If we're talking about the current state with Next Order: Ditching the Humans and the linear story they bring along. Have you ever played Chibi-Robo? Something like that where it's several small plotlines is the way it should be.
I'm going to repeat my idea of each egg being a separate character and you unlock them by recruiting more notable digimon who will help you directly instead of getting a job.
fuse both World and Story series, Cyber Sleuth tried but there's still room for improvement
That is impossible and will make Cyber Shit worse somehow. Frick you and frick that game.
But the scope of the world series far exceeds the v-pets, since it has a world to explore. The life cycle mechanics gets in the way of the exploration in a way that makes the player naturally resent the mechanic. The first digimon world attempted to minimize this problem by making a compact world that is never to far away from your main base, but the contradiction between the two mechanics is still evident.
>But the scope of the world series far exceeds the v-pets
Because it's a video game, they tried making a super port of the v-pets and it kinda sucked. So on the next go, they took all that toy lore and used it. >The life cycle mechanics get in the way of the exploration in a way that makes the player naturally resent the mechanic
Be honest and just say you resent it. And this is your opinion. This intellectual fluff is unnecessary.
Anyway, I want to skip ahead to the part where we agree to disagree. Because I know this going to end up in a back-and-forth where I argue a lot of the flaws with lifespan aren't because it's a necessarily bad mechanic but an unmastered one and you argue otherwise. It's the first game of it's kind so no one making it really knew how to work with it. And no one today knows either because there are barely any games trying to be Digimon World.
Also it's one of those things where I do believe half the people who don't like it just suck at the game or are scared of time limits like a sissy.
No, I like it because it’s familiar to me and I love Digimon.
Whoever, I can take a step back and realise that new players will resent it. That and how hard it is to balance in an RPG/Adventure game.
What if they made it so all mons inside the city age normally, while areas outside the city are corrupt with malice that causes rapid aging. Have it so instead of your Digimon dying of old age, it retires to the city and helps around with specific jobs depending on its own specialty, while you go on an adventure with a new mon.
This way there's technically still a life cycle, as you stop using your old mon and move on to a new one, but you don't deal with the heartache, as well as you actually make city progress upon starting a new cycle (so you're rewarded for having a long lived pet). They could still keep death in the game though, by having too many care mistakes or lose too many battles. That way the game can still punish you for neglect.
As an aside, this would also explain an odd plot hole that's always bugged me about the World games- why does your own Digimon rapidly age while all npc Digimon don't?
3 months ago
Anonymous
That requires some source of infinite baby digimon and room to put all the "dead" ones.
It's probably explained by the virtual pet digimon being worked more intensely than the npcs. Or because it's from a v pet and wasn't born normal.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>an odd plot hole that's always bugged me about the World games- why does your own Digimon rapidly age while all NPC Digimon don't?
>it kinda sucked
Bullshit, ver-s was pretty enjoyable game and it´s only relatively unknown because it was restricted to the sega saturn and was only sold in japan. I would play and updated version of ver-s for mobile phones.
On another note this image probably needs an update.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Just needs to have Survive, TCG, Tamers, Adventure movies and World 1 and Sleuth.
This.
The modes of gameplay are opposed to each other.
In the tamagotchi, a death means instant replayability.
In World, a death is potentially hours of retraining and raising to reach an evolution point on par with the current area you’re at.
>virtual pets. They're the same thing.
no they're not. digital monster ver S doesn't play at all like world. it has hearts, capsules/vitamins, and win percentage factors into which evo you get.
But the scope of the world series far exceeds the v-pets, since it has a world to explore. The life cycle mechanics gets in the way of the exploration in a way that makes the player naturally resent the mechanic. The first digimon world attempted to minimize this problem by making a compact world that is never to far away from your main base, but the contradiction between the two mechanics is still evident.
>The life cycle mechanics gets in the way of the exploration in a way that makes the player naturally resent the mechanic
or you can git gud enough to unlock rotten melons and make your digimon live forever. in Next 0rder it's possible to beat the entire game with your 1st gen mons if you know what you're doing.
raising mons gets easier as you advance. what's the point of the game if you can hit max stats without any unlocks?
>But the scope of the world series far exceeds the v-pets
Because it's a video game, they tried making a super port of the v-pets and it kinda sucked. So on the next go, they took all that toy lore and used it. >The life cycle mechanics get in the way of the exploration in a way that makes the player naturally resent the mechanic
Be honest and just say you resent it. And this is your opinion. This intellectual fluff is unnecessary.
Anyway, I want to skip ahead to the part where we agree to disagree. Because I know this going to end up in a back-and-forth where I argue a lot of the flaws with lifespan aren't because it's a necessarily bad mechanic but an unmastered one and you argue otherwise. It's the first game of it's kind so no one making it really knew how to work with it. And no one today knows either because there are barely any games trying to be Digimon World.
Also it's one of those things where I do believe half the people who don't like it just suck at the game or are scared of time limits like a sissy.
So your answer to the idea that the life cycle is a problem is to use in game items that nullify it? Seems like you've just proved that it is a problem
>it's an issue because it just is okay
The exploration is just part of the raising of the mon, which is what leads to the better evolutions.
If you want to spend 90% of your time at the gym to be in ultimate before ever venturing out that's on you.
3 months ago
Anonymous
The exploration is looking at amazing backgrounds and getting raped by gangbang battles.
>use in game items that nullify it?
but you're wrong. you still need to play the game to obtain life-span extending foods >they're are unlocks. the game doesn't just stuff your bag with melons: you play the game first, then you get them >in N0, you gotta exchange coins for a melon at the prize corner, and to get enough you have to clear the entire colosseum and complete some minigames at the casino. certain foods at the restaurant also make them live longer, but you need money for that, which implies battling
so either you work for it, or you can let your mons' lives run their course.
[...]
Yeah they're not gonna update themselves so why not just put their upgrades behind Digimon recruitment instead of grinding pointless nodes?
to make you wait. I'm not a fan of time-gating though.
>it's an issue because it just is okay
The exploration is just part of the raising of the mon, which is what leads to the better evolutions.
If you want to spend 90% of your time at the gym to be in ultimate before ever venturing out that's on you.
>spend 90% of your time at the gym getting an ultimate
it's funny because the gym is a crutch in N0. I mean, you'll still hit high numbers anyway if you stack all the bonuses (training food+recruitments+upgraded machines+upgraded gym), but 1 hour per training when battles advance time by 0 minutes and incur virtually fatigue is still too much.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>to make you wait
And actually finding and recruiting Digimon isn't already that? Even if you already know where the Digimon are it's still going to take a while to actually get them to settle in the city.
Also the gym, specially in N0, is only really useful for speeding up the passage of time as it's better to just battle Digimon.
Make an open world, crafting survival game and give digimon guns.
I was gonna write that "they already wielded guns once, but the game didn't quite turn out that well"
[...]
Your entire post is invalid for not liking Breath of Fire V. Next you’ll say FFVIII and Tales of Symphonia are bad.
>not liking
where does it say that?
>to make you wait
And actually finding and recruiting Digimon isn't already that? Even if you already know where the Digimon are it's still going to take a while to actually get them to settle in the city.
Also the gym, specially in N0, is only really useful for speeding up the passage of time as it's better to just battle Digimon.
>it's better to just battle Digimon.
yes and no. with all the boosts, you can gain a lot of stats, and a lot quicker (in real-world time)
The exploration is looking at amazing backgrounds and getting raped by gangbang battles.
Real progress happens at the gym. With slots.
Do slots. Not bawds.
>getting raped by gangbang battles.
learn to use the distance and block commands >Real progress happens at the gym
wow I had no idea the gym was the way to unlock the shop or the clinic
-UI (e.g. let people dig up all materials in 1 go instead of having to do it 3~5 times, if the sack is full, the excess remains at the extraction point; the item exchanger should let you exchange materials in bulk)
-blocking was kind of OP in Next 0rder (long window wherein incoming damage is reduced to 1, you can instruct your mon to block in the middle of an attack and it lasts until the attack is done)
-finishers seem a tad OP (unblockable... unless your mon happened to be blocking beforehand). I think decode had the right idea with the QTE to mitigate incoming damage
-healing item limits (having a stack of 99 floppies that can be used without any delays or wasting turns kind of trivializes the game). like, they could add an item use animation, or limit items used in hand to 9 and requiring more time to pull out more from the bag, or add a stacking debuff for healing item spam, or make item use draw aggro from enemy digimon, whose attacks can temporarily incapacitate the tamer
>There is no way you can make a pet sim game with a good combat mechanics
terrible bait.
Digimon World's combat seemed like the next step for turn-based RPGs to me: monsters attack, usually alternatingly, but you see techniques come out in real-time, and monsters can move out of the way to avoid attacks can literally miss. you can even tell the AI-controlled mon exactly when you want it to move out of the way, or to hold off from attacking so it won't get interrupted mid-way.
>DigiFarm and evolution systems from Story are so good that it invalidates World
it's not comparable to pet sims. they don't get tired, they don't get hungry, they don't get sleepy, they don't get sick, they don't get mad, they don't age and reincarnate (sooner or later depending on how good a job you did), etc.
Digimon World 1 tamer and city building mechanics, but in an open world setting. DW1 had an amazing sense of adventure, but traversal was divided into bunch of loading screens. Get rid of them.
The problem is that people do play something else, because it doesn´t work. Claiming otherwise is like pretending that people didn´t hate Breath of fire 5's d-counter mechanic.
I have to agree with this. I don’t want to remove it out of stubbornness, but it has to go.
Because you don’t really know when to venture out from the city. I’ve read the devs talking about how you really should only go exploring as a Champion.
I think Breath of Fire V’s D-Counter would be a cooler mechanic because it’s not passive. You control when to evolve to match an enemy and to what level. A mega would be an easier fight, with your D-counter rising an extra 5%, with death of that digimon at %100.
Improve on world, stop using the linear story progression.
I don't mind the humans but they shouldn't be the focal point of the plot.
Also let me frick the frog.
The virtual pet aspect is the core of Digimon, as is exploration.
Farming resources was pretty pointless in Next 0rder since it's just there to upgrade buildings when it'd be better to recruit Digimon to do it.
Do like camping though, make the world bigger, have different towns to rest in, hell take a page from Frontier and make trains important as finding and restoring trailmon stations unlocks fast travel(that still takes time because you're riding the train), make the wild feel like its actual wilderness filled with monsters.
And have perfect feel like an accomplishment to reach again, instead of passing all the coolness to ultimates.
Playing N0 all I do is wander around aimlessly, raising Digimon, and ignore the plot completely and would love a game that's built closer to enabling that experience.
You'd think armor evolution would be an obvious way to allow mons to evolve if they don't fulfill requirements in a world style game, but they've been implemented like regular evolution in next order.
The partner Digimon needs to be an actual character that develops with the protagonist.
I think it’s good to take story elements from Survive and Ghost Game.
However, how does a well developed Agumon really affect the world and level design?
If we're talking about the current state with Next Order: Ditching the Humans and the linear story they bring along. Have you ever played Chibi-Robo? Something like that where it's several small plotlines is the way it should be.
I'm going to repeat my idea of each egg being a separate character and you unlock them by recruiting more notable digimon who will help you directly instead of getting a job.
That is impossible and will make Cyber Shit worse somehow. Frick you and frick that game.
I think Next Order is a step back from Re:Digitize. To me it’s like taking inspiration from Digimon World 2 to apply to a World 1 sequel.
I still can't get over that my ultimates got shit on by a couple of random rookie Digimon on the map.
Cyber Shit has a really nice barrier of entry.
Having it so mechanically close to Pokémon and Persona does wonders for new players.
fuse both World and Story series, Cyber Sleuth tried but there's still room for improvement
>DigiFarm and evolution systems from Story are so good that it invalidates World
There is no way you can make a pet sim game with a good combat mechanics
It just doesn't mix
There might be a point to this.
Tune Factory, Animal Crossing, they’re all very close to the virtual pet games like Digimon World and Monster Rancher, but combat is never the focus.
Ironically, town building is the focus of Digimon World, like Animal Crossing.
you can, you just need better commands and to be rewarded for making the right decisions.
You can play the v-pets, that´s where the life cycle system makes sense.
The World type games adaptations of virtual pets. They're the same thing.
But the scope of the world series far exceeds the v-pets, since it has a world to explore. The life cycle mechanics gets in the way of the exploration in a way that makes the player naturally resent the mechanic. The first digimon world attempted to minimize this problem by making a compact world that is never to far away from your main base, but the contradiction between the two mechanics is still evident.
>But the scope of the world series far exceeds the v-pets
Because it's a video game, they tried making a super port of the v-pets and it kinda sucked. So on the next go, they took all that toy lore and used it.
>The life cycle mechanics get in the way of the exploration in a way that makes the player naturally resent the mechanic
Be honest and just say you resent it. And this is your opinion. This intellectual fluff is unnecessary.
Anyway, I want to skip ahead to the part where we agree to disagree. Because I know this going to end up in a back-and-forth where I argue a lot of the flaws with lifespan aren't because it's a necessarily bad mechanic but an unmastered one and you argue otherwise. It's the first game of it's kind so no one making it really knew how to work with it. And no one today knows either because there are barely any games trying to be Digimon World.
Also it's one of those things where I do believe half the people who don't like it just suck at the game or are scared of time limits like a sissy.
>Be honest and just say you resent it
No, I like it because it’s familiar to me and I love Digimon.
Whoever, I can take a step back and realise that new players will resent it. That and how hard it is to balance in an RPG/Adventure game.
What if they made it so all mons inside the city age normally, while areas outside the city are corrupt with malice that causes rapid aging. Have it so instead of your Digimon dying of old age, it retires to the city and helps around with specific jobs depending on its own specialty, while you go on an adventure with a new mon.
This way there's technically still a life cycle, as you stop using your old mon and move on to a new one, but you don't deal with the heartache, as well as you actually make city progress upon starting a new cycle (so you're rewarded for having a long lived pet). They could still keep death in the game though, by having too many care mistakes or lose too many battles. That way the game can still punish you for neglect.
As an aside, this would also explain an odd plot hole that's always bugged me about the World games- why does your own Digimon rapidly age while all npc Digimon don't?
That requires some source of infinite baby digimon and room to put all the "dead" ones.
It's probably explained by the virtual pet digimon being worked more intensely than the npcs. Or because it's from a v pet and wasn't born normal.
>an odd plot hole that's always bugged me about the World games- why does your own Digimon rapidly age while all NPC Digimon don't?
>it kinda sucked
Bullshit, ver-s was pretty enjoyable game and it´s only relatively unknown because it was restricted to the sega saturn and was only sold in japan. I would play and updated version of ver-s for mobile phones.
On another note this image probably needs an update.
Just needs to have Survive, TCG, Tamers, Adventure movies and World 1 and Sleuth.
This.
The modes of gameplay are opposed to each other.
In the tamagotchi, a death means instant replayability.
In World, a death is potentially hours of retraining and raising to reach an evolution point on par with the current area you’re at.
>virtual pets. They're the same thing.
no they're not. digital monster ver S doesn't play at all like world. it has hearts, capsules/vitamins, and win percentage factors into which evo you get.
>The life cycle mechanics gets in the way of the exploration in a way that makes the player naturally resent the mechanic
or you can git gud enough to unlock rotten melons and make your digimon live forever. in Next 0rder it's possible to beat the entire game with your 1st gen mons if you know what you're doing.
raising mons gets easier as you advance. what's the point of the game if you can hit max stats without any unlocks?
>it kinda sucked
did it? or is just your opinion?
So your answer to the idea that the life cycle is a problem is to use in game items that nullify it? Seems like you've just proved that it is a problem
>it's an issue because it just is okay
The exploration is just part of the raising of the mon, which is what leads to the better evolutions.
If you want to spend 90% of your time at the gym to be in ultimate before ever venturing out that's on you.
The exploration is looking at amazing backgrounds and getting raped by gangbang battles.
Real progress happens at the gym. With slots.
Do slots. Not bawds.
>use in game items that nullify it?
but you're wrong. you still need to play the game to obtain life-span extending foods
>they're are unlocks. the game doesn't just stuff your bag with melons: you play the game first, then you get them
>in N0, you gotta exchange coins for a melon at the prize corner, and to get enough you have to clear the entire colosseum and complete some minigames at the casino. certain foods at the restaurant also make them live longer, but you need money for that, which implies battling
so either you work for it, or you can let your mons' lives run their course.
to make you wait. I'm not a fan of time-gating though.
>spend 90% of your time at the gym getting an ultimate
it's funny because the gym is a crutch in N0. I mean, you'll still hit high numbers anyway if you stack all the bonuses (training food+recruitments+upgraded machines+upgraded gym), but 1 hour per training when battles advance time by 0 minutes and incur virtually fatigue is still too much.
>to make you wait
And actually finding and recruiting Digimon isn't already that? Even if you already know where the Digimon are it's still going to take a while to actually get them to settle in the city.
Also the gym, specially in N0, is only really useful for speeding up the passage of time as it's better to just battle Digimon.
wut digimon world 4 got to do
the pic was meant for
I was gonna write that "they already wielded guns once, but the game didn't quite turn out that well"
>not liking
where does it say that?
>it's better to just battle Digimon.
yes and no. with all the boosts, you can gain a lot of stats, and a lot quicker (in real-world time)
>getting raped by gangbang battles.
learn to use the distance and block commands
>Real progress happens at the gym
wow I had no idea the gym was the way to unlock the shop or the clinic
>mass replying
There’s no way this persona beat World.
-UI (e.g. let people dig up all materials in 1 go instead of having to do it 3~5 times, if the sack is full, the excess remains at the extraction point; the item exchanger should let you exchange materials in bulk)
-blocking was kind of OP in Next 0rder (long window wherein incoming damage is reduced to 1, you can instruct your mon to block in the middle of an attack and it lasts until the attack is done)
-finishers seem a tad OP (unblockable... unless your mon happened to be blocking beforehand). I think decode had the right idea with the QTE to mitigate incoming damage
-healing item limits (having a stack of 99 floppies that can be used without any delays or wasting turns kind of trivializes the game). like, they could add an item use animation, or limit items used in hand to 9 and requiring more time to pull out more from the bag, or add a stacking debuff for healing item spam, or make item use draw aggro from enemy digimon, whose attacks can temporarily incapacitate the tamer
>There is no way you can make a pet sim game with a good combat mechanics
terrible bait.
Digimon World's combat seemed like the next step for turn-based RPGs to me: monsters attack, usually alternatingly, but you see techniques come out in real-time, and monsters can move out of the way to avoid attacks can literally miss. you can even tell the AI-controlled mon exactly when you want it to move out of the way, or to hold off from attacking so it won't get interrupted mid-way.
it's not comparable to pet sims. they don't get tired, they don't get hungry, they don't get sleepy, they don't get sick, they don't get mad, they don't age and reincarnate (sooner or later depending on how good a job you did), etc.
Digimon World 1 tamer and city building mechanics, but in an open world setting. DW1 had an amazing sense of adventure, but traversal was divided into bunch of loading screens. Get rid of them.
This would be 10/10 tbh
Remake Digimon World with an open world and improve all the mechanics
Talk me out of or into getting Next Order, anons.
Already played the previous games.
Life cycle system has got to go.
The game is built around that you moron. At that point, you should just play something else.
The problem is that people do play something else, because it doesn´t work. Claiming otherwise is like pretending that people didn´t hate Breath of fire 5's d-counter mechanic.
So? I don't want something I like to get ruined more. Get into it as it is or frick off.
I have to agree with this. I don’t want to remove it out of stubbornness, but it has to go.
Because you don’t really know when to venture out from the city. I’ve read the devs talking about how you really should only go exploring as a Champion.
I think Breath of Fire V’s D-Counter would be a cooler mechanic because it’s not passive. You control when to evolve to match an enemy and to what level. A mega would be an easier fight, with your D-counter rising an extra 5%, with death of that digimon at %100.
Having digimon as the protagonist:
Make an open world, crafting survival game and give digimon guns.
but digimon already have guns. And digimon world was already open world.
Improve on world, stop using the linear story progression.
I don't mind the humans but they shouldn't be the focal point of the plot.
Also let me frick the frog.
The virtual pet aspect is the core of Digimon, as is exploration.
Farming resources was pretty pointless in Next 0rder since it's just there to upgrade buildings when it'd be better to recruit Digimon to do it.
Do like camping though, make the world bigger, have different towns to rest in, hell take a page from Frontier and make trains important as finding and restoring trailmon stations unlocks fast travel(that still takes time because you're riding the train), make the wild feel like its actual wilderness filled with monsters.
And have perfect feel like an accomplishment to reach again, instead of passing all the coolness to ultimates.
Playing N0 all I do is wander around aimlessly, raising Digimon, and ignore the plot completely and would love a game that's built closer to enabling that experience.
Yeah they're not gonna update themselves so why not just put their upgrades behind Digimon recruitment instead of grinding pointless nodes?
Make a digimon card game game
Make more of the royal knights turn out to be women.
Your entire post is invalid for not liking Breath of Fire V. Next you’ll say FFVIII and Tales of Symphonia are bad.
i havent enjoyed a digimon video game since Digimon World.
Then you’ll love Digimon World 2, the sequel.
You'd think armor evolution would be an obvious way to allow mons to evolve if they don't fulfill requirements in a world style game, but they've been implemented like regular evolution in next order.
Armour evolutions are linked to exploration. It’s the idea of finding the eggs and the forms opening up new ways to traverse.
World 3 and Adventure 02 are all about this.