against, so why are you just ignoring that?
Once again: What are *YOUR* personal clears? The games (YOU) have completed the 1cc on?
Oh, I've posted them before, I'm not really interested in just spamming a giant wall of games when it isn't pertinent to the discussion.
Post them again.
>isn't pertinent to the discussion.
Anons have DEMANDED that you post them. And this isn't pertinent? Frick off.
>I don't have interest in
Translation: I'm bad at fighting games and have to cope about it.
I have a collective experience of about 20 minutes playing fighting games, I am just talking about more objectively big picture.
>I have a collective experience of about 20 minutes playing fighting games,
Then you are utterly unqualified to talk about the subject. And no amount of linking to lists by random youtubers will change that. Actually play the video games next time before arguing about them for 20 posts.
>barely even plays fighting games.
>has like 30 different fighting game 1cc's
>But that's exactly what it is.
Well, we just don't agree on that.
even as adults /vr/art huffers remember getting bullied in arcades by fgers and get salty over it
exhibit a
no one in history has given enough of a damn about 1ccs to 'pad' them by spending quarters playing games they don't like
I promise you that anyone who exclusively played single player fg's in the arcade would be the one being bullied by the fgers
You know single player in any of those games after 1992 exists solely for like, girls and babies who waddle into the arcade right
meanwhile Justin Wong enjoys playing single player fighting games. You gonna bully him and call him a scrub?
I'd like to see you try to 1cc Super Street Fighter II Turbo on level 8.
Didn't Daigo struggle to do this or something? I remember hearing something like that
Yes he did.
Also people post 1cc's in hardcore fighting game groups like the No Honor Crew, and the posters there praise the player. Posters who are all very hardcore tournament winning players.
The idea that FGC top players don't also play single player for fun and challenge is a myth.
if you actually believe people gets asshurt about someone else's fighting game 1ccs, I can assure you that people are 1cc'ing fighting games for padding/social credit
It's not padding. It's an arcade game. It counts.
A lot of them are not nearly as easy as you imply.
What makes fighting games easier is how much more fun it is to get good at them playing vs other humans. So you spend 50 hours playing vs people having fun, then easily go through and beat arcade mode. But you still spent 50 hours playing the game.
The same applies to beat'em ups and shmups. Spend a lot of hours getting the skills you need for the genre and you can start clearing more games in no time at all. Your first clear might take 50 hours, and then you finish the next game in the series in 10. Because you've gotten better at the genre.
This is also why people in the 90s were able to clear so many "hard" games. They were more used to the conventions of the genre than the average gamer is today.
There are many hundreds of fighting games that you can 1CC in a couple hours with very little fighting experience. Doesn't really apply to shmups or run and guns or beat em ups
>Hundreds
Maybe 30, mostly all late era Capcom and Namco games. And Tecmo, I suppose.
>very little fighting experience
No. Fighting games are very popular genre, more people have more experience in these games than other arcade games. Someone who starts from scratch is going to take quite a while to be able to 1cc a hard fighting game.
dumplechan has over 150 fighting game clears that are all marked very low or low difficulty.
Playing against CPU in a PvP genre to farm clears for social credit is pathetic. Actually challenge yourself homosexual.
I don't give a single rat's shit about who "dumplechan" is or how they rank fighting games.
The point is there are very, very few fighting game clears that are even moderately challenging, and you're already a homosexual for playing against a CPU in a PvP, especially when it's to farm babby tier clears
>the point is there are very, very few fighting game clears that are even moderately challenging
It's not as few as you seem to think it is.
And the challenging ones are the ones most fighting game players focus on.
>can't name any
The hardest fighting game clears (with rare exceptions of broken garbage like the general) can't even come close to the hardest shmup, beat em up, run and gun, or puzzle clears. It's a genre meant to be played PvP
post your VF2 hardest 1cc, shitter
Post literally any non-deathsmiles Cave 1cc. You won't, because the process of getting it would be a transformative one in which you realize single player fighting games are literally a side attraction meme. No one cares that Justin Wong made a video about fighting SF alpha akuma, he himself would tell you it is a side diversion compared to any remotely serious PvP
Why doesn't Deathsmiles count?
It's, by far, the easiest CAVE clear outside of novice modes on the ports.
Fatal Fury 1/2/Special
Art of Fighting 1/2
Super Street Fighter II X/Turbo
Mortal Kombat 2
King of Fighters 94/95
Virtua Fighter 1/2/3
Power Instinct 1/2
Keep in mind the arcade versions of many fighting games are much harder than their console versions. Super Turbo on console level 8 is about equivalent to arcade level 1 or 2. I think Virtua Fighter is a lot easier on console too. And any fighting game 1cc should be done on the hardest difficulty, that's the standard convention of fighting game 1cc'ers.
I'd add my own personal rule to make it a true challenge: complete the game with all characters.
When you do this it gets a lot harder to exploit the A.I. because you can't rely on a single broken move that the A.I. doesn't know how to react to.
Here is how Dumplechan ranks these
>Fatal Fury 1/2/Special
not rated, Very Low, Very Low
>Art of Fighting 1/2
Low, not rated, (3 is Very Low)
>Super Street Fighter II X/Turbo
not rated, (Street Fighter II is Low/Medium)
>Mortal Kombat 2
Low
>King of Fighters 94/95
Medium/High, Medium
>Virtua Fighter 1/2/3
Very Low, not rated, Very Low
>Power Instinct 1/2
Low, not rated
Overall, these clears are easy. Dumplechan barely even plays fighting games.
Anon, how many different times do you have to have other anons tell you no one cares about this person and their rankings?
Then stop recommending easy games as an example of difficult 1CCs
you're incoherent
>to farm babby tier clears
You can tell this anon is too young to have ever gone to arcades. No one spent quarters on games they didn't like trying to get one coin clears for the sake of 'padding the number of games they 1cced,' aka a meaningless unprovable stat you could only 'back up' by showing someone your initials in the arcade itself. Delusional larp
all of the players nowadays are on emulator. Arcades are dead and gone and have been for well over a decade
That was then, this is now. I'm not a slave to a bygone era. Why are you?
By that same logic claiming any number of 1cc's is pathetic. Play for score and actually challenge yourself, homosexual.
Many other genres actually have difficult survival challenges for those who either don't like scoring or for games where the scoring is not well designed or fun, fighting games don't
>fighting games don't
They literally do have survival modes, hidden bosses, extra endings...
Yes and 99% of them are pisseasy, see Dumplechan's clear list. They're basically just practice for PvP
Dumplechan, we don't give a shit about you.
>people get asshurt over that
Bet you didn't expect to be a prophet.
This thread went full moron so fast. How can people be so stupid? Holy shit
Either make a specific complaint or GTFO. Frick off with your vagueposting.
When you have a bunch of people fighting for the same shit for hours, adding to that the autofire schizo, you know you're on the circus. Welcome to the craziest clowns on /vr/ of today!
pfft, this is nothing. You some kind of pussy that can't handle a little banter?
Reminder if your clear doesn't meet at least one of these requirements
>at least med/high difficulty on Dumplechan's list
>at least 25 difficulty on Perikles or wikia shmup list
>at least an 8/10 difficulty from Scoop Arcade
>at least top 30 in Mariax's no-miss difficulty list
then it is a shitclear and you need to stop wading around in the kiddy pool and put your big boy pants on and clear an actual challenging game
Knowing any of these names is the epitome of cringe.
I don't know what any of those names means and, judging by the attitude in this thread, I prefer it that way.
Yeah, I'm getting a heavy whiff of discord here.
No bueno.
I know nothing about this topic, but I'm going to assume you're in the wrong by default with all this eceleb asslicking.
literally none of those people are ecelebs zoomie.
They are skilled players within the community who have compiled difficulty lists from thousands of hours of experience and hundreds of clears.
That's a long ass sentence to say they are ecelebs
kys
there are games that are literally impossible to 1 credit clear.
play arcade racers, shitters
I can beat those within a few hours of practice each, they don't count. Arcade racer clears are just padding your 1cc's.
>he thinks racing is about 1ccs
Pathetic
>look up this "dumplechan" list
>darius gaiden listed as medium/high with ABDGLQV route
Opinion completely relegated to the trashcan, t. Darius Gaiden lover. Game is easy as frick, especially on that route
>Game is easy as frick
You've lost all perspective, anon.
That game, even on what you regard as "easy" is still an extremely challenging game. It's just that you are a very skilled shmup player.
Just gives reference of how laughably easy fighting games are
more like 1 credit queer
What is a good "babbys first beatemup" (not to 1cc, just asking since this has become a general arcade arguing thread) for someone who likes shmups and fightans but never played any beatemups?
The Punisher, it's Final fight fundamentals but easier.
King of dragons is simple but fun.
Double Dragon and Golden Axe are easy but broken and not that fun.
Thanks bros, gonna see which of these looks the coolest in the "arcade demo screen" sense and dive in
try Night Slashers. Has a fun aesthetic, pretty simple, pretty short.
Final Fight 3 for SNES. It's tuned to console difficulty. Then go on to Streets of Rage 1/2/3.
Only then tackle true arcade beat'em ups.
I didn't feel Streets Of Rage 2 is that hard.
X-Men or Simpsons or Metamorphic Force or TMNT for Genesis/SNES for Konami
King of Dragons, Cadillacs and Dinosaurs, Aliens vs. Predator for Capcom
Streets of Rage 2 or 3 or Golden Axe for SEGA
Violent Storm, Night Slashers, Undercover Cops, Ninja Baseball Batman for a mix of different devs aside from the usual suspects
Just pick one and learn it, most are pretty straightforward.
>Metamorphic Force
Remember to play the Japanese original release. The international versions are much more difficult.
That applies to all of these, Simpsons, XMEN, Streets of Rage 3 also have Japanese changes that are obvious. For XMEN in particular, make sure you pick a version that has the HP pickups or it's a lot harder.
Playing versions outside your territory is cheating.
things that are cheating
>playing games outside your territory
>non-original controls
>playing games with a dedicated cab release on a non-dedicated cab
>emulators or FPGA
>console ports
>PC ports
>playing via supergun
>playing via jamma test rig
>playing via a "control box"
>playing via "conturoreru boxu"
>turbo fire
>auto fire
>continuous fire
>using guides
>watching videos
>getting advice online
>getting advice offline
>calling tip lines
>reading magazine articles
>watching other players
>free play
>having faster than average reaction time
>having better than 20/20 vision
>having very large hands
>having very small hands
>possessing more than an average innate talent at playing video games
>possessing skills acquired through playing other video games than the one in question
>living within closer than average distance to the arcade
>not being in the 80s or 90s
it's cool and i find it pretty impressive if you can do them. i just don't believe that 1CCs were a developer's intended design as an arcade game designed like that would make almost no money.
The idea is the 1cc is attainable but you have to spend a huge amount of money to get good enough at the game to achieve it.
A game with an unattainable 1cc is not worth playing because it's a fair challenge. It's just a bullshit game. So the developers must find a balance.
Also by the 90s arcade games were being designed with the notion they would eventually be ported to home consoles.
See
In shmups 1cc is the only way to keep youe score, in bmups 1cc get you secret endings etc.
>in bmups 1cc get you secret endings
Name 3.
Final Fight
Powered Gear
Tower of Doom
And pretty much all good arcade beat 'em ups were inspired by Capcom so...
Thanks. Do you know any others? NGL this has changed my view.
What a bunch of morons
The moron spamming "shitter" and demanding footage like a madman deserve the rope.
clear shitter post
post clears
These threads deserve to be dogshit. Frick you.
Viewpoint. Neo geo mvs. 1cc. Real hardware on a candy cab.
I'm so prouuuuuuuuuud <3
But which difficulty setting?
It's just a no death challenge from other games. In the same way I don't think you have to hold the speedrun world record to have a valid opinion on a game, you don't have to be able to clear a game with zero continues to be able to give your opinion. There's degrees of success when playing a game, people can still provide valuable opinions on what they like and dislike about a game if they've used no continues, a few continues, or a lot, but they're all approaching the topic from different places.
If we went by this metric, the only game I could ever offer an opinion on would be Super Metroid because I used to hold the world record for GT classic. Holding the record doesn't mean the other people running GT classic don't have valuable input, it just means I happen to have the top clear at the time.
Memerunning isn't the same as a clear, and console genres aren't the same as arcade games.
I don't see why it's not. The question was if [person who plays the game better than others] has a more valid opinion on the game. The answer is not entirely, each player sees various aspects of the game and may have insight on specific things that higher skilled players do not, and thus it's worth hearing what they have to say and evaluating it on its own merits.
There will always be someone of higher skill than others, so drawing an arbitrary line in the sand (Which usually happens to be the bar said line-drawer has cleared) is not helpful for gaining a complete understanding of a game.
The problem is you think 1cc is some kind of WR memerunning cheevo, which isn't the case, it was the expected way to clear a game back in the arcades, they are short games meant to be played skillfully in one go and get better over time.
Ports with limited credits (3-4) are acceptable too
So what's wrong with playing the arcade version of Final Fight in 4 credits, since the Sega CD version has 4 continues?
Then you'll be playing by the rules of an inferior version and the devs will not give you good boy points.
If you like a game you'll naturally want to get better at it and endure, instead of being desperate to "beat it", beating for the sake of beating is kinda modern/console game design.
The Sega CD version is nearly identical to the arcade version.
That's because you didn't play the arcade enough. More faithful than the snes version? yes, a replacement over the arcade? Frick no.
I've played both. I never said it was a replacement, I said it was nearly identical. There's not a significant enough difference that would make using 4 credits in the arcade version significantly different than using all 4 continues in the Sega CD version.
>nearly identical
If you have low gameplay standards.
>There's not a significant enough difference that would make using 4 credits in the arcade version significantly different than using all 4 continues in the Sega CD version.
It's better than using infinite continues at least, but you are only doing this because you want to "beat the game" without the effort. Also no secret ending for weakgays
In the case of a console port, assuming good accuracy, would the amount of continues in the port not be a good indication of the "intended" amount of credits players are expected to use to beat the game?
It's intended for console players so of course it'll be more lenient, but in arcades jap devs always had one credit play in mind, be it in scores, secret 1cc ending or even not allowing continues as a dipswitch option.
What incentive would an arcade have to disable continues, considering they make money for every continue?
It's not common for continues to be off, but if you think about it, "hardcore" players are the ones that keep the business alive, so if the only way to clear the game is to 1cc, you'll have to practice a fricking in order to beat it, making it very replayable.
Also it's a reminder from devs that the game can be played that way, it's how arcade games started (and genres like racing games still are like this).
Oh also some Sega games like Eswat disable continues on the last stage for the same reason, you can't pay your lack of skills to beat it.
If devs intended the games to be played without continues, and only included continues in ports to be "more lenient" for console players, why are there many console-exclusive games that do not have continues or passwords? If the arcade games were intended not to have continues, why go out of their way to include them in the port?
You are going in circles, again it's the playerbase difference, arcade players tend to strive for skill and perseverance while console players just want to be done with the game. Skillful play is what make arcade games replayable and addicting.
>why are there many console-exclusive games that do not have continues or passwords?
These are mostly old 80s games still heavily inspired by arcade game design.
That's still not answering my question. If arcade games were designed around 1CCs, why were continues included in console ports, when many console-exclusive games did not have continues and many console gamers were already accustomed to games without continues? In addition, why do many arcade games have continue screens that are clearly trying to make the player continue as much as possible, like Final Fight having a bomb about to go off or Ninja Gaiden having a chainsaw slowly lowering onto Ryu's chest?
>why do many arcade games have continue screens that are clearly trying to make the player continue as much as possible, like Final Fight having a bomb about to go off or Ninja Gaiden having a chainsaw slowly lowering onto Ryu's chest?
To manipulate dumb kids like u, meanwhile 1cc chads were rewarded with praise from the devs.
That kid who recently "beat" Tetris was also praised by the dev, that doesn't mean the dev intended everyone to beat Tetris.
Comparing Tetris' golden era looping game design to Final Fight is kind of dumb, anon.
I'm saying that if players do something commendable, of course the devs are going to praise them. But that doesn't mean the devs intended everyone to put that same amount of effort into it. Devs praise speedrunners all the time but you can be damn sure they didn't intend their 20-30 hours game to be completed in an hour and a half. You already have quotes from the Gradius devs earlier in this thread saying they didn't even test if they could completely the game on one credit. Everything points towards the intention being to make the player want to continue because it makes the arcade money.
>I'm saying that if players do something commendable, of course the devs are going to praise them. But that doesn't mean the devs intended everyone to put that same amount of effort into it.
Black person it's a fricking ending included in the released game when you 1cc it, stop making pathetic excuses.
I'm not talking specifically about Final Fight, and including a bonus for dedicated players does not in any way imply that the devs intended for every player to be as dedicated. If 1CC'ing the game was just the intended way to play it, they wouldn't bother differentiating it with a special ending in the first place.
It's the intended way for anyone with genuine interest in a game, the rest can just play like morons and throw their money while not engaging only to be done with it, yeah.
Would wanting to see what's in the next stage or beyond the next boss not be considered "genuine interest" in the game?
In an arcade game yes, shit's not a movie where you just passively receive information, it's all your reaction to the game's challenges.
I genuinely think you're missing a core pillar of arcade game design if you blatantly ignore all of the design elements specifically set in place to elicit the urge to insert another coin. Every single aspect of the difficulty is designed around this.
>I genuinely think you're missing a core pillar of arcade game design if you blatantly ignore all of the design elements specifically set in place to elicit the urge to insert another coin.
Pure dunning-cruger. Again these game are most profitable when you put value to one credit skilled play, because there is value to losing and winning. If you just credit feed like a moron you never engage in proper losing/winning conditions and will lose interest after your first play because you are not engaging at all.
Actually they're at their most valuable when you have people spamming credits because they suck and can't handle the stage they're on, so they keep dying repeatedly no matter how many credits they put in, and eventually they give up only to come back the next day and try again. As opposed to the person who puts in a single credit, gives it a few runs, then comes back the next day and gets further in fewer credits. The latter is literally diminishing returns.
This is what zoomers think, but the reality is these kids weren't arcade regulars and rarely went wasting their mom's money on arcade games.
What made arcade profitable were hardcore junkies playing all day wanting to get better and better, stuff like fighting games are the perfect arcade design, because the best players are rewarded with playing for a long time while the worse players use lots of money to get better. Racing games are also profitable because they are short and have skill-based replay value.
Yup. The proverbial quarter feeding kid, if he even got more than 5 bucks to spend, was going to an arcade 1-2 times a year for birthday parties, not 3-7 times a week like the autismos
>people spamming credits because they suck and can't handle the stage they're on, so they keep dying repeatedly no matter how many credits they put in, and eventually they give up only to come back the next day and try again.
These people are extremely rare because they turn into the second type of people you mentioned very quickly. Back in the 80s and 90s anyone who went to an arcade more than once a month realized continuing is a sucker move. You maximize your play time by starting from the beginning every time.
Suck my dick.
>why do many arcade games have continue screens that are clearly trying to make the player continue as much as possible, like Final Fight having a bomb about to go off or Ninja Gaiden having a chainsaw slowly lowering onto Ryu's chest?
Those are for the suckers who don't realize they aren't getting a good deal when they continue.
Because "the devs" are not one entity.
Continues are turned off when there's high turnover in the arcade. You don't want people waiting in line for their turn while someone credit feeds to the end. That's no fun for them.
This was useful in the early days of a game's release when there was a lot of hype around the game.
>it was the expected way to clear a game back in the arcades
Nope. Not dying at all was the ultimate test. Even if 1 credit gave you 2 or 3 lives. Not dying once was the ultimate showoff.
>Ports with limited credits (3-4) are acceptable too
Nope. Ports were inferior to arcade versions until the PS2 came out. And even then, some arcade versions were still better.
>Ports were inferior to arcade versions until the PS2 came out.
Name a single port for any console whose input lag is the same or lower than PCB. Even the best PS2 ports still have an extra frame.
There's no point. You are agreeing with me.
Most of the previous-gen arcade ports released for the ps1 and saturn.
>showoff
This isn't a narcissism contest, it's about the standards for clearing an arcade games. For competition the only objective factor is score or times for racing games.
>Competition
>Not showing off
You compete to prove your superiority and dominance to others, showing off is part of it. You're entirely trying to show that you can achieve something your competitors can't. If everyone could achieve something, it wouldn't be very impressive.
>competition is related to showing off
That's what I said, my point was that just clearing the game isn't tied to competition nor showing off.
>Ports were inferior to arcade versions until the PS2 came out
That is not true at all. Lurk more.
The PS2 generation was clearly the turning point. Don't lie.
No, it wasn't. You are ignorant of the many good arcade ports released for the ps1 and saturn. These were ports of older arcade games that the systems could handle with ease.
>it's another shitterposter anon has an unironic meltdown when anybody doesn't conform to his very narrow-minded viewpoint of how people should play arcade games thread
Was it literal autism?
which shitposter?
Shitt*er*poster, not shitposter. The guy who is obsessed with autofire 1CCs played via MAME. He'll carry on about Japanese superplayers and how he's an expert on arcade culture, despite never once having set foot in an arcade, in US or Japan.
>t. zero clears and fuming
You're too poor to afford the things you supposedly love and are too socially maladjusted to even go to an actual arcade.
Western arcades are garbage. If I was to do anything, it would be a MiSTercade, but that's a lot of work and headache and will require a lot of adjustment from my current setup so I've just kept putting it off.
>Western arcades are garbage
Dead wrong.
And at the rate things are going western arcades are going to surpass Japanese arcades soon, by some standards they already have.
Do you live in alternate dimension? Seriously what the frick are you even on about? There are hardly any western arcades and the few that exist are mostly shitty barcades with nothing but Golden Era games and a pitifully low high score table. Anyone in the west who gives a shit about arcade games plays on MAME or has an at-home setup.
You're behind the times, anon. Do some searching and researching on the subject, you may be pleasantly surprised. Unless you're that one anon who refuses to drive more than 10 minutes away from him house. Can't help that guy.
>by some standards they already have.
Alright moron, name even just one standard by which they have.
More original dedicated cabinets with their original controls compared to Japan where usually all the 80s and early 90s games are in 29" Astro City or equivalent style cabs.
That's a disadvantage. Candy cabs and LS-32 are far superior to shitty stand up cabs and loose poorly maintained bat top sticks.
You can't even barely search for arcades, 95% of your results will be shit like Dave N Busters and Chuck E Cheese type places with ticket games and laser tag and stupid shit like that instead of actual arcades.
I'm sure I could find a couple arcades with maybe a couple cabs I'm interested in that are 30 minutes away, but again, why the frick would I drive out of my way to play a pitiful selection of games on a shitty, poorly maintained stand up cab? I don't fricking care. I don't basedface over plastic like you morons do
That's right, little buddy, your way is the only right way.
>You can't even barely search for arcade
You haven't even tried.
>he thinks arcade = stick and button games
*sucks teeth*
>You can't even barely search for arcades, 95% of your results will be shit like Dave N Busters and Chuck E Cheese type places with ticket games and laser tag and stupid shit like that instead of actual arcades
It's clear you haven't been to a arcade in years. Round One has modern Japanese Vewlix cabinets imported directly from Japan. Many loaded with fighting games and classic games like Neo Geo, Metal. Slug, and even other shmups. The controls aren't shitty and are the same stuff Japanese players use
Oh hell yeah dude, let me drive five hours to play slowdown ridden Metal Slug games without autofire and with a stick when I play full speed, with autofire, and use a pad. That would totally be worth it bro!!
Just shut the frick up man, no one fricking cares. In the time it takes to make a daytrip there, I could literally set up an entire mistercade or mamecade in my own fricking home if it was a big deal to me
I don't think you actually like arcades at all.
Even in Japan you'd be disappointed.
>Complains that Western cabinet joysticks are old and broken
>Is shown a brand new cabinet
>moves the goalposts and Complains that he doesn't like using a stick.
Yep. No helping this guy. Everyone ignore him.
No one is using those cabinets to play classic arcade games (for good reason). They are for modern live service arcade games that are mobile-tier slop
Vewlix cabinets are can work with numerous games. Many people load different games on these cabs They aren't just for "modern live service arcade games". You are just digging for any excuse. It's pathetic. Just stop.
Samegayging this hard. You could at least wait longer before replying to yourself.
>No one is using those cabinets to play classic arcade games (for good reason).
You're wrong since I've seen it. But yes please tell us your reason.
>No one is using those cabinets to play classic arcade games (for good reason).
How would you know when you admit you never go there?
>classic games like Neo Geo, Metal. Slug, and even other shmups.
>posts a shitty LCD exa arcadia cab
Holy shit you're moronic, have you ever even played SDOJ once in your life?
at this point I'm not sure if your posts are satire
That's Exa Arcadia, it's new shitty arranges of arcade games on a laggy LCD screen.
A huge appeal of playing on cabinet is the big CRT screen, with superior motion handling and input latency.
Yeah these things feel like garbage, especially if you have the muscle memory on a game like this required to actually sit down at an arcade and bang out a good run. Just not worth it with 2024 alternatives
I'm not talking about the Exa Arcadia cabinets. I'm talking about your entire mindset.
>laggy LCD screen.
LCDs haven't been laggy since the mid 2000s. Where have you been? Your info is super old and out of date. Modern arcade monitors are all flat screen and work very well. They use them in esports too.
Those 60Hz LCD screens are. High refresh rate VRR monitors are a lot better. And the motion handling is still trash, yes even OLED, due to no strobing
>due to no strobing
How does it feel to live in 2014?
Yeah dude these shitty arcade monitors are totally using BFI
Frick off moron. Yes, LCD screens have limited strobing capabilities like BFI not as good as CRT, these monitors they use aren't that. I'd be surprised if they're anything but fixed 60Hz monitors. Prioritizing responsiveness is just not a priority for modern gaming
>You're too poor to afford the things you supposedly love and are too socially maladjusted to even go to an actual arcade.
This
>Western arcades are garbage.
You haven't even visited a real well maintained arcade in decades. Your last experience was when you were a child at Chuck E Cheese
>stand-up cabs
>very limited selection
>shitty, loose bat top sticks
>western versions of games with non-default settings
>dirty and greasy and not regularly cleaned
>have to travel hours out of my way to play in an inferior way
Nah, I'm good bro. And I don't even play on stick anyways.
If I ever visited Japan, I would definitely check out some arcades, but I could have Galloping Ghost in my backyard and still wouldn't give a shit.
Lmao.
I don't emulate or use screen recorders. I play the old school way like my ancestors did.
Get on my level.
Ok you win the thread for how awesome that is.
I came to to this thread to say that's an awesome setup. Good job keeping that arcade cabinet running. It's like 30 years now. The 1cc autofire anon just got mauled by your post. Don't expect him to respond. You play everything old school and he can't compete against that.
>this guy spent money on (some very cool) cabs so his opinion on autofire is more valuable
lol I'd call you a samegay but I know there are so many morons like you on this board
If that anon can 1cc metal slug on an old arcade candy cab , then it's much more amazing than you doing it on mame with autofire turned on.
No one disagrees with individual runs being harder, even through gay means like mashing, without autofire. My point is that one guy preferring to play that way doesn't really mean anything to anyone. It's niche autism and there's a reason 98% of people who still engage with the genre prefer to not deal with it
keep seething shitter. he has more than 100 no-miss clears, this is more valuable than any cab and makes his opinion about autofire the most relevant one.
Post videos.
cut the fake interest bullshit. no one watches replays
>open video
>click to end
>check if last digit of score is 0 or not
>click through random points of video before to make sure you used 0 continues and not 10
Wow, that sure is a huge burden to test the veracity of a very significant claim. Even if you TA'd through the game, it would be so much work to play for survival for the time it would take to create the TAS/splice the save states that it would reflect some level of skill.
if last digit of score is 0 or not
only a few games do that lol, what a poser moron you are. clear a couple games of your own before demanding of others
>only a few games do that lol
every single day more Gankerermins who don't like or play retro games spill into this board, but why?
Name 20 games that do that
>Name 20 games that do that
When will you learn that nobody is your servant here.
it's something that was only prevalent starting in early-mid 90s, and even then, most games don't do it.
It's very strange to talk about how you will pan through a replay to see a 1 added to the score and how you don't care if a run is TASed. It's just completely tone-deaf if you are someone that actually plays and clears these games. From that one statement alone, you have outed yourself as a shitter with no clears
Sadly I don't have many clears |on video anyway, that whole no pix no proof. My only on video 1cc was vampire Saviors, I get so close on Garou but Butt always wrecks me with Rock.
Every good western shmup player watches replays because you are pissing your time away trying to make up a route in any near-solved game (see: any cave title) when a conglomerate of nips have already laid the groundwork for you
>constantly calls other people zero clear shitters
>constantly argue that any method of gameplay other than "MAME + keyboard + autofire + 1CC only + savestate practice" is either illegitimate or unworthy of praise
>refuses to link to a single one of his clears
I fully understand not wanting to share your personal shit on Ganker, but when you act like an insufferable turd who refuses to acknowledge any playstyle besides your own, to the point that anybody who posts in these threads can identify you within a single post, you should try to have something to back up your claims. Hell, even an annotated list or something would be better than nothing.
Who said you have to play on keyboard? Who said you have to use save state practice? Who said you have to 1CC every game you play? Who said you have to post links to a video of your clear?
You're just being called out for being a no clears shitter, nothing more. You don't need to deflect to "b-b-b-but this poster didn't post a full catalogue of their clears!!". You are a shitter, you don't have clears, so your opinion is irrelevant. Simple as that.
So you're a no clears homosexual calling other people no clears shitters. Got it.
No, I have almost a hundred no miss clears at this point, with posted videos. I don't feel the need to prove anything or seek validation from some random shitter.
Sure you do, champ.
He literally posted it online months ago for you homosexuals to see already. If you don't even know who the frick you're replying to, then shut the frick up nonplayer no clear shitter
Sure, kiddo.
Is that really yours, or are you just shitposting? I have a couple candy cabs, but one of those 50" rear projection cabs is something I'd love to have, even though I have absolutely no space for one at this point.
Anon, look at all the follow-up posts.
Are you moronic? It's fricking amazing setup.
You are just jealous because he has an top tier setup and you use your computer with a wimpy emulator.
OG hardware is number #1 when it comes to respect.
Even the Japanese agree.
Cabanon, no one is bashing your setup, everyone in the thread seems to agree it is quite nice regardless of opinions on other matters.
I think you meant to say Cabron, and his setup sucks a golf ball through a garden hose.
I'm jealous. I only have a small Chinese Century candy cab. You have my dream setup.
I am impressed. I haven't seen a Neo 50 in a long ass time. Maybe even decades. If you 1CC on that then you are probably the best in the thread.
1cc culture and MAME have been intertwined for 20+ years. It's disingenuous of you to imply otherwise.
>1cc culture
>arcade culture
Which is it?
Two different things, 1cc being a subset of arcade.
>Do you think that you can give an opinion of a game before you have achieved the "1 credit clear"?
Time investment means a lot more. The thing is that while better players have stronger fundamentals they've built up from years of practice, their routes in a new game will usually be worse. This is because they will take unnecessary risks that aren't actually risks to a player of their caliber, or use their skills to get themselves out of bad situations that were avoidable. Whereas a worse player will need a solid plan for every little thing, since every little thing is a threat to them.
Think about it - if you played a CAVE super easy novice mode right now, you'd do all sorts of weird, unnecessarily risky things, not because you don't know what to do, but because the game is so easy for you that you can frick around and get away with it. Then if your grandma tried to copy your replay thinking you used the best possible strategies, she would struggle because she doesn't know how to do half the things you do. You can scale that up to any level of play.
So a newer player who has 50 hours in a game they haven't yet cleared and an experienced player who cleared it in an afternoon both have opinions worth merit.
>What are your thoughts "1 credit clearing" games?
It's something for arcade games
>Do you think that you can give an opinion of a game before you have achieved the "1 credit clear"?
What a stupid question.
Any suggestions for fun light gun games to 1cc?
The House of the Dead is the only lightgun game I've 1CCd, real hardware with lightgun. The last stage is definitely the hardest, but if you manage to save every scientist, you get bonus health in the final stage. Magician, the final boss, is very difficult.
I beat Time Crisis 3 in a single credit at a Tilt when it was still around, I think the arcade owner was visibly upset about it. I put in a credit and played for almost an hour, finishing the entire game in an almost empty arcade.
I think from his perspective, his Tilt was closing due to not being profitable anymore and the machines being sold, some college student who could come in and virtually play for free was like having the rug pulled out from under him. Just when he finally got a customer to stuff money into a machine, it was the equivalent of a customer who bought a single coffee and sat in the shop for four hours just taking up space.
I still really miss Time Crisis though, I did buy it on console but I no longer have a CRT to play it on.
>What are your thoughts "1 credit clearing" games?
I know this is a cop-out, but I think you have to look at them on a case-by-case basis.
There are plenty of arcade and arcade-style games that give you a bad ending if you use continues and a good ending if you don't. (e.g. Strikers 1945) I'd say that clearly communicates the intent that you haven't beaten the game until you've 1CC'd it.
On the other hand, there are games like Pachinko Sexy Reaction which are extremely luck-based, and it's unclear whether any amount of skill or practice would allow a player to consistently 1CC. That appears to communicate the intent that getting to the end of the game is sufficient to beat it, no matter how many credits are used.
Then there are games that are in between. Most quiz games fall into this category. Certainly there is more to them than luck-- if nothing else it is possible to brute force memorize the answers-- but my perception is that these games expect players of all skill levels to invest multiple credits to reach the ending.
Ultimately arcade games are like golf. You aren't really competing against anyone else- just yourself and the course, and trying to do better than you did last time. If you're doing that and having fun, you're winning, whether you've "won" yet or not.
>Do you think that you can give an opinion of a game before you have achieved the "1 credit clear"?
If you've tried to 1CC a game a hundred times and haven't done it yet, I think your opinion of that game is worth a lot.
Only considering the opinions of people who have beaten a game opens you up to survivorship bias. There is much of value to be learned from people who valiantly struggle and fail, especially with more difficult games.
However, if you've only failed, say, ten times, I think you should withhold judgment beyond giving your first impressions. Try everything you can think of and then some, and see if that works before you let your thoughts calcify.
Don't use autofire, save states, speed hacks, inferior console ports, inaccurate emulation, or unofficial controllers. If you can do that, then it's a true 1cc. Simple as that.
>autofire is le bad
see
dumb shitter
I play without autofire all the time. I literally have an arcade down the street from where I live with high quality cabinets. So maybe you're just bad. Get on my level.
post clears shitter
It's an Arcade you dummy. An ARCADE. You know where people have to actually leave their house and visit in-person? I'm not emulating and using screen recorders. Lmao. I play on real cabinets. I can't believe I have to explain it to you.
>moron who has never cleared a game thinks his opinion matters
you can play with a fricking dance pad, no one cares if you game over in stage 2. actual players have all universally agreed upon autofire and it's been like that for 30+ years
the people who think autofiring is cheating/not ubiquitous are just the arcade extension of the weird anti-being-good-at-games mentality that has existed on Ganker since 2007. hard to put into words what i mean but it needs to be studied
Autofire is fine for 1CC. But people who do 1CC with full manual controls are much more impressive that autofire shitters.
It's like the difference between professional drivers who use automatic transmission VS manual transmission. Using manual is way more impressive.
Strange way to cope with zero clears.
You are the type of guy who plays Daytona USA with automatic transmission. Then gets upset when people laugh at your track times.
You are the type of guy to have zero clears and be blissfully unaware that autofire has been the norm for longer than you have been alive
Says the literal zoomer.
>no u
Lmao. Do better.
>autofire has been the norm for longer than you have been alive
I'm not denying autofire. Learn to read. I'm saying people who don't use it for 1CC runs are better than you.
>people who don't use it for 1CC runs are better than you.
The only people who don't use autofire are geriatric western boomers who game over in stage 2 and go "yep, I still got it". You have Stockholm syndrome from inferior western arcade design and still defend it to this day. Just move on.
Stop lying.
Just leave him alone, he clearly has genuine autism and derives his entire sense of worth from his very particular method of playing arcade games. He is entirely unwilling to admit that anything he does is inauthentic to "arcade culture" because it would undermine his entire sense of being.
So anybody going to explain how, in an arcade culture which is apparently nothing but hardcore gamers who only care about 1CCs and tournament play, Terminator 2 managed to do so well (even in Japanese arcades), despite being an obviously unfair lifedraining quartermuncher?
Terminator 2 was a fun game based on a blockbuster movie. People who got good at the game practiced it a lot in arcades until it became muscle memory.
The game is literally impossible for a human to 1CC.
It made money because it's a flashy game based on a very famous franchise that looks fun to casualgays who occasionally visit an arcade. It has little to do with the type of arcade culture this thread is about.
You all will hate me for saying this but:
"Arcade culture" and actual brick and mortar arcades have not been synonymous for many, many years now. And I mean MANY. Like even going back to the mid-90s. When we (hopefully we) were teens and kids playing ports of arcade games on ps1 and saturn, slightly inferior as they were, was when the arcade culture stopped being about the commercial arcade itself. It became a game design philosophy that branched off the rest of video gaming, such that games started being described as "arcade style" even if they never had an actual arcade release.
tbqh I think the switchover happened even earlier than the ps1 and saturn
So there's literally only one place over 30 mins away that's a bar with like 20 Golden Era cabs, that has maybe 3 games I would be even remotely interested in.. man what a bustling arcade scene. I just love driving over an hour round trip to pay to play an incredibly barebones selection of poorly maintained cabs.
Maybe it would be a good excuse to leave the house?
Not all of us are NEETs or WFH leeches you know
You're the one talking like driving 30 minutes is some huge burden.
30 minutes is fricking nothing.
People who actually leave their homes will drive that distance to any random store or service they have an interest in and consider it local. Even in the biggest cities in the world you don't have everything 10 frickin' minutes away from you.
30 minutes for a rundown piece of shit waste of time? It's like if the only food you had around was a Denny's 30 minutes away. Why the frick would you bother when you have good food at home?
>30 minutes for a rundown piece of shit waste of time?
Show us pictures of what you are calling a POS. How do you know the controls are busted if you haven't actually tested them?
So, for the 1CCgays, do lightgun 1CCs "count" or not?
>So, for the 1CCgays, do lightgun 1CCs "count" or not?
Yes, they count. But again it has to be done on original hardware.
Don't be attaching hacked guns with autofire if the game didn't come with it. Or adding a reload button to The gun when you were supposed to shoot off screen to reload.
It depends on the game. Some of them are designed for a 1cc; some of them just want your money.
Depends on the game. Some are a massive pain in the ass to the point I'd rather just use passwords or credit feed.
I hate zoomer shitstains and their soulless obsession with "clearing games" like they're a checklist for a discord badge so much.
It only upsets you because you are unable to do it and it exposes your fake interest. If you don't clear games, you shouldn't even be posting here. Frick off to Ganker or reddit or wherever the gays congregate to basedface over their collections of plastic they don't play
So beating games is now considered soulless?
On the other side of the coin, you got zoomers who will beat games in under 30 minutes via exploits.
To be fair if you're 17 in an arcade in 1994 you're only thinking "oh cool, videogame"
If you're 20 and emulating in 2024 there's some pressure to get a game over with so you can see what the other 15 in the series are like
Pretty much this. Games are meant to be fun. If you find 1CCing fun, great. If you don't, then don't bother, just enjoy the game. It's so weird to see people talking about clearing their game backlog like it's a fricking job they need to complete. I guess zoomers who grew up with esports and streamers have a different view of gaming than prior generations who view it as a fun past time and/or a timekilling challenge and not a job.
If you were old enough to have played at least the SNES when it was current, you should frick off to /v with all the other poser zoomers.
>esports and streamers
Too recent, more likely it's memory cards becoming cheap and widespread instead of an addon to certain oversized RPG cartridges
Kingdom Hearts games level 1 critical mode are "hard" but everything you beat is guaranteed progress.
If you grow up with the option to attempt a boss 500 times without needing to redo the entire game from scratch every 3, or less, attempts of those 500, all that redoing will seem like a mindless chore before you get to do what you "want" to
Aiming for 1CC completely changes how you play arcade games, and I find it to be fun.
>Do you think that you can give an opinion of a game before you have achieved the "1 credit clear"?
If you've tried for 1CC seriously and weren't able to reach it but still played a lot, yes, you can give your opinion. But I would never listen to opinions about beat em ups or shmups from someone who doesn't try for 1CC at all.
More or less this, at least in terms of game balance. Anybody can evaluate graphics, sound, and how much fun the game is to play without ever attempting to 1CC it. Like a lot of people seem to like the Revolution X arcade game despite it being unclearable without credit feeding.
Similarly I would evaluate how the person plays the game. If somebody 1CCs DDR with a controller or keyboard or 1CCs arcade Virtua Cop with a mouse, their opinion on the gameplay is entirely irrelevant, since that's so far removed from the originally intended gameplay method that they're effectively playing a different game.
I'm back to working on my 1cc of DoDonpachi. can get to the hall of hell in level 5, but then I get filtered. how do I beat it reliably bros??
play C-S, use your shot more than laser
practice and watch some replays, and learn the boss so you dont need to bomb
move up. that's it really.
it will kill stuff almost instantly, and you'll have a lot more room to dodge.
and use C-S yeah.
How hard is arcade Macross when it comes to 1CC? Had this game for years but haven't put a whole lot of time into it.
sad thread
I'd only do it with a game I already absolutely loved even on the level of quarter munching, setting out to do it in a game I don't even really know yet is speed runner troony brain
Yes, but it's still important to set limitations for yourself while playing an arcade game, because if you just credit feed from start to finish you're not really engaging with the game's challenges and mechanics at all.
I think 1CCs should be seen as the ultimate challenge of a game (unless the game does something to reward your efforts like Violent Storm which puts you into a "Violent Round" which just makes the game harder and changed enemy and background colors.)
the games were mostly designed to suck money out of you and not to excel in gameplay, of course there has to be some overlap or nobody would throw in another quarter
you can do this for free now with nearly every game designed for the arcades
those are the thoughts
Frankly, most games aren't fun or interesting enough to warrant the time and effort to getting a 1CC. Get a fricking life.
>Do you think that you can give an opinion of a game before you have achieved the "1 credit clear"?
Black and white thinking like this isn't a good discussion. It just makes everyone stupidier. Obviously your a ability to give an opinion relative to your 1cc clear is shades of grey. What about the guy who died with 1 hit left on the last boss to finish the 1cc? You going to say he's like someone who played the game for 5 minuets, as someone who can't give an opinion? How about a guy who only did the first 2 levels but has a lot of experience with the genre? Isn't his opinion greater than someone for whom this is their first 1cc?
Like just think about what you are typing actually makes any sort of sense before posting. And the people responding are just as bad. You'll actually get stupidier if you stick with this level of sloppiness in language.
As long as you are playing 1 credit runs and puttting some time to learn the game you are fine even without a clear, the problem is where you are an opinionated adhd flailer.
>How about a guy who only did the first 2 levels but has a lot of experience with the genre? Isn't his opinion greater than someone for whom this is their first 1cc?
No, having some genres fundamental isn't the same as having specific knowledge about a game, and the guy 1cc'd the game already learnt a bunch of those fundamentals by going for a 1cc.
1CC isn't possible without cheats or savestates.
And autofire
I don't think 1cc objectively matters. If you had asked me in the past I'd say yes, but now that I've played far more games I'd say no.
I 1cc'd Double Dragon and Golden Axe recently and my opinion of the games didn't change at all. I can't 1cc Final Fight yet because the last stage is getting me but I can tell, having beaten the game many times, figuring out how to cheese it won't change my mind there either.
It's all just bragging about finding the cheesy gimmick. It's just a weird puzzle where you try stuff and develop trivial muscle memory until the trick clicks. Like oh, you have to backstep that one attack and elbow. Okay, now I went from not being able to do it at all to taking no damage. Cool. So skilled.
who cares
Some games are not really well designed as "1cc" games. Namely games that kill you when some obstacle appears on the screen and you have no escape. Or games that are virtually unwinnable if you lose a life and lose your powerups at a certain point of the game. Those games are designed, or undesigned, for the player to keep feeding coins until they memorize and route the entire game.
Other, newer games, are designed with a lot more skill based, open ended play in mind. Those games typically require you to npt just 1cc but also meet extra requirements to basically get a true ending. They are designed for score running.
You don't have to 1cc, but if all you do is credit feed and continue to the end of those latter games you are a casual. There's nothing wrong with being a casual but it's what you are. The games are designed with autists in mind, they are just simple enough to pick up and play for anyone.
Nah, those are all designed as 1cc games, you are just a shitter
>that kill you
>you have no escape
>you have no escape
>lose your powerups
So which games are these that (You) suck at and are projecting about?
I assume he's talking about Gradius.
>What are your thoughts "1 credit clearing" games?
It must be done on original hardware with no mods. No special controller with a turbo button either. Otherwise it doesn't count as 1cc.